Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It has been roughly what would it be. We're almost
at twenty four.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Hours, just about.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Yeah, since the jury convicted former Franklin County Sheriff's deputy
Jason Mead of reckless homicide, there was a hung jury
on the murder charge, and of course this was a retrial,
a rehash, if you will, and so let's bring him
on the FOP President Lodge nine, Brian Steele, Welcome to
(00:26):
the show, Brian, and I wish it were under better
circumstances you were joining us today, and I know yesterday
was a tout, to put it mildly, a jagged pill
to swallow with regard to this. But now that you've
given it, you know, almost twenty four hours to kind
of bounce around in your brain. What are your thoughts?
(00:46):
Tell us what you're thinking over this whole thing.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yeah, so listen, Thanks, shoving on as always, I've talked
to hundreds of my members of officers and they're just confused.
They're wondering what's going on? How does this happen? How
do we take Supreme Court decisions Graham versus Connor, how
do we throw them out the window. They're asking me,
what am I supposed to do when I'm facing somebody
pointing a gun at me. And what upsets me is
(01:11):
it seems like I'm on an island by myself. The
FOP is on an island by ourselves. These officers are
given no direction and only thing I could tell them,
And I put out a message to them last night
to trich Ryde and let them to know that we
support them, we understand the job they do to despite this,
despite this travesty of justice, fulfill your oath, go out
serve your community, and go home to your family at
(01:32):
the end of the night.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
The the I guess the after this convention, this conviction,
I should say, awaiting sentencing, which is scheduled for June sixteenth,
took immediately into custody. Did that Did that take you
by surprise or by shock the way that this immediately
played out right afterwards?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, nothing shocks me in this town, especially when you
know when individuals in his town drink the Columbus kool
aidy the gallons. I will tell you a little bit surprised, though,
I was a little bit surprised that that bond was revoked.
The purpose of the bond is to ensure that they
go to court. He's not a flight risk. He's keys
this whole entire time. He's cooperated with the courts. The
(02:16):
F three reckless homicide, it is a very low level
charge that in this city, in this county, even even
for for drug dealers gangsters recited a violent offenders very rarely,
if ever, results in a prison sentence. It's generally community
control and an ankle brace and kicked back on the street.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
This guilty verdict has a maximum of three years, which
means in this case they'll probably sit us into forty
five to fifty. The problem is there's going to be
I'm quite sure an appeal to this decision to not
allow him to be out on bond. To prepare for
that appeal makes no sense whatsoever.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
No, I'm sure they will. And then this is what
we always talk about politics and policing.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
You know that they don't mesh well, I'm very dis made.
I guess at this point that the sworn testimony of
a twenty five year law enforcement officer sworn to serve
and protect is negated in favor of speculation on behalf
of people who weren't there and saw nothing. That is
(03:18):
I'm still I'm still trying to process that. It just
doesn't make sense. Courts are supposed to be about fact
and logic, and there was no fact or logic at
all to this decision.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
The false narrative today is still being put out. There
are community advocacy groups that are saying to this day
that he is going to prison for shooting an unarmed
black man. Mister Goodson had a gun. He was never
unarmed black man. But I don't understand how he can
keep putting out that false narrative.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Speaking of narratives, did you see that that's out there
on socials I was reading, Of course, I didn't see
any of the footage about this judge. And people are
saying that they basically just wanted to go home and
it was like kind of a forced type thing. Are
you hearing about that, and do you have thoughts on that?
Speaker 3 (04:09):
I thought it was a little strange that, you know,
in the afternoon they were hung and they said we're hung,
and they were given the Howard charge. They were sent back,
they were told figure this out and forty five minutes later, Now,
even though you know it took a day and a half,
now and forty five minutes he came back with a
reckless homicide. That was surprising.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
That sounds like they're just trying to appease the judge.
And honestly, if it would have been two three days,
I might be able to swallow this a little bit easier.
But the fact that it was less than an hour
and the jury comes back with a guilty on at
least one of the charges, that tells me they're just
trying to appease the judge and get out of there.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
What's you got to look at it too? The courts
make it clear when we're justified as shooting, it's through
the reasonable. It's what would a reasonable officer do. Multiple
officers that were the state's own witnesses said if I
was facing a gun threat, I would fire. And again,
two people were there. Jason was there, testified to this
individual pointed a gun at him. We know a gun
(05:07):
was recovered. Mister Goodson, unfortunately and tragically, is not there
to tell his story. But it's just what we there's
no body cameras. Now, what we basically said is we
don't have to trust any credibility of an officer, which
is not good for this system.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
On the hung jury charge, the hung jury, I'm sorry,
not the hung jury charge, the murder charge where it
was hung jury. And I believe I heard the speculation
that and I think it was you saying, look, I
hope they don't try to go for a third trial
on this or retry of that. Is is that an actual,
real possibility.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
It is a possibility. And now you know, like I said,
the shale of favor or a matter prosecutor, she inherited
this case, she now owns this case if she was
to go forward, I hope she objectively looks at it.
I hope she takes public interest in account along with
the defendant's rights. You know, two jury can't get it right.
What makes you think another half a million dollars in
(06:03):
taxpayer funds is going to do it on a third
time to you know, quote unquote get it right and
convict them. At what point does the defendant writs me
in anything right?
Speaker 1 (06:12):
I think any reasonable person, Brian can can look at
this situation and if it if it does come up
for a third time, I mean, how biased can it
get with regard to let's try a third time, and
we'll go a fourth and a fifth, and we'll keep
going until we finally get something here. I think any
reasonable person could start to see that that is exactly
(06:33):
what is happening here. This is ridiculous. This is ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
When prosecution becomes persecution, we've left the law behind. It's
all about revenge at that point. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Sure, yeah, warm sent it was a witch hunt from
the beginning from the former prosecutor.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
You know.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
The also the part about this too, which is being
it's kind of being brought out if you're reading any
of the social media posts and you know the threads
and so on. But I think the biggest part of
this moving forward is if you're an officer and you
kind of touched on it at the very beginning here.
If you're an officer and you are you it's a
(07:11):
split second decision in these situations, clearly, But all of
that notwithstanding, when you're an officer going into a situation
or you're beginning your shift, and every one of them
probably are going through this, and I think probably to
a degree like never before, especially given these last few years,
in the way it's going. It seems like everything are
(07:32):
against the police officers, but you're second guessing yourself in
a situation where that literally is that could mean the end,
and it will mean the end unfortunately for some officers
down the road. And it's all based on what is
happening right now in this trial and some of these
other trials. It is incredibly sad that the officers don't
(07:54):
have they they don't have what they need to actually
be officers anymore. The second guessing themselves. It's the difference
between going home and having dinner and not going home
or going home in a box.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
It's really difficult. Listen. We always try to de escalate
as much as we can, but this notion that an
armed gunman, I'm gonna try to call time out to
de escalate while they're pointing a weapon is just actually
not sound. And we have cases in this country where
officers have tried, okay, this individual has a gun, this
individual's pointing at me, I'm going to holster my gun
(08:29):
like the movies and walk up to him and try
to talk to them, and the officers have been shot
and killed. We saw last week where our officer shot
how quick The only difference for these two cases is
our officer that was shot last week. The suspect got
to drop on our officer first. And in the in
the Jason Mead case, Jason Mead got to drop on
mister Goodson, who had the gun first. You make the
(08:49):
wrong decision, you go to prison or you're dead.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Can we do anything? Can in the public do anything
at this point? Or is it just a wait and
see we please?
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Based on these expectations, so the community has to decide
and make vocal what do you want our officers to do?
Do you want our officers to go out there to
enforce the laws that that our legislators put on the books.
Do you want us to go out there and proactive
police and and and the Jason meat case. What do
you want us to do when we see an individual
(09:20):
pointing a gun out the window to somebody. Do you
want us to keep driving and go in a parking
lot and play seducals or do you want us to
stop and investigate that you tell us what to do?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Have you have you spoken to Jason by chance? Brian?
Speaker 3 (09:35):
I have not, not, not since he's been remanded in custody.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Now that's the other thing too, the fact that he's
in custody, given who he you know, what he has
done for a living all the way up till now.
I mean, and I might be asking the obvious, but
I would imagine there needs to be extra protection for
him while he's in custody, and you know, behind locked doors,
(09:59):
if you.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Will, I can tell you at least at least in
the county jail, I know he's fully protected. I can't
speak to exactly how protected he will be if he
was to go over to the prison side.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, okay, yeah, I know. When I had sent a
note to you yesterday, you're like, you know, give me
a little time to process this, And it sounds like
that is exactly what's happening, and I know it's an
ongoing process working through it again. The June sixteenth is
when the sentencing will happen, and of course we'll all
(10:32):
be watching, But the floor is yours, Brian, between now
and then as well. If you know there's anything that
you want to come on and talk about or at
least let people know absolutely, you're welcome to that. And
so I just wanted to put that out there and
publicly say that to you. And obviously we're we're all
kind of in shock over this this situation, and we
(10:54):
hope that it just plays out the best that it can.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
Well, I appreciate it. And the officers, the men and
women a law enforcement apre all your support.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
They truly do.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Yeah, for sure, all right, FOP President LAUNCHD. I'm Brian Steel, Brian,
thank you very much, thank you, all right, we'll see you.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Man.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
This is a this is like yesterday. Nobody saw really
this coming. No, and that's why it's I know there
are a lot of officers that also now are going cheese.
Like I was just saying to Brian, I mean you're
patrolling and that second guessing thing is really it is
(11:34):
really incredibly dangerous. You know, on so many different levels.
They already have a I feel like they have an
element of that. Anyway, now you throw this into the mix,
and every run you go on, if you're thinking this
is possibly the end of you know, they already think
this could be the end of my life depending on
what run you're going on. Now you're going if it's
(11:56):
not the end of my life, it's the end of
my life in free life, and I'm gonna end up
behind bars trying to do what I feel is the best.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well, this isn't just about the officers, So this is
about you too. I'm talking to you with your radio,
and this is about you too. When that officer responds
and you are in trouble, your spouse is in trouble,
your kids in trouble, and some bad guys trying to
do bad things. Do you want them second guessing themselves
as to whether or not they should protect, whether or
not they should draw a weapon, what could happen to
(12:26):
you or your family in the amount of time it's
required for them to decide? Is this worth maybe going
to court and going to jail because somebody says I
did something wrong? This This is a very very has
a bad precedent to say it really is.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Yeah, man, absolutely, Well, we'll be praying for Jason obviously
in this whole situation. But yeah, there's and you know what,
there's no winners here by the way either. No, there's
just no winners at all. You got everybody for the
other side saying the way that they feel, and you
saw all of them and their statements yesterday, and then
(13:03):
of course what's going on with Jason and his side
and all of his people. I mean, it's just no
winners in this situation.
It has been roughly what would it be. We're almost
at twenty four.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Hours, just about.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Yeah, since the jury convicted former Franklin County Sheriff's deputy
Jason Mead of reckless homicide, there was a hung jury
on the murder charge, and of course this was a retrial,
a rehash, if you will, and so let's bring him
on the FOP President Lodge nine, Brian Steele, Welcome to
(00:26):
the show, Brian, and I wish it were under better
circumstances you were joining us today, and I know yesterday
was a tout, to put it mildly, a jagged pill
to swallow with regard to this. But now that you've
given it, you know, almost twenty four hours to kind
of bounce around in your brain. What are your thoughts?
(00:46):
Tell us what you're thinking over this whole thing.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Yeah, so listen, Thanks, shoving on as always, I've talked
to hundreds of my members of officers and they're just confused.
They're wondering what's going on? How does this happen? How
do we take Supreme Court decisions Graham versus Connor, how
do we throw them out the window. They're asking me,
what am I supposed to do when I'm facing somebody
pointing a gun at me. And what upsets me is
(01:11):
it seems like I'm on an island by myself. The
FOP is on an island by ourselves. These officers are
given no direction and only thing I could tell them,
And I put out a message to them last night
to trich Ryde and let them to know that we
support them, we understand the job they do to despite this,
despite this travesty of justice, fulfill your oath, go out
serve your community, and go home to your family at
(01:32):
the end of the night.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
The the I guess the after this convention, this conviction,
I should say, awaiting sentencing, which is scheduled for June sixteenth,
took immediately into custody. Did that Did that take you
by surprise or by shock the way that this immediately
played out right afterwards?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, nothing shocks me in this town, especially when you
know when individuals in his town drink the Columbus kool
aidy the gallons. I will tell you a little bit surprised, though,
I was a little bit surprised that that bond was revoked.
The purpose of the bond is to ensure that they
go to court. He's not a flight risk. He's keys
this whole entire time. He's cooperated with the courts. The
(02:16):
F three reckless homicide, it is a very low level
charge that in this city, in this county, even even
for for drug dealers gangsters recited a violent offenders very rarely,
if ever, results in a prison sentence. It's generally community
control and an ankle brace and kicked back on the street.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
This guilty verdict has a maximum of three years, which
means in this case they'll probably sit us into forty
five to fifty. The problem is there's going to be
I'm quite sure an appeal to this decision to not
allow him to be out on bond. To prepare for
that appeal makes no sense whatsoever.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
No, I'm sure they will. And then this is what
we always talk about politics and policing.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
You know that they don't mesh well, I'm very dis made.
I guess at this point that the sworn testimony of
a twenty five year law enforcement officer sworn to serve
and protect is negated in favor of speculation on behalf
of people who weren't there and saw nothing. That is
(03:18):
I'm still I'm still trying to process that. It just
doesn't make sense. Courts are supposed to be about fact
and logic, and there was no fact or logic at
all to this decision.
Speaker 3 (03:29):
The false narrative today is still being put out. There
are community advocacy groups that are saying to this day
that he is going to prison for shooting an unarmed
black man. Mister Goodson had a gun. He was never
unarmed black man. But I don't understand how he can
keep putting out that false narrative.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Speaking of narratives, did you see that that's out there
on socials I was reading, Of course, I didn't see
any of the footage about this judge. And people are
saying that they basically just wanted to go home and
it was like kind of a forced type thing. Are
you hearing about that, and do you have thoughts on that?
Speaker 3 (04:09):
I thought it was a little strange that, you know,
in the afternoon they were hung and they said we're hung,
and they were given the Howard charge. They were sent back,
they were told figure this out and forty five minutes later, Now,
even though you know it took a day and a half,
now and forty five minutes he came back with a
reckless homicide. That was surprising.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
That sounds like they're just trying to appease the judge.
And honestly, if it would have been two three days,
I might be able to swallow this a little bit easier.
But the fact that it was less than an hour
and the jury comes back with a guilty on at
least one of the charges, that tells me they're just
trying to appease the judge and get out of there.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
What's you got to look at it too? The courts
make it clear when we're justified as shooting, it's through
the reasonable. It's what would a reasonable officer do. Multiple
officers that were the state's own witnesses said if I
was facing a gun threat, I would fire. And again,
two people were there. Jason was there, testified to this
individual pointed a gun at him. We know a gun
(05:07):
was recovered. Mister Goodson, unfortunately and tragically, is not there
to tell his story. But it's just what we there's
no body cameras. Now, what we basically said is we
don't have to trust any credibility of an officer, which
is not good for this system.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
On the hung jury charge, the hung jury, I'm sorry,
not the hung jury charge, the murder charge where it
was hung jury. And I believe I heard the speculation
that and I think it was you saying, look, I
hope they don't try to go for a third trial
on this or retry of that. Is is that an actual,
real possibility.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
It is a possibility. And now you know, like I said,
the shale of favor or a matter prosecutor, she inherited
this case, she now owns this case if she was
to go forward, I hope she objectively looks at it.
I hope she takes public interest in account along with
the defendant's rights. You know, two jury can't get it right.
What makes you think another half a million dollars in
(06:03):
taxpayer funds is going to do it on a third
time to you know, quote unquote get it right and
convict them. At what point does the defendant writs me
in anything right?
Speaker 1 (06:12):
I think any reasonable person, Brian can can look at
this situation and if it if it does come up
for a third time, I mean, how biased can it
get with regard to let's try a third time, and
we'll go a fourth and a fifth, and we'll keep
going until we finally get something here. I think any
reasonable person could start to see that that is exactly
(06:33):
what is happening here. This is ridiculous. This is ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
When prosecution becomes persecution, we've left the law behind. It's
all about revenge at that point. It's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Sure, yeah, warm sent it was a witch hunt from
the beginning from the former prosecutor.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
You know.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
The also the part about this too, which is being
it's kind of being brought out if you're reading any
of the social media posts and you know the threads
and so on. But I think the biggest part of
this moving forward is if you're an officer and you
kind of touched on it at the very beginning here.
If you're an officer and you are you it's a
(07:11):
split second decision in these situations, clearly, But all of
that notwithstanding, when you're an officer going into a situation
or you're beginning your shift, and every one of them
probably are going through this, and I think probably to
a degree like never before, especially given these last few years,
in the way it's going. It seems like everything are
(07:32):
against the police officers, but you're second guessing yourself in
a situation where that literally is that could mean the end,
and it will mean the end unfortunately for some officers
down the road. And it's all based on what is
happening right now in this trial and some of these
other trials. It is incredibly sad that the officers don't
(07:54):
have they they don't have what they need to actually
be officers anymore. The second guessing themselves. It's the difference
between going home and having dinner and not going home
or going home in a box.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
It's really difficult. Listen. We always try to de escalate
as much as we can, but this notion that an
armed gunman, I'm gonna try to call time out to
de escalate while they're pointing a weapon is just actually
not sound. And we have cases in this country where
officers have tried, okay, this individual has a gun, this
individual's pointing at me, I'm going to holster my gun
(08:29):
like the movies and walk up to him and try
to talk to them, and the officers have been shot
and killed. We saw last week where our officer shot
how quick The only difference for these two cases is
our officer that was shot last week. The suspect got
to drop on our officer first. And in the in
the Jason Mead case, Jason Mead got to drop on
mister Goodson, who had the gun first. You make the
(08:49):
wrong decision, you go to prison or you're dead.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Can we do anything? Can in the public do anything
at this point? Or is it just a wait and
see we please?
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Based on these expectations, so the community has to decide
and make vocal what do you want our officers to do?
Do you want our officers to go out there to
enforce the laws that that our legislators put on the books.
Do you want us to go out there and proactive
police and and and the Jason meat case. What do
you want us to do when we see an individual
(09:20):
pointing a gun out the window to somebody. Do you
want us to keep driving and go in a parking
lot and play seducals or do you want us to
stop and investigate that you tell us what to do?
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (09:30):
Have you have you spoken to Jason by chance? Brian?
Speaker 3 (09:35):
I have not, not, not since he's been remanded in custody.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Now that's the other thing too, the fact that he's
in custody, given who he you know, what he has
done for a living all the way up till now.
I mean, and I might be asking the obvious, but
I would imagine there needs to be extra protection for
him while he's in custody, and you know, behind locked doors,
(09:59):
if you.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Will, I can tell you at least at least in
the county jail, I know he's fully protected. I can't
speak to exactly how protected he will be if he
was to go over to the prison side.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Yeah, okay, yeah, I know. When I had sent a
note to you yesterday, you're like, you know, give me
a little time to process this, And it sounds like
that is exactly what's happening, and I know it's an
ongoing process working through it again. The June sixteenth is
when the sentencing will happen, and of course we'll all
(10:32):
be watching, But the floor is yours, Brian, between now
and then as well. If you know there's anything that
you want to come on and talk about or at
least let people know absolutely, you're welcome to that. And
so I just wanted to put that out there and
publicly say that to you. And obviously we're we're all
kind of in shock over this this situation, and we
(10:54):
hope that it just plays out the best that it can.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
Well, I appreciate it. And the officers, the men and
women a law enforcement apre all your support.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
They truly do.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Yeah, for sure, all right, FOP President LAUNCHD. I'm Brian Steel, Brian,
thank you very much, thank you, all right, we'll see you.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Man.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
This is a this is like yesterday. Nobody saw really
this coming. No, and that's why it's I know there
are a lot of officers that also now are going cheese.
Like I was just saying to Brian, I mean you're
patrolling and that second guessing thing is really it is
(11:34):
really incredibly dangerous. You know, on so many different levels.
They already have a I feel like they have an
element of that. Anyway, now you throw this into the mix,
and every run you go on, if you're thinking this
is possibly the end of you know, they already think
this could be the end of my life depending on
what run you're going on. Now you're going if it's
(11:56):
not the end of my life, it's the end of
my life in free life, and I'm gonna end up
behind bars trying to do what I feel is the best.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well, this isn't just about the officers, So this is
about you too. I'm talking to you with your radio,
and this is about you too. When that officer responds
and you are in trouble, your spouse is in trouble,
your kids in trouble, and some bad guys trying to
do bad things. Do you want them second guessing themselves
as to whether or not they should protect, whether or
not they should draw a weapon, what could happen to
(12:26):
you or your family in the amount of time it's
required for them to decide? Is this worth maybe going
to court and going to jail because somebody says I
did something wrong? This This is a very very has
a bad precedent to say it really is.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
Yeah, man, absolutely, Well, we'll be praying for Jason obviously
in this whole situation. But yeah, there's and you know what,
there's no winners here by the way either. No, there's
just no winners at all. You got everybody for the
other side saying the way that they feel, and you
saw all of them and their statements yesterday, and then
(13:03):
of course what's going on with Jason and his side
and all of his people. I mean, it's just no
winners in this situation.
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by Audiochuck Media Company.