Gringo's Guide To: The Latino Mental Health Stigma w/ Dr. Lisette Sanchez

Dramos is joined by therapist Dr. Lisette Sanchez to discuss the stigma around mental health within the Latin community, mental health issues within our community, setting boundaries, the effects of social media and more!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
Let me talk about talk there we go.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
I said, you live in life as a ringo, where
you question when you fit in every time you mingle
and they say.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
You do this would not that?

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Yes, Hello, and welcome to another episode of Life as
a Gringo.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
I am dramos, of course, And man, I thought I
had something cool. I was gonna go with h there,
but but I don't. I don't. I'm gonna give you
a quick life updates.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
I figure that's what happens in these first couple of
minutes of the podcast Amazing Guests, not today Show though,
by the way, if you were a listener, I think
it was last season. I was reading an article from
we Army two dot com talking about latinos and therapy
and mental health in general.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
And I know for some of you, like Man, you.

Speaker 2 (00:54):
Talk about this all the time, you might be thinking
that or maybe that's my imposter synto sneaking in. I'm
not sure, but I think it is a conversation that
continues to need to be had, especially in our community.
And I also love the idea of speaking to somebody
who's from our community, who is a therapist, does this for.

Speaker 1 (01:14):
A living and really.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
Discussing sort of the nuances of having somebody who kind
of comes from your background being the person sort of
guiding you or helping you through particular situations. There's a
lot of power in that. So I wanted to have
her on the show to kind of talk about that
in general. And I had mentioned when we did the
episode where I referenced an article we are meto dot com.
I was like, Oh, I should get this person on

(01:38):
the show, and boom.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Here we are. Your boy did it. He followed through.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
On one of his promises from the podcast. So that's
where we are today. Doctor Gazette Sanchez is going to
be on the show. She's a therapist, speaker, writer, and
credible human being. Again, I referenced her on an episode
I think it was last season, just discussing different things
when it comes specifically to latinos and mental health.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
So we'll talk about all that with her. With me,
what's going on with me?

Speaker 2 (02:02):
Thank you for asking, man, I feel like I've come
to a realization. I'm gonna say that I'm gonna get
into this quickly so we can get to the interview
with doctor Zet Sanchez. But I was talking to my
therapist and I was basically in complete denial of the
fact that your boy is burnt out.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
And I know what I'm thinking, what you might be
thinking is.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
Well, you had a nice break, like a month and
a half off before you started season three.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
Of the podcast.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
And that's sure I did, but logically, realistically, I was
still kind of in like a work mentality.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
Yeah, I took some more time off. Yeah, I vacationed a.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
Bit, I traveled a little bit, I you know, partook
because I partook in some you know, nightlife activities with friends.
But I still was kind of running around. I still
was filling the time with projects that I didn't have
time for when the whole podcast season was happening. So

(02:58):
I really they didn't sort of shut down the engines,
if you will. And I think I also came in
incredibly hot off of vacation, really trying to be incredibly
disciplined and almost like machine like.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
And I haven't made.

Speaker 2 (03:16):
Much time for a real personal life in a long time,
even prior to this, and I think it's all sort
of caught up with me a little bit. So yeah,
I kind of came to the conclusion with my therapist, like, shocker,
you're burnt out, man, that's why you're not feeling incredibly
motivated to do a lot right now.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
So I've kind of been in and of these funks.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
I think you've heard me kind of reference it or
talk about it a bit on the show. So yeah,
I'm trying to just get back into a bit of
a more creative mode and not be so productivity.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
Driven in the current moment. And it's like a big
year for me for a number of different reasons.

Speaker 2 (03:53):
But I also I think I have to recognize that
I'm not going to be at my best or doing
my best work if I'm burnt out right. I'm not
highly motivated. I'm just sort of getting by on fumes
right now. And for me, diving into some of my
creative passions I think is a way to sort of
get out of the productivity loop and just create for
the sake of creating. Like you know, music and djaying

(04:15):
has sort of energized me again recently, and I think
I'm going to kind of lean into it a bit
and I have expectations, but just from the point of
view of it's something I love doing, something I enjoy doing,
and it fills my cup a bit, you know, so
I want to lean back into that just for the
sake of having fun and building kind of a DJ
brand again, if you will.

Speaker 1 (04:35):
That's always fun to me.

Speaker 2 (04:37):
And I'm also just really excited about what we have
going out with just be as Well, which is obviously
still work, but I think it allows me to flex
my creative muscles in so many different ways, which I'm
grateful for. So I'm kind of just leaning into that
stuff and really just like being hyper creative or trying
to be and scratch all the different itches that I have,

(04:58):
you know, without trying to put to many expectations on
them for being anything like monetarily that are going to
be successful so to speak.

Speaker 1 (05:05):
Oh that makes sense, But I'm.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Yeah, I like today I just was like I had
a creative itge to like work out a video idea,
and that's what I did for like the first half
of the day.

Speaker 1 (05:13):
I just kind of like was it was digging up
old footage, which.

Speaker 2 (05:16):
Was really like nostalgic, and I felt really grateful I
was pulling up footage from like when I was eighteen, nineteen,
twenty twenty one years old, and then even I got
reminded on facebooks, I logged out the Facebook randomly, and
you know, you get those old pictures from like ten
years ago, and it was a picture of me ten
years ago in Miami at my music week, like a

(05:38):
big DJed conference that happens there, and I'm just thinking
about I put myself in the place of that kid
ten years ago who was trying to make a name
for himself in djaying.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
And it wasn't even on the radio at that point,
it wasn't, you know.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
It just really was a local New Jersey DJ and
just trying to hustle and make something happen, you know,
still living home as parents and all of the above,
and yeah, I don't know. I was like looking at
that kid and just thinking about how blown away he
would be if he saw how far we got to, you.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Know, like where we are today.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
And it just made me incredibly grateful and sort of
like brought me back down to reality a little bit,
to just all that I'm doing, all that I've done,
and how much there is to be grateful for. So, yeah,
that's my little share for today's show. With that said,
I want to get into mental health. I want to
talk about mental health specifically from the lens of our community.

(06:31):
And the challenges that face our community, and the sort
of the sort of out of if you would say,
like stereotypes or there's the sort of notions that many
people in our community have about therapy and mental health
and the stigmas, if you will, that's the word I
was looking for, the stigmas around mental health that exists
in our community. So I'm really excited to bring on

(06:53):
today's guest. As always, if you hear any ruffling in
the background, it's my eighty something pound dog being completely
restless and deciding that as soon as I hit record
is the time that he's going to toss and turn
all over the rug and carpet and just knock everything
over in the studio.

Speaker 1 (07:09):
So yeah, if you hear those noises, that's what it is.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
Without further ado, let's bring out today's guest as a
part of our me hent this segment. My guest today
is a therapist, writer and speaker known as the first
gen psychologist, doctor Lizette Sanchez.

Speaker 3 (07:32):
How you feeling, Hey, I'm so excited to be here
and so happy to just stepping community and have a
very important conversation.

Speaker 2 (07:41):
Yes, absolutely, and I'm really grateful to have you on
the show because I think I told you this when
we were kind of emailing back and forth, but I
kind of seen some.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
Of your work via We Are Me Too.

Speaker 2 (07:51):
They had done an article on on Latin mental that
we actually shared here on the show, and I remember,
as I was kind of reading this stuff, I was like,
I want to get her on the show because she's
bringing up a lot of really amazing points. And as
normal as mental health has become for myself personally and
those around me, I'm always shocked at how much of

(08:12):
the stigma still exists throughout our community. How many, you know,
people within our community still are sort of anti mental
health or live in fear of it, or whatever it
might be. So I'm really excited to kind of bring
you on in any chance that I get to bring
on somebody who is from our community and advocates for
mental health. I always love to have this conversation because
I think it's your work is just so incredibly important.

Speaker 3 (08:33):
I appreciate you saying that. I think that, like I
feel that my work is very important. But That's why
I'm showing up everywhere, right because.

Speaker 4 (08:41):
I'm so passionate about it.

Speaker 3 (08:42):
I'm so passionate around you know, like you mentioned, oh,
therapy is very important to me, Like I feel like
a brokenhurt oftentimes when I'm trying to share the message
around what is therapy, what is mental health? And how
do we destigmatize from messages that maybe we heard when
we were youngers, Like if you go to therapy, that

(09:03):
means the person if therapy is only for white people,
like all of the different barriers that we place to
something that is just life changing, right, because therapy and
to challenge everything is that therapy is for everyone at
any stage of their life. Because therapy, the whole purpose
of it is to help prove the quality of your life.

Speaker 4 (09:24):
Right.

Speaker 3 (09:25):
So maybe you're not in a crisis, so you think
I don't need therapy, but that's actually the best time.
The best time to get that support is when you're
not in a crisis, because that's when you can really
do deeper work and to learning more about yourself, how
you exist in the world, why maybe you react situation
is a certain way, and learn learn more about that.

(09:46):
Oftentimes we blame ourselves for so much and when we
talk to someone else, learn it's not really all about that, right, So,
like that's a big message. So again, not for crazy people.
It's for everyone. And the representation in when I think
of mental health professionals is it's more diverse I think

(10:09):
every day, and so in the past, you know, I
think when people think of therapy, you probably think of
that image of Freud, someone on the couch. Yeah, like
like older white man taking notes, and that seems so vulnerable.
But but what I love about social media is I

(10:29):
think that we can give examples of like, you know,
sometimes therapy is you know, like what's the tiesma today,
you know, like like like what's the tea? What are
we talking about? Because how we communicate generation social changes? Right, So, yeah,
it's not that sterial. I guess what I'm trying to say,
it's not that sterile.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, that's very well said.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
I would I would definitely agree, And I think we'll
start there where you know, I think I'm quoting you
from that same article where you said there's often a
belief that one must have a severe problem to seek
therapy or assistance, right, And I think that is the
giant misconception that I even I had when I first
started going to therapy in my twenties, and I was
fearfully telling anybody that was going to therapy was because

(11:15):
when you use words like depression or anxiety or you know,
needing help using that phrase, everybody immediately jumps to the
worst case scenario.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
You're losing your mind.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
You need to be placed on a suicide watch. We
can't leave you alone. There's something extremely wrong. You can't
function when there are obviously varying levels of mental health,
you know, crisises, or just needing somebody to talk to
that isn't in your life that can give you a real,
you know, guided sort of way of looking at things
that doesn't have the preconceived notions of the people around you.

Speaker 1 (11:48):
Right, So let's kind of you know, start there.

Speaker 2 (11:50):
I know we touched on it, but you know, let's
talk a bit about that, that belief that therapy has
to be when you're in crisis, and also even just
the idea of continuing the therapy when you are in
a good place, you know, the benefits of sort of
that maintenance mode that exists.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
I feel like as well, Yes, I love that you're
calling at maintenance mode because that's really is what we
talk about with my clients.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
And we get to that.

Speaker 3 (12:10):
Point and like you're you're ready, you're ready to graduate therapy,
you know, like, aka, you've met the goal step for
therapy and we can continue working together or you can
you know, as needed. And most of them, most people
are workers, are just normalize this, choose to stay on,
to have at least monthly what we call maintenance sessions,
monthly sessions where we're checking in to make sure they're

(12:30):
still managing, you know, whatever the stressors we're going on
with their lives. They're still keeping up with the coping
skills that maybe we learned. They're still holding the boundaries
that maybe we talked about. And so that's to speak
to that. But then to come back to your other
question is you know, I think we I think people
often view therapy as a last resort. You think of
therapy as the emergency room, right like, and and let's

(12:54):
talk about what that's like in our Latin the communities.
So you know, oftentimes there's a depending on whatever country
people are coming from. And I would say, you know,
my parents are from Mexico and there is a distrust
of medical systems, like I don't know that I can
trust you, and then you come here and we don't
know what your documentation status might be. That also then

(13:16):
impacts the distrust of the system. So when we don't
trust the system, that means that we'll only use it
if we have we feel that we have no other options, right,
And so you hear this a lot with people who
don't go to the doctor, They don't go to their
annual checkups, they don't go to So I want to say,
like all of the things that we think of as
maybe normal, that also comes with a lot of privilege,

(13:37):
like yet having your annual.

Speaker 4 (13:38):
Exam, all of that.

Speaker 3 (13:40):
But sure, everyone at some point has a crisis or emergency.

Speaker 4 (13:44):
Unfortunately I don't.

Speaker 3 (13:45):
Mean to say this in a positive way, but that
leads you to the point where you can no longer
cope with this on your own. And so then the
emergency room. And so when you go to therapy just
for crisis, you're treating it like the emergency room. And
what does it emergency room do? Like just maybe give
you a script. They patch you up, and you're like
you're on your way, but they don't.

Speaker 4 (14:05):
They don't really fix anything for you.

Speaker 3 (14:07):
They kind of just give you like a temporary band
aid and until next time maybe, right, And it kind
of feels like it's just holding together. So if you
seek out there when you're in that full crisis, and
that goes to that image that people imagine, oh, I'm
going to be hospitalized, I'm going to be held against
my will. That's not really always the case hospitalization, and

(14:32):
I want to say this to normalize it isn't it's
a last resort. It's a lot definitely a last resort
for me. I do not take hospitalizations lightly. It's not
something that anyone who comes into.

Speaker 4 (14:45):
Crisis, I'm like, oh, time to go to hospital.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
The only time that someone is hospitalized is if they
are going to be an imminent danger to themselves or others.

Speaker 4 (14:57):
That's if you tell me the.

Speaker 3 (14:58):
Moment i'm this room, I'm going to end my life
for someone else's life, that's when the hospitalization is necessary.
That is not what most crises look like or feel
like for people. We might have moments where we feel
like desperate and out of swords, like that burnout that

(15:19):
maybe I don't want to get out of bed, I
don't want to do any of these things, and that's
an emotional crisis. But that's a hospitalization needed crisis.

Speaker 4 (15:26):
It's not er.

Speaker 3 (15:29):
But anyway, but when we wait till that point. Right now,
the work definitely, we can really do a lot of
good work. But the work is then first starts on
that emergency room intervention, which is like we're going to
do a band aid, how do we kind of help
you hold it together and how do we help you
establish that strong foundation, and then we build from there together. Right. So,

(15:55):
and if when you're not un trying to think of
like how do you simplify this, and when you come
to therapy, when you're not in a crisis, and it's
when you're maybe in a good place, you already have
a strong foundation. So that part, that foundation is so
important because that's and I'm calling a foundation, but essentially
your baseline for how much sure, how much stress you

(16:16):
can handle out one time. We all have a different
base what that is. And let's say our baseline is here.
You know, our emotions can sometimes go, you know, up
and down, but we mostly stay around the baseline.

Speaker 4 (16:28):
And that's good. That's what we want. We don't want
too high highs or too low lows.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
But when we have no baseline, because we don't have
that foundation, we're just doing this the whole time. Right,
And so while we have the we're in a good place.
We have that foundation, so our moods feel are feeling
like they're in a good place. So then when we're
learning skills for how to manage them, it helps us
keep it level, helps us stay.

Speaker 4 (16:50):
In a good place.

Speaker 3 (16:52):
And again when we're in we're going to be going.
We're trying to go from down here just up to
the baseline, right, just to help out.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Yeah, I love it.

Speaker 2 (17:00):
You're kind of explaining the different levels to all this,
and I think the general idea of it is, wherever
you are, therapy is always a good answer for you.

Speaker 1 (17:10):
Right.

Speaker 2 (17:11):
I'm loving everything we're talking about today. Obviously a bunch
more want to get into. But we'll take a pause here,
we'll take a quick break, and then we'll be right back.

Speaker 1 (17:22):
All right, we are back.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
And it's interesting kind of speaking about parents and you know,
the sort of stigmas that that exists within our community,
because even within you know, my own with my own
you know mother, we had a conversation recently talking about
because I've struggled with depression, you know, for you know,
I guess as long as I can remember, and she

(17:45):
kind of had a you know, moment where she was
saying to me, like, I can't believe I didn't recognize
it or see it, you know, to see that that
was what was going on with you, like during your
teenage years or whatever, you know. And she was kind of,
I guess, beating herself up a little bit because she
was an educator, so she's, you know, to her, it's like,
I should be able to sort of as an educator

(18:05):
and you know, sort of being somebody trained in a
bit of the behavior of kids, I should be able
to recognize it in my own son.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
But I didn't.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
I failed to, you know, And you know, she sort
of didn't know if that was sort of her own
kind of maybe the stigma she had around mental health
and didn't want to believe that about her own son, right.
But it's it is interesting, I think, you know, how
our parents be their own because of their own sort

(18:33):
of belief systems and and sort of fear of the
idea of mental health or just not knowing what to
look for, you know, sort of how unequipped. Unfortunately, so
many people in our lives are to actually give us
assistance when we are going through some of these sort
of darker periods throughout the course of our lives now.

Speaker 3 (18:51):
When you were sharing that about your mom, there was
I was waiting for you to share something else because
it's another common narrative that I heard where the parent
is m have has a hard time accepting that something's
happening with their child because they feel that they are
to blame for what's happening with the right waiting for
you to say.

Speaker 4 (19:10):
Something, right and so, and you said it, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:12):
Did why not see it? How did I not see it?
Like I work with you know, I'm in education. I
should have seen it, and it becomes this other self cycle.
But the reality is is that she was doing her
best with everything she had and all the knowledge she
had at that time. And that's that's you know, part
of my work is also educating people on there having

(19:34):
more self compassion, right, Like this is hard. This is
hard to come back and reflect and have to deal
with those emotions. And I think that's how many people
will shy away from them because it's uncomfortable.

Speaker 4 (19:47):
And you know, you said you've been a therapy. You said,
that's something.

Speaker 3 (19:49):
You've been working through for a very long time. You
know how much work it is. It's yeah, and I'm
not saying that life is easy, but that familiar to
those challenges we experience in day to day life sometimes
feels easier to manage than the uness.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
And this possibility is right, right, Yeah, that's actually a
great way to put it.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
Yeah, I think the sort.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
Of the devil you know, almost right, is a bit
more comfortable in some sort of weird way than like
having to go down the rabbit hole of like figuring
out what's going on and figuring out how to treat
it and be more aware of it and what you.

Speaker 1 (20:30):
Know, practices.

Speaker 2 (20:31):
I guess we could adapt, and I think I think
that's where a lot of people probably get stuck as well. Right,
is within the comfort even in your own misery, there's
still comfort there, right, And that's sort of the hard
part I think about life and as a human being
in general, is that we have the capability of normalizing

(20:52):
so much that we sort of hold ourselves back from
from actually correcting things when we should or when we can,
you know, because we we you know, really are always
programmed to just seek comfort, seek comfort, even if it
is the very thing that is causing us our unhappiness
and our dissatisfaction with life.

Speaker 3 (21:11):
Exactly seek comfort. And you know, also, I don't know
about you, if I grew up with it's like, this is
just how things are with the message, right, this is
just how things are and you can do to change it,
which is a very disempowering message to receive when you're younger.
But it's a message that comes from the lived realities
of the people who are telling us that, right. Like

(21:32):
for I think of again my parents coming from their
like respective countries and experiences that they had. You know,
they didn't have access to education really where they were living,
and what learned through a school teacher. It's how she
learned to read and write. My dad was part of
a big family. There were eleven children, so and he's
one of the older ones. So at some point heeded

(21:53):
to work to provide for the family, to help help,
you know, make sure everyone was eating and so so
their internalized messages like this is just how things are
and we have to accept that. Uh, and but when
But the whole point of their creation story and the
narrative is because they were in search for another life, right,
And so sometimes having to remind me of well we are,

(22:15):
we're also now here because we don't want to accept
that reality anymore, because we want to consider that there's
life that I can live where I can be at peace,
I can have my joy, I can feel you know,
unconditional love. And I think that, I mean, I don't
know about you, but I think these are three things

(22:37):
that I really want in my life, right, like my love,
my joy.

Speaker 4 (22:39):
And my peace.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Yeah, yeah, well one hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (22:42):
What you know, something that's come to my mind as
we're just like talking, is because we've normalized the struggle
so much within our community, right, Like in Puerto Rico,
I called like like living in La Brega, Right.

Speaker 1 (22:54):
You're like constantly in the struggle. We've normalized it.

Speaker 2 (22:56):
And you know, even like like post hurricane, you had
a lot of people talking about like we're tired of
being resourceful, of being resilient, Like we were.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
Tired, Right, that's not a badge of honor anymore.

Speaker 2 (23:07):
And I think, you know, what's coming to my mind
that I would love to kind of pick your brain
on a bit is especially the kind of this hustle
culture that we exist in today, grind grind, grind, right,
And like the biggest complaint about the new generation is
nobody works hard anymore.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
Nobody wants to put in the work blah blah blah. Right,
And it's this very sort.

Speaker 2 (23:24):
Of toxic idea around hustling and what it means to
be productive and all these different things, right. And I
think what I struggle with is, if I'm not in
the grinding mode, if I'm not burning the candle at
both ends, how do I stay motivated?

Speaker 4 (23:42):
Right?

Speaker 2 (23:42):
Because that's like the easiest sort of fuel to find,
is when you are living with resentment that you're trying
to prove somebody wrong, when you are seeking validation, those
are the easy ones to find to give you the
motivation to push past the exhaustion, right and to you
know whatever, pull an all night or to get a
project done. But what I struggle with is how do
I I know that that that's toxic, I know that

(24:04):
that's unhealthy for me to live with those sort of
negative emotions and and sort of coexist with them in
that way and embrace them and celebrate them. How can
I still find, you know, sort of the motivation from
the happier stuff. I think that's the balance I think
is incredibly difficult. You know, when you aren't with your
back against the wall, how do you still keep that
same level of energy, you know, in a more positive manner.

Speaker 1 (24:26):
I guess if that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, I think this goes back also to what we
were talking about earlier as the whole the devil, you know, right,
Like when all you know to.

Speaker 4 (24:35):
Like overwork yourself and be burned out and be exhausted
all the time.

Speaker 3 (24:41):
What happens when we don't feel exhausted and when we're
not busy, you start to feel like, oh I'm latey, Like,
oh I'm not doing enough. I could be doing more,
Like I am not making the sacrifices of my ancestors worth.

Speaker 4 (24:54):
It, like right, right, right, It's like it's the amount
of guilt.

Speaker 3 (25:00):
Get think guilt drives a lot of progress for people.
It's like, I feel guilty because you know X Y T,
you know did this for me.

Speaker 4 (25:09):
But we don't.

Speaker 3 (25:10):
We don't need to always be driven by guilt, right,
We don't always have to be.

Speaker 4 (25:15):
It doesn't always have to be.

Speaker 3 (25:16):
The double go as long as you're willing to take
a risk to try it a different way. Now, maybe
that shifts the timeline of your project. Maybe you were
like set on wanting to get something done by the
end of this month, but that's only possible if you're
working around the park, and so now there has to
be a shift in the timeline if you're slowing it down.

(25:36):
But what we don't focus on. We focus on, oh,
my deadline's going to have to get shifted. I'm not
going to be able to get it done by when
I wanted to. That makes me a failure. But instead
the focus should be on, well, but what I will
have is sleep.

Speaker 4 (25:51):
Every night.

Speaker 3 (25:52):
I will sleep, I will have good rest. I will
have to actually take care of my body so that
long term, long term, I can actually maintain this business
or this dream or whatever I have built. Because when
we're thinking hustle culture, hustle mindset, like work NonStop. Anyone
can do that, but for a short period of time,

(26:13):
at some point it catches up to you. It catches
up to you physically, emotionally, spiritually, I think in every
single level of your being. It catches up to you.
And then what happens Then you have to completely stop.
You come to a full and so all the sprintings
that you were doing, no more progress because now, like now, it.

Speaker 4 (26:35):
Feels like you can't function.

Speaker 3 (26:36):
And I don't know if you have ever experienced that
level of burnout dramas.

Speaker 2 (26:40):
But I know, sure, I know that, and that's my
normal state of that. I've normalized that as my baseline,
which is the crezy like if I'm not you know,
and i'm you know, I've gotten a lot better at it.
But for a while, if I wasn't completely exhausted to
the point that like, you know, you sit me down
for ten seconds, I'm falling asleep somewhere like then, I

(27:02):
wasn't working hard enough.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
That's what I normalized was burnout. Basically, that was my baseline.

Speaker 3 (27:06):
That was your baseline, right, and we can't always be
the baseline. And you know what, earlier before we went
on this, I was saying, no, I love something. There's
something about the East Coast that I just loved, and
I love the energy and I love that from in
the cities.

Speaker 4 (27:20):
But what I.

Speaker 3 (27:20):
Don't miss was that constant pression to be on all
the time. I don't miss leaving my like leaving my apartment,
you know, six seven in the morning and getting back
at eight nine pm at night to still do more
work and romanticizing, right and thinking, oh that was all
I'm living the dream.

Speaker 4 (27:38):
I get to do all these you know, and I
don't miss that.

Speaker 3 (27:41):
But when I say I miss New York or I
missed the East Coast, I do just miss the like
energy of when I was out like my favorite memories
or it is like when I'm out at Central Park
because I got to go see a contint of joy,
you know, like I got to go you know, ice
skating at Bryant Park or whatever. Oh it's like I
got to go be a tourist in this amazing city

(28:03):
like world know, like that's really what I miss the most.
But I definitely don't miss sixteen hour days. But sometimes
something they do, actually sometimes they do right. Sometimes I'm
like me, that did all of that, But that version sure,
and I'm sure that version of you, which is they
were the current version of you, which is a version,

(28:23):
and I'm assuming that now there's a more balance in
your life.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
And so slightly yeah, yeah, it's still work your progress,
but definitely, like we're prioritizing sleep, which is a gigantic,
you know, step forward, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (28:35):
I don't sacrifice my sleep for anything, so that's a
huge milestone forward.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
But I think to your point when thinking about like
you know, geographically where people live in kind of the
normalization of culture. I do go to, Like when I
go to Puerto Rico, I feel different energy from people.
It's one of those things where it's like, you know
a lot of people aren't living with an abundance of wealth,
but they seem incredibly happy, or they're living longer lives.

(29:01):
You go and like I might complain at how long
it takes to get food or something like that, but
like they're in no rush. I'm actually the weird one
who's rushing to get through ordering food.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
And you know what I mean, like where do I
have to go?

Speaker 2 (29:11):
I'm on vacation, right, but I've been conditioned to be
go go go all the time, and that's why, you know,
I sort of have this roller coaster ride, and they
seem to be living a far more peaceful existence, sort
of kind of going.

Speaker 1 (29:25):
With the flow.

Speaker 2 (29:26):
And I think it speaks to that, you know, that
to that point that you're you're sort of making is is.
You know, a lot of times it depends culturally what's
been sort of normalized. And I think probably many of
our parents who came over here adapted that go go
go mindset because that's what they had to do to
survive over here and sort of forgot about, you know,

(29:50):
the peaceful life that they left behind and the mindset
that was there that has like, you know, my grandfather's
almost one hundred years.

Speaker 1 (29:56):
Old, you know what I mean, it's still like functioning,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
So like it's obvious that there's a difference, you know,
between the lifestyle that he has over there in Puerto
Rico and my dad who's here you know, in the States,
you know, and battle like his own health issues, you know,
at a way younger age.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
Yeah, yeah, and you know, I mean, hey, I like
the amount of snaps somebody with your grandfather a hundred
years old, Like I like hope that he's like chilling,
like I don't know, I'm enjoying the beach somewhere right now.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
But yeah, like they.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
Were looking out at least. I yeah, but no, absolutely,
I think that being I think what you were sharing
that I thought about, right the other messages that I
would hear often from my parents and that the clients
I work right here often is you know, like I
want I don't want you, like from their parents. It's
like I don't want you to have to work as
hard as I did. I don't want you to break

(30:48):
back and do these very physically demanding jobs.

Speaker 4 (30:52):
And that's the double advantage, i'd hear.

Speaker 3 (30:54):
And you know again, people are bit here when the
poority was I want you to focus on your education.
I want you to focus on how do we increase
your access. However, the hard part about this is that
that was their their value and their hope. But they
didn't really fully understand what they were encouraging you to
do and what they wanted you to do because it's
so different than what they knew. So then when it

(31:17):
starts to happen, it's join for them too.

Speaker 1 (31:20):
Right.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
So when I moved away for college for my undergrad
I moved away. It was a two hour drive, so
I went from LA to San Diego. And I was
strategic about this because I knew my parents. I'm the
oldest and the firstborn.

Speaker 4 (31:34):
They don't want me to leave.

Speaker 3 (31:35):
But I did not apply anywhere that was driving distance
from LA. I was like, I would have to move,
and then I chose San Diego because my father's side
of the family.

Speaker 4 (31:44):
Isn't the Gate, which is a border town, and so.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
My mind, I'm like, I'm literally a sandwich between La
and thic gate and so if I need any family
like like, I was prepared to make this argument for them, but.

Speaker 4 (31:59):
I share this.

Speaker 3 (32:00):
But when the time came to move out, even though
the messaging please go to college, please go get education,
to all of these things, my parents.

Speaker 4 (32:09):
Were not happy with me. My mom.

Speaker 3 (32:12):
My mom's narrative at that time was, you have been brainwashed.
You are abandoning your family. How could you do this?
You just want to get away from us? And in truth,
I mean I did. I'm not gonna I go give
her that.

Speaker 4 (32:25):
She wasn't like.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
I needed to get out.

Speaker 4 (32:29):
I need the space. I need to space.

Speaker 3 (32:31):
I grew up in this one sure, a small apartment,
so like, I'll give her that. But I was But
but I understood. I can understand more now where she
was coming from. Now we've been able to work through
that and talk through that, and she thinks back, like,
you know, I just didn't understand. I understand now that
we were trying to go to school. But I didn't

(32:53):
get it fully right. Even though it's the message that
we told you all the time, it wasn't. It was
I didn't expect, you know, in her mind, I would
live at home, go to community college and at twenty
five years old get married, meets you know, and someone
else there of me, right, right, But just to say,
just how much like our families, uh, I guess, like sorry,

(33:15):
our family expectations of us inpact just the choices that
we make. However, there, yes, are grounded in the limited
knowledge that they have, and so they don't use the
full picture, and so that's when some of the conflict
arises between the children and the parents.

Speaker 4 (33:33):
Right in that Jersey.

Speaker 2 (33:34):
Yeah, that's actually a fascinating kind of path I want
to go down a little bit because you know, and
we can kind of pull up full circle where we
talked about like the judicial sense of psychology mentioned Freud,
but like Carl Jung talks about the idea of like
the shadow self, right, and the part of ourselves were
almost like a shame to let the world see we
wear a mask, you know. And I think a lot

(33:57):
of what we struggle with in our own happiness and
fulfillment is the fear of judgment by the outside world
and specifically in our community where your family is in
your business, you know, and is sort of has zero
boundaries for.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
The most part, right, there's no boundaries in our community.
For the most.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
Part, it's like, you know, a lot of people hold
back their own happiness for the sake of what their
parents may think of them, or what their family may
think of them. And I think a lot of people
are really living as shells of themselves because of this

(34:38):
fear right, you know. I mean, I'm sure there are
a lot of people in your position who would have
allowed their parents guilt to make them go to that
community college, to not go away, to have that experience
of independence, you know.

Speaker 1 (34:48):
I mean, there's a lot of people who, you know,
sort of never leave the.

Speaker 2 (34:52):
House right until they're married, because it's like this guilt
trip that happens.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
Why would you want to move out somewhere. Our house
isn't good enough for your right when.

Speaker 2 (35:00):
These are all sorts of rights of passage to become
an adult, to find yourself, to really find what makes
you happy, and without them, it's hard to know where
your parents' opinion of who you should be ends and
where your true authentic self actually begins. Right, So I'd
love to kind of talk a bit about that. I know,
boundaries is a big thing for you that you talk

(35:21):
about on social media a lot but you know kind
of what what happens that you've seen for a lot
of people where they're really living in fear of being
able to fully express themselves because of the sort of
tight knit community family existence that we all grew up on.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
For the most part, it's so real.

Speaker 4 (35:40):
It's still so real. Like and.

Speaker 3 (35:43):
I think guilt is the much contributor to the like
feeling stuck for an individual in terms I think how
I love how to shed that, like where do your
expectations of who you are supposed to be from your
parents end?

Speaker 4 (36:00):
And where do you and your authentic self again?

Speaker 3 (36:03):
And I think that that's when we release the guilt
that we feel about needing to adhere.

Speaker 4 (36:08):
To these expectations.

Speaker 3 (36:10):
And I actually just had a wonderful conversation with someone
about guilt, and so like this is very fresh in
my mind, and yeah.

Speaker 4 (36:18):
You know with it, it's breaking down, well what is
what is guilt?

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Right?

Speaker 3 (36:21):
We always talk about I feel guilty, you know, I
think in I think naturally in a lot of like
the little Latina communication styles, it's a lot of guilt. Right,
you didn't come see me today? Like why you ever
call me anymore? Like And and I'm like you could
just say you missed. You could just say that, right,
Why we gotta.

Speaker 4 (36:41):
Make it so curious.

Speaker 3 (36:42):
So I've learned to kind of joke about it with
people when they try to make me feel guilty about something,
I'm like, let's talk about what you feel like saying,
just tell me that. But gil what it is, it's
like a misalignment of a value that you have and
maybe the action that you're engaged in. Right, and so

(37:02):
when I in my story of you know, wanting to
move away to college, there was a guilt associated there
because the value was be with family and be like factimistic.
But I also valued higher education and becoming successful of
being independent. So I'm holding these two values, but one
of them is in misalignment, which is you want to

(37:25):
be successful, you should sorry, do you want to You
never want to leave your family?

Speaker 4 (37:29):
Right with my action?

Speaker 3 (37:30):
Friend, feel guilty about that, but right if we if you? So,
it's a normal reaction to hap there's a normal feeling
to have, like, oh, I feel guilty because this is
something that's new and that's different that I'm doing. However,
there's a difference between guilty for doing something feeling guilty
for doing something wrong and feeling guilty because we're in misalignment. Right,

(37:52):
So this misalignment in the values is something that I
like that example that I just shared, guilty because you
did something wrong. You know, Like I have a young
younger brother, he's six years older than me.

Speaker 4 (38:01):
Right, Like, if I.

Speaker 3 (38:02):
Play a prank on him and he actually gets hurt,
I'm going to feel guilty because I actually I did
something wrong, you know, Like, right, I can't. I wish
I could think about with an example right now, but
you know it's sibling sibling rivalry. My cousin shap the
heads off my barbies. I hope you feel guilty for
that because that made me sad. But like that's that's

(38:22):
just that's that's a different kind of guilt that we're.

Speaker 4 (38:24):
Talking about, right.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
So this other guilt, yeah, this emotional guilt that's because
of the values being in conflict, feels so much, so
much bigger, so insurmountable. But that's not the case, because
all it is signifying that there is a change that
is happening, and you have now a choice to make
around which direction you're going to lean into with this change?

(38:47):
Are you going to let the guilt guide it, or
are you going to lean into the larger value that
was the calling that you had. Right, So, like they
get back to example, the guilt. If I felt if
I lean into the guilt, I would have stayed home.
I would have gone to community college when over followed
the journey, maybe would have still been a psychologist. I
don't know, but I'm not saying that that path doesn't

(39:10):
need to success. But that's not the path I chose
in my mind. I wanted to go to college, and
I was so afraid that if I started at community college,
I'd get stuck somehow my parents. You know, there was
a lot of other narratives I had in my mind.
So pushing through that guilt and taking a chance, taking
that leap of faith, was what ultimately helped me get

(39:32):
to the other side of that guilt, which was the
piece that I felt with the decision, and then a
place where I could have a more rational conversation with
my family about this. Right, so itill came back together
like this didn't break us apart. I think sometimes what
we fear will happen when we set a boundary, But

(39:53):
the guilt and boundaries are so closely related, right, we
set a boundary. We feel guilty doing it, and so
being able to navigate that guilt empowers us to be
able to set better boundaries. And as a reminder, boundaries
are there so that you can tell people how you
want to be treated, how you want to know, like

(40:14):
what is the best way for you to exist in.

Speaker 4 (40:15):
This world with them? Right?

Speaker 3 (40:17):
And that's all you're trying to say is I want
to spend time with you, and the best way for
me to feel loved or to love you is for
me to get some time to recharge on my own
before I do this, right, or I can only offer
the power of my time because after that I get
so dreamed because I'm an introvert. For my introverts out there,
so it always it's always comes from love, but that's

(40:42):
not what.

Speaker 4 (40:42):
It feels like always.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:44):
Yeah, those are the sort of like the difficult conversations
that we often avoid, but we have to have them,
you know, we have to be able to face it
head on.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
And and I think I.

Speaker 2 (40:58):
Think again to many of the points that you're up,
it's important to recognize where these things are coming from,
you know, and saying like, you know, my mom is
not guilting me about going away because you know, she
hates me. It's because she loves me so much that
she's in fear of me not being there every day
with her, right, she loves having me around so much,
you know. And I think it's easy to like, you know,

(41:22):
build up this resentment or take it a different type
of way. But I think that's why those conversations are
so necessary, because it kind of opens your eyes to
where this other person is coming from, and it allows
you to then process it maybe in a more healthy manner, right,
and not be sort of holding on to unnecessary negative
emotions that might not actually even have your real merit,

(41:44):
you know, once you get to know where the other
person was coming from.

Speaker 3 (41:47):
Yeah, and we don't always have the capacity to offer
that when we're doing everything out of guilt, because when
we're doing everything out of guilt, that means we're not
pouring into ourselves, which means that we don't have like
the energy to give away for that.

Speaker 4 (42:00):
Right. So then when you get the guilty like.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
You never come see me anymore, then then the reaction
instead of being oh, you're missing me, let's have a
conversation about this, then I'm depleted, so I'm defensive. What
are you talking about? We talk every day, I saw
you last weekend.

Speaker 4 (42:15):
What do you you know? What else? What do you
want for me?

Speaker 3 (42:18):
I give you all of myself. I give me nothing.

Speaker 4 (42:21):
Right. So that's I think a really.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
Important I guess a area to focus on. And that's
something that a lot of people do the work and
in therapy, right, like, and that's just to bring it back,
it's what can therapy help with. Therapy can help you
maybe release some of the guilt so that you can
arrive at the point where you can engage in like

(42:44):
a productive conversation as opposed.

Speaker 4 (42:47):
To just clashing all the time.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Right.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
And that's that's and therapist can help guide you and
provide you with resources for how you frame things with
your family, because we know family dynamics are very unique,
and especially when you're in a collectivistic culture and background,
it's very different than the stereotypical boundaries that you see.
People said, sure, and if you have a culturally informed

(43:12):
therapist who can help and recognize like, okay, we want
to you you really you respect this person and you
want to make sure you set a boundary and make
them feel disrespected. Let's talk about how we do that.

Speaker 4 (43:23):
That's that's easy.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
To it, right, Yeah, And I love that angle that
you kind of took, even from saying you know that
if you are yourself burnt out or depleted, you're not
going to react in a good way to whatever is
being brought to you, right, And then I think that's
sort of what you have to realize, you know. Like
for me, the boundary I've said is like, I'm not
answering my dad's calls before eleven am, because that's like

(43:47):
my time where I'm getting up my morning routine, my meditation,
I'm getting like my own sort of things that are
my priority done that early. And because I don't, I
can't get on the phone with him then have an
argument about something that's on his mind that's his priority
that then puts me in a bad.

Speaker 1 (44:02):
Mood that messes up the rest of my day.

Speaker 2 (44:03):
You know, I have to have that boundary because my
dad is like a type a personality. So for him,
it's like he sets his mind on something boom boom boom,
it has to get done, and if you don't drop
everything you're doing, he gets defensive about it. And I
know that, right, So I have to set that boundary
where I say, I'm not gonna be in a good place.
I'm gonna end up just getting into a fight, getting
provoked because I'm gonna get annoyed with him that he's

(44:25):
sort of overstepping into my precious time, right, And it's
up to me to set that boundary to then know
later on the day, once I've I've felt like you know,
I've gotten my stuff done for me, I'll be in
a far better place to just sort of yes and
listen to what he has to say and not have
it turned into a in argument or fight.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
Right.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
But I sort of I love that that perspective that
you sort of brought up and co signed them that.

Speaker 1 (44:48):
All right, I'm gonna stop here real quick one more time.
We'll take a quick break.

Speaker 2 (44:51):
Then we'll have the rest of our conversation with doctor
Vezette Sanchez. All Right, we are back, and I do
we also want to want to talk a bit about
the world that we exist in today. I mean, even
just outside of our community. I feel like I haven't
talked to anybody in the world of mental health and
therapy and things like that about their opinion on social media, right,

(45:15):
the era that we live in, right, now there's a
lot of talk about something like TikTok getting banned, right,
And there's been so much normalization of social media culture
being a part of our everyday lives and the way
that we just literally go out and exist in every
minute of every day of our life.

Speaker 1 (45:33):
Right, it's that much a part of it now.

Speaker 2 (45:35):
And I'm curious for you, you know, somebody who is
a mental health professional, what are you kind of seeing
of the effects of social media that maybe people aren't
necessarily aware of or want to admit, or or just
not having the right conversation right now.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
I think it's a very good question, and I have
lots of I think lots of different perspectives that are
coming up from me.

Speaker 4 (45:59):
So I'm coming up.

Speaker 3 (46:00):
So one thing is I think it's like with anything,
it's how do you use it?

Speaker 4 (46:07):
Like how do you use this?

Speaker 3 (46:10):
How you interact with social media will impact just your
general experience of is it something that's that's healthy or
if it's something that's on this well, like put it
on a spectrum like healthy or is it like unhealthy? Right,
If you're going social media and you're constantly engaging in
just like arguments and discussions of people and you're being

(46:32):
you're basically or is it like stressing yourself out all
the time, Like I think you probably need a break
from that, right, controlling stop trolling all social media? Read
it is also social media just like in case like no,
like if you find that you're activated by everything constantly,

(46:54):
that's not healthy. And when I say activated is sometimes
we can go on social media. You see the post,
you know, I light reel of everyone's life. Wow, this
person's doing so many things. I went to high school
with this person and look at everything they've done. What
am I doing with my life? That self, Daniel is
a thief of joy right, as they say, right that

(47:15):
in that place, I think it can be very dangerous, right,
And that's that's that goes back to the boundaries, right,
you have set boundaries with yourself. Like if I find
myself triggered by certain accounts even now, like I you know,
by immedia, that is like do I unfollow or do
I meet this account? Because there's something about this account
right now that is making me like making some of

(47:35):
my insecurities come out, and like I need I need
to take care of myself and that's new block whatever
I need to do nothing against that person. That's about
that I need for me, right, But yeah, I have
that awareness. And unless you have that awareness, you're not
going to know to do that. You're just gonna open
and you're gonna have a cycle of stress all day long.
So then that happens not sleeping. Well, I'm super stressfu

(47:58):
all the time. I'm getting sickled time because that's what
happens when your body's under chronic stress. So from that angle,
I would say it can be really unhealthy. So it's
again the you, how are you utilizing it?

Speaker 4 (48:10):
However? I do you think that social media has been
a very powerful tool, and at least in my journey.

Speaker 3 (48:18):
To destigmatize mental health because an increased representation the types
of stories that we're hearing, you know, like because you
get to choose now who you want to receive certain
messages from, who you're going to follow, Yeah, and that
choice is very very powerful and and you know, so

(48:39):
like I love following other first gen accounts, for example,
because when I'm seeing them, they normalize the struggle and you.

Speaker 4 (48:48):
Know, the successes, it's not just the highlight reel.

Speaker 3 (48:53):
And you know, there's so many mental health professionals, so
many medical professionals, so many amazing people who are on
there volunteering their time to share valuable resources and information
with folks. Right, So I from that part of it,
I think it's it's so beautiful, it's so wonderful, and
it helps, Like I think you mentioned the word normal

(49:14):
is at normalizing.

Speaker 4 (49:15):
It helps normalize that we are not alone and that
we have right.

Speaker 3 (49:19):
That's why I like podcasts and like conversations like this
are so important because you know, my value is if
one person can benefit from anything that I do, then
it's worth doing. I don't need five hundred thousand people
to hear the message. I just need the one sure, right,
And if you're using social media in a way that

(49:43):
it's respectful of your boundaries around am I being triggered
by this content? Let me stop your doings for that.
I am guilty of this. So like I want to
be aware of this. I want to acknowledge. It's like
sometimes I check some s thing as I wake up,
I look you having messages like how do my people do?

Speaker 4 (50:03):
Like whatever?

Speaker 3 (50:04):
And that's something that I'm working on doing less and
less of because that does activate me, right, that does
make yeah, And I'm like, oh, wait, how I need
to do this? And I find myself then I'm in
bed schooling for the next two hours instead of getting
up and do what you can to do.

Speaker 4 (50:19):
So, like.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
I guess in simple paces, it's like the healthy and
unhealthy ways of navigating social media, and it's important to
know your boundaries around it. But I do think that
you can connect with a lot of amazing creators and
contents and friends. Ultimately it is just keeping just loved
ones and so it's how do you, I guess, do
use it responsibly?

Speaker 4 (50:43):
Right?

Speaker 3 (50:44):
So that said, that means that there's a level of
critical thinking that is involved for when we're mine and
doing this, and so that's why I think there's an
age limit on these all, Right, many my major requirement
on these, but we know that that's not always the case,
that they're not all that age. And so I do
think that social media can be very dangerous for young minds,

(51:08):
especially you know, when you're in that peak and secure
era of life that we all go through, I think, right,
and like how much that can impact the individual self
esteem may how we've heard about different trends that people
or young young minds do or young kids do that

(51:29):
are dangerous, right, and then not having anyone to kind
of check them say like, hey, maybe that's not a
good idea, right. I think that's where I would say stangerous. So,
like I said, I think my my perspectives on social media.
What I think about it, how especially when it comes
to mental health, is that if you can use it responsibly,
I think it could be a wonderful tool.

Speaker 4 (51:50):
But if you.

Speaker 3 (51:53):
If you find that you're using it and it's distracting
you from your everyday life, you know, from your work,
from your friends, Like, if you find it you're living
on your phone, you're living for the likes, you're living
for the whatever, then I'd probably say you need a
little bit of a break from social media and respect
how you want to use it. And if you're a child,

(52:14):
I think that there should be some supervision.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
Yeah, I guess to all that.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
And I think you know the part that like I
that is sticking out to me what you said, is
using it responsibly. But the fact that we have to
make that distinction showcases how potentially dangerous it can be
with when you don't have the awareness of what you're

(52:40):
using it for or sort of like the void that
you might be trying to fill with it oftentimes, right
because I think about it in terms of beyond just
like people arguing in comments and obviously it being an
unnecessary stressor in that manner. I also look at it
like so many people use it as a means, for instance,
validation or gratification, so sort of as a workaround for

(53:04):
the void that they're feeling, right, the lack of self
love that they're feeling.

Speaker 1 (53:08):
And that's what I live in fear of a bit.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
And I've been called grumpy, you know when I because
I'm calling out, like you know, it's like, man, like,
just be on vacation. You don't have to be documenting
everything with like a professional angle photo like it. You know,
what you're doing is like taking yourself out of the
moment and living for the gratification of other people saying, yes,
that's a cool vacation you went on type of thing, right,

(53:32):
rather than being present and enjoying it. And for me,
even with that awareness, I feel it sometimes where I
might work hard on a post and I think it's
amazing and I put it up and it does terribly
and then I'm like, man, maybe I'm just not as
good at this whole thing as I think I am
and I should rethink life a little bit right, And
then I feel bad about myself because what I'm putting

(53:53):
out is an extension.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
Of myself, and I'm aware of it.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
I'm aware of the fact that I'm that this is
me searching for validation that I need to go internally.
But there are a lot a lot of people who
have never maybe done the therapy, maybe never delve deep
and had that alone time to recognize their insecurities and
what's coming up for them, that you know, are really
just using this every single day as a means to
kind of quiet the dark voices in their head or

(54:19):
in the worst case, they're beating themselves up and thinking
there's something wrong with them if a post doesn't do
well or whatever it might be. And I think that's
sort of what a lot of people are failing to
realize because we've just normalized this idea of sort of
doing so much for the attention of others.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
Yes, yes, no, And I love the saying that, and
obviously I heard you talking them like, I think we
can have a whole other episode where we social media
and mental health because they think there's yeah, maearance to it.
But but I think you're right. I think and especially
for some people, it has become their main source of income.
And you see pers talk about it all the time,

(54:58):
the burnout that they experience because is it because they
first they tell you don't have to overthink it. Everything
is content.

Speaker 1 (55:06):
Everything right, right, right, blah blah blah right.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
But then when it becomes your full time job, like
everything literally is content, and existing is exhausting, and existing
is work and hard, and what you think is.

Speaker 4 (55:21):
Going to be fun suddenly takes you out of the moment.

Speaker 3 (55:24):
Like you said, you're on vacation and you're thinking about,
I better get that shot. I have to get up
at five am to do this. It's no longer a vacation.

Speaker 4 (55:31):
It's work.

Speaker 3 (55:33):
That's again come back to that's where using it responsibly, right,
It's okay, you want to get some nice It's like,
let's say you're let's say taking pictures is important to
you on this vacation. Sure, set limits around what that
looks like. Maybe you give yourself like one day, one
chunk of the for like an hour or whatever. That's
when you get to do your stage shots or whatever.

(55:54):
Then it's a fun activity. As that you're doing because
you have free time and you enjoy it, you want to,
but those are just something you have to post it
right away. Like I'm big on like something here and there,
but I don't need to post this right now, I
mean in.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
Fact right or obsess over how it does even right,
Like it's like, do I do I like what I
fucked the shot that I took that I devote the
time right, and if I do, that should be where
it ends, right, because that's like that's where it's healthy.
Then it's yeah, I mean I'm expressing maybe a creative
part of myself that I you know, that I enjoy
doing that I don't normally get to do whatever. It

(56:28):
might be sure, but like but it's I think that's
the the the disconnect that happens is people will justify
it because they say, I just want to I enjoy aesthetics.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
I enjoy taking pictures of cool things.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
But then on the flip side of it, are constantly
refreshing to see who liked it and and and I
think that's where it's like, well, now you're crossing over
put into a potentially dangerous place mentally because you sort
of created your self worth, this identity of what your
self worth is. Be it based upon if this does
well out or not. You know, I'm a great artist
or I have a great eye for this based upon it,

(57:03):
if this does well or not, and if it doesn't
do good, it means I suck, I beat myself up
about it, or whatever the case might pay.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
Yes, yes, And so you're this is your narrative, right
and your narrative is what's most important. How how am
I experiencing this? Like, like you mentioned, it's like I
like this, I like this shot I took.

Speaker 4 (57:19):
It makes me so happy. I want to share with
the world.

Speaker 3 (57:22):
And but then, yeah, we're so used to seeking that
external validation and whining to see other you know wind
that little tilpamein hit from seeing those lives. Now we
forget that the whole purpose of sharing was because it
was something I liked and enjoyed and I wanted anyone
else to see it, regardless of if they like engage
with it or not. And yeah, so I think that

(57:44):
that's also very very powerful. It's like something to think about.
So I guess if someone listening to this, if you're
that person, maybe take a little bit.

Speaker 4 (57:51):
Of a break from social media.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
Yeah, I mean it's just I think it's just a
scary nature of the on demand world that we live
in a little bit, right, and I feel like it
makes all of us adapt some narcissistic tendencies almost, And
I think that it also it also sort of even
just as an artist, right, as a musician, like I
think about you know, okay, you know, you write music,

(58:15):
you go in the studio or record it, and this
is probably traditionally would have been over the span of
maybe six months to a year, right, You're working on
this body of work. Then eventually it gets presented to
the world, right, and then they can have it.

Speaker 1 (58:28):
But you put all your all into it, and it
was for you for that year or whatever.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
But now the culture we live in with like TikTok things,
is a musician will create an idea, not finish it,
post it, and if it gets a good response, then
they decide it's worthy of them finishing it or putting
their their heart into it. And I like, and everybody,
I know, people on the surface, but who cares, it doesn't.

Speaker 1 (58:50):
But I'm like, but you're missing sort.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
Of the spiritual part of you conceptualizing something and bringing
your art to life.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
That's what this was about.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
And now you've turned it into something about other people,
and whether you realize it or not, you're sort of
making the very least putting the value of what you
create in the hands of other people to determine if
it is good or not. And that sort of defeats
the purpose of creating art or creating anything in general.
And I think you know again that turns to you
living for other people's opinion rather than what naturally you

(59:24):
just feel in your heart.

Speaker 4 (59:25):
I think, no, I hear you.

Speaker 3 (59:28):
I hear you with that, And then that as you
were saying that, I thought about, Like what I said
earlier was like I think when I create content, because
I create informative content, right, and so it's meant to
like understand it. I was like, I just want like
one person to benefit from it. But as you said that,
I thought about it's like, well that, but also like
I benefit from it in my own way, rights like
that one person is also me because this is what

(59:50):
I share. It's also part.

Speaker 4 (59:51):
Of my.

Speaker 3 (59:53):
Yes, my process, right, and so maybe that one person
is that that version of me ten years ago, ten years.

Speaker 4 (01:00:01):
From now, who needs to see this.

Speaker 3 (01:00:03):
I don't know, but I think I'm You're leaving me
with a lot of food for thought.

Speaker 4 (01:00:06):
I think, is what I mean to say.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Oh man, all right, so yeah, well there's so much
we could we could get into.

Speaker 1 (01:00:14):
That'll be maybe a part two further down the line.
But I appreciate you hopping on here.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
I think there's so much, you know, just gems, so
many gems that were dropped. But also bringing it full
circle back to your work, you know, I think I
can honestly say that people like like you have been
incredibly helpful for me When I was searching for a
therapist to tackle specific issues within my life. I needed
somebody who came from a similar background to me, and

(01:00:42):
when I was able to find that, that was when
I was able to have those major breakthroughs in that
area of my life. So, you know, I think the
work you're doing is obviously incredibly important in that because
you're providing representation and you're you're somebody that you know
grows up in a similar bathaground from the community. First
gen can look to you and open up to you

(01:01:04):
and know that you know they're going to be understood
and seen, Whereas you know that wasn't necessarily the case.
You know what, ten twenty years ago, when the norm
of people in your field were white people essentially, you know,
that was just the norm.

Speaker 1 (01:01:18):
So I solute you for the work that you're doing.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
I think it's just it's incredible, and I hope you
you recognize on a regular basis, I.

Speaker 3 (01:01:25):
Think, thank you so much for saying that and acknowledging
that I think that I feel. I mean, I honestly
I feel this way towards so many like I feel
this way towards the.

Speaker 4 (01:01:33):
Work that you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:01:34):
I feel this way towards like anyone else who shows
because I think, so, let me go back, stories are healing,
and so when we show up our stories, that helps
us heal and that is so powerful. And so that's
why I love the work.

Speaker 4 (01:01:48):
That you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:01:49):
And I think, yes, as a mental health professional, like
I mean, it was one of the reasons I wanted
to be a psychologist, you know, and like therapist in
the first place, I realize that there weren't there wasn't
anyone focusing on like the cultural impacts on our mental health,
and I was tired every time I wanted to go
see someone.

Speaker 4 (01:02:08):
Or a therapist like there was not anyone that I.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Could find who looked like me, who had any shared experiences,
And everyone who I work with they always say, you know,
I chose to work with you too because I already
felt that you could see me and understand me, and
I didn't have to explain some of the mundane details
or what you know of my life because I felt

(01:02:32):
like you.

Speaker 4 (01:02:32):
Would just get it.

Speaker 3 (01:02:34):
And that's also powerful because I don't know how much
if you know this, but the strongest predictor of success
in therapy is that client therapist alliance, that relationship. You
feel comfortable with your therapist, you will trust them more easily,
you will open up more easily, and so then it
will feel more effective because you also feel safer.

Speaker 4 (01:02:58):
And more comfortable.

Speaker 3 (01:02:59):
And so that's why it's so powerful that myself and
all the other you know, bipod comissions.

Speaker 4 (01:03:05):
Out here are.

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
Showing up wanting to do the work and having our
own therapists ourselves.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
Yeah, that's beautiful, And we all said in a great
reminder for anybody who's considering therapy or you know, looking
into it, you can have that prerequisite in your mind
where you can think to yourself, I'm not just going
to take the first therapist that is thrown my way,
that my insurance covers, or that I see on Betterhelp
or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
There's a process to this, just like dating.

Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
I want to find the right person, and maybe the
first person you meet or the second person doesn't feel
like the right fit.

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
But that's not a reason to give up. You know,
this is a process.

Speaker 2 (01:03:42):
It's not going to be something that you instantly just
nail it maybe the first time.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
And I think that's also something that might turn off.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
A lot of people, as if they had a bad
experience with a therapist, thinking that this is how every
therapist is or every interaction is going to be. And
I think we have to realize that it's a process
before finding the right person and the right fit, the
right connection.

Speaker 1 (01:03:59):
Yes it is.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
I'm so happy you're normalizing that. But yeah, agreed on
every every note.

Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Yeah, I appreciate and I appreciate your time.

Speaker 1 (01:04:06):
Where can people follow you and get more of.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
The amazing content that you're creating, Yes, I think, jos Well,
I'm most active on Instagram, so come follow me on
Instagram at the first Gen Psychologist.

Speaker 3 (01:04:16):
And you know, I recently started a new series with
a fellow mental health professional. That's called one hundred boundaries,
and so where we give you examples on how to
express these boundaries with your loved ones. And so it's
a baby baby series.

Speaker 4 (01:04:30):
And so if.

Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
Anyone listening to this is thinking about the boundaries, how
to set the boundaries, send me the m and we
would love to give you a little bit of a role.

Speaker 4 (01:04:38):
Play to help set you up for success with your
next boundary.

Speaker 1 (01:04:41):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:42):
Well, thank you so much for hopping on the show,
and we'll definitely hopefully get to reconnect down the road again.

Speaker 4 (01:04:47):
Thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Man, big chats my guest this week, doctor Lye Sanchez,
for hopping on the show.

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
So good to finally get to connect with her.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
I as a fan, like I mentioned of the artic
she was a part of for we r me too,
and I just love the world work that she's doing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:01):
I mentioned this when we were talking. But for me.

Speaker 2 (01:05:04):
In my journey in therapy, it was such a blessing
when I sort of recognized the power of having somebody
from our community or the first time I was able
to have somebody from our community as my therapist, a
person of color, and how it just made these situations
that I was going through a bit easier to sort
of work through because they understood it. I didn't feel

(01:05:26):
like I had to explain some of the cultural differences
and things like that, and it was a blessing. So
the work that she's doing is amazing, especially in a
field that traditionally has.

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
Been dominated by white people.

Speaker 2 (01:05:38):
I just, you know, grateful that people like her exist,
Grateful for all the content that she's making and the conversation.
So she's definitely amazing and and we slew her being
on the show.

Speaker 1 (01:05:48):
With that said, I want to get y'all's take on
the conversation.

Speaker 2 (01:05:51):
Around mental health from a different perspective than I usually
have before, I think, so we'll do that far ask
a getting gost segment, But first it's take a quick
break and then we'll be right.

Speaker 3 (01:06:02):
Back ask question.

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
All right, So, as DJ Drama is, you want to
be a part of these conversations in the future.

Speaker 1 (01:06:16):
But I just posted my Instagram asking.

Speaker 2 (01:06:19):
People to share their own journey with mental health, not
necessarily what they've gone through, but if their journey has
sort of rubbed off on those around them, or if
people would share maybe a story about their parents, if
they have gone, you know, to talk to somebody, you know,

(01:06:41):
if their parents are a part of sort of embracing
this idea of mental health and therapy and all those things,
because I think for my generation and younger, it's become
far more common to be a lot more open about
this right and generally speaking. Of course, I'm not here
to shame anybody who hasn't gotten to that point yet
or whatever the case may be, but I know it's

(01:07:04):
far more common for my generation younger, whereas you know,
our parents' generation still I think has a bit of
that stigma. So I'm curious if anybody has had any
sort of breakthroughs or has had any instances where their
parents have still have old opinion about mental health or
have begun to embrace it. So that's sort of the
question for today's show. I don't have a lot of times.

(01:07:26):
I'm just gonna try to get to a couple here
at Growing with Sin says I actually influenced my friend,
who's a total toxic module man to.

Speaker 1 (01:07:33):
Go to therapyell a big flex and that's amazing. I think.

Speaker 2 (01:07:37):
I think what people don't sort of realize is a
you can't you can't get people to do these things
before they're ready, Right, even if it's very obvious to
you that they would benefit greatly from from speaking to somebody,
you know, they have to be ready to want to
open up to someone, right. And I think sometimes the

(01:07:58):
sort of best practice is to just sort of share
your own journey, I honestsarily mean, it doesn't have to
be on social media per se.

Speaker 1 (01:08:05):
Right, If you want to, that's amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
If not, I understand, you know, sort of wanted to
keep it a little bit closer to the your chest,
if you will.

Speaker 1 (01:08:11):
I think it's the same.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
But I think what you'll be shocked at is when
people begin to see you growing, when they begin to
see you on your journey and how far you've come
and all that you are are learning, they will naturally
be inquisitive about it and inquire and want to get

(01:08:32):
more information, you know, and try and see the benefits,
you know, for themselves. So I think that's sort of
the beauty about healing as well, is the way that
impacts the people around you. I've definitely noticed that for
myself for sure, friends in my life or family, you know,
really sort of taking a bit more of an interest
in mental health and.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
At the very least being curious just because they've sort of.

Speaker 2 (01:08:53):
Seen all that's done for me on my journey.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
And let's see acts.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
But Gua Chkh seven three two says, I always try
to talk to my parents about it and convince them
to go, but unfortunately they don't seem open to it.
I get that, and they don't seem open to it
just yet. You never know where it's gonna end up.
But I mean I relate to that. My parents I
think could could benefit from some therapy just as anybody else,

(01:09:22):
and you know, they're not as receptive or open to
it as as I would love for them to be.
I think, you know that that's part of the journey, though.
I think I know for a fact though, like we
kind of touched on before, even with my own personal journey,
I know that it's had an impact on them and
definitely sort of open their their minds up to the

(01:09:45):
benefits of it or even just having their own reflections,
right because when I've expressed certain things that I've learned
about myself or my upbringing, it's definitely made them go
back and sort of revisit maybe their own or situations
in the in the past. You know, so like I
and said, there's still positive stuff happening there, even just
by proxy of them associating with me, who is somebody
who obviously believes in this stuff heavily. But I think,

(01:10:09):
you know, it's tough, and I think you got to
be patient at the end of the day, you know,
and you can't try and force these things. I think
people when they're ready, they'll do it, and maybe they
might never be ready, but you know, you just got
to try to be there for them as best as
you can and not get too frustrated. I think it's
tough once you get older, and a lot of people,
once they reach a certain age, feel like they're too

(01:10:30):
old to change or toold to try something new. You know,
they have these sort of blockers in the way. So
I think they struggle with that a little bit, and
we have to be empathetic to it. So, you know, obviously,
again I would love for people like my parents to
hop into therapy, and I'm still holding out hope, but
you know, I get why it's still weird for them,

(01:10:52):
right It's something completely different that they didn't grow up
around or grew up with so much stigma around.

Speaker 1 (01:10:57):
So I definitely understand it to a degree.

Speaker 2 (01:11:00):
But that said, thank y'all so much for participating in
our ask a Goodingo segment again at DJ drop us
on Instagram.

Speaker 1 (01:11:05):
Might be a part of these conversations.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
With that said, let's quickly tie everything we talked about
today in a neat little boat in a segment call
conclusion stew time.

Speaker 4 (01:11:14):
Coon.

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
I'll be quick on this because I know it's a
we're running a little bit longer. I want to try
to keep these episodes within like an hour.

Speaker 1 (01:11:25):
But yeah, I just I.

Speaker 2 (01:11:28):
Keep bringing these conversations to our platform here because I
just think we constantly at times need reminders that we're
not alone. But at the same time, I think it's
also important to highlight people from our community who are
doing the work, who are providing safe spaces for those

(01:11:49):
of us who are looking to heal.

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
You know, doctor Zae Sanchez is.

Speaker 2 (01:11:53):
You know a gift for that right And I think also,
you know, a lot of times, even if it's me
talking about mental health, it might sound different coming from her,
or maybe she brings about a different conversation or makes
the conversation shift in a different way that maybe now
impacts somebody you know differently. Than it would have when

(01:12:15):
they just heard me talking about it, or when they
heard it a year ago. Right, So I think these
conversations are needed to continue to happen. They're important specifically
when you talk about all the nuances of specifically our
community or bipod communities. There's a lot that goes into it,
and you know a lot of it is not covered
in general mental health conversations that we see in other places.

(01:12:35):
So that's why I love to continuously bring people out
here who are doing the work or are providing those
safe spaces, who are experts in that field, to hopefully
continue doing my part to destigmatizing it and people being
able to get the help that they, you know, need
and that we all need. Honestly, again, it's universal, Like
she said, you don't have to be in crisis to

(01:12:57):
go see a therapist.

Speaker 1 (01:12:58):
It's great to just have somebody to work through.

Speaker 2 (01:13:00):
I mean, even how I talked about at the beginning
of the episode, I like didn't want to admit I
was burnt out. Basically I was finding every excuse in
the book as to like why I just wasn't being
you know, my normal productive self, and I just had
to talk through with with somebody who is skilled at
sort of knowing how to get to the bottom of
feelings and conversations, you know. So that is sort of

(01:13:25):
the of course, the benefit of it, the beauty of
it is by the end of that conversation with my therapist, I,
you know, was able to come to a conclusion that
I already knew in my heart, but I was able
to kind of work through it with somebody to kind
of help me sort out a lot of the thoughts
of feelings I was going through, and then I can
create a positive sort of plan of action to give
myself back on track and alleviate some of that stress

(01:13:46):
that I've been feeling. So, you know, again, we don't
have to be at the darkest moments of our lives
to seek therapy.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
You know, we could just be wanting, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:13:56):
A a person who doesn't have a real like, you know,
opinion as to our life. Right Like, it's tough to
talk to family and things like that because they're biased.
But to have an unbiased sort of expert just speaking
to you about emotions, feelings and all that you're going through,
I think there's so much value in that at the

(01:14:17):
very least, So just beautiful stuff, suits, air beds, doing
the work.

Speaker 1 (01:14:20):
Those of you who are still defense, I can get it.

Speaker 2 (01:14:22):
Hopefully, Conversations like this one begin to or continue to
open your mind just a little bit to potentially talking
to somebody and you know, exploring what help might be
out there for you and whatever you're struggling with. So
love bringing these conversations to our community. I think they're
incredibly important. And yeah, thank you all for tuning in.
With that said, we will catch you on a Thursday
for our Thursday Trends episode of course.

Speaker 1 (01:14:44):
So then stay safe and I'll talk to you soon. Peace.

Speaker 2 (01:14:49):
Life as a Good and Goo is a production of
the micro Thura podcast Network and iHeartRadio