August 10, 2026 • 27 mins
In the second hour, Dave Softy Mahler and Dick Fain are joined by Hugh Millen to talk about the Seahawks potentially signing Terrion Arnold, Byron Murphy’s next deal, the first Hard Knocks episode, and the frustrating Mariners, then the guys react to the M’s Top 50 list unveiled over the weekend including the big omission of pitcher Jeff Nelson.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right here he is a little more at four.
(00:03):
I think he was on this morning. I'm not sure.
Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't. I'm just kind of
hoping that we can all just agree theater of the
mind he was.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And he was great.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Left me wanting, yeah, that's right, Dick. A little more
so we're getting more at four with our friend Huey Millan.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
How are you, man, I'm good. Was not on this
morning and was not great. Please, so if you if
you were on the first time for everything, good to
be with you. Guys. What's happening?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yeah, there's a lot going on, man. We got this
Terry and Arnold story that's just coming down now. Mike
McDonald just met with the media by the way here
at the vMac and will play some of the audio later.
He said that the team has heard from folks they
trust on his side of his case. He says, quote,
everything's kind of on the table. He's facing eight felony
(00:53):
charges in Florida. Had a second visit apparently with the
Seahawks yesterday. What's your on the Terry and Arnold situation
up here in Seattle?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
A little bit surprising. I think it's obviously a serious issue.
So you know, I'm not going to try and make
light of it. I would just say, from from my
perspective and what I have learned about the NFL, I
think you can imagine a seat at the table on
this discussion. And who gets a seat at the table. Well,
(01:25):
number one, who just sat down. His talent, so his
first round draft pick and what they think is ceiling
is all right, So so his talent, you could throw
in agent as part of that, but just what he
could contribute. Number two at the table is a Seahawks depth.
I mean, I said before the Super Bowl, in my opinion,
(01:47):
I think that the least capable player on a really
really exceedingly talented defense was Josh job And of course
they've lost Greek one. And so then said again you
you may remember Dave. First couple of days of camp,
I said, the thinnest position on the football team is
cornerback in my estimation, right, so Seawk's death would be
(02:10):
would have a seat at the table. The fifth Amendment
gets a table seat at the table. Uh, he just
sat down, and you could say sixth Amendment and Fourth
Amendment together they worked together as as due process, and
of course we in the court of public opinion, were
not obligated to UH to UH in any strict sense
(02:33):
that there's a presumption of innocence. But I think as Americans,
just one man's opinion, I think that we should try
sometimes it's difficult, but we should try to hold to
those principles in our own minds, because, in fact, what
if somebody that we loved was under under target in
that regard, and so he is innocent until proven guilty.
(02:55):
And perhaps Mike McDonald was alluding to that, you know,
and then the final seat at the table is is
what I would call football character. I think we tend
to just look at at these guys say, okay, we
lump them all to get you know, their character is
is is either they have good character or they have
(03:16):
destructive character for a football team. And that's mostly true,
and you can put them on one linear scale. But
I would argue that there's a a off the field
character scale, and then there's a football in the building character.
And the best example I can give you is Michael
Irvin for the Cowboys. Most people know fans have been
(03:39):
around a bit. They know, you know, they know about
the fur code in the courtroom and the you know,
all the drug allegations and some other things, and so
you would say, oh, he's a bad guy. No, No,
life is a little bit more complex because his work
ethic hot, what kind of teammate he was was over
the top, phenomenal, like practiced every play like it was
(04:02):
the Super Bowl. Had not not good, not great, elite,
next level football character. And so I and I don't.
I haven't done enough on him to say what his
football character is. But you know, for example, when Jalen
Carter was coming out of the draft, and you know,
he was involved in in a high speed UH car
(04:26):
racing episode and he wasn't driving, but somebody ended up No,
he was driving, Sorry, he was driving and and somebody
ended up dying. He didn't call it. But you know,
there's a lot of questions about that. And I said, hey,
I'll tell you something. There's some gms that will close
the door and say, look, I feel terrible that somebody
died in this. But the fast that the fact that
(04:46):
a young man wants to drive fast, that doesn't bother me,
like I need to hear something else. Now, there's other
things to ding his football character, but but it's nuanced
and so the fact that Mike McDonald would be uh,
you know, kind of the overtures, the preemptive arguing on
his behalf tells you that they, in my opinion, are
having some of these discussions at the table I just described.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Hugh Byron Murphy just joined the show and on the
heels of Quinn Williams signing a nine figure contract at
defensive tackle and we could be twelve months away from
that for Byron Murphy. But what does Byron have to
do between now and then to get a nine figure contract.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Well, I don't think he has to do a heck
of a lot more than he's been doing. I think
he's in the eyes of Mike McDonald and John Schneider.
Would I have to say this guy is is vital
to what they do. I mean, he he has a unique,
you know, contribution because when you look at him, having
coached high school football at the four A level in Washington,
(05:54):
there's oftentimes you know, you kind of maybe glance at
the team, you know, as they're warming up or stretching
or whatever, and you'll see a guy who has a
body like Bayern Murphy, like seeing a guy that that's
you know, short, six foot six foot one. You know,
clearly over three hundred pounds. You know who who Who's
not winning any body building contests anytime soon. You know,
(06:17):
you actually see that on a high school football field
with great frequency. But those guys you don't really worry
about them getting in the game because there's slow as
a slug and they're not difficult to block. He has
a unique ability that he has a bad body and
and yet the Good Lord put so much twitch in him,
(06:38):
and and he's developed his talents as well. And just
you know, God didn't give him an Adonis body, but
you know what he he gave him great leverage, great strength,
incredible quickness. And so this is a guy that can
be a force in a in a league of elite athletes.
He can stand out hell on the first day of
one on one. Uh, you know, everybody you know kind
(07:01):
of look the same. And then there was Byron Murphy
who was head and shoulders of everybody in the drill
and oftentimes looks that way in the game as well.
So so look, I know you probably want me to
say he's got to produce more splash plays, whether it's
more sacks, quarterback hits, force fumbles, tackles for losses and
and that would help. But he is he's vital in
(07:24):
terms of chewing up that space. And remember what the Seahawks,
they don't want their defensive lineman penetrating. They want to
build a wall, force the ball to go outside, and
then their team speed with those corner like safeties that
can run and fill the lanes that they can spill
the ball to the outside and run and chase it.
And you got to have guys in the middle that
(07:44):
force it out to the outside. Particularly when you're playing
with a too high and you have one, you have
to play a gap and a half in this defense.
I know we don't have time to get into that,
but the way you got to play a gap and
a half because you got your playing with a too
high safety structure. You don't have that safety down to
the box. So all the math has to play out
with a couple of those guys playing a gap and
a half. He can do it, and it's really essential
(08:06):
to what they do on defense. Well it's here.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
It's interesting because Dick and I were on the air Friday,
and I Dick, I don't want to put words in
your mouth. So if you want to speak for yourself,
go ahead. But we were talking about the Hard Knocks
episode and talked about what we liked and Dick, you
said that you weren't a big fan of the Thomas
Hammock episode and all the F bombs, right.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Yeah, And I think Byron Murphy presented it perfectly there
when he said we need that sometimes, right, And I
totally agree with we need that once in a while.
I think once in a while was his way. I
just didn't like seventeen of them in a minute clip.
That's I mean that to me, the F bomb loses
(08:43):
it effect, its effectiveness the more you use it, that's
my point.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah, he was funny.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
I just asked him what his favorite part was, and
he said, Thomas Hammock getting on everybody in the running
back room. So what's your take on that?
Speaker 2 (08:55):
Yeah, Well, like it or don't like it. That's just
as woven into the fabric of football culture as football
cleats are. And and there's really three type of coaches
roughly will put him in three categories. Those that swear
often all the time, like Hammon, those who swear occasionally,
(09:17):
possibly for purposely for effect, like you're describing Dick. Maybe
Don James would be in that category. There there's a
few that are reputed to never have swear Tony Dungee,
Tom Landry. I could believe that, even Kaylin de boor Washington,
although I think that's kind of changing when he's down
at Alabama. Maybe Dabosweeney. There, there's that that is exceedingly rare.
(09:42):
I can tell you that I would be willing to
bet there. There is no no coaching staff in college
football or in the NFL that doesn't have at least
one of that Coach Hammond type, like a barrage of wearing.
And and really when you go back to that scene,
(10:04):
here's the problem for a running back. What in past protection,
You're you gotta scan, and you're you're relatively stationary, and
then the and and potential blitzer is coming a linebacker,
a safety's coming from six seven yards, you know, getting
almost a full head of steam. And then so you
you've got physics going against you. You're you know, it's
(10:25):
like he's the cue ball and you're just you know,
the eight ball. You're gonna get hit. So you gotta
you gotta somehow do everything you can to to uh
invert that and and step up in Stone. A guy
the best I ever saw was Charles White, if you remember,
it's a Heisman Trumphy winner for USC seven nine, teammate
of mine with the Rams. He backed up Eric Dickerson.
(10:46):
Dickerson was a much better running back, but he was.
But Charles White, he could just come up and then
he just snap his hips and and his hips were
just like he's doing a power clean and he could
just buckle guys and so and and Charles White is
the the only good one I've been around. But you know,
he's probably the best. And so there is a mentality.
(11:06):
There's a technique, but most importantly there's a mentality. And
so so the coach, I know you're not exactly talking
about that, but in the context of that meeting, sure,
when when the coaches is pulling the F bombs, he
is trying to set a tone like hey, like like
we're not gonna absorb that damn freaking rusher. We're gonna
somehow find a way from a stationary position to uncoil
(11:29):
like a cobra and freaking snap a dude in his
freaking chin, right and and and get it. But first
thing first, before we talk about technique, you let have
the right attitude. So it didn't bother me a bit. Uh,
you know, I think Byron Murphery also mentioned, you know, hey,
the Good Lord. Hell I don't paraphrase, but you know,
with the Good Lord's help with the contract, I'll take
(11:50):
care of himself. I mean, there's plenty of Christians that
that respond well to uh, those kinds that kind of
uh motivation exactly as exhibited by him. Okay, I get
the fire. I understand what coach coach needs and and
quite frankly, it's it's as it's as common as uh,
(12:11):
you know, as as uh as as grass blades on
the football field. So I'm trying to think, what's the
most common thing, uh, more common than grass blades? Air molecules. Yeah,
it's as common as as oxygen. So I think you
get my point. Yeah, that doesn't bother me. It's just
part of the deal, Hugh.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
The most newsworthy part of the First Hard Knocks was
the Witherspoon stuff near the end. You can call it
dirty laundry or miscommunication or what have you issue or
no issue after after seeing what you saw, I think.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Right now I feel pretty good about it. I love
that Witherspoon, you know he he he vocalized, I thought
he was great. Here he is driving and what have you.
I think he couldn't have written a script on on
how he said. He says, look, uh, you know, I
think I know my worth. Now I would contest, you know,
(13:07):
we don't. We don't get paid by what's difficult. We
uh a difficult job. We get paid by the scarcity
and how important the job is. But well, we'll just accept.
We'll give him what he said that the the defensive
backs are second, uh, the second most important differ or
excuse me, most difficult position next to quarterback. We'll give
(13:30):
him that, uh what he said. Thereafter he said, you know,
I want to get paid, but he says, hey, my
focus is is on you know, my role in maximizing
the team. I'm paraphrasing. I thought that was great, he
he he like Bia Murphy said, God will take care
of this thing. So you sense that there was a
grounding of him. And and what we've seen from Snyder
(13:53):
and the club through the years is that guys who
bring come to camp with that attitude, it's on almost
like the club wants to reward him for that, Like, hey,
not only has this guy played and been the leader
that we want and he is, he is indispensable in
terms of his emotional the fire this team doesn't have
(14:15):
on an aggregate level in the defense. They don't have
the fire of the twenty thirteen team. Although I'm sure
that there's there's a dozen of them that would would
just you know, kick my ass in an alley for
having said that they would bristle, But I would still
say they didn't have the swag. And so I think
that you've got in Witherspoon, a guy who brings the
(14:35):
swag more than anybody and and kind of sets the tone,
brings the team up, you know, it has his hand
on the thermostatic emotion of that defense. So you're paying
for a lot more than just the productivity. He's a corner,
you know, his job when he plays in the in
the dime defense, when he comes in the slot that
(14:55):
within McDonald's defense. There's a lot of complicated aspects to that.
For him to fast, he's got to have a high IQ,
study a lot, he does all of these things and
so and so when you take all of that and
then you throw in that he has the right attitude
about his contract. Hell, he just saw JSN, you know,
his same year in the draft, both first rounders. He
(15:18):
was the fifth over pick, JSN was the twentieth. Like
he would have every right to say, wait a minute,
take care of me too now, And I think that's
what he's saying. But he's also you know, not being
disruptive to the team whatsoever. So I like the direction
this seems to be going.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah, no doubt, Hey Hugh, before you go, yeah, we
can't let you loose without a quick thought from a
long time two oh six guy on the disaster that
has become our favorite baseball team.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Well this, you know, this weekend, and and you know
I was going to the games in nineteen seventy seven
and yelling Roupe out in the outfield, Ruper Jones, and
and doing my homework in middle school to knee house
the play by play. And so I feel like emotionally
connected this team from their inception. But it's almost like
(16:08):
you have that you know, this is where my heart is,
and this is where my head is. My heart loves
the idea of the Mariners. I mean it's kind of
g rated, almost Disney remember the show Happy Days, you know,
depicting the fifties. There's something about baseball that's unique, and
the summer. The weather's the star because we have to
endure all the gray and the drizzle, and so now
(16:29):
in the summer we get to be outside and watching
the manners. I love all of that, kind of that
Norman Rockwell setting of it. That's my emotion. But then
this weekend I can't get away from my rationale. In
since nineteen seventy seven, the Mariners have the second worst
record in all of the American League. Only the Royals
(16:51):
are just a decimal point lower than them. But the
Royals have two World Series. So if you were doing
a sometime of a scale like this the Times did
for the top fifty players, which I thought they did
a good job. If you're doing a scale, you know,
the Pirates are the only team in the NL National
League who have a worst record, but they've got a
World serieson The Mariners would literally be the worst team
(17:13):
in baseball since nineteen seventy seven. I mean, how do
you feel about the Cleveland Browns? How do you feel Jets? Well,
the Jets won a damn Super Bowl in the sixties
with Nameath But but like if you're if we were
not in Seattle and we were looking at it from
two or three time zones away, and we're just looking
at the Mariners in their history. I know they've they've
they're better now than they were, but in their history
(17:34):
since nineteen seventy seven, you'd say that they're the freaking
Cleveland Browns and so and and and that fact. It
just like this weekend, the fact they get swept and
a year that they're we're looking back at the fifty
years of the Mariners. It's like it was like it
was like perfect, Yeah, you get you're getting swept because
in fifty in those fifty years, you're the worst team
(17:56):
in baseball. Yeah yeah, and and and that that's hard
to even feel emotionally. Well, your rationale tells you to
think that, yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Well, Kansas City has got four World Series appearances since
nineteen eighty. They're not even close to being the Maritors,
not at all. Hueye, you're the man, great stuff. And
we'll talk on Friday about the Cowboy Games.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Ham me down, all right, all right, but Hugh.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Milling with us on the radio show. We haven't even
addressed that top fifty thing. Dick from Saturday Y dood
and who was left off by the way.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Uh, yeah, you're a you're a little ticket at one hot.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
We'll do it next on ninety three three KJRFM.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
Now back to Southy and Dick at the Virginia Mason
Athletics Center and our special coverage of Seahawks training camp,
brought to you by the Boeing Classic on Sports Radio
ninety three point three kJ r FM.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Alright, boys and girls, we're back at the Virginia Mason
Athletics SENNA. Seahawks training camp continues, Seahawks Cowboys Saturday night
preseason football. Uh lots going on here Byer Murphy. Good
stuff from him, Hugh Milling, good stuff from him. Bill
Krueger will join us at five o'clock tonight. We'll talk
about the series against the Raised, Dick and Jackson. We
(19:11):
can go over the top fifty lists as well, that
I thought generally was a pretty good thing, great ceremony
until they got to the end of the list and
Jeff Nelson didn't hear his name called, which I thought
was absolute chicken crap nonsense by this organization to do
what they did over the weekend in Nelly, He's number
one in games pitched in franchise history. For god's sakes,
(19:32):
he's got a three point two six ERA. He's the
only middle reliever to ever make the All Star Game
as a Mariner?
Speaker 2 (19:39):
What are we doing?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Can somebody tell me what I'm missing here, Dick? If
I'm missing something, I gladly will hear an argument against it. No,
I will gladly hear an argument. But you know what
this felt like to me? It felt like it wasn't
the top fifty best players. It was the top fifty
best players that the Mariners like, and that maybe John
Stanton is still making Jeff Nelson pay for popping his
p I hole off at the end of the twenty
(20:01):
three season about not making a deal and they traded
him back to the Yankees.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
What else?
Speaker 1 (20:07):
What other reason would there be for Jeff Nelson number
one in games bitched, number one in franchise history. But
you got to find a way to get Dave Valley
on the list and Mike Jackson on the list, and look,
I like those guys, but not over Jeff Nelson.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
What are we doing?
Speaker 3 (20:27):
No, it does appear that July thirty first, two thousand
and three cost Jeff Nelson and I, you know, at
first when I saw your tweet, because I didn't even
know all the list, right, I knew obviously a good
chunk of the list, but I didn't know a lot
of like the bottom ten, bottom fifteen guys on the list.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
So I saw yours.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
My first thought was, Okay, let's play Devil's avocabverse.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
Second, we know that Dave is close to Jeff Nelson.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
They've been friends for a quarter of a century, So
is this kind of clouding the judgment here? And then
I went and looked at the numbers, and I came
up with the same stuff that you came up. I'm
looking at the Mariner war leaders for pitchers right now.
There is exactly one relief pitcher who has a higher
war with the Mariners than Jeff Nelson, and that's JJ Puttz.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Jeff Nelson is higher than all the other guys.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Andre's Munno's, Arthur Rhodes, Mike Jackson's, all the other guys
that got named the top fifty list. So yes, I
believe you. I agree with you. Jeff Nelson should have
absolutely been on the list.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Well, there's just look, there's a perception about the way,
right Jackson, the Mariners do things correct and what's important
to them. And like we talked about in the first
segment of the show, when nobody takes accountability, when nobody
talks to the media, when people run and hide in
the showers after a game, when there's no leadership on
display from the clubhouse except for the manager quoting his
cliche book, then that feeds into certain perceptions that we
(21:50):
have about the franchise. When you do things like leave
Nellie I know you were fired about Gino Suarez too,
when you leave Jeff Nelson off the Top fifty list, who.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
So clearly, so clearly belongs.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
On the list, like people that don't even know Nelly.
Impartial and you're right, dick, friend of mine did a
show with a guy for three years whatever. Okay, it
pissed me off, just like it pisses me off to
find out that Mike Holmgren is still having to wait
for the Hall of Fame for exactly those reasons. But
just because we're close to people doesn't mean that the
arguments are incorrect, right. I mean, Tim Booth and The
(22:26):
Times did a whole story on this, and their number
one miss was Jeff Nelson. So when you do things
like that, guys, it just clearly feeds into the perception
that people have.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
It's interesting you look at the overall all time top
war leaders for the Mariners, and war is only one
of many stats. But you know, Jeff Nelson's not even
that far down there. It's clearly the omission the other
ones that really stand out. I mentioned you mentioned sofi
that I pointed out Ginosporaz.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
I think for a guy.
Speaker 6 (22:53):
Who delivers you one of the biggest moments in your
franchise's history, who you know right now if you and
I don't know if everybudy knows this, if you go
into the Mariners clubhouse and then you take the little
hallway from the clubhouse down to their dugout, a huge
thing is in just lit up letters saying good vibes.
(23:13):
Only they still have that right now, that just it
beams at you when you walk out to the dugout.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Good vibes.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Only for a guy who had that.
Speaker 6 (23:21):
Kind of influence, who also was a pretty darn good
player at two instances, I think that's a miss. But
also just look at this war thing, Olmarvas scale, he
right now is the thirty sixth highest War Mariner of
all time, he's off Jose Lopez right behind him at
ten point two war he's off, Ken Phelps, Leon Roberts,
Carlos Gian. That rounds out the top five of top
(23:42):
war getters that were left off this list. I think
there's a couple of those, especially Lopez Gian that I
kind of go Mariors, I think you missed big time
on a few of these guys.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Did they, Dick, Did they consider the egos of current
guys too much when they put as many players from
this team on that list? Because Logan Gilbert on it,
Brian wu is on it, Kirby, George Kirby is on it,
Luis Castillo, who's not here, but he's on it right
Julio Rodriguez, Cal Ray, JP Crawford. I mean, I don't
(24:12):
know if George Kirby belongs on.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
That list right now.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
No, I mean, honestly, you know, does George Kirby honestly
belong on a top fifty list right now over a
guy who's number one in games pitched in franchise history.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
I think what's interesting is is Jackson's point, if Gino
Suarez was on this team right now hitting twos even he.
Speaker 4 (24:33):
Just hitting two twenty with like ten probably on the list.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So I mean I was okay, and now because Gino
is clearly when you look at the most impactful Mariners
of all time, based upon what he did in the Monuments,
he is one of the most impactful Mariners. I just
don't know is a thousand, let's say, thirteen hundred eighties
is that enough to be a top fifty player all
(24:59):
to thirteen hundred eight b is not a lot. That's
like two full seasons some moments. He's very impactful. He's
maybe a top ten or fifteen impactful player of all
time in Mariner history.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah. Well, look, I mean I just think guys like
Dave Valley for example, and Mike Jackson. And the problem
with an argument like this is it becomes a I
hate a so gimme b right, And that's not the
deal here. Like I think guys like Dick and I.
You're too young to remember Valley when he was a
catcher playing for the Mariners. But is he on that
(25:31):
list if he's not a broadcaster right now?
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Exactly?
Speaker 3 (25:34):
Well, honestly, guys, the number one name that popped up
to me was your old boy Joel Pinata Dave, Yeah,
Joelle Pinero had two and a half good seasons with
the Mariners and then three terrible seasons with the Mariners,
like he fell off a cliff after two and a
(25:57):
half seasons. Well, to Jackson's point, Gino had two and
a half great seasons too and then didn't fall off
the cliff because he's no longer on the team.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Again, it's just another example of how they just you know,
this should have been something that everybody just loved and whatever,
and then you do something like leave Nelly off and
he's the number one guy for me by far, and
I mean, I'll just be honest with you. He's pissed.
I mean, he's hurt by this, but he's not on
the list, and I don't like it. I don't like,
you know, him feeling that way about the Mariners. And
I really hope that he was that they were clear
(26:28):
with him on what was going on, because you know,
he's doing he's doing games for the Marlins now Nelly
is so he's traveling and they had a game and
if he had known that this was what was going
on that, trust me, he would have been here right.
Other guys decided not to be here like Robbie Cano
and Kyle Seeger, who obviously belong on the list. I'm
not saying they don't. Those guys do for sure, but
(26:48):
I really and I have not heard from anybody. I've
reached out to a couple people and nobody's written back yet.
I doubt they ever will. I really hope that they
were up front with Nelly and saying, look, you've made
the list, we want you here, or let's not just
make this about the fifty guys that could get here,
because that's not how you run a franchise. That's not
how you treat a guy like a Jeff Nelson. And
(27:10):
if he's being punished, what was the date again, Dick that.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
You said, July thirty first, two thousand and three.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Yeah, if he's being punished for something that happened twenty
three years ago, when every fan in baseball agreed with him,
by the way, then shame on them.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Man.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Come on, we're gonna break textimonials and then we'll ask
Bill Krueger about the whole top fifty thing. I'm sure
he'll be thrilled to discuss that. At five on ninety
three three KJJRFM
All right here he is a little more at four.
(00:03):
I think he was on this morning. I'm not sure.
Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't. I'm just kind of
hoping that we can all just agree theater of the
mind he was.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
And he was great.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Left me wanting, yeah, that's right, Dick. A little more
so we're getting more at four with our friend Huey Millan.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
How are you, man, I'm good. Was not on this
morning and was not great. Please, so if you if
you were on the first time for everything, good to
be with you. Guys. What's happening?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yeah, there's a lot going on, man. We got this
Terry and Arnold story that's just coming down now. Mike
McDonald just met with the media by the way here
at the vMac and will play some of the audio later.
He said that the team has heard from folks they
trust on his side of his case. He says, quote,
everything's kind of on the table. He's facing eight felony
(00:53):
charges in Florida. Had a second visit apparently with the
Seahawks yesterday. What's your on the Terry and Arnold situation
up here in Seattle?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
A little bit surprising. I think it's obviously a serious issue.
So you know, I'm not going to try and make
light of it. I would just say, from from my
perspective and what I have learned about the NFL, I
think you can imagine a seat at the table on
this discussion. And who gets a seat at the table. Well,
(01:25):
number one, who just sat down. His talent, so his
first round draft pick and what they think is ceiling
is all right, So so his talent, you could throw
in agent as part of that, but just what he
could contribute. Number two at the table is a Seahawks depth.
I mean, I said before the Super Bowl, in my opinion,
(01:47):
I think that the least capable player on a really
really exceedingly talented defense was Josh job And of course
they've lost Greek one. And so then said again you
you may remember Dave. First couple of days of camp,
I said, the thinnest position on the football team is
cornerback in my estimation, right, so Seawk's death would be
(02:10):
would have a seat at the table. The fifth Amendment
gets a table seat at the table. Uh, he just
sat down, and you could say sixth Amendment and Fourth
Amendment together they worked together as as due process, and
of course we in the court of public opinion, were
not obligated to UH to UH in any strict sense
(02:33):
that there's a presumption of innocence. But I think as Americans,
just one man's opinion, I think that we should try
sometimes it's difficult, but we should try to hold to
those principles in our own minds, because, in fact, what
if somebody that we loved was under under target in
that regard, and so he is innocent until proven guilty.
(02:55):
And perhaps Mike McDonald was alluding to that, you know,
and then the final seat at the table is is
what I would call football character. I think we tend
to just look at at these guys say, okay, we
lump them all to get you know, their character is
is is either they have good character or they have
(03:16):
destructive character for a football team. And that's mostly true,
and you can put them on one linear scale. But
I would argue that there's a a off the field
character scale, and then there's a football in the building character.
And the best example I can give you is Michael
Irvin for the Cowboys. Most people know fans have been
(03:39):
around a bit. They know, you know, they know about
the fur code in the courtroom and the you know,
all the drug allegations and some other things, and so
you would say, oh, he's a bad guy. No, No,
life is a little bit more complex because his work
ethic hot, what kind of teammate he was was over
the top, phenomenal, like practiced every play like it was
(04:02):
the Super Bowl. Had not not good, not great, elite,
next level football character. And so I and I don't.
I haven't done enough on him to say what his
football character is. But you know, for example, when Jalen
Carter was coming out of the draft, and you know,
he was involved in in a high speed UH car
(04:26):
racing episode and he wasn't driving, but somebody ended up No,
he was driving, Sorry, he was driving and and somebody
ended up dying. He didn't call it. But you know,
there's a lot of questions about that. And I said, hey,
I'll tell you something. There's some gms that will close
the door and say, look, I feel terrible that somebody
died in this. But the fast that the fact that
(04:46):
a young man wants to drive fast, that doesn't bother me,
like I need to hear something else. Now, there's other
things to ding his football character, but but it's nuanced
and so the fact that Mike McDonald would be uh,
you know, kind of the overtures, the preemptive arguing on
his behalf tells you that they, in my opinion, are
having some of these discussions at the table I just described.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Hugh Byron Murphy just joined the show and on the
heels of Quinn Williams signing a nine figure contract at
defensive tackle and we could be twelve months away from
that for Byron Murphy. But what does Byron have to
do between now and then to get a nine figure contract.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Well, I don't think he has to do a heck
of a lot more than he's been doing. I think
he's in the eyes of Mike McDonald and John Schneider.
Would I have to say this guy is is vital
to what they do. I mean, he he has a unique,
you know, contribution because when you look at him, having
coached high school football at the four A level in Washington,
(05:54):
there's oftentimes you know, you kind of maybe glance at
the team, you know, as they're warming up or stretching
or whatever, and you'll see a guy who has a
body like Bayern Murphy, like seeing a guy that that's
you know, short, six foot six foot one. You know,
clearly over three hundred pounds. You know who who Who's
not winning any body building contests anytime soon. You know,
(06:17):
you actually see that on a high school football field
with great frequency. But those guys you don't really worry
about them getting in the game because there's slow as
a slug and they're not difficult to block. He has
a unique ability that he has a bad body and
and yet the Good Lord put so much twitch in him,
(06:38):
and and he's developed his talents as well. And just
you know, God didn't give him an Adonis body, but
you know what he he gave him great leverage, great strength,
incredible quickness. And so this is a guy that can
be a force in a in a league of elite athletes.
He can stand out hell on the first day of
one on one. Uh, you know, everybody you know kind
(07:01):
of look the same. And then there was Byron Murphy
who was head and shoulders of everybody in the drill
and oftentimes looks that way in the game as well.
So so look, I know you probably want me to
say he's got to produce more splash plays, whether it's
more sacks, quarterback hits, force fumbles, tackles for losses and
and that would help. But he is he's vital in
(07:24):
terms of chewing up that space. And remember what the Seahawks,
they don't want their defensive lineman penetrating. They want to
build a wall, force the ball to go outside, and
then their team speed with those corner like safeties that
can run and fill the lanes that they can spill
the ball to the outside and run and chase it.
And you got to have guys in the middle that
(07:44):
force it out to the outside. Particularly when you're playing
with a too high and you have one, you have
to play a gap and a half in this defense.
I know we don't have time to get into that,
but the way you got to play a gap and
a half because you got your playing with a too
high safety structure. You don't have that safety down to
the box. So all the math has to play out
with a couple of those guys playing a gap and
a half. He can do it, and it's really essential
(08:06):
to what they do on defense. Well it's here.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
It's interesting because Dick and I were on the air Friday,
and I Dick, I don't want to put words in
your mouth. So if you want to speak for yourself,
go ahead. But we were talking about the Hard Knocks
episode and talked about what we liked and Dick, you
said that you weren't a big fan of the Thomas
Hammock episode and all the F bombs, right.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Yeah, And I think Byron Murphy presented it perfectly there
when he said we need that sometimes, right, And I
totally agree with we need that once in a while.
I think once in a while was his way. I
just didn't like seventeen of them in a minute clip.
That's I mean that to me, the F bomb loses
(08:43):
it effect, its effectiveness the more you use it, that's
my point.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah, he was funny.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
I just asked him what his favorite part was, and
he said, Thomas Hammock getting on everybody in the running
back room. So what's your take on that?
Speaker 2 (08:55):
Yeah, Well, like it or don't like it. That's just
as woven into the fabric of football culture as football
cleats are. And and there's really three type of coaches
roughly will put him in three categories. Those that swear
often all the time, like Hammon, those who swear occasionally,
(09:17):
possibly for purposely for effect, like you're describing Dick. Maybe
Don James would be in that category. There there's a
few that are reputed to never have swear Tony Dungee,
Tom Landry. I could believe that, even Kaylin de boor Washington,
although I think that's kind of changing when he's down
at Alabama. Maybe Dabosweeney. There, there's that that is exceedingly rare.
(09:42):
I can tell you that I would be willing to
bet there. There is no no coaching staff in college
football or in the NFL that doesn't have at least
one of that Coach Hammond type, like a barrage of wearing.
And and really when you go back to that scene,
(10:04):
here's the problem for a running back. What in past protection,
You're you gotta scan, and you're you're relatively stationary, and
then the and and potential blitzer is coming a linebacker,
a safety's coming from six seven yards, you know, getting
almost a full head of steam. And then so you
you've got physics going against you. You're you know, it's
(10:25):
like he's the cue ball and you're just you know,
the eight ball. You're gonna get hit. So you gotta
you gotta somehow do everything you can to to uh
invert that and and step up in Stone. A guy
the best I ever saw was Charles White, if you remember,
it's a Heisman Trumphy winner for USC seven nine, teammate
of mine with the Rams. He backed up Eric Dickerson.
(10:46):
Dickerson was a much better running back, but he was.
But Charles White, he could just come up and then
he just snap his hips and and his hips were
just like he's doing a power clean and he could
just buckle guys and so and and Charles White is
the the only good one I've been around. But you know,
he's probably the best. And so there is a mentality.
(11:06):
There's a technique, but most importantly there's a mentality. And
so so the coach, I know you're not exactly talking
about that, but in the context of that meeting, sure,
when when the coaches is pulling the F bombs, he
is trying to set a tone like hey, like like
we're not gonna absorb that damn freaking rusher. We're gonna
somehow find a way from a stationary position to uncoil
(11:29):
like a cobra and freaking snap a dude in his
freaking chin, right and and and get it. But first
thing first, before we talk about technique, you let have
the right attitude. So it didn't bother me a bit. Uh,
you know, I think Byron Murphery also mentioned, you know, hey,
the Good Lord. Hell I don't paraphrase, but you know,
with the Good Lord's help with the contract, I'll take
(11:50):
care of himself. I mean, there's plenty of Christians that
that respond well to uh, those kinds that kind of
uh motivation exactly as exhibited by him. Okay, I get
the fire. I understand what coach coach needs and and
quite frankly, it's it's as it's as common as uh,
(12:11):
you know, as as uh as as grass blades on
the football field. So I'm trying to think, what's the
most common thing, uh, more common than grass blades? Air molecules. Yeah,
it's as common as as oxygen. So I think you
get my point. Yeah, that doesn't bother me. It's just
part of the deal, Hugh.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
The most newsworthy part of the First Hard Knocks was
the Witherspoon stuff near the end. You can call it
dirty laundry or miscommunication or what have you issue or
no issue after after seeing what you saw, I think.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Right now I feel pretty good about it. I love
that Witherspoon, you know he he he vocalized, I thought
he was great. Here he is driving and what have you.
I think he couldn't have written a script on on
how he said. He says, look, uh, you know, I
think I know my worth. Now I would contest, you know,
(13:07):
we don't. We don't get paid by what's difficult. We
uh a difficult job. We get paid by the scarcity
and how important the job is. But well, we'll just accept.
We'll give him what he said that the the defensive
backs are second, uh, the second most important differ or
excuse me, most difficult position next to quarterback. We'll give
(13:30):
him that, uh what he said. Thereafter he said, you know,
I want to get paid, but he says, hey, my
focus is is on you know, my role in maximizing
the team. I'm paraphrasing. I thought that was great, he
he he like Bia Murphy said, God will take care
of this thing. So you sense that there was a
grounding of him. And and what we've seen from Snyder
(13:53):
and the club through the years is that guys who
bring come to camp with that attitude, it's on almost
like the club wants to reward him for that, Like, hey,
not only has this guy played and been the leader
that we want and he is, he is indispensable in
terms of his emotional the fire this team doesn't have
(14:15):
on an aggregate level in the defense. They don't have
the fire of the twenty thirteen team. Although I'm sure
that there's there's a dozen of them that would would
just you know, kick my ass in an alley for
having said that they would bristle, But I would still
say they didn't have the swag. And so I think
that you've got in Witherspoon, a guy who brings the
(14:35):
swag more than anybody and and kind of sets the tone,
brings the team up, you know, it has his hand
on the thermostatic emotion of that defense. So you're paying
for a lot more than just the productivity. He's a corner,
you know, his job when he plays in the in
the dime defense, when he comes in the slot that
(14:55):
within McDonald's defense. There's a lot of complicated aspects to that.
For him to fast, he's got to have a high IQ,
study a lot, he does all of these things and
so and so when you take all of that and
then you throw in that he has the right attitude
about his contract. Hell, he just saw JSN, you know,
his same year in the draft, both first rounders. He
(15:18):
was the fifth over pick, JSN was the twentieth. Like
he would have every right to say, wait a minute,
take care of me too now, And I think that's
what he's saying. But he's also you know, not being
disruptive to the team whatsoever. So I like the direction
this seems to be going.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah, no doubt, Hey Hugh, before you go, yeah, we
can't let you loose without a quick thought from a
long time two oh six guy on the disaster that
has become our favorite baseball team.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Well this, you know, this weekend, and and you know
I was going to the games in nineteen seventy seven
and yelling Roupe out in the outfield, Ruper Jones, and
and doing my homework in middle school to knee house
the play by play. And so I feel like emotionally
connected this team from their inception. But it's almost like
(16:08):
you have that you know, this is where my heart is,
and this is where my head is. My heart loves
the idea of the Mariners. I mean it's kind of
g rated, almost Disney remember the show Happy Days, you know,
depicting the fifties. There's something about baseball that's unique, and
the summer. The weather's the star because we have to
endure all the gray and the drizzle, and so now
(16:29):
in the summer we get to be outside and watching
the manners. I love all of that, kind of that
Norman Rockwell setting of it. That's my emotion. But then
this weekend I can't get away from my rationale. In
since nineteen seventy seven, the Mariners have the second worst
record in all of the American League. Only the Royals
(16:51):
are just a decimal point lower than them. But the
Royals have two World Series. So if you were doing
a sometime of a scale like this the Times did
for the top fifty players, which I thought they did
a good job. If you're doing a scale, you know,
the Pirates are the only team in the NL National
League who have a worst record, but they've got a
World serieson The Mariners would literally be the worst team
(17:13):
in baseball since nineteen seventy seven. I mean, how do
you feel about the Cleveland Browns? How do you feel Jets? Well,
the Jets won a damn Super Bowl in the sixties
with Nameath But but like if you're if we were
not in Seattle and we were looking at it from
two or three time zones away, and we're just looking
at the Mariners in their history. I know they've they've
they're better now than they were, but in their history
(17:34):
since nineteen seventy seven, you'd say that they're the freaking
Cleveland Browns and so and and and that fact. It
just like this weekend, the fact they get swept and
a year that they're we're looking back at the fifty
years of the Mariners. It's like it was like it
was like perfect, Yeah, you get you're getting swept because
in fifty in those fifty years, you're the worst team
(17:56):
in baseball. Yeah yeah, and and and that that's hard
to even feel emotionally. Well, your rationale tells you to
think that, yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Well, Kansas City has got four World Series appearances since
nineteen eighty. They're not even close to being the Maritors,
not at all. Hueye, you're the man, great stuff. And
we'll talk on Friday about the Cowboy Games.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
Ham me down, all right, all right, but Hugh.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Milling with us on the radio show. We haven't even
addressed that top fifty thing. Dick from Saturday Y dood
and who was left off by the way.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Uh, yeah, you're a you're a little ticket at one hot.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
We'll do it next on ninety three three KJRFM.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
Now back to Southy and Dick at the Virginia Mason
Athletics Center and our special coverage of Seahawks training camp,
brought to you by the Boeing Classic on Sports Radio
ninety three point three kJ r FM.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Alright, boys and girls, we're back at the Virginia Mason
Athletics SENNA. Seahawks training camp continues, Seahawks Cowboys Saturday night
preseason football. Uh lots going on here Byer Murphy. Good
stuff from him, Hugh Milling, good stuff from him. Bill
Krueger will join us at five o'clock tonight. We'll talk
about the series against the Raised, Dick and Jackson. We
(19:11):
can go over the top fifty lists as well, that
I thought generally was a pretty good thing, great ceremony
until they got to the end of the list and
Jeff Nelson didn't hear his name called, which I thought
was absolute chicken crap nonsense by this organization to do
what they did over the weekend in Nelly, He's number
one in games pitched in franchise history. For god's sakes,
(19:32):
he's got a three point two six ERA. He's the
only middle reliever to ever make the All Star Game
as a Mariner?
Speaker 2 (19:39):
What are we doing?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
Can somebody tell me what I'm missing here, Dick? If
I'm missing something, I gladly will hear an argument against it. No,
I will gladly hear an argument. But you know what
this felt like to me? It felt like it wasn't
the top fifty best players. It was the top fifty
best players that the Mariners like, and that maybe John
Stanton is still making Jeff Nelson pay for popping his
p I hole off at the end of the twenty
(20:01):
three season about not making a deal and they traded
him back to the Yankees.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
What else?
Speaker 1 (20:07):
What other reason would there be for Jeff Nelson number
one in games bitched, number one in franchise history. But
you got to find a way to get Dave Valley
on the list and Mike Jackson on the list, and look,
I like those guys, but not over Jeff Nelson.
Speaker 2 (20:26):
What are we doing?
Speaker 3 (20:27):
No, it does appear that July thirty first, two thousand
and three cost Jeff Nelson and I, you know, at
first when I saw your tweet, because I didn't even
know all the list, right, I knew obviously a good
chunk of the list, but I didn't know a lot
of like the bottom ten, bottom fifteen guys on the list.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
So I saw yours.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
My first thought was, Okay, let's play Devil's avocabverse.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
Second, we know that Dave is close to Jeff Nelson.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
They've been friends for a quarter of a century, So
is this kind of clouding the judgment here? And then
I went and looked at the numbers, and I came
up with the same stuff that you came up. I'm
looking at the Mariner war leaders for pitchers right now.
There is exactly one relief pitcher who has a higher
war with the Mariners than Jeff Nelson, and that's JJ Puttz.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Jeff Nelson is higher than all the other guys.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Andre's Munno's, Arthur Rhodes, Mike Jackson's, all the other guys
that got named the top fifty list. So yes, I
believe you. I agree with you. Jeff Nelson should have
absolutely been on the list.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Well, there's just look, there's a perception about the way,
right Jackson, the Mariners do things correct and what's important
to them. And like we talked about in the first
segment of the show, when nobody takes accountability, when nobody
talks to the media, when people run and hide in
the showers after a game, when there's no leadership on
display from the clubhouse except for the manager quoting his
cliche book, then that feeds into certain perceptions that we
(21:50):
have about the franchise. When you do things like leave
Nellie I know you were fired about Gino Suarez too,
when you leave Jeff Nelson off the Top fifty list, who.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
So clearly, so clearly belongs.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
On the list, like people that don't even know Nelly.
Impartial and you're right, dick, friend of mine did a
show with a guy for three years whatever. Okay, it
pissed me off, just like it pisses me off to
find out that Mike Holmgren is still having to wait
for the Hall of Fame for exactly those reasons. But
just because we're close to people doesn't mean that the
arguments are incorrect, right. I mean, Tim Booth and The
(22:26):
Times did a whole story on this, and their number
one miss was Jeff Nelson. So when you do things
like that, guys, it just clearly feeds into the perception
that people have.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
It's interesting you look at the overall all time top
war leaders for the Mariners, and war is only one
of many stats. But you know, Jeff Nelson's not even
that far down there. It's clearly the omission the other
ones that really stand out. I mentioned you mentioned sofi
that I pointed out Ginosporaz.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
I think for a guy.
Speaker 6 (22:53):
Who delivers you one of the biggest moments in your
franchise's history, who you know right now if you and
I don't know if everybudy knows this, if you go
into the Mariners clubhouse and then you take the little
hallway from the clubhouse down to their dugout, a huge
thing is in just lit up letters saying good vibes.
(23:13):
Only they still have that right now, that just it
beams at you when you walk out to the dugout.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
Good vibes.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Only for a guy who had that.
Speaker 6 (23:21):
Kind of influence, who also was a pretty darn good
player at two instances, I think that's a miss. But
also just look at this war thing, Olmarvas scale, he
right now is the thirty sixth highest War Mariner of
all time, he's off Jose Lopez right behind him at
ten point two war he's off, Ken Phelps, Leon Roberts,
Carlos Gian. That rounds out the top five of top
(23:42):
war getters that were left off this list. I think
there's a couple of those, especially Lopez Gian that I
kind of go Mariors, I think you missed big time
on a few of these guys.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Did they, Dick, Did they consider the egos of current
guys too much when they put as many players from
this team on that list? Because Logan Gilbert on it,
Brian wu is on it, Kirby, George Kirby is on it,
Luis Castillo, who's not here, but he's on it right
Julio Rodriguez, Cal Ray, JP Crawford. I mean, I don't
(24:12):
know if George Kirby belongs on.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
That list right now.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
No, I mean, honestly, you know, does George Kirby honestly
belong on a top fifty list right now over a
guy who's number one in games pitched in franchise history.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
I think what's interesting is is Jackson's point, if Gino
Suarez was on this team right now hitting twos even he.
Speaker 4 (24:33):
Just hitting two twenty with like ten probably on the list.
Speaker 3 (24:37):
So I mean I was okay, and now because Gino
is clearly when you look at the most impactful Mariners
of all time, based upon what he did in the Monuments,
he is one of the most impactful Mariners. I just
don't know is a thousand, let's say, thirteen hundred eighties
is that enough to be a top fifty player all
(24:59):
to thirteen hundred eight b is not a lot. That's
like two full seasons some moments. He's very impactful. He's
maybe a top ten or fifteen impactful player of all
time in Mariner history.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yeah. Well, look, I mean I just think guys like
Dave Valley for example, and Mike Jackson. And the problem
with an argument like this is it becomes a I
hate a so gimme b right, And that's not the
deal here. Like I think guys like Dick and I.
You're too young to remember Valley when he was a
catcher playing for the Mariners. But is he on that
(25:31):
list if he's not a broadcaster right now?
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Exactly?
Speaker 3 (25:34):
Well, honestly, guys, the number one name that popped up
to me was your old boy Joel Pinata Dave, Yeah,
Joelle Pinero had two and a half good seasons with
the Mariners and then three terrible seasons with the Mariners,
like he fell off a cliff after two and a
(25:57):
half seasons. Well, to Jackson's point, Gino had two and
a half great seasons too and then didn't fall off
the cliff because he's no longer on the team.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Again, it's just another example of how they just you know,
this should have been something that everybody just loved and whatever,
and then you do something like leave Nelly off and
he's the number one guy for me by far, and
I mean, I'll just be honest with you. He's pissed.
I mean, he's hurt by this, but he's not on
the list, and I don't like it. I don't like,
you know, him feeling that way about the Mariners. And
I really hope that he was that they were clear
(26:28):
with him on what was going on, because you know,
he's doing he's doing games for the Marlins now Nelly
is so he's traveling and they had a game and
if he had known that this was what was going
on that, trust me, he would have been here right.
Other guys decided not to be here like Robbie Cano
and Kyle Seeger, who obviously belong on the list. I'm
not saying they don't. Those guys do for sure, but
(26:48):
I really and I have not heard from anybody. I've
reached out to a couple people and nobody's written back yet.
I doubt they ever will. I really hope that they
were up front with Nelly and saying, look, you've made
the list, we want you here, or let's not just
make this about the fifty guys that could get here,
because that's not how you run a franchise. That's not
how you treat a guy like a Jeff Nelson. And
(27:10):
if he's being punished, what was the date again, Dick that.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
You said, July thirty first, two thousand and three.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Yeah, if he's being punished for something that happened twenty
three years ago, when every fan in baseball agreed with him,
by the way, then shame on them.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Man.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Come on, we're gonna break textimonials and then we'll ask
Bill Krueger about the whole top fifty thing. I'm sure
he'll be thrilled to discuss that. At five on ninety
three three KJJRFM
Dave 'Softy' Mahler and Dick Fain News
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