January 15, 2024 • 39 mins
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In this thought-provoking installment, we dive deep into the latest scandal involving the esteemed Pastor TD Jakes, exploring the lessons we can learn from this situation. Join us as we discuss the impact of unequally yoked relationships and the importance of living authentically for Christ. But there's more! We also address a recent email we received from Pastor Kenneth Wagner of United Church of Dover Delaware.
Taking a trip down memory lane, we reflect on a podcast episode we released 3 years ago, where we shared our personal experience at the church. Join us as we unpack this situation, questioning the necessity of such an email after all these years and considering the limited viewership it garnered. Don't miss out on this enlightening conversation!
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-truth-diaries-podcast--4401885/support.
In this thought-provoking installment, we dive deep into the latest scandal involving the esteemed Pastor TD Jakes, exploring the lessons we can learn from this situation. Join us as we discuss the impact of unequally yoked relationships and the importance of living authentically for Christ. But there's more! We also address a recent email we received from Pastor Kenneth Wagner of United Church of Dover Delaware.
Taking a trip down memory lane, we reflect on a podcast episode we released 3 years ago, where we shared our personal experience at the church. Join us as we unpack this situation, questioning the necessity of such an email after all these years and considering the limited viewership it garnered. Don't miss out on this enlightening conversation!
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-truth-diaries-podcast--4401885/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Join us in this True DIARYES episodeas we dive into the scandals surrounding td
Jakes and the email correspondence between myself, Valencia, and Pastor Kenneth Wagner from
United Church here in Dover, Delaware, and the valuable lessons it teaches about
our faith. You know one thingI will almost called in that thing where
(00:49):
TDJS was doing his response because Iwas Nick. He said that, no,
it wasn't it. It was asmart Christian YouTube channel where he was
talking about how he's saying he reallywasn't address it, but he did throughout
because you can bother him because hekept freaking it up, but he did
saying there was that even if Idid do it, I could just a
statement, I know what he's good. But even if I did do it,
(01:11):
I could just repent and stuff.But I don't know. That didn't
come off right? Now? Didhe take that part out? Was that
port they said out? Yeah,because they probably did go back and saying,
oh yeah, that wasn't good.I did, like smart Christians how
he did it, and then NickNick because they look good for perspectives from
it. It was like they're bothtalking about the same thing. Smart Christians
was in his sermon what he saidwrong, and Nick was talking about like
that too. He also talked aboutthe people. He said how it affects.
(01:34):
You could see it was affected hiskids and family, and I see
that. You know, these arepeople, which I get, like,
I'm not looking for his nownfault.I mean, if he did it,
I think it should come out.Oh absolutely absolutely, you know, But
I'm not sitting here hoping, yeahTDGS goes down because just like what we
were talking about United, it affectsall the people. Like if the church
goes down, it's gonna affect thepeople that are in the church. But
(01:55):
like, we ain't gonna have nocontrol how people react to our stuff.
But at the end of the day, we know our hearts. That was
and there's no apology necessary for that. But I'm like, dude, why
are you sliding into our emails?But they go emails back. Yes,
he would have kept going back forlike this one. He tried to He
tried to get it, keep it. Theres like Mary Christmas out there.
Okay, I throw all this,but he's like, I pray that you
(02:17):
guys consider get more contests where yougive a review of a church that is
simply not accurate. I'm not angryI've heard, but understand you don't know
our heart. Merry Christmas, likemy thing is still that's what they we
learned how to take criticism as aChristian because you're gonna get it like we
might have been the only one Idon't know on I don't know how many
(02:37):
stuff so on YouTube. Nobody elsewants to talk about United that he knows
of, but not everybody is goingto be that you're great. No,
like we're going to get bad reviewsand stuff like me even happens. You
can't take everything personal. And Ithink that's probably gonna be one of my
biggest struggles only because you got everybodynamed MoMA on YouTube now calling everybody heretic
(02:59):
more or false prophet or false whatever, false preacher or something. And I'm
thinking it's gonna take for us tosay one thing that maybe he's not so
aligned with the Bible and call ouropinion over false because people aren't gonna people
some people have like you said,sure it's actually span. They're not going
to listen everything and they're going tofight here one thing contact clip that suffer
I said, you know, Iknow, we make a conscious effort which
(03:22):
I didn't really pay to him toomuch mind, other than a couple of
points when we sat there and didthose part one and two. That one
we remember, we highly emphasized yourexperience on there and went from there and
then we I think we looked atthe website. Everything we did it was
an opinion, and if it wasopinion, I think we said opinion,
but I don't think it was noopinion in there. If I made it.
(03:43):
If I had an opinion, itwas from your experience about that.
That's why he couldn't say mine wasfalse, because he knows about lying.
That's how we like, it's justreasonably accurate. He just shut out the
things that he didn't. You know, he would have emphasized more about why
he didn't spread the gospel in Manchester, so he couldn't say that y'all did,
Yeah, because you were there.Yeah, if you sat there,
I guess you would have told mewhy. I mean, what are you
(04:03):
going to say, like, y'allsugar? What over there? And knocked
all doors? Yep? And Ifelt that what I was saying, I'm
like, what is this film?Who's out here doing this? Playground?
Your stuff, like like you said, like you at that time, you
were a new believer. You're goingout there to make sure people know that
you love them in the Lord.Picking up trash is an active service,
sure, and maybe even an actof love. You want all stretch of
(04:25):
the word. But you gotta talkto people. Did they might talk to
anybody? No, nobody in thatneighborhood, because they even become nobody came
out from the natural neighborhood. Sowe talked to nobody in there, so
they all know that was just peoplefrom the office. That's probably what they're
thought, like, you look gotthrow dog way out here, clean enough
to stuff like that was the timeto introduce you stuff with your night church.
(04:46):
You know you have a church.Even if that was so they close
the door, but at least youmade contact with some people in their neighborhood
who's out there. The fact thatyour experience was demoted to reasonably accurate to
me, it seems like he's aperson that's not willing to accept any type
of accountability or really take constructive criticism. Can you just listen to the podcast
I rose hearst for you. Ican hear your voice and hear the frustration
(05:11):
you are carrying for United. Yourtone made it clear that there was a
personal issue with the church. Ididn't. I don't think so either,
like because I remember we listened toit too, and I know I started
out just looking at this tone ofstuff. Now, whatever my word choices
were, it is what it is, just two kids like you. You
know, people that go to thatchurch and have war behind the stuff.
(05:34):
If you wanted to hurt the church, you could have put that stuff out
hands down the church. But that'snot what we were trying to do.
No, not at all, Notat all. I think, if I
can recall, I believe our wholemission was yeah too in a sense exposed
because we know people in Delaware gogo a lot of people do that church.
(05:55):
But we just want to make surethat they know this. Look,
this is what you're gonna get,this is what you're in. But there
are some good things about it.They do make you feel very welcome when
you go there. I think that'salways awesome anywhere you Like, I never
went there and nobody's greeted. Youget everybody greeting you, and the people
probably said that that I served with. They're nice, they're nice. You
never felt like anybody that was was. I never had a bad experience with
(06:17):
the people away for this meeting.I remember you telling me too, when
you serve and how you gotta doall that, Like you just told me
that like last week or whatever,and that you know they do take precautions
and make sure you know that thosesex offenders and stuff, watching kids and
like serving in places they on needbe serving before starting afterwards, how they
feed you and make sure you geta chance to go in there and hear
the word too. That's why Ithought, too after the second mis set
(06:41):
to go out back again, becauselike you could tell, like you're saying,
you're not angry, but I feela little bit you're angry. But
I think this too, like youwere. You talked about his servant,
but you talked about how he focuseson him, I think a lot.
And that's what that's what really gotto right, Like you can see what
he did the email. He's likeI was reasonable act, oh no,
and you know, yeah, youwere reasonably accurate for the one the one
(07:03):
that attended that church for months wasonly reasonably accurate. So I know I
didn't stay no darn chance. Icame very personal. But that's something that
did upset me in that email whenhe was talking about him sharing the story
and comparing it to how Jesus sharingthe parables is toping. He said,
to be accused of narcissism because Iused story to relate to people was hurtful,
(07:24):
especially because I learned this method fromour Savior himself. He used story
parable to relate gospel principles to people. Can I ask you a question,
has any of the stories that heshared and you're just being there in personal
or looking online that have ever beenchrist like or like really geared towards Christ
(07:44):
or the message. I don't thinkso. I mean he tries to fit
them in there with his little personalbackground stories to be he's just long witted
with with it. Let's get toit. He'll talk about him and Jays.
I think soda is where they goout to the store above U.
Theyre try related back to what hismessage is. But it never really hits
him to me anyway. Now,when you look in the Bible, in
(08:07):
the Gospels in particular, I knowwhere you're there, and Jesus shared a
parable dies it go with the message. Whatever he's saying Okay, Well he
did share parables and stuff. Hedidn't say his name that he didn't say
he was He said it about somethingelse completely, but like you said,
tied into the message. I'm like, yeah, so I got a question
(08:28):
for you. So how how wouldhow do you think Kenneff's approach, his
email, his tone, all thatcompares to TD Jakes's approach, tone and
words he said. As far ashis rebuttal for all these accusations, I
don't know. I didn't feel likethis was like a loving thing with Kenneth
(08:52):
Wagner, definitely, because like Isaid, it felt he was angry,
and I think that's why he emphasizedI'm not angry. I've heard like it
felt more like you if you wereangry. Jake's all go. I didn't
hear every single thing he said.He definitely could tell he was hurt.
That was her, he kept saying, because I know, you know when
something's on your mind and surf,you're gonna keep bring it up. You
(09:16):
don't want to it bothers you.You could tell it's a effect on him,
so he can't bring it up.So I could see he was hurt.
It was hurt by this stuff.Yeah, I think I appreciate at
least that part of it, becausehe was very honest about his hurt and
stuff like that, even despite ustelling him that it was not the intention.
That's to me, that's something he'sgonna have to get over. But
(09:37):
as far as I feel like tdJake's too, he could have been a
lot more honest. He could takea page out of Kitnis. But because
you've got a major platform, nowhether it is true or not, I'll
be very hurt. I'm like,I'll be on my mind, especially something
something like that if we don't likeI said, when I say, if
it's true or not like that,that's a big dog gavinization. So they
(10:00):
got a couple questions that I gothim down right. Did you hear the
sermon that TDJS preach on Christmas Eve? I actually didn't hear the whole thing.
Somebody clipped a couple things on there. When I say clip, they
showed like four or five minutes listia. This man was preaching coarsely. The
creator has now become subject to whathe created. He gave up his omnipotence,
(10:28):
his omniscience, and his omnipresence.He submitted himself to prayer because he'd
given up omnipotence all powerful. Nowhe has to go to the garden and
pray omniscience because he says, noman knows today nor the hour which the
(10:48):
Son of Man cometh. No,not the angels nor the Son, but
the Father, which is in heaven. Means I don't know everything anymore.
So I gave up my omissions.He traveled because he gave up his omnipresence.
(11:09):
You addressing something that you say youweren't going to address, you got
the crowd all cheering, which Igot in that question about that, and
then you literally use Christmas Eve.He used it to speak and preach falsely.
Now you're saying that Jesus at somepoint in time wasn't all who he
is. They say that he doesa lot of that he believes in that
modism. Yeah, it makes sense. If everything was true, all I
(11:35):
gotta do is repent. You needto repent for that sermon too. If
he's not all who he is atevery point in time, that he ain't
it at all. Yeah, Ithink that was just bad on his tape
to like that. That part waslike got cruiser, Like why would you
like if I did, I repetlike it don't matter, you know,
yeah, like I don't think ifthat you did that stuff, you just
(11:58):
repent, They're gonna be enough.Nobody else was saying to is like,
because you kept saying I'm good,Well you're not that you want people to
do to make you and my thingis and I think now we don't kind
of got away from the true meaningof repentance. And okay, yeah you
(12:18):
can repent. God is so mercifulin everything, but it's an attitude he
that the II will not say thatGod looks into the hearts, He knows
our heart. You also have tolike change for what you're doing. Because
if these like you said, thesealligators are true, are you hope you
ain't still doing it? So youtalk about all you gotta do it's bad.
I'm curious to hear your viewpoint onthis. So when we have to
repent for whatever sin is in ourlives, isn't like a determination on your
(12:43):
part, isn't like a genuine changeeven though you know you're gonna struggle.
It is like a dependence on theLord. When it comes to that part,
it's like a it's like a dyingself in that moment, right,
you know, not saying that onceyou repent that you're not going to do
whatever. You'r strugg absolute, butit's definitely it's not like it's not easy.
(13:05):
It's not like I'm just gonna godo this to get like it's a
struggle, like, well, ifI do it to get, well,
you know, I'll repay God forgiveme. So you hear the crowd cheering
them all. He's like all thatstuff. What did you think about his
congregation? They're gonna they're gonna gowhatever he says. Like Unfortunately, you
see a lot of these people whoare like I said, they have idols
(13:28):
like TD Jake's like he falls down, it's gonna destroy everyone, you know,
everyone because they love him so much. And I think they can't separate
what he does and how he preachesfrom the person like he's a person.
He can fall, he can doyou can do this kind of like what
the Chris saying about tip, Yeahhe can do all this, but he
also give you doing that. Absolutelyabsolutely can't put them on the pedal like
(13:54):
like I love by an Tony Evansbecause we don't listen to many people.
But if he's doing this stuff.I mean that don't take away from well
because a sermon, right, No, and you know what, Okay,
let's talk about our mutual sin problem. We can do this not right,
(14:15):
but we also can go evangelized.I don't know about you. Don't you
feel a contradiction there a little bit? So I think that's why a lot
of part of our ministry really hasmaybe been put on pauls a lot of
times, because we know in ourpersonal walks, our relationship, our private
relationship with the Lord is probably notwhere it needs to be. You know
(14:35):
what I mean. I don't understandwhy some people don't get that. Well,
maybe they don't have a private relationship. But like you said, like
they treat these people with such anamor, and like Christian Key said,
like you said, deitize these people. I'm like you, I don't care.
I don't care, first of all. But everybody's clapping and cheering on
you because they burned. I'm notdoing all that. And you remember,
(14:56):
I remember I told you it mighthave been last year sometime I had to
treat we were like sitting now,we were like a crowd of people,
and I remember you were like sittingup you know, maybe like five or
six seven roads ahead of me,so I saw the back of ahead.
Everybody else was pretty much blurred out. And I remember this preacher, I
remember just not sitting right and probablyspeaking falsely and wickedly whatever. Everybody got
up and cheered him on, andI remember I couldn't see you, no
(15:20):
more than everybody standing up at thispoint. So I'm sitting down all I
see remember looking up, I seenyou know, many people. I'm like,
oh darn, I'm like, reallyjust the only ones on the chick
I'm staying it up front. Thisone of my thoughts were when I was
sitting there and see you, I'mlike, man, I want to dolina
sit up, standing up, goingwith this stuff. And then somehow he
was like, oh, let's followme or something, what if something like
(15:41):
that, And it was so heartwarmingto see that you were still sitting down
and not just us. There wasa couple more people, and made me
really think, I'm like, youknow what, one lord, I don't
ever want to follow somebody, ordeatize somebody, or idolize somebody other than
you. You were my everything,you know what I mean. And I'm
like, man, you're relicious everything. She's still with the I'm like,
(16:02):
you know what, that might onlybeen five of us out of five hundred,
but all five of us in herewe're ryding for you. And God
always has a remnant. Like Idon't understand, like why they put people
on the pestil like that, likepeople fall apart after you know, something
like this happens, like no,not TD why can't it be TD T.
(16:23):
He's God, He's just like you. He just has the gift the
preach like like, none of thesecelebrities will surprised me because they're human just
like us. They could still betalented and gifted and sitting in their life
like I understand it. It's likethe people that you're that you're a pre
(16:47):
preacher, You're you're living a doublelife kind of like life Robbie Zach Ryan.
Yeah, he was up there andyou know what he was preaching was
right, like, but he wasup there living a double double life.
It game and it came out likethis stuff is going to come ouse,
like you know, hopefully it's nottrue, but if it is, I
hope, you know, firstly,I do hope it comes out. Do
(17:07):
you see yourself lost and full ofuncertainties. Pain, uncertainty, and division
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(17:29):
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(17:52):
give today that's Way of Truth emdot org slash donate. Thank you so
much for your support. What doyou think about it? If it is
let's say it's false and these peopleare coming out and falsely accused it,
do you thinte that there should beso? Because my brother used to asked
me this a whole different subject,but about those that accuse people are like
(18:14):
sexual as well, and then itturns out that they really didn't do it
in their career and they he said, there should be wiser or something for
the people who everybody that has hada very vocal stance on it should owe
this man an apology. If itcomes out that he did nothing wrong.
I think there should become some kindof retribution for him in that point,
however, and this is why I'mglad we have this, because we like
(18:37):
to speak not so much not juston the personal thing, but on your
doctrine as well. You're a modalist. They owe you apology, but you
do apologize too, and get yourdoctor in shape because you still leading people's
renk the spark Christians. Well,he's spoken to to because he said he
could have used this definitely to notspeak on that, but to get his
the doctor straight. He's saying that'swhat he chose to speak, not about
(19:00):
the allegations but basically his his doctor. And yes, you could definitely do
it though you could put put yourselflike you know, how you write the
paper, take the facts of them, put your you know, put your
what you want to say around thesefacts. This punch of it there.
See your your buddy Marcus Rogers,He's take on and stuff. I've seen
the one with Mace Sad about howeverybody's like talk about TV, you gotta
(19:25):
make sure you're right too, andstuff like that, because he was if
it's just to say that Mace baseever said that, which I do see.
There there was no clips where heactually said that stuff about TD.
Okay, great Marcus, because hesaid he talked to market uh he and
he said, uh, y'all allall talking, y'all got so much energy
for TV. And he said he'snot talk about the allegations. He said,
(19:47):
but y'all gotta make sure you're righttoo, because how they come down
on him, that's how God's gonnacome down on you. Something like that.
And I get it that you dohave to beat those that are out
there. Uh. I guess he'sreally friends and there was try to get
gossip or for her stay offall orwhatever that you gotta make sure that you're
right to because which I get.I'm rooting for brother Marcus. I do.
(20:14):
I definitely get no one should everpray on there on somebody else's downfall.
But I mean see I'm a littleconflicting, and I'm pretty much gonna
share my position on the matter.I don't care because at some point I
care about your soul. I doyou got to go down? Okay,
God is no respector of person,and I'm not saying I'm not saying him
way. Oh, get dumb becausethey did it too, or get domb
(20:36):
because you know, no, ifyou did something, pay for it right
there. It comes out there orit's gonna come out. And you know,
I realized the chastisement of the Lordis a blessing. Will he say,
oh gosh, I don't know ifit's in proverbs or songs, but
he chastised those whom he loves.If we are getting corrected by the Lord,
(20:57):
I think that's a that's a termthat love for me. Again,
if that's called bringing on somebody downfall, then I guess that's what we're gonna
call it, called repent. Andthat's for anybody. Like if you're up
here doing wrong and stuff, especiallydisguise you are coming off as you're a
Christian, there's there's a bigger responsibilityyou're out here, you know, door
(21:21):
not living uh living right for ChristAnd then all here preaching. So that's
why I wanted to about it ifit's true, because you shouldn't be up
here preaching these people. You outhere doing this stuff and then telling them
they shouldn't why they shouldn't send thisstuff, and you're, you know,
sending freely, which is crazy.Like how you how your mouth open with
(21:41):
such hypocrisy? I don't know how. I don't know how Robbie did it
all that, and you're doing thisstuff. But you know, my mom
always said them, she said,you notice some preachers don't preach on the
things that they found in like Iremember we in fact, I think we
use it on at least a coupleat least one clip on like TikTok or
something. Well, they asked thatone famous little question about homosexuality or LGBTQ
(22:04):
stuff, girl Franklin, and Iknow TDJ was up in that piece.
The answer question, do you believein same sex marriage? No? Do
you believe in same sexion marriage?Valencia? No? Okay, we gotta
be careful who we surround ourselves with, right. I don't think it means
you can't have like non Christian friends, like all your friends have to be
(22:25):
Christians. But certain stuff you justknow you can't you can't do, you
know, like I was telling youabout that guy Discover like he's gay.
If you talked to her work,I could work with anybody. I had
nothing to get this because you knowhis lifestyle. But he was having a
wedding. I know if I gottaasked that question, I was not going
(22:48):
stuff you just can't do with TD, Like, yeah, if you're close
friends to the family doing the pastorduties, I wish that's fine. You
know, he was saying half birthdayto him, but I don't think theyttending
any of his party. You're juststopping through, especially in rather you're a
public or private that's got other becausepeople gonna get everything. But I mean,
(23:14):
what you're gonna do at Dinny party? He drenks like none of his
lifestyle, says none of it.I haven't seen anything either. I used
to think that unequally yo really justmeant for marriages, And I think maybe
that's one of the struggles we havein the in the Christian world that I
think we really always relate that verseto relationship wise, like remaining relationship wise
(23:37):
when you are unequally yoked, evenif your friends and you know, stuff
like that, and it's very innocent. For a while, you rubb off
on each other, especially when youspend a lot of time with the person
you're gonna rub off. Your mannerismmight because some things I'll pick up from
you, some things you pick upfrom me. It just that's happened.
That happens. I've met so manycool, unsaved people, so many you
(24:00):
have so many cool people. IfI wouldn't say if I'd be hanging out
with them, but I know Idid. Just there's a line I just
can't cross it because I'm not pickingup on your man I'm not going to
where you're going to. I don'tthink you're coming where. I'm gonna invite
you to go where I'm going.But I'm sure you're not coming, you
know it Just we're not on thesame wavelength. I don't think it's going
to be kind of productive. You'regonna pull me back into that world and
(24:22):
I'm gonna pull you into you know, this life kind of reminds me of
like CC Whitney, where we'll seethat like how I feel like that relationship
because you know Whitney, I thinkshe was kind of in and out with
the secular world and she go thereand pray and stuff like that, So
it seems like CEC was rubbing off. She would go to her and that
(24:42):
part of her was rubbing off.The prayer is putting her back where you
know, yep, to what sheknows. Yeah, I feel like she
was like a safe spot. Solike it was like that. I think
that it's fine, but like itdoesn't work that way. F us.
We can't we go out to theclubs or are doing that, you know,
definitely not. There is something veryimpactful by swimming upstream and going a
(25:03):
different way or doing something different.And I feel like, like you said,
with Whitney and CC, I thinkI really do think that was very
very helpful for Whitney at least tostay alive for more years, you know,
to come and really probably still havethat foundation. But like you said,
I cannot imagine doing that same stuffI was doing when I was compromising.
I won't. It's like, youknow, Jesus, like he wasn't
(25:26):
headed around. It was for changepreaching and stuff, and tell the Gospel,
he's trying to get them over thehead side. He's not trying to
fit in with them. Exactly anywhereI go. I wanted to show Christ
in it. However, learning now, I'm like, you know what,
I'm not always Christ conscious. I'mnot Christ is different. He broke,
(25:48):
he's got you know what I mean, he's always on point all time because
he's always gotten. Contrary to popularyou go with a bunch of people and
you're like the the Ondie one.Yes, yes, it's gotta be hard.
Well, I guess I could dothis, so I guess we can
give it. We can give in. Yeah, we can give it.
(26:08):
You're gonna go there and get thatbill. And then people got off the
right, you know, you knowwhat you say. I'm sorry I can't.
But if you got into it,it's different that they come to you.
You got there, You get thatchance. Yes, you have a
(26:29):
chance that you're going to fall.Yes, the percentage is greater on that
one at least for some topic.Who you surround yourself with that is really
really important because I believe that's apart, a great part of our downfall
as Christians. You know what Imean, I'm not gonna say, And
like even with T. D.Jakes, I'm not gonna say he didn't
start out really on point. Doctorsound doctrine, because I believe the same
thing for Kirk Yolanda Baby, lookCray. I don't really know whatever I
(26:56):
believe. I don't believe everybody startout with them on bad footing by any
means, however, But I knowthe pressure of society, especially I can
imagine their platform that they grow andgrow and grow and get more famous and
stuff, more pressure and more worldly, and it happens. But I believe
that we're going to see a mightysweep through the church. We're gonna be
seeing separated on the whet in thetear, like the people that's sitting in
these pulp in these little pews andstuff Sunday after Sunday getting the word and
(27:19):
being holy on Sunday. I thinkwe're going to see a major separation.
And I am excited about that.I'm not going to sugarcoat that. I'm
very excited because if it takes someonelike TD Jake's, who I compare to
Nebkin, I'll be honest, becauseGod can humble never Cazzer. He can
do the same thing. Man.If it takes one person to start the
(27:40):
domino effect, then so be it. I'm happy about that because I'm tired
of these fake Christians anyway. Butlet me ask you though, like,
are you saying that we should limitunsaved friends that we have or just like
basically just know when Yeah, Ithink, I think. I think wisdom
needs to come into play. It'sI feel like for us, the responsibility
we need to be yoked with God, you know what I mean, because
(28:04):
then we're gonna develop the sensitivity tothe spirit at that point and stuff like
that. I believe. I don'tbelieve that we just need to have just
Oh gosh, it's gonna sound badbecause it's like, and this is my
opinion, I don't see the effectivenessof just having Christian friends. I do
not otherwise, none of us so, but I do believe that as Christians
(28:27):
is we're gonna have unsaved people that'sgonna be around. I mean, my
God is probably more unsaved than safing. The effectiveness comes in and the responsibility
falls on us obviously to not putourselves around situation we're not willing to share
Christ then, you know what Imean? So, yeah, Christ went
anywhere he went, he affected change. Let's say your coworkers want to go
out to the bar. You're like, Okay, I'm finally gonna go.
(28:49):
Okay, what you're gonna do forLicia, Well, I'm going to preach
the gospel. Girl, let mego with you don't but I don't.
But I'm also not gonna blame youfor not wanting to go because it is
the bar. That's why I don'tgo to a lot of the events that
my job when they go to,because they always wanted to go to the
bar, and I'm like, theyhave a lot of them drink. I
(29:10):
don't. I'm just gonna be sittingthere like out of place with I do
think too. Let's say you didgo to the bar. You say that
you're sitting there, you ain't drinking, you ain't doing nothing that God wouldn't
be pleased with. But you're alsonot saying anything. You're kind of going
along to get along. You thinkas Christians we should be doing that now.
It's just the point basically they gonnathink that, you know, I
(29:33):
want to be you know, socializedwith us. I don't drink, you
know, But I think that's alsoanother point to make with like the Manchester
Loveday Kenneth Wager situation, we haveto use our voice. We have to
like, we're gonna we're gonna affectchange, We're gonna be christ Like.
I want people to see Christ inme. I don't want to talk.
I want Christ to see I wantpeople to see love, the love of
(29:56):
Christ in me by just picking upthe trash and not saying nothing to them,
not give him the gospel. What'sthe point? Like you said,
what is the point of that?So I don't know how we got off
that topic. That's all your fault, Delicia. But yeah, you know,
I think we definitely need to beprotecting our walk at all times.
Honest to God, I really I'mvery protective my walk. I get finally
(30:18):
too personally offended with my walk.I need to work on that, by
the way, because I don't needto take everything so personal. I ain't
gonna lie. I don't everything.Every person's comment or any person's actually is
not a direct attack on my walkwith the Lord. I definitely, I
know. I overemphasized it because Iknow that's where that's that's my identity,
you know what I mean, Like, you're not just attacking my character,
(30:41):
which I still have a problem withto I work on that too, But
you're attacking my identity. That's whyI kind of that email like, because
you're you're kind of projected what we'rewhat we were about. You don't even
know. I don't even know that. I don't feel like we need to
sit there all to discuss that withhim. But you can't. You can't
tell us that we're attacking the churchor we don't have any content to minimize
(31:03):
yours to reasonably accurate somebody that wentthere and served there through the process.
What's accurate? Then I don't seemy thing is with him. Yeah,
you can. I'm not gonna sayyou can't feel offended. I get all
that, we acknowledge that, butat the end of the day, you
got to ask yourself, why areyou offended? Why are you hurt?
(31:23):
I kind of let things, yeah, kind affect me a little bit and
then told me I have to sitwith film and stuff like, Okay,
it probably was who cares. Iain't gonna say this person. I don't
take it like I was a littlebit taken. Ask this is email.
How are you going to be ableto protect your walk and your feelings and
(31:44):
not take so much offense to whatpeople say? Yeah, I definitely said
I got work. I have toprepare you all that, but yeah,
I definitely have to to work orI take it everything, because that's what
I was saying with him, like, you're not always going to get the
comments, so first I know whatthis. We're not your podcasts. You're
(32:05):
going to get those that the trollsabout there and what to say. It
is absolutely like now I've got betterwith that because you know YouTube, they
just going there to say anything,Oh yeah, attack and whatever forget the
floor. It's like, oh,I gotta respond. But I'm like,
now I know people they want that, that's what they're looking for. You
should respond your stuff. So yep, you gotta you gotta know what when
(32:27):
it's wants to respond and when does. I think sometimes you do have to
respond. That's because there might bepeople seeking and that's a truly seeking and
want to know the answers. Butyou have to definitely like seek through and
see which ones to respond to.Ones that's attack and are saying something outlanders.
Yeah, I think that's always ourmotivation, right because of those people
(32:47):
that might be in that, especiallythat road Wade. Yeah, I mean
that was a lot you got unsafe, same people, you got a whole
bunch of mixtures. So it islike, and I think if I can't
recall specifically, but I know theones we did respond to the people was
like, that's not in the Bible. No, I feel like those things
because we are witnesses, we areliving witnesses, and we need to defend
argue with people. Now, Bobsays, what said. I can't change
(33:10):
it. You can't change it.It is what it is. And to
me, if I was offended andI sent the first email and that was
the response I got, I'm notnot to pipe down on a personal level,
but I would have piped down anemail he wrapped up. Yeah,
because in the response we defended,explained our position better and that's not our
intention, and blah blah blah,blah blah. And you've wrapped up like
(33:35):
you turned that stucker all the wayup to one hundred. And they was
like a five because you you haveto express yourself. I think that's what
it was like. He was setdown. He had That's why he set
the other mail, because it's likewe're kind of where ended it. But
he didn't get out what he wantedto know. He didn't and he had
that because he knew us by basicallyhe had to stucky the video because he
(33:55):
knew who addressed. Yeah. Yeah, he broke it down like that.
It's videos audio, so he knewhe knew who he wanted to address.
He said something, you know whatyou're like really thinking about. You have
to get it out. But Ifelt like that's what he was. He
was out with it. I hopehe feels better. That's all I can
say, because I don't know whatelse to get out of that. He
got what he wanted to say out. Yeah, I really hope he's doing
(34:16):
better because we've gotten absolutely nothing outof that. But it's still it's still
the truth. And I don't knowme personally. If I wouldn't, I
wouldn't have done all what he did. I'll be honest, I would have
done it. Let's say we doan episode and we get like a I
don't know that somebody critique it herstuff. Yeah, I probably probably would
(34:37):
take you know, I'm sure,but I am not going to sit up
here and like email this person orfind out who they are now. But
we and we had seven views betweenboth videos. Okay, we had nine.
Oh I'm sorry. I don't wantto short change us for two,
But like sir, that video wentabsolutely nowhere. You see if the whole
(35:00):
bunch of people are looking at thisUnited church, but I mean if my
people were from United, right,baby. I think in this new year,
I'm very excited about this new year. I ain't gonna lie. I
feel like a totally different person.I really a new year. Do setup
do everything we can quickly reflect ontwenty twenty three. How has that?
(35:24):
How has twenty twenty three impacted youyour mindset, your walk and really prepared
you for twenty twenty four. Idon't know. It's like a lot of
growth. I think this year newbeginnings, and I don't know, I
think it's just made me, likeeven financially everywhere everywhere in my area kind
(35:49):
of had to take a look atit. Yes, yeah, look at
some things and try to, youknow, get some things going to that's
going to help in the new year. So definitely, I would say growth,
Yeah, I believe. And justobviously we've been friends for a while
now, but I'm going to justisolate for twenty twenty three because I can't
(36:10):
go back because I see tremendous growthon your part. But just even seeing
twenty twenty three, there has beena lot of growth, you know what
I mean, I see, evenif it's just mindset wise, it really
really is some of the things thatI know used to frustrate you prior to
twenty twenty three. Now don't fai'n't gonna say, don't face you at
all, but not definitely, notnearly. As how the reactions are a
(36:34):
lot different. Yes, yes,yes, And then I can sit right
across from you and tell you that, so God, it's so good.
Distractions and accountability those are the twowords that really got me just kind of
moving forward a little bit. Iwas able to see my role in it,
so me taking accountability on that enabledme to be able to change it,
(36:59):
which made me to try to eliminatesome of the distractions that I've been
Man, it's something seeing yourself.It's really something really seeing yourself. It's
scary, you know, because don'tnobody want to feel like they're not perfect.
Don't give I don't even know whoyou are, you know what I'm
saying, especially perfections, So likeseeing yourself And just like, okay,
I did allow that. I can'tbe a victim because I've allowed this to
(37:21):
happen. I see you with thedistractions anyway, because I remember, because
you have nothing done in ministry.Somebody was always expressive. Try try to
get try to get the information.Don't hear for days, maybe not days,
but still no ministry like wow,yep. And with the family in
(37:42):
the house and she's still up thereworking on get out of my room.
That's definitely that's definitely changed. Thisis what we want to do. This
this the books. I ain't gotthe work books right now, but we
did a lot like God's great,and there's no way world, we're gonna
be sitting here not giving God glory. There's no way, there's no way.
(38:05):
What it's like we did one thing, he did a thousand, like
it doesn't make sense to me.I don't know how he got them with
all this stuff, with the workbooks and oh it's now. We didn't
evangelize none, but we got thetools to do it. Oh, it's
been very nice, Melitia. Man, God is so good. It's almost
like you take care of his business. He's gonna take care of yours,
do you know what I mean?Or even just get on the path and
(38:27):
take a step of faith. Hegot you. I don't know when this
started with us this year and stayingfocused and stuff like that, but somehow
it just started clicking one after another. I don't even know when we had
a discussion via text saying hey,we're gonna focus on all the cycle ship.
I wonder the point was. Idon't know this year, right,
Yeah, it might have been thetrip, Like, I don't know.
(38:51):
Honestly, I think our next stepsare in twenty twenty four ministry wise,
getting that ministry man. Honestly,I think that's like the cherry on the
either that or missionary work. Ihad something something gotta give. This will
be very fun, Yes,
Join us in this True DIARYES episodeas we dive into the scandals surrounding td
Jakes and the email correspondence between myself, Valencia, and Pastor Kenneth Wagner from
United Church here in Dover, Delaware, and the valuable lessons it teaches about
our faith. You know one thingI will almost called in that thing where
(00:49):
TDJS was doing his response because Iwas Nick. He said that, no,
it wasn't it. It was asmart Christian YouTube channel where he was
talking about how he's saying he reallywasn't address it, but he did throughout
because you can bother him because hekept freaking it up, but he did
saying there was that even if Idid do it, I could just a
statement, I know what he's good. But even if I did do it,
(01:11):
I could just repent and stuff.But I don't know. That didn't
come off right? Now? Didhe take that part out? Was that
port they said out? Yeah,because they probably did go back and saying,
oh yeah, that wasn't good.I did, like smart Christians how
he did it, and then NickNick because they look good for perspectives from
it. It was like they're bothtalking about the same thing. Smart Christians
was in his sermon what he saidwrong, and Nick was talking about like
that too. He also talked aboutthe people. He said how it affects.
(01:34):
You could see it was affected hiskids and family, and I see
that. You know, these arepeople, which I get, like,
I'm not looking for his nownfault.I mean, if he did it,
I think it should come out.Oh absolutely absolutely, you know, But
I'm not sitting here hoping, yeahTDGS goes down because just like what we
were talking about United, it affectsall the people. Like if the church
goes down, it's gonna affect thepeople that are in the church. But
(01:55):
like, we ain't gonna have nocontrol how people react to our stuff.
But at the end of the day, we know our hearts. That was
and there's no apology necessary for that. But I'm like, dude, why
are you sliding into our emails?But they go emails back. Yes,
he would have kept going back forlike this one. He tried to He
tried to get it, keep it. Theres like Mary Christmas out there.
Okay, I throw all this,but he's like, I pray that you
(02:17):
guys consider get more contests where yougive a review of a church that is
simply not accurate. I'm not angryI've heard, but understand you don't know
our heart. Merry Christmas, likemy thing is still that's what they we
learned how to take criticism as aChristian because you're gonna get it like we
might have been the only one Idon't know on I don't know how many
(02:37):
stuff so on YouTube. Nobody elsewants to talk about United that he knows
of, but not everybody is goingto be that you're great. No,
like we're going to get bad reviewsand stuff like me even happens. You
can't take everything personal. And Ithink that's probably gonna be one of my
biggest struggles only because you got everybodynamed MoMA on YouTube now calling everybody heretic
(02:59):
more or false prophet or false whatever, false preacher or something. And I'm
thinking it's gonna take for us tosay one thing that maybe he's not so
aligned with the Bible and call ouropinion over false because people aren't gonna people
some people have like you said,sure it's actually span. They're not going
to listen everything and they're going tofight here one thing contact clip that suffer
I said, you know, Iknow, we make a conscious effort which
(03:22):
I didn't really pay to him toomuch mind, other than a couple of
points when we sat there and didthose part one and two. That one
we remember, we highly emphasized yourexperience on there and went from there and
then we I think we looked atthe website. Everything we did it was
an opinion, and if it wasopinion, I think we said opinion,
but I don't think it was noopinion in there. If I made it.
(03:43):
If I had an opinion, itwas from your experience about that.
That's why he couldn't say mine wasfalse, because he knows about lying.
That's how we like, it's justreasonably accurate. He just shut out the
things that he didn't. You know, he would have emphasized more about why
he didn't spread the gospel in Manchester, so he couldn't say that y'all did,
Yeah, because you were there.Yeah, if you sat there,
I guess you would have told mewhy. I mean, what are you
(04:03):
going to say, like, y'allsugar? What over there? And knocked
all doors? Yep? And Ifelt that what I was saying, I'm
like, what is this film?Who's out here doing this? Playground?
Your stuff, like like you said, like you at that time, you
were a new believer. You're goingout there to make sure people know that
you love them in the Lord.Picking up trash is an active service,
sure, and maybe even an actof love. You want all stretch of
(04:25):
the word. But you gotta talkto people. Did they might talk to
anybody? No, nobody in thatneighborhood, because they even become nobody came
out from the natural neighborhood. Sowe talked to nobody in there, so
they all know that was just peoplefrom the office. That's probably what they're
thought, like, you look gotthrow dog way out here, clean enough
to stuff like that was the timeto introduce you stuff with your night church.
(04:46):
You know you have a church.Even if that was so they close
the door, but at least youmade contact with some people in their neighborhood
who's out there. The fact thatyour experience was demoted to reasonably accurate to
me, it seems like he's aperson that's not willing to accept any type
of accountability or really take constructive criticism. Can you just listen to the podcast
I rose hearst for you. Ican hear your voice and hear the frustration
(05:11):
you are carrying for United. Yourtone made it clear that there was a
personal issue with the church. Ididn't. I don't think so either,
like because I remember we listened toit too, and I know I started
out just looking at this tone ofstuff. Now, whatever my word choices
were, it is what it is, just two kids like you. You
know, people that go to thatchurch and have war behind the stuff.
(05:34):
If you wanted to hurt the church, you could have put that stuff out
hands down the church. But that'snot what we were trying to do.
No, not at all, Notat all. I think, if I
can recall, I believe our wholemission was yeah too in a sense exposed
because we know people in Delaware gogo a lot of people do that church.
(05:55):
But we just want to make surethat they know this. Look,
this is what you're gonna get,this is what you're in. But there
are some good things about it.They do make you feel very welcome when
you go there. I think that'salways awesome anywhere you Like, I never
went there and nobody's greeted. Youget everybody greeting you, and the people
probably said that that I served with. They're nice, they're nice. You
never felt like anybody that was was. I never had a bad experience with
(06:17):
the people away for this meeting.I remember you telling me too, when
you serve and how you gotta doall that, Like you just told me
that like last week or whatever,and that you know they do take precautions
and make sure you know that thosesex offenders and stuff, watching kids and
like serving in places they on needbe serving before starting afterwards, how they
feed you and make sure you geta chance to go in there and hear
the word too. That's why Ithought, too after the second mis set
(06:41):
to go out back again, becauselike you could tell, like you're saying,
you're not angry, but I feela little bit you're angry. But
I think this too, like youwere. You talked about his servant,
but you talked about how he focuseson him, I think a lot.
And that's what that's what really gotto right, Like you can see what
he did the email. He's likeI was reasonable act, oh no,
and you know, yeah, youwere reasonably accurate for the one the one
(07:03):
that attended that church for months wasonly reasonably accurate. So I know I
didn't stay no darn chance. Icame very personal. But that's something that
did upset me in that email whenhe was talking about him sharing the story
and comparing it to how Jesus sharingthe parables is toping. He said,
to be accused of narcissism because Iused story to relate to people was hurtful,
(07:24):
especially because I learned this method fromour Savior himself. He used story
parable to relate gospel principles to people. Can I ask you a question,
has any of the stories that heshared and you're just being there in personal
or looking online that have ever beenchrist like or like really geared towards Christ
(07:44):
or the message. I don't thinkso. I mean he tries to fit
them in there with his little personalbackground stories to be he's just long witted
with with it. Let's get toit. He'll talk about him and Jays.
I think soda is where they goout to the store above U.
Theyre try related back to what hismessage is. But it never really hits
him to me anyway. Now,when you look in the Bible, in
(08:07):
the Gospels in particular, I knowwhere you're there, and Jesus shared a
parable dies it go with the message. Whatever he's saying Okay, Well he
did share parables and stuff. Hedidn't say his name that he didn't say
he was He said it about somethingelse completely, but like you said,
tied into the message. I'm like, yeah, so I got a question
(08:28):
for you. So how how wouldhow do you think Kenneff's approach, his
email, his tone, all thatcompares to TD Jakes's approach, tone and
words he said. As far ashis rebuttal for all these accusations, I
don't know. I didn't feel likethis was like a loving thing with Kenneth
(08:52):
Wagner, definitely, because like Isaid, it felt he was angry,
and I think that's why he emphasizedI'm not angry. I've heard like it
felt more like you if you wereangry. Jake's all go. I didn't
hear every single thing he said.He definitely could tell he was hurt.
That was her, he kept saying, because I know, you know when
something's on your mind and surf,you're gonna keep bring it up. You
(09:16):
don't want to it bothers you.You could tell it's a effect on him,
so he can't bring it up.So I could see he was hurt.
It was hurt by this stuff.Yeah, I think I appreciate at
least that part of it, becausehe was very honest about his hurt and
stuff like that, even despite ustelling him that it was not the intention.
That's to me, that's something he'sgonna have to get over. But
(09:37):
as far as I feel like tdJake's too, he could have been a
lot more honest. He could takea page out of Kitnis. But because
you've got a major platform, nowhether it is true or not, I'll
be very hurt. I'm like,I'll be on my mind, especially something
something like that if we don't likeI said, when I say, if
it's true or not like that,that's a big dog gavinization. So they
(10:00):
got a couple questions that I gothim down right. Did you hear the
sermon that TDJS preach on Christmas Eve? I actually didn't hear the whole thing.
Somebody clipped a couple things on there. When I say clip, they
showed like four or five minutes listia. This man was preaching coarsely. The
creator has now become subject to whathe created. He gave up his omnipotence,
(10:28):
his omniscience, and his omnipresence.He submitted himself to prayer because he'd
given up omnipotence all powerful. Nowhe has to go to the garden and
pray omniscience because he says, noman knows today nor the hour which the
(10:48):
Son of Man cometh. No,not the angels nor the Son, but
the Father, which is in heaven. Means I don't know everything anymore.
So I gave up my omissions.He traveled because he gave up his omnipresence.
(11:09):
You addressing something that you say youweren't going to address, you got
the crowd all cheering, which Igot in that question about that, and
then you literally use Christmas Eve.He used it to speak and preach falsely.
Now you're saying that Jesus at somepoint in time wasn't all who he
is. They say that he doesa lot of that he believes in that
modism. Yeah, it makes sense. If everything was true, all I
(11:35):
gotta do is repent. You needto repent for that sermon too. If
he's not all who he is atevery point in time, that he ain't
it at all. Yeah, Ithink that was just bad on his tape
to like that. That part waslike got cruiser, Like why would you
like if I did, I repetlike it don't matter, you know,
yeah, like I don't think ifthat you did that stuff, you just
(11:58):
repent, They're gonna be enough.Nobody else was saying to is like,
because you kept saying I'm good,Well you're not that you want people to
do to make you and my thingis and I think now we don't kind
of got away from the true meaningof repentance. And okay, yeah you
(12:18):
can repent. God is so mercifulin everything, but it's an attitude he
that the II will not say thatGod looks into the hearts, He knows
our heart. You also have tolike change for what you're doing. Because
if these like you said, thesealligators are true, are you hope you
ain't still doing it? So youtalk about all you gotta do it's bad.
I'm curious to hear your viewpoint onthis. So when we have to
repent for whatever sin is in ourlives, isn't like a determination on your
(12:43):
part, isn't like a genuine changeeven though you know you're gonna struggle.
It is like a dependence on theLord. When it comes to that part,
it's like a it's like a dyingself in that moment, right,
you know, not saying that onceyou repent that you're not going to do
whatever. You'r strugg absolute, butit's definitely it's not like it's not easy.
(13:05):
It's not like I'm just gonna godo this to get like it's a
struggle, like, well, ifI do it to get, well,
you know, I'll repay God forgiveme. So you hear the crowd cheering
them all. He's like all thatstuff. What did you think about his
congregation? They're gonna they're gonna gowhatever he says. Like Unfortunately, you
see a lot of these people whoare like I said, they have idols
(13:28):
like TD Jake's like he falls down, it's gonna destroy everyone, you know,
everyone because they love him so much. And I think they can't separate
what he does and how he preachesfrom the person like he's a person.
He can fall, he can doyou can do this kind of like what
the Chris saying about tip, Yeahhe can do all this, but he
also give you doing that. Absolutelyabsolutely can't put them on the pedal like
(13:54):
like I love by an Tony Evansbecause we don't listen to many people.
But if he's doing this stuff.I mean that don't take away from well
because a sermon, right, No, and you know what, Okay,
let's talk about our mutual sin problem. We can do this not right,
(14:15):
but we also can go evangelized.I don't know about you. Don't you
feel a contradiction there a little bit? So I think that's why a lot
of part of our ministry really hasmaybe been put on pauls a lot of
times, because we know in ourpersonal walks, our relationship, our private
relationship with the Lord is probably notwhere it needs to be. You know
(14:35):
what I mean. I don't understandwhy some people don't get that. Well,
maybe they don't have a private relationship. But like you said, like
they treat these people with such anamor, and like Christian Key said,
like you said, deitize these people. I'm like you, I don't care.
I don't care, first of all. But everybody's clapping and cheering on
you because they burned. I'm notdoing all that. And you remember,
(14:56):
I remember I told you it mighthave been last year sometime I had to
treat we were like sitting now,we were like a crowd of people,
and I remember you were like sittingup you know, maybe like five or
six seven roads ahead of me,so I saw the back of ahead.
Everybody else was pretty much blurred out. And I remember this preacher, I
remember just not sitting right and probablyspeaking falsely and wickedly whatever. Everybody got
up and cheered him on, andI remember I couldn't see you, no
(15:20):
more than everybody standing up at thispoint. So I'm sitting down all I
see remember looking up, I seenyou know, many people. I'm like,
oh darn, I'm like, reallyjust the only ones on the chick
I'm staying it up front. Thisone of my thoughts were when I was
sitting there and see you, I'mlike, man, I want to dolina
sit up, standing up, goingwith this stuff. And then somehow he
was like, oh, let's followme or something, what if something like
(15:41):
that, And it was so heartwarmingto see that you were still sitting down
and not just us. There wasa couple more people, and made me
really think, I'm like, youknow what, one lord, I don't
ever want to follow somebody, ordeatize somebody, or idolize somebody other than
you. You were my everything,you know what I mean. And I'm
like, man, you're relicious everything. She's still with the I'm like,
(16:02):
you know what, that might onlybeen five of us out of five hundred,
but all five of us in herewe're ryding for you. And God
always has a remnant. Like Idon't understand, like why they put people
on the pestil like that, likepeople fall apart after you know, something
like this happens, like no,not TD why can't it be TD T.
(16:23):
He's God, He's just like you. He just has the gift the
preach like like, none of thesecelebrities will surprised me because they're human just
like us. They could still betalented and gifted and sitting in their life
like I understand it. It's likethe people that you're that you're a pre
(16:47):
preacher, You're you're living a doublelife kind of like life Robbie Zach Ryan.
Yeah, he was up there andyou know what he was preaching was
right, like, but he wasup there living a double double life.
It game and it came out likethis stuff is going to come ouse,
like you know, hopefully it's nottrue, but if it is, I
hope, you know, firstly,I do hope it comes out. Do
(17:07):
you see yourself lost and full ofuncertainties. Pain, uncertainty, and division
seem to be everywhere you turn thesedays until you turn to Jesus. We
believe that the Gospel can be thespark for changing people's lives, especially in
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disciple Christians from all walks of life, to help them live lives that are
(17:29):
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(17:52):
give today that's Way of Truth emdot org slash donate. Thank you so
much for your support. What doyou think about it? If it is
let's say it's false and these peopleare coming out and falsely accused it,
do you thinte that there should beso? Because my brother used to asked
me this a whole different subject,but about those that accuse people are like
(18:14):
sexual as well, and then itturns out that they really didn't do it
in their career and they he said, there should be wiser or something for
the people who everybody that has hada very vocal stance on it should owe
this man an apology. If itcomes out that he did nothing wrong.
I think there should become some kindof retribution for him in that point,
however, and this is why I'mglad we have this, because we like
(18:37):
to speak not so much not juston the personal thing, but on your
doctrine as well. You're a modalist. They owe you apology, but you
do apologize too, and get yourdoctor in shape because you still leading people's
renk the spark Christians. Well,he's spoken to to because he said he
could have used this definitely to notspeak on that, but to get his
the doctor straight. He's saying that'swhat he chose to speak, not about
(19:00):
the allegations but basically his his doctor. And yes, you could definitely do
it though you could put put yourselflike you know, how you write the
paper, take the facts of them, put your you know, put your
what you want to say around thesefacts. This punch of it there.
See your your buddy Marcus Rogers,He's take on and stuff. I've seen
the one with Mace Sad about howeverybody's like talk about TV, you gotta
(19:25):
make sure you're right too, andstuff like that, because he was if
it's just to say that Mace baseever said that, which I do see.
There there was no clips where heactually said that stuff about TD.
Okay, great Marcus, because hesaid he talked to market uh he and
he said, uh, y'all allall talking, y'all got so much energy
for TV. And he said he'snot talk about the allegations. He said,
(19:47):
but y'all gotta make sure you're righttoo, because how they come down
on him, that's how God's gonnacome down on you. Something like that.
And I get it that you dohave to beat those that are out
there. Uh. I guess he'sreally friends and there was try to get
gossip or for her stay offall orwhatever that you gotta make sure that you're
right to because which I get.I'm rooting for brother Marcus. I do.
(20:14):
I definitely get no one should everpray on there on somebody else's downfall.
But I mean see I'm a littleconflicting, and I'm pretty much gonna
share my position on the matter.I don't care because at some point I
care about your soul. I doyou got to go down? Okay,
God is no respector of person,and I'm not saying I'm not saying him
way. Oh, get dumb becausethey did it too, or get domb
(20:36):
because you know, no, ifyou did something, pay for it right
there. It comes out there orit's gonna come out. And you know,
I realized the chastisement of the Lordis a blessing. Will he say,
oh gosh, I don't know ifit's in proverbs or songs, but
he chastised those whom he loves.If we are getting corrected by the Lord,
(20:57):
I think that's a that's a termthat love for me. Again,
if that's called bringing on somebody downfall, then I guess that's what we're gonna
call it, called repent. Andthat's for anybody. Like if you're up
here doing wrong and stuff, especiallydisguise you are coming off as you're a
Christian, there's there's a bigger responsibilityyou're out here, you know, door
(21:21):
not living uh living right for ChristAnd then all here preaching. So that's
why I wanted to about it ifit's true, because you shouldn't be up
here preaching these people. You outhere doing this stuff and then telling them
they shouldn't why they shouldn't send thisstuff, and you're, you know,
sending freely, which is crazy.Like how you how your mouth open with
(21:41):
such hypocrisy? I don't know how. I don't know how Robbie did it
all that, and you're doing thisstuff. But you know, my mom
always said them, she said,you notice some preachers don't preach on the
things that they found in like Iremember we in fact, I think we
use it on at least a coupleat least one clip on like TikTok or
something. Well, they asked thatone famous little question about homosexuality or LGBTQ
(22:04):
stuff, girl Franklin, and Iknow TDJ was up in that piece.
The answer question, do you believein same sex marriage? No? Do
you believe in same sexion marriage?Valencia? No? Okay, we gotta
be careful who we surround ourselves with, right. I don't think it means
you can't have like non Christian friends, like all your friends have to be
(22:25):
Christians. But certain stuff you justknow you can't you can't do, you
know, like I was telling youabout that guy Discover like he's gay.
If you talked to her work,I could work with anybody. I had
nothing to get this because you knowhis lifestyle. But he was having a
wedding. I know if I gottaasked that question, I was not going
(22:48):
stuff you just can't do with TD, Like, yeah, if you're close
friends to the family doing the pastorduties, I wish that's fine. You
know, he was saying half birthdayto him, but I don't think theyttending
any of his party. You're juststopping through, especially in rather you're a
public or private that's got other becausepeople gonna get everything. But I mean,
(23:14):
what you're gonna do at Dinny party? He drenks like none of his
lifestyle, says none of it.I haven't seen anything either. I used
to think that unequally yo really justmeant for marriages, And I think maybe
that's one of the struggles we havein the in the Christian world that I
think we really always relate that verseto relationship wise, like remaining relationship wise
(23:37):
when you are unequally yoked, evenif your friends and you know, stuff
like that, and it's very innocent. For a while, you rubb off
on each other, especially when youspend a lot of time with the person
you're gonna rub off. Your mannerismmight because some things I'll pick up from
you, some things you pick upfrom me. It just that's happened.
That happens. I've met so manycool, unsaved people, so many you
(24:00):
have so many cool people. IfI wouldn't say if I'd be hanging out
with them, but I know Idid. Just there's a line I just
can't cross it because I'm not pickingup on your man I'm not going to
where you're going to. I don'tthink you're coming where. I'm gonna invite
you to go where I'm going.But I'm sure you're not coming, you
know it Just we're not on thesame wavelength. I don't think it's going
to be kind of productive. You'regonna pull me back into that world and
(24:22):
I'm gonna pull you into you know, this life kind of reminds me of
like CC Whitney, where we'll seethat like how I feel like that relationship
because you know Whitney, I thinkshe was kind of in and out with
the secular world and she go thereand pray and stuff like that, So
it seems like CEC was rubbing off. She would go to her and that
(24:42):
part of her was rubbing off.The prayer is putting her back where you
know, yep, to what sheknows. Yeah, I feel like she
was like a safe spot. Solike it was like that. I think
that it's fine, but like itdoesn't work that way. F us.
We can't we go out to theclubs or are doing that, you know,
definitely not. There is something veryimpactful by swimming upstream and going a
(25:03):
different way or doing something different.And I feel like, like you said,
with Whitney and CC, I thinkI really do think that was very
very helpful for Whitney at least tostay alive for more years, you know,
to come and really probably still havethat foundation. But like you said,
I cannot imagine doing that same stuffI was doing when I was compromising.
I won't. It's like, youknow, Jesus, like he wasn't
(25:26):
headed around. It was for changepreaching and stuff, and tell the Gospel,
he's trying to get them over thehead side. He's not trying to
fit in with them. Exactly anywhereI go. I wanted to show Christ
in it. However, learning now, I'm like, you know what,
I'm not always Christ conscious. I'mnot Christ is different. He broke,
(25:48):
he's got you know what I mean, he's always on point all time because
he's always gotten. Contrary to popularyou go with a bunch of people and
you're like the the Ondie one.Yes, yes, it's gotta be hard.
Well, I guess I could dothis, so I guess we can
give it. We can give in. Yeah, we can give it.
(26:08):
You're gonna go there and get thatbill. And then people got off the
right, you know, you knowwhat you say. I'm sorry I can't.
But if you got into it,it's different that they come to you.
You got there, You get thatchance. Yes, you have a
(26:29):
chance that you're going to fall.Yes, the percentage is greater on that
one at least for some topic.Who you surround yourself with that is really
really important because I believe that's apart, a great part of our downfall
as Christians. You know what Imean, I'm not gonna say, And
like even with T. D.Jakes, I'm not gonna say he didn't
start out really on point. Doctorsound doctrine, because I believe the same
thing for Kirk Yolanda Baby, lookCray. I don't really know whatever I
(26:56):
believe. I don't believe everybody startout with them on bad footing by any
means, however, But I knowthe pressure of society, especially I can
imagine their platform that they grow andgrow and grow and get more famous and
stuff, more pressure and more worldly, and it happens. But I believe
that we're going to see a mightysweep through the church. We're gonna be
seeing separated on the whet in thetear, like the people that's sitting in
these pulp in these little pews andstuff Sunday after Sunday getting the word and
(27:19):
being holy on Sunday. I thinkwe're going to see a major separation.
And I am excited about that.I'm not going to sugarcoat that. I'm
very excited because if it takes someonelike TD Jake's, who I compare to
Nebkin, I'll be honest, becauseGod can humble never Cazzer. He can
do the same thing. Man.If it takes one person to start the
(27:40):
domino effect, then so be it. I'm happy about that because I'm tired
of these fake Christians anyway. Butlet me ask you though, like,
are you saying that we should limitunsaved friends that we have or just like
basically just know when Yeah, Ithink, I think. I think wisdom
needs to come into play. It'sI feel like for us, the responsibility
we need to be yoked with God, you know what I mean, because
(28:04):
then we're gonna develop the sensitivity tothe spirit at that point and stuff like
that. I believe. I don'tbelieve that we just need to have just
Oh gosh, it's gonna sound badbecause it's like, and this is my
opinion, I don't see the effectivenessof just having Christian friends. I do
not otherwise, none of us so, but I do believe that as Christians
(28:27):
is we're gonna have unsaved people that'sgonna be around. I mean, my
God is probably more unsaved than safing. The effectiveness comes in and the responsibility
falls on us obviously to not putourselves around situation we're not willing to share
Christ then, you know what Imean? So, yeah, Christ went
anywhere he went, he affected change. Let's say your coworkers want to go
out to the bar. You're like, Okay, I'm finally gonna go.
(28:49):
Okay, what you're gonna do forLicia, Well, I'm going to preach
the gospel. Girl, let mego with you don't but I don't.
But I'm also not gonna blame youfor not wanting to go because it is
the bar. That's why I don'tgo to a lot of the events that
my job when they go to,because they always wanted to go to the
bar, and I'm like, theyhave a lot of them drink. I
(29:10):
don't. I'm just gonna be sittingthere like out of place with I do
think too. Let's say you didgo to the bar. You say that
you're sitting there, you ain't drinking, you ain't doing nothing that God wouldn't
be pleased with. But you're alsonot saying anything. You're kind of going
along to get along. You thinkas Christians we should be doing that now.
It's just the point basically they gonnathink that, you know, I
(29:33):
want to be you know, socializedwith us. I don't drink, you
know, But I think that's alsoanother point to make with like the Manchester
Loveday Kenneth Wager situation, we haveto use our voice. We have to
like, we're gonna we're gonna affectchange, We're gonna be christ Like.
I want people to see Christ inme. I don't want to talk.
I want Christ to see I wantpeople to see love, the love of
(29:56):
Christ in me by just picking upthe trash and not saying nothing to them,
not give him the gospel. What'sthe point? Like you said,
what is the point of that?So I don't know how we got off
that topic. That's all your fault, Delicia. But yeah, you know,
I think we definitely need to beprotecting our walk at all times.
Honest to God, I really I'mvery protective my walk. I get finally
(30:18):
too personally offended with my walk.I need to work on that, by
the way, because I don't needto take everything so personal. I ain't
gonna lie. I don't everything.Every person's comment or any person's actually is
not a direct attack on my walkwith the Lord. I definitely, I
know. I overemphasized it because Iknow that's where that's that's my identity,
you know what I mean, Like, you're not just attacking my character,
(30:41):
which I still have a problem withto I work on that too, But
you're attacking my identity. That's whyI kind of that email like, because
you're you're kind of projected what we'rewhat we were about. You don't even
know. I don't even know that. I don't feel like we need to
sit there all to discuss that withhim. But you can't. You can't
tell us that we're attacking the churchor we don't have any content to minimize
(31:03):
yours to reasonably accurate somebody that wentthere and served there through the process.
What's accurate? Then I don't seemy thing is with him. Yeah,
you can. I'm not gonna sayyou can't feel offended. I get all
that, we acknowledge that, butat the end of the day, you
got to ask yourself, why areyou offended? Why are you hurt?
(31:23):
I kind of let things, yeah, kind affect me a little bit and
then told me I have to sitwith film and stuff like, Okay,
it probably was who cares. Iain't gonna say this person. I don't
take it like I was a littlebit taken. Ask this is email.
How are you going to be ableto protect your walk and your feelings and
(31:44):
not take so much offense to whatpeople say? Yeah, I definitely said
I got work. I have toprepare you all that, but yeah,
I definitely have to to work orI take it everything, because that's what
I was saying with him, like, you're not always going to get the
comments, so first I know whatthis. We're not your podcasts. You're
(32:05):
going to get those that the trollsabout there and what to say. It
is absolutely like now I've got betterwith that because you know YouTube, they
just going there to say anything,Oh yeah, attack and whatever forget the
floor. It's like, oh,I gotta respond. But I'm like,
now I know people they want that, that's what they're looking for. You
should respond your stuff. So yep, you gotta you gotta know what when
(32:27):
it's wants to respond and when does. I think sometimes you do have to
respond. That's because there might bepeople seeking and that's a truly seeking and
want to know the answers. Butyou have to definitely like seek through and
see which ones to respond to.Ones that's attack and are saying something outlanders.
Yeah, I think that's always ourmotivation, right because of those people
(32:47):
that might be in that, especiallythat road Wade. Yeah, I mean
that was a lot you got unsafe, same people, you got a whole
bunch of mixtures. So it islike, and I think if I can't
recall specifically, but I know theones we did respond to the people was
like, that's not in the Bible. No, I feel like those things
because we are witnesses, we areliving witnesses, and we need to defend
argue with people. Now, Bobsays, what said. I can't change
(33:10):
it. You can't change it.It is what it is. And to
me, if I was offended andI sent the first email and that was
the response I got, I'm notnot to pipe down on a personal level,
but I would have piped down anemail he wrapped up. Yeah,
because in the response we defended,explained our position better and that's not our
intention, and blah blah blah,blah blah. And you've wrapped up like
(33:35):
you turned that stucker all the wayup to one hundred. And they was
like a five because you you haveto express yourself. I think that's what
it was like. He was setdown. He had That's why he set
the other mail, because it's likewe're kind of where ended it. But
he didn't get out what he wantedto know. He didn't and he had
that because he knew us by basicallyhe had to stucky the video because he
(33:55):
knew who addressed. Yeah. Yeah, he broke it down like that.
It's videos audio, so he knewhe knew who he wanted to address.
He said something, you know whatyou're like really thinking about. You have
to get it out. But Ifelt like that's what he was. He
was out with it. I hopehe feels better. That's all I can
say, because I don't know whatelse to get out of that. He
got what he wanted to say out. Yeah, I really hope he's doing
(34:16):
better because we've gotten absolutely nothing outof that. But it's still it's still
the truth. And I don't knowme personally. If I wouldn't, I
wouldn't have done all what he did. I'll be honest, I would have
done it. Let's say we doan episode and we get like a I
don't know that somebody critique it herstuff. Yeah, I probably probably would
(34:37):
take you know, I'm sure,but I am not going to sit up
here and like email this person orfind out who they are now. But
we and we had seven views betweenboth videos. Okay, we had nine.
Oh I'm sorry. I don't wantto short change us for two,
But like sir, that video wentabsolutely nowhere. You see if the whole
(35:00):
bunch of people are looking at thisUnited church, but I mean if my
people were from United, right,baby. I think in this new year,
I'm very excited about this new year. I ain't gonna lie. I
feel like a totally different person.I really a new year. Do setup
do everything we can quickly reflect ontwenty twenty three. How has that?
(35:24):
How has twenty twenty three impacted youyour mindset, your walk and really prepared
you for twenty twenty four. Idon't know. It's like a lot of
growth. I think this year newbeginnings, and I don't know, I
think it's just made me, likeeven financially everywhere everywhere in my area kind
(35:49):
of had to take a look atit. Yes, yeah, look at
some things and try to, youknow, get some things going to that's
going to help in the new year. So definitely, I would say growth,
Yeah, I believe. And justobviously we've been friends for a while
now, but I'm going to justisolate for twenty twenty three because I can't
(36:10):
go back because I see tremendous growthon your part. But just even seeing
twenty twenty three, there has beena lot of growth, you know what
I mean, I see, evenif it's just mindset wise, it really
really is some of the things thatI know used to frustrate you prior to
twenty twenty three. Now don't fai'n't gonna say, don't face you at
all, but not definitely, notnearly. As how the reactions are a
(36:34):
lot different. Yes, yes,yes, And then I can sit right
across from you and tell you that, so God, it's so good.
Distractions and accountability those are the twowords that really got me just kind of
moving forward a little bit. Iwas able to see my role in it,
so me taking accountability on that enabledme to be able to change it,
(36:59):
which made me to try to eliminatesome of the distractions that I've been
Man, it's something seeing yourself.It's really something really seeing yourself. It's
scary, you know, because don'tnobody want to feel like they're not perfect.
Don't give I don't even know whoyou are, you know what I'm
saying, especially perfections, So likeseeing yourself And just like, okay,
I did allow that. I can'tbe a victim because I've allowed this to
(37:21):
happen. I see you with thedistractions anyway, because I remember, because
you have nothing done in ministry.Somebody was always expressive. Try try to
get try to get the information.Don't hear for days, maybe not days,
but still no ministry like wow,yep. And with the family in
(37:42):
the house and she's still up thereworking on get out of my room.
That's definitely that's definitely changed. Thisis what we want to do. This
this the books. I ain't gotthe work books right now, but we
did a lot like God's great,and there's no way world, we're gonna
be sitting here not giving God glory. There's no way, there's no way.
(38:05):
What it's like we did one thing, he did a thousand, like
it doesn't make sense to me.I don't know how he got them with
all this stuff, with the workbooks and oh it's now. We didn't
evangelize none, but we got thetools to do it. Oh, it's
been very nice, Melitia. Man, God is so good. It's almost
like you take care of his business. He's gonna take care of yours,
do you know what I mean?Or even just get on the path and
(38:27):
take a step of faith. Hegot you. I don't know when this
started with us this year and stayingfocused and stuff like that, but somehow
it just started clicking one after another. I don't even know when we had
a discussion via text saying hey,we're gonna focus on all the cycle ship.
I wonder the point was. Idon't know this year, right,
Yeah, it might have been thetrip, Like, I don't know.
(38:51):
Honestly, I think our next stepsare in twenty twenty four ministry wise,
getting that ministry man. Honestly,I think that's like the cherry on the
either that or missionary work. Ihad something something gotta give. This will
be very fun, Yes,
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