Lacrosse Legends Roundpoint Family

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Episode Transcript

(00:07):
So we're pleased to be here todayat Aquasasi at the Traveling College and continuing
to do interviews like we have forthe last three four years. And today
we're going to learn a little bitabout the round Point family and their involvement
as stickmakers here in the community andlearn a little bit of history that way.
So I wanted to introduce Bill roundPoint first. And Bill, maybe

(00:31):
you could tell us your age first, and my name's Bill round Point.
I'm fifty nine years old. Nogreat, Frank you, Yeah, I'm
fifty eight, fifty eight years old. And when would you guys been introduced
to the to the game of lacrosseseason? We're probably four years old anymore,
three if I might have been four, he was three in our older

(00:54):
brothers, Rust and Barrys. Theyhad us out there with our other brother
Mark, he's a year older thanI am, and they showed us.
They taught us how to pass andshoot, and they would tie cans and
stuff to the to the net inthe back, told us to shoot at
it, and they told us howto pass the ball to the open guy

(01:15):
when somebody's coming at you like they'dlike a like on power play. They
do that triangle. They had usbecause Frank was a right and Mark was
a right and I was a lefty. So it worked out good. And
they showed us how to move theball out and to shoot that way.
That's basically the start of it everything. Yeah, and after a while they
couldn't get the ball from us becausewe caught on pretty quick. Yeah,

(01:36):
they last because they knew how fastwe were learning though. So we played
Cornwall mine on lacrosse. Grew upCornwall Mine on lacross. I started out
as a goaltender. Yeah. Iplayed goaltender up until Bannam and I think
it was fourteen maybe, and wehad a team here called the Mohawks.
It was coached by Ron Thomas.Bill was playing as he was playing as

(02:00):
like it maybe a midget or yeah, yeah, for the junior team.
And they had goaltender before Brian Thomasand Stanley Francis yea, and they were
a good tandem and they graduated tosenior and the goal tenders behind them were
really up to snuff. So theypulled me from Bandams and I played as
a fourteen year old in the juniorleague and I come down remember one time

(02:23):
wearing you know, to cut offshirt. It was in the summertime and
my arms were full of bruises,and my mother to look at me and
she said, you're not playing goalanymore for that for the junior team.
But he could also play out realgood or because a few years too,
when they were kids, he wouldplay out, but like he was at
the yard, like as a molder, he would play stay at the same
level, or like he beat himat the major and I moved up to

(02:46):
the minor in the next level,and he would play out and he played
very good out too, so hecould have played either or. And then
uh, actually, at the ageof fifteen, they started a team called
the Thunderbirds. They played against theWarriors here and that was a good rivalry
in the community kind of you hadfans for both. As a fifteen year

(03:06):
old, I remember they were shortplayers, so they asked me to play,
so I said, okay, I'llplay. And Willie Jock was a
coach. He's not a lacrosse guy, and uh, to this day,
I don't know why he was thecoach, but he he was on the
bench and he looked at me,She's gonna give you one shot. Good
out there, and my first shiftI scored. Yeah, so we're like
they needed players and they knew wewere players, and so we went to

(03:29):
play Yarland. We played against men, yeah, and well here so we
survived, right, So yeah,I mean but there was no really no
junior league at that time for usto go to play. So we played
there and a lot of other guysour age would play for the other team,
the Warriors too, so there wasstill that rival like the our age
group rivalry too, you know,instead of us having one team. Yeah,

(03:53):
and then we played. They madea team for us in the La
Junior bat team yeah, called theEagles. Ye called the Za the Eagles.
And we played in the league andwe didn't have that much success,
but me and him and Mark,we were the leaders of the team.
We led the Mark and I weretied first for scoring and he was like
two points behind. Yeah. Sowe'd go out and play, and we'd

(04:15):
go out and play, and Ithink we only won maybe two games there.
Yeah, but it was all learningfor a lot of a lot of
guys who didn't play as much aswe played. I'm gonna say, you
know, we have that I findand I still we were a very individual
team. You know, we weren'tmaking picking roles. We weren't you know,
there was a lot of individual andthat's and we were good at doing

(04:36):
what we were doing because we grewup playing with equipment in the backyard.
Whoever had the ball, you getdouble team by the other two. And
our grandmother with Stanton Lodder and tellus say, we were crazy because we're
just beating the headcout of each other. It was fun though. We would
go and watch our brothers played juniorlacrosse in Cornwall. Come back and we
been playing in the dark. Weplayed, were so excited from watching.

(04:59):
And the thing too, was Iremember was there would be a lot of
kids our age. We're running allover the place in the arena, you
know, just going there to runaround all havoc. We sat there and
watched what was going on, youknow, and uh that, like you
said, we'd come back after thegame, like there would be a big
line up on the bridge. Thebridge was a long bridge at the time.
They played out of the Water Streetarena and the horns would be blaring

(05:21):
because they won because they beat theRams or just an that and we get
back and we'd emilate whoever our favoriteplayer was, you know, stuff like
that. So how much older wereyour older brothers? And you guys three
berries three and mar Russell's four yearsolder. Yeah, so they both play.
Have a sister Eline as well,and they all all our brothers are

(05:43):
good lacrosse players too. They're allgood. They all could play the game
really well. You know. Yeah, you're whole f you're whole fair.
Yeah. Yeah, our father played, and I mean Frank went to Saint
Catherine's for his induction into La theOla Hall of Fame. Yeah at all.
We put wrote the bio for himand we hope we got him in
there. So yes, but heI guess um, I think Wallace played

(06:06):
the longest above the Wallace. Hetraveled out west. He played from North
Shore as a back in the day. And I remember back in ninety five,
Wayne Baker gave me a call,would you like to come up and
play? You know, we heardsome good things about you. It was
actually Barry Paulis, who played forWayne before, who gave him my name.

(06:27):
I played against Barry when he wasin on Naga and I used to
like beat on him and Frank wasFrank was pretty Frank could let people notice
him in a pretty physical way,real fast. Yeah. I was like
six two two thirty, you know, and I was I was in pretty
tape at one time. He alwayssaid, like I still get those comments,
you know how a referee shore knowyou you know where the penalty box

(06:48):
still is a bill you know.Yeah, okay, sure, all right,
but we could play the game inall the ways if we had to,
you know, so we played dlike the old man said this,
stay, we can't played both endsof the floor. Don't get on the
floor. Yeah, exactly, that'swhat he said. In the time when
they were doing the transition offense defensewe were going forward. I played because

(07:09):
of my size. I played onthe crease in defense and then the crease
on offense. I was running thefull length of Yeah, and I would
play on the other side, youknow. But I wasn't as fast as
this guy, you know, butI still got down there. Yeah.
He was good. He like,I got a lot of opportunities scoring because
I cut through the pain lot andwent and you know, I wasn't one
hundred percent, but he took alot fewer shots than me, and he

(07:30):
scored. He's percentage. It wasin the ninety percent when he shot.
Maybe I shot once or twice agame and you get two goals. I
shoot like six times, didn't getthree. You know, stuff like that.
And we played with a lot ofgood lacrosse players, yeah, for
sure around here. But our styleof lacrosse was, like he said,
it was like there was no system, right, nobody did the pick and

(07:51):
roll or or or the motion ornot. We didn't. We didn't know
that stuff. And I remember JimBishop come to watch us play time at
the Water Street Arena, and heremember this, He says, as long
as you guys keep playing the wayyou're doing, individual and none of you
aren't gonna win a national championship.And then, you know, no truer
words really ever spoke, but hespeat Scotts. We won that game though,

(08:13):
Yeah, whatever happened that our team, the Thunderbirds, went out there
and we won the game against ateam that played a better system than us.
So his words were teutonic. Weneeded that game, but exactly,
and then uh we formed a team. Uh, lacrosse died, and then
it was just the old sticks thatwere going at the Water Street Arena.
And then it was a Frankie andErnie that started the thunder. The thunder

(08:39):
I think it was Ernie. Yeah, Ernie. We did the club Ernie
Mitchell and we went to play inthe President's Cup and we were pretty unorganized,
but we managed to win two gamesin the tournament. And then the
next year they met, they meetthe LA Yeah, and we we went
to the finals against Nadaga. Theyhad a pretty strong well year, was
that ninety four, ninety three,ninety three I believe, and uh a

(09:03):
Nadaga end up beating us game seventhin the series, and they played out
of an outdoor arena and the balland that was small. They were used
to playing in that. When weplayed them in the arena, we beat
them hands down. But but becausethey had the better regular season record,
they had the last game at hometo their credit, you know, and
they end up beating us in gameseven. Yeah. They were pretty crafty.

(09:24):
Yeah, I know that outdoor box. Yeah right, thus call it.
Yeah, it's like you ran indeep sense in some spots. Yeah.
And then the final the following yearwe won the league, we went
to the Presidents Cup. It wasin Hamilton, I believe, or Bramford.
It was in Branford. And uhI think we won bronze medal and

(09:45):
tuscarroor thunder Ocks beat Burning being thegold medal and we lost the Burner being
a double overtime. Yeah right,that was a tight game to seventh and
Tuscarora had a goalie who was huge. His name was Dale Henry uk hard
score on him. This is whenthe nets were four by four. Guy
was four by guys. This guygot about two or three. Yeah.

(10:05):
Yeah, what I do is Irun by him, jump in the air
and he grew up like this andI bounced out at this week. Yeah.
I never thought on that, butI get knocked on my ass by
the Chrysler brothers after I did that. Yeah, you paid the price.
Yeah, it was also worth itfor me. I never really got into
a game until I got knocked onmy ass. Yeah, you know,
straight after a while. Yeah,okay, thanks for getting blocked in exactly.

(10:28):
Yeah. Yeah. So and thenthe following year, um, I
don't know what happened, but theyformed the team Outlaws and the Thunder and
that was what year. Okay,because I went to the he went to
the Olas. Actually I went tothe OLATS two along with my buddy Tyler
Sunday and we were running and itjust seemed like they weren't really committed,

(10:52):
you know, some of the veterans. They were like sitting on the bench
while we're training, and we justsaid, let you go back to the
thunder. He stayed. I went, yeah, I stayed on the time.
Were you guys ninety five through againsteach other? Yeah, Like,

(11:13):
I mean, there's a lot oftensions in the community. It was this
stuff is big rivalry and people weregetting involved, right. Yeah. And
the brand game I played, Ialways was in your face and you at
my ball, and I wanted thatkind of thing, you know, And
I was aggressive player and I scoreda lot. Yeah. And uh,
anyways, we had a player thatcame in. His name is Dean Chiconi,

(11:35):
and to me, that was thebest thing that could have happened to
me in my career because he showedme how to run the picking roll,
what to do when you don't havethe moll pick off ball and get loose
and I did that and I watchedhim and I did that. Him and
Pete Skuy was also an influence forme because he was good at throwing the
fake pick, taking a step backin the ball and bearing it. So

(11:56):
I started doing the things they weredoing and it was working, you know,
really nice, right and then yeah, and then we end up going
to we beat them in the finalsand we went to the President's Cup.
We picked up Mikey Benedict Junior anda couple other players and uh, Mikey
was the only one really player ofthe who played. Yeah, and we
we uh we end up losing theBurnaby in the round robin and we faced

(12:20):
him in the final and uh,we end up beating them, but we
were in the penalty box the firsttwo periods all the time. You know,
it was and it was so badthe reference that Soan Gil who was
the CLA commissioner at the time,went into referee and room and told him
you better start referring this game fairor you know, it's that obvious.
This was in print, Prince George, British Columbia. Right. And but

(12:43):
we were still I think we werewe might have been a goal or two
up after the second and the third. We were the only team that scored.
I got two goals in the thirdand uh we steal the deal and
that was for the Founder's Cup.Yeah, we were the first team Romco
the national Yeah, and that wason the other team, right, I

(13:05):
didn't go. I heard that rivalry. Uh. There were tough times yea
at that time, and that helpedbring the community together apparently eventually. You
know, across there, a lotof people say their creators game a healing
game, right, Yes, itwasn't for me. It was a little
brother of war for me. Andthat's the way I played it, you
know, And people hated me forit, and a lot of people,

(13:28):
like our fans on ours, likethe team I played on it, and
like him, but that's because heplayed so well. And that's starting to
respect. Yes, So I meanwe played and you know, like he
won, and I'm happy for him, and you know, and but I
had a good season with these guys. Uh, with the team I played

(13:48):
with, I played, I didn'tthink I had a ball. Maybe fifteen
to twenty goals in that season,a whole bunch of assists. So I
had to play with Mike Benedict Juniorand Owen Benedict and on the line,
and I played on the first linefor the first time probably in a long
time, so, which was okay. But at the end of the day,
we didn't have enough to take themdown. But but I mean without

(14:09):
us playing and pushing them as hardas we did, they probably wouldn't have
been that good to use that toget to the final, to the championship.
So all right, So how howlong did you play for? Like?
How old were you when you finallyhung it up? I don't know.
A last team I played for fora full season, probably was the
Outlaws. This was I don't know, probably thirty seven, thirty eight maybe,

(14:35):
and then I might have played likethe next year for somebody a couple
of games and that was it.And then now I just played little masters,
run around with a bunch of guysin the summer right around my eight
guy ex players, we play liketry and go forty and over because thirty
five are still still should be playingin the real game. You know.
That's what I always would say,What are you doing out here? You

(14:56):
should be playing the real game ifyou want to run as already running now,
yeah, right right, right right? I played, uh ninety eight,
I went out west, played forNorth Shore Indians. We had a
good team. We you know,we had a really good team. Todd
katan Check, Mike Meridia and JamieBow and good good players, you know.

(15:16):
And Petch guy was out there aswell. I played with Pete before,
so Yule Baker stuff like that.And then um, we went in
the playoff run and we end upgetting beat by I think it was Victoria
carry Kate. Oh, I wasplaying Victoria at the time. And yeah,
he was a hard person to stuff, you know. He just had
that knack for scoring. Yeah,oh yeah, And I seen him play

(15:39):
one game. I don't remember ifit was against us, but there was
a it was a tie game,and he come through the movie he's getting
knocked out like this. He justgoes like this back end, top corner
game over. You know. It'sjust it's such an incredible knack. And
then, uh I played against Johnwith John Tavares. I came back here.
I don't know how old I was. I was pretty old. I
shouldn't have been playing when you hadthis PA A major series league thunder.

(16:04):
John Tavares was playing UM and uhso we played against John Grant junior year,
you know, and there was alot of players in the league,
you know. Yeah, it wasgood, good experience, and I found
from junior senior B to senior AThe difference was what you do when you
don't have the ball and how quickyou can release the ball once you get

(16:26):
in your stick. You know,the goalies were better for sure. Yeah
I can uh, Senior B.I could score three four goals a game
quite often. Senior A. Iwas getting one goal a game, you
know, and I was getting aton of chances too. So so let
me go back a little bit,Bill, what was how did you make
your living growing up? You know, from the when you picked your profession

(16:47):
that you're going to follow and thatkind of thing, like how did you
what did you do for to makeyour living? Well? Right now?
Like I'm going working child protection likeyou know, for families. That's okay.
I going to school for that.And then I worked with kids in
schools in the school systems there andI did I helped out in the classrooms
and that. Then I did construction. Frank's got a construction company. I

(17:08):
worked for him for about twelve thirteenyears, and then I went back to
this. Um that's what I'm doingnow. I'm I'm working. I will
call like a representative for aqua Ustine. It's like a band representative, and
we work with families who who haveinvolvement with children protection agencies outside the community.
These people, the people I workwith, are Aquasusna people, but

(17:32):
they don't live in Aquasusine. Isee. Yeah, so we're just like
advocates for them to make sure theyget three fairly and they understand what's happening
and we assist. You're an advocate, Yeah, I'm an advocate. Yeah,
yeah, okay, but I myfather did show me how to make
lacrosse sticks way back. And thenwhat was your dad thing? His name
was Ron Rompoint. They called himRooney though, and he played, but

(17:53):
he was more known as a stickmaker. Oh yeah, so he was
My grandfather owned that. Your grandfather'sname was Frank round Point. Yeah.
So there was Gilbert Wallace and myfather Rooney, and then they had a
sister named Elizabeth or they called himher Bessia. But they all they all
worked there. I think mostly Wallaceand my father made sticks. Gilbert might

(18:15):
have worked there for a little while, but I don't think that was his
true interest in work. But Icould be wrong, because I know he
was a partner. After my grandfatherpassed, they owned a business and they
were Colin Chisholm was one of thewas the other partner. I guess that's
my grandfather Frank. He's the ownerof the cross factory with his brothers.

(18:38):
What's the earliest fact you guys knowabout how it started and the different names
along the way until it got backto the round points. Well, I
guess they all worked in Cornwall withfor a guy named Joe Lally. I
don't know if that was his realown last named Lally, might have been
Pendergrass or Lally. What year wasI think might have been in the thirties

(19:00):
or the forties. Okay, Andmy grandfather worked there with his brother Alex.
And there's a lot of men fromuncle Zustina worked there. Okay,
this is my uncle Wallace. Wrongpoint. He's carving the handle of to
make a lacross, like using hisdraw on those draw horse. Okay.
And they would work and then Iguess they came up with the idea that

(19:21):
hey, let's why don't we justdo this ourself. We got land,
we can build a building to manufacture. So the building the building came in
around what time did the I wouldn'tknow. I'm going to say around the
same time they start doing it overforties forties. Yeah, and then they
just did it all after that.And then I guess they got Colin because

(19:41):
Colin Chisholm was a teacher. Theyneeded somebody, an English person right to
help them with the sales and stuffand the contacts. Because my grandfather is
a fluid mohawk speaker. I don'tthink he could read it and write either,
I was told. So they hadhim and he helped market and sell
it. So I guess it reallytook off a in a long way.
And my dad and my uncle andmaybe my uncle Gilbert, they did.

(20:06):
They worked in the factory. Probablymy aunt Bessie too, I believe she
worked there too. But they employeda lot of people, like like I'll
say eighty ninety people maybe, Andthen they would take the sticks to different
homes and the ladies would let thesticks at home because they they're taking care
of the kids, right, yea, So they would let them. When
they're done, somebody would come andget them and take them back, and

(20:27):
they'd be a part of an orderto go somewheres, right, Like you
said, you guys would get sticksway out in Long Island, right,
So yeah, so those are probablyall part of that stuff. So yeah.
Yeah, so the uh, Iguess I heard the fact that nine
of the world's lacrosse sticks came fromfrom from Aquasasi or Saint Regis said,

(20:51):
yeah, yeah, so it's appliedthe world, you know, like England.
Well England had six mayors over there, but a lot came from from
here to get over there. InAustralia they got them, and Baltimore and
Long Island and upstate New York andyeah, because I remember they used to
put those stickers them back at right, residents on the raising, the resident
raising. Yeah, they put iton there and they said, this is

(21:11):
for a company in the state.Yeah, I said, I come and
they put that. You put thatsticker on. Well, they're selling it
and they're selling as their brand.We're just the manufacturers. Okay, So
it's a little bit of business oneon one right there, right, yeah,
manufacturer the middleman in the cellar.Right. So, so did you
you both could make a stick ifyou had to right now? No,

(21:33):
No, you would. Frank couldbuild you a perfect house, but the
stick making part wasn't ask them andhe showed me. And the first thing
they did they sent me in thewoods with a guy named Dowit hops and
we went to Kazaville and Quebec andthe guy was cutting trees down and we
were taking the logs and holding themin the wagon to the woods shag,

(21:56):
bark, hickery and bitter not too, I think was more bitter not than
any Oh yeah, yeah, Sowe bring him across and sometimes going over
the train tracks. That wagon fellapart. So we must have done three
or trough two or three loads ofday. That was it, and by
then it's getting dark and every timewe got to the road to put the

(22:17):
drop the logs, we ate thesandwhich because it suits back, it's hard
work though, So we did that, and then they showed me how to
carve, and my father and aguy named Joe the LARMI he's they're both
passing away by now, they calledhim Sphina, and I make a stick
and then they look at it,they grab it, they break it,
they say, make another one,and come finally they now you're getting the

(22:37):
hang of it. And then theysaid the hardest part was how to sharpen
the blade. Though he showed mehow to sharpen though, and then yeah,
there's a technique to it. Huh. Teddy Leaf worked there now and
Teddy Leaf still master carver still andhe works down the east for and my
alla for Mark Mitchell. Okay,so Teddy always asked me you make any
sticks still? I said yeah,He said, were you're gonna show me

(22:59):
them? I said, I don'tknow what, Teddy. I don't want
him to break my stick. Soan they taught me. I worked there
for a bit, you know.It was like kind of a programmer government,
a program where they got money todo this, and I worked there.
But then the sticks weren't really sellinganymore. So right after nineteen seventy
one seventy two, because I remember, yeah, I mean, my father

(23:23):
went to Syracuse for some kind ofI don't know what. It was,
the lacrosse festival. It was alacrosse thing and they had this thing at
night and I was Frank Benning hadme carving, and Paul Gate walked in
there and he's talking to me andmy father and he was he seemed like
a nice guy, you know,yes, but my own man's eyes lit

(23:45):
right up because he knew who hewas right there. You know who that
is? Yeah, that's that PaulGate. Yea. Even the coach from
squ was there that Roy Simmons Junior, Yes, yes, I know.
I asked him. I said,how come you don't have more natives on
your team? And he says,honestly, it's the grades. You gotta
have a certain grades, right,So I don't know. So anyways,
I just had to ask that.Anyways, Well, Roy Simmons Junior and

(24:06):
Oran are like this, yeah,yeah, so and Jimmy Brown was on
their team at Syracuse. Yeah hewas. He played at that outdoor box
you were talking about it. Theysay, there's a story that almost every
year that the shoe players would goplay against on the Dagga guys in that
box. They had it for thelongest times, and and they guess the

(24:26):
people treated the people from a shoeteam pretty rotten rotten, but they took
it as a side of respect becausethey were they were hard on them,
you know what I mean. Sohere's two stories about that box that I
know, okay, as I interviewedOoran in that box at one point.
First one, there used to bea big tree limb over the box,

(24:48):
a big tree limb, and thekids would sit on that tree limb and
the game would go on right underneaththem right, and one team, the
branch finally broke and they all endedup up right on the field, right
on the box. You know.Uh you know they fell about eight eight
ten feet you know or whatever,and uh yeah, they were fine,
but that it was a funny story. And then the other one was with

(25:14):
I think paulas his dad hip checkJimmy Jimmy Brown twice and took him down
and his dad weighed like one hundredand forty five pounds and took an Oran.
I just talked to Oran about thisa few weeks ago down in Baltimore,
and he was saying, he wastelling that story. How, yeah,
he was great at this hip checkand he took Jimmy Brown down twice.

(25:38):
You don't think Jimmy was built likeyou two thirty and six two,
you know, and uh, youknow. So those are two stories that
come from that box. And Iknow, you know, yeah, and
so the round Point family, didyou always know you were going to be
stick makers or like or or like? How did that? Well? They
were doing that when we came along. That's was going on. That's what

(26:00):
was going on. And my grandparentshad their house right beside the factory,
right and then every now and then, if you're there playing there visiting,
there's these buses are there and yousee these young guys comeing out. I
guess there's the Man Cup was inin Cornwall before. I didn't know,
but the teams went there to getsticks. They look at took the tour
and remember Bruce had said they hada meal in there for them two teams

(26:23):
the Man Cup, right, yeah, they had the game that the Water
Street that the finals at the WaterStreet Arena for the Man Cup. So
I don't I don't remember because Iwas a kid. So but I remember
the factory. I always being there, and there's always a stick. You
know. If I wanted to stick, they would give us a stick.
They would have sticks. Uh itwas my grandfather or my father. And

(26:45):
I'd go in and say, Idon't really remember my grandfather, but we
could always pick the best stick.They would pick it for us. Here,
this one's the best one. Totake this one, Okay. We
were privileged like that. Yeah,you would have been the first first North
America to get the new And eveneven my cousin Evan, he would tell
me too, he said, wheneveryou go to visit our grandma, our
grandmother, and my father was thereall the time. My father would always

(27:07):
go out and come in and givehim a stick. He would give him
a stick, and he had wholebunch of them. He would go back
to where his mother, his motherwas visiting his grandmother, which would have
been my well that would my grandmotherwas Evan's great grandmother. Okay, so
he would he would take told me, you'd take the stick down, he
says, uncle Rooney game, andhe said, you got enough for him,

(27:30):
take it back now. Evan Creeis another well known sick these days,
right, got how much younger thanyou guys? See, I don't
know about maybe more maybe maybe aboutfifteen years And so you say he really
never I never played on the samefloor as Evan. I don't know.
He's got an older brother, Garrett. I was just on my way out

(27:53):
when he was coming in. Yeah, dere dey're younger than us and they
can play, but like they're goodplayers, and havn't really into making sticks
now, and that's what he's that'swhat he does for his work. And
he says him A lot of theschools in the States by the sticks because
they gift them to graduating seniors.Yeah, what a gift, right,

(28:14):
it is great. So he's theydon't use them in but he says they're
buying them. I mean, nottoo many people will use a stick like
I play Masters, and a lotof guys come up to when I'm playing,
I'll trade you this my stick forhim stick. I know. Never
Yeah, I wasn't a big fanof the Masters. Uh. And I'll
tell you why. A lot ofthe people like you said they were kind

(28:36):
of young. They should have beenplaying senior. B You're running around with
us fifty year olds and they're hackingus up like like, and I gotta
sometimes I get a temperate when I'mon the Florida just looking yeah, and
then that's it, you know,and then you you just gotta tell them,
you know, you want to playthat way. I can still probably
do that too, right, Andyou do it, and then they'll stop

(28:56):
right usually, you know, soexactly. I just it's not for me,
you know. I played my styleof playing for thirty years and I
never really had an injury. Playedone game of Masters. My retina was
detached. A couple of teeth werenot Now, you guys, don't control
your stick man that's supposed to bea non contact. I go to work
the next day and I got ashiner. And I remember that we played

(29:21):
in the tournament together. We wonthe tournament, which we did good,
so it was good. But atthat age in your stage of your life,
you don't want to, you know, you don't want to be in
that kind of physical content because becausewe all played on concrete, right,
and now your your legs, yourhips and knees, it's all the toll
in your back. Because the guysI played with now we play over at

(29:41):
the arena over here, and it'sgot a nice turf on it. And
I said, I'm only going toever play again on turfing. Sure,
everybody's limpid, everybody's limpid, butwe're still laughing and throwing it on with
me. For me not to wegrew up playing on the Water Street arena.
It's probably the best concrete floor barnone, right, And and I
never played on the turf, sowhen you make a cut, you just

(30:03):
do slide a little bit. Yougot a little bit of give. Right.
So I got invited to the BuffaloBandits training camp in Stanborne, New
York, after we won the PredatorsCup. That was what year about.
Les Bartley was the coach. Yes, Brian Holle was the captain, John
Tivers, Troy Cordley the killed herbrothers were there anyways, So we're doing

(30:26):
the drills and we're running and youknow, I'm holding my own in my
opinion, and uh, I madea sudden cut and I tore legaments in
my ankle. Less Barley had mynumber. He kept calling me, calling
me, I would like you tocome back and and but my daughter.
The funny thing is as the sameankle I tore when I was playing junior
the last practice of the year.We were playing basketball as part of our

(30:51):
and I jumped up to get arebound and I landed on somebody's foot and
form ligaments. And we had agame to following Saturday, had a home
opener we hadn't played yet, andI'm there, I go there in the
cast and then I took my castoff and I played. And then after
that I limped the doctor and herefused to help me. So it was
basically the same ankle that I didit again too, and I just,

(31:12):
uh, you know, I totoday's day, I wish I never did
that when I was a junior becauseI can feel it now. But yeah,
that was a good experience playing goingto that camp. And you know,
so when you guys were like fourand five years old, he had
a big fire at the because ofall the sawdust in the air, and

(31:33):
it combusted right or something like that. I don't really know what happened.
But do you remember seeing that orat all? Or you were too young
to even I remember the first onewas kind of like red, that barn
red color, Yes, I rememberthat, and then the next one was
all cinder blocks. But so therewere a couple of fires. I think
I remember that, And I remembermy uncle Wallace's house burning. Do you

(31:53):
remember that? Yeah, But that'sanother time. But I wanted to tell
a story about my brother Barry.Sure that Barry was an outstanding player on
Junior's Asso was too, but Barrywas lanky. He could run a lot
with effortless. I remember we're watchingthe games and we're standing up top at

(32:14):
the water Street and my father walksin and who's with him as a fellow
by the name of Jim Bishop,who was coaching the Ashwood Green Gales at
the time. They went, andthey talked to Barry Jim Bishop asked Berry,
I want you to come and playfor my team, right, and
Barry said, I appreciate the offer, but I want to stay at play

(32:35):
lacrosse and my friends. Right.So this summer, me and Barry we're
golfing. We're golfing out there whereI live. And I asked him that
question. Barry, remember that timeJim Bishop asked you to play lacrosse?
The yeah, I'm there. Doyou regret it, Easter, I do
now, Bill, And that wasit, you know, like he could
have who knows where that would havethat about. And also Barry at letter
from Cornell University too. They wantedhim to go play fiel lacrosse even though

(32:59):
he's never ever played the game,because of what he did on the lacrosse
Dead. Harkness was at Cornell atthat time. Yeah, yeah, and
uh well Bishop was winning seven MentalCups in a row. Yeah, that's
like unheard of. We we playedFuel lacrosse. We both went to General
Vanji and it was a startup programand we were playing the New York State

(33:21):
teams here, but we weren't consideredpart of the league because we weren't American,
right, But we played exhibition gameswith them and we were winning.
We had a good team. Sowe went to the Ontarios as a first
year team and we won the AllOntario. Yeah yeah, so y one
and Brian Gilmour was our coach.He had no experience coaching that, but

(33:43):
he was a hockey guy. Youknow. He had organized you're on hockey
school, You're on hockey school.He had connections to universities in the state.
So we played the Ontarios. Iwas always a good scoring in phil
Across. It was like scoring thatsix by six. Yeah, it was
just you know, getting a sixseven goals a game and stuff like that.
And because I thought, you gota letter from Penn State, you

(34:05):
know, for me to come down, I never went. And I got
asked the guy from Holy Cross askedme if I was interested, and you
know, like I never thought likethat. You know, now you look
at people nowadays to play and everywhere. So yeah. So I mean when
they first they did a clinic onhow to show us how to play,
I mean Frank was on that sideand it was on this side and we're
just pounding that ball in the net. And Dave White from Salmon River coach.

(34:29):
I think the round points know howto play field across already, so
they told us to get off becausethe long sticks couldn't even get in the
airs, were already hammering the ballin the that we played against the team't
wait to get the balls. I'mgonna I'm gonna shoot. You know you
are, because don't forget. Welearned it from a kid being a kid
up. That's all we did everysummer day we played lacrosse. Yeah,

(34:49):
there's a saying that any decent boxacross from go on the field and play
decent as a fuel across. Buta decent field across can't just go in
the box and play decent because it'sso different. It's a different system,
you know. And uh, thatyear we played a team he was Saint
Lawrence High School out the Brazier Falls. They were the powerhouse in the league,

(35:09):
and we we dominated. They beatus the first game, but the
next game when we learned it,we learned it quick. After that we
got him and we never lost.And their coach, coach Kegan I think
his name was, he was soupset he was smacking his players around and
this and that. But we wereThey were more too technical where we were
technical and loose and fluid. Wecould see the we could see the fields.

(35:34):
You know. We just found thatball, we get it and pound
it. And it was a different, different animal for me because it was
so wide open, you know,there so many opportunity to do what you
want to do. Yeah, So, I mean we picked it up and
we had some good success at thathigh school where we're at. And first
we won the champion Ontario Championship andthen we lost in the next year in

(35:54):
the double overtime in the finals Peterboroughto another team good Tenner in high school.
I believe they were, and theycouldn't beat the face off. Man,
that was the game. Yeah,it's possession right. It might have
been John Barry coaching there. Idon't know. When we went out there
too. We kind of billeted withsome of the their players and uh yeah,

(36:15):
they had Peterborough James game was theythey were watching us playing. They
invited me to their camp and mybrother I didn't go, but we just
like playing around here. Yeah,yeah, it was yeah. And then
that's the thing, right like backthen we nobody went out to play somewhere.
Nowadays it's a real common occurrence.They clouded the kids six Nations,

(36:37):
some kids from Gunnawaga and Cool Quitlamplaying ball and they get exposure, they
get to go to a D oneschool and next thing you know, it
might be running in the NLU,right right. And that's and even they
field LA Cross League. So Imean lacrossees has grown in that way.
The opportunities are so great. Uhyeah, which is good. Which is

(36:57):
good, you know, it isgood, you know, with the potential
Olympics twenty twenty eight, that hassomething. I tried out for the Aquan
Nationals. We were playing a clubteam and there were some SUE players on
that club team, Salmon River HighSchool, and we played them on a
Saturday morning. We got to beatlike twenty to eleven or something. This

(37:19):
guy guy scored a whole bunch ofgoals or seven goals. I played deep
in the game. I played,I played long pole and I had that
WOODI uh and I got stripping guyson. But they had some pretty big
players football guys playing midfield and theywere just running guys over. The guy
couldn't run me over though I knewhe's coming, and it was a it

(37:39):
was a challenging bang, you know, yeah, and I stopped him and
we both took a step back.That was it, you know, which
is you know, it's that's thata little batter you like to play out
Like I played a physical game oflacrosse too, you know. So I
mean those are the experiences we had, uh, I mean we him and
I played together against each other,but always were you know, our mother

(38:01):
always made sure that we always gotalone though, like if no matter how
bad it might have gotten the community, you know, and other people would
say, you guys are brothers,you know, we know, but we're
just playing against each other. Everybodyelse's being like like when it was Thunder
the Outlaws. Yeah, all mybuddies were playing for the Outlaws. You
know, after the game, I'dhang out with them, and even though

(38:22):
I was being uh, all ofthem guys he's talking about, they all
respected him. Yeah, everybody respectedmy brother. They all respected his ability
the way he played the game becausethey knew how much of a competitor he
was. Though, did you guysever coach after you got done with playing?
I coached, I coached, Icoached minor lacrosse, and I still

(38:46):
might again this year. I mightcoach junior Sea in Cornwall. But it's
still up in the air. Iget asked all the time because they got
my coaching levels. Uh right.So I coached fuel across at a high
school in Williamstown, Ontario, andwe had some good we had because a
lot of them kids played in Cornwalland but that's kind of it up in

(39:07):
the air too. So basically that'scoaching that be it, you know.
So Frank Frank it doesn't doesn't havehe's got to have that card to get
on the bay. I got levelone. I never went for level two,
right to me, um, Igo to every game in the area,

(39:30):
like I support the junior team wholeheartedly, you know. Yeah sometimes uh
you know, I see the waythey played, they played that motion offense.
I'm so I'm against the motion offense. I grew up playing senior a
pick and roll, you know,and it's it works picking a it works,
you know, as long as yougot two guys who know what to

(39:51):
do, right. Yeah. AndI find because a lot of people are
playing field. Before they go intothe box and field, you gotta avoid
your defender. You gotta run awayfro him. There's no engaging or you're
gonna get called right, Whereas apick and roll, you got to engage
your defender so that the defenseman coveringyou is focused on you. When he
gets picked, he doesn't realize,Okay, this guy's one step ahead of

(40:12):
me and you're giving the ball.Exactly what kind of right you got to
make? That that doesn't happen intoday's game. I find only I find
that happens more in a senior ajunior A. But in B it's a
lot of motion offense running around.If you're on a tight house here,
you're gonna shut that down, ryou know, right right then? And
like he's saying, like this,expand on that, like if you can
make your defender work hard as you'reworking right, you're gonna get a third

(40:37):
period. Third periods, we're goingto get fatigued now, right, So
those were mistakes are really going tomake place. Right, who's in better
shape then should have a better chance, Who can think, continue to think
without worried about why I gotta I'mbreathing? And you know, yeah,
because sometimes it comes down to conditionand though so and I find, like
you said, the conditioning aspect becauseplayers are only playing a half flour now,

(40:59):
right, they're not as in goodshape as whether if they were running
up and down, you know.So for me, and I've talked to
a friend of mine, Wayne Baker, we sit there watching games and we
we kind of you know, they'reon a power play and they lose the
ball and they just run off.You know, they don't even for the
ball again. You know, youshould be pressing because defense starts as soon

(41:21):
as you lose the ball, right, no matter where you lose it,
and it can go right back tooffense that quick, right, human They
don't even got a few seconds toget the ball over the lining. So
I guess that's because we all playedfull court for so long exactly. I
think a lot was lost in thegame when they went half and half.
You know, your your offensive playersare on the floor more, yeah,
and get it. But if theyget caught in the floor, they're a
liability. Yeah, right, Sothey need to learn both ends of the

(41:45):
ex because just because you're playing offenseyour whole life and you're trying to get
on a team with a higher level, you might not be able to stay
at that way you're used to.And they ask you to play on the
defensive side, and they are lost, you might end up not being on
that team, right, so's whyit's why it's important to know as much
as you canoken on that about playingboth ends of that Florida transition everything.

(42:07):
Yeah for sure. Yeah. Doyou have any sons, daughters, niece's
nephews that play the game at all? I have my son, he doesn't
play. My stepsons used to playthere, my wife's kids they played for
the longest time, but they don'tplay anymore. So, like what you
said, yeah for the last thebag is getting empty for her lacrosse before

(42:30):
wow, my last one. Yeahwow wow, long long history with your
family. And yeah, well Imean Bruce or cousin. Bruce's grandsons were
playing, right, Trevor and Dalton, but they don't seem to play anymore.
You know whatever preach in your way, right, yeah work, Yeah
for sure. Yeah, I canthink of your family and stuff. Yeah,

(42:50):
lacrosse doesn't really pay that much evenif you're in the proles, right
right, Because my uncle Walace toldme a good story about that before It's
belly. He says, a lacrosspaw lacrosse ball might look like a potato,
but he said, no matter howlong you boil it, it's still
a lacrosse ball, he says,So get your ass to work. He's
just time you play lacrosse. Butwork too, right, because you can't.

(43:14):
You can't make a living off alacrosse back then. You know.
I don't know if they can.No, No, I don't. I
don't know. I don't think theycan. You know, maybe some players
get you know, but you've gotto be in the game for quite a
while. Yeah, just the big, the big, big games. I
think I think it's going in theright direction with Paul Rabow what he's doing,
you yeah, and stuff like that. He's getting sponsorship and uh,

(43:36):
I think I heard a comment whathe said is at one time in the
UFC was in the same boat asm but now look at the money they're
again because they had somebody marketing thegame. And that's what he's doing.
So my hats are off to him, and I hope he succeeds. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, youknow. But on the Cree side,
your cousin, righty, are therekids playing on that side? I

(44:00):
think I think Garrett's boys are playing, right, Yeah, Garrett's stepson was
playing, but Evan's son, Idon't know if he's plays yet, but
right right, so, I don'tknow. We'll see what happens, or
see what happens. Yeah, maybethey'll skip a generation and the grandkids will
play, right who knows. Yeah, so you know this this did you

(44:20):
you play other sports as well?Or it was lacrosse your your only I
was pretty decent. I never playedcompetitive hockey because at the time it was
kind of expensive and my parents hadgotten divorced and we were staying with our
mother. But we played pickup gamesand then playing the arena, could skate.
Shoot, It's just you know,it's an athletic hand e coornation and
you know, and basketball was prettydecent in basketball as well. Yeah,

(44:44):
I played football in high school,played hockey him, we played pickup league
whatever. But lacrosse. Lacrosse wasthe Lacrosse was the number one. Now
yeah, so I mean that's whereyou put all your energy into it because
that's for me, probably for himtoo. That's that was the game,
right, Yeah, that was ourgame, and that's what we did.
We were lacrosse players, were knownas lacrosse players. Yes, now we're

(45:07):
retired lacrosse players. So yeah,So but I mean that's the thing,
right. I mean, like yousaid, we were born into this.
And I remember when we were littlekids they had that expo and the Man
in Montreal and sixty seven or sixtyeight, the Man in the Road,
the Road, the World Fairy.And my parents made me play lacrosse for

(45:30):
a team in Montreal, and Ididn't want to go. They said,
if you don't play, you're notgonna go. So I played. I
didn't want to play because I didn'tunderstand French or nothing. That ran around
did my obligation. And then meand him we're running around all over the
place and I got lost. ActuallyI do remember that now. He was
he's always he's younger, right,But we were always run around and there

(45:52):
was like there was they had anice drink in the summertime and there's a
figure skating there. I thought thatwas pretty amazing and a little kid,
but I ended up getting lost,uh right, and everything, and then
my mother they put me in Theyreconnected again, and anyway, I remember
I had to play lacrosse so muchafter you got a spanking, I had

(46:15):
to. I had to play lacrosse. But I'm sure I don't know.
I felt I believed them. Thenthey said if you don't, if you
don't play lacrosse, you're not coming. Yeah. So I guess I had
something to do with the lacrosse factorybecause my father was still very involved.
So but I was just a littlekid and I didn't really know them.

(46:36):
Didn't see it for anything else thatif I don't go, I don't get
to If I don't play, Idon't get to go. There was enough
of the carrot for you. Yeah, I had to. So I played
and didn't enjoy it. I'n't tellyou the truth. I didn't know them
kids, shy, I didn't understandthe word they were saying, but I
played anyways. Yeah, very good. Well, anything else you want to
say about the game, I don'tthink I've covered just about everything that's far.

(47:00):
Yeah. Yeah. You know,a round Point family always be known
worldwide as great stick makers for thesport and UH and the players as well.
And you know, you should bevery proud of your your heritage.
You know what what they you know, your family gave to the game.
All allowed a lot of people toto play. M h M.