Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I am. I'm so excited for this conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
You know, I think you know if you've been listening
to me.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
For a while, that I love I love reading opinion pages, editorials,
op eds, and I love writing them as well when
I have time. And I saw a fascinating interview, which,
by the way, is linked on my blog at Rosskaminski
dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
So you can read it yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
It was an interview by my friend Nick Gillespie of
Reason with Adam O'Neill, who is the new opinion editor
at the Washington Post, and the headline is is the
Washington Post Becoming Libertarian? So let's just jump right into
the conversation. Adam O'Neil, Welcome to KOA. It's really good
to have you here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I'm excited to talk about what we're up to at the.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Post before we get it, and we're going to spend
almost all the time on that.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
But before we get to that, just so tell us
a little about you.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
You told me you started a little bit in talk
radio at very low level, but like just briefly on
your background and also are you a libertarian?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (00:59):
I have had a you know, I want to I
don't want to say a standard journalism career, because I've
kind of zigzagged all over the place, but got started
in talk radio, bounced around at some digital publications, spent
time at a couple of newspapers in the Economist, and
then I've been at the at the Post now for
about four months. And as to whether I'm a libertarian,
(01:20):
you know, there's small libertarian you know, in Capital l
I'm not a member of the Libertarian Party, and I
don't know if every view I have is necessarily libertarian,
but I think that there's a lot that the country
can benefit from from a lot of libertarian ideas in
different ways, and I think that's been reflected a lot
in what we've been doing at the Page.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
I have a feeling if if you and I sat
down over a beer or bourbon, we would probably agree
on a on a lot. I think of myself as
mostly Lowercaselle libertarian. My son's middle name is Rand to
give you a sense of kind of where I am.
All right, So you you were? You were brought in
for a reason. He makes a decision this big without
(02:01):
a reason? What's the reason or reasons why you?
Speaker 4 (02:04):
I think the posts we've really wanted to re energize
and reinvigorate the opinion section. Our owner announced earlier this
year that we would be reorienting the section toward free
markets and personal liberties, and those are north stars. And
if you look at the different places I've worked in
my career, that's always been a consistent through line of
(02:25):
advocating these core American values, pushing for more freedom in
the economic realm and the personal realm. And so it
just felt like a natural fit, and I had reached
out and went through the process. And so there's the
ideological aspect of it or the philosophical aspect of it,
and then there's just the practical matter of changing the
(02:45):
newspaper and our section of the newspaper, the opinion section.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
And that's really what I wake up and focus on every.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
Day, is how do we not just advocate that north
star and think through it, but how can we host
really interesting debates within free markets and personal liberties because
that's a huge range of prudential questions about how high
should taxes be, what do you actually want to regulate
or not regulate, And so we're not just you know,
spitting out talking points, but really hosting a debate from
(03:15):
all sort of corners of politics in our pages.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
I will say it was not entirely coincidental that after
reading this interview about you, I bought a digital Washington
Post subscription. So and I think that that sort of
relates to what you're saying about sort of the practical,
the practical aspect of this. I also want to I
want to remind listeners of something as we're talking with
(03:41):
Adam O'Neill, the new opinion editor at the Washington Post,
that within these organizations there's a very important firewall that
really is honored between the opinion section and in the
news people. So just as you're hearing this conversation, don't
think about the news part.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
It's not what Adam is doing. So, Adam, did.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
You when you looked at the Washington Post as you
were thinking about this job within the opinion section, did
you think that there was an obvious bias either through
what was printed or what wasn't printed that made you think,
for both of the reasons you just described, like this
(04:22):
is the kind of change we need to make.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Well, one first, thank you for subscribing.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
That's exactly what we're trying to do is get subscribers,
not just in the DC area. We love our subscribers here,
we create a lot of value for them, but across America.
And I'll say this about the Opinion section, they before
I arrived, the Washington Post had endorsed presidential candidates for
half a century and they never once endorsed the Republican
(04:51):
And I don't spend a lot of time thinking about
individual contributors in the past or looking back on it,
but one of our core issues is that we're a
nonpartis institution. And I think that the Post, throughout its
history almost one hundred and fifty years, has done great journalism,
whether on the new side or the opinion side. And
there are still dozens of people who were here before
I got here, who are still working here, who believe
(05:12):
in the mission and are doing a great job. But
we've moved away from a partisan identity that the section
might have had in the past, and it hosted a
range of voices and so I don't want to paint
a broad brush on everybody. But the endorsement issue, I
think is just a real clear crystallization. Every four years,
you knew which party was getting the endorsement from the Post,
(05:32):
and that's no longer the case. I want people when
they read us to be surprised, and I think that's
happening a lot. They're not going to know if we're
going to hit a Republican or Democrat or praise a
Republican or Democrat based on party, but instead its first
principles that are guiding us.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
And that's really how we're thinking about it going forward.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
As part of the process. Did you meet with Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Jeff and I are totally aligned, and he's involved in
the paper, but he hires leaders to lead and not
really a micromanager on that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, got it, that makes sense. So we've just got
maybe ninety seconds here.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So how excited are you for this?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
And do you believe that there is a real market
because I do.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Actually, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
For example, I don't know if you're aware of a
network called News Nation and they're trying to stake out
kind of being honest and I.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Don't even want to say centrist.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
I want to say even handed, because they'll have partisans
on both sides to have a debate, but they're even
handed and kind of feels to me like that's what
you want to do. But a lot of the big
boys in TV and even in newspapers seem to have
thought that the market just comes from offering confirmation bias.
So are you confident there is a market for what
you are trying to do?
Speaker 4 (06:47):
I genuinely do believe that there is. We've got millions
of subscribers. They're very smart, discerning people, and we're continuing
to provide a product that they're going to like. At
the same time, there are millions people across America who
frankly don't trust big legacy media institutions, and what we're
trying to do is say it's going to take some
(07:07):
time to rebuild that trust, but check us out. Come
to the opinion section and you'll see that there really
is a range, and over time a lot of things
you'll say like, oh, hey, they were right about that,
or oh maybe they didn't get that right, but they
had an interesting way of thinking about it. And we
think that we can diversify our audience geographically, political outlook,
(07:28):
different age groups. We really think that there are a
lot of people who would get a ton of value
from what we do, and they just either have lost
the trust or they just don't know it's there. So
it's finding the readers where they are and consistently showing
them there's value in the Washington.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
Post and in Post opinion.
Speaker 4 (07:44):
You're going to have the most interesting debates going on
in the country on a daily basis when you open
up the app or the print edition or wherever you
like to read it or on social.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
I'm really looking forward to it.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
I will say, I believe you that you have smart
and discern earning readers and subscribers, but you also have
me in addition to In addition to those people, you
also have me.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
So there's that, and thanks so much for your time.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
I wish you lots of success, and maybe if you're
open to it, I'll be in touch to see if I.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Could potentially write for you from time to time.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
I love that, and you'd love to hop on some
time in the future just chat about the news.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
It's great. Let's uh, let's keep the dialogue going.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Ross absolutely.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Adam O'Neill is the new opinion editor at The Washington Post. Thanks, congratulations,
good luck, and we'll talk again soon.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Thanks man. Take care
I am. I'm so excited for this conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
You know, I think you know if you've been listening
to me.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
For a while, that I love I love reading opinion pages, editorials,
op eds, and I love writing them as well when
I have time. And I saw a fascinating interview, which,
by the way, is linked on my blog at Rosskaminski
dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
So you can read it yourself.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
It was an interview by my friend Nick Gillespie of
Reason with Adam O'Neill, who is the new opinion editor
at the Washington Post, and the headline is is the
Washington Post Becoming Libertarian? So let's just jump right into
the conversation. Adam O'Neil, Welcome to KOA. It's really good
to have you here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
I'm excited to talk about what we're up to at the.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Post before we get it, and we're going to spend
almost all the time on that.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
But before we get to that, just so tell us
a little about you.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
You told me you started a little bit in talk
radio at very low level, but like just briefly on
your background and also are you a libertarian?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (00:59):
I have had a you know, I want to I
don't want to say a standard journalism career, because I've
kind of zigzagged all over the place, but got started
in talk radio, bounced around at some digital publications, spent
time at a couple of newspapers in the Economist, and
then I've been at the at the Post now for
about four months. And as to whether I'm a libertarian,
(01:20):
you know, there's small libertarian you know, in Capital l
I'm not a member of the Libertarian Party, and I
don't know if every view I have is necessarily libertarian,
but I think that there's a lot that the country
can benefit from from a lot of libertarian ideas in
different ways, and I think that's been reflected a lot
in what we've been doing at the Page.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
I have a feeling if if you and I sat
down over a beer or bourbon, we would probably agree
on a on a lot. I think of myself as
mostly Lowercaselle libertarian. My son's middle name is Rand to
give you a sense of kind of where I am.
All right, So you you were? You were brought in
for a reason. He makes a decision this big without
(02:01):
a reason? What's the reason or reasons why you?
Speaker 4 (02:04):
I think the posts we've really wanted to re energize
and reinvigorate the opinion section. Our owner announced earlier this
year that we would be reorienting the section toward free
markets and personal liberties, and those are north stars. And
if you look at the different places I've worked in
my career, that's always been a consistent through line of
(02:25):
advocating these core American values, pushing for more freedom in
the economic realm and the personal realm. And so it
just felt like a natural fit, and I had reached
out and went through the process. And so there's the
ideological aspect of it or the philosophical aspect of it,
and then there's just the practical matter of changing the
(02:45):
newspaper and our section of the newspaper, the opinion section.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
And that's really what I wake up and focus on every.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
Day, is how do we not just advocate that north
star and think through it, but how can we host
really interesting debates within free markets and personal liberties because
that's a huge range of prudential questions about how high
should taxes be, what do you actually want to regulate
or not regulate, And so we're not just you know,
spitting out talking points, but really hosting a debate from
(03:15):
all sort of corners of politics in our pages.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
I will say it was not entirely coincidental that after
reading this interview about you, I bought a digital Washington
Post subscription. So and I think that that sort of
relates to what you're saying about sort of the practical,
the practical aspect of this. I also want to I
want to remind listeners of something as we're talking with
(03:41):
Adam O'Neill, the new opinion editor at the Washington Post,
that within these organizations there's a very important firewall that
really is honored between the opinion section and in the
news people. So just as you're hearing this conversation, don't
think about the news part.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
It's not what Adam is doing. So, Adam, did.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
You when you looked at the Washington Post as you
were thinking about this job within the opinion section, did
you think that there was an obvious bias either through
what was printed or what wasn't printed that made you think,
for both of the reasons you just described, like this
(04:22):
is the kind of change we need to make.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
Well, one first, thank you for subscribing.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
That's exactly what we're trying to do is get subscribers,
not just in the DC area. We love our subscribers here,
we create a lot of value for them, but across America.
And I'll say this about the Opinion section, they before
I arrived, the Washington Post had endorsed presidential candidates for
half a century and they never once endorsed the Republican
(04:51):
And I don't spend a lot of time thinking about
individual contributors in the past or looking back on it,
but one of our core issues is that we're a
nonpartis institution. And I think that the Post, throughout its
history almost one hundred and fifty years, has done great journalism,
whether on the new side or the opinion side. And
there are still dozens of people who were here before
I got here, who are still working here, who believe
(05:12):
in the mission and are doing a great job. But
we've moved away from a partisan identity that the section
might have had in the past, and it hosted a
range of voices and so I don't want to paint
a broad brush on everybody. But the endorsement issue, I
think is just a real clear crystallization. Every four years,
you knew which party was getting the endorsement from the Post,
(05:32):
and that's no longer the case. I want people when
they read us to be surprised, and I think that's
happening a lot. They're not going to know if we're
going to hit a Republican or Democrat or praise a
Republican or Democrat based on party, but instead its first
principles that are guiding us.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
And that's really how we're thinking about it going forward.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
As part of the process. Did you meet with Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Jeff and I are totally aligned, and he's involved in
the paper, but he hires leaders to lead and not
really a micromanager on that sort of thing.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yeah, got it, that makes sense. So we've just got
maybe ninety seconds here.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
So how excited are you for this?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
And do you believe that there is a real market
because I do.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Actually, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
For example, I don't know if you're aware of a
network called News Nation and they're trying to stake out
kind of being honest and I.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Don't even want to say centrist.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
I want to say even handed, because they'll have partisans
on both sides to have a debate, but they're even
handed and kind of feels to me like that's what
you want to do. But a lot of the big
boys in TV and even in newspapers seem to have
thought that the market just comes from offering confirmation bias.
So are you confident there is a market for what
you are trying to do?
Speaker 4 (06:47):
I genuinely do believe that there is. We've got millions
of subscribers. They're very smart, discerning people, and we're continuing
to provide a product that they're going to like. At
the same time, there are millions people across America who
frankly don't trust big legacy media institutions, and what we're
trying to do is say it's going to take some
(07:07):
time to rebuild that trust, but check us out. Come
to the opinion section and you'll see that there really
is a range, and over time a lot of things
you'll say like, oh, hey, they were right about that,
or oh maybe they didn't get that right, but they
had an interesting way of thinking about it. And we
think that we can diversify our audience geographically, political outlook,
(07:28):
different age groups. We really think that there are a
lot of people who would get a ton of value
from what we do, and they just either have lost
the trust or they just don't know it's there. So
it's finding the readers where they are and consistently showing
them there's value in the Washington.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
Post and in Post opinion.
Speaker 4 (07:44):
You're going to have the most interesting debates going on
in the country on a daily basis when you open
up the app or the print edition or wherever you
like to read it or on social.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
I'm really looking forward to it.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
I will say, I believe you that you have smart
and discern earning readers and subscribers, but you also have
me in addition to In addition to those people, you
also have me.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
So there's that, and thanks so much for your time.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
I wish you lots of success, and maybe if you're
open to it, I'll be in touch to see if I.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
Could potentially write for you from time to time.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
I love that, and you'd love to hop on some
time in the future just chat about the news.
Speaker 3 (08:22):
It's great. Let's uh, let's keep the dialogue going.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Ross absolutely.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Adam O'Neill is the new opinion editor at The Washington Post. Thanks, congratulations,
good luck, and we'll talk again soon.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Thanks man. Take care
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