The Troubleshooter 11-10-25

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yea ripped up.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
News. So you don't have come run in just as
as as we can. Shooter's gonna help come.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
Man, This is the Troubleshooter Show. No Tom Martino, I'm
Tom Martino and I'm here to help you. The show
has been established more than fifty years ago, forty five
years in Denver, fighting for you. It did major Mark,
major sign up here. I'm on the hey man, hey brother,

(00:40):
what do you think? Government shut down? And then it's
gonna be over.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
It's gonna be over in a couple of days, which
is great. And I'm curious what we do with the
uh affordable well Obamacare, let's just call it what it is.
That'll be interesting because we're not doing anything on that
for the Democrats to open up the government. And what
is even crazy is the Democrats are going at each

(01:04):
other's throats about this.

Speaker 5 (01:06):
Have you read up on some of these armies.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
Yeah, it's incredible. What's going on? You know? Is this
safe to say? And by the way, Jonathan Europe about
the Broncos game. Mark, by the way, and Suzanne, we're
at the Broncos game Thursday night. I'm assuming that's the
game you're talking about, But Mark, it's just never been
like this before, such division. I mean, people disagreed, but

(01:31):
there's a different level of disagreement. Don't you Don't you
feel that? Don't you feel that?

Speaker 4 (01:36):
I mean even with even within their own party, the
party is fractioning big time. I think we need to
come up with that third party, and that might be
the people in the middle. It would be nice to
have at some point.

Speaker 3 (01:49):
Those tuning in my partner, Mark Major at Casa Studio.
I'm at Casa Studio and we are solving problems, answering questions,
saying complains. Jonathan, Oh, okay, who's in the bow, Deputy Doc.
Thanks listen, people, the main goal of this show is

(02:10):
to try to solve problems. Sometimes we don't solve your problem,
but it helps others listening, maybe with similar problems where
someone who's about to enter a transaction and we don't
want him to make a mistake. So, Jonathan, what's happening
with the Bronco game and the towing? It sounds like
a nightmare.

Speaker 6 (02:30):
Take it away, Jonathan, Yeah, yeah, thanks, Tom, just love
your show, Thank.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
You, thank you. Yeah, what's going on? Yeah?

Speaker 6 (02:39):
It was it was pretty egregious. I mean, after the game.
You know, we're looking for our car and we're just like, man,
did we park on a different street or what?

Speaker 7 (02:47):
What's going on?

Speaker 3 (02:48):
You know, it is it is a terrible It is
a terrible fricking feeling. I'll tell you what. I had
it once and you're right, So how did you figure
out it was towed and all that?

Speaker 6 (03:00):
Well, we actually had a couple there was probably about
five or six couples who were also frantically looking around,
and they go, are you missing.

Speaker 1 (03:09):
Your car too?

Speaker 6 (03:10):
And then it hit me, oh my gosh, did we
all get towed? And after having conversations with a couple
of people, they said, not only did they tow a
handful of cars, they towed the entire street?

Speaker 7 (03:22):
And well was it was?

Speaker 3 (03:23):
It? Were they? Okay? Did they do it legally? Who
ordered the tow? Tell us all about the toe? Well,
I mean, towing is not illegal, even the whole street
if they were parked illegally. To shed some light on this, Jonathan,
even where you may have screwed up, go ahead.

Speaker 6 (03:40):
Yeah, so some people definitely screwed up. They didn't read
the fine print that says during event, you know, it
says during stadium events you will be towed this way.
But okay, toe people illegally and I was one of them.
And how I know is we were in between the signs.
I have pictures of the signs.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
What does that mean? You were in the proper So
you were not in the area where it was illegal?

Speaker 7 (04:05):
Correct?

Speaker 1 (04:06):
Correct?

Speaker 6 (04:06):
And other people they the signs were actually hidden by
certain trees. There was bushes in some areas, so if
you were headed north or you know, you weren't really
paying attention to there was signs actually even somewhat not
you couldn't really recognize them.

Speaker 7 (04:21):
But hey, do you have well.

Speaker 3 (04:22):
You have pictures.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
You said you had pictures not only of the signs,
but do you have pictures of when you were actually
parked there where your car was parked?

Speaker 7 (04:32):
Yeah, exactly, so when I yeah.

Speaker 4 (04:34):
Why wait wait wait wait, I had a feeling you
were going to say that, why did you take the pictures?

Speaker 7 (04:40):
Well?

Speaker 6 (04:40):
I took the pictures because you know, I usually just
do and I knew that you know this, it was
pretty cool, So you.

Speaker 3 (04:47):
Took a picture. I agree with Mark, that's unusual. So
you took a picture before you were told.

Speaker 6 (04:54):
No, no, no, no. I got the pictures, so I
took a picture of the signs after I was told
I saw the pictures of my car once I paid
the ticket. On the ticket, you can go down to details.
It's all online and they provide.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
So the toe company, the tow company, has pictures of
your car and it shows that it was parked legally.

Speaker 6 (05:17):
Yep, the car is inside the two signs that clearly
show you can't park this way, you can't park this way,
and there was two spots were legal, and I.

Speaker 8 (05:30):
Is that?

Speaker 7 (05:31):
Yeah? So I I was coming from out of town.

Speaker 6 (05:35):
I was born and raised in Colorado, and I was
meeting the family or going to the game. And so
my idea was, well, they saw on my license plate
it said fleet which way.

Speaker 7 (05:46):
Maybe they knew right.

Speaker 6 (05:47):
Away that this guy's from out of town, or this
guy's you know, he's using a rental and they just
took it anyways, or maybe the tow truck drivers weren't
even paying attention and they're just like, let's just take
the whole street.

Speaker 3 (06:00):
But those when you got those pictures, have you called
the toe company?

Speaker 7 (06:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (06:05):
And what was really This is where this story gets
even crazier.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
What's the name of the tow company? By the way,
what's the what's the name of the tow company?

Speaker 7 (06:13):
I believe it was, as it might have been ast Towing.
I'll double check on that.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
I can't do What were you saying? You were saying
something very unusual. Go ahead.

Speaker 6 (06:24):
Yeah, So when I got down there, I actually showed
the police officer. Because this is where this story gets
even weirder. Is they give you, they give you an.

Speaker 7 (06:32):
Address to go pick up your car.

Speaker 6 (06:34):
And mind you, what none of us knew is that
you only get an hour and a half till after
the game is over to go find your car, So
you have to figure out ways to.

Speaker 3 (06:43):
Well what does that mean? Like, well, what does that mean?
You only get an hour and a half. What happens
after an hour and a half.

Speaker 6 (06:49):
They they shut down the tow yard and they double
the price and you have to pick it up tomorrow
or the next day.

Speaker 3 (06:55):
Oh got it?

Speaker 6 (06:56):
Okay, So they only give you a So if the
game goes into overtimers, then you're not picking your car
up like you only get you know, you only.

Speaker 7 (07:03):
Get so much fur.

Speaker 6 (07:06):
The address and go to drops you off at this
main building in the middle of nowhere and there's nothing around,
and thank god, a guy comes up to me. He says, hey,
you know you got to walk like a half mile
down the road.

Speaker 3 (07:18):
By the way, was this considered a police authorized toe?

Speaker 6 (07:24):
Yes, because there was nine police officers there.

Speaker 7 (07:28):
When we when.

Speaker 3 (07:30):
The police, the police authorized the toe, and and Mark,
when when the police up authorized the toe. It's a
totally different set of rules in circumstances, agreed.

Speaker 4 (07:44):
Yeah, when it comes to getting the vehicle picked up,
it sure is.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (07:49):
Also, well yeah, they go ahead, they may be do
a breathalyzer. So I had I came. When I came
and picked it up, they were kind of you know,
you know, shaping everybody up into a corner and they're like, here,
so wait a minute.

Speaker 3 (08:03):
You had to do a breathalyzer when you went to
pick up your car from the towyard.

Speaker 1 (08:07):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (08:08):
Yeah, So I he was like, yeah, they you know,
they send you to one cop, they send you to
another top another cop takes your name.

Speaker 3 (08:13):
Then they said, okay, but is your main complaint today?
Your main complaint today is, if I had to sum
this up, Tom Mark, I was parked legally for the
game in between two signs where you can clearly see
I was legally parked and I was towed period? Is
that it?

Speaker 7 (08:33):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (08:34):
Yeah, that's that's basically it. Yeah, and I know that
there was others too that were parked legally as well
that also got towed.

Speaker 7 (08:42):
But I mean, what.

Speaker 6 (08:43):
Happens if you don't have money, you don't have your phones,
not to.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
You're screwed to the Oh no, no, you're absolutely right.
But do they acknowledge have you been able to speak
to anyone even at the police station or somewhere that
acknowledge is yeah.

Speaker 6 (09:01):
So when I got up to the police officer who
breathalyized me, I was like, hey, can you take a
look at these paps?

Speaker 3 (09:05):
Now? Where was the police officer? Was the police officer
at the site where it was towed or was the
police officer at the tow company? Where was this police officer?

Speaker 7 (09:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (09:15):
The police officers were at the tow company all about
nine o's oh and then.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
Ok yeah they were there greeting. What they were greeting
people that coming to get their car.

Speaker 6 (09:27):
My guess is one for protection and for me just
to make sure nobody's drinking and driving, but.

Speaker 3 (09:32):
For okay, there there was a lot of cops.

Speaker 6 (09:35):
And yeah, after I took my breathalyzer.

Speaker 7 (09:37):
I showed the top. I was like, hey man, I'm
not even sure why I got towed.

Speaker 6 (09:41):
I was like, can you take a look at these pictures?
And he took a look at him and he goes,
you know what, I'm not sure why you got towed.
And I was like, is there anything you can do
right now? And he goes, no, you have to take
it up with the toe company, And so I have
to pay the one hundred and twenty dollars to get
it out. I had to pay the seventy five dollars ticket,
and they the only way that I can fight it

(10:01):
is I have to fly back to Denver go to
an in person.

Speaker 4 (10:05):
Yeah, well that's not no, that's not correct. That's not
the only way, because you made the right call. If
you say, hold on a second, mark, hold on, we're.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
Gonna help you. Give it. That's right, give him. We're
gonna give you some specific information. So you hang on
because I have to take a break. And really it's
not a break, it's full information. Our show is like
any other show, and that everything is important that we do.
But it's important to tell you that if you have
a problem, a question, or complaint, you can call us

(10:34):
at three oh three Martino three oh three six two
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(11:23):
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and that is for renew home innovations. All right, so Mark,
you looked at the pictures. Tell me what you're finding, sir.

Speaker 5 (12:07):
Well, I'm a little curious here. Let's bring that caller up.

Speaker 4 (12:11):
And it says, I see the no parking and I
see the era. Where was your car looking at the
picture here?

Speaker 3 (12:19):
Because they were between he's claiming it was between yeah,
two signs.

Speaker 7 (12:25):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 6 (12:26):
So you have one sign basically pointing north that says
no parking, and then the other sign is pointing south,
no parking, and then it shows that you know the
stadium events, so that I mean, which is crazy because
that probably includes compos.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
The one here it says it says no parking noon
to nine during large stadium events except permitted.

Speaker 4 (12:51):
Nope, I'm reading that completely different time. I'm reading no
parking period, end of story. Then after that it says
twelve noon to nine pm during large stadium events, a permit.

Speaker 3 (13:05):
Accepted, meaning it's a meaning that you can park there
with the proper credentials.

Speaker 6 (13:14):
But that would be south of that, right.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
No, that's right, it would be in the it would
be in the direction of the arrow. So it's telling you,
as Mark pointed out, you can't park back there unless
it's during a stadium event and you have a proper permit.

Speaker 5 (13:32):
But I'm saying something else.

Speaker 4 (13:34):
What I'm saying is I agree to the right of
the sign or behind the signs pointing you can park
there if you have a permit. Except right Other than that,
I'm seeing there is no parking anywhere. So I don't
understand why you're thinking you can park even in front
of where the arrow is. I'm saying the arrow is

(13:54):
pointing to where it is accepted only during events.

Speaker 3 (13:58):
Okay, Mark, But but it is it is. It does
show an arrow though, right, I mean, it does show
an arrow, And wouldn't you agree or wouldn't you assume
it's from that parking sign backward? In other words, in
front of that sign. It's not applying to in front

(14:19):
of that sign. Do you have the white pickup truck?

Speaker 9 (14:21):
Sir?

Speaker 6 (14:23):
No, that was ironically one of the ladies who I was,
you know, but that's.

Speaker 3 (14:28):
Where you were parked. You were parked between these two signs.

Speaker 6 (14:32):
In between the two signs, and she was like, Hey,
that's my truck, and you sent me that.

Speaker 3 (14:36):
And by the way, I want to make something clear
when it says no parking and then accept not as
accept but exception. There is an exception during studio of
stadium events for those who have a permit. So that's
what it means accepted. So you're accepted. The law does

(14:58):
not apply to you if you have one of these permits.
Suffice it to say you didn't have a permit, you
were parked in front of the sign, and you believe
all's fair in that. But but the way.

Speaker 4 (15:07):
I'm w wait, wait, wait that other sign in front
of the white truck. Does it have an arrow pointing
what direction? What does it say?

Speaker 3 (15:15):
I can't read it? Oh wait, oh, we're right I truck.

Speaker 6 (15:17):
Yeah, yeah, I put a picture in there of that.
Also it says no parking and then it has a
street sweeping you know, call out, but it's pointing north basically,
so there's two spots that should be legal.

Speaker 3 (15:28):
No, I agree, Yeah, I agree. I totally agree that
though those signs specifically point in a direction. Listen, I've
done that before where it says no parking, and I've
gone in front of the sign where I can park again.
This okay, So but you got to go to a

(15:48):
referee or something. You're gonna have to take some action. Now.
If you're claiming it was the Toe company, well hell
if you have pictures showing did you, Why didn't you
show us the Toe company pictures that they supplied to you.

Speaker 6 (16:04):
Yeah, those are on there, so I put those on there.
They should be the last three pictures, but those are
all okay. I was driving that Hondai ConA that was
my rental car. It's that car, and you can clearly
see him in mark.

Speaker 3 (16:19):
Do you see the ones? That's okay, the ConA right there,
but I can't clearly see where it is. I just
see the ConA, but me too.

Speaker 6 (16:26):
But you're saying, so, yeah, you can see the white building.
And I looked, and I'm thinking, because I took a
screenshot of the maps, the street view from the maps
to show that.

Speaker 3 (16:36):
Building as well.

Speaker 6 (16:37):
You can clearly see I'm in front of the Would
you take this.

Speaker 3 (16:42):
To small claims court? If it was you, would you
take into small claims court? I would?

Speaker 4 (16:46):
But I think the first call and I think we
have a deputy call over with these pictures, not of
his ConA, but of the ones we've been talking about
with the white truck. Because here's what I'm saying. Once again,
I believe how I read it, it's no parking. It
doesn't matter if it's in front of that sign or
behind the sign, unless it's during an event and you

(17:09):
have an a permit, then you can park to the
right of the sign or behind the sign, and you
can't park in front of it.

Speaker 5 (17:17):
I don't read it to where you're allowed to park.

Speaker 4 (17:20):
In between the two signs. I simply don't read it
that way.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
Well, okay, very confusing, it is it is.

Speaker 4 (17:29):
I agree with you, and that's why I think Small
Claims Court might side with you. But then we come
up with the same issue. You're out of state. It's
going to cost you a fortune to do it. So
what I would like to do is, let's put one
of our deputies on to send this information over and say,
come on, guys, what's going on here?

Speaker 3 (17:49):
Explain it to us. They don't let them tell it
to me. You can't do a teleconference a Small Claims court.
No Ah, that's going to be a pain. So listen.
And it's not their fault, obviously you're out of state,
but you're going to have to do something on your own.
If they don't do it voluntarily, We'll have a deputy

(18:11):
call over there. Deputy Bow, why don't you call over there?

Speaker 5 (18:14):
Yeah, just sak your teeth into it, man.

Speaker 10 (18:16):
Yeah, send me the email CLI over there this afternoon.

Speaker 3 (18:20):
Yeah, I would like to see if we could. Maybe
you can even pop a call now just to say
if they just to see if they would consider photographic evidence.
I mean when you when you tried to show it
to someone, caller, what what the police officer said, Well,
I don't know why you're You know, even, Toad, did

(18:40):
you talk to anyone at the toe company when you
were picking up your car? Was that before you knew
where you stood?

Speaker 7 (18:47):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (18:47):
So well I showed the officer and yep, he said,
I don't know why you were Toad.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
So when I went and.

Speaker 6 (18:53):
Talked to the front desk lady, she says, the only
thing you can do is dispute it after you get
your car out. So I had no choice but the page.

Speaker 3 (19:00):
Well okay, well and that's what you're doing right now.
We'll make the call. Thank you. Three oh three seven
one three talk seven one three eight two five five
before break eron, I want to get started with you
issues with contractors just pissed me off. I'm not sure
which one it is, but sum it up in a
sentence and then we'll come back to Aaron and and

(19:20):
get to the meat of it. What's happening?

Speaker 8 (19:24):
All right?

Speaker 7 (19:24):
So can you hear me?

Speaker 3 (19:26):
Yes? I can, sir very well?

Speaker 11 (19:27):
Okay, all right?

Speaker 8 (19:29):
So yeah, so essentially what it is, I'm looking to
build a steal building on my property outside of Colorado Springs,
and I went with a contractor.

Speaker 12 (19:39):
That I had a good relationship with it.

Speaker 8 (19:41):
The funding took a bit longer, so it's been over
several months and we've had a couple of delays.

Speaker 3 (19:47):
Now, now, did you let me ask you this. Did
you buy the building separately and then go to your
contractor or did you do everything through your contractor?

Speaker 8 (19:57):
Everything is through the contractor.

Speaker 3 (19:59):
Okay, So you said I want to build a steel
building and he went ahead and started the whole process.
Where was the first sign of breakdown?

Speaker 8 (20:09):
Last about eight days ago when we were supposed to
get started.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
Yeah, and all right, hold on, then we'll come back
and talk about this. Steel buildings, by the way, is
a real big topic on this show.

Speaker 1 (20:23):
Now.

Speaker 3 (20:23):
I'm not saying it's the steal building's problem. It could be,
of course, it could be the contractor it could be anything.
We'll talk about that coming up. I want to tell
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(20:45):
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(21:08):
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(21:29):
Man dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance
three oh three nine two zero, sixteen twenty two. Hi
Tom Martino here, Welcome to the show. I want to
go to Aaron now and talk about this problem. Hire
a contractor for a still building and what went wrong?

Speaker 7 (21:54):
Okay?

Speaker 8 (21:55):
Yeah, So I hired them to do the concrete, concrete
work and building. So we had really great communication.

Speaker 3 (22:04):
What kind of concrete were the slabs for the building? Correct? Okay,
got it, keep going, sir, Sorry, yep.

Speaker 8 (22:12):
We had great communication up until very recently. I got
some of the other prep work done that needed to
get done for the building, and then we were going
to tentatively set up a date to start as October
twenty seventh, and at that point in time, the contractor
messed me saying, can't start that week. I have some
pretty serious and medical appointments and I'll be wiped out

(22:33):
coming up, so let's start the next week. And I'm like, okay,
that's fine. And then that next week would have been
November third. November third came no and showed up. I
called it, went to voicemail. He texted me. I said, hey,
is the one coming? No job ran late. We'll be
there Tuesday and then similar, you know, similar thing on Tuesday.

Speaker 3 (22:55):
Have you paid money so far? Please tell me you
did not pay money up front? So far?

Speaker 7 (23:03):
I did?

Speaker 3 (23:04):
How much did you pay upfront?

Speaker 8 (23:07):
A thirty percent down? So it ended up being right
around twenty four k?

Speaker 3 (23:12):
And why did you do that?

Speaker 8 (23:17):
Contractually? That's what it said that it needed.

Speaker 3 (23:19):
And so okay, Aaron, let's let me let me and
I'm doing this. It's really a rhetorical question why you
did it. I know it's in the contract, but you
don't see contracts are negotiable. And I would never ever,
ever put thirty percent down or money upfront ever. Okay,
that's just the way it is. Okay, So I there there,

(23:42):
and I shouldn't say ever. If you ordered something and
you can verify it was ordered, then you put the
money down, but you're really not putting bound money in advance.
What was the reason he needed thirty percent down?

Speaker 8 (23:55):
Well that was that was that was told that we
were ordering the building to data contract.

Speaker 3 (24:00):
Okay, well then that's different. That's different if you were truly,
but you should have verified the you know, I hate
to say this because it sounds like it sounds like
it's overkill, but it's not. In today's day and age,
you have to verify everything. So if a contractor says
to me, Tom, you need to put thirty percent down,
I say why and they say, well, we're ordering materials.

(24:21):
I'll say, okay, I want to see the order in
my name and I'll pake the deposit directly to the
supply house. I mean, you have to protect yourself. Do
you realize that every single contracting problem and Aaron, please
excuse us because Mark and I seek to prevent future problems.

(24:41):
So I'm not addressing this all at you, But ninety
eight percent or more? How many mark can you recall?
When it comes to contracting, it starts out with money down,
and then contractors simply do not put the money towards
your job. They run out of money, or they delay,
and it's against the Contractor's Trust Act, which can be criminal.

(25:04):
Even so, here's all I need to know, first of all,
a few really quick questions. Then I'll let you continue
because we'll get to work on this. I am this
pisses me off. Who is the contractor?

Speaker 8 (25:16):
His name is Kellen K E L l E N.
Last name is Vance v A Ncee of Vance Metal
Buildings LLC.

Speaker 3 (25:26):
Okay, now, what is the latest song and dance you're
getting from this guy? Uh, as far as what are
he's going to do?

Speaker 8 (25:35):
Yeah, So basically what I did is I reached out
to him this morning because I just got a bad,
really really bad feeling last night. I talked to my wife,
so she did some kind of internet slooping online. The
song and dance we got yesterday or last week? Is
that the reason why he hasn't been able to reach
out because he's in.

Speaker 13 (25:55):
Chemo and ah, he men like.

Speaker 8 (25:58):
I said, that serious medical issue.

Speaker 14 (26:00):
You.

Speaker 8 (26:00):
My wife was able to verify that there is an
account that telf caring Bridge. So it does seem in
fact that this gentleman is going through some.

Speaker 3 (26:09):
Well listen, having gone through cancer and chemo, I can understand,
but that still doesn't excuse him of the financial responsibility.
My question would be, apart from chemo and all of that,
my heart goes out to him. I'm fine, but where's
your money? I mean, what did he did he order
the building? And if he did, where is it? What

(26:30):
is exactly on the job site right now? Nothing?

Speaker 8 (26:35):
And that's what I just messaged him today. I was like,
I want to execute Okay, I want to terminate this
contract for a failure to render services. You have not
shown to me that you say you've ordered the building,
but just much to your point, I have no proof
you ordered the building. I have no no work being done.
I told him as a back on October sixth, you

(26:57):
said you would you would file for permits. I verify
through pist Speak Regional Building yesterday that you have not
applied for permit.

Speaker 3 (27:03):
All right, Mark, what is your gut? What is your gut? Mark?
You got a good gut on these things? What would
you do?

Speaker 4 (27:08):
I'd like to call and talk to the contractor myself.
So I want Kelly to send me the information on
that that thirty percent you put down. Did you pay
him anything else? And how much does that represent? And
was the steel ever delivered or did you get the
wet stamps or the drawings?

Speaker 5 (27:26):
What has been done?

Speaker 3 (27:29):
Well?

Speaker 8 (27:29):
So he offered to provide me the extradent architectural plans,
which I said I didn't need because you're applying for
the permit. So it's hard nothing.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
No, no, no, but getting them would be something just
to have, just to see if he comes through. So
where does it stand right now?

Speaker 8 (27:48):
Where it stands right now?

Speaker 6 (27:50):
Is?

Speaker 8 (27:50):
I emailed him this morning, telling him that I did
not want to move forward with him, that I need
to move forward with another contractor. Yeah, I just want
the money that I put down as a deposit return
because no services have been rendered, no proof of building
has been ordered.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
No.

Speaker 3 (28:07):
Well, I think you're entitled under the Contractor's Trust Act.
You need to mention the Contractors Trust Act by name,
and you need to say that money was And I'm
telling you, I am so sick and tired of people
violating this. But under the Contractor's Trust Act, you are
absolutely not. You cannot use that money for anything. You

(28:29):
can't even use it for rent. It has to be
put in trust. People don't understand how serious that is.
It's like a retainer you give to an attorney. It's
got to be put in trust and it cannot be
used for anything else. You have to tell him you're
going to pursue him. Let me just give you the
number so you can look it up. Okay, it's CRS,

(28:51):
which stands for Colorado Revised Statues at Statutes. And we will,
by the way, help you with a call to and
we'll give this to someone. But here's the number. Three
to eight dash, two to two dash one two seven. Now,
I know that I gave Bo a problem this morning,

(29:13):
but the reason I'm giving him this stock is not
that I don't trust you, but Bo is specifically very
adapt adept at contractor stuff. So Bo, what I'd like
you to do is really lean hard on this Colorado,
this Trust Act, this Trust Act. People, I'm telling you

(29:35):
we have to start demanding action. We do. We have
to start demanding action. Now. Debra's got a question on
a will, which is great, and then we also have
Michael as a question on the state planning. So what
I'd like to do is during the break for them,
I want to get Dan McKenzie on the phone if
we can, that would be great to help us out.
Dan McKenzie McKenzie law who does that as well. All right,

(29:57):
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one help. You'll think you're his only customer when you

(30:42):
choose Frank durand the real estate Man dot com to
list your home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine
two zero sixteen twenty two. Tom Arsino here along with
Mark Major, and I also have doctor Joel Schrdach from
Denver Regen dot com we'll talk to in a minute.
Here calls take priority. Deborah has a question on a will,
and we have Dan McKenzie up from mackenzie Law, and

(31:04):
I can honestly say I am a client. He can't
say that because of the privilege. But I am a
client and they're helping me with my estate plan, which
I should have done a long time ago. I mean,
when you look mortality dead in the face like this,
it should have been done. But anyway, I digress. Let's
go to Deborah. Deborah, what is your question? Dare what's happening?

Speaker 9 (31:26):
Well, Hi, Hi, I just have a quick question. My
husband died in July. I'm noticing on the will that
was written up by his son, he had a family
friend witness and.

Speaker 14 (31:45):
Sign for it.

Speaker 9 (31:47):
Can he be my late husband's personal representative?

Speaker 3 (31:53):
You're asking, Kenny be as if let me ask you
want him to be. No. Are you saying, did that
make him the personal representative? No?

Speaker 9 (32:07):
My husband wrote that down, and I think it's a
conflict of interest.

Speaker 3 (32:11):
Okay, but but did your husband actually name him personal representative?

Speaker 6 (32:17):
The person.

Speaker 9 (32:20):
My husband was under hospice, Karen, very incapacitated. He put
down my step son first, and then if my step
son something happened, then he put this family friend down
who had witnessed the will. His signature is on my
late husband's will.

Speaker 3 (32:40):
Okay, But Deborah, I guess what I'm asking when you
say he named him? Did your husband actually name him
this man as his person nominated for personal representative? Uh?

Speaker 15 (32:55):
Huh?

Speaker 3 (32:56):
Okay. So, Dan McKenzie, how do you name a personal
representative in a will? And then answer her question like like,
if she doesn't agree with the personal representative, what can
she do?

Speaker 6 (33:11):
So?

Speaker 11 (33:11):
Yeah, one of the most important things to do in
the will is nominate the personal representative. It's a pretty
simple statement about who you want that to be, and
it can be any adults. The fact that this guy
witnessed the will, I don't think is disqualifying because you
can witness the will. Actually, even if you're one of
the beneficiaries, it's definitely not recommended. But I'd say it's

(33:31):
not automatically disqualifying. I guess you know. An issue for.

Speaker 1 (33:36):
You deb right is like, is this will?

Speaker 11 (33:39):
Is it going to probate? Is there going to be
is it is he in.

Speaker 9 (33:44):
Probate right now?

Speaker 3 (33:46):
Is there anything on the surface that is glaring? Is
a glaring conflict or error in your opinion that.

Speaker 9 (33:54):
He's going to receive my property? The property?

Speaker 3 (33:58):
Wait a minute, he left him as an air as well.

Speaker 9 (34:01):
It happens to my steps, and if something happens to
my steps and he will get eight hundred thousand, my
eight hundred thousand dollars house. Wait a minute, conflict of interest?

Speaker 11 (34:14):
Are you included in the will at the beneficiary too?

Speaker 9 (34:18):
Nope, my step son.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
How long is how long were you married? How long
were you married to this How long were you married
to this guy?

Speaker 9 (34:27):
Fifteen years?

Speaker 3 (34:29):
And and you're saying that he aced you out of
the will completely.

Speaker 9 (34:36):
Yeah, how about wait, wait, wait, how about espousal benefits
or anything?

Speaker 5 (34:42):
Dan, isn't there something there?

Speaker 3 (34:44):
What is this?

Speaker 7 (34:46):
Yeah?

Speaker 11 (34:47):
I mean you're it's it's not entirely three or fourth formula,
but there is a formula. And you can make a
spousal election against a will that you were disinherited from
if your spouse disinherited you. So depends on a couple
of factors how much you might be able to receive
that you should not be necessarily disinherited from this will.

Speaker 3 (35:07):
Now, if the statement is not made that he's disinheriting her,
is she automatically entitled to a certain amount?

Speaker 1 (35:19):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (35:21):
Okay, we need to explore this. We can call you
back or whatever, Dan, But hang on because we also
have someone else who has a question on pre planning
the estate. I'm Tom Martino. This gets very complicated. We'll
try to simplify it and button it up for you.
Coming up on the Troubleshooter Show THREEHO three seven one
three A two five five Go with a sure thing

(35:44):
Denver's Best Roofer Excel roofing dot com.

Speaker 5 (35:47):
You don't pay a cent until you're content.

Speaker 3 (35:52):
Time for an insurance check up free no obligation in comparison,
call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at dozens
of insurance companies find out now three all three seven
seven one help. You'll think you're his only customer when
you choose Frank durand the real estate man dot com
to list your home with Remax Alliance three all three
nine two zero sixteen twenty two.

Speaker 16 (36:13):
Yeah, RiPP, you need advice who.

Speaker 15 (36:23):
You don't have the.

Speaker 2 (36:25):
Come run in just as as as we can. Show
Shooter's gonna help.

Speaker 17 (36:31):
Come Man six is the Troubleshooter Show. No Tom Martino.

Speaker 3 (36:37):
Hey, I'm Tom Martino, and I want to go right
to the phones. I got Major Mark, Major F and
we're talking now to Dan McKenzie, who is an essate
planning expert and attorney at law. And uh it's mackenzie
loss on one of that I'm personally amusing and we've
recommended to many people. And I'll give his contact information later.

(36:57):
But here's the bottom line. Okay, Deborah has a question
about her husband's will. She was married fifteen years. Deborah,
is this safe in assuming obviously as kids and stuff,
how many times was he married?

Speaker 9 (37:10):
I'm just curious once before?

Speaker 3 (37:15):
Okay, so you're a second wife and.

Speaker 9 (37:18):
You brought back up he was married, once divorced and
his second wife died.

Speaker 3 (37:23):
I'm sorry, Okay, all right, So you're the third wife
of fifteen years and you say that the son right now,
his biological son is the uh the representative personal representative?
Is that correct?

Speaker 18 (37:40):
Really?

Speaker 9 (37:41):
I'm not sure about that. His name has been put
on the house deed when my husband was completely incapacitated.

Speaker 3 (37:50):
So the son, your step son, his son was put
on the deed. Did your husband do that? You did
your husband put him on the deed?

Speaker 9 (38:01):
Yes, and he told me he very much regretted it.
I have evidence, well I don't know of that.

Speaker 3 (38:08):
I don't know. I don't think you can take it back,
but we'll ask Dan mackenzie. But right now, what does
this friend have to do with anything that you're questioning?
What happened with his friend?

Speaker 9 (38:21):
That's what I'd like to know. This will has this
this person's name on it.

Speaker 15 (38:26):
He's not a family.

Speaker 3 (38:28):
But is his name on it as simply a witness?
I mean, when you say his name is on it,
how is his name on it?

Speaker 9 (38:37):
He witnessed the will with another person. There's a notary,
but if you look through the will. If something happens
to my steps and this family friend inherits this house.

Speaker 3 (38:51):
Now hold on, does he inherit it or is he?

Speaker 9 (38:55):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (38:56):
Is it? Does he inherit it? Or does he simply
takeover management of the estate? Do you know?

Speaker 9 (39:05):
I'm not sure about that.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
But see, have you had anyone looked Have you had
anyone look at the will? Did an attorney look at
the will, maybe even for the estate and advise you
as to where you stand? Has anyone even looked at
the will and advised you?

Speaker 9 (39:23):
Yes, my husband's lawyer.

Speaker 3 (39:29):
And what did what did he sell tell you? Did
he tell you were disinherited or what did he tell you?

Speaker 9 (39:38):
Well, I'll be quite frank. He said it was and
you don't have to he said it was. He read
the will and he said, oh my god, this is bs.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
Yeah, but okay, he died. He died in February. There
was a reading of the will. Are they in July?
Oh god, I'm sorry, John? Is he? So? How is
this all affecting you? First of all, I need to
ask how this is affecting your Is the son asking
you to move?

Speaker 9 (40:09):
Yes, I'm being evicted at the end of this month.

Speaker 3 (40:13):
Okay, Now you keep mentioning another thing that makes no
sense whatsoever, and you say a conflict of interest. What
do you mean that the friend having the friend in
the will is a conflict of interest? Because all wills
could be construed as a conflict of interest because they're personal.

(40:35):
So what exactly is a conflict of interest.

Speaker 9 (40:41):
That he was going to that there was unduly influence
and he was going to inherit a property that's worth
over eight hundred thousand dollars.

Speaker 3 (40:51):
Well, he would only inherit it if something happens to
the sun, Yes, which could happen.

Speaker 9 (40:59):
I'm just saying that it's sounds very shady. Anyone aren't
been talking to sounds it's very shady.

Speaker 3 (41:05):
Well, it can sound shady all you want, But if
that's your husband wishes, I've.

Speaker 4 (41:11):
The real problem is her trying to a victor. She's
saying she has claim in the home.

Speaker 3 (41:16):
Okay, First of all, under Colorado law, you generally cannot
disinherit a spouse. You can't by default. That by default
usually and I'm gonna let Dan explain this, that you're
entitled to a certain amount of the estate and it

(41:36):
grows each year until it gets to fifty percent unless
there is a pre nup or a post nup. Did
you have any go Dan, I'm gonna let you take over.
Go ahead? Is that basically correct? They can't just disinherit.

Speaker 11 (41:52):
Her right without written authorization, which is the pre or
the post nup. You cannot disinherit spout.

Speaker 8 (42:02):
So for fifteen years, I'm in trouble.

Speaker 9 (42:04):
I'm in trouble because I had to sign a pre
nup just to marry him.

Speaker 3 (42:08):
Well, because okay, well then there you go. You could
have led with that. Well, you're not in trouble. But
if you you knowingly did it, you knowingly signed this prenup.
What does the prenup.

Speaker 9 (42:21):
Say I knowingly did not want to sign it.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
I did not, but you signed it. You can't? Can
can she go back? I listen, let's just address this
because you're and this is not against you, Deborah, but
it's a statement of fact. You're you're you're trying to
say all of this stunt was done against your will,
but you did it, you signed it, Dan. Can somebody
go back and say, well, I didn't really mean to

(42:47):
sign that prenup?

Speaker 11 (42:50):
Sure, like any contract, you can you can claim that
you were pressured or unduly influenced, and.

Speaker 3 (42:56):
Then why and then what.

Speaker 11 (43:00):
I mean, it might get it might get in validated,
but it's you know, you've got to proof that has happened, right,
I mean, what were the circumstances under which he signed
the prenup? Was it right before the wedding? Was it
his attorney that drafted it? Did you did you see
your own at about it?

Speaker 9 (43:16):
I have no attorney, I had no money.

Speaker 3 (43:19):
How much is this entire estate? How much is his
entire estate worth? Uh?

Speaker 9 (43:27):
The real tu said seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars.
He could sell his house and that's pretty much it.

Speaker 3 (43:33):
So there's no savings or stocks or anything like that. Nope, No,
he's Okay. I'm gonna I'm going to take an amateurist
to guess Dan and say that she's never going to prevail. Okay,
unless unless there is such compelling evidence. You know, she's
she's pissed off, she's not in the will, she signed
a prenup. What does the prenup say, Deborah in a nutshell?

(43:55):
What does it say? I know you've had somebody look
at it. What does it say?

Speaker 9 (44:00):
It's just a lot of gobbledygook.

Speaker 3 (44:03):
Okay, what does the gobly book say? Does it say
you don't get anything?

Speaker 9 (44:10):
I think?

Speaker 14 (44:10):
So?

Speaker 3 (44:12):
Okay, why did you sign it? Why did you sign it.

Speaker 9 (44:16):
So that I had a place to live?

Speaker 3 (44:21):
Okay, well you signed it? Where were you living before that?

Speaker 9 (44:27):
In an apartment? And I worked two jobs. I had
two children to take care of.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
Why'd you marry this guy? Doesn't sound much like love
to me? I mean, were you in love with this guy?
Was he in love with you? Yes?

Speaker 9 (44:42):
And we wanted to take care of our property because
we had been told that there are Colorado laws that
might have intervened with that. He wanted to make sure
his son inherited it, and they said, well you need
to be married and do such and such. So we
had every everything was was put to together by our
lawyer here in Colorado.

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Okay, and we're what did he want you? Did? He say?
I want you to have the house, and I want
you to have half of everything. He did, Okay, but
he didn't put it in the will.

Speaker 9 (45:13):
I have a lot, it's in there. No, there are
two wills. This has gotten so complicated that I'm just
I'm at the How are.

Speaker 3 (45:20):
There two wills? How are there two wills?

Speaker 9 (45:24):
There are his original twenty ten when we signed right
before we were married. We went to this lawyer, his
lawyer and signed. I got everything put together. I had
a living estate, a life estate, sorry, and I could
live here as long as I live. I could live

(45:45):
at home after he died, and then his son would
have that leader, which was what he wanted to do
because this is a nice house.

Speaker 3 (45:56):
And then the second will, when was that signed?

Speaker 9 (46:00):
February fourteen? My stepson rewrote a will that but.

Speaker 3 (46:06):
Your your husband signed it. Your husband signed it? Yes?

Speaker 9 (46:10):
And then the hospice nurse.

Speaker 3 (46:12):
How long after the first will was the second will done?
How long after the first will was the second will done?
How long? Five years? Ten years, one year, two years?

Speaker 9 (46:22):
What twenty ten is the original and this year is
the second.

Speaker 3 (46:28):
So just before he died he did a second will.

Speaker 9 (46:31):
Yes, yeah, and he looked so the hospice nurses just said,
don't don't let him do anything legally. He couldn't sign
any check.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
Okay, Dan could could she argue that he was incapacitated?
And is that a big burden of proof? I mean,
you're listening to this, what would you advise her if
she came into your office. Yes, let's go after the
will what he did.

Speaker 11 (46:57):
Yes, the answer to your question is, of course you
can always challenge. But yeah, it typically requires like medical
evidence and expert testimony. It's pretty expensive and involved and.

Speaker 7 (47:11):
Take some more.

Speaker 3 (47:13):
Okay, if she wanted to challenge the second will, even
if she gets the first will, it's a life of
state and it's not like she gets a bundle of
cash to pay her legal bill. So, Deborah, you need
money to fight this in a legal You gotta file
a lawsuit.

Speaker 6 (47:35):
Okay, so I would.

Speaker 9 (47:38):
Right now, I'm writing up the objection to and contesting
the second will because I have all of his medical records.

Speaker 3 (47:46):
Do have an attorney representing you?

Speaker 9 (47:50):
No, they're supposed to be calling me. It's through pro
bono because my steps and drained my chicking account.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
Okay, listen, Deborah, this is a really terrible situation you're facing,
but you're not going to get it. You're not going
to get a pro bono attorney. You're not going to
get an attorney to take This case is going to
take up to a year or more, and it's going
to take a minimum of about in my opinion fifty

(48:19):
thousand dollars. When you talk about expert testimony, medical records, courts, depositions,
I just think you're.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
Face having someone Can you scrape together enough just to
have someone like Dan look at the will, look at
the prenup and kind of tell you where you even are?

Speaker 5 (48:39):
You have no idea? You call it gobbly goog.

Speaker 3 (48:42):
Yeah, you should have at least a consultation, Dan, How
do you work consultations? If someone wanted to know where
they stand?

Speaker 11 (48:52):
I mean, if you want to have an attorney evaluate, like,
look at documents and evaluate evidence and give you some guidance.

Speaker 1 (48:59):
We do charge for that.

Speaker 11 (49:01):
You know, we have some paralegal options that honestly, Yeah,
what you're describing the resources you're going to need to
pursue this. Unfortunately, in this, you know, people are used
to personal injury ads talking about how you know you
don't pay.

Speaker 3 (49:18):
It, right, that's right, right?

Speaker 11 (49:21):
So the personal injury lawyers of condition people that think
like you can just sue and maybe if you win,
you'll have to pay out of your award. But that's
that doesn't apply to most other types of lawsuits. And
I don't I don't think too many attorneys are going
to be willing to take on something like this without No.

Speaker 3 (49:38):
You're not going to do any pro bono here. So Deborah,
let's I hate giving wrong information to people. Let me
just tell you like it is. It's going to be
about fifty thousand dollars and you're going to have to
hire an attorney and they're going to fight you. I mean,
but at least for the initial consultation to go over
documents and stuff, it's going to be one thousand to

(49:59):
fifteen hundred in my opinion. And Dan, I don't think
you'd argue that.

Speaker 11 (50:05):
All right, Yeah, and it's a couple hours of work, sure.

Speaker 3 (50:09):
All right, So we have to take this break. Deborah.
I hate giving you this information, but I mean, it's true.
There's no sense lying to you. You got yourself in
a situation, you agree to it. Now you have to
try to undo all of it and try to prove
that the sun was cheating and that the sun took
advantage of your husband's medical condition. But all of this

(50:29):
takes real life evidence and a lawsuit. By the way,
Mackenzie is at eight three to three co plans eight
three to three co plans. Michael's got a question for
you coming up. We got more right after this. Go
with a sure thing Denver's Best Rufer Excel Roofing dot com.

(50:52):
You don't pay a cent until you're content. Time for
an insurance checkup. No obligation in comparison, call Compass Insurance
paying too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies
find out now three O three seven seven to one help.
You'll think you're his only customer when you choose Frank
durand the real estate Man dot com to list your

(51:14):
home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two. You know, I can't tell you how
many times we get problems from people who have signed
documents and they say they didn't mean to or it

(51:35):
was unfair, and it's really difficult to undo things like that.
Dan McKenzie, let's listen to Michael, who has a question.
Mackenzie Law eight three three co plans an estate planning attorney.
I'm personally using and deputy boused and a lot of
people are using that. I recommend him. Michael, what's going on?

(51:58):
What is your question about your estate?

Speaker 15 (52:02):
My mom is in uh uh assisted living. She's ninety
two and she we're trying to get on Medicare because
she was a government employee and we're selling her house.
We closed next month. What is the best thing I
should do with that money? I gotta pay for the

(52:23):
assistant care every month, but just put it in the
bank or what?

Speaker 3 (52:28):
Well? How much? How much money are we talking about?

Speaker 15 (52:31):
All around three hundred thousand?

Speaker 3 (52:34):
Okay, you need something very low risk and liquid. Okay,
So really, if if that's your question, you're gonna it
could be you're going to run out of money too.
I mean, how much month is this costing you?

Speaker 15 (52:50):
That's gonna be a probably around ten.

Speaker 3 (52:52):
Grand ten grand a month.

Speaker 15 (52:55):
I'm guessing, I am an asked, but.

Speaker 3 (52:58):
Dan McKenzie, what people usually do when they have a
nest egg they're drawing from for their plan, do you know? Yeah?

Speaker 11 (53:07):
I mean, if she's already in the in the in
that facility trying to qualify for probably Medicaid, they are
going to expect you to spend that money. And is
that what you mentor are you trying to call it
fire for MEDICAIDS? You should already be receiving Medicare. They
don't uhould cover this kind of care.

Speaker 3 (53:28):
So Medicare covers it partially, right, Dan, I mean they
don't pay for one it.

Speaker 11 (53:35):
So, but I guess for events that last longer than
I think ninety days is the problem. So medical okay,
that's why, that's why long term care is such a
problem for so many people, because Medicare really does not
cover it.

Speaker 3 (53:50):
Okay. Once you exhaust your money though, then and and
a lot of people try to, you know, wink wink,
gamble a little way, spend it, give it to somebody
in the family. But you they want you to spend
it down. And if she applies, if she applies for assistance, Dan,
can she do it in the anticipation of running out

(54:11):
of money? Literally? I mean, can she do it ahead
of time? Or does she have to wait until truly
she has no money left?

Speaker 11 (54:19):
You really have to wait? I mean three hundred thousand.
I mean, even at ten thousand a month, that's going
to get you through a while. We're talking about a
ninety two year old. So I mean it seems like
if there is a good chance that it won't be
totally exhausted.

Speaker 3 (54:33):
Right, there's a good chance she won't outliver money. But
is ten thousand a month? So we're talking about, Yeah,
ten thousand a month basically, So what what other plan you?
Does she have any other kind of help?

Speaker 4 (54:53):
No, you know, I just want to while we're sitting
here for a second, I want to throw the That's
why talking to Dan McKenzie about asset protection is so
important to do early on. I just wanted to throw
that out there.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
That is that is very important Dan. Is there a
way to preserve assets? But still I hate to put
it this way, but still beyond the public dole. You know,
a lot of people want to protect their money. Isn't
there a look back period to make sure people don't
dump their money real quick?

Speaker 15 (55:29):
Yeah, you got to.

Speaker 11 (55:30):
If you get rid of any asset for less than
care market value, you're you apply for medicaid, They're going
to look back five years and see if that happened,
and if it did, they're going to expect you to
get that asset back or they're going to prevent you
from getting care for as long as that.

Speaker 1 (55:47):
Asset would have covered.

Speaker 11 (55:48):
So if you have it, if you had given away
the three hundred dollars out, you know, they're gonna they're
going to calculate how much care that would about you
and they're going to be just qualified for that on.

Speaker 7 (55:57):
Time, so.

Speaker 11 (55:59):
That it usually does take some planning. There are some
things you can do even in emergency situations, but really
Medicaid's approach here is like, we're not here to facilitate inheritance,
We're here to cover people's care in an emergency basis.

Speaker 3 (56:16):
Right, So, Michael, the bottom line is not so much
where you keep that money it really. I mean, obviously
you don't want high risk. You're never going to make
enough to cover everything beyond thirty months anyway. I mean,
but you should put it in just a money market
or something that doesn't do zero but has basically no

(56:39):
risk to it. Even a good ETF is good, but
it's not I wouldn't recommend it for this. And ETF
is an exchange traded fund and it's like a money
market but more sophisticated, and they do a lot of
investing with it. But I don't like the idea when
you need this money to literally pay monthly payments, and
then she can apply after that when she exhausts her funds,

(57:02):
and it doesn't have to be zero, it just has
to get down to a certain amount and you start
the qualification process for Medicaid. I can't believe. On a
side note, Dan, does everyone just basically who doesn't have
enough money end up on Medicaid? I mean, is that
really the ultimate end? It's government government paid medicaid right.

Speaker 11 (57:25):
Everybody's feedback plan. So's it's most of our biggest depth
of protection risks from Claybay side divorce. It's like divorce
and you know medical deals.

Speaker 3 (57:35):
Yeah, and and Medicaid. I can't believe it hasn't run
out of money. I mean, so many people, so many
people have to spend down their estate and then when
they do, they have nowhere else to go. That's why
it's so important. As Mark said, you know, if you
have assets, first of all, try to grow assets if
you can, okay, and then try to get try to

(57:58):
get long term care if you can. But that's not
even an answer. Long term care insurance is sometimes just
for an amount, and it's not It doesn't necessarily cover everything.
I'm sorry you're facing this, Michael again, that's not a
lot of money to be going into retirement. Three oh
three seven to one three talks seven one three, eight
two five y five. If you're interested in the state planning, okay,

(58:22):
Dan McKenzie McKenzie law is a great guy. Eight three
three co plans or co plans dot co. We have
a lot more to talk about coming up, and I
can't stress enough this water pros healthy water. This whole system.
If you're going to do something, you should Every home
should have. This takes out the total clorine, the nanoplastics,

(58:45):
the forever chemicals and purifies your water and plus you
get drinking water at the kitchen. Saying this entire system
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This would be a minimum of fifteen grand from a
plumber or more. But it's forty six ninety five Waterpros
dot and at three O three eight six, two five,
five five four go with a sure thing Denver's best

(59:09):
roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent
until you're content. Time for an insurance check up free,
no obligation. In comparison, call Compass Insurance paying too much
your coverage at dozens of insurance companies find out now
three oh three seven seven to one help. You'll think
you're his only customer when you choose Frank durand the

(59:30):
Real Estate man dot com to list your home with
Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two.
Hi Tom Martino, you're a troubleshooter three O three seven
one three talk seven one three eight two five five.

(59:51):
I can't tell you how many times I get texts
I don't read because they're so asinine. But I just
want to tell people to keep them coming. Every once
in a while, there's a gem. But this moron says
he doesn't like that Warren Buffett doesn't pay payroll taxes,
and I brought out how he pays millions of dollars

(01:00:14):
on dividends for taxes, and payroll tax is actually less
than him taking it the way he does. He actually
pays more tax It's just amazing to me how everyone
is living everyone else's life and all they care abound.
I swear to God, we have gotten to a point
now where they're politics of envy. You know, I want

(01:00:37):
everyone to be equal. I want I want what you want.
I want what you have, and you know it just
pisses me off. Go ahead, Mark, I'm.

Speaker 4 (01:00:46):
Sir, Well, I'm running some numbers on Warren, but on
a total side note, well, not really a side note,
you made me think of it. You know, Trump said
something amazing in the last twenty four hours. You know
how there is a housing crisis. Just take Colorado. There's
a lot of people, especially in their twenties, just married,
you know, young families starting out, but they got jobs

(01:01:08):
and stuff, but they simply can't.

Speaker 3 (01:01:10):
Afford a mortgage. They have to rent.

Speaker 4 (01:01:13):
They don't either have the down payment or won't qualify
because the payments are so high with interest rates in
the cost of homes in Denver Metro.

Speaker 5 (01:01:21):
Trump came out and.

Speaker 4 (01:01:23):
Basically said, I think I've got a great answer for
people want to own their own home.

Speaker 5 (01:01:28):
A fifty year mortgage.

Speaker 4 (01:01:30):
And I was talking to John Clace at CMG about this, Yeah,
and he ran numbers you'd be amazed. Now, look, it
takes a lot longer to pay it off, but let's
face off. Of course, of course, but the cash flow
aspect of it is absolutely drastic. It could literally make
people afford a home and then as they get more established.

Speaker 3 (01:01:51):
Rage there. You know, there used to be mark There
used to be routinely forty year mortgages. Did you know
that I.

Speaker 4 (01:01:58):
Did know there was forty We actually started punching the
numbers with an interest only. Unfortunately, an interest only is
not going to save people any money in general.

Speaker 5 (01:02:09):
Plus they'd never own the property.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
They save some money, but you're right, but in the
long run, what people want is the hope of ownership.
A mortgage is really you know, people say, well, I
own a home. A mortgage is a lease on that
property until you get the majority of it paid off.
It's like leasing a property, but it's yours and it's
something to take pride. And home ownership is one of

(01:02:32):
the most important things in life. But you have to
And I did a whole separate thing on this I
won't get into right now, but the true cost of
ownership when people squeak by and get into a home,
they're not prepared for emergencies or what I call amortized costs,
and they can end up in big trouble. I just
posted some social stuff on that on what the true
cost of ownership is. And right now, just to give

(01:02:55):
you a nutshell, you got to figure at least three
hundred dollars a month on top of everything else for
a contingency fund. And that's conservative. Josh.

Speaker 4 (01:03:05):
Wait, wait, so I ran the numbers. Josh, we're going
to bring you up. Go ahead, Mark, just for the
more on there that texted you. So, first of all, Berkshire, Berkshire,
Hathaway in the last twenty years, so from five through
twenty twenty four, this is just taxes ninety five billion
in taxes, so they have paid that much. And then

(01:03:27):
Warren Buffett personally, in the same period of time has
paid basically ninety eight billion.

Speaker 3 (01:03:37):
I know it now now listen to this is how
stupid he is. So I said, Warren Buffett pays more
taxes by paying through dividends and other profits than true payroll.
And he said, so why not both? Well, you freaking idiot.
You know, if you take money away from those other
profits through a payroll deduction, he's actually going to end

(01:03:59):
up paying less tax not more. People are so stupid
I them.

Speaker 5 (01:04:07):
I definitely want to clarify that.

Speaker 3 (01:04:08):
Okay, can you do real.

Speaker 5 (01:04:12):
Is one hundred billion?

Speaker 3 (01:04:15):
Yeah? Isn't that nice? God? Anyway, I think it should
be mandatory that people take a course in economics and
understand the true not not the republic under the Democrat,
but the true math on what people pay and what
they should pay or should not pay. The whole graduated

(01:04:35):
tax system was born out of envy. You make more,
you pay a higher rate. What if everyone just played
a fat flat tax with no deductions, a flat tax.
Whatever you make, you pay. I love it, Josh. What's
going on with Verizon? I'm sorry for the way, Josh.
We're going to try to solve this for you if
we can. I hope we can. What's going on?

Speaker 18 (01:04:56):
Ah, so quick question, more of an opinion question. So
I on my variety of account about five hundred dollars worth,
caught it within about five minutes of it going through.
Verizon sent me emails that they admit.

Speaker 3 (01:05:10):
It was fraud.

Speaker 18 (01:05:11):
They take responsibility.

Speaker 5 (01:05:13):
Hey form, Yeah, what form did.

Speaker 18 (01:05:19):
When somebody went into a store in another state and
bought a bunch of phones and signed up for a
bunch of lines. I don't know how they got through
because I was getting.

Speaker 3 (01:05:28):
Texts to approve the okay, to prove.

Speaker 18 (01:05:32):
The charges, and I didn't. I didn't approve any of them.
And then what happened emails.

Speaker 6 (01:05:36):
Is the charges?

Speaker 18 (01:05:37):
Well, the bottom line was kind of bugged me?

Speaker 3 (01:05:39):
Is it was?

Speaker 18 (01:05:39):
It wasn't cheap.

Speaker 11 (01:05:40):
It was about five hundred and fifty bucks.

Speaker 18 (01:05:43):
Verizon stances you have to pay for the fraud, and
we will reimburse you some point down the road, probably
in about four billing cycles.

Speaker 3 (01:05:54):
But what was their reasoning for this? I don't understand it.

Speaker 18 (01:05:58):
Because that's that's their process, which which basically tells me
we're going to keep your money for four months, earn
interest on it, then give it back to you, which
I think.

Speaker 3 (01:06:07):
Is it doesn't make sense to me. It really doesn't
make sense to me.

Speaker 18 (01:06:13):
No, I'm just looking on like, do I wait it
out four months? Do I take mars approach and file
a small claims?

Speaker 3 (01:06:20):
But how is it affecting you? Really? Other? I mean,
you're not paying on.

Speaker 18 (01:06:24):
It, right, annoys me?

Speaker 15 (01:06:25):
No paid the five hundred bucks?

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
Yeah, but can't you leave a balance on the account?

Speaker 5 (01:06:30):
WHOA you paid the five hundred.

Speaker 18 (01:06:34):
I'm on auto pay, so that even though I told
them they didn't have my permission to draft it, they
drafted the pull them out.

Speaker 3 (01:06:40):
That's insane.

Speaker 18 (01:06:43):
And my other problem is list you guys over the years,
I don't think I'm going to actually ever see the credit.

Speaker 4 (01:06:54):
I've happened to have engaged with Verizon. How we're discussing
them as soon as they get served, they're going to
reach out to you and they're going to cut you check,
so you'll get your fifty five dollars court fee and
if you do calculate interest, you can ask for the
interest as well. But it's going to take two or

(01:07:14):
three hours of your time.

Speaker 3 (01:07:16):
So yeah, I do it. But did they say this, Josh?
Did they say you have to pay and then we
reimburse you after we investigated or did they just I
mean you you have to pay it because it's on
your account, not because it's fraud, and then they will
find out it's fraud and then credit you. Is that
the way it works?

Speaker 18 (01:07:36):
I can understand that they've already investigated it. They've already
sent me emails and said you are not responsible. And
in the emails it says the way our process works
is you will pay, you are responsible for the bill,
and we will credit you within four billing cycles, which
is four months down the road, which I.

Speaker 3 (01:07:54):
Think that doesn't make sense to me. That makes no
sense to me that they can't credit you.

Speaker 4 (01:07:58):
So, I mean, it makes sense to me they're trying
to keep his money for four months, right, But Mark,
do you really.

Speaker 3 (01:08:05):
Believe that they go through all these the the all
these payings just to keep four hundred dollars for a
couple of billing cycles.

Speaker 4 (01:08:13):
Yeah, I think so. I think that's just how their
systems set up.

Speaker 3 (01:08:16):
All right, we got to take this break and I
want to talk to Ship. I want to talk to
Chip about a moving vehicle or moving a vehicle, uh
from state to state. Right after this, go with a
sure thing Denver's best roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You
don't pay a cent until you're content. Time for an

(01:08:41):
insurance checkup free, no obligation comparison call Compass Insurance paying
too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies find
out now three all three seven to seven to one help.
You'll think you're his only customer when you choose Frank
durand the real estate Man dot com to list your
home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two. Hello, I'm Tom Martine. You are troubleshooter

(01:09:09):
three O three seven one three talk seven one three
eight two five five. Let's go to the phones and
solve some problems. So we have, uh, what what are
we doing with this vehicle? By the way, wasn't he first?
I think Chip Oh no, No, it's not Terry. Is Terry?

(01:09:30):
What's going on with you?

Speaker 19 (01:09:31):
And then Chip, Hey, Tom, Hey, what's happening?

Speaker 3 (01:09:40):
What's happening.

Speaker 1 (01:09:41):
I've got some concerns about a balance for medical bills
that I'm receiving here and wanted to get your guys.

Speaker 3 (01:09:49):
With So are you are you being billed for the balance?
Is that a copey?

Speaker 1 (01:09:55):
It is a high deductible plan and I am being
built at the back.

Speaker 3 (01:10:00):
Got it?

Speaker 1 (01:10:00):
My insurance kicked in?

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
Okay, all right, So what's your question?

Speaker 1 (01:10:07):
My question is, you know they're legit services, but I'm
concerned about the charges and the amounts for the services
because when I go on okay their website to do
an estimate, they're significantly lower.

Speaker 3 (01:10:25):
Really wait a minute, so they actually reprice it for
you and your claim, and it's different than their open
pricing because by law, they have to have their prices.
They have to have their prices up front and they
can't change them. So let's talk about this. This could
be a good case. So tell me the procedure. Give

(01:10:47):
me an example of a procedure.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
It is a CT headscan and an emergency.

Speaker 3 (01:10:55):
Okay, are the bulk of the charges okay, the heat,
the CT headscan. You're saying that it's actually less than
they're billing you.

Speaker 1 (01:11:08):
When I go into their quoting tool, because they will
not give me a quote independently of their tool. I
asked for something to be an email and they don't
do that. So their tool, I did a quote with
and without insurance and team.

Speaker 3 (01:11:20):
Hold on, hold on, We'll come right back to you.
Hold on, Go with a sure thing Denver's Best roofer
Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay a cent until
you're content. Time for an insurance checkup free no obligation
comparison call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at
dozens of insurance companies find out now three oh three

(01:11:42):
seven to seven to one help. You'll think you're his
only customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate
Man dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance
three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two.

Speaker 16 (01:11:53):
Yeah, rifts advice so you don't have.

Speaker 14 (01:12:05):
Come run in just as stas as we can.

Speaker 2 (01:12:09):
Shoot's gonna help coming.

Speaker 3 (01:12:12):
Man Dix is the Troubleshooter Show. No Tom Martino, Hey
Tom Martino here, Welcome to the show three O three
seven one, three eight two five five Terry's got a
question or an issue with medical bills, then we'll talk
about your problems, questions and complaints Denverregen dot com in
the house. Of course, we know that they do testosterone

(01:12:34):
a replacement. They do UH also weight loss UH drugs
at a fraction of the cost, and there's something new
about their system we want to talk about. And then
they also do what I love them for is the
pain relief painful joints and tendons. They helped me through

(01:12:54):
a very rough time in my life, and I had
their stem cell therapy and then I went back and
had it done for my and I truly got great results.
I want to talk about ozempic face. We hear it
called ozepic face, or this look that people get when
they're on GLP ones. What is that? What is that

(01:13:15):
from sir? What what can we do about that?

Speaker 20 (01:13:17):
So, particularly with cemeglotide, if people aren't exercising a lot
and eating a protein heavy diet, there's a tendency to
lose muscle mass UH. And one way to counteract that
that we're adding, and.

Speaker 3 (01:13:30):
That's not the fault of the drug that's just when
people just don't do anything.

Speaker 20 (01:13:34):
To right, if you just felt the drug in, don't
do anything, you'll lose the weight, but you will also
have loose skin and you'll lose some muscle mass. Yes,
and so a great way to counteract that that we're
adding to a lot of our treatment plans is to
add growth hormones stimulating peptides. So this is a compound
that's a peptide, just like the cemeglotide enters eptide or peptides,

(01:13:55):
And what it does is it stimulates your body's own
production of growth hormone that helps to maintain muscle mass
while you're on the weight loss program, so that you
don't get that ozepic face or you know, basically look gaunt,
you don't look sucked in, right, so don't have the
same skin, and you don't lose muscle mass.

Speaker 3 (01:14:13):
Okay, And so is this combined in one shot? How
does it work? So we can do it one of
two ways.

Speaker 20 (01:14:20):
We can have the compounding pharmacy combine it with the
weight loss drug in one so you're just taking one injection,
or you can have them compounded separately, so you can
you can take as much or as little of either
one as you want, and we custom tailor each treatment
plan so that the patient knows exactly how much of
each one of those peptides to take, how much of
the weight loss drug, and how much of the growth

(01:14:41):
hormone stimulating peptides to take alongside with it to help
reduce that muscle loss. If there is any muscle loss
with the weight loss.

Speaker 3 (01:14:50):
Well, that's pretty cool. Yeah, okay, did you have something?

Speaker 21 (01:14:54):
Yeah, Joe, you know, a few days ago, I saw
a report on the news and I haven't dug into
it yet, but apparently BO with President Trump and Secretary
Kennedy have negotiated a huge discount on these drugs from
the manufacturers. I heard it was like half off. Is
it too soon to discuss those details? Do you have
any idea how this is going to work?

Speaker 6 (01:15:12):
Well?

Speaker 3 (01:15:12):
Remember this is half all from the big expensive ones,
right so you know, right now the details about who's
eligible or kind of not, it's kind of gray right now.

Speaker 20 (01:15:22):
But the cost that they're promoting it for direct to
consumer is like maybe ten or fifteen dollars a month
less than what we're charging. But it also doesn't include
the doctor's visit. It doesn't include constant, you know, continuous honoring.
You don't have access to a healthcare professional like you
do with our program, so there really isn't a savings

(01:15:43):
compared to us.

Speaker 3 (01:15:44):
As it's because you guys are already cutting it to
the quick. I mean, you're going right, okay, Terry back
to you. So you had a CT headscan and you're
being billed for that for what your insurance didn't pay.
How much was it quoted the CT scan? How much

(01:16:06):
were you quoted on your bill? Of that you're paying on.

Speaker 1 (01:16:12):
The charge on the bill is I'm just going to
round up fifty nine hundred for the CT scan.

Speaker 3 (01:16:16):
Alone, God, fifty nine hundred, and how much of that
do you have to pay?

Speaker 1 (01:16:24):
My balance is about five thousand on the little bill
after insurance kicked in.

Speaker 3 (01:16:28):
Quait a minute, Insurance paid nine hundred of the fifty
nine hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
No I apologies, that doesn't include the emergency visit. So
the total bill was about seventy six hundred. Insurance paid
about twenty six hundred.

Speaker 3 (01:16:44):
Wow, so you're left with a big bill. So what
is your main question?

Speaker 1 (01:16:50):
My main question is I feel like I'm being penalized
for being insured because the quoting tool on their website
is significantly less, and they don't have an explanation.

Speaker 4 (01:16:59):
Yeah, welcome to Obamacare, man, I mean, but they're not
allowed to have them.

Speaker 3 (01:17:05):
They're not allowed to charge different prices.

Speaker 4 (01:17:07):
So he doesn't have the balance billing. Argument's not going
to work for him.

Speaker 3 (01:17:13):
No, I'm not talking about even the balance billing. What
I'm talking about is the price itself. If he went
on and put in the same stuff that he had done,
it doesn't matter. He doesn't.

Speaker 4 (01:17:24):
He hasn't negotiated, nor has his It sounds like he's
at a network, for lack of a better way to
put it, and he doesn't have He has not negotiated
prices with that particular hospital. He just hasn't, so they
can charge them whatever the hell they want to.

Speaker 3 (01:17:42):
And we I want to get someone from I believe
what you're saying. I just don't understand it. Fully, none
on the house stand it. But yeah, in Tegro would
be a great person to have on. But the bottom
line is, like we have Kaiser.

Speaker 4 (01:17:55):
Kaiser goes to certain hospitals and negotiates how much a
CT scan is. He doesn't have a insurance company that
has negotiated with whatever hospital. So they're going to charge
his insurance company or himself, you know, an extraordinary amount
of money.

Speaker 1 (01:18:13):
But what if I what if they're tool for uninsured
is in one hundreds of dollars?

Speaker 3 (01:18:21):
So are you saying this that much different?

Speaker 4 (01:18:23):
There's nowhere I can go pay cash for a CT
scan for a couple hundred bucks, nowhere on this planet.

Speaker 3 (01:18:30):
Terry, explain it to me. Now, let let let me
understand this. When you go on their self pricing tool,
you put in there what kind of insurance you have
or that you're uninsured or do you just make an inquiry?
How does that work?

Speaker 1 (01:18:47):
It's it's an estimate tool for for customers.

Speaker 3 (01:18:50):
And you can so when you put an estimate tool
in you said, but if I had no insurance, So
in the estimate tool itself, do you ask do you
answer a qui question upfront as to what coverage you have?

Speaker 1 (01:19:04):
You can select either uninsured or select your provider. Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:19:09):
Now, the reason they do that is for exactly what
Mark just said. You put your provider in there, and
then they put the negotiated price for that provider. That's
exactly what's happening. But I'm really interested in the insurance
part of it. So you're saying, if you put in uninsured,
what does the price for a CT scan come up?

(01:19:31):
How much for the.

Speaker 1 (01:19:33):
Identical code that's showing on my bill? The uninsured price
just for the CT scan is three hundred and fifty dollars.

Speaker 3 (01:19:43):
What so you could go in there uninsured and get
a CT scan for three hundred and fifty dollars.

Speaker 4 (01:19:51):
That's better code. I'm going to run the code. What
is the code?

Speaker 1 (01:19:57):
If the code is seven zero, four or five zero,
it is a scan without contrast.

Speaker 3 (01:20:07):
Let me ask you something. If you if you did
all of the stuff that you had done and put
in the uninsured price, are you telling me that you're
actually going to pay less than if you were insured.

Speaker 1 (01:20:24):
That's my understanding.

Speaker 3 (01:20:27):
Can anyone go on that website you're on right now?
Can anyone go on that site right now? Or do
you have to have a log in?

Speaker 1 (01:20:36):
Nope? Anybody can?

Speaker 3 (01:20:38):
Okay, give me the website.

Speaker 1 (01:20:42):
Just go to Common Spirit.

Speaker 3 (01:20:48):
Common Spirit, Okay, health and then you don't have to
log in.

Speaker 1 (01:20:54):
No.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
Can you look up at the url? Is it commonspirit
dot org?

Speaker 1 (01:21:02):
It is Mountain dot Common Spirit dot orgin m.

Speaker 5 (01:21:08):
How much is your insurance paying for that CT scan.

Speaker 1 (01:21:14):
I don't have it broken out on what they've paid
against that they just contributed twenty six hundred total.

Speaker 3 (01:21:21):
But wouldn't it be crazy if you could go in
there uninsured and and get cheaper than with insurance. That's
that's absolutely ridiculous. Okay, yours you wanted to say something,
Joeld doctor Cherdak, go ahead.

Speaker 20 (01:21:38):
Oftentimes those imaging places will have a cash discount if
you're paying. So for example, we work with with a
company here that has places all.

Speaker 3 (01:21:47):
Over for the stem cell. Yeah, but we like simon imaging.

Speaker 20 (01:21:51):
We have to well specifically health images.

Speaker 4 (01:21:54):
Okay images, we're talking about a hospital doc.

Speaker 5 (01:21:57):
I mean, this guy's talking er, I think.

Speaker 20 (01:22:01):
Uh yeah, I know what I'm talking about. Is still
for four hundred dollars you can get an MRI for
cash at Health Images, which is significantly less than what
they charge insurance.

Speaker 3 (01:22:11):
And what about Okay, so which when I get on
this website, where do I go to find that estimating tool?
I'm in the estimating tool right now? How did you
get to a pricing and estimates? Is that what you hit?
Pricing and estimates? Let me see how did I get there. Yeah, pricing.

Speaker 4 (01:22:28):
By the way, you guys are looking that up. Is
this where did this tool come from the hospital or what?

Speaker 21 (01:22:36):
Well, it's on con it's a Common Spirit. Now they
want me to choose one of the three providers. That's right,
Common Spirit Health, Craig Hospital, right, And.

Speaker 3 (01:22:44):
I did Common Spirit And it says imaging create an
estimate for imaging services including CT so you can hit that.
So I'm going to suffice it to say that you're
not lying. And are you telling me that you checked
how much it would cost? And are you telling me
that if you were uninsured you'd absolutely pay less than

(01:23:05):
with your insurance. Is that what you're telling.

Speaker 1 (01:23:08):
Me according to the estimate tool?

Speaker 14 (01:23:11):
Yes.

Speaker 4 (01:23:11):
Look, look guys, I always seem to be the bad guy,
but I think we're talking two different things.

Speaker 5 (01:23:17):
One, you go on and.

Speaker 4 (01:23:19):
Schedule a CT scan to come in and look at
your leg or look at whatever you want, and they
give you a time and you show up. Maybe it
is that amount. You get hit by a car at
two am and end up into the er. It might
not be that amount. That's a completely different thing.

Speaker 3 (01:23:36):
Good point, So yours would Yeah, that's true. Yours was
as a result of an emergency room visit, Is that right,
Terry correct?

Speaker 1 (01:23:46):
Which there was a separate charge for that?

Speaker 3 (01:23:49):
Yeah? But Mark, what about that the separate charge for
the er would be as emergency room visit. Wouldn't the
scan be the same or would it be more because
it was after hours? Maybe it was more.

Speaker 5 (01:24:00):
You know, I have absolutely no idea.

Speaker 4 (01:24:02):
I'm sure you've called up the hospital and asked them.
And by the way, does that hospital I really want
to understand this is it their tool?

Speaker 5 (01:24:10):
Are you guys using the hospital's tool?

Speaker 3 (01:24:13):
All right, hold on, let's come back and answer that
because I want to know what time of day will
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(01:25:00):
up free, no obligation. In comparison, call Compass Insurance paying
too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies find
out now three all three seven seven to one help.
You'll think you're his only customer when you choose Frank
durand the real estate Man dot com to list your
home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom Martino, your troubleshooter three O

(01:25:30):
three seven to one three talk, get your calls in.
Let's go to the phones and find out what's in
your mind. Yes, sir, can I interject something you do?
I want Deputy Doc to talk about this real quick.
This is really important. I don't want to get off track.

Speaker 10 (01:25:42):
Right now, a single since I have never heard of
any hospital or doctor billing based on time of day.

Speaker 3 (01:25:51):
Okay, fine, thank you, Deputy D. I need to talk
to you about this. D. So, what did you find?
He is saying, basically that he had a CT scan
done while he was in the emergency room, and he
is saying he literally is being charged more as an
insured person than if he went in there without insurance.

Speaker 21 (01:26:10):
So I'm in the common spirit cost estimating tool and
it requires me to choose a hospital. So, Terry, can
you please tell us where you had this procedure done?

Speaker 1 (01:26:22):
Yes, the hospital location is in Fort Morgan.

Speaker 3 (01:26:28):
Do you remember what it's called?

Speaker 1 (01:26:31):
Let me tell you that here short? Okay?

Speaker 21 (01:26:34):
Should I don't see guys, I don't see any.

Speaker 3 (01:26:37):
For making though. Did you do any searching or were
we just going to fill it out on the air?

Speaker 21 (01:26:42):
No, I was going to so look, so I put
in the code. It recognized the cry. Now it says,
in order to provide a price, choose your service location,
and it gives me a list of about a dozen
different hospitals.

Speaker 3 (01:26:54):
So they actually change prices based on location. Doesn't that
make sense?

Speaker 21 (01:26:58):
Not different hospitals charge different prices for service?

Speaker 7 (01:27:00):
Mark?

Speaker 3 (01:27:01):
Go ahead? What mark?

Speaker 5 (01:27:02):
So here's the bottom line?

Speaker 4 (01:27:03):
Like it And it's going to be hard for a
lot of people to absorb this, but it couldn't be
more true. And you can double check my work or homework.
Here's the bottom line. If you pay cash, you're going
to pay a hell of a lot less with insurance.
That's going to be three to five thousand dollars depending
on your deductible and your insurance. If you pay cash,
it can be five hundred dollars. It's basically the reverse

(01:27:26):
insurance pricing, and that's part of Obamacare because there's a
lot of people with insurance out there that pay zero.

Speaker 5 (01:27:33):
So us that pay very high premiums and have a.

Speaker 4 (01:27:38):
Lot out of pocket each year and no tax credits
basically pick up the bill for people with insurance that
get it for free. If you pay cash, you pay less.
That's just the bottom line. So can I decide? Can
I decide at the time of treatment?

Speaker 3 (01:27:54):
Can I decide not to use my insurance and just
pay cash. Can I say to them, listen, don't build
my insurance, I'll pay cash.

Speaker 4 (01:28:02):
Yeah, when you walk in on an ambulance, you think
that's going to work that way.

Speaker 3 (01:28:06):
Well, no, I'm not talking about an ambulance. I'm just
talking about when you're in there getting a procedure, not
to put it through insurance.

Speaker 4 (01:28:14):
They actually call this the reverse insurance pricing, or a
lot of people coined it the insurance penalty. Can you
imagine that Obama forced us to buy insurance and pay
more than if we did with cash.

Speaker 5 (01:28:28):
That's an incredible thing.

Speaker 3 (01:28:30):
John Jones Junior. With Integra Insurance, they're your health brokers
that help you find insurance, and I'm telling you you
should use them during open enrollment to help you find
health insurance, whether it's Medicare with a supplement advantage or
a private plan. John Jones Junior, John, let's just talk.
Have you heard about this. He went to an er

(01:28:53):
he had a CT scan and he said that his
copay is way more than if he just paid for
it out of pocket.

Speaker 12 (01:29:02):
Yeah, sure, it can happen in some hospitals, clinics, doctors,
though in your self pay or cash only discounts can
be less than if it's front through insurance. I mean
you're saving the uh, you know, the paperwork at the
time and the processing and claims and all of that
that that stuff. So yeah, that can happen.

Speaker 1 (01:29:19):
And but.

Speaker 12 (01:29:21):
Paying for things out of pocket, like you, I'll just
go without health insurance and just say for stuff out
of pocket. That works for the small stuff potentially, but
not major self the insurance gives you that max out
of pocket, and so if you have a major medical event,
you're not going to negotiate down three hundred thousand dollars
of healthcare. You know, of claims of bills to right

(01:29:42):
cash totally bucks right and so.

Speaker 3 (01:29:44):
But John, is it okay? Is it okay to say,
when I'm going in for a CT scan, can I
compare self pay with my insurance and then choose self pay?

Speaker 12 (01:29:54):
No, Because because they don't know, it just goes through it,
it's submitted to the insurance. They're not going to be
able to tell you, well, this is what's going to
cost if you use your health insurance to go through
the claims process they build, the insurance company whatever, they
build all of it.

Speaker 3 (01:30:07):
What a screwed up system. Game. Yeah, what a screwed
up system. It's totally screwed up. Insured. I can't believe.
I can't believe that Terry is paying more because he's insured,
because my god.

Speaker 4 (01:30:18):
I've been bitching about Obamacare forever. Think about it, man,
it's absolutely insane. Who's making all the money If it's
five hundred bucks if you pay cash to the hospital
and three thousand if you have insurance, insurance is putting
all the money in their greedy pockets.

Speaker 3 (01:30:35):
No, now, you know I agree with that.

Speaker 19 (01:30:37):
I don't know.

Speaker 12 (01:30:37):
I do agree with that that three thousand dollar goes
towards your MAC out of pocket, it goes through towards
your deductible. It's not no so and the whole thing's convoluted.
Like I said, the doctors in the hospital's build, the
insurance company whatever it is they want to bill them.

Speaker 7 (01:30:51):
I guess.

Speaker 12 (01:30:52):
I mean, here's kind of arbitrary to a point too.
An insurance company then sort through, apply to discounts and
then you get your EOBS explanation of benefit with your cost.

Speaker 13 (01:31:00):
You're at a pocket cost for that service, but.

Speaker 12 (01:31:02):
It does apply towards your deductible. If you were only
paying cash, it's not applying toward anything. And you know,
if you do have that larger medical event, well now
you're paying more eventually by going that route.

Speaker 21 (01:31:15):
Well, so to get back to the more narrow topic
of Terry's call, So I did run this service through
the estimating tool, Yeah, and I did find Saint Elizabeth
Hospital up in forth Morgan and our core Terry is correct.
It says that hey, the regular price for this is
fifty eight hundred and seventy dollars, but if for self

(01:31:35):
pay no insurance, it's three hundred and forty.

Speaker 3 (01:31:38):
Five dollars sucks. Come on, man, that sucks. Tell me
about it now. It does caution you that real makes
sense to me.

Speaker 21 (01:31:45):
Radiologist and reading fees will be built separately, but I
can't imagine that those would add up to five thousand bucks.

Speaker 3 (01:31:52):
I share marks, iire, I really do. It's freaking ridiculous.
You know, we need a system that really works. What
we should do?

Speaker 4 (01:32:00):
You want to bring this up the Democrats, So I
am going to take it a little political because they're.

Speaker 3 (01:32:04):
The ones on it.

Speaker 4 (01:32:05):
They mark do it after this, save Obamacare they want
to save you know, they produce everything. They go down
five hundred bucks, I pay almost triple.

Speaker 5 (01:32:15):
Now it is complete nonsense.

Speaker 3 (01:32:18):
All right, we're gonna talk more about this, plus take
your calls. If you're on the line, we will. Margie,
please hang on the line, Jim, hang on the line.
We got more coming up on the Troubleshooter Show. Listen,
this is look at We discuss everyday aches and pains,
the things that tack you up, the things that make
you tick. And it's really ticking me off. Right after this,

(01:32:43):
go with a sure thing Denver's Best roofer Excel roofing
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of insurance companies find out Now three oh three, seven
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(01:33:04):
customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate man
dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance three
oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom
Martinez here with Mark Major and basically John Jones. You're
saying it's not unusual to have cash payments much much,

(01:33:30):
much lower than insurance payments.

Speaker 8 (01:33:32):
Why wouldn't insurance company I'm surprised.

Speaker 12 (01:33:35):
I'm surprised by that. That the numbers that he was
just looking at there, and that's an estimator. Remember it's
not necessarily exactly what it's going to be.

Speaker 13 (01:33:44):
I am surprised that it's that much much lower.

Speaker 12 (01:33:46):
And it certainly depends on the insurance. It depends on
the carrier and the contract they have with the with
the buyer or the hospital.

Speaker 3 (01:33:55):
But yeah, I mean, I have a simple question, File things.
I have a simple question. Why wouldn't an insurance company
say we insist on the lowest price, And why wouldn't
they get a cash price or or five hundred instead
of thirty five hundred. I mean, it just doesn't seem
to me they're doing a good job negotiating prices. If

(01:34:16):
I had an insurance company and I could pay five
hundred dollars for something, why wouldn't I?

Speaker 1 (01:34:23):
No, I understand, I understand.

Speaker 4 (01:34:25):
It's to your point. Everybody should get the medicaid price.
Then that'd be impossible. They wouldn't have a business.

Speaker 12 (01:34:33):
You mean medicary a percentage of medicare that type of thing?

Speaker 7 (01:34:36):
No, exactly.

Speaker 12 (01:34:37):
So then you and in You're right, At different locations,
things cost different a different hospitals, different doctors.

Speaker 3 (01:34:45):
Okay, I guess what I meant was this? Okay, what
would the real price be if you didn't have paying
overly too much or too little? What would the real
price be to make a profit? And on a ct scale?
In other words, you're saying, Mark, you couldn't exist at
three point fifty, but what about fifty nine hundred? There's

(01:35:07):
got to be a realistic price. Why did we get
into this game of pricing things different?

Speaker 5 (01:35:13):
Oh my god, Well, I'm going to say it again.

Speaker 4 (01:35:15):
Obamacare, he decided to give all the money to insurance companies. Look,
we need insurance. Going to John Junior, exactly what he said.
If something was catastrophic, this guy most likely would be
maximum out of pocket of fifteen thousand or whatever his
insurance plan is.

Speaker 3 (01:35:33):
So I get that.

Speaker 4 (01:35:34):
But to answer your question, Tom, Obamacare Obamacare Obamacare.

Speaker 3 (01:35:40):
But we and we can't have realistic pricing across the board,
is what I'm saying. I think we will.

Speaker 4 (01:35:45):
I think we will in the next year or so.

Speaker 3 (01:35:49):
That would be I think God said. And I'm not
talking about I'm not talking about just a realistic price
that everyone can depend on. Insurance pays it in division,
wills pay it, and you don't have this phony baloney
stuff where the majority people are paying for they're paying

(01:36:09):
for our minority they are. Why if you made the
entire system more fair, then people would be able to
afford insurance. They're defeating their own purpose by having these
football prices, where your footballing prices depending on where it is,
who it is, how it is. It's just really ridiculous.

(01:36:29):
How can they justify five nine hundred bucks for a
CT scan, Oh, unless you're paying three hundred and fifty dollars.
I mean, what is that That three fifty is not
paying for that service? We can agree to that. So
who's supplementing that the people paying fifty nine hundred and
again Mark saying it happened with Obamacare. Are you sure?

(01:36:52):
I don't know, John Jones. Have we had pricing discrepancies
before Obamacare?

Speaker 14 (01:36:57):
Sure?

Speaker 12 (01:36:57):
But is there's medical loss rare with these health insurance companies.
They have to pay eighty percent of premiums on medical
claims and quality improvements.

Speaker 3 (01:37:07):
So they have to.

Speaker 12 (01:37:09):
Pay eighty percent of the premium dollar that comes in
goes out to paying medical claims. It's not just like.

Speaker 4 (01:37:16):
But since but since Obamacare? Right John Junior. Prior to Obamacare,
they didn't have to well.

Speaker 12 (01:37:23):
Constant Sky, Well, prior to Obamacare, a lot of people
couldn't get health insurance because they had a pre existing
condition and so insurance.

Speaker 5 (01:37:30):
Listen, I'm not arguing the good parts about it. That's
not what I'm here to do. What I'm saying is
they change.

Speaker 3 (01:37:36):
The rules to where if you don't.

Speaker 4 (01:37:39):
Benefit from tax credits, the bottom line is you pay
more than you ever did in your entire damn life.

Speaker 12 (01:37:47):
Sure, yes, right, you did because you're now paying for
pre existing conditions. You're not paying.

Speaker 11 (01:37:51):
I mean everybody gets there.

Speaker 4 (01:37:52):
And for pregnancy and for abortions and for everything. And
I'm a mail and I still pay for this other things.

Speaker 7 (01:38:00):
Corrector though, all right.

Speaker 3 (01:38:01):
I got we got to move on, John Junior Integra
Insurance by the way, three zho three four six six
fifty five hundred. There's Margie too, Margie. What's going Yeah
they are Margie. What's going on with you? Margie?

Speaker 22 (01:38:13):
Oh?

Speaker 14 (01:38:14):
I got three situations, but I'll tell you the first first.

Speaker 3 (01:38:17):
Okay, go ahead.

Speaker 14 (01:38:18):
I have been looking for a room. I lived.

Speaker 19 (01:38:24):
For three years with one guy. He was like family
and a friend. Then I moved in with my ex
for three and a half years. I moved back with him.
We had problems, and so I moved back with him.
He's he's a hoarder.

Speaker 14 (01:38:36):
Oh my god, so bad.

Speaker 19 (01:38:38):
Anyway, he asked me to move out, and I think
because he's whatever, he has so many problems, doesn't want
me to see it.

Speaker 3 (01:38:45):
Whatever.

Speaker 14 (01:38:45):
So I'm desperate.

Speaker 19 (01:38:46):
I gotta find a place. I go to one place,
I moved in with a woman who turned into satan
in eight days. That's one situation. But this other situation.
I give a guy to a deposit that didn't work
out the first one. I moved back with my roommate
looking for a place.

Speaker 14 (01:39:02):
I'm desperate.

Speaker 19 (01:39:03):
I'm sixty three, disabled, naive, no direction, nobody to help me.
So I put a deposit. I give a guy a
six hundred dollars deposit. He tells me a realist. He's
a real estate agent, thirty years old. You know, seems
like you've got it going on. I believe him.

Speaker 14 (01:39:20):
I give him a deposit.

Speaker 19 (01:39:22):
After I give him the deposit, he starts to texting me,
I want you to walk around sexy and negliges.

Speaker 3 (01:39:28):
Wait wait a minute, mar Marge, you paid this guy
six hundred bucks. Yes, and after you paid this, before
you moved in, he started asking, what you're going to
wear as you walk around?

Speaker 14 (01:39:43):
Pictures of me sexy.

Speaker 19 (01:39:44):
Now, I'm sixty three and I look pretty damn good.
And I'm disabled too. I need serious surgery anyway, But
I look good all right. So he's telling me he
wants to smell my dirty underwear, have pictures of me
around the house, have me walk around after I did them.

Speaker 5 (01:40:02):
You're six hundred back, and thank your lucky stars. I mean,
come on, I can't.

Speaker 14 (01:40:06):
I can't find him. He won't text me back. I'm
going to give you the money.

Speaker 3 (01:40:10):
Wait a minute, where where did you pay him? Did
you go look at the room?

Speaker 14 (01:40:14):
Yes? And then I paid him through Zell, which was
stupid because I didn't know any better.

Speaker 19 (01:40:21):
I can't to a different person, Judy from Judy M.
I don't want to say too many names up here
because it's the radio.

Speaker 3 (01:40:28):
So this guy was this guy was texting you. Did
you keep all the texts? Yeah?

Speaker 14 (01:40:34):
I got him. I can read them to you right now.

Speaker 5 (01:40:36):
How do you know he even had control over the room.

Speaker 14 (01:40:40):
I didn't.

Speaker 19 (01:40:40):
And he didn't want to do a background check.

Speaker 14 (01:40:42):
I said, I went a background check. I saw another woman.

Speaker 3 (01:40:45):
He how old is this guy? How old is this guy?
Is he a dirty old man? How old is he?

Speaker 14 (01:40:50):
He said he was thirty years old? He was young.

Speaker 4 (01:40:52):
Wait wait, wait, Margie, how did you see the room?
You said you saw it? Did you go there and
meet the guy?

Speaker 3 (01:40:58):
What happened?

Speaker 19 (01:40:59):
Yes, to meet him at one place in Aurora and
then I didn't like that place, and he brought me
down to Denver. I have all the addresses and stuff,
and I said, okay, lots.

Speaker 14 (01:41:11):
Of room this and that.

Speaker 19 (01:41:12):
He was telling me, Oh, I'm a makeup artist. You
could do makeup for my YouTube channel. I'm going to
help you make money with your feet.

Speaker 14 (01:41:20):
Your feet are beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:41:21):
And that was oh god, this, this guy's a weirdo.
This guy's a weirdo. So right now you're looking, right now,
you're looking to get your money back. I take it.

Speaker 19 (01:41:32):
Yeah, And I'm out eighteen hundred dollars from another woman too,
and I don't know how many subjects.

Speaker 5 (01:41:37):
What's my goodness?

Speaker 3 (01:41:39):
Why did you? Where'd you get all this money to
pay out?

Speaker 19 (01:41:43):
I got I'm on disability. I need some I really
need some severe surgeries. And so I had some disability money.
I had to move out, and I took a nanny
job with the other lady and that didn't work.

Speaker 14 (01:41:54):
Out for eight days. She said, I destroyed this God.

Speaker 3 (01:41:56):
You have what what? How'd you? How'd you get into
this situation at sixty three? By the way, how.

Speaker 14 (01:42:07):
Lots of bad decisions?

Speaker 19 (01:42:09):
I guess, being so naive and alone, no direction, no boyfriend, nobody.

Speaker 3 (01:42:14):
What what is your what is your plan for the future?
What is your plan?

Speaker 19 (01:42:20):
Well, I have a great place to live, in right now,
I'm in Greenwood Village and it's beautiful, but.

Speaker 14 (01:42:26):
All my disability money goes to that.

Speaker 19 (01:42:28):
And I had to take a job which I really
shouldn't even be working to afford this place. It's the
only decent place I could find. And I'm in a
spot and food stamps and I don't want to get
into tears.

Speaker 3 (01:42:42):
Well, I'm trying to come up with a So, So
what are you calling about today, Margie? What's the main
issue today?

Speaker 5 (01:42:49):
She wants a reforce.

Speaker 9 (01:42:50):
My good friend told me to call you, and yeah,
maybe you can help me because give me this guy.

Speaker 4 (01:42:58):
Get get this guy's name and phone number, and I'll
try to reach him.

Speaker 3 (01:43:01):
All right, hold on, we're gonna take a break. Hold on,
we got we gotta take this break. I'm Tom Martino.
Let's figure out what this guy is, where he is
and try to get some money for her. Right after this,
go with a sure thing Denver's Best roofer Excel roofing

(01:43:24):
dot com. You don't pay a cent until you're content.
Please time for an insurance check up free, no obligation
comparison call Compass Insurance paying too much your coverage at
dozens of insurance companies find out now three oh three
seven to seven to one. Help. You'll think you're his
only customer when you choose Frank durand the real estate

(01:43:44):
man dot com to list your home with Remax Alliance
three oh three nine two zero sixteen twenty two.

Speaker 4 (01:43:57):
All right, three o three seven one three eight two five.
Margie got herself into a bind. Hey, bring Margie back up.
But Margie, you met with this guy, what's his name,
Chico Chino. You met with him a couple times and
transferred money to him. Then you decided after he started
getting uh, let's just say a little fetishi or freaky.

Speaker 5 (01:44:19):
That you didn't want anything to do with him.

Speaker 4 (01:44:21):
I tried to call him a second ago while we
were on break, and all I got was this number.
I couldn't leave a message, I couldn't talk to anybody.

Speaker 3 (01:44:29):
I couldn't do anything.

Speaker 14 (01:44:31):
Mm hmmm mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:44:34):
So she sent it.

Speaker 4 (01:44:35):
By Zelly track him down? But how would I track
him down?

Speaker 19 (01:44:43):
My good friend said that we could find out about
the addresses and who owns the home. I was told
to call you.

Speaker 3 (01:44:50):
No, no, I understand. We can try to find out
whuants on home? But how's that going to help you
get money back from Zell. Here's what I would like
to do.

Speaker 4 (01:45:00):
I would like to set up for him to show
me an apartment and then I can confront the guy.

Speaker 5 (01:45:06):
That's what I'm trying to figure out.

Speaker 3 (01:45:08):
How would I do that, Margie?

Speaker 14 (01:45:11):
Oh, that's excellent. How he was on next door?

Speaker 3 (01:45:15):
Well, that's okay, but he may not want you to
walk around in a secondly a sexy neglige. He might
just be targeting women.

Speaker 5 (01:45:23):
Hey, I might bring Dimitri. Then that'll put an end
of all women.

Speaker 14 (01:45:27):
He was renting to all women?

Speaker 12 (01:45:29):
Women?

Speaker 7 (01:45:31):
Wow?

Speaker 3 (01:45:32):
So this home? Where where did you first see the ad?

Speaker 14 (01:45:37):
Next door?

Speaker 3 (01:45:39):
Next? I want to set up a sting.

Speaker 4 (01:45:41):
We got to figure out how I can get in
touch with him, even if I'm Nancy.

Speaker 3 (01:45:45):
Yeah, So hold on, Margie, and let's figure it out.
Let's try to get a hold of this guy on
next door and see where it leads. I'm Tom Martine.
We got more coming up on The Troubleshooter Show three
oh three, seven to one, three talks seven to one,
three eight two more right after this, Go with a

(01:46:07):
sure Thing Denver's Best Roofer Excel roofing dot com. You
don't pay a cent until you're content. Time for an
insurance check up free, no obligation comparison call Compass Insurance
paying too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies.
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You'll think you're his only customer when you choose Frank

(01:46:29):
durand the real estate Man dot com to list your
home with Remax Alliance three oh three nine two zero
sixteen twenty two.

Speaker 1 (01:46:37):
Yeah, Ritt.

Speaker 3 (01:46:44):
News.

Speaker 2 (01:46:45):
You need advice who you don't have?

Speaker 3 (01:46:49):
Come run instant as can.

Speaker 2 (01:46:53):
Shooter's gonna help.

Speaker 17 (01:46:54):
Come man, this is the Troubleshooter Show. No, I'm Martino.

Speaker 3 (01:47:01):
Hey, I'm Tom Martino. Welcome to the show. This hour
brought to you by Frank Duran, the Realestateman dot com,
the only one in the business who offers you a
free analysis of your home and what it should be
priced at, what it will sell for, what you will net,
what you can buy. It's all free of charge. Complementary
from Frank Duran, the Realestateman dot com. He's been around

(01:47:23):
thirty years and he has great market knowledge. He can
impart to you. And I'm telling you if you need
information on what your house will sell for then you
want Frank Duran, the realestateman dot com threeho three nine
to zero, sixteen twenty two. We've had quite of the
discussions this morning, and Margie said, I tried to rent

(01:47:49):
a room from a guy. I paid a money upfront
in Zell and then he starts texting me stuff like
I want you to walk around sexy, I want you
to do this, I want you to do that. So
she had to find a place elsewhere. She never went
to this place, and now she doesn't know how to
get her money back. And I don't think you are

(01:48:10):
going to get your money back unless he gives it back.
And I'm not sure you have all the text so
you can prove he was texting you inappropriately. The guy
sounds like a sicko. And he said he was only
in his thirties and he offered to rent you a place.

(01:48:30):
Where was this place roughly located, Margie?

Speaker 19 (01:48:34):
Can I say the name of the street, Yeah, twenty
fifth Street in Denver, Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:48:42):
And you saw it on next door? And did he
start did he start texting you immediately after you sent
him the money? Yes, And you went to see him
and you met with him, and did he seem creepy
to you.

Speaker 19 (01:48:59):
No, he seemed like the super cool guy, like, oh wow,
you know he was gonna.

Speaker 3 (01:49:06):
And what was the first inappropriate text? What did he say?

Speaker 19 (01:49:10):
All right, Uh, let's get it.

Speaker 14 (01:49:15):
I bet you have beautiful feet. You're very pretty. Margie
called me princess.

Speaker 3 (01:49:22):
God, that's sick.

Speaker 14 (01:49:24):
I want to see what your feet look like. What
a weird let's see. Uh, let's get to the good one.

Speaker 3 (01:49:32):
When were you do to move in there?

Speaker 14 (01:49:35):
I guess about a month ago? Thank you?

Speaker 3 (01:49:39):
So you've been trying to get your money back? Did
you can you text him? Do you have his number?

Speaker 19 (01:49:45):
Yeah? And I text him and you guys called, and
there's no anything.

Speaker 14 (01:49:49):
You can't get him. I think he's blocked.

Speaker 3 (01:49:50):
Mark. Is the phone out of order or what's going on? Mark?

Speaker 4 (01:49:53):
Yeah, there's no voicemail set up and no one answers.
It basically goes directly to hey, not accepting call.

Speaker 19 (01:50:01):
I have sewn your feet, send me a picture of
your feet.

Speaker 14 (01:50:05):
I'm not like that.

Speaker 3 (01:50:06):
You'll see how this guy's really into feet. But then
he said he wants you to walk around.

Speaker 14 (01:50:11):
Now are your legs?

Speaker 19 (01:50:13):
He wants to know about my sweaty feet? Was I
want your dirty underwear. I want you to walk around
in a negligee. I want to see your dirty panties.
One day I can controntroll myself. Yeah, I can't make
this up.

Speaker 3 (01:50:27):
No that you can't make this up. I'm so sorry
about this, Margie. This is terrible.

Speaker 5 (01:50:37):
I think it's beyond that.

Speaker 4 (01:50:38):
I doubt he has any control over these two rooms
at all.

Speaker 14 (01:50:44):
Because my friend looked at the address.

Speaker 3 (01:50:47):
And were you inside the house. Did you look? Did
he show you the rooms?

Speaker 18 (01:50:51):
Yes?

Speaker 19 (01:50:52):
I was inside both locations, the Aurora location.

Speaker 14 (01:50:55):
Which I have the address to that. I gave it
to the woman that talked to me before you, and
I have the address for that. I saw both places.

Speaker 19 (01:51:04):
He was renting to another woman and another woman in
the other place in Denver.

Speaker 14 (01:51:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:51:10):
Women, you didn't see the women, did you?

Speaker 19 (01:51:15):
I met the one woman in Aurora, and I did
not see the other woman who was renting in Denver.

Speaker 3 (01:51:24):
And did you happen to did the woman say anything?
Did she seem okay or what?

Speaker 19 (01:51:30):
The woman that was renting from him and Aurora was
not okay. She wanted a lease from him, and he
said yeah, but he wouldn't give me a lease.

Speaker 14 (01:51:38):
A background check or anything. I don't do that. I
just trust people. That's a bread flag too.

Speaker 3 (01:51:45):
Did you talk to the other woman a little bit.

Speaker 19 (01:51:49):
We had a conversation and she had a problem where
she was renting before and then she said, I want
a lease, I want this and.

Speaker 3 (01:51:56):
She was Did she say did she hint you that
this guy might be a weirdo?

Speaker 19 (01:52:01):
No, she hinted that the other people she was living
with were no good.

Speaker 3 (01:52:07):
God, Margie, Margie, Margie.

Speaker 14 (01:52:12):
He was so charming. Oh, I'm going to hope you.

Speaker 19 (01:52:14):
You're going to do makeup for me for my YouTube videos.

Speaker 14 (01:52:18):
Oh, I'm going to help you make the on.

Speaker 3 (01:52:20):
Your Do you have his YouTube? Do you have his
YouTube channel?

Speaker 14 (01:52:26):
I think so, but it would be hard to find.
I did subscribe to it.

Speaker 3 (01:52:30):
Yes, Well, would you do us a favor and try
to find that YouTube channel for us so we can
look at it. I wanted this guy could be dangerous.
I mean it's crazy, I'm scared.

Speaker 14 (01:52:46):
I mean it's fright.

Speaker 21 (01:52:47):
I would love to look up this dude's YouTube channel. Yeah,
and then I want to research him a little bit,
because so, let's you're into something.

Speaker 3 (01:52:55):
This guy really could be dangerous.

Speaker 14 (01:52:57):
Time though, I don't know if I could do it.

Speaker 3 (01:52:59):
No, no, we'll we'll no, no no, we can disconnect
and get back in touch. Kachina, get this number for
Deputy Deputy D. I want to Margie. Hold on. We'll
get your cell phone number and Deputy D will get
that name of the YouTube channel from you. If you
subscribe to it, then it's got to be somewhere where

(01:53:20):
you can get it. We want to look at this
guy and maybe, seriously, this guy might be a nut
that we have to let people know about. Three oh
three seven one three talk seven one three A two
five five. Jim, Welcome to the show. After Jim, we
have open lines you can get right through three O
three seven one three A two five five. What's going on? Jim?

Speaker 7 (01:53:45):
Hey Tom, how you guys doing.

Speaker 3 (01:53:46):
Appreciate good man, it's kind of weird. What's going on
with you?

Speaker 13 (01:53:52):
Well, Uh, I had some problems with the local utility
company down here in Okay Spring.

Speaker 3 (01:53:59):
What's the name of the utility.

Speaker 13 (01:54:01):
Company, Colorado Springs Utilities, Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:54:06):
And what's the problem you're having.

Speaker 13 (01:54:09):
Well, my wife and I went over one night to
go work on a place that we're going to be
moving into, and it was kind of cold. It was
in February of this, you know, last year, and I
didn't have any heat, so I couldn't I couldn't figure
out how to turn it on. I tried lighting the pilot,
couldn't get anything. So we called out the utility department.

(01:54:33):
They light your pilots for free, you know, And so
he came out and the guy said, hey, I can't
get this lid. I don't know what's going on. So
he did some more investigation and he said, can you
go turn on your lights, you know, in the rest
of the place, And I said, sure, Well, part of

(01:54:53):
the lights didn't come on in one side of the house,
the bedroom, the master bedroom light didn't come on. In
the bathroom, the master bedroom light didn't come on. And
so apparently, long story short, they called out another crew
to come out to hook up an emergency generator for us,

(01:55:16):
so you know, we could light the furnace and have
heat there and yeah, try and do what you need
to do. Well, they came out and they couldn't get
it lit either, and they said it was a bad transformer.
So they had a guy come out and he was,
you know, working underground.

Speaker 3 (01:55:34):
And they said, so wait a minute. So they said
it was an outside problem, not inside your house.

Speaker 7 (01:55:41):
Right, correct. Yeah.

Speaker 13 (01:55:43):
So they came out with a temporary generator and that
lit or that got some of the power going for
the bedroom, you know, the lights, but the furnace would
not fire up.

Speaker 1 (01:55:57):
It wouldn't go.

Speaker 13 (01:55:58):
So then they said, well, our transformers that and so
from the transformer box to where it taps into our meter,
our electrical meter, it was fried and there was nothing.

Speaker 1 (01:56:09):
They could do.

Speaker 13 (01:56:10):
They had to hire it out to a subcontractor to
come and do it.

Speaker 3 (01:56:13):
Okay, so far, so good, Jim, so far so good.
What's going on?

Speaker 13 (01:56:18):
Well, the problem is is that according to my furnace guy,
my furnace is fried and it was I had just
had it inspected.

Speaker 1 (01:56:27):
For the year.

Speaker 3 (01:56:28):
How old is this furnace?

Speaker 13 (01:56:33):
Probably about twelve years old.

Speaker 3 (01:56:36):
What makes you so you're accusing basically the utility company
of destroying your furnace?

Speaker 1 (01:56:43):
Absolutely?

Speaker 7 (01:56:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:56:45):
Why why would it take your furnace out but nothing
else in the house?

Speaker 1 (01:56:50):
Well, it did it hit the lights all? None of
the lights came on.

Speaker 5 (01:56:57):
Did they do?

Speaker 3 (01:56:58):
You said, so you're saying they're bad transformer knocked out
your furnace?

Speaker 13 (01:57:04):
Yeah, because it was it was working.

Speaker 7 (01:57:07):
I mean that earlier.

Speaker 13 (01:57:08):
That day, before the outage, before you know, whatever happened happened.

Speaker 3 (01:57:13):
And I thought you said it wasn't working.

Speaker 13 (01:57:18):
No, no, no. When I got there, it wasn't working.
But when we had left that day, the furnace was on.
Everything was good. We went over there to go work.
So I went to go turn the furnace up, couldn't
get it on.

Speaker 3 (01:57:30):
Got it. So to make this argument, this is going
to be a really difficult argument. You're making the argument
that the utilities transformer took out your furnace.

Speaker 7 (01:57:45):
Right, so I went through the claims.

Speaker 3 (01:57:47):
I don't know, it's both still there. Yes, I'm listening bo.
It doesn't even seem possible if there was a bad
transformer an electrical part. You know, electricity is not a
big part of a furnace that it would take it
out completely. I mean there's burners and gas valves and
all kinds of stuff.

Speaker 10 (01:58:06):
I have a couple of questions for Jim. Every finance
has a external and internal fuse, as possible, it could
be just the fuse and nft T they.

Speaker 7 (01:58:17):
Went through everything when they were there.

Speaker 3 (01:58:19):
Okay, what about.

Speaker 1 (01:58:20):
That anything there?

Speaker 10 (01:58:22):
Well, the most that could happen would be the computer
or the circuit board. You can't take out the burners.

Speaker 3 (01:58:28):
Like, that's what I'm saying. Like, have you had your
furnace analyzed by someone that you can trust? Yeah?

Speaker 13 (01:58:35):
Yeah, where did he saypened?

Speaker 1 (01:58:39):
I had.

Speaker 13 (01:58:39):
I had the furnace inspected and plane for the winner.
So then I called this guy back out and told
him what happened, and he goes, yeah, your chip. Your
chip is burnt on the circuit board. It's like seventy
eight hundred bucks. So he came out with a new one,
tried to hook that up and it still didn't work.

Speaker 3 (01:58:57):
Yeah, but Jim, truly board in there. Their transformers not
going to blow out your burners. They're not going to
blow There's something else wrong with this system. You need someone, truly,
you know who? I would call where are you in
the Springs?

Speaker 22 (01:59:13):
Uh?

Speaker 7 (01:59:14):
Central?

Speaker 3 (01:59:16):
Okay, I would call Smith.

Speaker 13 (01:59:19):
That's the thing though, is that they said it was
there's nothing they can do according to the rules and regulations.
I tried to call the Public Utilities Department and they said,
because Colorado Springs is a municipality, they have no jurisdiction over.

Speaker 3 (01:59:34):
The Jim, Well, you could Jim, I mean, Jim, Jim,
you're not listening to me. I'm not convinced that your
furnace guy diagnosed your problem accurately. And the only way
we can help you is if you get Smith Plumbing, heating, cooling,
and electric out there and you have them analyze it.

(01:59:56):
What's that?

Speaker 1 (01:59:57):
Yeah?

Speaker 9 (01:59:57):
I know Eva, I know Eva the owner.

Speaker 3 (02:00:00):
Good, excellent, Oh my god, you know Eva and Mike Robinson.
Eva and Mike Robinson. Get them to come out and
analyze exactly what's wrong with the furnace and see if
they can make a connection to the bad transformer and
then will help you. Yeah, they need on the invoice,

(02:00:20):
tell me the same thing.

Speaker 7 (02:00:21):
They're going to say, it's a chip.

Speaker 3 (02:00:23):
Well you know what. But but hold on, but you
said even with the chip it won't fire up. They
can tell you.

Speaker 13 (02:00:32):
Why it works.

Speaker 7 (02:00:33):
Well, okay, I look at.

Speaker 3 (02:00:35):
What am I? Hello? Hello? Is this thing working?

Speaker 13 (02:00:39):
I mean, I'm trying to do what it is?

Speaker 3 (02:00:42):
Okay, Jim, I'm not I understand everything you're saying. You're
saying that a faulty transformer somehow blew out your furnace.

Speaker 13 (02:00:50):
I had a faulty He said that I had a
faulty meter, which is what caused it. And I said, well,
what do I have to do with a city meter?
And he came back, This is the adjuster for the
utilities department. He came back and said, well, according to
how it works, the City of Colorado Springs is not

(02:01:10):
responsible for their equipment when it causes damage. They're saying,
I had a faulty meter, and I said, why, don't
have anything to do with the meter. It's not my meter.

Speaker 3 (02:01:21):
Yeah, but read what you still, Jim. A faulty meter
is not going to blow out your furnace. We're trying
to figure out what is wrong with your furnace.

Speaker 1 (02:01:32):
Are there?

Speaker 3 (02:01:33):
It's just a circuit board, Jim.

Speaker 7 (02:01:35):
They said it was the chip.

Speaker 3 (02:01:37):
Jim. Would you do us a favor. Here's what I'm
telling you to do. We need an accurate diagnosis. Even
Deputy bow here says it's not sounding accurate. Now, listen,
you got a twelve year old furnace. What we want
to know is exactly what is wrong with the furnace,

(02:01:58):
Not from your cockamami guy who came there and said
somehow the transformer blew out your furnace. We want to
know what is wrong with that furnace. It could be
a circuit board, it could be more. It could have
nothing to do with what's going on. It could be coincidental,
it could be directly caused by it. Jim, we want

(02:02:20):
to help you, but we're not going to build on
your foundation. We are going to build a new foundation.
That's what we're going to do. We're gonna analyze this
step by step. First, you call Smith out, you have
them go through the entire system and tell you what's
wrong with it, and then we figure out could this

(02:02:43):
be tied to the meter? Could this be tied to
the transformer? Bo help me here. He discussed first the
transformer and then the meter. They are two separate systems.
The electric nach.

Speaker 10 (02:03:01):
Wouldn't have anything to do with that.

Speaker 5 (02:03:02):
All it does is s been around the transformer.

Speaker 10 (02:03:05):
Blowing could have caused a power surge. The most that
could possibly do is maybe take out a circuit board,
which is like a six to seven hundred dollars item.
It would not destroy the entire furnace.

Speaker 3 (02:03:18):
When Benny said, but then he said, when he put
the board in it did not work. I don't know
if the guy did it correctly or not. That's why
I told him to call Mike Robinson and Eva call
over at Smith Plumbing, Heat and Cooling Electric. Jim, we're
not telling you we don't want to help you. We're
telling you we do want to help you, but we

(02:03:40):
have to figure out what is wrong with it. That's
what we have to figure out.

Speaker 10 (02:03:46):
We need a proper diagnosis from a repidal company that
we know.

Speaker 4 (02:03:50):
Hey you, hey guys, even if even if it was
a transformer and it went through the meter and blew
out his furnace, I mean, couldn't that be an active
God would took out to transformer. Why not just turn
this over to your homeowners and call it done?

Speaker 3 (02:04:05):
Because we don't even know. That's the problem. That's the
first part. Because his homeowners is going to say, well,
we're not going to fix a furnace. We're not a
warranty company. See, that's gonna be the problem. We don't
have any definitive answer. He just has his guy that
went out there. But even Jim doesn't understand what he's

(02:04:26):
telling him. Did he say exactly what's wrong with the furnace.
If it's the circuit board, it's the circuit board. If
it's the burners, it's the burners. The meter would have
nothing to do with his furnace failing. But Jim doesn't
understand that, and I don't blame him for being confused.
But then he tells us we're interrupting him when we're
telling him what to do. Get it analyzed by a

(02:04:49):
company we know and trust. Then we take it one
step at a time and we find out who's responsible
or isn't just old. But that's what we have to do.
Three O three seven to one three talks seven one
three eight two five five. Go with a sure thing

(02:05:11):
Denver's best roofer Excel Roofing dot com. You don't pay
a cent until you're content, wait time for an insurance
check up free, no obligation. In comparison, call Compass Insurance
paying too much your coverage at dozens of insurance companies
find out now three all three seven to seven to
one help. You'll think you're his only customer when you

(02:05:32):
choose Frank durand the real estate Man dot com to
list your home with Remax Alliance three all three nine
two zero sixteen twenty two. Hi Tom Martino, A busy,
busy day today. It's been crazy, Doctor Tcherdeck is with
a Joel Tcherdek from Denver Region dot com, and I
want to remind people that the weight loss is great.
They do for pennies on the dollar and now they

(02:05:53):
have this new peptide they're adding to it. And the
main purpose, Joel.

Speaker 20 (02:05:58):
Is for what to add to this, It's to prevent
muscle loss while on the weight loss GLP once.

Speaker 3 (02:06:05):
So that's one of the biggest problems where people start
looking sunk in and all that.

Speaker 20 (02:06:09):
Right, if you're not exercising, you know, or even you know,
just taking some megotide in particular, you're losing body weight,
but part of that is also going to be some
muscle mouse if you don't maintain.

Speaker 3 (02:06:19):
These peptides can help maintain it.

Speaker 5 (02:06:21):
PEPSI I got to help you in here. Guys, ahead,
go ahead, more on this.

Speaker 4 (02:06:25):
I was on with Denver Regent of course for eight months.
I lost forty five pounds and I'm glad to say
I got off of it six or about six weeks ago,
and I've been doing great. You definitely lose some muscle mass,
but I want everybody to hear this part of it.
I was terrified the second I got off these you'd

(02:06:46):
put the weight back on, because that's what everybody kept saying, Oh,
you're gonna be on them for life. No, that is
not the case with me, and I think there's more
people like me than there are people that put.

Speaker 3 (02:06:56):
All the weight back on.

Speaker 4 (02:06:58):
You actually start getting some muscle memory in your brain
of your eating habits that formed while you were on
this drug. And the doc is one hundred percent right
on this. You can lose muscle mass, but if you
work out and do some stuff like that, in the
little bit of food you do eat, eat protein, do good,
and you'll you'll get by that. But once you're off THEMEDGE,

(02:07:21):
you can still control your weight and that muscle mass
comes back extremely quickly. And in that adding that peptide
to it, I wish you guys did that when I
was on it. It's ingenious, Doc. I love that aspect of it.
When did you guys do that?

Speaker 3 (02:07:37):
Well?

Speaker 20 (02:07:37):
I started talking to some colleagues around the country and
there were talking about getting really good results by adding
that to their treatment plants. And so now we're offering
that to patients as well. It's just one more added
thing that makes it a customized treatment plan, you know,
Like I said, it's never a one size fits all
for our patients. We want to make sure that we're
going to get the best results for all of our patients.

(02:07:58):
So by adding that peptide that helps to prevent skeletal
muscle loss. So Nri, we didn't have that when you
started mark, but we do now.

Speaker 3 (02:08:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:08:07):
No, and it's absolutely great. But people have got to
understand too. For less than three hundred bucks a month,
That's what I was saying, think about this. That include
the initial consultation with the doctor.

Speaker 3 (02:08:17):
You can do it.

Speaker 4 (02:08:17):
Over zoom, you can do it in person, whatever you
want to do, it doesn't matter. And then you have
contact to the MD all the time any questions you have.
And that includes some medication, which by the way, is
so easy to take it's crazy. And there's no long
term agreements. When you want to stop, you stop. You're
going to love these people. And I swear to God,

(02:08:40):
I'm walking testimony. Forty five pounds in eight months. I'm
telling you go to Denverregen dot com and just call up,
schedule that first free consultation and talk.

Speaker 3 (02:08:53):
About weight loss. Somebody said, I got off of the
weight loss a drug, and can I take a peptide
now to help me build muscles. That's a good question. Absolutely.

Speaker 20 (02:09:05):
We've always offered that as a standalone Ye. Yes, but
now we're combining both of them.

Speaker 3 (02:09:10):
That's good to know though. So the answer is yes, yes,
you can do excoose me. You can do the peptide
alone to help build muscle, right, and we have three
different growth hormone stimulating peptides, so we can help decide
which one would be the best fit a patient. Denverregen
dot com.

Speaker 5 (02:09:28):
Hey, one more thing real quick with him.

Speaker 4 (02:09:30):
I sent you guys like two days ago, doc someone
that was like, Hey, I am really having issues with
my diabetes and I'm having all this tingling in my
feet and you guys do that as well well.

Speaker 20 (02:09:44):
Well, the weight loss drug also treats for the diabetes,
but when you do have neuropathy in your feet, we
do have a stem cell procedure to treat foot neuropathy.
That's a long term effect of having diabetes. So that
yes on both of those, but it's.

Speaker 4 (02:09:58):
Not just a procedure to make make you feel better.
It actually corrects the problem and of course that gets
rid of the symptoms right right.

Speaker 20 (02:10:06):
Well, we treat the problem that it's throue, not just
a symptoms. So we treat the nerve damage, restore blood
floats of the nerve, which is what's causing the pain
in the first place, and that is what corrects the problem.

Speaker 3 (02:10:18):
It corrects the underlined We have to take this break.
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two zero sixteen twenty two. I'm Tom Martino, your troubleshooter, Adam.

(02:11:04):
Welcome to the show. What's going on? Adam? Hello? Adam?
What's happening?

Speaker 22 (02:11:12):
Hello?

Speaker 17 (02:11:13):
Hey?

Speaker 22 (02:11:14):
Oh not much?

Speaker 3 (02:11:19):
How can we help you? Adam? We're listening to you
and you keep saying hello, So tell us what's going on? Bro.

Speaker 22 (02:11:30):
I'm just trying to get advice on how to get
my child back that I can't seem to locate the
mother or where she is or anything in that nature.

Speaker 3 (02:11:41):
Okay, where I can now? Were you married? Were you
married to the mom?

Speaker 14 (02:11:46):
No?

Speaker 3 (02:11:49):
Okay? And how old is the child?

Speaker 22 (02:11:54):
There'll be three on the seventeenth of this month.

Speaker 3 (02:11:58):
Okay. Are you a birth certificate?

Speaker 7 (02:12:00):
Kid?

Speaker 3 (02:12:02):
No?

Speaker 22 (02:12:02):
Because when she had the child in the state of Colorado,
she was married to some other guy, and to get
unmarried she had to put it in the newspaper for
two weeks than she never did.

Speaker 3 (02:12:15):
To be unmarried, she had to put it in a
newspaper for two weeks. I don't understand what you mean.
Do you understand what he's trying to achieve? Well, I know,
I'm trying to get to the basics. So you have
a three year old son, and you have a woman
who has the son and is keeping you from seeing

(02:12:37):
the sun.

Speaker 22 (02:12:39):
Yes, and moved all the way to North Carolina.

Speaker 3 (02:12:42):
How do you know it's your son.

Speaker 22 (02:12:48):
By him looking exactly like me and having.

Speaker 3 (02:12:52):
You need way more than that, bro, You need way
more than that. Did you have any blood tests? Did
you establish legally? Have you as established paternity?

Speaker 17 (02:13:04):
No?

Speaker 22 (02:13:04):
And that's why I'm trying to find out where she
is to be able to locate her.

Speaker 4 (02:13:08):
Are you ready to pay child support to static curiosity?

Speaker 3 (02:13:13):
Yeah, okay, because you will have to pay child support,
but you have to You can't force her to get
a paternity suit unless you bring a court action, right
your suspicion. Listen, are you saying she was married to

(02:13:33):
another guy while she was having sex with you?

Speaker 15 (02:13:39):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (02:13:41):
And then do you think she tried to cover up, Adam?
Did she try to cover up the fact that this
was your son.

Speaker 22 (02:13:51):
No, the whole time she was admittedly, besides the very
first start, she was admittedly telling me that the whole
time it was my.

Speaker 3 (02:14:01):
Okay, Now, is she still married to this guy?

Speaker 22 (02:14:07):
I have no idea. I know that you went out
to North Carolina and had another child with some other
dude that I have no idea about.

Speaker 3 (02:14:17):
It's going to be very difficult, Adam, for you to
establish paternity. You have to now get to the courts
in North Carolina where she lives, and you're going to
have to compel that. You have to have something to
go on. How long were you going how long were

(02:14:38):
you seeing this woman?

Speaker 14 (02:14:43):
I mean.

Speaker 22 (02:14:46):
Before we had the kid like before the nine months.
So she got pregnant for a couple months and then
we were together for about a year and a half.

Speaker 3 (02:14:54):
When you say together, you were openly together.

Speaker 15 (02:14:59):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (02:15:01):
Were you living together?

Speaker 7 (02:15:03):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (02:15:05):
Okay, I didn't know that. So you were living together
for a year and a half. Then she got pregnant.

Speaker 22 (02:15:13):
No, No, we were living together for the first couple
of months, and then she got pregnant, and then we
continued to live with each other throughout the pregnancy. In
the little aftercod so she took off.

Speaker 1 (02:15:23):
With the kid.

Speaker 3 (02:15:25):
Okay, well, then that's a little stronger. And you don't
know where she is right now as far as exactly
where she is.

Speaker 22 (02:15:34):
All I know is Hampstead, North Carolina. That's all I know.

Speaker 3 (02:15:38):
So okay, so I looked up This is good news
for him.

Speaker 4 (02:15:41):
I looked up North Carolina and thank god, it's a
lot different than Colorado. But they'll actually under NC forty
nine fourteen, they will basically do a DNA test and
she doesn't It doesn't matter if she wants it done
or not. They're going to be able to do it,
which is pretty cool, but you do have to go

(02:16:02):
through the court and ask for it. In North Carolina.

Speaker 3 (02:16:08):
So you need to hire an attorney in North Carolina
who will then bring a motion to the court for
a paternity test.

Speaker 4 (02:16:18):
Tom, this is saying a little different. This is saying basically,
it gives you an idea of the motion. I'm just
talking about Rock or Ai. But I don't even think
he needs to hire an attorney. He basically needs to
state this eight dash five to zero dash one or
whatever the exact thing is, and.

Speaker 3 (02:16:35):
Mark anyone and anyone can force a paternity test.

Speaker 4 (02:16:39):
Yeah, then the sheriff will serve the mother and basically, yeah,
that's pretty much it.

Speaker 3 (02:16:45):
That's exactly it, Adam. Is there a way you can
get her actual address to get her served?

Speaker 22 (02:16:51):
That's what That's the biggest battle I've been fighting the
whole time is trying to locate it.

Speaker 3 (02:16:57):
Mark. Do we have any private detectives that can help
with this.

Speaker 5 (02:17:00):
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 3 (02:17:03):
We used to have some really good skip tracers that
could find people. Yeah, you need to find What we
need to do is if anyone's listening, and I want
to keep your number here, who can help him skip
trace someone? That's what he needs, he really does. He
needs to do this because we need to get him
somebody who can find What's the first of all, how

(02:17:27):
do you even know? Hold on, I got to come
back to you. I want to know how you even
know where she is? By the way, what's the quick
answer to that? How do you know where she is?
The town?

Speaker 22 (02:17:40):
Two?

Speaker 3 (02:17:42):
Okay, let's just take this break. We'll be right back.