November 18, 2025 • 57 mins
Today, we welcome a remarkable guest whose life’s work unfolds in the powerful spaces where transformation begins. Sande Hart is an award-winning author, humanitarian visionary, women’s empowerment advocate, and founder of Global Woman’s Village, formerly S.A.R.A.H., an interfaith organization dedicated to compassion, collaboration, and community healing. Sande is also the author of the celebrated book The Liminal Odyssey, exploring the alchemical force found in the “in-between” spaces of our lives—those thresholds where identity shifts, consciousness expands, and destiny unfolds. Her leadership in establishing California as the world’s first “Compassionate State” has positioned her as a global catalyst for positive social evolution. In her work as a futurist, spiritual activist, and community builder, Sande teaches us to honour the unseen, embrace uncertainty, and use liminal space as a gateway to personal and collective transformation.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome to Mission Evolution Radio show with Gwildawaka, bringing together
today's leading experts to uncover ever deepening spiritual truths and
the latest scientific developments in support of the evolution of humankind.
For more information on Mission Evolution Radio with Gildawaka, visit
www dot Mission Evolution dot RG. And now here's the
(00:31):
host of Mission Evolution, Miss Gwildaweka.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
This is Mission Evolution and I'm Guildaweka. Today we welcome
a remarkable guest whose life's work unfolds the powerful spaces
where transformation begins. Sandy Hart is an award winning author, humanitarian, visionary,
women's empowerment advocate, and founder of global Women's Village and
interfaith organization dedicated to compare collaboration and community healing. Sandy's
(01:04):
also the author of the celebrated book The Liminal Odyssey,
The Alchemical Power of the Spaces in Between, exploring the
alchemical force found in the in between spaces of our lives,
these thresholds where identity shifts, consciousness expands, and destiny unfolds.
(01:25):
Her leadership in establishing California as the world's first compassionate
state has positioned her as a global catalyst for positive
social evolution. In her work as a futurist, spiritual activist,
and community builder, Sandy teaches us to honor the unseen,
embrace uncertainty, and use liminal space as a gateway to
(01:46):
personal and collective evolution. Sandy, thanks for joining us on
Mission Evolution.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I am so happy to be here with you. Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
It's it's just a real pleasure. I'm so looking forward
to working with you today.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So, Sandy, what first inspired your lifelong work with the liminal.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Well, it started long before I even understood what the
word liminal meant. It was a tongue twister for me.
But I'd always been really curious about people, and I
was raised in a rather rigid home. I wasn't raised
with a lot of confidence or you know, an environment
that really fostered evolutionary growth, you know, and that was
(02:29):
very much due to the content with My parents are
much older than me, I much older than the average parent,
and also, you know, it was it was necessary for
my for my for for who I was. It was
I had to go through the difficult experiences and some
(02:52):
trauma to really know that this was a catalyst for
me to start asking different questions. And I was always
asking people where they were from, and you know, I
was always asking to get invited into people's homes because
I wanted to know what it smelt like, and I
wanted to know what kind of food's d and I
wanted to understand what was on the walls and what
that meant to them. So I was always interested in
(03:13):
what motivated people really is what it was. And so
the morning of nine to eleven, I woke up completely
rewired from the director of sales and marketing of you
know who I was the night before nine to eleven,
and I heard gather women And I'm like, who's saying
(03:35):
this to me? And where am I supposed to find
these women? And what am I supposed to do with
them once I find them? But I said yes, And
before I knew it, I had twelve women from the
faith communities because this is what was going on in
my county, were these conversations of different faiths coming together
to address the tolerance in the community. And that's where
(03:58):
I found the women. So we were just naturally inter
faithful when we gathered. So we called ourselves some other
of all nations known as Sarah and then twenty years
later we realized it was time to change and became
the Global Women's Village. We're not inter faithful anymore, but
it's very much part of our DNA. But I'll to
(04:21):
answer your question about the liminal space. It was always
in those liminal spaces that I've accomplished. Anything and everything
I have done was a creative spark. So there was
no state of compassion before now California is a state
of compassion. There was no women's organization that looked anything
(04:45):
like us, and now we became the world's largest in
you know, grassroots interfaith organization. There was nothing like any
of the initiatives that I have ever you know, brought
forth or you know, and door led further. And so
I came to realize this that all of that happened
(05:06):
in these spaces, but I didn't have a framework for
it until I've heard this word liminal that meant threshold.
So I discovered it's really what I'm doing in those
spaces in between you know, dilemma and choice, crisis and action,
you know. Hearing something that catalyzed me into what am
I going to do next with this? I wasn't just
(05:29):
happy sitting there and letting it pass by me. So
that is that liminal space is what informs me of
what the next thing to do. Is slowing down, asking
the question what wants to happen here and then doing it.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Now, that's fascinating. So how do your roles as a mother, grandmother, author,
and community leader shape your perspective on social change?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
First of all, becoming a changes everything because now you
see the world through the lens of how it's impacting
my child, how I'm impacting my child, What am I
contributing to in the world, Where is my dollar going,
Who am I supporting? What corporation am I feeding? You know?
And so it changed everything for me at some cellular level.
(06:26):
You know, I really didn't really come to understand that
until I've been doing this study, which is really more
intense in the last five years, and I'm okay, that
is what was driving me to always show up into
different spaces were my kids? Interfaith? Oh gosh, Well, the
beauty of interfaith community building is that you get to
(06:49):
learn about all these different traditions and pathways which really
do more for deepening the roots of your own tradition
and belief system. And so the interfaith, you know, adding that,
you know into the mix, you know, into the cauldron
that it was stirred up, you know, being a mother
(07:10):
and seeing the world to that archetypal understanding of who
I was as a mother, and also being becoming to
become more connected to the child, to the maiden in me,
you know, if you're looking at these archetypal identities of maiden,
mother crone, and so these perspectives have changed over the
(07:32):
years as I grow into that crone, into that wisdom
of being a woman. And so all of these understandings
every day evolved my belief system and my fiber and
rearrange the DNA every day because I'm learning different things
(07:53):
every day.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Never a dull moment, then.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Huh, never a dull moment.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
What eded you to create Global Women's Village and how
has it evolved?
Speaker 3 (08:04):
So the Global Women's Village having trans the reason why
it transformed when we knew this is what the name
and the destiny of what Sarah would become, that which
is the mother of all nations. That's what we called
her Sarah. The spiritual religious lines for hope that you know,
(08:25):
soon after nine to eleven, when we were all convening.
And then in twenty twenty three, I found myself back
on the Women's Task Force for the Parliament of the
World's Religions, which is the world's largest convening of clergy, theologians, seekers, environmentalists,
social impact or you know, organizers' safety net organizations, everyone
(08:50):
who really could you know, focuses on their highest and
deepest value system to heal our world from whatever perspective.
With all these different tracks of programming and workshops four
hundred workshops, plenaries, you know, observances of other people's rituals
(09:10):
and interactive and engagement and you know, experiences for a
whole week, eight to ten thousand people come from eighty
different countries around the world. It's imagine walking the halls
everyone in the regalia and the different languages and just
heaven on Earth really. And so having been on the
(09:34):
task force before, and also having been to the parliaments
because they're every few years, going back to two thousand
and nine at Melbourne, Australia's Parliament, I started noticing women
and I wasn't alone that women have very little room
in that space. Over the course of the week, and
then we get this Women's Task force in twenty fifteen,
(09:58):
and the the privilege to have forty of those four
hundred workshops dedicated to the topic of women, the dignity
of women, women's empowerment, women, and you know, impressing culture,
all different ways of conversing on the topic of women.
(10:19):
But even that wasn't enough. Come twenty twenty three, I
just raised my hand and said, you know, how about
we create a space within the Parliament of the world's religions,
right in the middle of the world's religions, and call
it the Women's Village, and design it for everyone, but
(10:41):
by women, in the design of the divine feminine, if
you will. We had an earth alter, We had a
mother tree. We had a water fountain. We had circles
for dialogue, spontaneous dialogues. We had what we call a
red tent room where you could go in and close
the door and it was a sacred space. Women might
just want to sit in silence. We also did a
lot of very loud programming in there. We had all
(11:03):
kinds of these different fixtures. But women were coming up
to us all week and saying, I feel safe here.
The era is different. In here. We were solving problems differently,
and we were coming up with real critical solutions to
real old problems. We were doing this work in a
(11:24):
different way in circle. Really, we were doing it differently.
Men were coming in and engaging too. It's for men too.
Yet when women play on, when women design, when women organize,
we have a different way and our solutions are swift
and sustainable. And this all came to light and kind
(11:45):
of came right into focus while standing in the middle
of the Women's Village, and I know what's next for Sarah,
And here we became the global women's village, focusing on women,
futuring a new paradigm.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
How did you help cultivate California as a first official
compassionate state in the world.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Well, long before everything I just shared with you, Compassionate
California happened, I was on the volunteer staff of the
Charter for Compassion International, which is a global organization that
at the time was really focused on creating cities of compassion.
(12:25):
And that means bringing together not only civic leaders, but
also social impact organizations and safety net organizations like the
food bank and the domestic violence shelters, and youth programming
and you know, bringing together the Department of Education and teachers,
bringing together grassroots and of course also the interfaith community
(12:49):
and all kinds of you know, all the stakeholders of
a community. We got together in one room and we said,
can we all agree to these four basic, very elegant,
very simple paragraphs that are known as the Charter for Compassion,
which really reminds us to come down to the golden
(13:10):
rule treat others as you treat themselves. But really, how
do we solve problems? How do we communicate? How do
we build community in a compassionate way? And when it
comes from all these different sectors, because we are all interrelated,
interconnected and mutually beneficial. When we do solve our problems collectively,
then we're not I'm not creating a solution for the
(13:33):
environmental community that is wrecking another community. Right, How do
we work this out in this room? And that's what
a city today.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
I'm sorry time, We're going to have to take it
a station break, Sandy, and I will return very shortly,
So don't you go away. This is Mission Evolution www.
Dot Mission evolution dot org.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
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Speaker 2 (15:36):
With this is our discussing feminine leadership. Is Sandy Hart,
the author of The Liminal Odyssey and Alchemical Power of
the Spaces in Between. Sandy, how has feminine wisdom influenced
your inner faith and community building efforts?
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Oh, it's everything, because it's wired in me as it
is in every woman, and I've only recently learned how
to utilize it, how to honor it and have reverence
for it and then listen to it. That's a big one.
How many times do we get a nudge or a
(16:14):
pain or a you know, our throat tightens up or
heart light separate titans. That's feminine wisdom. That's our body
talking to us. We are not separate from our body.
And that was a big revelation for discovery for me.
And it shows up in my body. Lets you know
right away, without a doubt. I can always count on it.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
It's like my bff, can you share an example of
a time when you identified a gap in a system
and turned it to an opportunity for change.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Oh yes, all the time. As my fact, here's one,
the here's one. It's like picking our favorite child. Right.
I was on a call co hosting a panel. I
was at the Charter for Compassion, actually with someone at
(17:09):
a department at the UN, it doesn't matter who they were.
And I asked the question because we were talking about
the Sustainable Development Goals, these eighteen goals that are designed
to mark critical change across all these different critical issues
on our planet. And so I asked them, why is
(17:31):
it taking so long to achieve these goals? Why is
it taking so long for the United Nations to accomplish
these goals? I mean they're markers, there's improvements, but it's
been fifteen years. Why so long? And the response woke
(17:51):
me up. It said, he said, good policy requires good people,
and most people are not even conscious of the choices
they make while sitting in their seat at the United Nations.
I mean they're consciously considering everything, but are we truly
(18:12):
living it in that way? So this is not to
discourage the United Nations, because they do remarkable work, but
it's not fast enough when you have the resources the
United Nations has, And so that led me to thinking
about a big friend. There are seventeen goals. I thought
(18:32):
of an eighteenth a personal responsibility and self agency. What
if we had an eighteenth goal that threaded through every
single one of those to remind everyone working on any
one of those goals to really stop and think about
what's my personal responsibility and my self agency in addressing
issues and brings it right down to the personal. It
(18:54):
got tractions traction, and it was never intended to really
get a designated as an eighteenth goal. I mean, this
is a big system, a big machine. It was really
a grassroots effort to grab the imagination of people, and
it got it, got made a lot of you know track,
(19:16):
It had a lot of traction, It got places, but
it got it. I realized that it was much more
than I could manage, and it eventually went away. But
the intention there was that the other and that is
and this came from a challenge. Being an interfaith organization
(19:39):
we were there was a contest coming up, and that
contest for this global organization that we are part of
was called the United Religions Initiative was to come up
with a project that exemplified our collectivision, which is at
the r I the United Religions and should have the
(20:02):
principal and preamble of the United Religions Initiative, which are
these universal goals that we all want to reach, you know,
ultimately ending up with the everyone living the Golden rule
UH doing to under others as you will have done
unto yourself. And so immediately it dawned on me what
our projects should be that we wanted to present and
(20:24):
submit as a prize winning or submission. And because we've
done panel discussions, we convene the community in circle. We
have we have spoken on podiums across all the different
faith traditions at the universities, at every university in On County.
We've done programming on campus and a number of them
(20:46):
for nearly ten years at the time. But what weren't
we doing. We weren't reaching the critical mass of our community.
What will people show up for? They will show up
for community service. So I convene my circle and we
created the Weekend of Community Service, inter fifth Weekend of
Community Service where we pulped cross pollinated our different faith
(21:09):
traditions to go out and do service together. Now that
was ten years ago, that was at least ten years
ago because we did it for seven years and oh
and we won the award you're actually looking at it
for the top of the one up there, and we
got to accept it in India. That was our prize.
We've received a cash award plus this trip to India
(21:32):
to receive it. A global assembly to a global assembly
at any rate. The impact from that was so profound
that a mosque and a synagogue that would never step
into one another's place of worship got together and now
they to this day still sponsor a homeless a homeless
(21:57):
transition home for families.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
It is.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So that's that's just one of the you know, impacts
from the work that we have done. But you know,
taking a problem what aren't we doing and finding you know,
stopping in that liminal space and asking what else could
what aren't we doing? What questions aren't we asking? And
that's where we came up with that. And by the way,
(22:24):
we still have that money in our account. We don't
we don't really do a lot to spend money here.
So and that was ten years ago.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
So what global shift do you believe is necessary for
women to move into equal leadership roles?
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Thank you for asking that question. It's absolutely about remembering
who we are. We and ask ourselves, how am I
perpetuating the system? Where is my dollar going? How am
I treating my sister? Am I wounded? Do I have
the sister? When do I have some trauma that could
be addressed? And how am I living? That we fund them?
(23:00):
Only believe that women are the answer to all of
humanity's issues right now? And what about the men or
the We need our men, we need our partners. We
can't fly. We need the two wings of the bird
to be in balanced. But sometimes you want to turn
a corner, you want to change directions, You got to
shift which wing is up here and which wing is
(23:22):
going to be taken care of down here. And so
we know that when we do our work, everyone is healed.
And that's what happened at the women's village at the Parliament.
Everyone was welcoming the space. We didn't do it just
for ourselves, but we did it through how women heal,
(23:43):
how women sell problems, how women design.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
So what is liminality.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
Liminal means threshold, liminality means what we do in that space.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
And how does the concept of liminality relate to expanded
conscious in spiritual awakening.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
I think it's everything. It's where we start, It's where
we can slow down the speed of on wonder. Right,
this is just standard fundamental that should be the default
on wonder because when you're in wonder, you're in curiosity.
Right when you're in curiosity, there's not a lot of
room for vulnerability or fear, and fear is usually what
(24:24):
keeps us in place. That's why we continue. We might
be spiraling as an evolution, but we keep coming back
around because I think this is great spirit God. However,
you want to identify whatever force is moving this, moving us,
moving through us, which is not I can't even find
a name. There is no name for it. That which
(24:46):
cannot be named. It continues to put this back in
front of us. Look at the conditions in the United
States right now. How is it so fragile that so
much is getting rolled back and so many are agreeing
to it? Is that possible? We haven't learned, we haven't
asked the right questions, and we that's what we are
(25:06):
in search of that We're in search of the right answers.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
But first you have to have the right questions.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
And that happens in the liminal space when we quiet
and realize and just realize real with real eyes, turn
on your inside eyes, you know, your internal eye, your
inner eye, and what haven't but we've been asking, get real.
We have to go general on ourselves, but we get
to be real, real with ourselves in that space. And
(25:35):
that's where I did. That's when, that's when I discovered
this one chapter I thought it was writing for the
Liminal Odyssey turned out to be eleven or twelve chapters.
And I say eleven or twelve because the twelfth is
barely a chapter, but it's packs a punch, if you will.
And it basically unfolded because I started slowing down in
(25:56):
that space and thinking about what does this story really mean?
That happened me in my life, but I thought was
a mundane experience, kind of cool Monday and experience, but
a mondane experience. What was happening there? And oh my gosh, wait,
there's another story. Suddenly all these stories started just like
rolling out of me, each with and you know, anchored
(26:16):
with a methodology or or a mythology or a philosophy
or some science that that you know in some quantum
science as well. That really made sense of what was
going on in that story? And then I started seeing
a web developed and that web then became my safety net.
(26:40):
So we when we do this, when we write our stories,
we start seeing not only how they are not mundane,
they are some juicy full story is worth writing. We
can start saying, what was a live in me? What
was going on in that moment? And that's our gift
(27:00):
that makes up all of our beautiful parts. The wounds,
the scars, the joys, all of our parts are beautiful
when we can take the time and on wonder in
the liminal space to see them.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
So what does it mean to call yourself a woman?
Speaker 3 (27:16):
Futurer to future a new paradigm is to know that
we we were doing our work, but we're looking into
the future, I should say, and we are looking into
the future right, we're keeping our eye on what's ahead
of us. And three rules of futuring. There's no blaming,
(27:36):
there's no shaming, there's no victimizing. Right when my five
year old child at the time threw a fit and
treated me poorly, I didn't carry that on. I'm like, wait,
I'm a mother here, I see what's going on. I'm
here to love you back into wholeness. And that's what
(27:58):
women who future do. Recognize our rules and responsibility as
the biological woman who flows in the in the same
system as the moon who bleeds just like the rivers flow.
And when we stop that and we move into our crone,
(28:21):
that let stays in our womb to nurture our wisdom.
So when we see the nature of who we are
and honor it with reference, then we will move this needle.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
A lot of your We're about out of time in
this segment, but I've noticed you use I assume a
lot of ceremony in what you do.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
I do, and I've never thought of myself as a
ceremonious person. I love ceremony. I'm Jewish, and being Jewish
there is ritual and a lot we like the candles.
We you know, there are certain things that sanctify that moment.
So it ceremony means lighting a candle, right and keeping
(29:09):
water and having something to smell ding that's pleasurable.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Well, fortunately we're going to have to talk about ceremony
on the other side of a station break. Sandy and
I will be right back to continue our discussion. Please
stay right there. This is Mission Evolution, Mission evolution dot org.
What are the in between spaces? This is Mission Evolution,
Mission evolution dot org. With us discussing the power of
(29:33):
liminal space is Sandyheart her website sandyheart dot com. Sandy,
we were talking a little bit about ceremony, and through
what you've said to me so far, I see whiffs of,
if you will, the aroma of various different cultural ceremonies
from Native America and you're talking about the Red Tans
(29:55):
or the Red Lodge to all sorts of different ones.
Have you drawn on all different uh traditions? And is
that giving you the power to sit in the center
of that liminal space?
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Oh? Absolutely Yeah. Ceremony brings us back to who we
are and engages our body. It brings us our body
to the table when we think when we're in that space,
and that's what ceremony does. And ceremony is all about reverence.
So when when you can truly have reverence for what
you're doing, whether you're seek and you're you know, brushing
(30:33):
your scriptures, if you are reading scriptures or whatever with
the with this soft brush, or if you are you know,
standing shoulder to shoulder like the like my Muslim brothers
and sisters, do you know, to signify community and putting
your forehead this yoga post, to put your yoga, your
forehead to the floor, to just demonstrate your humility and
(30:57):
reverence for earth and for for all living things. Whether
it's lighting the Shabbat candles in my Jewish tradition, which
Jewish women all over the world are doing, so it's
going round the clock. We're all saying the same prayer
at once. It takes five minutes maybe, or it could
take a minute, you know, yes, absolutely, and especially the
(31:21):
ancient traditions that our indigenous people have carried on in circle.
They brought us circle, as did our you know, ancient
grandmothers brought us circle. The first way forms of sitting,
you know, unearthed by archaeologists dating back to early Mesopotamia.
(31:41):
Our communities were a circle, and there were also no
heads of the table. The chair was between the male
and the female leaders were at the same height. So
we have reverence for those symbols that just bring us
deeper into who we are. And there's no right or
wrong combination. So yes, all bring.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Me meaning very beautiful. Can you describe a personal limital
moment that deeply changed you.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
Yes. Chapter one, it's known as the What About the
Dog is the title of the chapter. And in nineteen
eighty two, I found myself at a a music festival,
cause concert called Peace Sunday. It was a No Nuke's
(32:30):
rally and music festival, and one hundred thousand people gathered
at the Rose Bowl, which many people know if you
watch football, is in Pasadying in California, and with stadium
seating and everyone on the grass makes about a room
for about one hundred thousand people, and it was packed
and early on in the day, you know, we're all
there for the music, right at least I was. I
(32:52):
was twenty one years old at the time, nineteen eighty two,
and I was there for the music, and you know,
you know, there was something about this perhaps being my woodstock,
but also being you know, my I was just on
the other side. Too late too. It's born too late
to be a hippie, and that was a I was
a frustrated hippie. So that spoke to me too. About
(33:15):
ten o'clock in the morning, before the program began, the
MC came to the microphone and said, you know, it's
going to be a hot day and somebody left their
dog in the car, and if that's your dog and
your car, go roll the window down. And you know,
everybody kind of expressed booze and hushes or there's a
hush around the crowd. But I couldn't unhear that. And
so when I had a moment when I found a
(33:37):
moment of silence between a speaker and the band, because
that's how the day went. Speaker band, speaker band all
the way through, and environmentalists and politicians and celebrities, Mike Ferrell,
Jane Fonda, Yoko Ono. These are all the speakers that
peppered in between the bands. As soon as there was
(33:57):
a space between speaker and band, I started shouting, what
about the dog? You know, I'm sitting stage left. I
they'll hear me, for sure, over one hundred thousand people.
But I realized I've got a chance, so they'll it'll
be repetitive, and they'll hear what about the dog? Because
I want to report back stat And you know, I
got drowned out. And now my friends on the next time,
(34:19):
the next turner, the next time around joined me, and
then by noon and I was regentless and enchanting. I
started every chance until it took a life of its own.
The entire stadium by noon was chanting what about the dog?
Every moment they could in between the spaces, and I
(34:42):
realized in that moment, oh, there's something here. But it
was seated in me. I didn't have I hadn't lived
enough to know that. That was a moment for me
until I started writing this story. And there's much more
to that story to even get to douse here. But
it was until about four o'clock that day. I was
walking in from the concession stand and I heard it,
(35:04):
and I'm like, wait, I didn't start this. I started something,
but it wasn't that round of chanting, and it went
until the MC had to make an announcement that the
dog is fine, and that was only so mister Stevie
Wonder could get five minutes of silence to pray, because
they probably knew he won it. Anyway, that that then
(35:28):
informed my psyche somewhere, my soul was rejoicing that finally
there might be an outlet for my divine purpose, my
sacred task here on this planet. And it did as
soon as I started writing this book. And that was
this first story that I realized, oh, what was anchoring me?
There was and that was exactly the same time I
heard the word liminal and I'm like, okay, what was
(35:50):
going on? And that's how I, uh, that's how I
wrote that book. It wrote me, It wrote me.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
What practical tools do you teach individuals or organizations to
help them navigate liminal transitions?
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Yeah, there's a series, there's a process, and I use
a lot of my compassion integrity training on secular ethic compassionate.
It's trauma informed training, although I don't call that when
I step into the room, but it does really tap
into those spaces where we can start to question who
we are, and we start with questioning assumptions. What assumptions
(36:28):
do you carry through the day? And that's not something
you can answer just the first time you hear it.
You have to start paying attention and being willing to
ask the question. And starting with certain practices, they start
creating different neuropathways in our mind.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Every day.
Speaker 3 (36:46):
If I ask myself, why am I flipping this light
switch before going out of the room? Am I why
am I getting in my car and doing these things
that I'm doing? Some regular thing that you do every
single day, set a president of practice, set a practice
for it, and before you know it, that'll start cultivating
(37:10):
different awareness centers will start firing off. It's like, why
do I believe that? Why do I think I have
to buy that product? Why do I watch TV commercials
that tell me I'll be thin and prutty and smart
if I buy their product. That's not right. We start
to become more aware when we start paying attention to
the patterns that we carry on in our life and
(37:31):
we don't even know it. So I'll just say that
I start with questioning assumptions.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
It's like taking yourself off autopilot. It sounds like it's
exactly right.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
It's exactly right.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
So how does the moinality apply to larger scale societal
changes such as climate justice, cultural division?
Speaker 3 (37:52):
I think every day every one of us, including every
system on the planet, experiences limental spaces where there's a
challenge and a choice right, and we all contribute up
and down the scale from the from what happens in
the home to what happens in the White House or
(38:12):
any parliament or wherever you are in the world. It
all begins like that gentleman from the United Nations says,
it all begins here. That's how change happens. So we
are in this incredible time. It's an incredible time to
be alive right now. And I thank your listeners for
(38:33):
tuning in to this conversation because there's something in them
that says, ah, I have a role here to play.
And that's true. We all have a role here to play.
And this you know, the world is speeding up to
with technology and now AI we don't know what to
wrap our minds around. It's being manipulated in a lot
of political spheres. Give them too much, give them too much,
(38:55):
they won't know where to turn. And all this stuff
can happen right let's face it, that's what's happening, especially
here in the United States. So how do we say, ah,
I'm stepping out of the noise, slowing down to the
speed of onlander. What's going on? What's my role in it?
And where do I find my center?
Speaker 2 (39:15):
How can creatives and media makers use liminality to influence
culture in positive ways?
Speaker 3 (39:21):
Well they do. Liminal was a word that was really
is really well understood in the world of photography. It's
thought of. If you look up the definition of liminal
you'll get a few different things. One would be it's
a place of transition. If you ask a photographer what
(39:42):
it means or an architect what it means, you'll get
two more answers. To a photographer, these are artists, right.
To a photographer, a liminal space is what you feel
when you see a particular picture, see a picture of
a shipyard. A shipyard, for example, immediately evokes a series
(40:06):
of you already know exactly what that space is all
around it, and what it means to be there, what
it smells like. You can probably almost get the taste
of metal in your mouth. You know. That's what liminal
means to a photographer, right, The emotions, the feelings that
the space between your eyes seeing the picture and what
it brings back to you, and what that means to you.
(40:29):
To an architect, and there's a bigger field of discussion
and even different language around this is the space where
they're creating movement, right, and whether they're creating how a
home with a stairwell which is a transitionary place, right,
(40:52):
or a hallway and how it's lived within, or a
public park or a shop out of a shopping center,
to see how do people move in this space? How
do we create community in this space? How do we
have the right lighting in these different places? So liminal
really means what we do with the space that we've got.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
How do you integrate the concept of seven generations thinking
into your work?
Speaker 3 (41:22):
Everything? What am I doing today that's going to affect
seven generations? Period? That's it.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
Do you know where the term or the concept of
the seventh generation comes from?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Comes from our indigenous elders. Yeah, it's definitely a construct
of their cultures. Yeah, I think it's a I do believe,
and I am actually you know, I sound like a colonizer.
That's a question for an indigenous person. But that's where
I learned it, and I do believe. It transcends all traditions,
(41:56):
all different nations.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
All the amazing treasures one can find there right.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Oh yes, the earth based, Earth based traditions are all
foundational to the patterns of the cosmos and to the
dirt and what's below it and everything in between. The
winged ones, the thin ones, four legged as, two legged,
the trees, everything is part of the human family.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
What keeps you grounded is your work gains recognition and awards.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Oh well, at first it was humility because I was
getting a little full of myself. I was like, oh,
well look at me, Look what I can do. And
I'm like, oh no, there's And then I learned how
much I didn't know. And every day I learned how
much I don't know. So I just see in that
on wonder and what keeps me grounded on my sisters,
(42:53):
my circles. I thrive on being in women's circles, and
I'm in all kinds of different circles having different conversations.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
Well it's that magic moment again. We've taken up the
station break, but please stay with us. Is Sandy and
I explore cross culture collaboration. This is Mission Evolution www
dot Mission evolution dot org. Can we transcend religious divides?
This is Mission Evolution, Mission evolution dot org. We're continuing
(43:24):
our discussion with Sandyheart. Sandy, how do you encourage collaboration
across cultural, generational or religious divides?
Speaker 3 (43:34):
You know, my work has moved out of the community based,
you know, interfaith community building, and what we've done before
is bring people together. The question is are they willing
to sit at the table. And I will tell you
that what I discovered after nearly two years of interfaith
(43:57):
community building at the grassroots where I'm in the room
from where it happened, I discovered it isn't religion that
divides us. What it is is nationalism and the rigid
edges of religion that are manipulated if you will to
(44:17):
have us believe that we are divided, right for power
for my way right and there at last I look,
there were eight point one five billion people on the planet,
but that was a while ago. And while there's a
finite amount of faith traditions and definitely a smaller more
(44:40):
world religions collection of belief systems, there are infinite ways
of living and being in that faith. So I am
informed by all of those things we talked about, Right,
I have all these life experiences and all these you know,
(45:01):
I've learned from so many different perspectives and experiences that
have happened to me. So how I'm going to address
my faith tradition is going to be different than another
Jewish person sitting right next to me, even if they
were born on the same day as me. We have
a different way of seeing the world, and we have
different life experiences. So yet, if your conversation is about
(45:25):
the survival of a religion which is due to nationalism
or a form of manipulation that causes conflict, genocide. You know,
then that's a completely different room. That's a whole different conversation.
Faith traditions, who people who really I've discovered that those
(45:47):
who really understand their faith and it applies to them
in a way of love and not fear, then it's
an easy conversation to have. The difficult dialogues are when
it's about conflict, war, division, lines in the sand.
Speaker 2 (46:12):
So with your exposure it's all sorts of different faith
traditions and religions. Have you found they have more in
common than not totally?
Speaker 3 (46:22):
You know the golden rule which I mentioned a few times,
Now do unto others as they would have done unto you.
Every faith tradition the world, religions right, those that are
commonly known, from Sikhism to Islam, to Judaism, to Christianity
to the high of Buddhism and so on, including indigenous,
(46:47):
they have a golden rule too as well. The Indigenous
isn't necessarily spoken and it's felt out a little differently actually,
but they all have the same unto the idea as
I would do under myself you know, for an example, right,
But they all, you know, they just rearrange the words
so that we all share that construct of I am
(47:11):
my beloved, and my beloved is mine and you are
my beloved.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
What upcoming project initiative are you most excited about right now?
Speaker 3 (47:22):
Yeah, the Global Women's Village is working on a global
conference and I'm referring to it as an unconference. It's
a convening of women that was inspired because all those
women tugging on our sleeves or grabbing my shoulders and saying,
we need our own conference, we need our own convenient,
(47:42):
we need this in our own space. Right. One thing
I hadn't said yet about that configuration of building a
village and what the greatest inspiration was is that the
world's religions, the rigid edges of world's religions, dating back
to the the written word, have been responsible for perpetuating
(48:03):
systems of domination otherwise known as patriarchy, and women contribute
to that too. So this isn't a man bashing moment.
There's never a man bashing moment in my world, but
this is not one of them, for sure. And so
here in the middle of the world's religions. We put
(48:24):
a village for women and men, designed by women. There
was something significant there and that is what I think
alchemized the air. So that's what we've got coming up.
It's called Destiny Ignited and you can stay tuned by
joining our newsletter at Global Women's Village Network. Yeah, it's
(48:46):
come in November twenty twenty six. We're waiting for our
first run to funding, so bring it on.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
That is exciting. What question would you ask your future
self about the impact of your work?
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Not a great question, That's a good question to ask
it because it helps me chart my path. What have
I learned? There? It is what have I learned? But
good question?
Speaker 2 (49:21):
How can listeners begin to recognize limital opportunities in their
own daily lives?
Speaker 3 (49:26):
Awareness their every day, between every breath, between a crisis
and action, the limit and choice. Question and answer. There's
never a moment I mean, and there's never a moment
where not we don't have these opportunities. A liminal space
can be a hot second, or it can be thirty years.
(49:48):
And I have some stories in there, that one which
demonstrates how things happen over a course of thirty years
that did not dawn on me until I was writing it. So,
like I said, l it wrote me. So yeah, it's
that practice, that awareness, practice awareness with that little, with
that little those steps I gave you earlier.
Speaker 2 (50:12):
The it seems like you know, when you're talking about
the liminal space, it's that space between, like you said,
thought and action, et cetera, et cetera. How can we
maximize that? How can we take advantage of it? Because
we tend to right over the top of it and
never take that moment. How how can we how can
we take advantage of it?
Speaker 3 (50:32):
Well, we have full agency over what we do, right,
I mean we might be we might be confined by
it or you know, restricted by time we have to
get to work, But that doesn't mean we have to
stop thinking about what what we're stepping over. Right, stay
with it, government, journal about it. You'll be surprised what
comes out of the bottom of your pen, the end
(50:54):
of your pen. I'll tell you. I've grabbed my head
a few times with where did that come from? So?
How do we make the most of it? And I
love that question because I'm all about making the most
of everything. It's just like unpacking it, unpack it, keep
asking yourself questions about it, Well, why do you think
that is? Where did that come from? What prevented me
(51:15):
from doing that in the first place? Yeah, stay with it,
breathe into it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:23):
So when we're in one of those liminal spaces and
we're getting new information, where is it coming from?
Speaker 3 (51:30):
That's another great question. And I don't know that anybody knows.
It can be spirit, it can be your womb, it
could be your heart, it could be your soul. I
have a perspective that it's my soul talking to me.
And I also have the perspective that my soul's purpose
is to be free, and it will only be free
(51:51):
when I have learned all my lessons on the and
I am on the other side whenever that might be. So,
I I don't know where we're going, but I know
we're on our way. I say this all the time.
I don't want to poison the water hole when I
get there. What can I do to clean up my act?
What can I do to look at the baggage I
might be bringing with me and I don't want to
(52:12):
do that. What can I heal today?
Speaker 1 (52:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (52:17):
And what happens is it just turns into this joy
ride and I do a course on liminality which I
refer to it as a joy ride into the liminality
of your life.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
Yeah, if you have a vision of what the world
would look like if more of us take time in
that in between space, what would it be?
Speaker 3 (52:40):
I think it would be a beloved community. I think
it would be the beloved community where everyone takes what
they need and there's enough for everyone and the world
works for everyone. It's important to say here that fear
is a primary motivator in our lives today. So how
(53:03):
do we are? We motivated from love? And to understand,
fear is nothing more than love of something we are protecting.
So there really is no fear, It's just love that
needs a little more attention.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Can fear exist in those liminal spaces?
Speaker 3 (53:21):
It does exist in those liminal spaces until we realize it,
until we love it back into wholeness, and that wholeness
is love. We take it, we start pulling it apart,
making a bite size What am I really afraid of here?
Where did that come from? Who taught me that? No
victimizing here? But let's learn from it. Okay, I've got agency.
Personal agency is the answer.
Speaker 2 (53:43):
Yeah, do you see victimization or self victimization is a
major problem in staying keeping us from staying in that
liminal space and getting the info there.
Speaker 3 (53:52):
Yeah, it's really easy to blame someone, so we really
don't have to take the time. There's a certain comfort
level and just whoa, it's me And in the end,
man did this to women? And you know and no, darling, no,
we've we are the divine feminine embodied we birth life.
We've we we are the healers and the nurtures and
(54:17):
the keepers of life and the keepers of tradition. And men.
We need our men and they contribute greally.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
For generations. In the indigenous cultures, there were matriarchal societies.
What do you see is the advantage of matriarchal society
that we're missing?
Speaker 3 (54:37):
Well, I think that I'm not. I don't propose that
we move into a matriarchal society because that takes us
back out of balance. Right. We need a system of partnership, right,
and there is an entire system of partnership scaffolding. There's
(54:58):
there's visit doctor Leon Eisler, E I s L E R.
Or reach out to me and I will I will
put you in touch with that and then direct you
to what it means for a system of partnership to
thrive that she is the architect of. And we're also
(55:19):
speaking this Friday on a call nice.
Speaker 2 (55:23):
It's that time, Sandy, when I have to ask you,
what's your mission.
Speaker 3 (55:28):
To future a new paradigm? Simple as that, Yeah, and
to be a good mom and grandmother.
Speaker 2 (55:37):
Being the elder. That's a challenge, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (55:42):
It is, and that's why it's so important that we
remember it. And then it's not a challenge anymore. Then
you just know who you are.
Speaker 2 (55:52):
Well, it's been absolutely wonderful having you on the show.
Unfortunately we are out of time, but Sandy, thank you
so much for being here and during your wisdom.
Speaker 3 (56:01):
It was a delight. Thank you so much for having
me and asking such great questions.
Speaker 2 (56:05):
My pleasure, our thanks to Sandyheart for an inspiring and
profoundly insightful conversation. Her workman reminds us that real change
doesn't happen in moments of certainty. It happens in the unknown,
the unseen, and the unclaimed spaces between what is and
what will be. To learn more about Sandy's book, upcoming programs,
(56:28):
or the Global Women's Village visit sandyheart dot com. Until
next time, may you walk boldly through your own liminal
spaces and discover the transformation waiting on the other side.
As always, thank you for joining us on Mission Evolution
with Gildoviyeka. For more information or to enjoy our past
(56:48):
archived episodes, visit www Mission evolution dot org. But please
be sure to join us right here next time, as
this mission will continue bringing in information, resources and support
to our evolving world.
Welcome to Mission Evolution Radio show with Gwildawaka, bringing together
today's leading experts to uncover ever deepening spiritual truths and
the latest scientific developments in support of the evolution of humankind.
For more information on Mission Evolution Radio with Gildawaka, visit
www dot Mission Evolution dot RG. And now here's the
(00:31):
host of Mission Evolution, Miss Gwildaweka.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
This is Mission Evolution and I'm Guildaweka. Today we welcome
a remarkable guest whose life's work unfolds the powerful spaces
where transformation begins. Sandy Hart is an award winning author, humanitarian, visionary,
women's empowerment advocate, and founder of global Women's Village and
interfaith organization dedicated to compare collaboration and community healing. Sandy's
(01:04):
also the author of the celebrated book The Liminal Odyssey,
The Alchemical Power of the Spaces in Between, exploring the
alchemical force found in the in between spaces of our lives,
these thresholds where identity shifts, consciousness expands, and destiny unfolds.
(01:25):
Her leadership in establishing California as the world's first compassionate
state has positioned her as a global catalyst for positive
social evolution. In her work as a futurist, spiritual activist,
and community builder, Sandy teaches us to honor the unseen,
embrace uncertainty, and use liminal space as a gateway to
(01:46):
personal and collective evolution. Sandy, thanks for joining us on
Mission Evolution.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
I am so happy to be here with you. Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
It's it's just a real pleasure. I'm so looking forward
to working with you today.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
So, Sandy, what first inspired your lifelong work with the liminal.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Well, it started long before I even understood what the
word liminal meant. It was a tongue twister for me.
But I'd always been really curious about people, and I
was raised in a rather rigid home. I wasn't raised
with a lot of confidence or you know, an environment
that really fostered evolutionary growth, you know, and that was
(02:29):
very much due to the content with My parents are
much older than me, I much older than the average parent,
and also, you know, it was it was necessary for
my for my for for who I was. It was
I had to go through the difficult experiences and some
(02:52):
trauma to really know that this was a catalyst for
me to start asking different questions. And I was always
asking people where they were from, and you know, I
was always asking to get invited into people's homes because
I wanted to know what it smelt like, and I
wanted to know what kind of food's d and I
wanted to understand what was on the walls and what
that meant to them. So I was always interested in
(03:13):
what motivated people really is what it was. And so
the morning of nine to eleven, I woke up completely
rewired from the director of sales and marketing of you
know who I was the night before nine to eleven,
and I heard gather women And I'm like, who's saying
(03:35):
this to me? And where am I supposed to find
these women? And what am I supposed to do with
them once I find them? But I said yes, And
before I knew it, I had twelve women from the
faith communities because this is what was going on in
my county, were these conversations of different faiths coming together
to address the tolerance in the community. And that's where
(03:58):
I found the women. So we were just naturally inter
faithful when we gathered. So we called ourselves some other
of all nations known as Sarah and then twenty years
later we realized it was time to change and became
the Global Women's Village. We're not inter faithful anymore, but
it's very much part of our DNA. But I'll to
(04:21):
answer your question about the liminal space. It was always
in those liminal spaces that I've accomplished. Anything and everything
I have done was a creative spark. So there was
no state of compassion before now California is a state
of compassion. There was no women's organization that looked anything
(04:45):
like us, and now we became the world's largest in
you know, grassroots interfaith organization. There was nothing like any
of the initiatives that I have ever you know, brought
forth or you know, and door led further. And so
I came to realize this that all of that happened
(05:06):
in these spaces, but I didn't have a framework for
it until I've heard this word liminal that meant threshold.
So I discovered it's really what I'm doing in those
spaces in between you know, dilemma and choice, crisis and action,
you know. Hearing something that catalyzed me into what am
I going to do next with this? I wasn't just
(05:29):
happy sitting there and letting it pass by me. So
that is that liminal space is what informs me of
what the next thing to do. Is slowing down, asking
the question what wants to happen here and then doing it.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Now, that's fascinating. So how do your roles as a mother, grandmother, author,
and community leader shape your perspective on social change?
Speaker 3 (05:59):
First of all, becoming a changes everything because now you
see the world through the lens of how it's impacting
my child, how I'm impacting my child, What am I
contributing to in the world, Where is my dollar going,
Who am I supporting? What corporation am I feeding? You know?
And so it changed everything for me at some cellular level.
(06:26):
You know, I really didn't really come to understand that
until I've been doing this study, which is really more
intense in the last five years, and I'm okay, that
is what was driving me to always show up into
different spaces were my kids? Interfaith? Oh gosh, Well, the
beauty of interfaith community building is that you get to
(06:49):
learn about all these different traditions and pathways which really
do more for deepening the roots of your own tradition
and belief system. And so the interfaith, you know, adding that,
you know into the mix, you know, into the cauldron
that it was stirred up, you know, being a mother
(07:10):
and seeing the world to that archetypal understanding of who
I was as a mother, and also being becoming to
become more connected to the child, to the maiden in me,
you know, if you're looking at these archetypal identities of maiden,
mother crone, and so these perspectives have changed over the
(07:32):
years as I grow into that crone, into that wisdom
of being a woman. And so all of these understandings
every day evolved my belief system and my fiber and
rearrange the DNA every day because I'm learning different things
(07:53):
every day.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Never a dull moment, then.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Huh, never a dull moment.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
What eded you to create Global Women's Village and how
has it evolved?
Speaker 3 (08:04):
So the Global Women's Village having trans the reason why
it transformed when we knew this is what the name
and the destiny of what Sarah would become, that which
is the mother of all nations. That's what we called
her Sarah. The spiritual religious lines for hope that you know,
(08:25):
soon after nine to eleven, when we were all convening.
And then in twenty twenty three, I found myself back
on the Women's Task Force for the Parliament of the
World's Religions, which is the world's largest convening of clergy, theologians, seekers, environmentalists,
social impact or you know, organizers' safety net organizations, everyone
(08:50):
who really could you know, focuses on their highest and
deepest value system to heal our world from whatever perspective.
With all these different tracks of programming and workshops four
hundred workshops, plenaries, you know, observances of other people's rituals
(09:10):
and interactive and engagement and you know, experiences for a
whole week, eight to ten thousand people come from eighty
different countries around the world. It's imagine walking the halls
everyone in the regalia and the different languages and just
heaven on Earth really. And so having been on the
(09:34):
task force before, and also having been to the parliaments
because they're every few years, going back to two thousand
and nine at Melbourne, Australia's Parliament, I started noticing women
and I wasn't alone that women have very little room
in that space. Over the course of the week, and
then we get this Women's Task force in twenty fifteen,
(09:58):
and the the privilege to have forty of those four
hundred workshops dedicated to the topic of women, the dignity
of women, women's empowerment, women, and you know, impressing culture,
all different ways of conversing on the topic of women.
(10:19):
But even that wasn't enough. Come twenty twenty three, I
just raised my hand and said, you know, how about
we create a space within the Parliament of the world's religions,
right in the middle of the world's religions, and call
it the Women's Village, and design it for everyone, but
(10:41):
by women, in the design of the divine feminine, if
you will. We had an earth alter, We had a
mother tree. We had a water fountain. We had circles
for dialogue, spontaneous dialogues. We had what we call a
red tent room where you could go in and close
the door and it was a sacred space. Women might
just want to sit in silence. We also did a
lot of very loud programming in there. We had all
(11:03):
kinds of these different fixtures. But women were coming up
to us all week and saying, I feel safe here.
The era is different. In here. We were solving problems differently,
and we were coming up with real critical solutions to
real old problems. We were doing this work in a
(11:24):
different way in circle. Really, we were doing it differently.
Men were coming in and engaging too. It's for men too.
Yet when women play on, when women design, when women organize,
we have a different way and our solutions are swift
and sustainable. And this all came to light and kind
(11:45):
of came right into focus while standing in the middle
of the Women's Village, and I know what's next for Sarah,
And here we became the global women's village, focusing on women,
futuring a new paradigm.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
How did you help cultivate California as a first official
compassionate state in the world.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Well, long before everything I just shared with you, Compassionate
California happened, I was on the volunteer staff of the
Charter for Compassion International, which is a global organization that
at the time was really focused on creating cities of compassion.
(12:25):
And that means bringing together not only civic leaders, but
also social impact organizations and safety net organizations like the
food bank and the domestic violence shelters, and youth programming
and you know, bringing together the Department of Education and teachers,
bringing together grassroots and of course also the interfaith community
(12:49):
and all kinds of you know, all the stakeholders of
a community. We got together in one room and we said,
can we all agree to these four basic, very elegant,
very simple paragraphs that are known as the Charter for Compassion,
which really reminds us to come down to the golden
(13:10):
rule treat others as you treat themselves. But really, how
do we solve problems? How do we communicate? How do
we build community in a compassionate way? And when it
comes from all these different sectors, because we are all interrelated,
interconnected and mutually beneficial. When we do solve our problems collectively,
then we're not I'm not creating a solution for the
(13:33):
environmental community that is wrecking another community. Right, How do
we work this out in this room? And that's what
a city today.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
I'm sorry time, We're going to have to take it
a station break, Sandy, and I will return very shortly,
So don't you go away. This is Mission Evolution www.
Dot Mission evolution dot org.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
Are you ready for a tale that will leave you
on the edge of your seat? Get ready to dive
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Sebral takes you on a heart pounding journey unmasking the
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(14:29):
In Moonman, Sibrel fearlessly reveals his real life espionag's adventures,
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Brace yourself for shocking revelations, including Sibrell's discovery of privately
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(14:51):
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Don't miss this opportunity to uncover the secrets hidden for decades.
(15:13):
Let your curiosity guide you as you joined Bart Sibrel
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Prepare to have your beliefs shaken to the very core.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
With this is our discussing feminine leadership. Is Sandy Hart,
the author of The Liminal Odyssey and Alchemical Power of
the Spaces in Between. Sandy, how has feminine wisdom influenced
your inner faith and community building efforts?
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Oh, it's everything, because it's wired in me as it
is in every woman, and I've only recently learned how
to utilize it, how to honor it and have reverence
for it and then listen to it. That's a big one.
How many times do we get a nudge or a
(16:14):
pain or a you know, our throat tightens up or
heart light separate titans. That's feminine wisdom. That's our body
talking to us. We are not separate from our body.
And that was a big revelation for discovery for me.
And it shows up in my body. Lets you know
right away, without a doubt. I can always count on it.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
It's like my bff, can you share an example of
a time when you identified a gap in a system
and turned it to an opportunity for change.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Oh yes, all the time. As my fact, here's one,
the here's one. It's like picking our favorite child. Right.
I was on a call co hosting a panel. I
was at the Charter for Compassion, actually with someone at
(17:09):
a department at the UN, it doesn't matter who they were.
And I asked the question because we were talking about
the Sustainable Development Goals, these eighteen goals that are designed
to mark critical change across all these different critical issues
on our planet. And so I asked them, why is
(17:31):
it taking so long to achieve these goals? Why is
it taking so long for the United Nations to accomplish
these goals? I mean they're markers, there's improvements, but it's
been fifteen years. Why so long? And the response woke
(17:51):
me up. It said, he said, good policy requires good people,
and most people are not even conscious of the choices
they make while sitting in their seat at the United Nations.
I mean they're consciously considering everything, but are we truly
(18:12):
living it in that way? So this is not to
discourage the United Nations, because they do remarkable work, but
it's not fast enough when you have the resources the
United Nations has, And so that led me to thinking
about a big friend. There are seventeen goals. I thought
(18:32):
of an eighteenth a personal responsibility and self agency. What
if we had an eighteenth goal that threaded through every
single one of those to remind everyone working on any
one of those goals to really stop and think about
what's my personal responsibility and my self agency in addressing
issues and brings it right down to the personal. It
(18:54):
got tractions traction, and it was never intended to really
get a designated as an eighteenth goal. I mean, this
is a big system, a big machine. It was really
a grassroots effort to grab the imagination of people, and
it got it, got made a lot of you know track,
(19:16):
It had a lot of traction, It got places, but
it got it. I realized that it was much more
than I could manage, and it eventually went away. But
the intention there was that the other and that is
and this came from a challenge. Being an interfaith organization
(19:39):
we were there was a contest coming up, and that
contest for this global organization that we are part of
was called the United Religions Initiative was to come up
with a project that exemplified our collectivision, which is at
the r I the United Religions and should have the
(20:02):
principal and preamble of the United Religions Initiative, which are
these universal goals that we all want to reach, you know,
ultimately ending up with the everyone living the Golden rule
UH doing to under others as you will have done
unto yourself. And so immediately it dawned on me what
our projects should be that we wanted to present and
(20:24):
submit as a prize winning or submission. And because we've
done panel discussions, we convene the community in circle. We
have we have spoken on podiums across all the different
faith traditions at the universities, at every university in On County.
We've done programming on campus and a number of them
(20:46):
for nearly ten years at the time. But what weren't
we doing. We weren't reaching the critical mass of our community.
What will people show up for? They will show up
for community service. So I convene my circle and we
created the Weekend of Community Service, inter fifth Weekend of
Community Service where we pulped cross pollinated our different faith
(21:09):
traditions to go out and do service together. Now that
was ten years ago, that was at least ten years
ago because we did it for seven years and oh
and we won the award you're actually looking at it
for the top of the one up there, and we
got to accept it in India. That was our prize.
We've received a cash award plus this trip to India
(21:32):
to receive it. A global assembly to a global assembly
at any rate. The impact from that was so profound
that a mosque and a synagogue that would never step
into one another's place of worship got together and now
they to this day still sponsor a homeless a homeless
(21:57):
transition home for families.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
It is.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So that's that's just one of the you know, impacts
from the work that we have done. But you know,
taking a problem what aren't we doing and finding you know,
stopping in that liminal space and asking what else could
what aren't we doing? What questions aren't we asking? And
that's where we came up with that. And by the way,
(22:24):
we still have that money in our account. We don't
we don't really do a lot to spend money here.
So and that was ten years ago.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
So what global shift do you believe is necessary for
women to move into equal leadership roles?
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Thank you for asking that question. It's absolutely about remembering
who we are. We and ask ourselves, how am I
perpetuating the system? Where is my dollar going? How am
I treating my sister? Am I wounded? Do I have
the sister? When do I have some trauma that could
be addressed? And how am I living? That we fund them?
(23:00):
Only believe that women are the answer to all of
humanity's issues right now? And what about the men or
the We need our men, we need our partners. We
can't fly. We need the two wings of the bird
to be in balanced. But sometimes you want to turn
a corner, you want to change directions, You got to
shift which wing is up here and which wing is
(23:22):
going to be taken care of down here. And so
we know that when we do our work, everyone is healed.
And that's what happened at the women's village at the Parliament.
Everyone was welcoming the space. We didn't do it just
for ourselves, but we did it through how women heal,
(23:43):
how women sell problems, how women design.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
So what is liminality.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
Liminal means threshold, liminality means what we do in that space.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
And how does the concept of liminality relate to expanded
conscious in spiritual awakening.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
I think it's everything. It's where we start, It's where
we can slow down the speed of on wonder. Right,
this is just standard fundamental that should be the default
on wonder because when you're in wonder, you're in curiosity.
Right when you're in curiosity, there's not a lot of
room for vulnerability or fear, and fear is usually what
(24:24):
keeps us in place. That's why we continue. We might
be spiraling as an evolution, but we keep coming back
around because I think this is great spirit God. However,
you want to identify whatever force is moving this, moving us,
moving through us, which is not I can't even find
a name. There is no name for it. That which
(24:46):
cannot be named. It continues to put this back in
front of us. Look at the conditions in the United
States right now. How is it so fragile that so
much is getting rolled back and so many are agreeing
to it? Is that possible? We haven't learned, we haven't
asked the right questions, and we that's what we are
(25:06):
in search of that We're in search of the right answers.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
But first you have to have the right questions.
Speaker 3 (25:13):
And that happens in the liminal space when we quiet
and realize and just realize real with real eyes, turn
on your inside eyes, you know, your internal eye, your
inner eye, and what haven't but we've been asking, get real.
We have to go general on ourselves, but we get
to be real, real with ourselves in that space. And
(25:35):
that's where I did. That's when, that's when I discovered
this one chapter I thought it was writing for the
Liminal Odyssey turned out to be eleven or twelve chapters.
And I say eleven or twelve because the twelfth is
barely a chapter, but it's packs a punch, if you will.
And it basically unfolded because I started slowing down in
(25:56):
that space and thinking about what does this story really mean?
That happened me in my life, but I thought was
a mundane experience, kind of cool Monday and experience, but
a mondane experience. What was happening there? And oh my gosh, wait,
there's another story. Suddenly all these stories started just like
rolling out of me, each with and you know, anchored
(26:16):
with a methodology or or a mythology or a philosophy
or some science that that you know in some quantum
science as well. That really made sense of what was
going on in that story? And then I started seeing
a web developed and that web then became my safety net.
(26:40):
So we when we do this, when we write our stories,
we start seeing not only how they are not mundane,
they are some juicy full story is worth writing. We
can start saying, what was a live in me? What
was going on in that moment? And that's our gift
(27:00):
that makes up all of our beautiful parts. The wounds,
the scars, the joys, all of our parts are beautiful
when we can take the time and on wonder in
the liminal space to see them.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
So what does it mean to call yourself a woman?
Speaker 3 (27:16):
Futurer to future a new paradigm is to know that
we we were doing our work, but we're looking into
the future, I should say, and we are looking into
the future right, we're keeping our eye on what's ahead
of us. And three rules of futuring. There's no blaming,
(27:36):
there's no shaming, there's no victimizing. Right when my five
year old child at the time threw a fit and
treated me poorly, I didn't carry that on. I'm like, wait,
I'm a mother here, I see what's going on. I'm
here to love you back into wholeness. And that's what
(27:58):
women who future do. Recognize our rules and responsibility as
the biological woman who flows in the in the same
system as the moon who bleeds just like the rivers flow.
And when we stop that and we move into our crone,
(28:21):
that let stays in our womb to nurture our wisdom.
So when we see the nature of who we are
and honor it with reference, then we will move this needle.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
A lot of your We're about out of time in
this segment, but I've noticed you use I assume a
lot of ceremony in what you do.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
I do, and I've never thought of myself as a
ceremonious person. I love ceremony. I'm Jewish, and being Jewish
there is ritual and a lot we like the candles.
We you know, there are certain things that sanctify that moment.
So it ceremony means lighting a candle, right and keeping
(29:09):
water and having something to smell ding that's pleasurable.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Well, fortunately we're going to have to talk about ceremony
on the other side of a station break. Sandy and
I will be right back to continue our discussion. Please
stay right there. This is Mission Evolution, Mission evolution dot org.
What are the in between spaces? This is Mission Evolution,
Mission evolution dot org. With us discussing the power of
(29:33):
liminal space is Sandyheart her website sandyheart dot com. Sandy,
we were talking a little bit about ceremony, and through
what you've said to me so far, I see whiffs of,
if you will, the aroma of various different cultural ceremonies
from Native America and you're talking about the Red Tans
(29:55):
or the Red Lodge to all sorts of different ones.
Have you drawn on all different uh traditions? And is
that giving you the power to sit in the center
of that liminal space?
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Oh? Absolutely Yeah. Ceremony brings us back to who we
are and engages our body. It brings us our body
to the table when we think when we're in that space,
and that's what ceremony does. And ceremony is all about reverence.
So when when you can truly have reverence for what
you're doing, whether you're seek and you're you know, brushing
(30:33):
your scriptures, if you are reading scriptures or whatever with
the with this soft brush, or if you are you know,
standing shoulder to shoulder like the like my Muslim brothers
and sisters, do you know, to signify community and putting
your forehead this yoga post, to put your yoga, your
forehead to the floor, to just demonstrate your humility and
(30:57):
reverence for earth and for for all living things. Whether
it's lighting the Shabbat candles in my Jewish tradition, which
Jewish women all over the world are doing, so it's
going round the clock. We're all saying the same prayer
at once. It takes five minutes maybe, or it could
take a minute, you know, yes, absolutely, and especially the
(31:21):
ancient traditions that our indigenous people have carried on in circle.
They brought us circle, as did our you know, ancient
grandmothers brought us circle. The first way forms of sitting,
you know, unearthed by archaeologists dating back to early Mesopotamia.
(31:41):
Our communities were a circle, and there were also no
heads of the table. The chair was between the male
and the female leaders were at the same height. So
we have reverence for those symbols that just bring us
deeper into who we are. And there's no right or
wrong combination. So yes, all bring.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Me meaning very beautiful. Can you describe a personal limital
moment that deeply changed you.
Speaker 3 (32:09):
Yes. Chapter one, it's known as the What About the
Dog is the title of the chapter. And in nineteen
eighty two, I found myself at a a music festival,
cause concert called Peace Sunday. It was a No Nuke's
(32:30):
rally and music festival, and one hundred thousand people gathered
at the Rose Bowl, which many people know if you
watch football, is in Pasadying in California, and with stadium
seating and everyone on the grass makes about a room
for about one hundred thousand people, and it was packed
and early on in the day, you know, we're all
there for the music, right at least I was. I
(32:52):
was twenty one years old at the time, nineteen eighty two,
and I was there for the music, and you know,
you know, there was something about this perhaps being my woodstock,
but also being you know, my I was just on
the other side. Too late too. It's born too late
to be a hippie, and that was a I was
a frustrated hippie. So that spoke to me too. About
(33:15):
ten o'clock in the morning, before the program began, the
MC came to the microphone and said, you know, it's
going to be a hot day and somebody left their
dog in the car, and if that's your dog and
your car, go roll the window down. And you know,
everybody kind of expressed booze and hushes or there's a
hush around the crowd. But I couldn't unhear that. And
so when I had a moment when I found a
(33:37):
moment of silence between a speaker and the band, because
that's how the day went. Speaker band, speaker band all
the way through, and environmentalists and politicians and celebrities, Mike Ferrell,
Jane Fonda, Yoko Ono. These are all the speakers that
peppered in between the bands. As soon as there was
(33:57):
a space between speaker and band, I started shouting, what
about the dog? You know, I'm sitting stage left. I
they'll hear me, for sure, over one hundred thousand people.
But I realized I've got a chance, so they'll it'll
be repetitive, and they'll hear what about the dog? Because
I want to report back stat And you know, I
got drowned out. And now my friends on the next time,
(34:19):
the next turner, the next time around joined me, and
then by noon and I was regentless and enchanting. I
started every chance until it took a life of its own.
The entire stadium by noon was chanting what about the dog?
Every moment they could in between the spaces, and I
(34:42):
realized in that moment, oh, there's something here. But it
was seated in me. I didn't have I hadn't lived
enough to know that. That was a moment for me
until I started writing this story. And there's much more
to that story to even get to douse here. But
it was until about four o'clock that day. I was
walking in from the concession stand and I heard it,
(35:04):
and I'm like, wait, I didn't start this. I started something,
but it wasn't that round of chanting, and it went
until the MC had to make an announcement that the
dog is fine, and that was only so mister Stevie
Wonder could get five minutes of silence to pray, because
they probably knew he won it. Anyway, that that then
(35:28):
informed my psyche somewhere, my soul was rejoicing that finally
there might be an outlet for my divine purpose, my
sacred task here on this planet. And it did as
soon as I started writing this book. And that was
this first story that I realized, oh, what was anchoring me?
There was and that was exactly the same time I
heard the word liminal and I'm like, okay, what was
(35:50):
going on? And that's how I, uh, that's how I
wrote that book. It wrote me, It wrote me.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
What practical tools do you teach individuals or organizations to
help them navigate liminal transitions?
Speaker 3 (36:05):
Yeah, there's a series, there's a process, and I use
a lot of my compassion integrity training on secular ethic compassionate.
It's trauma informed training, although I don't call that when
I step into the room, but it does really tap
into those spaces where we can start to question who
we are, and we start with questioning assumptions. What assumptions
(36:28):
do you carry through the day? And that's not something
you can answer just the first time you hear it.
You have to start paying attention and being willing to
ask the question. And starting with certain practices, they start
creating different neuropathways in our mind.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Every day.
Speaker 3 (36:46):
If I ask myself, why am I flipping this light
switch before going out of the room? Am I why
am I getting in my car and doing these things
that I'm doing? Some regular thing that you do every
single day, set a president of practice, set a practice
for it, and before you know it, that'll start cultivating
(37:10):
different awareness centers will start firing off. It's like, why
do I believe that? Why do I think I have
to buy that product? Why do I watch TV commercials
that tell me I'll be thin and prutty and smart
if I buy their product. That's not right. We start
to become more aware when we start paying attention to
the patterns that we carry on in our life and
(37:31):
we don't even know it. So I'll just say that
I start with questioning assumptions.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
It's like taking yourself off autopilot. It sounds like it's
exactly right.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
It's exactly right.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
So how does the moinality apply to larger scale societal
changes such as climate justice, cultural division?
Speaker 3 (37:52):
I think every day every one of us, including every
system on the planet, experiences limental spaces where there's a
challenge and a choice right, and we all contribute up
and down the scale from the from what happens in
the home to what happens in the White House or
(38:12):
any parliament or wherever you are in the world. It
all begins like that gentleman from the United Nations says,
it all begins here. That's how change happens. So we
are in this incredible time. It's an incredible time to
be alive right now. And I thank your listeners for
(38:33):
tuning in to this conversation because there's something in them
that says, ah, I have a role here to play.
And that's true. We all have a role here to play.
And this you know, the world is speeding up to
with technology and now AI we don't know what to
wrap our minds around. It's being manipulated in a lot
of political spheres. Give them too much, give them too much,
(38:55):
they won't know where to turn. And all this stuff
can happen right let's face it, that's what's happening, especially
here in the United States. So how do we say, ah,
I'm stepping out of the noise, slowing down to the
speed of onlander. What's going on? What's my role in it?
And where do I find my center?
Speaker 2 (39:15):
How can creatives and media makers use liminality to influence
culture in positive ways?
Speaker 3 (39:21):
Well they do. Liminal was a word that was really
is really well understood in the world of photography. It's
thought of. If you look up the definition of liminal
you'll get a few different things. One would be it's
a place of transition. If you ask a photographer what
(39:42):
it means or an architect what it means, you'll get
two more answers. To a photographer, these are artists, right.
To a photographer, a liminal space is what you feel
when you see a particular picture, see a picture of
a shipyard. A shipyard, for example, immediately evokes a series
(40:06):
of you already know exactly what that space is all
around it, and what it means to be there, what
it smells like. You can probably almost get the taste
of metal in your mouth. You know. That's what liminal
means to a photographer, right, The emotions, the feelings that
the space between your eyes seeing the picture and what
it brings back to you, and what that means to you.
(40:29):
To an architect, and there's a bigger field of discussion
and even different language around this is the space where
they're creating movement, right, and whether they're creating how a
home with a stairwell which is a transitionary place, right,
(40:52):
or a hallway and how it's lived within, or a
public park or a shop out of a shopping center,
to see how do people move in this space? How
do we create community in this space? How do we
have the right lighting in these different places? So liminal
really means what we do with the space that we've got.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
How do you integrate the concept of seven generations thinking
into your work?
Speaker 3 (41:22):
Everything? What am I doing today that's going to affect
seven generations? Period? That's it.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
Do you know where the term or the concept of
the seventh generation comes from?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Comes from our indigenous elders. Yeah, it's definitely a construct
of their cultures. Yeah, I think it's a I do believe,
and I am actually you know, I sound like a colonizer.
That's a question for an indigenous person. But that's where
I learned it, and I do believe. It transcends all traditions,
(41:56):
all different nations.
Speaker 2 (41:58):
All the amazing treasures one can find there right.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Oh yes, the earth based, Earth based traditions are all
foundational to the patterns of the cosmos and to the
dirt and what's below it and everything in between. The
winged ones, the thin ones, four legged as, two legged,
the trees, everything is part of the human family.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
What keeps you grounded is your work gains recognition and awards.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
Oh well, at first it was humility because I was
getting a little full of myself. I was like, oh,
well look at me, Look what I can do. And
I'm like, oh no, there's And then I learned how
much I didn't know. And every day I learned how
much I don't know. So I just see in that
on wonder and what keeps me grounded on my sisters,
(42:53):
my circles. I thrive on being in women's circles, and
I'm in all kinds of different circles having different conversations.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
Well it's that magic moment again. We've taken up the
station break, but please stay with us. Is Sandy and
I explore cross culture collaboration. This is Mission Evolution www
dot Mission evolution dot org. Can we transcend religious divides?
This is Mission Evolution, Mission evolution dot org. We're continuing
(43:24):
our discussion with Sandyheart. Sandy, how do you encourage collaboration
across cultural, generational or religious divides?
Speaker 3 (43:34):
You know, my work has moved out of the community based,
you know, interfaith community building, and what we've done before
is bring people together. The question is are they willing
to sit at the table. And I will tell you
that what I discovered after nearly two years of interfaith
(43:57):
community building at the grassroots where I'm in the room
from where it happened, I discovered it isn't religion that
divides us. What it is is nationalism and the rigid
edges of religion that are manipulated if you will to
(44:17):
have us believe that we are divided, right for power
for my way right and there at last I look,
there were eight point one five billion people on the planet,
but that was a while ago. And while there's a
finite amount of faith traditions and definitely a smaller more
(44:40):
world religions collection of belief systems, there are infinite ways
of living and being in that faith. So I am
informed by all of those things we talked about, Right,
I have all these life experiences and all these you know,
(45:01):
I've learned from so many different perspectives and experiences that
have happened to me. So how I'm going to address
my faith tradition is going to be different than another
Jewish person sitting right next to me, even if they
were born on the same day as me. We have
a different way of seeing the world, and we have
different life experiences. So yet, if your conversation is about
(45:25):
the survival of a religion which is due to nationalism
or a form of manipulation that causes conflict, genocide. You know,
then that's a completely different room. That's a whole different conversation.
Faith traditions, who people who really I've discovered that those
(45:47):
who really understand their faith and it applies to them
in a way of love and not fear, then it's
an easy conversation to have. The difficult dialogues are when
it's about conflict, war, division, lines in the sand.
Speaker 2 (46:12):
So with your exposure it's all sorts of different faith
traditions and religions. Have you found they have more in
common than not totally?
Speaker 3 (46:22):
You know the golden rule which I mentioned a few times,
Now do unto others as they would have done unto you.
Every faith tradition the world, religions right, those that are
commonly known, from Sikhism to Islam, to Judaism, to Christianity
to the high of Buddhism and so on, including indigenous,
(46:47):
they have a golden rule too as well. The Indigenous
isn't necessarily spoken and it's felt out a little differently actually,
but they all have the same unto the idea as
I would do under myself you know, for an example, right,
But they all, you know, they just rearrange the words
so that we all share that construct of I am
(47:11):
my beloved, and my beloved is mine and you are
my beloved.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
What upcoming project initiative are you most excited about right now?
Speaker 3 (47:22):
Yeah, the Global Women's Village is working on a global
conference and I'm referring to it as an unconference. It's
a convening of women that was inspired because all those
women tugging on our sleeves or grabbing my shoulders and saying,
we need our own conference, we need our own convenient,
(47:42):
we need this in our own space. Right. One thing
I hadn't said yet about that configuration of building a
village and what the greatest inspiration was is that the
world's religions, the rigid edges of world's religions, dating back
to the the written word, have been responsible for perpetuating
(48:03):
systems of domination otherwise known as patriarchy, and women contribute
to that too. So this isn't a man bashing moment.
There's never a man bashing moment in my world, but
this is not one of them, for sure. And so
here in the middle of the world's religions. We put
(48:24):
a village for women and men, designed by women. There
was something significant there and that is what I think
alchemized the air. So that's what we've got coming up.
It's called Destiny Ignited and you can stay tuned by
joining our newsletter at Global Women's Village Network. Yeah, it's
(48:46):
come in November twenty twenty six. We're waiting for our
first run to funding, so bring it on.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
That is exciting. What question would you ask your future
self about the impact of your work?
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Not a great question, That's a good question to ask
it because it helps me chart my path. What have
I learned? There? It is what have I learned? But
good question?
Speaker 2 (49:21):
How can listeners begin to recognize limital opportunities in their
own daily lives?
Speaker 3 (49:26):
Awareness their every day, between every breath, between a crisis
and action, the limit and choice. Question and answer. There's
never a moment I mean, and there's never a moment
where not we don't have these opportunities. A liminal space
can be a hot second, or it can be thirty years.
(49:48):
And I have some stories in there, that one which
demonstrates how things happen over a course of thirty years
that did not dawn on me until I was writing it. So,
like I said, l it wrote me. So yeah, it's
that practice, that awareness, practice awareness with that little, with
that little those steps I gave you earlier.
Speaker 2 (50:12):
The it seems like you know, when you're talking about
the liminal space, it's that space between, like you said,
thought and action, et cetera, et cetera. How can we
maximize that? How can we take advantage of it? Because
we tend to right over the top of it and
never take that moment. How how can we how can
we take advantage of it?
Speaker 3 (50:32):
Well, we have full agency over what we do, right,
I mean we might be we might be confined by
it or you know, restricted by time we have to
get to work, But that doesn't mean we have to
stop thinking about what what we're stepping over. Right, stay
with it, government, journal about it. You'll be surprised what
comes out of the bottom of your pen, the end
(50:54):
of your pen. I'll tell you. I've grabbed my head
a few times with where did that come from? So?
How do we make the most of it? And I
love that question because I'm all about making the most
of everything. It's just like unpacking it, unpack it, keep
asking yourself questions about it, Well, why do you think
that is? Where did that come from? What prevented me
(51:15):
from doing that in the first place? Yeah, stay with it,
breathe into it. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:23):
So when we're in one of those liminal spaces and
we're getting new information, where is it coming from?
Speaker 3 (51:30):
That's another great question. And I don't know that anybody knows.
It can be spirit, it can be your womb, it
could be your heart, it could be your soul. I
have a perspective that it's my soul talking to me.
And I also have the perspective that my soul's purpose
is to be free, and it will only be free
(51:51):
when I have learned all my lessons on the and
I am on the other side whenever that might be. So,
I I don't know where we're going, but I know
we're on our way. I say this all the time.
I don't want to poison the water hole when I
get there. What can I do to clean up my act?
What can I do to look at the baggage I
might be bringing with me and I don't want to
(52:12):
do that. What can I heal today?
Speaker 1 (52:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (52:17):
And what happens is it just turns into this joy
ride and I do a course on liminality which I
refer to it as a joy ride into the liminality
of your life.
Speaker 2 (52:29):
Yeah, if you have a vision of what the world
would look like if more of us take time in
that in between space, what would it be?
Speaker 3 (52:40):
I think it would be a beloved community. I think
it would be the beloved community where everyone takes what
they need and there's enough for everyone and the world
works for everyone. It's important to say here that fear
is a primary motivator in our lives today. So how
(53:03):
do we are? We motivated from love? And to understand,
fear is nothing more than love of something we are protecting.
So there really is no fear, It's just love that
needs a little more attention.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
Can fear exist in those liminal spaces?
Speaker 3 (53:21):
It does exist in those liminal spaces until we realize it,
until we love it back into wholeness, and that wholeness
is love. We take it, we start pulling it apart,
making a bite size What am I really afraid of here?
Where did that come from? Who taught me that? No
victimizing here? But let's learn from it. Okay, I've got agency.
Personal agency is the answer.
Speaker 2 (53:43):
Yeah, do you see victimization or self victimization is a
major problem in staying keeping us from staying in that
liminal space and getting the info there.
Speaker 3 (53:52):
Yeah, it's really easy to blame someone, so we really
don't have to take the time. There's a certain comfort
level and just whoa, it's me And in the end,
man did this to women? And you know and no, darling, no,
we've we are the divine feminine embodied we birth life.
We've we we are the healers and the nurtures and
(54:17):
the keepers of life and the keepers of tradition. And men.
We need our men and they contribute greally.
Speaker 2 (54:26):
For generations. In the indigenous cultures, there were matriarchal societies.
What do you see is the advantage of matriarchal society
that we're missing?
Speaker 3 (54:37):
Well, I think that I'm not. I don't propose that
we move into a matriarchal society because that takes us
back out of balance. Right. We need a system of partnership, right,
and there is an entire system of partnership scaffolding. There's
(54:58):
there's visit doctor Leon Eisler, E I s L E R.
Or reach out to me and I will I will
put you in touch with that and then direct you
to what it means for a system of partnership to
thrive that she is the architect of. And we're also
(55:19):
speaking this Friday on a call nice.
Speaker 2 (55:23):
It's that time, Sandy, when I have to ask you,
what's your mission.
Speaker 3 (55:28):
To future a new paradigm? Simple as that, Yeah, and
to be a good mom and grandmother.
Speaker 2 (55:37):
Being the elder. That's a challenge, isn't it.
Speaker 3 (55:42):
It is, and that's why it's so important that we
remember it. And then it's not a challenge anymore. Then
you just know who you are.
Speaker 2 (55:52):
Well, it's been absolutely wonderful having you on the show.
Unfortunately we are out of time, but Sandy, thank you
so much for being here and during your wisdom.
Speaker 3 (56:01):
It was a delight. Thank you so much for having
me and asking such great questions.
Speaker 2 (56:05):
My pleasure, our thanks to Sandyheart for an inspiring and
profoundly insightful conversation. Her workman reminds us that real change
doesn't happen in moments of certainty. It happens in the unknown,
the unseen, and the unclaimed spaces between what is and
what will be. To learn more about Sandy's book, upcoming programs,
(56:28):
or the Global Women's Village visit sandyheart dot com. Until
next time, may you walk boldly through your own liminal
spaces and discover the transformation waiting on the other side.
As always, thank you for joining us on Mission Evolution
with Gildoviyeka. For more information or to enjoy our past
(56:48):
archived episodes, visit www Mission evolution dot org. But please
be sure to join us right here next time, as
this mission will continue bringing in information, resources and support
to our evolving world.
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