The Horrifying Reality of Human Sacrifices Under Famous Landmarks!

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'd heard stories about that the London Bridge, that people
were sacrificed and buried under the London Bridge to get
it to stand. I think as recent as ten years ago.
I might have those numbers wrong, but there were skeletons
found in the towers. Yeah, the Tower of London. There
were skeletons found in there that were encased within the walls.

(00:23):
That is very shocking.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
This is the Cross Files podcast, Brilliantly blending enlightenment and engagement.
This thought provoking show explores ancient and modern topics through
a biblical lens, offering listeners a fresh perspective on historical mysteries,
spiritual encounters, and current events with a focus on the supernatural.
Your hosts, Michael and Jerry bring a unique insightful viewpoint,

(00:51):
encouraging listeners to embrace the spiritual significance behind the veil.
Join them on a fascinating journey to broaden your horizons
and uncover the super natural aspects of life.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
Welcome to the Crossfiles Podcast. I am post Christmas here tonight,
and I'm not sure when I'll put this out, but
hopefully it'll be soon. I've got my podcast partner and
Ry Michael Bashan tonight.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
Welcome Michael.

Speaker 3 (01:27):
Hello there, fellow sir, and I've got my awesome, beautiful
special guest that we haven't talked to. Can you believe
in three and a half years? Jenny k Parts Welcome Jen? Hello,
I can't believe that long.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
I'm glad.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
Absolutely, we're blessed to have you on board again.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Thank you, miss Jen. How have you been doing? It's
been a challenging few years because you're saying like it's
three and a half since your last time, it's been
challenging lots of ways, lots of personal ways. I feel,
at least in my life, the Lord is digging things
out and showing me where I don't really trust him
and pinching from that and learning to trust more and

(02:03):
renewing my mind and going back and doing that again
and again, like you're going upstairsteps, right, so I get
it this way and then next step? Oh okay, all right, yeah,
I need to trust there too. I need to have
faith there too, and what faith is and what really
looks like and not yeah like that, you don't have
to go on. I'm gonna have faith and you're conjure
it up and give me try so hard. It's just

(02:24):
a trust. Like you're sitting down in a chair. I
trust this chair I'm sitting on to hole me up.
That's faith. Personal is it's fit three or so years,
My goodness, it has absolutely.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
I totally resonate with that about trusting God and God
showing us whatever areas that we need to open up
the door to so that He can start cleaning out
that room. And there's so many different rooms that are
dusty in my life that God says, Okay, you need
to work on this, you need to work on that.
Here's where you're.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
Submitted to you, here's where you're not submitted to you.
And then that is awesome, Jen, I really appreciate that.

Speaker 3 (02:57):
And Jen tell us some good news with regards to
your partnership with the Ever Fine Podcast guys Brandon and
BT and Lindsay Yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
I yeah. Working with Brandon Spain and Lindsay it's unrefined.
So I'm going on there as a guest host. So
when it's a topic that I'm really curious about or
like the discussion that we want to have. Earlier this year,
I think October we had a discussion about satanic panic
and Mike Warnkey, Yes, and stand up comedian from Yeah,
it's really fun because he'll Brandon will throw out this

(03:27):
idea and then he has a few different people that
work as guest hosts, and if you're interested in the idea,
great show up and we all take different parts of
the research and then bring it together. So it's been
a lot of fun doing that awesome podcast. Yeah, that's
great being a guest host.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
I can see why they invited you on because you
are full of the Lord's wisdom and knowledge and you're
definitely read up. And I know that you have a
Gritty Lady's book club as I can see the little
flign Eye, which is awesome, and tell us about that too.

Speaker 1 (03:57):
Sure, it is a book club that I lead for
women called the Gritty Ladies book Club, and we meet
on Mondays. Our community at this point in time is
on Discord, but we meet Monday nights on Zoom and
we read books that scratch beneath the surface, books that
are worth reading. I like to put it that way,
worth reading, and the one I'm going to talk about

(04:18):
today was one of them. But we read Unseen Realm,
we read the Book of Enoch. We've read they only
come out at Night with Vicky Joy Anderson. We did
a great one earlier this year with called Monster Mirror,
which is the story of David Berkowitz. Interesting, not familiar
if you're not true crime.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
He is.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
He was the forty four caliber killer or the Son
of Sam was what he was often known by. And
this book is the story of a pastor who visited
him for over one hundred hours in prison and communicated
with him and how he is a believer, and you
track how his life was transformed and what he's doing.

(05:00):
And if you're like me, I was, yeah, you say
anything in prison, right, Yeah, But you go through the
book and enclose the book, and there's not a doubt
in my mind that he is a believer, and he
is doing an amazingly specifically chosen job that God gave
him in the world to do that he is uniquely

(05:21):
equipped to do. He gets letters and he does a
letter ministry, but he gets letters all the time from
people who are in prison for serial killing and or
in prison because they were gonna or I was gonna
built my school, but then I was looking at your
stuff and I found your things, and I still really
want to do this. And he is able to write
from his perspective and say you don't want to do this,

(05:42):
and he does so unique credentials because of what he's
been through. It's amazing. It's a miracle. So I like
to pick books like that are going to have an
impact and say this, here's the way you've always thought
of it, but maybe that's not the way it is.
Maybe it's different. And so I really enjoyed doing that.
And we're gonna we're gonna ramp up. There's gonna be
some changes coming next year. I don't know exactly how

(06:06):
it's all gonna work. And that's the podcast I'm hoping
to launch. After a while, I'm gonna be with Brandon
and stuff like that, getting my feet wet. But then
I hope to launch that podcast and be able to
talk a lot more about books.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
Gritty ladies could read nice and that's interesting. I know
that true crime is a huge thing among men and women,
and for you to section off and say, look this,
there is hope. But behind the killer, it's not about
the killing of the gore and the murder and stuff,
but their redemption. In this case, David Berkowitz and I

(06:38):
heard about the Son of Sam killings and I've heard
podcasts that that re find it about it, and I
think they heard one that you did about it.

Speaker 1 (06:47):
What's maybe a miss I didn't break them as well?

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Yeah, okay, so I did remember that one. Yeah, it's
deep rabbit hole with that and see it's amazing for sure.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Wow, go ahead, Michael.

Speaker 4 (07:03):
Oh wow, did you knew my brain that was about
to ask a question? Then? For what? How do you see?
I'm thinking about this a lot, Like there's such an
audience for true crime and all the conspiracies that we
indulge in, and they're fun. Do you see a way
that we can bring people to get hungry for the

(07:23):
Bible and the Word of God by confronting those topics
a thirst and of hunger for the Word of God
after they get into it.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
I think it depends. It depends. So some people will
just only go down the true crime path and just
continue that way and just continue darker and darker, deeper
and deeper, when it can leads you just into a
completely pointless.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
Hopeless, nihilistic view of the world.

Speaker 1 (07:52):
But then there's also like you start reading into it.
For myself, I started reading True Crime probably probably your
tooth in the book by John Douglas, the head of
the FBI Criminal Profiling Unit. He put out the book
mind Hunter. I think that was a mind hunter And
I read that book and I was just hooked because

(08:13):
I wanted to understand how people think, How do you
end up like that? How do you get? What are
the thoughts, what are the steps that have a person
to be there? How am I different from the serial killers?
Or is there something in my heart that's the same.
So I think that. Oh, and then after a while
I just got It's like I knew all the things

(08:35):
we would see, something would come up on I might
be watching Dateline, which I have to say, as soon
as Dateline, I'm like, I have to watch my show.
What's the whole thing? But and I think reading that
book monster me or really showed me there's something more
to this. The standard line in true crime they're too
far gone, they're beyond redemption. They can't be helped. They

(08:57):
really just need to be incarcerated. And that's what I
think thought, because that's what John Douglas and other people
like that would say, this is the way it is.
But hearing the story of David Berkowitz and how his
life changed, how Jesus changed his life suddenly, now the
true crime has meaning and they go back. The book
goes back and details his story as a child, and

(09:20):
one of the big things was he was adopted when
he was baby, but he didn't know that until he
was five, and as he loved his parents, but his
parents came to him and said, we wanted to know
that you were adopted and that your mother died when
you were born. At that moment, so the death of
the mother, that was a common lie that adopted parents

(09:40):
were told to tell them. It will make your child
feel They won't feel like they were unwanted. They will
feel wanted. But something happened that they just couldn't control, right,
so it wouldn't scar them that way. What he thought
right away was did I kill my mom when I
was being born? Did I kill my mom?

Speaker 4 (09:58):
Wow?

Speaker 1 (09:58):
And boom, that was on him. Now, I think back
to myself, right, the traumatic things that have happened in
my life, and instead of and the voice that the
enemy can come in write then that was my fault.
And so then from the age of five, this guilt
was on him. And I think about that that that
is the human condition, That is what we all go through.

(10:21):
We all go through those things like that where the
enemy comes in swoop and instead of using something for good,
he turns it and twists it and tries to distort it.
But the Lord is all of it for good, all
of it at the end. Amen. Yeah, So I see
that in True Crime now that I've read this book.
But I'll tell you, for a long time, I lost
total interest in True Crime because I knew all the

(10:42):
stories and I and the story could start. I'm done.
I'm bored. I know it already.

Speaker 4 (10:47):
That's a good point, though, getting word of just listening
to true Crime to whatever, fall asleep or whatever.

Speaker 2 (10:55):
God knows.

Speaker 4 (10:56):
I've done that before, but I fall asleep listening to
these horrible worries and I just sleep so well. But
instead of like staying there, getting in to the maturation
process of Okay, that's what I'm literally after with the
I'm a missionary literally from China. We've talked before. I
think that way, And how do we reach people who

(11:18):
listen to true crime all day and then bring them
to where it's meaningful towards the great commission? So answer
my questions very well, Adam, Thank you, And.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
I think too you would be able to have the question,
I'd be able to give them the question back. Or
I don't understand why somebody does this. I know I
know why. I get him into pravity.

Speaker 4 (11:41):
Entered in when he heard those words, those demons. That's
how we got to teach our kids the word through
and you praying over him, speak over them all the time,
because that enemy tries to get them to form a
covenant with death to where they think, oh, I killed
my mom, yeah exactly.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Covenant of death is a really good way to put it.
Later on in that's towards the beginning of the book,
but later on in the book, he explains how how
adoption and I was adopted, How adoption is. It's a trauma.
It's a rejection. This voice that was here and a smell,
and everything that was here is suddenly gone. You can't
get that comfort anymore. It's gone and there's no replacement.

(12:21):
And you are a child, and you have no power
and no control, and you are abandoned and bereft. I
heard a great quote the other day that adoption is
the only trauma you're supposed to feel good about.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
For sure, My heart goes out to you, for sure,
And I praise God and thank God that your parents
had adopted you. But then there's of course that rejection
of what happened, or you feel rejected no matter what
circumstance was that caused your mom to put you up
for adoption. And then there's that period of time between
the rejection and the adoption that will never get back,

(12:54):
and you would belee need healing, and the enemy would
try to use any trauma in our life, whether exactly
it was that or I went through or stuff Michael
went through or whatever. It's similar in terms of the trauma,
but different because it's a different type of traumas what
I'm trying to say.

Speaker 1 (13:10):
And so this thing about the book Monster Her, it
really takes you through process sake. These individuals are not
a breed apart from us. They're not lost, they're humans,
and but for the grace of God, step I'd be
in the same situation. Yes, it really takes good. So yeah,
so if somebody was saying, oh, I love true crime,
but I don't understand why anybody asks that way, and

(13:32):
be like I do, Well know, let's tal I can
tell you. I can tell you all the things.

Speaker 3 (13:37):
Oh, you're uniquely qualified to talk about it because of
your experience. I am a weird story A man who
was told when he was a boy that somebody ate
his brother because they couldn't actually come out and tell
him that his brother had died due to an illness.

Speaker 1 (13:54):
They thought this weird way.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
They thought that telling him that his brother eaten by somebody,
that that seemed to be more acceptable than him dying
of an illness. And I'm like, what was it? And
so that person became the cannibal themselves children.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
Exactly, Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (14:20):
Yes, And like you said, the enemy will step in
there and try to be try to tell them to
replicate that or whatever.

Speaker 1 (14:27):
I get it.

Speaker 3 (14:28):
I get it in my humanity. I empathize what that
person goes through. But then at the same time, I'm like, oh,
that's horribly differsting, and I would never do that. But
at the same time, the only reason why we would
never do that is because again the grace of God.

Speaker 4 (14:41):
Yes exactly, the cannibalism thing is the spirit that the
enemy was to bring back. So among many other demonic spirits.
Back when I used to watch Hollywood movies, there's one
that was huge that came out. It was just endorsing
cannibalism and showing it in such a visceral way. It
was one of the Kingsman movies or something from ten

(15:02):
years ago. I just couldn't believe I was watching. It
was just like, what are they doing? There's candles?

Speaker 1 (15:09):
Yeah, I know what you're talking about.

Speaker 4 (15:10):
Things about it. I think they're going to do that.
They're actually pushing that so one more demon to smash
and claim that it's under our feet.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yes Jesus name, yes, yes, yes, I know exactly what
movie you're talking about. There was a second Kingsman movie
where one of the villainess's name Poppy or something like that,
that she pushed a guy into this meat grinder. I
know it's early disgussion, but they want to normalize.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
It goes way back Fried Green Tomatoes, you know that movie.

Speaker 3 (15:40):
Yes, yes, they nixt tell the.

Speaker 1 (15:44):
Man who was abusing the woman, and they chopped him
up and they put him in the barbecue and they
found all the downs people exactly. And when I first
watched that movie in ninety two, I thought it was
an entertaining movie, and I thought, as a nineteen twenty
year old girl, I thought, well, he deserves that. With
the hands on my hips.

Speaker 3 (16:04):
But you know what now looking at the global agenda
to try to normalize that, like, okay, that fall in
line with the global agenda. Or if anyone's seen the
movie Soilent Green, which is totally gross and disgusting. But yeah,
I don't know why we went.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
Down the rable podcasts.

Speaker 4 (16:22):
Let's have a little what what about what Jennifer got
cooking for two year? Three and a half years? That's
like the tribulation.

Speaker 1 (16:30):
Yeah, at least. One of the really awesome books that
you read that I wanted to talk to you guys
about tonight is called The Threshold Covenant. Yeah, and it
is absolutely fascinating. I'll give you just a little bit
of history and why the heck. I think it's a
good book, absolutely it is. The author is Henry Clay Trumbull.

(16:52):
He is the great. He was the great grandfather of
Elizabeth Elliott. Yes, so that gives you, Yeah, that gives
you some kind of bona fides there. It was published
in eighteen ninety six and his purpose for writing it
was to document the worldwide threshold traditions. Okay, he saw
the information fading in modern day understanding. And I would

(17:14):
say it has gone now for here where we are,
but we have wait.

Speaker 4 (17:18):
What is worldwide threshold traditions? Is this fringe stuff we're talking.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
About is talking about history around the threshold of a building,
the traditions that would be like.

Speaker 4 (17:32):
An actual like a build threshold.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Yeah, okay it And oh, you guys, there's so much
stuff in this book is blowing my mind every time
I look at it. You guys know this, right, blue
pill versus red Pill? Who know that it goes back
to the movie The Matrix, and you know the decision
that that neo has to make, right, either he's going
to have everything revealed or everything's going to be a secret.

(17:55):
So you know, red pill blue pill. But one hundred
years from now, if we say, oh, that's a red
pill blue pill kind of thing, right, then somebody who
has not seen The Matrix would they would only know
that it is just a decision. Okay, you're making a
decision between one thing or the other. The impact of
the context is lost on them. They know it's a decision,

(18:16):
but they don't know any of the depth. We're going
to talk about the depth and the meaning of the thresholds.
A couple of key Bible passages. It's all over the place.
But if you think about the Passover, the door was
painted in blood, and you think about in Revelation when
Jesus says I stand at the door and knock, those

(18:37):
are both things that call back to these ancient threshold traditions.
So I'm going to highlight some Yeah, I'm just going
to highlight the here and soacinating topic.

Speaker 4 (18:51):
Jesus standing at the door knocking, the two Moses commanding
Israelites to paint their doors with flood for the Angel passover.

Speaker 1 (19:02):
Yes, they're all connected by by the doorway. Oh, it's it.
We're gonna go deep, my friend. It was just the
first mind blown. That is mind blow number one. It'll
man okay, all right, So let me just define a
threshold the doorway. It can be the bottom of the door.
It can be a gate. It can be a portal.

(19:25):
Think portal anywhere you think door or gate or something
like that. In scripture, you can think portal to go through.
Jesus says, I am the good Shepherd. I come through
the gate. The thief comes over the gate. The thief
comes over the edge. The thief comes in. It sneaks
in to kill steel and destroyed. The thief doesn't go
through the door across the threshold. That will have meaning later,

(19:46):
So just hang on to that one. And then you
have oh the door post, those would also be considered
they would fall under threshold there. So the top of
the door liminal space. That space, yes, the space that's
in between two things, that is a liminal space. That
is the doorway, that's the lentil, that's the threshold, all connected.

Speaker 4 (20:10):
So the audience liminal space is a very trendy Internet thing.
It might not be anymore, but like a year ago,
everybody was talking about these limitle spaces like the long
hallways and the back rooms, and they real and it
was like for teenagers, like the first conspiracy theory for
a lot of them. Something spiritual about that though. Yeah,

(20:31):
I always felt like they were acting with So that's
really fascinating.

Speaker 3 (20:36):
Oh yeah, absolutely for sure.

Speaker 1 (20:39):
So look to it. Another way to other things to
think about it is the threshold stone was usually made
of stone, and then it was also the cornerstone of
the house building. The cornerstone and the or the orf
also called the foundation stone, the one stone that was
put there and everything else was built off of that stone.

(21:00):
At that particular location, the threshold of the house to
be put there, and the house to be built around it.
So those all tie together. Threshold foundation.

Speaker 4 (21:12):
In the old days, they didn't have home depot get
the concrete blocks. They would have looked for an actual stone,
like a big boulder or something big enough, and then
a stone. Because I've been building goat sheds up in
the road. I live in western North Carolina, So any
kind of foundation is valuable, especially when two trillion gallons

(21:34):
of water just drop on you.

Speaker 1 (21:35):
Oh yes, yes, absolutely, okay. So and these different types
of thresholds that I'm talking about, they'll all they all
fall under this category. But if you think we have
this innate concept of threshold boundaries. For example, you have
a salesman who comes to your door right and you're saying, no,

(21:57):
I'm sorry, we don't want any right now, and he
sticks your foot, He sticks a foot in the door.
He has crossed your threshold, and we innately knows, oh no,
get that foot out of there. That is not your
place to be, right. We know that is a boundary.
That's an innate sense that we have the same thing
carries over in the husband carrying the bride across the threshold.
There's lots of traditions like that. He's saying, I will

(22:19):
carry you over this. There was actually I think it
was in Italy, but I'm not remembering exactly where it's
in the book here though, but where that was the
tradition the husband carried the bride over the threshold so
that she didn't stumble on the threshold and that would
be a bad sign for the marriage. He carries her
over to secure a better marriage. Is what the threshold
I do was. And then of course the christening of

(22:40):
a ship. So we're going to get into sacrifices and
things like that made on that, but the christening of
a ship was like you're setting it out on the
maiden voyage. You are making a sacrifice, you are breaking
this bottle of wine on the ship, and that is
christening the ship. That is like a threshold. If that
makes sense. Well, it'll tie in more here as we go.

(23:02):
So interesting and it fascinating. Definitely blows my.

Speaker 3 (23:06):
Mind when you were my mind is blown to when
you were telling me about how the husband will carry
the wife over the threshold, and I thought, wow, I
didn't realize how symbolic that was I just thought the
neat little marriage tradition, and oh no.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
This is great. So the book's called Threshold Covenant to
find covenant. A covenant would be an agreement between two parties. Essentially,
it is formal, solemn, and even sacred. Examples of a
covenant would be marriage. We also have too much in this.
We also have our modern view of hospitality, and that is,

(23:44):
you have a guest come over, people come over for Christmas, right,
you're welcome, you take their coat, you help them, you
get them a beverage, and you're taking care of them
and you're welcoming them in hospitality. And then when they
go their merry way. And that's our view of hospitality.
But the ancient view of hospital was much deeper. Often
a sacrifice, a sacrifice was made to welcome the honored guest,

(24:09):
and the sacrifice had been made would be on the threshold,
so it would be at your front door before you
welcome the person. In this sacrifice is made, you slit
the neck of the goat there on the threshold. The
animal was killed on the threshold. And often you can
still find pictures of this, but the threshold think a
large stone maybe eighteen inches wide and then a couple

(24:33):
of feet long, and it might have a little curved
indentation a place where it could hold blood. Essentially, it
would have that indentation in it. Oh. Yes, so the
blood would be poured on the threshold and into the
walk up to the home. So the bloodod be poured
on the threshold into the walk of the home. But

(24:54):
it's all welcoming somebody as part and it is sane
a covenant. So the guest would walk through the blood
and step over the threshold into the home. And a
modern day version of that. Think red carpet in movies
rolling out the red carpet. Interesting, but I think there's

(25:17):
something there. When the red carpet is rolled out, you
are a guest of honor. That's amazing.

Speaker 3 (25:24):
Oh, no problem, So let me ask you this jent. Okay,
So if a guest would come to somebody's home, it's
the homeowner doing it right. And is it after they
slit the throat, say of the god or lamb? Are
they eating it afterwards?

Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yes? Oh, that can be part of a feast, a
celebration to say this is the covenant we've made with you. Okay,
we're going to celebrate or promise that we've made a
celebratory meal. But it would be whatever animal was happened
to be available. It might be chickens, it might be whatever. Whatever.
If you think the story of the prodigal sun right here,

(25:58):
put a ring on his hand, put a roll on him,
kill the fatted calf.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
Oh okay, that's definitely the resounding threshold covenant.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
Yes, fascinating, And I'm taking you into covenant again. You
are my son again. Oh I love. That isn't that good? Great?

Speaker 3 (26:17):
That is awesome.

Speaker 1 (26:17):
That is good. It will take you in and I
will provide for you. If you think, you think of
that where one tribe goes to another and first Viking
sitting around on the table, Your enemies are my enemies.
We ride at on and connected and we will fight together.
That's the kind of hospitality that's being initiated here. That's

(26:39):
the kind of covenant and promise that it's happening in
this situation. So they would do that to welcome royalty.
They would do that maybe just to welcome daughter marry.
This man and his parents are coming into my home.
I will offer this sacrifice and make a covenant with
them that our children will be together, and our families
will be together, and we will fight together and we

(26:59):
will support together. And it's just it's just saying that
in blood. I am signing this in blood. So it'show
solidarity that.

Speaker 4 (27:09):
People really understood covenant back then, even when even before
Abraham yes formed that God formed the covenant, people understood
what that meant. That was the culture that was so
much stronger, keep families and children. It was plasticky Walmart,
fast food, sleep around, only garbage, everybody's divorced, everybody's lonely,

(27:32):
everybody's depressed. Compared to that old culture. Life make precious
and you knew, like lose half of your children when
you have fifteen kids. But there was such a sense
of duty and just precious this with.

Speaker 1 (27:44):
This relationship, and that covenant was made in blood. Made
it in blood. Yes, So let's see, oh stepping, So
the guests would walk through the blood, they'd step over
the threshold into the home, be stepping over the blood
into that threshold, and by doing that, you would be
saying I am joining you in this covenant. The visitor
would say I am joining you here and stepping over

(28:07):
the threshold. Threshold though also extended protection and loyalty over
the guests from the family and the deities guarding the home.
He's guarding the whole. It's a big thing. It was
a big thing, and I'll give you some really good
examples of that. Guardian deities and things like that would
be over the home. So the blood was s built

(28:29):
as an extension of a covenant. And Scripture defines covenant right.
It says I cut a covenant. So we have that
first initial government with Abraham. Although you could also say
that because God killed an animal to clothe Adam and Eve,
you may have been making a covenant with them there too.
But Scripture talks about a covenant. You cut a covenant,

(28:51):
and that's basically you are cutting something, you are sacrificing
something to establish that covenant. And so we have that
Old Testament principle. We also have that demonstrated in the
New Testament principle with Jesus himself being a sacrifice. It's
interesting making it covenant with us.

Speaker 3 (29:09):
I'm glad that you clarified Jen that this wasn't necessarily
an ancient Israelite Hebrew practice, but this was practiced in
the ancient world. Well, we would consider a quote unquote
pagan like the Greeks or the Romans or the Vikings
or whatever, at least at one point where pagan and
many have come to Christ.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
Thank God. Since then?

Speaker 2 (29:30):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (29:31):
Interesting, Yeah, so these are like ancient understandings that we've lost.
We don't have the context anymore. But this is restoring
the context here. So the meal was shared, which was
ratifying that covenant. Right, It's saying, we both come to
agreement with this covenant. We're going to share this meal together.
That's part of why it was so scandalous that Jesus

(29:51):
ate with prostitutes and tax collectors, because that was considered,
if you're dining at this thing in some way or another,
you have a covenent, eating a covenant, and some kind
of connection with this person that is more than just
a casual Oh, let's hang out and go to Denny's.
It was that it was ratifying Denny's. Thought, don't find Denny's.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
But Denny. The moon's over my Hammie, something awesome.

Speaker 1 (30:19):
All right. So what happened a little bit is that
was all this sacred and solemn business was happening at
the threshold. There were times and areas where that threat
where all that business would happen, would move to different
parts of the home. For example, that threshold stone might
become the hearth stone, and then marriages would be performed

(30:42):
in front of the hearth, and different things would be
done in front of the hearth of the home, so
right by the fireplace. So they moved a little bit
like that, or becoming its own altar. That's where we
get the stone altars. It was lifted up or moved.
Let's not do it right there, Let's do it in
front of here, and we'll put an altar and that's
where we'll kill the lamb and whatever. We'll do that

(31:04):
in front of an altar. So when you think of
a hearth and you think of stone altars, that's exactly
what they are. They are thresholds in another position. Okay,
does that make sense? Yes, totally. That's what I love
about you, Jen.

Speaker 3 (31:21):
One of the many things I love about you is
you explain things in a very understandable way. I've never
left thinking what did she say?

Speaker 1 (31:28):
What?

Speaker 3 (31:30):
So, thank you so much for breaking it down for
us in demandagable mental chunks we could cheew want so
thank you.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
So I was reading this book at the same time
I was doing a little bit of traveling. So I'm
going to share some one story that I heard. I
toured the Puye Cliff Dwellings in New Mexico and the
Puya Indians were there, p u Ye, the puy A Indians,
and they have a tour that you can take the
cliff dwellings and it's actually led by the Native Americans there.

(31:58):
They give you inside information what not, and you go
up and it had a large, oh, very large, think
like a football stadium size area. Big area that had
They had a central plaza area and then they had
homes that were built all around that. And they began
excavating and uncovering things, and they were hoping to restore

(32:19):
some of the buildings and whatnot. But they said that
they the effort stopped when they discovered the body of
a baby, of an infant buried underneath the threshold. I
was shocking. So they didn't think they thought, okay, this sorry,
the dead body. Dead bodies are sacred to us. We
will do no more excavation in this area. I'm in

(32:41):
the middle of this book and I'm thinking, Hello, the
baby was buried at under the threshold. That's important. That's significant.
That's not nothing. And if you wanted to remember the baby,
you might put in a separate part. But putting the
child underneath the threshold, it was not unusual. And I'm
I'm not saying the Puya Indians did this, but it

(33:02):
is not unusual in ancient times to make a sacrifice
and bury that sacrifice underneath the threshold of your house.

Speaker 3 (33:13):
A human sacum interesting?

Speaker 1 (33:17):
Do you mind if I asked go ahead?

Speaker 2 (33:19):
Day?

Speaker 1 (33:20):
I'm sorry. Oh, We're gonna get darker here, depending on
how dark you guys want to go, all right, and
then I'll go light. We can tie it.

Speaker 3 (33:29):
We're gonna tie it into Christ as a sacrifice. But
I was wondering, Jen, so what cultures normally did human sacrifice?
Was it all of them except Israelites? Or I'm just
I know you can't say all culture, every single culture
who did human sacrifice? But I'm just curious, what are

(33:51):
the maybe top three or something if you can think of.

Speaker 1 (33:54):
Did you mention that this was something that was practiced
worldwide at various times?

Speaker 3 (33:59):
We'd oh, my gosh, worldwide.

Speaker 1 (34:03):
In fact, let's get into that, yare okay, let me see,
I'm gonna this one. I'll do. Okay, I'm gonna skip
a couple of notes, but I'm gonna get to this
part that there's a section in the book, a chapter
in the book called Foundations in Blood, and again he's
making these covenants. And you guys, there's so much. Really,
this book is just a list of here's the area,

(34:25):
and paragraph a paragraph of different stories and very he
has footnotes. But I'm telling you, I want to go
back and I want to look at every single footnote
and every investigate every single one because it's fascinating. So
in Turkey, I have a story here in Turkey, all right,
let me just read here. A second, human sacrifices in
order to furnish blood at the foundations of a house

(34:47):
or a public structure have continued down two recent times
to the present. In some portions of the world, it
is not uncommon. So in Turkey, modern day Turkey, in Scutaria,
i think, is how it's pronounced scuta r I. The
workmen were and I'm quoting here, the workmen were engaged

(35:09):
on its fortifications in a building there its fortifications for
three years, but the walls would not stand. Then they
protested that the only possible way was to lay a
foundation in them was to put a living human being
in that foundation. They accordingly laid hold of a young
woman who had brought them dinner and immured her. They

(35:32):
buried her in the foundation. Oh we just left, okay.
So that yeah, that was one of the things. Another
one is wow Copenhagen. So in Copenhagen, a story is
told among the Danes that many years ago, when the
ramparts were being raised around Copenhagen, the walls always sank

(35:54):
so that it was not possible to get them to
stand firm. They therefore took a little innocent girl, placed
her on a chair by a table, and gave her
playthings and sweetmeats. That while she sat thus enjoying herself,
twelve masons built an arch over her, which, when completed,

(36:14):
they covered with earth to the sound of drums and trumpets.
By this process the walls were made solid. It was
a human sacrifice in there. Oh my gosh. And I'd
heard stories about that the London Bridge, that people were
sacrificed and buried under the London Bridge to get it

(36:35):
to stand. Recently, in recent excavations, I think as recent
as ten years ago, I might have those numbers wrong.
But there were skeletons found in the towers. Yeah, the
Tower of London. There were skeletons found in there that
were encased within the walls. That is very shocking. One more,
I want to share my daughter as is in China,

(36:57):
and she was doing some translating and helping out friend
and she was reading some and so doing some voiceover
stuff and one of the terms in there she didn't understand,
and it was that they had living pillars, and she thought, oh,
what does this mean, like they have plants scurrying out
of him or what does this mean? So she asked
her friend to explain this to me. No, what it

(37:19):
means is that as those pillars were being built, they
put living people inside them and buried them in the pillars.
So this place was advertising and promoting the fact that
they had living pillars, people with bodies entombed inside them

(37:40):
as they were dying.

Speaker 3 (37:41):
Basically, so they weren't dead, they were dying inside the pillars. Yes,
And so could you dive into the religious aspect of
that or why what deity are they appeasing when they
sacrificed these innocent men, women and children.

Speaker 1 (38:01):
So there's he goes into that a little bit. But
the specific stories I told you, I couldn't tell you
what specific deity that it is. I can tell you
that they would often bury they would carve little carve,
little rocks and stuff like that would look like the
Upcollu the early watchers, and they would bury them under there,
and hoping that would appease them. That those would be

(38:23):
the deities that would protect their home. And it would
be different ones in different places. If you look at again,
this is China, but you can see this Google at
China doors and you'll see that there are signs up
both sides, and those are It's not just good luck
or get your pizza here. It's not like that. It's saying,

(38:44):
these are the deities that guard our house you come
into it, or the guard this place you come into
that you might be making a covenant with those particular deities.
There are other things that are like that. So I
can't give you a specific one that it might be
or why they thought, oh, all right, the foundation will hold.
They didn't think, like we did, let's put some more
concrete now. They didn't think that. They thought, all right,

(39:06):
we have to sacrifice the human person here in order
to have this foundation built. Wow, I'm not sure of
what the leap it is that makes you make that
come to that conclusion, but understanding that blood had to
be spilled for a foundation to be laid, I think
that's what it ties to. Blood is spilled on the
foundation for it to work. If you don't spill blood,

(39:27):
you don't have you can't have a successful foundation or
successful whatever it is you're trying to build. It reminds me.

Speaker 3 (39:36):
Jen of how the Watchers were assigne different territories, first
by God by Ah way Jehovah to guide humanity in
the right direction, towards himself, towards being godly. Yeah way Jehovah,
Jesus or yeahweh Jehovah God. But then of course, with

(39:58):
regards to the Divine Council worldview that there, art's changed
and the Watchers became fallen and then led mankind astray.
And I think part of that, and I want to
ask what you think. I think part of that is
influencing people to believe that a human sacrifice needs to

(40:20):
be made in order to appease the God of that
region or the fallen angel slash watcher of that region.
What do you think about that. Do you think that,
like it might be the motivation behind these human sacrifices
is that they were trying to appease maybe the god
of that region, over the water, over the land, over
the house, or whatever.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
Do you think that might be the reason? Sure, I
think just there's an innate understanding that for certain things,
sacrifices need to be made. Right, we have the sacrifice
of Jesus, so we know that, yes, we don't have
to make those we don't have to do those things.
But the yes, yeah, I absolutely think that there are
demonic forces. It's saying this, to be great, you know what,

(41:01):
you should just slaughter all your twelve years olds on
the top of your zigarot like the Aztecs.

Speaker 3 (41:07):
Yes, right, right. And what's interesting when we see movies
like Apocalypto by Mel Gibson where he was talking about
or that he was illustrating how the Aztecs made the
sacrifice at the top of those ziggorots and what have you.
So we only think of the Aztecs doing that, but
you're saying one hundred percent of the world did that,
whether it was human and or animal. Albeit the the

(41:30):
Israelites just use animals to sacrifice obviously at threshold, because
the Israelites were supposed to be a different people group
among the other worshiper of their gods and goddesses of
those regions.

Speaker 1 (41:42):
So interesting, I'm sorry, and not to do the same
things that people did for their other gods. When you
go into a new place, don't you don't do the
same things. You do what I tell you to do. Yeah, yeah,
that would be my assumption. But we also know that
there's a passage to this send you're offering your children
to Molak, which I never even crossed my mom to
suggest for you to do, but that's what the world

(42:03):
is doing around it, so that was something that they
would do.

Speaker 3 (42:06):
And they're still offering their children to moluk in a
sense through abortion. Yeah, not to judge those who had abortion,
but nonetheless, a lot of women girls do not understand
that when they abort their children, they are implicitly sacrificing
their children to an ancient deity, which is mole.

Speaker 1 (42:24):
Like, Yes, he doesn't go into that one in her
focus was much different. But since you got there's one
more thing I want to talk about, and then we'll
talk about the passover, and then I also want to
share with you. As I was reading this book, I
had such a clear, amazing vision that think though, why

(42:45):
this even matters, why this is important? Okay, more modern
day examples, and I talked about the Puye Cliff dwellings
they have in Italy and you can look it up now,
Porta di morti, and they're called death doors, doors for
the dead. And it's essentially it looks like instead of
the foundation that like it being the whole with up

(43:05):
and down, the bottom half of the bottom third is
much smaller and has only room to pass, maybe one
leg at a time or not. Even so it looks
like a huge keyhole. And it's a porta de morti.
And what it was is a door for the dead.
Someone died in that home. The way they left was
through that door. You didn't take the dead over this

(43:30):
sacred space here. You took the dead out that door,
so it wouldn't have any influence or anything like that
on this door that we come through every day that
we leave. It was also so that if you snuck
out of the house, said the young girl wanted to
go off and marry somebody, and she snuck out through
the porte de morti. She was dead to the family.

(43:52):
You deliberately go out that door, you were dead to us. Wow,
influencing right in that wild.

Speaker 3 (44:01):
That is wild because you hear people say, if you
do this or this, you're dead to me, And exactly.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
We didn't realize. We don't realize that is rooted in.

Speaker 3 (44:11):
Like you said, if somebody sneaks out of the house
to marry a suitor, that her parents don't approve of that,
and they're dead to them, so to speak.

Speaker 1 (44:21):
Very fascinating and I'm once you get through this book,
I'm not saying that threshold covenant, that everything is a
threshold covenant, but I am saying there are thresholds everywhere,
all over thet all over the place.

Speaker 4 (44:34):
A couple much better word than order. We got to
establish borders borders, but threasholds. There's a lot more meaning
to the term threshold. A border is just like a wall.
Let's just have a wall everywhere. But a threshold means
there's a sacredness to what you do allow through your threshold.

(44:54):
You could include through your eye gates, what are you consuming,
your ear gates, your mind. There's so many different applications,
but people don't really think about thresholds as much as
they say the workers have more borders.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
That's very true. That's very true. You're going to get
strong borders and you need let's deal with the threshold.
Who comes, who doesn't, Who do we let in? Who
do we not let in? What do we let in?
What do we not let in? Yes? All those? Yeah,
and there was one I really wanted to show you. Oh,
I want to cover this here real quick because I
think it's really important. And a biblical perspective is that
when you would take place, you would step over the threshold, right,

(45:31):
and that was part of your ratifying this covenant. I'm
agreeing to this covenant. But if you stepped on that,
if you kicked it with your heel, or if you yeah,
or you stumbled over it, there was shown as contempt
and you were not going to accept this. You were
not going to have part of it. So you think
about the passage, right, Jesus said, he's the cornerstone, the

(45:56):
stumbling stone, Yes, the rock that makes you stumble, or
he becomes your cornerstone or a stumbling stone. It was
either one that you could do that right stumbling right,
that's tight in there. But kicking the stone, stumbling over it,
snagging your foot on it or whatever. Those were all
very bad things that the other guy doesn't care.

Speaker 4 (46:18):
He's just some brunk or loser, doesn't for the covenant,
he doesn't get the ritual. It's like, forget this guy.

Speaker 1 (46:26):
And if we think of it a stop, if we
think of it as a stumbling stone to the Jews,
they stumbled over it. Jesus the cornerstone. They rejected him,
and they stumbled over it. They knew the context of that.
It's then this threshold context. They knew the context of
that that he was saying, I am the threshold. I

(46:48):
am the place you step. You have stumbled over me,
I have made you fall. Wow. Interesting, Oh it's so good.
There's a couple other examples. Let's see, I can't find.

Speaker 4 (47:05):
My little note very meaningful. When you're like the bathroom family,
we love to bring people in and come live with us. Great,
since I was even before I was even born. When
you have people that are respectful and thankful, that's great.
But when you have people that abuse it and then
they don't want to leave, and then it's like you

(47:25):
don't get well, this is about this. It's some freebie
thing like yes, and business like we're starting little businesses.
And I've noticed the same thing when people break the contract.
The contract says this, but can we just tell me them?
And then they have in their mind they're like they
have this weird thing. You're like, no, I need to
literally you need to do what I say or I

(47:45):
literally have to call the police right now. And it
makes so much sense to have a covenant, yeah, and
to have respect for the covenant. I mean, it's such
a great conversation. Anyway, I was trying to fill in
because you were looking for something.

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Oh yeah, no, it's really good it. We talked a
little bit about guardianingdeed. He's one that I wanted to
bring up, and I can't find the note for it.
But you guys familiar with the Stone of Scone. The
Stone of Scone, Stone of Scone. Oh yeah, so it

(48:20):
is all right, backtrack here a little bit.

Speaker 4 (48:22):
Yeah, tell us what that is. It's the Jacob flatderstone.
Sorry middle Sorry.

Speaker 1 (48:27):
It's Jacob Ladder. No, no, no, So so the story
goes that when Jacob went to when he saw Jacob's ladder,
the stairs going up whatever like a ziggarot to heaven.
When he sees this, he's sleeping. He's going specifically to
that area to rest his head on the Jupiter stones
so that he will get a vision. That's what he's doing,

(48:48):
that's what's happening there. So he puts his head on
that stone, he gets a vision, all right, got himself
a vision. But the story goes that stone was found
maybe memorial there, that stone was found, taken to Scotland.
It wasn't Scotland at the time, but taken to Scotland
and captured by the British Empire. And now every monarch

(49:13):
that is sworn in or christened or whatever it is
that it is a proclaimed a monarch sits on a
throne that is on top of the Stone of Scone.
So you can look up of the found that the
monarch stone or stone of Scone or something like that.
You can look up an image of the throne that

(49:34):
Prince Charles was just made king on and he's got
his seat, and then between the seat and the floor
is this large stone and that is the Stone of Scone.
And they do that for a reason. There must be
some significant reason that they're doing that. You don't just
say I like those stones that were over there. Let's
bring some here. You there's some spiritual and sacred meeting

(50:00):
in that, and I think that's fascinating. I could do
old deep dive into the stones and what does stones mean?
And but that that's another fascinating aside.

Speaker 4 (50:08):
But again he said the stones, So you mentioned Jupiter stones.
So I didn't know about Jupiter stones. So maybe I'm
old school fringe Christian, like I know about the stone
of stone. But wait, I was told there was only
one stone.

Speaker 1 (50:21):
Or no, I think there probably were.

Speaker 4 (50:26):
Thought was the only excuse me with another stone?

Speaker 3 (50:35):
And yeah, he's a great accent has he done?

Speaker 1 (50:40):
That's good? That's good. But I thought that one was
such an an interesting little addendum on one of the
things that they're But okay, so by.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
The way, people, you may be listening to this and
you're thinking stone of Scone. What is that? It's funny
the first thing when you said stone of Scone, I
thought it immediately because I'm a little hungry.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
I thought, like, the little pastry.

Speaker 3 (51:05):
I like, is that that goes into the the scone love?

Speaker 4 (51:10):
It might be as regular pastry looking it.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
Could it could be, or it could be that that
the stone was taken to the area of Scone and
scones made the scones. And so that's how you oh,
it's a Scone like Champagne. It's only from Champagne France.

Speaker 3 (51:27):
I don't know it makes sense, it does, Carolyn?

Speaker 4 (51:29):
Do you need to door to ask you some scones
right now?

Speaker 3 (51:36):
Du street in anytown, Florida.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
There you go, there you go, Scone scoons for everyone.
Let them be scones.

Speaker 4 (51:45):
That is such a that is the Jacob's ladder, that
it's so profound, and to this day I really don't
understand what that meant. I mean but that whole sequence,
and I think that we live than a world that
has extended from the British Empire in many ways, George
Washington being a British general and all that, and to

(52:07):
think that tradition still maintains. Yes, they keep those Why
what is the power behind that? And they love to
hide it. But that's why I love fringe Christian stuff
because this is like we have unveioed the secrets classics.

Speaker 1 (52:24):
And I think that you go back and you read
that portion about Jacob, You're going to have more insight.
I think as a Christian, if we like. So if
I ask you how many inches is the cubit and
you would say, oh, it's about eighteen inches, And I'd say,
how do you know? Because you looked somewhere outside of
scripture to inform what scripture said, to give you better understanding.

(52:47):
It's the same thing. So when we look outside of
scriptures what was going on with stones during that time,
and you can connect it to Jupiter stones and all that,
well it means So it illuminates more and make clear
what scripture actually means because we what Heiser would always say,
this book was not written to us, but it was

(53:09):
written for us, right, So it wasn't written to us.
We don't know the full context. We will gain when
we look outside and we get that's what great Bible
commentaries and whatnot do. But looking outside of that will
give you a better understanding what's going on in there.
Let's yeah, I wanted to make sure we got that one.
There's a lot more and I could gosh.

Speaker 4 (53:32):
Every week, bi weekly, twice a week for.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
I know, right, I'm actually thinking that this would be
a good just a good YouTube series to go on
and cover just a little bit of it at a time.
It would give me a chance to really deep dive
into all the different things, because I'm telling you this,
it is packed of all these just little paragraphs are
like what what, and then you just want to keep digging.
There's one passage he quotes this and he's talking about

(53:59):
I looked at the reference of it, right, he has
lots of little footnotes and it was on kirk grimms
k I r k dash g r I ms grimms
the brothers Grims. Kirk Grims were spirits that guarded churchyards,
and this was written about all over the place. I

(54:21):
know Kirk. So I'll see if I can find the
actual little footnote. But when I saw that, I'm like,
I could go down this rabbit hole forever direction.

Speaker 4 (54:31):
Listen, I'm looking at maybe our family maybe one day
buying a church we actually have one in mind, Yes,
this is the kind of thing we need to know it.
Or about a churchyard being guarded by spirits and that.

Speaker 1 (54:45):
Yeah, I think. And the particular story I was reading,
they were saying that this young girl she had to
leave home, and oh, you hurry, hurry, so you get
home so the kirk Grims don't get you. And you
think of all the stories the brothers grim all the
fairy tales. Yeah, I'm lovely waving. There's lots of what

(55:05):
in here.

Speaker 3 (55:06):
Okay, So for sure, let's tie it.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
Back to scripture because I know I could go for hours,
you guys, I don't know if everybody wants to sit
or watch for hours, but I could do it. Okay,
So we've got some time.

Speaker 4 (55:17):
Okay, my kids are all duct taped back there and
they're fine, so for them. But yeah, this is your exuberance.
Your energy is catchy. Keep going.

Speaker 1 (55:29):
So now let's talk about passover, how the kind of
the scripture Hebrew passover or the crossover sacrifice. And essentially,
he makes the point in the book that things like this,
spilling blood, painting it on the threshold to gain a
specific deities blessing was not unusual. It was common. And

(55:53):
so he says here in dealing with his chosen people,
God did not invent a new rite or ceremony at
every strage of his progressive revelation to them. But he
took a rite with which they were already familiar and
gave it a new and deeper significance in its new
use and relations. So he said, before that day, a covenant,

(56:14):
welcome was given to a guest, right, a guest in marriage.
You've already covered that, a bridegroom, a new member of
the family, somebody that were going to welcome in and
give hospitality to Blood would be spilled at the door.
And now Jehovah announced that he was going to visit
Egypt on a designated night, and that those who would
welcome him should prepare a threshold covenant or a passover

(56:37):
sacrifice as proof of that welcome. For where no such
welcome was made ready for him by a family, he
must count that threshold as an enemy. So he said,
you're going to sacrifice a lamb. You're going to do
this lamb. You're going to paint it all around the threshold.
This was not new and weird, like we think, oh,

(56:58):
that's such a weird thing to do, right, it's gross.
It's not like we think it was common to do that.
But what you were what they were doing saying that
this Yahweh is going to come to visit us. We
are aligning ourselves with Yahweh. This is what he told
us to do. So he makes the point, which I
think is really quite brilliant, is that we see the passover.

(57:22):
When you hear passover, that is when the angel of
Death passed over the Israelites and didn't kill anybody in
their household, but went to the other people. He makes
the point in the book here that it was a
pass over the threshold to dwell with the Israelites and

(57:43):
leaving that that way, I'm passing into this house. I'm
dwelling here. Spirit of death, you go someplace else. Oh
yahweh coming into the home, and the spirit of death
has to go elsewhere because now this belongs to yahweh. Awesome,
It's amazing.

Speaker 4 (58:03):
I've been watching Moses movies on repeat, my kids kids.
We watched the Nights and fifties. Do you guys don't
have three hours? Watch the YouTube playlist Moses commitments so.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
Good crime a oh yes.

Speaker 4 (58:16):
And then I watched the dumb Stanley Krubrick whenever the
Realley Scott Batman plays Moses, and it was just so empty.
But I saw them. I saw these visuals over and
over again. I never caught that, but it makes so
much sense. So it's not that fighting God into the hall.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
God, the way past over the threshold end to dwell
with them and then painting the blood on the door
of saying you are welcome here, we want you here,
we want this covenant. And Egyptian doors. So that was
another thing. Ancient doors all written over. I talked a
little bit about the Chinese doors. Right, these are the
Guardians and Syrian Roman. Anywhere you can look and find

(58:57):
ancient doors, you're gonna find some kind of symbolism. You
think of Notre Dame, the castle, the put the heck
is it, the big chapel, the church, Notre Dame.

Speaker 3 (59:07):
You'll see all of these.

Speaker 1 (59:10):
Things around the door. Those are all symbols of saying,
these are the spirits that we are associated with in
one way. Anytime you say that, right, wreaths on the door,
this is another thing. You put a wreath on the door,
that would tell some spirit that this is we're associated
with this one. We're in this club, we worship this god.
We're gonna put his wreath on our door. So it
was again another thing. But so having something on the door,

(59:33):
putting blood on your door, that was not new. Making
a sacrifice was not new. But what he's saying, you
may have done that in the past to other gods
you didn't know better. Now you know better. You're gonna
do it for me and I the Lord of all creation.
I'm going to come in and I'm going to dwell
with you here, and the angel of death that I'm
going to send to everybody else shall not come nigh

(59:55):
to you. That's beautiful, little said, Oh isn't that awesome
if you think about I love Psalm ninety one, me too.
And I'm just gonna read that here real quick because
it is all it's all threshold language. So let me
pull it on it. It's so good, all right, Psalm

(01:00:16):
ninety one. All right, this is you, guys.

Speaker 4 (01:00:20):
This is all threshold.

Speaker 1 (01:00:21):
It's so good. And think about the hospitality and everything
that we said, he who dwells in the shelter of
the most High shall abide in the shadow of the Almighty.
I will say to the Lord my refuge and my fortress,
my God in whom I trust. So you can picture
that transaction. You have walked into a fortress and you're saying,
this is my God, and I will trust in him.

(01:00:41):
You will dwell in that fortress. Yes, we've crossed that threshold,
for he will deliver you from the scenari of the
fowler and from the deadly pestilence. He will cover you
with his pinions, and under his wings you will find refuge.
His faithfulness is a shield and buckler. You shall not
fear the terror by night, nor the arrow that flies
by day, the pestil and the stalks in the darkness,

(01:01:02):
nor the destruction that lays waste at noonday. So we
have said, I'm going to come into you and trust you.
And God is saying, you don't need to fear this.
You don't need to fear that. You don't need to
fear that. You are now under my protection. Your enemies
are my enemies. We ride at dawn right God is saying,
I'm over all, that I've got it, And then.

Speaker 3 (01:01:25):
We ride at doll with God.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
It may ride at dawn with God. A thousand shall
fall at your side, and ten thousand at your right hand,
but it will not come nigh to you. You will
with your eyes and see the recompense of the wicked.
Because you have made the Lord your dwelling place. You
have made the most High, who is your refuge. No
evil shall befall you, No plague will come nigh your tent,

(01:01:48):
For He will command his angels concerning you and guarding
all your ways on your hands. They will bear you
up lest you strike your foot against a stone. You
will tread with on the lion and the adder, the
young lion and the serpent, you will trample underfoot. That's
just good. And then and then our response back to him,

(01:02:10):
because he holds me fast, Oh no, Jesus saying more
the Lord saying, because he holds me, he holds fast
to me in love. I will deliver him. I will
protect him because he knows my name. And when he
calls to me, I will answer him. I will be
with him in trouble. I will rescue him and honor
him with long life. I will satisfy him and show

(01:02:31):
him salvation. That is all threshold, baby, that is all
threaten men. And now we have that context. Now we
understand me too.

Speaker 3 (01:02:47):
It's goosebumpthy for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
Man.

Speaker 4 (01:02:50):
So we're talking. We need to get a lawyer and
figure out how we split the commission for the booklet
that we're going to create from this podcast. Booklet and
just being focused revelation in this This could be like.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
A twelve volume set. I have to say, oh, it's
gonna be a little booklet.

Speaker 4 (01:03:07):
Oh yes, absolutely, Just from the very first question I
asked you, like, how can we stem the interest in
true crime to you just rest and coming under the
covenant of Jesus Christ. And that's our aim. That's what
we want to do is podcasts and what we want
to do it. I think the lab wills show us

(01:03:28):
in due time. But don't use you treathon. I'm just
I'm always thinking about I'm literally looking at a church
to buy it. When you talked about it, great, what
do we do about the backyard of the church. This
is very important stuff. I'm the missionary here, but we
need to have the intel Michael Heiser, people that carry

(01:03:49):
the torch to Michael Heiser like, oh so great.

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
So I have a question, Oh yeah, go ahead, go ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
So do you think the modern adaptation of the threshold
covenant with the animal being sacrificed would be the guest
bringing a food offering so to speak to the homeowner.
I know that the homeowner would sacrifice the animal for

(01:04:17):
the guest as a threshold covenant, but do you think
the modern adaptation is the guest bringing some sort of
food offering to the homeowner as gratitude, as you know,
we're bringing bread together.

Speaker 1 (01:04:32):
Like a reciprocal like a housewarming, like we went to
Christmas meal at my aunt and so we brought a
bottle of wines and thank you for hosting, like that
kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:04:40):
Yes, okay, yeah, I could see sort of covenant there
when a guest brings a food or drink offering to
the homeowner.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
Or do you think that there's no connection. I would
say that there should be a connection, but there's not.
Does that make sense? You don't put the same weight.
We don't put the weight on it. We don't understand.
But there is something if you break bread with people,
there's something there. I don't know the depth of it,

(01:05:10):
but there's something there. It's not nothing, but I don't know.
I don't know all what it is.

Speaker 3 (01:05:15):
It's interesting that the Romans and as well as the Israelites,
they had written or unwritten rule or whatever that they
wouldn't eat with non Romans people that weren't of their civilization.
And it's possible that they wouldn't eat with the Hebrews

(01:05:36):
during when the Hebrews occupied the Roman territory there, that
they wouldn't break bread with them unless they were obviously
Christian believers. Of course, later on but initially before Christ,
before any believers in Christ, the Romans wouldn't eat with
the Hebrews because they didn't want to take upon their god,
to take upon their god vice versa.

Speaker 1 (01:05:58):
There's some sort of connection there. I'm certain of it.
I'm certain of it. I think modern day context, I
don't think we have it right. Again, you and I
can meet a McDonald's and we're not. There's no covenant
that is conspiring between us. But just because it's so
different now, we don't have the context and we don't
have that culture. But that culture Jesus day they absolutely

(01:06:19):
understood that. Again. That's why that's why they got upset
at Jesus for eating with the tax collectors and the sinners.

Speaker 3 (01:06:26):
The sinners, the prostitutes of the tax cultures. The I
guess they looked upon those people as the sum of
society or what have you. But yet Jesus came to
set the cap is free, and he didn't come to
the healthy that don't need a doctor, the spiritually sick.
And I thought that was interesting that he associated with

(01:06:47):
those who were lowly in society according to the elite people,
whether they be fat far sadducees or whoever and whatever,
what we're coming. I wanted to make is that I
always thought that what I would watch the Ten Commandments
with about Moses and about everything with regards to the Passover,
and how it was a dramatization obviously of the Old

(01:07:09):
Testament passover putting the blood of the Lamb on the
door post. And I always thought, obviously there's two parts
of it. I only thought of the one part, which
is the spirit of death, the agel of death passing
over and not smiting and killing the people inside because
they had the blood of the Lamb of the door post.
But I didn't think of the second part, which is
inviting the spirit.

Speaker 1 (01:07:29):
Of Jehovah Yahweh into their home.

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
I never thought of that, that it's inviting the spirit
of God into their hearts, into their home. And I
actually even taking one step further, that the applying the
blood of the physical Lamb in the Old Testament and
the spirit of death will pass over is the spiritualizing
would be to me putting the blood of the Lamb
over the doorpost of our hearts, so to span the

(01:07:53):
blood of the Lamb obviously is Christ, and so we
we invite them into our hearts. We are putting that
that the blood over our hearts so that the spirit
of death will pass over us at the moment of
death and then we'll be ushered into the Lord's presence.
So anyway, just a thought.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
I the last thing I want to share one if
you want to know any more about this, and I
have just iceberg tip of that's all we've done. Yeah,
and this is so dense. It's easy reading, but it
is dense with information. So if you want to know more,
there are free pdf It's in the public domain, so
you can get a free PDF, which is what I did.

(01:08:31):
But it's definitely worth reading just to see a holy cow,
we actually did that. People did that and people. It
gives you that whole different perspective that illuminates the Bible stuff.
The last thing I want to share with you guys too,
is it's a vision that God gave me very clearly
while I was reading this, and it really like just

(01:08:52):
in the heart. So I might cry, but we'll be okay, Okay,
So I cry with you, okay. And revelations with Michael. Yes,
where Jesus is saying I stand at the door and
knock right. So this was the verse. It was going
through my head, and so I'm just gonna write down
the little thoughts because they're like little thought pictures. To

(01:09:12):
open the door to him is to establish a threshold
covenant with him and to provide hospitality and protection to him.
We know instinctively we are destitute, and we are utterly
unable to do that. We know the great honor we
should give, and that we should make a tremendous blood

(01:09:33):
sacrifice at that threshold, but we have no animal worthy,
we have no wine or salt to make a sacrifice.
Then Jesus lays down. You could see the picture I
had is you think the mud hut just a mud
hut barely together. There's nothing in the hut. I'm there,

(01:09:54):
I'm wearing rags, and Jesus comes to the threshold. So
then Jesus lays down at our threshold, offering to be
the sacrifice we cannot make.

Speaker 4 (01:10:07):
Thanks good.

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
And that is when the Father comes into view. He
wants to come in. He sent the son in front
of him so that the Father could enter. Now, because
we know the context of this book, to welcome this
great guest, I have to make a sacrifice, can't I
can't do that, and so my thought, no, don't do that.

(01:10:30):
I'm not worthy of a sacrifice. I am poor, I'm blind,
i am nothing. I am too small a thing for
this gift, and I have nothing that I can give
in return. But the scene plays out. The lamb, without
protest is slaughtered at the door, blood draining until the
body is lifeless. Horror, What have you done? The anguish?

(01:10:56):
The entire custom is upended. I am supposed to sacrifice
for you. What shall I do? Now? Everything is upside down.
Everyone has seen this spectacle, and they know my poverty.
What is to be done? And then the father steps
over the threshold, over the blood of his son, over
the lifeless body, into my home, my poor, dirty, cluttered

(01:11:21):
with sins and agonies, bereft of food, salt and wine
and all comfort.

Speaker 2 (01:11:26):
Home.

Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
It's beautiful. He stretches his hand down to the blood
pooled at the entrance, touching it with his fingers, and
his fingers in the blood. He wipes the blood along
the entire entrance, the entire doorpost of my home. Now
the world sees that my home is his home. Yes,

(01:11:48):
all he has and is he brought with him. He
stretches out his hand again and reaches for his son,
and the son stands on his feet. The blood is
still there, but the sun is alive. Yes, I did
start to cry.

Speaker 3 (01:12:07):
Wait, you write that I did most awesome.

Speaker 4 (01:12:14):
Tongues. Where can people find your writings? You're reading all
these other great literature masterpieces? But do you have a
substack at least? Are you?

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
I should? I should get on that. I should do
a sub stack.

Speaker 4 (01:12:31):
I didn't do three year olds and six year olds.
I would be doing that every day. I've got so
many things that was so powerful that got me. It
was second.

Speaker 3 (01:12:41):
Yes, absolutely, it touched my heart so much that I
was so blessed to hear that.

Speaker 4 (01:12:45):
I saw it so vividly as you were describing it.
I was just like, nobody's ever seen that before until you.
I'm not trying to butter you up or anything.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
No, this is an encouragement to be because I read
the book a couple years ago and it was like
God was saying, you need to start pulling at this thread.
My God, I'm just not listening. But this has just
re energized me, and I think I really need, I
really do need to do this and dig in.

Speaker 3 (01:13:12):
And I would be your first Michael and I will
be your first two subscribers on your substat and we'll
share it with others. Be your first two fans for sure.
But you definitely have a gift of teaching and a
gift of writing, for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
That's awesome.

Speaker 4 (01:13:29):
Thinkank God, God, there's a power in carrying all the legacy.
Like yes, not just saying oh I got this vision,
listen to me, but you're giving honor to people who
walked and taught and fought and then left. Michael Hyder
died rather suddenly in twenty e twenty or something, rather

(01:13:50):
said or twenty eleven. It was very recently.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
It was very just a couple of years ago.

Speaker 4 (01:13:55):
Yeah, there are there's such a thirst for people who
right that. I know that we had some people in
the Fringe Radio network that were walking at his teachings,
and a lot of people like to piggyback because they
have that edge, like they want to get their book promoted.
But I really I sense in you a real actual
teacher's annoying and desire to bring forth those truths. Not

(01:14:20):
just oh wow, so cool, but because you're driving people
to the word, to the gospel and letting God do
what you preach the gospel, people get healed, they get delivered,
they get whatever supernatural miracle they need. My Grandma taught that,
preach the gospel, watch the miracles happen, get ready for miracles,

(01:14:41):
supernatural things. So you're needed, sister.

Speaker 3 (01:14:45):
I love that, Thank you about appreciate you for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:14:48):
Maybe we'll have something coming and I'll let you guys
know when I do that. I've really been plain about
what because you can see my occulting stuff in the background.
How can I you know, you get to a point
of like, all right, people can tell you how to
do this stitch. That's not where my heart is anymore. God,
what do you want me to do? How do I
put these things together? How do I make it important
and significant and make an impact with what You've given

(01:15:11):
me to do? So I think this is part of it.
I think things are weaving together. But I very much
appreciate you're kind. Absolutely, we appreciate you very much. Absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:15:21):
I am so glad that you felt open and vulnerable
to share what the Holy Spirit is laid on your heart.
And I know when I start tearing up, it's because
I really feel the presence of God in what I'm reading.
Or listening to. In this case, one thing I want
to say to our listening in or watching audience is
I don't know who you are, what your background is,

(01:15:43):
friends and people that are listening and or watching, but
we don't need to do any sacrifices whatsoever, whether they
be animal, whether they're human, I don't even I don't
know if Satanists or Luciferians are watching this or whatever.
We don't need any animal in or humans sacrifice, whether
it's Santa Ria or voodoo or Satanism or whatever. We

(01:16:03):
have one sacrifice that for God's love the world that
he gave is only we gotten son Jesus, that whosoever
should believe in him should not perish in hell but
have everlasting life. And it's interesting when I listen to
these podcasts where former Satanists are talking, some would say,
even in Texas or even growing up in the Bible Belt,

(01:16:24):
some would actually say that they've never heard the gospel
of Jesus Christ, that Jesus Christ was a sacrifice that
he laid down his life for everybody. We would say, oh,
the tax collectors and the prostitutes from the Jesus' day,
But now who are the lowliest of society in society's eyes,

(01:16:44):
that we would be the drug addict or the child molester,
or the serial killer, or the promiscuous man or woman
out there, or whatever whoever the society tends to uphold
and say, these horrible people, I'm so much better than
they are.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
Whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:17:01):
Well, if those people are, whether they be elitist or's knobs,
or whether they be the lowliest of society, God said
his son for you, whether you're the top, middle, or
bottom rung of society, and we're all the least of these.
We're all the least of these. And Jesus loves us
so much. If you think of the person that if
you can ask yourself who loves me the most, and

(01:17:23):
you might say, oh, Dad, or a boyfriend or a
husband or wife or girlfriend or best friend or whatever
it is, think about that love just totally multiplied by
a million billion times that you can't even understand that.
That's how much God loves all of us.

Speaker 1 (01:17:39):
That's just what I wanted to say. And I think that, oh,
that's so good. I think this gives new perspective. Like
the debt has been paid. You don't have to pay
that debt. It's done.

Speaker 4 (01:17:49):
It's done, but you have to respect the comedy. If
you come into this and you're like, I mean, he
will forgive you, but you're not gonna get You have
to really receive him as lord. And even when you
say the words, you might not feel nothing in your

(01:18:10):
life might look like Jesus's Lord. But I dare you
say the words Jesus's Lord. Speak the words, invite him
over the threat, let him be the sacrifice. Blood was
everywhere when he died for you. Yes, he ate for
your sins. He also paid for your healing, and he

(01:18:32):
paid for you to get out of debt, and he
paid for you to get out of all the problems
that you're living in and medications, and he paid for everything.
We're gonna live. You're gonna get an immortal body, and
you can start to receive. This is the new thing
for me is receive Jesus into your heart. Get saved.
You're going to heaven.

Speaker 1 (01:18:50):
Boom.

Speaker 4 (01:18:51):
Don't stop there. Start getting into the word. Get rid
of that depression, get word of those addictions, get rid
of relational problems, get rid of forgiveness, and start to
experience freedom like you've never even experienced joy since when
you were even a little kid opening your Christmas presence.
You will never see wait like you have when you

(01:19:11):
truly received Jesus into every area of your Life's okay,
I could turn for hours too. Yes, that's why I
have my own podcast. I don't talk to I will
be interview.

Speaker 1 (01:19:27):
We have the gift of Yeah, it's definitely the gift
of Jenny or Jennifer or jen other one. Either one
is fine. I don't see that.

Speaker 2 (01:19:35):
To me.

Speaker 1 (01:19:36):
Jennifer is usually when I'm in trouble or I have
to sign some sort of legal document. Yes it's jenn
or Jenny said something, Jed.

Speaker 3 (01:19:47):
I love following you Jed because I just feel like
that much more closer to you if I call you Jed,
like I got works that God calls all of us
by our nick name. What do I get called by
by for documents? Is Jerylyn for somebody who has Jerrelyn,
And I respond to that, But I respond better to Jerry.
So if you call me Jerry or Peach, I'm like,

(01:20:09):
that's in my inner circle there. So anyway, God wants
to call us by our prefer not only for a
for name, but our nickname or.

Speaker 1 (01:20:17):
Pet name or whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:20:18):
It is that because he loves us so much and
he wants to become that within our threshold. He wants
us to invite him into our hearts as our Morden savior. Amen, Jen,
So can people message you and ask you questions or yes.

Speaker 1 (01:20:36):
The best place is to email me at Gretty Ladies
book Club at gmail dot com, Greedy Ladies book Club
at gmail dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:20:43):
Perfect. That's okay, great because I think that there's going
to be people that will reach out to you.

Speaker 1 (01:20:48):
You never know who's listening or watching. Be so exciting,
that'd be so exciting. I like you said, next year,
changes are coming to the Gritty Ladies book Club, but
still the heart is there once a week meeting with
ladies and we have a good discussion on discord. We've
got prayer and all kinds of stuff there. Resources there,
and then I also have on the YouTube channel I have.
You have to be a part of the book club

(01:21:09):
to access them, but I have the meetings recorded, all
the meetings from the zoom, the meetings that we've had,
so you can go back and look, aha, we were
talking about this at that book or whatever, and go
back and look at new ones. And I have a
few other things up on that on the Gritty Ladies
book Club YouTube channel. I'm looking to bust that up
a little bit more this year.

Speaker 4 (01:21:28):
Gretty Ladies YouTube.

Speaker 1 (01:21:29):
Okay, Gritty Ladies book Club YouTube.

Speaker 4 (01:21:31):
Yeah, Gritty Ladies book Club.

Speaker 1 (01:21:34):
Yes, Gritty Ladies book Club.

Speaker 3 (01:21:35):
You, Gritty Ladies book Club, alto, you definitely have that
we scratch beneath the surface, gritty scratching beneath the surface
because of the true grit. You definitely have the wonderful
combination of grace.

Speaker 1 (01:21:50):
And grit together. Thank you. I appreciate that absolutely, I
mean it for sure. It's been wonderful. Guys, this has
been wonderful. Thank you.

Speaker 3 (01:21:57):
It's been wonderful to have you on board. This the
Strange o'clock podcast or the Crossfiles podcast. Train once again
to cue, it's to the weird analogy of a train.

Speaker 1 (01:22:09):
I don't know what.

Speaker 3 (01:22:15):
Sc Yes, wait, after this, we'll have to go down
to the local bakery and.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
Get a scone.

Speaker 3 (01:22:20):
I don't know if anybody is open at nine pm
at night here and he's too sence moment, it's probably
for you there being an MST. Probably yeah, wonderful.

Speaker 1 (01:22:29):
Michael or Jet would you like to close U out
in prayer. If not, I can pray, go for it.

Speaker 4 (01:22:34):
Michael, Okay, I have been missioned. My children are not.
I can hear them streaming, but they're happy. Best locks
the tooth during the podcast. By the way, I keep
having to mute myself. Harla duia. Lord, We thank you
for this time. We just bless the audience Lord, especially

(01:22:57):
anybody who listens to this. I thank you that they
receive the anointing from those words that our dear sister
Jenny shared about receiving you. We didn't have to pay
you pay the bills. We thank you that you covered
it with your blood. And we bless our team tonight,

(01:23:18):
all of us, that we would be just filled with
the spirit and healings and miracles for our families protection
around us. Jesus date Palm ninety one to hold prayed,
pray that our audience will claim that over themselves as well.
Jesus Date Amen, Amen, Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:23:38):
Lord, Thank you Lord.

Speaker 3 (01:23:40):
Thank you so much, Jen and Michael, you for your
time tonight. Thank you so much for listening and or
watching the Crossbowls podcast with my partner in crime Michael
Basham and our wonderful guest Jenny K. Parks, and we
love you all, and day's strange and supernatural, and we'll
see you next time. Bye.

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