June 20, 2025 • 38 mins
In this Ortho Marketing episode, Dean Steinman is joined by Gary Sastow, Partner at Danziger & Markhoff LLP, to discuss the legal essentials every dental practice owner needs to know. From regulatory compliance and risk management to contracts and employee matters, Gary shares expert insights to help practices stay protected and legally sound. Whether you're starting, growing, or managing a practice, this episode is packed with must-know legal guidance.
Ready to elevate your practice?
Contact us! https://orthomarketing.com/contact-us/
About Gary Sastow
Gary Sastow has over twenty-five years of experience in the practice of law. While maintaining a broad scope of practice, Gary focuses on representing healthcare professionals in all aspects of their business, professional and personal lives. Having been raised in a family of physicians, he possesses a unique understanding and insight into the business of practicing a healthcare profession. Combined with his years of practice in what has become a more complex and highly regulated industry, Gary’s clients see him as a trusted advisor, confidant, and advocate. On an ongoing basis, he works with clients on transactional matters, regulatory compliance issues and problem solving including providing representation to clients under professional investigation before OPMC, OPD or the Justice Center. Gary is a prolific speaker and author of professional articles in various publications. He has also served as an adjunct professor at Pace University teaching Health Law and Policy and Not for Profit Organizations. Gary is a recommended legal services provider for the NYS Dental Association. D&M now provides representation to clients under professional investigation before OPMC, OPD or the Justice Center
Ready to elevate your practice?
Contact us! https://orthomarketing.com/contact-us/
About Gary Sastow
Gary Sastow has over twenty-five years of experience in the practice of law. While maintaining a broad scope of practice, Gary focuses on representing healthcare professionals in all aspects of their business, professional and personal lives. Having been raised in a family of physicians, he possesses a unique understanding and insight into the business of practicing a healthcare profession. Combined with his years of practice in what has become a more complex and highly regulated industry, Gary’s clients see him as a trusted advisor, confidant, and advocate. On an ongoing basis, he works with clients on transactional matters, regulatory compliance issues and problem solving including providing representation to clients under professional investigation before OPMC, OPD or the Justice Center. Gary is a prolific speaker and author of professional articles in various publications. He has also served as an adjunct professor at Pace University teaching Health Law and Policy and Not for Profit Organizations. Gary is a recommended legal services provider for the NYS Dental Association. D&M now provides representation to clients under professional investigation before OPMC, OPD or the Justice Center
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is Gary Sasto. I'm a lawyer at the law
firm and a partner of the law firm Danziger and
Markov in White Plains, New York, a firm dedicated to,
among other things, representing dentists and dental practices. And you're
going to hear today a discussion about important legal issues
(00:21):
and business issues and liability protection issues that are you know,
really really applicable to you as a dentist, to you
as the owner or practitioner of dentistry at a dental practice.
And we're hoping you'll enjoy it and find it very useful.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Orthomarketing dot com three hundred and sixty degree digital marketing
solutions for your practice.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Hello, everybody in podcast land, this is Dean Steinman from
Worth of Marketing. What we are back with another super
fantabulous podcast for you, So thanks so much everybody for
being here and listening. I really appreciate all the support.
(01:16):
And it's now summertime almost upon us twenty twenty five,
and hopefully everybody's happy you get the spring somewhere around you.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
But now if it.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Talks about some serious stuff. So today I have with
me a very special guest Gary Sasto, who is a
partner in law firm Danziger and Markoff who specializes and
works with dental practices. And we're going to talk a
little bit about issues going on in the industry, what
you need to be prepared for, and how to cover yourself.
There's a lot to talk about here. So it's a
(01:48):
very in depth, interesting topic here and very excited to
dive into it. So Gary, thanks so much for joining.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
How are you today. I'm doing well, Dean, Thank you
for for having me.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Looking forward to adding to the adding to the party,
No worry, that's the party, man. So let's kind of
jump in. So before we do that, just want to
make introduction, tell.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Us a little bit about who Dary is and what
you do and why you why you do what you do?
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Sure? Sure, so yeah, as you said, my name's Gary
Sasto'm a partner at the law firm of Dancy Gren
markov Where located in White Plains, New York, and the
firm has an almost sixty five year history of operating
in the area of representing healthcare providers dentists in particular.
(02:43):
I've not been doing this for sixty five years. I've
been doing this for going on thirty five years. And
I come from a family of doctors, and the healthcare
world was very comfortable for me. I understood it stood
the way healthcare providers see things in a way that's
(03:06):
different from people in other lines of work or areas
of business. And when I became a lawyer, I gravitated
to representing health care providers and it was somewhat of
a natural progression. I didn't start out that way, but
(03:28):
again because of my understanding and comfort level, it's I've
been very fortunate that I've really enjoyed a fund and
an exciting career. Part of the fun and excitement comes
from the changes that have occurred in healthcare over the
(03:51):
three decades that I've been in practice. And you know,
dentistry is subject to a lot of these these changes
and innovations as well. Some are good, some are not
so good, Some are a headache, some are making life
(04:12):
easier and happy to be here to to talk about this.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
All Right's when it comes to you know, there's protecting
their practice.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
There's so many.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Different variables and aspects when it comes to coverage for
legal and it's any in any business obviously, So if
you can why don't you give us like maybe the
most three or four most common legal mistakes that you
see dentists have when when running a practice.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
So, you know, the world has become really complicated, and
it's complicated from a professional perspective, from a legal perspective,
from an IT perspective. And dentists were during their training
(05:01):
trained to provide clinical dentistry, not to provide practice management,
not to provide excuse me it supported, not trained to
do back office administrative work. So it really is important
to have a good team to support the practice. Certainly
(05:25):
an accountant at an accountant hopefully that would be involved
periodically over the course of a year. Not just the
accountant who takes numbers at the end of the year
and prepares a tax return. Yes that's an important and
necessary function, but someone who can also act as somewhat
of an advisor and a counselor having legal support for
(05:50):
not only making sure that your practice is structured properly,
but over the course of time, issues come up, whether
it's with a patient, whether it's with a vendor, an
insurance company, or your staff. That's often something that we
find ourselves dealing with with with with our clients and
(06:12):
you know it. Are you HIP a compliant? Are you
a DA compliant? Is everything working? So again, there's only
so much that the dentist can can do as far
as all of this is concerned. And you know, I
often hear clients sort of bemoaning, well, yeah, you know,
(06:35):
the IT person costs money, the lawyer costs money, the
accountant costs money. And that is true. These are all expenses,
but they're also insurance policies to hopefully prevent things from
going wrong, but also really hopefully allowing the practice to
run smoothly and effectively so you can focus on your
(06:58):
patient care, focus on your productivity, and focus on doing
what you as the clinician does.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
Is there like a one size fits all when it
comes to a general practice as far as legal coverage
or do you have to come up with a unique
strategy and program for each individual office.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So you know, we're not reinventing the wheel every time,
but every practice is to some extent unique. It's certainly
going to be unique in the personalities involved. There are
certainly differences in you know, general practice versus you know,
(07:45):
a specialty practice, difference in patient demographics. Are you an
insurance practice. Are you a FIFA service practice? Are you
a blend? You know where you look located? Is this
a one person practice, a solo practice or are their
(08:05):
partners where decision making and sharing of revenue and all
those other items need to be addressed. So you know,
I would say that probably, you know, seventy five percent
is to some extent one size fits all, right, but
then the unique part has to be addressed. And obviously
(08:29):
that's what makes makes everyone unique and special.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Right, So you know, if you were to basically put
into a little package the core coverage that at practice
in needs, what things do they check off to make
sure that they can at least sleep at night? For
the basics, and then we can talk about specifics moving forward.
It's like we met to Hipper and a DA and
(08:53):
you know, partnerships and this and that. But what would
you say the two O the three main pillars that
a practice needs for cover, So you know, from worker's
comp to you know, to my ability to this or that,
is there any you know three things that a dental
practice needs without question.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
So so certainly you need to have professional liability insurance
that that's sort of number one, and everyone for the
most part recognizes that workers comp insurance absolutely, if you
have employees, that's that's depending on your state, but most
states that's a requirement. And general liability insurance. You know,
(09:33):
I've run across over the years dentists who are very
focused obviously on the concern of a professional malpractice claim,
so they have that insurance and sometimes mistakenly think that, well,
that's all I need. But the patient who trips on
the carpet and falls down and gets injured, you know,
(09:55):
that's not the o malpractice carrier. That's your general liability carry.
And I actually had a client a few years ago
who had a very very dentist phobic patient who came
in with a friend of hers and asked if the
friend could come into the operatory to provide some moral support,
(10:19):
and the dentist, being very accommodating, said sure. And the
patient is in the chair holding hands with her friend
who's standing next to the chair. The dentist takes out
the big long nova caate needle. The friend sees it
in the face and on the way down bangs her
head on a counter. Spoke to my client who was
(10:45):
calling to confirm that he should be putting his malpractice
carrier on notice, and I had to point out to
him that there was no problem with his patient. This
is not a malpractice issue. This is your general liability issue.
Fortunately she is not hurt badly. She never made a claim.
It all went away. I'm not sure if he's so
(11:06):
accommodating anymore allowing other people into the operatory. But you know,
that's what your generaliability insurance covers.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
And there's so many different variables on that you know
and what they're protected. And obviously you don't have crystal ball.
They don't have a crystal ball, But you don't know
what's coming down the pike, you know, So you know,
do most you know, practices that you work with, that
you consult with are the clients of yours. Do you
kind of look at here's what you have to have.
(11:40):
You have like a checklist that you send to them
and saying, let's make sure we have this or this,
or do you customize it for each person? And then
and then who knows what's gonna been down the road.
But you know, just when you can sleep at night.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
How do you do it?
Speaker 3 (11:50):
How do you actually just look at them and say
you need this, this and this or cover this, you know,
walk me through a little bit of that from when
you first work with a practice.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Sure, so when we're working with a dentist who is
setting up a new practice or even purchasing an existing
practice and becoming the owner, yes, we do have sort
of a checklist of the basics that need to be covered,
(12:21):
and then obviously we talk about the unique aspects of
the practice and what that dentist wants to do with
their practice, and to the extent we need to add
a few additional bells and whistles, we do that. One
of the fundamental things that we almost always will recommend
is that the dentist practice through a legal entity. Depending
(12:43):
upon the state you're in, it could be called a
professional corporation, a professional association, a professional limited liability company.
But what that does is it will protect the dentists
from personal liability for any issues that come up other
than malpractice. The professional liability. The malpractice is always personal
(13:07):
to the dentist, and there's no entity that's going to
provide a shield. But for the person who trips and
falls and injures themselves in the waiting room, they're not
going to be suing the dentist. They're going to be
suing the dentist's legal entity, so that provides a good
shield of the dentist's personal assets. So we always do
(13:33):
recommend that we start out with a legal entity in
place to provide that that layer of liability protection.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
We're talked about before about employees. You know, I've got
employees and I have to have a employee handbook that
has to be continutely updated. Walk us through the nuances
of that, and how important is it that to have
that you know and be very transparent with your employe
as far as you know all the bells and whistles
and the legality and you know time off and.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
This and that.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
So how important is it to have or is it
necessary or just a value add for hample.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
It really is necessary. Depending upon you know your your
jurisdiction where you are, it may in fact be a requirement.
But but even if it's not a legal requirement, it
really is very important for professional staff. If you're hiring
associate dentists, those people should have employment contracts, formal contracts
(14:39):
that spells out the terms of their employment, what they're
going to be paid, how they're going to be paid,
when they're going to be paid. Who's paying for their
malpractice insurance? Are there any benefits like health insurance or
four O one K or profit sharing retirement plan, And
very importantly a non compete or a restrictive covenant that
(15:02):
protects the practice from that employee saying well, thanks for interview,
you know, introducing me to this community, to the patients,
to your referral sources. I'm quitting today and I'll be
opening up across the street, you know, Monday morning. You
(15:23):
know that that's not a good result. So so that's
important for your professional staff. For your non professional staff,
it's probably not necessary to have a formal contract with them.
They would be employees at will, which means that you
(15:45):
can terminate them at any time. They can quit at
any time. The grounds for termination can be anything, so
long as it's not discriminatory. It could even be as arbitrary.
I was in a bad mood that day, But you
can't say it's because the person was a particular race,
(16:07):
a particular ethnicity, a particular sexual orientation. That would become
discriminatory and improper. But those employees at will, because you
then don't have a formal written contract with them, that's
when the employee Manual of the employee handbook becomes very important.
(16:31):
It's important so that when the person says, I want
to take next week off and you say, well, you've
already used up all your vacation days, and they say, oh,
I thought I had three weeks. Isn't that what you
told me when you hired me. No, you have two weeks. Look,
it's in the handbook that I gave you and you
(16:52):
signed for when you started working. So it helps in
that respect. It also avoids frankly errors being made. You know,
you have one new employee come on board and you
say we give two weeks vacation. You have another one
come on board and you inadvertently tell that person three
weeks of vacation. I've seen that happen, and then you've
(17:16):
got all sorts of problems because now you either have to,
you know, give more vacation to the person who only
had two weeks, or try and call back vacation. Good
luck with that. So you know, that's just you know,
one example of where the employment the employee handbook becomes important.
(17:37):
It's also important in terms of dress code. You know
really pretty much everything about how the office is going
to function, and you'd be surprised what comes up when
you tell, you know, an employee, Oh, you're working late
Thursday night, Well, I don't work past five o'clock. Well,
(18:01):
the handbook says you do on Thursdays. So you know,
that becomes you know, really really very important. And on
the dress code issue, you know, that becomes important as well,
whether it's someone who's maybe dressing with a little too
(18:22):
much showing, or you know, lately, in the last few
number of years, I've had you know, issues with piercings
and tattoos and things which you know, societally may or
may not be you know, viewed as acceptable or appropriate
(18:43):
in all circumstances. So the handbook becomes very important.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
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Speaker 1 (18:55):
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You know what?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
What is it?
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Typical sp for a handbook, So.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Typically speaking, it's not something that requires that much updating.
Certainly if there are changes in the law that would
have to be updated, or if there are changes in
the way you're conducting your practice. Actually, I do have
a client a few years ago, you know, on the
(20:22):
topic of dress code. Who this is the kind of
change that you would would incorporate. There were a lot
of clothing issues in the office. The solution to that
was everyone needs to wear scrubs. That was a you know,
small change in the office policy in the office culture,
(20:46):
but obviously that then needed to be reflected in the handbook.
So you know, every few years it's something you should
look at and then you know more frequently to the
extent that there are you know, actual changes in the
practice or legal changes, and hopefully you've got a relationship. Again,
(21:07):
going back to what i'd said earlier about having the team,
that you would have a relationship with a lawyer who
practices in this area and they would send you the
notification a new law is effect of January one of
next year. You need to know it, you need to
understand it, you need to implement it, and it needs
(21:27):
to be reflected in your manual.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
OK.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
So, if you were to put a big pie together
of all of the lawsuits in the dental industry, would
you categorize most of them as being malpractice a patient
focus that off to a doctor or is it more
somebody another lawyers doing them because they're not compliant with
a DA or HIPPA or this or that. Because you've
(21:56):
got obviously almost B two C and B to B there,
so we're yeah, why would you say the majority because
I have to be covering both sides. But what's the trend?
Speaker 1 (22:06):
So you know, with respect to malpractice, there's not that
much malpractice litigation for dentists. Maybe some specialty dentists or
all surgeons, they may be greater exposure, but certainly for
the general dentist there's not that much activity. And the
(22:32):
reason for that is, Let's say you've got a patient
who is having an issue with the way a crown
is fitting or not fitting, and rightly or wrongly, there
have been adjusted adjustments made and so forth, and the
patient is just not happy and believes it wasn't done properly.
(22:54):
They'll go to the malpractice attorney who works on a contingency,
and the attorney will evaluate that case and say, well,
you know, the recovery here is three thousand dollars to
go to a new dentist and have a new crown
put in, and I'm making up numbers, and you know
(23:18):
I take a third of that one thousand dollars. Well,
there are not that many lawyers willing to invest their
time and effort into a case where the legal fee
is going to be one thousand dollars. So the patient
is still disgruntled, and what do they do well. They
(23:41):
start putting bad reviews on social media and sometimes they
go as far as filing complaints with the Department of Health.
The Department of Health is mandated in most states to
investigate every single complaint, even if on its face it
looks like it's not really particularly substantive, they still have
(24:07):
to review it. And that's another area that dentists should
be aware of that if you are contacted by a
health department representative in connection with a patient complaint or
any other matter, you need to be represented by a lawyer,
(24:27):
even if it's simple and it's clear cut, because the
stakes can be high. These are the Department of Health
has the ability, in you know, worst case scenario, to
limit or even completely you know, invalidate your license to practice.
(24:50):
They almost expect you to have a lawyer because they
expect you to take the investigation or the inquiry very
very seriously, and sometimes not having a lawyer, you know,
I've had clients say, well, if I get a lawyer,
they'll they'll think, ooh, I'm lawyering up. I've got something
to hide. It's actually, in my experience of the reverse.
They want to see you be professional and take professional
(25:12):
complaints seriously, so they want to see you have a lawyer.
And I've had situations over the years where they've come
into an office and said, can I review a patient's record, Yeah, sure,
no problem, come on in patience. Record turns out to
be fine, but while they were in the office they
noticed something wasn't completely the way it should be, whether
(25:37):
it was a hygiene issue or a hip issue. You
really don't want people like that coming into your office.
As a lawyer, I would intervene and say, no, need
to come to the office. We'll send you a copy
of whatever record you're interested in, and to the extent
there's any follow up, we'll be happy to come and
meet with you in your office to keep them out
(25:59):
of the offe. So so that's sort of one area
of concern. Obviously, there are ordinary, everyday business disputes. You
get into a dispute with a landlord and the landlord
makes a claim for you know, rent that wasn't paid
or rent was in dispute. That's just sort of an
ordinary business issue. But then there are those problems that
(26:26):
are and I hate to say, you know, there are
lawyers who have created sort of cottage industries, whether it's
you know, they hire someone confined to a wheelchair and
they say, okay, start going door to door and make
sure your wheelchair has access to that office, or they'll
go onto the websites that's not an ADA compliant website.
(26:52):
And there are lawyers who who we've seen you know,
somewhat outdotally, but but you know pretty clearly they'll sort
of target certain professionals. I know in our practice we
saw a lot of plastic surgeons getting letters demand letters
(27:13):
from lawyers saying your your website is not a compliance.
Then we saw a lot of dentists getting those letters.
And we've seen it, as I said, with with the
a D A compliant access to the office, with the
ADA compliant website. And then certainly someone who's been into
your office and sees that there are you know, as
(27:38):
traditionally there were you know shelves on the you know,
the walls of the hallways, you know, with you know,
little side tabs of all the patients charts. You know,
here's the a's and the b's and the c's or
some other kind of you know hip a violation, right,
(27:59):
and and that can come up and bite you as well.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Two more more questions for you, Gary. So, a big
trend obviously in the in the industry is d s
O s and practices being being purchased so and looked at.
So almost all of my clients are getting solicited almost
daily from a potential buyout as interested in taking over. So,
(28:26):
what are some red flags that should look out for
when potentially buying selling merging? You know, we're like two
or three major flags. Don't stop blah blah blah blah blah.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Right, So, the d s O world is a little
bit of sort of the wild wild West. There are
some very straightforward, honest, reputable players, and then there are
some that are are not quite as honest and straightforward.
(28:59):
And the sales pitch is often very attractive. Will give
you a chunk of money today, and then for the next,
you know, at least three years or so forth, you'll
you'll work for us, and all you have to worry
about is your dentistry, because we worry about everything else
and take care of everything else that is always going
(29:25):
to look the same. So you have to sort of
scratch below the surface, and invariably certain issues come up.
We're going to pay you a million dollars for your practice,
two hundred and fifty thousand dollars at closing, and seven
hundred and fifty thousand dollars of roll up stock. Well,
I was kind of hoping for the million dollars in cash. No, no, no, no, no.
(29:52):
That roll up stock has the potential to be even
more valuable because we're one day going to sell and
you'll get much more than seven hundred and fifty thousand
dollars from that sale. I'm conservative by nature and I'm
conservative by profession. Get the money up front. You want
(30:16):
to take a small risk with some portion of the
purchase price, as you know, sort of equity in the purchaser.
You know, we can talk about that and then as
the expression goes, the devil's in the details. We've seen
some of these DSOs offer equity, but not in the
(30:39):
big valuable company. They create what they call subdsos, where
they created a sub DSO entity that has no function
in the world other than to manage your practice. When
the big sale comes, they're not selling your little SUBDSO
(31:02):
that you've got equity, and they're selling the big parent
company on top and you're not part of that. So
you know, We've seen permutations where you know, once you
scratch below the surface, things are not what they appear
that we are. So you know you have to be
(31:22):
you have to obviously be careful. And again it goes
back to that team. Have your accountant look at the
finances of this company, have your lawyer look at what
the deal really is, not what it appears to be.
And then you know, frankly, I had a client not
too long ago who did a lot of implant dentistry
(31:44):
and did a lot well, there was a lot of
you know, back and forth discussions with a DSO who
was looking to purchase and they had a real problem
with the supplies he was using. And the problem was
he was using expensive supplies and they told him essentially
that you know, well, once we do the deal, you'll
(32:04):
start using these supplies. And he said, yeah, but those
are really inferior. He was unwilling to go into a
transaction where there was that kind of pressure that he
would have to use what he viewed to be inferior supplies, cheaper,
(32:25):
less expensive supplies, more profit but professionally that was not
something he was comfortable with. So, you know, there are
a lot of pieces to these to these deals and
they really have to be examined very carefully and to
some extent resist you know, the sales pitch of you know,
(32:47):
we're going to give you a big pay day today
and down the road you'll have even a bigger pay day.
You've really got to be careful.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
Two final questions are One is if you have one
bit of a legal advice to every dentist listening today,
what would it be.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Don't cut corners. You know, as I said, there's a
tendency and especially when you're starting out and you've got
a lot of expenses and maybe not that much revenue yet,
you know, put that team in place, have a good accountant,
have a good IT company, making sure you're you're up
and running first of all, and that you're hippa and
(33:35):
high tech compliant. Have a lawyer somewhere in the background
who can be there to backstop issues that that that
come up, and you know, really focus then on running
a a good, clean, well protected practice, even if it
costs you a little bit of money. It may to
(33:58):
some extent sound self serve because I'm that lawyer that
would be brought on to the team. But you know,
being absolutely honest I can tell you that I can
just go on and on and on with examples of where,
you know, situations come up and iriac thought is, oh,
(34:20):
if only you had spoken to me before this happened, right,
And that's really my my, my advice, and to sort
of not necessarily follow the follow the pack. You know,
there's a lot of well that's what everyone seems to
be doing, so I guess I'll do that too. There
may be a good reason for doing it, and it
(34:41):
may be an appropriate thing, but it may not be.
And I've seen you know, dentists follow sort of you know,
professional business trends that you know may work for their
colleagues in the community, but it may not work for them,
because again it's every practice is a little bit unique
and different.
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Okay, one final question. So I like to read, and
you know what, we keep up the stuff. So if you
would have if you're a reader or not, but if
you could recommend one book anybody out there, could be fiction,
non fiction, one book that you think has been kind
of a game changer or I just thought was incredible,
what would you recommend?
Speaker 1 (35:25):
So my, my, my, my reading, and I guess I'm
going to sound you know, a little maybe nerdy, but
my reading is history. I'm a really history buff, so
I really can't necessarily tell you of any one particular,
uh you know, book that really was like wow. But
(35:50):
you know, I really am fascinated by history and by
historical personalities.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
So a biography that you read that was so interesting
that you never the way thing about to watch the
biography on somebody or so, you.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Know, I've I've always been very very impressed when it
comes to biographies of Abraham Lincoln, okay, and Golden Ear,
the former one and only female prime minister of the
State of Israel early on in its existence. They were both,
(36:24):
in obviously very very different ways, really quite remarkable characters
and personalities. So that's really kind of where where my
uh my kind of recreational reading. Oh good, that was awesome.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
All right, so thanks so much for joining. I really
appreciate guys. There's so much you need to learn and cover.
Don't do this yourself. Don't put a chat GPD and
put it in and make yourself your own contracts. That's
what lawyers are here for. So if somebody wants to
learn more about you, how to how to contact you,
you can help them what's the best way for somebody
to reach out.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Sure, so obviously other than reaching out to you and
asking for my compact and fashion. Luckily, we've got the
internet these days, and if you go to ww dot
Danzigermarkov dot com you'll find me or my name Gary
Sasto s A S t O W. You'll find me
through my firm's website. And you know, to the extent
(37:23):
that you know I and my colleagues at the firm
can be can be helpful to you. You know, that
would be terrific. In addition to what what we've been
discussing today, my colleagues at the firm do a state
planning for dentists and do define benefit and profit sharing
(37:45):
plans that are customized to to to really work well
for a dentists and other healthcare providers. So you know,
those are the three core areas of our firm and
they're they're all, you know, very very important. Two elements
for for dentists and for dental practices.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
Are well, Gary, thanks so much for joining. I really
appreciate everybody out there. I said, please speak to professionals
when needed, do an update, and if you are looking
for any help, questions you have, please you know, Gary's
the man, so appreciate everybody in podcast land. Thanks so
much for all of the support, questions, comments, listeners. I
(38:26):
really appreciate you know everybody out there, so Gary, thanks
so much for joining everybody on podcast. Thanks so much
for listening, and we don't speak to you.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
We'll see you soon.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Have a great summer.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
Everybody WORTHO marketing dot com three hundred and sixty degree
digital marketing solutions for your practice
This is Gary Sasto. I'm a lawyer at the law
firm and a partner of the law firm Danziger and
Markov in White Plains, New York, a firm dedicated to,
among other things, representing dentists and dental practices. And you're
going to hear today a discussion about important legal issues
(00:21):
and business issues and liability protection issues that are you know,
really really applicable to you as a dentist, to you
as the owner or practitioner of dentistry at a dental practice.
And we're hoping you'll enjoy it and find it very useful.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Orthomarketing dot com three hundred and sixty degree digital marketing
solutions for your practice.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
Hello, everybody in podcast land, this is Dean Steinman from
Worth of Marketing. What we are back with another super
fantabulous podcast for you, So thanks so much everybody for
being here and listening. I really appreciate all the support.
(01:16):
And it's now summertime almost upon us twenty twenty five,
and hopefully everybody's happy you get the spring somewhere around you.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
But now if it.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Talks about some serious stuff. So today I have with
me a very special guest Gary Sasto, who is a
partner in law firm Danziger and Markoff who specializes and
works with dental practices. And we're going to talk a
little bit about issues going on in the industry, what
you need to be prepared for, and how to cover yourself.
There's a lot to talk about here. So it's a
(01:48):
very in depth, interesting topic here and very excited to
dive into it. So Gary, thanks so much for joining.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
How are you today. I'm doing well, Dean, Thank you
for for having me.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
Looking forward to adding to the adding to the party,
No worry, that's the party, man. So let's kind of
jump in. So before we do that, just want to
make introduction, tell.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Us a little bit about who Dary is and what
you do and why you why you do what you do?
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Sure? Sure, so yeah, as you said, my name's Gary
Sasto'm a partner at the law firm of Dancy Gren
markov Where located in White Plains, New York, and the
firm has an almost sixty five year history of operating
in the area of representing healthcare providers dentists in particular.
(02:43):
I've not been doing this for sixty five years. I've
been doing this for going on thirty five years. And
I come from a family of doctors, and the healthcare
world was very comfortable for me. I understood it stood
the way healthcare providers see things in a way that's
(03:06):
different from people in other lines of work or areas
of business. And when I became a lawyer, I gravitated
to representing health care providers and it was somewhat of
a natural progression. I didn't start out that way, but
(03:28):
again because of my understanding and comfort level, it's I've
been very fortunate that I've really enjoyed a fund and
an exciting career. Part of the fun and excitement comes
from the changes that have occurred in healthcare over the
(03:51):
three decades that I've been in practice. And you know,
dentistry is subject to a lot of these these changes
and innovations as well. Some are good, some are not
so good, Some are a headache, some are making life
(04:12):
easier and happy to be here to to talk about this.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
All Right's when it comes to you know, there's protecting
their practice.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
There's so many.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Different variables and aspects when it comes to coverage for
legal and it's any in any business obviously, So if
you can why don't you give us like maybe the
most three or four most common legal mistakes that you
see dentists have when when running a practice.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
So, you know, the world has become really complicated, and
it's complicated from a professional perspective, from a legal perspective,
from an IT perspective. And dentists were during their training
(05:01):
trained to provide clinical dentistry, not to provide practice management,
not to provide excuse me it supported, not trained to
do back office administrative work. So it really is important
to have a good team to support the practice. Certainly
(05:25):
an accountant at an accountant hopefully that would be involved
periodically over the course of a year. Not just the
accountant who takes numbers at the end of the year
and prepares a tax return. Yes that's an important and
necessary function, but someone who can also act as somewhat
of an advisor and a counselor having legal support for
(05:50):
not only making sure that your practice is structured properly,
but over the course of time, issues come up, whether
it's with a patient, whether it's with a vendor, an
insurance company, or your staff. That's often something that we
find ourselves dealing with with with with our clients and
(06:12):
you know it. Are you HIP a compliant? Are you
a DA compliant? Is everything working? So again, there's only
so much that the dentist can can do as far
as all of this is concerned. And you know, I
often hear clients sort of bemoaning, well, yeah, you know,
(06:35):
the IT person costs money, the lawyer costs money, the
accountant costs money. And that is true. These are all expenses,
but they're also insurance policies to hopefully prevent things from
going wrong, but also really hopefully allowing the practice to
run smoothly and effectively so you can focus on your
(06:58):
patient care, focus on your productivity, and focus on doing
what you as the clinician does.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
Is there like a one size fits all when it
comes to a general practice as far as legal coverage
or do you have to come up with a unique
strategy and program for each individual office.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So you know, we're not reinventing the wheel every time,
but every practice is to some extent unique. It's certainly
going to be unique in the personalities involved. There are
certainly differences in you know, general practice versus you know,
(07:45):
a specialty practice, difference in patient demographics. Are you an
insurance practice. Are you a FIFA service practice? Are you
a blend? You know where you look located? Is this
a one person practice, a solo practice or are their
(08:05):
partners where decision making and sharing of revenue and all
those other items need to be addressed. So you know,
I would say that probably, you know, seventy five percent
is to some extent one size fits all, right, but
then the unique part has to be addressed. And obviously
(08:29):
that's what makes makes everyone unique and special.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Right, So you know, if you were to basically put
into a little package the core coverage that at practice
in needs, what things do they check off to make
sure that they can at least sleep at night? For
the basics, and then we can talk about specifics moving forward.
It's like we met to Hipper and a DA and
(08:53):
you know, partnerships and this and that. But what would
you say the two O the three main pillars that
a practice needs for cover, So you know, from worker's
comp to you know, to my ability to this or that,
is there any you know three things that a dental
practice needs without question.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
So so certainly you need to have professional liability insurance
that that's sort of number one, and everyone for the
most part recognizes that workers comp insurance absolutely, if you
have employees, that's that's depending on your state, but most
states that's a requirement. And general liability insurance. You know,
(09:33):
I've run across over the years dentists who are very
focused obviously on the concern of a professional malpractice claim,
so they have that insurance and sometimes mistakenly think that, well,
that's all I need. But the patient who trips on
the carpet and falls down and gets injured, you know,
(09:55):
that's not the o malpractice carrier. That's your general liability carry.
And I actually had a client a few years ago
who had a very very dentist phobic patient who came
in with a friend of hers and asked if the
friend could come into the operatory to provide some moral support,
(10:19):
and the dentist, being very accommodating, said sure. And the
patient is in the chair holding hands with her friend
who's standing next to the chair. The dentist takes out
the big long nova caate needle. The friend sees it
in the face and on the way down bangs her
head on a counter. Spoke to my client who was
(10:45):
calling to confirm that he should be putting his malpractice
carrier on notice, and I had to point out to
him that there was no problem with his patient. This
is not a malpractice issue. This is your general liability issue.
Fortunately she is not hurt badly. She never made a claim.
It all went away. I'm not sure if he's so
(11:06):
accommodating anymore allowing other people into the operatory. But you know,
that's what your generaliability insurance covers.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
And there's so many different variables on that you know
and what they're protected. And obviously you don't have crystal ball.
They don't have a crystal ball, But you don't know
what's coming down the pike, you know, So you know,
do most you know, practices that you work with, that
you consult with are the clients of yours. Do you
kind of look at here's what you have to have.
(11:40):
You have like a checklist that you send to them
and saying, let's make sure we have this or this,
or do you customize it for each person? And then
and then who knows what's gonna been down the road.
But you know, just when you can sleep at night.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
How do you do it?
Speaker 3 (11:50):
How do you actually just look at them and say
you need this, this and this or cover this, you know,
walk me through a little bit of that from when
you first work with a practice.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Sure, so when we're working with a dentist who is
setting up a new practice or even purchasing an existing
practice and becoming the owner, yes, we do have sort
of a checklist of the basics that need to be covered,
(12:21):
and then obviously we talk about the unique aspects of
the practice and what that dentist wants to do with
their practice, and to the extent we need to add
a few additional bells and whistles, we do that. One
of the fundamental things that we almost always will recommend
is that the dentist practice through a legal entity. Depending
(12:43):
upon the state you're in, it could be called a
professional corporation, a professional association, a professional limited liability company.
But what that does is it will protect the dentists
from personal liability for any issues that come up other
than malpractice. The professional liability. The malpractice is always personal
(13:07):
to the dentist, and there's no entity that's going to
provide a shield. But for the person who trips and
falls and injures themselves in the waiting room, they're not
going to be suing the dentist. They're going to be
suing the dentist's legal entity, so that provides a good
shield of the dentist's personal assets. So we always do
(13:33):
recommend that we start out with a legal entity in
place to provide that that layer of liability protection.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
We're talked about before about employees. You know, I've got
employees and I have to have a employee handbook that
has to be continutely updated. Walk us through the nuances
of that, and how important is it that to have
that you know and be very transparent with your employe
as far as you know all the bells and whistles
and the legality and you know time off and.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
This and that.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
So how important is it to have or is it
necessary or just a value add for hample.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
It really is necessary. Depending upon you know your your
jurisdiction where you are, it may in fact be a requirement.
But but even if it's not a legal requirement, it
really is very important for professional staff. If you're hiring
associate dentists, those people should have employment contracts, formal contracts
(14:39):
that spells out the terms of their employment, what they're
going to be paid, how they're going to be paid,
when they're going to be paid. Who's paying for their
malpractice insurance? Are there any benefits like health insurance or
four O one K or profit sharing retirement plan, And
very importantly a non compete or a restrictive covenant that
(15:02):
protects the practice from that employee saying well, thanks for interview,
you know, introducing me to this community, to the patients,
to your referral sources. I'm quitting today and I'll be
opening up across the street, you know, Monday morning. You
(15:23):
know that that's not a good result. So so that's
important for your professional staff. For your non professional staff,
it's probably not necessary to have a formal contract with them.
They would be employees at will, which means that you
(15:45):
can terminate them at any time. They can quit at
any time. The grounds for termination can be anything, so
long as it's not discriminatory. It could even be as arbitrary.
I was in a bad mood that day, But you
can't say it's because the person was a particular race,
(16:07):
a particular ethnicity, a particular sexual orientation. That would become
discriminatory and improper. But those employees at will, because you
then don't have a formal written contract with them, that's
when the employee Manual of the employee handbook becomes very important.
(16:31):
It's important so that when the person says, I want
to take next week off and you say, well, you've
already used up all your vacation days, and they say, oh,
I thought I had three weeks. Isn't that what you
told me when you hired me. No, you have two weeks. Look,
it's in the handbook that I gave you and you
(16:52):
signed for when you started working. So it helps in
that respect. It also avoids frankly errors being made. You know,
you have one new employee come on board and you
say we give two weeks vacation. You have another one
come on board and you inadvertently tell that person three
weeks of vacation. I've seen that happen, and then you've
(17:16):
got all sorts of problems because now you either have to,
you know, give more vacation to the person who only
had two weeks, or try and call back vacation. Good
luck with that. So you know, that's just you know,
one example of where the employment the employee handbook becomes important.
(17:37):
It's also important in terms of dress code. You know
really pretty much everything about how the office is going
to function, and you'd be surprised what comes up when
you tell, you know, an employee, Oh, you're working late
Thursday night, Well, I don't work past five o'clock. Well,
(18:01):
the handbook says you do on Thursdays. So you know,
that becomes you know, really really very important. And on
the dress code issue, you know, that becomes important as well,
whether it's someone who's maybe dressing with a little too
(18:22):
much showing, or you know, lately, in the last few
number of years, I've had you know, issues with piercings
and tattoos and things which you know, societally may or
may not be you know, viewed as acceptable or appropriate
(18:43):
in all circumstances. So the handbook becomes very important.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
This podcast is sponsored by orthomarketing dot com.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
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(19:40):
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your practice success. Worth of Marketing It's not just our name,
it's what we do. I finish. Is it one and
done or is it updated every year every two years?
You know what?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
What is it?
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Typical sp for a handbook, So.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Typically speaking, it's not something that requires that much updating.
Certainly if there are changes in the law that would
have to be updated, or if there are changes in
the way you're conducting your practice. Actually, I do have
a client a few years ago, you know, on the
(20:22):
topic of dress code. Who this is the kind of
change that you would would incorporate. There were a lot
of clothing issues in the office. The solution to that
was everyone needs to wear scrubs. That was a you know,
small change in the office policy in the office culture,
(20:46):
but obviously that then needed to be reflected in the handbook.
So you know, every few years it's something you should
look at and then you know more frequently to the
extent that there are you know, actual changes in the
practice or legal changes, and hopefully you've got a relationship. Again,
(21:07):
going back to what i'd said earlier about having the team,
that you would have a relationship with a lawyer who
practices in this area and they would send you the
notification a new law is effect of January one of
next year. You need to know it, you need to
understand it, you need to implement it, and it needs
(21:27):
to be reflected in your manual.
Speaker 4 (21:30):
OK.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
So, if you were to put a big pie together
of all of the lawsuits in the dental industry, would
you categorize most of them as being malpractice a patient
focus that off to a doctor or is it more
somebody another lawyers doing them because they're not compliant with
a DA or HIPPA or this or that. Because you've
(21:56):
got obviously almost B two C and B to B there,
so we're yeah, why would you say the majority because
I have to be covering both sides. But what's the trend?
Speaker 1 (22:06):
So you know, with respect to malpractice, there's not that
much malpractice litigation for dentists. Maybe some specialty dentists or
all surgeons, they may be greater exposure, but certainly for
the general dentist there's not that much activity. And the
(22:32):
reason for that is, Let's say you've got a patient
who is having an issue with the way a crown
is fitting or not fitting, and rightly or wrongly, there
have been adjusted adjustments made and so forth, and the
patient is just not happy and believes it wasn't done properly.
(22:54):
They'll go to the malpractice attorney who works on a contingency,
and the attorney will evaluate that case and say, well,
you know, the recovery here is three thousand dollars to
go to a new dentist and have a new crown
put in, and I'm making up numbers, and you know
(23:18):
I take a third of that one thousand dollars. Well,
there are not that many lawyers willing to invest their
time and effort into a case where the legal fee
is going to be one thousand dollars. So the patient
is still disgruntled, and what do they do well. They
(23:41):
start putting bad reviews on social media and sometimes they
go as far as filing complaints with the Department of Health.
The Department of Health is mandated in most states to
investigate every single complaint, even if on its face it
looks like it's not really particularly substantive, they still have
(24:07):
to review it. And that's another area that dentists should
be aware of that if you are contacted by a
health department representative in connection with a patient complaint or
any other matter, you need to be represented by a lawyer,
(24:27):
even if it's simple and it's clear cut, because the
stakes can be high. These are the Department of Health
has the ability, in you know, worst case scenario, to
limit or even completely you know, invalidate your license to practice.
(24:50):
They almost expect you to have a lawyer because they
expect you to take the investigation or the inquiry very
very seriously, and sometimes not having a lawyer, you know,
I've had clients say, well, if I get a lawyer,
they'll they'll think, ooh, I'm lawyering up. I've got something
to hide. It's actually, in my experience of the reverse.
They want to see you be professional and take professional
(25:12):
complaints seriously, so they want to see you have a lawyer.
And I've had situations over the years where they've come
into an office and said, can I review a patient's record, Yeah, sure,
no problem, come on in patience. Record turns out to
be fine, but while they were in the office they
noticed something wasn't completely the way it should be, whether
(25:37):
it was a hygiene issue or a hip issue. You
really don't want people like that coming into your office.
As a lawyer, I would intervene and say, no, need
to come to the office. We'll send you a copy
of whatever record you're interested in, and to the extent
there's any follow up, we'll be happy to come and
meet with you in your office to keep them out
(25:59):
of the offe. So so that's sort of one area
of concern. Obviously, there are ordinary, everyday business disputes. You
get into a dispute with a landlord and the landlord
makes a claim for you know, rent that wasn't paid
or rent was in dispute. That's just sort of an
ordinary business issue. But then there are those problems that
(26:26):
are and I hate to say, you know, there are
lawyers who have created sort of cottage industries, whether it's
you know, they hire someone confined to a wheelchair and
they say, okay, start going door to door and make
sure your wheelchair has access to that office, or they'll
go onto the websites that's not an ADA compliant website.
(26:52):
And there are lawyers who who we've seen you know,
somewhat outdotally, but but you know pretty clearly they'll sort
of target certain professionals. I know in our practice we
saw a lot of plastic surgeons getting letters demand letters
(27:13):
from lawyers saying your your website is not a compliance.
Then we saw a lot of dentists getting those letters.
And we've seen it, as I said, with with the
a D A compliant access to the office, with the
ADA compliant website. And then certainly someone who's been into
your office and sees that there are you know, as
(27:38):
traditionally there were you know shelves on the you know,
the walls of the hallways, you know, with you know,
little side tabs of all the patients charts. You know,
here's the a's and the b's and the c's or
some other kind of you know hip a violation, right,
(27:59):
and and that can come up and bite you as well.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Two more more questions for you, Gary. So, a big
trend obviously in the in the industry is d s
O s and practices being being purchased so and looked at.
So almost all of my clients are getting solicited almost
daily from a potential buyout as interested in taking over. So,
(28:26):
what are some red flags that should look out for
when potentially buying selling merging? You know, we're like two
or three major flags. Don't stop blah blah blah blah blah.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Right, So, the d s O world is a little
bit of sort of the wild wild West. There are
some very straightforward, honest, reputable players, and then there are
some that are are not quite as honest and straightforward.
(28:59):
And the sales pitch is often very attractive. Will give
you a chunk of money today, and then for the next,
you know, at least three years or so forth, you'll
you'll work for us, and all you have to worry
about is your dentistry, because we worry about everything else
and take care of everything else that is always going
(29:25):
to look the same. So you have to sort of
scratch below the surface, and invariably certain issues come up.
We're going to pay you a million dollars for your practice,
two hundred and fifty thousand dollars at closing, and seven
hundred and fifty thousand dollars of roll up stock. Well,
I was kind of hoping for the million dollars in cash. No, no, no, no, no.
(29:52):
That roll up stock has the potential to be even
more valuable because we're one day going to sell and
you'll get much more than seven hundred and fifty thousand
dollars from that sale. I'm conservative by nature and I'm
conservative by profession. Get the money up front. You want
(30:16):
to take a small risk with some portion of the
purchase price, as you know, sort of equity in the purchaser.
You know, we can talk about that and then as
the expression goes, the devil's in the details. We've seen
some of these DSOs offer equity, but not in the
(30:39):
big valuable company. They create what they call subdsos, where
they created a sub DSO entity that has no function
in the world other than to manage your practice. When
the big sale comes, they're not selling your little SUBDSO
(31:02):
that you've got equity, and they're selling the big parent
company on top and you're not part of that. So
you know, We've seen permutations where you know, once you
scratch below the surface, things are not what they appear
that we are. So you know you have to be
(31:22):
you have to obviously be careful. And again it goes
back to that team. Have your accountant look at the
finances of this company, have your lawyer look at what
the deal really is, not what it appears to be.
And then you know, frankly, I had a client not
too long ago who did a lot of implant dentistry
(31:44):
and did a lot well, there was a lot of
you know, back and forth discussions with a DSO who
was looking to purchase and they had a real problem
with the supplies he was using. And the problem was
he was using expensive supplies and they told him essentially
that you know, well, once we do the deal, you'll
(32:04):
start using these supplies. And he said, yeah, but those
are really inferior. He was unwilling to go into a
transaction where there was that kind of pressure that he
would have to use what he viewed to be inferior supplies, cheaper,
(32:25):
less expensive supplies, more profit but professionally that was not
something he was comfortable with. So, you know, there are
a lot of pieces to these to these deals and
they really have to be examined very carefully and to
some extent resist you know, the sales pitch of you know,
(32:47):
we're going to give you a big pay day today
and down the road you'll have even a bigger pay day.
You've really got to be careful.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
Two final questions are One is if you have one
bit of a legal advice to every dentist listening today,
what would it be.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Don't cut corners. You know, as I said, there's a
tendency and especially when you're starting out and you've got
a lot of expenses and maybe not that much revenue yet,
you know, put that team in place, have a good accountant,
have a good IT company, making sure you're you're up
and running first of all, and that you're hippa and
(33:35):
high tech compliant. Have a lawyer somewhere in the background
who can be there to backstop issues that that that
come up, and you know, really focus then on running
a a good, clean, well protected practice, even if it
costs you a little bit of money. It may to
(33:58):
some extent sound self serve because I'm that lawyer that
would be brought on to the team. But you know,
being absolutely honest I can tell you that I can
just go on and on and on with examples of where,
you know, situations come up and iriac thought is, oh,
(34:20):
if only you had spoken to me before this happened, right,
And that's really my my, my advice, and to sort
of not necessarily follow the follow the pack. You know,
there's a lot of well that's what everyone seems to
be doing, so I guess I'll do that too. There
may be a good reason for doing it, and it
(34:41):
may be an appropriate thing, but it may not be.
And I've seen you know, dentists follow sort of you know,
professional business trends that you know may work for their
colleagues in the community, but it may not work for them,
because again it's every practice is a little bit unique
and different.
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Okay, one final question. So I like to read, and
you know what, we keep up the stuff. So if you
would have if you're a reader or not, but if
you could recommend one book anybody out there, could be fiction,
non fiction, one book that you think has been kind
of a game changer or I just thought was incredible,
what would you recommend?
Speaker 1 (35:25):
So my, my, my, my reading, and I guess I'm
going to sound you know, a little maybe nerdy, but
my reading is history. I'm a really history buff, so
I really can't necessarily tell you of any one particular,
uh you know, book that really was like wow. But
(35:50):
you know, I really am fascinated by history and by
historical personalities.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
So a biography that you read that was so interesting
that you never the way thing about to watch the
biography on somebody or so, you.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Know, I've I've always been very very impressed when it
comes to biographies of Abraham Lincoln, okay, and Golden Ear,
the former one and only female prime minister of the
State of Israel early on in its existence. They were both,
(36:24):
in obviously very very different ways, really quite remarkable characters
and personalities. So that's really kind of where where my
uh my kind of recreational reading. Oh good, that was awesome.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
All right, so thanks so much for joining. I really
appreciate guys. There's so much you need to learn and cover.
Don't do this yourself. Don't put a chat GPD and
put it in and make yourself your own contracts. That's
what lawyers are here for. So if somebody wants to
learn more about you, how to how to contact you,
you can help them what's the best way for somebody
to reach out.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Sure, so obviously other than reaching out to you and
asking for my compact and fashion. Luckily, we've got the
internet these days, and if you go to ww dot
Danzigermarkov dot com you'll find me or my name Gary
Sasto s A S t O W. You'll find me
through my firm's website. And you know, to the extent
(37:23):
that you know I and my colleagues at the firm
can be can be helpful to you. You know, that
would be terrific. In addition to what what we've been
discussing today, my colleagues at the firm do a state
planning for dentists and do define benefit and profit sharing
(37:45):
plans that are customized to to to really work well
for a dentists and other healthcare providers. So you know,
those are the three core areas of our firm and
they're they're all, you know, very very important. Two elements
for for dentists and for dental practices.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
Are well, Gary, thanks so much for joining. I really
appreciate everybody out there. I said, please speak to professionals
when needed, do an update, and if you are looking
for any help, questions you have, please you know, Gary's
the man, so appreciate everybody in podcast land. Thanks so
much for all of the support, questions, comments, listeners. I
(38:26):
really appreciate you know everybody out there, so Gary, thanks
so much for joining everybody on podcast. Thanks so much
for listening, and we don't speak to you.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
We'll see you soon.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Have a great summer.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
Everybody WORTHO marketing dot com three hundred and sixty degree
digital marketing solutions for your practice
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