July 14, 2026 • 32 mins
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
It's that time time, Time, Luck and Load.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Michael Verie Show is on the air.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
I received an email yesterday after our discussion on what
I considered something of an anomaly in data related to Catholics.
If baptisms are down and first communions are down, why
are confirmations up? What's going on in our society? I
(00:45):
am very interested in the relationship between individuals acting individually
and organized religion Christianity, whether on a personal level or
a church association, and how those individual decisions add up
(01:07):
to create a more sweeping assessment of what's happening. Why
are people doing these things? Each person is making an
individual decision. So the email said, I'm a regular listener
with Lizon Richmond reaching out to offer my services as
a Catholic consultant. I was prompted to contact you because
of several things I heard on this morning show regarding
(01:27):
church teaching that were misleading or inaccurate.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
There were so.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Many that I wanted to explain or refute, but was
unable to do so. Unable to do so. My personal
background is this. I'm a former devout Southern Baptist who's
a Catholic convert of thirty six years Over the past
thirty six years, I have studied the teachings, doctrines, canon law,
and related matters of the Catholic faith. I also keep
falling ever more deeply in love with Jesus and the
church he established. I don't consider myself an apologist, but
(01:54):
I am literally an evangelist, and I have a doctoral
degree as confirmation of this claim. What this means in
practice is that I desire to awaken others to the
importance of a personal relationship with our Lord and Savior
and his Church, so that they might walk the narrow
road and enter the narrow gate Matthew seven thirteen through fourteen,
choosing his way to eternal life over the easy, self
centered life that leads to spiritual death.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
If you think I might have.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Something to offer you or your listeners, please respond to
this email or contact me at the number below. PS
I enjoy your show, and I did. And here she
is Marilyn Wesson. Welcome to the program.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Well, thank you for having me. It's such a blessing
to speak with you in your audience.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I must say, and I say things that upset people.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I was surprised I don't regularly hear Catholics make statements
like this. I desire to awaken others to the importance
of a personal relationship with our Lord and Savior and
his Church. I don't hear people, I don't hear Catholics
evangelizing for Jesus Christ. I hear Catholics evangelizing for church membership.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
That's what I hear. That doesn't mean it's true.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I was surprised to hear you say that it sounded
to me more like a Southern Baptist than a Catholic.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Well, actually, it's very christa centric, i e. It's centered
on the teachings of Christ, and that is the bottom line.
That is what I do. I am not here to
My place in the world is not to try to
convince people. It's to teach and inform and educate or
(03:34):
whatever it's I'm a seed sewer. That's how I look
at my role as a lay person in the church.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And you get paid for this, Do you do you
pay your bills in this way?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
No?
Speaker 1 (03:45):
No, I mean I have. I've worked in different capacities
at the parish level. I am currently a consult uh
uh contributing author with my publisher on a war project
they're working on which I get compensated for contract. You
(04:06):
know contract, we have a contract, and yeah, I had no,
I do not. My day job is dedicated solely to
the research in writing for whatever I see as a need.
And that became really apparent back about eleven years ago
(04:29):
when the Pew Report came out about the changing landscape
of religious landscape in America, and it broke my heart.
It just truly did. I've been feeling some of this
stuff in when I heard your interest in the data
around surrounding all of that and everything that's come forward
(04:52):
since it was I believe it was just a divine
intervention that I happened to be in the car when
that segment was on yesterday and I heard it, and
I just said, I've got to email Michael and offer
my services if you will.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Well, let's talk a little bit about Well, first of all,
I want to give you an opportunity and don't be
afraid to criticize me.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
I'm a big boy.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
You said, I heard several things that were misleading or inaccurate.
Tell me what those things are. I'm no Catholic expert,
that's for.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Sure, right right, And you know what I'm I would
say very humbly. My daughter can think so otherwise She's
told me, yes, mom, you are an expert. You are,
And I said, no, that's to me hubris to say,
I'm definitely an experiment this because I'm always learning and
every day I'm a little more embarrassed about what I
(05:45):
did though five ten years ago, a year ago. You know,
I'm learning as I grow and bought this journey and
what really, you know, some of the comments about the
annulment process specifically is what I had and talking about
the what you call it the RCAIA, it's actually the
(06:05):
o CIA now because there is a movement in the
church to better reflect the fact that the process of
becoming is that they play Catholic is sort of an organic,
holistic journey of initiation into Roman Catholic Church because and
(06:25):
it's not like you're having to go through some secret
classes on you know, secret handshakes and all that sort
of thing. Know, it's just that learning what it means
to follow the teachings of the Church, which are the
teachings of Jesus, and you have to put you have
(06:45):
to put together what Scripture says plus what the Apostolic fathers.
Those were the first Christian church leaders what they thought.
You have to follow that thread to understand why.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Certain let's drill down because that's that's very amorphous.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
So so, first of all, if you say it's.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Not the r C I A. I didn't know what
that was. I read it from an email from the listener.
But if you go to Mycatholic dot life, it says
becoming Catholic through the Right of Christian Initiation for adults
r C I A.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Why is it important to say O C I A.
And what is the O?
Speaker 1 (07:22):
The O is the Anglicized version of Latin, which means
order order of the I know it's.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
And so why is that? Why is that distinction important.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Because it reflects better the Latin translation of what it
was termed originally, but also to reflect more of a
journey versus just about the rights. Uh, they want the
church wanted to correct the misinterpretation, if you will, of
it being strictly about learning about ritual and all that
(07:57):
is involved, which is part of the problem, but more
about formation.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
Well, it's interesting you say that and you come from
a Southern Baptist background, because that's one of my criticisms
to Catholic friends.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Is it feels more.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Like going through the motions than an actual active faith.
We'll talk more about Catholicism coming up. Marilyn Wesson is
our guest. We're talking about Catholicism, and she is a
convert from a Southern Baptist to a Catholic. She spent
a lot of time and effort. She's written several books.
(08:30):
I've posted to Facebook a link to some of those
some of her work, if you would like to learn
more about that, Marilyn, I want to get into some
hard hitting or fast action question and answer, so if
you would kind of keep them a little bit brief,
I want to start with what you must have heard
me talking about yesterday. I saw the data that said
(08:53):
in nineteen sixty five Catholic baptisms were high, nineteen ninety
they were down, and in twenty twenty five their way down.
First communions were also down, but confirmations were way up
from ninety to twenty twenty five. And had a number
of different answers as to one, what do you make
of that?
Speaker 1 (09:14):
Well, I think what has what happened over that time
is adults. Well, first of all, the reason why there
was a decline overall and all across the board was
because a lot of different changes that were happening so theologically,
culturally in our world at that time, during that time period.
(09:38):
But at the same time, people there's there's that portion
of us, that spiritual being that is created in the
image of God, which hungers for truth, which hungers for righteousness,
and we search about it and we search for it
in different ways. But my experience has been because I
taught o CIA, which is a recent change, by the
(10:00):
way our say was what it was up until about
a year or so ago. And what I found with
people that were coming in is they felt like they
found something that was concrete, that was made sense and
appealed to their intellect. But it also that was what
(10:21):
my responsibility was to help them connect it with what
they were feeling in their hearts, to connect the heart
and the mind so that then the behaviors would follow.
So that's the short answer to that.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
And here you stay right on the microphone, Maryland, because
you're kind of cutting.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
A little bit in and out.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
So, but what I read this data to say, and
this is just cold data, is that a lot of
people are coming to the Catholic Church, are coming back
to the Catholic Church one or the other. We don't
get the qualitative, We just get the quantitative. Who were
not in the Catholic Church by bad you know, as
a baby, nor as whenever first communion?
Speaker 2 (11:01):
And what do you make of that?
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Well, again, I think it's the attraction of the concrete
uh teaching and then form if it's done properly. Formation.
And that's what It takes a while to go through
that process because it's it's not about learning how to
be a Catholic about the rituals. It is about developing
(11:26):
that relationship with Jesus. It's a form it's a formative process.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
It should be this.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Let me ask you, let me ask you this the
priest scandal.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
And by the way, the Catholics aren't the only ones
who had this, It's just they're the more organized church.
And you could you could apply there were lots of
Southern Baptist individual churches that had scandals and other denominations.
But I know for a fact Southern Baptist churches and
and youth ministers and song ministers and and the pastor
and and they had their own problems.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
With the Catholic Church.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
The Catholic Church, fairly or unfairly, came under a lot
of fire, not just for the actions of priests, but
for covering it up and moving them down the road.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
And I think you had the movie about it, or
two movies about it.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
You had a lot of talk about it, and you
had the settlements and all that, And it feels like
the Catholic Church has moved on past that, and I
assume they've dealt with it with internal policy changes. It
also feels to me like the Catholic Church moved past
that dark time that maybe kept people away.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
I don't know if that's true, but I suspect that.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Oh, I think you're absolutely right. I think about the
ambals of particularly the late nineties, when everything was the
light was being shed on some of the evil players
in that whole issue, and it was definitely it was
definitely one of the reasons why.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
There was a full.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Faith. But what what I attributed, Man, I.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Don't I don't know what you're doing, but you're moving
around and we're getting about every third word. So I
just I got right on the Okay.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Okay, I'll give them, yes, Okay. I think looking at
it rationally from my perspective is that it was truly
an attack by Staytan on the Church, playing on the
weaknesses of human beings. And you know, understand that the
Church on Earth, of any denomination, is comprised of human
(13:36):
beings who have faults and failings. But the Catholic Church,
particularly in America, has been a target for a lot
of you know, we're worried about any Semitism. Now, there's
a strong vein of anti Catholicism and always has been
running through the Christian community in general. For the church, yeah,
(14:00):
I mean, I know. I grew up sitting around a
Southern Baptist table hearing things, and so I knew what
was being said. I have firsthand knowledge of what the
attitudes were and which, interestingly enough, I was always told that, oh,
you can't go into a Catholic church. It's evil, you know,
(14:21):
and you know God will strike you dead, I mean not,
you know, to that degree. And so I was like, oh,
I never will. I did, and here I am. So
I'm a Catholic theologian. Go figure that.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
No, I think that's fair. My parents didn't have that view,
you know. We I went to youth Catholic events with
friends of mine but there was a very small Catholic
presence in my part of the Golden Triangle, and and
there weren't very many of my peers who were raised
Catholic there or were involved in the Catholic Church. Of course,
(14:53):
we didn't have but one Jewish family and a couple
of Mormon families, and so it was largely, almost exclusively
Southern Baptist. But I think a lot of that depends
on where you're raised. I think, you know, if you're
from Boston or New York, or Baltimore or Philly, Chicago,
even Detroit, you're going to find a lot more traditional
Catholics in that manner. I will also say that I
(15:15):
noted an increasing conservatism among America's Catholics, and I found
that to be an interesting you know, it was the
case in nineteen ninety that Catholics voted Democrat more often,
and that is moving. The data shows self described in
the way of conservatism, and I think that's pretty I
got about thirty seconds if you want to speak to that.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Well. I think that what you saw the vood that
there had everything, if not most, things to do with
the pro life movement. It was just you know, the
fact the Democratic Party got really behind abortion.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
I think you're right.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
That's an interesting and I think very insightful point. I
think that that was probably more to do with Green
catholicsen than anything.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Else with Bizar of talk radio The Michael Berry Show.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
Wadys July fourth, in nineteen thirty two, Del Reeves was born.
He died in two thousand and seven on New Year's Day.
Dell was not his full name. It wasn't d A. L. E.
It was d El, short for Delano, as in Franklin
Delano Reeves. He was fd R, And of course he
(16:32):
was named for the president at the time, one of
the worst presidents we ever had, Franklin Delano Roosevelt. On
this day, in nineteen ninety eight, Richard McDonald died. He
was the co founder of McDonald's Fast Food along with
his brother Maurice. Nineteen forty eight, the brothers fully redesigned
(16:55):
and rebuilt their little restaurant in San Bernardino to focus
on a reduced menu consisting of nine items. In addition
to their fifteen cent one five cent hamburger. That menu
would include a cheeseburger, and they really spiced it up.
You could add a cheat you could add a slice
of cheese to your meat, soft drinks, milk coffee, potato chips.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
And a slice of pie.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
The McDonald's brother's restaurant was a raging success and with
the goal of making a million dollars before they turned fifty.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
It's a lot of money back then.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
The McDonald brothers began franchising their system in nineteen fifty three,
beginning with the restaurant in Phoenix, Arizona, operated by Neil Fox.
The brothers drew the attention of Ray Kroc, a milkshake
mixer salesman for Prince Class Castle. He was out selling
the mixers to make milkshakes. After they purchased eight of
(17:55):
his multi mixers for their San Bernardino, California restaurant, Kroc
visited the restaurant in nineteen fifty four, Hey, this is
a good customer. That year the McDonald brothers hired Kroc
as their franchise agent.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
This guy's good.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Kroc took one point nine percent of the gross sales,
of which the McDonald brothers got point five percent, So
he's three to one on the take from them. But
he's the one out knocking on the doors and traveling
and covering his own expenses, Kroc became frustrated with the
McDonald brothers desire to maintain a small number of restaurants.
The brothers also consistently told Kroc he could not make
(18:32):
changes to things like the original blueprint, but despite him
begging and pleading with him, the brothers would not send
any formal letters that legally allowed the changes in the chain.
By nineteen sixty one, he had bought the company for
two point seven million dollars, calculated so as to ensure
each brother received you guessed it the million dollars after taxes.
(18:54):
At the closing, he became annoyed that the brothers would
not transfer to him the real estate and rights to
the original San Bernardino location. The brothers had told Kroc
they were giving the operation, property and all to the
founding employees. In his anger, Krot later opened a new
McDonald's restaurant near the original McDonald's, which had been renamed
The Big M because the brothers had neglected to retain
(19:16):
rights to the name.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
The Big M closed six years later.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
It is alleged that is part of the buyout, Krot promised,
based on a handshake, to continue the annual one percent
royalty of the original agreement, but there is no evidence
of this beyond a claim by a nephew of the
McDonald brothers, and that would add up to be a
lot of money. Neither of the brothers publicly expressed disappointment
over the deal. Speaking to someone about the buyout, Richard
(19:40):
McDonald reportedly said he had no regrets. On November thirtieth,
nineteen eighty four, Richard McDonald, the first cook behind the
grill of the McDonald's, was served the ceremonial fifty billionth
McDonald's hamburger by Ed Rindsay, then President of McDonald's USA,
at the Grand Hyatt Hotel in New York City. This
was an old Willard Scott commercial Ronald McDonald commercial. They
(20:04):
say it was the first one and producing the world's
Lewis mc hillias and hamburger eating.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Us Brown Ronald McDonald's.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
Ronald, Hey, isn't watching TV? First thing you got delicious
McDonald hamburger, Ronald. You can't be on TV and watch
it at the same time.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Now, come on and meet the boys and girl. Oh
you've already met.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
I know we're gonna be praised too, because I like
to do everything boys and girls like to do. Firstly,
when it comes to deep nose delicious McDonald Sambergers, I
manage the crator keeps me. Weal with the blood McDonald samburgers,
frinch rhymes, and milk. See watch for Me on TV.
We'll have lots of fun.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
McDonald Hamburger Happy.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Is his favorite place.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
There is a really really good movie. Now is it
historically accurate? When I tell you a song is good,
or a movie is good, or whatever else, that doesn't
mean that I think that it is historically accurate or
that there isn't a dispute about it.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
I don't know why people insist on doing this. It's
a good movie.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
It's one data point to consider in the growth of
what became America's and the world's largest fast food chain
and what spawned a lot of copycats that today are
still around. And it's Michael Keaton. It's one of my
favorite I didn't I'm not a big one for the
Batman stuff, but it may be my favorite Michael Keaton role.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
There's one other one.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
I'm trying to think of it as a little phantasma gore,
which is not normally my thing, but he's good in
that one.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
But the movie itself is called Founder. I thought it
was The Founder, but I looked it up.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
It's just Founder, and it's Michael Keaton as Ray Krost
And and it's a really really fascinating story of the
grit determination, consistency, recklessness, fearlessness, of the types of people
(22:17):
who end up being who end up being first generation
self made billionaires.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
And are they always perfect?
Speaker 6 (22:28):
No?
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Would everybody else like some of their money? Do they
have too much money either? We hear all these these
these things, but at the end of it, what no
one realizes is that for every billion every self made billionaire,
which is how most billionaires became billionaires, not all. There's
some Walton Airs, there will be some Coke heirs, but
(22:51):
most of the cell of the of the self made billionaires,
For every one of them, there's a thousand guys that
are broke that their wife leaves them because they're tired
of having to move from rent hoouse to renthouse and
not have any money. Because Bob keeps trying to open
a business that fails. We talked to Mike Shane yesterday,
(23:13):
who was the executive director of the Houston Chapter and
some other chapters of the Texas Restaurant Association. And this
is a guy who counsels advises, mentors restaurant owners around
the region. And as he admitted, they went out of
business in twenty twenty three.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
It's not just a food business. Owning a business is
really tough for everybody criticizing business owners. Give it a try.
To come back and talk to me and this other guy,
Michael Barry.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
That is Harry Dean Stanton. Not the greatest vocalist of
all time, but man, what a career. He hated being
called a character actor, hated that term, but he was
and he was a damn good one.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Roger Ebert said.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
No movie with Harry Dean Stanton or Emmett Walsh can
be a bad movie.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
But later he said, they said, what about.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Dream A Little Dream? I think that was a movie
that they said that about. He said, well, okay, that
might violate the rule. My favorite Harry Dean Stanton role.
I know people are gonna say cool hand Lou Godfather,
twin Peaks. There's a number of movies that he was in.
My favorite role that he ever played, and the one
I quote the most and loved the most. You know
(24:37):
what it is, Jim I've narrowed it down, huh, not
Big Love, I've narrowed it way down. Well, he's in
a bunch of movies. But the scene in Red Dawn,
oh man, maybe because of where I was at that
moment in my life and what that movie meant to me.
(24:59):
My goodness, was that ever a scene?
Speaker 6 (25:01):
Wow?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Sh I was talking to somebody the other day about that.
Who was I talking to about that? That moment? And
Wolverine and that cast. You know, I gotta think about
when those movies came out where exactly I would have been.
But those guys weren't much well, they were playing characters
(25:24):
that weren't much older than me.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
They were older than me.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
But that whole cast of guys, Matt Dillon, Emilio, Estabz,
Charlie Sheen, Patrick Swayze, Tom Cruise was in The Outsider.
C Thomas Howell is that his name?
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Man?
Speaker 3 (25:40):
That those series of movies that came out for guys
that are my age. They don't know exactly what I'm
talking about, the Outsiders of Ralph Mancio obviously in that one.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I mean that movie.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I go back now and there's people I forget that
we're in it, like Tom Cruise is in have a
major role, and the people I forget who were in it,
and and I forget how powerful those roles were.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Omit, you have it. Go ahead. I can't afford to
be crying anymore.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Now.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I won't either one of you ever have a I'll
ever do it as.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Long as you live. Where's my dab record?
Speaker 7 (26:24):
I don't know, Son, Well, get going, now, get out
before they find you.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Yes, I love you.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
I know you did, Son, I love you too.
Speaker 6 (26:55):
What man, I still get chill bumps.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
I still get chill bumps I got.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
I got an email this morning from someone who I
respect in a door and love genuinely.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
He said, Uh, you know, I disagree with you over
your opinion of.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Lindsey Graham and Lindsey Graham there was nothing wrong with
Lindsey Graham being in Ukraine the day before he died,
and that Lindsey Grahm's a patriot, and that the Ukrainians
are doing something very important in fighting the Russians, and
that I grew up crawling under the desk from the
(27:50):
bomb threat of the Russians attacking and I still think
they mean us harm. And are you telling me you
like Putin, And as I said, I love and adore
this person, and I don't take it personally to disagree
over policy or people with people that I like, But
(28:12):
not everyone has that approach, and so for me, these
discussions are enjoyable. They're engaging, they're entertaining there they're enlightening,
and they force you. They force you to make arguments,
they force you to ask yourself why you think the
way you do. And so, you know, most people, you'd
(28:34):
be surprised if you gave your honest opinions, your real, honest,
unvarnished opinions, day in and day out, no quote unquote
political correctness.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
You're in the minority on some issues, and you don't.
Speaker 3 (28:50):
Realize a lot of people are. If people know what
I think, boy, let them have it. You would until
you realize that the very people you care about will
then will then question their love for you, They will
question your wisdom, they will question whether you're even a
good person. Because forcing people to question that which they
(29:14):
have already put to bed is a very discomforting experience
for most people. Most people don't want to think a
new about a person or a concept that they believed
for a long time.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
You probably know about the study.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
Where I think it was at Stanford where they give
them twenty dollars to convince the group and a dollar
to convince the group and the dollar one.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
And what it supposedly reveals is kind of that.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
The standard example used there is that people do not
want to change. People do not want to reconsider something
where they have come to a conclusion already, and they
will do anything to stop it.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
You want to know why we.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Will never have a proper hearing and proper accountability for
COVID and for all the horror that was conducted, because
it would force people to admit they were wrong. You
want to know why so many Jews will not vote
Republican no matter what is done in this country, because
(30:19):
it would force them to admit they were wrong.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
We could go on and on.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
You want to know why so many people will not
undo Obamacare or speak ill of Obamacare because it would
force them to admit they were wrong. And it is
easier to just hope it's forgotten than to correct the record,
and people do not do that lightly. So are the
(30:45):
Russians our primary threat?
Speaker 2 (30:46):
No, they're not. It's not even close. Are the Ukrainians.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
Valiantly battling the Russians, and by them battling the Russians,
we don't have to know this is bunk. We are
making their top tier leadership rich, and I dare say
we're making Americans rich who they are kicking back that
money to. And no amount of wrapping yourself in the
(31:15):
flag is going to change my opinion.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
But these are the conversations.
Speaker 6 (31:20):
We should be happy.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
If nothing else, It's a good way to pass our time.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I'm glad you're here with us, But heck, we might
even be changing somebody's opinion. You never know who's going
to be listening. We once got a band a gig
on Saturday Night Live because the executive producer of Saturday
Night Live was driving through the Catskills and listening to
our show on podcast and heard me play a band
(31:45):
in His secretary, whose dad was the head of GE
at the time, sent me an email said who is
the band? And two weeks later there they were playing.
So you just never know. This is a slight humble
bract close the show. I didn't mean for it to be,
but it ended up that way.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
I guess
It's that time time, Time, Luck and Load.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Michael Verie Show is on the air.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
I received an email yesterday after our discussion on what
I considered something of an anomaly in data related to Catholics.
If baptisms are down and first communions are down, why
are confirmations up? What's going on in our society? I
(00:45):
am very interested in the relationship between individuals acting individually
and organized religion Christianity, whether on a personal level or
a church association, and how those individual decisions add up
(01:07):
to create a more sweeping assessment of what's happening. Why
are people doing these things? Each person is making an
individual decision. So the email said, I'm a regular listener
with Lizon Richmond reaching out to offer my services as
a Catholic consultant. I was prompted to contact you because
of several things I heard on this morning show regarding
(01:27):
church teaching that were misleading or inaccurate.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
There were so.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
Many that I wanted to explain or refute, but was
unable to do so. Unable to do so. My personal
background is this. I'm a former devout Southern Baptist who's
a Catholic convert of thirty six years Over the past
thirty six years, I have studied the teachings, doctrines, canon law,
and related matters of the Catholic faith. I also keep
falling ever more deeply in love with Jesus and the
church he established. I don't consider myself an apologist, but
(01:54):
I am literally an evangelist, and I have a doctoral
degree as confirmation of this claim. What this means in
practice is that I desire to awaken others to the
importance of a personal relationship with our Lord and Savior
and his Church, so that they might walk the narrow
road and enter the narrow gate Matthew seven thirteen through fourteen,
choosing his way to eternal life over the easy, self
centered life that leads to spiritual death.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
If you think I might have.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Something to offer you or your listeners, please respond to
this email or contact me at the number below. PS
I enjoy your show, and I did. And here she
is Marilyn Wesson. Welcome to the program.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Well, thank you for having me. It's such a blessing
to speak with you in your audience.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I must say, and I say things that upset people.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I was surprised I don't regularly hear Catholics make statements
like this. I desire to awaken others to the importance
of a personal relationship with our Lord and Savior and
his Church. I don't hear people, I don't hear Catholics
evangelizing for Jesus Christ. I hear Catholics evangelizing for church membership.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
That's what I hear. That doesn't mean it's true.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I was surprised to hear you say that it sounded
to me more like a Southern Baptist than a Catholic.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Well, actually, it's very christa centric, i e. It's centered
on the teachings of Christ, and that is the bottom line.
That is what I do. I am not here to
My place in the world is not to try to
convince people. It's to teach and inform and educate or
(03:34):
whatever it's I'm a seed sewer. That's how I look
at my role as a lay person in the church.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And you get paid for this, Do you do you
pay your bills in this way?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
No?
Speaker 1 (03:45):
No, I mean I have. I've worked in different capacities
at the parish level. I am currently a consult uh
uh contributing author with my publisher on a war project
they're working on which I get compensated for contract. You
(04:06):
know contract, we have a contract, and yeah, I had no,
I do not. My day job is dedicated solely to
the research in writing for whatever I see as a need.
And that became really apparent back about eleven years ago
(04:29):
when the Pew Report came out about the changing landscape
of religious landscape in America, and it broke my heart.
It just truly did. I've been feeling some of this
stuff in when I heard your interest in the data
around surrounding all of that and everything that's come forward
(04:52):
since it was I believe it was just a divine
intervention that I happened to be in the car when
that segment was on yesterday and I heard it, and
I just said, I've got to email Michael and offer
my services if you will.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Well, let's talk a little bit about Well, first of all,
I want to give you an opportunity and don't be
afraid to criticize me.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
I'm a big boy.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
You said, I heard several things that were misleading or inaccurate.
Tell me what those things are. I'm no Catholic expert,
that's for.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Sure, right right, And you know what I'm I would
say very humbly. My daughter can think so otherwise She's
told me, yes, mom, you are an expert. You are,
And I said, no, that's to me hubris to say,
I'm definitely an experiment this because I'm always learning and
every day I'm a little more embarrassed about what I
(05:45):
did though five ten years ago, a year ago. You know,
I'm learning as I grow and bought this journey and
what really, you know, some of the comments about the
annulment process specifically is what I had and talking about
the what you call it the RCAIA, it's actually the
(06:05):
o CIA now because there is a movement in the
church to better reflect the fact that the process of
becoming is that they play Catholic is sort of an organic,
holistic journey of initiation into Roman Catholic Church because and
(06:25):
it's not like you're having to go through some secret
classes on you know, secret handshakes and all that sort
of thing. Know, it's just that learning what it means
to follow the teachings of the Church, which are the
teachings of Jesus, and you have to put you have
(06:45):
to put together what Scripture says plus what the Apostolic fathers.
Those were the first Christian church leaders what they thought.
You have to follow that thread to understand why.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Certain let's drill down because that's that's very amorphous.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
So so, first of all, if you say it's.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Not the r C I A. I didn't know what
that was. I read it from an email from the listener.
But if you go to Mycatholic dot life, it says
becoming Catholic through the Right of Christian Initiation for adults
r C I A.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
Why is it important to say O C I A.
And what is the O?
Speaker 1 (07:22):
The O is the Anglicized version of Latin, which means
order order of the I know it's.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
And so why is that? Why is that distinction important.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Because it reflects better the Latin translation of what it
was termed originally, but also to reflect more of a
journey versus just about the rights. Uh, they want the
church wanted to correct the misinterpretation, if you will, of
it being strictly about learning about ritual and all that
(07:57):
is involved, which is part of the problem, but more
about formation.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
Well, it's interesting you say that and you come from
a Southern Baptist background, because that's one of my criticisms
to Catholic friends.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Is it feels more.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Like going through the motions than an actual active faith.
We'll talk more about Catholicism coming up. Marilyn Wesson is
our guest. We're talking about Catholicism, and she is a
convert from a Southern Baptist to a Catholic. She spent
a lot of time and effort. She's written several books.
(08:30):
I've posted to Facebook a link to some of those
some of her work, if you would like to learn
more about that, Marilyn, I want to get into some
hard hitting or fast action question and answer, so if
you would kind of keep them a little bit brief,
I want to start with what you must have heard
me talking about yesterday. I saw the data that said
(08:53):
in nineteen sixty five Catholic baptisms were high, nineteen ninety
they were down, and in twenty twenty five their way down.
First communions were also down, but confirmations were way up
from ninety to twenty twenty five. And had a number
of different answers as to one, what do you make
of that?
Speaker 1 (09:14):
Well, I think what has what happened over that time
is adults. Well, first of all, the reason why there
was a decline overall and all across the board was
because a lot of different changes that were happening so theologically,
culturally in our world at that time, during that time period.
(09:38):
But at the same time, people there's there's that portion
of us, that spiritual being that is created in the
image of God, which hungers for truth, which hungers for righteousness,
and we search about it and we search for it
in different ways. But my experience has been because I
taught o CIA, which is a recent change, by the
(10:00):
way our say was what it was up until about
a year or so ago. And what I found with
people that were coming in is they felt like they
found something that was concrete, that was made sense and
appealed to their intellect. But it also that was what
(10:21):
my responsibility was to help them connect it with what
they were feeling in their hearts, to connect the heart
and the mind so that then the behaviors would follow.
So that's the short answer to that.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
And here you stay right on the microphone, Maryland, because
you're kind of cutting.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
A little bit in and out.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
So, but what I read this data to say, and
this is just cold data, is that a lot of
people are coming to the Catholic Church, are coming back
to the Catholic Church one or the other. We don't
get the qualitative, We just get the quantitative. Who were
not in the Catholic Church by bad you know, as
a baby, nor as whenever first communion?
Speaker 2 (11:01):
And what do you make of that?
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Well, again, I think it's the attraction of the concrete
uh teaching and then form if it's done properly. Formation.
And that's what It takes a while to go through
that process because it's it's not about learning how to
be a Catholic about the rituals. It is about developing
(11:26):
that relationship with Jesus. It's a form it's a formative process.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
It should be this.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Let me ask you, let me ask you this the
priest scandal.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
And by the way, the Catholics aren't the only ones
who had this, It's just they're the more organized church.
And you could you could apply there were lots of
Southern Baptist individual churches that had scandals and other denominations.
But I know for a fact Southern Baptist churches and
and youth ministers and song ministers and and the pastor
and and they had their own problems.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
With the Catholic Church.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
The Catholic Church, fairly or unfairly, came under a lot
of fire, not just for the actions of priests, but
for covering it up and moving them down the road.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
And I think you had the movie about it, or
two movies about it.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
You had a lot of talk about it, and you
had the settlements and all that, And it feels like
the Catholic Church has moved on past that, and I
assume they've dealt with it with internal policy changes. It
also feels to me like the Catholic Church moved past
that dark time that maybe kept people away.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
I don't know if that's true, but I suspect that.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Oh, I think you're absolutely right. I think about the
ambals of particularly the late nineties, when everything was the
light was being shed on some of the evil players
in that whole issue, and it was definitely it was
definitely one of the reasons why.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
There was a full.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Faith. But what what I attributed, Man, I.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Don't I don't know what you're doing, but you're moving
around and we're getting about every third word. So I
just I got right on the Okay.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Okay, I'll give them, yes, Okay. I think looking at
it rationally from my perspective is that it was truly
an attack by Staytan on the Church, playing on the
weaknesses of human beings. And you know, understand that the
Church on Earth, of any denomination, is comprised of human
(13:36):
beings who have faults and failings. But the Catholic Church,
particularly in America, has been a target for a lot
of you know, we're worried about any Semitism. Now, there's
a strong vein of anti Catholicism and always has been
running through the Christian community in general. For the church, yeah,
(14:00):
I mean, I know. I grew up sitting around a
Southern Baptist table hearing things, and so I knew what
was being said. I have firsthand knowledge of what the
attitudes were and which, interestingly enough, I was always told that, oh,
you can't go into a Catholic church. It's evil, you know,
(14:21):
and you know God will strike you dead, I mean not,
you know, to that degree. And so I was like, oh,
I never will. I did, and here I am. So
I'm a Catholic theologian. Go figure that.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
No, I think that's fair. My parents didn't have that view,
you know. We I went to youth Catholic events with
friends of mine but there was a very small Catholic
presence in my part of the Golden Triangle, and and
there weren't very many of my peers who were raised
Catholic there or were involved in the Catholic Church. Of course,
(14:53):
we didn't have but one Jewish family and a couple
of Mormon families, and so it was largely, almost exclusively
Southern Baptist. But I think a lot of that depends
on where you're raised. I think, you know, if you're
from Boston or New York, or Baltimore or Philly, Chicago,
even Detroit, you're going to find a lot more traditional
Catholics in that manner. I will also say that I
(15:15):
noted an increasing conservatism among America's Catholics, and I found
that to be an interesting you know, it was the
case in nineteen ninety that Catholics voted Democrat more often,
and that is moving. The data shows self described in
the way of conservatism, and I think that's pretty I
got about thirty seconds if you want to speak to that.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Well. I think that what you saw the vood that
there had everything, if not most, things to do with
the pro life movement. It was just you know, the
fact the Democratic Party got really behind abortion.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
I think you're right.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
That's an interesting and I think very insightful point. I
think that that was probably more to do with Green
catholicsen than anything.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Else with Bizar of talk radio The Michael Berry Show.
Speaker 3 (16:07):
Wadys July fourth, in nineteen thirty two, Del Reeves was born.
He died in two thousand and seven on New Year's Day.
Dell was not his full name. It wasn't d A. L. E.
It was d El, short for Delano, as in Franklin
Delano Reeves. He was fd R, And of course he
(16:32):
was named for the president at the time, one of
the worst presidents we ever had, Franklin Delano Roosevelt. On
this day, in nineteen ninety eight, Richard McDonald died. He
was the co founder of McDonald's Fast Food along with
his brother Maurice. Nineteen forty eight, the brothers fully redesigned
(16:55):
and rebuilt their little restaurant in San Bernardino to focus
on a reduced menu consisting of nine items. In addition
to their fifteen cent one five cent hamburger. That menu
would include a cheeseburger, and they really spiced it up.
You could add a cheat you could add a slice
of cheese to your meat, soft drinks, milk coffee, potato chips.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
And a slice of pie.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
The McDonald's brother's restaurant was a raging success and with
the goal of making a million dollars before they turned fifty.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
It's a lot of money back then.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
The McDonald brothers began franchising their system in nineteen fifty three,
beginning with the restaurant in Phoenix, Arizona, operated by Neil Fox.
The brothers drew the attention of Ray Kroc, a milkshake
mixer salesman for Prince Class Castle. He was out selling
the mixers to make milkshakes. After they purchased eight of
(17:55):
his multi mixers for their San Bernardino, California restaurant, Kroc
visited the restaurant in nineteen fifty four, Hey, this is
a good customer. That year the McDonald brothers hired Kroc
as their franchise agent.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
This guy's good.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Kroc took one point nine percent of the gross sales,
of which the McDonald brothers got point five percent, So
he's three to one on the take from them. But
he's the one out knocking on the doors and traveling
and covering his own expenses, Kroc became frustrated with the
McDonald brothers desire to maintain a small number of restaurants.
The brothers also consistently told Kroc he could not make
(18:32):
changes to things like the original blueprint, but despite him
begging and pleading with him, the brothers would not send
any formal letters that legally allowed the changes in the chain.
By nineteen sixty one, he had bought the company for
two point seven million dollars, calculated so as to ensure
each brother received you guessed it the million dollars after taxes.
(18:54):
At the closing, he became annoyed that the brothers would
not transfer to him the real estate and rights to
the original San Bernardino location. The brothers had told Kroc
they were giving the operation, property and all to the
founding employees. In his anger, Krot later opened a new
McDonald's restaurant near the original McDonald's, which had been renamed
The Big M because the brothers had neglected to retain
(19:16):
rights to the name.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
The Big M closed six years later.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
It is alleged that is part of the buyout, Krot promised,
based on a handshake, to continue the annual one percent
royalty of the original agreement, but there is no evidence
of this beyond a claim by a nephew of the
McDonald brothers, and that would add up to be a
lot of money. Neither of the brothers publicly expressed disappointment
over the deal. Speaking to someone about the buyout, Richard
(19:40):
McDonald reportedly said he had no regrets. On November thirtieth,
nineteen eighty four, Richard McDonald, the first cook behind the
grill of the McDonald's, was served the ceremonial fifty billionth
McDonald's hamburger by Ed Rindsay, then President of McDonald's USA,
at the Grand Hyatt Hotel in New York City. This
was an old Willard Scott commercial Ronald McDonald commercial. They
(20:04):
say it was the first one and producing the world's
Lewis mc hillias and hamburger eating.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Us Brown Ronald McDonald's.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
Ronald, Hey, isn't watching TV? First thing you got delicious
McDonald hamburger, Ronald. You can't be on TV and watch
it at the same time.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Now, come on and meet the boys and girl. Oh
you've already met.
Speaker 5 (20:31):
I know we're gonna be praised too, because I like
to do everything boys and girls like to do. Firstly,
when it comes to deep nose delicious McDonald Sambergers, I
manage the crator keeps me. Weal with the blood McDonald samburgers,
frinch rhymes, and milk. See watch for Me on TV.
We'll have lots of fun.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
McDonald Hamburger Happy.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Is his favorite place.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
There is a really really good movie. Now is it
historically accurate? When I tell you a song is good,
or a movie is good, or whatever else, that doesn't
mean that I think that it is historically accurate or
that there isn't a dispute about it.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
I don't know why people insist on doing this. It's
a good movie.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
It's one data point to consider in the growth of
what became America's and the world's largest fast food chain
and what spawned a lot of copycats that today are
still around. And it's Michael Keaton. It's one of my
favorite I didn't I'm not a big one for the
Batman stuff, but it may be my favorite Michael Keaton role.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
There's one other one.
Speaker 3 (21:46):
I'm trying to think of it as a little phantasma gore,
which is not normally my thing, but he's good in
that one.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
But the movie itself is called Founder. I thought it
was The Founder, but I looked it up.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
It's just Founder, and it's Michael Keaton as Ray Krost
And and it's a really really fascinating story of the
grit determination, consistency, recklessness, fearlessness, of the types of people
(22:17):
who end up being who end up being first generation
self made billionaires.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
And are they always perfect?
Speaker 6 (22:28):
No?
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Would everybody else like some of their money? Do they
have too much money either? We hear all these these
these things, but at the end of it, what no
one realizes is that for every billion every self made billionaire,
which is how most billionaires became billionaires, not all. There's
some Walton Airs, there will be some Coke heirs, but
(22:51):
most of the cell of the of the self made billionaires,
For every one of them, there's a thousand guys that
are broke that their wife leaves them because they're tired
of having to move from rent hoouse to renthouse and
not have any money. Because Bob keeps trying to open
a business that fails. We talked to Mike Shane yesterday,
(23:13):
who was the executive director of the Houston Chapter and
some other chapters of the Texas Restaurant Association. And this
is a guy who counsels advises, mentors restaurant owners around
the region. And as he admitted, they went out of
business in twenty twenty three.
Speaker 2 (23:34):
It's not just a food business. Owning a business is
really tough for everybody criticizing business owners. Give it a try.
To come back and talk to me and this other guy,
Michael Barry.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
That is Harry Dean Stanton. Not the greatest vocalist of
all time, but man, what a career. He hated being
called a character actor, hated that term, but he was
and he was a damn good one.
Speaker 2 (24:06):
Roger Ebert said.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
No movie with Harry Dean Stanton or Emmett Walsh can
be a bad movie.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
But later he said, they said, what about.
Speaker 3 (24:15):
Dream A Little Dream? I think that was a movie
that they said that about. He said, well, okay, that
might violate the rule. My favorite Harry Dean Stanton role.
I know people are gonna say cool hand Lou Godfather,
twin Peaks. There's a number of movies that he was in.
My favorite role that he ever played, and the one
I quote the most and loved the most. You know
(24:37):
what it is, Jim I've narrowed it down, huh, not
Big Love, I've narrowed it way down. Well, he's in
a bunch of movies. But the scene in Red Dawn,
oh man, maybe because of where I was at that
moment in my life and what that movie meant to me.
(24:59):
My goodness, was that ever a scene?
Speaker 6 (25:01):
Wow?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Sh I was talking to somebody the other day about that.
Who was I talking to about that? That moment? And
Wolverine and that cast. You know, I gotta think about
when those movies came out where exactly I would have been.
But those guys weren't much well, they were playing characters
(25:24):
that weren't much older than me.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
They were older than me.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
But that whole cast of guys, Matt Dillon, Emilio, Estabz,
Charlie Sheen, Patrick Swayze, Tom Cruise was in The Outsider.
C Thomas Howell is that his name?
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Man?
Speaker 3 (25:40):
That those series of movies that came out for guys
that are my age. They don't know exactly what I'm
talking about, the Outsiders of Ralph Mancio obviously in that one.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I mean that movie.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
I go back now and there's people I forget that
we're in it, like Tom Cruise is in have a
major role, and the people I forget who were in it,
and and I forget how powerful those roles were.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Omit, you have it. Go ahead. I can't afford to
be crying anymore.
Speaker 4 (26:09):
Now.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
I won't either one of you ever have a I'll
ever do it as.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Long as you live. Where's my dab record?
Speaker 7 (26:24):
I don't know, Son, Well, get going, now, get out
before they find you.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Yes, I love you.
Speaker 4 (26:45):
I know you did, Son, I love you too.
Speaker 6 (26:55):
What man, I still get chill bumps.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
I still get chill bumps I got.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
I got an email this morning from someone who I
respect in a door and love genuinely.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
He said, Uh, you know, I disagree with you over
your opinion of.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Lindsey Graham and Lindsey Graham there was nothing wrong with
Lindsey Graham being in Ukraine the day before he died,
and that Lindsey Grahm's a patriot, and that the Ukrainians
are doing something very important in fighting the Russians, and
that I grew up crawling under the desk from the
(27:50):
bomb threat of the Russians attacking and I still think
they mean us harm. And are you telling me you
like Putin, And as I said, I love and adore
this person, and I don't take it personally to disagree
over policy or people with people that I like, But
(28:12):
not everyone has that approach, and so for me, these
discussions are enjoyable. They're engaging, they're entertaining there they're enlightening,
and they force you. They force you to make arguments,
they force you to ask yourself why you think the
way you do. And so, you know, most people, you'd
(28:34):
be surprised if you gave your honest opinions, your real, honest,
unvarnished opinions, day in and day out, no quote unquote
political correctness.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
You're in the minority on some issues, and you don't.
Speaker 3 (28:50):
Realize a lot of people are. If people know what
I think, boy, let them have it. You would until
you realize that the very people you care about will
then will then question their love for you, They will
question your wisdom, they will question whether you're even a
good person. Because forcing people to question that which they
(29:14):
have already put to bed is a very discomforting experience
for most people. Most people don't want to think a
new about a person or a concept that they believed
for a long time.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
You probably know about the study.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
Where I think it was at Stanford where they give
them twenty dollars to convince the group and a dollar
to convince the group and the dollar one.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
And what it supposedly reveals is kind of that.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
The standard example used there is that people do not
want to change. People do not want to reconsider something
where they have come to a conclusion already, and they
will do anything to stop it.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
You want to know why we.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
Will never have a proper hearing and proper accountability for
COVID and for all the horror that was conducted, because
it would force people to admit they were wrong. You
want to know why so many Jews will not vote
Republican no matter what is done in this country, because
(30:19):
it would force them to admit they were wrong.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
We could go on and on.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
You want to know why so many people will not
undo Obamacare or speak ill of Obamacare because it would
force them to admit they were wrong. And it is
easier to just hope it's forgotten than to correct the record,
and people do not do that lightly. So are the
(30:45):
Russians our primary threat?
Speaker 2 (30:46):
No, they're not. It's not even close. Are the Ukrainians.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
Valiantly battling the Russians, and by them battling the Russians,
we don't have to know this is bunk. We are
making their top tier leadership rich, and I dare say
we're making Americans rich who they are kicking back that
money to. And no amount of wrapping yourself in the
(31:15):
flag is going to change my opinion.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
But these are the conversations.
Speaker 6 (31:20):
We should be happy.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
If nothing else, It's a good way to pass our time.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
I'm glad you're here with us, But heck, we might
even be changing somebody's opinion. You never know who's going
to be listening. We once got a band a gig
on Saturday Night Live because the executive producer of Saturday
Night Live was driving through the Catskills and listening to
our show on podcast and heard me play a band
(31:45):
in His secretary, whose dad was the head of GE
at the time, sent me an email said who is
the band? And two weeks later there they were playing.
So you just never know. This is a slight humble
bract close the show. I didn't mean for it to be,
but it ended up that way.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
I guess
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