February 15, 2024 • 34 mins
Jane Schleichter, Esq, invites you into her world as she navigates the delicate dance of work, life, and balance. As a devoted mother, Jane brings a unique perspective, offering insights into the challenges and triumphs of juggling a thriving legal career while prioritizing family, herself, community engagement, and leadership. Join her as she shares candid anecdotes, practical tips, and heartfelt reflections on finding harmony amidst the chaos. Whether you're a fellow parent, an aspiring attorney, or simply seeking inspiration in the pursuit of balance, Jane's energizing story will resonate and empower you to embrace your journey with grace and resilience.
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Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (00:00):
Good. Welcome to Rowan College at
(00:02):
Burlington County's BaronessPodcast. I'm Dr. Brooke
Mailhiot, program chair andassistant professor of our
entertainment technologiesdepartment. I'm the co chair of
the Women's Advocacy Group, asubcommittee of the President's
Advisory Council on diversity,equity and inclusion. This
(00:23):
monthly series highlights womenin leadership while encouraging
listeners to build their skills,connect with the community and
visualize the opportunitiesavailable to women in various
professions. Tune in for afemale perspective on the
Burlington County community. Weare here to listen to these
(00:44):
amazing women and if you want tohear from women who lead and
inspire this podcast is for you.Welcome to the month of February
Love is in the air and there areton of observances during
February and this woman who Ibrought on I think is such an
advocate and fun person thatdemonstrates a little bit of all
(01:06):
these monthly weeks andobservances and days so check
this out. We've got nationalmaker friend day, we have gallon
tines day, we have be humbledday, self renewal day, time to
talk Day, National Hug Day latteday. And the list can go on and
on this February. But when Iheard of all these days, I
(01:28):
thought of my one friend, JaneScheichter. Jane, welcome to the
Baroness podcast.
Unknown (01:34):
Hi, Brooke, thank you for having me.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (01:35):
Jane, your wife, mother, everything in
between. You're a powerhouse.You're an attorney. And not just
any attorney trial attorneyworking for the city of
Philadelphia. Some tough, toughthings going on in your life day
to day that you're doing. Tellus a little bit about yourself,
Jane,
Unknown (01:54):
let's say I've been a lawyer for probably 2324 years,
a mother for 11 years, I havethree kids, an 11 year old boy,
a nine year old boy and a sevenyear old girl. They are all in
the Morristown public schooldistrict, fifth grade, fourth
grade and second grade. Theykeep me very, very busy. When
(02:15):
I'm not with them, I'm workingas an attorney in the city of
Philadelphia, I've held this jobfor close to 20 years, I do tax
litigation for the city ofPhiladelphia, and that tax
collection funds schools in thecity. So we try to collect money
from delinquent taxpayers, andthat will fund the school
district to keep kids in schoolbooks and classrooms,
(02:38):
technology, keep the buildingsafe, all the things that you
can think of to keep our schoolup and running. So you're
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (02:44):
doing a lot of that for the city of
Philadelphia. But I also knowyou and the community,
Burlington County community alsoknows you for helping out the
home and school association youdo a lot locally on the
community level, also to supportschools, what are some things
that you do? So
Unknown (03:01):
with three kids in the school district, you're very
involved in day to dayactivities and events that
happens at the school. So two ofmy boys are both of my boys are
in the upper elementary schooland my daughter is in the lower
elementary school Baker school.So I am currently the bookfair,
Chair of Baker. I am the subchair for the bookfair at the
(03:25):
UVs. And I also run projectdemocracy and volunteer for odds
and ends here in their recessrunners, lunch programs. Any
other way I can really getinvolved?
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (03:36):
Well, that's just that that's a lot.
And I think one of the thingsthat I thought of you about
talking to you about because Ithink this is a struggle for
most women in these empoweringpositions and strong leadership
positions is how do you manageit? All right, you have this
(03:57):
amazing career that I am sure isway more than the normal weekly,
hourly, you know, time allotted,and then you have your family
life, you have your communityinvolvement. And then with
having all those kids, you havetons of other extracurricular
activities that aren't takingplace within the regular school
(04:20):
day that are post school timeand weekend time. And so how do
you manage as a working mom anda working woman? How do you
manage all that?
Unknown (04:32):
When my firstborn Liam, arrived in December of 2012, I
had just taken a new positionwithin within my field, same
niche. It's a whole new job, awhole new firm I was at and I
had taken that job right beforemy maternity leave and like had
that maternity leave to reallythink about. Did I want to go
(04:53):
back to work as an attorney, ordid I want to stay home and
raise my son I took my maternityleave. It was great. But I found
myself lacking that organizationand prioritizing things in my
life because it was a lot ofjust It was December, December,
January, February, they're coldmonths, you're not going out.
Nobody's visiting, you have anewborn, it was very isolating.
(05:17):
I started my new job in March.And I was very worried those
first couple weeks, couplemonths, I said to my husband,
you know, I don't know if I'mgoing to do this. I have a
newborn at home. He's threemonths old, and he's with you
most of the day, because myhusband works at home. And I
feel like I miss him. But at thesame time, as I, as week went
by, and another week went by, Ifelt invigorated. And I felt
(05:39):
that need to be back in thecourtroom and back being a trial
attorney. And at that point, Isaid to myself, well, how do I
figure out how to be really goodat my job, but really good as a
new mom, I had no idea what Iwas doing. And it was, it was
really hard. It was really hardto figure out how to get home at
five o'clock. Your newbornshome? Yeah. Did he already eat?
(06:00):
Did he already sleep? What's hisnap schedule? And finally get on
a schedule. And they find outI'm pregnant again. And I was
thought to myself, Okay, well,this is a sign this is a sign
that this is going to be toomuch. And this might be my stay
at home time. Maybe this is whenI become a stay at home mom and
I leave my 15 year legal careerbehind me and maybe I'll pick it
(06:22):
back up. But the same thinghappened. I was home with my
second son Connor. And I havethese. I have a 10. But what was
at that point, 18 months, lienwas 18 months. And Connor was a
newborn, it was the summer. Andthe summer is much different,
right? So you're out. People arearound, you're walking around,
you're going to restaurants, westill lived in Philadelphia. But
again, I felt that need to goback to work and do what I feel
(06:45):
really good to
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (06:46):
do. And you needed your outlet, you needed
to follow your passion, you areempowered again. But you know,
women we feel we feel like if wedon't do that, we're like bad
people. Right? I feel likesociety puts that on women.
Sometimes it's like they
Unknown (07:03):
do and it's yeah, it's twofold, right? Because when
you're in the workplace, youdon't want to work all night you
want to I mean, sure, there wastimes that my husband would call
me and be like, the kids are amess. It's four o'clock, and I
just wanted to hightail out ofmy job to get home and be with
my kids. On the flip side. Itwas I can't believe you're
leaving your house at 7am to goto work when you have two
(07:24):
littles who haven't gotten upyet. So you get the bias at
home, and you get the bias inthe workplace. So how do you
match that? Well, I'm verylucky. And I went to my boss.
And I was like, Look, this isvery difficult for me. And I had
a I did a part time nanny, andthen a daycare. And that worked
out really well. But I just feltI felt like there wasn't enough
(07:45):
time in the day something wasmissing. Something was missing.
And what was it I couldn'tfigure it out. It wasn't my job.
It wasn't the kid wasn't myhusband, we had a lovely life,
Have a lovely life. So I haddecided to go flex time. So what
that has done for me, it'sallowed me to be in the office.
But also, if I need to leavethree, it's not a big deal. If I
need to pick up at seven o'clockat night when everybody's quiet.
(08:09):
I can do that. And it has been Iwould wish for every workplace
to allow women to do that.Because that has been so
beneficial to me. It has allowedme to keep up on my job. I still
do trial work. I'm still incourt. But when I have meetings
at the school or it's bookfairweek, for example, book for a
week, I'm pretty much I didn'twork Mondays and Tuesdays and
(08:29):
then Wednesday through Friday,I'm pretty much incommunicado
because there's no there's areception, right? Yeah, exactly.
Right.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (08:36):
And I'm working, but you're but it's
like being present. And itallows you to be present in in
those aspects that aremeaningful to you, right. So you
can be president, your career100% And have that access and be
present in your family life.Right. That's a struggle. I
think it's a struggle for oursoul.
Unknown (08:54):
And you'll find me sitting at book fair. And in my
downtime, or when I have a lotof volunteers. I'll pick up my
work phone, I'll answer a fewemails, if I have people who can
like just kind of pick up theslack where I can't do it at the
moment. And that works outreally, really well. I found a
really great balance. Now noteverybody can do that. Because
some jobs require you to be onyour computer and you have to
(09:14):
take a certain amount of hoursthat your keyboard goes or
showing you have to be in theoffice. Sure. That's been the
beauty of being a trial attorneybecause a lot of that stuff
doesn't have to be done in anoffice. A lot of that prep can
be done at home when your kidsare asleep or a day like today
I'm not in the office I workedall morning and now I'm here
with you. So it's that nicebalance of you get your
(09:36):
fulfillment and what I studiedso hard to do, but also I always
wanted to be a mom and then ofcourse on my third came along
then it was easy. It was mucheasier than when the two boys
were there because I already hada routine we were already
established and she just addedthe she was a little sugar to
our spicy
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (09:53):
right. So would you give some other people
because everybody doesn't havethis right every doesn't?
Everybody doesn't have thisinternal like, I can time
manage, I can organize, what aresome tips or some tricks or
things that help you to develop,you know, the routine that
(10:13):
you've now been able toestablish?
Unknown (10:16):
You know, it's funny, I, this is my life, right? So I
live it every day. But after youand I spoke yesterday, I was
thinking of like, things totouch on that I felt were
important things I wanted tocommunicate effectively. And so
I was reading up on a few thingslast night, and I read this
thing about success. And I foundit very interesting. I was
actually telling a friend thismorning, it said success is
(10:39):
action and self discipline. Andthose the only two things you do
and I thought to myself, well, Idon't know if I necessarily
believe that. But those are tworeally powerful words. And I can
really apply those to myself.It's, it's very hard to have
self discipline, I, it's hardfor me, yes. But I forced myself
to get up at 530 in the morning,and either go for a run or go to
(11:01):
the gym, get my creative juicesflowing, right, get a need some
get it out, just alone time Idisconnect from my phone, I put
my air pods in and I just go inmy basement, like get on that
treadmill or I go to the gym andyou know, do a heavy lifting
workout and I don't answer myphone for a solid hour. Of
course, you know, then I getback in the car drive home, it's
(11:22):
like things blowing
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (11:23):
up. But that's like your you time you
need I think every woman needsthat escape of the me time that
wellness that that mental andemotional time to just
Unknown (11:37):
be 100%. And you have to you can find it in any part
of the day for me. I can't, it'svery hard for me to self
motivate with three kids andschool calls and office calls at
10am 11am 12pm 530 in themorning, nobody's calling me I
don't have any obligations. So Iuse that time to start my day,
(11:57):
set an intention, set an action,whatever it is, I'm going to do
that day. And when I get home orwhen I'm done 630 In the
morning, everybody's starting toget up. And that's when the day
starts. And from 630 to 830. Itis chaos between everybody's
gotta eat breakfast, everybody'sgot to get ready for work, get
ready for school, pack lunches,get on the bus, and then at 830.
You know, I feel like half myday is gone. It feels like it's
(12:19):
yeah, it's noon. But then that'swhen you have to like really
time manage, that's when I thinklike, Okay, I'm going to work
from this time to this time, Ihave to do a target pickup, I
have to meet Brooke. Then atthree o'clock, I have to do
this. And it's by the time it'seight o'clock at night, you're
exhausted. But totally, it feelsgood to me to get to tick all
(12:39):
those boxes during the day. Andagain, it's self discipline, I'd
love to sit home some days andjust watch Real Housewives to be
honest with you. But
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (12:47):
our guilty pleasures, right? It is guilty
pleasures but but that mightneed time. But it's a mindset of
have that mental that thatbreath that.
Unknown (12:58):
And right and mindless activity is also really good
activity I find so watching
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (13:03):
the escape, it's escape drive at all, like I
just need time.
Unknown (13:08):
And when the kids go to sleep, you know, sometimes my
husband goes in the office or,you know, does whatever he's not
in the in the family room withme, that's when I just sit there
and I put on like realhousewives and I watch other
people do really mindless stuff.And it's great because it just
gives you that moment to escapefrom your own life and all the
things that you just did all daylong. And then you wake up and
(13:29):
started. It's like GroundhogDay, right? But then on days,
you know, I go to the office,that's a full day have we have a
much tighter schedule in themorning because I have to be out
of the house at a certain timeto miss rush hour and I have to
be at work at a certain time. Sothey're out and they get home
and you know, I require them tofor that hour or two that I'm
(13:49):
not there when I'm still at workand they're home from school. I
just asked them like becausethey're old enough. Do your
homework make it easier on me sothat when I come home, we can
spend time together and I'm notarguing with you about fractions
or
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:00):
yes, you have to organize the kids. Okay,
do you homework? Do you knowfollow up on this? I mean, you
know what it's like, it's I knowI've got lists, I need lists,
trying to do
Unknown (14:10):
fourth or fifth grade math. You have a fifth grader.
You know how crazy it is. It'simpossible. I sit there some
days and think to myself, Ohcheese, like
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:17):
I was like did I ever learn this? I
remember learning this and doyou need this? I don't know.
Unknown (14:22):
Counting backwards to subtract or I'm like I don't
even understand what's the newmath.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:26):
I'm like there's new math every year. I
can't handle the new math, oldmath. It is it's overwhelming
because I think people don'trealize the many many hats that
not only do you wear but yourpre wearing throughout the day
to try and figure out what youneed to do and where everybody
(14:50):
needs to go and be a leader andbe you know, an advocate and do
everything that you do in thattimeframe. It's like it's
wicked. And
Unknown (15:00):
when I mentor young, or young attorneys or people going
into the legal field, men orwomen, I go back to that thing I
just spoke about the action andself discipline, I tell them,
you can do any of this, it allsounds hard, it all sounds
unmanageable. It sounds like,you know, an unrealistic life.
(15:20):
But really, once you, once youput one foot forward, the other
one follows, and then you juststart to do, you just, it just
becomes a habit. And if you cankeep those habits, it everything
falls into place.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (15:35):
And what's interesting, you did talk about
like your me time, and I knowyou you said about exercising? I
know some of the other thingsyou enjoy are reading, what are
some of the other kind ofescapes, and we talked about in
real house? But like, what aresome of the other hobbies and
activities that kind of put yourmind at ease that that give you
that balance? For your days?
Unknown (15:58):
Well, my escapes aren't necessarily solo, they're not
necessarily just me time, likethe time can be like today,
spending this time with you, orgoing out to dinner, or hosting
an event at my house. It's, it'sa disconnect from family, it's a
disconnect from work, it'sspending time with people who
(16:20):
lift you up who you enjoy beingaround who take you out of your
reality for two or three hours.And, you know, you're talking
about all kinds of stuff. Imean, you've been, you've been
at the girl dinners I've beenat, yeah, we range that we go
from here to there in a matterof 10 minutes, then back to
here. It's, it's great. Andthat's having that support
system is a good escape for mehaving different perspectives of
(16:42):
different friends who dodifferent things. workwise Mom,
mom, mom wise, activity wise, Ialways love to learn from other
people, what they're doing, whatthey what they do every day. And
again, it could be it could beanything, but I'm always
interested to hear because Ilike to get involved in that
stuff. If I can have the time.Yeah.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (17:02):
And that's really cool. Because I think
every one of my guests, wealways get to that there's like
this female support system. It'slike this, the diva groups of
the people that we needsurrounding us to lift us up.
And I think everybody needsthat. And it is hard to find
(17:23):
that How hard has it been? Whenlike you're saying you're
getting you have a challengingcareer, you have three kids at
home that are certainly that's alot of work and time and effort.
But when do you have time to beand make those friends and
(17:44):
develop that kind of network ofwomen that can support you?
Unknown (17:48):
So it's very hard to do that. When I moved to Morristown
in 2014, I had a two year old,an almost two year old and a six
month old. And I was working inPhiladelphia. So factor and a
commute factor in a brand newtown. We moved here, drawing a
circle on the map in New Jerseyand saying, let's find some good
(18:11):
school districts. Let's find outwhere we can afford a house. And
this is where we landed. Itwasn't because family was here.
It wasn't because we knewanybody. We moved, bought a
house. And hi, were theselectors here. We thought Yeah,
we knew nobody.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (18:25):
So you were starting fresh. So they are from
your from a city urban center,where literally you could
probably walk outside and go to20 different places. Now you're
in the middle of suburbia,completely different vibe,
feeling and people like yousaid, you're not from around
here. And you're liketransplanted and now you have to
(18:46):
start all over again. And youhave at the time the two kids
and you know, right
Unknown (18:51):
and how do you do that? You get involved with your
little ones and you meet peopleand they introduce you to people
but I had heard from there was alaw mom group that someone had
recommended. I don't evenremember how and it was at a
woman's home. And then I saw Imet a lot of lawyers but I
wasn't in the schools yetbecause my littles were
(19:12):
literally little and she said tome, you know, how has it been
making friends and we actuallytalked about that that one day.
Yeah, you know, I haven't met alot of people because I'm not
I'm not out I don't I'm not astay at home mom. So I'm not
doing a lot of right activities,your
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (19:25):
career mom, on the days I'm home the days
you're home, you're working orjuggling things in your home or
taking my
Unknown (19:31):
two year old to places a two year ago while also
telling a six month old and shesaid to me she's like when you
get in the schools and your kidsmake friends. Your group will
start to expand you won'tnecessarily be just friends with
your kids, friends, moms, you'llbe friends like you'll meet them
then they'll introduce you andyou'll just see like all these
different like a tree everythingwill just start to branch off in
(19:51):
certain directions. And it takesa while you have to be patient.
But that's what happened. Andonce my boys got a little and I
met people Both things becamemuch easier. You're going to
invite to birthday parties, andyou're forced to stand with a
mom at Sky Zone where you'reboth like this is the worst. And
you just start making small talkover, oh, where does your child
go to school? What grade? Arethey? Yeah, who is their
(20:12):
teacher? And that kind of youfind your similarities with
those people. And then it eithersticks or it doesn't. And most
of the time doesn't stick. Youstill know those people, it's
still connection. It's still afriendly phrase. They might not
be the people that you go todinner with or have over your
home. But it's still, it's stillan acquaintance. Still an
acknowledgement, which is alwaysnice, right? You see people
Sure, you wave to them. You say,hi, you make small talk, you
(20:34):
feel comfortable standing withthem. It's it's doable, but it's
hard to get there.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (20:41):
No, I know. And, and so now you you were
adjusting, and you wereadjusted. And now it's you also
want to make sure that as a mom,and as a career mom, you know,
you're not staying at home andbeing able to have maybe 24/7,
dealing with all the schoolactivities all the time. How do
(21:05):
you make sure then also thatyour kids are doing the same
that you did that the kids aremaking friends that they have a
support system, that they'regetting what they need? Because
that's just as important right?As you doing your day to day and
your career? That's for yourkids. So how are you handling
that? That
Unknown (21:26):
involves going to the local playgrounds on the
weekend, even when you're tiredif you don't want to T ball
sports, all the little sportsthat people say oh, you know, I
can't believe you're doingsoccer at two years old, but
you're really not doing soccerto know your kid is going to be
Pele, you're doing it becauseyour children meet people, they
learn how to socially interactwith other children, they learn
(21:47):
how to deal with and meet otherparents and that that's what we
did, which it's very timeconsuming and very boring.
Sitting in a gymnasium, watchingyour two year old not kick a
ball and run up and down, youknow, a gymnasium, but it's
mutually beneficial foreverybody. And because you're
sitting with those parents andyou're talking to them and your
son or daughter is running upand down. And they say they get
(22:09):
to kindergarten say Oh, Iremember when so and so was in
my you know, soccer class orbaseball like and that's how you
make sure that works. And youjust keep them keep them
involved as much as you canwithout overburdening them or
yourself.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (22:26):
What has been the most difficult thing
being the working mom and andwith your flex time and being a
wife and a mom and all thosethings? What has been the most
difficult area for you?
Unknown (22:42):
The most difficult area? It would probably be my
energy level. There are justyeah, some days I am. I'm just
exhausted, your tank is empty.And i No matter what, no matter
what is happening, it could be agreat day my kids could be
behaving, the day could be goinggreat. But if you just don't
have that energy, you're havinga terrible day. And you're
(23:05):
tired. And, and it's not anybodyelse that's doing anything
wrong. It's just you just don'tfeel like it. And that makes it
hard. Some days like, you know,my kids get home from school.
Some days I work from home, Ishould be I should feel
energized. Right? I didn'tcommute. I didn't have to get
dressed up. Sure. But I'm justtired and they come home and you
think to yourself, I just don'tfeel like dealing with this. Ya
(23:26):
know? So it's hard. That's why Ilove that you
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (23:28):
share that because a lot of people are
scared to share that they'relike afraid like that you're not
like this perfect. Oh, no box,you know what I mean? That it's
okay. It's okay to feel thatway. And I think a lot of women
are scared to share that they
Unknown (23:42):
are. And it's, you know, that's, again, when I talk
to younger attorneys, andthey're thinking about how am I
going to get married, how we'regonna have kids and do this and
do that. And it's one of thosethings that you cannot plan. You
just have to, you have to seewhat fits right. I wouldn't do.
I wouldn't be a book fair chair.If I felt overburdened. I
wouldn't volunteer in the areasI volunteer for if I thought I
(24:04):
couldn't do it. I can do it. ButI mean, some days you things
just catch up to you and you'retired. And you're allowed to be
everybody's tired. I mean, mykids have the same kind of
thing. Yeah, days that, youknow, they're just tired and
nothing is going wrong in theworld. Nothing's going wrong in
their life. It's just like yousaid, your tank is empty, and
you've just had enough for aday. And you'd have to force
(24:24):
yourself to just
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (24:26):
power through power. Do it. Yeah. No,
no. And I and I totally agree. Iwanted to go back to you had
said about a few times you hadexplained about this mentoring
young attorneys. Okay. What aresome of the things that they
come to you? What are some ofthose number one thing that they
(24:49):
come to you because that's ait's a huge career path, right?
It's additional schooling. It'sa lot of working up the ladder
To get to where you are, and Ithink being a female, a lot of
us, like you said early on, do Ido the stay at home mom thing, I
do want to have kids, but I wantto work to be a partner, I want
(25:11):
to work to grow and affirm orsomething like that. There's a
lot of things going on with inthe legal realm, right? What do
you say to these young womenthat work with you? And that
you're mentoring? What what aresome of the things that you
share with them?
Unknown (25:28):
Well, a lot of them have this preconceived notion
with the stigma of being anattorney that you have to be
success driven. If you're not,you have to, there's always
going to be success, you'regoing to be this great lawyer,
and you do these great things,and you're going to make a lot
of money. That is not true. Thatis not true. There are plenty of
areas of law where you know,you're a civil servant, or
(25:49):
you're in a corporate law, oryou have a government job, or
your head of a bank might be ofcounsel, there's tons of
different things. And there'sdifferent ranges of salaries,
there's, from wherever towherever, it's what you make of
it. And it's what you want to dowhat you want to do, do what you
want to do, I, you know, I tooka job out of law school, because
I got the job, and it was a wellpaying job at the time. And I
(26:12):
thought it was gonna be a greatfit for me. And it was a
terrible fit. For me, it wasterrible. I was, I was
miserable. And after ninemonths, I left and I moved
through another job and then gotthe job I have now which I've
had for almost 2020 years. And Ilove it. And it's it's it's a
great job for men, everybody cansay that though. And amazing. To
(26:32):
me, that is what success is itdoesn't. You don't have to make
a ton of money, you don't haveto be a named partner, you don't
have to be all these things thatsociety defines what a lawyer
is. That's, that's notrealistic. So do what you want
to do, and make yourself happy.Because if you're not happy,
especially at work, where youdevote so much of your life to
that rolls right over into yourson or your if you have a
(26:54):
family, you're going to besnapping at your kids, you're
going to be miserable. And Idon't know why anybody would
waste their time doing thatunless they absolutely had to
for a financial reason, a livingsituation, whatever that case,
maybe it's not, it's not worthit. So
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:10):
knowing what you know, now, what would
you tell your young selfentering law school? If you
could tell your young selfanything?
Unknown (27:23):
What I tell my young self, right,
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:25):
you just got accepted to law school,
you're ready to go? What wouldyou tell your young self?
Brooke? I'm being honest. I dideverything. Good. You know, I'm
not everybody can say that.
Unknown (27:37):
I think but for me. So I was just kudos
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:39):
to you for being driven because you are you
have that? You know, inside younot everybody is motivated. Not
everybody has that motivation.Like every time I see you, you
are like rambunctious you'reready to go you're happy, happy.
You're Hurrah. You're like, doyou don't you mean, you're like
one of those people that, youknow, on a bad day, I feel like
(28:02):
I'm going to call Jane and she'sgoing to lift me up and she's
going to tell a joke or a funnything or something. We're going
to lunch, or we just got to gogo get a cup of coffee or lunch.
And it's like, I could justlaugh for hours. But not
everybody has that. And I feellike if you can say like, Yeah,
I did what I came to do, and Iyou know, and then you're
(28:23):
supporting that mantra, andyou're helping young women. I
mean, that's beautiful.
Unknown (28:28):
I mean, I don't know what I would have done
differently, because I don'treally know what my other path
would have been. But I just kindof, you know, for me, it was
just like a rolling snowball. Iwent to college, and it rolled
right into law school. And itrolled right into my first job
in Philadelphia, and I neverlived in Philadelphia, and I
fell in love with the city. Soat that point, I knew I wanted
to stay. But I was unhappy in myjob. So it was kind of like it
(28:49):
was a sink or swim. Right? Whatdo you do at this point? Do you
just keep rolling in the samedirection? Or do you change but
you knew you need to change,right? And all I did was change
my job. But everything elsestayed the same. I kept the same
friends in the same, you know, Ilived in the same area, and I
just loved it. Loved it. Andthen of course, I met my husband
and we did the same thing. Westayed in Philadelphia for a
while. And then with kids, itjust became impossible to stay.
(29:12):
I mean, I would have tried tofigure it out. But the school
system isn't as great and weneeded more space, all the
things that you know, you thinkabout when you're not thinking
about yourself when you thinkabout raising a family, how are
you going to make them how yougonna give them a good life. My
husband who came from BucksCounty was like, We need a
backyard and a driveway and agarage and bikes and all the
things that
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (29:31):
and you're like, let's that
Unknown (29:33):
wasn't thinking about but right when someone else puts
it in perspective for you, youthink okay, well, time to make a
change. But it's been a greatchange. I mean, I have no
complaints. We did the rightthing. We ended up in the right
spot, and we were where weshould be. So
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (29:45):
I have some really fun question. there that
I have and these are like thoseinteresting questions are from
all over but I wanted to justpick one up and ask you This is
a great one for you. Describeyour perfect day.
Unknown (30:07):
My perfect day, okay, my perfect day is I get up, I
get to go to the gym, I comehome, my kids are up, they want
to eat breakfast, they want toget dressed, they want to pack
their things, they go to school,I can get some work done. And
then if I have a couple hours, Ican run my errands by myself
without anybody in tow withouthaving to buy another lip gloss
(30:29):
or Pokeyman cards, I target, andthen come home and feel
refreshed from gettingeverything done. Just go on
about our day, whether that'ssports practices, or sit home
have dinner. That's kind of agood day for me.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (30:42):
Alright, my last question, then we're gonna
wrap up. If you had theattention of the world for 10
seconds, what would you say?
Unknown (30:53):
That's easy. Just be kind. I tell my kids that all
the time. Have a good day. Andbe kind and behave two things. I
say them every day. Threethings, right? Because that
would be three No, be kind ofEve. I love it. That's all you
have to do. Because if you canbe nice to people, even if it's
not reciprocated, I know thatyou've done your best. And
(31:15):
whatever Fallout comes fromwhatever was said, who did
something to someone? Did youact kind in that moment, and if
you did, then I'm good with it,we'll figure it out. Everything
else can be figured out. But ifyou weren't, and we have a
problem, then it becomes adifferent situation, which then
follows with the if you can't bekind, but you can't be calm,
please just be June's. Look.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (31:34):
Let's see what else there is.
Unknown (31:38):
And they do a good job of that. And they they remember
I mean, when I talk to themabout adversities school there.
I always say like, you know, sotell me what happened. But I did
it. I did it in a nice voicethat said, Well, that's fine.
But I appreciate the effort.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (31:53):
So throughout our discussion here,
I've been writing down some ofyour key words and phrases, and
I and I go through them and Iuse them as hashtags. And then
after I read them, I asked myguests, what is their personal
hashtags. So that's kind of likea summary of what we just talked
about. So think about this. I'mgoing to read through them for
you. Hashtag organization,hashtag prioritizing, hashtag
(32:19):
isolating, hashtag, invigorated,new mom bias, beneficial
routine, success, action anddiscipline, self motivate
mentor, unmanageable energy.Can't plan what you make of it,
love it, do what you want to do.Just be kind. What would be your
(32:43):
personal hashtag?
Unknown (32:45):
Do I only get one, we can do a few Go ahead. I'm up
for it. Definitely a hashtagself discipline. That's the only
thing that gets me throughbecause it's, it's me, myself
and I when it comes to whathappens in my day, right? I
mean, other people can throw meoff. But if I can keep my wits
about me, or just continue tomove on rise above rise below or
sink below, whatever it's goingto be. That's on me. It's on
(33:07):
nobody else. And I always had toi That's hard. I remind myself
of that a lot. And I feel like,you know,
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:12):
I think it's my way I have to do that.
Yeah, good step back.
Unknown (33:16):
Definitely hashtag energy. I love energy. I
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:19):
know I do over your face. I
Unknown (33:21):
love energy you are it's important. It's it's how I
get through my day. And hashtagbe kind. I try to be kind. I'm
not always good at it. And it'sa work in progress. But I really
do make an effort to do the bestwith what I'm given.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:38):
Well, I have just had the loveliest
conversation. I am so happy thatyou took me up on this offer. I
know and, and kudos to you forreally being you know, that
empowering female perspective. Imean, it's just a beautiful
thing. And I look up to you and,and I am so grateful that that
(34:00):
you join me today.
Unknown (34:02):
Thanks. And I will say, you know, this was it's very
hard to talk about yourself, andlike all the things you do so
this was a challenge for me day.This was one of those things
that like you have to really putyourself to someone. Yeah,
because it's hard to be like Ido all these. I'm gonna go home
in an hour. Like why are youguys fighting?
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (34:20):
Thank you so much for having me, Brooke,
Unknown (34:22):
I appreciate it. Take care. Thanks. You've
Jason Varga (34:24):
been listening to the rcbc Baroness podcast which
highlights women in leadershipwhile encouraging listeners to
build their skills, connect withthe community and visualize the
opportunities available to womenin various professions. For more
information about this podcastor other podcasts available on
the rcbc Podcast Network, visitrcbc.edu/podcast And be sure to
subscribe to the rcbc barenesspodcast available on all
(34:46):
streaming platforms.
Good. Welcome to Rowan College at
(00:02):
Burlington County's BaronessPodcast. I'm Dr. Brooke
Mailhiot, program chair andassistant professor of our
entertainment technologiesdepartment. I'm the co chair of
the Women's Advocacy Group, asubcommittee of the President's
Advisory Council on diversity,equity and inclusion. This
(00:23):
monthly series highlights womenin leadership while encouraging
listeners to build their skills,connect with the community and
visualize the opportunitiesavailable to women in various
professions. Tune in for afemale perspective on the
Burlington County community. Weare here to listen to these
(00:44):
amazing women and if you want tohear from women who lead and
inspire this podcast is for you.Welcome to the month of February
Love is in the air and there areton of observances during
February and this woman who Ibrought on I think is such an
advocate and fun person thatdemonstrates a little bit of all
(01:06):
these monthly weeks andobservances and days so check
this out. We've got nationalmaker friend day, we have gallon
tines day, we have be humbledday, self renewal day, time to
talk Day, National Hug Day latteday. And the list can go on and
on this February. But when Iheard of all these days, I
(01:28):
thought of my one friend, JaneScheichter. Jane, welcome to the
Baroness podcast.
Unknown (01:34):
Hi, Brooke, thank you for having me.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (01:35):
Jane, your wife, mother, everything in
between. You're a powerhouse.You're an attorney. And not just
any attorney trial attorneyworking for the city of
Philadelphia. Some tough, toughthings going on in your life day
to day that you're doing. Tellus a little bit about yourself,
Jane,
Unknown (01:54):
let's say I've been a lawyer for probably 2324 years,
a mother for 11 years, I havethree kids, an 11 year old boy,
a nine year old boy and a sevenyear old girl. They are all in
the Morristown public schooldistrict, fifth grade, fourth
grade and second grade. Theykeep me very, very busy. When
(02:15):
I'm not with them, I'm workingas an attorney in the city of
Philadelphia, I've held this jobfor close to 20 years, I do tax
litigation for the city ofPhiladelphia, and that tax
collection funds schools in thecity. So we try to collect money
from delinquent taxpayers, andthat will fund the school
district to keep kids in schoolbooks and classrooms,
(02:38):
technology, keep the buildingsafe, all the things that you
can think of to keep our schoolup and running. So you're
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (02:44):
doing a lot of that for the city of
Philadelphia. But I also knowyou and the community,
Burlington County community alsoknows you for helping out the
home and school association youdo a lot locally on the
community level, also to supportschools, what are some things
that you do? So
Unknown (03:01):
with three kids in the school district, you're very
involved in day to dayactivities and events that
happens at the school. So two ofmy boys are both of my boys are
in the upper elementary schooland my daughter is in the lower
elementary school Baker school.So I am currently the bookfair,
Chair of Baker. I am the subchair for the bookfair at the
(03:25):
UVs. And I also run projectdemocracy and volunteer for odds
and ends here in their recessrunners, lunch programs. Any
other way I can really getinvolved?
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (03:36):
Well, that's just that that's a lot.
And I think one of the thingsthat I thought of you about
talking to you about because Ithink this is a struggle for
most women in these empoweringpositions and strong leadership
positions is how do you manageit? All right, you have this
(03:57):
amazing career that I am sure isway more than the normal weekly,
hourly, you know, time allotted,and then you have your family
life, you have your communityinvolvement. And then with
having all those kids, you havetons of other extracurricular
activities that aren't takingplace within the regular school
(04:20):
day that are post school timeand weekend time. And so how do
you manage as a working mom anda working woman? How do you
manage all that?
Unknown (04:32):
When my firstborn Liam, arrived in December of 2012, I
had just taken a new positionwithin within my field, same
niche. It's a whole new job, awhole new firm I was at and I
had taken that job right beforemy maternity leave and like had
that maternity leave to reallythink about. Did I want to go
(04:53):
back to work as an attorney, ordid I want to stay home and
raise my son I took my maternityleave. It was great. But I found
myself lacking that organizationand prioritizing things in my
life because it was a lot ofjust It was December, December,
January, February, they're coldmonths, you're not going out.
Nobody's visiting, you have anewborn, it was very isolating.
(05:17):
I started my new job in March.And I was very worried those
first couple weeks, couplemonths, I said to my husband,
you know, I don't know if I'mgoing to do this. I have a
newborn at home. He's threemonths old, and he's with you
most of the day, because myhusband works at home. And I
feel like I miss him. But at thesame time, as I, as week went
by, and another week went by, Ifelt invigorated. And I felt
(05:39):
that need to be back in thecourtroom and back being a trial
attorney. And at that point, Isaid to myself, well, how do I
figure out how to be really goodat my job, but really good as a
new mom, I had no idea what Iwas doing. And it was, it was
really hard. It was really hardto figure out how to get home at
five o'clock. Your newbornshome? Yeah. Did he already eat?
(06:00):
Did he already sleep? What's hisnap schedule? And finally get on
a schedule. And they find outI'm pregnant again. And I was
thought to myself, Okay, well,this is a sign this is a sign
that this is going to be toomuch. And this might be my stay
at home time. Maybe this is whenI become a stay at home mom and
I leave my 15 year legal careerbehind me and maybe I'll pick it
(06:22):
back up. But the same thinghappened. I was home with my
second son Connor. And I havethese. I have a 10. But what was
at that point, 18 months, lienwas 18 months. And Connor was a
newborn, it was the summer. Andthe summer is much different,
right? So you're out. People arearound, you're walking around,
you're going to restaurants, westill lived in Philadelphia. But
again, I felt that need to goback to work and do what I feel
(06:45):
really good to
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (06:46):
do. And you needed your outlet, you needed
to follow your passion, you areempowered again. But you know,
women we feel we feel like if wedon't do that, we're like bad
people. Right? I feel likesociety puts that on women.
Sometimes it's like they
Unknown (07:03):
do and it's yeah, it's twofold, right? Because when
you're in the workplace, youdon't want to work all night you
want to I mean, sure, there wastimes that my husband would call
me and be like, the kids are amess. It's four o'clock, and I
just wanted to hightail out ofmy job to get home and be with
my kids. On the flip side. Itwas I can't believe you're
leaving your house at 7am to goto work when you have two
(07:24):
littles who haven't gotten upyet. So you get the bias at
home, and you get the bias inthe workplace. So how do you
match that? Well, I'm verylucky. And I went to my boss.
And I was like, Look, this isvery difficult for me. And I had
a I did a part time nanny, andthen a daycare. And that worked
out really well. But I just feltI felt like there wasn't enough
(07:45):
time in the day something wasmissing. Something was missing.
And what was it I couldn'tfigure it out. It wasn't my job.
It wasn't the kid wasn't myhusband, we had a lovely life,
Have a lovely life. So I haddecided to go flex time. So what
that has done for me, it'sallowed me to be in the office.
But also, if I need to leavethree, it's not a big deal. If I
need to pick up at seven o'clockat night when everybody's quiet.
(08:09):
I can do that. And it has been Iwould wish for every workplace
to allow women to do that.Because that has been so
beneficial to me. It has allowedme to keep up on my job. I still
do trial work. I'm still incourt. But when I have meetings
at the school or it's bookfairweek, for example, book for a
week, I'm pretty much I didn'twork Mondays and Tuesdays and
(08:29):
then Wednesday through Friday,I'm pretty much incommunicado
because there's no there's areception, right? Yeah, exactly.
Right.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (08:36):
And I'm working, but you're but it's
like being present. And itallows you to be present in in
those aspects that aremeaningful to you, right. So you
can be president, your career100% And have that access and be
present in your family life.Right. That's a struggle. I
think it's a struggle for oursoul.
Unknown (08:54):
And you'll find me sitting at book fair. And in my
downtime, or when I have a lotof volunteers. I'll pick up my
work phone, I'll answer a fewemails, if I have people who can
like just kind of pick up theslack where I can't do it at the
moment. And that works outreally, really well. I found a
really great balance. Now noteverybody can do that. Because
some jobs require you to be onyour computer and you have to
(09:14):
take a certain amount of hoursthat your keyboard goes or
showing you have to be in theoffice. Sure. That's been the
beauty of being a trial attorneybecause a lot of that stuff
doesn't have to be done in anoffice. A lot of that prep can
be done at home when your kidsare asleep or a day like today
I'm not in the office I workedall morning and now I'm here
with you. So it's that nicebalance of you get your
(09:36):
fulfillment and what I studiedso hard to do, but also I always
wanted to be a mom and then ofcourse on my third came along
then it was easy. It was mucheasier than when the two boys
were there because I already hada routine we were already
established and she just addedthe she was a little sugar to
our spicy
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (09:53):
right. So would you give some other people
because everybody doesn't havethis right every doesn't?
Everybody doesn't have thisinternal like, I can time
manage, I can organize, what aresome tips or some tricks or
things that help you to develop,you know, the routine that
(10:13):
you've now been able toestablish?
Unknown (10:16):
You know, it's funny, I, this is my life, right? So I
live it every day. But after youand I spoke yesterday, I was
thinking of like, things totouch on that I felt were
important things I wanted tocommunicate effectively. And so
I was reading up on a few thingslast night, and I read this
thing about success. And I foundit very interesting. I was
actually telling a friend thismorning, it said success is
(10:39):
action and self discipline. Andthose the only two things you do
and I thought to myself, well, Idon't know if I necessarily
believe that. But those are tworeally powerful words. And I can
really apply those to myself.It's, it's very hard to have
self discipline, I, it's hardfor me, yes. But I forced myself
to get up at 530 in the morning,and either go for a run or go to
(11:01):
the gym, get my creative juicesflowing, right, get a need some
get it out, just alone time Idisconnect from my phone, I put
my air pods in and I just go inmy basement, like get on that
treadmill or I go to the gym andyou know, do a heavy lifting
workout and I don't answer myphone for a solid hour. Of
course, you know, then I getback in the car drive home, it's
(11:22):
like things blowing
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (11:23):
up. But that's like your you time you
need I think every woman needsthat escape of the me time that
wellness that that mental andemotional time to just
Unknown (11:37):
be 100%. And you have to you can find it in any part
of the day for me. I can't, it'svery hard for me to self
motivate with three kids andschool calls and office calls at
10am 11am 12pm 530 in themorning, nobody's calling me I
don't have any obligations. So Iuse that time to start my day,
(11:57):
set an intention, set an action,whatever it is, I'm going to do
that day. And when I get home orwhen I'm done 630 In the
morning, everybody's starting toget up. And that's when the day
starts. And from 630 to 830. Itis chaos between everybody's
gotta eat breakfast, everybody'sgot to get ready for work, get
ready for school, pack lunches,get on the bus, and then at 830.
You know, I feel like half myday is gone. It feels like it's
(12:19):
yeah, it's noon. But then that'swhen you have to like really
time manage, that's when I thinklike, Okay, I'm going to work
from this time to this time, Ihave to do a target pickup, I
have to meet Brooke. Then atthree o'clock, I have to do
this. And it's by the time it'seight o'clock at night, you're
exhausted. But totally, it feelsgood to me to get to tick all
(12:39):
those boxes during the day. Andagain, it's self discipline, I'd
love to sit home some days andjust watch Real Housewives to be
honest with you. But
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (12:47):
our guilty pleasures, right? It is guilty
pleasures but but that mightneed time. But it's a mindset of
have that mental that thatbreath that.
Unknown (12:58):
And right and mindless activity is also really good
activity I find so watching
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (13:03):
the escape, it's escape drive at all, like I
just need time.
Unknown (13:08):
And when the kids go to sleep, you know, sometimes my
husband goes in the office or,you know, does whatever he's not
in the in the family room withme, that's when I just sit there
and I put on like realhousewives and I watch other
people do really mindless stuff.And it's great because it just
gives you that moment to escapefrom your own life and all the
things that you just did all daylong. And then you wake up and
(13:29):
started. It's like GroundhogDay, right? But then on days,
you know, I go to the office,that's a full day have we have a
much tighter schedule in themorning because I have to be out
of the house at a certain timeto miss rush hour and I have to
be at work at a certain time. Sothey're out and they get home
and you know, I require them tofor that hour or two that I'm
(13:49):
not there when I'm still at workand they're home from school. I
just asked them like becausethey're old enough. Do your
homework make it easier on me sothat when I come home, we can
spend time together and I'm notarguing with you about fractions
or
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:00):
yes, you have to organize the kids. Okay,
do you homework? Do you knowfollow up on this? I mean, you
know what it's like, it's I knowI've got lists, I need lists,
trying to do
Unknown (14:10):
fourth or fifth grade math. You have a fifth grader.
You know how crazy it is. It'simpossible. I sit there some
days and think to myself, Ohcheese, like
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:17):
I was like did I ever learn this? I
remember learning this and doyou need this? I don't know.
Unknown (14:22):
Counting backwards to subtract or I'm like I don't
even understand what's the newmath.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (14:26):
I'm like there's new math every year. I
can't handle the new math, oldmath. It is it's overwhelming
because I think people don'trealize the many many hats that
not only do you wear but yourpre wearing throughout the day
to try and figure out what youneed to do and where everybody
(14:50):
needs to go and be a leader andbe you know, an advocate and do
everything that you do in thattimeframe. It's like it's
wicked. And
Unknown (15:00):
when I mentor young, or young attorneys or people going
into the legal field, men orwomen, I go back to that thing I
just spoke about the action andself discipline, I tell them,
you can do any of this, it allsounds hard, it all sounds
unmanageable. It sounds like,you know, an unrealistic life.
(15:20):
But really, once you, once youput one foot forward, the other
one follows, and then you juststart to do, you just, it just
becomes a habit. And if you cankeep those habits, it everything
falls into place.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (15:35):
And what's interesting, you did talk about
like your me time, and I knowyou you said about exercising? I
know some of the other thingsyou enjoy are reading, what are
some of the other kind ofescapes, and we talked about in
real house? But like, what aresome of the other hobbies and
activities that kind of put yourmind at ease that that give you
that balance? For your days?
Unknown (15:58):
Well, my escapes aren't necessarily solo, they're not
necessarily just me time, likethe time can be like today,
spending this time with you, orgoing out to dinner, or hosting
an event at my house. It's, it'sa disconnect from family, it's a
disconnect from work, it'sspending time with people who
(16:20):
lift you up who you enjoy beingaround who take you out of your
reality for two or three hours.And, you know, you're talking
about all kinds of stuff. Imean, you've been, you've been
at the girl dinners I've beenat, yeah, we range that we go
from here to there in a matterof 10 minutes, then back to
here. It's, it's great. Andthat's having that support
system is a good escape for mehaving different perspectives of
(16:42):
different friends who dodifferent things. workwise Mom,
mom, mom wise, activity wise, Ialways love to learn from other
people, what they're doing, whatthey what they do every day. And
again, it could be it could beanything, but I'm always
interested to hear because Ilike to get involved in that
stuff. If I can have the time.Yeah.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (17:02):
And that's really cool. Because I think
every one of my guests, wealways get to that there's like
this female support system. It'slike this, the diva groups of
the people that we needsurrounding us to lift us up.
And I think everybody needsthat. And it is hard to find
(17:23):
that How hard has it been? Whenlike you're saying you're
getting you have a challengingcareer, you have three kids at
home that are certainly that's alot of work and time and effort.
But when do you have time to beand make those friends and
(17:44):
develop that kind of network ofwomen that can support you?
Unknown (17:48):
So it's very hard to do that. When I moved to Morristown
in 2014, I had a two year old,an almost two year old and a six
month old. And I was working inPhiladelphia. So factor and a
commute factor in a brand newtown. We moved here, drawing a
circle on the map in New Jerseyand saying, let's find some good
(18:11):
school districts. Let's find outwhere we can afford a house. And
this is where we landed. Itwasn't because family was here.
It wasn't because we knewanybody. We moved, bought a
house. And hi, were theselectors here. We thought Yeah,
we knew nobody.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (18:25):
So you were starting fresh. So they are from
your from a city urban center,where literally you could
probably walk outside and go to20 different places. Now you're
in the middle of suburbia,completely different vibe,
feeling and people like yousaid, you're not from around
here. And you're liketransplanted and now you have to
(18:46):
start all over again. And youhave at the time the two kids
and you know, right
Unknown (18:51):
and how do you do that? You get involved with your
little ones and you meet peopleand they introduce you to people
but I had heard from there was alaw mom group that someone had
recommended. I don't evenremember how and it was at a
woman's home. And then I saw Imet a lot of lawyers but I
wasn't in the schools yetbecause my littles were
(19:12):
literally little and she said tome, you know, how has it been
making friends and we actuallytalked about that that one day.
Yeah, you know, I haven't met alot of people because I'm not
I'm not out I don't I'm not astay at home mom. So I'm not
doing a lot of right activities,your
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (19:25):
career mom, on the days I'm home the days
you're home, you're working orjuggling things in your home or
taking my
Unknown (19:31):
two year old to places a two year ago while also
telling a six month old and shesaid to me she's like when you
get in the schools and your kidsmake friends. Your group will
start to expand you won'tnecessarily be just friends with
your kids, friends, moms, you'llbe friends like you'll meet them
then they'll introduce you andyou'll just see like all these
different like a tree everythingwill just start to branch off in
(19:51):
certain directions. And it takesa while you have to be patient.
But that's what happened. Andonce my boys got a little and I
met people Both things becamemuch easier. You're going to
invite to birthday parties, andyou're forced to stand with a
mom at Sky Zone where you'reboth like this is the worst. And
you just start making small talkover, oh, where does your child
go to school? What grade? Arethey? Yeah, who is their
(20:12):
teacher? And that kind of youfind your similarities with
those people. And then it eithersticks or it doesn't. And most
of the time doesn't stick. Youstill know those people, it's
still connection. It's still afriendly phrase. They might not
be the people that you go todinner with or have over your
home. But it's still, it's stillan acquaintance. Still an
acknowledgement, which is alwaysnice, right? You see people
Sure, you wave to them. You say,hi, you make small talk, you
(20:34):
feel comfortable standing withthem. It's it's doable, but it's
hard to get there.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (20:41):
No, I know. And, and so now you you were
adjusting, and you wereadjusted. And now it's you also
want to make sure that as a mom,and as a career mom, you know,
you're not staying at home andbeing able to have maybe 24/7,
dealing with all the schoolactivities all the time. How do
(21:05):
you make sure then also thatyour kids are doing the same
that you did that the kids aremaking friends that they have a
support system, that they'regetting what they need? Because
that's just as important right?As you doing your day to day and
your career? That's for yourkids. So how are you handling
that? That
Unknown (21:26):
involves going to the local playgrounds on the
weekend, even when you're tiredif you don't want to T ball
sports, all the little sportsthat people say oh, you know, I
can't believe you're doingsoccer at two years old, but
you're really not doing soccerto know your kid is going to be
Pele, you're doing it becauseyour children meet people, they
learn how to socially interactwith other children, they learn
(21:47):
how to deal with and meet otherparents and that that's what we
did, which it's very timeconsuming and very boring.
Sitting in a gymnasium, watchingyour two year old not kick a
ball and run up and down, youknow, a gymnasium, but it's
mutually beneficial foreverybody. And because you're
sitting with those parents andyou're talking to them and your
son or daughter is running upand down. And they say they get
(22:09):
to kindergarten say Oh, Iremember when so and so was in
my you know, soccer class orbaseball like and that's how you
make sure that works. And youjust keep them keep them
involved as much as you canwithout overburdening them or
yourself.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (22:26):
What has been the most difficult thing
being the working mom and andwith your flex time and being a
wife and a mom and all thosethings? What has been the most
difficult area for you?
Unknown (22:42):
The most difficult area? It would probably be my
energy level. There are justyeah, some days I am. I'm just
exhausted, your tank is empty.And i No matter what, no matter
what is happening, it could be agreat day my kids could be
behaving, the day could be goinggreat. But if you just don't
have that energy, you're havinga terrible day. And you're
(23:05):
tired. And, and it's not anybodyelse that's doing anything
wrong. It's just you just don'tfeel like it. And that makes it
hard. Some days like, you know,my kids get home from school.
Some days I work from home, Ishould be I should feel
energized. Right? I didn'tcommute. I didn't have to get
dressed up. Sure. But I'm justtired and they come home and you
think to yourself, I just don'tfeel like dealing with this. Ya
(23:26):
know? So it's hard. That's why Ilove that you
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (23:28):
share that because a lot of people are
scared to share that they'relike afraid like that you're not
like this perfect. Oh, no box,you know what I mean? That it's
okay. It's okay to feel thatway. And I think a lot of women
are scared to share that they
Unknown (23:42):
are. And it's, you know, that's, again, when I talk
to younger attorneys, andthey're thinking about how am I
going to get married, how we'regonna have kids and do this and
do that. And it's one of thosethings that you cannot plan. You
just have to, you have to seewhat fits right. I wouldn't do.
I wouldn't be a book fair chair.If I felt overburdened. I
wouldn't volunteer in the areasI volunteer for if I thought I
(24:04):
couldn't do it. I can do it. ButI mean, some days you things
just catch up to you and you'retired. And you're allowed to be
everybody's tired. I mean, mykids have the same kind of
thing. Yeah, days that, youknow, they're just tired and
nothing is going wrong in theworld. Nothing's going wrong in
their life. It's just like yousaid, your tank is empty, and
you've just had enough for aday. And you'd have to force
(24:24):
yourself to just
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (24:26):
power through power. Do it. Yeah. No,
no. And I and I totally agree. Iwanted to go back to you had
said about a few times you hadexplained about this mentoring
young attorneys. Okay. What aresome of the things that they
come to you? What are some ofthose number one thing that they
(24:49):
come to you because that's ait's a huge career path, right?
It's additional schooling. It'sa lot of working up the ladder
To get to where you are, and Ithink being a female, a lot of
us, like you said early on, do Ido the stay at home mom thing, I
do want to have kids, but I wantto work to be a partner, I want
(25:11):
to work to grow and affirm orsomething like that. There's a
lot of things going on with inthe legal realm, right? What do
you say to these young womenthat work with you? And that
you're mentoring? What what aresome of the things that you
share with them?
Unknown (25:28):
Well, a lot of them have this preconceived notion
with the stigma of being anattorney that you have to be
success driven. If you're not,you have to, there's always
going to be success, you'regoing to be this great lawyer,
and you do these great things,and you're going to make a lot
of money. That is not true. Thatis not true. There are plenty of
areas of law where you know,you're a civil servant, or
(25:49):
you're in a corporate law, oryou have a government job, or
your head of a bank might be ofcounsel, there's tons of
different things. And there'sdifferent ranges of salaries,
there's, from wherever towherever, it's what you make of
it. And it's what you want to dowhat you want to do, do what you
want to do, I, you know, I tooka job out of law school, because
I got the job, and it was a wellpaying job at the time. And I
(26:12):
thought it was gonna be a greatfit for me. And it was a
terrible fit. For me, it wasterrible. I was, I was
miserable. And after ninemonths, I left and I moved
through another job and then gotthe job I have now which I've
had for almost 2020 years. And Ilove it. And it's it's it's a
great job for men, everybody cansay that though. And amazing. To
(26:32):
me, that is what success is itdoesn't. You don't have to make
a ton of money, you don't haveto be a named partner, you don't
have to be all these things thatsociety defines what a lawyer
is. That's, that's notrealistic. So do what you want
to do, and make yourself happy.Because if you're not happy,
especially at work, where youdevote so much of your life to
that rolls right over into yourson or your if you have a
(26:54):
family, you're going to besnapping at your kids, you're
going to be miserable. And Idon't know why anybody would
waste their time doing thatunless they absolutely had to
for a financial reason, a livingsituation, whatever that case,
maybe it's not, it's not worthit. So
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:10):
knowing what you know, now, what would
you tell your young selfentering law school? If you
could tell your young selfanything?
Unknown (27:23):
What I tell my young self, right,
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:25):
you just got accepted to law school,
you're ready to go? What wouldyou tell your young self?
Brooke? I'm being honest. I dideverything. Good. You know, I'm
not everybody can say that.
Unknown (27:37):
I think but for me. So I was just kudos
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (27:39):
to you for being driven because you are you
have that? You know, inside younot everybody is motivated. Not
everybody has that motivation.Like every time I see you, you
are like rambunctious you'reready to go you're happy, happy.
You're Hurrah. You're like, doyou don't you mean, you're like
one of those people that, youknow, on a bad day, I feel like
(28:02):
I'm going to call Jane and she'sgoing to lift me up and she's
going to tell a joke or a funnything or something. We're going
to lunch, or we just got to gogo get a cup of coffee or lunch.
And it's like, I could justlaugh for hours. But not
everybody has that. And I feellike if you can say like, Yeah,
I did what I came to do, and Iyou know, and then you're
(28:23):
supporting that mantra, andyou're helping young women. I
mean, that's beautiful.
Unknown (28:28):
I mean, I don't know what I would have done
differently, because I don'treally know what my other path
would have been. But I just kindof, you know, for me, it was
just like a rolling snowball. Iwent to college, and it rolled
right into law school. And itrolled right into my first job
in Philadelphia, and I neverlived in Philadelphia, and I
fell in love with the city. Soat that point, I knew I wanted
to stay. But I was unhappy in myjob. So it was kind of like it
(28:49):
was a sink or swim. Right? Whatdo you do at this point? Do you
just keep rolling in the samedirection? Or do you change but
you knew you need to change,right? And all I did was change
my job. But everything elsestayed the same. I kept the same
friends in the same, you know, Ilived in the same area, and I
just loved it. Loved it. Andthen of course, I met my husband
and we did the same thing. Westayed in Philadelphia for a
while. And then with kids, itjust became impossible to stay.
(29:12):
I mean, I would have tried tofigure it out. But the school
system isn't as great and weneeded more space, all the
things that you know, you thinkabout when you're not thinking
about yourself when you thinkabout raising a family, how are
you going to make them how yougonna give them a good life. My
husband who came from BucksCounty was like, We need a
backyard and a driveway and agarage and bikes and all the
things that
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (29:31):
and you're like, let's that
Unknown (29:33):
wasn't thinking about but right when someone else puts
it in perspective for you, youthink okay, well, time to make a
change. But it's been a greatchange. I mean, I have no
complaints. We did the rightthing. We ended up in the right
spot, and we were where weshould be. So
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (29:45):
I have some really fun question. there that
I have and these are like thoseinteresting questions are from
all over but I wanted to justpick one up and ask you This is
a great one for you. Describeyour perfect day.
Unknown (30:07):
My perfect day, okay, my perfect day is I get up, I
get to go to the gym, I comehome, my kids are up, they want
to eat breakfast, they want toget dressed, they want to pack
their things, they go to school,I can get some work done. And
then if I have a couple hours, Ican run my errands by myself
without anybody in tow withouthaving to buy another lip gloss
(30:29):
or Pokeyman cards, I target, andthen come home and feel
refreshed from gettingeverything done. Just go on
about our day, whether that'ssports practices, or sit home
have dinner. That's kind of agood day for me.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (30:42):
Alright, my last question, then we're gonna
wrap up. If you had theattention of the world for 10
seconds, what would you say?
Unknown (30:53):
That's easy. Just be kind. I tell my kids that all
the time. Have a good day. Andbe kind and behave two things. I
say them every day. Threethings, right? Because that
would be three No, be kind ofEve. I love it. That's all you
have to do. Because if you canbe nice to people, even if it's
not reciprocated, I know thatyou've done your best. And
(31:15):
whatever Fallout comes fromwhatever was said, who did
something to someone? Did youact kind in that moment, and if
you did, then I'm good with it,we'll figure it out. Everything
else can be figured out. But ifyou weren't, and we have a
problem, then it becomes adifferent situation, which then
follows with the if you can't bekind, but you can't be calm,
please just be June's. Look.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (31:34):
Let's see what else there is.
Unknown (31:38):
And they do a good job of that. And they they remember
I mean, when I talk to themabout adversities school there.
I always say like, you know, sotell me what happened. But I did
it. I did it in a nice voicethat said, Well, that's fine.
But I appreciate the effort.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (31:53):
So throughout our discussion here,
I've been writing down some ofyour key words and phrases, and
I and I go through them and Iuse them as hashtags. And then
after I read them, I asked myguests, what is their personal
hashtags. So that's kind of likea summary of what we just talked
about. So think about this. I'mgoing to read through them for
you. Hashtag organization,hashtag prioritizing, hashtag
(32:19):
isolating, hashtag, invigorated,new mom bias, beneficial
routine, success, action anddiscipline, self motivate
mentor, unmanageable energy.Can't plan what you make of it,
love it, do what you want to do.Just be kind. What would be your
(32:43):
personal hashtag?
Unknown (32:45):
Do I only get one, we can do a few Go ahead. I'm up
for it. Definitely a hashtagself discipline. That's the only
thing that gets me throughbecause it's, it's me, myself
and I when it comes to whathappens in my day, right? I
mean, other people can throw meoff. But if I can keep my wits
about me, or just continue tomove on rise above rise below or
sink below, whatever it's goingto be. That's on me. It's on
(33:07):
nobody else. And I always had toi That's hard. I remind myself
of that a lot. And I feel like,you know,
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:12):
I think it's my way I have to do that.
Yeah, good step back.
Unknown (33:16):
Definitely hashtag energy. I love energy. I
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:19):
know I do over your face. I
Unknown (33:21):
love energy you are it's important. It's it's how I
get through my day. And hashtagbe kind. I try to be kind. I'm
not always good at it. And it'sa work in progress. But I really
do make an effort to do the bestwith what I'm given.
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (33:38):
Well, I have just had the loveliest
conversation. I am so happy thatyou took me up on this offer. I
know and, and kudos to you forreally being you know, that
empowering female perspective. Imean, it's just a beautiful
thing. And I look up to you and,and I am so grateful that that
(34:00):
you join me today.
Unknown (34:02):
Thanks. And I will say, you know, this was it's very
hard to talk about yourself, andlike all the things you do so
this was a challenge for me day.This was one of those things
that like you have to really putyourself to someone. Yeah,
because it's hard to be like Ido all these. I'm gonna go home
in an hour. Like why are youguys fighting?
Dr. Brooke Mailhiot (34:20):
Thank you so much for having me, Brooke,
Unknown (34:22):
I appreciate it. Take care. Thanks. You've
Jason Varga (34:24):
been listening to the rcbc Baroness podcast which
highlights women in leadershipwhile encouraging listeners to
build their skills, connect withthe community and visualize the
opportunities available to womenin various professions. For more
information about this podcastor other podcasts available on
the rcbc Podcast Network, visitrcbc.edu/podcast And be sure to
subscribe to the rcbc barenesspodcast available on all
(34:46):
streaming platforms.
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