March 24, 2021 • 37 mins
Who says gardening and tending to the flowers is a gendered activity? From house plants to flowers, the plant daddies and Miracle-Bros are infusing their personality into growing culture and redefining what masculinity means.
In this episode, Mango reconnects with friend of the pod Michael “Mr. Plant Geek” Perry as they talk about living your truth among the plants. New York drag queen Missleidy The Plant Lady stops by and reads men based on their plant preferences. We’ll also hear from men across the country about their own views on plant care and masculinity.
For more helpful tips on gardening, check out the Miracle-Gro Website and learn about Orchids with Floral Designer Carlos Franco or discover Vertical Gardening with Gardenier Jim Cunneen. Your friends at Miracle-Gro are collaboration partners with iHeart Radio for "Humans Growing Stuff."
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Fourth grade was a big year at HP DuPont Middle
School because it's the year we got to join the band.
And on the day we picked out instruments, I chose
the clarinet. M not because I liked the clarinet, but
because my best friend Jeremy chose the clarinet, and I
(00:26):
figured we could sit next to each other. What I
didn't realize was that Jeremy and I were the only
two boys who would picked the clarinet. And I also
didn't realize that he'd be really, really good at it.
So you know, we started out the year sitting next
to one another, but a month later I was stuck
starring at the back of his head with about seventeen
(00:46):
or eighteen girls sitting between us. But and I promised,
there's a point to this. It wasn't long before the
kids in my school started poking fun at the boys
who played clarinet. It wasn't as quote girly as the flute,
but was in the same bracket. So I started a
pr campaign. I said, the clarinets great because it gets
(01:07):
you out of study hall. It's great because you can
use the carrying cases of shield and snowball fights. It's
great because you can cope the read in fun dip,
which I actually did, so it tastes like cherry candy
while you play, and you cannot do that with a trumpet.
Like a nine year old Don Draper, I took this
thing that was seen as not fit for boys and
(01:28):
started a campaign to make it a thing of envy,
and I kind of spun my way out of any bullying.
Like I've said before, my grandfather was a botanist, so
I never saw a gardening or really most things ex gendered.
I was encouraged to pursue the arts, and really just
anything I was interested in. I was never told cooking
(01:48):
or sport, or dance, or engineering or men's or women's work.
That's kind of how my family was, and that just
wasn't my home. But last week, as I started thinking
about what sort of flowers I might try to plant
in my garden, I kept stumbling into these weirdly gendered
posts on the Internet. They screened things like do you
(02:11):
real men garden? Three reasons why flowers can be masculine,
manly horticulturists, and history. In a strange way, it felt
like algorithms were trying to tell me don't worry. It's
okay to be a guy and garden. And it made
me wonder, how is the culture around gender and gardening changed,
(02:31):
and does gardening feel like a safe space for everyone
to get their hands dirty? Let's dig in. Hey there,
I'm Mongish Particular, co host of Part Time Genius, one
of the founders of Mental Flaws, and this is Humans
Growing Stuff, a collaboration from My Heart Radio and your
friends at Miracle Grow. Our goal is to make this
(02:52):
the most human show about plants you'll ever listen to.
Along the way, we'll share inspiring stories, tips and tricks
to or to your plane addiction, and just enough science
to make you sound like an expert. Today's show is
all about gender and gardening, what your plants say about you,
and how men have opened up their arms and their
hearts to embrace the world of growing. Chapter eleven, Plant
(03:16):
Daddy's Miracle Burrows and the Seeds of Modern masculinity. Maybe
this is just how I want to view the world.
But one of the things I found heartening about watching
kids today hang out in New York is that kids
who are clearly artsy, you're gay, you're queer, don't seem
(03:39):
to be ostracized or bullied the way they were when
I was younger. I don't know whether it's the Internet
or the way TV has shaped us, or maybe being
raised by a generation that grew up on Mr. Rogers,
but it feels like there's less pressure to fit into
a certain stereotypical mold and more space to explore who
you are and who you want to be. And it
(04:01):
made me consider just how much things have changed. I
was reading Michael Perry's Mr. Plant Geek website this week
and I stumbled into this article he wrote called Beating
the Stigma around gender and Gardening. In it, he writes
about hiding his love from gardening from his schoolmates the
same way he hit his sexuality. And in one paragraph
(04:23):
he talks about being called a pansy on the playground
and how quote the way school bullies grabbed that innocent
plant name and used it to hurt me really summed
up how they felt about my less than masculine weekend hobby.
Just hearing that made my stomach drop, and I want
to hear how his perspective has changed, how he's learned
(04:43):
to embrace his identity as a gardener. So we called
him up Hey, Michael, Hey, how's it coming. Hey, It's
so nice to have you back on the program. I've
got to say I loved your tips so much, and
and I loved all the plants that I showed my kids,
the dancing plant, how you could hang flowers upside down,
(05:07):
and all these amazing wonders. But I'm thrilled to have
you back on the program. Oh, no problems. It's good
to be here and good to share my love of
innovation and new plants and new ways of growing plants
and most of all, easier ways to grow the parts
we love. Yeah. So, so today we're talking about masculinity
(05:27):
and gardening, and I want to get into that topic.
But before any of that, I know, the last time
we chad with you, you were, I think, just laying
down concrete in your backyard and your gardens. How's that
coming along? Well, we're developed now, So it's the finishing
touches because everything obviously after the concrete then came the decking, painting.
(05:49):
I then planted everything. So I planted lots of bulbs,
lots of bear roots. So I've been able to really
multi plant and have some real colonies of bulbs, and
and I tend to plant them very closely together as well,
because I like them to support each other, and so
I have that kind of informality and just keeping my
fingers crossed that everything I planted will appear. So it's
(06:12):
always a bit of a leap of faith when you
plant something in the autumn and you don't see anything
until spring, and it's kind of, you know, it still
makes me kind of like get anxious, as it were.
Once I get my tulips with their lovely, luscious leaves,
you know, dangling over my concrete, I'll be happy. That
sounds nice. So, you know, one of the things that
(06:34):
we're talking about on this program is about masculinity and
gardening and also just like beating the stigma around gender
and rightening. And so I know you wrote an article
about this a while ago, and I really loved reading it.
I was curious what prompted you to put your feelings
out there and right about this topic. I think kind
of my love of plants and sexuality have always been
(06:57):
kind of intertwined, both in a good way and in
a bad way. And I'm just really jealous now of
younger people these days because it's so much easier to
be yourself. And I don't just mean sexuality wise, I
mean in terms of following your interests the things you
really love, because we've got the Internet, which has really helped,
and social media, so you can find other people that
(07:18):
are interested in that very niche thing that you're interested in.
So it just kind of helps the whole sense of community.
And it's funny because I don't know, when you're interested
in plants from a young aide, you are automatically kind
of you know, people take the mick out of you
and they kind of call your pansy or all sorts
of different awful names, which are obviously relating to your
(07:41):
love of plants, but also you know, tinged with that
sexuality edge as well. So it's kind of hopefully things
have changed a lot these days, but it's kind of
like for me that plants and the sexuality have always
been intertwined, you know. Yeah, I mean, I I think
what you're saying is true about community and being able
to find community through the Internet. People felt so alone
(08:02):
and even finding information was difficult. Yeah, the YouTube videos
are are so easy to access now at versus like
the difficulty of like having to go to the library,
having to find specialty books like finding someone with that interest, right, Yeah,
And I do wonder if the world opening up, the
kind of community opening up, you know, at the same
time as people getting to know each other, they've realized
(08:23):
that there are more people out there like them, which
is you know, obviously gay bye, you know, and interested
in plants and so on. It's funny because the last
time we talked, we chatted about your love of gardening
partially coming from your grandparents home, right, and and and
watching your grandparents garden. And I always wanted to do
(08:44):
more gardening because my grandfather was a botanist, but those
ideas were so romantic. And then to know that you
kind of had to hide these feelings in school is
is really I don't know, it's depressing. I don't know,
I kind of hit it. I still had a really
nice time within that because I made I created my
own world, my own world where I was, you know,
(09:07):
loving plants, spending time with plants, and you know, obviously
the school part of it was just you know, the
thing that had to be bearable. But I didn't necessary
hide it from my friends, but I just didn't mention
it in particularly you know, or yeah, yeah, or I
would have said I was playing with something cool at
the weekend, like lego or something that you had the
(09:29):
idea of, Like growing something out of nothing and watching
a plasts im and sharing food is so much cooler
than sticking legos together in something, unless you make it
a Lego bouquet or something like. Yeah, So tell me
a little bit about when you started opening up to
your school friends or more people about this gardening identity
(09:53):
you had. Yeah, it's really hard to judge. And I
wonder if I was a straight guy, if I would
have felt the same embarrassment about loving plants. But then
in those days, it wasn't cool to like anything that
was kind of out of the ordinary anyway. There was
always some trend where there was always some jacket you
had to have, or you know, when it was teenage
mutant ninja turtles, you had to be interested in that,
(10:15):
and if you're interested in anything else, then you would
be kind of, you know, an outcast. So yeah, I
do think it was hard to be an individual in
any way in those days. Yeah. I feel like I've
seen magazine articles and website articles recently about how it's
okay to give men flowers and the type of flowers
(10:35):
men like, and it's so strange to put any sort
of limits or ideas on those things. Yeah, I know,
I know, it's so bizarre. Social media has changed so
much because now I sometimes I'm on there and one
of my friends that has probably taken the mick out
of me liking plants in the past is then buying
their their first house plant, you know. So everyone's been
(10:57):
you know, carried along with this journey, which is fantastic.
And then of course you put pandemic into the mix
and that is the thing that has accelerated it as well. Yeah,
it's a golden time for us because we're accepted from
all angles. Couldn't be better. No, I completely agree. I've
done two kids, and I watched it at my kids school,
and my seven year old identifies as a day And
(11:19):
it's amazing to see the sort of acceptance that is
there in the world and and of all interests in
a new way that I just don't think was there
at least when I was growing up. Yeah, No, totally.
It's just it's amazing. Really, I'd like, I'd like to
be younger now and see if it would be easier
or perhaps then these days there's different worries. I think
there's just a different set of things to worry about. Now.
(11:41):
I agree, there's always face to occupy that worry. Unfortunately,
So our episode is about plant Daddy's and you know,
trying to figure out what those words mean exactly. Do
you enjoy that sort of moniker or take any pride
in it? Yeah, I mean it's it's never not puzzling
because you know, kind of loving plants was something that
(12:04):
wasn't popular, you know, obviously being gay with something that
wasn't popular. It's just amazing that those two worlds, two
worlds that I'm very involved in, collided in this way.
And I'm not single, but I can see that there's
a lot of dating elements that go in there, and
it almost seems like people meet each other through plant
daddy hashtag on Instagram or through you know, Facebook page
(12:27):
with boys with plants or similar and I think a
lot of guys are meeting through that method these days
rather than your typical you meet up apps or different
ways that you might have dated in the past, which
is very really interesting thing to look in on because
that is a very different movement as well. Yeah, you
talk a little earlier about your own garden, and the
(12:49):
idea of bob supporting each other sounds kind of adorable.
I also find it super interesting that you said bob's
grow better together in community. It's not dissimilar from humans really.
So why do you grow the bulbs in that way? Well,
I'm quite an impatient gardener, so I always want to
(13:10):
have impact as soon as possible. So even with my garden,
you know, I talk about the leap of faith of
growing bulbs in the autumn and then having to wait
until the spring, and it's just it's it's far too much.
So when the bulbs come through, I want them to
have impact from the world goes. So I tend to
plant them very closely, you know, much more closely than
(13:30):
it would tell you on the label or on the instructions,
because I want that impact sooner, and I want them
to kind of be this lovely big clump and this
like vivid color explosion. And of course when you plant
them closer, it makes more sense because the bulbs, the
stems all support each other, because you've got this big
(13:51):
almost thicket of growth that is then supporting all the
flower heads rather than a single bulb, you know, solitary
in the border, and another one is six inches away.
It's just it doesn't make sense because they're just going
to blow about all over the place. Well, I like
the idea also of um, you know, the idea of
these bulbs near each other and supporting each other rather
(14:12):
than isolated. There's something wonderful and that. Yeah, I mean,
it's it's very interesting because the fact I've been talking
about bulbs being planted closely together and that gives support
and it gives a kind of more community feel. It
has a bigger effect that really relates a lot to
how life is and how life has been with social
media is the lubricant and kind of the the openness
(14:34):
that we now have the ability to find like minded
individuals that we then support each other and then we
you know, we amplify gardening and the whole plant world.
So yeah, it's a it's a really interesting parallel. There.
Just a few final tips. Now a spring is hitting
here in Brooklyn. Anything I should be thinking about as
(14:54):
I'm figuring out what to do with my garden. Gosh, well,
it's time soon to are some vegetables and some salad
crops outdoors or if you haven't got any outside, then
it could be micro greens on a window cell, or
if you are guarding the inside, then soon your house
plants are going to start needing some feed again and
a bit more water, so hopefully you've given them a
(15:16):
bit of a win to rest, but soon they'll be
bouncing back into life. Michael, thank you so much for
being here with us. I feel like I can't wait
to see what your garden looks like on your Instagram
and then how it changes a year from then. Hey,
no worries. Thank you very much. It's been really really
cool to be here and speak to you again, and
hope to talk to you again sometime soon. That sounds wonderful.
(15:42):
Humans growing stuff will be right back after a short break.
The other day, I was scrolling through the comments section
of Reddit posts with strangers, trying to figure out what's
going to happen on the next in of Lupin, and
it reminded me that while the Internet is a source
(16:05):
of a lot of truly truly awful things, you get
moments like this when we get to connect with people
around the world who are so different from us about
topics we have a shared interest in and In this case,
it was a heated debate about what we think we
know about being a successful jewel thief in France that
(16:26):
none of us has any expertise in. But thanks to
platforms like Instagram and Interest, we've seen more and more
communities come together, including men embracing their love of house
plants in these creative and very expressive ways. In large part,
these sites are where the plant daddy movement was born.
(16:46):
Living at the intersection of horticulture and sexuality, the plant
daddy movement has given men this opportunity to display a
new side of masculinity and create a space for men
to connect with each other as human over their love
of plants. You know, most plant daddies are house plant parents,
and this growing trend has been gaining numbers for the
(17:08):
last few years. According to a survey from the National
Gardening Association, millennials account for one fourth of plant purchases
in two thousand eighteen, and it's important to note that
tropical house plants were the dominant purchase there and more
significantly than any of that, men made up fifty three
of those purchases. So today you can follow accounts like
(17:34):
Boys with Plants and see men of all shapes and
sizes and backgrounds, posing proudly with their parlor palms or
bird's nest ferns. Because, more than anything, the plant Daddy
movement is rooted in freedom of expression. So much of
(17:57):
our show is about not stereotyping people and boxing them in,
but YouTube diva Miss Lady. The Plant Lady enjoys analyzing
the plants in your collection and using them to do
exactly that interpret your personality. For her, plants are like
a zodiac chart, telling her everything she needs to know
about the type of man or person who cares for
(18:20):
I don't know a zz plant. So this week we
invited her to share her powers of perception with us
and give us the t on different types of plant owners?
Is this lady on the other side? Was Getty? Was Getty?
Was getdy? Miss Lady to the plant Lady, I'm so
(18:41):
excited to have you on. I've seen your features in
Paper Magazine, I've read about you on Apartment Therapy, I've
seen your Instagram and it's just so fun to be
chatting with you. What's that boom? I'm happy to be
here and excited to be chatting with you. So I'm
a little nervous about this. I'm going to give you
the name of a plant, and I want your take
on the personnel, the traits of the plant. Dad who
(19:02):
lives with this plant? Perfect, Let's do it. Let's let
me get these chakras ready, let me get these vibes ready.
So what does it mean if someone has a pathos
plant on their mantle? Okay, well, if you go into
their house and this man has a pathos in his house,
he is a man who is a little basic. He's
(19:22):
not the one, you know what. I love me some pothos,
and I own know myself, so I'm maybe reading myself
a little bit. Pothos are great. They're really resilient. You
could literally put them anywhere and they're gonna like survive
and thrive and do their thing in nature. They're amazing.
They're climbers, they get huge and all that. But the
kind of person who brings it into their home, there's
(19:43):
no thought process to it is just Okay, this will survive.
We'll just throw it here. Avoid But that's just that's
the team. So this is another plant that I feel like.
These fiddle leaf figs are everywhere, and I'm curious what
your thoughts are when you walk into an apartment and
see one on full display. Okay this and like you
really cancel me right now, but I have like my
(20:04):
hand on my forehead and I'm just like, stay stay
away from this man. To be honest, I've never even
owned a fiddle leaf fig and I've owned like pretty
much every plant you live in a rainforest essentially right
your apartment, pretty much. And this is the one plant
I do not let into my into my space because
of the energy that it gives off. A few basic
traits that I would give a person who has a
(20:24):
fiddle leaf is they're a little selfish and it's either
their way or the highway, you know. Like fiddle leaves,
once you put them in a place in your house
and they start to grow, don't touch them, don't do
anything different, leave them where they're at, because they'll drop
leaves like crazy, they'll get brown edges. It is the
most problematic plant. They just show you no kind of love,
(20:45):
too finicky, and we don't want that. We don't want
that energy. N you know, no, I feel that. To
tell me about succulents and and maybe cacti in particular,
I feel like it's all bad news. Okay, I don't
(21:07):
really care for plants that can hurt me, thorn, spikes,
all that kind of stuff. So the aura that I
get from a man who has a cacti is good
from Afar, but far from good. When you're growing these
luscious grain tropical plants, you love touching the foliage and
seeing like the textures. Some are velvety, some are rubbery
and leathery, and it's part of this relationship with your plants.
(21:29):
And I really feel like succulents represent that kind of
man that is totally closed off. He's very beautiful, he's handsome,
he's gorgeous. So when you get close and you try
to touch, you donna get spikes. And we're not dealing
with that. We're not just a good from Afar, but
far from good. So I am ready for some good news. Yes,
(21:52):
what are your feelings on zz plants? Now? See, this
is a plant I could get behind. ZZ is completely
and de rated. It might not be the showiest plant,
but let me tell you, the z z is gonna
stick with you through thick and thin. Z z s
don't eat that much water. They're very hardy and resilient plants.
You could even sometimes throw a z eazy in a
(22:13):
closet for like a month or two and go check
it in a month and it will still be alive.
It won't be thriving. Don't do that to the poor
is easy, you know. And yeah, So in regards to
a man who has his zaz, he is a man
who is loyal, who is going to stick with you
through the good times and the bad times. And that's
the man you marry if you believe in that. So
(22:34):
I approve of that. So I have another one for
you that I'm seeing pop up a whole lot recently
on Pinterest. And I think it's called and Thorium waa quiana.
Do you know how do you know what that is? Yes?
And Theorium walk Reanum queen and they um and like
in the plant community right now there's like spikes and
plants that become very popular. The variegated monstera and then
(22:57):
the Pink Princess was one, and now it's the Intherium
war Aquianum or the Queen and Theorium. And this one
is an interesting one. It's detail oriented. The man who
has this characteristics that really like describe him are somebody
who is invested in you, and invested in life, and
(23:20):
invested in the little things, because he knows the fruits
that come when you pay attention and put focus on life, relationships,
work all of those things. So I get behind that
man too. He's a lot more work than diseasing, but
worth it. But worth it, Go bigger, go home. Right.
I saw them with a friend and they said that
(23:40):
it looked like cheetos were growing out of it. Yes,
the inflorescence, yes, they get pollinated. The fruits turn orange,
which is really cool. Yeah. And and one last question,
I read that part of your design sense comes from
from your grandparents, from the way your grandmother kept the house,
but your father's exotic bird collection, and I was curious,
(24:03):
what sort of matches your grandfather's personality. Yeah, I mean
my grandfather always the birds that he brought were just
always very exotic. And I was born in the US
that day, came over from Cuba in nine and because
of them always telling me, like their stories of how
it was in Cuba and them growing up seeing like
(24:24):
my grandfather bringing in like plants that were reminiscent of Cuba,
like that they're like planning them around the house or
inside the house and even some of the birds and
stuff that they had always felt that was the connection,
you know, plants and animals like that was my connection
to Oh, this is the piece of Cuba that I
didn't get to experience with them, But I'm experiencing it
with them in real time right now, and you know,
(24:47):
and I feel like a lot of the birds were
always like beautiful and like flamboyant and stuff like that,
and I feel like it was a reflection of how
he like viewed Cuba. Well, I love these descriptions. I
can't wait to go out into the world and stereotype
everyone based on their plant touchtions. But but I really
appreciate this, miss lady. It's been so fun. It was
(25:08):
so fun. Thank you for having me. If you ever
need me to read some more plant horoscopes, let me
know we'll do. One of my favorite sites on the
web is the sociology site Society Pages, and I love
it because they analyze culture in all sorts of intriguing ways.
(25:30):
Like in one post, they analyzed over kids books, including
Richard Scarry's Busy Town Books, and they learned that mice
and pigs mostly get depicted in service industry jobs. While
more predatory creatures like lions often end up as executives.
They also do a couple of interest collections, including one
of pointlessly gendered items, and the page is filled with
(25:52):
real items like manrea sangria, men can feel comfortable drinking
at barbecues, chap fix chapter that's engineered for men, and
cleanex for men, which sports man sized tissues. If we're
being honest, it all feels a little ridiculous, doesn't it,
Like why do men need a manly label to justify
(26:15):
that they like fruit in wine? Or why would someone
feel inadequate about buying tissues to blow their nose in?
It is a bodily need, and when you're about to sneeze,
most people are just looking for something to sneeze into
and grateful they have any tissues on hand, let alone
something gendered. But the truth is there is nothing gendered
(26:38):
about any of these products, and there's no reason to
feel less of a man because you're passionate about plant care.
But where does this all come from? The site also
has an interesting history of gardening on it, showing how
the nation's first popular garden designer, this guy named Andrew
Jackson Downing, who I guess was a Martha Stewart like
(27:01):
taste maker taught people how to design a tasteful garden
way back in the eighteen forties. So as more and
more houses were set back from the street, Downing wrote quote,
men should tend the lawn walkways, vegetables and fruit trees,
and women the flowers. Meanwhile, a book called Gardening for Ladies,
(27:21):
published in England around the same time, encouraged women to
gain in the garden and actually gave them permission to
go outside and do something. So for proper women to
be told playing the dirt was okay as long as
they didn't exhaust themselves too much. That was liberating. But
this book to focus their world to flowers, and as
(27:42):
Society Pages points out, these stereotypes persisted, especially as lawnmowers
were marketed to men in the eighteen fifties. But between
Quarantine and the connections we can make through Instagram, new
communities have sprouted up, and there's so many different ways
to picture your pursuits. In previous episodes, we've talked about
black gardening communities. We've seen the world where sneaker heads
(28:06):
and plants collide, and we've heard people label themselves plant
parents and members of plant parenthood. While the plant Daddy's
movement was born from the LGBTQ community, men of all
sexual preferences and identities have come to embrace their status
as plant parents and we are excited to talk about
(28:26):
it too. I sent my producer Molly out to talk
to men from all across the US who love their plants,
from flower beds to jade plants. They shared their thoughts
around plant care and masculinity. I'm Bob Hershawn, and I
like plants, you know. When you you touched on the
eighteen hundreds and gardening, that just reminded me. Leo Tolstoy,
(28:51):
the novelist. He was born in aristocrat, all the money
he could ever need. He had peasants, hundreds of them,
taking care of the outdoors. But it was very important
to him to go outside and prove that he knew
how to use a shovel, and he could use a plow,
and he could use a syfe, and that showed that
he was a real man. He was really masculine, you know.
(29:12):
To be a real guy, you know, you have to
go out and make stuff grow. And that whole idea
caught on and I think that we're kind of stuck
because of that. And I think that we do have
a lot of men that live that act badly and
think of masculinity as being a big dufas, or at
least because they are males, they have license to be
a big dufis. And I think that's terrible and negative.
(29:35):
And I see signs that we're getting away from that,
and I hope that's true. E J. Horne. I'm located
in Bursailles, Kentucky. I grew up on a farm. We
had bulldozers and sawmills and tractors and escalators and everything
driven cold juts. I mean, I can say, you know,
(29:57):
I'm masking, is your job or whatever, But the process
of creation and this, the process of watching things flowers
is really neat. It's a miracle, I mean it really is.
And to bring those into the house and to not
beautiful the house and let's see other people get to
enjoy those things, or that's just a good thing. My
(30:19):
name is Douglas Waterbury Team and I'm currently living in Franklin,
Tennessee with my wife. I do believe that flowers can
be masculine. I suppose the most important thing is that
there's the human response to them, not the gendered response
to them. You know, as humans, we are attracted to beauty,
(30:41):
and flowers are undeniably and unmistakably beautiful. My name is
Joel Arnold, and I grew up in Michigan, where I
really liked gardening, and I now live in Los Angeles
where I don't have a garden, but I do take
care of a few house plants for the guy who's
like very skeptical of plant care. If there are wanting
to like attractive partner, it shows like that they can
(31:05):
care and that they have some kind of responsibility to
them if they have house plants that they're actively caring for,
like in their space. I feel like showing that you
can take care of your space having it clean, like
that's one thing. Another level would be like plant care,
like that's that's very attractive. I feel like. My name
is Jake Calasini. I live in Brooklyn, New York. When
it comes down to it, they're just like nice to
(31:25):
look at, you know, putting care into them, you know,
you get you get something back. I think I just
enjoyed growing things and being able to transform space into
a space that is nice to walk in. That is
nice to sit in to contemplate, you know, have people
over and and allow them the space and the time
(31:45):
to do the same. My name is Ramsey Junt. I
live in Atlanta, Georgia. It's the same nurturing you give
to anyone, and in particular for me, and like with
my partner and as well as with my daughter, try
to be as nurturing as I can with her. And
I try to get her excited about things, like I
try to keep her involved with what's growing out in
(32:07):
the garden if she's having a bad day, just to
get her mind off as like, hey, the peach trees blossoming.
That was pretty huge for her because she she loves peaches.
And just seeing her demeanor change into happiness, it's makes
me happy as a father to see that. My love
(32:28):
for flowers and my love for gardening always came from
my dad. My name is Ben Polson. I live in Philadelphia.
I've been living here for about eighteen months. You can't
care for a plant without understanding it in a way
that I think men don't do very often. And you know,
and you've got to listen to the plant, and that's
always a healthy thing to do. You've got to care
(32:49):
for it in a way that I think is sometimes
quite unmasculine. But they's definitely got the power to change
the conversation to you know, the kind of show men
a different way of dealing with things or with living
things around them. I don't feel at all qualified to
(33:10):
to define modern masculinity outside of my own bounds, which
I hope is fair. I'm sure many a male gardener
has man splained fertilization to a woman gardener that knows
a lot more about it than they do. But I
think gardening has a lot of opportunity, and you know,
it's an opportunity for humility as well. You're trying to
(33:32):
control nature here and I don't know why my com
quote tree suddenly sprouted thorns, and I don't know why
my olive tree just uped and died. And I think,
you know, accepting that you don't know a lot of
things is really challenging to men that are supposed to
know things all the time. And I think that's another
good aspect that gardening keeps you humble. So from my perspective, yeah,
(33:57):
I think masculinity needs to be a bit moll for
about three years to make up for the past a
few thousand. But once we do that, I'm sure we
can we could all make comment and if plants can
help us do that, that would be a beautiful thing. Indeed,
(34:18):
I could think a lot lately about flowers. At some
point over time, flowers became this symbol of femininity, which
is always strange to me, because flowers themselves have a sex,
and some are actually male, but most flowers are actually bisexual,
meaning they have both male and female reproductive parts. So
(34:39):
even this thing that we've gendered as feminine doesn't adhere
to these constructs. So why should we let ourselves believe
that flowers and gardening are also gendered. Men are not
a monolith, and masculinity does not have to have just
one definition, and neither does gardening for that matter. I
know I've taught about my family a lot on this show,
(35:02):
and my grandfather, the engineer, It was just this incredible
male figure for me as a kid, this role model,
and I keep learning more and more about him to
this day. His interests had no boundaries. I've mentioned he
started an ice cream factory, he had farms, He built
incredible things from scratch. He was a writer, but he
(35:25):
also loved roses. He bred them, and he brought in
all these rare seeds and cultivated rare flowers that people
would come to watch bloom. He also had three types
of jasmine in his yard, including one that bloomed and
perfumed only at night. The scent used to calm him,
and it's actually what inspired me as I started to
(35:47):
look into my backyard and start planning for the future.
We have this idea that such delicate aspects of nature
can't be masculine, but there's no reason for it. In
the same way we've seen in femininity exudes strength and power,
it's encouraging to see a wider masculinity that can convey
softness and beauty. I find comfort in watching the next
(36:11):
generation post online, unashamed of their passions and interests, and
sharing how they can live in more than one lane.
It tells me that we're heading towards a more accepting
and promising future because at the end of the day,
the carrots and the hyacinth they don't care about how
much testosterone or estrogen you have. And like all things,
(36:35):
the gardening community only gets better with new ideas and
different perspectives male, female, non binary. Because to the world
out there waiting in your backyard, we're all just humans
growing stuff. That's it for today's episode. Don't forget it.
(37:00):
No matter what season it is or where you're at
in your gardening journey, there's some incredible resources waiting for
you on the Miracle Grow website. Next time on our show,
we're gonna talk about regenerative farming practices, stuff you can
bring into your backyard. If you like what you heard,
don't forget to rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts. Also,
(37:21):
we want to hear from you. What are your inspiring
plant stories, relatable struggles or growing questions. Tag us in
your post or tweet using the hashtag Humans Growing Stuff,
and don't be surprised if you hear your story featured
on an upcoming episode. Humans Growing Stuff is a collaboration
from My Heart Radio and your friends at Miracle Grow.
Our show is written and produced by Molly Sosha and
(37:42):
me Mongy Chatiguler in partnership with Ryanovadia, Daniel Ainsworth, Haley Ericsson,
and Garrett Shannon of Banter. Until next time, Thanks so
much for listening.
Fourth grade was a big year at HP DuPont Middle
School because it's the year we got to join the band.
And on the day we picked out instruments, I chose
the clarinet. M not because I liked the clarinet, but
because my best friend Jeremy chose the clarinet, and I
(00:26):
figured we could sit next to each other. What I
didn't realize was that Jeremy and I were the only
two boys who would picked the clarinet. And I also
didn't realize that he'd be really, really good at it.
So you know, we started out the year sitting next
to one another, but a month later I was stuck
starring at the back of his head with about seventeen
(00:46):
or eighteen girls sitting between us. But and I promised,
there's a point to this. It wasn't long before the
kids in my school started poking fun at the boys
who played clarinet. It wasn't as quote girly as the flute,
but was in the same bracket. So I started a
pr campaign. I said, the clarinets great because it gets
(01:07):
you out of study hall. It's great because you can
use the carrying cases of shield and snowball fights. It's
great because you can cope the read in fun dip,
which I actually did, so it tastes like cherry candy
while you play, and you cannot do that with a trumpet.
Like a nine year old Don Draper, I took this
thing that was seen as not fit for boys and
(01:28):
started a campaign to make it a thing of envy,
and I kind of spun my way out of any bullying.
Like I've said before, my grandfather was a botanist, so
I never saw a gardening or really most things ex gendered.
I was encouraged to pursue the arts, and really just
anything I was interested in. I was never told cooking
(01:48):
or sport, or dance, or engineering or men's or women's work.
That's kind of how my family was, and that just
wasn't my home. But last week, as I started thinking
about what sort of flowers I might try to plant
in my garden, I kept stumbling into these weirdly gendered
posts on the Internet. They screened things like do you
(02:11):
real men garden? Three reasons why flowers can be masculine,
manly horticulturists, and history. In a strange way, it felt
like algorithms were trying to tell me don't worry. It's
okay to be a guy and garden. And it made
me wonder, how is the culture around gender and gardening changed,
(02:31):
and does gardening feel like a safe space for everyone
to get their hands dirty? Let's dig in. Hey there,
I'm Mongish Particular, co host of Part Time Genius, one
of the founders of Mental Flaws, and this is Humans
Growing Stuff, a collaboration from My Heart Radio and your
friends at Miracle Grow. Our goal is to make this
(02:52):
the most human show about plants you'll ever listen to.
Along the way, we'll share inspiring stories, tips and tricks
to or to your plane addiction, and just enough science
to make you sound like an expert. Today's show is
all about gender and gardening, what your plants say about you,
and how men have opened up their arms and their
hearts to embrace the world of growing. Chapter eleven, Plant
(03:16):
Daddy's Miracle Burrows and the Seeds of Modern masculinity. Maybe
this is just how I want to view the world.
But one of the things I found heartening about watching
kids today hang out in New York is that kids
who are clearly artsy, you're gay, you're queer, don't seem
(03:39):
to be ostracized or bullied the way they were when
I was younger. I don't know whether it's the Internet
or the way TV has shaped us, or maybe being
raised by a generation that grew up on Mr. Rogers,
but it feels like there's less pressure to fit into
a certain stereotypical mold and more space to explore who
you are and who you want to be. And it
(04:01):
made me consider just how much things have changed. I
was reading Michael Perry's Mr. Plant Geek website this week
and I stumbled into this article he wrote called Beating
the Stigma around gender and Gardening. In it, he writes
about hiding his love from gardening from his schoolmates the
same way he hit his sexuality. And in one paragraph
(04:23):
he talks about being called a pansy on the playground
and how quote the way school bullies grabbed that innocent
plant name and used it to hurt me really summed
up how they felt about my less than masculine weekend hobby.
Just hearing that made my stomach drop, and I want
to hear how his perspective has changed, how he's learned
(04:43):
to embrace his identity as a gardener. So we called
him up Hey, Michael, Hey, how's it coming. Hey, It's
so nice to have you back on the program. I've
got to say I loved your tips so much, and
and I loved all the plants that I showed my kids,
the dancing plant, how you could hang flowers upside down,
(05:07):
and all these amazing wonders. But I'm thrilled to have
you back on the program. Oh, no problems. It's good
to be here and good to share my love of
innovation and new plants and new ways of growing plants
and most of all, easier ways to grow the parts
we love. Yeah. So, so today we're talking about masculinity
(05:27):
and gardening, and I want to get into that topic.
But before any of that, I know, the last time
we chad with you, you were, I think, just laying
down concrete in your backyard and your gardens. How's that
coming along? Well, we're developed now, So it's the finishing
touches because everything obviously after the concrete then came the decking, painting.
(05:49):
I then planted everything. So I planted lots of bulbs,
lots of bear roots. So I've been able to really
multi plant and have some real colonies of bulbs, and
and I tend to plant them very closely together as well,
because I like them to support each other, and so
I have that kind of informality and just keeping my
fingers crossed that everything I planted will appear. So it's
(06:12):
always a bit of a leap of faith when you
plant something in the autumn and you don't see anything
until spring, and it's kind of, you know, it still
makes me kind of like get anxious, as it were.
Once I get my tulips with their lovely, luscious leaves,
you know, dangling over my concrete, I'll be happy. That
sounds nice. So, you know, one of the things that
(06:34):
we're talking about on this program is about masculinity and
gardening and also just like beating the stigma around gender
and rightening. And so I know you wrote an article
about this a while ago, and I really loved reading it.
I was curious what prompted you to put your feelings
out there and right about this topic. I think kind
of my love of plants and sexuality have always been
(06:57):
kind of intertwined, both in a good way and in
a bad way. And I'm just really jealous now of
younger people these days because it's so much easier to
be yourself. And I don't just mean sexuality wise, I
mean in terms of following your interests the things you
really love, because we've got the Internet, which has really helped,
and social media, so you can find other people that
(07:18):
are interested in that very niche thing that you're interested in.
So it just kind of helps the whole sense of community.
And it's funny because I don't know, when you're interested
in plants from a young aide, you are automatically kind
of you know, people take the mick out of you
and they kind of call your pansy or all sorts
of different awful names, which are obviously relating to your
(07:41):
love of plants, but also you know, tinged with that
sexuality edge as well. So it's kind of hopefully things
have changed a lot these days, but it's kind of
like for me that plants and the sexuality have always
been intertwined, you know. Yeah, I mean, I I think
what you're saying is true about community and being able
to find community through the Internet. People felt so alone
(08:02):
and even finding information was difficult. Yeah, the YouTube videos
are are so easy to access now at versus like
the difficulty of like having to go to the library,
having to find specialty books like finding someone with that interest, right, Yeah,
And I do wonder if the world opening up, the
kind of community opening up, you know, at the same
time as people getting to know each other, they've realized
(08:23):
that there are more people out there like them, which
is you know, obviously gay bye, you know, and interested
in plants and so on. It's funny because the last
time we talked, we chatted about your love of gardening
partially coming from your grandparents home, right, and and and
watching your grandparents garden. And I always wanted to do
(08:44):
more gardening because my grandfather was a botanist, but those
ideas were so romantic. And then to know that you
kind of had to hide these feelings in school is
is really I don't know, it's depressing. I don't know,
I kind of hit it. I still had a really
nice time within that because I made I created my
own world, my own world where I was, you know,
(09:07):
loving plants, spending time with plants, and you know, obviously
the school part of it was just you know, the
thing that had to be bearable. But I didn't necessary
hide it from my friends, but I just didn't mention
it in particularly you know, or yeah, yeah, or I
would have said I was playing with something cool at
the weekend, like lego or something that you had the
(09:29):
idea of, Like growing something out of nothing and watching
a plasts im and sharing food is so much cooler
than sticking legos together in something, unless you make it
a Lego bouquet or something like. Yeah, So tell me
a little bit about when you started opening up to
your school friends or more people about this gardening identity
(09:53):
you had. Yeah, it's really hard to judge. And I
wonder if I was a straight guy, if I would
have felt the same embarrassment about loving plants. But then
in those days, it wasn't cool to like anything that
was kind of out of the ordinary anyway. There was
always some trend where there was always some jacket you
had to have, or you know, when it was teenage
mutant ninja turtles, you had to be interested in that,
(10:15):
and if you're interested in anything else, then you would
be kind of, you know, an outcast. So yeah, I
do think it was hard to be an individual in
any way in those days. Yeah. I feel like I've
seen magazine articles and website articles recently about how it's
okay to give men flowers and the type of flowers
(10:35):
men like, and it's so strange to put any sort
of limits or ideas on those things. Yeah, I know,
I know, it's so bizarre. Social media has changed so
much because now I sometimes I'm on there and one
of my friends that has probably taken the mick out
of me liking plants in the past is then buying
their their first house plant, you know. So everyone's been
(10:57):
you know, carried along with this journey, which is fantastic.
And then of course you put pandemic into the mix
and that is the thing that has accelerated it as well. Yeah,
it's a golden time for us because we're accepted from
all angles. Couldn't be better. No, I completely agree. I've
done two kids, and I watched it at my kids school,
and my seven year old identifies as a day And
(11:19):
it's amazing to see the sort of acceptance that is
there in the world and and of all interests in
a new way that I just don't think was there
at least when I was growing up. Yeah, No, totally.
It's just it's amazing. Really, I'd like, I'd like to
be younger now and see if it would be easier
or perhaps then these days there's different worries. I think
there's just a different set of things to worry about. Now.
(11:41):
I agree, there's always face to occupy that worry. Unfortunately,
So our episode is about plant Daddy's and you know,
trying to figure out what those words mean exactly. Do
you enjoy that sort of moniker or take any pride
in it? Yeah, I mean it's it's never not puzzling
because you know, kind of loving plants was something that
(12:04):
wasn't popular, you know, obviously being gay with something that
wasn't popular. It's just amazing that those two worlds, two
worlds that I'm very involved in, collided in this way.
And I'm not single, but I can see that there's
a lot of dating elements that go in there, and
it almost seems like people meet each other through plant
daddy hashtag on Instagram or through you know, Facebook page
(12:27):
with boys with plants or similar and I think a
lot of guys are meeting through that method these days
rather than your typical you meet up apps or different
ways that you might have dated in the past, which
is very really interesting thing to look in on because
that is a very different movement as well. Yeah, you
talk a little earlier about your own garden, and the
(12:49):
idea of bob supporting each other sounds kind of adorable.
I also find it super interesting that you said bob's
grow better together in community. It's not dissimilar from humans really.
So why do you grow the bulbs in that way? Well,
I'm quite an impatient gardener, so I always want to
(13:10):
have impact as soon as possible. So even with my garden,
you know, I talk about the leap of faith of
growing bulbs in the autumn and then having to wait
until the spring, and it's just it's it's far too much.
So when the bulbs come through, I want them to
have impact from the world goes. So I tend to
plant them very closely, you know, much more closely than
(13:30):
it would tell you on the label or on the instructions,
because I want that impact sooner, and I want them
to kind of be this lovely big clump and this
like vivid color explosion. And of course when you plant
them closer, it makes more sense because the bulbs, the
stems all support each other, because you've got this big
(13:51):
almost thicket of growth that is then supporting all the
flower heads rather than a single bulb, you know, solitary
in the border, and another one is six inches away.
It's just it doesn't make sense because they're just going
to blow about all over the place. Well, I like
the idea also of um, you know, the idea of
these bulbs near each other and supporting each other rather
(14:12):
than isolated. There's something wonderful and that. Yeah, I mean,
it's it's very interesting because the fact I've been talking
about bulbs being planted closely together and that gives support
and it gives a kind of more community feel. It
has a bigger effect that really relates a lot to
how life is and how life has been with social
media is the lubricant and kind of the the openness
(14:34):
that we now have the ability to find like minded
individuals that we then support each other and then we
you know, we amplify gardening and the whole plant world.
So yeah, it's a it's a really interesting parallel. There.
Just a few final tips. Now a spring is hitting
here in Brooklyn. Anything I should be thinking about as
(14:54):
I'm figuring out what to do with my garden. Gosh, well,
it's time soon to are some vegetables and some salad
crops outdoors or if you haven't got any outside, then
it could be micro greens on a window cell, or
if you are guarding the inside, then soon your house
plants are going to start needing some feed again and
a bit more water, so hopefully you've given them a
(15:16):
bit of a win to rest, but soon they'll be
bouncing back into life. Michael, thank you so much for
being here with us. I feel like I can't wait
to see what your garden looks like on your Instagram
and then how it changes a year from then. Hey,
no worries. Thank you very much. It's been really really
cool to be here and speak to you again, and
hope to talk to you again sometime soon. That sounds wonderful.
(15:42):
Humans growing stuff will be right back after a short break.
The other day, I was scrolling through the comments section
of Reddit posts with strangers, trying to figure out what's
going to happen on the next in of Lupin, and
it reminded me that while the Internet is a source
(16:05):
of a lot of truly truly awful things, you get
moments like this when we get to connect with people
around the world who are so different from us about
topics we have a shared interest in and In this case,
it was a heated debate about what we think we
know about being a successful jewel thief in France that
(16:26):
none of us has any expertise in. But thanks to
platforms like Instagram and Interest, we've seen more and more
communities come together, including men embracing their love of house
plants in these creative and very expressive ways. In large part,
these sites are where the plant daddy movement was born.
(16:46):
Living at the intersection of horticulture and sexuality, the plant
daddy movement has given men this opportunity to display a
new side of masculinity and create a space for men
to connect with each other as human over their love
of plants. You know, most plant daddies are house plant parents,
and this growing trend has been gaining numbers for the
(17:08):
last few years. According to a survey from the National
Gardening Association, millennials account for one fourth of plant purchases
in two thousand eighteen, and it's important to note that
tropical house plants were the dominant purchase there and more
significantly than any of that, men made up fifty three
of those purchases. So today you can follow accounts like
(17:34):
Boys with Plants and see men of all shapes and
sizes and backgrounds, posing proudly with their parlor palms or
bird's nest ferns. Because, more than anything, the plant Daddy
movement is rooted in freedom of expression. So much of
(17:57):
our show is about not stereotyping people and boxing them in,
but YouTube diva Miss Lady. The Plant Lady enjoys analyzing
the plants in your collection and using them to do
exactly that interpret your personality. For her, plants are like
a zodiac chart, telling her everything she needs to know
about the type of man or person who cares for
(18:20):
I don't know a zz plant. So this week we
invited her to share her powers of perception with us
and give us the t on different types of plant owners?
Is this lady on the other side? Was Getty? Was Getty?
Was getdy? Miss Lady to the plant Lady, I'm so
(18:41):
excited to have you on. I've seen your features in
Paper Magazine, I've read about you on Apartment Therapy, I've
seen your Instagram and it's just so fun to be
chatting with you. What's that boom? I'm happy to be
here and excited to be chatting with you. So I'm
a little nervous about this. I'm going to give you
the name of a plant, and I want your take
on the personnel, the traits of the plant. Dad who
(19:02):
lives with this plant? Perfect, Let's do it. Let's let
me get these chakras ready, let me get these vibes ready.
So what does it mean if someone has a pathos
plant on their mantle? Okay, well, if you go into
their house and this man has a pathos in his house,
he is a man who is a little basic. He's
(19:22):
not the one, you know what. I love me some pothos,
and I own know myself, so I'm maybe reading myself
a little bit. Pothos are great. They're really resilient. You
could literally put them anywhere and they're gonna like survive
and thrive and do their thing in nature. They're amazing.
They're climbers, they get huge and all that. But the
kind of person who brings it into their home, there's
(19:43):
no thought process to it is just Okay, this will survive.
We'll just throw it here. Avoid But that's just that's
the team. So this is another plant that I feel like.
These fiddle leaf figs are everywhere, and I'm curious what
your thoughts are when you walk into an apartment and
see one on full display. Okay this and like you
really cancel me right now, but I have like my
(20:04):
hand on my forehead and I'm just like, stay stay
away from this man. To be honest, I've never even
owned a fiddle leaf fig and I've owned like pretty
much every plant you live in a rainforest essentially right
your apartment, pretty much. And this is the one plant
I do not let into my into my space because
of the energy that it gives off. A few basic
traits that I would give a person who has a
(20:24):
fiddle leaf is they're a little selfish and it's either
their way or the highway, you know. Like fiddle leaves,
once you put them in a place in your house
and they start to grow, don't touch them, don't do
anything different, leave them where they're at, because they'll drop
leaves like crazy, they'll get brown edges. It is the
most problematic plant. They just show you no kind of love,
(20:45):
too finicky, and we don't want that. We don't want
that energy. N you know, no, I feel that. To
tell me about succulents and and maybe cacti in particular,
I feel like it's all bad news. Okay, I don't
(21:07):
really care for plants that can hurt me, thorn, spikes,
all that kind of stuff. So the aura that I
get from a man who has a cacti is good
from Afar, but far from good. When you're growing these
luscious grain tropical plants, you love touching the foliage and
seeing like the textures. Some are velvety, some are rubbery
and leathery, and it's part of this relationship with your plants.
(21:29):
And I really feel like succulents represent that kind of
man that is totally closed off. He's very beautiful, he's handsome,
he's gorgeous. So when you get close and you try
to touch, you donna get spikes. And we're not dealing
with that. We're not just a good from Afar, but
far from good. So I am ready for some good news. Yes,
(21:52):
what are your feelings on zz plants? Now? See, this
is a plant I could get behind. ZZ is completely
and de rated. It might not be the showiest plant,
but let me tell you, the z z is gonna
stick with you through thick and thin. Z z s
don't eat that much water. They're very hardy and resilient plants.
You could even sometimes throw a z eazy in a
(22:13):
closet for like a month or two and go check
it in a month and it will still be alive.
It won't be thriving. Don't do that to the poor
is easy, you know. And yeah, So in regards to
a man who has his zaz, he is a man
who is loyal, who is going to stick with you
through the good times and the bad times. And that's
the man you marry if you believe in that. So
(22:34):
I approve of that. So I have another one for
you that I'm seeing pop up a whole lot recently
on Pinterest. And I think it's called and Thorium waa quiana.
Do you know how do you know what that is? Yes?
And Theorium walk Reanum queen and they um and like
in the plant community right now there's like spikes and
plants that become very popular. The variegated monstera and then
(22:57):
the Pink Princess was one, and now it's the Intherium
war Aquianum or the Queen and Theorium. And this one
is an interesting one. It's detail oriented. The man who
has this characteristics that really like describe him are somebody
who is invested in you, and invested in life, and
(23:20):
invested in the little things, because he knows the fruits
that come when you pay attention and put focus on life, relationships,
work all of those things. So I get behind that
man too. He's a lot more work than diseasing, but
worth it. But worth it, Go bigger, go home. Right.
I saw them with a friend and they said that
(23:40):
it looked like cheetos were growing out of it. Yes,
the inflorescence, yes, they get pollinated. The fruits turn orange,
which is really cool. Yeah. And and one last question,
I read that part of your design sense comes from
from your grandparents, from the way your grandmother kept the house,
but your father's exotic bird collection, and I was curious,
(24:03):
what sort of matches your grandfather's personality. Yeah, I mean
my grandfather always the birds that he brought were just
always very exotic. And I was born in the US
that day, came over from Cuba in nine and because
of them always telling me, like their stories of how
it was in Cuba and them growing up seeing like
(24:24):
my grandfather bringing in like plants that were reminiscent of Cuba,
like that they're like planning them around the house or
inside the house and even some of the birds and
stuff that they had always felt that was the connection,
you know, plants and animals like that was my connection
to Oh, this is the piece of Cuba that I
didn't get to experience with them, But I'm experiencing it
with them in real time right now, and you know,
(24:47):
and I feel like a lot of the birds were
always like beautiful and like flamboyant and stuff like that,
and I feel like it was a reflection of how
he like viewed Cuba. Well, I love these descriptions. I
can't wait to go out into the world and stereotype
everyone based on their plant touchtions. But but I really
appreciate this, miss lady. It's been so fun. It was
(25:08):
so fun. Thank you for having me. If you ever
need me to read some more plant horoscopes, let me
know we'll do. One of my favorite sites on the
web is the sociology site Society Pages, and I love
it because they analyze culture in all sorts of intriguing ways.
(25:30):
Like in one post, they analyzed over kids books, including
Richard Scarry's Busy Town Books, and they learned that mice
and pigs mostly get depicted in service industry jobs. While
more predatory creatures like lions often end up as executives.
They also do a couple of interest collections, including one
of pointlessly gendered items, and the page is filled with
(25:52):
real items like manrea sangria, men can feel comfortable drinking
at barbecues, chap fix chapter that's engineered for men, and
cleanex for men, which sports man sized tissues. If we're
being honest, it all feels a little ridiculous, doesn't it,
Like why do men need a manly label to justify
(26:15):
that they like fruit in wine? Or why would someone
feel inadequate about buying tissues to blow their nose in?
It is a bodily need, and when you're about to sneeze,
most people are just looking for something to sneeze into
and grateful they have any tissues on hand, let alone
something gendered. But the truth is there is nothing gendered
(26:38):
about any of these products, and there's no reason to
feel less of a man because you're passionate about plant care.
But where does this all come from? The site also
has an interesting history of gardening on it, showing how
the nation's first popular garden designer, this guy named Andrew
Jackson Downing, who I guess was a Martha Stewart like
(27:01):
taste maker taught people how to design a tasteful garden
way back in the eighteen forties. So as more and
more houses were set back from the street, Downing wrote quote,
men should tend the lawn walkways, vegetables and fruit trees,
and women the flowers. Meanwhile, a book called Gardening for Ladies,
(27:21):
published in England around the same time, encouraged women to
gain in the garden and actually gave them permission to
go outside and do something. So for proper women to
be told playing the dirt was okay as long as
they didn't exhaust themselves too much. That was liberating. But
this book to focus their world to flowers, and as
(27:42):
Society Pages points out, these stereotypes persisted, especially as lawnmowers
were marketed to men in the eighteen fifties. But between
Quarantine and the connections we can make through Instagram, new
communities have sprouted up, and there's so many different ways
to picture your pursuits. In previous episodes, we've talked about
black gardening communities. We've seen the world where sneaker heads
(28:06):
and plants collide, and we've heard people label themselves plant
parents and members of plant parenthood. While the plant Daddy's
movement was born from the LGBTQ community, men of all
sexual preferences and identities have come to embrace their status
as plant parents and we are excited to talk about
(28:26):
it too. I sent my producer Molly out to talk
to men from all across the US who love their plants,
from flower beds to jade plants. They shared their thoughts
around plant care and masculinity. I'm Bob Hershawn, and I
like plants, you know. When you you touched on the
eighteen hundreds and gardening, that just reminded me. Leo Tolstoy,
(28:51):
the novelist. He was born in aristocrat, all the money
he could ever need. He had peasants, hundreds of them,
taking care of the outdoors. But it was very important
to him to go outside and prove that he knew
how to use a shovel, and he could use a plow,
and he could use a syfe, and that showed that
he was a real man. He was really masculine, you know.
(29:12):
To be a real guy, you know, you have to
go out and make stuff grow. And that whole idea
caught on and I think that we're kind of stuck
because of that. And I think that we do have
a lot of men that live that act badly and
think of masculinity as being a big dufas, or at
least because they are males, they have license to be
a big dufis. And I think that's terrible and negative.
(29:35):
And I see signs that we're getting away from that,
and I hope that's true. E J. Horne. I'm located
in Bursailles, Kentucky. I grew up on a farm. We
had bulldozers and sawmills and tractors and escalators and everything
driven cold juts. I mean, I can say, you know,
(29:57):
I'm masking, is your job or whatever, But the process
of creation and this, the process of watching things flowers
is really neat. It's a miracle, I mean it really is.
And to bring those into the house and to not
beautiful the house and let's see other people get to
enjoy those things, or that's just a good thing. My
(30:19):
name is Douglas Waterbury Team and I'm currently living in Franklin,
Tennessee with my wife. I do believe that flowers can
be masculine. I suppose the most important thing is that
there's the human response to them, not the gendered response
to them. You know, as humans, we are attracted to beauty,
(30:41):
and flowers are undeniably and unmistakably beautiful. My name is
Joel Arnold, and I grew up in Michigan, where I
really liked gardening, and I now live in Los Angeles
where I don't have a garden, but I do take
care of a few house plants for the guy who's
like very skeptical of plant care. If there are wanting
to like attractive partner, it shows like that they can
(31:05):
care and that they have some kind of responsibility to
them if they have house plants that they're actively caring for,
like in their space. I feel like showing that you
can take care of your space having it clean, like
that's one thing. Another level would be like plant care,
like that's that's very attractive. I feel like. My name
is Jake Calasini. I live in Brooklyn, New York. When
it comes down to it, they're just like nice to
(31:25):
look at, you know, putting care into them, you know,
you get you get something back. I think I just
enjoyed growing things and being able to transform space into
a space that is nice to walk in. That is
nice to sit in to contemplate, you know, have people
over and and allow them the space and the time
(31:45):
to do the same. My name is Ramsey Junt. I
live in Atlanta, Georgia. It's the same nurturing you give
to anyone, and in particular for me, and like with
my partner and as well as with my daughter, try
to be as nurturing as I can with her. And
I try to get her excited about things, like I
try to keep her involved with what's growing out in
(32:07):
the garden if she's having a bad day, just to
get her mind off as like, hey, the peach trees blossoming.
That was pretty huge for her because she she loves peaches.
And just seeing her demeanor change into happiness, it's makes
me happy as a father to see that. My love
(32:28):
for flowers and my love for gardening always came from
my dad. My name is Ben Polson. I live in Philadelphia.
I've been living here for about eighteen months. You can't
care for a plant without understanding it in a way
that I think men don't do very often. And you know,
and you've got to listen to the plant, and that's
always a healthy thing to do. You've got to care
(32:49):
for it in a way that I think is sometimes
quite unmasculine. But they's definitely got the power to change
the conversation to you know, the kind of show men
a different way of dealing with things or with living
things around them. I don't feel at all qualified to
(33:10):
to define modern masculinity outside of my own bounds, which
I hope is fair. I'm sure many a male gardener
has man splained fertilization to a woman gardener that knows
a lot more about it than they do. But I
think gardening has a lot of opportunity, and you know,
it's an opportunity for humility as well. You're trying to
(33:32):
control nature here and I don't know why my com
quote tree suddenly sprouted thorns, and I don't know why
my olive tree just uped and died. And I think,
you know, accepting that you don't know a lot of
things is really challenging to men that are supposed to
know things all the time. And I think that's another
good aspect that gardening keeps you humble. So from my perspective, yeah,
(33:57):
I think masculinity needs to be a bit moll for
about three years to make up for the past a
few thousand. But once we do that, I'm sure we
can we could all make comment and if plants can
help us do that, that would be a beautiful thing. Indeed,
(34:18):
I could think a lot lately about flowers. At some
point over time, flowers became this symbol of femininity, which
is always strange to me, because flowers themselves have a sex,
and some are actually male, but most flowers are actually bisexual,
meaning they have both male and female reproductive parts. So
(34:39):
even this thing that we've gendered as feminine doesn't adhere
to these constructs. So why should we let ourselves believe
that flowers and gardening are also gendered. Men are not
a monolith, and masculinity does not have to have just
one definition, and neither does gardening for that matter. I
know I've taught about my family a lot on this show,
(35:02):
and my grandfather, the engineer, It was just this incredible
male figure for me as a kid, this role model,
and I keep learning more and more about him to
this day. His interests had no boundaries. I've mentioned he
started an ice cream factory, he had farms, He built
incredible things from scratch. He was a writer, but he
(35:25):
also loved roses. He bred them, and he brought in
all these rare seeds and cultivated rare flowers that people
would come to watch bloom. He also had three types
of jasmine in his yard, including one that bloomed and
perfumed only at night. The scent used to calm him,
and it's actually what inspired me as I started to
(35:47):
look into my backyard and start planning for the future.
We have this idea that such delicate aspects of nature
can't be masculine, but there's no reason for it. In
the same way we've seen in femininity exudes strength and power,
it's encouraging to see a wider masculinity that can convey
softness and beauty. I find comfort in watching the next
(36:11):
generation post online, unashamed of their passions and interests, and
sharing how they can live in more than one lane.
It tells me that we're heading towards a more accepting
and promising future because at the end of the day,
the carrots and the hyacinth they don't care about how
much testosterone or estrogen you have. And like all things,
(36:35):
the gardening community only gets better with new ideas and
different perspectives male, female, non binary. Because to the world
out there waiting in your backyard, we're all just humans
growing stuff. That's it for today's episode. Don't forget it.
(37:00):
No matter what season it is or where you're at
in your gardening journey, there's some incredible resources waiting for
you on the Miracle Grow website. Next time on our show,
we're gonna talk about regenerative farming practices, stuff you can
bring into your backyard. If you like what you heard,
don't forget to rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts. Also,
(37:21):
we want to hear from you. What are your inspiring
plant stories, relatable struggles or growing questions. Tag us in
your post or tweet using the hashtag Humans Growing Stuff,
and don't be surprised if you hear your story featured
on an upcoming episode. Humans Growing Stuff is a collaboration
from My Heart Radio and your friends at Miracle Grow.
Our show is written and produced by Molly Sosha and
(37:42):
me Mongy Chatiguler in partnership with Ryanovadia, Daniel Ainsworth, Haley Ericsson,
and Garrett Shannon of Banter. Until next time, Thanks so
much for listening.
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