March 25, 2026 • 23 mins
In this episode, Mark joins the conversation to share his experience playing Australian Survivor. He talks about his second time on the show, where he decided to play a more villainous role and take control of the game. Mark opens up about the strategy behind his gameplay, the impact of having his torch snuffed and the relationships he formed with other players. He also discusses the process of being brought back for a second season and how he approached the game differently this time around.
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Mark as Played
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's in the news today, but it was actually on
TV Reload the podcast pig that line. Yea, Everyone, Welcome
back to TV Reload. My name is Benjamin Norrisen. Today
I am joined by Let's be honest one of the
loudest players from this current series of Australian Survivor. Today's guest,
of course, is Mark. Now. Whether you loved him, were
frustrated by him, or just couldn't look away, there's no
denying that Mark played a huge game now coming back
(00:23):
for a second shot, Mark didn't want just redemption, He
wanted impact, and this time around he wasn't interested in
playing it safe. So what happens when you stop worrying
about perception and just go all in? In this chat,
Mark opens up about leaning into his villainous, unpredictable role,
blowing up tribal councils, taking control of the game, and yes,
becoming what he calls an oxygen's thief out there on
(00:46):
the island. We also unpacked that moment that every survivor
dreams of and dreads, having your torch snuffed and why
for Mark it was both brutal and strangely satisfying. Plus
we get into the strategy behind the chaotic gameplay, what
it was really going on most of the time in
his head, and who he thinks is now stepping up
to take control of the game in his absence, and
(01:07):
just quietly, what really happens when you become the mayor
of Jury Villa. This is a fun chat, It's honest,
very self aware, and with one of the most memorable
players of the season. I think you're going to enjoy this. So, guys,
here is Mark, one of us Survivor's latest and I
dare say, biggest icons.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Oh stop event, Look, there's too many kings and queens
on Survivor. I was trying to not go down that route,
but I do feel like this has been an incredible
experience to play Survivor twice and then to be plastered
all over the screen for however many episodes. It's been
a lot of Mark, which is pretty cool. I like
it so and I've had a great experience. And I
(01:46):
really watched I really enjoyed watching my torch snuff to
get last night.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
That was so that's a weird thing to say, you know,
the experience of having your torch snuffed is just bizarre
in general.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Well, like look at the set, look at their flames.
Is the Golden God looking at you with this huge body,
and there's the tension and the emotion in that space
is palpable, and so when that torch gets snuffed, it's
like like the knife just cuts through and that's your
game done. So it's very final, but it's got this
(02:19):
like weird, weird final destiny sort of like a vibe
to it, and you really feel it when you're out there,
and then you go and eat a burger, which is nice.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
I mean, you did get a line's share of this season. Like,
I feel like my partner is not as big a
Survivor fan as I am, so I watching every episode
maybe twice. I'm a little weird, and he will be
coming in and out and watching it and he's like,
I'm so glad Mark's still there and he'd been following
it and it's all us. You got a lot of
screen time. I'm just going to tell you this. Did
(02:48):
you play it this way the second time around? Knowing
what gets screen time and what does that? I don't know, Like,
how does that work for you as a player?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
I think that's obviously as a retorney, you have the
experience of play, of having played and then having watched
the show, so you know, like, oh, okay, I know
what makes it onto the show. I wasn't playing for TV.
What I was wanted to do this time is last
time I was cast as a former diplomat, I was
cast as a titan of diplomacy, and so you know,
(03:17):
you're out there and you're trying to tell a story,
and it was I think it was kind of pushing
me into this professional mode, right, And I played a
great game. I'm really happy with how it went. I
came third, I almost won, like ah cy clothes this
time round. I'm like, I don't need to be professional
Mark on the island. I've got so many friends out
there in the real world that are like Mark, You're
not like that all the time. At a dinner party,
(03:38):
you can be a bit outrageous. And so I thought
to myself, you know what, when in life do you
get a second chance to play this great game? When
in life do you get to just have carte blanche,
go out there and just do whatever you want and
have fun. That's the mentality that I went into it,
and it just so happened that when there's four attorneyes
(03:58):
on a tribe on a eason of twenty four players,
I'm a huge target. And then I just found myself
blowing up tribal councils and then leaning into this, into
this like intimidating, villainous role. It wasn't pre planned at all.
It just sort of came to me. I thought that
was the best strategy. And then yeah, obviously I wanted
to What I realized from last time was being honest
(04:19):
and authentic is the best way to show yourself, and
so I wanted I wanted to be honest, but like
a little bit outrageous obviously, and so just say like
there was no way last time I would have said
I am running this tribe, no way, Like we're Australian,
there's tall poppies everywhere. This time around, I was like,
you know what, just say it. Just say it and
deal with the consequences later. And if you put a
(04:41):
little bit of make it a little bit more outrageous,
so be it. I mean, like I said some ridiculous
things ben I said talked about peeling into people's brains
and having octopus tentacles. I was just telling the truth,
which is what I felt out there and just with
like a little bit of you know, creative flourish, as
they might say. So that's that's what I was feeling
out there.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I feel like you worked out the heightened reality of
this whole thing, and if I'm wrong by maybe looking
in at your time this time around, I think you
had more fun with it in terms of what it
all means, like what it all means, because I think
last time you did so well, you came to the
end and you didn't win, and that's a real cross
to bear, that really is that's a really hard thing
(05:20):
to do. But then you must have had the time
to look back reflect on your time on the show
and know that the moments that really mattered were the
television moments that audiences love. So then this time around
you're like, okay, yeah, I can be people's brains and
say a few iconic survivor you know tropes.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
I learned a lot from the first season, and I
actually not intentionally, I just realized that a lot of
players didn't get screen time, and so I spend a
lot of time talking to those people about their experiences,
and the consistent message I got from almost everyone was
I wish I just took opportunities as they as they came, Like,
sometimes an opportunity comes up and you just got to
(05:58):
grab it. This time around, I'm like, whenever there's an opportunity,
I'm going to take it. I'm going to take it
because someone else might take it. And yeah, it creates
TV because you are taking the opportunity. There's tension in
the game, and sometimes you just got to take it.
I also learned from last time that when you break
things and disrupt the game, it creates opportunities. And so yeah,
(06:19):
people are going to be like popping off online being
like action done this, I Action done that. But hey,
it creates new opportunities. And if you're the one setting
the agenda a very head office of me again, I
know it creates space for you to do things. And
that's the mentality that went out there. You're right, it
sucks losing. I wanted to win. I'm super competitive if
(06:39):
you can't tell already, But I just wanted to I
just wanted to play. I just wanted to play like
the most full on game that I could. Freed from
the responsibilities of the normal bounds that regulate normal behavior
in normal life, because thank god they exist a normal life.
I'm kind of.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Going all over the place with this, but I kind
of feel like, you know, what I would liked to
have seen with you is more of the continuation of
maybe some of the storylines from your first season. There
were some iconic players there, and you had some iconic
moments with people.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Caroline.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
You know, there were some moments I would have really
liked to have seen this redemption story with one of
those people brought into this series with you. Had you
thought that there was a possibility when you turned up
on the beach that there may be someone from your
previous series that you would be rehashing some unfinished business with.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Then you're sick. You're basically asking do you want to
continue the traumas that you experienced from last time on
this time?
Speaker 1 (07:35):
No.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
I did not want to see anyone from times we
rebels out there. I was like, oh my god, I've
already patched things up with so many of these people.
I have a such a special space in my life
with Caroline. What an icon what a woman? Eden Valaria like,
it's already so hard playing this game. I did not
want to play with anyone from that season I know
(07:55):
would have made great TV, because that would have been terrifying.
But I'm very grateful that I was on a beach
with Brook, the Queen of Australian Survivor, and I couldn't
have asked for a better attorney to be paired with.
But I still won. The Sicico.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
The cicco inside of me is that I wanted to
see that play out in some way. I mean, was
there anyone that did you haven't patched things up with?
Is there anyone that's still on that island?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
There are two very different seasons. The first time you play,
you're so naive to the way in which this game
affects you and relationships. This time round, I went out
there giving myself space to I think, you really need
to be able to compartmentalize relationships, and so I did
that a lot more this time round. I know that
I've heard people's feelings and so I will always I
(08:40):
acknowledge that. And look at me, Ben, I am a
nice per I actually am a nice person, and for
anyone I am, I am very happy to be friends
with whoever one wants to be friends with me, and
because but it is a huge life experience and I
can't wait to meet every single member of the player
or every single played redemption if they want to meet
(09:01):
with me.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Well, what's the process of bringing you back? Like when
did you find that out? I mean, I because you know,
it's so funny when you do these chats with everyone,
Everyone throughout the podcast always drops in a tease to
them coming back. It's kind of a wishful thinking you
know that that that could even happen. I'd like to
know from your story did they say that too at
the end of the last one, like your unfinished business,
(09:24):
we're going to come back to you? Or like when
does that start to happen and how did that happen
for you?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I don't trust making TV. You get you, you develop
a trust complex with production, so I could only control
what I thought, And in my mind, I'm like, the
way I'm going to handle this is I am just
in my mind not going to play again because I
want to create real friendships with the people that I
want to be friends with in the Survivor universe. There's
(09:50):
nothing that irks me more than people trying to hit
me out with the potential that will see each other
out there on the beach, Like that's the biggest ick
for me so when I I got so when I
got the phone call, it was late in the piece,
I was pretty much a no, to be honest, Oh yeah,
And my wife and I discussed it at length. There's
like a whole heeop of logistical things. I was sort
(10:12):
of like, Ah, you really want to do this again?
You know you did so well last time. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
I went boy with all of our personal chats. It's
such an honor to be asked again. And there was
just the thrill of the adventure is the thing that
made me go back. I liken Survivor to Jamunji. You know,
the survival world exists in Jamunji. It's high definition, the
(10:36):
colors are saturated. I have no photos selfies of me
on Survivor. I have no tangible like things from that world.
It just exists in the Jamunji land. And that's a
fantastic fantasy land to be able to escape to. Sometimes
hashtag Stephen fishback escape exclamationmunk. And that's the world that
(10:57):
I was like, do you want to go back into
Jumunji again? And let's do it one more time and
see how we came.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Have you watched that SNL clip where she talks about
being Jumanji. She's like, it's so every time I feel
like you're saying, I feel like you're pronouncing Jumanji the
way that they pronounce it on.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I haven't seen that clip, So you haven't seen it.
You haven't seen this, Oh, I'll go check it out.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Okay, let's just stop the podcast to watch a whole
episode of SNL. You know, in this last episode there's
something that you do, which I'm wondering how you feel
about it now and what the conversation with Simon looked
like afterwards. But you know, in employee to stay on
the show knowing that you're in danger, you did offer
to sacrifice a return e. How has that all played
(11:39):
out now that it's played out on television and Simon
seen it all? Like, how do you feel about it?
And was there any repercussions?
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah? Good question. There are elements of the episode last
night which don't align with my reality, and some of
them I want to leave us magic because it's magical
TV and I like, I like, I love the episode
from last night. One thing about Simon putting votes onto
Simon is I'm happy to talk about that. I was
never voting for Simon, and I told Simon I was
(12:07):
putting his name out there, and I said to Simon,
please go to town and tell everyone you're voting for me.
We really wanted to create this idea that we were
not working together, so Simon and I've told that. Simon
as to Simon after the game as well, so I
think when he was watching it, he maybe like, really, really, Mark,
it looks pretty convincing. But at least in my memory,
I remember the conversation with Caleb seems pretty strong on
(12:30):
silent Simon, but in my memory it was just a ruse.
It's hard when you're gaslighting yourself Ben to remember like
what's the truth and what's not. But in at least
in my memory, that was not a real plan.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
So there was an opportunity really for you to fall
out of the competition at this point and having so
much of the narrative, How do you feel like it's
going to go because my expectation is that there's Ben
and there's a few others. You know, there's people that
are coming up now from behind the ranks. Who do
you think stepping forward at this point of the game
to take this competition out?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
I feel like there is a power vacuum. I feel
like I was an oxygen thief out there, and I
think that there's a real opportunity for other people to
flex their muscles. I think I never bet against Brook
and Kelly, Like, I just don't bet against them. They
may be down, but they are so savvy, so much experience,
(13:24):
and have weapons in there in their pockets. But I
think think, sorry, Caleb, Ben and Jackson have emerged as
the people that are willing to take the rains and
shape the game. Some people wait for opportunities to come,
and that's fine, but I think that this now that
there's a power somewhat of a power vacuum. I think
(13:46):
that those gents are the three that'll try and grab
the reins. But they've still got some pretty stiff competition
in Brook and Keilly.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Brook is doing very well, Achille is doing very well
as well. There's some people there that are playing some
very good games. I mean there's also people there. You've
got your Blanches and there's other people out there. I mean,
it's Blanche a little bit. Just she still playing the
game or is she in a romance? I feel like
she is spending a lot of time staring at someone
am I reading into that.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Blanche has had before merged. She went to tribal council
three times. There's an element of like just the edit
in terms of like not being able to see you know,
her experience, which is Yeah, I feel for Blanche because
you know, it's a big commitment to go out there.
She's got a lot of kids watching her home and
you know she was away from them. So it's not
always just based on gameplay. But you know, like I,
(14:33):
you know, let's see, let's see how Blanche goes. Maybe
she's going to maybe she's going to cartwheel to the
to the leadership role. We'll see how we go.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
She certainly is a big personality, isn't she.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I remember seeing Blanche on day one and I thought
she was a hoot. She had that disco T shirt,
she had like her hair and like a huge energy, incredible,
incredible personality. Strategically, we haven't worked together. I think that's
no secret. So yeah, but I think Blanche brings some
really fine energy to the TV screen and I like
(15:03):
watching it.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
And before we go, we need to just sort of
unpack where things have been left for this tribal council.
So I was reading the subtitles down the bottom, So
what's happening with this idol? What do you see that
it's happening, and what information have you passed over before
you had your torch enough?
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Oh god, I don't know what took over me, but
I was just like, oh, obviously I'm going I'm saying
my farewells to my buddies. Super protective of Brook, and
in my mind, I'm like, I'm super protective of Keeley
as well. I really want Brook to know that Keehley
has an idol. I also know that Keiehley has this
alleged fake idol. I hadn't seen it at this point
in time. So I just wanted to give Brook a
(15:39):
little leg up to initiate that conversation with Keighley because
they're going to they are both two very smart women
and they're going to need to use all of the
tricks in their toolbox. I don't know, I'm mixing mating
force here. They're going to need everything that they can
to get through. And it was just kind of like
an encouraging push from me to help Brook and inevertently
(16:01):
help Keeley too. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
I wasn't sure whether you were pitting them against each
other or whether or not you were asking them to help,
you know, That's that's where I was a little bit
confused help each other.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Hey, look, my game can be confusing, but no, definitely
I want I'm rooting for Brook, I'm rooting for Keeley. Absolutely,
I want them to I want them to kick kick
some goals.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I think it's always strange when you look at the
ogs and in how long they can survive in a
show like this. Well done to you as well for
being such a noisy player and sticking around, because you'd
think that these these newbies would be like, let's get
rid of these people, you know, straight away, like one, two, three, four,
Do you know what I mean? Like, it's interesting that
Brook and Simon are even still in this competition at
this point.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
Yeah, I think like we're all terrified out there that literally,
like the newbies could ganging up on us at any
point in time. Part of the trick is to identify
good allies the start and make quick relationships like you
have to move so quickly, and it's probably the strength
of my game was identifying faith in Keeley as super
(16:58):
good survivor players, telling them that I want to work
with them, keeping Brook on side, and then Don and
Caleb like Don and Caleb Don. On the first night,
he was angry at me because I didn't help with
the shelter, which is definitely true. He went down and
lay on the beach and I went down. I said, mate,
sorry I didn't help out. And he told me all
about how his mum's artistic, artistic and loves loves poetry,
(17:19):
and he recited a poem to me off by heart
and I looked it into his eyes and I'm like,
I love this man. Don is so funny and adorable.
And then Caleb came along and the Cornship cartel got created.
So I think that finding the right people that wanted
to connect, be it over strategy or over poetry really
and then flipping the table at first tribal council was
(17:41):
the only way in which I was going to survive.
And yeah, I think I've done pretty well to get
as far as I did, because, yeah, there's a lot
of a lot of opportunities for me to go before tonight,
well before last night.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Was there a disappointment that you didn't do as well?
Like how did it come down at the end, Like
when you're was your wife pleased to be for you
to be coming home earlier, or like, how did it
all sit for you?
Speaker 2 (18:02):
No, I've got weeks on the jury now, Ben, so
you know that flight home doesn't matter of final tribal
on the jury. It's the same. That's right.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
You were there right to You're the first on the
tribal counts of amazing. Yeah, Christ into the jury. Sorry,
that's amazing. That's like so good. And then you don't
have to come home and do any parenting or any
respontibility whatsoever. You just hang out all day, eating and
drinking whatever you like, becoming the fast lug that you
are right to the very end to make a decision.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
The fat mayor of Juryvilla. That's right, that's me. No,
I don't feel disappointed at all, Ben, I had a
great time. I'm really proud of the game that I played.
I think it was a tall order for US attorneys
coming in. I mean, Harry is an icon of the
game and they got him, you know, so it's like
it's gonna it's pretty hard. It's pretty hard to get
(18:52):
this far. So I'm super proud, very very very happy
to be on the jury. The mayor of jury Villa.
I get to set the tone and then obviously I
get to cast my vote for towards someone who may
or may not win. So that's a real To have
the full experience again is pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Being on the jury is so cool because like you're
the first person there, so yep, you get to be
the mayth. I think you've just given yourself that title.
But also from talking to people over the seasons, you
know there's still gameplayer manipulation involved in that timeframe. We
expected to see some trickery behind the scenes in the
way in which you influence and guide people towards who
the winner may be.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
You wouldn't expect that of me, Ben, No, Like I
make nothing less.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
I think that you would have thoughts and feelings about things,
and you're very good at being able to lead and
mislead people.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
So maybe you're still playing the game. It's a fun question.
But I I took the experience from last time into account.
So last time I was the last one onto jury Villa,
and I could see that, like various fews have become calcified,
if that's a word set in stone, And what I
wanted to do was my parting words when I was
(19:59):
granted a full standing ovation, and they included. What I
said was go out there and play the best game
that you can play, because only you can play your
own game. And that's what I Survivor is a deeply
individual game that relies on other people. And so when
I went into the jury, I had obviously time to
drink beer and feed myself grapes. But what I wanted
players to do was take the time to process the
(20:21):
anger and the disappointment by themselves. But then ultimately the
main thing that I was encouraging them all was you
have the right to vote for who you want you,
but you just be clear on your principles, like your metrics,
like what do you value in the game. It's okay
if you just want to have a spiteful vote, do it,
but just own it. Don't vote for someone because of
(20:43):
being concerned about a perception of who you should or
shouldn't vote for. Like no one. You are your own player.
You are the judge of Survivor. We each come into
this game with our own biases, backgrounds, prejudices. And that's okay.
If you thought that I was at the final tribal
Council and I'm annoying as all. Hell, don't vote for me,
but like if if you thought that you valued my
gameplay both for me. So I was just really trying
to encourage players to process the emotion and then understand
(21:07):
what they value and then put their money where their
mouth is at that final trouble counsel. So no, I
was not. I mean, I don't know, does is that
manipulating the jury? I'm not sure. Be your best self,
that's being the best self.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I mean you kind of learned this with reality shows
and being a returning player. You've obviously clicked and clocked
this that you know the best. The best thing you
can do on reality television is be authentically yourself, good
or bad. You will resonate with audiences and I think
you will feel better about who you are on this show,
because if you are not being your authentic self and
(21:40):
you come off a show like this, you will always
second guess something. You'll always think, why didn't I just
be myself? You're retelling of that and helping and your
information that you can pass on to other people. I
think is good. I think that is coming from a
good place. It was, No, it was, And I love
to wait and see. I'm super excited to see what
comes next. I run out of time, but I always
(22:01):
finished with a behind the scenes secret. So I just
want a one word answer season three for you, like
what are your thoughts?
Speaker 2 (22:06):
And you're going to come back.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
We're going to see some more Mark without the Blazer,
with the Blazer at a bit.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
I think there's been enough Mark on Australian Survivor to
quench everyone's mark first. So I am done two from two,
huge experience. Both times. I am very pleased with my
Survivor experience. My life is bigger than Survivor. I'm going
to move on and do something else, but I'm very
grateful for the time I've had on Survivor.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I still think there's rivals. There's some rivalry out there.
Stop it, man, it's a bad man. There's a band
dagy out there. I don't know where it's coming from.
I'm just going to try and clear that out of
the way. There's a bad energy going on. I could
definitely see you coming back for another series of some rivals.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah, well maybe it's me versus you mate. We'll see.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
They won't let me anywhere near the show. I can
promise you that much. Mark enjoy chatting to the media.
You know you're an iconic player. You're someone who really
is so much fun to watch on the television. You
invoke an emotional response from audiences, and I genuinely think
out of this season, you are the one player you
cannot take out for this season to be working the
(23:09):
way that it is, so I leave that with me.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Thanks Ben, thanks so much for your time and I
love your podcast. I love it. Keep it sassy you going,
please keeping yeah fair enough? I enjoy. Thanks so much.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Thanks lovely to chat by may Mate.
It's in the news today, but it was actually on
TV Reload the podcast pig that line. Yea, Everyone, Welcome
back to TV Reload. My name is Benjamin Norrisen. Today
I am joined by Let's be honest one of the
loudest players from this current series of Australian Survivor. Today's guest,
of course, is Mark. Now. Whether you loved him, were
frustrated by him, or just couldn't look away, there's no
denying that Mark played a huge game now coming back
(00:23):
for a second shot, Mark didn't want just redemption, He
wanted impact, and this time around he wasn't interested in
playing it safe. So what happens when you stop worrying
about perception and just go all in? In this chat,
Mark opens up about leaning into his villainous, unpredictable role,
blowing up tribal councils, taking control of the game, and yes,
becoming what he calls an oxygen's thief out there on
(00:46):
the island. We also unpacked that moment that every survivor
dreams of and dreads, having your torch snuffed and why
for Mark it was both brutal and strangely satisfying. Plus
we get into the strategy behind the chaotic gameplay, what
it was really going on most of the time in
his head, and who he thinks is now stepping up
to take control of the game in his absence, and
(01:07):
just quietly, what really happens when you become the mayor
of Jury Villa. This is a fun chat, It's honest,
very self aware, and with one of the most memorable
players of the season. I think you're going to enjoy this. So, guys,
here is Mark, one of us Survivor's latest and I
dare say, biggest icons.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Oh stop event, Look, there's too many kings and queens
on Survivor. I was trying to not go down that route,
but I do feel like this has been an incredible
experience to play Survivor twice and then to be plastered
all over the screen for however many episodes. It's been
a lot of Mark, which is pretty cool. I like
it so and I've had a great experience. And I
(01:46):
really watched I really enjoyed watching my torch snuff to
get last night.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
That was so that's a weird thing to say, you know,
the experience of having your torch snuffed is just bizarre
in general.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Well, like look at the set, look at their flames.
Is the Golden God looking at you with this huge body,
and there's the tension and the emotion in that space
is palpable, and so when that torch gets snuffed, it's
like like the knife just cuts through and that's your
game done. So it's very final, but it's got this
(02:19):
like weird, weird final destiny sort of like a vibe
to it, and you really feel it when you're out there,
and then you go and eat a burger, which is nice.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
I mean, you did get a line's share of this season. Like,
I feel like my partner is not as big a
Survivor fan as I am, so I watching every episode
maybe twice. I'm a little weird, and he will be
coming in and out and watching it and he's like,
I'm so glad Mark's still there and he'd been following
it and it's all us. You got a lot of
screen time. I'm just going to tell you this. Did
(02:48):
you play it this way the second time around? Knowing
what gets screen time and what does that? I don't know, Like,
how does that work for you as a player?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
I think that's obviously as a retorney, you have the
experience of play, of having played and then having watched
the show, so you know, like, oh, okay, I know
what makes it onto the show. I wasn't playing for TV.
What I was wanted to do this time is last
time I was cast as a former diplomat, I was
cast as a titan of diplomacy, and so you know,
(03:17):
you're out there and you're trying to tell a story,
and it was I think it was kind of pushing
me into this professional mode, right, And I played a
great game. I'm really happy with how it went. I
came third, I almost won, like ah cy clothes this
time round. I'm like, I don't need to be professional
Mark on the island. I've got so many friends out
there in the real world that are like Mark, You're
not like that all the time. At a dinner party,
(03:38):
you can be a bit outrageous. And so I thought
to myself, you know what, when in life do you
get a second chance to play this great game? When
in life do you get to just have carte blanche,
go out there and just do whatever you want and
have fun. That's the mentality that I went into it,
and it just so happened that when there's four attorneyes
(03:58):
on a tribe on a eason of twenty four players,
I'm a huge target. And then I just found myself
blowing up tribal councils and then leaning into this, into
this like intimidating, villainous role. It wasn't pre planned at all.
It just sort of came to me. I thought that
was the best strategy. And then yeah, obviously I wanted
to What I realized from last time was being honest
(04:19):
and authentic is the best way to show yourself, and
so I wanted I wanted to be honest, but like
a little bit outrageous obviously, and so just say like
there was no way last time I would have said
I am running this tribe, no way, Like we're Australian,
there's tall poppies everywhere. This time around, I was like,
you know what, just say it. Just say it and
deal with the consequences later. And if you put a
(04:41):
little bit of make it a little bit more outrageous,
so be it. I mean, like I said some ridiculous
things ben I said talked about peeling into people's brains
and having octopus tentacles. I was just telling the truth,
which is what I felt out there and just with
like a little bit of you know, creative flourish, as
they might say. So that's that's what I was feeling
out there.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
I feel like you worked out the heightened reality of
this whole thing, and if I'm wrong by maybe looking
in at your time this time around, I think you
had more fun with it in terms of what it
all means, like what it all means, because I think
last time you did so well, you came to the
end and you didn't win, and that's a real cross
to bear, that really is that's a really hard thing
(05:20):
to do. But then you must have had the time
to look back reflect on your time on the show
and know that the moments that really mattered were the
television moments that audiences love. So then this time around
you're like, okay, yeah, I can be people's brains and
say a few iconic survivor you know tropes.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
I learned a lot from the first season, and I
actually not intentionally, I just realized that a lot of
players didn't get screen time, and so I spend a
lot of time talking to those people about their experiences,
and the consistent message I got from almost everyone was
I wish I just took opportunities as they as they came, Like,
sometimes an opportunity comes up and you just got to
(05:58):
grab it. This time around, I'm like, whenever there's an opportunity,
I'm going to take it. I'm going to take it
because someone else might take it. And yeah, it creates
TV because you are taking the opportunity. There's tension in
the game, and sometimes you just got to take it.
I also learned from last time that when you break
things and disrupt the game, it creates opportunities. And so yeah,
(06:19):
people are going to be like popping off online being
like action done this, I Action done that. But hey,
it creates new opportunities. And if you're the one setting
the agenda a very head office of me again, I
know it creates space for you to do things. And
that's the mentality that went out there. You're right, it
sucks losing. I wanted to win. I'm super competitive if
(06:39):
you can't tell already, But I just wanted to I
just wanted to play. I just wanted to play like
the most full on game that I could. Freed from
the responsibilities of the normal bounds that regulate normal behavior
in normal life, because thank god they exist a normal life.
I'm kind of.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Going all over the place with this, but I kind
of feel like, you know, what I would liked to
have seen with you is more of the continuation of
maybe some of the storylines from your first season. There
were some iconic players there, and you had some iconic
moments with people.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Caroline.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
You know, there were some moments I would have really
liked to have seen this redemption story with one of
those people brought into this series with you. Had you
thought that there was a possibility when you turned up
on the beach that there may be someone from your
previous series that you would be rehashing some unfinished business with.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Then you're sick. You're basically asking do you want to
continue the traumas that you experienced from last time on
this time?
Speaker 1 (07:35):
No.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
I did not want to see anyone from times we
rebels out there. I was like, oh my god, I've
already patched things up with so many of these people.
I have a such a special space in my life
with Caroline. What an icon what a woman? Eden Valaria like,
it's already so hard playing this game. I did not
want to play with anyone from that season I know
(07:55):
would have made great TV, because that would have been terrifying.
But I'm very grateful that I was on a beach
with Brook, the Queen of Australian Survivor, and I couldn't
have asked for a better attorney to be paired with.
But I still won. The Sicico.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
The cicco inside of me is that I wanted to
see that play out in some way. I mean, was
there anyone that did you haven't patched things up with?
Is there anyone that's still on that island?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
There are two very different seasons. The first time you play,
you're so naive to the way in which this game
affects you and relationships. This time round, I went out
there giving myself space to I think, you really need
to be able to compartmentalize relationships, and so I did
that a lot more this time round. I know that
I've heard people's feelings and so I will always I
(08:40):
acknowledge that. And look at me, Ben, I am a
nice per I actually am a nice person, and for
anyone I am, I am very happy to be friends
with whoever one wants to be friends with me, and
because but it is a huge life experience and I
can't wait to meet every single member of the player
or every single played redemption if they want to meet
(09:01):
with me.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Well, what's the process of bringing you back? Like when
did you find that out? I mean, I because you know,
it's so funny when you do these chats with everyone,
Everyone throughout the podcast always drops in a tease to
them coming back. It's kind of a wishful thinking you
know that that that could even happen. I'd like to
know from your story did they say that too at
the end of the last one, like your unfinished business,
(09:24):
we're going to come back to you? Or like when
does that start to happen and how did that happen
for you?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I don't trust making TV. You get you, you develop
a trust complex with production, so I could only control
what I thought, And in my mind, I'm like, the
way I'm going to handle this is I am just
in my mind not going to play again because I
want to create real friendships with the people that I
want to be friends with in the Survivor universe. There's
(09:50):
nothing that irks me more than people trying to hit
me out with the potential that will see each other
out there on the beach, Like that's the biggest ick
for me so when I I got so when I
got the phone call, it was late in the piece,
I was pretty much a no, to be honest, Oh yeah,
And my wife and I discussed it at length. There's
like a whole heeop of logistical things. I was sort
(10:12):
of like, Ah, you really want to do this again?
You know you did so well last time. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
I went boy with all of our personal chats. It's
such an honor to be asked again. And there was
just the thrill of the adventure is the thing that
made me go back. I liken Survivor to Jamunji. You know,
the survival world exists in Jamunji. It's high definition, the
(10:36):
colors are saturated. I have no photos selfies of me
on Survivor. I have no tangible like things from that world.
It just exists in the Jamunji land. And that's a
fantastic fantasy land to be able to escape to. Sometimes
hashtag Stephen fishback escape exclamationmunk. And that's the world that
(10:57):
I was like, do you want to go back into
Jumunji again? And let's do it one more time and
see how we came.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Have you watched that SNL clip where she talks about
being Jumanji. She's like, it's so every time I feel
like you're saying, I feel like you're pronouncing Jumanji the
way that they pronounce it on.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I haven't seen that clip, So you haven't seen it.
You haven't seen this, Oh, I'll go check it out.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Okay, let's just stop the podcast to watch a whole
episode of SNL. You know, in this last episode there's
something that you do, which I'm wondering how you feel
about it now and what the conversation with Simon looked
like afterwards. But you know, in employee to stay on
the show knowing that you're in danger, you did offer
to sacrifice a return e. How has that all played
(11:39):
out now that it's played out on television and Simon
seen it all? Like, how do you feel about it?
And was there any repercussions?
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah? Good question. There are elements of the episode last
night which don't align with my reality, and some of
them I want to leave us magic because it's magical
TV and I like, I like, I love the episode
from last night. One thing about Simon putting votes onto
Simon is I'm happy to talk about that. I was
never voting for Simon, and I told Simon I was
(12:07):
putting his name out there, and I said to Simon,
please go to town and tell everyone you're voting for me.
We really wanted to create this idea that we were
not working together, so Simon and I've told that. Simon
as to Simon after the game as well, so I
think when he was watching it, he maybe like, really, really, Mark,
it looks pretty convincing. But at least in my memory,
I remember the conversation with Caleb seems pretty strong on
(12:30):
silent Simon, but in my memory it was just a ruse.
It's hard when you're gaslighting yourself Ben to remember like
what's the truth and what's not. But in at least
in my memory, that was not a real plan.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
So there was an opportunity really for you to fall
out of the competition at this point and having so
much of the narrative, How do you feel like it's
going to go because my expectation is that there's Ben
and there's a few others. You know, there's people that
are coming up now from behind the ranks. Who do
you think stepping forward at this point of the game
to take this competition out?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
I feel like there is a power vacuum. I feel
like I was an oxygen thief out there, and I
think that there's a real opportunity for other people to
flex their muscles. I think I never bet against Brook
and Kelly, Like, I just don't bet against them. They
may be down, but they are so savvy, so much experience,
(13:24):
and have weapons in there in their pockets. But I
think think, sorry, Caleb, Ben and Jackson have emerged as
the people that are willing to take the rains and
shape the game. Some people wait for opportunities to come,
and that's fine, but I think that this now that
there's a power somewhat of a power vacuum. I think
(13:46):
that those gents are the three that'll try and grab
the reins. But they've still got some pretty stiff competition
in Brook and Keilly.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
Brook is doing very well, Achille is doing very well
as well. There's some people there that are playing some
very good games. I mean there's also people there. You've
got your Blanches and there's other people out there. I mean,
it's Blanche a little bit. Just she still playing the
game or is she in a romance? I feel like
she is spending a lot of time staring at someone
am I reading into that.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Blanche has had before merged. She went to tribal council
three times. There's an element of like just the edit
in terms of like not being able to see you know,
her experience, which is Yeah, I feel for Blanche because
you know, it's a big commitment to go out there.
She's got a lot of kids watching her home and
you know she was away from them. So it's not
always just based on gameplay. But you know, like I,
(14:33):
you know, let's see, let's see how Blanche goes. Maybe
she's going to maybe she's going to cartwheel to the
to the leadership role. We'll see how we go.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
She certainly is a big personality, isn't she.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I remember seeing Blanche on day one and I thought
she was a hoot. She had that disco T shirt,
she had like her hair and like a huge energy, incredible,
incredible personality. Strategically, we haven't worked together. I think that's
no secret. So yeah, but I think Blanche brings some
really fine energy to the TV screen and I like
(15:03):
watching it.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
And before we go, we need to just sort of
unpack where things have been left for this tribal council.
So I was reading the subtitles down the bottom, So
what's happening with this idol? What do you see that
it's happening, and what information have you passed over before
you had your torch enough?
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Oh god, I don't know what took over me, but
I was just like, oh, obviously I'm going I'm saying
my farewells to my buddies. Super protective of Brook, and
in my mind, I'm like, I'm super protective of Keeley
as well. I really want Brook to know that Keehley
has an idol. I also know that Keiehley has this
alleged fake idol. I hadn't seen it at this point
in time. So I just wanted to give Brook a
(15:39):
little leg up to initiate that conversation with Keighley because
they're going to they are both two very smart women
and they're going to need to use all of the
tricks in their toolbox. I don't know, I'm mixing mating
force here. They're going to need everything that they can
to get through. And it was just kind of like
an encouraging push from me to help Brook and inevertently
(16:01):
help Keeley too. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
I wasn't sure whether you were pitting them against each
other or whether or not you were asking them to help,
you know, That's that's where I was a little bit
confused help each other.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Hey, look, my game can be confusing, but no, definitely
I want I'm rooting for Brook, I'm rooting for Keeley. Absolutely,
I want them to I want them to kick kick
some goals.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I think it's always strange when you look at the
ogs and in how long they can survive in a
show like this. Well done to you as well for
being such a noisy player and sticking around, because you'd
think that these these newbies would be like, let's get
rid of these people, you know, straight away, like one, two, three, four,
Do you know what I mean? Like, it's interesting that
Brook and Simon are even still in this competition at
this point.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
Yeah, I think like we're all terrified out there that literally,
like the newbies could ganging up on us at any
point in time. Part of the trick is to identify
good allies the start and make quick relationships like you
have to move so quickly, and it's probably the strength
of my game was identifying faith in Keeley as super
(16:58):
good survivor players, telling them that I want to work
with them, keeping Brook on side, and then Don and
Caleb like Don and Caleb Don. On the first night,
he was angry at me because I didn't help with
the shelter, which is definitely true. He went down and
lay on the beach and I went down. I said, mate,
sorry I didn't help out. And he told me all
about how his mum's artistic, artistic and loves loves poetry,
(17:19):
and he recited a poem to me off by heart
and I looked it into his eyes and I'm like,
I love this man. Don is so funny and adorable.
And then Caleb came along and the Cornship cartel got created.
So I think that finding the right people that wanted
to connect, be it over strategy or over poetry really
and then flipping the table at first tribal council was
(17:41):
the only way in which I was going to survive.
And yeah, I think I've done pretty well to get
as far as I did, because, yeah, there's a lot
of a lot of opportunities for me to go before tonight,
well before last night.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Was there a disappointment that you didn't do as well?
Like how did it come down at the end, Like
when you're was your wife pleased to be for you
to be coming home earlier, or like, how did it
all sit for you?
Speaker 2 (18:02):
No, I've got weeks on the jury now, Ben, so
you know that flight home doesn't matter of final tribal
on the jury. It's the same. That's right.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
You were there right to You're the first on the
tribal counts of amazing. Yeah, Christ into the jury. Sorry,
that's amazing. That's like so good. And then you don't
have to come home and do any parenting or any
respontibility whatsoever. You just hang out all day, eating and
drinking whatever you like, becoming the fast lug that you
are right to the very end to make a decision.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
The fat mayor of Juryvilla. That's right, that's me. No,
I don't feel disappointed at all, Ben, I had a
great time. I'm really proud of the game that I played.
I think it was a tall order for US attorneys
coming in. I mean, Harry is an icon of the
game and they got him, you know, so it's like
it's gonna it's pretty hard. It's pretty hard to get
(18:52):
this far. So I'm super proud, very very very happy
to be on the jury. The mayor of jury Villa.
I get to set the tone and then obviously I
get to cast my vote for towards someone who may
or may not win. So that's a real To have
the full experience again is pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (19:08):
Being on the jury is so cool because like you're
the first person there, so yep, you get to be
the mayth. I think you've just given yourself that title.
But also from talking to people over the seasons, you
know there's still gameplayer manipulation involved in that timeframe. We
expected to see some trickery behind the scenes in the
way in which you influence and guide people towards who
the winner may be.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
You wouldn't expect that of me, Ben, No, Like I
make nothing less.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
I think that you would have thoughts and feelings about things,
and you're very good at being able to lead and
mislead people.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
So maybe you're still playing the game. It's a fun question.
But I I took the experience from last time into account.
So last time I was the last one onto jury Villa,
and I could see that, like various fews have become calcified,
if that's a word set in stone, And what I
wanted to do was my parting words when I was
(19:59):
granted a full standing ovation, and they included. What I
said was go out there and play the best game
that you can play, because only you can play your
own game. And that's what I Survivor is a deeply
individual game that relies on other people. And so when
I went into the jury, I had obviously time to
drink beer and feed myself grapes. But what I wanted
players to do was take the time to process the
(20:21):
anger and the disappointment by themselves. But then ultimately the
main thing that I was encouraging them all was you
have the right to vote for who you want you,
but you just be clear on your principles, like your metrics,
like what do you value in the game. It's okay
if you just want to have a spiteful vote, do it,
but just own it. Don't vote for someone because of
(20:43):
being concerned about a perception of who you should or
shouldn't vote for. Like no one. You are your own player.
You are the judge of Survivor. We each come into
this game with our own biases, backgrounds, prejudices. And that's okay.
If you thought that I was at the final tribal
Council and I'm annoying as all. Hell, don't vote for me,
but like if if you thought that you valued my
gameplay both for me. So I was just really trying
to encourage players to process the emotion and then understand
(21:07):
what they value and then put their money where their
mouth is at that final trouble counsel. So no, I
was not. I mean, I don't know, does is that
manipulating the jury? I'm not sure. Be your best self,
that's being the best self.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I mean you kind of learned this with reality shows
and being a returning player. You've obviously clicked and clocked
this that you know the best. The best thing you
can do on reality television is be authentically yourself, good
or bad. You will resonate with audiences and I think
you will feel better about who you are on this show,
because if you are not being your authentic self and
(21:40):
you come off a show like this, you will always
second guess something. You'll always think, why didn't I just
be myself? You're retelling of that and helping and your
information that you can pass on to other people. I
think is good. I think that is coming from a
good place. It was, No, it was, And I love
to wait and see. I'm super excited to see what
comes next. I run out of time, but I always
(22:01):
finished with a behind the scenes secret. So I just
want a one word answer season three for you, like
what are your thoughts?
Speaker 2 (22:06):
And you're going to come back.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
We're going to see some more Mark without the Blazer,
with the Blazer at a bit.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
I think there's been enough Mark on Australian Survivor to
quench everyone's mark first. So I am done two from two,
huge experience. Both times. I am very pleased with my
Survivor experience. My life is bigger than Survivor. I'm going
to move on and do something else, but I'm very
grateful for the time I've had on Survivor.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I still think there's rivals. There's some rivalry out there.
Stop it, man, it's a bad man. There's a band
dagy out there. I don't know where it's coming from.
I'm just going to try and clear that out of
the way. There's a bad energy going on. I could
definitely see you coming back for another series of some rivals.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah, well maybe it's me versus you mate. We'll see.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
They won't let me anywhere near the show. I can
promise you that much. Mark enjoy chatting to the media.
You know you're an iconic player. You're someone who really
is so much fun to watch on the television. You
invoke an emotional response from audiences, and I genuinely think
out of this season, you are the one player you
cannot take out for this season to be working the
(23:09):
way that it is, so I leave that with me.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Thanks Ben, thanks so much for your time and I
love your podcast. I love it. Keep it sassy you going,
please keeping yeah fair enough? I enjoy. Thanks so much.
Speaker 1 (23:19):
Thanks lovely to chat by may Mate.
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