August 11, 2026 • 33 mins
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
It's that time, time, time, time, luck and load. The
Michael Verie Show is on the air. The case of
(00:25):
Vanessa Savage has received national attention. A lot of eyes
on this case and her story and what she did.
I wonder how many people would have done what she did,
how many people didn't do what she did? How many
people look the other way? That's typically what happens. All
it takes for evil to thrive is for good men
(00:47):
to do nothing. She didn't do nothing. She has said,
God wrote this story. He asked me to walk down
this path, and I walked that. That is a very
humble way of dismissing the bravery that she engaged in.
And it's incredible and that's why this story has received
(01:07):
such attention. Vanessa Sivich is our guest. Welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Thank you, Michael, thank you so much for having me today.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Is it weird for people to talk about you as
a hero, You know.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
That's a funny question. It is a little strange to
see myself on the news and on radio broadcast like
this one, because I really never anticipated or planned this.
This was not in my career plan, believe it or not,
I did not plan on blowing the whistle at the
nation's largest children's hospital. Did not plan on being a
(01:45):
collaborative force with the government to bring this settlement forward.
I was just a nurse trying to do my very
best in a job that I deeply loved and with
patients that I deeply cared about. When all of a sudden,
I just started to see things that I couldn't dismiss,
couldn't ignore. I saw children being systematically harmed. But I
(02:06):
text the children's hospital, and so a couple of years ago,
I blew the whistle. And I'm very grateful that the
settlement announced last week is a direct Now I can
talk about that directly as a part of what I
did to blow the whistle.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Yeah, I'm glad because I think these sunlight is the
best disinfectant. Let's open the blinds and look into what happened,
because I think a lot of people are I think
a lot of people just assume things like this can't happen,
and they do. They do, and you saw it. But
let's rewind from Vanessa.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Where were you born, born and raised here in Houston
with the hospital. Well, I was born and I was
born and raised in kind of sugar Land area.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Okay, and your parents, what did they do?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
You know, my dad is a pastor for many years.
My mom's a teacher, and they homeschooled me. I had
a great Christian education growing up. Something that I really
credit as one of the foundational pieces into why I
was able to do what I did is I had
a very strong foundation for my faith. And I'm grateful
for my parents. I have amazing parents.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Or all those people who worry whether their children will
turn out okay if they homeschool them, here is exhibit a.
Yes you will. You can if you choose, you can
raise a child of conscience and conviction. And obviously your
parents hope they're both still alive. They should be very
very proud of what you have done and their role
(03:34):
in that, because the fruit doesn't fall very far from
the tree.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Thank you. Yes they are. They are very very proud,
very grateful.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
So you go to college where.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
I went to the University of Texas Health Science Center
in the medical Center. So I stayed in Houston. I
graduated from nursing school in twenty fifteen, and it was
in twenty eighteen that I accepted this position exist Children's
which at the time thought it was going to be
my dream job. As you know, Texas Children's is the
jewel of Houston. It is globally renowned and very prestigious,
(04:12):
and so for anyone a nurse accepting a position in
this in this hospital, it's a dream come true. And
that's how I felt for a really long time until
twenty twenty one when I accepted a different position within
that same hospital, and I started to notice a fully
functioning gender clinic operating on the premises of my workplace,
(04:36):
something I didn't know when I accepted the job. And
so week after week I watched as girls struggling with
for depression and mental health issues and a host of
you know issues with their you know past of sexual
abuse and just medical issues as a whole went just
(04:58):
kind of swept under the rug because they were struggling
with their gender identity, and these doctors would convince parents
that this was the right thing to do. They would
put them on a cossix foremone and week after week,
girls would start to look less like girls, and they
would start to develop masculine features, and they'd start to
essentially erase that God given identity they were born with.
(05:18):
And that was devastating to me, not just as a
nurse who believed in biological truth, but as a Christian
who believes in biblical truths, that there is male and
there is female, That there is no such thing as
a transgender child. That there are deeply confused children who
need help and healing and mental health, but there's no
such thing as a transgender child. And so I battled
(05:39):
for a long time on what to do. I tried
to leave, I tried to find a different job, and
now I know why none of that worked out. Of course,
that there was a divine purpose to me staying there
and to me seeing the things that I did.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
But I don't know what you have and professionally, but
it would be a huge favor to me if I
could just step away from this show and you take
it over from here on out. You you, you are amazing,
You're you're just You're You're incredible, not only what you've done,
but your ability to articulate, to explain, to help us
(06:24):
understand what you did and who you are. It was
a relatively suciinct answer for years of a very deep
and emotionally fraught time for you. I can't imagine when
when you witnessed what was going on with these children?
Did you have somebody you were confiding with, what were
(06:44):
you doing away from work? And were you talking to
you when at work about it?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
You know, I wish we had all the time in
the world for me to answer that, Well.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I do. I just honestly, I'd rather you just I'll
let me go do something else. And you finished the
show to every day. I'm not joking. You're incredible. We'll
have to give you a better radio name because Sivage,
the way it's pronounced is not just be the Vanessa Shaw.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Let me try to answer that very succinctly for you,
but for your listeners who are listening this morning, I
would encourage them to listen to the interview that was
just posted on X with Catherine Harridge. A couple of
days ago. She posted a twenty minute interview in which
we filmed my first exclusive interview in which I talk
(07:35):
about a lot of this and I full disclosure to
your audience. It's the most emotional and raw interview I've
ever given, I've ever done. I was visibly emotional because
for the last two years I haven't been able to
talk about any of this haven't been able to share
this with my closest family or friends, haven't been able
to reveal the fact that I was a collaborative government
(07:59):
witness in this false claimed act investigation at the first
of the time in the United States of America, in
which now as a result of medical.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Can with me just w by the way, I have
not seen the interview, but I was scrolling and I
saw it, and that's why we reached out to you
in the first place. But just one Michael Very show
continues all. Vanessa Savage is the whistleblower who exposed the
(08:35):
fact that Texas Children's Hospital was this premier medical institution
was transitioning children across the sex from their god assigned
to another sex and everything that went with it. Vanessa,
can you it's graphic, but can can you walk us through,
(08:57):
because most of us know about this from a distance,
can you walk us through what that looks like? Is
the child there for depression or they? How does how
does that patient? How did you begin your contact with
that patient?
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Yeah? Great question, Yeah, thank you for having me. Yeah. So,
usually what happens is a child will be referred to
the gender clinic through a pediatrician and then the transgender
provider will start to see this patient week after week
and consistently start increasing the dosage of either testosterone or estrogen,
(09:35):
the cross sex hormones given to a male, estrogen to
a male, or testosterone to a female. And a week
after week, girls start to develop facial hair, they start
to develop beers, they start to develop and I am zapple,
Their voices starts to change into a masculine voice, their
(09:56):
breaths are decreased in size, Their secondary such characteristics also
UH change in that in that time period, leading and
culminating to the moment with enough dosage, with the high
high dosage of this drug, in which a girl's period
stops and her ovaries shrink, and eventually she can she
(10:21):
stops ovulating. Eventually she will not be able to conceive
or have children. That is the most devastating effect of all,
of course, which is just something that I got uh
the unfortunate I had just the unfortunate role to see
this up close, and it was devastating for me for
(10:42):
my faith, for my belief that there is two sexes
beautifully made and God damage and to watch them systematically,
UH be be kind of ushered into this pathway of
a rasure and tremendous physical and psychological harm under the
guise of compassion and care was devastating to me, and
(11:05):
so I knew I had to speak out about it.
But I'm one person in a hospital, as you said,
a prestigious, premier hospital institution of more than twenty thousand
employees bringing in billions of dollars in annual revenue. How
is one person supposed to achieve or to expose what
(11:26):
is going on in a way that would change things,
in a way that would stop the harm that is
being done? And I think that really, this is a
story that only God could write, because only He could
achieve his victory on my behalf ultimately. And I'm super grateful,
super grateful for the very small role that I've played
in this.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I appreciate your humility, but I think not only is
it an outsized role, it is a role that had
you not played it, would people know what was going on?
Was there a was there something that was a duplicative whistleblower?
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Well, thankfully many of your listeners know the story. But thankfully,
doctor Aton Hines was the reason why I came forward
in the first place. Right he blew the whistle. He
was a surgeon at Texas Children's and blew the whistle
before me, And that is when I had, you know,
I built up the courage to come forward myself because
(12:27):
I realized that someone else within this hospital institution actually
also shared my same concerns that children were being harmed.
And so courage is contagious. I know that's something cheesy
we like to say all the time, but it's true
because once I saw what he was willing to put
on the line, what he was willing to risk, I
decided to come forward myself.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
And how did you come forward?
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Yeah, So in May twenty twenty three, I came forward anonymously,
first with Christopher, who's an amazing journalist. Came forward anonymously.
And although I kind of blew the whistle at that
time with my testimony of what was going on inside
of the gender clinic with them transitioning kids in secrets,
(13:14):
never thought anything would come of that. I was perfectly
content to let that be the end of my involvement
until two months later. As you know, the FBI visited
my home in July twenty twenty three. They said that
they knew of my views and they threatened me if
I did not collaborate with their investigation, they couldn't protect me,
and they of course threatened my career and my safety.
(13:37):
And that was the most terrifying thing I think we've
ever been through. But what it did was it set
me up on a path where I could no longer
ignore what I was saying. And so I didn't respond
very kindly to that threat I did not know. I
did not go into away into a hole as they
(13:57):
wanted and just shut up about what I knew, which
is what they had asked me to do. But instead
I did the opposite, and I came forward publicly the
next year. So in June of twenty twenty four, for
the second time, I blew the whistle publicly, and this
time I revealed that not only had the hospital transition
children in secret, that they were billing Texas Medicaid for
(14:19):
their sex rejecting treatments and hormones. That is illegal, it
is fraudulent, it's federal fraud, and it's state fraud. And
so under the false claim that we were able to
bring this lawsuit forward and thanks to a collaborate effort
between the Trump Department of Justice and Attorney General can
(14:39):
tax in the amazing team the State of Texas Attorney
General and my attorneys. This settlement was finally brought to
the lights about a week.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Ago and ten million dollars. Good for you. I'm glad
it's a big number because it's going to get a
lot of attention, and it should get a lot of attention.
Do you ever think to yourself, I mean, it's evil,
but do you ever think we were there other people
there who probably shared your views, maybe not as deeply,
(15:12):
and maybe they may not have even been Bible based,
but they knew in their hearts this was wrong and
they simply didn't want to be the squeaky wheel. Do
you think there were other people who do you know
there were other people who felt that way?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yes? No, there absolutely are other people, you know. But
the ironic thing is that you work with you know,
I worked with my coworkers for six years, right, they
all knew who I was. When I blew the whistle.
I did not get a single and this is not
a surprise to anyone, But I'm not a single person
reached out right, And I'm not saying that to you know,
(15:48):
in any kind of way, but I'm just saying, you know, people,
people really and I was this person. I don't blame
them for this, but these are just the facts, right.
It's it can be very difficult to confront the possibility
of losing everything you've worked for, to lose your salary,
your lifestyle, the career that you've worked so hard to build,
(16:11):
the relationships you fostered within the hospital system, your retirement,
your benefits, all of those things are on the line,
right and so I had to weigh those risks very
carefully myself, and I know that it's the same for
other people. So I have compassion on those people who
don't necessarily want to sign up for what I did.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Right after that, Yeah, you know, we talked about bravery.
Most people are not brave. Most people would rather hope
that that Vanessa savitge will take. Can you hold with
us for just a moment, like the boy. Vanessa Savitch
(16:54):
is our guest. She was a nurse at Texas Children's
Hospital who was part of the Whistler effort to expose
what Texas Children's Hospital was doing in violation of the
law to these children. Mutilating them is what it's called.
It's not healthcare, it's mutilation. And these are children. They
wouldn't let you put tattoos on them, they wouldn't let
(17:17):
you send them to war, we wouldn't let them smoke
cigarettes or drink alcohol. But under the guys of supposed medicine,
they took scalpels to their bodies and filled them full
of very, very dangerous hormones. Vanessa, did these kids ever
come back and express doubts or concerns because this is
(17:40):
a pretty big change in their body, you.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Know, that's a great question. No, not yet. In fact,
I've gotten messages to the opposite. Of fact, I've gotten
several messages from former patients of the Gender clinic at
Texas Children who are absolutely attacking and slandering me for
what I've done. They say that you know that you know,
they were about to commit suicide until they started gender treatments,
(18:06):
and are absolutely using the most colorful and vulgar language
you could imagine in these in these messages to me.
And so here's what I would say is, you know,
for a time they might feel that way. They might
feel like, you know, like these changes are something that
(18:26):
they've wanted in their body, and they are also again,
remember they're surrounded by an affirming community, the affirming transgender
community that tells them that there is peace on the
other side of taking these hormones and blockers, that they
will feel finally fulfilled and at peace with themselves if
(18:48):
they move on in the transition pathway. Of course, we
know that that is a lie, right and that is
that could not be more false, But they're you know,
with social media, with this community. Sometimes they have parents
who are fully in alignment with this, and so I
(19:09):
think that for a time, they're deceived, and so I'm
praying for them. There's not a day that goes by
that I don't pray that these former patients are the
clinic that I was working at, that they'll wake up
one day and they'll they'll realize what was done to them,
that they were deceived, they were manipulated by doctors who
believed they were doing the right thing, and that they'll
(19:30):
wake up and now they actually have an opportunity to
come to the nation, to the world's first de transition
clinic at the very same hospital that once sanctioned their
harm and their mutilation, which is just an unrivaled story again,
a story that only God could write. And if they
(19:50):
do wake up one day and they regret what was
done to them. Now there's an opportunity for their health,
for their healing, at zero cost to them for the
first five years.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
You deserve, rightfully to be extraordinarily proud that this has happened. This, this,
this is a career accomplishment, and you have so much
ahead of you. You're a very young woman, and you
have accomplished this out of out of conviction. It doesn't
always end well for whistleblowers. In fact, typically it does not.
(20:22):
It typically goes the other way, and they go off
into obscurity and lick their wounds for the rest of
their lives. You you have, you have had a grand
victory for yourself and a lot of other people and
on behalf of speaking out and this, this is, this
is the result we could only hope for. Do you
trust that they will develop this clinic in good faith
(20:45):
and that they will do what they've said because they
have in the past done horrible things.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
You know, that's a great question, one that I've already
I've been asked before. And here's what I'll say to
that is, we'll be watching and waiting. You know, I
can't I can't predict the future. But what we can
do is we can publicly we publicly shame the behavior
that is evil and unrighteous. As a society and as
a culture, we shame that behavior. Right, And when there's
(21:13):
behavior that does a complete one eighty, when it seeks
to undo the wrongs of the past, when it seeks
to affirm biological realities, when it seeks to protect and
help children instead of harm them, then we publicly honor
that behavior that change that we see. I think that's
very powerful. I think public shaming, as we've done in
(21:35):
the last five to ten years, since the transgender movement
has kind of come up more so into the spotlight,
has been incredibly effective. Right, it's kind of in retreat now,
But what I would say is that we're now entering
stase two. We're entering phase two because we're not going
to allow the institutions and the doctors, both of them
(21:59):
who have knowingly, you know, participated in the in sect
projecting procedures for years. They've done this. In fact, my
settlement showed that the hospital had started to do these
procedures and to build falsely since twenty ten, and I
(22:20):
brought evidence forwards starting in twenty twenty. I didn't even
know that this had been going on for years before
I came forward. But now we know, and what we're
going to do now as a society is we're not
going to let these hospitals and doctors off the hook.
We're not going to just say, well, we've you know,
we've defeated the trans movement. We're just going to move
(22:41):
on and let them live their lives in peace. No,
now we go back and we strip them of their
medical licenses so they they can't practice medicine. Now we
actually hold hospitals accountable who build medicaids falsely or who
deceive the public, and we force them into settlements in
which they admit what they've done, which is a exactly
what has happened here. So when we talk about accountability
(23:04):
moving forward, this is what we're talking about. We're talking
about holding institutions and doctors accountable for the years and
years of harm that they facilitated.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
I don't know if you're familiar with the case of
Mary Tally Boden, but she had her privileges at Methodists
revoked and she had the Texas Medical Board come after her,
and they've tried to destroy her. That is also one tough,
tough lady. But now everything she said has been proven true,
(23:36):
and Fauci and the establishment have been made out to
be worse than fools and knaves. They are criminals. And
you know, the sunlight se best disinfectant. We are seeing
the truth come out. Now, where does Vanessa Sivich go?
Where do you go from here? Well?
Speaker 2 (23:58):
You know, hopefully I I won't need a lifetime of therapy,
but you know, no, it's a joke. I I'm just
very deeply grateful. You know, I don't know that has
that remains to be seen. We have one more negotiation
settlement that will be that will be We will kind
(24:22):
of come to that here in the next couple of weeks.
I don't want to say too much about that, but
one more settlement. But uh, you know, I'm going to
go on vacation. I'm going to enjoy my time with
my husband and we're going to try to get our
life back. The meantime I leave, I lead Protecting Texas Children,
which is a state advocacy nonprofit dedicated towards advancing pro
(24:43):
child policies in Texas, and so that keeps me very busy.
Just a little bit.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
I want to I want to hear about that roub
against to break, if you can whold just one more segment.
I want to hear about that. I want to hear
about your work going forward and see how we can
help you in those efforts. I admire what you have done,
and I know there are big things ahead. Vanessa Sivitch
comeing out with them, Michael, Mary, They're.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
All Duncans, and you know Duncan means jo Yo.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Vanessa Sivitch is our guest. She is a nurse who
has become nationally famous for speaking out about what she
saw at Texas Children's Hospital when they did what they
said they weren't doing, when they broke the law, when
they mutilated children, making boys into girls and girls into boys,
or trying physically anyway that interview with Catherine Herridge that
(25:33):
you did. First of all, I have a lot of
respect for Katherine Herridge. She's been an expert for years
or a journalist covering national security. I'm glad to see
her branching out to do more than just military stories
because she's hard hitting and tough and fair. She's somebody
that the Obama administration came after like Cheryl Atkinson and
(25:54):
did her wrong. But let's talk about your future. Vanessa Sivitch,
You've started an organization and the intention is advocacy for children.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm the founder and president of Protecting Texas Children.
But encourage your audience to check out our website and
our work. We exist to defend children from radical gender ideology,
not just in medicine, because as you know, that takes
lots of forms. It's in media, it's in our entertainment,
(26:23):
it's in our school system, it's in curriculum, it's in
library books that are accessible to children, and so we
exist to defend children from that radical and destructive ideology
in all of its forms. We also work with lawmakers
in the state of Texas to advance pro child and
pro family policies. So that is a deeply fulfilling work
(26:46):
that I'm just so privileged to be a part of,
and I continue to doing that well.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
I will be sending a thousand bus when we finish,
and I would encourage a lot of other people, anyone
who is able to send whatever you can send, if
it's five bucks, to show our support for what you're doing.
It looks like there's a legislative side to this. So
presumably you're going to be working to pass laws to
protect children. What do you foresee what kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, one of the most important things I'll briefly touch
on that I'm very excited about is a law that
will allow D transitioners in the state of Texas to
hold their providers accountable. To see them right now, if
you can believe what is happening right now, in the
state of Texas, D transitioners only have a window of
two years to sue. There is about you know, we
(27:41):
know this from studies that have been done, but it
takes D transitioners an average of five to ten years
on average to realize what was done to them, the
harm that was done to them, when they wake up
one day and they realize, oh, my goodness, my breasts
are removed. Now I can't ever nurse my children like
that which happened to sore and Aldoca, one of my
(28:03):
good friends, a D transitioner here in Texas. We have
lawmakers in Austin who are putting together legislation as we
speak to extend that statute of limitations so that D
transitioners can sue their doctors and hold them accountable. And
so that's something that's a policy that protecting Texas children
will be championing, and we will be working together as
(28:26):
closely as we can with lawmakers in the House and
Senate to make sure that that makes it across the
finish line and on to the governor's desks so he
can sign it into law.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Yeah, you know, it's it's amazing, and it's taking lemons
and making lemonade. Sometimes we have to be we have
to go through something because I mean, you're minimizing it
or or kind of glossing over it. But this would
have been a difficult thing for you to understand that
this career that you it's hard to become a nurse.
It takes a lot of preparation, education, admission, you know,
(29:02):
all these things, and to realize that doing this was
going to jeopardize your career. It wasn't going to get
you a pat on the back. That was a you know,
there were a lot of things that play here. In
addition to just what you were witnessing. There were a
lot of things at play. Let me go back to
you talk about getting reassigned or getting a different job,
and that's where you ended up in this particular situation.
(29:25):
Was that a promotion? What was the job to which
you were assigned?
Speaker 2 (29:30):
It was not a promotion. It was a lateral move.
What it was was a very practical mood. We wanted
to move to the suburbs. I didn't want to commute
into the downtown medical center every day. So we moved
in suburbs and I took a job at a multi
specialty satellite clinic of Texas Children's And that's where all
of this kind of went down, is kind of in
(29:51):
a suburb clinic. And so that's that's kind of when
I started to see what I've described previously with children
being transition and with providers billing medicaid fraudulently, culminating in
the ten million dollars settlement that was announced last week.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
When you talk about billing Medicare medicaid or Medicare Medicaid
medicaid fraudulently, do you think they knew? Do you think
everyone up and down the chain knew that they were
committing fraud.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
That's a great question. I can say for in absolute
certainty that one of the doctors that I blew the
whistle on which I cannot say his name, but I
can tell you for certain that one of them admitted
he perjured himself, and he admitted when he sued the
state of Texas after SB fourteen was passed two years ago,
(30:48):
which is the law that made these treatments illegal, he
admitted that his patients were on Medicaid, and so that's
public record. So I can tell you for certain that
one of them did know that his uh that excuse me,
that the doctor's patients were on many of them were
(31:09):
on Medicaid, and so I can't I can't speak to
the other ones. But this really is a watershed moment
for for this type of fraud case, this False Claims
Act case. The Department of Justice has announced and has
said in the past, that this will be the model
that they use for all other pending litigation in other states.
(31:31):
What what I've always wanted and what my hope has
been is that this serves as the blueprint that other
hospitals because of what is, you know, the example that
Texas Children's is the setting here. The precedent that's being
said is that other hospitals will now be compelled to
also open d transition centers of their own at zero cost.
(31:54):
And so what a what a remarkable, redeeming story this is.
I just want to say that, yes, never could I
have imagine that this would have been the outcome that
I'm hopeful that this will just be one clinic, you know,
in a long series of future clinics that will open
as a result of this watershed moment.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Yeah, because there are a lot of kids, you know,
there are a lot of kids. This it's a trend.
I mean, it's I hate to I hate to use
such a seemingly dismissive term, but it is a trend.
These things. This was not traditional, This was not historic.
There is not a legacy of this. Uh, this was
this was a political trend. It's not medicine. And there
(32:36):
are going to be children who were terribly terribly harmed
out of this, like phlidimide or or or taking the
clock shot. Vanessa Sivich, you are wonderful. Uh, You're fantastic.
Please keep up this fight. It's important and we need you,
our children need you.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Thank you. Thanks for your donation. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Got it. I will post a link to her sight.
And if you can give, don't ever think that because
I can only give tenor I can only give twenty,
or I can only give fifty. Whatever that is. Be
surprised we raised I mean how much money we raise
off you not being fat anymore. It wasn't six million,
(33:17):
It was over fifty thousand dollars. I got that list
around here somewhere. There are a lot of people who
came up big on Oh never an illness has left
a been any thank you, I mean good night.
It's that time, time, time, time, luck and load. The
Michael Verie Show is on the air. The case of
(00:25):
Vanessa Savage has received national attention. A lot of eyes
on this case and her story and what she did.
I wonder how many people would have done what she did,
how many people didn't do what she did? How many
people look the other way? That's typically what happens. All
it takes for evil to thrive is for good men
(00:47):
to do nothing. She didn't do nothing. She has said,
God wrote this story. He asked me to walk down
this path, and I walked that. That is a very
humble way of dismissing the bravery that she engaged in.
And it's incredible and that's why this story has received
(01:07):
such attention. Vanessa Sivich is our guest. Welcome to the program.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Thank you, Michael, thank you so much for having me today.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Is it weird for people to talk about you as
a hero, You know.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
That's a funny question. It is a little strange to
see myself on the news and on radio broadcast like
this one, because I really never anticipated or planned this.
This was not in my career plan, believe it or not,
I did not plan on blowing the whistle at the
nation's largest children's hospital. Did not plan on being a
(01:45):
collaborative force with the government to bring this settlement forward.
I was just a nurse trying to do my very
best in a job that I deeply loved and with
patients that I deeply cared about. When all of a sudden,
I just started to see things that I couldn't dismiss,
couldn't ignore. I saw children being systematically harmed. But I
(02:06):
text the children's hospital, and so a couple of years ago,
I blew the whistle. And I'm very grateful that the
settlement announced last week is a direct Now I can
talk about that directly as a part of what I
did to blow the whistle.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Yeah, I'm glad because I think these sunlight is the
best disinfectant. Let's open the blinds and look into what happened,
because I think a lot of people are I think
a lot of people just assume things like this can't happen,
and they do. They do, and you saw it. But
let's rewind from Vanessa.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Where were you born, born and raised here in Houston
with the hospital. Well, I was born and I was
born and raised in kind of sugar Land area.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Okay, and your parents, what did they do?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
You know, my dad is a pastor for many years.
My mom's a teacher, and they homeschooled me. I had
a great Christian education growing up. Something that I really
credit as one of the foundational pieces into why I
was able to do what I did is I had
a very strong foundation for my faith. And I'm grateful
for my parents. I have amazing parents.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Or all those people who worry whether their children will
turn out okay if they homeschool them, here is exhibit a.
Yes you will. You can if you choose, you can
raise a child of conscience and conviction. And obviously your
parents hope they're both still alive. They should be very
very proud of what you have done and their role
(03:34):
in that, because the fruit doesn't fall very far from
the tree.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Thank you. Yes they are. They are very very proud,
very grateful.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
So you go to college where.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
I went to the University of Texas Health Science Center
in the medical Center. So I stayed in Houston. I
graduated from nursing school in twenty fifteen, and it was
in twenty eighteen that I accepted this position exist Children's
which at the time thought it was going to be
my dream job. As you know, Texas Children's is the
jewel of Houston. It is globally renowned and very prestigious,
(04:12):
and so for anyone a nurse accepting a position in
this in this hospital, it's a dream come true. And
that's how I felt for a really long time until
twenty twenty one when I accepted a different position within
that same hospital, and I started to notice a fully
functioning gender clinic operating on the premises of my workplace,
(04:36):
something I didn't know when I accepted the job. And
so week after week I watched as girls struggling with
for depression and mental health issues and a host of
you know issues with their you know past of sexual
abuse and just medical issues as a whole went just
(04:58):
kind of swept under the rug because they were struggling
with their gender identity, and these doctors would convince parents
that this was the right thing to do. They would
put them on a cossix foremone and week after week,
girls would start to look less like girls, and they
would start to develop masculine features, and they'd start to
essentially erase that God given identity they were born with.
(05:18):
And that was devastating to me, not just as a
nurse who believed in biological truth, but as a Christian
who believes in biblical truths, that there is male and
there is female, That there is no such thing as
a transgender child. That there are deeply confused children who
need help and healing and mental health, but there's no
such thing as a transgender child. And so I battled
(05:39):
for a long time on what to do. I tried
to leave, I tried to find a different job, and
now I know why none of that worked out. Of course,
that there was a divine purpose to me staying there
and to me seeing the things that I did.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
But I don't know what you have and professionally, but
it would be a huge favor to me if I
could just step away from this show and you take
it over from here on out. You you, you are amazing,
You're you're just You're You're incredible, not only what you've done,
but your ability to articulate, to explain, to help us
(06:24):
understand what you did and who you are. It was
a relatively suciinct answer for years of a very deep
and emotionally fraught time for you. I can't imagine when
when you witnessed what was going on with these children?
Did you have somebody you were confiding with, what were
(06:44):
you doing away from work? And were you talking to
you when at work about it?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
You know, I wish we had all the time in
the world for me to answer that, Well.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I do. I just honestly, I'd rather you just I'll
let me go do something else. And you finished the
show to every day. I'm not joking. You're incredible. We'll
have to give you a better radio name because Sivage,
the way it's pronounced is not just be the Vanessa Shaw.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Let me try to answer that very succinctly for you,
but for your listeners who are listening this morning, I
would encourage them to listen to the interview that was
just posted on X with Catherine Harridge. A couple of
days ago. She posted a twenty minute interview in which
we filmed my first exclusive interview in which I talk
(07:35):
about a lot of this and I full disclosure to
your audience. It's the most emotional and raw interview I've
ever given, I've ever done. I was visibly emotional because
for the last two years I haven't been able to
talk about any of this haven't been able to share
this with my closest family or friends, haven't been able
to reveal the fact that I was a collaborative government
(07:59):
witness in this false claimed act investigation at the first
of the time in the United States of America, in
which now as a result of medical.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Can with me just w by the way, I have
not seen the interview, but I was scrolling and I
saw it, and that's why we reached out to you
in the first place. But just one Michael Very show
continues all. Vanessa Savage is the whistleblower who exposed the
(08:35):
fact that Texas Children's Hospital was this premier medical institution
was transitioning children across the sex from their god assigned
to another sex and everything that went with it. Vanessa,
can you it's graphic, but can can you walk us through,
(08:57):
because most of us know about this from a distance,
can you walk us through what that looks like? Is
the child there for depression or they? How does how
does that patient? How did you begin your contact with
that patient?
Speaker 2 (09:10):
Yeah? Great question, Yeah, thank you for having me. Yeah. So,
usually what happens is a child will be referred to
the gender clinic through a pediatrician and then the transgender
provider will start to see this patient week after week
and consistently start increasing the dosage of either testosterone or estrogen,
(09:35):
the cross sex hormones given to a male, estrogen to
a male, or testosterone to a female. And a week
after week, girls start to develop facial hair, they start
to develop beers, they start to develop and I am zapple,
Their voices starts to change into a masculine voice, their
(09:56):
breaths are decreased in size, Their secondary such characteristics also
UH change in that in that time period, leading and
culminating to the moment with enough dosage, with the high
high dosage of this drug, in which a girl's period
stops and her ovaries shrink, and eventually she can she
(10:21):
stops ovulating. Eventually she will not be able to conceive
or have children. That is the most devastating effect of all,
of course, which is just something that I got uh
the unfortunate I had just the unfortunate role to see
this up close, and it was devastating for me for
(10:42):
my faith, for my belief that there is two sexes
beautifully made and God damage and to watch them systematically,
UH be be kind of ushered into this pathway of
a rasure and tremendous physical and psychological harm under the
guise of compassion and care was devastating to me, and
(11:05):
so I knew I had to speak out about it.
But I'm one person in a hospital, as you said,
a prestigious, premier hospital institution of more than twenty thousand
employees bringing in billions of dollars in annual revenue. How
is one person supposed to achieve or to expose what
(11:26):
is going on in a way that would change things,
in a way that would stop the harm that is
being done? And I think that really, this is a
story that only God could write, because only He could
achieve his victory on my behalf ultimately. And I'm super grateful,
super grateful for the very small role that I've played
in this.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I appreciate your humility, but I think not only is
it an outsized role, it is a role that had
you not played it, would people know what was going on?
Was there a was there something that was a duplicative whistleblower?
Speaker 2 (12:06):
Well, thankfully many of your listeners know the story. But thankfully,
doctor Aton Hines was the reason why I came forward
in the first place. Right he blew the whistle. He
was a surgeon at Texas Children's and blew the whistle
before me, And that is when I had, you know,
I built up the courage to come forward myself because
(12:27):
I realized that someone else within this hospital institution actually
also shared my same concerns that children were being harmed.
And so courage is contagious. I know that's something cheesy
we like to say all the time, but it's true
because once I saw what he was willing to put
on the line, what he was willing to risk, I
decided to come forward myself.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
And how did you come forward?
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Yeah, So in May twenty twenty three, I came forward anonymously,
first with Christopher, who's an amazing journalist. Came forward anonymously.
And although I kind of blew the whistle at that
time with my testimony of what was going on inside
of the gender clinic with them transitioning kids in secrets,
(13:14):
never thought anything would come of that. I was perfectly
content to let that be the end of my involvement
until two months later. As you know, the FBI visited
my home in July twenty twenty three. They said that
they knew of my views and they threatened me if
I did not collaborate with their investigation, they couldn't protect me,
and they of course threatened my career and my safety.
(13:37):
And that was the most terrifying thing I think we've
ever been through. But what it did was it set
me up on a path where I could no longer
ignore what I was saying. And so I didn't respond
very kindly to that threat I did not know. I
did not go into away into a hole as they
(13:57):
wanted and just shut up about what I knew, which
is what they had asked me to do. But instead
I did the opposite, and I came forward publicly the
next year. So in June of twenty twenty four, for
the second time, I blew the whistle publicly, and this
time I revealed that not only had the hospital transition
children in secret, that they were billing Texas Medicaid for
(14:19):
their sex rejecting treatments and hormones. That is illegal, it
is fraudulent, it's federal fraud, and it's state fraud. And
so under the false claim that we were able to
bring this lawsuit forward and thanks to a collaborate effort
between the Trump Department of Justice and Attorney General can
(14:39):
tax in the amazing team the State of Texas Attorney
General and my attorneys. This settlement was finally brought to
the lights about a week.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Ago and ten million dollars. Good for you. I'm glad
it's a big number because it's going to get a
lot of attention, and it should get a lot of attention.
Do you ever think to yourself, I mean, it's evil,
but do you ever think we were there other people
there who probably shared your views, maybe not as deeply,
(15:12):
and maybe they may not have even been Bible based,
but they knew in their hearts this was wrong and
they simply didn't want to be the squeaky wheel. Do
you think there were other people who do you know
there were other people who felt that way?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Yes? No, there absolutely are other people, you know. But
the ironic thing is that you work with you know,
I worked with my coworkers for six years, right, they
all knew who I was. When I blew the whistle.
I did not get a single and this is not
a surprise to anyone, But I'm not a single person
reached out right, And I'm not saying that to you know,
(15:48):
in any kind of way, but I'm just saying, you know, people,
people really and I was this person. I don't blame
them for this, but these are just the facts, right.
It's it can be very difficult to confront the possibility
of losing everything you've worked for, to lose your salary,
your lifestyle, the career that you've worked so hard to build,
(16:11):
the relationships you fostered within the hospital system, your retirement,
your benefits, all of those things are on the line,
right and so I had to weigh those risks very
carefully myself, and I know that it's the same for
other people. So I have compassion on those people who
don't necessarily want to sign up for what I did.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Right after that, Yeah, you know, we talked about bravery.
Most people are not brave. Most people would rather hope
that that Vanessa savitge will take. Can you hold with
us for just a moment, like the boy. Vanessa Savitch
(16:54):
is our guest. She was a nurse at Texas Children's
Hospital who was part of the Whistler effort to expose
what Texas Children's Hospital was doing in violation of the
law to these children. Mutilating them is what it's called.
It's not healthcare, it's mutilation. And these are children. They
wouldn't let you put tattoos on them, they wouldn't let
(17:17):
you send them to war, we wouldn't let them smoke
cigarettes or drink alcohol. But under the guys of supposed medicine,
they took scalpels to their bodies and filled them full
of very, very dangerous hormones. Vanessa, did these kids ever
come back and express doubts or concerns because this is
(17:40):
a pretty big change in their body, you.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Know, that's a great question. No, not yet. In fact,
I've gotten messages to the opposite. Of fact, I've gotten
several messages from former patients of the Gender clinic at
Texas Children who are absolutely attacking and slandering me for
what I've done. They say that you know that you know,
they were about to commit suicide until they started gender treatments,
(18:06):
and are absolutely using the most colorful and vulgar language
you could imagine in these in these messages to me.
And so here's what I would say is, you know,
for a time they might feel that way. They might
feel like, you know, like these changes are something that
(18:26):
they've wanted in their body, and they are also again,
remember they're surrounded by an affirming community, the affirming transgender
community that tells them that there is peace on the
other side of taking these hormones and blockers, that they
will feel finally fulfilled and at peace with themselves if
(18:48):
they move on in the transition pathway. Of course, we
know that that is a lie, right and that is
that could not be more false, But they're you know,
with social media, with this community. Sometimes they have parents
who are fully in alignment with this, and so I
(19:09):
think that for a time, they're deceived, and so I'm
praying for them. There's not a day that goes by
that I don't pray that these former patients are the
clinic that I was working at, that they'll wake up
one day and they'll they'll realize what was done to them,
that they were deceived, they were manipulated by doctors who
believed they were doing the right thing, and that they'll
(19:30):
wake up and now they actually have an opportunity to
come to the nation, to the world's first de transition
clinic at the very same hospital that once sanctioned their
harm and their mutilation, which is just an unrivaled story again,
a story that only God could write. And if they
(19:50):
do wake up one day and they regret what was
done to them. Now there's an opportunity for their health,
for their healing, at zero cost to them for the
first five years.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
You deserve, rightfully to be extraordinarily proud that this has happened. This, this,
this is a career accomplishment, and you have so much
ahead of you. You're a very young woman, and you
have accomplished this out of out of conviction. It doesn't
always end well for whistleblowers. In fact, typically it does not.
(20:22):
It typically goes the other way, and they go off
into obscurity and lick their wounds for the rest of
their lives. You you have, you have had a grand
victory for yourself and a lot of other people and
on behalf of speaking out and this, this is, this
is the result we could only hope for. Do you
trust that they will develop this clinic in good faith
(20:45):
and that they will do what they've said because they
have in the past done horrible things.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
You know, that's a great question, one that I've already
I've been asked before. And here's what I'll say to
that is, we'll be watching and waiting. You know, I
can't I can't predict the future. But what we can
do is we can publicly we publicly shame the behavior
that is evil and unrighteous. As a society and as
a culture, we shame that behavior. Right, And when there's
(21:13):
behavior that does a complete one eighty, when it seeks
to undo the wrongs of the past, when it seeks
to affirm biological realities, when it seeks to protect and
help children instead of harm them, then we publicly honor
that behavior that change that we see. I think that's
very powerful. I think public shaming, as we've done in
(21:35):
the last five to ten years, since the transgender movement
has kind of come up more so into the spotlight,
has been incredibly effective. Right, it's kind of in retreat now,
But what I would say is that we're now entering
stase two. We're entering phase two because we're not going
to allow the institutions and the doctors, both of them
(21:59):
who have knowingly, you know, participated in the in sect
projecting procedures for years. They've done this. In fact, my
settlement showed that the hospital had started to do these
procedures and to build falsely since twenty ten, and I
(22:20):
brought evidence forwards starting in twenty twenty. I didn't even
know that this had been going on for years before
I came forward. But now we know, and what we're
going to do now as a society is we're not
going to let these hospitals and doctors off the hook.
We're not going to just say, well, we've you know,
we've defeated the trans movement. We're just going to move
(22:41):
on and let them live their lives in peace. No,
now we go back and we strip them of their
medical licenses so they they can't practice medicine. Now we
actually hold hospitals accountable who build medicaids falsely or who
deceive the public, and we force them into settlements in
which they admit what they've done, which is a exactly
what has happened here. So when we talk about accountability
(23:04):
moving forward, this is what we're talking about. We're talking
about holding institutions and doctors accountable for the years and
years of harm that they facilitated.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
I don't know if you're familiar with the case of
Mary Tally Boden, but she had her privileges at Methodists
revoked and she had the Texas Medical Board come after her,
and they've tried to destroy her. That is also one tough,
tough lady. But now everything she said has been proven true,
(23:36):
and Fauci and the establishment have been made out to
be worse than fools and knaves. They are criminals. And
you know, the sunlight se best disinfectant. We are seeing
the truth come out. Now, where does Vanessa Sivich go?
Where do you go from here? Well?
Speaker 2 (23:58):
You know, hopefully I I won't need a lifetime of therapy,
but you know, no, it's a joke. I I'm just
very deeply grateful. You know, I don't know that has
that remains to be seen. We have one more negotiation
settlement that will be that will be We will kind
(24:22):
of come to that here in the next couple of weeks.
I don't want to say too much about that, but
one more settlement. But uh, you know, I'm going to
go on vacation. I'm going to enjoy my time with
my husband and we're going to try to get our
life back. The meantime I leave, I lead Protecting Texas Children,
which is a state advocacy nonprofit dedicated towards advancing pro
(24:43):
child policies in Texas, and so that keeps me very busy.
Just a little bit.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
I want to I want to hear about that roub
against to break, if you can whold just one more segment.
I want to hear about that. I want to hear
about your work going forward and see how we can
help you in those efforts. I admire what you have done,
and I know there are big things ahead. Vanessa Sivitch
comeing out with them, Michael, Mary, They're.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
All Duncans, and you know Duncan means jo Yo.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Vanessa Sivitch is our guest. She is a nurse who
has become nationally famous for speaking out about what she
saw at Texas Children's Hospital when they did what they
said they weren't doing, when they broke the law, when
they mutilated children, making boys into girls and girls into boys,
or trying physically anyway that interview with Catherine Herridge that
(25:33):
you did. First of all, I have a lot of
respect for Katherine Herridge. She's been an expert for years
or a journalist covering national security. I'm glad to see
her branching out to do more than just military stories
because she's hard hitting and tough and fair. She's somebody
that the Obama administration came after like Cheryl Atkinson and
(25:54):
did her wrong. But let's talk about your future. Vanessa Sivitch,
You've started an organization and the intention is advocacy for children.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm the founder and president of Protecting Texas Children.
But encourage your audience to check out our website and
our work. We exist to defend children from radical gender ideology,
not just in medicine, because as you know, that takes
lots of forms. It's in media, it's in our entertainment,
(26:23):
it's in our school system, it's in curriculum, it's in
library books that are accessible to children, and so we
exist to defend children from that radical and destructive ideology
in all of its forms. We also work with lawmakers
in the state of Texas to advance pro child and
pro family policies. So that is a deeply fulfilling work
(26:46):
that I'm just so privileged to be a part of,
and I continue to doing that well.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
I will be sending a thousand bus when we finish,
and I would encourage a lot of other people, anyone
who is able to send whatever you can send, if
it's five bucks, to show our support for what you're doing.
It looks like there's a legislative side to this. So
presumably you're going to be working to pass laws to
protect children. What do you foresee what kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, one of the most important things I'll briefly touch
on that I'm very excited about is a law that
will allow D transitioners in the state of Texas to
hold their providers accountable. To see them right now, if
you can believe what is happening right now, in the
state of Texas, D transitioners only have a window of
two years to sue. There is about you know, we
(27:41):
know this from studies that have been done, but it
takes D transitioners an average of five to ten years
on average to realize what was done to them, the
harm that was done to them, when they wake up
one day and they realize, oh, my goodness, my breasts
are removed. Now I can't ever nurse my children like
that which happened to sore and Aldoca, one of my
(28:03):
good friends, a D transitioner here in Texas. We have
lawmakers in Austin who are putting together legislation as we
speak to extend that statute of limitations so that D
transitioners can sue their doctors and hold them accountable. And
so that's something that's a policy that protecting Texas children
will be championing, and we will be working together as
(28:26):
closely as we can with lawmakers in the House and
Senate to make sure that that makes it across the
finish line and on to the governor's desks so he
can sign it into law.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
Yeah, you know, it's it's amazing, and it's taking lemons
and making lemonade. Sometimes we have to be we have
to go through something because I mean, you're minimizing it
or or kind of glossing over it. But this would
have been a difficult thing for you to understand that
this career that you it's hard to become a nurse.
It takes a lot of preparation, education, admission, you know,
(29:02):
all these things, and to realize that doing this was
going to jeopardize your career. It wasn't going to get
you a pat on the back. That was a you know,
there were a lot of things that play here. In
addition to just what you were witnessing. There were a
lot of things at play. Let me go back to
you talk about getting reassigned or getting a different job,
and that's where you ended up in this particular situation.
(29:25):
Was that a promotion? What was the job to which
you were assigned?
Speaker 2 (29:30):
It was not a promotion. It was a lateral move.
What it was was a very practical mood. We wanted
to move to the suburbs. I didn't want to commute
into the downtown medical center every day. So we moved
in suburbs and I took a job at a multi
specialty satellite clinic of Texas Children's And that's where all
of this kind of went down, is kind of in
(29:51):
a suburb clinic. And so that's that's kind of when
I started to see what I've described previously with children
being transition and with providers billing medicaid fraudulently, culminating in
the ten million dollars settlement that was announced last week.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
When you talk about billing Medicare medicaid or Medicare Medicaid
medicaid fraudulently, do you think they knew? Do you think
everyone up and down the chain knew that they were
committing fraud.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
That's a great question. I can say for in absolute
certainty that one of the doctors that I blew the
whistle on which I cannot say his name, but I
can tell you for certain that one of them admitted
he perjured himself, and he admitted when he sued the
state of Texas after SB fourteen was passed two years ago,
(30:48):
which is the law that made these treatments illegal, he
admitted that his patients were on Medicaid, and so that's
public record. So I can tell you for certain that
one of them did know that his uh that excuse me,
that the doctor's patients were on many of them were
(31:09):
on Medicaid, and so I can't I can't speak to
the other ones. But this really is a watershed moment
for for this type of fraud case, this False Claims
Act case. The Department of Justice has announced and has
said in the past, that this will be the model
that they use for all other pending litigation in other states.
(31:31):
What what I've always wanted and what my hope has
been is that this serves as the blueprint that other
hospitals because of what is, you know, the example that
Texas Children's is the setting here. The precedent that's being
said is that other hospitals will now be compelled to
also open d transition centers of their own at zero cost.
(31:54):
And so what a what a remarkable, redeeming story this is.
I just want to say that, yes, never could I
have imagine that this would have been the outcome that
I'm hopeful that this will just be one clinic, you know,
in a long series of future clinics that will open
as a result of this watershed moment.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
Yeah, because there are a lot of kids, you know,
there are a lot of kids. This it's a trend.
I mean, it's I hate to I hate to use
such a seemingly dismissive term, but it is a trend.
These things. This was not traditional, This was not historic.
There is not a legacy of this. Uh, this was
this was a political trend. It's not medicine. And there
(32:36):
are going to be children who were terribly terribly harmed
out of this, like phlidimide or or or taking the
clock shot. Vanessa Sivich, you are wonderful. Uh, You're fantastic.
Please keep up this fight. It's important and we need you,
our children need you.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Thank you. Thanks for your donation. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (32:56):
Got it. I will post a link to her sight.
And if you can give, don't ever think that because
I can only give tenor I can only give twenty,
or I can only give fifty. Whatever that is. Be
surprised we raised I mean how much money we raise
off you not being fat anymore. It wasn't six million,
(33:17):
It was over fifty thousand dollars. I got that list
around here somewhere. There are a lot of people who
came up big on Oh never an illness has left
a been any thank you, I mean good night.
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