June 10, 2026 • 33 mins
Paul Dehner Jr. of The Athletic and The Growler Podcast joined us to discuss what a difference a year makes for the Bengals, what Joe Burrow's contract restructure means, and much more.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
America. As you said, what's up? Six after five? This
is ESPN fifteen thirty mon names moo Edner. Thank you
so much for listening. Hope you're having an awesome Wednesday
afternoon right now. But going is good for the Reds
in San Diego. Spencer Steer two run bomb for the
Reds and they have taken a two to one lead
over the Padres on getaway day in San Diego. Two
(00:21):
to one lead is safe with Brady Singer in this
bullpen right Padres batting in the bottom of the fourth inning.
We will keep you up to date as the afternoon unfolds.
A rare street for us. Typically, Paul Danner Junior's with
us on Tuesdays in the three o'clock hour, but he's
had to do his job and kind enough to say,
let's move it to another day, another hour. So here's
(00:43):
Paul in the five o'clock hour on a Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
You know what, anybody that's listening on the radio right
now and is on the road can appreciate where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
To start this. Uh huh, big difference between trying to
get to you Tuesday at three versus Wednesday at five.
I will say that much.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I come in with a little bit more stress, but look,
the back roads were kind to me. Had to make
some adjustments on the fly, and I did, and I
was here with plenty of time.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
There's lots of really good things about my work hours.
I rarely get stuck in traffic. Yeah, I will sometimes
get the tail end of rush hour at six o'clock,
especially if.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
I want to go to a game or something.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
But I'm not driving to work during rush hour, and
I'm usually free and clear of all that stuff by
the time I leave here.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Yeah, it's not free and clear right now. It's a
little little Harryet a couple of spots out there. But
that's all right. I made it to you so we
can we can talk Bengals.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
There's actually a decent amount of stuff to talk about.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Yeah, for this time of year, I would say, so.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I mean, and I feel something about precedent happens the
day before I come on your show.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
I'm excited and like I was gonna say, all.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Of it's good, Yeah, like this is all good stuff. Yes,
good things are happening. I did tell you before you start.
I was before you came on the Growlery yesterday. I
was just going back because I was like kind of
trying to look through just for some good nuggets or
something for topics, And so I went back to this
time last year and I was like, what did what
(02:09):
were we talking about?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It was the headline of the episode was the erosion
of Zach Taylor's culture.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Right fast forward one year and we have.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
The culture has never felt better, They've never felt on
this particular day, and when we're talking June haven't felt
better in ages. When it comes to all of that stuff.
One year after it feeling like it was, I mean
maybe an all time low.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
I was having a conversation on Monday night with somebody
who I think is really really close to it, who
went out of his way to sort of articulate, like,
it's night and day. Yeah, it's night and day from
what it was a year ago. It's night and day
from what it was all of last season. Now again
it's June. We'll see if it's night and day. In October,
we'll see if it's to day the first you know,
(03:01):
real adversity.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
But like night and day, that stuff matters, Yes, that
stuff matters, and it builds belief, It builds people wanting
to do the right thing, people not wanting to screw
it up for everybody else not looking around. We talked,
you know, I remember talking multiple times in recent years
because you know, I love talking about football culture with
(03:22):
Andrew Whitworth, and he talks about those things, the erosion
of locker rooms, what these off field things do, particularly
when they involve stars and stars not being around and
fighting with ownership and that type of stuff. When that
stuff happens, it starts to impact things. It makes everybody talk,
It makes everybody start to question when and then you
(03:44):
don't feel like everybody is rowing in the right direction.
It might feel like a one off here or one
off there, but especially over time, when they start to
pile up, it really does impact things.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
In the NFL.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I've had many coaches tell me, look, the talent level
across from team one to teaen thirty two is just
not that far off. Outside of anybody with quarterback problems,
it's just not that far. It's the teams that have
the chemistry that come together that all of a sudden,
the guys start playing above their level because all the
boats are raising. Are the teams that end up playing
(04:19):
at the end like that happens far more often than
anybody wants to recognize. And I think the what's happening
right now is a great sign for that. There's still
ten other things you got to get through, but like, man,
they're they're really in a great place, and things like
like the restructure from Burrow that happened yesterday on back
(04:40):
to just just the excitement to DJ Turner and Dax
Hill and Miles Murphy and all these guys. They're Jase Brown,
they are all here, they're participating, they're du like everybody
doesn't want to screw it up. Everybody sees the opportunity
that is here for this team, kind of looking around
at what they've got, looking around at the positive attitude,
(05:03):
understanding how there's leadership, there's accountability here.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
Everybody seems into it. There's a pretty high standard.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
You do feel that, and new guys that I've talked
to you have expressed that to me. Older guys that
I've talked to have expressed that to me. It absolutely
is a real thing. I do think it can translate
to wins, but for right now, it's just a really
good thing.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Wait, you reference something that I jotted down because you
wrote about DJ Turner being here and if there was
maybe a guy who would have a compelling reason to
not be here right now, perhaps it's him. And I
wrote down, I just don't want to be the wet blanket.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
So I did this topic when Trey was leaving. We
used to have an employee here that I would refer
to as wet blanket. Not that they were a bad person,
not that they were a bad employee, but they just
they were always unhappy. There was always something, and I
started to refer to this person as wet blanket.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
And when wet Blanket left and found their lives work,
I remember what the Monday after wet Blanket leaving felt
like we all still had the same jobs, we al
still have the same inner office relationships, but it was
just it was like, you know what this is. This
is a little bit more fun without them, And I'm
enjoying being here a little bit more without wet blanket.
(06:20):
And so I compared Trey Hendrickson to wet Blanket. Trey's
a terrific player, greatest free agent acquisition arguably in franchise history.
I do not want to think about what it's going
to be like to maybe have to block him if
he is at his best in Baltimore.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
But I I've done the same thing.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
I've gone back and thought about where we were a
year ago, and Trey Hendrickson's showing up at practice Grant
standing in his golf attire that was wet blanket. The
wet blanket has gone. And so I've got to imagine
there's this like sigh of relief. And also you have
dudes like DJ like Dax, like Chase, like Andre maybe
others who go, you know what, I got business that's
got to get done.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But I don't want to be the wet blanket.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Yeah, and there's just not gonna be. And this wouldn't
be the case with those guys. But like in regards
to Trey and some of the other stuff that's gone on,
just don't tolerate the garbage, Like, just don't be here
for it.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
You know what. Let's be done with this.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Let's just move on from this, right And whether we're
talking about Tree Hendrickson or Jermaine Burton or any of
the things that have happened where they've just gone on that,
especially when they don't involve like Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase,
you know, what I mean, just find out, be done,
move on, find another answer, use another path, and and
(07:34):
be cognizant. And I have been critical of this team
often over the years for not being cognizant enough at
all of culture of what the impact of what they're
doing to try to win negotiations or whatever. Shamar Stewart
the impact that really has on the team and has
had on the team. They and being two money and
(07:56):
numbers driven, And I think a lot of what they've
done this off season has not been that has been
about the injection of this attitude, has been about leadership
and dudes that are about the right stuff and like
centering their attack on that. And and you see that
like even in the new guys that have come in,
Like there's they who knows what they'll turn into, but
(08:18):
like for they all seem to be like very much
targeted for the fact that they're grown adults. They want
to be leaders, have been leaders, been on winning teams.
This is the stuff they focused on back in When
you go back to the twenty twenty, twenty one, twenty
two times, it was like the core of Zach Taylor's
tenant when he got here, get more of those guys
(08:38):
in here and watch what happens, and I think you
could feel them the last few years getting away from that,
you could feel more toleration of the junk, right, And
so for that fact, I just think you can It's
maybe shouldn't be as much of a surprise that they
feel like they do right now.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
It's it's refreshing, Yeah, it's I mean, it's I joke
all the time about providing people like me with content,
but it is. It's extraordinarily refreshing. And there's it feels
like twenty twenty one. This team would be very lucky
if it achieved what twenty twenty one's team did. But
you know, I remember talking with you about, you know, leaders,
(09:18):
guys who had won.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
But dudes who just love ball.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, And that's what I gathered listening to Cash as
how Yeah, dude who just loves ball, loves ball like
I've listened to him on two different occasions, and I've
thought like, that's the definition of what we had talked about.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Being here for a while.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I remember talking to a number of different scouts in
recent years, and the lesson that had obviously been learned
was we know why guys have failed in the past,
we missed on the character abow or we missed on
the ball lover right like it wasn't that wasn't there.
We've seen that, like we feel like when we've when
(09:59):
we've hit on that and gotten that right, we've gotten
really good players, good production. We've we've hit on draft picks,
and there's just been too many years where it feels
like they're not drafting the right type of guy, and
then that blows up in your face. And when we
saw that. You know, there's any number of different guys
you can look back on in recent years, and I
think they feel like they're they're back, maybe a little
(10:23):
bit more focused on that at least with some of
their their top picks here and How's a great example. Yeah,
I mean I think he earned that reputation at A
and M, and then.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
He proved it on the field as well.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
So I just think between that and then between the
you know, the accountability that everybody feels walking in the
room doesn't feel like a circus. I mean we've been
we've been whistling the circus music in the media room
there for a couple of years because every day was
like a new big top and it was like, it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
It feels professional right now.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It doesn't feel like every day and you walk in
wondering what's today's circus gonna bring us? You know, here
come the elephants right like that, No, it feels like
you're walking into a place with a high standard.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
I had.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I was talking to just Sear Taylor yesterday, new cornerback
who came in with the Jets the second half last year,
started his career as Chargers, and he was just his
eyes got real wide and he was talking to me.
He was like, no, you can like really feel the
standard and the expectations that everybody feels right now, like
they feel like this is going to be a great
team and there's no gray area on what that looks
(11:27):
like even right now.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And he's like, that's a you know, from a guy
who was at the Jets last year. I think he
felt like that was pretty refreshing. Probably you're talking about
it right now.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
And I took that as like, you know, guys are
feeling at the moment they walk in the door here
right now, and that's I mean, that's all you can
really ask for.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
For June, you.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
Look back on stuff that you were doing a year ago.
I'll have Facebook memories pop up, because you know, we
put the stupid show clips on social media, and it's like,
here's her memory from one year ago, and it's invariably
a clip of me sitting right here ranting and raving
about Trey Hendrickson. Are coming up with some bs take
on Trey Hendrickson, and it's like, man, there is a
(12:06):
part of me that does miss that. But the part
of me that wants this team to be really good
this season doesn't miss that at all. Paul Danner Juniors
with us from The Athletic and the Growler Podcast. We'll
talk about Joe Burrow's contract restructure and what it may
mean next on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
The UC Health Traffic Center at the UCSPN fifteen thirty
Moegger Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic is here really
good piece on DJ Turner and the dudes that you
might not expect to be at OTAs at OTA's also
wrote about Joe Burrow's contract restructure, and then he did
an episode of his podcast yesterday where we talked about
whether or not the brent S Benz Bridge would be
(12:53):
repaired in time to carry with it a Red's parade.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
That's that's the sort of hard hitting stuff he brings
me on for. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. We
had a few goods.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Somebody sent me, I feel like the Reds one that
we did should have been altered by the way. I
felt bad about it afterwards because I should have done
what what happens first the new bridge is complete or
the Reds win the division? Oh, it makes it a
little bit more accessible, Okay, a little. I think that's
a little bit because it's hard to win a title
like right, so that's a little bit.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I haven't won a division in fourteen years. Exactly exactly
what I think.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
I think it's a decent conversation, but I felt like
I felt like that would have been a little bit
more accurate.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
I was.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I was a touch off in the comparison on that one.
Made it too easy to go bridge.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
I don't dabble into prediction markets or those those things
are creepy, but but that that one should be created.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Yes, it absolutely should be created.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
Jay and I we had a great time with the
what will happen first the uh or what's what's more likely,
the top three offense versus the top ten defense. We
were talking about that a little bit more today. By
the way, got a good nugget because in the middle
of that we talked about the nineteen eighty nine team. Yeah,
the nineteen eighty nine Bengals.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Which for those who haven't heard yesterday, this was yesterday,
yeh Growler podcast. It came up the eighty nine offense
led the league in total total.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Point they were to they were the last time the
Bengals were top three in offensive either yards or points,
so last time and they have.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
The eighty nine season has always been weird because it's
sandwiched between the Super Bowl season and then the team
that won, you know, was the last team to advance
in the postseason for thirty one years. The eighty nine
team started great and then sort of fizzled out, and
we went on this maybe three minute thing on the
A nineteen.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
But I was told then by a great friend at
Bengals PR that actually is a great nugget about that team.
They actually they had one hundred and nineteen plus one
nineteen point margin that season, which is the NFL record
for largest point margin and not having a winning record
really still is today, how about so?
Speaker 3 (14:59):
But you know, because they beat the Oilers sixty one
to seven.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Oh the number, there's there's four games like that, right,
They had a fifty six to twenty three, the sixty
one to seven game. There were like a forty one
to ten. They had four massive blowouts, right, and they
were two and five and one score games. And then
they lost on Christmas where they could have made twenty
nine to twenty one.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yeah, where they could have made the postseason.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
But I mean a team that was great, I mean
arguably just as good, like generally as the Super Bowl
team from the year before, but just things didn't go
their way.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
It was wonky.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
They couldn't win the close ones, and then it all
kind of started to fall apart after that.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
That Christmas Night nineteen eighty nine game, right, they lose
to the Vikings, and I remember the score because it
was in the world where college had a two point conversion,
the NFL did not, and so they were two possession loss.
The next year, my grandfather died on December the twenty third.
A few weeks after that, I described with my grandmother
in the room that Christmas nineteen eighty nine was the
(16:00):
worst Christmas of my life. She's like, not the one
where my husband died. Yeah, so that so that was good.
It shows the impact and that Houston sixty one seven game.
Everybody always misplaces that because the next year in the
playoffs they blew them out.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
But it wasn't sixty one to seven.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
The sixty one to seven game was a regular season game,
and people I think placed that in nineteen.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Ninety It was the game right before Minnesota. Yes, right
before the Minnesota games. Oh, they're going in. They just
scored sixty one last week and then we couldn't goin
in Minnesota and win.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Everything you've ever wanted to know about the nineteen ninety.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Nine tangent for me and you in one week.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
The Joe Burrow contract restructure. Yeah, the nuts and bolts
of it. Yeah, we know it's it's something else that
they don't do that they've done, which is great, But
the nuts and bolts of it. What impact is that
going to have only twenty twenty six Bengals.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I think it allows them to operate a little bit
more like the twenty twenty five Bengals did. From this
point forward. So think about what happened from this point forward.
Last year, Noah Fense, Felton Reisner trade for Flacco. They
were able to take on those things. A fan was
about three mil. Flacco I think they ended up paying
(17:11):
him about a little less than two. Riisner was a
little bit of the minimum. But they were able to
go out there and still be active. Not big moves, right,
And I mean, I know not to say that a
big move is not necessarily going to happen anymore, like
the Bengals have been different, but I'll say, like you know,
this is more about getting them back to normalcy, to
breatheable space. They were twenty ninth in cap space before this,
(17:34):
they had seven million. Now they have seventeen. It puts
them up to nineteenth. They're right in the middle. And
they usually, you know, they like to have money around
for practice, squad elevations, injuries, whatever. They want to be
able to move where the season evolves in different ways,
and they.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
Did that pretty good.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I mean, those three moves were valuable last year, and
I think be making sure that you're still able to
do those is really important, and I think they felt
restricted in being able to do those right now on
top of just the regular stuff, and so yeah, from
the twenty twenty six standpoint, I think it just gets
(18:14):
them to ability to kind of move the same way
that they did last.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
So this isn't the cleared room to go get Bobby Wagner.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
I do not see that as being the case now,
unless Bobby Wagner's number comes down. I think they are
looking at this as if we have an opportunity, we
want to be able to take advantage of it. I
don't think that they felt like they coul take advantage
of any opportunity. That doesn't mean that Bobby Wagner's walking
through that door. I just think that there it would
(18:40):
still have to be a really good deal for them.
Doesn't still doesn't feel like, you know, there's not a
seventeen million dollar splash happening right right, and so but
I think if they feel like the right spot happens
and you can find the right number on somebody, I
would I would certainly for right now, pinpoint corner, line back,
swing tackle as your main three. But you know, it
(19:04):
takes one or two injuries in camp and all of
a sudden you're like, we need to go get somebody.
So I and then obviously once we get through all
of that and the ability of whatever that would look like.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
You know, the extensions are part of this.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Those don't typically have big you know, growth in cap
hits for the current year. That's not the way most
of those work, but they can and they do involve
money changing around a little bit. And so to be
able to go get that, to maybe get an extension
or two done, I do think is also partially a
part of this.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Does this for those who talk and it's not really
here in Cincinnati, but for those who talk endlessly about
Joe Burrow's relationship with the Bengals, does this tell us
that the relationship right now is pretty damn good?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Joe Burrow told us that it's pretty damn good. I mean,
the last time we talked to him, he said, people
maybe have everything we need. He said that, and he's
he said himself, people have been trashed in the front office.
That needs to end. They went and did it right.
That needs to end. That includes from Joe Burrow, right
it is how I take that. It's like I'm done
(20:09):
saying things about the front of We're good and then
the fact that yeah, there's yeah, I'll restructure my deal,
working very easily with them getting it done. Seeing we
have everything we need. All of that stuff to me
suggests that they are in as good of a place
as they've been in a long time, because you know,
(20:30):
we know that the public push has been out there.
He said the things that he said, and you know,
now the tone is just very different from him. I
tend to take him at his word. I don't think
he's lying to us, and his actions suggest the same.
So yeah, I think they're in a great place right now.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I have another quarterback contract question that we have to get.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
To when we come back. Okay, it is twenty eight
away from six o'clock.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Paul Danner Junior, The Athletic dot Com and The Growler
Podcast follow at Paul Danner Junior. Reds and Padres tied
to two sports headlines coming up as well. This is
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 1 (21:12):
From Signs our Service at Kelsey Chevrolet, Home of lifetime
powertrain protection guarantee credit approval from their family to Yours
for Life Kelsey chev dot Com. Reds are playing on
Getaway Day in San Diego. They are headed to the
bottom of the sixth inning. Cincinnati blew a chance to
(21:34):
take the lead in the top six and the top
of the six, as a person who knows how to
speak might say, so, it's two to two Reds and
Padres bottom six. Spencer Steer a two run homer for Cincinnati.
Brady Singer five innings of work so far, giving up
the two Padres runs. Reds are home this weekend. Singer
on for the bottom of the six. Cincinnati in the
(21:54):
aftermath of that game yesterday were like every bullpen arm
had to pitch. Brings up Chase Petty, Zach mccambley sent
down to Louisville, Florence Yall's take on the New Jersey
Jackals tonight. Bob Huggins will be inducted into UC's Athletics
Hall of Fame on October the twenty third, is part
of the school's fiftieth Hall of Fame class. That is
homecoming weekend and Game four of the NBA Finals is
(22:17):
tonight in Madison Square, Guard Nicks and Spurs.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
New York is up two games to one. Are you nervous?
Send this to you off air. I was really filled.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
With anxiety going into Game three, I feel okay right now.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
You know why, I would feel really good if I
were you. I Wu Tang halftime in the house.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Yes, Wu Tang in the house in New York at halftime.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
Come on, you can't lose with Wu in the house.
Taylor Swift is also attending tonight. Is that true? That's true? Taran?
That is true? Correct?
Speaker 1 (22:55):
Today's gonna be at the game? Yes, Wow, my daughter's
back on board.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Oh my gosh, my kids are definitely gonna want to
the game.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
Wow. I feel.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
There's I feel just the basic nervousness that comes with
my team's playing at this stage in the season and
they're this close to winning. I felt like Monday was
a little bit much just Monday.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
It was about New.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
York and who's gonna be there, and how you're gonna
get there, and what the tickets cost, and the President's
coming in, and it just I'm certainly expecting the environment
tonight to be awesome and heated and maybe a little
bit pensive. But I think tonight's a little bit more
about basketball, a little bit more about basketball, and that'll help.
The road team has never won four straight games to
(23:44):
open the finals in NBA history. There's obviously a first
for everything. I think the fixes the next that we
need to make are are are not easy, but like
they're fixable. And maybe when min Yama not playing with
two nights rest.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Will help us tonight, maybe that will help you. But
either way, I'm excited for it. You can't lose with
Wu Tang in the house.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
That's all on the winner tonight wins the series. Yes,
the winner tonight wins.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
The puss pull out the big dogs when you need them,
they're there.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
I love it. What else you got for me? Patrick
Mahomes has restructured his contract. Yeah, he got more money,
So he's.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Gonna make over five hundred million dollars in his reworked deal.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, through twenty thirty three.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Is there any Joe Burrow side effect impact anything there
remotely related to Pat's.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Probably a good reminder that if this year goes great,
it ain't gonna be long till Joe comes back to
the table. And I would feel like the Bengals would
probably welcome that, considering what the previous.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Conversations have been. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Sure, if he wants to come back to the table
and wants to be more here long term, I'm sure,
the Bengals would love to tie more money up into him,
especially if he can have a year like this like
they people have this year and you know, MVP super Bowl,
all the stuff that feels like it's being talked about
right now. If you do that, yeah, I think he
would want to come. He should want to try to
(25:10):
make more money, and the Bengals would probably love to
have that be the conversation.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Yeah, all right, so we're.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Gonna be talking soon about Joe Burrow making over half
a billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:20):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
I mean I don't know all these guys, right, I mean,
it's every year like this. I mean, whether it doesn't
matter who it is, Like we'll be talking about Lamar soon,
we'll be talking about all the Josh Allen like these
new deals will get done. They all top each other.
The cap keeps going up. Quarterbacks not getting less valuable.
They have nothing but more leverage every year, Like you know,
(25:42):
I think at a certain point, Yeah, this is always
going to be part of the conversation is whenever the
quarterback has the most leverage and decide it's time to
come get it, they can come get it.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah, you mentioned we were talking about the Burrow restructure,
and like, is there money there for a swing talk,
money there for a slock corner? Money there maybe for
a linebacker, and obviously having money to react to things
as training camp and as the season unfold. Is there
a position where it would make sense to add one
(26:13):
more guy that we're not talking about beyond those three
positions you referenced before.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Beyond those three we have a hard time getting past
those three right now. Corner in particular, Charlie and I,
Charlie Goldsmith and I were talking a little bit about
the comparison between the Reds bullpen and the Bengals cornerback position.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
Oh no, no, no, it hasn't gotten there yet.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
But you felt good about the bullpen entering this season.
You did right, yes, Like, but there's volatility in it
in general, and cornerback play can be like that, and
you can be one injury, a couple guys that you're
betting on that don't quite get there, and then one
injury and suddenly you know you're playing guys and it's
(26:58):
not going well, and it can get ugly real quick when.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
You're exposed out there.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Right, similar type of feel of what could happen if
you had some of the same things that have happened
to the Reds bullpen, and I don't necessarily think you
could ever predict that that would happen at one position.
But I just there's a lot of you know, behind
DJ and Dax, and it's a high injury position, and
both those guys have had injuries. I just there's a
lot of bets that are unproven or journeyman or whatever.
(27:27):
Yeah that or rookie that you're trying to make at
a very important, easily exposed position that worry me. Where
it feels like you would just like.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
To have.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
A veteran and that has a bunch of starts played
in this league be there in the background if if needed,
or called upon that song.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
See as we're saying this, I'm trying to go, Okay,
Jalen Davis is Tony Santion, Maybe right it would be.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Who Yeah, the guy who kind of came on and
was the the great field.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
Good story of last year.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
But we all recognize that it's not necessarily a sustainable
A little bit too much to be asking him to
be too much.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Yeah, I mean that's that's possible in that scenario. These
aren't comparisons. I was hoping to. And I'm not saying
it's gonna go that way.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
I'm just saying that is a position where you're just
you're always your depth is always tested at corner every year, right,
And and I like the idea of could dj Ivy
be something? Maybe Tokario Davis has a good future. Jalen
Davis just to your tailor at Taylor seems nice, like like, oh,
this is the things you could do with the slot
(28:40):
position between Kyle Duggar and cashus how and the fun
hybrid pieces there, Like that's all great conversation, but it's
all a lot of unproven thought exercise. And so I
I just I like something that feels a little more solid. Well, yeah,
there's this here. Yeah, right, we always have Rasseul Douglas,
(29:04):
you know, like and if that at least he's started
a ninety games and was a starter the last two years.
He knows what he's doing, right, like Apple and Eli
Apple type, Yeah, right, who's there if you need him?
And I just that's where I'm at with that position
right now.
Speaker 3 (29:21):
Josh Newton would be like Sam Moule, can you pick
up a bun?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Josh Newton would be I'm trying to think who who
is still here? Despite playing terrible last year. It was
rough for Josh and that doesn't you know that. I
don't think he's part of the equation right now unless
something changes dramatically in this training.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Is there any job in all of sports that invites
more ridicule than bad bullpen orm?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Oh no, no, because you're already on the outskirts, right
You're outskirts of the conversation anyway. You're always you know,
one two bad weeks from being in Louisville, like everybody
and is anymore, and they're so valid Ole. I just
there's such a name that you they're fleeting. You forget
that they were everything around.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
It's well, I used to love to make fun of
Joel Konell, but he's now good with the Brewers, so
I can't can't drop that name anymore.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
I just know this.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
In the last like three weeks, including with you, In
any text that is involved like somebody screwing something up
or having to apologize for something, it's like, ah, sorry,
I'm the Pierce Johnson of grilling out, like I mean,
even like with my my wife and I like I'm
not going to cut the grass tonight. I'm as I'm
as reliable as I hate making fun of tj Antone
(30:41):
because he's such a nice guy and he's such a
cool story. But I'm as reliable as I don't. I
don't give me Luis May Yeah, yeah, yeah, Zach Maxwell,
just so many. It was a guy named mccambley now
on the team. Something I didn't get to get to
this with you last week you joined me. Zach Taylor
(31:02):
had a press conference, yeah, and he was I think
seventeen minutes late for the press conference. Yeah. I think
he was supposed to be a two thirty. Sure, got
there a two forty seven, and it was everything okay,
everything was fine. The practice went a little bit later.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
I think the practice was ten minutes later than originally thought.
And I'm very happy that he did go late because
that was the time where we got Eric all last week,
that's right, which was great.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You were here and you wrote about Eric Hall, and
I was really happy.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I didn't know if the late arrival for the press
conference was related to the distance between where he lives
and where he works. By the way, JJ Blede has
just gone long and I got you to laugh.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
So I like.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
That one that brought that one back. It killed me.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
I was so mad at myself because two weeks ago
you got short with me because I referenced, you know,
Brian Schottenheimer, the coach of the Cowboys, is moving closer
to the Cowboys facility, because that's what football coaches have
to do. And then you know this is my favorite trope.
And then last week you joined me from the immediate
aftermath of the press conference. We covered all these topics,
(32:11):
and I forgot to throw at you like was Zach
late because he was late to work because he doesn't
live close enough to the stadium, And I didn't do it,
and it's bothered me for a week.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
See, And now I'm disappointed too, because I've now gotten
accustomed this time of year, the last couple of weeks
coming here and you trying to get me irritated, and
you didn't do that. Today, you didn't even do that.
I'm kind of this is how good.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
The vibes are.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Everybody's in such a good mood that I can't even
irritate you in the middle of June.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
I know this is I don't like it at all.
What are we doing? Cal Trey hendrickson the wet blanket.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Paul Danner Junior read his work covering the Bengals Theathletic
dot Com and listen to the Growler podcast and I
appreciate it as always.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Well there's the music. We're done. The show is OK.
Programming note, I'm off tomorrow. Chad Brenda will be here.
I return on Friday. Load management season has begun. Have
a great night. Thank you for listening. Anything you might
have missed go listen to on the iHeartRadio app thanks
to a long Neck sports Grill. Don't forget Tony and
Austin with Tony's since E three sixty at noon, and
(33:20):
I will talk to you on Friday. Have a great
night and have a great Thursday as well. Thanks to
Tarren Bland for producing. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. So
next ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center at
America. As you said, what's up? Six after five? This
is ESPN fifteen thirty mon names moo Edner. Thank you
so much for listening. Hope you're having an awesome Wednesday
afternoon right now. But going is good for the Reds
in San Diego. Spencer Steer two run bomb for the
Reds and they have taken a two to one lead
over the Padres on getaway day in San Diego. Two
(00:21):
to one lead is safe with Brady Singer in this
bullpen right Padres batting in the bottom of the fourth inning.
We will keep you up to date as the afternoon unfolds.
A rare street for us. Typically, Paul Danner Junior's with
us on Tuesdays in the three o'clock hour, but he's
had to do his job and kind enough to say,
let's move it to another day, another hour. So here's
(00:43):
Paul in the five o'clock hour on a Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
You know what, anybody that's listening on the radio right
now and is on the road can appreciate where I'm going.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
To start this. Uh huh, big difference between trying to
get to you Tuesday at three versus Wednesday at five.
I will say that much.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I come in with a little bit more stress, but look,
the back roads were kind to me. Had to make
some adjustments on the fly, and I did, and I
was here with plenty of time.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
There's lots of really good things about my work hours.
I rarely get stuck in traffic. Yeah, I will sometimes
get the tail end of rush hour at six o'clock,
especially if.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
I want to go to a game or something.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
But I'm not driving to work during rush hour, and
I'm usually free and clear of all that stuff by
the time I leave here.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Yeah, it's not free and clear right now. It's a
little little Harryet a couple of spots out there. But
that's all right. I made it to you so we
can we can talk Bengals.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
There's actually a decent amount of stuff to talk about.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Yeah, for this time of year, I would say, so.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I mean, and I feel something about precedent happens the
day before I come on your show.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
I'm excited and like I was gonna say, all.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Of it's good, Yeah, like this is all good stuff. Yes,
good things are happening. I did tell you before you start.
I was before you came on the Growlery yesterday. I
was just going back because I was like kind of
trying to look through just for some good nuggets or
something for topics, And so I went back to this
time last year and I was like, what did what
(02:09):
were we talking about?
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (02:11):
It was the headline of the episode was the erosion
of Zach Taylor's culture.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Right fast forward one year and we have.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
The culture has never felt better, They've never felt on
this particular day, and when we're talking June haven't felt
better in ages. When it comes to all of that stuff.
One year after it feeling like it was, I mean
maybe an all time low.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
I was having a conversation on Monday night with somebody
who I think is really really close to it, who
went out of his way to sort of articulate, like,
it's night and day. Yeah, it's night and day from
what it was a year ago. It's night and day
from what it was all of last season. Now again
it's June. We'll see if it's night and day. In October,
we'll see if it's to day the first you know,
(03:01):
real adversity.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
But like night and day, that stuff matters, Yes, that
stuff matters, and it builds belief, It builds people wanting
to do the right thing, people not wanting to screw
it up for everybody else not looking around. We talked,
you know, I remember talking multiple times in recent years
because you know, I love talking about football culture with
(03:22):
Andrew Whitworth, and he talks about those things, the erosion
of locker rooms, what these off field things do, particularly
when they involve stars and stars not being around and
fighting with ownership and that type of stuff. When that
stuff happens, it starts to impact things. It makes everybody talk,
It makes everybody start to question when and then you
(03:44):
don't feel like everybody is rowing in the right direction.
It might feel like a one off here or one
off there, but especially over time, when they start to
pile up, it really does impact things.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
In the NFL.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I've had many coaches tell me, look, the talent level
across from team one to teaen thirty two is just
not that far off. Outside of anybody with quarterback problems,
it's just not that far. It's the teams that have
the chemistry that come together that all of a sudden,
the guys start playing above their level because all the
boats are raising. Are the teams that end up playing
(04:19):
at the end like that happens far more often than
anybody wants to recognize. And I think the what's happening
right now is a great sign for that. There's still
ten other things you got to get through, but like, man,
they're they're really in a great place, and things like
like the restructure from Burrow that happened yesterday on back
(04:40):
to just just the excitement to DJ Turner and Dax
Hill and Miles Murphy and all these guys. They're Jase Brown,
they are all here, they're participating, they're du like everybody
doesn't want to screw it up. Everybody sees the opportunity
that is here for this team, kind of looking around
at what they've got, looking around at the positive attitude,
(05:03):
understanding how there's leadership, there's accountability here.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
Everybody seems into it. There's a pretty high standard.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
You do feel that, and new guys that I've talked
to you have expressed that to me. Older guys that
I've talked to have expressed that to me. It absolutely
is a real thing. I do think it can translate
to wins, but for right now, it's just a really
good thing.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Wait, you reference something that I jotted down because you
wrote about DJ Turner being here and if there was
maybe a guy who would have a compelling reason to
not be here right now, perhaps it's him. And I
wrote down, I just don't want to be the wet blanket.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
So I did this topic when Trey was leaving. We
used to have an employee here that I would refer
to as wet blanket. Not that they were a bad person,
not that they were a bad employee, but they just
they were always unhappy. There was always something, and I
started to refer to this person as wet blanket.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
And when wet Blanket left and found their lives work,
I remember what the Monday after wet Blanket leaving felt
like we all still had the same jobs, we al
still have the same inner office relationships, but it was
just it was like, you know what this is. This
is a little bit more fun without them, And I'm
enjoying being here a little bit more without wet blanket.
(06:20):
And so I compared Trey Hendrickson to wet Blanket. Trey's
a terrific player, greatest free agent acquisition arguably in franchise history.
I do not want to think about what it's going
to be like to maybe have to block him if
he is at his best in Baltimore.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
But I I've done the same thing.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
I've gone back and thought about where we were a
year ago, and Trey Hendrickson's showing up at practice Grant
standing in his golf attire that was wet blanket. The
wet blanket has gone. And so I've got to imagine
there's this like sigh of relief. And also you have
dudes like DJ like Dax, like Chase, like Andre maybe
others who go, you know what, I got business that's
got to get done.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
But I don't want to be the wet blanket.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Yeah, and there's just not gonna be. And this wouldn't
be the case with those guys. But like in regards
to Trey and some of the other stuff that's gone on,
just don't tolerate the garbage, Like, just don't be here
for it.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
You know what. Let's be done with this.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Let's just move on from this, right And whether we're
talking about Tree Hendrickson or Jermaine Burton or any of
the things that have happened where they've just gone on that,
especially when they don't involve like Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase,
you know, what I mean, just find out, be done,
move on, find another answer, use another path, and and
(07:34):
be cognizant. And I have been critical of this team
often over the years for not being cognizant enough at
all of culture of what the impact of what they're
doing to try to win negotiations or whatever. Shamar Stewart
the impact that really has on the team and has
had on the team. They and being two money and
(07:56):
numbers driven, And I think a lot of what they've
done this off season has not been that has been
about the injection of this attitude, has been about leadership
and dudes that are about the right stuff and like
centering their attack on that. And and you see that
like even in the new guys that have come in,
Like there's they who knows what they'll turn into, but
(08:18):
like for they all seem to be like very much
targeted for the fact that they're grown adults. They want
to be leaders, have been leaders, been on winning teams.
This is the stuff they focused on back in When
you go back to the twenty twenty, twenty one, twenty
two times, it was like the core of Zach Taylor's
tenant when he got here, get more of those guys
(08:38):
in here and watch what happens, and I think you
could feel them the last few years getting away from that,
you could feel more toleration of the junk, right, And
so for that fact, I just think you can It's
maybe shouldn't be as much of a surprise that they
feel like they do right now.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
It's it's refreshing, Yeah, it's I mean, it's I joke
all the time about providing people like me with content,
but it is. It's extraordinarily refreshing. And there's it feels
like twenty twenty one. This team would be very lucky
if it achieved what twenty twenty one's team did. But
you know, I remember talking with you about, you know, leaders,
(09:18):
guys who had won.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
But dudes who just love ball.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, And that's what I gathered listening to Cash as
how Yeah, dude who just loves ball, loves ball like
I've listened to him on two different occasions, and I've
thought like, that's the definition of what we had talked about.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Being here for a while.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
I remember talking to a number of different scouts in
recent years, and the lesson that had obviously been learned
was we know why guys have failed in the past,
we missed on the character abow or we missed on
the ball lover right like it wasn't that wasn't there.
We've seen that, like we feel like when we've when
(09:59):
we've hit on that and gotten that right, we've gotten
really good players, good production. We've we've hit on draft picks,
and there's just been too many years where it feels
like they're not drafting the right type of guy, and
then that blows up in your face. And when we
saw that. You know, there's any number of different guys
you can look back on in recent years, and I
think they feel like they're they're back, maybe a little
(10:23):
bit more focused on that at least with some of
their their top picks here and How's a great example. Yeah,
I mean I think he earned that reputation at A
and M, and then.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
He proved it on the field as well.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
So I just think between that and then between the
you know, the accountability that everybody feels walking in the
room doesn't feel like a circus. I mean we've been
we've been whistling the circus music in the media room
there for a couple of years because every day was
like a new big top and it was like, it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
It feels professional right now.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It doesn't feel like every day and you walk in
wondering what's today's circus gonna bring us? You know, here
come the elephants right like that, No, it feels like
you're walking into a place with a high standard.
Speaker 3 (11:04):
I had.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I was talking to just Sear Taylor yesterday, new cornerback
who came in with the Jets the second half last year,
started his career as Chargers, and he was just his
eyes got real wide and he was talking to me.
He was like, no, you can like really feel the
standard and the expectations that everybody feels right now, like
they feel like this is going to be a great
team and there's no gray area on what that looks
(11:27):
like even right now.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And he's like, that's a you know, from a guy
who was at the Jets last year. I think he
felt like that was pretty refreshing. Probably you're talking about
it right now.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
And I took that as like, you know, guys are
feeling at the moment they walk in the door here
right now, and that's I mean, that's all you can
really ask for.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
For June, you.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
Look back on stuff that you were doing a year ago.
I'll have Facebook memories pop up, because you know, we
put the stupid show clips on social media, and it's like,
here's her memory from one year ago, and it's invariably
a clip of me sitting right here ranting and raving
about Trey Hendrickson. Are coming up with some bs take
on Trey Hendrickson, and it's like, man, there is a
(12:06):
part of me that does miss that. But the part
of me that wants this team to be really good
this season doesn't miss that at all. Paul Danner Juniors
with us from The Athletic and the Growler Podcast. We'll
talk about Joe Burrow's contract restructure and what it may
mean next on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
The UC Health Traffic Center at the UCSPN fifteen thirty
Moegger Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic is here really
good piece on DJ Turner and the dudes that you
might not expect to be at OTAs at OTA's also
wrote about Joe Burrow's contract restructure, and then he did
an episode of his podcast yesterday where we talked about
whether or not the brent S Benz Bridge would be
(12:53):
repaired in time to carry with it a Red's parade.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
That's that's the sort of hard hitting stuff he brings
me on for. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. We
had a few goods.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Somebody sent me, I feel like the Reds one that
we did should have been altered by the way. I
felt bad about it afterwards because I should have done
what what happens first the new bridge is complete or
the Reds win the division? Oh, it makes it a
little bit more accessible, Okay, a little. I think that's
a little bit because it's hard to win a title
like right, so that's a little bit.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I haven't won a division in fourteen years. Exactly exactly
what I think.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
I think it's a decent conversation, but I felt like
I felt like that would have been a little bit
more accurate.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
I was.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
I was a touch off in the comparison on that one.
Made it too easy to go bridge.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
I don't dabble into prediction markets or those those things
are creepy, but but that that one should be created.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Yes, it absolutely should be created.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
Jay and I we had a great time with the
what will happen first the uh or what's what's more likely,
the top three offense versus the top ten defense. We
were talking about that a little bit more today. By
the way, got a good nugget because in the middle
of that we talked about the nineteen eighty nine team. Yeah,
the nineteen eighty nine Bengals.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Which for those who haven't heard yesterday, this was yesterday,
yeh Growler podcast. It came up the eighty nine offense
led the league in total total.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Point they were to they were the last time the
Bengals were top three in offensive either yards or points,
so last time and they have.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
The eighty nine season has always been weird because it's
sandwiched between the Super Bowl season and then the team
that won, you know, was the last team to advance
in the postseason for thirty one years. The eighty nine
team started great and then sort of fizzled out, and
we went on this maybe three minute thing on the
A nineteen.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
But I was told then by a great friend at
Bengals PR that actually is a great nugget about that team.
They actually they had one hundred and nineteen plus one
nineteen point margin that season, which is the NFL record
for largest point margin and not having a winning record
really still is today, how about so?
Speaker 3 (14:59):
But you know, because they beat the Oilers sixty one
to seven.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Oh the number, there's there's four games like that, right,
They had a fifty six to twenty three, the sixty
one to seven game. There were like a forty one
to ten. They had four massive blowouts, right, and they
were two and five and one score games. And then
they lost on Christmas where they could have made twenty
nine to twenty one.
Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yeah, where they could have made the postseason.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
But I mean a team that was great, I mean
arguably just as good, like generally as the Super Bowl
team from the year before, but just things didn't go
their way.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
It was wonky.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
They couldn't win the close ones, and then it all
kind of started to fall apart after that.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
That Christmas Night nineteen eighty nine game, right, they lose
to the Vikings, and I remember the score because it
was in the world where college had a two point conversion,
the NFL did not, and so they were two possession loss.
The next year, my grandfather died on December the twenty third.
A few weeks after that, I described with my grandmother
in the room that Christmas nineteen eighty nine was the
(16:00):
worst Christmas of my life. She's like, not the one
where my husband died. Yeah, so that so that was good.
It shows the impact and that Houston sixty one seven game.
Everybody always misplaces that because the next year in the
playoffs they blew them out.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
But it wasn't sixty one to seven.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
The sixty one to seven game was a regular season game,
and people I think placed that in nineteen.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Ninety It was the game right before Minnesota. Yes, right
before the Minnesota games. Oh, they're going in. They just
scored sixty one last week and then we couldn't goin
in Minnesota and win.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Everything you've ever wanted to know about the nineteen ninety.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Nine tangent for me and you in one week.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
The Joe Burrow contract restructure. Yeah, the nuts and bolts
of it. Yeah, we know it's it's something else that
they don't do that they've done, which is great, But
the nuts and bolts of it. What impact is that
going to have only twenty twenty six Bengals.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I think it allows them to operate a little bit
more like the twenty twenty five Bengals did. From this
point forward. So think about what happened from this point forward.
Last year, Noah Fense, Felton Reisner trade for Flacco. They
were able to take on those things. A fan was
about three mil. Flacco I think they ended up paying
(17:11):
him about a little less than two. Riisner was a
little bit of the minimum. But they were able to
go out there and still be active. Not big moves, right,
And I mean, I know not to say that a
big move is not necessarily going to happen anymore, like
the Bengals have been different, but I'll say, like you know,
this is more about getting them back to normalcy, to
breatheable space. They were twenty ninth in cap space before this,
(17:34):
they had seven million. Now they have seventeen. It puts
them up to nineteenth. They're right in the middle. And
they usually, you know, they like to have money around
for practice, squad elevations, injuries, whatever. They want to be
able to move where the season evolves in different ways,
and they.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
Did that pretty good.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
I mean, those three moves were valuable last year, and
I think be making sure that you're still able to
do those is really important, and I think they felt
restricted in being able to do those right now on
top of just the regular stuff, and so yeah, from
the twenty twenty six standpoint, I think it just gets
(18:14):
them to ability to kind of move the same way
that they did last.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
So this isn't the cleared room to go get Bobby Wagner.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
I do not see that as being the case now,
unless Bobby Wagner's number comes down. I think they are
looking at this as if we have an opportunity, we
want to be able to take advantage of it. I
don't think that they felt like they coul take advantage
of any opportunity. That doesn't mean that Bobby Wagner's walking
through that door. I just think that there it would
(18:40):
still have to be a really good deal for them.
Doesn't still doesn't feel like, you know, there's not a
seventeen million dollar splash happening right right, and so but
I think if they feel like the right spot happens
and you can find the right number on somebody, I
would I would certainly for right now, pinpoint corner, line back,
swing tackle as your main three. But you know, it
(19:04):
takes one or two injuries in camp and all of
a sudden you're like, we need to go get somebody.
So I and then obviously once we get through all
of that and the ability of whatever that would look like.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
You know, the extensions are part of this.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Those don't typically have big you know, growth in cap
hits for the current year. That's not the way most
of those work, but they can and they do involve
money changing around a little bit. And so to be
able to go get that, to maybe get an extension
or two done, I do think is also partially a
part of this.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Does this for those who talk and it's not really
here in Cincinnati, but for those who talk endlessly about
Joe Burrow's relationship with the Bengals, does this tell us
that the relationship right now is pretty damn good?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Joe Burrow told us that it's pretty damn good. I mean,
the last time we talked to him, he said, people
maybe have everything we need. He said that, and he's
he said himself, people have been trashed in the front office.
That needs to end. They went and did it right.
That needs to end. That includes from Joe Burrow, right
it is how I take that. It's like I'm done
(20:09):
saying things about the front of We're good and then
the fact that yeah, there's yeah, I'll restructure my deal,
working very easily with them getting it done. Seeing we
have everything we need. All of that stuff to me
suggests that they are in as good of a place
as they've been in a long time, because you know,
(20:30):
we know that the public push has been out there.
He said the things that he said, and you know,
now the tone is just very different from him. I
tend to take him at his word. I don't think
he's lying to us, and his actions suggest the same.
So yeah, I think they're in a great place right now.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I have another quarterback contract question that we have to get.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
To when we come back. Okay, it is twenty eight
away from six o'clock.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Paul Danner Junior, The Athletic dot Com and The Growler
Podcast follow at Paul Danner Junior. Reds and Padres tied
to two sports headlines coming up as well. This is
ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 1 (21:12):
From Signs our Service at Kelsey Chevrolet, Home of lifetime
powertrain protection guarantee credit approval from their family to Yours
for Life Kelsey chev dot Com. Reds are playing on
Getaway Day in San Diego. They are headed to the
bottom of the sixth inning. Cincinnati blew a chance to
(21:34):
take the lead in the top six and the top
of the six, as a person who knows how to
speak might say, so, it's two to two Reds and
Padres bottom six. Spencer Steer a two run homer for Cincinnati.
Brady Singer five innings of work so far, giving up
the two Padres runs. Reds are home this weekend. Singer
on for the bottom of the six. Cincinnati in the
(21:54):
aftermath of that game yesterday were like every bullpen arm
had to pitch. Brings up Chase Petty, Zach mccambley sent
down to Louisville, Florence Yall's take on the New Jersey
Jackals tonight. Bob Huggins will be inducted into UC's Athletics
Hall of Fame on October the twenty third, is part
of the school's fiftieth Hall of Fame class. That is
homecoming weekend and Game four of the NBA Finals is
(22:17):
tonight in Madison Square, Guard Nicks and Spurs.
Speaker 3 (22:19):
New York is up two games to one. Are you nervous?
Send this to you off air. I was really filled.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
With anxiety going into Game three, I feel okay right now.
Speaker 3 (22:35):
You know why, I would feel really good if I
were you. I Wu Tang halftime in the house.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Yes, Wu Tang in the house in New York at halftime.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
Come on, you can't lose with Wu in the house.
Taylor Swift is also attending tonight. Is that true? That's true? Taran?
That is true? Correct?
Speaker 1 (22:55):
Today's gonna be at the game? Yes, Wow, my daughter's
back on board.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Oh my gosh, my kids are definitely gonna want to
the game.
Speaker 3 (23:05):
Wow. I feel.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
There's I feel just the basic nervousness that comes with
my team's playing at this stage in the season and
they're this close to winning. I felt like Monday was
a little bit much just Monday.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
It was about New.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
York and who's gonna be there, and how you're gonna
get there, and what the tickets cost, and the President's
coming in, and it just I'm certainly expecting the environment
tonight to be awesome and heated and maybe a little
bit pensive. But I think tonight's a little bit more
about basketball, a little bit more about basketball, and that'll help.
The road team has never won four straight games to
(23:44):
open the finals in NBA history. There's obviously a first
for everything. I think the fixes the next that we
need to make are are are not easy, but like
they're fixable. And maybe when min Yama not playing with
two nights rest.
Speaker 2 (24:02):
Will help us tonight, maybe that will help you. But
either way, I'm excited for it. You can't lose with
Wu Tang in the house.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
That's all on the winner tonight wins the series. Yes,
the winner tonight wins.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
The puss pull out the big dogs when you need them,
they're there.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
I love it. What else you got for me? Patrick
Mahomes has restructured his contract. Yeah, he got more money,
So he's.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Gonna make over five hundred million dollars in his reworked deal.
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, through twenty thirty three.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
Is there any Joe Burrow side effect impact anything there
remotely related to Pat's.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Probably a good reminder that if this year goes great,
it ain't gonna be long till Joe comes back to
the table. And I would feel like the Bengals would
probably welcome that, considering what the previous.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Conversations have been. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Sure, if he wants to come back to the table
and wants to be more here long term, I'm sure,
the Bengals would love to tie more money up into him,
especially if he can have a year like this like
they people have this year and you know, MVP super Bowl,
all the stuff that feels like it's being talked about
right now. If you do that, yeah, I think he
would want to come. He should want to try to
(25:10):
make more money, and the Bengals would probably love to
have that be the conversation.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Yeah, all right, so we're.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Gonna be talking soon about Joe Burrow making over half
a billion dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:20):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
I mean I don't know all these guys, right, I mean,
it's every year like this. I mean, whether it doesn't
matter who it is, Like we'll be talking about Lamar soon,
we'll be talking about all the Josh Allen like these
new deals will get done. They all top each other.
The cap keeps going up. Quarterbacks not getting less valuable.
They have nothing but more leverage every year, Like you know,
(25:42):
I think at a certain point, Yeah, this is always
going to be part of the conversation is whenever the
quarterback has the most leverage and decide it's time to
come get it, they can come get it.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Yeah, you mentioned we were talking about the Burrow restructure,
and like, is there money there for a swing talk,
money there for a slock corner? Money there maybe for
a linebacker, and obviously having money to react to things
as training camp and as the season unfold. Is there
a position where it would make sense to add one
(26:13):
more guy that we're not talking about beyond those three
positions you referenced before.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Beyond those three we have a hard time getting past
those three right now. Corner in particular, Charlie and I,
Charlie Goldsmith and I were talking a little bit about
the comparison between the Reds bullpen and the Bengals cornerback position.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
Oh no, no, no, it hasn't gotten there yet.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
But you felt good about the bullpen entering this season.
You did right, yes, Like, but there's volatility in it
in general, and cornerback play can be like that, and
you can be one injury, a couple guys that you're
betting on that don't quite get there, and then one
injury and suddenly you know you're playing guys and it's
(26:58):
not going well, and it can get ugly real quick when.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
You're exposed out there.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Right, similar type of feel of what could happen if
you had some of the same things that have happened
to the Reds bullpen, and I don't necessarily think you
could ever predict that that would happen at one position.
But I just there's a lot of you know, behind
DJ and Dax, and it's a high injury position, and
both those guys have had injuries. I just there's a
lot of bets that are unproven or journeyman or whatever.
(27:27):
Yeah that or rookie that you're trying to make at
a very important, easily exposed position that worry me. Where
it feels like you would just like.
Speaker 3 (27:39):
To have.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
A veteran and that has a bunch of starts played
in this league be there in the background if if needed,
or called upon that song.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
See as we're saying this, I'm trying to go, Okay,
Jalen Davis is Tony Santion, Maybe right it would be.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Who Yeah, the guy who kind of came on and
was the the great field.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
Good story of last year.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
But we all recognize that it's not necessarily a sustainable
A little bit too much to be asking him to
be too much.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Yeah, I mean that's that's possible in that scenario. These
aren't comparisons. I was hoping to. And I'm not saying
it's gonna go that way.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
I'm just saying that is a position where you're just
you're always your depth is always tested at corner every year, right,
And and I like the idea of could dj Ivy
be something? Maybe Tokario Davis has a good future. Jalen
Davis just to your tailor at Taylor seems nice, like like, oh,
this is the things you could do with the slot
(28:40):
position between Kyle Duggar and cashus how and the fun
hybrid pieces there, Like that's all great conversation, but it's
all a lot of unproven thought exercise. And so I
I just I like something that feels a little more solid. Well, yeah,
there's this here. Yeah, right, we always have Rasseul Douglas,
(29:04):
you know, like and if that at least he's started
a ninety games and was a starter the last two years.
He knows what he's doing, right, like Apple and Eli
Apple type, Yeah, right, who's there if you need him?
And I just that's where I'm at with that position
right now.
Speaker 3 (29:21):
Josh Newton would be like Sam Moule, can you pick
up a bun?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
Josh Newton would be I'm trying to think who who
is still here? Despite playing terrible last year. It was
rough for Josh and that doesn't you know that. I
don't think he's part of the equation right now unless
something changes dramatically in this training.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Is there any job in all of sports that invites
more ridicule than bad bullpen orm?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Oh no, no, because you're already on the outskirts, right
You're outskirts of the conversation anyway. You're always you know,
one two bad weeks from being in Louisville, like everybody
and is anymore, and they're so valid Ole. I just
there's such a name that you they're fleeting. You forget
that they were everything around.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
It's well, I used to love to make fun of
Joel Konell, but he's now good with the Brewers, so
I can't can't drop that name anymore.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
I just know this.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
In the last like three weeks, including with you, In
any text that is involved like somebody screwing something up
or having to apologize for something, it's like, ah, sorry,
I'm the Pierce Johnson of grilling out, like I mean,
even like with my my wife and I like I'm
not going to cut the grass tonight. I'm as I'm
as reliable as I hate making fun of tj Antone
(30:41):
because he's such a nice guy and he's such a
cool story. But I'm as reliable as I don't. I
don't give me Luis May Yeah, yeah, yeah, Zach Maxwell,
just so many. It was a guy named mccambley now
on the team. Something I didn't get to get to
this with you last week you joined me. Zach Taylor
(31:02):
had a press conference, yeah, and he was I think
seventeen minutes late for the press conference. Yeah. I think
he was supposed to be a two thirty. Sure, got
there a two forty seven, and it was everything okay,
everything was fine. The practice went a little bit later.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
I think the practice was ten minutes later than originally thought.
And I'm very happy that he did go late because
that was the time where we got Eric all last week,
that's right, which was great.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You were here and you wrote about Eric Hall, and
I was really happy.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I didn't know if the late arrival for the press
conference was related to the distance between where he lives
and where he works. By the way, JJ Blede has
just gone long and I got you to laugh.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
So I like.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
That one that brought that one back. It killed me.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
I was so mad at myself because two weeks ago
you got short with me because I referenced, you know,
Brian Schottenheimer, the coach of the Cowboys, is moving closer
to the Cowboys facility, because that's what football coaches have
to do. And then you know this is my favorite trope.
And then last week you joined me from the immediate
aftermath of the press conference. We covered all these topics,
(32:11):
and I forgot to throw at you like was Zach
late because he was late to work because he doesn't
live close enough to the stadium, And I didn't do it,
and it's bothered me for a week.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
See, And now I'm disappointed too, because I've now gotten
accustomed this time of year, the last couple of weeks
coming here and you trying to get me irritated, and
you didn't do that. Today, you didn't even do that.
I'm kind of this is how good.
Speaker 3 (32:36):
The vibes are.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Everybody's in such a good mood that I can't even
irritate you in the middle of June.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
I know this is I don't like it at all.
What are we doing? Cal Trey hendrickson the wet blanket.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Paul Danner Junior read his work covering the Bengals Theathletic
dot Com and listen to the Growler podcast and I
appreciate it as always.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (32:57):
Well there's the music. We're done. The show is OK.
Programming note, I'm off tomorrow. Chad Brenda will be here.
I return on Friday. Load management season has begun. Have
a great night. Thank you for listening. Anything you might
have missed go listen to on the iHeartRadio app thanks
to a long Neck sports Grill. Don't forget Tony and
Austin with Tony's since E three sixty at noon, and
(33:20):
I will talk to you on Friday. Have a great
night and have a great Thursday as well. Thanks to
Tarren Bland for producing. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. So
next ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
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