July 16, 2025 • 55 mins
Remember when you thought your childhood best friends would be at your wedding, baby shower, and every birthday party? Then life happened. Distance grew. Schedules filled. And somehow friendships that once seemed permanent began to shift.
In this deeply authentic conversation, hosts Tajuana and Sheree welcome back guest Michele to explore the evolution of friendship through life's different seasons. They dive into the bittersweet reality of watching childhood friendships transform as we grow older, move away, and enter new life phases. As Michele poignantly observes, "When you're little, you don't account for life... it's like they maybe won't be able to come to your baby shower or they're not always gonna live five minutes up the street."
The conversation takes a powerful turn when discussing motherhood's impact on friendships. The hosts share how no becoming parents creates an intense bonding experience with other mothers—what Michele describes as similar to "quarantine relationships" where connections form rapidly through shared struggles. They also reflect on the heart-wrenching experience of watching their children navigate friendships, feeling every rejection and celebration alongside them.
What emerges is a beautiful portrait of friendship's transformative nature. Some relationships naturally fade while others deepen through shared experiences. New friendships form in unexpected places, especially within communities built around specific challenges like parenting children with disabilities or NICU experiences. As Tajuana notes, these connections become essential: "When you have people that just have this unspoken understanding... it's so comforting because motherhood is very lonely."
Whether you're grieving changed friendships, celebrating your ride-or-dies, or seeking your community, this episode reminds us that meaningful connection is possible in every season of life. Subscribe now and join the conversation about friendship in the trenches!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome to Turn the Page.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Podcast Sisters best friends and brunch enthusiasts.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
With relatable episodes that feel like you're
chatting with two of yourclosest friends or sisters.
Join us as we turn the page todifferent topics about losing
yourself in motherhood,adulthood, anyhood.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And finding yourself again through meaningful
friendships.
Shameless piles of unreadlibrary books and endless Amazon
package deliveries Real, honestand a little bit chaotic we
talk about it all.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
So grab your favorite drink, put the kids to bed,
lace up your sneaks or whateveryou need to do, and join us.
We can't wait to connect withyou.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Can't wait to connect with you.
Hi guys, Welcome to Turn thePage podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
I am your co-host Tawana Page.
I'm your other co-host, cheriePage-Farber.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
And we have a return guest, michelle.
Remind me again, monastra,monastra, thank you, I'm so
horrible with names.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I'm so sorry.
Monastra, monastra.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Thank you, I'm so horrible with names.
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4 (01:07):
It's okay.
I can't tell you how manydifferent versions of that I get
on a daily basis.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Oh, I understand, that was my first name.
People call me Paige becausethey just give up.
I'm like that's actually not myname, yes, all the time, but
Cherie will tell you.
You, like, it's nothingpersonal, I didn't butcher words
, I butcher names.
Yeah, like, yeah, I just loveyou and you literally just told
me, but I forgot.
Yeah, listen, it's been a longweek.
(01:36):
Yes, it has, but, michelle, Iwanted to give you an update.
Since the last time we spoke,sheree and I have gotten new
tattoos.
Since the last time I did forgetto tell you that yes, yeah, so
I got two hearts on my arm forthe boys oh I got sheree, I have
to tell you a semicolon on theback of my neck because it's the
(01:58):
mental health, one of themental health symbols or signs,
and mommy goes let me see yourtattoos.
So I showed her in the car.
She goes is that a questionmark?
I said no, it's a semicolon.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
You mean like this yes, you have one too.
Yes I do I have one also on theback of my neck.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Ever since I saw natalie portman has attached in
the back of her neck, I justlike fell in love.
I'm in love with her.
But like I fell in love withthat tattoo and I've been like
wanting it for years and Ifinally did and it took two
seconds yes, those are the bestyeah, loved ones are terrible oh
yeah, what are your?
What's your tattoo?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
oh right, um, so it's a north star I'm just gonna say
it's a north star.
That's so pretty thank youbecause the lady at the place,
like she, kept calling it asparkle I was like I don't know
why she keeps calling it it'snot a sparkle um, but there's 12
dots because it's supposed to.
(02:59):
This one's from my dad andthat's like his number, his like
sports and favorite number, sonow I have one for everybody.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Yes oh yeah.
Well, that was a little sidebar, but that's just what we do so
michelle, thank you for comingback.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Thank you for having me back on a friday for all
three moms.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I'm not really sure how we did this, but we did it.
The stars aligned yeah they did, and next time we're in Jersey
we have to let you know ahead oftime so that we can plan ahead
of time instead of like todaywe're there.
Hey girl, you're like um at abirthday party, can't?
So?
You know next time we're there,I appreciate that.
(03:41):
Thanks Because I know last timewe were there, you were like
you were in new jersey and youdidn't tell me.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
I was like, oh, my bad girl casual ig stories and
I'm like, oh, you're in newjersey yeah, you're like wait a
second.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
It's just so hard to remember all the things, so many
things now but we going to do athis or that, and then we're
going to Would you rather?
Oh my bad.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Just like.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
Okay, but also let's share the news Someone just had
a birthday.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Oh, yes, I did.
I, just I did.
It was Wednesday we'rediscussing this.
Yes, I did turn 31.
Oh, Wednesday, you turned 31.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
We were discussing this.
Yes, I did turn 31.
Speaker 4 (04:30):
My little baby's growing up.
Yes, Is this a show?
It's just I remember gettingolder, so I'm almost 40.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
Girl we're the same age, I'm pretty sure.
What year are you?
Speaker 4 (04:46):
86.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Girl, me too.
When's your birthday?
Speaker 4 (04:49):
April 18th.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Okay, you're six months older than me.
I'm October.
Oh man Girl it's Sorry,Michelle.
It's getting there.
I mean it's okay, we are themature millennials.
We have a friend who is wellCherie's from it.
She's my friend through Cherie.
She's 1988.
And for Cherie's bacheloretteparty we were the oldest, we
(05:12):
were the only people born in the1980s that were in attendance.
So we were like the moms.
But it was so fun because welike knew everybody.
But we kept saying like we'rethe mature millennials.
Because, millennials starts inlike 81, I think I was like
we're the mature, because I keptsaying like oh, we're the
elders.
She goes no, no, no, we're themature millennials.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
We are, we are, but it's like I don't know what it
is.
The older I get, the more thatI kind of realize that it's
really a privilege to get older.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
I like that.
That's a good segue into whatwe're talking about, Like.
I feel like it'll show up intothe topics that we're talking
about, which is great.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Yeah, it's like I mean, getting older is kind of
it's very sobering.
It's like, okay, I'm gettingolder, I might have like one
more or two more gray hairs,it's like 10, but it's such,
it's such an honor to get olderand be able to reflect on where
(06:19):
you were 10 years ago to whereyou are now, of course, and it's
like it's just incredible, likeI mean just growing up and
maturing and it's not linear,it's just it kind of is what it
is and you really you have toembrace that and I just, you
(06:41):
know, I remember being 25 and Icouldn't, I couldn't imagine
doing the things that I'm doingnow, like being a mom.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
I remember, like at 18, I was like I thought 30 was
like 80.
Like I thought it was so oldand I was I'm going to have my
like.
You have to have your lifetogether by 30.
I am 38.
Yes, 38, 38 and a half, and I'mlike I literally don't have my
life anywhere near together.
I can only tell my 18-year-oldself that this is what you have
(07:11):
to look forward to, yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:15):
Yeah, but you have a little bit more together than
I'm sure you did at 18.
Oh, 1,000% yeah 100%.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But when I was 18, you guys can attest when you're
18, you think 30 is like so faraway, which it is.
It's like 12 years, but like 12years isn't that long.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Like the older you get you're like oh, 12 years ago
I was this age, but it's justlike you just think that 30 is
so old and it's like you made itI think that's what I'm
realizing as I get older too isjust like how fast time flies,
like this year is all hiking ourparents would talk about, like
how fast time is.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
I'm like, oh, you know, blah, blah, blah.
But now I'm like like thatquote that you sent me, sure?
It's like how are we alreadyfive months into a year that
started two weeks ago?
Yeah, like it's already the endof May.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
I think it's like seeing something that, like you
saw start from scratch.
You know what I mean, like akid like that definitely puts
time in perspective.
It just makes you realize likeit doesn't seem like much time
has passed, and then you look atthem and they're five inches
taller and it's like oh yeah,it's been years.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
It's crazy.
Now we know, because our dadalways talks about like how
quickly he grew up and he like,literally he has like the best
memory of like when we wereyounger and like when he was
younger too, and it's just likehe.
I'm like oh time flies.
He was like who are you telling?
He's like I remember when youguys were like this age and that
age, and now he's a grandpa.
It's just like, it's wild andit's what you were saying,
michelle.
It's like very sobering, like tojust watch your kids grow up
(08:51):
and you're like, wow, this ishow our parents felt, like my
kids are going to be.
My youngest is going to be threeand two weeks I literally feel
like I just drove to thehospital on his birthday and was
prepared to get cut open andhave him yeah yep yep mine yeah,
my oldest is going to be in twomonths and I feel like I just
(09:14):
drove to the hospital that dayas well, because I had my water
broke and I didn't know it and Iwas bleeding and I was like
that was six years ago, almostsix years ago it's crazy, it's
so crazy and I think you knowseeing life through their eyes
is really like oh, it's wild,it's incredible and it's just
(09:34):
like it's.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
It's the coolest thing.
I can't I can't put a properspin on it, but it's just.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
You know, you're watching them learn something
new every day and yeah, oh, it'sso fascinating and everything
is like like I'm very sarcastic,but I forget that kids are so
literal and like I used to belike oh, I'm going to, like I
went to the moon, like I'mkidding, my oldest was like I
don't want you to go to the moon.
I was like what are you talkingabout?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
but like to him it's like real and I'm like oh right
yes it's just, it's crazy thiswas a great intro um you're way
off topic.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
No, I love it.
No, it's not.
I don't think I think it tieson.
It's not?
I don't think I think it tiesin.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
It's very on brand.
I'm going to just shift us backto the.
Would you rather real quick?
Me too, okay.
Would you rather lose yoursight or your memories?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Oh, I would say like, because I feel like memory,
like I don't know, like all to.
The older I get, the more Ilike cling on to memories and
like remember things and I'mlike I wish it could go back to
like this time and like Iremember certain memories like
(11:05):
so vividly, so I feel like sight.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
I, I, I feel like memory because, okay, you can
create new memories with sightthat's a good point oh yeah,
that's where.
That's where I'm at no, that'sfair reason.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
I know, I don't know.
I think I don't know, I thinksight, I'm just gonna go with my
gut and say sight, I don't havean explanation.
That was a hard one.
Okay, wait, all right, would?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
you rather be chronically underdressed or
overdressed?
For sure underdressed, because,well, I've been really like
doing up my wardrobe lately.
I've been like caring moreabout what I look like now when
I go to work.
But there's nothing morecomforting than coming home and
whipping off that bra andgetting into my pajamas.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
And.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
I will say I went to the grocery store last Sunday
with my oldest to go like alittle bit of grocery shopping
and I literally only wore shortsand a shirt and shoes, like
nothing underneath, because Ijust did not care.
Yeah, just didn't care I waslike I'm not putting underwear
on for this.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
I can't, I can't listen, sometimes you just gotta
let it let it go.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
I feel like I'm chronically underdressed,
because I feel like I have thosedays and I just don't care.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Oh, that's fair.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
I'm getting better.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
I think probably underdressed.
I don't love clothes.
Yeah, I don't like.
I just find them toorestricting.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
so they are, and I feel like for me, if I'm
overdressed, I feel like I'msnooty, Like I'm the snooty one
in the room, Like I didn't getthe memo.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, I'm going to pick underdressed too, too, just
because I'd rather becomfortable than like
presentable.
Um, all right, last one.
This is interesting as an a momparent, would you rather
oversleep every day for a weekor not get any sleep at all for
(13:44):
four days?
Speaker 3 (13:46):
oh, you're gonna have to say not get sleep for four
days because I've been there,yeah yeah multiple times I think
oversleeping I would wake up inpanic because I've missed all
the things I need to do and likeI would just start off the
morning anxious, becauseoversleeping for me could be
like 7 or 7, 3030.
And we know this as moms andI'm like my child.
(14:07):
My children are already askingto eat and I'm like I'm usually
like up at 6 or whatever, wakeup at 6.
Give me like an hour to likedecompress.
If I wake up at 7.30, they'rewanting breakfast, like now.
I'm like I have to get myselftogether.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
No, like who knows what they've gotten into.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Right, that too, because I feel like that's been
for four days.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (14:27):
Which is we've been there.
It sucks, but we somehowmiraculously bounced back.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, somehow Awful, yeah.
Yeah, I think that felt prettyunanimous yeah.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
I think yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
That's a good ending one.
What's our topic today?
Speaker 3 (14:50):
Our topic today is friendship in the trenches and
just friendships in differentseasons of our lives.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Did you guys have any friendships that changed from
like before kids to after kids,friends that maybe you knew
before you had kids?
Like, did your friendshipschange For sure, what does that
look like now?
Because I feel like a lot of itis normalizing it, because,
(15:25):
like it's- a tough adjustment.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Well, sure you know my core group of friends from
home um.
I have my core group of friends.
There's four of us, three girlsand a guy um, and we were
friends since like one sincelike fourth grade and then like
eighth grade and maybe sixthgrade, but like since we were
like little and like we all livein different different
(15:47):
countries, different cities.
Now two out of the four havekids.
I'm one of the two.
Um, we still like, send eachother like memes and dms on
instagram and like we still text, but like we haven't seen each
other in like actual years andsometimes like makes me sad
because I'll get nostalgic whenwe go home.
I'm like, oh, we used to do this, but like I just text one of my
(16:10):
best friend out of that groupor they're all my best friends,
but you know the one from fourthgrade like a song from like
when we were growing up and Idon't know it just feels like
that's changed and just likewe'll text each other back like
when we can and it just likedoesn't feel the same.
But I don't, not that I don'tfeel sad because I am sad
because like time just naturallychanges.
(16:31):
But like I understand, like wegot older and just things
naturally shift and it just liketakes more effort to stay in
contact.
But we're the type where, like,we can pick off what we left
off and like nothing's changed.
Yeah, but, um, but shannon, whowe've known since, like before
we were born, we have periodswhere we like aren't in contact,
(16:57):
not because like anything wrong, it's just life.
But we actually saw her when wewere in town and I had to give
her a heads up because she'salso a mom.
But our dads have been bestfriends since first grade, so
like our families know eachother.
But it's literally like no timehas passed, like she still
looks the same and it's justlike our kids finally met and
(17:19):
like we call her our cousin andthat's we used to call each
other, like when we were growingup.
She went to the same school, ohyeah um, yeah, that's what we
used to call each other, likewhen we were growing up we went
to the same schools, but um,yeah, that's.
I mean, that's nothing, it hasthey have.
It has changed.
And it makes me sad sometimesbecause I'm like I remember life
when we didn't have kids, orlike when we weren't old and
working nine to five.
(17:39):
But and how I see people onInstagram like doing like friend
reunions and stuff.
Like I know it's Instagram, soit's like curated, but those are
the times like I miss them toono, I get that yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
I think there's something to be said about those
friendships, though, where youcan just pick up and you know
right back where you you startedfrom and you know they've seen
every version of you, yes, andthey have continued to stay
they're choosing to stay, yeahyeah, they're choosing to stay
(18:19):
um, sometimes, you know, undertheir will, but um right, they
just know too much.
You can't leave exactly it'sjust so you know they, they've
watched you grow and grow up andthe fact that you know I I
still have a friend who we'vebeen friends since first grade I
(18:43):
love that yeah, we don't, youknow, we don't talk every day,
but anytime I, I you know, I'llhave a thought about her and
I'll text her and it's just likeyep, we're still seven.
Yeah, yeah, you know, and we've,you know, we grew up together,
we went to high school together,we went to college.
Oh cool, we had kids around thesame time and it's just love
(19:08):
that it's.
It's such a testament to whatfriendship can be.
Yeah, that, you know you, youjust you have to smile when you
think about it.
And I've had reverse umfriendships where we were so
close yeah then you know youhave kids and suddenly you don't
(19:36):
fit in their lives anymore yeahyeah, and it's sad but it it's,
you know it's.
It's part of the growth processtoo yeah, no, I agree.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
I think that it's interesting because I feel like
I've collected friends from likevery core age groups.
I would say Like I have thefriends that I grew up with like
from scratch.
And then, like I have a friendthat we kind of all like
accumulated together as a corememory kind of.
(20:11):
And then I've got my group fromcollege and like from there
we've all just kind of grown uptogether and even my college
friends at this point we'veknown each other for Jesus 12
years, 13 years.
That's insane.
Used to feel not great abouthaving like a small circle, but
(20:37):
I'm realizing how much thatmeans because of a lot of what
you guys mentioned.
Like they see you througheverything, they follow with you
through all the differentmilestones, like you see all
their milestones.
yeah, it's just cool to kind ofgrow and stretch and be able to
pivot and adjust with a group ofpeople and know that they will
(20:59):
be there kind of regardless,even though it might look
different.
So, yeah, it's a lot of texting, group chats, memes and, yeah,
like facetime so we can yeah,well, and I I think about our
friendship Like we met when youwere 17.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Yeah, oh my God, it's been that long.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
It's been that long, that's been 14 years.
That's crazy.
Yeah, I met Sheree when she was17.
And you know you weregraduating high school.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Oh my God.
And like you know, in you werein the trenches, like I was in a
different set of trenchesdealing with all kinds of stuff.
Yes, and then we lost touch andthen it was like, I don't know,
out of the blue you were havingsage and I was like you know,
hey, how are you?
(21:54):
And then it just like we pickedup where we left off.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
I was like, oh my god wait, you also had a baby.
You know how this like.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Please walk me through this yeah, so we just,
you know I, we found each otherat a certain point in our lives,
um, and then we rediscoveredeach other like yeah, you know
that's so beautiful.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
I love that, yeah and then I've met like a few few of
my friends.
Now I met through shereebecause, um, she's like, oh, I
think you would like like myfriend, and she's like, oh, I
think you would like my sister,and I just think that's also
like a testament like to us assisters.
It's like, oh, I think youwould like my sister, and I just
think that's also like atestament like to us as sisters.
It's like we talk about eachother, I talk about you to my
friends Also, like vice versa,and like so far, your track
(22:44):
record has been spot on.
Like I love Michelle, like wesend each other memes every
single day and that's just ourlove language.
And I can't imagine like nothaving ever met her.
Like I feel like she's been myfriend for like ever.
Yeah, we relate on so manylevels and it's like I just
(23:08):
think that's a testament to likeall of us too.
And also what you were sayingabout how your friends show up,
but it looks different.
It's like when you're younger.
You like from first grade,michelle.
It's's like I'm sure you guysimagine like doing everything
together, like past the age ofseven, and like having kids.
It's like you would plan yourkids and your wedding, but like
not realizing that they maybewon't be there like the way that
you thought they would be.
(23:29):
Yeah, like I was in my bestfriend's wedding and like, um, I
obviously wasn't there for thebirth of her kids and she wasn't
here for mine.
Because it's like life it justhappens like it doesn't happen
like it does in the movies andit's like when you're little,
like you don't account for life.
it's like oh wait, like theymaybe won't be able to like,
come to your baby shower or likethey're not always gonna live
(23:51):
five minutes up.
Yeah, yeah and it's like youcan't wrap your head around that
when you're younger because youjust refuse to accept anything
else, but like when you're olderand you're starting to get
older, like it's hard to accept.
Or then you're like, oh, thisis like how life is.
It's like I feel like it'seasier for us to keep in contact
nowadays versus like when ourparents are our age, because we
have social media and liketexting and like all that so I
(24:14):
just feel like at least for me,I've like accepted that, like if
I feel like all that sucks,like you see things on like the
movies and tv.
It's like all your friends areat your wedding and like you
know they come to your baby'sbirthday parties, and it's like
sometimes your, your friends,maybe will not meet your kids
until they're older, but itdoesn't mean they don't know
about them yeah, it's just likeit's just wild, it's just I
(24:39):
think it's humbling also but itjust makes you realize that when
you're younger, your mindset isso different because you don't
know anything other than likewhat you have known for the past
, like x amount of years, likeyou can't think past that in the
sense of like you, where youthink that it's that it's not
going to be different one day.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Yeah, I definitely think that, um, like meeting
friends and motherhood or likereconnecting with friends and
motherhood, like it speedsthings up.
You know how they say.
Like you know like quarantinerelationships where like
everything was set up becauseyou just it's like hyper focused
, you're like in this littlebubble.
(25:21):
Motherhood kind of feels likethat, because the friendships
that like I was just talkingwith son about this this morning
, I was like it feels like I've.
We were saying it feels likewe've known each other forever,
but it's been maybe two and ahalf years, like just since our
kids have been here.
But because of the things thatwe talk about and go through and
like connect a lot more often,just like, hey, how you like,
(25:47):
are you still good over there?
Like what's going on?
It I don't know.
I think it just like expeditesthe process.
And that was one of my mainthings going into having sage.
I was like I just want my, likeI want a friend village, I want
my community.
I was very scared of beingisolated and not having people
that I felt connected to and I.
(26:08):
That I feel like, is somethinglike I'm very proud of.
I have a very, very lovelycommunity of mom friends, and
that's not something that I takefor granted.
It's very important.
Speaker 4 (26:20):
Yeah, I think you develop, especially becoming a
mom.
You just develop these deeperconnections with people.
Yeah, because you've beenthrough the same thing.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Yeah.
And you also don't have timefor bullshit anymore, so you're
like, I don't have time for thisanymore.
So you're like, please, yeah,it's like I don't have time for
this.
If you don't understand that,like I can't come because I have
kids, then obviously we're notgoing to be friends yeah I don't
have.
I literally have no time in myday to sit here and be sad about
this yeah, and you know, like,have I used to get very upset?
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Well, maybe I still do get a little upset, but, like
you know friends that I have,like I have one friend in
particular who carried methrough like the darkest moments
of my life and now we barelytalk and you know I'll text her
(27:18):
and I don't hear anything.
Oh yeah, and I get, I got.
You know, I used to get upsetand I'm like, but my time is my
time's worth it.
Like I'm so busy.
There are days like I don't eat, like I don't even remember to
eat some days.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
Yeah, oh wait, it's like five o'clock and I have.
You know, I eat chips all day.
Yeah, yeah, and it's like whenI'm thinking about you.
I want to let you know that I'mthinking about you because A
you are important, my time isimportant and I'm making you a
priority.
Yeah, and if you can't make mea priority, then you know, our
(28:03):
friendship has changed and it'sevolved, and it wasn't where it
it does.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I mean, I think it's so hard because, yes, been there
, it's been there and like Ialso get upset about it still,
because it's hard not to feelFlighted, yeah, or like just the
one-sided dynamic that I think,just yeah, can be a little
triggering and I think, man, Idon't know, I think remembering
(28:34):
that you just you don't alwaysknow what's going on has been
really helpful for me.
And like not taking thingspersonally and kind of meeting
your friends where they are,because if you've been friends
with these people for years five, 10, 15, 20, like however many
years like you're growing andyou're changing, so it's like
(28:56):
learning new friends, kind of,and like how to show up and
engage with these people as youchange too.
So it's, it's a balancing act.
I don't know it's interesting,but I think that it's worth.
I think it's worth it.
I can't imagine not having,like people that I check in with
(29:17):
and just have that spaceoutside of family.
Yeah, um, yeah.
So that is something that I notin a sexist way, but like I'm,
kind I'm, I love being a girlbecause it feels like a lot more
, like it's easier, maybe morenatural for, like the female
(29:40):
relationships, because like alot of the relationships that I
notice with males.
It's like it's hard for them togo deep sometimes or maybe,
like I don't know like thecommunication piece, maybe it
just looks different than whatI'm used to.
I'm not saying they can't do it, they do it in their own way,
different than what I'm used to.
I'm not saying they can't do it, they do it in their own way.
(30:03):
But this video popped up for meon Facebook.
That was like I had my husbandcall all his friends and say
goodnight and it's going viralon TikTok.
So he just calls his friend andhe's like hey, what's up?
He's like nothing, man.
He's like, hey, we're justcalling to say goodnight.
He's like why, why?
And it's just this montage ofall these people recreating it.
I'm like I've definitely textedpeople goodnight and it's like
(30:23):
goodnight, love you.
Like goodnight, love you too.
Like why is that weird?
So I just am very grateful thatit is a natural thing for us.
It doesn't feel like somethingyou have to question or second
guess or like you can't beyourself all the time and I
don't know.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
I feel like a lot of my male relationships are like
based on, like joking, oh mygosh, yes, because that's how we
connect, but, like my femalefriends, it's like we go deep
yeah, but like I appreciate that, but it's just funny and then
it's like I have you for jokingand I have you for talking about
like stuff that might be tootmi for the males yeah but, um,
(31:04):
this is kind of tying into, likemy next thing, but I have a
crazy observation tree.
Tell me if I'm wrong but, I'venoticed that you not seek out
but like you're friends withpeople who are like around my
age, and I don't know if that'sbecause, like you're used to
having me as like a sister.
But on the other end, I amfriends with people that are
(31:29):
like in your age group, like I,like gravitate towards that,
like at work, I have a lot offriends that are like in your
age group or younger and I feellike it's just like a natural
mentoring thing for me and Ifeel like I don't really connect
with like older people notconnect.
But I feel like I gravitate moretowards like younger people,
(31:50):
maybe because it's like I wantto be young, keep my youth, but
also probably because I'm likeused to being like the oldest
yeah, the older sister, like theolder cousin, I don't know.
I just like I have like moreconnections with them and like I
learned from them.
But I'm just like I justnoticed that because Michelle
and son are like in my age group.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
I know.
I mean, marina was too, I think.
Yeah, that's um something thatI've also noticed, and I think,
partly because I've always beenlike I'm like an old soul, I
feel like I've always been alittle bit ahead of my time.
So I connect with older peoplein general, like even yeah,
quote the adults like we're alladults, right, but you know, the
(32:30):
adults that were adults when wewere kids, like I just have a
way, I don't know, I feelcomfortable with them and even
like my Zumba.
It's like, you know, like olderladies, but like I love it.
I don't know why, but like Ialso connect really well with
kids so I can shape, shift.
(32:51):
It's the Gemini and me, I guessI feel like I can too.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
I mean, I can not that I can be friends with
anybody, because I absolutelycannot, but I can like talk to
anybody and make it seem likeI'm friends with you.
That sounds really bad, comingoff like that, but I just feel
like I can, like I don't know,but like I love my work friends.
A few are my age and a few arelike a lot younger, like 1990s,
(33:21):
and I'm like whoa, like you'refreaking a baby and then I'm
like oh yeah, like my sister's1994, so like I forget that
frequently.
But so I feel like maybe that'swhy I'm like I can connect with
them easier, and also justbecause their cousins are
younger than me, I'm just usedto being the oldest in the room,
fair and.
(33:42):
I just didn't realize thatuntil like now what have you
noticed, michelle?
Speaker 2 (33:48):
do you tend to gravitate towards group or
personality type?
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Um, I don't know.
I think I tend to gravitate alittle more towards like older
people.
Maybe Okay, like older than usyeah, but I also feel like I get
along with everybody I can seethat I just I, I don't know like
(34:25):
I I will talk to anybody.
I don't care how old you are orcolor, creed, whatever if
you're a person, if you'rebreathing, I'm speaking to you
yeah like I will.
I'm like that mom at theplayground that, like I will
talk to you and you'll probably,you know, like you know, walk
(34:49):
away a little bit.
You know, tiptoe, I have to goget my kids yeah, you don't have
kids, you're just like, I'mjust like I'll talk to anybody,
um, and it's funny because, likenow that my son's in school, um
, and I'm watching him makefriends yeah, it's wild, it is.
(35:12):
It is pure love.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
No, and they do?
Speaker 3 (35:17):
They're obsessed with each other?
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
The hugs they love hugging.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
They love hugging, it doesn't matter.
The other day we were at thepark and my son this was just
like it was such a beautifulmoment.
He was an adult, he was in awheelchair and my son was like
fascinated and I said, why don'tyou go talk to him?
(35:42):
And he walked up to this manwho was so, so nice and, just
like my son, was like how manywheels do you have?
And he was just like I have two.
Like you want to see them.
And it was just like he wasn'tafraid.
There was nothing, like hedidn't have any preconceived
(36:03):
notions, he didn't have anything.
Yeah, he just thought thisguy's wheelchair was really cool
, yeah, and that's like what hewent with and like, how cool is
that?
like, how you know, when you seethat in your kids and you're
like you know, I mean, I was alittle bit like not fearful, but
(36:24):
I was like how is he going toapproach this?
What is he going to do withthis?
And he did exactly what willdoes he just everybody and, like
you know, wants to be friendswith everybody.
So, you know, I, it was just,it was a really pure and
beautiful moment and it was justlike you know, he didn't.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
I love that he didn't see anything different like,
which also makes me sad, becauseI'm like, wow, like we used to
be like that.
And then the world, you know,society, was just like, well,
we're gonna change that for you.
And just like, and like myoldest like literally will like
(37:11):
tell me every little thing abouthis friends, like oh, so-and-so
came in with the glasses todaybecause he also has glasses.
I'm like, oh, that's like,that's awesome.
But it's like those littlethings they notice and like that
they feel the need to tell youis just so like pure to me, and
it's just like it's sofascinating and also kind of sad
(37:32):
.
It's like, okay, it's like whatage should we lose that?
And like, how come we can'tjust like get that back?
And it's just like it makes meso sad when, like you hear about
kids going through things thatkids should not go through, or
like see things they shouldn'tsee.
Because once you lose that kidsense you do, you cannot get it
back.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
I mean even to the point where, like when I found
out that RJ had to get glassesfound out like he's my kid.
But, like you know, my firstthought is like no one better
make fun of him, like.
I swear to god if anybody makesfun of his glasses because you
know how shitty kids can beauntie.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Riri was coming for them yeah but that was my first
thought.
She was like, oh my gosh, I washoping to make fun of him.
I was like, oh gosh, but he hasno problem wearing them.
Like no one like he, everyonelike loves it.
But that was my first thoughtand it's because we know how
shitty kids can be and we knowthat it's their parents and we
(38:33):
know, I'm like kids are, aremean, they're so mean.
And when I hear that likesomeone wouldn't let him play
with something like at school,I'm just like, oh, really like
that makes me like I have tolike take a moment and like
shift, because I'm like, as amom, I'm like, oh, like, who's
this kid?
Let me go find him but also.
I'm like it's okay, buddy.
(38:54):
Like buddy, we were at a playplace one time and he, so brave,
asked everyone that he saw toplay with him and they said no.
And I'm like, why the fuck didthey say no Whatever, for
whatever reason?
And he was so sad and he wascrying.
He said I want to leave.
No one's playing with me.
He didn't want to play with hisbrother.
And then the next time he wentto a play place, he, I guess,
(39:18):
forgot about that.
He asked everybody or like justdidn't let it bother him, and
asked everybody again at adifferent play place and people
told him, yes, he was so excited.
And then I like told him that,like, that was so brave of him
to like try again.
And I was just like I wanted tomake sure.
I like said that because I feellike as adults, the minute I get
(39:41):
rejected, I'm like I'm nevershowing my face again, thank you
.
And it's like kids are soresilient and we went to the
parks at one time.
He was so excited that thesetwo kids were like playing with
him.
It's like, wait a second, whereare you going?
Like you need to tell us whereyou're going.
But he was just so stoked andI'm like I like sat there and
watched him ask them to play andI was like watching his brother
(40:04):
and also I was like, oh my god,please say yes.
I was like I can't handle a noand they said yes.
I was like, oh, like what'dthey say?
He's like, oh, they said yes,I'm like, oh, of course they did
go play but like, what doesthat say about you as a mom?
Speaker 4 (40:20):
because you trusted him enough to continue to ask do
you want to play with me?
And, yeah, rejected the firsttime and you didn't say to him
like, oh, you shouldn't do thatagain, because you know people
are just going to reject you.
Speaker 3 (40:38):
You trusted him enough yeah you, you know, you,
you see everything in your kid,every great oh yeah and you,
just, you just went with it, andyou know it's so hard to watch
them be rejected oh, my god,yeah, oh my god, I was literally
like holding my breath and hewas asking them and I was like,
(41:00):
oh, at the end they like left orwhatever to get ice cream and
they just ended up leaving.
I was like, did you catch theirnames?
He goes.
No.
I was like you know what?
That's fine.
You played with them.
Like it doesn like of coursethey're gonna say yes if you're
awesome, like hello, but likeanytime you think, oh, someone
(41:21):
didn't want to play.
I think you know what bud, likeit's okay, like I tried to like
not say kids are shitty andthey should play with you always
, but that's not the case.
It's like kids are mean, adultsare mean, for whatever reason,
and you will get left outsometimes and it's awful to
watch.
Yeah, because you know how itfeels and kids don't understand.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
Yeah, to get through it.
Yeah, yes, you know it hurtsyeah.
And it, you know, it developswho you are, because you take,
you know, these moments of hurtand you can, either, you know
you can rise from it or you can,you know, fall, and you know he
(42:03):
took that moment to to rise,you know, and just say, well,
let me try it again the next dayyeah, that's just, it's awesome
to watch them, but it's alsolike you know how the world is
and like you, just it's so crueland even like other parents are
(42:23):
cruel, and I'm like that'sunnecessary, like for a kid.
Speaker 3 (42:27):
And I always feel for the moms that are moms of kids
who have disabilities, becauseit's like I can't even like
imagine what they're goingthrough, not because the kid has
a disability, because like itdoesn't matter, but it matters
because people are so mean andthey will take that and like,
use it in a cruel way, and youknow that and you know that,
(42:51):
like, your kid may notunderstand why someone doesn't
want to talk to them and it'sjust like, but he's great, who
cares if he can't do xyz or heor she?
and it just breaks my like,absolutely breaks my mom heart.
I swear to god, having kidsliterally broke me in half, like
shattered my heart and likerebuilt it.
(43:11):
But it's just like.
It makes me so sad and I thinkI get.
I get sad for, like, the kidsbecause I'm like the world is so
mean, like we unfortunatelyknow what's going to happen,
they're going to get made fun of.
And for, like, there's noreason for them to get made fun
of, obviously, but it's justwhat it is and it's horrific,
it's awful yeah yeah, and it'slike you, as a parent, know how
(43:35):
amazing your kid is, whetherthey have a disability or not,
who cares?
Like they're your kid, you lovethem no matter what.
But then, like you, are sadbecause you know how mean
everybody is.
Speaker 4 (43:47):
Yeah, it's.
It's funny you kind of bringthat up because somebody asked
me, so I had kids.
I was almost 35 when I had Will, so in medical you know
terminology.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Oh, you're a geriatric patient.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
Yeah, so when I had I forget what it's called, the, I
don't know the genetic testingdone.
Speaker 3 (44:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:13):
I had it done because you know there's a little bit
more.
It's a little more common forsome genetic, you know things,
abnormality, and I forget who.
It was asked me like, well, whywould you do that?
Like, if you know, like, whatare you going to do?
(44:35):
And I was like what do you mean, what am I going to do?
Like if you know, like, whatare you going to do?
And I was like what do you mean, what am I going to do?
Like, I'm going to find out,and if there is a problem, like
it's my child, I'm going to yeah, and if there's resources that
I need, You're going to findthem.
That's the only reason why Iwould get it done is because I
can prepare just a little bit.
(44:55):
Yeah, I like that approach.
Yeah, that's the only reasonI'm like they're, they're my
child, it doesn't matter no,like it doesn't matter of course
you
Speaker 3 (45:07):
want.
You want and pray for healthykids, obviously, but sometimes
it doesn't work out like thatand you deal with it and it's
like.
That's why I just like adorethe parents who have children's
disabilities, because it's likethey are forever advocating for
their kids, forever findingresources, and like they are the
(45:28):
reason their kids are like likethriving, because it's like
they're doing it for their kids.
Yeah, like they're finding allthe resources.
Like your kids autistic, it'slike there's so many resources.
Or like, if they have like, aphysical disability, it's like
they wouldn't have known aboutany of these resources if they
didn't have a child with adisability.
And like that alone.
(45:49):
Also, like you form amazingrelationships to people who are
in the same position as you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah it's like adifferent kind of trenches yeah,
yeah, my nephew.
Speaker 4 (46:04):
He has a very rare genetic disorder.
Um like 100 people in the worldhave it and wow, um, it's very
it.
Basically his body can'tprocess essential fats.
So my sister, you know, shewent on basically like this
(46:25):
crusade to get him what heneeded.
She has fought insurancecompanies and she has friends
from all over the world.
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, and I love that together.
I love that.
We just found, like they found,light in a dark place.
(46:46):
You know it's like motherhoodis hard.
And then when you add otherelements to that, yep, you feel
so alone.
And then when you have somebodywho's like I know exactly what
you're going through and it'slike it's the best thing in the
world yeah, and then alsoparents of kids that, like,
(47:08):
spent time in the NICU afterthey were born.
Speaker 3 (47:10):
That's like a whole nother community that can be
formed.
So it's like that's a wholenother on top of just having a
kid.
Now they're in the NICU for Xamount of months for whatever
reason, and it's like that's ontop of all of that.
It's like you have to deal withthat and maybe lifelong things
after that or maybe not, like no, but it's like you have a whole
(47:33):
community of people who arelike I know what you're going
through.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (47:42):
Yeah.
Very important, you don't haveto say anything.
It's like yeah.
You know, you see somebody inthe grocery store and their kid
is having a meltdown and I lookat them and I'm just like you're
okay.
Gonna pass Like like like mykids had one yesterday, like I
(48:04):
know what.
You're going to stand there andbe like, oh my goodness, you
need to control your childalthough before kids that was me
and.
Speaker 3 (48:11):
I'm ashamed to admit that, but like the older I get,
the more I'm like it was okay,like you didn't have kids 20 you
didn't know.
Now I know and I'm like I can'tbelieve I was ever like control
your kid, because also,sometimes kids in the store when
they're having tantrums arebecause of like, like a
neurodiversion or like there'snot something wrong with them,
but like they have a disability.
(48:32):
It's like sometimes, thingsthat are out of their control.
It's not because they can't getcandy, it's because they maybe
cannot control something.
Yeah, and it's like the mom wasshe needed to go to the store,
she needed to bring her kid.
It's like she had you have todo what you have to do and she
was like taking the risk, likein her mind, to like he might
(48:52):
have a tantrum because he'soverstimulated, or like it seems
like a tantrum, but it's likewe need to get food and you
can't stay home by yourself andthere's no one to watch you yeah
I just feel like moms just takerisks every day oh yeah, waking
up sometimes is a risk
Speaker 2 (49:14):
yeah, you don't know what.
You don't know what the day isgonna bring.
Speaker 4 (49:17):
Not at all not at all and I, there's a crap shoot
every day.
Oh, absolutely.
But when you have people thatyou know, they just have this
unspoken understanding of youknow exactly what you're going
through and it's so comfortingbecause motherhood is very
(49:40):
lonely.
Yeah, it is, it's you know,especially like those first
three months where it's oh andyou're thrown into, like I mean
talk about trial by fire throwninto, like I mean, talk about
(50:04):
trial by fire.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Yeah, like no man, you will like take this kid home
and keep him alive.
Speaker 2 (50:06):
Okay, I'll try my best.
No, it feels like a fever dream.
It feels like like I don't knowhow we got through that kind of
it's odd, because you're likehow to get through?
Speaker 3 (50:19):
but you're like I want to do it again.
But I know like I got throughit, but also like I'm done, but
I just told my conversation, butalso it's like, wow, it seems
so long ago and it's like,especially for me, with those
times I'm like this is nevergonna end.
I, I'm never going to be ableto like not have to deal with
(50:40):
this.
But here we are and it's justit's like a testament to like
what moms go through and what welike get through.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, and definitely could not do it without our
community.
So grateful for that andgrateful for I don't know, just
friendship and adult time andand I like what you said earlier
.
Speaker 3 (51:04):
Sure, about normalizing things.
Yeah, because I'm sure there'salso other communities like that
we don't know about, like formoms with children with
disabilities.
I'm sure they text each otherat 2 am because of something and
it's just like I love thatthere are those communities out
(51:27):
there for that and even it eventakes like one mom to like start
it.
Yeah, and I love that they havelike those 2 am people who are
like you know, he'soverstimulated.
To him it's just like same,like my kid too, like let's, we
can do this together or whateverthe reason might be, but like
(51:50):
oh, he has another doctor'sappointment tomorrow and it's
like that's like a whole notherworld.
And I always feel for thosemoms.
Speaker 4 (51:56):
I just want to hug them, yeah yeah, and it's like
motherhood is hard enough, ohyeah absolutely, and you know,
you don't know how hard it isuntil you do it, and it's not
like a one and done.
It's hard, it's every daythere's something a little bit
different.
(52:19):
But just having those, you know,having those relationships
where you can just be completelyhonest and oh yeah, you know
there there are some days, likeespecially in the beginning,
where I'm just like I can't dothis.
Yeah, I just like I I don'tknow how I'm going to do this.
(52:39):
Like I remember breastfeedingit was like oh Lord, so hard and
it was such like just a kick inthe pants, because I'm like, am
I doing it right?
He's this, that and the otherthing.
And I found out like he wastongue-tied so he couldn't match
.
Speaker 3 (53:00):
It wasn't even or his fault, it's like and you know
you just everybody's like.
Speaker 4 (53:06):
Oh, breastfeeding is so natural, it is when
everything goes right yeah youknow it's like here, fly this
plane.
You have never been to flightschool.
Speaker 3 (53:18):
Never.
Speaker 4 (53:19):
At a manual.
Speaker 3 (53:20):
But fly the plane.
I've never taken a vehicle offthe ground.
Yeah, I don't think.
Speaker 2 (53:28):
I could.
Speaker 3 (53:28):
No, I think I could.
I love this conversation.
This is amazing.
Yes, I feel like we should havelike a part two down the line.
There were so many things thatI thought about, but we're moms
and it's friday and it's late,so we're gonna have to white
laws that need to be drank soand sleep.
That need to be, that needs tobe had I love this though.
Speaker 2 (53:52):
Michelle please keep coming back.
We love talking to you.
Please keep having me back.
I love talking to you, pleasekeep having me back.
Speaker 4 (53:57):
I love this.
Speaker 3 (53:58):
Yes, and of course next summer in Jersey.
We'll let you know, michelle.
Yes, appreciate that.
Thank you for fitting in.
Feel free to call us out again,I don't mind.
Speaker 4 (54:08):
Oh well.
I will 100% continue to callyou out on it.
Speaker 2 (54:14):
Thank you, I'll never let it down.
Speaker 3 (54:17):
Thanks, guys, guys for listening and like listening
to school.
And thanks for being on again,michelle.
We love you.
Speaker 4 (54:26):
Yes love you, guys, love you.
And uh, yeah, I'm gonna gofinish some ice cream.
So, yes, enjoy it.
Oh well, my kids are asleep, myhusband's not home please, you
gotta go girl amazing talk toyou soon.
Speaker 2 (54:46):
Like listen, subscribe and review bye ladies,
bye all right everyone.
This was another episode ofturn the page podcast.
Speaker 1 (55:00):
Thanks, for hanging out.
Don't forget to like, listenand subscribe, and also don't
forget to leave a review, please, and let us know what you
thought about today's episodeand all the other episodes.
Thanks, guys, talk to you soon.
Bye.
Welcome to Turn the Page.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Podcast Sisters best friends and brunch enthusiasts.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
With relatable episodes that feel like you're
chatting with two of yourclosest friends or sisters.
Join us as we turn the page todifferent topics about losing
yourself in motherhood,adulthood, anyhood.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And finding yourself again through meaningful
friendships.
Shameless piles of unreadlibrary books and endless Amazon
package deliveries Real, honestand a little bit chaotic we
talk about it all.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
So grab your favorite drink, put the kids to bed,
lace up your sneaks or whateveryou need to do, and join us.
We can't wait to connect withyou.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Can't wait to connect with you.
Hi guys, Welcome to Turn thePage podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
I am your co-host Tawana Page.
I'm your other co-host, cheriePage-Farber.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
And we have a return guest, michelle.
Remind me again, monastra,monastra, thank you, I'm so
horrible with names.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
I'm so sorry.
Monastra, monastra.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Thank you, I'm so horrible with names.
I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4 (01:07):
It's okay.
I can't tell you how manydifferent versions of that I get
on a daily basis.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Oh, I understand, that was my first name.
People call me Paige becausethey just give up.
I'm like that's actually not myname, yes, all the time, but
Cherie will tell you.
You, like, it's nothingpersonal, I didn't butcher words
, I butcher names.
Yeah, like, yeah, I just loveyou and you literally just told
me, but I forgot.
Yeah, listen, it's been a longweek.
(01:36):
Yes, it has, but, michelle, Iwanted to give you an update.
Since the last time we spoke,sheree and I have gotten new
tattoos.
Since the last time I did forgetto tell you that yes, yeah, so
I got two hearts on my arm forthe boys oh I got sheree, I have
to tell you a semicolon on theback of my neck because it's the
(01:58):
mental health, one of themental health symbols or signs,
and mommy goes let me see yourtattoos.
So I showed her in the car.
She goes is that a questionmark?
I said no, it's a semicolon.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
You mean like this yes, you have one too.
Yes I do I have one also on theback of my neck.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Ever since I saw natalie portman has attached in
the back of her neck, I justlike fell in love.
I'm in love with her.
But like I fell in love withthat tattoo and I've been like
wanting it for years and Ifinally did and it took two
seconds yes, those are the bestyeah, loved ones are terrible oh
yeah, what are your?
What's your tattoo?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
oh right, um, so it's a north star I'm just gonna say
it's a north star.
That's so pretty thank youbecause the lady at the place,
like she, kept calling it asparkle I was like I don't know
why she keeps calling it it'snot a sparkle um, but there's 12
dots because it's supposed to.
(02:59):
This one's from my dad andthat's like his number, his like
sports and favorite number, sonow I have one for everybody.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Yes oh yeah.
Well, that was a little sidebar, but that's just what we do so
michelle, thank you for comingback.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
Thank you for having me back on a friday for all
three moms.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
I'm not really sure how we did this, but we did it.
The stars aligned yeah they did, and next time we're in Jersey
we have to let you know ahead oftime so that we can plan ahead
of time instead of like todaywe're there.
Hey girl, you're like um at abirthday party, can't?
So?
You know next time we're there,I appreciate that.
(03:41):
Thanks Because I know last timewe were there, you were like
you were in new jersey and youdidn't tell me.
Speaker 4 (03:48):
I was like, oh, my bad girl casual ig stories and
I'm like, oh, you're in newjersey yeah, you're like wait a
second.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
It's just so hard to remember all the things, so many
things now but we going to do athis or that, and then we're
going to Would you rather?
Oh my bad.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Just like.
Speaker 3 (04:13):
Okay, but also let's share the news Someone just had
a birthday.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Oh, yes, I did.
I, just I did.
It was Wednesday we'rediscussing this.
Yes, I did turn 31.
Oh, Wednesday, you turned 31.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
We were discussing this.
Yes, I did turn 31.
Speaker 4 (04:30):
My little baby's growing up.
Yes, Is this a show?
It's just I remember gettingolder, so I'm almost 40.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
Girl we're the same age, I'm pretty sure.
What year are you?
Speaker 4 (04:46):
86.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Girl, me too.
When's your birthday?
Speaker 4 (04:49):
April 18th.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Okay, you're six months older than me.
I'm October.
Oh man Girl it's Sorry,Michelle.
It's getting there.
I mean it's okay, we are themature millennials.
We have a friend who is wellCherie's from it.
She's my friend through Cherie.
She's 1988.
And for Cherie's bacheloretteparty we were the oldest, we
(05:12):
were the only people born in the1980s that were in attendance.
So we were like the moms.
But it was so fun because welike knew everybody.
But we kept saying like we'rethe mature millennials.
Because, millennials starts inlike 81, I think I was like
we're the mature, because I keptsaying like oh, we're the
elders.
She goes no, no, no, we're themature millennials.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
We are, we are, but it's like I don't know what it
is.
The older I get, the more thatI kind of realize that it's
really a privilege to get older.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
I like that.
That's a good segue into whatwe're talking about, Like.
I feel like it'll show up intothe topics that we're talking
about, which is great.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Yeah, it's like I mean, getting older is kind of
it's very sobering.
It's like, okay, I'm gettingolder, I might have like one
more or two more gray hairs,it's like 10, but it's such,
it's such an honor to get olderand be able to reflect on where
(06:19):
you were 10 years ago to whereyou are now, of course, and it's
like it's just incredible, likeI mean just growing up and
maturing and it's not linear,it's just it kind of is what it
is and you really you have toembrace that and I just, you
(06:41):
know, I remember being 25 and Icouldn't, I couldn't imagine
doing the things that I'm doingnow, like being a mom.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
I remember, like at 18, I was like I thought 30 was
like 80.
Like I thought it was so oldand I was I'm going to have my
like.
You have to have your lifetogether by 30.
I am 38.
Yes, 38, 38 and a half, and I'mlike I literally don't have my
life anywhere near together.
I can only tell my 18-year-oldself that this is what you have
(07:11):
to look forward to, yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:15):
Yeah, but you have a little bit more together than
I'm sure you did at 18.
Oh, 1,000% yeah 100%.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But when I was 18, you guys can attest when you're
18, you think 30 is like so faraway, which it is.
It's like 12 years, but like 12years isn't that long.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Like the older you get you're like oh, 12 years ago
I was this age, but it's justlike you just think that 30 is
so old and it's like you made itI think that's what I'm
realizing as I get older too isjust like how fast time flies,
like this year is all hiking ourparents would talk about, like
how fast time is.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
I'm like, oh, you know, blah, blah, blah.
But now I'm like like thatquote that you sent me, sure?
It's like how are we alreadyfive months into a year that
started two weeks ago?
Yeah, like it's already the endof May.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
I think it's like seeing something that, like you
saw start from scratch.
You know what I mean, like akid like that definitely puts
time in perspective.
It just makes you realize likeit doesn't seem like much time
has passed, and then you look atthem and they're five inches
taller and it's like oh yeah,it's been years.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
It's crazy.
Now we know, because our dadalways talks about like how
quickly he grew up and he like,literally he has like the best
memory of like when we wereyounger and like when he was
younger too, and it's just likehe.
I'm like oh time flies.
He was like who are you telling?
He's like I remember when youguys were like this age and that
age, and now he's a grandpa.
It's just like, it's wild andit's what you were saying,
michelle.
It's like very sobering, like tojust watch your kids grow up
(08:51):
and you're like, wow, this ishow our parents felt, like my
kids are going to be.
My youngest is going to be threeand two weeks I literally feel
like I just drove to thehospital on his birthday and was
prepared to get cut open andhave him yeah yep yep mine yeah,
my oldest is going to be in twomonths and I feel like I just
(09:14):
drove to the hospital that dayas well, because I had my water
broke and I didn't know it and Iwas bleeding and I was like
that was six years ago, almostsix years ago it's crazy, it's
so crazy and I think you knowseeing life through their eyes
is really like oh, it's wild,it's incredible and it's just
(09:34):
like it's.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
It's the coolest thing.
I can't I can't put a properspin on it, but it's just.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
You know, you're watching them learn something
new every day and yeah, oh, it'sso fascinating and everything
is like like I'm very sarcastic,but I forget that kids are so
literal and like I used to belike oh, I'm going to, like I
went to the moon, like I'mkidding, my oldest was like I
don't want you to go to the moon.
I was like what are you talkingabout?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
but like to him it's like real and I'm like oh right
yes it's just, it's crazy thiswas a great intro um you're way
off topic.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
No, I love it.
No, it's not.
I don't think I think it tieson.
It's not?
I don't think I think it tiesin.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
It's very on brand.
I'm going to just shift us backto the.
Would you rather real quick?
Me too, okay.
Would you rather lose yoursight or your memories?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Oh, I would say like, because I feel like memory,
like I don't know, like all to.
The older I get, the more Ilike cling on to memories and
like remember things and I'mlike I wish it could go back to
like this time and like Iremember certain memories like
(11:05):
so vividly, so I feel like sight.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
I, I, I feel like memory because, okay, you can
create new memories with sightthat's a good point oh yeah,
that's where.
That's where I'm at no, that'sfair reason.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
I know, I don't know.
I think I don't know, I thinksight, I'm just gonna go with my
gut and say sight, I don't havean explanation.
That was a hard one.
Okay, wait, all right, would?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
you rather be chronically underdressed or
overdressed?
For sure underdressed, because,well, I've been really like
doing up my wardrobe lately.
I've been like caring moreabout what I look like now when
I go to work.
But there's nothing morecomforting than coming home and
whipping off that bra andgetting into my pajamas.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
And.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
I will say I went to the grocery store last Sunday
with my oldest to go like alittle bit of grocery shopping
and I literally only wore shortsand a shirt and shoes, like
nothing underneath, because Ijust did not care.
Yeah, just didn't care I waslike I'm not putting underwear
on for this.
Speaker 4 (12:38):
I can't, I can't listen, sometimes you just gotta
let it let it go.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
I feel like I'm chronically underdressed,
because I feel like I have thosedays and I just don't care.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Oh, that's fair.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
I'm getting better.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
I think probably underdressed.
I don't love clothes.
Yeah, I don't like.
I just find them toorestricting.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
so they are, and I feel like for me, if I'm
overdressed, I feel like I'msnooty, Like I'm the snooty one
in the room, Like I didn't getthe memo.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, I'm going to pick underdressed too, too, just
because I'd rather becomfortable than like
presentable.
Um, all right, last one.
This is interesting as an a momparent, would you rather
oversleep every day for a weekor not get any sleep at all for
(13:44):
four days?
Speaker 3 (13:46):
oh, you're gonna have to say not get sleep for four
days because I've been there,yeah yeah multiple times I think
oversleeping I would wake up inpanic because I've missed all
the things I need to do and likeI would just start off the
morning anxious, becauseoversleeping for me could be
like 7 or 7, 3030.
And we know this as moms andI'm like my child.
(14:07):
My children are already askingto eat and I'm like I'm usually
like up at 6 or whatever, wakeup at 6.
Give me like an hour to likedecompress.
If I wake up at 7.30, they'rewanting breakfast, like now.
I'm like I have to get myselftogether.
Speaker 2 (14:20):
No, like who knows what they've gotten into.
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Right, that too, because I feel like that's been
for four days.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (14:27):
Which is we've been there.
It sucks, but we somehowmiraculously bounced back.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Yeah, somehow Awful, yeah.
Yeah, I think that felt prettyunanimous yeah.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
I think yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
That's a good ending one.
What's our topic today?
Speaker 3 (14:50):
Our topic today is friendship in the trenches and
just friendships in differentseasons of our lives.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Did you guys have any friendships that changed from
like before kids to after kids,friends that maybe you knew
before you had kids?
Like, did your friendshipschange For sure, what does that
look like now?
Because I feel like a lot of itis normalizing it, because,
(15:25):
like it's- a tough adjustment.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Well, sure you know my core group of friends from
home um.
I have my core group of friends.
There's four of us, three girlsand a guy um, and we were
friends since like one sincelike fourth grade and then like
eighth grade and maybe sixthgrade, but like since we were
like little and like we all livein different different
(15:47):
countries, different cities.
Now two out of the four havekids.
I'm one of the two.
Um, we still like, send eachother like memes and dms on
instagram and like we still text, but like we haven't seen each
other in like actual years andsometimes like makes me sad
because I'll get nostalgic whenwe go home.
I'm like, oh, we used to do this, but like I just text one of my
(16:10):
best friend out of that groupor they're all my best friends,
but you know the one from fourthgrade like a song from like
when we were growing up and Idon't know it just feels like
that's changed and just likewe'll text each other back like
when we can and it just likedoesn't feel the same.
But I don't, not that I don'tfeel sad because I am sad
because like time just naturallychanges.
(16:31):
But like I understand, like wegot older and just things
naturally shift and it just liketakes more effort to stay in
contact.
But we're the type where, like,we can pick off what we left
off and like nothing's changed.
Yeah, but, um, but shannon, whowe've known since, like before
we were born, we have periodswhere we like aren't in contact,
(16:57):
not because like anything wrong, it's just life.
But we actually saw her when wewere in town and I had to give
her a heads up because she'salso a mom.
But our dads have been bestfriends since first grade, so
like our families know eachother.
But it's literally like no timehas passed, like she still
looks the same and it's justlike our kids finally met and
(17:19):
like we call her our cousin andthat's we used to call each
other, like when we were growingup.
She went to the same school, ohyeah um, yeah, that's what we
used to call each other, likewhen we were growing up we went
to the same schools, but um,yeah, that's.
I mean, that's nothing, it hasthey have.
It has changed.
And it makes me sad sometimesbecause I'm like I remember life
when we didn't have kids, orlike when we weren't old and
working nine to five.
(17:39):
But and how I see people onInstagram like doing like friend
reunions and stuff.
Like I know it's Instagram, soit's like curated, but those are
the times like I miss them toono, I get that yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
I think there's something to be said about those
friendships, though, where youcan just pick up and you know
right back where you you startedfrom and you know they've seen
every version of you, yes, andthey have continued to stay
they're choosing to stay, yeahyeah, they're choosing to stay
(18:19):
um, sometimes, you know, undertheir will, but um right, they
just know too much.
You can't leave exactly it'sjust so you know they, they've
watched you grow and grow up andthe fact that you know I I
still have a friend who we'vebeen friends since first grade I
(18:43):
love that yeah, we don't, youknow, we don't talk every day,
but anytime I, I you know, I'llhave a thought about her and
I'll text her and it's just likeyep, we're still seven.
Yeah, yeah, you know, and we've,you know, we grew up together,
we went to high school together,we went to college.
Oh cool, we had kids around thesame time and it's just love
(19:08):
that it's.
It's such a testament to whatfriendship can be.
Yeah, that, you know you, youjust you have to smile when you
think about it.
And I've had reverse umfriendships where we were so
close yeah then you know youhave kids and suddenly you don't
(19:36):
fit in their lives anymore yeahyeah, and it's sad but it it's,
you know it's.
It's part of the growth processtoo yeah, no, I agree.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
I think that it's interesting because I feel like
I've collected friends from likevery core age groups.
I would say Like I have thefriends that I grew up with like
from scratch.
And then, like I have a friendthat we kind of all like
accumulated together as a corememory kind of.
(20:11):
And then I've got my group fromcollege and like from there
we've all just kind of grown uptogether and even my college
friends at this point we'veknown each other for Jesus 12
years, 13 years.
That's insane.
Used to feel not great abouthaving like a small circle, but
(20:37):
I'm realizing how much thatmeans because of a lot of what
you guys mentioned.
Like they see you througheverything, they follow with you
through all the differentmilestones, like you see all
their milestones.
yeah, it's just cool to kind ofgrow and stretch and be able to
pivot and adjust with a group ofpeople and know that they will
(20:59):
be there kind of regardless,even though it might look
different.
So, yeah, it's a lot of texting, group chats, memes and, yeah,
like facetime so we can yeah,well, and I I think about our
friendship Like we met when youwere 17.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
Yeah, oh my God, it's been that long.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
It's been that long, that's been 14 years.
That's crazy.
Yeah, I met Sheree when she was17.
And you know you weregraduating high school.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Oh my God.
And like you know, in you werein the trenches, like I was in a
different set of trenchesdealing with all kinds of stuff.
Yes, and then we lost touch andthen it was like, I don't know,
out of the blue you were havingsage and I was like you know,
hey, how are you?
(21:54):
And then it just like we pickedup where we left off.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
I was like, oh my god wait, you also had a baby.
You know how this like.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Please walk me through this yeah, so we just,
you know I, we found each otherat a certain point in our lives,
um, and then we rediscoveredeach other like yeah, you know
that's so beautiful.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
I love that, yeah and then I've met like a few few of
my friends.
Now I met through shereebecause, um, she's like, oh, I
think you would like like myfriend, and she's like, oh, I
think you would like my sister,and I just think that's also
like a testament like to us assisters.
It's like, oh, I think youwould like my sister, and I just
think that's also like atestament like to us as sisters.
It's like we talk about eachother, I talk about you to my
friends Also, like vice versa,and like so far, your track
(22:44):
record has been spot on.
Like I love Michelle, like wesend each other memes every
single day and that's just ourlove language.
And I can't imagine like nothaving ever met her.
Like I feel like she's been myfriend for like ever.
Yeah, we relate on so manylevels and it's like I just
(23:08):
think that's a testament to likeall of us too.
And also what you were sayingabout how your friends show up,
but it looks different.
It's like when you're younger.
You like from first grade,michelle.
It's's like I'm sure you guysimagine like doing everything
together, like past the age ofseven, and like having kids.
It's like you would plan yourkids and your wedding, but like
not realizing that they maybewon't be there like the way that
you thought they would be.
(23:29):
Yeah, like I was in my bestfriend's wedding and like, um, I
obviously wasn't there for thebirth of her kids and she wasn't
here for mine.
Because it's like life it justhappens like it doesn't happen
like it does in the movies andit's like when you're little,
like you don't account for life.
it's like oh wait, like theymaybe won't be able to like,
come to your baby shower or likethey're not always gonna live
(23:51):
five minutes up.
Yeah, yeah and it's like youcan't wrap your head around that
when you're younger because youjust refuse to accept anything
else, but like when you're olderand you're starting to get
older, like it's hard to accept.
Or then you're like, oh, thisis like how life is.
It's like I feel like it'seasier for us to keep in contact
nowadays versus like when ourparents are our age, because we
have social media and liketexting and like all that so I
(24:14):
just feel like at least for me,I've like accepted that, like if
I feel like all that sucks,like you see things on like the
movies and tv.
It's like all your friends areat your wedding and like you
know they come to your baby'sbirthday parties, and it's like
sometimes your, your friends,maybe will not meet your kids
until they're older, but itdoesn't mean they don't know
about them yeah, it's just likeit's just wild, it's just I
(24:39):
think it's humbling also but itjust makes you realize that when
you're younger, your mindset isso different because you don't
know anything other than likewhat you have known for the past
, like x amount of years, likeyou can't think past that in the
sense of like you, where youthink that it's that it's not
going to be different one day.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Yeah, I definitely think that, um, like meeting
friends and motherhood or likereconnecting with friends and
motherhood, like it speedsthings up.
You know how they say.
Like you know like quarantinerelationships where like
everything was set up becauseyou just it's like hyper focused
, you're like in this littlebubble.
(25:21):
Motherhood kind of feels likethat, because the friendships
that like I was just talkingwith son about this this morning
, I was like it feels like I've.
We were saying it feels likewe've known each other forever,
but it's been maybe two and ahalf years, like just since our
kids have been here.
But because of the things thatwe talk about and go through and
like connect a lot more often,just like, hey, how you like,
(25:47):
are you still good over there?
Like what's going on?
It I don't know.
I think it just like expeditesthe process.
And that was one of my mainthings going into having sage.
I was like I just want my, likeI want a friend village, I want
my community.
I was very scared of beingisolated and not having people
that I felt connected to and I.
(26:08):
That I feel like, is somethinglike I'm very proud of.
I have a very, very lovelycommunity of mom friends, and
that's not something that I takefor granted.
It's very important.
Speaker 4 (26:20):
Yeah, I think you develop, especially becoming a
mom.
You just develop these deeperconnections with people.
Yeah, because you've beenthrough the same thing.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Yeah.
And you also don't have timefor bullshit anymore, so you're
like, I don't have time for thisanymore.
So you're like, please, yeah,it's like I don't have time for
this.
If you don't understand that,like I can't come because I have
kids, then obviously we're notgoing to be friends yeah I don't
have.
I literally have no time in myday to sit here and be sad about
this yeah, and you know, like,have I used to get very upset?
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Well, maybe I still do get a little upset, but, like
you know friends that I have,like I have one friend in
particular who carried methrough like the darkest moments
of my life and now we barelytalk and you know I'll text her
(27:18):
and I don't hear anything.
Oh yeah, and I get, I got.
You know, I used to get upsetand I'm like, but my time is my
time's worth it.
Like I'm so busy.
There are days like I don't eat, like I don't even remember to
eat some days.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
Yeah, oh wait, it's like five o'clock and I have.
You know, I eat chips all day.
Yeah, yeah, and it's like whenI'm thinking about you.
I want to let you know that I'mthinking about you because A
you are important, my time isimportant and I'm making you a
priority.
Yeah, and if you can't make mea priority, then you know, our
(28:03):
friendship has changed and it'sevolved, and it wasn't where it
it does.
Speaker 2 (28:08):
I mean, I think it's so hard because, yes, been there
, it's been there and like Ialso get upset about it still,
because it's hard not to feelFlighted, yeah, or like just the
one-sided dynamic that I think,just yeah, can be a little
triggering and I think, man, Idon't know, I think remembering
(28:34):
that you just you don't alwaysknow what's going on has been
really helpful for me.
And like not taking thingspersonally and kind of meeting
your friends where they are,because if you've been friends
with these people for years five, 10, 15, 20, like however many
years like you're growing andyou're changing, so it's like
(28:56):
learning new friends, kind of,and like how to show up and
engage with these people as youchange too.
So it's, it's a balancing act.
I don't know it's interesting,but I think that it's worth.
I think it's worth it.
I can't imagine not having,like people that I check in with
(29:17):
and just have that spaceoutside of family.
Yeah, um, yeah.
So that is something that I notin a sexist way, but like I'm,
kind I'm, I love being a girlbecause it feels like a lot more
, like it's easier, maybe morenatural for, like the female
(29:40):
relationships, because like alot of the relationships that I
notice with males.
It's like it's hard for them togo deep sometimes or maybe,
like I don't know like thecommunication piece, maybe it
just looks different than whatI'm used to.
I'm not saying they can't do it, they do it in their own way,
different than what I'm used to.
I'm not saying they can't do it, they do it in their own way.
(30:03):
But this video popped up for meon Facebook.
That was like I had my husbandcall all his friends and say
goodnight and it's going viralon TikTok.
So he just calls his friend andhe's like hey, what's up?
He's like nothing, man.
He's like, hey, we're justcalling to say goodnight.
He's like why, why?
And it's just this montage ofall these people recreating it.
I'm like I've definitely textedpeople goodnight and it's like
(30:23):
goodnight, love you.
Like goodnight, love you too.
Like why is that weird?
So I just am very grateful thatit is a natural thing for us.
It doesn't feel like somethingyou have to question or second
guess or like you can't beyourself all the time and I
don't know.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
I feel like a lot of my male relationships are like
based on, like joking, oh mygosh, yes, because that's how we
connect, but, like my femalefriends, it's like we go deep
yeah, but like I appreciate that, but it's just funny and then
it's like I have you for jokingand I have you for talking about
like stuff that might be tootmi for the males yeah but, um,
(31:04):
this is kind of tying into, likemy next thing, but I have a
crazy observation tree.
Tell me if I'm wrong but, I'venoticed that you not seek out
but like you're friends withpeople who are like around my
age, and I don't know if that'sbecause, like you're used to
having me as like a sister.
But on the other end, I amfriends with people that are
(31:29):
like in your age group, like I,like gravitate towards that,
like at work, I have a lot offriends that are like in your
age group or younger and I feellike it's just like a natural
mentoring thing for me and Ifeel like I don't really connect
with like older people notconnect.
But I feel like I gravitate moretowards like younger people,
(31:50):
maybe because it's like I wantto be young, keep my youth, but
also probably because I'm likeused to being like the oldest
yeah, the older sister, like theolder cousin, I don't know.
I just like I have like moreconnections with them and like I
learned from them.
But I'm just like I justnoticed that because Michelle
and son are like in my age group.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
I know.
I mean, marina was too, I think.
Yeah, that's um something thatI've also noticed, and I think,
partly because I've always beenlike I'm like an old soul, I
feel like I've always been alittle bit ahead of my time.
So I connect with older peoplein general, like even yeah,
quote the adults like we're alladults, right, but you know, the
(32:30):
adults that were adults when wewere kids, like I just have a
way, I don't know, I feelcomfortable with them and even
like my Zumba.
It's like, you know, like olderladies, but like I love it.
I don't know why, but like Ialso connect really well with
kids so I can shape, shift.
(32:51):
It's the Gemini and me, I guessI feel like I can too.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
I mean, I can not that I can be friends with
anybody, because I absolutelycannot, but I can like talk to
anybody and make it seem likeI'm friends with you.
That sounds really bad, comingoff like that, but I just feel
like I can, like I don't know,but like I love my work friends.
A few are my age and a few arelike a lot younger, like 1990s,
(33:21):
and I'm like whoa, like you'refreaking a baby and then I'm
like oh yeah, like my sister's1994, so like I forget that
frequently.
But so I feel like maybe that'swhy I'm like I can connect with
them easier, and also justbecause their cousins are
younger than me, I'm just usedto being the oldest in the room,
fair and.
(33:42):
I just didn't realize thatuntil like now what have you
noticed, michelle?
Speaker 2 (33:48):
do you tend to gravitate towards group or
personality type?
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Um, I don't know.
I think I tend to gravitate alittle more towards like older
people.
Maybe Okay, like older than usyeah, but I also feel like I get
along with everybody I can seethat I just I, I don't know like
(34:25):
I I will talk to anybody.
I don't care how old you are orcolor, creed, whatever if
you're a person, if you'rebreathing, I'm speaking to you
yeah like I will.
I'm like that mom at theplayground that, like I will
talk to you and you'll probably,you know, like you know, walk
(34:49):
away a little bit.
You know, tiptoe, I have to goget my kids yeah, you don't have
kids, you're just like, I'mjust like I'll talk to anybody,
um, and it's funny because, likenow that my son's in school, um
, and I'm watching him makefriends yeah, it's wild, it is.
(35:12):
It is pure love.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
No, and they do?
Speaker 3 (35:17):
They're obsessed with each other?
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (35:19):
The hugs they love hugging.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
They love hugging, it doesn't matter.
The other day we were at thepark and my son this was just
like it was such a beautifulmoment.
He was an adult, he was in awheelchair and my son was like
fascinated and I said, why don'tyou go talk to him?
(35:42):
And he walked up to this manwho was so, so nice and, just
like my son, was like how manywheels do you have?
And he was just like I have two.
Like you want to see them.
And it was just like he wasn'tafraid.
There was nothing, like hedidn't have any preconceived
(36:03):
notions, he didn't have anything.
Yeah, he just thought thisguy's wheelchair was really cool
, yeah, and that's like what hewent with and like, how cool is
that?
like, how you know, when you seethat in your kids and you're
like you know, I mean, I was alittle bit like not fearful, but
(36:24):
I was like how is he going toapproach this?
What is he going to do withthis?
And he did exactly what willdoes he just everybody and, like
you know, wants to be friendswith everybody.
So, you know, I, it was just,it was a really pure and
beautiful moment and it was justlike you know, he didn't.
Speaker 3 (36:48):
I love that he didn't see anything different like,
which also makes me sad, becauseI'm like, wow, like we used to
be like that.
And then the world, you know,society, was just like, well,
we're gonna change that for you.
And just like, and like myoldest like literally will like
(37:11):
tell me every little thing abouthis friends, like oh, so-and-so
came in with the glasses todaybecause he also has glasses.
I'm like, oh, that's like,that's awesome.
But it's like those littlethings they notice and like that
they feel the need to tell youis just so like pure to me, and
it's just like it's sofascinating and also kind of sad
(37:32):
.
It's like, okay, it's like whatage should we lose that?
And like, how come we can'tjust like get that back?
And it's just like it makes meso sad when, like you hear about
kids going through things thatkids should not go through, or
like see things they shouldn'tsee.
Because once you lose that kidsense you do, you cannot get it
back.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
I mean even to the point where, like when I found
out that RJ had to get glassesfound out like he's my kid.
But, like you know, my firstthought is like no one better
make fun of him, like.
I swear to god if anybody makesfun of his glasses because you
know how shitty kids can beauntie.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Riri was coming for them yeah but that was my first
thought.
She was like, oh my gosh, I washoping to make fun of him.
I was like, oh gosh, but he hasno problem wearing them.
Like no one like he, everyonelike loves it.
But that was my first thoughtand it's because we know how
shitty kids can be and we knowthat it's their parents and we
(38:33):
know, I'm like kids are, aremean, they're so mean.
And when I hear that likesomeone wouldn't let him play
with something like at school,I'm just like, oh, really like
that makes me like I have tolike take a moment and like
shift, because I'm like, as amom, I'm like, oh, like, who's
this kid?
Let me go find him but also.
I'm like it's okay, buddy.
(38:54):
Like buddy, we were at a playplace one time and he, so brave,
asked everyone that he saw toplay with him and they said no.
And I'm like, why the fuck didthey say no Whatever, for
whatever reason?
And he was so sad and he wascrying.
He said I want to leave.
No one's playing with me.
He didn't want to play with hisbrother.
And then the next time he wentto a play place, he, I guess,
(39:18):
forgot about that.
He asked everybody or like justdidn't let it bother him, and
asked everybody again at adifferent play place and people
told him, yes, he was so excited.
And then I like told him that,like, that was so brave of him
to like try again.
And I was just like I wanted tomake sure.
I like said that because I feellike as adults, the minute I get
(39:41):
rejected, I'm like I'm nevershowing my face again, thank you
.
And it's like kids are soresilient and we went to the
parks at one time.
He was so excited that thesetwo kids were like playing with
him.
It's like, wait a second, whereare you going?
Like you need to tell us whereyou're going.
But he was just so stoked andI'm like I like sat there and
watched him ask them to play andI was like watching his brother
(40:04):
and also I was like, oh my god,please say yes.
I was like I can't handle a noand they said yes.
I was like, oh, like what'dthey say?
He's like, oh, they said yes,I'm like, oh, of course they did
go play but like, what doesthat say about you as a mom?
Speaker 4 (40:20):
because you trusted him enough to continue to ask do
you want to play with me?
And, yeah, rejected the firsttime and you didn't say to him
like, oh, you shouldn't do thatagain, because you know people
are just going to reject you.
Speaker 3 (40:38):
You trusted him enough yeah you, you know, you,
you see everything in your kid,every great oh yeah and you,
just, you just went with it, andyou know it's so hard to watch
them be rejected oh, my god,yeah, oh my god, I was literally
like holding my breath and hewas asking them and I was like,
(41:00):
oh, at the end they like left orwhatever to get ice cream and
they just ended up leaving.
I was like, did you catch theirnames?
He goes.
No.
I was like you know what?
That's fine.
You played with them.
Like it doesn like of coursethey're gonna say yes if you're
awesome, like hello, but likeanytime you think, oh, someone
(41:21):
didn't want to play.
I think you know what bud, likeit's okay, like I tried to like
not say kids are shitty andthey should play with you always
, but that's not the case.
It's like kids are mean, adultsare mean, for whatever reason,
and you will get left outsometimes and it's awful to
watch.
Yeah, because you know how itfeels and kids don't understand.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
Yeah, to get through it.
Yeah, yes, you know it hurtsyeah.
And it, you know, it developswho you are, because you take,
you know, these moments of hurtand you can, either, you know
you can rise from it or you can,you know, fall, and you know he
(42:03):
took that moment to to rise,you know, and just say, well,
let me try it again the next dayyeah, that's just, it's awesome
to watch them, but it's alsolike you know how the world is
and like you, just it's so crueland even like other parents are
(42:23):
cruel, and I'm like that'sunnecessary, like for a kid.
Speaker 3 (42:27):
And I always feel for the moms that are moms of kids
who have disabilities, becauseit's like I can't even like
imagine what they're goingthrough, not because the kid has
a disability, because like itdoesn't matter, but it matters
because people are so mean andthey will take that and like,
use it in a cruel way, and youknow that and you know that,
(42:51):
like, your kid may notunderstand why someone doesn't
want to talk to them and it'sjust like, but he's great, who
cares if he can't do xyz or heor she?
and it just breaks my like,absolutely breaks my mom heart.
I swear to god, having kidsliterally broke me in half, like
shattered my heart and likerebuilt it.
(43:11):
But it's just like.
It makes me so sad and I thinkI get.
I get sad for, like, the kidsbecause I'm like the world is so
mean, like we unfortunatelyknow what's going to happen,
they're going to get made fun of.
And for, like, there's noreason for them to get made fun
of, obviously, but it's justwhat it is and it's horrific,
it's awful yeah yeah, and it'slike you, as a parent, know how
(43:35):
amazing your kid is, whetherthey have a disability or not,
who cares?
Like they're your kid, you lovethem no matter what.
But then, like you, are sadbecause you know how mean
everybody is.
Speaker 4 (43:47):
Yeah, it's.
It's funny you kind of bringthat up because somebody asked
me, so I had kids.
I was almost 35 when I had Will, so in medical you know
terminology.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Oh, you're a geriatric patient.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
Yeah, so when I had I forget what it's called, the, I
don't know the genetic testingdone.
Speaker 3 (44:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (44:13):
I had it done because you know there's a little bit
more.
It's a little more common forsome genetic, you know things,
abnormality, and I forget who.
It was asked me like, well, whywould you do that?
Like, if you know, like, whatare you going to do?
(44:35):
And I was like what do you mean, what am I going to do?
Like if you know, like, whatare you going to do?
And I was like what do you mean, what am I going to do?
Like, I'm going to find out,and if there is a problem, like
it's my child, I'm going to yeah, and if there's resources that
I need, You're going to findthem.
That's the only reason why Iwould get it done is because I
can prepare just a little bit.
(44:55):
Yeah, I like that approach.
Yeah, that's the only reasonI'm like they're, they're my
child, it doesn't matter no,like it doesn't matter of course
you
Speaker 3 (45:07):
want.
You want and pray for healthykids, obviously, but sometimes
it doesn't work out like thatand you deal with it and it's
like.
That's why I just like adorethe parents who have children's
disabilities, because it's likethey are forever advocating for
their kids, forever findingresources, and like they are the
(45:28):
reason their kids are like likethriving, because it's like
they're doing it for their kids.
Yeah, like they're finding allthe resources.
Like your kids autistic, it'slike there's so many resources.
Or like, if they have like, aphysical disability, it's like
they wouldn't have known aboutany of these resources if they
didn't have a child with adisability.
And like that alone.
(45:49):
Also, like you form amazingrelationships to people who are
in the same position as you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah it's like adifferent kind of trenches yeah,
yeah, my nephew.
Speaker 4 (46:04):
He has a very rare genetic disorder.
Um like 100 people in the worldhave it and wow, um, it's very
it.
Basically his body can'tprocess essential fats.
So my sister, you know, shewent on basically like this
(46:25):
crusade to get him what heneeded.
She has fought insurancecompanies and she has friends
from all over the world.
Yeah, I love that.
Yeah, and I love that together.
I love that.
We just found, like they found,light in a dark place.
(46:46):
You know it's like motherhoodis hard.
And then when you add otherelements to that, yep, you feel
so alone.
And then when you have somebodywho's like I know exactly what
you're going through and it'slike it's the best thing in the
world yeah, and then alsoparents of kids that, like,
(47:08):
spent time in the NICU afterthey were born.
Speaker 3 (47:10):
That's like a whole nother community that can be
formed.
So it's like that's a wholenother on top of just having a
kid.
Now they're in the NICU for Xamount of months for whatever
reason, and it's like that's ontop of all of that.
It's like you have to deal withthat and maybe lifelong things
after that or maybe not, like no, but it's like you have a whole
(47:33):
community of people who arelike I know what you're going
through.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (47:42):
Yeah.
Very important, you don't haveto say anything.
It's like yeah.
You know, you see somebody inthe grocery store and their kid
is having a meltdown and I lookat them and I'm just like you're
okay.
Gonna pass Like like like mykids had one yesterday, like I
(48:04):
know what.
You're going to stand there andbe like, oh my goodness, you
need to control your childalthough before kids that was me
and.
Speaker 3 (48:11):
I'm ashamed to admit that, but like the older I get,
the more I'm like it was okay,like you didn't have kids 20 you
didn't know.
Now I know and I'm like I can'tbelieve I was ever like control
your kid, because also,sometimes kids in the store when
they're having tantrums arebecause of like, like a
neurodiversion or like there'snot something wrong with them,
but like they have a disability.
(48:32):
It's like sometimes, thingsthat are out of their control.
It's not because they can't getcandy, it's because they maybe
cannot control something.
Yeah, and it's like the mom wasshe needed to go to the store,
she needed to bring her kid.
It's like she had you have todo what you have to do and she
was like taking the risk, likein her mind, to like he might
(48:52):
have a tantrum because he'soverstimulated, or like it seems
like a tantrum, but it's likewe need to get food and you
can't stay home by yourself andthere's no one to watch you yeah
I just feel like moms just takerisks every day oh yeah, waking
up sometimes is a risk
Speaker 2 (49:14):
yeah, you don't know what.
You don't know what the day isgonna bring.
Speaker 4 (49:17):
Not at all not at all and I, there's a crap shoot
every day.
Oh, absolutely.
But when you have people thatyou know, they just have this
unspoken understanding of youknow exactly what you're going
through and it's so comfortingbecause motherhood is very
(49:40):
lonely.
Yeah, it is, it's you know,especially like those first
three months where it's oh andyou're thrown into, like I mean
talk about trial by fire throwninto, like I mean, talk about
(50:04):
trial by fire.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Yeah, like no man, you will like take this kid home
and keep him alive.
Speaker 2 (50:06):
Okay, I'll try my best.
No, it feels like a fever dream.
It feels like like I don't knowhow we got through that kind of
it's odd, because you're likehow to get through?
Speaker 3 (50:19):
but you're like I want to do it again.
But I know like I got throughit, but also like I'm done, but
I just told my conversation, butalso it's like, wow, it seems
so long ago and it's like,especially for me, with those
times I'm like this is nevergonna end.
I, I'm never going to be ableto like not have to deal with
(50:40):
this.
But here we are and it's justit's like a testament to like
what moms go through and what welike get through.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, and definitely could not do it without our
community.
So grateful for that andgrateful for I don't know, just
friendship and adult time andand I like what you said earlier
.
Speaker 3 (51:04):
Sure, about normalizing things.
Yeah, because I'm sure there'salso other communities like that
we don't know about, like formoms with children with
disabilities.
I'm sure they text each otherat 2 am because of something and
it's just like I love thatthere are those communities out
(51:27):
there for that and even it eventakes like one mom to like start
it.
Yeah, and I love that they havelike those 2 am people who are
like you know, he'soverstimulated.
To him it's just like same,like my kid too, like let's, we
can do this together or whateverthe reason might be, but like
(51:50):
oh, he has another doctor'sappointment tomorrow and it's
like that's like a whole notherworld.
And I always feel for thosemoms.
Speaker 4 (51:56):
I just want to hug them, yeah yeah, and it's like
motherhood is hard enough, ohyeah absolutely, and you know,
you don't know how hard it isuntil you do it, and it's not
like a one and done.
It's hard, it's every daythere's something a little bit
different.
(52:19):
But just having those, you know,having those relationships
where you can just be completelyhonest and oh yeah, you know
there there are some days, likeespecially in the beginning,
where I'm just like I can't dothis.
Yeah, I just like I I don'tknow how I'm going to do this.
(52:39):
Like I remember breastfeedingit was like oh Lord, so hard and
it was such like just a kick inthe pants, because I'm like, am
I doing it right?
He's this, that and the otherthing.
And I found out like he wastongue-tied so he couldn't match
.
Speaker 3 (53:00):
It wasn't even or his fault, it's like and you know
you just everybody's like.
Speaker 4 (53:06):
Oh, breastfeeding is so natural, it is when
everything goes right yeah youknow it's like here, fly this
plane.
You have never been to flightschool.
Speaker 3 (53:18):
Never.
Speaker 4 (53:19):
At a manual.
Speaker 3 (53:20):
But fly the plane.
I've never taken a vehicle offthe ground.
Yeah, I don't think.
Speaker 2 (53:28):
I could.
Speaker 3 (53:28):
No, I think I could.
I love this conversation.
This is amazing.
Yes, I feel like we should havelike a part two down the line.
There were so many things thatI thought about, but we're moms
and it's friday and it's late,so we're gonna have to white
laws that need to be drank soand sleep.
That need to be, that needs tobe had I love this though.
Speaker 2 (53:52):
Michelle please keep coming back.
We love talking to you.
Please keep having me back.
I love talking to you, pleasekeep having me back.
Speaker 4 (53:57):
I love this.
Speaker 3 (53:58):
Yes, and of course next summer in Jersey.
We'll let you know, michelle.
Yes, appreciate that.
Thank you for fitting in.
Feel free to call us out again,I don't mind.
Speaker 4 (54:08):
Oh well.
I will 100% continue to callyou out on it.
Speaker 2 (54:14):
Thank you, I'll never let it down.
Speaker 3 (54:17):
Thanks, guys, guys for listening and like listening
to school.
And thanks for being on again,michelle.
We love you.
Speaker 4 (54:26):
Yes love you, guys, love you.
And uh, yeah, I'm gonna gofinish some ice cream.
So, yes, enjoy it.
Oh well, my kids are asleep, myhusband's not home please, you
gotta go girl amazing talk toyou soon.
Speaker 2 (54:46):
Like listen, subscribe and review bye ladies,
bye all right everyone.
This was another episode ofturn the page podcast.
Speaker 1 (55:00):
Thanks, for hanging out.
Don't forget to like, listenand subscribe, and also don't
forget to leave a review, please, and let us know what you
thought about today's episodeand all the other episodes.
Thanks, guys, talk to you soon.
Bye.
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