May 18, 2026 • 27 mins
Ghosts and Spirits
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're listening to KFI A M six forty on demand. Mike,
Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show. Hello Jesus, Hi Mike,
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Well? First, let me he's you a little followed here?
Mary had a little lamb and who knew it? Did
the official that he would learn, submit and grow to
Pierre Savory official, My problem is that years ago really
(00:39):
just disrespecting my mother and the last years of her life.
I said some things. It's just completely uncalled. Before I
was going through some part times, I was on drugs
and I had some really bad people around me.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Did your mother? Did your mother know you were on drugs? Mike?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I'm sure she did? Okay, Uh, but uh, I don't know.
If there's some way I can I know she's she
lived a great life. She lived a good life. She
was a teacher in the in the kind of get
(01:24):
some schools here in our local church.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
And how did you.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
How did she react when you weren't Uh, what would
be something you'd do and how would she react to it?
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh? Boy, it was right in the middle of her
doing me some favors out of way. I had some
trouble with where I was living and I had some
stuffs toward at her house and she just got tired
of probably probably just got tired of listening to life
(01:59):
this respect, and she hired a storage unit and just
had everything moved kind of her house, So probably she
did that appeal with me anymore.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So, So what's your question for me in this today? I?
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Uh, there's the nice thing I can do here. Sorry,
anything I can do here. You know, yours are probably
closed in your mouth is probably open disprace God right now,
and there's no way for me to get through to her.
(02:35):
But I just I don't want to. I don't want
to make it right. Your other well, I'm still well,
I still.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Have that opportunity has passed, and in its most specific context,
with your mother gone, there's no way for you to
make up for the things that you did in the past. However,
it's it's important that you trust that these things balance out.
(03:03):
And now you need to take what you've learned and
make sure that you apply it to all other relationships
in your life. That you don't go taking people for granted,
that you don't just put your will on other people.
And when you're in a good mood, bad mood, or
in your case, on drugs, and that you honor your
(03:27):
mother for the remainder of your life by living in
a way that you know would be the way she
would encourage you to live.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Well, she would have encouraged me to find a relationship
and grandchildren, suddress. You know what that hasn't worked out either.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Well, maybe there's something else going on that you're rejecting
or that you're not applying to your life in some way.
If that's not the path you're going down, what do
you mean, Well, if there's these things you're saying that
that hasn't happened in your life, it's important for you
to continue to look at your life to see why
(04:12):
it might not be happening.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Well, it's given up the drugs.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
That's a good start, I'm all.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I mean everything I'm about it is just being so
next to people that I don't It doesn't matter if
they've made me angry or disrespected me or cheated me,
or I still try to, you know, because that's what
she would have wanted me to do. And you know
it's just not working out. I'm still alone and still alone.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Well, that could just mean that there's more work for
you to do, Mike, that's all that. There's more work
inside that you need to focus on. A lot of
people think that all you all you need to be
to be in a relationship is just not have anybody
(05:03):
else in your life like that and you're ready and
good to go. And that's not the way it works.
There's more to it than that. I think people are
in tune, at least the healthy ones are in tune
with other people when they're not healthy. It's great that
you're off the drugs, there's more to it than that.
I think you're still working through some things with your
(05:23):
mom and the way you treated her. That's what you
called for, and those things need to be worked out.
It's not some equation, but you need to understand them more.
I wouldn't worry about forgiveness and all of those things.
That's all taken care of. What I would concern myself
with in your case is learning from that and adapting yourself. Now,
(05:49):
why were you that way? Well, if you were on drugs.
Removing drugs from your life is that's a great start,
But you're still going to want to learn why you
were on drugs in the first place. You're going to
want to learn why you lean towards destructive behavior and
things like that, when you learn those things that are
(06:11):
going on in your life or those attributes that you
may have, and learn to control them and build better
relationships just every day, whether it's with your grosser or
somebody at the service station, whatever it is, that through
those interactions you'll learn more about yourself and then be
open and ready to actually have a relationship. But it's
(06:34):
not just going to come because you don't have one
right now. Everybody thinks that, oh, well, i'm single, therefore
I'm available, and they're not synonymous. There's more to being
available that you have to learn and apply to your life,
and part of that is learning to enjoy yourself, your
own company, to enjoy who you are, to learn about yourself,
(06:59):
because that's part of the process. Knowing who you are
and enjoying your own company is what becomes attractive to
someone else. And if you kind of sidestep that and
just say, well, i'm single, therefore I should have someone
in my life, that's not necessarily the way it's going
(07:20):
to go down. The father is doing something, some work
in you that makes all these things stirred up, that
makes you think about them that makes you think about
your mom the way you treated her. That's all good.
That means there's a work going on inside you. There's
something being worked inside you to get you to that
place where you are going to be that person who
(07:42):
is ready for a partner. But there's more to it
than that, and it is a process, and it's not
just well, I'm nice to people and I'm not doing
drugs and I'm nice to people. Now, there's more to
relationships than that, and you have to find those levels
and how they work in your life and what that
unfinished business is. And many people have it, and I
(08:06):
hear from them all the time saying, but I want
a relationship, so therefore shouldn't I be having one, or
shouldn't it be easier? No, there's a lot of things
that are in the process. And imagine it this way.
If you're walking walking on a car lot and you
see a car and it has a lot of attributes
(08:27):
that you like, and you go, wow, that's great, and
I like the color and the shape and it's got
everything I want. But the tire it doesn't have any
tires on it. You'll move on to the next car.
If there's anything that's left undone. People will pick up
on it, at least the healthy ones. The unhealthy ones
have their own issues and they're going to jump on whatever.
(08:49):
But you want that healthy one, You want to want it.
Wait out for a healthy relationship, and the way to
do that is get yourself healthy first, and that rate
relationship will come. Pam, Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Hi Jesus, thank you for taking.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
My call, my pleasure. Thank you for waiting. How can
I help you? Well?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
I hope I can get through this without crying. It's okay,
but that's my question. My husband passed away about eight
months ago, very suddenly, massive heart attack, and it was devastating.
So through that I've come to a relationship with you.
(09:35):
I always thought I had faith, but I realized now
how shallow it was. And wonderful things have been happening
to me in the wake of his passing. And when
I go to church, which this has gotten me back
to church. When I go to church, I walk in
(09:56):
in the moment I start singing, it's just I just
fall apart and I cry. But more importantly at night,
when I'm in bed and I that's my time to
spend time with you, and I pray, and I I
(10:16):
come apart. I just I just fall apart. It's like
I I, I don't know if that's because I feel
your presence. It almost doesn't even seem to be about
my husband. It just when I'm saying my prayers, I
just I strange things happen. I feel the cot I
feel the covers pulsing. I feel like the cover shrink
(10:40):
wrap around me. I feel someone leaning against my back.
I feel my air mattress, you know, breathing in and
out like I'm getting a hug. I feel and I
don't know, is that your presence? And I and I
just feel, And then I have these nice cleansing cries
and I can sleep and tell me, is that my
(11:05):
sign that you are with me?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Well? Sure, all of those things can be a part
of it. You can hear descriptions throughout Scripture of different
people's response to prayer and tears is often one of them. However,
there can be more than one thing going on here.
You can be in a state of openness emotionally, and
(11:31):
when you're in that process of It's interesting that a
lot of people say, oh, well, whenever there's something ugly
or bad or rough that goes on in someone's life,
they run to God. Well, let's hope. So so you
were in a position where you looked at life a
little differently through the loss of your husband, and now
(11:52):
you're as you go and you look introspectively as to
what's going on in your life. You reconnect with church
and reconnect with God, all of which is wonderful and
well timed because you're going to need that support during
this time. And during that process, you're going through kind
(12:13):
of a shedding process of some of the old things
in your life and bringing in the new ones. And
I'm going to ask you to hold tight for a moment,
because coming up next I want to talk to you
a little bit more about that and explain some of
the things that going on, because I think it's really
really wonderful and I don't want you to fear it
or any of those things. So hang tight, and coming
(12:34):
up next we'll talk some more. We were talking with Pam,
who says that when she prays, she cries. She often
cries at church with music and worship. And Pam, you
said that your husband died eight months ago.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
Yes, and there's been almost like supernatural signs of his
eternal life in my home, which is what brought me
to God in the first place, because I I his
(13:15):
His bathroom sink has filled up with water two times.
The ceiling fan over that sink has come on like
eight different times. It's not random, it's in response to
events around the house. For instance, the last time the
fan came on, and that the phenomena when I pray
(13:38):
at night, and it's it's I don't know it was.
It's a gift. I feel like it's a gift. And
some people have faith, and I now have faith. But
it's not just that I have faith. I know, I know,
(13:58):
and I can't ignore it anymore. And so now I
feel like I'm just becoming consumed by wanting to read
the Bible and listen to Christian radio and listen to
your show and go to church. And now I just
I just it's like captivates me. Does that make any sense?
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yes, it does. And I think that the majority of
it comes from a healthy place. What I don't want
you to do is get to a place where you
overly spiritualize things. And I want to explain this because
I don't want to throw you know, what cold water
on wonderful experiences, because I think you're having many of them,
but I also don't want you to get to a
(14:45):
place that Often when there's a loss on earth and
a family member, a spouse, there is a desire to
remain connected with that individual. And the beauty of the
of the the the Christian belief system is that it
doesn't center around man, but truly centers around God, whereas
(15:06):
a lot of belief systems are all about man. How
can this help me? How can I reach christ consciousness?
How can I get more out of this or more
out of that? And really, Christianity isn't about that. It's
what sets it apart and makes it different. And the
importance and the beauty of your relationship here with your
husband was to point to an even greater relationship and
(15:28):
a more important relationship, and that is the one between
your husband and God and you and God. And that
process of crossing over or graduating to be with the
Father is similar to any other graduation in life. And
if you try and retard that process by holding someone back,
(15:50):
like if you could imagine a father or a mother
trying to hold their child back in school just because
they don't want them to grow up. How that would
throw off the process of growth right with the child.
You don't want to do that with your husband. Your
husband has moved on purposely and specifically to be with God,
the Father, the greatest reunion of all experience. And in
(16:14):
these things that you see, quite frankly, whether they're fans
turning on or sinks, my first response would be, there's
a very practical reason for those things that need to
be looked at. That doesn't mean God doesn't use the
supernatural or all of those things. It is to look
at them and to make sure. In Thessalonians it says
(16:36):
to test all things and hold fast to that which
is true and good. And you need to do that
in your walk in Christianity, as well as to not
get wrapped up in signs and wonders and things, but
the very practical parts of life and living them, whether
it's in your day to day life and in prayer.
(16:57):
I think it's quite normal to be crying. I think
it's a combination of many things. I think, like an onion,
you are slowly being peeled to be to that new skin,
that young, fresh new skin that God has created in you.
Not just fleshly, I mean in deep down inside your heart,
(17:18):
and through that process there is a process of wonderment
and rebirth and cleansing and all those things that can
be very overwhelming to those that are that are sensitive
in spirit and aware and willing to receive those things.
I just don't want you to get caught up in
those things, because God puts you on this earth for
(17:40):
a reason, and it's a very practical and clock winding earth.
You gotta wind the clock for it to tick, and
you have to put batteries in your watch, and you've
got to keep food in the refrigerator, and a lot
of practical, legitimate things in life that you have to do.
And if it becomes this mystic or all to con
assumed with the supernatural, you lose sight of the reason
(18:04):
why you're here and the purpose that God has for
you here. I don't want you to get to that place.
I think that place will let you down eventually, and
I think that you will find yourself with a great
emptiness if that's all that you're seeking. I want you
to balance those things and put them in a perspective
(18:25):
that can be productive in your everyday life, and you
can experience them, and you can think about your husband
and you can mourn. It's only been eight months. You're
going to be going through a lot of different types
of stages of mourning in that process and experience those.
And crying isn't always because of pain, as you know,
(18:48):
it can be a part of great joy right and
throughout scripture, the smallest scripture in all of the Bible
are these words Jesus wept, and it was during a
time of prayer that that occurred. So it is a
(19:08):
beautiful gift. And when you describe it as a cleansing cry,
you're spot on. There's those times where you just come
up from it and you feel like you gave birth
and you just shed so much sadness or ugliness or
consumed so much happiness. All that's wonderfully healthy, But I
(19:28):
need you to promise me that you're going to balance
these things in your life and you're still going to
check and make sure that there's not a problem in
that sink or there's not faulty wiring in that fan,
not because of a lack of faith, but because God
puts you in a practical world for practical reasons, and
it doesn't mean you won't see glimpses of the supernatural,
(19:53):
and they won't be a part of your walk because
they will, But I don't want you to seek only those,
because you're in your existence. The mere breath you take
in every day. The fact that you witnessed a life
and shared a life with your husband and he passed
as all part of the miracle, no less miraculous than
the sight of a fan turning on or a sink
(20:14):
filling up. Do you see the miracles in the everyday
life that you're experiencing, the fact that you wake up
and you breathe, that you can cry at all, all
of that's a miracle.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Yes. And I'm very concerned because I don't want to
draw my husband and keep him around me when he
needs to move on, because I know I cannot have
a relationship with the deceased person and it's not good
for both of us. I feel like I got the
(20:46):
message that there is eternal life and I need to
have a relationship with God and that's more important than
my trying to stay connected to him.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
And amen.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
And I know exactly what you're saying, and I know
you're positively right. It's just that it did comfort me,
and it opened my eyes, and I want to use
it as a gift. It was, but I do need
to move on, and I just want to know. I
just wanted to know if the crying was a sign
that you were close by.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Absolutely you could see that not only throughout Scripture, but
throughout history. There's a lot of people that would just
weep in the presence or the feeling of knowing God
was there. Totally normal, especially in a time what's.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
That that must be?
Speaker 2 (21:31):
It?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Sure, this is a time. This is a wonderful time
of cleansing for you and understanding and through something that
is sad and can be dark to others. Look how
death has been used in scripture. Think about it, the
very act of the enemy, the devil himself thought that
it was going to be a wonderful triumph when I
(21:53):
went to the cross and I died on the cross,
and to all of Christianity and the thought of everything
that took place, all of Christianity changed. It actually occurred
at the death and the cross. So what the enemy
or what those that are fighting against those things that
are just and good and noble and kind and wonderful
and godly in life, don't understand is that death brings
(22:17):
newness at times. And with the loss of your husband,
as sad as that is here, you knew immediately where
he was and that it was part of the plan
and part of the process and part of his graduation.
And the fact that you knew that is an overwhelming
task that some people spend their entire lives searching for
and and for whatever reason, what God's plans were for
(22:42):
you and to see and experience. He gave you the
gift of experiencing it that in that moment and through
that tragedy and through that sadness, you've had the gift
of seeing it and experiencing it and being able to
let it come at you head on. And you're not
being shamed or feeling ashamed of crying and being completely
(23:05):
open and available to what God wants to do and
change and work through you. And that's a beautiful thing.
No one, no one should take it away or make
you feel ugly about it. It is really quite wonderful.
I just want you to know it in its purest context.
And I think you are spot on when you say
that it's feeling the presence of God. I think it's
(23:25):
part of the morning. It's part of the revelation of
the process of life. It's seeing a glimpse of the plan.
I think it's all of those things I do.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
I think I'm very I'm very happy for him because
I know he's in an amazing place. I feel like
he's promoted. That's the way I choose to think about it,
that he's been promoted, and that if I want to
be promoted, then I need to act like the guy's upstairs.
And and it's just like I feel my nature is
(23:55):
changing somehow, and it's it's I'm full of awe, but.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
I won't keep You know, you're a baby.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
That's exactly right. And I do I feel like I
feel like I'm crawling.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
That's the process. And you're gonna be in a state
of wonderment because as an adult you can see it differently.
But you've got the white eyes of a child, and
you're wobbling around, walking and looking and crying out of
joy and cooing and all of those things. It's part
of the process. I know that people all the thing
is born again as a as a sect or a
(24:35):
religious it's not it's a term in scripture be gotten
from above. That's translated is born again out of a
conversation that I had with Nicodemus, And really it's about
that rebirth of your spirit and you experience that. I
know it sounds corny in the context of life, and
people go, ah, but that's what's going on. You're being
born again and you're a baby. Over spiritualizing oftentimes the
(25:07):
questions that came to me during times of scripture, and
you can see them in scripture as well. When someone
would come up to me and ask me about heaven,
my response was, how why should I describe heaven or
explain heaven to you when you haven't even started to
understand earth. So when I say over spiritualizing things or
(25:29):
the old term, you're so heavenly minded, you know earthly good.
These things come from that concept of over spiritualizing, which
means that everything has a spiritual message. Now does everything
have a spiritual message in the big sense, of course,
because everything's been put here by God. So in that sense, yes,
(25:52):
everything has its spiritual place, and it's every star is
hung with care by God, specifically and purposefully. However, there
are many times in scripture where somebody would be going
down this real spiritual path with me, and I'd say, no,
they're washing my feet. That is what I want them
(26:14):
to do right now, because it speaks to a place
of service and a heart of servitude, and that is
where I want people's minds to be, not just on
the prize, not just on heaven, not just on the
spiritual things that go around you. There are many things
if you could only see every time you talk about Me,
(26:37):
every time you pray, every time you are in meditation
or contemplation about the things of God, you should see
what is going on around you spiritually. The amazing battles
between good and evil that are fighting on your behalf
and on the behalf of the kingdom every day. The
(26:58):
spiritual warfare is something that you could not even comprehend. However,
to not be rooted in this world while you're here
in this world, not of this world. You're not giving
into the things of this world. But if you are
not in tune with it and understand that God puts
(27:21):
you here for a reason, and that God puts you
on earth and not in heaven to start your experience,
you are second guessing the will and purpose of God.
And that's what I mean by over spiritualizing Kfi six
on demand
You're listening to KFI A M six forty on demand. Mike,
Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show. Hello Jesus, Hi Mike,
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Well? First, let me he's you a little followed here?
Mary had a little lamb and who knew it? Did
the official that he would learn, submit and grow to
Pierre Savory official, My problem is that years ago really
(00:39):
just disrespecting my mother and the last years of her life.
I said some things. It's just completely uncalled. Before I
was going through some part times, I was on drugs
and I had some really bad people around me.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Did your mother? Did your mother know you were on drugs? Mike?
Speaker 2 (01:03):
I'm sure she did? Okay, Uh, but uh, I don't know.
If there's some way I can I know she's she
lived a great life. She lived a good life. She
was a teacher in the in the kind of get
(01:24):
some schools here in our local church.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
And how did you.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
How did she react when you weren't Uh, what would
be something you'd do and how would she react to it?
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh? Boy, it was right in the middle of her
doing me some favors out of way. I had some
trouble with where I was living and I had some
stuffs toward at her house and she just got tired
of probably probably just got tired of listening to life
(01:59):
this respect, and she hired a storage unit and just
had everything moved kind of her house, So probably she
did that appeal with me anymore.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
So, So what's your question for me in this today? I?
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Uh, there's the nice thing I can do here. Sorry,
anything I can do here. You know, yours are probably
closed in your mouth is probably open disprace God right now,
and there's no way for me to get through to her.
(02:35):
But I just I don't want to. I don't want
to make it right. Your other well, I'm still well,
I still.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Have that opportunity has passed, and in its most specific context,
with your mother gone, there's no way for you to
make up for the things that you did in the past. However,
it's it's important that you trust that these things balance out.
(03:03):
And now you need to take what you've learned and
make sure that you apply it to all other relationships
in your life. That you don't go taking people for granted,
that you don't just put your will on other people.
And when you're in a good mood, bad mood, or
in your case, on drugs, and that you honor your
(03:27):
mother for the remainder of your life by living in
a way that you know would be the way she
would encourage you to live.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Well, she would have encouraged me to find a relationship
and grandchildren, suddress. You know what that hasn't worked out either.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
Well, maybe there's something else going on that you're rejecting
or that you're not applying to your life in some way.
If that's not the path you're going down, what do
you mean, Well, if there's these things you're saying that
that hasn't happened in your life, it's important for you
to continue to look at your life to see why
(04:12):
it might not be happening.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Well, it's given up the drugs.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
That's a good start, I'm all.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I mean everything I'm about it is just being so
next to people that I don't It doesn't matter if
they've made me angry or disrespected me or cheated me,
or I still try to, you know, because that's what
she would have wanted me to do. And you know
it's just not working out. I'm still alone and still alone.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Well, that could just mean that there's more work for
you to do, Mike, that's all that. There's more work
inside that you need to focus on. A lot of
people think that all you all you need to be
to be in a relationship is just not have anybody
(05:03):
else in your life like that and you're ready and
good to go. And that's not the way it works.
There's more to it than that. I think people are
in tune, at least the healthy ones are in tune
with other people when they're not healthy. It's great that
you're off the drugs, there's more to it than that.
I think you're still working through some things with your
(05:23):
mom and the way you treated her. That's what you
called for, and those things need to be worked out.
It's not some equation, but you need to understand them more.
I wouldn't worry about forgiveness and all of those things.
That's all taken care of. What I would concern myself
with in your case is learning from that and adapting yourself. Now,
(05:49):
why were you that way? Well, if you were on drugs.
Removing drugs from your life is that's a great start,
But you're still going to want to learn why you
were on drugs in the first place. You're going to
want to learn why you lean towards destructive behavior and
things like that, when you learn those things that are
(06:11):
going on in your life or those attributes that you
may have, and learn to control them and build better
relationships just every day, whether it's with your grosser or
somebody at the service station, whatever it is, that through
those interactions you'll learn more about yourself and then be
open and ready to actually have a relationship. But it's
(06:34):
not just going to come because you don't have one
right now. Everybody thinks that, oh, well, i'm single, therefore
I'm available, and they're not synonymous. There's more to being
available that you have to learn and apply to your life,
and part of that is learning to enjoy yourself, your
own company, to enjoy who you are, to learn about yourself,
(06:59):
because that's part of the process. Knowing who you are
and enjoying your own company is what becomes attractive to
someone else. And if you kind of sidestep that and
just say, well, i'm single, therefore I should have someone
in my life, that's not necessarily the way it's going
(07:20):
to go down. The father is doing something, some work
in you that makes all these things stirred up, that
makes you think about them that makes you think about
your mom the way you treated her. That's all good.
That means there's a work going on inside you. There's
something being worked inside you to get you to that
place where you are going to be that person who
(07:42):
is ready for a partner. But there's more to it
than that, and it is a process, and it's not
just well, I'm nice to people and I'm not doing
drugs and I'm nice to people. Now, there's more to
relationships than that, and you have to find those levels
and how they work in your life and what that
unfinished business is. And many people have it, and I
(08:06):
hear from them all the time saying, but I want
a relationship, so therefore shouldn't I be having one, or
shouldn't it be easier? No, there's a lot of things
that are in the process. And imagine it this way.
If you're walking walking on a car lot and you
see a car and it has a lot of attributes
(08:27):
that you like, and you go, wow, that's great, and
I like the color and the shape and it's got
everything I want. But the tire it doesn't have any
tires on it. You'll move on to the next car.
If there's anything that's left undone. People will pick up
on it, at least the healthy ones. The unhealthy ones
have their own issues and they're going to jump on whatever.
(08:49):
But you want that healthy one, You want to want it.
Wait out for a healthy relationship, and the way to
do that is get yourself healthy first, and that rate
relationship will come. Pam, Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Hi Jesus, thank you for taking.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
My call, my pleasure. Thank you for waiting. How can
I help you? Well?
Speaker 3 (09:13):
I hope I can get through this without crying. It's okay,
but that's my question. My husband passed away about eight
months ago, very suddenly, massive heart attack, and it was devastating.
So through that I've come to a relationship with you.
(09:35):
I always thought I had faith, but I realized now
how shallow it was. And wonderful things have been happening
to me in the wake of his passing. And when
I go to church, which this has gotten me back
to church. When I go to church, I walk in
(09:56):
in the moment I start singing, it's just I just
fall apart and I cry. But more importantly at night,
when I'm in bed and I that's my time to
spend time with you, and I pray, and I I
(10:16):
come apart. I just I just fall apart. It's like
I I, I don't know if that's because I feel
your presence. It almost doesn't even seem to be about
my husband. It just when I'm saying my prayers, I
just I strange things happen. I feel the cot I
feel the covers pulsing. I feel like the cover shrink
(10:40):
wrap around me. I feel someone leaning against my back.
I feel my air mattress, you know, breathing in and
out like I'm getting a hug. I feel and I
don't know, is that your presence? And I and I
just feel, And then I have these nice cleansing cries
and I can sleep and tell me, is that my
(11:05):
sign that you are with me?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Well? Sure, all of those things can be a part
of it. You can hear descriptions throughout Scripture of different
people's response to prayer and tears is often one of them. However,
there can be more than one thing going on here.
You can be in a state of openness emotionally, and
(11:31):
when you're in that process of It's interesting that a
lot of people say, oh, well, whenever there's something ugly
or bad or rough that goes on in someone's life,
they run to God. Well, let's hope. So so you
were in a position where you looked at life a
little differently through the loss of your husband, and now
(11:52):
you're as you go and you look introspectively as to
what's going on in your life. You reconnect with church
and reconnect with God, all of which is wonderful and
well timed because you're going to need that support during
this time. And during that process, you're going through kind
(12:13):
of a shedding process of some of the old things
in your life and bringing in the new ones. And
I'm going to ask you to hold tight for a moment,
because coming up next I want to talk to you
a little bit more about that and explain some of
the things that going on, because I think it's really
really wonderful and I don't want you to fear it
or any of those things. So hang tight, and coming
(12:34):
up next we'll talk some more. We were talking with Pam,
who says that when she prays, she cries. She often
cries at church with music and worship. And Pam, you
said that your husband died eight months ago.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
Yes, and there's been almost like supernatural signs of his
eternal life in my home, which is what brought me
to God in the first place, because I I his
(13:15):
His bathroom sink has filled up with water two times.
The ceiling fan over that sink has come on like
eight different times. It's not random, it's in response to
events around the house. For instance, the last time the
fan came on, and that the phenomena when I pray
(13:38):
at night, and it's it's I don't know it was.
It's a gift. I feel like it's a gift. And
some people have faith, and I now have faith. But
it's not just that I have faith. I know, I know,
(13:58):
and I can't ignore it anymore. And so now I
feel like I'm just becoming consumed by wanting to read
the Bible and listen to Christian radio and listen to
your show and go to church. And now I just
I just it's like captivates me. Does that make any sense?
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yes, it does. And I think that the majority of
it comes from a healthy place. What I don't want
you to do is get to a place where you
overly spiritualize things. And I want to explain this because
I don't want to throw you know, what cold water
on wonderful experiences, because I think you're having many of them,
but I also don't want you to get to a
(14:45):
place that Often when there's a loss on earth and
a family member, a spouse, there is a desire to
remain connected with that individual. And the beauty of the
of the the the Christian belief system is that it
doesn't center around man, but truly centers around God, whereas
(15:06):
a lot of belief systems are all about man. How
can this help me? How can I reach christ consciousness?
How can I get more out of this or more
out of that? And really, Christianity isn't about that. It's
what sets it apart and makes it different. And the
importance and the beauty of your relationship here with your
husband was to point to an even greater relationship and
(15:28):
a more important relationship, and that is the one between
your husband and God and you and God. And that
process of crossing over or graduating to be with the
Father is similar to any other graduation in life. And
if you try and retard that process by holding someone back,
(15:50):
like if you could imagine a father or a mother
trying to hold their child back in school just because
they don't want them to grow up. How that would
throw off the process of growth right with the child.
You don't want to do that with your husband. Your
husband has moved on purposely and specifically to be with God,
the Father, the greatest reunion of all experience. And in
(16:14):
these things that you see, quite frankly, whether they're fans
turning on or sinks, my first response would be, there's
a very practical reason for those things that need to
be looked at. That doesn't mean God doesn't use the
supernatural or all of those things. It is to look
at them and to make sure. In Thessalonians it says
(16:36):
to test all things and hold fast to that which
is true and good. And you need to do that
in your walk in Christianity, as well as to not
get wrapped up in signs and wonders and things, but
the very practical parts of life and living them, whether
it's in your day to day life and in prayer.
(16:57):
I think it's quite normal to be crying. I think
it's a combination of many things. I think, like an onion,
you are slowly being peeled to be to that new skin,
that young, fresh new skin that God has created in you.
Not just fleshly, I mean in deep down inside your heart,
(17:18):
and through that process there is a process of wonderment
and rebirth and cleansing and all those things that can
be very overwhelming to those that are that are sensitive
in spirit and aware and willing to receive those things.
I just don't want you to get caught up in
those things, because God puts you on this earth for
(17:40):
a reason, and it's a very practical and clock winding earth.
You gotta wind the clock for it to tick, and
you have to put batteries in your watch, and you've
got to keep food in the refrigerator, and a lot
of practical, legitimate things in life that you have to do.
And if it becomes this mystic or all to con
assumed with the supernatural, you lose sight of the reason
(18:04):
why you're here and the purpose that God has for
you here. I don't want you to get to that place.
I think that place will let you down eventually, and
I think that you will find yourself with a great
emptiness if that's all that you're seeking. I want you
to balance those things and put them in a perspective
(18:25):
that can be productive in your everyday life, and you
can experience them, and you can think about your husband
and you can mourn. It's only been eight months. You're
going to be going through a lot of different types
of stages of mourning in that process and experience those.
And crying isn't always because of pain, as you know,
(18:48):
it can be a part of great joy right and
throughout scripture, the smallest scripture in all of the Bible
are these words Jesus wept, and it was during a
time of prayer that that occurred. So it is a
(19:08):
beautiful gift. And when you describe it as a cleansing cry,
you're spot on. There's those times where you just come
up from it and you feel like you gave birth
and you just shed so much sadness or ugliness or
consumed so much happiness. All that's wonderfully healthy, But I
(19:28):
need you to promise me that you're going to balance
these things in your life and you're still going to
check and make sure that there's not a problem in
that sink or there's not faulty wiring in that fan,
not because of a lack of faith, but because God
puts you in a practical world for practical reasons, and
it doesn't mean you won't see glimpses of the supernatural,
(19:53):
and they won't be a part of your walk because
they will, But I don't want you to seek only those,
because you're in your existence. The mere breath you take
in every day. The fact that you witnessed a life
and shared a life with your husband and he passed
as all part of the miracle, no less miraculous than
the sight of a fan turning on or a sink
(20:14):
filling up. Do you see the miracles in the everyday
life that you're experiencing, the fact that you wake up
and you breathe, that you can cry at all, all
of that's a miracle.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Yes. And I'm very concerned because I don't want to
draw my husband and keep him around me when he
needs to move on, because I know I cannot have
a relationship with the deceased person and it's not good
for both of us. I feel like I got the
(20:46):
message that there is eternal life and I need to
have a relationship with God and that's more important than
my trying to stay connected to him.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
And amen.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
And I know exactly what you're saying, and I know
you're positively right. It's just that it did comfort me,
and it opened my eyes, and I want to use
it as a gift. It was, but I do need
to move on, and I just want to know. I
just wanted to know if the crying was a sign
that you were close by.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Absolutely you could see that not only throughout Scripture, but
throughout history. There's a lot of people that would just
weep in the presence or the feeling of knowing God
was there. Totally normal, especially in a time what's.
Speaker 3 (21:30):
That that must be?
Speaker 2 (21:31):
It?
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Sure, this is a time. This is a wonderful time
of cleansing for you and understanding and through something that
is sad and can be dark to others. Look how
death has been used in scripture. Think about it, the
very act of the enemy, the devil himself thought that
it was going to be a wonderful triumph when I
(21:53):
went to the cross and I died on the cross,
and to all of Christianity and the thought of everything
that took place, all of Christianity changed. It actually occurred
at the death and the cross. So what the enemy
or what those that are fighting against those things that
are just and good and noble and kind and wonderful
and godly in life, don't understand is that death brings
(22:17):
newness at times. And with the loss of your husband,
as sad as that is here, you knew immediately where
he was and that it was part of the plan
and part of the process and part of his graduation.
And the fact that you knew that is an overwhelming
task that some people spend their entire lives searching for
and and for whatever reason, what God's plans were for
(22:42):
you and to see and experience. He gave you the
gift of experiencing it that in that moment and through
that tragedy and through that sadness, you've had the gift
of seeing it and experiencing it and being able to
let it come at you head on. And you're not
being shamed or feeling ashamed of crying and being completely
(23:05):
open and available to what God wants to do and
change and work through you. And that's a beautiful thing.
No one, no one should take it away or make
you feel ugly about it. It is really quite wonderful.
I just want you to know it in its purest context.
And I think you are spot on when you say
that it's feeling the presence of God. I think it's
(23:25):
part of the morning. It's part of the revelation of
the process of life. It's seeing a glimpse of the plan.
I think it's all of those things I do.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
I think I'm very I'm very happy for him because
I know he's in an amazing place. I feel like
he's promoted. That's the way I choose to think about it,
that he's been promoted, and that if I want to
be promoted, then I need to act like the guy's upstairs.
And and it's just like I feel my nature is
(23:55):
changing somehow, and it's it's I'm full of awe, but.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
I won't keep You know, you're a baby.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
That's exactly right. And I do I feel like I
feel like I'm crawling.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
That's the process. And you're gonna be in a state
of wonderment because as an adult you can see it differently.
But you've got the white eyes of a child, and
you're wobbling around, walking and looking and crying out of
joy and cooing and all of those things. It's part
of the process. I know that people all the thing
is born again as a as a sect or a
(24:35):
religious it's not it's a term in scripture be gotten
from above. That's translated is born again out of a
conversation that I had with Nicodemus, And really it's about
that rebirth of your spirit and you experience that. I
know it sounds corny in the context of life, and
people go, ah, but that's what's going on. You're being
born again and you're a baby. Over spiritualizing oftentimes the
(25:07):
questions that came to me during times of scripture, and
you can see them in scripture as well. When someone
would come up to me and ask me about heaven,
my response was, how why should I describe heaven or
explain heaven to you when you haven't even started to
understand earth. So when I say over spiritualizing things or
(25:29):
the old term, you're so heavenly minded, you know earthly good.
These things come from that concept of over spiritualizing, which
means that everything has a spiritual message. Now does everything
have a spiritual message in the big sense, of course,
because everything's been put here by God. So in that sense, yes,
(25:52):
everything has its spiritual place, and it's every star is
hung with care by God, specifically and purposefully. However, there
are many times in scripture where somebody would be going
down this real spiritual path with me, and I'd say, no,
they're washing my feet. That is what I want them
(26:14):
to do right now, because it speaks to a place
of service and a heart of servitude, and that is
where I want people's minds to be, not just on
the prize, not just on heaven, not just on the
spiritual things that go around you. There are many things
if you could only see every time you talk about Me,
(26:37):
every time you pray, every time you are in meditation
or contemplation about the things of God, you should see
what is going on around you spiritually. The amazing battles
between good and evil that are fighting on your behalf
and on the behalf of the kingdom every day. The
(26:58):
spiritual warfare is something that you could not even comprehend. However,
to not be rooted in this world while you're here
in this world, not of this world. You're not giving
into the things of this world. But if you are
not in tune with it and understand that God puts
(27:21):
you here for a reason, and that God puts you
on earth and not in heaven to start your experience,
you are second guessing the will and purpose of God.
And that's what I mean by over spiritualizing Kfi six
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