June 24, 2022 • 29 mins
The guitarist reflects on recording the band’s latest record ‘Dropout Boogie,’ including sessions with ZZ Top’s Billy Gibbons. Auerbach also looks back on the 20th anniversary of the Black Keys’ debut, his early blues heroes, and what’s to come for the Black Keys’ summer tour.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan run Tug,
but enough about me. My guest today is one of
my all time favorite fans. He's an audio artisan with
a relentless commitment to his craft and a purveyor of
gut punching guitar leads that have made The Black Keys
one of the biggest rock groups on the planet. After
(00:23):
a five year hiatus, he re teamed with his old
friend and bandmate Patrick Carney for Let's Rock. But it
was their next record, a blues covers album called Delta Cream,
that was their true homecoming. Recorded in just a day,
the spontaneous studio jam was something of a reset, a
reminder of the sounds and the spirit that first drew
them to music as teenage neighbors growing up in Akron, Ohio.
(00:46):
The down in dirty blues atmosphere is apparent on their
latest album, Drop Out Boogie, or at least twenty years
almost to the day after their debut, the Big Come Up.
A lot's changed since those days of recording in basements
and touring in bands. Now they've become heroes themselves to
a whole new generation of brash blues punks, all awaiting
their own big come up. I'm so happy to welcome
(01:07):
Dan our By first and foremost congratulations on a new record.
I mean, it's really it's setting the summer off right
for me. It's to me, it's the perfect convertible album.
I know you released Waiting on a Song on eight track,
and I'm kind of wishing you did that with this
one too. I feel like it's the perfect eight track record.
UM started at the very beginning, what role did your
(01:30):
album Delta Cream, their previous record, play in the creation
of Dropout Boogie? You know, I don't think we could
have had one without the other. You know, I think
Um Delta Delta Cream kind of paved the way for
for Dropout Boogie. You know, we it was so um
off the cuff Delta Cream was and it was so easy,
(01:55):
and we ended up both really loving it and loving
the way it sounded. We just kind of took that
positive momentum and we went right into making Drop Up Booie. Yeah.
I think Pat called it a great reset of the band,
and was it amuse reset musically in terms of reminding
you of the the artists and the songs that first
brought you together or was it a reset in terms
(02:15):
of actually playing the music in a room together. I mean, um,
a little bit of both. I mean, we definitely were
playing stuff that influences when we first started, but we
were also playing with Kenny Brown for the very first time.
We were playing with the bass player for the very
first time in the studio, we were playing with the
percussionists for the very first time. So it was like
(02:36):
it was this weird combination of absolutely brand new and old.
And I think that that is a balance that we
always kind of strive for in our records, you know,
Oh yeah, I mean Kenny Brown and stuff Eric Deaton
was bringing to the table. It sounds so good. I mean,
I feel like a huge debt of gratitude not only
for the music that you've made as the Black Keys,
(02:58):
but just turned me onto acts like you know, Junior,
kimbro Are, All Burnside Mississippi, Fred McDowell, I mean people
I never would have heard of where it not through
your covers on Delta Cream and just people you cited
in interviews as influences. And and I gotta say that
Robert Finley record, Oh my god, Sharecropper's son is just
such an incredible album, and he's he's the real deal.
(03:18):
I so I want to thank you for all those
influences you've You've shared with your fans too, Yeah, of course.
I mean I was honored to get to make those
records with Robert. I mean, as soon as he walked
in my studio, it was just like he was electric.
He just was like he was wearing a three quarter
length leather duster and a giant cowboy belt. Buckley had
snakeskin boots, song leather pants. He had a satin cowboy
(03:41):
shirt on and a leather cowboy hat, and his hair
was braided underneath it. It was like, I was like,
who is this guy? I'm so glad to hear that
living up to all of my dreams and expectations like
a Louisiana superhero. That's so cool. I mean it sounds like,
in the same way that you opened up the band
(04:03):
on Delta Cream, you opened up the songwriting process a
bit on dropout boogie, working with outside writers and I
think five tracks. What led you to bring Greg Cartwright
and Angelo into the sessions. Well, those are a couple
of guys that I had worked with a lot in
the past, and I just wrote some songs with Greg
and Angelo on the new Marcus King record. You know,
(04:23):
I I've done a bunch of things, you know, we
worked on the Velvet Heres together and just all kinds
of stuff. So I kind of had a feeling that
Pat would get along with them and that it would
be fruitful. So we rang them up and it was great.
It was so easy, it was fun. And and here,
you know, we are like twenty years into our album
(04:44):
career and uh, we're you know, doing something we've never
done before. So it was really nice. Yeah, I wanted
to ask you more about what you're writing processes is
historically like with Pat, because how much of it is
improvising together versus want of you bringing sort of a
song frack into the studio and then working it out
at a table. It sounds like it's more improvisational, right.
(05:07):
It's always been improvisational, you know, We've always just kind
of messed around in the studio and and something happens.
You know. It's been something that we've been able to
do since we were like sixteen seventeen. I think that's
why we stuck with it when we started, because we
realized right off the bat, We really didn't have to
work at getting it to sound cool. You know. It's like,
(05:29):
as soon as we started making music together, it was like, Oh,
that's I like that whatever that is that sounds fun,
you know. So I think we just it's just always
been there like that for us. So that's that's generally
how we started the songs, and then we kind of
you know, have to shape the song that way. It's
a little bit reverse, you know. And since moving to Nashville,
(05:51):
I've definitely, like UM, gotten to appreciate more old school
style of UM songwriting, you know, just the base chords
and melodies and lyrics first. But you know, so I
guess I understand how that works too. But the way
the pattern I work is just different, you know, you
just always has been. Yeah, I mean moving to Nashville,
(06:13):
it's such a collaborative musical scene that must have been
sounds very different to you know, having been sort of
more self contained the two of you. That must have
been a really cool, uh you know, sort of new
learning process of working in a whole different way. Yeah,
it was. It was you know, pretty uh I opening
(06:35):
when we first got here. But you know, I always
loved Nashville and the and the music scene here, and
I can't imagine living anywhere else. I mean, I've been
here eleven years, almost twelve, I guess now, and it's
an amazing city if you're a musician, you know, it's
just like there's so many tools in the toolbox here. It's, um,
(06:59):
you know, I find it hard to live without. At
this point, you're talking about that a little bit of
magic with you and Pat. I mean, this blew my mind,
good love, burn the damn thing down, didn't I love you?
I think these are all first takes, right, that is
just incredible to me. Yeah, those are all just first take,
one take songs. Wow, that is there. I'll go back
(07:21):
and um, spruce up the lyrics. But I'm as we're
playing it down, I'm like improvising lines and stuff. Sometimes
the line of work. Sometimes it sparks some better line.
But you know, yeah, those are those are first takes.
But that's why they have that feel and that sound
and you can't really fake that. And um, you know
Wild Child does not have that sound, but we like
(07:41):
to have a mix of those, those different kinds of recordings.
You know, I think it I think it's a nice
to to have a like a little bit of a
you know, different palette there. Oh absolutely, I mean that's spontaneity,
the excitement of the moment of creation. It's so cool
and it's so apparent in the tracks, but it got
something like wild Child. It's it's such a great vibe.
(08:04):
I feel like it's it's got a different feel to
it than things I've heard from you. It almost feels
the groove is thord funky comes to mind. I know
that's an overused word, but it's got such a different
flavor to it. It's such a cool track. How did
that track come together? I mean I probably started with
the drum loop, you know, is a funky ass due
wipe Bo, And you know, we started with the with
(08:28):
the rhythm track, and I think instantly we really liked
it. It It was so simple. We both there's something so
kind of like instantly likable, catchy about it. Um, so
we just kept working at it, you know what I mean. So, uh,
that was the That was one of the songs we
called in Angelo, were called him Greg and we sat
(08:49):
down at the table with some acoustic guitars and we
kind of like worked out the melodies and the lyrics,
but that was after we had the instrumental, you know,
so it was fun. You know, I think it was
worth It was definitely worth while. I know you've worked
a lot with Danger Mouse in the past, and something
that I've noticed is that I feel like I can
always tell the albums you made with him because there's
(09:10):
something in the rhythm that's different and I can't put
my finger on it. It just it swings differently these
albums that that you self produce. I don't know if
it's not playing with a click or something, but I
feel like on a track like how Long on this
new album, it's got this incredible feel to it. It's
a slower and looser That's one of my favorite tracks
on this how Long. It's such an incredible I really
(09:31):
liked that song a lot, and you know, that was
just that just happened out of an improblem playing guitar
and drums across from each other, you know, just started
playing that lick and Pat fell in and that one
came together really quickly. To be honest, I do like
that song a lot. I love how your vocal sits
(09:53):
in it. It's like it's not like a lead singer
it's like another instrument to me. It's it's such a
cool way that it sits in the track. Yeah, I
don't know. You know, when Pat and I UM are
in a good place and comfortable, Um, I don't know.
It's I've never been more comfortable playing with someone, you know,
(10:15):
in my life. I don't even have to think about it,
you know. I wanted to ask you about your I
think your latest single, and it Ain't Over UM has
this really unique sound on it. When I was listening
(10:37):
to it, I couldn't figure out what it was. I
assumed it was a keyboard sound. I did a little
digging and I learned it was something called an optagan,
which I'd never heard of in my life. Oh well,
tell me about that. Almost like an early sample, like
a souped up melotron, right, Like, what is that? Yeah?
They had UM these little disks that you would put
in it. It was basically like a Fisher Prize keyboard
(10:57):
toy for kids. And you know, I think people got
hip to them, and people like Tom Wade's and I
don't know everybody's used them, but they just have an
amazing sound, and you know, you can flip the discs
upside down and it plays the sounds backwards, so you know,
it has a keyboard sound and then like a rhythm
(11:19):
accompaniment which is like got some like kind of generally
cheesy sounding percussion or drums or bass or something like that.
And Uh, it's really fun to kind of spark ideas.
I've done it before. You know, I used it on
the Doctor John record I made. Um. You know, we
used it a bunch. You know, it's a fun tool.
(11:39):
I like, there's definitely some different sounds on this record.
I know that, UH used the wall for the first
time right on on what what track was on Wild Child? Yeah? Yeah?
On Wild Child? Yeah, some rhythm guitar. Yeah. I don't
know what got into me feeling crazy that day. M
(12:01):
I gotta ask you about the guitar work by Mr
Billy F. Gibbins. How did he get involved and what
was he like just to play with in the room? Man?
He Uh, he's the best. He's the coolest, coolest guy
on earth. I mean I texted him and told him
Pat and I would be in the studio and if
he was free, he should stop by because I heard
(12:22):
he was in town. And uh, and I didn't hear
anything from a few hours went by, and then he
got a text from him he said, I'm headed over, amigo.
He showed up. Man, he didn't bring guitar. He just
brought bottle of bottle of wine. And uh. I handed
him a guitar that I had plugged it straight into
(12:42):
an AMP, a guitar he's never played before. You know,
pour him a glass of wine and we just started playing.
And we played for you know, almost two hours and um,
and then he took off and I think we probably
had like four songs kind of written in that time.
We were just flowing. It was great and good Love
is one of those songs. And it's just like his
(13:04):
sound is so instantly identifiable as it's awesome to be
able to like, um, sit in the room with him
and play music. It's like, it's pretty cool. Oh man, man,
it wasn't even his guitar. Wow, just all in the fingers.
What what is man? He had this old triny Lopez
(13:24):
that I own that that used to be used to
belong to Mississippi Fred McDowell. What. It's a beautiful guitar.
You can see video footage of him of Fred McDowell
playing it. On YouTube. He's Scott his wife glued like
some um jewelry, some like brooches to the headstock into
the upper about of the guitar. And um, it's a
(13:47):
cool guitar, you know. But we've always heard stuff about
Billy Gibbons like he plays special kind of slinky strings
and only uses this kind of whatever. It's like, Man,
this guitar had normal as strings, plugged it straight into
an amp and it sounded instantly like Billy Gibbinson was
fucking awesome. Wow have you played with them before. We've
(14:09):
done a couple of things with them before, but not
like this. Oh. Man, that that is incredible. I hope
we get to hear those other songs you guys worked
on too. I hope there's a you know, expanded edition
or EP or you know special seven inch or something coming. Yeah,
I mean you never know. Man, Oh, that is so cool.
I mean you've you've worked with so many amazing artists.
(14:32):
I mean you mentioned Dr John, Robert Finley, you know,
Yola see low Green, Lana del Rey. How is your
production work outside of the Black Keys impacted your work
in the band as producing outside people almost given you
kind of more objectivity when it comes to your own
band and your own sound and change the way you worked.
I think so. I think it really has. I think
(14:53):
it especially in the last few years, being able to
hone in on our strengths and being able to like
maybe figure out how we how it's like max enjoyable
what I mean, because that's really what's most important for
Pat and I at this point, is to like be
able to do this, uh and enjoy it. You know,
(15:17):
that's kind of the goal. I think he said in
a few interviews that this is the most enjoyable record
you guys have ever made. You do you echo that sentiment? Yeah,
it was. It was pretty awesome. I mean, you know,
every record we got to make is really fun, but
there was something about this when where it was just
like we're firing on all cylinders, you know, It's just
(15:38):
like we were so um, we're just in that in
the zone. I love the title of the record. I
immediately thought of Captain Beefhart and Safe as Milk was
sort of my access point to his music. I just
I think that record is incredible. I mean, I'm glad
those spine tingling vocals. I mean, that's crazy kind of
warp do wop sound. I mean Ryan Cooter's guitar work.
(16:01):
Such an amazing record. I know that sounds like that
was a real point of connection for YouTube growing up
when you first were um discovering music together. Yeah, it
was a huge influence on on us. And when we
were first touring in the van, just the two of us,
you know, zigzagging back and forth across the States. It
was one of the records we listened to the most.
(16:22):
I still amazing to me. But when you were growing up,
I can't imagine there are many other kids in town
who were listening to Captain Beefar and yet you guys
were just down the street from one another. It's just
such a crazy thing to consider. I mean, it really
does make you, you know, I wonder about fate. What
were some other musical points of connection between the two
of you when you were first getting to know each other.
(16:43):
I mean, we loved Which Hang Records. We loved Liquid Sours,
the Jizz album, just the aesthetic of the record, the
way it sounded. We loved Um Credence clear Water. We
used to sit and listen to Buy You Country over
and over again. Um. Yeah, we love to be hard
and we would listen to the Sonics all the time. Um, yeah,
(17:06):
I don't know. We we liked We liked music that
was real, raw, kind of grimy and and fun. That
was kind of what we were into. Had read that
The Big Come Up. Initially, an early version of it
had like skits in between the songs, like a hip
hop record. Yeah, and the dude who owned the record
labels this French guy who's like in the rock and
(17:26):
roll hated rap. He was like, he's like, what is
this ship? You got got to get rid of this stuff,
And uh, it was probably the smart idea. We did
leave a couple of little things and so it was nice,
but it was probably It's crazy that Dropout Bookie came
out the day before the twenty anniversary of your debut,
(17:46):
The Big Come Up. Uh what do you see when
you contrast those two, Because in a funny way, I
almost feel like Dropout Boogie is more like your first
record than any you've made in a while, all aside
from maybe Delta Cream, especially something like the closer Didn't
I Love You? I Mean to me, that feels like
something that that could have come out of the basement
in a way. Yeah, I think that we are. The
(18:09):
more I work with other people, the more I appreciate,
you know what, the thing that the specialty gift that
Pat and I were given, you know what I mean,
And to be to be able to have our own
sound and our own thing. It's just like we're just
really starting to be able to really enjoy it. I think,
you know what I mean? And uh, I agree with you.
(18:31):
I think that I think that the The Deltas Cream
album was definitely like a reset and and and this
album does feel like it's it's coming from the same
place as the big come up was. I know you're
(18:56):
you're just wrapped an album and you're hitting the road,
but I understand you're working on more material in the studio.
Where are you at with that? We we're pretty far
along on a on another record, and we had some
fun people come in and write with us. So yeah,
we're excited about that. It's actually pretty legit so far.
(19:20):
Are you able to say who or is it a
little too early for that? Yeah? Too early for me.
I talked to me about the tour of this summer
because it sounds like you've got a few friends going
out with you. Kenny and Eric and you're gonna do
a Delta Cream Spotlight and the Gabber Brothers and they
go way back with you, right, Yeah. The Gabber Brothers
played in a band called the Shams who played with
the Black Keys on at the Black He's very first
(19:42):
show in Cleveland, Ohio at the Beachland Town. Oh Man,
what do you remember by that gig? Not a whole lot.
We feel like we had like thirty minutes of music
and we played it in like fifteen minutes because we
were so nervous. We played everything like four times speed.
(20:02):
It was like when you're on your TV and it
says two times speed and then you go to four
times speed. That's where were we were at the whole
set and I remember going. I just remember we came
to backstage and it was like we looked at each
other like what just happened? Was the fun though out?
Not really? Is it fun? Oh No? It was never racking,
(20:25):
but it was cool when they asked us to come back.
I mean a lot of full circle moments. I got
the gab of Brothers with you and sounds like you're
gonna be hitting the Blossom Music Center in Ohio for
this tour. You know that spot's got a special meeting
for you. Yeah. I used to work there when I was,
uh teenager. I used to be one of those kids
(20:48):
in the parking and with the flag waving the cars.
So but I mean it was always like a real
magical place. I used to kind of like be able
to go backstage and stuff, and I saw the inner
workings of the place, and it's like right in the
in the middle of the woods. It's really beautiful there.
(21:08):
It's like everybody goes there is really happy to be
there that you know. So it was like a kind
of an amazing place. Oh man, were you able to
see many of the acts there. I went and saw
Whitney Houston with my mom that rule. That's so cool. Yeah,
(21:28):
he was awesome. She was all I remember is we
were in the grass and they didn't have really good
video screens, so looking at her on stage, she was
just like a little minuscule neon dot running back and forth.
I just remember everybody on stage head on kneeon like
(21:49):
jogging outfits. It was crazy. So it feels like that
was her aesthetic for a while, Like you know, the
Jamee found the workout tape aesthetic late eighties stuff. Oh man,
I've I've had the pleasure of seeing you several times
in concert. I'm looking forward to it again this summer.
I uh, I save this question for last because I'm
(22:11):
always afraid that people are gonna hang up. I mean
think I'm crazy for asking it, But I'm curious what
you have to say about this, especially with sort of
the Blues being steeped in in in so much um
mythology in a sense, do you believe in a in
a supernatural element in music? Um? Yeah, I think that
(22:34):
there's some some something ancient, something um in our d
n A that you know, allows us all to understand
music no matter what language it's in, and to be
able to feel things from music. I think there's something
special there. But you know, it's I think that's why
(22:55):
it's usually part of every religion on earth. It's like
music think is very important to humans and it's hard
to really say why, which makes it so magical. Yeah,
the mystery of music is just so. It's one of
the things that keeps me coming back and you look
at all these you know, remains of ancient cultures and
(23:16):
back at a time when human beings were just struggling
to to to eat and live. You see remains of
primitive instruments and you think, wow, this was really a
priority for us, even you know, at a base level need.
It's something that was always there and something we always needed.
But it's really hard to articulate exactly why, but it
definitely it hits us, absolutely absolutely, And you know, we're
(23:41):
so lucky that we grew up in North America and
you know, in America and like the melting pot that
this country is has just been like it was just
like exploded with music, and every corner of this country
has got a little special niche and and a special
you know, notch in history. And um, I just got
(24:05):
so into all the regional music in America. Record labels
like our Hooly you know that would that would like
just like really dive deep into where this music came from,
and it's just so special. I love that. I love
like the dust to digital account and stuff like that.
I'm always love discovering all these pockets of music. And
(24:27):
you I mean, I'm so excited for the the Sunhouse
set you have coming out soon. I'm uh just I'm
so grateful for a lot of the music that you've
again I said, this is the beginning of talking to you,
just that you've shared through your label and just through
interviews citing your influences. I mean, you've really uh turned
me and I'm sure millions of others on the so
(24:49):
much great music that would have otherwise never crossed my path. Yeah,
that sun House tape is crazy, just out of the blue.
Dick Waterman said, I have a box full of tapes
in my gras and they've been there since the sixties.
Do you want do you want them to want to
buy them? Just a treasure chas, Oh my God, and
(25:10):
this and that the Sunhouse album that we just put
out forever on my mind. It predates his Columbia recordings,
and so it's like some of the earliest recordings after
he was rediscovered in the sixties, and and in my opinion,
some of the greatest versions of those songs. They feel
so comfortable. I don't know what it was about the
surroundings where he was, but man, he was like sober
(25:33):
and singing with so much conviction and amazing performances are
kind of like blew my mind. After we got that
tape transferred, and that's what was on it. It was
absolutely insane. God, I mean, that's amazing. That's do you
have any other uh? I hesitate They called archival, but
I guess that's the word I'll use. Uh projects in
(25:55):
the works that you're excited about. Yeah. Here you know Waterman,
he sold me a whole box full of tapes. What
we're all different artists, So yeah, we've got some plans.
Oh man. Yeah, we can't spill the beans yet. We
got some really good stuff mined up to release. It's
(26:18):
kind of you know, being a blues nerd since I
was a kid, it's pretty mind blowing to be able
to like acquire this stuff and be able to put
it out. It's kind of insane. How did how did
this music first reach you? I mean, I know that
I'm probably of the last age group that didn't have
the entire history of record of music at their fingertips
(26:38):
growing up, And so it was hard where I was
living just to get you know, a copy of Odyssey
and Oracle by the Zombies or something. It took up
six weeks to get imported from god knows where. How
did you first discover this this kind of music when
you were growing up? Like, how did you got its
safe as milk reach you. I mean I heard about
Save His Milk from Pat. But my dad had keptain
Beefheart albums um at the house. Uh, although we didn't
(27:04):
listen to him much, but you know, my dad had
a great record collection. My mom's family played blue grass,
and my mom's uncle's a harmonica player and played a
telecaster a Telly custom um or yeah, tele custom into
a super reaver, which is what I ended up playing
(27:24):
when I when we started the Black Keys, because I
you know, as he always had a bad bass guitar sound.
But he introduced me to all kinds of people like
Lightning Hopkins and um, you know just that pretty much
everybody really, I mean he he hit me to all
the good blue stuff, and between that the blue grass,
my mom playing classical music, my dad's record collections, and
(27:47):
then when Pat and I got into the van with
each other and we would spend like ten twelve hours
every single fucking day together, we were playing each other's stuff.
And so, I mean Pat played me led Zeppelin for
the first time I had ever. My dad never played
led Zeppeline, never really heard it. I need, I knew
a couple of songs from the radio, but I'd never
heard any of their albums. Um, but you know, he
(28:10):
introduced me to the Captain beefheard stuff, and um I
introduced him to Junior, kimbro and Harrold burn Side and
like you know, between all that, I had some really
good influences. Oh Man, well we are. As a fan,
I'm grateful that that you've shared them. I am. I
don't want to take up too much more of your time,
(28:30):
but I am so grateful for your time today, and
most importantly, I'm so grateful for your music. Dan. Thank
you so much. You're the best. Hey Man, thanks so much.
I appreciate it. We hope you enjoyed this episode of
Inside the Studio, a production of I Heart Radio. For
more episodes of Inside the Studio or other fantastic shows,
(28:52):
check out the I Heart Radio app Apple podcast for
wherever you listen to your favorite podcast
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan run Tug,
but enough about me. My guest today is one of
my all time favorite fans. He's an audio artisan with
a relentless commitment to his craft and a purveyor of
gut punching guitar leads that have made The Black Keys
one of the biggest rock groups on the planet. After
(00:23):
a five year hiatus, he re teamed with his old
friend and bandmate Patrick Carney for Let's Rock. But it
was their next record, a blues covers album called Delta Cream,
that was their true homecoming. Recorded in just a day,
the spontaneous studio jam was something of a reset, a
reminder of the sounds and the spirit that first drew
them to music as teenage neighbors growing up in Akron, Ohio.
(00:46):
The down in dirty blues atmosphere is apparent on their
latest album, Drop Out Boogie, or at least twenty years
almost to the day after their debut, the Big Come Up.
A lot's changed since those days of recording in basements
and touring in bands. Now they've become heroes themselves to
a whole new generation of brash blues punks, all awaiting
their own big come up. I'm so happy to welcome
(01:07):
Dan our By first and foremost congratulations on a new record.
I mean, it's really it's setting the summer off right
for me. It's to me, it's the perfect convertible album.
I know you released Waiting on a Song on eight track,
and I'm kind of wishing you did that with this
one too. I feel like it's the perfect eight track record.
UM started at the very beginning, what role did your
(01:30):
album Delta Cream, their previous record, play in the creation
of Dropout Boogie? You know, I don't think we could
have had one without the other. You know, I think
Um Delta Delta Cream kind of paved the way for
for Dropout Boogie. You know, we it was so um
off the cuff Delta Cream was and it was so easy,
(01:55):
and we ended up both really loving it and loving
the way it sounded. We just kind of took that
positive momentum and we went right into making Drop Up Booie. Yeah.
I think Pat called it a great reset of the band,
and was it amuse reset musically in terms of reminding
you of the the artists and the songs that first
brought you together or was it a reset in terms
(02:15):
of actually playing the music in a room together. I mean, um,
a little bit of both. I mean, we definitely were
playing stuff that influences when we first started, but we
were also playing with Kenny Brown for the very first time.
We were playing with the bass player for the very
first time in the studio, we were playing with the
percussionists for the very first time. So it was like
(02:36):
it was this weird combination of absolutely brand new and old.
And I think that that is a balance that we
always kind of strive for in our records, you know,
Oh yeah, I mean Kenny Brown and stuff Eric Deaton
was bringing to the table. It sounds so good. I mean,
I feel like a huge debt of gratitude not only
for the music that you've made as the Black Keys,
(02:58):
but just turned me onto acts like you know, Junior,
kimbro Are, All Burnside Mississippi, Fred McDowell, I mean people
I never would have heard of where it not through
your covers on Delta Cream and just people you cited
in interviews as influences. And and I gotta say that
Robert Finley record, Oh my god, Sharecropper's son is just
such an incredible album, and he's he's the real deal.
(03:18):
I so I want to thank you for all those
influences you've You've shared with your fans too, Yeah, of course.
I mean I was honored to get to make those
records with Robert. I mean, as soon as he walked
in my studio, it was just like he was electric.
He just was like he was wearing a three quarter
length leather duster and a giant cowboy belt. Buckley had
snakeskin boots, song leather pants. He had a satin cowboy
(03:41):
shirt on and a leather cowboy hat, and his hair
was braided underneath it. It was like, I was like,
who is this guy? I'm so glad to hear that
living up to all of my dreams and expectations like
a Louisiana superhero. That's so cool. I mean it sounds like,
in the same way that you opened up the band
(04:03):
on Delta Cream, you opened up the songwriting process a
bit on dropout boogie, working with outside writers and I
think five tracks. What led you to bring Greg Cartwright
and Angelo into the sessions. Well, those are a couple
of guys that I had worked with a lot in
the past, and I just wrote some songs with Greg
and Angelo on the new Marcus King record. You know,
(04:23):
I I've done a bunch of things, you know, we
worked on the Velvet Heres together and just all kinds
of stuff. So I kind of had a feeling that
Pat would get along with them and that it would
be fruitful. So we rang them up and it was great.
It was so easy, it was fun. And and here,
you know, we are like twenty years into our album
(04:44):
career and uh, we're you know, doing something we've never
done before. So it was really nice. Yeah, I wanted
to ask you more about what you're writing processes is
historically like with Pat, because how much of it is
improvising together versus want of you bringing sort of a
song frack into the studio and then working it out
at a table. It sounds like it's more improvisational, right.
(05:07):
It's always been improvisational, you know, We've always just kind
of messed around in the studio and and something happens.
You know. It's been something that we've been able to
do since we were like sixteen seventeen. I think that's
why we stuck with it when we started, because we
realized right off the bat, We really didn't have to
work at getting it to sound cool. You know. It's like,
(05:29):
as soon as we started making music together, it was like, Oh,
that's I like that whatever that is that sounds fun,
you know. So I think we just it's just always
been there like that for us. So that's that's generally
how we started the songs, and then we kind of
you know, have to shape the song that way. It's
a little bit reverse, you know. And since moving to Nashville,
(05:51):
I've definitely, like UM, gotten to appreciate more old school
style of UM songwriting, you know, just the base chords
and melodies and lyrics first. But you know, so I
guess I understand how that works too. But the way
the pattern I work is just different, you know, you
just always has been. Yeah, I mean moving to Nashville,
(06:13):
it's such a collaborative musical scene that must have been
sounds very different to you know, having been sort of
more self contained the two of you. That must have
been a really cool, uh you know, sort of new
learning process of working in a whole different way. Yeah,
it was. It was you know, pretty uh I opening
(06:35):
when we first got here. But you know, I always
loved Nashville and the and the music scene here, and
I can't imagine living anywhere else. I mean, I've been
here eleven years, almost twelve, I guess now, and it's
an amazing city if you're a musician, you know, it's
just like there's so many tools in the toolbox here. It's, um,
(06:59):
you know, I find it hard to live without. At
this point, you're talking about that a little bit of
magic with you and Pat. I mean, this blew my mind,
good love, burn the damn thing down, didn't I love you?
I think these are all first takes, right, that is
just incredible to me. Yeah, those are all just first take,
one take songs. Wow, that is there. I'll go back
(07:21):
and um, spruce up the lyrics. But I'm as we're
playing it down, I'm like improvising lines and stuff. Sometimes
the line of work. Sometimes it sparks some better line.
But you know, yeah, those are those are first takes.
But that's why they have that feel and that sound
and you can't really fake that. And um, you know
Wild Child does not have that sound, but we like
(07:41):
to have a mix of those, those different kinds of recordings.
You know, I think it I think it's a nice
to to have a like a little bit of a
you know, different palette there. Oh absolutely, I mean that's spontaneity,
the excitement of the moment of creation. It's so cool
and it's so apparent in the tracks, but it got
something like wild Child. It's it's such a great vibe.
(08:04):
I feel like it's it's got a different feel to
it than things I've heard from you. It almost feels
the groove is thord funky comes to mind. I know
that's an overused word, but it's got such a different
flavor to it. It's such a cool track. How did
that track come together? I mean I probably started with
the drum loop, you know, is a funky ass due
wipe Bo, And you know, we started with the with
(08:28):
the rhythm track, and I think instantly we really liked
it. It It was so simple. We both there's something so
kind of like instantly likable, catchy about it. Um, so
we just kept working at it, you know what I mean. So, uh,
that was the That was one of the songs we
called in Angelo, were called him Greg and we sat
(08:49):
down at the table with some acoustic guitars and we
kind of like worked out the melodies and the lyrics,
but that was after we had the instrumental, you know,
so it was fun. You know, I think it was
worth It was definitely worth while. I know you've worked
a lot with Danger Mouse in the past, and something
that I've noticed is that I feel like I can
always tell the albums you made with him because there's
(09:10):
something in the rhythm that's different and I can't put
my finger on it. It just it swings differently these
albums that that you self produce. I don't know if
it's not playing with a click or something, but I
feel like on a track like how Long on this
new album, it's got this incredible feel to it. It's
a slower and looser That's one of my favorite tracks
on this how Long. It's such an incredible I really
(09:31):
liked that song a lot, and you know, that was
just that just happened out of an improblem playing guitar
and drums across from each other, you know, just started
playing that lick and Pat fell in and that one
came together really quickly. To be honest, I do like
that song a lot. I love how your vocal sits
(09:53):
in it. It's like it's not like a lead singer
it's like another instrument to me. It's it's such a
cool way that it sits in the track. Yeah, I
don't know. You know, when Pat and I UM are
in a good place and comfortable, Um, I don't know.
It's I've never been more comfortable playing with someone, you know,
(10:15):
in my life. I don't even have to think about it,
you know. I wanted to ask you about your I
think your latest single, and it Ain't Over UM has
this really unique sound on it. When I was listening
(10:37):
to it, I couldn't figure out what it was. I
assumed it was a keyboard sound. I did a little
digging and I learned it was something called an optagan,
which I'd never heard of in my life. Oh well,
tell me about that. Almost like an early sample, like
a souped up melotron, right, Like, what is that? Yeah?
They had UM these little disks that you would put
in it. It was basically like a Fisher Prize keyboard
(10:57):
toy for kids. And you know, I think people got
hip to them, and people like Tom Wade's and I
don't know everybody's used them, but they just have an
amazing sound, and you know, you can flip the discs
upside down and it plays the sounds backwards, so you know,
it has a keyboard sound and then like a rhythm
(11:19):
accompaniment which is like got some like kind of generally
cheesy sounding percussion or drums or bass or something like that.
And Uh, it's really fun to kind of spark ideas.
I've done it before. You know, I used it on
the Doctor John record I made. Um. You know, we
used it a bunch. You know, it's a fun tool.
(11:39):
I like, there's definitely some different sounds on this record.
I know that, UH used the wall for the first
time right on on what what track was on Wild Child? Yeah? Yeah?
On Wild Child? Yeah, some rhythm guitar. Yeah. I don't
know what got into me feeling crazy that day. M
(12:01):
I gotta ask you about the guitar work by Mr
Billy F. Gibbins. How did he get involved and what
was he like just to play with in the room? Man?
He Uh, he's the best. He's the coolest, coolest guy
on earth. I mean I texted him and told him
Pat and I would be in the studio and if
he was free, he should stop by because I heard
(12:22):
he was in town. And uh, and I didn't hear
anything from a few hours went by, and then he
got a text from him he said, I'm headed over, amigo.
He showed up. Man, he didn't bring guitar. He just
brought bottle of bottle of wine. And uh. I handed
him a guitar that I had plugged it straight into
(12:42):
an AMP, a guitar he's never played before. You know,
pour him a glass of wine and we just started playing.
And we played for you know, almost two hours and um,
and then he took off and I think we probably
had like four songs kind of written in that time.
We were just flowing. It was great and good Love
is one of those songs. And it's just like his
(13:04):
sound is so instantly identifiable as it's awesome to be
able to like, um, sit in the room with him
and play music. It's like, it's pretty cool. Oh man, man,
it wasn't even his guitar. Wow, just all in the fingers.
What what is man? He had this old triny Lopez
(13:24):
that I own that that used to be used to
belong to Mississippi Fred McDowell. What. It's a beautiful guitar.
You can see video footage of him of Fred McDowell
playing it. On YouTube. He's Scott his wife glued like
some um jewelry, some like brooches to the headstock into
the upper about of the guitar. And um, it's a
(13:47):
cool guitar, you know. But we've always heard stuff about
Billy Gibbons like he plays special kind of slinky strings
and only uses this kind of whatever. It's like, Man,
this guitar had normal as strings, plugged it straight into
an amp and it sounded instantly like Billy Gibbinson was
fucking awesome. Wow have you played with them before. We've
(14:09):
done a couple of things with them before, but not
like this. Oh. Man, that that is incredible. I hope
we get to hear those other songs you guys worked
on too. I hope there's a you know, expanded edition
or EP or you know special seven inch or something coming. Yeah,
I mean you never know. Man, Oh, that is so cool.
I mean you've you've worked with so many amazing artists.
(14:32):
I mean you mentioned Dr John, Robert Finley, you know,
Yola see low Green, Lana del Rey. How is your
production work outside of the Black Keys impacted your work
in the band as producing outside people almost given you
kind of more objectivity when it comes to your own
band and your own sound and change the way you worked.
I think so. I think it really has. I think
(14:53):
it especially in the last few years, being able to
hone in on our strengths and being able to like
maybe figure out how we how it's like max enjoyable
what I mean, because that's really what's most important for
Pat and I at this point, is to like be
able to do this, uh and enjoy it. You know,
(15:17):
that's kind of the goal. I think he said in
a few interviews that this is the most enjoyable record
you guys have ever made. You do you echo that sentiment? Yeah,
it was. It was pretty awesome. I mean, you know,
every record we got to make is really fun, but
there was something about this when where it was just
like we're firing on all cylinders, you know, It's just
(15:38):
like we were so um, we're just in that in
the zone. I love the title of the record. I
immediately thought of Captain Beefhart and Safe as Milk was
sort of my access point to his music. I just
I think that record is incredible. I mean, I'm glad
those spine tingling vocals. I mean, that's crazy kind of
warp do wop sound. I mean Ryan Cooter's guitar work.
(16:01):
Such an amazing record. I know that sounds like that
was a real point of connection for YouTube growing up
when you first were um discovering music together. Yeah, it
was a huge influence on on us. And when we
were first touring in the van, just the two of us,
you know, zigzagging back and forth across the States. It
was one of the records we listened to the most.
(16:22):
I still amazing to me. But when you were growing up,
I can't imagine there are many other kids in town
who were listening to Captain Beefar and yet you guys
were just down the street from one another. It's just
such a crazy thing to consider. I mean, it really
does make you, you know, I wonder about fate. What
were some other musical points of connection between the two
of you when you were first getting to know each other.
(16:43):
I mean, we loved Which Hang Records. We loved Liquid Sours,
the Jizz album, just the aesthetic of the record, the
way it sounded. We loved Um Credence clear Water. We
used to sit and listen to Buy You Country over
and over again. Um. Yeah, we love to be hard
and we would listen to the Sonics all the time. Um, yeah,
(17:06):
I don't know. We we liked We liked music that
was real, raw, kind of grimy and and fun. That
was kind of what we were into. Had read that
The Big Come Up. Initially, an early version of it
had like skits in between the songs, like a hip
hop record. Yeah, and the dude who owned the record
labels this French guy who's like in the rock and
(17:26):
roll hated rap. He was like, he's like, what is
this ship? You got got to get rid of this stuff,
And uh, it was probably the smart idea. We did
leave a couple of little things and so it was nice,
but it was probably It's crazy that Dropout Bookie came
out the day before the twenty anniversary of your debut,
(17:46):
The Big Come Up. Uh what do you see when
you contrast those two, Because in a funny way, I
almost feel like Dropout Boogie is more like your first
record than any you've made in a while, all aside
from maybe Delta Cream, especially something like the closer Didn't
I Love You? I Mean to me, that feels like
something that that could have come out of the basement
in a way. Yeah, I think that we are. The
(18:09):
more I work with other people, the more I appreciate,
you know what, the thing that the specialty gift that
Pat and I were given, you know what I mean,
And to be to be able to have our own
sound and our own thing. It's just like we're just
really starting to be able to really enjoy it. I think,
you know what I mean? And uh, I agree with you.
(18:31):
I think that I think that the The Deltas Cream
album was definitely like a reset and and and this
album does feel like it's it's coming from the same
place as the big come up was. I know you're
(18:56):
you're just wrapped an album and you're hitting the road,
but I understand you're working on more material in the studio.
Where are you at with that? We we're pretty far
along on a on another record, and we had some
fun people come in and write with us. So yeah,
we're excited about that. It's actually pretty legit so far.
(19:20):
Are you able to say who or is it a
little too early for that? Yeah? Too early for me.
I talked to me about the tour of this summer
because it sounds like you've got a few friends going
out with you. Kenny and Eric and you're gonna do
a Delta Cream Spotlight and the Gabber Brothers and they
go way back with you, right, Yeah. The Gabber Brothers
played in a band called the Shams who played with
the Black Keys on at the Black He's very first
(19:42):
show in Cleveland, Ohio at the Beachland Town. Oh Man,
what do you remember by that gig? Not a whole lot.
We feel like we had like thirty minutes of music
and we played it in like fifteen minutes because we
were so nervous. We played everything like four times speed.
(20:02):
It was like when you're on your TV and it
says two times speed and then you go to four
times speed. That's where were we were at the whole
set and I remember going. I just remember we came
to backstage and it was like we looked at each
other like what just happened? Was the fun though out?
Not really? Is it fun? Oh No? It was never racking,
(20:25):
but it was cool when they asked us to come back.
I mean a lot of full circle moments. I got
the gab of Brothers with you and sounds like you're
gonna be hitting the Blossom Music Center in Ohio for
this tour. You know that spot's got a special meeting
for you. Yeah. I used to work there when I was,
uh teenager. I used to be one of those kids
(20:48):
in the parking and with the flag waving the cars.
So but I mean it was always like a real
magical place. I used to kind of like be able
to go backstage and stuff, and I saw the inner
workings of the place, and it's like right in the
in the middle of the woods. It's really beautiful there.
(21:08):
It's like everybody goes there is really happy to be
there that you know. So it was like a kind
of an amazing place. Oh man, were you able to
see many of the acts there. I went and saw
Whitney Houston with my mom that rule. That's so cool. Yeah,
(21:28):
he was awesome. She was all I remember is we
were in the grass and they didn't have really good
video screens, so looking at her on stage, she was
just like a little minuscule neon dot running back and forth.
I just remember everybody on stage head on kneeon like
(21:49):
jogging outfits. It was crazy. So it feels like that
was her aesthetic for a while, Like you know, the
Jamee found the workout tape aesthetic late eighties stuff. Oh man,
I've I've had the pleasure of seeing you several times
in concert. I'm looking forward to it again this summer.
I uh, I save this question for last because I'm
(22:11):
always afraid that people are gonna hang up. I mean
think I'm crazy for asking it, But I'm curious what
you have to say about this, especially with sort of
the Blues being steeped in in in so much um
mythology in a sense, do you believe in a in
a supernatural element in music? Um? Yeah, I think that
(22:34):
there's some some something ancient, something um in our d
n A that you know, allows us all to understand
music no matter what language it's in, and to be
able to feel things from music. I think there's something
special there. But you know, it's I think that's why
(22:55):
it's usually part of every religion on earth. It's like
music think is very important to humans and it's hard
to really say why, which makes it so magical. Yeah,
the mystery of music is just so. It's one of
the things that keeps me coming back and you look
at all these you know, remains of ancient cultures and
(23:16):
back at a time when human beings were just struggling
to to to eat and live. You see remains of
primitive instruments and you think, wow, this was really a
priority for us, even you know, at a base level need.
It's something that was always there and something we always needed.
But it's really hard to articulate exactly why, but it
definitely it hits us, absolutely absolutely, And you know, we're
(23:41):
so lucky that we grew up in North America and
you know, in America and like the melting pot that
this country is has just been like it was just
like exploded with music, and every corner of this country
has got a little special niche and and a special
you know, notch in history. And um, I just got
(24:05):
so into all the regional music in America. Record labels
like our Hooly you know that would that would like
just like really dive deep into where this music came from,
and it's just so special. I love that. I love
like the dust to digital account and stuff like that.
I'm always love discovering all these pockets of music. And
(24:27):
you I mean, I'm so excited for the the Sunhouse
set you have coming out soon. I'm uh just I'm
so grateful for a lot of the music that you've
again I said, this is the beginning of talking to you,
just that you've shared through your label and just through
interviews citing your influences. I mean, you've really uh turned
me and I'm sure millions of others on the so
(24:49):
much great music that would have otherwise never crossed my path. Yeah,
that sun House tape is crazy, just out of the blue.
Dick Waterman said, I have a box full of tapes
in my gras and they've been there since the sixties.
Do you want do you want them to want to
buy them? Just a treasure chas, Oh my God, and
(25:10):
this and that the Sunhouse album that we just put
out forever on my mind. It predates his Columbia recordings,
and so it's like some of the earliest recordings after
he was rediscovered in the sixties, and and in my opinion,
some of the greatest versions of those songs. They feel
so comfortable. I don't know what it was about the
surroundings where he was, but man, he was like sober
(25:33):
and singing with so much conviction and amazing performances are
kind of like blew my mind. After we got that
tape transferred, and that's what was on it. It was
absolutely insane. God, I mean, that's amazing. That's do you
have any other uh? I hesitate They called archival, but
I guess that's the word I'll use. Uh projects in
(25:55):
the works that you're excited about. Yeah. Here you know Waterman,
he sold me a whole box full of tapes. What
we're all different artists, So yeah, we've got some plans.
Oh man. Yeah, we can't spill the beans yet. We
got some really good stuff mined up to release. It's
(26:18):
kind of you know, being a blues nerd since I
was a kid, it's pretty mind blowing to be able
to like acquire this stuff and be able to put
it out. It's kind of insane. How did how did
this music first reach you? I mean, I know that
I'm probably of the last age group that didn't have
the entire history of record of music at their fingertips
(26:38):
growing up, And so it was hard where I was
living just to get you know, a copy of Odyssey
and Oracle by the Zombies or something. It took up
six weeks to get imported from god knows where. How
did you first discover this this kind of music when
you were growing up? Like, how did you got its
safe as milk reach you. I mean I heard about
Save His Milk from Pat. But my dad had keptain
Beefheart albums um at the house. Uh, although we didn't
(27:04):
listen to him much, but you know, my dad had
a great record collection. My mom's family played blue grass,
and my mom's uncle's a harmonica player and played a
telecaster a Telly custom um or yeah, tele custom into
a super reaver, which is what I ended up playing
(27:24):
when I when we started the Black Keys, because I
you know, as he always had a bad bass guitar sound.
But he introduced me to all kinds of people like
Lightning Hopkins and um, you know just that pretty much
everybody really, I mean he he hit me to all
the good blue stuff, and between that the blue grass,
my mom playing classical music, my dad's record collections, and
(27:47):
then when Pat and I got into the van with
each other and we would spend like ten twelve hours
every single fucking day together, we were playing each other's stuff.
And so, I mean Pat played me led Zeppelin for
the first time I had ever. My dad never played
led Zeppeline, never really heard it. I need, I knew
a couple of songs from the radio, but I'd never
heard any of their albums. Um, but you know, he
(28:10):
introduced me to the Captain beefheard stuff, and um I
introduced him to Junior, kimbro and Harrold burn Side and
like you know, between all that, I had some really
good influences. Oh Man, well we are. As a fan,
I'm grateful that that you've shared them. I am. I
don't want to take up too much more of your time,
(28:30):
but I am so grateful for your time today, and
most importantly, I'm so grateful for your music. Dan. Thank
you so much. You're the best. Hey Man, thanks so much.
I appreciate it. We hope you enjoyed this episode of
Inside the Studio, a production of I Heart Radio. For
more episodes of Inside the Studio or other fantastic shows,
(28:52):
check out the I Heart Radio app Apple podcast for
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