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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:00):
Writer, Welcome back. How you doing.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
I'm doing great, Chris. Thanks for having me on again.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's been a minute, it has and it's wonderful to
have you back. It has been a wild few years.
You've been a busy dude. We both have two films released,
one in the works, A Clockwork Shining with super Badass.
My friend can't wait for the new one. Right now
is an amazing time for filmmakers because we can do
(00:26):
everything ourselves, including distribution. It's a shit ton of work,
but it can be done. You and I are examples
of that. And today we're going to talk about your
new film and the works about psychic spies. We're all
about this here. Before we get into it, though, remind
the audience a little bit about yourself and let them
know how they can find out more.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
I'm writer Lee. I am a director podcast host of
Raised by a Giants. You can find me on YouTube
and any and all podcast platforms and on the Forbidden
Knowledge News Network. Yeah, the psychic spy stuff is really
interesting to me. I got interested in it going through
the MK Ultra programs. So I found out that the
(01:09):
CIA was actually funding the Rockefeller Foundation for Behavioral Science,
which is psychology, and a few of those studies were
on gifted people. This was back in the fifties. They
were funding work into Duke University, Harvard and things like that.
And that's where things get really weird because mk Ultra
(01:29):
also had subprojects studying gifted people, more specifically Subproject eighty
three in Subproject one thirty six, which was dedicated to
the research and development of ESP and psychic abilities. There's
actually a document on the CIA's website called Hypnosis and
Control Behavior that says, if there's a situation where hypnosis
(01:51):
can be applied on a target individuals or groups, this
is from the CIA. Okay, you can guarantee that it
will be used. The CIA also fundering SRI International for
developmental research into ESP and psychic abilities called remote viewing.
The CIA chief at that time, Stansfield Turner, said that
(02:14):
the agency found a man who could see what was
going on anywhere in the world through his psychic powers.
Turner said the CIA scientists and officials would show the
man a picture of any place and he would then
describe the activity that was going on there. At that time,
seems pretty important thing to have, especially for the CIA
(02:35):
at that time. During the Cold War.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I said, these were going on are in the same
time as the mk ultra experiments are relatively the same time.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Well arguably mk Ultra could have been started in the
fifties or in the sixties. It ran for about twenty
five to thirty years, officially, stopping in officially in nineteen
seventy five. So the studies go, I mean, we have
(03:05):
psychic people going back decades and decades and even centuries.
You know, they were called shamans. There were you know,
only supposed to be imbued upon the enlightened people. But
it's essentially all the same thing. There's different labels to
all of this stuff. And remote viewing kind of was
an SRI coined term. Came from the Chinese study into
(03:32):
remote viewing and psychic abilities and children. So when Stansfield
Turner said that they had found this man like you
see what was going on anywhere in the world. That
man's name was Pat Price. But the CIA cut ties
with SRI in seventy five when Pat Price suspiciously died
(03:55):
he was found in a hotel room in Vegas. Russell Targan,
how put off, then went to the Foreign Technology division
at RYE Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio to
try and get funding for SRI through the Air Force.
Now dell Graf worked there and eventually became the operations
manager for the DIA Stargate program at Fort Mead, Maryland.
(04:18):
Later on and around the early nineties nineteen ninety to
nineteen ninety one, but the Air Force picked up the
funding to SRI. To continue this investigation into remote unit
psychic abilities, an ESP dell Graph put together a small
remote viewing unit at RYE. Patterson Air Force Base. They
(04:39):
then received tasking to find a missing Russian airplane that
downed somewhere in Africa. Rosemary Smith, which was part of
the remote Viewing unit at right Patterson Air Force Base.
This was like an unofficial small unit that dell Graph
had put together. He gave give her a map, like
(05:03):
a large area map, and said can you find this
TU twenty two down Russian airplane? And then she put
an X on the map where she had seen the
visions and the psychic impressions of where she believed that
it was. He then turned that into the CIA and
they converted where she put that X on a map
(05:24):
into a coordinate. They then went to where she said
that she thought that it was, which was in Africa,
and then they found the missing airplane exactly where she
said that it was. President Jimmy Carter then talked about
this mission in an interview in nineteen ninety five. It's
very difficult to find that interview, but it's on my
(05:45):
YouTube channel Raised by Giants, and it will also be
in the upcoming documentary Psychic Agent. But the funding by
the Air Force stopped to SRI in nineteen eight and
then the Right Patterson Air Force Base unofficial unit was disbanded,
(06:07):
but Army Intelligence was forming another remote viewing group at
for ME called Grill Flame, which was to use psychic
abilities with gifted people to collect intelligence data on foreign targets.
But then you also have the Monroe Institute, which was
founded by Robert Monroe in nineteen seventy four that created
(06:28):
this technology called Hemi Sync to induce an out of
body experience. This has connections to the DIA Stargate program
because when Grill Flame first opened up, which it changed
its name a lot of times, it changed it to
Center Lane Sun Streak, and then it finally landed upon
Stargate in ninety one. Army Intelligence sent their site gets
(06:54):
to the Monroe Institute. They paid Robert Monroe two thousand
dollars to see if Robert Monroe's tapes would help the
remote viewers be more accurate. It's called perfect sight integration,
where the viewer can duplicate their physical body and travel
in their astra body to anywhere in the world and
(07:18):
then collect information.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Now, let me ask you, the hymn Sync was allowing
the remote viewers to also leave their bodies, now, is
what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Well, that's the thing is that that is the goal
with the Hemi Sink tapes is to induce an out
of body experience. But a lot of the remote viewers
had already been having out of body experiences. Yes, specifically
Angela Ford, she would have out of body experiences every time,
(07:48):
all the time whenever she was young. Ingo Swan would
also have out of body experiences due to trauma from
being bullied whenever he was younger for being gay. So
that's like a part of it. But INGOs One had
developed this terminology to be able to get outside of
(08:08):
your body. That was called perfect side integration, where you
could literally go to another area of the world and
your body is physically duplicated into an asterol body and
then you can feel the invit. It's like it's like
remote viewing on steroids is essentially what you can. You
can then affect the environment, you can move things around,
(08:34):
like it's almost like your physical body has is also there,
but it's not quite your physical body. It's just like
a duplicated version of your physical body. But this is
also it really seems to me that trauma induces these
(08:56):
types of abilities, and trauma also induces in out of
body experience, like if you go through enough trauma, you're
inevitably going to disassociate from your reality. And sometimes you
know how people whenever they go through trauma, they're like, oh,
I seen this from a far distance. It was like
I was up in the corner of the room and
(09:17):
I was looking down on myself. That's a forced out
of body experience through trauma. And with the MK Ultra
programs what they were doing, it seems as if the
MK Ultra programs were inadvertently creating gifted individuals, which is
that would be of course, the ones that survived that
(09:38):
didn't go catatonic and you know, weren't able to get
over the trauma or disassociate. They stayed within their physical body,
like you know a lot of the people at Raven's
Crag in Canada, which also the Rockefeller Foundation provided a
(09:58):
grant to help found the Allen Memorial Institute aka Ravens
Craig Hospital that supported doctor Hughan Cameron's MK Ultra experiments
and upwards of one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a
year for five years. And then there was also grants
that happened after that as well.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Super interesting man, tell us again, who are you? Who
do you have in the film?
Speaker 1 (10:23):
All confirmed people within the DIA Army Intelligence Remote Viewing
Unit at Fort Mead, so Angela Ford Dell graf Dell
Graph was the operations manager, which I was just mentioning
that had the small remove viewing unit at Ry Paterson
Air Force Base Limb Buchanan, which the movie The Minister
(10:44):
at Goes is kind of semi based off of. And
then doctor David Moorehouse.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Oh well, we won't give away too much.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Then, well, with doctor Hughan Cameron, he's one of the
ones that created the technology of psyche driving. He would
all these sessions with patients and he would have a
patient listen back to one of those tapes, and then
he noticed that one of his patients had a visceral
reaction to hearing a certain part of this tape. So
he started making her listen to this tape over and
over and over again, day in and day out for months,
(11:16):
and it's pretty soon he was doing this with all
of his patients. Now, the people that were experimented on it,
Ravens Craig ended up getting together and sued the CIA
and they settled out of court for around eight hundred
thousand dollars. Now, the psyche driving thing is essentially a programming, right,
so if you can, there's three steps to it, so
(11:40):
it's called deep patterning. So he would essentially traumatize these
people through torture and you know, just fill in the blanks.
Then he would drug them. And this was an array
of drugs. See, a lot of people believe that mk
Ultra was just about LSD were just doing a little No.
(12:01):
There was over one hundred and fifty different drugs that
were tested on within the mk Ultra program, some of
them including caffeine, amphetamine, antidepressants, antipsychotics, marijuana, like all of it.
All of it was essentially tested on. And a lot
of people don't know that Sidney Gottlieb, which was ahead
(12:22):
of the mk Ultra programs, I'm pretty much the only
person that's ever brought this up before. He had a
brother named David Gottlieb, which was a plant biologist. So
it stands to reason that Sidney Gottlieb was probably getting
some of these compounds of these drugs from his brother,
(12:45):
which was a plant biologist. I don't think that you
would do all of these experiments with all these types
of drugs and have a brother that's a plant biologist
and not utilize what he would be concocting in some
sort of CIA designer drug. So with the psychic driving things,
so it's a deep patterning. They remove all of your
(13:06):
normal thinking patterns, rational thought, cognitive beliefs, and then through
traumatization and then they drug you with an array of
drugs and then they psychically drive you. Now, the psychic
driving can be anything. It could be anything could be
(13:27):
on the looped audio message that he was giving. And
then if you could take that a step further and
put in a TV right, so you would not only
be getting looped audio messages, but you would also be
getting visual messages. Now, this isn't something that's official that
(13:48):
they were actually doing, but I'm common sense says that
it developed that it turned into something even more. That's
just the official one. The looped audio message. Well, you
could take that a step further and you could take
it to virtual reality. Right, you can take a headset
put over the person, have them feeding audio into their
(14:12):
brain and also a visual stimulus to make them believe
something that didn't even happen, or make them believe something
about themselves that wasn't even real, or something that was
real and make them believe that it wasn't real. It
works both ways. And we know that the military has
been using video games to training their soldiers for decades now.
They'll use simulations, they'll use video games, They'll take a
(14:34):
gun that is just as heavy as a real gun
and have them shoot imaginary video game targets. They'll use
data simulations to do explosions and tanks and all of that.
They've been doing that for a really long time. So
it only stands to reason that this is going to
(14:55):
develop into something more and that would be the next
step of the MK Ultra program would be to depattern
them right through trauma, drug them, and then have this
stimulus of something on a TV or even a stuff
(15:16):
further would be virtual reality. And then when you look
at our environment and how the world has shaped, over
fifty percent of the people in the United States is
in some form of pharmaceutical medication. We are constantly being
traumatized through the media and these events that are happening
(15:36):
around us all the time, and then we're being psychically
driven through the TV, through social media, through programming to
get the same talking points over and over and over again.
I mean, there's this clip by George Bush that is
like George Bush Junior, I was like, I'm going to
(15:57):
repeat it. I'm going to repeat it a bunch of
time because you got to repeat it several times for
them to really drive home the narrative. They really catapult
the propaganda, all right. So that's that's obviously a technique
that has carried over from these MK ultra programs is
(16:18):
just putting the same thing up on the screen over
and over and over and over again, regardless if it's
real or not. If you can make people believe that
it's real, it doesn't matter if it actually is or not.
As long as the perception is there that it is now.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
I wanted to ask you, I don't want to get
too far away from the mk Ultra.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
But the mk Ultra programs were wild, dude. They were
doing all kinds of wild They had so many wild
thoughts and crazy ideas. There was one that was to
during World War Two was to paint a bunch of
foxes with radio active material and throw them off the
(17:06):
ship of the coast of Japan, and that the Japanese
would see this as like an omen or a sign
from the gods, and that they would surrender like wild stuff.
They were going to poison the president of Cuba at
that time. What was his name, Yeah, Fidel Castro. They're
(17:31):
going to poison Fidel Castro with put something in his
cigars to poison him. They were going to put some
things in his shoes that would make him lose his hair,
like just stuff. But there was this book that was
written in nineteen seventy eight by Walter H. Baward, which
(17:55):
was called Operation Mind Control that really exposed was the
entire alien and abduction phenomenon where the military would get
these kids to dress up as gray aliens and the
military would abduct their target. The Sudden and the kid
would then act as aliens, and they would have the
(18:18):
set all made up, and then they would use these
drugs and this weapon that was called a stun gun,
which would act as like a memory suppressor. So then
later on when the sudden individual got that would it
would make them like black out right, It would make
them like kind of raise the thought in the memory
(18:40):
from their head. And then you know, years later, or
maybe a little bit of time later, they would be like, oh, man,
I guess I'm missing time. Something really strange must have happened.
Then these memories will start kind of coming back to
them of this experience that they had with these aliens. Okay,
but they were really just kids dressed up in gray
alien outfits.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I can only imagine where things like that have progressed
to in our in our modern age. But that's a
whole other show. So how long were they running these
psychic spy programs.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Well, if you count it from the time that they
started funding SRI, the CIA funding SRI was from nineteen
seventy two, but if you're not then it would be
seventy eight, whenever the Army first started implementing the remote
viewing stuff in to Army Intelligence for MEAD, which was
(19:41):
grow Flame, but then they shut down that program and
then they turned it into Sunstreak and Center Lane, and
then it eventually set aed on Stargate. So officially, Army
Intelligence had a program from seventy eight and then it
got transferred to the DIA, and it became a DIA
(20:06):
under the umbrella of the DoD Special Access Program in
eighty five, and then it ran for ten more years
under the DIA and the DoD to nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Any thoughts on how they're integrating it other than what
you said earlier. Obviously, with the drugs and social media
and virtual reality, basically that we live in seem to
have been experimentation to get us to a certain point
(20:45):
and beyond. But any thoughts on where else these programs
might have been integrated into.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Well, I mean, every facet of our existence has essentially
been turned into some sort of MK Ultra style program
style syop. Right now when you talk about the the
type of stranger thing aspect of this, because people are
probably wondering, oh, well, this is interesting, this is cool,
(21:17):
but where does the where does the experimentation on kids
come in right. Well, we know that there were these
programs set up as Team Beyond Behavioral Modification schools Okay
in Utah, some in state New York, Okay, where kids
(21:39):
would literally be abducted from their home where their parents
would pay this company to come and abduct their kid,
but handcuff them, blindfold them, throw them in the back
of a suv sometimes on an airplane, a private airplane,
and fly them wherever they wherever this facility was. Okay. So,
(22:02):
some of those first ones started in Utah, and then
it kind of spread out all over the United States
and into Arizona, into New York and one of those
is called Ivy Ridge in New York. So and a
lot of the people that were involved in these Team
Behavioral Health Modification schools described them as a form of
(22:25):
mk ULTRA. Some of the exact same techniques that were
used on them are the same types of techniques that
you can read about in these mk ULTRA documents. One
hundred and forty nine subprojects of mk ULTRA. Now, if
you get into the Twilight Learner program, which was developed
(22:47):
by a psychiatrist named Thomas H. Bodinsky, it was a
neurofeedback program which was started in Colorado, which was dubbed
Pink Noise to help produce relaxation facilitate learning. And this
one is kind of a big one, which is the
alter mental states. Kind of sounds similar to the Monroe Institute. Right,
(23:08):
the Twilight Learner program is referred to as a sleep
state suggestion experiments. Now, it's possible that the tapes that
Thomas Badinsky used was some of the tapes that the
Monroe Institute was also using. Still doing research into this,
(23:31):
but I know somebody that was a part of the
Twilight Learner program in Colorado that has some of these tapes.
She can't play them yet because she doesn't have a
cassette tape recorder. But I do know someone that has
these tapes. So I'm trying to figure out a way
(23:54):
to play these tapes to see if they are any
way connected to the Monroe Institute eight Way tapes, because
this is a very important connection. There's the school gate programs,
which were gifted individuals public school programs, right, And there's
(24:14):
also the Gateway program. So there's the and then there's
a Stargate program. So all this stuff gets very convoluted
and kind of all mixed together because it all has
gate at the end of it.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
So, bro, have you seen Wayward Pines on Netflix? Yes,
that the abducting of kids bringing them to this experimental school.
That's exactly what that show is about.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
That's exactly what the show is about. And there's also
another show called The Institute on MGM plus. It's a
show that's based off of Stephen King's book The Institute,
where kids are abducted out of their home taken to
this facility because they have psychic abilities and psychic problems.
Is Crazy, which is a really good show. I highly
recommend it. And when I saw that, I was like,
(25:00):
holy shit, this is basically my documentary in a nutshell.
I mean, this is a you know, Hollywood version of
what I believe it was happening on some levels. So
you have the Twilight Learner Program, which Thomas A. Shbadinsky
(25:25):
initially worked as an aerospace engineer in southern California, including
working on a top secret classified projects at Area fifty
one on the SR seventy one Blackbird, which is so interesting.
It's a tidbit of information how a lot of these
(25:46):
guys always seem to work for some sort of Aerospace company,
and then switch into psychology an experimentation on the human mind.
But you have the gate programs in school. Now this
is how it's connected to the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes,
(26:07):
because there's been this flurry of online activity around the
Gate programs because people are thinking back to them and thinking, oh,
that's that was kind of freaking weird. I was being
pulled out of class. I was had these really strange
I was asked to do these really strange things like
mess with ropes, mess with blocks. There was a guy
(26:28):
that was telling me to say what's on the flash
card without having to see what's on the flash card.
I had these really weird, strange hearing tests. They would
do really weird, strange vision tests. And this would happen
periodically through my upbringing in public school. And what's triggering
a lot of these people is this clip of this
(26:54):
hearing test that was done and a lot of people
remember this was you should be hearing my voice in
your right ear, And that's triggering a lot of people
to bring back this memory of these hearing tests that
was done in public school. Now it turns out that
that tape is the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes. Whoa So,
(27:21):
how did the Monroe Institute gateway tapes end up in
public school? And why did they end up in public
school and why were they using this as an experiment
on children in the seventies, the late seventies, eighties, and nineties.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It is super interesting.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
And they've also a lot of people have said that
they were told to drink some type of sink.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Drink, yeah, pink.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Drink, yellow drinks, And depending on where they were and
where they lived in what state that they were in,
they were told it was for a different reason. Not
everybody got the same reason as to why they needed
to ingest this liquid. Some people was told it's for
(28:20):
that it was vitamins. Other people were told that it
was vaccines. Other people were told that it was asthma medication,
you know. And then some of the programs too, depending
on where you lived in the United States, depended on
(28:41):
what the excuse was for why your kid needed to
be a part of the program. Some of them were, Oh,
he's a genius, he needs or they need or the
girl or whoever it is, they're a genius. They need
to be put inside of a special type of program.
(29:01):
Before advanced learning kids. Other people, it was he's an
unruly child, he has ADHD, he has all these problems.
He can't sit still, he needs to be put in
a special class. So if you were in California during
(29:28):
this period of time, you would probably be told, oh, well,
your kid needs special attention because he's a really he's
very smart, he's scoring very high on a lot of
these tests. We need to put him into a special class.
He needs to be put into it. And the parents
were like, okay, yes, do it, do it whatever. And
(29:50):
then if you were in I don't know, Ohio or
Pennsylvania or some place northern East coast, more likely that
it would be your kid is unruly, your kid can't
say still, he's got problems, he's being disruptive in class.
(30:12):
He needs to be put into a special class to
where with other kids that are like him. And the parents, yes, yes,
put me in. So they're using different techniques and different
reasons for why the kids need to be put into
a gifted classroom, depending on what location you live in
(30:37):
during that time. And these ran from They had to
have started in the late seventies, yeah, in through the eighties,
and probably ended in the late nineties, and a lot
(30:58):
of people remember these programs. They remember them very vividly.
Now there is a possibility that it didn't have anything
to do with psychic abilities. There is a possibility that
it had something to do with recruitment, right, that it
(31:21):
had to do with putting people in positions of power.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I'm sure it's multi layered. All of these operations seemed
to have multiple purposes going on. At one time, they're
trying to create assassins and at the same time looking
at spying at people across the world. It's you know,
they seem to have multiple purposes for their stuff.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Well, a lot of people that I have talked to
personally that of finished out these types of programs, like
the school Gate programs, Yeah, or MGM Mentally Gifted Minds,
that's what it was known at as in California. They
(32:16):
all ended up in some form of military.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
Service really.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
Or in I've talked to some people that knew some
family members that were a part of these programs that
are had writers for the New York Post or yeah,
you know what I mean. Like it, it's really strange.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
It could be some kind of grooming program. It makes
me wonder if what they're doing if they're still doing
this now with the access of technology, and like you
were saying earlier, the ability to get kids hooked on
prescriptions and constantly be in a state where they are
(33:04):
susceptible to hypnosis or some kind of you know, getting
them to do something, but you know, through technology. Now
instead of having to actually bring the kid to a
specific class or kidnap them anymore, it may be just
(33:27):
easier to access through this stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
Yeah, easily accessed through technology and meet the people with
the kids where they are online. Just like the most
recent Rockefeller collaboration with famous influencer mister Beast, That's what
they talked about is to help children, really we need
(33:55):
to meet the kids where they are, and where they
are is online. Yeah, So it's definitely a technology based
way now. And I really don't think except in maybe
a special scenario or a special case, that they would
(34:17):
even need to use a psychic anymore. Because everything is
tracked online. Everybody has a phone. You can know the
location of where anybody is at any given moment. You know,
track the IP address, you know exactly where they are.
You know, there's pegas' software that could all you literally
(34:37):
need to do is have the person's phone number and
you could hack whatever. You can literally have a duplicate
copy of their phone exactly what they're doing every single
day on your computer. So the tracking and the data
collection no longer needs to be done through a psychic individual.
(35:02):
It's not just technology.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
I want to get your thoughts on some of the
things that I've heard over the years that may be
associated with these remote viewers or psychic spies. Many have
said that when you are out of body, are your
remote viewing, that there may be some sort of psychic
(35:27):
block or someone else that is out in the astral
waiting for people to stop them from accessing certain information
certain areas. Do you think that's true.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
I mean, it could be true in a sense, but
hiring people to do that seems kind of silly, you
know what I mean, Yeah, let's hire these military astral
travel people. It is because you can't really be doing
(36:08):
this while you're out just like doing everyday normal life,
Like you can't be outside of your body while you're
washing the dishes, like you have to be in a
certain meditative state and a certain deep consciousness level that
(36:29):
allows you to get outside of your body and then
to be able to even control that, to know how
to control to get outside of your body is very
difficult to do. I don't think that anybody can actually
do it verbatim every single time that they try. It's
normally something that just kind of happens. Now there's something,
(36:54):
there are ways to try and induce it. You can
try and do breath work really late at night when
you're melatonin is the most highest in your brain, and
you might be able to get outside of your body
doing it that way. But it's not something that you
can just lay down and expect to immediately get outside
(37:14):
of your body. It's just not the way that it works.
So I highly doubt it. It seems like that if
people are saying that that's what's going on now, there
are ways to block remov vieing through certain materials, I believe.
(37:36):
I believe Uri Geller has talked about how the CIA
has or some intelligence agency or the military has some
sort of psychic energetic blocking room to where that because
they were afraid that the Soviets were spying on them
(38:00):
and in that they were getting their intelligence data leaks,
so then they created this room where nothing could no
psychic could possibly get into. That's just rumor. I don't
know if that's true yeah or not, but I highly
doubt that it would be it would really be possible.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
You mentioned guards, Yeah, yeah, well, you know, it's a
it's a fun concept. You mentioned Uri Gala, Uri Geller,
and Ingo Swan. In recent years, they have been part
of the quote unquote UFO disclosure movement. You hear about
remote viewing aliens on the moon and extra terrestrials. They
(38:47):
seem to be supporting this UFO narrative. Of course, they
were working with the CIA. So how much trust can
you put into that? Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I don't necessarily believe a lot of the things that
you're a yaller, says he but I do believe him
on one thing, which I think is a really important thing.
When he talked about to Russell targ on the documentary
(39:23):
Third Eye Spies, and he said that in a roundabout way,
that Pat Price didn't die, that they didn't that he
wasn't murdered, and that his death was essentially fated, and
(39:44):
then he was taken into this black budget underground program
that the CIA was doing. Because it's just a coincidence
that after Pat Price died even though sr I had
other psychics such as Ingo Swan and Hella Hammond and
(40:05):
a few others. Whenever Pat died, the CIA was almost
immediate like, oh yeah, we don't care anymore, We're out
of this cut. The funny Nessri, the only reason that
you would do that is if you already had another program,
(40:29):
or you had or that you had the individual, the
best individual for the job already, because then you wouldn't
need to fund them searching and looking in studies and
all that. For another thing, if you already have the
best guy that can already do it, Like the CIA
(40:50):
said back whenever in the early seventies, that they have
someone they can see anything anywhere. All they need to
do is show him a picture of that thing. So
if they already have him, there's no point in continuing
funding for anybody else. So that's what I believe happened.
(41:13):
Because there's so many really strained which is all going
to be in the documentary as well. There's a lot
of very strange things that surrounded Pat Price's death.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
M Now go ahead, Uh.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
No, I was just saying that there's very strange things,
like he called his family members before the day before
that he was found out in the hotel room and
gave them very cryptic goodbyes. He took out a very
large life in insurance policy right before he died the
whenever he was the family wasn't informed of his death
(41:50):
until he was already cremated.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Interesting, they'd already cremated the man before they ever called
his wife and called his family to say that he
was dead. Whenever he died, a man came in with
what could be described as men in black, came in
with briefcases and told everyone to clear out of the
(42:15):
clear out of the building that they had under control.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
So there's a really And then mix that with what
Juri Geller was saying that they do not kill people
that lay golden eggs.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
Yeah, right, and that it wouldn't make sense, It doesn't
make any sense. Not to give away too much more
from the film, but is there anything else that we
didn't cover yet that you can give the audience a
little sneak peek about.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Well, there's going to be a lot of The documentary
is going to run about an hour and forty minutes
that it's going to cover a lot of information really quickly.
The history of the remote viewing unit. It's going to
get into the gate programs is going to get into
the Monroe Institute gateway tapes. Because that's another thing. Whenever
(43:16):
Army Intelligence sent the Army person out to the Monroe
Institute to study under Robber Monroe to see if being
outside of the body it could increase or make the
remote viewing more accurate or the psychic ability is more accurate.
They also brought those tapes back to Fort Mead, Maryland,
(43:38):
so they had access to those tapes, and according to
Lim Buchanan and some other people that were actually there
said that they would use those tapes to like cool
down and like after a remote viewing session, to like
relax and like gather their thoughts back into it. Now,
(43:58):
I don't want people getting the wrong impression of remote
viewing and how remote viewing works. It's not one hundred
percent accurate. It's never been one hundred percent accurate. And
sometimes the people that are seeing these things aren't really
(44:19):
even seeing them. They're getting impressions. M okay. So how
it would work is they would get into the relaxed state,
we get into their what could be considered a meditative state.
Then they'll get a piece of paper and a pen,
(44:39):
and then they will be assigned the coordinate. I mean
there's different ways of remote viewing. There's extended remote viewing,
could coordinate remote viewing, long range remote there's many different
ways to do it. But with coordinate remote viewing, they
would be assigned the target. The person that is giving
the target to the individual is supposed to be blind
(45:01):
to the target because if they're not blind to the target,
then they can then influence the target. So the person
that's assigning the target essentially has to imbue what is
what the target is onto the coordinate. The coordinate literally
does not matter. The coordinate isn't a real coordinate, it's
(45:25):
a series of numbers. Yeah, So the person that's assigning
the target has to be highly trained in order to
not subliminally get things mixed up with the coordinate and
then imbue things that aren't real and create their perception
(45:48):
so that the remote viewer can't see the thing that
they're supposed to be seen. It's a very complicated and
complex process. When you get into the military remote viewing stuff.
It's not as easy as sitting down and looking out
(46:10):
a picture and then remote viewing the picture. Nine times
out of ten. If you're doing that, then you're you're
just using your imagination. You're just seeing things that you
want to see. Thus, the whole point of remote viewing
is to be blind to the target because then the
(46:32):
information the things that you see is pure, because if
you know what it is that you're supposed to be viewing,
then that gets subliminal. Yeah, that messages into your brain
to trick your brain into seeing what you think that
you should see. Makes sense, So you need to be blind.
(46:56):
The person that's giving you the target needs to be blind.
So there has to be a middleman in between there.
So the person that signs a target and the person
that gives a target has to be different people. And
then you sit down, then you take your pen and
your piece of paper, and then you view. You get
(47:20):
impressions of what you think that it is, and then
you draw on a piece of paper and any words
or any thoughts that come to mind on the piece
of paper. That's what these military or remote viewing sessions were,
and that's how they operated, and that's how they worked.
And I think that with you know, social media and
(47:43):
these self proclaimed remote viewers and self proclaimed psychics have
the wrong impression or the wrong idea of how remote
viewing is. There's a difference between being remote viewing and
and being psychic. There are two separate things. If you
(48:08):
can look at a picture and see what's going on
currently at that place in based off of that picture,
that means you're psychic. That's basically what Pat Price was.
Pot Price was a very powerful psychic. Now you can
(48:31):
argue that he was remote viewing or whatever. That's what
they would call it. It would be remote viewing. But
if you take a picture and you can describe what's
going on at that location, you are a psychic. You're
not a remote viewer. Remote viewing is a completely separate protocol.
(48:51):
There's a protocol to remote viewing. So people are getting
these things mixed up thinking that they're remote viewing when
they're not actually remote viewing. There's they're literally setting down
and using their imagination to come up with what their
brain believes might possibly be going on at that location.
Speaker 2 (49:11):
Now, I know we went over the possibility of remote assassins,
but do you know if they were also able to say,
affect the environment of what they were trying to remote
view in any way?
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Many experiments of that Ingo Swan would do that on
many occasions. That's one of the things that he dow
that got the military and the CIA interested in the phenomenon.
You know, he would be able to remotely affect the
environment and move things around where that he wasn't even near.
(49:47):
It's called remote perturbation. That's the official term, which would
translate to something like remote telekinesis where you can move
an object that is nowhere near you or around you.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
That's crazy.
Speaker 1 (50:06):
Yeah, the Russians were also into remote perturbation, remote influence.
So yeah, but recently that it is possible to do
and you can remotely what you do then gives a
whole new definition to you know, haunted activity and spirits
(50:31):
and ghosts. Maybe it's maybe it's not even ghosts. Maybe
it's not even spirits, dude. Maybe it's literally a living
person that's remote viewing you and affecting your environment.
Speaker 2 (50:47):
He's remoter masturbating you. Bron Well, right on, man, I
can't wait for this film last few minutes. I know
you've done some great work in colle go out BSUFO narratives.
People who are involved that are spreading disinformation and some
(51:08):
of the some of the I guess you could say
some of the current happenings that tend to involve UFOs
or the narrative is pushed towards a UFO or an
extraterrestrial But as far as where we're at now, we
have at least more congressional hearings that pop up here
(51:31):
and there. What are your thoughts on the state of
quote unquote disclosure?
Speaker 1 (51:38):
Oh man, Honestly, I haven't really been paying too much attention.
I kind of left that whole thing because I it's
almost like whenever you're when you're onto something too soon,
it almost feels like that you're wrong, you know what
(52:03):
I mean, Like you get you get attacked by all
kinds of people. You get you know, hate comments, hate messages,
and all kinds of nonsense and stupid ass, ridiculous emails,
you know, basically telling you that you're a propagandist and
(52:24):
that you're working for the government, you cover up the UFOs,
and that you're it's just ridiculous, dude. So that's what
it feels like when and I'm not the only one
that's experienced that. Several people have experienced that throughout, you know,
just in the past. You know, ten years. So often,
(52:47):
being too soon on a topic often feels like that
you're wrong topic. And I felt like that I was
really soon.
Speaker 2 (53:00):
Well us soon, but you were definitely onto something. I
agree with much of your much of your thoughts on
the matter, but I just thought that we were currently
entering a very uh, well, we've been in a very
interesting place when it comes to the narratives that they're
trying to push forward. And like I said, you were
(53:22):
doing a great job calling that out and I get
it it. People don't respond well to things that they're
not ready to let go of yet. And there's a
lot of people out there that are not ready to
let go of the UFOs and little Green Men yet.
Speaker 1 (53:38):
I mean, it's obviously an agenda. And where I think
that this kind of heading is with AI. I think
that AI is going to be responsible for so much
and they're going to pin a lot of things on AI.
I mean, I know now that they're already talking about
how that they want to what's that call whenever you like,
pardon that you're part of all of these different companies
(54:01):
and these people that's been holding all the secrets to
the UFO technology. We're going to pardon him. We're not
going to hold them responsible for Whenever all this information
comes out, I think that it's going to be used
as an excuse for defense in the name of an
invisible boogeyman, just like we've been led to believe the
(54:25):
visible invisible boogeyman. It's always been an invisible boogeyman. It's
always been that thing that no one can see, no
one really has firsthand knowledge of that it's you know,
just happening, and we need all this money to help
protect you from the invisible boogeyman. So I do one
(54:46):
percent believe that it's going to be used as a
military budget to funnel more money into to then protect
us from the aliens.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Right, And I think of all those YouTubers that for
years their content was about presenting video evidence. We're at
a point now where unfortunately it's gotten to look too
real and in many instances it's extremely difficult to tell
(55:22):
the difference, and that's only going to get better. So
it seems like the era of any video evidence maybe did.
Speaker 1 (55:30):
It really is? And when you look at the history
of this stuff and you just like what I mentioned
with the man who wrote the book Operation Mind Control,
where the military would get these kids to address up
and great alien costumes and abduct people and make them
(55:51):
believe that they had been abducted by imans. They took
them to some kind of area that had a background
stet that made them believe that they were on a
spaceship and stuff like that. If they're willing to go
that far, yeah, could you to pull something off like that?
If they're willing to go as far as to break
into Paul Benowitz's house in the early eighties to replace
his computer with an NSA modified computer to make him
(56:14):
believe that he's in contact with aliens while the NSA
is posted up across the street, be mean signals into
his house. Oh okay, man, If they're going to go that.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
Far, so diabolical.
Speaker 1 (56:26):
What else are they willing to do? Man?
Speaker 2 (56:33):
Have you read the book Cameleo heard about this story
with the Invisible Miserable that we're sitting to this guy's house.
If they were doing shit like that back then, who
knows what they've got going on now? And you have
to question everything, even paranormal phenomena. We live in wild times. Brother,
(56:55):
Before I let you go, remind the audience where they
can find out more you again.
Speaker 1 (57:01):
You'll find me on YouTube, any and all podcast platforms
for Good Knowledge, News Network, Facebook, Instagram, x, Twitter, and
you can watch my documentary as GFKX and The Clockwork
Shining on Amazon Prime Video to b TV. And thanks
for having me on and be looking forward to my
(57:21):
new documentary, Psychic Agent, Real Life Stranger Things, which is
hopefully going to be released soon, which we'll cover everything
that me and Chris talked about here today and much
much more. Thank you very.
Speaker 2 (57:37):
Much, right on man, can't wait for that to come out.
Until next time. Everyone, have a wonderful evening. We will
talk again tomorrow. We'll see y'all. Dan
Writer, Welcome back. How you doing.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
I'm doing great, Chris. Thanks for having me on again.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
It's been a minute, it has and it's wonderful to
have you back. It has been a wild few years.
You've been a busy dude. We both have two films released,
one in the works, A Clockwork Shining with super Badass.
My friend can't wait for the new one. Right now
is an amazing time for filmmakers because we can do
(00:26):
everything ourselves, including distribution. It's a shit ton of work,
but it can be done. You and I are examples
of that. And today we're going to talk about your
new film and the works about psychic spies. We're all
about this here. Before we get into it, though, remind
the audience a little bit about yourself and let them
know how they can find out more.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
I'm writer Lee. I am a director podcast host of
Raised by a Giants. You can find me on YouTube
and any and all podcast platforms and on the Forbidden
Knowledge News Network. Yeah, the psychic spy stuff is really
interesting to me. I got interested in it going through
the MK Ultra programs. So I found out that the
(01:09):
CIA was actually funding the Rockefeller Foundation for Behavioral Science,
which is psychology, and a few of those studies were
on gifted people. This was back in the fifties. They
were funding work into Duke University, Harvard and things like that.
And that's where things get really weird because mk Ultra
(01:29):
also had subprojects studying gifted people, more specifically Subproject eighty
three in Subproject one thirty six, which was dedicated to
the research and development of ESP and psychic abilities. There's
actually a document on the CIA's website called Hypnosis and
Control Behavior that says, if there's a situation where hypnosis
(01:51):
can be applied on a target individuals or groups, this
is from the CIA. Okay, you can guarantee that it
will be used. The CIA also fundering SRI International for
developmental research into ESP and psychic abilities called remote viewing.
The CIA chief at that time, Stansfield Turner, said that
(02:14):
the agency found a man who could see what was
going on anywhere in the world through his psychic powers.
Turner said the CIA scientists and officials would show the
man a picture of any place and he would then
describe the activity that was going on there. At that time,
seems pretty important thing to have, especially for the CIA
(02:35):
at that time. During the Cold War.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
I said, these were going on are in the same
time as the mk ultra experiments are relatively the same time.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Well arguably mk Ultra could have been started in the
fifties or in the sixties. It ran for about twenty
five to thirty years, officially, stopping in officially in nineteen
seventy five. So the studies go, I mean, we have
(03:05):
psychic people going back decades and decades and even centuries.
You know, they were called shamans. There were you know,
only supposed to be imbued upon the enlightened people. But
it's essentially all the same thing. There's different labels to
all of this stuff. And remote viewing kind of was
an SRI coined term. Came from the Chinese study into
(03:32):
remote viewing and psychic abilities and children. So when Stansfield
Turner said that they had found this man like you
see what was going on anywhere in the world. That
man's name was Pat Price. But the CIA cut ties
with SRI in seventy five when Pat Price suspiciously died
(03:55):
he was found in a hotel room in Vegas. Russell Targan,
how put off, then went to the Foreign Technology division
at RYE Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio to
try and get funding for SRI through the Air Force.
Now dell Graf worked there and eventually became the operations
manager for the DIA Stargate program at Fort Mead, Maryland.
(04:18):
Later on and around the early nineties nineteen ninety to
nineteen ninety one, but the Air Force picked up the
funding to SRI. To continue this investigation into remote unit
psychic abilities, an ESP dell Graph put together a small
remote viewing unit at RYE. Patterson Air Force Base. They
(04:39):
then received tasking to find a missing Russian airplane that
downed somewhere in Africa. Rosemary Smith, which was part of
the remote Viewing unit at right Patterson Air Force Base.
This was like an unofficial small unit that dell Graph
had put together. He gave give her a map, like
(05:03):
a large area map, and said can you find this
TU twenty two down Russian airplane? And then she put
an X on the map where she had seen the
visions and the psychic impressions of where she believed that
it was. He then turned that into the CIA and
they converted where she put that X on a map
(05:24):
into a coordinate. They then went to where she said
that she thought that it was, which was in Africa,
and then they found the missing airplane exactly where she
said that it was. President Jimmy Carter then talked about
this mission in an interview in nineteen ninety five. It's
very difficult to find that interview, but it's on my
(05:45):
YouTube channel Raised by Giants, and it will also be
in the upcoming documentary Psychic Agent. But the funding by
the Air Force stopped to SRI in nineteen eight and
then the Right Patterson Air Force Base unofficial unit was disbanded,
(06:07):
but Army Intelligence was forming another remote viewing group at
for ME called Grill Flame, which was to use psychic
abilities with gifted people to collect intelligence data on foreign targets.
But then you also have the Monroe Institute, which was
founded by Robert Monroe in nineteen seventy four that created
(06:28):
this technology called Hemi Sync to induce an out of
body experience. This has connections to the DIA Stargate program
because when Grill Flame first opened up, which it changed
its name a lot of times, it changed it to
Center Lane Sun Streak, and then it finally landed upon
Stargate in ninety one. Army Intelligence sent their site gets
(06:54):
to the Monroe Institute. They paid Robert Monroe two thousand
dollars to see if Robert Monroe's tapes would help the
remote viewers be more accurate. It's called perfect sight integration,
where the viewer can duplicate their physical body and travel
in their astra body to anywhere in the world and
(07:18):
then collect information.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Now, let me ask you, the hymn Sync was allowing
the remote viewers to also leave their bodies, now, is
what you're saying.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Well, that's the thing is that that is the goal
with the Hemi Sink tapes is to induce an out
of body experience. But a lot of the remote viewers
had already been having out of body experiences. Yes, specifically
Angela Ford, she would have out of body experiences every time,
(07:48):
all the time whenever she was young. Ingo Swan would
also have out of body experiences due to trauma from
being bullied whenever he was younger for being gay. So
that's like a part of it. But INGOs One had
developed this terminology to be able to get outside of
(08:08):
your body. That was called perfect side integration, where you
could literally go to another area of the world and
your body is physically duplicated into an asterol body and
then you can feel the invit. It's like it's like
remote viewing on steroids is essentially what you can. You
can then affect the environment, you can move things around,
(08:34):
like it's almost like your physical body has is also there,
but it's not quite your physical body. It's just like
a duplicated version of your physical body. But this is
also it really seems to me that trauma induces these
(08:56):
types of abilities, and trauma also induces in out of
body experience, like if you go through enough trauma, you're
inevitably going to disassociate from your reality. And sometimes you
know how people whenever they go through trauma, they're like, oh,
I seen this from a far distance. It was like
I was up in the corner of the room and
(09:17):
I was looking down on myself. That's a forced out
of body experience through trauma. And with the MK Ultra
programs what they were doing, it seems as if the
MK Ultra programs were inadvertently creating gifted individuals, which is
that would be of course, the ones that survived that
(09:38):
didn't go catatonic and you know, weren't able to get
over the trauma or disassociate. They stayed within their physical body,
like you know a lot of the people at Raven's
Crag in Canada, which also the Rockefeller Foundation provided a
(09:58):
grant to help found the Allen Memorial Institute aka Ravens
Craig Hospital that supported doctor Hughan Cameron's MK Ultra experiments
and upwards of one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a
year for five years. And then there was also grants
that happened after that as well.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Super interesting man, tell us again, who are you? Who
do you have in the film?
Speaker 1 (10:23):
All confirmed people within the DIA Army Intelligence Remote Viewing
Unit at Fort Mead, so Angela Ford Dell graf Dell
Graph was the operations manager, which I was just mentioning
that had the small remove viewing unit at Ry Paterson
Air Force Base Limb Buchanan, which the movie The Minister
(10:44):
at Goes is kind of semi based off of. And
then doctor David Moorehouse.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
Oh well, we won't give away too much.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Then, well, with doctor Hughan Cameron, he's one of the
ones that created the technology of psyche driving. He would
all these sessions with patients and he would have a
patient listen back to one of those tapes, and then
he noticed that one of his patients had a visceral
reaction to hearing a certain part of this tape. So
he started making her listen to this tape over and
over and over again, day in and day out for months,
(11:16):
and it's pretty soon he was doing this with all
of his patients. Now, the people that were experimented on it,
Ravens Craig ended up getting together and sued the CIA
and they settled out of court for around eight hundred
thousand dollars. Now, the psyche driving thing is essentially a programming, right,
so if you can, there's three steps to it, so
(11:40):
it's called deep patterning. So he would essentially traumatize these
people through torture and you know, just fill in the blanks.
Then he would drug them. And this was an array
of drugs. See, a lot of people believe that mk
Ultra was just about LSD were just doing a little No.
(12:01):
There was over one hundred and fifty different drugs that
were tested on within the mk Ultra program, some of
them including caffeine, amphetamine, antidepressants, antipsychotics, marijuana, like all of it.
All of it was essentially tested on. And a lot
of people don't know that Sidney Gottlieb, which was ahead
(12:22):
of the mk Ultra programs, I'm pretty much the only
person that's ever brought this up before. He had a
brother named David Gottlieb, which was a plant biologist. So
it stands to reason that Sidney Gottlieb was probably getting
some of these compounds of these drugs from his brother,
(12:45):
which was a plant biologist. I don't think that you
would do all of these experiments with all these types
of drugs and have a brother that's a plant biologist
and not utilize what he would be concocting in some
sort of CIA designer drug. So with the psychic driving things,
so it's a deep patterning. They remove all of your
(13:06):
normal thinking patterns, rational thought, cognitive beliefs, and then through
traumatization and then they drug you with an array of
drugs and then they psychically drive you. Now, the psychic
driving can be anything. It could be anything could be
(13:27):
on the looped audio message that he was giving. And
then if you could take that a step further and
put in a TV right, so you would not only
be getting looped audio messages, but you would also be
getting visual messages. Now, this isn't something that's official that
(13:48):
they were actually doing, but I'm common sense says that
it developed that it turned into something even more. That's
just the official one. The looped audio message. Well, you
could take that a step further and you could take
it to virtual reality. Right, you can take a headset
put over the person, have them feeding audio into their
(14:12):
brain and also a visual stimulus to make them believe
something that didn't even happen, or make them believe something
about themselves that wasn't even real, or something that was
real and make them believe that it wasn't real. It
works both ways. And we know that the military has
been using video games to training their soldiers for decades now.
They'll use simulations, they'll use video games, They'll take a
(14:34):
gun that is just as heavy as a real gun
and have them shoot imaginary video game targets. They'll use
data simulations to do explosions and tanks and all of that.
They've been doing that for a really long time. So
it only stands to reason that this is going to
(14:55):
develop into something more and that would be the next
step of the MK Ultra program would be to depattern
them right through trauma, drug them, and then have this
stimulus of something on a TV or even a stuff
(15:16):
further would be virtual reality. And then when you look
at our environment and how the world has shaped, over
fifty percent of the people in the United States is
in some form of pharmaceutical medication. We are constantly being
traumatized through the media and these events that are happening
(15:36):
around us all the time, and then we're being psychically
driven through the TV, through social media, through programming to
get the same talking points over and over and over again.
I mean, there's this clip by George Bush that is
like George Bush Junior, I was like, I'm going to
(15:57):
repeat it. I'm going to repeat it a bunch of
time because you got to repeat it several times for
them to really drive home the narrative. They really catapult
the propaganda, all right. So that's that's obviously a technique
that has carried over from these MK ultra programs is
(16:18):
just putting the same thing up on the screen over
and over and over and over again, regardless if it's
real or not. If you can make people believe that
it's real, it doesn't matter if it actually is or not.
As long as the perception is there that it is now.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
I wanted to ask you, I don't want to get
too far away from the mk Ultra.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
But the mk Ultra programs were wild, dude. They were
doing all kinds of wild They had so many wild
thoughts and crazy ideas. There was one that was to
during World War Two was to paint a bunch of
foxes with radio active material and throw them off the
(17:06):
ship of the coast of Japan, and that the Japanese
would see this as like an omen or a sign
from the gods, and that they would surrender like wild stuff.
They were going to poison the president of Cuba at
that time. What was his name, Yeah, Fidel Castro. They're
(17:31):
going to poison Fidel Castro with put something in his
cigars to poison him. They were going to put some
things in his shoes that would make him lose his hair,
like just stuff. But there was this book that was
written in nineteen seventy eight by Walter H. Baward, which
(17:55):
was called Operation Mind Control that really exposed was the
entire alien and abduction phenomenon where the military would get
these kids to dress up as gray aliens and the
military would abduct their target. The Sudden and the kid
would then act as aliens, and they would have the
(18:18):
set all made up, and then they would use these
drugs and this weapon that was called a stun gun,
which would act as like a memory suppressor. So then
later on when the sudden individual got that would it
would make them like black out right, It would make
them like kind of raise the thought in the memory
(18:40):
from their head. And then you know, years later, or
maybe a little bit of time later, they would be like, oh, man,
I guess I'm missing time. Something really strange must have happened.
Then these memories will start kind of coming back to
them of this experience that they had with these aliens. Okay,
but they were really just kids dressed up in gray
alien outfits.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I can only imagine where things like that have progressed
to in our in our modern age. But that's a
whole other show. So how long were they running these
psychic spy programs.
Speaker 1 (19:16):
Well, if you count it from the time that they
started funding SRI, the CIA funding SRI was from nineteen
seventy two, but if you're not then it would be
seventy eight, whenever the Army first started implementing the remote
viewing stuff in to Army Intelligence for MEAD, which was
(19:41):
grow Flame, but then they shut down that program and
then they turned it into Sunstreak and Center Lane, and
then it eventually set aed on Stargate. So officially, Army
Intelligence had a program from seventy eight and then it
got transferred to the DIA, and it became a DIA
(20:06):
under the umbrella of the DoD Special Access Program in
eighty five, and then it ran for ten more years
under the DIA and the DoD to nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Any thoughts on how they're integrating it other than what
you said earlier. Obviously, with the drugs and social media
and virtual reality, basically that we live in seem to
have been experimentation to get us to a certain point
(20:45):
and beyond. But any thoughts on where else these programs
might have been integrated into.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Well, I mean, every facet of our existence has essentially
been turned into some sort of MK Ultra style program
style syop. Right now when you talk about the the
type of stranger thing aspect of this, because people are
probably wondering, oh, well, this is interesting, this is cool,
(21:17):
but where does the where does the experimentation on kids
come in right. Well, we know that there were these
programs set up as Team Beyond Behavioral Modification schools Okay
in Utah, some in state New York, Okay, where kids
(21:39):
would literally be abducted from their home where their parents
would pay this company to come and abduct their kid,
but handcuff them, blindfold them, throw them in the back
of a suv sometimes on an airplane, a private airplane,
and fly them wherever they wherever this facility was. Okay. So,
(22:02):
some of those first ones started in Utah, and then
it kind of spread out all over the United States
and into Arizona, into New York and one of those
is called Ivy Ridge in New York. So and a
lot of the people that were involved in these Team
Behavioral Health Modification schools described them as a form of
(22:25):
mk ULTRA. Some of the exact same techniques that were
used on them are the same types of techniques that
you can read about in these mk ULTRA documents. One
hundred and forty nine subprojects of mk ULTRA. Now, if
you get into the Twilight Learner program, which was developed
(22:47):
by a psychiatrist named Thomas H. Bodinsky, it was a
neurofeedback program which was started in Colorado, which was dubbed
Pink Noise to help produce relaxation facilitate learning. And this
one is kind of a big one, which is the
alter mental states. Kind of sounds similar to the Monroe Institute. Right,
(23:08):
the Twilight Learner program is referred to as a sleep
state suggestion experiments. Now, it's possible that the tapes that
Thomas Badinsky used was some of the tapes that the
Monroe Institute was also using. Still doing research into this,
(23:31):
but I know somebody that was a part of the
Twilight Learner program in Colorado that has some of these tapes.
She can't play them yet because she doesn't have a
cassette tape recorder. But I do know someone that has
these tapes. So I'm trying to figure out a way
(23:54):
to play these tapes to see if they are any
way connected to the Monroe Institute eight Way tapes, because
this is a very important connection. There's the school gate programs,
which were gifted individuals public school programs, right, And there's
(24:14):
also the Gateway program. So there's the and then there's
a Stargate program. So all this stuff gets very convoluted
and kind of all mixed together because it all has
gate at the end of it.
Speaker 2 (24:26):
So, bro, have you seen Wayward Pines on Netflix? Yes,
that the abducting of kids bringing them to this experimental school.
That's exactly what that show is about.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
That's exactly what the show is about. And there's also
another show called The Institute on MGM plus. It's a
show that's based off of Stephen King's book The Institute,
where kids are abducted out of their home taken to
this facility because they have psychic abilities and psychic problems.
Is Crazy, which is a really good show. I highly
recommend it. And when I saw that, I was like,
(25:00):
holy shit, this is basically my documentary in a nutshell.
I mean, this is a you know, Hollywood version of
what I believe it was happening on some levels. So
you have the Twilight Learner Program, which Thomas A. Shbadinsky
(25:25):
initially worked as an aerospace engineer in southern California, including
working on a top secret classified projects at Area fifty
one on the SR seventy one Blackbird, which is so interesting.
It's a tidbit of information how a lot of these
(25:46):
guys always seem to work for some sort of Aerospace company,
and then switch into psychology an experimentation on the human mind.
But you have the gate programs in school. Now this
is how it's connected to the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes,
(26:07):
because there's been this flurry of online activity around the
Gate programs because people are thinking back to them and thinking, oh,
that's that was kind of freaking weird. I was being
pulled out of class. I was had these really strange
I was asked to do these really strange things like
mess with ropes, mess with blocks. There was a guy
(26:28):
that was telling me to say what's on the flash
card without having to see what's on the flash card.
I had these really weird, strange hearing tests. They would
do really weird, strange vision tests. And this would happen
periodically through my upbringing in public school. And what's triggering
a lot of these people is this clip of this
(26:54):
hearing test that was done and a lot of people
remember this was you should be hearing my voice in
your right ear, And that's triggering a lot of people
to bring back this memory of these hearing tests that
was done in public school. Now it turns out that
that tape is the Monroe Institute Gateway tapes. Whoa So,
(27:21):
how did the Monroe Institute gateway tapes end up in
public school? And why did they end up in public
school and why were they using this as an experiment
on children in the seventies, the late seventies, eighties, and nineties.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It is super interesting.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
And they've also a lot of people have said that
they were told to drink some type of sink.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Drink, yeah, pink.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
Drink, yellow drinks, And depending on where they were and
where they lived in what state that they were in,
they were told it was for a different reason. Not
everybody got the same reason as to why they needed
to ingest this liquid. Some people was told it's for
(28:20):
that it was vitamins. Other people were told that it
was vaccines. Other people were told that it was asthma medication,
you know. And then some of the programs too, depending
on where you lived in the United States, depended on
(28:41):
what the excuse was for why your kid needed to
be a part of the program. Some of them were, Oh,
he's a genius, he needs or they need or the
girl or whoever it is, they're a genius. They need
to be put inside of a special type of program.
(29:01):
Before advanced learning kids. Other people, it was he's an
unruly child, he has ADHD, he has all these problems.
He can't sit still, he needs to be put in
a special class. So if you were in California during
(29:28):
this period of time, you would probably be told, oh, well,
your kid needs special attention because he's a really he's
very smart, he's scoring very high on a lot of
these tests. We need to put him into a special class.
He needs to be put into it. And the parents
were like, okay, yes, do it, do it whatever. And
(29:50):
then if you were in I don't know, Ohio or
Pennsylvania or some place northern East coast, more likely that
it would be your kid is unruly, your kid can't
say still, he's got problems, he's being disruptive in class.
(30:12):
He needs to be put into a special class to
where with other kids that are like him. And the parents, yes, yes,
put me in. So they're using different techniques and different
reasons for why the kids need to be put into
a gifted classroom, depending on what location you live in
(30:37):
during that time. And these ran from They had to
have started in the late seventies, yeah, in through the eighties,
and probably ended in the late nineties, and a lot
(30:58):
of people remember these programs. They remember them very vividly.
Now there is a possibility that it didn't have anything
to do with psychic abilities. There is a possibility that
it had something to do with recruitment, right, that it
(31:21):
had to do with putting people in positions of power.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I'm sure it's multi layered. All of these operations seemed
to have multiple purposes going on. At one time, they're
trying to create assassins and at the same time looking
at spying at people across the world. It's you know,
they seem to have multiple purposes for their stuff.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Well, a lot of people that I have talked to
personally that of finished out these types of programs, like
the school Gate programs, Yeah, or MGM Mentally Gifted Minds,
that's what it was known at as in California. They
(32:16):
all ended up in some form of military.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
Service really.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
Or in I've talked to some people that knew some
family members that were a part of these programs that
are had writers for the New York Post or yeah,
you know what I mean. Like it, it's really strange.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
It could be some kind of grooming program. It makes
me wonder if what they're doing if they're still doing
this now with the access of technology, and like you
were saying earlier, the ability to get kids hooked on
prescriptions and constantly be in a state where they are
(33:04):
susceptible to hypnosis or some kind of you know, getting
them to do something, but you know, through technology. Now
instead of having to actually bring the kid to a
specific class or kidnap them anymore, it may be just
(33:27):
easier to access through this stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
Yeah, easily accessed through technology and meet the people with
the kids where they are online. Just like the most
recent Rockefeller collaboration with famous influencer mister Beast, That's what
they talked about is to help children, really we need
(33:55):
to meet the kids where they are, and where they
are is online. Yeah, So it's definitely a technology based
way now. And I really don't think except in maybe
a special scenario or a special case, that they would
(34:17):
even need to use a psychic anymore. Because everything is
tracked online. Everybody has a phone. You can know the
location of where anybody is at any given moment. You know,
track the IP address, you know exactly where they are.
You know, there's pegas' software that could all you literally
(34:37):
need to do is have the person's phone number and
you could hack whatever. You can literally have a duplicate
copy of their phone exactly what they're doing every single
day on your computer. So the tracking and the data
collection no longer needs to be done through a psychic individual.
(35:02):
It's not just technology.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
I want to get your thoughts on some of the
things that I've heard over the years that may be
associated with these remote viewers or psychic spies. Many have
said that when you are out of body, are your
remote viewing, that there may be some sort of psychic
(35:27):
block or someone else that is out in the astral
waiting for people to stop them from accessing certain information
certain areas. Do you think that's true.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
I mean, it could be true in a sense, but
hiring people to do that seems kind of silly, you
know what I mean, Yeah, let's hire these military astral
travel people. It is because you can't really be doing
(36:08):
this while you're out just like doing everyday normal life,
Like you can't be outside of your body while you're
washing the dishes, like you have to be in a
certain meditative state and a certain deep consciousness level that
(36:29):
allows you to get outside of your body and then
to be able to even control that, to know how
to control to get outside of your body is very
difficult to do. I don't think that anybody can actually
do it verbatim every single time that they try. It's
normally something that just kind of happens. Now there's something,
(36:54):
there are ways to try and induce it. You can
try and do breath work really late at night when
you're melatonin is the most highest in your brain, and
you might be able to get outside of your body
doing it that way. But it's not something that you
can just lay down and expect to immediately get outside
(37:14):
of your body. It's just not the way that it works.
So I highly doubt it. It seems like that if
people are saying that that's what's going on now, there
are ways to block remov vieing through certain materials, I believe.
(37:36):
I believe Uri Geller has talked about how the CIA
has or some intelligence agency or the military has some
sort of psychic energetic blocking room to where that because
they were afraid that the Soviets were spying on them
(38:00):
and in that they were getting their intelligence data leaks,
so then they created this room where nothing could no
psychic could possibly get into. That's just rumor. I don't
know if that's true yeah or not, but I highly
doubt that it would be it would really be possible.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
You mentioned guards, Yeah, yeah, well, you know, it's a
it's a fun concept. You mentioned Uri Gala, Uri Geller,
and Ingo Swan. In recent years, they have been part
of the quote unquote UFO disclosure movement. You hear about
remote viewing aliens on the moon and extra terrestrials. They
(38:47):
seem to be supporting this UFO narrative. Of course, they
were working with the CIA. So how much trust can
you put into that? Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I don't necessarily believe a lot of the things that
you're a yaller, says he but I do believe him
on one thing, which I think is a really important thing.
When he talked about to Russell targ on the documentary
(39:23):
Third Eye Spies, and he said that in a roundabout way,
that Pat Price didn't die, that they didn't that he
wasn't murdered, and that his death was essentially fated, and
(39:44):
then he was taken into this black budget underground program
that the CIA was doing. Because it's just a coincidence
that after Pat Price died even though sr I had
other psychics such as Ingo Swan and Hella Hammond and
(40:05):
a few others. Whenever Pat died, the CIA was almost
immediate like, oh yeah, we don't care anymore, We're out
of this cut. The funny Nessri, the only reason that
you would do that is if you already had another program,
(40:29):
or you had or that you had the individual, the
best individual for the job already, because then you wouldn't
need to fund them searching and looking in studies and
all that. For another thing, if you already have the
best guy that can already do it, Like the CIA
(40:50):
said back whenever in the early seventies, that they have
someone they can see anything anywhere. All they need to
do is show him a picture of that thing. So
if they already have him, there's no point in continuing
funding for anybody else. So that's what I believe happened.
(41:13):
Because there's so many really strained which is all going
to be in the documentary as well. There's a lot
of very strange things that surrounded Pat Price's death.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
M Now go ahead, Uh.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
No, I was just saying that there's very strange things,
like he called his family members before the day before
that he was found out in the hotel room and
gave them very cryptic goodbyes. He took out a very
large life in insurance policy right before he died the
whenever he was the family wasn't informed of his death
(41:50):
until he was already cremated.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Interesting, they'd already cremated the man before they ever called
his wife and called his family to say that he
was dead. Whenever he died, a man came in with
what could be described as men in black, came in
with briefcases and told everyone to clear out of the
(42:15):
clear out of the building that they had under control.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
So there's a really And then mix that with what
Juri Geller was saying that they do not kill people
that lay golden eggs.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
Yeah, right, and that it wouldn't make sense, It doesn't
make any sense. Not to give away too much more
from the film, but is there anything else that we
didn't cover yet that you can give the audience a
little sneak peek about.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Well, there's going to be a lot of The documentary
is going to run about an hour and forty minutes
that it's going to cover a lot of information really quickly.
The history of the remote viewing unit. It's going to
get into the gate programs is going to get into
the Monroe Institute gateway tapes. Because that's another thing. Whenever
(43:16):
Army Intelligence sent the Army person out to the Monroe
Institute to study under Robber Monroe to see if being
outside of the body it could increase or make the
remote viewing more accurate or the psychic ability is more accurate.
They also brought those tapes back to Fort Mead, Maryland,
(43:38):
so they had access to those tapes, and according to
Lim Buchanan and some other people that were actually there
said that they would use those tapes to like cool
down and like after a remote viewing session, to like
relax and like gather their thoughts back into it. Now,
(43:58):
I don't want people getting the wrong impression of remote
viewing and how remote viewing works. It's not one hundred
percent accurate. It's never been one hundred percent accurate. And
sometimes the people that are seeing these things aren't really
(44:19):
even seeing them. They're getting impressions. M okay. So how
it would work is they would get into the relaxed state,
we get into their what could be considered a meditative state.
Then they'll get a piece of paper and a pen,
(44:39):
and then they will be assigned the coordinate. I mean
there's different ways of remote viewing. There's extended remote viewing,
could coordinate remote viewing, long range remote there's many different
ways to do it. But with coordinate remote viewing, they
would be assigned the target. The person that is giving
the target to the individual is supposed to be blind
(45:01):
to the target because if they're not blind to the target,
then they can then influence the target. So the person
that's assigning the target essentially has to imbue what is
what the target is onto the coordinate. The coordinate literally
does not matter. The coordinate isn't a real coordinate, it's
(45:25):
a series of numbers. Yeah, So the person that's assigning
the target has to be highly trained in order to
not subliminally get things mixed up with the coordinate and
then imbue things that aren't real and create their perception
(45:48):
so that the remote viewer can't see the thing that
they're supposed to be seen. It's a very complicated and
complex process. When you get into the military remote viewing stuff.
It's not as easy as sitting down and looking out
(46:10):
a picture and then remote viewing the picture. Nine times
out of ten. If you're doing that, then you're you're
just using your imagination. You're just seeing things that you
want to see. Thus, the whole point of remote viewing
is to be blind to the target because then the
(46:32):
information the things that you see is pure, because if
you know what it is that you're supposed to be viewing,
then that gets subliminal. Yeah, that messages into your brain
to trick your brain into seeing what you think that
you should see. Makes sense, So you need to be blind.
(46:56):
The person that's giving you the target needs to be blind.
So there has to be a middleman in between there.
So the person that signs a target and the person
that gives a target has to be different people. And
then you sit down, then you take your pen and
your piece of paper, and then you view. You get
(47:20):
impressions of what you think that it is, and then
you draw on a piece of paper and any words
or any thoughts that come to mind on the piece
of paper. That's what these military or remote viewing sessions were,
and that's how they operated, and that's how they worked.
And I think that with you know, social media and
(47:43):
these self proclaimed remote viewers and self proclaimed psychics have
the wrong impression or the wrong idea of how remote
viewing is. There's a difference between being remote viewing and
and being psychic. There are two separate things. If you
(48:08):
can look at a picture and see what's going on
currently at that place in based off of that picture,
that means you're psychic. That's basically what Pat Price was.
Pot Price was a very powerful psychic. Now you can
(48:31):
argue that he was remote viewing or whatever. That's what
they would call it. It would be remote viewing. But
if you take a picture and you can describe what's
going on at that location, you are a psychic. You're
not a remote viewer. Remote viewing is a completely separate protocol.
(48:51):
There's a protocol to remote viewing. So people are getting
these things mixed up thinking that they're remote viewing when
they're not actually remote viewing. There's they're literally setting down
and using their imagination to come up with what their
brain believes might possibly be going on at that location.
Speaker 2 (49:11):
Now, I know we went over the possibility of remote assassins,
but do you know if they were also able to say,
affect the environment of what they were trying to remote
view in any way?
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Many experiments of that Ingo Swan would do that on
many occasions. That's one of the things that he dow
that got the military and the CIA interested in the phenomenon.
You know, he would be able to remotely affect the
environment and move things around where that he wasn't even near.
(49:47):
It's called remote perturbation. That's the official term, which would
translate to something like remote telekinesis where you can move
an object that is nowhere near you or around you.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
That's crazy.
Speaker 1 (50:06):
Yeah, the Russians were also into remote perturbation, remote influence.
So yeah, but recently that it is possible to do
and you can remotely what you do then gives a
whole new definition to you know, haunted activity and spirits
(50:31):
and ghosts. Maybe it's maybe it's not even ghosts. Maybe
it's not even spirits, dude. Maybe it's literally a living
person that's remote viewing you and affecting your environment.
Speaker 2 (50:47):
He's remoter masturbating you. Bron Well, right on, man, I
can't wait for this film last few minutes. I know
you've done some great work in colle go out BSUFO narratives.
People who are involved that are spreading disinformation and some
(51:08):
of the some of the I guess you could say
some of the current happenings that tend to involve UFOs
or the narrative is pushed towards a UFO or an
extraterrestrial But as far as where we're at now, we
have at least more congressional hearings that pop up here
(51:31):
and there. What are your thoughts on the state of
quote unquote disclosure?
Speaker 1 (51:38):
Oh man, Honestly, I haven't really been paying too much attention.
I kind of left that whole thing because I it's
almost like whenever you're when you're onto something too soon,
it almost feels like that you're wrong, you know what
(52:03):
I mean, Like you get you get attacked by all
kinds of people. You get you know, hate comments, hate messages,
and all kinds of nonsense and stupid ass, ridiculous emails,
you know, basically telling you that you're a propagandist and
(52:24):
that you're working for the government, you cover up the UFOs,
and that you're it's just ridiculous, dude. So that's what
it feels like when and I'm not the only one
that's experienced that. Several people have experienced that throughout, you know,
just in the past. You know, ten years. So often,
(52:47):
being too soon on a topic often feels like that
you're wrong topic. And I felt like that I was
really soon.
Speaker 2 (53:00):
Well us soon, but you were definitely onto something. I
agree with much of your much of your thoughts on
the matter, but I just thought that we were currently
entering a very uh, well, we've been in a very
interesting place when it comes to the narratives that they're
trying to push forward. And like I said, you were
(53:22):
doing a great job calling that out and I get
it it. People don't respond well to things that they're
not ready to let go of yet. And there's a
lot of people out there that are not ready to
let go of the UFOs and little Green Men yet.
Speaker 1 (53:38):
I mean, it's obviously an agenda. And where I think
that this kind of heading is with AI. I think
that AI is going to be responsible for so much
and they're going to pin a lot of things on AI.
I mean, I know now that they're already talking about
how that they want to what's that call whenever you like,
pardon that you're part of all of these different companies
(54:01):
and these people that's been holding all the secrets to
the UFO technology. We're going to pardon him. We're not
going to hold them responsible for Whenever all this information
comes out, I think that it's going to be used
as an excuse for defense in the name of an
invisible boogeyman, just like we've been led to believe the
(54:25):
visible invisible boogeyman. It's always been an invisible boogeyman. It's
always been that thing that no one can see, no
one really has firsthand knowledge of that it's you know,
just happening, and we need all this money to help
protect you from the invisible boogeyman. So I do one
(54:46):
percent believe that it's going to be used as a
military budget to funnel more money into to then protect
us from the aliens.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Right, And I think of all those YouTubers that for
years their content was about presenting video evidence. We're at
a point now where unfortunately it's gotten to look too
real and in many instances it's extremely difficult to tell
(55:22):
the difference, and that's only going to get better. So
it seems like the era of any video evidence maybe did.
Speaker 1 (55:30):
It really is? And when you look at the history
of this stuff and you just like what I mentioned
with the man who wrote the book Operation Mind Control,
where the military would get these kids to address up
and great alien costumes and abduct people and make them
(55:51):
believe that they had been abducted by imans. They took
them to some kind of area that had a background
stet that made them believe that they were on a
spaceship and stuff like that. If they're willing to go
that far, yeah, could you to pull something off like that?
If they're willing to go as far as to break
into Paul Benowitz's house in the early eighties to replace
his computer with an NSA modified computer to make him
(56:14):
believe that he's in contact with aliens while the NSA
is posted up across the street, be mean signals into
his house. Oh okay, man, If they're going to go that.
Speaker 2 (56:24):
Far, so diabolical.
Speaker 1 (56:26):
What else are they willing to do? Man?
Speaker 2 (56:33):
Have you read the book Cameleo heard about this story
with the Invisible Miserable that we're sitting to this guy's house.
If they were doing shit like that back then, who
knows what they've got going on now? And you have
to question everything, even paranormal phenomena. We live in wild times. Brother,
(56:55):
Before I let you go, remind the audience where they
can find out more you again.
Speaker 1 (57:01):
You'll find me on YouTube, any and all podcast platforms
for Good Knowledge, News Network, Facebook, Instagram, x, Twitter, and
you can watch my documentary as GFKX and The Clockwork
Shining on Amazon Prime Video to b TV. And thanks
for having me on and be looking forward to my
(57:21):
new documentary, Psychic Agent, Real Life Stranger Things, which is
hopefully going to be released soon, which we'll cover everything
that me and Chris talked about here today and much
much more. Thank you very.
Speaker 2 (57:37):
Much, right on man, can't wait for that to come out.
Until next time. Everyone, have a wonderful evening. We will
talk again tomorrow. We'll see y'all. Dan
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