November 27, 2025 • 61 mins
ORIGINAL AIR DATE: NOV 27, 2022
When did Thanksgiving in the United States actually start? Was Canada first to have a Thanksgiving? What did the Prince of Wales have to do with it? What conspiracies surround Thanksgiving in America? We look into this and many things around what we have come to know as Thanksgiving in America in this episode. We are grateful to you for being supportive loyal listeners!
Email us at: downtherh@protonmail.com
When did Thanksgiving in the United States actually start? Was Canada first to have a Thanksgiving? What did the Prince of Wales have to do with it? What conspiracies surround Thanksgiving in America? We look into this and many things around what we have come to know as Thanksgiving in America in this episode. We are grateful to you for being supportive loyal listeners!
Email us at: downtherh@protonmail.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hi, everybody, it's me Cinderella Acts. You are listening to
the Fringe Radio Network. I know I was gonna tell them, Hey,
do you have the app? It's the best way to
listen to the Fringe Radio Network. It's safe and you
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doesn't track you or trace you, and it sounds beautiful.
(00:27):
I know I was gonna tell him, how do you
get the app?
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Just go to.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Fringeradionetwork dot com right at the top of the page.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I know, slippers, we gotta keep cleaning these chimneys.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Welcome everybody to NWCZ radio dot com Channel ones down
the rabbit Hole.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
My name is Big D and I'm Brandon, and it's
great to have everybody along.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I hope you're well. I guess we're going into winter.
Are we officially in winter yet? Or is that in December?
Speaker 4 (01:36):
I don't know, but it feels like it's freaking cold.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
It feels like it where I'm at as well. We're
like twenty twenty five degrees below normal right now. Usually
it's seventy and sunny, and it's been it's been rough,
but this is the week of Thanksgiving here in the
United States, and so I think it's important that we
take a true historical look at it. And you know what,
(01:59):
we're probably going to lose some listeners.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Probably we seem to run into a thing where some
of our listeners only like the truth when it doesn't
go against some of the stuff that they you know,
they believe.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Hey, we sincerely appreciate all of you who listen because
we just hit another milestone, and we don't we don't
like to put our numbers out there or whatever. Just
know that you're part of a big family. Yes, and
we've had way more downloads than we ever imagine, so
we appreciate that, and we appreciate the fact that you listen.
(02:33):
And for those of you who have been with us
for a long time, thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
Yes, And I mean, you know, for those that have
been for a long time, I hope that you know
I'm trying to fix the issues with the sound on
my episode. So I hope that the last couple of episodes
has been a little bit better. I mean, Big D
says they sound better on his end. If there's issues
once again, and let us know, I will work to
try and figure them out. I think I figured out
the issue we we are. We do try and you know,
(02:57):
we do listen, and we do try to make things
as good as we can.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Speaking of listening, for those of you who have been
with us for a long time, we made a promise
way back in the beginning, yes, that we would never
take advertisements or advertising on this show. That's not something
we've ever wanted to do, much to my wife's dismay,
but we get emails fairly consistently from groups that we
(03:26):
don't solicit obviously, asking if they can advertise on our show.
And we got another one this week is that they
sent us three emails. Apparently they really liked the show
and we're not interested because I'd listen to podcasts, and
one thing I hate is when you're in the middle
(03:48):
of a podcast and they're strategic about it. Just when
it's getting to the point where they're about to, you know,
drop a bomb or get into something really interesting, it
goes into some dang commercial and it just you can't
skip ahead.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Now, and it drives me nuts. I do that too.
There's one of the one of the podcasts that I
listen to they have I timed it once it was
like almost four or five minutes of commercials in the
middle of their episodes, and it drives me nuts every time.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Sometimes it drives me so much I just turn it off,
and so then you lose a listener. And we don't
want to do that. We we just wanted to be
straight up and be honest with you. That's why we
don't have advertising. If we had a website or something,
we might consider it, but up to this point that's
just we're not gonna do that.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
So someday we might get a website. And if we
did the website, I could see putting stuff up there
and having maybe sponsor, you know, an affiliate links. But
I mean to every episode to talk, it's just yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
You will never ever hear us say this is sponsored
by whatever, or hey, go out and get this, because
it's just not gonna happen. But anyway, Also, speaking of email,
you can email us at down the RH at ProtonMail
dot com. Down the RH at ProtonMail dot com. And
(05:16):
of course, as always, thanks to Fringe Radio Network and
NWCZ Radio dot com Channel one.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Yes, thank you both for you know, putting us on
the show, putting us on the air.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
So this week, being that it's Thanksgiving, here in America.
I have to say that because see my wife's Canadian
and they have theirs in October. And we'll touch on
that a little bit later in the episode. But here
in America and most of our audience as American, and
(05:49):
even if you're not, I think you're gonna find this
interesting because there's a dark history, and there's some dark
corners around the Thanksgiving story that most people don't know,
and there's some conspiracy involved with Thanksgiving. Yep. So we're
going to try to tackle all that today's but first,
(06:09):
as usual, we need to back it up and get
into some of the history of this stuff. I know
that when I was going to school and when I
was young, we would see i'll just call them propaganda films.
That's what they were about Thanksgiving, about how the Pilgrims
(06:30):
got together with the Indians and had their little feast.
Then we would watch the Charlie Brown Thanksgiving. There would
usually be, you know, some other cartoon or kid oriented
show about Thanksgiving, and it was usually it's always around,
of course, having a turkey and dressing and stuffing and
(06:52):
people gathering around and giving thanks Is that was that
your experience growing.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Up pretty much I mean as much as I can remember.
I mean, it was kind of one of those things.
I mean, my family we did Thanksgiving, but I grew
up Mormons, We're huge. At anytime we had a family function,
I just wanted to crawl in her corner and die.
So I'm one of those ones like now, like Thanksgiving,
usually we just do something at home. We don't go anywhere.
(07:18):
We don't go to any family. This year, we might
go to my daughters just because you know, Big d
knows issues just had a baby today, so we might
go down to her so we can, you know, see
the baby, because hospitals are dumb.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
You buried the lead, I did, I did? You are
a grandpa, I am. I am so congratulations on that,
old man.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
Thank you. But I haven't been able to see her
yet because the hospitals they only allow two people to
come in. So that was my my wife and you know,
of course the father. We're the only ones that can
go into the hospital with her. So I have to
wait till they release her from the hospital to fly
and go see her.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
That's because you live in the separate country, Washington State.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
We do, we do, and they just freaking elected them
all back.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I know my experience with Thanksgiving starts when I was
a kid and we actually had in school programs where
we would dress up and you would dress up. Some
would dress up as Pilgrims and some would dress up
as Indians or as we call now Native Americans. Somebody
(08:26):
would give a speech and it would be this shangri
law moment of coming together and being thankful for the
bounty and that they all had food. But that's not
what happened. No, so let's get into what actually happened,
because there's several Thanksgivings. That's the thing that I found
(08:50):
the most weird about this.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
There is because the one that we've all been taught
was the Plymouth, you know, the Pilgrims, which they weren't
even called the Pilgrim speaking with they were just called separatists.
But that's the one that we all learned about, and
that we all learned that that was the real, the
first Thanksgiving, but they really wasn't. There was ones before
that and a bunch after it.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
How it all started, and it is a worldwide thing.
It's basically because there are references to people in Spain
doing this. It was a celebration of the harvest. Harvest
is over, the storehouse, the warehouses and the storage houses
(09:36):
are full. The hard work is done. We're heading into winter,
and so we're going to have a big feast to
celebrate basically our bountiful harvest. And we invite all the
neighbors over or family or whatever, and everybody brings whatever
it is that they grew or if they hunted duck
(09:58):
or whatever they did. Everybody brought some. They came together.
It was a community meal to celebrate the fact that
they had, you know, made it through another harvest season
and hopefully there was an abundance heading into the winter.
Speaker 4 (10:14):
Yes, And I mean that's one thing like with Plymouth,
I mean that's how we all kind of learned it.
That it was this big thing of you know, but
the way they portrayed it that I remember it like
all of a sudden, it was like and this was
us coming in. This was like I mean, like the
Geneva connect convention that we had this huge like there
was these big problems between us, and then we came
(10:34):
together and had this big meal to to settle our
differences and blah blah blah and everything else.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
And it's like, now, no, the americanized version, which is
where we're going to really zero in here, actually starts
in England because, as we know everybody, all the early
settlers that came over here basically came from England. Yes, however,
(11:01):
this specific group went via Holland. They left England because
of the persecution of the king. And when I say persecution,
he was on them about everything, primarily religion and his dictats,
and if you didn't agree with him, he would hunt
(11:22):
you down, he would put you in jail, and sometimes
you would kill people over it.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Yeah, I mean he was very much you had to be.
I mean it was law that you had to go
to church. If you didn't go to church, you were
breaking the law. His church, Church of England, the Church
of England, which King James. That's where the King James
Bible comes from.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
And so they left and they went up to hang
out with the Dutch. They were looking for basically religious
freedom and a place to resettle and it kind of
worked out for a little bit, but then they heard
that they were sending the Mayflower over to this New Land,
(12:11):
and there was there was opportunity.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
So I can't remember the exact number of people that
boarded it, but it was under two hundred I believe.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
I think it only ended up being about one hundred
and two.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Yeah, it was. I mean, when you think about how
big America is and how many people are here now,
just imagine a boat showing up in Plymouth, basically over
there on the East coast and one hundred and two people.
And it was brutal trip. They sat out in the
harbor in that boat for months after they arrived, because
(12:48):
the men rowed ashore just to check it out and
see what if there was anything worth sticking around for. Yeah,
and people who made the trip died on the boat
sitting in the harbor, never touched the America or the
New Land. Then when they got into when they finally
got onto the New Land, it's November.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
On the one thing too, I mean, honestly, if you
go through, I mean we're gonna because there's a lot
we have to go over, so we're kind of glossing
over it. There's a lot. There was technically two ships
begin with, and there's a whole bunch just between them
going to Amsterdam and coming here. I mean, we can
almost do an entire episode just on the way they
(13:30):
how they got to Plymouth.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Oh absolutely, Yes, it's a brutal story. No what it is.
I don't know how these people did it, honestly, and
I have I have a lot of admiration for their gumption.
But when they got here, the it was basically by
the time they ever got everybody onto shore, it was
(13:54):
heading into winter. Imagine showing up somewhere there's no buildings,
nobody to greet you, there's no houses, nothing's cleared away,
nothing zero. Yeah, and they had to quickly set up shop. Well,
(14:16):
the first winter, half of them died.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Yeah, I mean it was brutal. I mean brutal. I
mean it's one of those things if you look like,
you know, the winters in New England but with no houses.
I mean we already hear about when things happen in
New England and everything else, and people freezing to death
and all this stuff happening, and people completely don't think
(14:43):
about it. Forget about the fact that when these people
showed up, it was literally just they walked into a forest.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
And had no idea where the forest ended, where it started.
I mean it's brutal. Well, one of the people who
came over and he was basically they called him the
governor of the colony. His name was William Bradford, and
(15:11):
barely a mention of Bradford really comes up in US history,
and I'm not sure why, because there's a major lesson
that Bradford learned that we should all take heed of
to this day. The problem is is that in sixteen
twenty one, which is when everybody says, oh, it was
(15:32):
a bountiful harvest, and this is when the pilgrims helped
the new settlers plant and learn how to fish and everything,
actually it was not bountiful at all. And the colonists
who showed up they were kind of lazy and they
were thieves. And so what Bradford did was he set
(15:54):
up basically before Marx even thought of it, socialism. Yes,
And how they did this was nobody owned land, and
you work basically to your ability, and everything went in
to the community pot, all the food, all the housing
(16:16):
was distributed based upon need. Nobody owned anything. And it
was a massive failure because the young guys were getting
sick and tired of working, as they said, for other
men's wives and children, so they stopped producing. People were
griping about their living conditions as opposed to others living
(16:40):
conditions and on, and it was just it just unraveled. Yeah,
well he sat down and tried to figure out how
we're going to get out of this, because we're going
to starve or they're going to kill each other. Because
this is this is obviously not working. It sounds great
in theory, but it wasn't working because you had half
(17:02):
the men not doing anything, all the young guys working
their butts off, you had some women doing some things,
others not doing and then so they all just said, well,
why why am I doing this If I'm not even
benefiting from it? What's the point. So what he did
was he gave everybody a parcel of land and said,
this is your land. You can do on it whatever
(17:23):
you want. You can harvest, you can raise things, and
basically we're going to start free enterprise. You grow what
you need, and you grow anything more, you can barter it,
sell it whatever. And then it flourished. They had more
than they needed.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
And that's when these A lot of people don't point
that out. A lot of people will focus on the
fact that and see this as a way that, oh,
this is how socialism worked, and it's like, no, it
didn't if you actually looked at the history, it didn't work,
and they had to switch it to capitalism right.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Ay. They weren't adjusted to the weather, they didn't really
know how to grow crops. And that is where the Indians,
the Native Americans, came in and showed them, Hey, here's
how we do it. Here's what we grow here, here's
how you catch stuff out in the like out in
the lobster and cod out here in the bay. And
(18:23):
this will get you going in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Well, and there was one thing that I was reading
who said that. I think they said in the first month,
they hadn't killed any animal, they hadn't shot any animals,
and they caught one fish because they just had no
idea how to do any of this stuff until like that,
you know, Native Americans showed up and showed them how
and helped them. You know, there was one I couldn't
(18:46):
find it anywhere. I heard it on two different podcasts
that I was listening about Thanksgiving, but I couldn't find
it anywhere to prove it. But they said the first
Indian that met them walked up and said, hey, you
got any beer?
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Nice?
Speaker 4 (19:00):
But I kept trying to find that like in anything.
But yeah, I heard it in two different podcasts with
It's like oh yeah, because he knew English from eating
you know, trappers and stuff like that. And his first
words to them was hey, Hi, Hi, you got any beer?
Like that's pretty found the first you know, prime boy.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Yeah, yeah, grow some hops. We'll have it in a moment.
The sad truth about the what has been pointed out
in history, or at least the history books about this,
this three day feast that we've all learned about was
the first quote Thanksgiving feast. It was actually almost a
(19:36):
last supper because this was when the settlers were pretty
much decimated. They were barely hanging on. This is when
they were doing their shared sort of socialism experiment going on,
and they were heading into winter and they didn't know
(19:56):
how to store anything. Yeah, and so well they said,
we're going to have a big community meal and we're
going to invite our friends who have helped us out.
And it was kind of a come and go as
you will three It wasn't a it was not a
sit down at a big table event for three days.
(20:16):
It was food was put out. All the food was
put out on tables and everything for three days because
they they knew it was going to spoil, it was
going to rotten, whatever. So it was come get your
belly full, is really what it was. And it was
intended to basically not waste what they the little that
they had grown and kind of store up some fat
(20:40):
for the winter because we're not sure we're going to
make it, which is not what we learned at all.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
No, it was supposed it was a huge celebration, you know.
And the thing is too that the one thing you
know that a lot of people don't realize either, is
the only reason another settlement had already tried to settle
there and failed. They weren't even supposed to be there.
They were supposed to be farther north. They landed in
(21:07):
the wrong spot, which was one of those things that
kind of it gets really weird in the contract, the
contract that they were supposed to have to basically almost
be indentured servants by their original contract was basically broken
by them landing in the wrong spot. There's half the
people that were there weren't actually Puritans. Half of them
(21:30):
were just random people that they picked up on the
the you know, off the street, and like just put
them on the boat. Right, They basically did what the
Texas governor did. They said, hey, you're homeless, get on
the boat.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
We're taking you somewhere new.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
We're getting ready, and I mean that's what they did.
And I mean it was one of those things. There
was a few times they did that with boats where
it's like, oh, you're heading over to the New World. Here,
take these vagrants with you.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Right. That's why when they showed up here they realized
these guys were lazy, thieving people. For the most part.
It's almost like like when England sent all their riff
raff and jailbirds to Australia and said good luck.
Speaker 4 (22:08):
I still think that the Earth is the Australia of
the universe. But I think that's how we got started.
We were just, you know, our ancestors were just the
riff raff of the universe.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
University. Send them to that little marble over there.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
But it's one of those things that it really shows
like that we all believed that, you know, what we
were taught was it was just a group of Puritans,
like you know, you think it was just this big
group of happy people like ooh, we're going over there
and we're going to become you know, go to the
United States and it's like, no, it was a hellish time.
And half of them aren't even Puritans. They just they
didn't have anything else to do.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
Well. The other thing too, that I find just outrageous,
the idea of what the Puritans wore. We have in
our mind because we've been taught over and over that
they wore these black and white, these dresses with these big.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
Buckles, and they like the Quaker Omo guy exactly.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
And the men wore the big, you know, kind of
weird hat with the buckle on it, and they had
their muzzle. They didn't wear that at all. They wore
what they had when they loaded the boat. And that
was not part of the deal. Yeah, the propaganda of
this supposed Quaker group or the Pilgrims or whatever you
(23:31):
want to call this group of people that came over here.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
The Separatists, that's what they call it. That's what they
called him the time, a separatists because they were separating
from the Church of England, because they didn't recognize that
the Church of England was you know that they were real, right.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
But it wasn't until way later that they dug back
in history and found a small sect of these Quakers
who did dress like that, and they attributed it to everybody.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
Yeah, and I mean the thing was and really these
weren't even Quakers.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
They were Puritans, that's right.
Speaker 4 (24:06):
It was a completely different religious sect.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
So how this all got mismatched together is astounding.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Yeah, it is, and it would really if you look
at a lot of the other colonies, they all had
something similar to this Plymouth. For whatever reason, I don't
know why this is the one that they picked to
be considered the representation of Thanksgiving, because I mean, really,
it wasn't until I think George Washington said, you know,
seventeen eighty nine was the first Thanksgiving, because there was
(24:35):
a second Thanksgiving too that was horrible. And I know
one of the things too, is the way that they
everything was cleared for them basically to have places to stay,
and everything was because an entire tribe had been wiped
out by smallpox. And when that tribe got wiped out
by smallpox, when the first thing that the settlers did
when they showed up was to basically raid the gray
(25:00):
of both them and the settlers had been before them.
They raised raided the graves of those settlers and the
Native Americans and then also used their huts to survive it.
So they basically lived off the you know, like yeah,
grave robbers, total grave robbers and everything else. I mean,
there's a lot of things about this group that was
(25:21):
quite interesting to learn.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Another reference to Thanksgiving was in sixteen thirty seven, and
some people pointing back to this as the true origin
of Thanksgiving where Massachusetts Bay Colony Governor John Winthrop.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
That's what they Yeah, they called a second but in
some say it's the first and the second.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
So right, he declared a day to celebrate soldiers who
had just killed hundreds of Pequat men and women and
children in what is now called Mystic Connecticut. Now, depending
upon which account you read of that, there's three or
four or five different angles to that story, and depending
(26:05):
on which one you pick up, you're going to get
a whole different version of it. Essentially what happened, just
without any political interpretation or just the facts. Man, what
happened was there was the settlers were sort of friendly
with the natives, and you had some riff raff in
(26:31):
the settlers. They were in fighting, the natives were infighting
with themselves and other tribes. Each were blaming each other
for the problems. I don't know who fired the first shot.
I don't know if anybody does, but they started raiding
each other. Then there was an interpreter who was a
(26:55):
Native American who brought word to the settlers that there
was a raid coming. So they decided to preempt it,
and they were first to go, and they they did.
They wiped out quite a few of these Native Americans.
And whether that's good or bad, I don't know. They
(27:17):
were just they were trying to survive and they thought
they were about to be raided. It's war, that's what
it was. And there were there's plenty of blame on
all sides. But again, like I said, depending on who
you're which when you're reading, it's either all the settler's fault,
or it's all the Native American's fault, or it goes
(27:39):
in many different directions. Now I wasn't there, You weren't there.
There's very little recorded about it, and so it's basically,
how do you want to interpret this event? Regardless this
John Winthrop, because they were the winners, declared it a
day of Thanksgiving essentially because they were alive. Yeah, and
(28:04):
then there was Abraham Lincoln.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
Well, even before him, there was George Washington in seventeen
eighty nine.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
Oh that's true.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Yep, you said the first Thanksgiving proclation by the national
government of the United States, and that was in seventeen
eighty nine, correct, But it doesn't say really. I was
reading some things and it's like that, there's nothing that
really says why.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
I think they were just looking for a reason to party, Yeah,
to celebrate, because Lincoln brought it up, and then there
was Franklin delan of Roosevelt brought it up. It's been
changed over time as to which Thursday it is it
used to be. It's been all different kind of thursdays.
Speaker 4 (28:52):
Yeah, And I noticed like in eighteen seventeen, even before
Abraham Lincoln, New York and a couple other states made
a holiday a Thanksgiving holiday, but they had different days
everything else. And then like we said, you know, all
of a sudden, Abraham Lincoln said, nope, this is what
we're going to do. And like I said, Franklin d.
(29:12):
Roosebarg changed the day. So it's kind of moved around.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Yeah, according to this, Franklin delan Or Roosevelt signed the
bill in nineteen forty one, it was actually on December
twenty sixth, so they were actually doing work through Christmas,
so go figure. He made it a matter of federal law,
fixing the day as the fourth Thursday of November, and
then according to this article, for several years. Some states
(29:37):
continue to observe the last Thursday dates in years with
five November or five Thursdays in November, such as nineteen
forty four, with Texas doing so as late as nineteen
fifty six. It was not without controversy though, when Franklin
Roosevelt first brought it up, twenty three states went along
(29:59):
with it. In twenty did not and couldn't decide on
which day and whether it would be a government holiday
or not.
Speaker 4 (30:07):
Wow, And now it's technically the most place it's a
government holiday both Thursday and Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Correct, because you got to go shopping. It's the only
day you get paid to go shopping if you actually
get out on Black Friday.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
And a lot of company our stores have stopped doing
Black Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
I've noticed that. I have noticed that, well, most things
have moved online and it got so crazy.
Speaker 4 (30:31):
Well, I think some of them still do. One of
the big things that they started doing. For a while,
there was Thursday afternoon, like Thursday evenings, so they're pre
brought black Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
And I'm like that your mind, Yeah, that's that's crazy.
I'm watching.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
I hate shopping.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
There's multiple facets to this Thanksgiving story, and none of
them are concrete now as far as this is the
beginning or this is the Thanksgiving arena, And that's the
fascinating thing to me, because I do believe, if you
(31:07):
really want to get down to the brass knuckles of
this thing, it's probably the most propagandistic holiday we have. Yeah,
because what they've told us about it's not true. The
initial feast and in fact, all the early feasts with
the settlers over here, it did not contain turkey or
(31:28):
stuffing or mashed potatoes, probably not gravy. It was way
more vegetables, seafood. And if they had any kind of
bird at all, it was a most likely pheasant or
some sort of you know, duck. Maybe there was a
some wild turkey. And I'm not talking about the drink.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Hey man, you gotta do what you do, you gotta
do to get through Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Maybe they did, maybe they maybe they did make beer.
I don't know, but from all accounts, some of them
did have journals back then that were found and they
list the food off and it's not what we think
of as Thanksgiving now today.
Speaker 4 (32:10):
But I mean, I'll be honest, most of the menu
sounds much better than what we supposed to Thanksgiving, like
the sweet potatoes, sweet yams, all that stuff. No, for me,
ham potatoes, I would be happy with. Lobster. Lobster and
cod would be amazing for Thanksgiving. I could get behind
that holiday.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah. I tried to look up when that all sort
of became a thing. The closest I could come as
far as dates and stuff. There's a lot of stats
on how much turkey is eaten, how much you know,
gravy is made, and all of that kind of stuff.
But as far as dates, like when this all kind
(32:50):
of became a thing, I couldn't find it. I did
find this though, that if you're really big into the
green bean castle role, it was invented by an employee
of the Campbell Soup Company in nineteen fifty five.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well, like I said, for me, and it's funny because
it used to be a big problem because like my family,
I'm the only one in my family who doesn't like turkey.
So I don't like turkey. I don't like just cooked
bird like turkey for like sandwich meat fine, but like turkey,
just a cooked bird. So it used to be a problem,
(33:24):
like with my family, I won't eat the turkey. So
of course everyone's like, well what will you you know,
so they had to make a ham specifically for me
because I won't eat the turkey. But then it became
like this huge issue and I'm like, I'm not asking
you to make the ham. I'm not telling you to
make the ham. You're the one choosing because I won't
eat the turkey.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
According to this, it says mashed potatoes, gravy stuffing, sweet potatoes,
cranberry sauce, sweet corn ball, vegetables, squash, Brussels sprouts, pumpkin
pie are among the side dishes commonly associated with Thanksgiving.
All of these are actually native to the Americas, or
we're introduced as new food source to the Europeans when
(34:02):
they arrived. Turkey may be the exception. Nathaniel Philbrick in
his book Mayflower, suggests that the Pilgrims might have already
been familiar with Turkey and England even though the bird
is basically native to America. The Spaniards had brought some
domesticated turkeys from Central America in the seventeenth century, and
they became popular all over Europe, including England. But again,
(34:26):
if you read the accounts of what they put out
on the table, because things were so sparse and there
wasn't even a lot of meat. Actually there was more
like venison and seafood.
Speaker 4 (34:39):
It seemed like venison seafood, and a lot of crops
like corn and stuff like that. Because one thing a
lot of people don't think about too, is when they
showed up. Like I said, there was an entire village
that was wiped out from smallpox years prior, but it
wasn't a lot of years prior, so a lot of
like the cornfields and stuff were already still there. They
(35:00):
just had to, you know, plow them, plow them over
and start over again. But they were already there and
ready to go.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Right, And they didn't think ahead enough to figure out
how to store this stuff.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
Well, from some of the stuff I read too, they
didn't even they weren't really even a farmer's group, like
they weren't they want it all, They had no idea
how to live on this stuff. They just thought they'd
show up and figure it out. And it's like, no,
life was a lot harder for them than they thought.
I think they thought it was going to be a
lot easier when they got here. I think, you know,
(35:33):
it just it did not go the way they thought
it was.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Oh, for sure, they were told it's the land of
milk and honey, and you're going to go prosper and
you can have all the lands you want. It's just
going to be awesome. And if they had shown up,
probably in say April or May, they may have had
that thought. But they showed up in November now on
the East coast, which is brutal.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
Even if they showed up in April and May, they
just would have been beat by the heat because they
had no idea how to do any of this stuff.
They didn't know how to plant crops. I mean, if
it hadn't been for you know, Squanto and I can't
remember the other guy's name, if they hadn't showed up
and started talking to them, I.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Know, they would have all died. Yeah, they would have
all died.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
They had no idea what they were doing. It'd be
like taking you know, someone who lives in Seattle right
now and just dropping them out in the middle of
you know, the Mountaineer National Forest with nothing and say survived.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
There is a couple of thoughts that Canada actually hosted
the first Thanksgiving.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
No way, Canada can't do anything like that.
Speaker 2 (36:36):
According to CNN, and take that as you will. But
according to CNN, Canada was host to the actual first Thanksgiving.
The claim in question refers to the arrival of English
explorer Martin Frobisher and his crew to Canada in fifteen
seventy eight, which it wasn't Canada at the time, but
(36:58):
you know what I'm saying. They were happy to be
on dry land. They celebrated with a feast of beef, mushy,
peas and crackers so British. And whether or not it
was called Thanksgiving, it's still up for debate. But it
was a thankful meal and they marked it down.
Speaker 4 (37:17):
But it's one of those things, I mean, really, if
you look at Thanksgiving where it falls, I mean, you
go back to ancient times, Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, all beasts
and pay tribute to the gods after the fall harvest,
and really, isn't that what Thanksgiving is.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
It's morphed over the years.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
Obviously, they say it has a lot of reseemblance to
the ancient Jewish harvest festival of second.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Yeah, I think it's just a harvest. It is a
harvest celebration. It's a bountiful celebration where you give thanks,
whether it's to the gods or to your family, or
to God or however you see it. Now, that's why
I don't understand why in America we had to They
felt the need to pick one, two or three events
(38:03):
and nobody can quite figure out which one it is,
and then attribute all this nonsense to it, like what
the Quakers wore, that it was this great unifying event
between the natives and these settlers, even though it was
basically almost like a death meal.
Speaker 4 (38:22):
But then, like you said, I mean, it's one of
those things. I mean they basically attributed to Quakers, but
none of the three stories that they really point out
are Quakers.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
Here's another one out of Canada that I thought was
interesting in the file of maybe it started in Canada
because according to this, Canada observes their Thanksgiving on the
second Monday of every October. And if you're Canadian or
have any Canadian relatives. You know this, and it is
because in eighteen seventy two, the Prince of Wales got
(38:53):
medical recovery and Canada wanted to celebrate and it became
a national holiday to give thanks. Know how many Canadians
know that basically your Thanksgiving originally was to give thanks
for the recovery of the Prince of Wales over in England.
Speaker 4 (39:13):
So wown.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
So I don't even know. I'd be shocked to if
many Canadians even knew that.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
Probably not. I mean, it's one of those things. I
think a lot of these holidays. We celebrate them and
we have what we're told they're supposed to be, and
then once you do the research, you're like, oh wait
a minute. You know, it's like when we've gone down
you know, Christmas and Easter and everything else where. They
do have some background in like pagan religions and stuff
like that, but it's also the Christianity. It gets weird.
(39:45):
You know, We've talked about them on you know, past episodes,
but with this one, it's really weird because, like you said,
there's three or four that you can really point out.
They say that's where it seems to come from. But
none of them fully fit.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
No, because we're given these pictures and we're giving the stories,
but they've kind of combined three different events into one
to make up a fairy.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Tale and then added weird stuff to it too, because
like the one thing we said, none of those three
stories have anything to do with Quakers. No, And they're
all dressed like Quakers, and you know, they still tell
us that Pilgrims and everything else. But I pretty much
grew up most of my life thinking they were Quakers
because they're freaking they look like the guy in the
Quaker outmill box exactly, but they're really puritant, and none
(40:33):
of them dressed like that.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
So I did find this that according to the guests
at the first Thanksgiving quote affair, and this was the
one that lasted three days, there was neither turkey nor
pumpkin pie. However, they did enjoy foods such as lobster, seal,
swan deer, along with bread, corn, and vegetables.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
Which sounds like I mean at that time and where
they're at, I mean, they're basically in Maine.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
It's quite a feast.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
I mean, it's quite a feast, but that sounds like
the food of that place. I mean, that's why I've
always been surprised, where like people, you know, you would
think that Thanksgiving would be less about like the turkey
and stuff more about your your local cuisine, which that
sounds like when you think of Maine, I mean besides
the deer, but I mean lobster and seafood sounds about right.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Yeah. And up there in the Pasacific Northwest, I would
imagine it would be some salmon involved.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
I don't know about the seal though, I mean some trout.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Well, I mean they're starving. They're gonna eat whatever whatever
they can get a hold of.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
What what seal? What tastes like a kind of fatty probably.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
So let's get into a little bit of conspiracy that
I have found that I thought that this was interesting
it it happened at Thanksgiving. So I don't think it's
actually a Thanksgiving conspiracy, but I found interesting that it
happened at Thanksgiving and it's still continuing to this day.
And this happened last year on November twenty third, twenty
(42:09):
twenty one. This is according to the Dallas Observer, that
there is an odd sect of QAnon followers that gathered
quote yet again in Dallas. So they've been doing it
for a while. It's this group called Negative forty eight,
and according to this article, they call it a French
q Andon group. And there's a.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Guy named the Negative forty eight.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
Yeah, and there's a guy named Michael Prattsman who is
the head of this. Anyway, they gather because they believe
that JFK, who was assassinated in Dallas in nineteen sixty three,
and his son, JFK Junior, who died in a plane
crash in nineteen ninety nine, we're going to reveal themselves
to the world after all these years. And on top
(42:53):
of that, JFK Junior would be Trump's vice president in
the twenty twenty four race. According to this it says
that obviously didn't happen, but they're planning to come back
this year. And I haven't seen a story yet about that.
And this article goes on to talk about the theories
of why they believe JFK Junior didn't actually die, that
(43:18):
he's still alive, and that John Kennedy obviously we've gone
over that JFK. There's a lot of people believe that
he's still alive. And I don't know how he could be.
Speaker 4 (43:31):
But he's partying with Elvis and all the other ones
that Jim Morrison and everybody else. Oh wait, Brando's still alive,
isn't he whatever.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
So anyway, if you happen to be in Dallas on
Thanksgiving and you're walking around around Daley Plaza and you
see a group of people with CES on their shirts
or or whatever, they're they're waiting for JFK and JFK
Junior to show up.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
What don't surprised me because when I was there in
last month, there was people like protesting no more nukes
ideally plause. Yeah, that's weird, Like it's twenty twenty two.
Like one of my friends was like, dude, maybe they
were like reenacting because you know when he was shot,
(44:25):
you know, was during the time of you know, there
was the you know, the Cuban missile crisis. I'm like,
one of them looked like a day, So they did
not look like a him or her. It was a day,
So I'm pretty sure that they weren't. They weren't reenacting something.
They were really like protesting no nukes. I'm like, it's
twenty twenty two. When's the last time we had a
problem with nukes.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
I don't know. I did find this interesting because and
I don't know how true this is, but this is
according to the San Francisco Chronicle and this history professor
Ken Albala. He says that Thanksgiving was a practice with
a far different intention and traditions than the gluttonous feast
(45:07):
we associate with the holiday today. He says, in fact,
the event we point to as the first Thanksgiving wasn't
even called as such. Well no kidding, yeah, He says,
actual Thanksgiving was an occasion for the Pilgrims, specifically the
more pious Puritans amongst them, to gather in a communal
day of fasting and meditation, to give thanks for a
(45:29):
bountiful harvest and reflect on how to improve upon their
shortcomings as individuals. So he's saying that it was actually
a day too fast and to.
Speaker 4 (45:39):
Meditate, and why did they have other lobsters.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
I don't know where he's getting that.
Speaker 4 (45:46):
And she'd be tough on that one, because there are
journal entries from people, some of the members of the
Plymouth Colony that flat out mentioned this and even tell
us the men you yes, so again, I told mean
they weren't eating it. They didn't put out all this
food and just ignore it.
Speaker 2 (46:07):
File that under the there are different people who have
different views. Yeah, and I don't know, there's no links
to his theory or any any kind of historical reference
that he gives, But that's his take on it. Maybe
he just doesn't like turkey and he wants to take
the day off.
Speaker 4 (46:26):
Just do what I do, eat the ham.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Also, according to this this other article, it says, can
you imagine trying to eat your entire Thanksgiving meal with
a spoon? Sounds rough, right, but knives and spoons where
all the pilgrims had to work with when they sat
down for that first three day meal.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
But if you think about the foods that we mentioned,
I mean, if you cook fish correctly, you really don't
need a fork, you know, Lobster you eat with your
hands anyway, because you got to snap it apart.
Speaker 2 (46:58):
I mean, I don't know. But why wouldn't they have forks?
Did they not invent They were invented obviously.
Speaker 4 (47:05):
I mean they were. I mean, they couldn't even forget
how to farm without the Native America telling them how.
Speaker 5 (47:10):
I mean, I mean when you look at it, when
you look at a pitchfork and say, hey, a much
smaller version of that would be really helpful about now probably,
But I mean, there's also a debate about part the
pardon turkey. Now, for those of you who aren't in
the United States, it's becoming this tradition every year that
(47:32):
the president, it's really dumb. They go out on like
the South Lawn or some part of the White House
and they prop this poor old turkey up on a
table and everybody gathers around the turkey, scared out of
its mind, and the President gives an official pardon to
the turkey, meaning it can't be killed, and then they
(47:55):
usher it off to some green pasture somewhere where it
can live live out the rest of its life. And
everyone collapsed, and it's become a big deal. I've never
understood it. I don't get it. I don't get it,
but it's just it's a press off.
Speaker 4 (48:09):
I guess, well, they didn't Obama, like it wasn't Obama
who like part in a toe turkey.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me. But here's
the history on that, because I did find it kind
of kind of interesting, even though I hate the whole thing.
Some historians think it started with Abraham Lincoln, who pardoned
a turkey intended for dinner. When his son Tad interceded
(48:39):
on his behalf. Tad admitted that the turkey's life was spared,
and I a lot of people say, well, it's he
was vegan or you know, he didn't want he didn't
like turkey, and so he's like, hey, don't kill the turkey.
We don't need a turkey. And his dad said, okay, whatever,
but he didn't officially part. There were no words like
(49:01):
I pardon you. President Harry Truman in the forties, they
believe that he may have pardoner turkey, but then of
course that never happened. It's a rumor, it's a myth
because they're trying to prop up some sort of event
in history to justify what's going on. Some believe JFK
(49:22):
John F. Kennedy partner Turkey. According to this, that said
who happened to be wearing a sign around his neck
that read good eaten, mister president just days before his assassination.
And I couldn't find any confirmation of that. However, the
credit actually belongs to George W. Bush. George H. W. Bush,
(49:42):
so that would be the first. George Bush. He began
the practice in nineteen eighty nine. According to the National
Turkey Federation, how'd you like to be the president of
that which raises birds for the presidential pardon ceremony? According
to this, the average Turkey doesn't have an exceptionally long
(50:03):
life and can expect to live only an additional two
or three years, even if given a reprieve by the president.
So we can think, George Herbert Walker Bush.
Speaker 4 (50:13):
They're basing there's a society that only raises birds for
this purpose.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
The National Turkey Federation raises birds solely for the president
to pardon it.
Speaker 4 (50:27):
So they're partying a bird that wasn't going to be
killed in anyway.
Speaker 2 (50:30):
In this article, they have a link to their page,
but it comes up not found. I don't even they
may not even have a page anymore. Wow, I thought
this was interesting. Just I'm gonna roll through some trivia here,
because everybody thinks that America and probably Canada, because they
have an official Thanksgiving and Turkey is part of their thanksgiving,
(50:52):
that we're all the big eaters of Turkey. No, according
to data from you US News and World Report, it's
actually Israel Israel, the average citizen enjoys a staggering one
hundred and twenty seven point two pounds of turkey annually. Wow,
(51:15):
the United States is an impressive one hundred and four
point nine pounds per person every year. So Israel, I
did not know that.
Speaker 4 (51:26):
I could see the American though, because like for me,
especially now, I mean, I probably eat more turkey than beef.
The only time I have anything like, you know, like
ground beef, as if I'm doing like actual hamburgers are
making a steak, I'll have beef. But other than that,
it usual almost everything I do is ground turkey.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
Here's another thing I did not know, and they don't
teach us this in school, nor did they bring it
up when they're talking about Thanksgiving. I can attest to
the fact that this may be true. The biggest drinking
night of the year in America is Thanksgiving Eve. According
(52:04):
to this, there is no other occasion that has bartenders
nationwide pouring more drinks than they do on the Wednesday
night before Thanksgiving. It's aptly named drinks Giving.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
Getting ready to deal with the family because I know,
for me, I freaking if I have to go, like
when we had to go to you know family, you
know Thanksgiving. When I first got married, I would take
four flasks.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
According to this, it brings in a one hundred and
sixty seven percent increase in alcohol sales compared to a
typical Wednesday night, and that's not counting what people are
buying and taking home goodness. Also interesting enough, according to
the plumbing company rote A Router, every year they nicknamed
(52:56):
the day after Thanksgiving Brown Friday. The company sees a
fifty percent increase in service calls and on average twenty
one percent increase in overall business compared with other holiday
weekends during the year.
Speaker 4 (53:14):
So there's a company, a job where you do not
get the day after.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Yeah, I think you're getting time and a half and
we probably should get.
Speaker 4 (53:22):
More, probably because everything all the crap raating.
Speaker 2 (53:27):
I wonder how Senko DeMaio compares to that. I know,
I know, and a lot of people don't celebrate that,
but I would think that would be close.
Speaker 4 (53:35):
Well, everyone celebrates it, celebrates it about the Mexicans.
Speaker 2 (53:39):
True, that true that.
Speaker 4 (53:41):
I've had a few of my friends that said that,
like their families in Mexico have no idea what Oh no.
Speaker 2 (53:48):
It's a it's a text mechs celebration. They do celebrate
it here San Antonio goes crazy, but in Mexico they
have no idea what we're talking about.
Speaker 4 (53:59):
This Also, people like, you know, they don't realize too
that sinco to mayo literally just means may the feed
in Spanish.
Speaker 2 (54:06):
People don't know that. No.
Speaker 4 (54:08):
I've had a few people like, when it's sinko to mayo,
it's made it fet That's exactly what I said. Sinco
to mayo is translates to may the fat.
Speaker 2 (54:20):
Oh my well, it has nothing to do with Mexican
independence either. So it was just a battle. It was
not we We just randomly threw a dart at Mexican
events and said that's it, sinko to myo. I thought
this was interesting as well. I did not know this
that the invention of the TV dinner was the result
(54:41):
of Thanksgiving leftovers. In nineteen fifty three, as a result
of an ordering miscalculation, food industry giant Swanson had a
post holiday surplus of two hundred and sixty tons of
frozen turkeys. Rather than throw it all out and take loss,
Swanson salesman Gary Thomas came up with what ultimately proved
(55:05):
to be a lucrative solution. Inspired by pre prepared meals
served by airlines, he ordered five thousand aluminum trays, organized
an assembly line of employees to fill them with turkey, peas,
corn bread, and sweet potatoes, and just like that, the
TV Dinner was born. Wow, I had no idea.
Speaker 4 (55:28):
That's insane.
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Getting back to a little bit of the history, the
writer of Mary Had a Little Lamb helped make Thanksgiving
a national holiday, Sarah Joseph Hale. According to history, for
the most of the eighteen hundreds, Thanksgiving was only celebrated
in the Northeast, and in eighteen forty six, Sarah Joseph
(55:49):
Hale wrote a nursery rhyme called Mary Had a Little Lamb.
She then wrote a letter to President Abraham Lincoln and
others in position of power or telling them to make
Thanksgiving a national holiday, and on October third, eighteen sixty three,
(56:10):
they paid off. So she was passionate about it. She was,
so there's a lot of weird things around this holiday
that I think a lot of us just take for granted.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
I think so. I think it's just been one of
those things we all thought, you know, the pilgrims landed
they met with the Indians. I mean the way that
we always kind of learned it was they just kind
of they landed, the Indians said, Hi, welcome to America.
Let's have some pood.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
The way they dressed, how it supposedly went down, that
it was this Kumbaya feast. The whole thing is mind
blowing in the way that it was presented, which is
why I say it's like a pro It's probably the
biggest propaganda holiday. We have. Not to get too conspiratorial
(57:01):
about it, but when you read and you know about propaganda,
oh yeah, and yeah, and how propaganda works, and how
this thing has evolved over time and from what actually
happened with people dying a massacre at you know, one
of the original supposed thanksgivings. There was no turkey involved.
(57:25):
The way the whole thing has evolved because I've been
to some people's houses where if you slightly divert from
the quote traditional meal, they freak out. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (57:37):
Oh, I've been no a few that are like that.
And I mean I've got other people that I know
that do primary like I said, we do Ham. We
don't even do a turkey.
Speaker 2 (57:45):
Yeah, most people, you know, Ham goes with Easter. We'll
have to deal with that when we get there. I
don't I've never understood that either, right, But anyway, hopefully
you enjoyed the little trip down the Thanksgiving story road.
It's interesting, it's fascinating, and it's kind of creepy. Honestly.
(58:09):
It's definitely not what we learned in school. I don't
even I don't know what they teach now in school
about Thanksgiving. I haven't watched a Thanksgiving quote special on TV.
I still like the Charlie Brown one, but.
Speaker 4 (58:19):
I think that gree might just skip over and talk
about Christmas.
Speaker 2 (58:22):
Oh yeah, there's no doubt about that. So I like
Thanksgiving personally. I like to be a grateful person. I'll
just say, in my house, we view it as a
time a gathering of friends and family and we share
a meal and were and we count our blessings. And
(58:42):
I think there's nothing wrong with that. And if they
had just set it up like that in the beginning,
I think that would have flourished more as a holiday.
Now it's a controversial holiday because we shouldn't even People
say we shouldn't even have it anymore because it's it's
genocide and it's a slaughter and it's it's a lie
and is this that and the other thing that's the
(59:04):
fault of the propagandas honestly it is.
Speaker 4 (59:07):
I mean, if they just go with like you said,
where it should be that we're thankful, you know, that's
the one thing that you know, like every once in
a while. I mean, I think this year, the last
couple of years we've kind of done it. We kind
of during COVID it didn't go as much, but we
do like a friends giving, which is just a bunch
of us friends get together and have a Thanksgiving dinner
and we'd all go around and say what we're thankful for,
(59:28):
And that's what it should be. It's what are we
thankful for? And me, I'll say this, I'm thankful for
the listeners.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
So, oh yes, we're thankful for you. We're thankful for
the fact that you have spent many hours with us.
A lot of you have been here since the beginning
and have emailed us, sent us paintings and drawings and
all kinds of suggestions, and we've had great conversations, and
(59:56):
so we are very grateful and thankful to you. Obviously,
if it wasn't for you, we'd just be talking into
the air and so we appreciate your feedback and always
your kind words. So I think with that, we're going
to wrap it up. I'll be with everybody on the midweek.
I'm looking forward to it. I've got three or four
I think very important topics rattling around. I don't know
(01:00:18):
if I'm going to zero in on one or just
try to tackle them all. But there's a lot going
on right now. Yes, and one of the top one
of the subjects I just give your heads up is
this FTX crypto thing that is way deeper than most
of you know about. And we may have to deep
(01:00:43):
dive into that because it goes all the way to
the World Economic Forum and it's amazing. So we'll be that.
I'll do that on Wednesday, and then we'll be back
next week. We'll have a great Thanksgiving Grandpa, take it.
Speaker 4 (01:00:57):
Easy, you too. I'm Big d I'm Brandon. We're out
of here, see you lady.
Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
Hi, everybody, it's me Cinderella. As you are listening to
the Fringe Radio Network. I know I was gonna tell him, Hey,
do you have the app? It's the best way to
listen to the Fringe Radio Network. It's safe, and you
don't have to log in to use it, and it
doesn't track you or trace you, and it sounds beautiful.
(01:01:31):
I know I was gonna tell him, how do you
get the app? Just go to fringeradionetwork dot com right
at the top of the page.
Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
I know, slippers, we gotta keep cleaning these chimneys.
Hi, everybody, it's me Cinderella Acts. You are listening to
the Fringe Radio Network. I know I was gonna tell them, Hey,
do you have the app? It's the best way to
listen to the Fringe Radio Network. It's safe and you
don't have to log in to use it, and it
doesn't track you or trace you, and it sounds beautiful.
(00:27):
I know I was gonna tell him, how do you
get the app?
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Just go to.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Fringeradionetwork dot com right at the top of the page.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I know, slippers, we gotta keep cleaning these chimneys.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Welcome everybody to NWCZ radio dot com Channel ones down
the rabbit Hole.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
My name is Big D and I'm Brandon, and it's
great to have everybody along.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I hope you're well. I guess we're going into winter.
Are we officially in winter yet? Or is that in December?
Speaker 4 (01:36):
I don't know, but it feels like it's freaking cold.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
It feels like it where I'm at as well. We're
like twenty twenty five degrees below normal right now. Usually
it's seventy and sunny, and it's been it's been rough,
but this is the week of Thanksgiving here in the
United States, and so I think it's important that we
take a true historical look at it. And you know what,
(01:59):
we're probably going to lose some listeners.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Probably we seem to run into a thing where some
of our listeners only like the truth when it doesn't
go against some of the stuff that they you know,
they believe.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
Hey, we sincerely appreciate all of you who listen because
we just hit another milestone, and we don't we don't
like to put our numbers out there or whatever. Just
know that you're part of a big family. Yes, and
we've had way more downloads than we ever imagine, so
we appreciate that, and we appreciate the fact that you listen.
(02:33):
And for those of you who have been with us
for a long time, thank you very much.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
Yes, And I mean, you know, for those that have
been for a long time, I hope that you know
I'm trying to fix the issues with the sound on
my episode. So I hope that the last couple of episodes
has been a little bit better. I mean, Big D
says they sound better on his end. If there's issues
once again, and let us know, I will work to
try and figure them out. I think I figured out
the issue we we are. We do try and you know,
(02:57):
we do listen, and we do try to make things
as good as we can.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
Speaking of listening, for those of you who have been
with us for a long time, we made a promise
way back in the beginning, yes, that we would never
take advertisements or advertising on this show. That's not something
we've ever wanted to do, much to my wife's dismay,
but we get emails fairly consistently from groups that we
(03:26):
don't solicit obviously, asking if they can advertise on our show.
And we got another one this week is that they
sent us three emails. Apparently they really liked the show
and we're not interested because I'd listen to podcasts, and
one thing I hate is when you're in the middle
(03:48):
of a podcast and they're strategic about it. Just when
it's getting to the point where they're about to, you know,
drop a bomb or get into something really interesting, it
goes into some dang commercial and it just you can't
skip ahead.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Now, and it drives me nuts. I do that too.
There's one of the one of the podcasts that I
listen to they have I timed it once it was
like almost four or five minutes of commercials in the
middle of their episodes, and it drives me nuts every time.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Sometimes it drives me so much I just turn it off,
and so then you lose a listener. And we don't
want to do that. We we just wanted to be
straight up and be honest with you. That's why we
don't have advertising. If we had a website or something,
we might consider it, but up to this point that's
just we're not gonna do that.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
So someday we might get a website. And if we
did the website, I could see putting stuff up there
and having maybe sponsor, you know, an affiliate links. But
I mean to every episode to talk, it's just yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
You will never ever hear us say this is sponsored
by whatever, or hey, go out and get this, because
it's just not gonna happen. But anyway, Also, speaking of email,
you can email us at down the RH at ProtonMail
dot com. Down the RH at ProtonMail dot com. And
(05:16):
of course, as always, thanks to Fringe Radio Network and
NWCZ Radio dot com Channel one.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Yes, thank you both for you know, putting us on
the show, putting us on the air.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
So this week, being that it's Thanksgiving, here in America.
I have to say that because see my wife's Canadian
and they have theirs in October. And we'll touch on
that a little bit later in the episode. But here
in America and most of our audience as American, and
(05:49):
even if you're not, I think you're gonna find this
interesting because there's a dark history, and there's some dark
corners around the Thanksgiving story that most people don't know,
and there's some conspiracy involved with Thanksgiving. Yep. So we're
going to try to tackle all that today's but first,
(06:09):
as usual, we need to back it up and get
into some of the history of this stuff. I know
that when I was going to school and when I
was young, we would see i'll just call them propaganda films.
That's what they were about Thanksgiving, about how the Pilgrims
(06:30):
got together with the Indians and had their little feast.
Then we would watch the Charlie Brown Thanksgiving. There would
usually be, you know, some other cartoon or kid oriented
show about Thanksgiving, and it was usually it's always around,
of course, having a turkey and dressing and stuffing and
(06:52):
people gathering around and giving thanks Is that was that
your experience growing.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Up pretty much I mean as much as I can remember.
I mean, it was kind of one of those things.
I mean, my family we did Thanksgiving, but I grew
up Mormons, We're huge. At anytime we had a family function,
I just wanted to crawl in her corner and die.
So I'm one of those ones like now, like Thanksgiving,
usually we just do something at home. We don't go anywhere.
(07:18):
We don't go to any family. This year, we might
go to my daughters just because you know, Big d
knows issues just had a baby today, so we might
go down to her so we can, you know, see
the baby, because hospitals are dumb.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
You buried the lead, I did, I did? You are
a grandpa, I am. I am so congratulations on that,
old man.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
Thank you. But I haven't been able to see her
yet because the hospitals they only allow two people to
come in. So that was my my wife and you know,
of course the father. We're the only ones that can
go into the hospital with her. So I have to
wait till they release her from the hospital to fly
and go see her.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
That's because you live in the separate country, Washington State.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
We do, we do, and they just freaking elected them
all back.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
I know my experience with Thanksgiving starts when I was
a kid and we actually had in school programs where
we would dress up and you would dress up. Some
would dress up as Pilgrims and some would dress up
as Indians or as we call now Native Americans. Somebody
(08:26):
would give a speech and it would be this shangri
law moment of coming together and being thankful for the
bounty and that they all had food. But that's not
what happened. No, so let's get into what actually happened,
because there's several Thanksgivings. That's the thing that I found
(08:50):
the most weird about this.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
There is because the one that we've all been taught
was the Plymouth, you know, the Pilgrims, which they weren't
even called the Pilgrim speaking with they were just called separatists.
But that's the one that we all learned about, and
that we all learned that that was the real, the
first Thanksgiving, but they really wasn't. There was ones before
that and a bunch after it.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
How it all started, and it is a worldwide thing.
It's basically because there are references to people in Spain
doing this. It was a celebration of the harvest. Harvest
is over, the storehouse, the warehouses and the storage houses
(09:36):
are full. The hard work is done. We're heading into winter,
and so we're going to have a big feast to
celebrate basically our bountiful harvest. And we invite all the
neighbors over or family or whatever, and everybody brings whatever
it is that they grew or if they hunted duck
(09:58):
or whatever they did. Everybody brought some. They came together.
It was a community meal to celebrate the fact that
they had, you know, made it through another harvest season
and hopefully there was an abundance heading into the winter.
Speaker 4 (10:14):
Yes, And I mean that's one thing like with Plymouth,
I mean that's how we all kind of learned it.
That it was this big thing of you know, but
the way they portrayed it that I remember it like
all of a sudden, it was like and this was
us coming in. This was like I mean, like the
Geneva connect convention that we had this huge like there
was these big problems between us, and then we came
(10:34):
together and had this big meal to to settle our
differences and blah blah blah and everything else.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
And it's like, now, no, the americanized version, which is
where we're going to really zero in here, actually starts
in England because, as we know everybody, all the early
settlers that came over here basically came from England. Yes, however,
(11:01):
this specific group went via Holland. They left England because
of the persecution of the king. And when I say persecution,
he was on them about everything, primarily religion and his dictats,
and if you didn't agree with him, he would hunt
(11:22):
you down, he would put you in jail, and sometimes
you would kill people over it.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Yeah, I mean he was very much you had to be.
I mean it was law that you had to go
to church. If you didn't go to church, you were
breaking the law. His church, Church of England, the Church
of England, which King James. That's where the King James
Bible comes from.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
And so they left and they went up to hang
out with the Dutch. They were looking for basically religious
freedom and a place to resettle and it kind of
worked out for a little bit, but then they heard
that they were sending the Mayflower over to this New Land,
(12:11):
and there was there was opportunity.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:15):
So I can't remember the exact number of people that
boarded it, but it was under two hundred I believe.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
I think it only ended up being about one hundred
and two.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Yeah, it was. I mean, when you think about how
big America is and how many people are here now,
just imagine a boat showing up in Plymouth, basically over
there on the East coast and one hundred and two people.
And it was brutal trip. They sat out in the
harbor in that boat for months after they arrived, because
(12:48):
the men rowed ashore just to check it out and
see what if there was anything worth sticking around for. Yeah,
and people who made the trip died on the boat
sitting in the harbor, never touched the America or the
New Land. Then when they got into when they finally
got onto the New Land, it's November.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
On the one thing too, I mean, honestly, if you
go through, I mean we're gonna because there's a lot
we have to go over, so we're kind of glossing
over it. There's a lot. There was technically two ships
begin with, and there's a whole bunch just between them
going to Amsterdam and coming here. I mean, we can
almost do an entire episode just on the way they
(13:30):
how they got to Plymouth.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Oh absolutely, Yes, it's a brutal story. No what it is.
I don't know how these people did it, honestly, and
I have I have a lot of admiration for their gumption.
But when they got here, the it was basically by
the time they ever got everybody onto shore, it was
(13:54):
heading into winter. Imagine showing up somewhere there's no buildings,
nobody to greet you, there's no houses, nothing's cleared away,
nothing zero. Yeah, and they had to quickly set up shop. Well,
(14:16):
the first winter, half of them died.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Yeah, I mean it was brutal. I mean brutal. I
mean it's one of those things if you look like,
you know, the winters in New England but with no houses.
I mean we already hear about when things happen in
New England and everything else, and people freezing to death
and all this stuff happening, and people completely don't think
(14:43):
about it. Forget about the fact that when these people
showed up, it was literally just they walked into a forest.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
And had no idea where the forest ended, where it started.
I mean it's brutal. Well, one of the people who
came over and he was basically they called him the
governor of the colony. His name was William Bradford, and
(15:11):
barely a mention of Bradford really comes up in US history,
and I'm not sure why, because there's a major lesson
that Bradford learned that we should all take heed of
to this day. The problem is is that in sixteen
twenty one, which is when everybody says, oh, it was
(15:32):
a bountiful harvest, and this is when the pilgrims helped
the new settlers plant and learn how to fish and everything,
actually it was not bountiful at all. And the colonists
who showed up they were kind of lazy and they
were thieves. And so what Bradford did was he set
(15:54):
up basically before Marx even thought of it, socialism. Yes,
And how they did this was nobody owned land, and
you work basically to your ability, and everything went in
to the community pot, all the food, all the housing
(16:16):
was distributed based upon need. Nobody owned anything. And it
was a massive failure because the young guys were getting
sick and tired of working, as they said, for other
men's wives and children, so they stopped producing. People were
griping about their living conditions as opposed to others living
(16:40):
conditions and on, and it was just it just unraveled. Yeah,
well he sat down and tried to figure out how
we're going to get out of this, because we're going
to starve or they're going to kill each other. Because
this is this is obviously not working. It sounds great
in theory, but it wasn't working because you had half
(17:02):
the men not doing anything, all the young guys working
their butts off, you had some women doing some things,
others not doing and then so they all just said, well,
why why am I doing this If I'm not even
benefiting from it? What's the point. So what he did
was he gave everybody a parcel of land and said,
this is your land. You can do on it whatever
(17:23):
you want. You can harvest, you can raise things, and
basically we're going to start free enterprise. You grow what
you need, and you grow anything more, you can barter it,
sell it whatever. And then it flourished. They had more
than they needed.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
And that's when these A lot of people don't point
that out. A lot of people will focus on the
fact that and see this as a way that, oh,
this is how socialism worked, and it's like, no, it
didn't if you actually looked at the history, it didn't work,
and they had to switch it to capitalism right.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Ay. They weren't adjusted to the weather, they didn't really
know how to grow crops. And that is where the Indians,
the Native Americans, came in and showed them, Hey, here's
how we do it. Here's what we grow here, here's
how you catch stuff out in the like out in
the lobster and cod out here in the bay. And
(18:23):
this will get you going in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Well, and there was one thing that I was reading
who said that. I think they said in the first month,
they hadn't killed any animal, they hadn't shot any animals,
and they caught one fish because they just had no
idea how to do any of this stuff until like that,
you know, Native Americans showed up and showed them how
and helped them. You know, there was one I couldn't
(18:46):
find it anywhere. I heard it on two different podcasts
that I was listening about Thanksgiving, but I couldn't find
it anywhere to prove it. But they said the first
Indian that met them walked up and said, hey, you
got any beer?
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Nice?
Speaker 4 (19:00):
But I kept trying to find that like in anything.
But yeah, I heard it in two different podcasts with
It's like oh yeah, because he knew English from eating
you know, trappers and stuff like that. And his first
words to them was hey, Hi, Hi, you got any beer?
Like that's pretty found the first you know, prime boy.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Yeah, yeah, grow some hops. We'll have it in a moment.
The sad truth about the what has been pointed out
in history, or at least the history books about this,
this three day feast that we've all learned about was
the first quote Thanksgiving feast. It was actually almost a
(19:36):
last supper because this was when the settlers were pretty
much decimated. They were barely hanging on. This is when
they were doing their shared sort of socialism experiment going on,
and they were heading into winter and they didn't know
(19:56):
how to store anything. Yeah, and so well they said,
we're going to have a big community meal and we're
going to invite our friends who have helped us out.
And it was kind of a come and go as
you will three It wasn't a it was not a
sit down at a big table event for three days.
(20:16):
It was food was put out. All the food was
put out on tables and everything for three days because
they they knew it was going to spoil, it was
going to rotten, whatever. So it was come get your
belly full, is really what it was. And it was
intended to basically not waste what they the little that
they had grown and kind of store up some fat
(20:40):
for the winter because we're not sure we're going to
make it, which is not what we learned at all.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
No, it was supposed it was a huge celebration, you know.
And the thing is too that the one thing you
know that a lot of people don't realize either, is
the only reason another settlement had already tried to settle
there and failed. They weren't even supposed to be there.
They were supposed to be farther north. They landed in
(21:07):
the wrong spot, which was one of those things that
kind of it gets really weird in the contract, the
contract that they were supposed to have to basically almost
be indentured servants by their original contract was basically broken
by them landing in the wrong spot. There's half the
people that were there weren't actually Puritans. Half of them
(21:30):
were just random people that they picked up on the
the you know, off the street, and like just put
them on the boat. Right, They basically did what the
Texas governor did. They said, hey, you're homeless, get on
the boat.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
We're taking you somewhere new.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
We're getting ready, and I mean that's what they did.
And I mean it was one of those things. There
was a few times they did that with boats where
it's like, oh, you're heading over to the New World. Here,
take these vagrants with you.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Right. That's why when they showed up here they realized
these guys were lazy, thieving people. For the most part.
It's almost like like when England sent all their riff
raff and jailbirds to Australia and said good luck.
Speaker 4 (22:08):
I still think that the Earth is the Australia of
the universe. But I think that's how we got started.
We were just, you know, our ancestors were just the
riff raff of the universe.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
University. Send them to that little marble over there.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
But it's one of those things that it really shows
like that we all believed that, you know, what we
were taught was it was just a group of Puritans,
like you know, you think it was just this big
group of happy people like ooh, we're going over there
and we're going to become you know, go to the
United States and it's like, no, it was a hellish time.
And half of them aren't even Puritans. They just they
didn't have anything else to do.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
Well. The other thing too, that I find just outrageous,
the idea of what the Puritans wore. We have in
our mind because we've been taught over and over that
they wore these black and white, these dresses with these big.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
Buckles, and they like the Quaker Omo guy exactly.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
And the men wore the big, you know, kind of
weird hat with the buckle on it, and they had
their muzzle. They didn't wear that at all. They wore
what they had when they loaded the boat. And that
was not part of the deal. Yeah, the propaganda of
this supposed Quaker group or the Pilgrims or whatever you
(23:31):
want to call this group of people that came over here.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
The Separatists, that's what they call it. That's what they
called him the time, a separatists because they were separating
from the Church of England, because they didn't recognize that
the Church of England was you know that they were real, right.
Speaker 2 (23:47):
But it wasn't until way later that they dug back
in history and found a small sect of these Quakers
who did dress like that, and they attributed it to everybody.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
Yeah, and I mean the thing was and really these
weren't even Quakers.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
They were Puritans, that's right.
Speaker 4 (24:06):
It was a completely different religious sect.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
So how this all got mismatched together is astounding.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Yeah, it is, and it would really if you look
at a lot of the other colonies, they all had
something similar to this Plymouth. For whatever reason, I don't
know why this is the one that they picked to
be considered the representation of Thanksgiving, because I mean, really,
it wasn't until I think George Washington said, you know,
seventeen eighty nine was the first Thanksgiving, because there was
(24:35):
a second Thanksgiving too that was horrible. And I know
one of the things too, is the way that they
everything was cleared for them basically to have places to stay,
and everything was because an entire tribe had been wiped
out by smallpox. And when that tribe got wiped out
by smallpox, when the first thing that the settlers did
when they showed up was to basically raid the gray
(25:00):
of both them and the settlers had been before them.
They raised raided the graves of those settlers and the
Native Americans and then also used their huts to survive it.
So they basically lived off the you know, like yeah,
grave robbers, total grave robbers and everything else. I mean,
there's a lot of things about this group that was
(25:21):
quite interesting to learn.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Another reference to Thanksgiving was in sixteen thirty seven, and
some people pointing back to this as the true origin
of Thanksgiving where Massachusetts Bay Colony Governor John Winthrop.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
That's what they Yeah, they called a second but in
some say it's the first and the second.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
So right, he declared a day to celebrate soldiers who
had just killed hundreds of Pequat men and women and
children in what is now called Mystic Connecticut. Now, depending
upon which account you read of that, there's three or
four or five different angles to that story, and depending
(26:05):
on which one you pick up, you're going to get
a whole different version of it. Essentially what happened, just
without any political interpretation or just the facts. Man, what
happened was there was the settlers were sort of friendly
with the natives, and you had some riff raff in
(26:31):
the settlers. They were in fighting, the natives were infighting
with themselves and other tribes. Each were blaming each other
for the problems. I don't know who fired the first shot.
I don't know if anybody does, but they started raiding
each other. Then there was an interpreter who was a
(26:55):
Native American who brought word to the settlers that there
was a raid coming. So they decided to preempt it,
and they were first to go, and they they did.
They wiped out quite a few of these Native Americans.
And whether that's good or bad, I don't know. They
(27:17):
were just they were trying to survive and they thought
they were about to be raided. It's war, that's what
it was. And there were there's plenty of blame on
all sides. But again, like I said, depending on who
you're which when you're reading, it's either all the settler's fault,
or it's all the Native American's fault, or it goes
(27:39):
in many different directions. Now I wasn't there, You weren't there.
There's very little recorded about it, and so it's basically,
how do you want to interpret this event? Regardless this
John Winthrop, because they were the winners, declared it a
day of Thanksgiving essentially because they were alive. Yeah, and
(28:04):
then there was Abraham Lincoln.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
Well, even before him, there was George Washington in seventeen
eighty nine.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
Oh that's true.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Yep, you said the first Thanksgiving proclation by the national
government of the United States, and that was in seventeen
eighty nine, correct, But it doesn't say really. I was
reading some things and it's like that, there's nothing that
really says why.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
I think they were just looking for a reason to party, Yeah,
to celebrate, because Lincoln brought it up, and then there
was Franklin delan of Roosevelt brought it up. It's been
changed over time as to which Thursday it is it
used to be. It's been all different kind of thursdays.
Speaker 4 (28:52):
Yeah, And I noticed like in eighteen seventeen, even before
Abraham Lincoln, New York and a couple other states made
a holiday a Thanksgiving holiday, but they had different days
everything else. And then like we said, you know, all
of a sudden, Abraham Lincoln said, nope, this is what
we're going to do. And like I said, Franklin d.
(29:12):
Roosebarg changed the day. So it's kind of moved around.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
Yeah, according to this, Franklin delan Or Roosevelt signed the
bill in nineteen forty one, it was actually on December
twenty sixth, so they were actually doing work through Christmas,
so go figure. He made it a matter of federal law,
fixing the day as the fourth Thursday of November, and
then according to this article, for several years. Some states
(29:37):
continue to observe the last Thursday dates in years with
five November or five Thursdays in November, such as nineteen
forty four, with Texas doing so as late as nineteen
fifty six. It was not without controversy though, when Franklin
Roosevelt first brought it up, twenty three states went along
(29:59):
with it. In twenty did not and couldn't decide on
which day and whether it would be a government holiday
or not.
Speaker 4 (30:07):
Wow, And now it's technically the most place it's a
government holiday both Thursday and Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Correct, because you got to go shopping. It's the only
day you get paid to go shopping if you actually
get out on Black Friday.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
And a lot of company our stores have stopped doing
Black Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
I've noticed that. I have noticed that, well, most things
have moved online and it got so crazy.
Speaker 4 (30:31):
Well, I think some of them still do. One of
the big things that they started doing. For a while,
there was Thursday afternoon, like Thursday evenings, so they're pre
brought black Friday.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
And I'm like that your mind, Yeah, that's that's crazy.
I'm watching.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
I hate shopping.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
There's multiple facets to this Thanksgiving story, and none of
them are concrete now as far as this is the
beginning or this is the Thanksgiving arena, And that's the
fascinating thing to me, because I do believe, if you
(31:07):
really want to get down to the brass knuckles of
this thing, it's probably the most propagandistic holiday we have. Yeah,
because what they've told us about it's not true. The
initial feast and in fact, all the early feasts with
the settlers over here, it did not contain turkey or
(31:28):
stuffing or mashed potatoes, probably not gravy. It was way
more vegetables, seafood. And if they had any kind of
bird at all, it was a most likely pheasant or
some sort of you know, duck. Maybe there was a
some wild turkey. And I'm not talking about the drink.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Hey man, you gotta do what you do, you gotta
do to get through Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Maybe they did, maybe they maybe they did make beer.
I don't know, but from all accounts, some of them
did have journals back then that were found and they
list the food off and it's not what we think
of as Thanksgiving now today.
Speaker 4 (32:10):
But I mean, I'll be honest, most of the menu
sounds much better than what we supposed to Thanksgiving, like
the sweet potatoes, sweet yams, all that stuff. No, for me,
ham potatoes, I would be happy with. Lobster. Lobster and
cod would be amazing for Thanksgiving. I could get behind
that holiday.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah. I tried to look up when that all sort
of became a thing. The closest I could come as
far as dates and stuff. There's a lot of stats
on how much turkey is eaten, how much you know,
gravy is made, and all of that kind of stuff.
But as far as dates, like when this all kind
(32:50):
of became a thing, I couldn't find it. I did
find this though, that if you're really big into the
green bean castle role, it was invented by an employee
of the Campbell Soup Company in nineteen fifty five.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well, like I said, for me, and it's funny because
it used to be a big problem because like my family,
I'm the only one in my family who doesn't like turkey.
So I don't like turkey. I don't like just cooked
bird like turkey for like sandwich meat fine, but like turkey,
just a cooked bird. So it used to be a problem,
(33:24):
like with my family, I won't eat the turkey. So
of course everyone's like, well what will you you know,
so they had to make a ham specifically for me
because I won't eat the turkey. But then it became
like this huge issue and I'm like, I'm not asking
you to make the ham. I'm not telling you to
make the ham. You're the one choosing because I won't
eat the turkey.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
According to this, it says mashed potatoes, gravy stuffing, sweet potatoes,
cranberry sauce, sweet corn ball, vegetables, squash, Brussels sprouts, pumpkin
pie are among the side dishes commonly associated with Thanksgiving.
All of these are actually native to the Americas, or
we're introduced as new food source to the Europeans when
(34:02):
they arrived. Turkey may be the exception. Nathaniel Philbrick in
his book Mayflower, suggests that the Pilgrims might have already
been familiar with Turkey and England even though the bird
is basically native to America. The Spaniards had brought some
domesticated turkeys from Central America in the seventeenth century, and
they became popular all over Europe, including England. But again,
(34:26):
if you read the accounts of what they put out
on the table, because things were so sparse and there
wasn't even a lot of meat. Actually there was more
like venison and seafood.
Speaker 4 (34:39):
It seemed like venison seafood, and a lot of crops
like corn and stuff like that. Because one thing a
lot of people don't think about too, is when they
showed up. Like I said, there was an entire village
that was wiped out from smallpox years prior, but it
wasn't a lot of years prior, so a lot of
like the cornfields and stuff were already still there. They
(35:00):
just had to, you know, plow them, plow them over
and start over again. But they were already there and
ready to go.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Right, And they didn't think ahead enough to figure out
how to store this stuff.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
Well, from some of the stuff I read too, they
didn't even they weren't really even a farmer's group, like
they weren't they want it all, They had no idea
how to live on this stuff. They just thought they'd
show up and figure it out. And it's like, no,
life was a lot harder for them than they thought.
I think they thought it was going to be a
lot easier when they got here. I think, you know,
(35:33):
it just it did not go the way they thought
it was.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Oh, for sure, they were told it's the land of
milk and honey, and you're going to go prosper and
you can have all the lands you want. It's just
going to be awesome. And if they had shown up,
probably in say April or May, they may have had
that thought. But they showed up in November now on
the East coast, which is brutal.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
Even if they showed up in April and May, they
just would have been beat by the heat because they
had no idea how to do any of this stuff.
They didn't know how to plant crops. I mean, if
it hadn't been for you know, Squanto and I can't
remember the other guy's name, if they hadn't showed up
and started talking to them, I.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Know, they would have all died. Yeah, they would have
all died.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
They had no idea what they were doing. It'd be
like taking you know, someone who lives in Seattle right
now and just dropping them out in the middle of
you know, the Mountaineer National Forest with nothing and say survived.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
There is a couple of thoughts that Canada actually hosted
the first Thanksgiving.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
No way, Canada can't do anything like that.
Speaker 2 (36:36):
According to CNN, and take that as you will. But
according to CNN, Canada was host to the actual first Thanksgiving.
The claim in question refers to the arrival of English
explorer Martin Frobisher and his crew to Canada in fifteen
seventy eight, which it wasn't Canada at the time, but
(36:58):
you know what I'm saying. They were happy to be
on dry land. They celebrated with a feast of beef, mushy,
peas and crackers so British. And whether or not it
was called Thanksgiving, it's still up for debate. But it
was a thankful meal and they marked it down.
Speaker 4 (37:17):
But it's one of those things, I mean, really, if
you look at Thanksgiving where it falls, I mean, you
go back to ancient times, Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, all beasts
and pay tribute to the gods after the fall harvest,
and really, isn't that what Thanksgiving is.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
It's morphed over the years.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
Obviously, they say it has a lot of reseemblance to
the ancient Jewish harvest festival of second.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Yeah, I think it's just a harvest. It is a
harvest celebration. It's a bountiful celebration where you give thanks,
whether it's to the gods or to your family, or
to God or however you see it. Now, that's why
I don't understand why in America we had to They
felt the need to pick one, two or three events
(38:03):
and nobody can quite figure out which one it is,
and then attribute all this nonsense to it, like what
the Quakers wore, that it was this great unifying event
between the natives and these settlers, even though it was
basically almost like a death meal.
Speaker 4 (38:22):
But then, like you said, I mean, it's one of
those things. I mean they basically attributed to Quakers, but
none of the three stories that they really point out
are Quakers.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
Here's another one out of Canada that I thought was
interesting in the file of maybe it started in Canada
because according to this, Canada observes their Thanksgiving on the
second Monday of every October. And if you're Canadian or
have any Canadian relatives. You know this, and it is
because in eighteen seventy two, the Prince of Wales got
(38:53):
medical recovery and Canada wanted to celebrate and it became
a national holiday to give thanks. Know how many Canadians
know that basically your Thanksgiving originally was to give thanks
for the recovery of the Prince of Wales over in England.
Speaker 4 (39:13):
So wown.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
So I don't even know. I'd be shocked to if
many Canadians even knew that.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
Probably not. I mean, it's one of those things. I
think a lot of these holidays. We celebrate them and
we have what we're told they're supposed to be, and
then once you do the research, you're like, oh wait
a minute. You know, it's like when we've gone down
you know, Christmas and Easter and everything else where. They
do have some background in like pagan religions and stuff
like that, but it's also the Christianity. It gets weird.
(39:45):
You know, We've talked about them on you know, past episodes,
but with this one, it's really weird because, like you said,
there's three or four that you can really point out.
They say that's where it seems to come from. But
none of them fully fit.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
No, because we're given these pictures and we're giving the stories,
but they've kind of combined three different events into one
to make up a fairy.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
Tale and then added weird stuff to it too, because
like the one thing we said, none of those three
stories have anything to do with Quakers. No, And they're
all dressed like Quakers, and you know, they still tell
us that Pilgrims and everything else. But I pretty much
grew up most of my life thinking they were Quakers
because they're freaking they look like the guy in the
Quaker outmill box exactly, but they're really puritant, and none
(40:33):
of them dressed like that.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
So I did find this that according to the guests
at the first Thanksgiving quote affair, and this was the
one that lasted three days, there was neither turkey nor
pumpkin pie. However, they did enjoy foods such as lobster, seal,
swan deer, along with bread, corn, and vegetables.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
Which sounds like I mean at that time and where
they're at, I mean, they're basically in Maine.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
It's quite a feast.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
I mean, it's quite a feast, but that sounds like
the food of that place. I mean, that's why I've
always been surprised, where like people, you know, you would
think that Thanksgiving would be less about like the turkey
and stuff more about your your local cuisine, which that
sounds like when you think of Maine, I mean besides
the deer, but I mean lobster and seafood sounds about right.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Yeah. And up there in the Pasacific Northwest, I would
imagine it would be some salmon involved.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
I don't know about the seal though, I mean some trout.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Well, I mean they're starving. They're gonna eat whatever whatever
they can get a hold of.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
What what seal? What tastes like a kind of fatty probably.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
So let's get into a little bit of conspiracy that
I have found that I thought that this was interesting
it it happened at Thanksgiving. So I don't think it's
actually a Thanksgiving conspiracy, but I found interesting that it
happened at Thanksgiving and it's still continuing to this day.
And this happened last year on November twenty third, twenty
(42:09):
twenty one. This is according to the Dallas Observer, that
there is an odd sect of QAnon followers that gathered
quote yet again in Dallas. So they've been doing it
for a while. It's this group called Negative forty eight,
and according to this article, they call it a French
q Andon group. And there's a.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Guy named the Negative forty eight.
Speaker 2 (42:32):
Yeah, and there's a guy named Michael Prattsman who is
the head of this. Anyway, they gather because they believe
that JFK, who was assassinated in Dallas in nineteen sixty three,
and his son, JFK Junior, who died in a plane
crash in nineteen ninety nine, we're going to reveal themselves
to the world after all these years. And on top
(42:53):
of that, JFK Junior would be Trump's vice president in
the twenty twenty four race. According to this it says
that obviously didn't happen, but they're planning to come back
this year. And I haven't seen a story yet about that.
And this article goes on to talk about the theories
of why they believe JFK Junior didn't actually die, that
(43:18):
he's still alive, and that John Kennedy obviously we've gone
over that JFK. There's a lot of people believe that
he's still alive. And I don't know how he could be.
Speaker 4 (43:31):
But he's partying with Elvis and all the other ones
that Jim Morrison and everybody else. Oh wait, Brando's still alive,
isn't he whatever.
Speaker 2 (43:44):
So anyway, if you happen to be in Dallas on
Thanksgiving and you're walking around around Daley Plaza and you
see a group of people with CES on their shirts
or or whatever, they're they're waiting for JFK and JFK
Junior to show up.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
What don't surprised me because when I was there in
last month, there was people like protesting no more nukes
ideally plause. Yeah, that's weird, Like it's twenty twenty two.
Like one of my friends was like, dude, maybe they
were like reenacting because you know when he was shot,
(44:25):
you know, was during the time of you know, there
was the you know, the Cuban missile crisis. I'm like,
one of them looked like a day, So they did
not look like a him or her. It was a day,
So I'm pretty sure that they weren't. They weren't reenacting something.
They were really like protesting no nukes. I'm like, it's
twenty twenty two. When's the last time we had a
problem with nukes.
Speaker 2 (44:46):
I don't know. I did find this interesting because and
I don't know how true this is, but this is
according to the San Francisco Chronicle and this history professor
Ken Albala. He says that Thanksgiving was a practice with
a far different intention and traditions than the gluttonous feast
(45:07):
we associate with the holiday today. He says, in fact,
the event we point to as the first Thanksgiving wasn't
even called as such. Well no kidding, yeah, He says,
actual Thanksgiving was an occasion for the Pilgrims, specifically the
more pious Puritans amongst them, to gather in a communal
day of fasting and meditation, to give thanks for a
(45:29):
bountiful harvest and reflect on how to improve upon their
shortcomings as individuals. So he's saying that it was actually
a day too fast and to.
Speaker 4 (45:39):
Meditate, and why did they have other lobsters.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
I don't know where he's getting that.
Speaker 4 (45:46):
And she'd be tough on that one, because there are
journal entries from people, some of the members of the
Plymouth Colony that flat out mentioned this and even tell
us the men you yes, so again, I told mean
they weren't eating it. They didn't put out all this
food and just ignore it.
Speaker 2 (46:07):
File that under the there are different people who have
different views. Yeah, and I don't know, there's no links
to his theory or any any kind of historical reference
that he gives, But that's his take on it. Maybe
he just doesn't like turkey and he wants to take
the day off.
Speaker 4 (46:26):
Just do what I do, eat the ham.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Also, according to this this other article, it says, can
you imagine trying to eat your entire Thanksgiving meal with
a spoon? Sounds rough, right, but knives and spoons where
all the pilgrims had to work with when they sat
down for that first three day meal.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
But if you think about the foods that we mentioned,
I mean, if you cook fish correctly, you really don't
need a fork, you know, Lobster you eat with your
hands anyway, because you got to snap it apart.
Speaker 2 (46:58):
I mean, I don't know. But why wouldn't they have forks?
Did they not invent They were invented obviously.
Speaker 4 (47:05):
I mean they were. I mean, they couldn't even forget
how to farm without the Native America telling them how.
Speaker 5 (47:10):
I mean, I mean when you look at it, when
you look at a pitchfork and say, hey, a much
smaller version of that would be really helpful about now probably,
But I mean, there's also a debate about part the
pardon turkey. Now, for those of you who aren't in
the United States, it's becoming this tradition every year that
(47:32):
the president, it's really dumb. They go out on like
the South Lawn or some part of the White House
and they prop this poor old turkey up on a
table and everybody gathers around the turkey, scared out of
its mind, and the President gives an official pardon to
the turkey, meaning it can't be killed, and then they
(47:55):
usher it off to some green pasture somewhere where it
can live live out the rest of its life. And
everyone collapsed, and it's become a big deal. I've never
understood it. I don't get it. I don't get it,
but it's just it's a press off.
Speaker 4 (48:09):
I guess, well, they didn't Obama, like it wasn't Obama
who like part in a toe turkey.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me. But here's
the history on that, because I did find it kind
of kind of interesting, even though I hate the whole thing.
Some historians think it started with Abraham Lincoln, who pardoned
a turkey intended for dinner. When his son Tad interceded
(48:39):
on his behalf. Tad admitted that the turkey's life was spared,
and I a lot of people say, well, it's he
was vegan or you know, he didn't want he didn't
like turkey, and so he's like, hey, don't kill the turkey.
We don't need a turkey. And his dad said, okay, whatever,
but he didn't officially part. There were no words like
(49:01):
I pardon you. President Harry Truman in the forties, they
believe that he may have pardoner turkey, but then of
course that never happened. It's a rumor, it's a myth
because they're trying to prop up some sort of event
in history to justify what's going on. Some believe JFK
(49:22):
John F. Kennedy partner Turkey. According to this, that said
who happened to be wearing a sign around his neck
that read good eaten, mister president just days before his assassination.
And I couldn't find any confirmation of that. However, the
credit actually belongs to George W. Bush. George H. W. Bush,
(49:42):
so that would be the first. George Bush. He began
the practice in nineteen eighty nine. According to the National
Turkey Federation, how'd you like to be the president of
that which raises birds for the presidential pardon ceremony? According
to this, the average Turkey doesn't have an exceptionally long
(50:03):
life and can expect to live only an additional two
or three years, even if given a reprieve by the president.
So we can think, George Herbert Walker Bush.
Speaker 4 (50:13):
They're basing there's a society that only raises birds for
this purpose.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
The National Turkey Federation raises birds solely for the president
to pardon it.
Speaker 4 (50:27):
So they're partying a bird that wasn't going to be
killed in anyway.
Speaker 2 (50:30):
In this article, they have a link to their page,
but it comes up not found. I don't even they
may not even have a page anymore. Wow, I thought
this was interesting. Just I'm gonna roll through some trivia here,
because everybody thinks that America and probably Canada, because they
have an official Thanksgiving and Turkey is part of their thanksgiving,
(50:52):
that we're all the big eaters of Turkey. No, according
to data from you US News and World Report, it's
actually Israel Israel, the average citizen enjoys a staggering one
hundred and twenty seven point two pounds of turkey annually. Wow,
(51:15):
the United States is an impressive one hundred and four
point nine pounds per person every year. So Israel, I
did not know that.
Speaker 4 (51:26):
I could see the American though, because like for me,
especially now, I mean, I probably eat more turkey than beef.
The only time I have anything like, you know, like
ground beef, as if I'm doing like actual hamburgers are
making a steak, I'll have beef. But other than that,
it usual almost everything I do is ground turkey.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
Here's another thing I did not know, and they don't
teach us this in school, nor did they bring it
up when they're talking about Thanksgiving. I can attest to
the fact that this may be true. The biggest drinking
night of the year in America is Thanksgiving Eve. According
(52:04):
to this, there is no other occasion that has bartenders
nationwide pouring more drinks than they do on the Wednesday
night before Thanksgiving. It's aptly named drinks Giving.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
Getting ready to deal with the family because I know,
for me, I freaking if I have to go, like
when we had to go to you know family, you
know Thanksgiving. When I first got married, I would take
four flasks.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
According to this, it brings in a one hundred and
sixty seven percent increase in alcohol sales compared to a
typical Wednesday night, and that's not counting what people are
buying and taking home goodness. Also interesting enough, according to
the plumbing company rote A Router, every year they nicknamed
(52:56):
the day after Thanksgiving Brown Friday. The company sees a
fifty percent increase in service calls and on average twenty
one percent increase in overall business compared with other holiday
weekends during the year.
Speaker 4 (53:14):
So there's a company, a job where you do not
get the day after.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Yeah, I think you're getting time and a half and
we probably should get.
Speaker 4 (53:22):
More, probably because everything all the crap raating.
Speaker 2 (53:27):
I wonder how Senko DeMaio compares to that. I know,
I know, and a lot of people don't celebrate that,
but I would think that would be close.
Speaker 4 (53:35):
Well, everyone celebrates it, celebrates it about the Mexicans.
Speaker 2 (53:39):
True, that true that.
Speaker 4 (53:41):
I've had a few of my friends that said that,
like their families in Mexico have no idea what Oh no.
Speaker 2 (53:48):
It's a it's a text mechs celebration. They do celebrate
it here San Antonio goes crazy, but in Mexico they
have no idea what we're talking about.
Speaker 4 (53:59):
This Also, people like, you know, they don't realize too
that sinco to mayo literally just means may the feed
in Spanish.
Speaker 2 (54:06):
People don't know that. No.
Speaker 4 (54:08):
I've had a few people like, when it's sinko to mayo,
it's made it fet That's exactly what I said. Sinco
to mayo is translates to may the fat.
Speaker 2 (54:20):
Oh my well, it has nothing to do with Mexican
independence either. So it was just a battle. It was
not we We just randomly threw a dart at Mexican
events and said that's it, sinko to myo. I thought
this was interesting as well. I did not know this
that the invention of the TV dinner was the result
(54:41):
of Thanksgiving leftovers. In nineteen fifty three, as a result
of an ordering miscalculation, food industry giant Swanson had a
post holiday surplus of two hundred and sixty tons of
frozen turkeys. Rather than throw it all out and take loss,
Swanson salesman Gary Thomas came up with what ultimately proved
(55:05):
to be a lucrative solution. Inspired by pre prepared meals
served by airlines, he ordered five thousand aluminum trays, organized
an assembly line of employees to fill them with turkey, peas,
corn bread, and sweet potatoes, and just like that, the
TV Dinner was born. Wow, I had no idea.
Speaker 4 (55:28):
That's insane.
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Getting back to a little bit of the history, the
writer of Mary Had a Little Lamb helped make Thanksgiving
a national holiday, Sarah Joseph Hale. According to history, for
the most of the eighteen hundreds, Thanksgiving was only celebrated
in the Northeast, and in eighteen forty six, Sarah Joseph
(55:49):
Hale wrote a nursery rhyme called Mary Had a Little Lamb.
She then wrote a letter to President Abraham Lincoln and
others in position of power or telling them to make
Thanksgiving a national holiday, and on October third, eighteen sixty three,
(56:10):
they paid off. So she was passionate about it. She was,
so there's a lot of weird things around this holiday
that I think a lot of us just take for granted.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
I think so. I think it's just been one of
those things we all thought, you know, the pilgrims landed
they met with the Indians. I mean the way that
we always kind of learned it was they just kind
of they landed, the Indians said, Hi, welcome to America.
Let's have some pood.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
The way they dressed, how it supposedly went down, that
it was this Kumbaya feast. The whole thing is mind
blowing in the way that it was presented, which is
why I say it's like a pro It's probably the
biggest propaganda holiday. We have. Not to get too conspiratorial
(57:01):
about it, but when you read and you know about propaganda,
oh yeah, and yeah, and how propaganda works, and how
this thing has evolved over time and from what actually
happened with people dying a massacre at you know, one
of the original supposed thanksgivings. There was no turkey involved.
(57:25):
The way the whole thing has evolved because I've been
to some people's houses where if you slightly divert from
the quote traditional meal, they freak out. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (57:37):
Oh, I've been no a few that are like that.
And I mean I've got other people that I know
that do primary like I said, we do Ham. We
don't even do a turkey.
Speaker 2 (57:45):
Yeah, most people, you know, Ham goes with Easter. We'll
have to deal with that when we get there. I
don't I've never understood that either, right, But anyway, hopefully
you enjoyed the little trip down the Thanksgiving story road.
It's interesting, it's fascinating, and it's kind of creepy. Honestly.
(58:09):
It's definitely not what we learned in school. I don't
even I don't know what they teach now in school
about Thanksgiving. I haven't watched a Thanksgiving quote special on TV.
I still like the Charlie Brown one, but.
Speaker 4 (58:19):
I think that gree might just skip over and talk
about Christmas.
Speaker 2 (58:22):
Oh yeah, there's no doubt about that. So I like
Thanksgiving personally. I like to be a grateful person. I'll
just say, in my house, we view it as a
time a gathering of friends and family and we share
a meal and were and we count our blessings. And
(58:42):
I think there's nothing wrong with that. And if they
had just set it up like that in the beginning,
I think that would have flourished more as a holiday.
Now it's a controversial holiday because we shouldn't even People
say we shouldn't even have it anymore because it's it's
genocide and it's a slaughter and it's it's a lie
and is this that and the other thing that's the
(59:04):
fault of the propagandas honestly it is.
Speaker 4 (59:07):
I mean, if they just go with like you said,
where it should be that we're thankful, you know, that's
the one thing that you know, like every once in
a while. I mean, I think this year, the last
couple of years we've kind of done it. We kind
of during COVID it didn't go as much, but we
do like a friends giving, which is just a bunch
of us friends get together and have a Thanksgiving dinner
and we'd all go around and say what we're thankful for,
(59:28):
And that's what it should be. It's what are we
thankful for? And me, I'll say this, I'm thankful for
the listeners.
Speaker 2 (59:34):
So, oh yes, we're thankful for you. We're thankful for
the fact that you have spent many hours with us.
A lot of you have been here since the beginning
and have emailed us, sent us paintings and drawings and
all kinds of suggestions, and we've had great conversations, and
(59:56):
so we are very grateful and thankful to you. Obviously,
if it wasn't for you, we'd just be talking into
the air and so we appreciate your feedback and always
your kind words. So I think with that, we're going
to wrap it up. I'll be with everybody on the midweek.
I'm looking forward to it. I've got three or four
I think very important topics rattling around. I don't know
(01:00:18):
if I'm going to zero in on one or just
try to tackle them all. But there's a lot going
on right now. Yes, and one of the top one
of the subjects I just give your heads up is
this FTX crypto thing that is way deeper than most
of you know about. And we may have to deep
(01:00:43):
dive into that because it goes all the way to
the World Economic Forum and it's amazing. So we'll be that.
I'll do that on Wednesday, and then we'll be back
next week. We'll have a great Thanksgiving Grandpa, take it.
Speaker 4 (01:00:57):
Easy, you too. I'm Big d I'm Brandon. We're out
of here, see you lady.
Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
Hi, everybody, it's me Cinderella. As you are listening to
the Fringe Radio Network. I know I was gonna tell him, Hey,
do you have the app? It's the best way to
listen to the Fringe Radio Network. It's safe, and you
don't have to log in to use it, and it
doesn't track you or trace you, and it sounds beautiful.
(01:01:31):
I know I was gonna tell him, how do you
get the app? Just go to fringeradionetwork dot com right
at the top of the page.
Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
I know, slippers, we gotta keep cleaning these chimneys.
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