Inspire Change SEASON 7-308 Why Go Back to University Now?

This week on Inspire Change...Gunter opens the conversation on Why Go Back to University Now? His journey going back to the university for his PhD.

 #InspireChange #Philosophy #Science #Reflection #Contemplation #SelfDevelopment #Masculinity #MakingGoodMenGreat #stoicism 

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Hello to all our listeners, We thank YOU for tuning in and promoting positive social change.  This makes you a part of Gunter’s efforts in transforming not only men's lives but lives in general and we are grateful you have joined us.   This week we are thrilled to announce that Ethiopia was #20 on our global listeners list, specifically in Addis Ababa (a-duhs-ah-buuh-baa)! CONGRATULATIONS!!! 
We appreciate your efforts to support positive social change! Thank you for joining Africa's efforts of inspiring Positive Social Change.  Next we take a look at the USA, lets congratulate our listeners in Magee (muh-GHEE), Mississippi for bringing your state to #10 on the USA Top listeners list. CONGRATULATIONS!!!  I, DeVonna Prinzi the Co-Exec Producer and our Show-runner Miranda Spigener-Sapon sincerely thank you and ask that you please take the time to like, follow, subscribe, and share as your efforts make a difference to everyone here at Inspire Change with Gunter.
Please remember If you want to share your story of social change, feel free to reach out  to the show directly. Please see the show-notes for our contact information. As always thank you to each and every one of our listeners, and most importantly please keep Inspiring positive social change.



Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/inspire-change-with-gunter--3633478/support.

Gunter Swoboda and Lorin Josephson's neo-noir/supernatural thriller novel Amulets of Power, Book I A Brian Poole Mystery is officially ON SALE EVERYWHERE you like to get book, but if you want a discount please consider ording direct. ANY LISTENER who order's direct will get a surprise gift. https://shop.ingramspark.com/b/084?params=3RoOA6kVQ7ZgmqSK9LdnvNyDAZZFsg9IMaLUaprPgXK

Make sure you LIKE SUBSCRIBE & FOLLOW our new Official YouTube Channel of Video Shorts series: https://www.youtube.com/@InspireChangewithGunterSwoboda/videos where we will be adding new videos and content every week from Gunter and our guests.  https://www.youtube.com/@InspireChangewithGunterSwoboda/videos

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, listeners, it's good to siboa here with some exciting news.
We're on the lookout for sponsors to join us on
our incredible journey with Inspired Change with Conta. If your
organization cares deeply about meaningful conversations around masculinity, self development,
and mental health, we'd love to partner with you. Our

(00:24):
podcast has a wonderful, dedicated audience, commit it to personal
growth and positive social change. By sponsoring Inspired Change with Conta,
your brand will connect with listeners who truly value thoughtful
discussion and support initiatives that promote real transformation. We're incredibly

(00:47):
proud to be ranked number one in Australia and number
five in the USA on feed spots top men's mental
health Podcasts. For more information on how to become sponsor,
please reach out to Miranda Spegner sap On, our showrunner
and executive producer. We'd love to explore how we can

(01:09):
work together to inspire change. Now. Thank you for your
continued support, and let's keep inspiring change together.

Speaker 2 (01:18):
You're listening to Inspire Change, the broadcast that strives to educate, motivate,
and empower men to challenge traditions of masculinity to guide
us through the intricacies and intersections of emotions, relationships, and
male identity is renowned psychologists, author, and speaker Gunter Swaboda.
This is Inspire Change.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
Before I begin the actual podcast, I would like to
respectfully acknowledge the gategor people of the or nation, who
are the traditional custodians of the land on which I work.
I would also like to pay my respects to their elders,
past and present. Come everybody to another episode of Inspire

(02:02):
Change with gun I'm your host.

Speaker 4 (02:05):
Welcome to Inspire Change with Gunta. I'm going to steal murder.
I'm your host. I'm an author, a.

Speaker 5 (02:11):
Psychologist, and I'm about to tell you why at my
age I chose to go back to university as a
student and a researcher.

Speaker 4 (02:23):
If you ever thought you were too old to take
on something big, this one's for you. So I had
every practical reason not to do this. I've got a
full clinical loade, I've got a family, a really full,
rich life. But there was allowed a reason to do this,

(02:45):
and that was curiosity, also some unfinished business. I've also
had unfinished questions about men therapy and how culture shapes
our inner lives and that voice one out. So by
the end of this episode, you'll hear what tipped me

(03:06):
over the line, what I'm actually studying, and how you
can decide whether returning to study makes sense for you. Yep,
people often ask me, well, why go back now? So
here's the truth. I'm very proud of my career, but

(03:28):
I do not want to spend the next decade repeating myself.
The field of masculinity and psychotherapy is moving. If I
want to contribute at the level I expected myself, I
need to sharpen the tools to test my ideas in
the fire of peer review and stand on the shoulders

(03:51):
of new research. And then there's the second reason, integrity.
I ask men to keep growing, to question old stories,
to risk change. I can't preach growth and then coast
become a catch potato. And going back to study is

(04:15):
me walking the talk. And there's acquired reason. Mortality focuses
the mind. You start asking what work still matters for me?
It is this. I want to help men unlearn what
harms them, become relationally stronger, and build communities that thrive.

(04:44):
So what is it that I'm researching in plain language? Fundamentally,
I've decided to investigate how traditional masculine norms i e.
Patriarchy get inside the therapist, especially male therapist, and then
show up in the therapy room, not just as ideas,

(05:06):
but in the body in the micro moments of practice.
Think breath, tone, timing, the pull to fix rather than feel,
the tendency to protect competence at the expense of connection,

(05:27):
and competence reflects in a sense where we think our
status lie. Now there's two working concepts that guide me.
The first one is what I call the masculine introject
in psychotherapy. Interjection is basically integrating, assimilating social means, messages, attitudes,

(05:52):
belief that then reside within the unconscious. It's a learned
internal voice that equates competence with control, downplays vulnerable emotion,
and prizes problem solving over presence in the relationship. You
can hear this as get it done, keep it together,

(06:17):
don't show too much. The second core concept is what
I call the triadic habitusts, which is three overlapping contexts
that train us the wider culture we grow up in,
the professional training we receive, and the personal world we

(06:39):
carry from home and history. When they align, we flow.
When they fight, we feel torn, and therapy sits right
in that tension. My questions are practical. When a male
therapists learn restraint meets the clients there for a tumen,

(07:03):
what happens to the alliance? Do we miss repairs because
the body says hold it in? How should we train
and supervise therapists in this context? In many respects, this
isn't a moral issue, but it's also a clinical skill set. Now,

(07:29):
the other thing I'm asked is well, why do this
through a university? And my answer usually is this because
evidence and dialogues matter. I want my claim stress testing
by people who may or will disagree with me. I
want methods that hold up. I want to contribute to

(07:49):
training programs, not just opinion pieces. A degree is not
a vanity project, its accountability. There's also access. University has
given the library, the data, the ethics process, the networks,
and I've really in a way rediscovered this wealth of

(08:12):
a gold mine. Now, if you want your work to leave,
you build it on foundations others can stand on. And
that's exactly what I want to do for me. In
many ways, this is legacy. So the other big is
the age question. Am I told for this, Well, you know,

(08:35):
I had to be really honest with myself and go, okay,
are there any shortcomings in my thinking? You know, the
logic irrational, the integrated emotional sides of me? Are they
balanced in a way? You know? But more importantly, are
there any cognitive deficits? Now, the other aspect of this

(08:57):
is that personally, I'm not of the school that thinks
I'm too old for this. Obviously, in many ways I
think I'm at the exact age for this. I bring
clinical hours, mistakes and long memory with me. I know

(09:17):
what actually helps men and what looks good on paper
but fails in the room. Study is not a young
person's game. It's a curious person's game. If anything, age
cuts the fluff. If I'm too old? Is your story?
Check whether it is your voice or someone else's. Most

(09:41):
of the time it's a ghost from the culture telling.

Speaker 1 (09:44):
You to shrink.

Speaker 4 (09:49):
So what has returning to study changed in me? Well,
firstly humility. You don't know what you think you know
until you've had to show your workings, and that's healthy.
So yesterday I did a peer presentation for a conference

(10:15):
at the university which is going to be greater and
if I'm honest with myself. It wasn't necessarily my best
piece of work, but I'm hoping that it will held
up to scrutiny. Secondly, out of this process, you do

(10:36):
get better questions instead of the old is masculinity toxic?
I'm asking which parts of learned masculinity help men love
well and which parts choke intimacy? And how do we
retrain the bondage dues connection under stress. The third I

(11:00):
expect is that the university is fundamentally a community. Study
puts me in rooms with people who sharpened my work.
Some might disagree with me. That's good, you know iron
Sharper's iron. And the final aspect to this is yes, discipline. Now,

(11:21):
anyone looking at how I work and what I produced
would say, well, you don't really need that. You're pretty disciplined,
And part of me agrees, But the other part of
me is also about we can always do better. My
experience is that, in many respects, studies less about IQ

(11:44):
and a lot more about calendar's drafts and recovery. After
said back, that discipline bleeds into everything therapy, writing relationships. Now,
one of the things that I've spoken about in terms
of myself is that I'm essentially a perfectionist who's on

(12:05):
a continuous journey of recovery, and so this process really
forces me to put perfectionism in my pocket. So what
if you were considering doing this? So here's a quick
self check, Grab a pen and answer three questions. Firstly,

(12:29):
what problem do you care about enough to read, write,
and argue about for two years maybe more. I'm having
to pursue this further into my PhD. My superfiser seems
very comfortable with that idea, but you know of the
thought that, well, I'm not going to count my chickens
and then until they're hatched. The second question is where

(12:52):
would new training make your work more honest than useful?
And thirdly, what support could you set up now so
study doesn't become a lonely grind. Now, let me share
with you some of the practical steps that help me

(13:14):
pick a program that fits your question, not your ego,
And to me, this is exactly what I've done.

Speaker 1 (13:22):
Now.

Speaker 4 (13:23):
The question that I get off and around this is well,
why aren't you doing this through the school of psychology?
And part of the reason for that is that I
wanted to take a look at my work through a
different discipline. That discipline happens to be anthropology and sociology,
and how I can build bridges between those schools of

(13:46):
scholarship because I think too much in our current society
is running like silos, and I see that at universities.
You know, the psychologists don't talk a lot to anthropologists.
The anthropologists and sociologists possibly disdainful. Maybe I'm being a
bit harsh there of psychologists, but there isn't necessarily a

(14:09):
lot of cross fertilization. And this particular research that I'm
working in is all about cross fertilization. It's about bringing anthropology, sociology,
and psychodynamic psychotherapy into the room and creating a dialogue
in that process.

Speaker 5 (14:32):
And so.

Speaker 4 (14:35):
My interest in masculinity on all sorts of different levels,
whether it's from the intrapsychic personal journey of healing to
the massive picture of social change of sustainable ecological balance,
because essentially we all are part of an ecology. We

(14:57):
are not little islands unto ourselves.

Speaker 6 (15:01):
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More Labs. They have a product called Morning Recovery. It's
the number one alcohol recovery supplement that helps you wake
up clear headed and refreshed. Clinically proven and trusted by thousands,
with twenty million plus bottles sold and a four point
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(15:26):
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(15:46):
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Speaker 4 (15:47):
This is seriously important in more of you, and it
has massive implications, not just in training soccer therapists, but
just as a whole why exploring being human. So this
project for me is not about my growth. It's not

(16:08):
only about my growth. The bigger aim is cultural. We
men need better stories, We therapists need better training. Why
do I say that because the reality is when I
took a curriculum audit, I discovered that the issue of

(16:30):
masculinity is virtually silent in our training and in our supervision.
That concerns me. The other part of a communities need
men who are strong in the right place. Returning to
university is one way I can help build that future
with evidence, clarity and teachable tools. So if this whole

(16:58):
thing has stirred something in you, sit with it, ask
better questions, back yourself, and if returning to study is
part of your path, I hope you take that step.
Whatever people in the media tell you that university degrees

(17:20):
are useless, pointless, you might as well put that money
into a house. They are talking shape. It's as simple
as that. It's bullshit. To be educated in life. Experience, philosophically, professionally,

(17:41):
you know, and spiritually is fundamental to creating a sustainable planet,
sustainable relationships, a sustainable self. So at this point, thanks
for listening to inspire change with me. I hope that

(18:03):
stirred something in you. Most importantly, back yourself, follow the
show labor review, and most importantly share this to someone
who needs permission to start again. Well, just to start
and I'll see you next time.

Speaker 7 (18:25):
Hello to all our listeners, we thank you for tuning
in and promoting positive social change. This makes you a
part of Gunter's efforts and transforming not only men's lives,
but lives in general, and we are grateful that you
have joined us. This week, We're thrilled to announce that
Ethiopia was number twenty on our global listeners list. Specifically

(18:47):
in a does a boo bah congraduations. We appreciate your
efforts to support positive social change and thank you for
joining Africa's efforts and inspiring pop positive social change. Next,
we take a look at the USA. Let's congratulate our
listeners in McGee, Mississippi for bringing your state to number

(19:10):
ten on the USA Top Listeners List. Congraduations. I Devana Prinzy,
the co executive producer and our showrunner Miranda spidnerse opone
sincerely thank you and ask that you please take the
time to like, follow, subscribe, and share, as your efforts
make a difference to everyone here at Inspire Change with Gunter.

(19:33):
Please remember if you want to share your story of
social change, feel free to reach out to the show directly.
Please see the show notes for our contact information. As always,
thank you to each and every one of our listeners,
and most importantly, please keep inspiring positive social change.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
Love to hear from me and if you're.

Speaker 3 (19:56):
Please check out my work on www.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
Dot goto Swaboda.

Speaker 3 (20:02):
Dot com or www Dot goodman Grade dot com.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
Thank you for listening to Inspire Change, a broadcast that
strives to educate, motivate, and empower men to challenge traditions
of masculinity. For more information on the making good men
great movement, or for individual or group coaching centsihips with Gunter,
visit goodman grade dot com.