Gringo's Guide To: Toxic Self-Help Culture

Inspired by a recent article on Jay Shetty, Dramos deep dives into the self-help business and the toxic aspects effects of when people use the trauma of others as a means to get money and fame.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/ng-interactive/2024/feb/29/jay-shetty-self-help-empire

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
Let me talk about here we go.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
He said, you live in life as a ringo, where
you question when you fit in.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
Every time you mingle, they say you do this with not.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Ingo. Yes, hello, and welcome to another episode of Life
as a Gringo. I am dramos, of course, and man,
I hope you can can hear it in my voice.
I finally feel like a fucking human being again. Okay,
I am not sick, I am not dying of allergies.

(00:42):
I am well rested. It is a whole new day
over here in the studio. There's a full human being
coming to you from this microphone or looking into this
camera if you're watching the video version of the podcast.
We're here, man, first time in twenty twenty four, we
have arrived as.

Speaker 1 (01:03):
A full human being.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
It feels like or at least the first time in
a long time. So I'm incredibly excited to just feel good.
My dog is just doing his thing right now. If
you hear some background noise, he's rolling around the carpet.

Speaker 1 (01:17):
He's excited. We're just ready to go for today's episode.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
And I've been meaning to do this episode for a
minute now, talking about self help and.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
What it's become okay.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
And if you follow me on on social media, you
might have seen a video I had posted about Jayshetty
and this article from the Guardian that came out sort
of I don't want to say exposing him, but definitely
kind of pointing out how many of his claims, his

(01:57):
credentials were stretched.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
He stretched the truth just a little bit on his
story and may have stolen some content. We'll get into all.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
That, but to me, it kind of brought up a
larger conversation that I've been happening, you know, with people
in my life behind the scenes. I think some of
the members of the Just Be Social Club we've we've
had conversations about this as well, and it's just sort
of I think a side of the times where something

(02:32):
like self help is big business, where it is content
that gets a lot of engagement and follows, and you.

Speaker 1 (02:39):
Know a lot of these self help.

Speaker 2 (02:40):
Grouge Seddy being one of them, our people who have
now become celebrities in their own right. And it's an
interesting time period and I think it's an an age
old case study of what happens when you mix celebrity,
fame and money, how it begins to dilute something that
at point started in in a you know, a positive place.

(03:05):
It began with the intention of helping people and really
had a peer intention, and then began to get watered
down by fame and money.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
I mean, that's that's an age old story, right, And.

Speaker 2 (03:17):
I'm not disregarding or dismissing the entire self help industry
as a whole or its ability to, for lack of
better words, help people.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
Right.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
I've been, you know, changed in a profound way because
of self help content and books and programs and things
like that. I think there's a lot of value, but
you also have to sort of be weary of people
and also apply a bit of your critical thinking to say, Okay,

(03:50):
this works for me, this doesn't work for me. I
agree with this, I don't agree with this kind of
being able to take it, take from it what you
can write or what would makes sense for you, and
leave the other stuff behind. And I think a lot
of us are kind of really I think, missing some
of the deeper meanings and.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
Self help as well, or the deeper work that is needed.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
I think a lot of people get fed this sort
of McDonald's version and don't understand all of the work
that truly needs to go on if you want this
information to actually have a profound impact on your life
and not sort of just make you feel good in
the moment.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Type of thing.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
Right, So, just a larger conversation around self help, the
toxic entrepreneur bro culture that it's also sort of invited
in as well. We're going to touch on a few
different things, but I just wanted to have this conversation,
especially as somebody who I guess is to a degree
none for putting out inspirational content. I'm very weary of
calling my content self help or you know, even with

(04:50):
just be my quote unquote wellness brand, we call our
you know, we say we're not your mother's wellness brand.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Right.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
We want to distinguish ourselves from the no, because I
think the NORM has failed the vast majority of people
on the NORM has also left particularly our community and
communities of color, out of the conversation because there has
been this sort of cast system, and the figures that
have been propped up in said system don't look like

(05:19):
you or I or we'll kind of get into all that.
So I want to just give you a preface as
to what we're talking about. On today's show. So I'm
excited to bring you, like I guess, the first sort
of solo deep dive of the season selfishly and this
is me just as i'd love to typically do, get
some shit off by chest using the podcast and hopefully

(05:43):
I don't know, be of service in doing so as well.
So that's what we're doing on today's show. So without
further ado, let's first and foremost just dive into this J.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
Shetty thing self help as a whole. You know, let's
just talk about it.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
We'll do a deep dive as we always do in
a second when we call for the people in the back,
say a lot for the people in the.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
Say a lot for the people in the.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
Say a lot of the people.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
All right, So I want to start with this J.
Shetty article from the Guardian.

Speaker 2 (06:22):
I think that's just like a good launching place because
again I've been having these types of conversations, you know,
behind closed doors or with the members of our just
be social call. I think I've used the word snake
oil salesman to describe a lot of the people in
this industry. I've even been like trying to say, like,
you know, for me, I consider myself to be a

(06:45):
self help dude for people who hate self helped dudes.

Speaker 1 (06:47):
Basically, you know, like, I'm.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Really just on my journey and I'm documenting it and
I'm sharing information and a lot of it tends to
be self help because I'm growth or oriented, right, But
that's sort of my intention.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
And for me, self help has been such a game.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
Changer and something I discovered, you know, I think late teens,
early twenties, and really I think kind of helped me
out a lot in a dark period of my life.
And we'll kind of get to that and then you
hit this segment. But I personally have a have a
you know, an investment in this sort of content, this industry,
the idea of it, and that's what frustrates me when

(07:28):
I hear particular stories. And we'll start again with this
Ja Schetty one where The Guardian wrote kind of.

Speaker 1 (07:34):
A expose if you will, I would.

Speaker 2 (07:37):
It's not like I don't know, man, it's not a
hit piece and it's not like you're not I guess
you're exposing to a degree, but it's not like he
has some egregious you know, like history or something like that.
But I think it is it is worth noting, worth
talking about. So it's called Uncovering the Higher Truth of Jayshetty.
I'll link to it in the show notes. But essentially

(07:59):
throughout the course of the article, they go into moments
where he's exaggerated much of his story, or I guess
history as a whole has been exaggerated, right. Ja Shetty
is known as the dude who was a monk and
allegedly lived solitude and like disconnected from the world, and
then decided I need to go out and like share

(08:20):
this information with mainstream culture. I left the monk could
and jump right back into normal life type of thing.
What they say this article is though, that much of
Sheddy's spiritual education took place not in India but in
Watford in Orbitable orbital Orbital. I don't know what the
hell ward it's orbital town outside of northwest London.

Speaker 1 (08:40):
I don't know what the the what they mean by orbital.

Speaker 2 (08:44):
Maybe it's like a commuter town is what they would
call it where I'm from.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
But right outside of northwest London. They're saying that.

Speaker 2 (08:55):
His claims of like going to India living in I
believe it's called monastery. It's like you know, amongst the
monks in like Silence, they're saying that was fabricated.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
He visited India, but didn't.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
Stay out there for an extended period of time, and
most of his work was done in India. And while
he would make these claims of sort of being like disconnected.

Speaker 1 (09:14):
From technology, the world didn't speak.

Speaker 2 (09:17):
I think he even talked about being depressed at one
point when he sort of came back into the real
world and had to readjust they're saying that was that
was a lie. He was actually posting content on YouTube
at the time, I believe, while quote unquote in his
sort of monk hold days, so he wasn't really disconnected
from the world. He had plenty of access to technology

(09:38):
and was using the internet started to build his personal
brand while he was supposedly this monk in in you know,
in Silence or whatever. Right now, some of the more
kind of gross claims are that he was actually also
stealing people's content. And I did see on TikTok there
people going hard when this first came out, was side

(10:00):
by side comparisons, and it was him regurgitating other people's
content and not crediting and kind of claiming it as
his own original content, be it quotes, be it sort
of observations about the world. He was posting these things
as if they were his and throughout the course of
the article.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
It's also interesting to me, a.

Speaker 2 (10:21):
They Jaysha's lawyers or you know, refute certain claims and
things like that within the article. But what the article
does is it actually references like specific links or specific
pieces of content and then shows that it was taken
down after the Guardian you know, reached out to Jayshetty
or or after the Guardian had posted about it, like

(10:42):
those links are being scrubbed from the internet basically, So
if you've got nothing to hide, why are you scrubbing
shit like that? That's first and foremost, you know, you
know rule one oh one here. If you are not cheating,
why are you deleting text messages type shit? Right, That's
it's just like it's obvious you try to hide something here, right,
So that is is sort of to me. I look

(11:04):
at that, and Okay, this is a person who was
sort of very much intentionally trying to build a personal brand,
which listen, there's nothing wrong with that. And as we
sort of like fast forward to where he is now,
it's like, oh, he really like wanted to be a
celebrity and this self help lane was his route to

(11:27):
being a celebrity.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
And you kind of see it. He was the person
who uh.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
Not like the preacher, but like he did he did
j Lo and Ben Affleck's wedding.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
He was the one who married them. And I don't know, man.

Speaker 2 (11:45):
To each their own, but like stuff like that, it's like,
what do you it's listen, I'm trying to like put
myself in. I don't know if it's his shoes or whatever.
I just think this is my whole thing, and I'm
gonna be kind of bouncing around as I have these thoughts.

(12:06):
But my whole thing is this. This isn't like you're
an actor. You're creating entertainment or even a musician creating entertainment, right,
and or you're just a content creator who creates something
of entertainment value. Yeah, Like, there's gonna be celebrity, there's
gonna be fame that comes along with it.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
That's a part of it.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
And while I think celebrity and fame are nothing to
be overvalued, I get it. Certain people want to be
famous and they find their avenue for being famous. My
gripe with that in a real sense when it comes
to self help is.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
You're doing so at the expense.

Speaker 2 (12:49):
Of other people's trauma, right, Like, I don't want my
trauma or my depression, my need for help and information
to be your quick rich, you get quick, your get
quick rich, you get rich quick scheme. I don't know

(13:10):
why that took me so long to get out, and
I'm gonna keep it real. We're not gonna edit that
out in the podcast, keep it raw here.

Speaker 1 (13:16):
I don't want my trauma to be your get rich
quick scheme. I don't know why. That's a mouthful.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
And that's that's I think where we begin to enter
this gray area, right because listen, he's allowed to create
its personal brand.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
He's allowed to want to be a fucking celebrity if
that's what he wants.

Speaker 2 (13:32):
Cool, but it feels a bit dirty when it's done
on the backs of people who are trying to find
meaning in their life or trying to get through a
particularly difficult moment in their life. And I think when

(13:53):
your intention, and again I'm not in his head, but
from the outside looking in, seems like your intention was
to go viral, was to be famous, was to be
amongst celebrities because pretty much, you know, from what I
see on the internet.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
You know, I used to casually listen to this podcast.
I have it in a while, but you know, he
interviews a lot of.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
Random fucking celebrities, like you know, once once it crossed
into like interviewing the Kardashians, it's kind of like, yeah,
what what are you really trying to do here? And
I understand to play Devil's advocate. One argument could be
made that the Kardashians have an audience that now is
going to be exposed to somebody who is potentially, you know,

(14:33):
giving out self help information that that that there's value
in that. Sure, and to that degree, I think somebody
like Jayshti does have value in that. But I think
for me, not as the casual self help enthusiast, but
as somebody who truly wants to create profound change in

(14:53):
their life and wants profound change and healing for the world.

Speaker 1 (14:57):
I do have to side I a.

Speaker 2 (14:59):
Little bit when I see him in general and kind
of just see the celebrity approach to.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
It, and.

Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yeah, it's gonna be one of those things where it's
it's somewhat hypocritical, I think at times for me with
you know, maybe my lifestyle or whatever it might be.
But I think there's a line, you know, like for me,
and that's making it so all about me, but for
me because I'm trying to like work it out in
my head of like where I think we begin to deviate,

(15:31):
where we begin to go wrong, right, Like for me,
getting into inspiring people, and I've always been doing those
things and wanting to help people.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
I've done that before I had a platform to do.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
It, you know, I can remember, you know, even in
my twenties, I had like a record label and lifestyle brand,
but like it was very much in line with this
kind of stuff where I was like really trying to
be somebody who brought others together, brought community, other creatives,
and to inspire them to not give up, to keep working,
you know. And that was something I was doing on
a small level in New Jersey and New York, you know.

(16:05):
But I think for me, how I rationalize it all
in my head, the inspirational content.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
Or the self help, the wellness, those kinds of things, Like.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
I'm not looking at that as my main business or
my main source of income, right I'm just looking at
it as a part of my duty, and more than
just duty, a blessing that I've gotten to do the

(16:42):
things that I love to do for a living, and
I want to in some ways somehow share that immense
amount of love and happiness that I feel doing those things.
I want to share it with other people and try
and inspire them to recreate it in their own way.
At the same time, I've also been through some shit,

(17:04):
and I know I felt so alone for so long,
and I want to let people know you're not alone
in your suffering or your hardships or your experiences. Right now,
of course, I've gotten paid to do speaking engagements, right
The Just Be Social Club has a paid aspect of

(17:28):
it because of course our time, energy, and literal investments
that we've made into it all come at a cost.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
But I'm not doing it.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
With the intention of like this is my one big
business idea, this is my pathway to fame. This is
where celebrity is coming into play, and that I think
is this sort of difference. And we'll talk about like
pricing and things like that, because like you know, for me,
it's like, how do I make this as accessible as
possible while not spreading myself too thin.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
Right, So we'll get into that because that's kind of
the next thing I'll talk about when it comes to
money and things like that.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
But I think when I see people like Jay Shetty
or even like somebody like like Lewis Howes, I've said
this a bunch behind the scenes, and I've kind of like,
I don't.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
Want to sound like a hater, but.

Speaker 2 (18:21):
Like they create these these these stories as it means
to be the vehicle to sell you on why you
should spend your money with them. Like their business is
in the business of selling people hope or dreams or whatever.
Right like Lewis Howe's, you know, former pro athlete turned
lifestyle entrepreneur? What is a lifestyle entrepreneur? Meaning you just

(18:45):
make up random shit and sell it to people. You
give them, you know, this regurgitated information package it and
sell it to them.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
That's literally what your business model has been.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
You didn't know what type of business you want to start,
and you sort of self help business. And that's what
I mean where it's like when you started, you know,
with the intention of selling people self help rather than
you just sort of began living life and by proxy,
people began to be drawn to you because you were
just trying to put good energy out there and share

(19:16):
game and things like that. And then from there you
were like, Okay, I have to be compensated for my
time in some sort of way. How do I find
the healthy balance? To me, that's a more admirable pathway.
But these people, when you look at it, you know,
Jay Shetty included because when they talk about the content stuff,
you know, he was very much obviously trying to create

(19:37):
this brand and then be able to profit off of
it while stealing people's content, which is like the scary part.
And he was also also like he was apparently using
like interns from one of the religious groups like that
he was affiliated with, and like telling them that this

(19:58):
was work for the religious group. Really it was really
just work for his personal brand. There's a few different
things in that story that you're kind of just like,
it feels a little dirty, but there's a gray area.
I hope, I hope I'm clearly getting to that gray
area of what it means right when your intention is

(20:18):
solely like this is your next big business idea, that's
when it's dirty.

Speaker 1 (20:22):
I think.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
That is is what I think a lot of people
are doing in today's current date age, and also even
just for likes and follows, right, that's I think it's
the same type of shit, and self help is big business, right,
and that also rubs me the wrong way a bit.
All Right, we're gonna take a quick break here. I
got to obviously a lot more want to get into.

(20:45):
But we'll take a little pause here or take a
quick break, and then we'll be right back. All right,
we are back now. I have numbers here where they
say the market size for self help globally in twenty
twenty three was forty one point two billion dollars, so
it's a forty one point two billion dollar industry globally.

(21:05):
In twenty thirty two, they're projecting that the market size
it's going to be an eighty one point six billion
dollar industry. So it's only growing, it's only becoming more profitable.
And I think what happens with that it begins to

(21:27):
become profitable at the expense of the people who need
it most, and it becomes inaccessible to those who need
it most. And that's what I'm fearful of as well,
because you have something like twenty Robbins right, And I
was just kind of digging around a little bit.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
Tony Robbins is like one of the bigger self help people.

Speaker 2 (21:47):
And in the world. Right, He's been that way forever.
He used to even have fucking CDs that are like
most motivacial CDs. That's how long he's been.

Speaker 1 (21:54):
Doing this for.

Speaker 2 (21:55):
But apparently, from what I can find on the interwebs,
he charges anywhere from twenty five hundred to ten k
to hear him speak at a seminar, and allegedly there's
also a platinum ticket that is seventy thousand dollars, which,
if I'm not mistaken, gets you access, I think, to
all the seminars, so you can travel around and become

(22:16):
a Robin's Head, kind of like the Deadheads follow and
around a concert. Bro this is a lot of fucking money.
Twenty five hundred is still a lot to just sit
in a conference room for a day or two amongst
thousands of other people just to hear him speak. Ten
K obviously is a hell of a lot of money
as well. Seventy k wild And I think what's interesting

(22:38):
about these numbers, And I'm not trying to shame anybody
who's invested in themselves and done these things. I'll get
to how I've done the same thing. I've spent thousand
dollars on a particular program. What I've recognized, though, is
this becomes a cast system, the haves and the have nots.
And I think it's also why you don't see many

(23:02):
people who look like you and die.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
And that's about traditionally. I know social media has kind
of helped this a lot, but traditionally it's why you
don't see people who look like you and die in
the world of self help.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
Because many of us didn't grow up with inexpendable ten
thousand dollars to spend a ticket to hear.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Some man speak right.

Speaker 2 (23:27):
And even if the information is great, there's been mixed
reviews I've seen online.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
I've also heard from personal people that it was life changing.

Speaker 2 (23:37):
Sure, but again, when you're charging that much money, those
who are really down and out are not going to
get this information. And again, I think that's why our
community has been left out of the conversation for so long.
That's sort of I feel like part of my life's
work in what I'm doing with Just Be.

Speaker 1 (24:01):
Is I've been fortunate enough.

Speaker 2 (24:06):
To discover a lot of really valuable information at an
early age and gone through a lot of the work
of applying it. Still continue to go through the work,
and I think I'm good at articulating it in a

(24:27):
way that maybe speaks to people who normally wouldn't get
that information. I always say my greatest gift is observation
awareness and then the ability to articulate, like that's my
talent in this life, My God given talent, I think
is that. But I'm doing it with a genuine purpose

(24:51):
in mind. And I would you know and quote me
on this in ten years, you know, when this is
the big podcasts in the world. I don't want to
be charging people ten thousand dollars a ticket to come
here and me speak at a seminar. That still sounds
crazy to me. To me, the people who have the

(25:14):
ten thousand dollars, and this is excluding those who take
out loans.

Speaker 1 (25:19):
Because there's stories about that.

Speaker 2 (25:20):
There are people who go into debt, take money out
of their pension to go and attend these things. I
believe there's even from what I've heard it. I don't
know Tony Robbins specifically. I've heard of different ones where
they even have because they'll upsell you at the end
of it, like, oh, you got to join this next program,
you gotta level up, and this.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
One's extra money.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
And they'll have like credit card companies right there that
are going to give you a credit card so you
get into credit card debt to join their next program.
It's like a Pyramids game basically. But again, anybody who
didn't have to go into massive, notunt of debt for this,
they are already in a privileged position where they can
spend thousands of dollars to sit in a room for

(26:01):
a day. Most of us can't do that. Most of
us didn't grow up being able to do that. And
for me, I would never be able in good conscience
just cater to that audience. That's for me, because I

(26:22):
know I have people follow me or people i'm cool
with that run different programs, coaching proms whatever to each
their own. For me, where I stand, that's where I'm at.
Even if I could get away with charge the ten
K ticket, it wouldn't feel right to me. But again,
Tony Robbins has made self help his entire business model

(26:45):
essentially right. And for me, that's why I would never
make self help by entire thing because then to me,
it waters it all down, because then it's like, fuck,
I have to now turn this into an incredibly profitable
business in order for me to live the life I
want to live for me.

Speaker 1 (27:04):
I don't want.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
I don't want to put that pressure on this because
I want to keep it as pure as possible. And
I think that is the sort of line, the fine
line that has to be walked here. When this is
your core business, you're inevitably going to have to become

(27:26):
a shrewd business person in some sort of way, charging
people ten thousand dollars the ticket essentially, and again that
creates this cast system. Those of us who can't afford
that aren't getting access to the information.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
Because these are.

Speaker 2 (27:47):
And you know, I'm gonna the information is obviously out
there for anybody who wants it. Right, Let's play devil's advocate.
Let's play both sides of the fence here. Because other
people would be like, well, you could just go.

Speaker 1 (27:57):
On line and find these things. You're absolutely right. There
is something different.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
When you have a more intimate access to ask questions,
when you're in a room full of other like minded people.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
Right.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
I've noticed that in the master minds that we do.
It's a different type of energy, right, and there's a
value in that. I'm not taking away the value of
any of these programs or things like that, but again,

(28:35):
it comes down to access and for me, for me,
access is more important than anything else when it comes to.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
The this type of work.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
The access is what I'm I'm like, for me, like
why I post on social media and things like that,
It's like, I'm trying to just give people game, you know,
and I want as many people as possible to potentially

(29:16):
be able to access that. I want to share with
you all that I've been learning, and I think that's
what is important.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
And yeah, I'm losing my train.

Speaker 2 (29:31):
Of thought over here, because it's just like it's such
a fine fucking line between I feel like becoming a
snake oil salesman and getting compensated for your time, because
I genuinely do believe you should.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
Be compensated for your time. All of our time is valuable.

Speaker 2 (29:45):
But again, when you're trying ten thousand dollars or this
seventy thousand dollars platinum ticket, you're taking advantage of people's
chom at the end of the day, and.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
I think it's just also a sort of.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Moment to stop now or reflect a little bit when
we're having these conversations on check credentials, right, And this
is actually a little sense I would say, check credentials
when it comes to people like giving you, you know, opinions,
but check credentials in sort of the literal sense here
of like you have somebody like Jayshetty sort of selling

(30:26):
you on this false narrative, this false reason why he's
a person of authority.

Speaker 1 (30:32):
And I don't know Tony.

Speaker 2 (30:33):
Robbins's background person, I know he's got, you know, a
struggle story that's very similar to many other people in
his industry.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
I think when you get propped up.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
In that way of like, Okay, I'm the guru, I
also take issue in that because what I've learned and
maybe maybe I just suck it self help, or maybe
I am just chronically depressed beyond what these people are,
or maybe I've experienced trauma beyond what these guys have experienced.
So maybe I'm just fucked up here and broken right.

(31:10):
But for me, I've been doing work since my twenties
and we're talking about a decade plus at this point
of just being heavily invested in personal growth and work,
and I'm still figuring this shit out.

Speaker 1 (31:23):
Day by day. I'm not a fucking guru.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
I've read a ton of books, listen to the podcast
I've gone to programs, I've done the work, I've gone
a therapy for years and years and years. I'm still
figuring this out. I'm still fucking up every single day.
I would never feel comfortable being called a guru or
being propped up as somebody who has it all figured out.

(31:47):
I'm literally just telling you what I learned today, how
it worked for me, and I'm sharing that. I'm also
telling you I fucking feel like shit today. I feel depressed.
This is just part of the process. And like, that's transparency,
that's honesty at the end of the day, right, that's
that's just me being authentic. I'm not asking you to

(32:08):
prop me up as anything special. But a lot of
these guys, the way they come off is if they
have it all figured out. And I know at times
they'll have moments where they talk about like I was
fighting with my wife and I've discovered this blah blah, Okay, cool,
but like the thing that bothers me so much about
a lot of these things and like a lot of

(32:29):
the podcast conversations they have. These people talk as if
there is a finish line. They talk as if the
thing that they have figured out, they figured it out
and then they never had another fucking issue, you know,
a day in their life. That's what bothers me, like
the you know, like Mel Robbins and I'm a fucking
like taking shots out here. People are catching strays left

(32:51):
and right over here in the self help world. I'm
like the fifty cent of the self help world when
he was just going at rappers early in his career.
I don't want to be that way. I'm just having
it on as conversation with no filter. I like, I've
read bel Robins book. It was a lot of fluff,
but it was interesting five four three two one rules.
She's that lady where you're like, if you're like stuck,
you're like frozen, you're like in bed depressed, count up

(33:12):
five four three two one, and then just get off,
you know, get.

Speaker 1 (33:15):
Out of bed, basically like a rocket ship taking off right.
And then I honestly I applied that for a little bit.
It helped.

Speaker 2 (33:21):
Then I sort of my mind got tired of it
and al grew it. And stopped working. But when you
hear somebody like her talk, it's like, I.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
Fucking did this end? Now? My life is perfect.

Speaker 2 (33:32):
I've figured out. I have figured out this thing called life.
And it's like, bro, this is never ending. That works
for a year, now what you know? And again I'm
like generalizing here, I'm picking on people for the sake
of example. But it's this never ending work And I'm
not saying it's never any work where I'm like, the

(33:54):
work never ends.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
Sign up for our you know, fucking platinum package now.

Speaker 2 (33:58):
Like that, Like this is what I I'm fucking knocking
my microphone over here, if you're here on camera. I'm
getting real, I don't know, annoyed by by by the
way things are to a degree, I'm kidding. I'm really
becoming my dad, like a grumpy old man now.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
But what I'm saying is is like.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
This air of perfection and elitism that comes from a
lot of these people. And again that's me reading into
me having my own lens by which I view things.
Maybe that maybe I'm part of the problem.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (34:30):
Maybe you don't see it that way, and that's fine,
but I can't help but look at a lot of
these people in this world, and this feeling of elitism
that comes across or perfectionism or PERFORMANCESM right, And I've
I've been at talks before where I'm in real time

(34:51):
watching a snake oil salesman, And maybe that's jaden to
me a bit. I think I was a little bit
jaded before that. But like, I'm watching people.

Speaker 1 (35:01):
I did a talk where I was watching the organizers
have said talk just like perform. It felt incredibly inauthentic.

Speaker 2 (35:17):
It made me incredibly uncomfortable because it was like, I'm
watching these people put on a show of what they
think a self.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
Help speaker is supposed to look like.

Speaker 2 (35:29):
And again, it's not everybody that I've ever encountered or
worked with or whatever, but there was a couple in
particular that I was like, Bro, you are looking at
this as your next business venture. You are putting on
the costume of what a self help speaker is supposed
to do. You are doing your very best Tony Robbins impersonation.

(35:56):
And it's not only cringey and I'm not cringey, And like, oh,
you're being so authentic.

Speaker 1 (36:02):
It's cringey.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
You no like cringey like, bro, stop just stop trying
to fucking play this character and just be you. But
they're doing it with the intention of this is gonna
get me paid speaking gigs. I'll become even richer. I
could sell courses, which they already are, so create I
create this bullshit story, or if it's not even bullshit,

(36:23):
but I exaggerate my story into being something so dramatic,
or I exaggerate what I have figured out success wise
into being something so valuable that somebody's going to buy
my program, will invest with me. Right, And like a
lot of times they're talking about money.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
These guys are particularly like how I became the first
millionaire in my family. I don't know about y'all, but that's
that's cool.

Speaker 2 (36:45):
But I have other things to worry about right now, Like,
that's not that interesting to me. You becoming the first
millionaire in your family. Tell me about your personal life.
How is your personal life? Are you happy, sir?

Speaker 1 (36:55):
Right? Because your money is awesome? Cool? Money is great.
We all need it.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
But if that's what you're leading with, that's the one
thing you have to give to the world. Is like,
I'm gonna teach you how to be another rich guy.
Some some's off there, or you're just like inauthentically screaming
on the stage like you're Tony, Like, I don't know, man,
there's a lot of people performing doing impressions of other people.

(37:22):
That's what I'm saying. So to surmise all that I've
been talking about here.

Speaker 1 (37:28):
You just gotta be weary of this world that we're in.

Speaker 2 (37:38):
And I don't mean to be pessimistic or to fucking
taint it for anybody, but a lot of people aren't
who they say they are. It's the same shit with celebrity.
We should never be propping people up as perfect, and
anybody that tells you on the idea that they are perfect,
they have it all figured out. Run in the complete
opposite direction of them. I guess that's my thoughts as well.
And it don't get me started on like the trend

(38:00):
of like reposting quotes and things like that.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
Unless I'm a quote junkie, I'll repost quotes all day,
every day.

Speaker 2 (38:07):
But so many people don't realize it's more than just
a quote that makes you feel validated in the moment.
What do you do with that information? Dig deep, do
the work. It's ongoing, never ending work.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
That sucks. It is painful.

Speaker 2 (38:21):
Right Just when you fucking think you've reached the mountaintop,
you get thrown back down on the other side of
the hill. That's what fucking self help is in real
like in in in real practice. It's not sexy. Right again,
I've read all the fucking books. Basically, I've done a
lot of the work. I continue to do the work.
I just crawled out of being like depressed for the

(38:46):
last couple of weeks, basically combination of being sick but
also being depressed. And I've done so much fucking work
and it continues. It's cycles. I'm not gonna tell you otherwise.
I don't have it figured out. I'm just talking to
you honestly as a human being who's trying his best.

(39:07):
Hopefully you get something out of it. But I'm doing
this genuinely because this makes me feel good to know
that I can connect with people and share this information.
And I feel like when I see other people like
this doing it inauthentically, I feel dirty for even just
like associating myself in this world in general. And obviously

(39:29):
these guys are far more successful than I am and
have you know, far bigger followings.

Speaker 1 (39:33):
Right.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
It's not like, you know, we're being spoken about in
the same breath or anything like that.

Speaker 1 (39:42):
But I just hate that they cheap and andn taint something.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
That I hold so dear to my heart and that
I personally believe in it so much.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
I think that's what my point is, and.

Speaker 2 (39:51):
The way we've social media has watered it down so
much that people think because they read a couple of
books that, like, you know, problems Solved type of thing,
post a quote where they weaponize self care just to
be an asshole, basically like, oh, self care might get
a jail free card to be selfish and not value
other people's time and energy. There's a lot of things

(40:13):
that go along with that. I'm gonna stop there because
I could go on a tangent. I don't want to
be negative, but I want to also share with you
a bit of my personal journey and how I process
all this stuff. Right, because I just gave you whatever
a half an hour of fucking me ripping into self help,
let's talk about my own relationship with as well. Does

(40:35):
that army hint that segment? But first to take a
quick break and then we'll be right back, all right,
So I know, I took over that last conversation a
little bit. It was supposed to be a deep dive

(40:56):
on self help industry, and I made it about me
a little bit up. I did want to go a
bit deeper in this segment and just give you a
bit about my background with self help, my relationship with it,
my thoughts I've arrived with the mindset that I have today, right,
and for me, I've been into self help since my
late teens, early twenties. I was depressed kid, just trying

(41:18):
to figure things out, right, And.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Yeah, I didn't realize how.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
Long I've been on this journey until like recently, I
was my parents called me basically like they come pick
up your shit in our basement or we're gonna throw
it out.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Basically. You know, anybody who's.

Speaker 2 (41:35):
You know, been out of the house for a little
bit eventually gets that phone call where your parents are
going to stop being your storage unit. So I had
to go pick up some stuff and see what I
wanted to throw away. And I found an old book
that I had bought that was a self help book.
And it's not like one of the classics signed anything profound,
I don't think.

Speaker 1 (41:55):
But I was really like blown away.

Speaker 2 (41:57):
I was like, man, I was, I was really like
in invested in all the things that I'm doing currently.
I was doing that years ago before I even really
knew what to call it, or sort of even though
I was on a journey essentially, right.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
And I think for me, that's probably why I have
sort of this personal relationship.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
And I feel so protective about self help as much
as I hate that word, because at one point it
was really all that I had, you know, before I
even started going to therapy, you know, and took that journey.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
It was like all I had were these.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
Kind of books and these pieces of information and music
from artists who you know, expressed going through depression.

Speaker 1 (42:46):
And things like that. You know, that's all I had
to sort of bring me comfort.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
And it comes from a very pure place for me
of not only is this information incredibly helpful and useful
for me in my life, but.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
My want to share it is.

Speaker 2 (43:19):
So ingrained in me because I don't want anybody to
feel as alone and as I did through some of
those darker periods in life, right, or the ones I
still experience from time to time. You know, this is
me giving back as much as I can and I
think that's sort of my own personal purpose, if you will, right,

(43:43):
and why I really hold this stuff so dear.

Speaker 1 (43:45):
To my heart.

Speaker 2 (43:48):
And it also now having this journey within my culture
finding myself you know, where I belong in my latinus right,
the bipod community, and have a level of awareness about

(44:11):
many of the issues that affect us and many of
the conversations that were not a part of I'm always
sort of looking around in the rooms that I'm in
now and saying, Okay, who looks like me, who looks
like they're from my background?

Speaker 1 (44:30):
Who could share my story? Whose voice sounds familiar? Right?

Speaker 2 (44:34):
And what I've found is a lot of times in
this space, I'm one of the only people there, sometimes
in the literal sense in the room or the figurative sense,
I don't have many other places to go to hear
this type of information.

Speaker 1 (44:49):
Right. That's why I did, you know, sort of.

Speaker 2 (44:54):
Faithfully love podcast like who Is Houses podcast? Because even
though I couldn't relate to this, you know, white guy
who is a jock? The information that was the only
place I could get it from, right, And now everything's
kind of been because the Internet in a beautiful way,
It's also diversified a lot. I now have a platform
to kind of get through my own thoughts and interview

(45:14):
people who I can gain information from.

Speaker 1 (45:17):
Which is beautiful.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
But again, for a long time, I just sort of
had to settle for what was available to me and
what was actually really profound for me. I talked about
the Hoffmann process a lot, right, the personal growth retreat
that I went away to probably almost three years at
this point, which is crazy, And I remember sitting there

(45:46):
looking around and man, I am the only Latin person here,
and there's not one Black.

Speaker 1 (45:59):
Person here.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
Aside from the people who worked there at like the
bed and breakfast they were Latin and black people who
worked at the better breakfast, but in the actual room
getting this help or teaching me, I was the only
a Latin person. There was not one black person, right,
And everybody.

Speaker 1 (46:21):
For the most part, were.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
From wealthy backgrounds doctors, tech.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
Industry, finance. That was basically it.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
That rounded out everything, right, And I like the preface,
I'm not judging for these are beautiful people that were
completely open to me.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
I love all those people, right.

Speaker 2 (46:46):
I have relationships with many of them that when we
see each other, it's all love and They're very supportive
of me, right, So I'm not saying this in a negative,
But what I'm saying is though obviously somewhere along the way,
the message didn't make it down to our community, right,

(47:07):
Because this is an incredibly popular program in the world
of self help in industries like tech, many people, many entrepreneurs,
have gone through this program and rant and rave about
how effective it is. So I begin to ask the question,
how has it not reached our community? And I think

(47:33):
much of the answers is sort of much of my gripe.
In general, it's the cost. At the time. I think
it was like between four and five thousand dollars to
do this retreat, which, in comparison to ten K to
sit in a conference room with a bunch of you know,
with a thousand other people, is a bargain because this
was like seven days of incredibly intense work, you know,

(47:57):
in the middle of the woods at a ben and
breakfast in Connecticut. Right, So it was a far more involved, uh,
you know program than the just going to a.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
Conference room at a local hotel. You know. Even with that,
I remember, I remember.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
The decision that it felt like to make that sort
of investment and of course they have payment plans and
things like that, but it was still a lot of money.

Speaker 1 (48:33):
It was like two payment plans.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
Right and I and and the the other thing I
want to bring up because I ended up doing this,
because I mean at that time, I definitely couldn't like it.
I you know, you have like some cash on hand,
but it's like that's really like digging deep into, you know,
my my savings. I was trying to buy a house
at that time too, but it was like I remember,
I was that was one of my darkest, most depressed

(48:56):
periods of.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
My entire life. So I was like, bro, I need
something drastic.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
Therapy is not working. The books, the podcasts aren't working.
Like people ran orrate about this shit. I gotta I
gotta figure this out. And it felt like life or death,
almost like dire, you know. And to their credit, they
offer a scholarship program. And I think the scholarship program
is like half the price. So it was like two
thousand dollars and you had to make under X amount.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
Of dollars in order to qualify for it.

Speaker 2 (49:25):
Luckily for me at that time, I did and I
was able to file for it and was able to
get in that way, right, And at that time, two
thousand dollars still felt a hell a lot of money.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
Shit still feel like that now.

Speaker 2 (49:36):
But you know, I remember talking to like the person
from like there, I guess the registrar's office at this thing,
and they were like, you should apply for the the scholarship.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
And what she told me, like again, was one of
those eye opening things now in.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
Retrospect, where she said, because most of the time, the
scholarship goes unused, and now collecting all the information, why
does it go unused? Because only a particular group of
people are aware that this exists or are inquiring to

(50:19):
find out more information. Only rich people, essentially are well
to do people, people who have money are aware of
this incredibly impactful program and have access to it financially,
or feel like it's a realistic thing for them that
they would even bother to inquire about, you know, what

(50:41):
payment options might be available.

Speaker 1 (50:47):
And that is.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
Really I think profound in what we're talking about, and
I think why our community has been left out of
these conversations. It's a lack of access to information, also
a lack of the finances needed to even.

Speaker 1 (51:05):
Be a part of a community of people.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
That would be aware that something like this exists, right,
because again, it's incredibly popular amongst doctors, amongst the tech industry.
Why is that because they're all doing it, they all
have the means to do it, so they're having conversations
amongst one another about it, and the information is spreading
in their said communities. We don't come from backgrounds where

(51:28):
our parents push therapy or self help or you know,
coaching programs. They weren't aware of it, and they didn't
have the fucking means to do it. They probably believe
it was like Bluehadiyah, right. So combined with all of
that and not being financially able to be a part
of these things, it didn't make its rounds in our community.
And at the same time, the figureheads have said of
these programs, of these movements, writing the books, you know,

(51:51):
putting out the motivational CDs and things like.

Speaker 1 (51:55):
That, were white people, right.

Speaker 2 (51:58):
They didn't look like us, So we weren't paying it
as much because they weren't really speaking to us directly, right.
And I think that is where a lot of the
disconnect has has happened. And for me, that is where
I fall as like ma'am, I love self help. It's

(52:19):
resonated so much for me. I need to give this
valuable information back to my community, and I'm trying to
like explain my methodology, and maybe I'm also trying to
like validate that I'm not one of these these sort
of snake oil salesmen. Right, I've tried to do so,
I guess subconsciously. Now I'm trying not to sound like

(52:42):
an infomercial for what I do as well. I'm just
trying to like really give you insight into my head
into what I do. But like that's really what to
just be social club has become is like how do
I give this information to people who look like me,
who have maybe never been exposed, or are looking for
deeper connection within a community, all those things. How do
I do it in a way where I don't become
one of those people? This is my struggle, I guess,

(53:04):
this is what I'm trying to express. This is my struggle.
How do I do it in a way where my
time is being utilized well and I'm valuing it, but
I don't want to become one of those people who
makes it inaccessible to those who I feel like really
needed the most, you know, and that's what we've been
struggling with. And I'll be completely honest and transparent. You know,

(53:27):
we did like the first Mastermind group for the Just
Be Social Club. It was free for a year. You know,
we would get together and like it was you know,
there was no charge whatsoever.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
It was just you know, really giving back.

Speaker 2 (53:39):
And the second one, you know, we did it at
like I think it was seventy seven dollars a month
and you get like one on one, so all these
different things, and it's like I'm seeing the impact people
it's having on people's lives and things like that. And
then you know, meeting with other coaches and other people,
we started drinking the sauce a little bit.

Speaker 1 (53:58):
I'll be one hundred percent who laid was.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Flowing, and we were like, oh, we're going to charge
you know whatever, one thousand dollars for you know, for
a couple of months of it.

Speaker 1 (54:09):
Blah blah blah. And I remember people were even like
that's too low, But I was like a thousand bucks.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
There's a lot of fucking money to be charging somebody
who is just trying to get their shit together, you know.
And I think it was a thousand or something like
that whatever it was, and I had to have my
own reckoning where I was like, let's let's slow this
ship down a little bit. Here, you are setting yourself up,

(54:34):
even if people are willing to give you that money,
you're setting yourself up to now.

Speaker 1 (54:38):
Be only speaking to a certain group of people. You
are bringing yourself.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
Further away from your real purpose and intention by having
that price point, and myself and brand who's my business
partner and also a coach, we had to have that
real conversation, what are we more invested in creating this

(55:11):
business or really helping and speaking to our community and
helping to create profound change in their lives. Which one
are we really focused on? And obviously we came to

(55:32):
the conclusion that we're really just trying to help our community.

Speaker 1 (55:35):
And then it says, okay, how do we do that.

Speaker 2 (55:37):
In a way that is fair to us and our
families and our obligations outside of this. How do we
make sure that we are sort of honoring the time
that's going to be invested in it while also making
sure that it is accessible to anybody who needs it
and wants to be a part of it. And that's
sort of the balance that we're at right now, And

(56:01):
maybe this entire conversation that I'm having with you on
this podcast is me talking to myself and sort of
I don't know if it's justifying to myself or reminding
myself that you are not one of those people. You

(56:21):
are not the snake oil salesman. You are not trying
to take advantage of people. Your heart is in the
right place and you're qualified to lead by example. And
at the same time, your time is worth something. But

(56:46):
you are doing everything from a purpose driven place rather
than a exploitative, monetary, business driven place. I just need
to get all this out of my head and like
journal it out verbally to remind myself of all that. Yeah,

(57:10):
and I'm I don't know. I hope there's nobody like disappointed,
Like I just sat through whatever an hour of this
just for him to like have his own comfort Jesus moment,
but or to validate why he's not a snake oil
sales But I don't know this, This is these are
real thoughts people, This is this is my real trade
of thought. But for me, like again, I'm not trying

(57:33):
to make it infovertial, but like I want to give
everything I've ever been looking for, Like, this is community,
what we're what we're doing, what we're trying to do, right,
I want to like, I want to give people access
to like, you know, potential collaborations. If you're a creative,
you can collaborate with somebody like creating just bringing people together,
creating this hub. But we can all virtually meet up,

(57:57):
talk about life, share experience, to share our journey, share
the ups and downs, what's worked, what has it, you know,
give each other feedback your real time on our work,
and and be a positive force to help up, you know,
uplift each other when we need it. To connect people
together who have like minds, who potentially can go off
and build something together, you know.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
Like that's what I'm trying to to.

Speaker 2 (58:18):
Really bring actual value to our community, specifically speaking to
bipop communities, people of color.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Right, That's that's.

Speaker 2 (58:26):
Sort of the work within this whole thing as somebody
to talk about. We're gonna launch it in April. End
of April is the goal for the next round of it,
and of course it's going to be accessible to everybody.

Speaker 1 (58:39):
But yeah, that's that's I guess where I am on it.

Speaker 2 (58:43):
And again for me, it's like just be is a
passion project more than anything, you know, And I will
never say, like, you know, this is my my business idea.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
I get rich business.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
Ideas that I'm gonna you know, use as as my
means to live this sort of financially free life. Like now,
It's just one of the things that I do that
I'm incredibly passionate about, you know, and I try to
make sure that I'm valuing my time in the form of.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
You know, getting something.

Speaker 2 (59:21):
Out of it aside from the spiritual sense, but but
also you know, getting something out of it for the
hours that I'm putting into it. But again, it's like
I'm never gonna gonna say, hey me trying to be
somebody's guru, is you know, my I'm your I'm the guy,
and this is my business. And let me tell you,
you know, a bunch of bullshit things and on all
these things, I'm not.

Speaker 1 (59:41):
Gonna put that kind of pressure because I don't want
to cheap in it. You know. I think I'm just
talking in circles at.

Speaker 2 (59:46):
The end of the day, and I think one thing
I want to I want to end on this right.
One thing that's been really helpful for for me in
the self help world, particular.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
When it was.

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
Overrun by people who didn't look like you and I
white people, right, And I've always used this in anything,
any sort of piece of information.

Speaker 1 (01:00:18):
It's a filter by which I listen and read with.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
I don't just take everything that they say for everything
I hear or read and apply it to my life blindly.
I take what resonates, I take what makes sense for me,
and I filter out the rest. Write whatever resonates, I
listen whatever doesn't, I ignore. And that's why I say,

(01:00:49):
even somebody like Jayshtty still has value for me. I
can watch as a clip on TikTok and take something
from it. If it's a message that touches where I'm
at in my life or something I needed to hear,
I resonate with, right. But I'm not gonna go beyond that, right,
because I don't. It just superficially resonates with me. I
can move on to the next thing even with me like,

(01:01:10):
I never want anybody listening to what I do to
sort of be like your Bible and be like, you
know your rule of life, and you don't question anything
I say. You don't question my methodology because I'm constantly.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
Changing and adjusting.

Speaker 2 (01:01:28):
I'm giving you the information based upon who I am
right now and what I think makes sense, but that
could change tomorrow based upon new information that I get,
you know, new experiences. I'm constantly evolving and changing, just
like anybody else. So you know, it takes critical thinking.
You know, it's just like The Secret, like the book
and the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
It's like if you just blindly like.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
Watch that, it didn't have any critical thinking, you might
be a little bit inspired, but like you're not really
getting practical advice. You kind of have to like read
between the lines of what they're saying and what applies
to you is like, yeah, I want a million dollars.
I'm not going to sit in my mailbox taking the
checks in coming for no reason, right, Like, that's just
not how it works. I know, Okay, I get the concept.

(01:02:12):
I have to think it's feasible that I can actually
make a million dollars. So then now, with that belief system,
how can I create an idea that can eventually get
me a million dollars? Then that check comes to the
mail right. But it's a little bit of critical thinking,
a little bit of action, a little bit of deciphering
what's really being said, throwing away the fluff, and getting
to a place of what makes sense for you. I
think that's what we have to look at when it
comes to self help and not sort of just blindly

(01:02:36):
follow everything and prop.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
These people up as like a holier than thou, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
And I think that's sort of the crux of it all.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
Now, with that said, I've talked a lot. Let's listen
to you. What do you have to say about self help? Right?

Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Well, we'll get to that and ask a getting go segment,
but first to take a quick break and then we'll
be right back.

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
Ask question.

Speaker 2 (01:03:08):
All right, So I simply asked people on my Instagram
at DJ Dramos, if you want to be a part
of these conversations, and.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
I simply ask what are your thoughts on self help? Good?
Bed ugly? Would have been your experiences?

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
I'm gonna read a few responses that I got at
calidot boy dot auth says self help media is great,
self help guru sounds like a money grab like everything.
Just take it in moderation. I couldn't have said it
better myself. The content is great, the information is great,
the people questionable and you can't prop them up. And

(01:03:44):
I love that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
Just like anything else. Take it in moderation.

Speaker 2 (01:03:47):
Take from it what makes sense for you, what you need,
what feeds you in that moment, and that's it. Don't
over obsess, overthink things. Just get the value from it
and apply it to your life.

Speaker 1 (01:03:58):
Take action.

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
That's probably the most important part some of the things
that you're learning at Miss alex Jay says, I like
self help info is the same, but the way someone
says it can hit differently.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
And yes, I love.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
This as well. This sort of speaks to why it's
important to have people who sort of speak your language,
so to speak. You know, that's kind of redundant right there,
but it resonates a bit differently. When somebody puts their
own interpretation based on their own experience, they might be
similar to yours. And again, I think this is where
people like Jay Shetty are impactful, right because he is.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
This good looking dude, right, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Got suave accent, you know, and I'm sure for a
lot of people who are from his background He's Indian,
you know, it's nice to see a different face. I mean, obviously,
like the idea of Buddhism and monk culture and wellness
have been long grained in Indian culture, but in the

(01:05:04):
mainstream again it's people like Tony.

Speaker 1 (01:05:05):
Robbins that have been propped up.

Speaker 2 (01:05:07):
So yeah, I think even for me initially seeing somebody
like Jay Shehtdy rise to this sort of level of
being up there in his face, being all over the place,
it was a bit comforting to see a different type
of face in there, somebody speaking a bit more like
a normal person, younger, you know, those types of things.

(01:05:27):
So yeah, it does hit differently from different people. That's
sort of what I talk about, what I'm talking about
as well.

Speaker 1 (01:05:31):
Where it's like.

Speaker 2 (01:05:33):
For me, that's why it's important to gain this information
and not to hoard it, but to then like, you know,
share it with anybody who wants to hear it, because
I know I have a way of delivering it that
is going to be different than.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
You know, Tony Robbins or whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I think I'm obsessing over this guy, but you know,
for this taking example, so I definitely agree with that.
At Emmy j M says necessary evil at times, especially
when people are few.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Used to hear you or see you. Yeah, I think
that's it's an interesting way to look at it necessary evil.
That's that's it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
I think that's that really speaks to how I don't know,
uh inauthentic. A lot of the content has become that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:22):
It feels like a necessary evil. But I get what
you're saying, especially you said that people don't hear you
or see you. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:06:27):
I think for me, I grew up feeling like I
wasn't being heard or seen. And hearing others share of
vulnerability or even just acknowledge that things like depression were
real or things that was feeling were real and giving
advice on them made me feel comforted and I guess
seen as a result. So even you know, when I

(01:06:48):
joked about like those those quotes on social media that
people were like, well, just haphazardly repost. Sometimes that's just
what you need though, right, It's like, yeah, this is corny,
and the person that posted it is an absolute mess
of a human being. But that quote resonating me with

(01:07:12):
me in that moment, and I needed to hear.

Speaker 1 (01:07:15):
I don't know a.

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
Bit of inspiration about the struggle right to know that
the struggle is a part of the process.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
I just need that reminder today.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
Right, So again, I think there's probably a part of
us that are are almost nauseated by being inundated with
a lot of positive and self help content. But once
we get past the ick or the cringe, we're like, yeah,
but this is actually really good fucking information as well. Right,
So it's like, you know, maybe part of it is
we're in our own way as well, we're overfaking it

(01:07:43):
as a result of some of the characters within this world,
if you will.

Speaker 1 (01:07:48):
But yeah, well said, that's.

Speaker 2 (01:07:50):
It for our ask a getting segment again at DJ
Dramas on Instagram, going to be a part of these conversations. Now,
with that said, let's tie everything we talked about today
in a neat little bow. And second we call conclusions too.

Speaker 1 (01:08:02):
Time for conclusion, all right. I rambled for way too
fucking long.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
I literally did not expect to get into this long
of a conversation around this, but I guess I need
to get some shit off my chest and speak to
to inner dramas a little bit as well. And yeah,
I don't know, I care about this stuff, man, It's
like it's it's changed my life. This information has set

(01:08:33):
me off on a journey that I know has redirected
the course of my life, right. I look around at
many people that I grew up with, and not to
say that they're like their lives are all in shambles
or anything like that because they didn't get to self help,
But I look around and I'm like, man, my life

(01:08:58):
is completely different than a lot of theirs because I
went and dove into this information that at the time
was considered weird or left of center or niche right.
And I don't think I would be living the life

(01:09:19):
that I'm living now if it wasn't for things like
self help, because I think in those moments where I
felt alone and unsupported, I was able to turn to
that content, that information, those quotes, those books, and they
gave me just enough fuel to keep on going, I think,

(01:09:42):
And that's incredibly important when you're doing hard work like
healing or trying to believe in yourself or to get
out of your own way. You just need those little pushes.

Speaker 1 (01:10:03):
Along the way.

Speaker 2 (01:10:03):
And for me, the self help content stuff, the documentaries,
it was all I think important parts of my story
that kept me writing my story, if you will, so,
I am incredibly protective about it, and I think I

(01:10:26):
get a bit frustrated when you have people getting into
this who are business first? Help second? That mindset is
I think what rubbed me the wrong way because I

(01:10:51):
know for me, I truly want to help people, and
then just creates this sort of weird dialogue of life.

Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
But am I one of these types of people? Now?
You know, the people who are trying to.

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
You know, monetize the trauma of other people and stuff
like that. I'm just giving you a really honest conversation
when it comes to this stuff. Also, I don't want
to see people getting take advantage of it. Also, I
look around, I'm like, there's so much good information, even

(01:11:34):
from the people that I'm critiquing, and it's it's not
getting its way to our community. And that's frustrating to me.
And just like I explained with that retreat, I went
away too. It's like, man, this hasn't hasn't gone to
our community, hasn't reached us, and it's so fucking helpful,

(01:11:55):
it's so profound, But because it's in excess, or because
it's only popular amongst the privilege, it's not trickling its
way down to those.

Speaker 1 (01:12:06):
Who really need it or those who could really.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
Benefit from it. In so many ways, and not to
say you know, people have money, don't have problems.

Speaker 1 (01:12:17):
But for me personally, I guess so my life's work.

Speaker 2 (01:12:21):
I look at my community, I'm like, man, this could
be so huge for us if we collectively were adapting
a lot of these ideas. So yeah, I wish I
had like a good final sentence to really button this up,
but I just wanted to, I don't know, share my

(01:12:42):
thoughts on what's going on now and hopefully remind everybody
of why this stuff is so important, but also a
reminder of like, don't idolize anyone and don't feel like
you are broken just because the work is ongoing for
you because you have you don't see a finish line

(01:13:03):
in sight, because what they don't tell you is there
is no finish line.

Speaker 1 (01:13:07):
There is no you know, get fixed quick scheme.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
This is life. It's ups and downs. You fall off
the wagon, you get back on it. No matter how
many books you've read, how much therapy, all these things,
you're constantly learning, evolving, growing, failing, winning, It just it's ongoing.

Speaker 1 (01:13:28):
You're in pain, you're happy, it never ends. We're all
on that.

Speaker 2 (01:13:32):
Journey together, and anybody who tries to sell you on
anything otherwise it's just full of shit at the.

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
End of the day. I guess that's that's my closing thought.
With that said, thank y'all so much for tuning in.
I will catch you on Thursday for our Thursday Trends episode.
So then stay safe and we will talk soon. Where
is

Speaker 2 (01:13:56):
Life as a Good INNGO is a production of the
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