June 9, 2025 • 52 mins
Monday on 2 Pros and a Cup of Joe, the Thunder bounce back as expected with a defensive shutdown of the Pacers. Jon Gruden takes another step towards an NFL comeback. Plus, the Packers cut ties with Jaire Alexander while the Dolphins still try to find a trade partner for Jalen Ramsey. Aaron Rodgers’ 1-year contract and Russell Wilson’s departure may mean Tomlin’s days are numbered.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the best of two pros and a couple
Joe with Lamar airings and rating win and Jonas Knox
on radio.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
I gotta be honest with you, first of all, good morning,
Good morning. I got nothing from that game last night
in the NBA Finals that that that seemed like exactly
the way that game was gonna go. Yeah, and the
second Game one ended and Indiana won that game, Like
(00:36):
my mind completely focused on Game three. It was almost like, yeah,
we know what's gonna happen. All right, Oklahoma City is
gonna respond. They're a really good team, and then the
series is going to be tied, and then we turn
our sights to Indiana for Game three and then we
figured it out from there.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
That's what it felt, and I think that that's that's
the right approach. You knew that this was somewhat of
a backs up against the wall type of game for OKCUH.
They responded, well, I didn't think that they would cover
the ten point spread.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
What was it like ten and a half?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I believe it was eleven or eleven and a half
when I when I submitted my you know deal, it
was at ten and a half, I believe, And I
said you know what, okay See will win. They will
hit the over the game, will hit the over on points,
which I believe it did, but I was I was
incorrect on them covering, So give them a lot of credit.
(01:29):
They bounced back. You know, Sga is a beast. He
does what he's going to do. It's a matter of
is he going to get you know, his help. You know,
Jay Williams contributed. Caruso showed up last night. He contributed,
(01:51):
and it wasn't just on the defense side. He gave
them points. But I think the tail of the tape. Honestly,
my takeaway from watching the game was if if OKC
can maintain that high level of defense where they just
make it totally uncomfortable for the Pacers to be able
(02:14):
to find any type of rhythm in their offensive sets,
any type of you know, kind of comfort or or continuity.
It just it just didn't seem like the Pacers could
find that in this this last game. And I just wonder,
(02:35):
can can okay See continue to play defense at that
high of a level that it totally disrupted their entire
their entire flow of in fact, didn't allow Indiana to
really get into a real flow during the course of
this game.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Yeah, you can't breathe.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
They just they suffocate you because no matter where you are,
they got somebody on the wing, they can get you.
They got some download they can get you. There's no
weakness defensively for them. And that's why they've been such
a pain in the ass for everybody all year. It's
why they won, you know, sixty eight games during the
course of the season. Was Yeah, SGA has been great,
and he's the MVP, and they've got talent offensively that
(03:17):
can score. But defensively they're fantastic. I mean, somebody have
called it one of the best defensive teams we've seen
in a long time in years in the NBA, which
is kind of a kind of a breath of fresh
air on that front, because so many teams are, you know,
giving up one hundred twenty one hundred and twenty five
points a game or whatnot, and just you see these
(03:37):
shootouts and so to see some old school defensive play,
it's fun to watch. From Okay, so you're speaking of SGA.
He did speak afterwards. He talked about the difference in
how things feel in the NBA Finals as opposed to
other games.
Speaker 5 (03:54):
The loss has hurt a little bit more, for sure,
And I've tried to just tell myself, like, like, as
much as you can, just enjoy the process and enjoy
the moment, are you, Absolutely, It's been amazing. It's been
everything I dreamed it to be. It's been like it's
hard to even putting to words and wrap my head around.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
It's been so fun.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
And it's the best stage of basketball ever of all time,
and we get the opportunity to play in that.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
And that's how I try to like view it. I
try to view it.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
As so many people die for this opportunity and I
have my whole entire life and now I'm finally here.
So just as much as I can enjoy it. But
keep that.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Competitor far just a chill dude, just matter of fact,
business as usual.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Huh hyah.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
You know you can tell he's in the moment and
this is one of those those stages where you get
the opportunity. We hear his name, he's finally got the
MVP Award coming his way.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
Now, first one down. Now you're on the.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Largest stage, You're in the finals. You know a lot
of the conversation last year, even though they didn't make
it to the finals surrounded you know, Anthony Edwards and
what he is and what he can be. A lot
of conversations started circulating with Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum.
(05:19):
You know, there are a lot of different players that
were being brought up. You know, the Jokige's, you know,
the the Greek Freak. You know, you have all of
these guys that are being discussed in such flattering manners
and being the best. And SGA's name popped up. It
(05:42):
was popping up, but it wasn't a main name being said.
It wasn't you weren't saying you weren't leading off with SGA.
And and I feel like where he's at right now,
the platform that he's on, the magnitude of being in
the NBA Finals and just showing total like his control,
(06:05):
his ball control is amazing, his decision making is amazing. Uh,
his shot shot selections are are solid.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
He's like all systems go right now.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
As as a leader of a team, and what you
would consider to be a superstar because there are some
other guys on the team, I mean maybe not of
the caliber that that SGA is, but nonetheless, I mean,
like chet Chet had a really good game, good showing
and win puppet. I mean he he shows up, he
(06:40):
shows up. They they played Who's the other big coop?
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Teach me to tell me chet Holmgren doesn't look like
some guys out outside of car dealership, but they got
deals on fourth of July weekend.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Super strong for certain, he ain't he ain't built the
strongest could game though. They kept parking Styn in more
of this game, which I thought was maybe the mistake
they had maybe made in the first one. Uh, they
were getting second and third and sometimes even fourth opportunities
when they missshots. I thought that played a major part
(07:10):
and the success that they were able to have. So
I mean, give Okay see a lot of credit. I'm
curious to see what Indiana plans on doing. How do
they try to counteract what took place yesterday, because that's
not an easy fix.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Would you would you.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Go as far to say, in discussing SGA that he
is the the face of the NBA. Would you go
as far as to say that, and that tired, tired
discussion which really really irritates me, that whole face of
the NBA conversation. And you know why, because the face
of the NBA is Michael Jordan. Like it just that's
(07:49):
what it is, and it's that way because nobody will
let that go.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
And there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
But stop trying to manufacture, well, who's the who's the
face of the It's Jordan?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
What do you mean?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Like that's who.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Who's everybody is compared to any time of conversation comes.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
I disagree a little bit on that. Like, while I will.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Agree with the idea of yes, it's whenever you're talking greatness,
Jordan's name is generally the first one that comes up.
It's it's generally the same five or six names that
always come up. You know, it's it's Cobe, it's mj
it's Will Chamberlain, it's Magic Johnson, it's Bill Russell. I mean,
(08:31):
it's generally Lebron, it's generally the same names that come up.
What I will say is right now, by default, I
would just say, by default it's Lebron James, and it's
Lebron James because a his body of work is strong
enough to be in the conversation of greatest ever and
(08:55):
and be compared to what the face of the league
has been historically, you know, at least in his era.
Of time, which is MJ. But I think it's really
because he wants to be the face of the league,
which I think is very different than airas Pass. I
think airs Pass guys wanted to be the guy. I
(09:16):
think Kobe wanted to be the guys. Shaq wanted to
be the guy. You know, you look at these other guys,
a Keem, Elijah One, you know, David Robinson, you know,
you keep going back, you know, Pat Ewing and all
those they wanted to be the guys. They wanted to
be the faces of the league. They wanted to be
what they were.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Going to be.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Charles Barkley and all those guys. Penny Hardaway, well, Penny
Hardaway not so much like he was more kind of
like he kind of has a personality more like some
of these newer guys. The newer guys, it doesn't seem
like that's important to them. It seems like it's just
more about just playing and whatever it is that they're
(09:55):
interested in, whether it's music, whether it's fashion. You know,
they're they're into being strip clubs, you know, behind this
and you know, whatever it is.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
They seem to be okay with being really really good
basketball players. I'd say, Anthony Atwards wants to be the
face of the elite. There's a few guys that you'll
see they give you I want to be face of elite.
I don't get that from SGA. I don't get that
from yokiics. But we don't.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
It's it's just don't get it from Luca. It just
feels manufactured in the NFL. Like Tom Brady's the greatest
quarterback of all time, you know, like you know, like
if we're talking about somebody on par with Jordan or
whatnot as far as the titles and all that, tom
Brady's But.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
If their accomplishments, it's his accomplishments that place from there,
of course, but we.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Don't have the Hey, who's the face of the NFL? Now,
none of those conversations happened because.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
It's the it's the accomplishments.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Though, if we didn't have Patrick Mahomes accomplishing at the
level he's accomplishing at and achieving, we would have conversation.
I don't think if it's not Patrick Mahomes, who's the
face of the league.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
I don't care.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I don't think because I think I don't think the
NFL needs a face of the league because they the
star is the league. Like we always worried about what
was gonna happen if Brady retired or Peyton Manning retired.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
Are they gonna find the next guy?
Speaker 2 (11:18):
I remember this being a conversation where man, you know,
Roethlisberger and Manning and Braydon, these guys are gonna retire.
What's gonna happen next? Oh, I don't know. Patrick Mahomes,
Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen. The NFL does such a better
job just rolling out star after star, and it's not
about face of the league. The league is the star.
(11:41):
And with the NBA, all you hear about is Michael Jordan.
Michael Jordan. And that's fine, but let's stop trying to Hey,
is SGA going to be the face of the NBA?
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Now?
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Is who's the face of the league?
Speaker 2 (11:54):
No, the face of the league is Michael Jordan, because
that's all you keep hearing about when people discuss greatness
in that league.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
I feel like you gotta have your main character, your face,
and that's Patrick Mahomes. They can lean on Patrick Mahomes.
The NFL can lean into Patrick Mahomes, just like they
were able to lean into Tom Brady and at times
Peyton Manning. I really do. And again, like you say
face of the league, I mean there are faces in
(12:23):
the NFL. There have been faces plural of the league.
And just mentioning those two names I just mentioned, I
mean there was a point in time where Joe Montana
was the face of the league, but you didn't have
to look any further than the guy he was throwing
the ball to to say he's the face of the
league as well, and Jerry Rice. You had other quarterbacks
(12:44):
around the league that you could say fall into the
conversation of face of the league, just like you do now.
I mean when you had Montana, you had Kelly, you
had Marino, you had Dallas Dallas quarterback Troy a.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Men.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
I mean, you had some really really fine quarterbacks during
Joe Montana's run. But he was he was goated because
he kept winning. And I think that that's what you're
dealing with right now. Tom Brady in his era, he
was goaded because he kept winning, even more so than
(13:22):
Peyton Manning. And then now you look at Patrick Mahomes,
he's goated because he's winning. Even when he's not winning,
he's still winning because they're making it to the Super Bowl.
They're the best representation of the teams, you know, in
the league, one of the two. So when I look
at the NBA, who has established what team has been
(13:46):
able to establish that this is what they are and
this is the player that's going to do it, there
hasn't been one. There hasn't been one. And that's why
Lebron James in a way by default going to the
super team that he was going to, you know, getting
started in Miami with with uh with Who's Tall Buddy?
(14:07):
Dwayne Wade as Bosh, Chris Bosh. I mean, then you
go back, you got you got love and you got
Kyrie irving in Cleveland, like who's tall buddy?
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Who's tall buddy? Thank you.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
I appreciate the pool too. I just I just feel
like where we're at right now. By the way, Bosch
does kind of get lost in that hole. He does
next and he was like he was like the main
catalysts for the one year that they want it. I mean,
if there's no Chris Bosh, they don't win it. They
don't win it. But my point is is that what
(14:42):
team had, what franchise and player connected to that franchise
has established that type of dominance in the NBA.
Speaker 4 (14:49):
So in a way, you can't go to guy.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
If their team isn't put Like, okay, we talk about
the Joker like he does this, he does he's the
best that I die.
Speaker 4 (15:01):
He should have been MVP again he gets MVP, but
he's got one championship. Who is dominating when? Like, if
you ass Michael Jeffrey Jordan, what mattered most to him,
He'll tell you winning championships mattered the most of him.
You can you can look at stats and all these
(15:22):
other things.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
What what a decent golf course and a casino and uh.
Speaker 4 (15:27):
You know, a couple of rocket ships walking around? I
mean it could be where are you going with it?
I'm just saying.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
I'm just saying winning, winning was most important to him,
not MVPs, not not any of these other you know,
distinguished because those things.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
Come when you win. When you win at all, those
those achievements and those accomplishments automatically follow. So to me,
I feel like where we're at right now, no one
has really grab the bulls by the horns in the NBA.
Not a team, not a player, not a duo of players.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
I mean, there are some pretty nice duos out there,
but none have proven to be a dominant like you
had the opportunity with Jalen and Tatum and this year
being able to maybe come back repeat. Now the conversation
continues on that fell apart, fell off of the rails.
(16:29):
There's not a team or a player or a set
of players that has been dominant enough to be goaded
and put in the conversation. And the crazy thing is
that's why you continue to hear the conversations about Lebron
James because no one has been able to really offset
what Lebron James represents to the NBA just yet. Great Stars,
(16:53):
Young Stars, SGA now has the opportunity to make it
more of a conversation as it applies to him. But
it's not an everyday thing where that's how it takes place.
You got to do this for more than one season,
so you could set the stage by doing what you
do this season. But then now, what are you going
to do next year? What are you going to do
(17:15):
the year after that? What are you going to do
year after that? Because in order to get goaded, you
gotta win, and you gotta win more than one time.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Be sure to catch live editions of Two Pros and
a Cup of Joe with Brady Quinn, LeVar Arrington and
Jonas Knox weekdays at six am Eastern, three am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Everybody, it is Jonas Knox here and at the Home Depot.
It is time for pros to source the whole job
with one partner. Ask about all we can do for
you at the pro Desk the Home Depot Pro It's
about time. Speaking of a pro. John Harbaugh's a pro.
He's a pro football coach. And he had another former
(18:00):
pro football coach in the building to kind of take
a gander at how things were operating there in Baltimore,
none other than John Gruden, and the current Ravens head coach.
Talked about the presence of Gruden there at Ravens OTAs to.
Speaker 4 (18:15):
Give you a general overview.
Speaker 6 (18:16):
He studied us, you know, and basically the message was,
you know, if I was game planning against you your defense,
what would I do and how would I attack you guys?
And he didn't just stop there. He watched our offensive guys.
He talked to our offensive guys, looked at all the players,
had something for each player just you know, phenomenal and
very very detailed, great teacher too.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
At what point does John Gruden get another shot? Because
I feel like we're inching closer towards him getting another opportunity,
Like he's.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Out in the public more he does like as a
head coach.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
I why not go get a college team and build
a college program.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
I mean, what's he waiting for? Is he still getting
paid by the Raiders? Is? I doubt? I'm sure that's
probably run out by now.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
It's twenty twenty one when it took place, probably ran
out by now.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
You know.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
That's a hard one to answer, I believe, because you
got to take into consideration the amount of opportunities he's
already received to be a head coach for one, then
for two, what does that look like after everything that
took place? Depending on what side you fall on in
(19:34):
terms of the politics of it all, is that going
to be acceptable? It seems as though the climate of
society and culture isn't necessarily slowing down in the racial category,
but it certainly is taking shifts away from different racial groups,
(19:57):
and it's settling in on different ones is at different.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
Times, right, All right, So now you guys can be offended.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Right, And this month in particular isn't even connected to
a racial group. It's just connected to a certain group,
you know, I don't know what, yes, you do?
Speaker 4 (20:17):
What do you know?
Speaker 1 (20:18):
What you mean?
Speaker 4 (20:21):
It's it's I happen to have a birthday in this
month too.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
By the way, it's not my community.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
But anyway, I think the point a lot of you
have a lot of pride in your birthday. Isn't wrong
with that? I do too, everybody should.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
My favorite color is blue, I don't.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
I mean, I just second favorite is black. Damn. I'm
just being honest. He's going to get an opportunity at
some point. I don't, do you think. I just feel like.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
As a head coach, well, all we've heard is glowing
reviews from players who were there in Vegas, whether it
was Max Crosby or spoke about him, like other players
have talked about Gruden's presence there and how disappointed they
were in him getting let go.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
And there's people that feel like he kind of got screwed.
What he did was dumb. He shouldn't have done it,
he shouldn't have said it, he shouldn't have written it.
But I think there were people that feel he got
kind of screwed over well, he wasn't an innocent bystand
by any stretch of the imagination. I mean, his actions
were his actions, and it came to like based on
(21:46):
he was a bystander that was impacted by someone else's
actions and them being impacted. And that's where it gets
a little like kind of sketchy. How do you make
sense of it?
Speaker 3 (21:59):
Because this dude not been that type of dude, then
this information doesn't come out. And then with this information
coming out, then it exposes this dude over here. And
you want to say he was an innocent bystander that
got clipped, but he wasn't innocent and the.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
Way he did because he did it.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
So it's kind of like he didn't get screwed, but
he did get screwed. It's like a contradiction. It's a
conundrum the web.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Of Dan Snyder and the people that have been caught
up in the web and this being one of them,
because that's why this happened, because they went through the
emails they found that. I mean, it still is wild
to me to think that in all of those forty
thousand emails or whatever the number was, that this is
what they pulled from.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
It, because I'm certain there's way way, way more egregious
things than a coach planned a Dozens on a union
leader and he exchanges like because that's what that's all
it is, is playing. That's that's the Dozens, that's what
he was doing. And and and people get sensitive when
(23:10):
it's a different racial group that joins into But there's
some coaches that are really good trash talkers. Man, the
Dozens like you talk, that's on people like you talk.
Ass if a black dude said what what John Grutin said,
it wouldn't have been no, Like, it's it's normal, it's normal.
(23:31):
But there's certain rules and parameters I guess that that
play a part in. And how like, if you're in
the locker room, you can have those types of conversations
and cats will laugh at it, like you'll laugh that
people will join in. And that's why I think, you know,
the people that were sitting there trying to say, guys
were Uncle Tom's that were were sticking up for Grooton
(23:53):
when it had first initially happened, Like you saw Warren sapping,
different guys coming out to to be you know, support
John Grutin it's like if you know him, you know
he's not you know, he's not a racist.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I don't know John Gruton that well. I've met him
a few times. I don't know him that well. But
the guys that have played for him had very strong
opinions that were, you know, in favor of just John
Gruten being John Gruton in those moments.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
And again like sometimes you.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Know, things can be let you know, let off into
the main stratosphere because the information has been released, and
people it's like like even you know, again, I'll post
stuff on social and I'll tell people and that or
die this, that and the other, and they get like
all sensitive, like I don't know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It's like.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Locker room culture, like football facility culture. It's its own culture.
And if you haven't lived in it and you haven't
been a part of it, then you can speak to
it as a fan if you want to, But in reality,
it's like, what are you really doing it for it
because you don't You'll never understand it unless you lived
(25:07):
in it.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
It's I think people also get a little insecure about
that because that is one of the things I've talked
to Brady about.
Speaker 4 (25:14):
This before to where.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Like there there should be a respect level to yeah,
you don't get it, you've never been there. Like I
played high school, for I know what a high school
football locker room's like.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
But do you know how like when people do that,
you know, do you know how Like it's pretty funny
when you hear somebody say, well, I played football, I
was in high school, I played youth league. Like it's
not even any reason to say it that because it's
it's so it's so insignificant from even college. It's like,
(25:50):
it doesn't make any sense to even say, well, I
was in the locker room in high school. It's not
it's not the same. It's like and I just so
when I hear you guys talk about the law, I don't.
I look at it and I go, yeah, you're right,
that is.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Your That is an experience that only a few a
fraction of society can speak to. And I've heard stories
from other people have told me stories about a weird
stuff that's happened in a locker room.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
I mean some of the most outlendo things, some of
the most outlets things you'll ever hear.
Speaker 4 (26:21):
I remember, David, some of if some of the stuff
came out that was being done in locker rooms. John
Grutin's emails would see like romper room compared to some
of the stuff that people do in the locker room.
I remember my buddy David Anderson, who played in the
NFL for a while. He told me a story about
there was alignment he played with on the Texans who
(26:43):
used to eat his food in the stall while he
was on the toilet. He would eat like McDonald's or
whatever he was eating that day while he was on
the toilet. He just thought that that was the more
efficient way to eat his lunch. And then also, you know,
drop the kids off at the same time.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
I mean, there's way worse than that. There's way worse
than that. It's just like super repulsive things that take
place in the locker room, man, and for better or
for worse. Like, the only time it becomes an issue
is when somebody you know, feels like they need to
tell all about it or whatever it may be. You know,
(27:22):
it becomes an issue when it's an issue. But for
the most part, there are always a handful of dudes
that are going to do some wild s in the
locker room.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, and that's why I think there should be a
little more leeway given to that.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
If that's where but that's where the line gets blurred
really badly. It gets blurred really badly, because what you
do know is if it does become public knowledge, it's
almost like secret like secret service, right like you get
(28:02):
sent on a mission.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
We sent you, we paid you your commission to do it.
But if you get caught, we don't know you. That's
that's how it is.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
If you are if you are going to do something
that's going to possibly come up and bring reproach on you,
this team, this league, we don't know you. We don't
know you, and we don't owe you. So in these moments,
it doesn't matter what your reputation was. It doesn't matter,
(28:37):
you know, how good of a person you are, doesn't
matter how many Super Bowls you got, doesn't none of
those things matter.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
All that matters is the.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
Damning information that made it to the public to be consumed.
And now you've been judged by the public. That's all
that matters. And once that happens, you have to disassociate
yourself with those types of people. And that's what happened
with John Gruden and Will that happen Like I felt
(29:09):
like that could have possibly happened to the coach buddy
from from Miami when he started suing and he's like,
all right, I'm going to sue, and I thought he
might be done, Brian Flores, Brian Flores, but he ends
up getting onto a team. So obviously what he said
and what he went through and what he was putting
(29:29):
out there wasn't egregious enough for the ownership pool the
ring to say that he's out. I don't know for
certain what John Gruden's status is and that you know,
in that circle, but you would think after all this time,
(29:50):
you said, what year, twenty twenty one, twenty twenty one,
that's a long time, bro, that's a long time to
circle back and be like, you know what, let's give
him another go, because what does that say about your
coaching pool and development to begin with?
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, I mean I've thought, you know, maybe as an OC,
maybe in some capacity like that, Just the fact that.
Speaker 4 (30:16):
He's getting as many.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
That teams are consulting with him, like you know, it
was New Orleans last year, it was you know, Baltimore
this year. It just feels like we're inching closer towards
it being more of a possibility of him getting a
chance at some level in the NFL. So you know,
we'll keep you posted if we have any more developments
on John Gruden potentially back in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
With his I get I'll get kicked off the air.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
I was about to use what he said, Oh, I him,
and then it would have been funny and then but
then I might have lost my job. But it's so
funny because if he was joking, like if we was
joking about that in the locker room, everybody would have
been left and they would have turned that on him.
They would have said something about him, They would have
they would have played the dozens on him. In fact,
(31:05):
I mean there were a lot of people that didn't
even like to do that. He was he was speaking
on to begin with. Yeah, so there's that.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
There's that.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
But you know, when color gets involved and race gets
involved and it becomes a thing, you know, the league
has to handle those things in a certain type of way,
and it's always going to be handled the same way. Yeah,
hidden women, racially driven, you know, racially insensitive deals, inequality
(31:36):
type of dips, you're gonna be in trouble. Man, like
you're gonna be in some serious trouble. They've taken teams
away from owners off of being inappropriate, and they have
taken jobs away from coaches for being inappropriate, and they
have taken jobs away from players for being inappropriate.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
So you got to choose wisely.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Be sure to catch live editions of Two Pros and
a Cup of Joe with Brady Quinn, LeVar Arrington and
Jonas Knox weekdays at six am Eastern, three am Pacific.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Do you want to mention some news that just came
out a short time ago. Uh, not the biggest surprise
in the world. This was the expectation at some point
if they couldn't get a deal done. But that's a
wrap Jay r Alexander has been cut by the Green
Bay Packers, so that is Uh, that'll wrap up his
(32:29):
time with the Green Bay Packers. That according to Ian Rappaport, Hey,
what's your.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
Reaction to that, Lee? How you feel? How does that
make you feel?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Lee?
Speaker 7 (32:41):
Well, I'm bummed that he just never panned out as
a great player for for the whole season. He was
always injured. He never really lived up to the full potential.
He was great, He's a great player still still great
years old, but whatever.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Rub it in Sorry, please distraught. That was one of
his Packers jerseys. Sorry, didn't you have a gy your
Alexander Jersey. No, never to get I don't get players
who get stay injured.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
Oh gosh, geez, oh they're there. I guess, uh, the
organization don't keep players that stay injured. I think it
was more he wanted out. Okay, yeah, they they offered
him a restructured contract.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
He said he wanted to stay, but he was always
I don't know, he was always saying something like he
wanted out.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
By the way, did you see LEBARGI happened to see
the latest on Jalen Ramsey. Speaking of defensive backs, tell
everyone so the very latest on Jalen Ramsey. This also,
according to NFL Network, Ramsey will stay away from the
Dolphins off season program. They're still trying to trade him. God,
(33:49):
I can't imagine why they haven't been able to execute
a trade yet. It was almost like, you know, they
let everybody know it advance. Yeah, we're trading this player.
I still don't understand, and I know it's well, why
beat around the you know, why not make it public
that you know if you're going to move on from
a guy, and move on from a guy, why let
any of that information out? If you want to get
(34:09):
a trade done, and you are actually motivated to get
a trade done and you want to move a player,
why would you give any tell at all that you're
trying to trade the guy. If have conversations, you know,
with teams, if teams ask, hey, anybody available, I don't know,
what do you think about Jalen Ramsey? But instead you
come out and you tell everybody you're trying to trade
(34:31):
the guy. Why would teams around the league make a
move when they can just sign him if he gets released?
Like Jerry Alexander and the Packers probably had several conversations
with teams, but they're like, dude, they're just gonna end
up releasing them anyways, because it's been so public. I
just I don't I don't understand the thought, and teams
still do it, still talking, Oh well, listen, we're going
(34:53):
to try to trade. Like Chris Greer, the GM for
the Dolphins, say oh, we're going to try and trade
Jalen Ramsey.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Why go publicly that? Why not keep that behind close tours?
I don't.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
I then didn Jalen Ramsey make it so that they
had to go public though? Didn't he say, you know,
bit farewell to everyone in Miami.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
I think it was after Chris Greer. Was it after Yeah,
that's why I don't understand, Like, if you really we
get it.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
It didn't work. It hasn't worked out there.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
But do you feel as though he may have leveraged
them into having to say something, you know, I don't
like if y'all don't release me or trade me or whatever,
like I'm gonna let people know I'm not coming back.
Speaker 4 (35:36):
Yeah, but they came first the market.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
Players do that all the time though, to where they'll
do something passive aggressive on social media like that's that's
you know, the new move in the NFL, like or
the new move in sports where if somebody wants out,
oh they they unfollowed the team and they.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Put not no longer a part of it, like it's
not in their bio that they're on the team.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
It's like the new it's like the new Facebook relationship thing.
It's complicated.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
It's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Why don't you just say I'm looking for something strange? Okay,
just say that. But these but like so players will
post that all the time the organization. You don't hear
gms come out even if he did post something like
that and come out and say, oh, yeah, we are
trying to trade him. Okay, So why would I do
a deal with you if he's just gonna get cut.
I'll just wait until he's available and I don't have
(36:27):
to give anything up for him. Just doesn't make any
sense to.
Speaker 3 (36:30):
Me unless you really need him. And if you have
a real need for him and you believe that he's
got enough gas in the tank, then you don't want
somebody else to get a hold of him. So you
try to figure out a deal. What does that look like?
What would that type of deal look like? How much
money is is? Is he you know, is his contract
worth like? What does that look like? I think that
(36:51):
that would play the biggest role in what takes place here.
If that's a too that's a nut that's too big
to crack, you're not going to go get them. And
and Miami has to know that going into this. So
what is the scenario Why why would you have not
tried to salvage the situation with him? And if it
(37:13):
were not a salvageable situation and you are indeed moving
on from him. I would have been way more aggressive
with trying to move him, you know, earlier on like
pre draft, you know all that, like the start of
the NFL season, the new NFL season. I would have
been all over that to try to make that work.
Why is this why is this drug out into June? Well,
(37:37):
it's like the Kirk Cousins stuff. At this point, Kirk
Cousins has two options because he you know, he wants
to play, he wants an opportunity, and he wants to
be elsewhere. And he talked to the Falcons. He went
to Arthur Blank, he you know, gave him his case
as to why he you know, can you trade me?
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Can you move on?
Speaker 2 (37:54):
And the Falcons are like, no, no, we want to
keep around for a veteran insurance at the backup quarterback spot.
We picked up his ten million dollar option. So if
you're Kirk Cousins, and this is just the cruel reality
of where he's at this offseason, if you're Kirk Cousins
at this point in the offseason, you got two choices, right,
you got two options. Either you're playing for the Falcons
(38:15):
next year, or somebody gets hurt and if a team
has a starting quarterback who gets hurt and they're desperate,
that's when you would see them make a move. But
at this point, to your point, it's a little late
in the game to start. It's a little light like
wheeling and dealing, and for whatever reason, you know, at
least you know the Packers have moved on reportedly from
(38:36):
JayR Alexander. That'll be done later on today, and then
we still wait to see what happens with Jalen Ramsey.
Now Aaron Rodgers is a Pittsburgh Steeler quarterback. Speaking of
former Packers, jay R Alexander is going to be one.
Aaron Rodgers is one. He's now the starting quarterback for
the Pittsburgh Steelers, as he signed his one year deal
over the weekend, made it official one year, nineteen million
(38:59):
dollars with incentives thirteen million dollars in change, but really
the guarantee is ten million dollars, So basically it's a
one year, ten million dollar deal and he can get
to those other numbers if he hit certain incentives in
certain benchmarks in the contract.
Speaker 5 (39:16):
All that.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
Can we talk Can we talk about this whole Aaron
Rodgers situation, him wearing number eight, who were number eight
in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (39:26):
I think they're a ponter did. But now he's going
to wear a number three. Why is he wearing number eight?
That's not what I want.
Speaker 3 (39:35):
I want to talk about Aaron Rodgers getting a one
year deal and getting ten million guaranteed and having an
upwards of nineteen million and escalators and incentives in his contract. Again,
I will say this, and I said this when they
got Russ and I said this when they got Buddy
(39:58):
from Chicago, Josh Justin Fields, when they got filled. So
you're saying Tramisky, No, I'm gonna say. I'm gonna say,
with the quarterbacks they brought in last year, you got
discounted rates for both of them, one still being on
(40:19):
their their rookie contract, the other one just not having
any value at this point in time when you brought
them on. So you have two quarterbacks that are pretty
comparable and what their contracts look like, and so there's
no real you know, you have the feeling there's no
(40:41):
real loss if neither one of them proves out. Now
you do that one off season with two former starters
of two different organizations last season, that's fine, is it,
okay to do it two seasons in a row. It
works so good last year, Well, it didn't work so
(41:01):
good last year. Pushing through your sarcasm, it didn't work
very well last year. In fact, it did not work
to the degree of where you didn't want one of
the quarterbacks. Speculation says that you possibly wanted one of
the quarterbacks back, and both of them are gone and
(41:22):
you go back to a quarterback that was a starter
for you from before that. Really, which if you look
this up, Lee or you Jonas is Mason Rudolph eight
and four as the starting quarterback of the Pittsburgh Steelers.
I think he's a winning record quarterback during his tenure
(41:46):
as a Pittsburgh Steeler quarterback. Nonetheless, they did not prove
out and show that they were a Super Bowl contending
team with Mason Rudolph. And so now you bring him back.
You got Will Howard the draft pick.
Speaker 4 (42:03):
Is he the guy?
Speaker 3 (42:05):
So is the setup in the scenario of this to say,
Aaron Rodgers gives us one year to give Will the
opportunity to learn from Aaron Rodgers, watch his habits, watch
how he studies, study him, and learn from him.
Speaker 4 (42:23):
If something were to happen.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
Mason Rudolph is our safety net to put in so
that we can still try to be competitive for the season,
and then at some point we're going with will as
our starting quarterback. If that's what it is, then I
don't know at this point, is it? I feel like,
is it? It's prudent to let the plan be made known.
(42:47):
This is what we're planning on doing. This is why
we didn't sign Aaron Rodgers to a long term contract.
This is why we didn't sign Aaron Rodgers to a
large contract because this is what we're planning on doing.
But we do feel as though we can improve our team,
impact our team right now with a motivated Aaron Rodgers.
(43:08):
Which now the question becomes, with everything that he's gone
through and all the speculation with good authority, what it
is that he's experienced this offseason, with the personal things
he's had to get through, does it translate into Aaron
Rodgers coming in and having one amazing year And if so,
(43:29):
then now doesn't that create another issue where now the
conversation has to be we gave him a one year contract,
he played his ass off, he played well. Are you
rewarding him with a long term con Are you rewarding
him with a different contract, I think, or are you
moving on and sticking to the plan of what it
may have been to move on to Will Howard, who
(43:50):
you drafted in this year's draft class. I think he's
hit a one year at a time basis at this
point in his career. And I think he said as
much in interviews as well too, is that you know,
just gonna take it one year at a time.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
If he plays well enough this year and they.
Speaker 2 (44:05):
Have a good year and he looks, you know, more
like the Rogers of old, and what looks more like
the Rogers we saw in the back end of last
year when he played much better. I mean, I think
then the conversation becomes, well, let's just do it again,
Like why wouldn't we just do it again, especially if
they're out of contention and getting a top draft pick.
(44:26):
But at some point they're going to have to figure
out their quarterback of the future, and they've been scrambling
to do that for years now. I mean, you know,
Ben Roethlisberger got a red ass when they took Mason
Rudolph in the third round or whatever it was. I
remember talking about it at the time when Roethlisberger called
into a sports radio show in Pittsburgh and it was
(44:50):
like a Saturday Saturday afternoon. He called into some sports
radio show in Pittsburgh and was just sort of criticizing
the Steelers. Well, why would we take a quarterback there?
There were other positions of me that we needed, et cetera,
et cetera. They should have addressed their quarterback of the
future conversation a long ass time ago, because since Roethlisberger's
final year, what they had since an he picket didn't
(45:14):
work didn't work.
Speaker 4 (45:15):
It just it just didn't work. For whatever reason you had.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
Nothing has worked out. No we could give the names.
Nothing has worked out. In fact, the last days of
Ben Roethlisberger didn't work out. That didn't work out as well.
So it wasn't like you left him prematurely.
Speaker 4 (45:34):
He was done too. Is just that the idea of
replacing a replacement has not that has not surfaced me.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
So let me ask you that, because there was I
think it was Adam Schefter who said on Friday or
it was over the weekend at some point and he
made the mention that Aaron Rodgers is the Packers third option,
that they were all in on wanting to get Matthew Stafford.
That didn't work. They wanted to resign Justin Fields anyone elsewhere,
and so they end up with Rogers. Whether that's true,
(46:05):
who knows.
Speaker 4 (46:06):
But Mike, this is what I do know.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
Whether you kept Justin Fields, whether you got Aaron Rodgers,
whether you kept Russell Wilson, whether you brought in Mason Rudolph,
whether you drafted Will Howard, is there anything else we want?
Speaker 2 (46:22):
Well, whether you win and got let me ask you
this though, because let's let's play that out. That okay,
they wanted Matthew Stafford. Well there's other teams that wanted
Matthew Stafford as well too. He ended up staying with
the Rams. The Justin Fields conversation, well, they wanted Justin Fields.
He chose to go to the Jets. And I look
at that and I'm like, what does that mean? Why
(46:48):
would he choose the Jets over the Steelers? And you know,
the easy answer is, well, because of money. They offered
him more guaranteed money, so on and so forth. I
feel like the Steelers probably could have stepped up. It's
not like Justin Field's got this monster contract. In comparison,
to other quarterbacks in the NFL, the Steelers, you know,
had they wanted him bad enough, they would have stepped
(47:09):
up and made the move and made the money right
to try and keep him. But it just goes back
to Mike Tomlin has been through all these different combinations
of quarterbacks that they've been trying since Roethlisberger walked away,
and this feels like Mike Tomlin at the end of
this being like, hey man, we're going to give it
(47:31):
one last go. And Lvar you brought this up last offseason.
I think Tomlin's days are numbered, Like I think if
this doesn't work, you'd have to assume that that's that's
what comes next. And that's why I continue to have
the conversation the way that I continue to have the conversation,
like what is your ultimate end by bringing in Aaron Rodgers.
(47:55):
You're bringing him in at this this this price, this
price tag. Where does that price tag rank with all
the other quarterbacks in the league right now? That's not
even half, No, that's not even half of a one.
Speaker 3 (48:08):
Year guarantee for some of these upper echelonts qbs, it's
not even had because it's like starting at like forty
these days. Right, it's like high thirties forties per year. Yeah,
So you got him with ten million guaranteed and an
(48:28):
upwards of nineteen million dollars and he took it, and
he took it, So you got to take into consideration
what that means. He took well below market value of
a position that he could have required way more.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
He took it.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
Now people will sit out there and nail. Conventionally, the
conventional wisdom response to what I just said is he's
good enough, he's made enough. He can go prove that
he's that good and the money can come from somewhere else, right, Like,
this could be a different situation.
Speaker 4 (49:08):
But I don't.
Speaker 3 (49:09):
I don't think that that's it. I think that this
is the best price he could get if he's going
to continue to play, and this could be his best
opportunity to try to have success before he ends his career.
And if that's the case, I just feel like those
are hard circumstances. A one year contract, a team that's
trying to figure it out, just got rid of their
(49:30):
number one, all right, they bring in DK whatever, blase blah.
I just don't think that this is a recipe that
is going to yield a very good looking or great
tasting product that is consumable.
Speaker 4 (49:44):
I just I don't feel that way right now.
Speaker 5 (49:46):
Lee.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
You've got the number from what I'm seeing.
Speaker 7 (49:49):
If you were to look at his thirteen point six,
and even if you looked at his nineteenth, he would
still nineteen million. He would be ranked at nineteenth Steelers
just behind Justin Field at twenty million dollars ever annually
with the Jets, ahead of rookie cam Ward in Tennessee,
who's getting twelve this year.
Speaker 3 (50:05):
As a rookie, as a rookie, as a rookie on
a slotted scale. You guys don't think slotted scale contract.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
You guys don't think I if Rogers wanted to haggle
the Steelers and squeeze a couple more million out of them,
he couldn't come on, Darren Rodgers.
Speaker 3 (50:21):
I mean. But again, that's that's the point that I'm making.
The point is is that that is what he took.
That is what he's getting, and that is what they're
paying him. And you're gonna get if you're talking about
getting the top CEO for your company and you want
to steal him away for her away from this company
over here to bring him to your company and get
what you pay for. You get what you pay for
(50:43):
what you pay for, And I think that that's ultimately
what this comes down to. Like you could be thinking
you're getting a discounted, you know, rate for the same
thing that you're getting, but you're ultimately you're only worth
what people are willing to pay you. And whether it's
a car, whether it's like it's like I was talking
(51:04):
to somebody about mister Styx the other day and they
asked me, you know, they're they're thinking about getting a
boor bull and this that and the other and da
dah dah and this and that. We went through it,
talked through it, breeders died this, that did a lot
of homework, blase blah. This is what I paid for
when I wanted to get this dog in particular, and
that's what I paid for. And then he told me
(51:26):
what he was paying for to get his and I said, well,
that's what you're gonna get. I mean, that's that's fourteen
off of what I paid. So if you think you're
going to get the same the same quality, good luck.
I mean, maybe maybe it does happen. Maybe maybe you
(51:48):
do feel like, the quality of the dog is that
of one that you would have to pay top dollar for.
And maybe that happened, but maybe it didn't. But you
do know what you're getting for when you pay top
dollar for what you paid for.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
Did you just call Aaron Rodgers a borble?
Speaker 3 (52:04):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (52:05):
No?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
And if I did, I would have said he was
the borble that's fourteen off from the other barble, which
I mean, is he okay with me? Is he okay
with being in that situation? Like you're being paid, you're
being paid like a backup, but you're going to be
asked to do what starters do. That's right, Okay, Well
(52:27):
there you go. Stillers
This is the best of two pros and a couple
Joe with Lamar airings and rating win and Jonas Knox
on radio.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
I gotta be honest with you, first of all, good morning,
Good morning. I got nothing from that game last night
in the NBA Finals that that that seemed like exactly
the way that game was gonna go. Yeah, and the
second Game one ended and Indiana won that game, Like
(00:36):
my mind completely focused on Game three. It was almost like, yeah,
we know what's gonna happen. All right, Oklahoma City is
gonna respond. They're a really good team, and then the
series is going to be tied, and then we turn
our sights to Indiana for Game three and then we
figured it out from there.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
That's what it felt, and I think that that's that's
the right approach. You knew that this was somewhat of
a backs up against the wall type of game for OKCUH.
They responded, well, I didn't think that they would cover
the ten point spread.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
What was it like ten and a half?
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I believe it was eleven or eleven and a half
when I when I submitted my you know deal, it
was at ten and a half, I believe, And I
said you know what, okay See will win. They will
hit the over the game, will hit the over on points,
which I believe it did, but I was I was
incorrect on them covering, So give them a lot of credit.
(01:29):
They bounced back. You know, Sga is a beast. He
does what he's going to do. It's a matter of
is he going to get you know, his help. You know,
Jay Williams contributed. Caruso showed up last night. He contributed,
(01:51):
and it wasn't just on the defense side. He gave
them points. But I think the tail of the tape. Honestly,
my takeaway from watching the game was if if OKC
can maintain that high level of defense where they just
make it totally uncomfortable for the Pacers to be able
(02:14):
to find any type of rhythm in their offensive sets,
any type of you know, kind of comfort or or continuity.
It just it just didn't seem like the Pacers could
find that in this this last game. And I just wonder,
(02:35):
can can okay See continue to play defense at that
high of a level that it totally disrupted their entire
their entire flow of in fact, didn't allow Indiana to
really get into a real flow during the course of
this game.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Yeah, you can't breathe.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
They just they suffocate you because no matter where you are,
they got somebody on the wing, they can get you.
They got some download they can get you. There's no
weakness defensively for them. And that's why they've been such
a pain in the ass for everybody all year. It's
why they won, you know, sixty eight games during the
course of the season. Was Yeah, SGA has been great,
and he's the MVP, and they've got talent offensively that
(03:17):
can score. But defensively they're fantastic. I mean, somebody have
called it one of the best defensive teams we've seen
in a long time in years in the NBA, which
is kind of a kind of a breath of fresh
air on that front, because so many teams are, you know,
giving up one hundred twenty one hundred and twenty five
points a game or whatnot, and just you see these
(03:37):
shootouts and so to see some old school defensive play,
it's fun to watch. From Okay, so you're speaking of SGA.
He did speak afterwards. He talked about the difference in
how things feel in the NBA Finals as opposed to
other games.
Speaker 5 (03:54):
The loss has hurt a little bit more, for sure,
And I've tried to just tell myself, like, like, as
much as you can, just enjoy the process and enjoy
the moment, are you, Absolutely, It's been amazing. It's been
everything I dreamed it to be. It's been like it's
hard to even putting to words and wrap my head around.
Speaker 4 (04:12):
It's been so fun.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
And it's the best stage of basketball ever of all time,
and we get the opportunity to play in that.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
And that's how I try to like view it. I
try to view it.
Speaker 5 (04:21):
As so many people die for this opportunity and I
have my whole entire life and now I'm finally here.
So just as much as I can enjoy it. But
keep that.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Competitor far just a chill dude, just matter of fact,
business as usual.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Huh hyah.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
You know you can tell he's in the moment and
this is one of those those stages where you get
the opportunity. We hear his name, he's finally got the
MVP Award coming his way.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
Now, first one down. Now you're on the.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Largest stage, You're in the finals. You know a lot
of the conversation last year, even though they didn't make
it to the finals surrounded you know, Anthony Edwards and
what he is and what he can be. A lot
of conversations started circulating with Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum.
(05:19):
You know, there are a lot of different players that
were being brought up. You know, the Jokige's, you know,
the the Greek Freak. You know, you have all of
these guys that are being discussed in such flattering manners
and being the best. And SGA's name popped up. It
(05:42):
was popping up, but it wasn't a main name being said.
It wasn't you weren't saying you weren't leading off with SGA.
And and I feel like where he's at right now,
the platform that he's on, the magnitude of being in
the NBA Finals and just showing total like his control,
(06:05):
his ball control is amazing, his decision making is amazing. Uh,
his shot shot selections are are solid.
Speaker 4 (06:15):
He's like all systems go right now.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
As as a leader of a team, and what you
would consider to be a superstar because there are some
other guys on the team, I mean maybe not of
the caliber that that SGA is, but nonetheless, I mean,
like chet Chet had a really good game, good showing
and win puppet. I mean he he shows up, he
(06:40):
shows up. They they played Who's the other big coop?
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Teach me to tell me chet Holmgren doesn't look like
some guys out outside of car dealership, but they got
deals on fourth of July weekend.
Speaker 3 (06:50):
Super strong for certain, he ain't he ain't built the
strongest could game though. They kept parking Styn in more
of this game, which I thought was maybe the mistake
they had maybe made in the first one. Uh, they
were getting second and third and sometimes even fourth opportunities
when they missshots. I thought that played a major part
(07:10):
and the success that they were able to have. So
I mean, give Okay see a lot of credit. I'm
curious to see what Indiana plans on doing. How do
they try to counteract what took place yesterday, because that's
not an easy fix.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Would you would you.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Go as far to say, in discussing SGA that he
is the the face of the NBA. Would you go
as far as to say that, and that tired, tired
discussion which really really irritates me, that whole face of
the NBA conversation. And you know why, because the face
of the NBA is Michael Jordan. Like it just that's
(07:49):
what it is, and it's that way because nobody will
let that go.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
And there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
But stop trying to manufacture, well, who's the who's the
face of the It's Jordan?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
What do you mean?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Like that's who.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
Who's everybody is compared to any time of conversation comes.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
I disagree a little bit on that. Like, while I will.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Agree with the idea of yes, it's whenever you're talking greatness,
Jordan's name is generally the first one that comes up.
It's it's generally the same five or six names that
always come up. You know, it's it's Cobe, it's mj
it's Will Chamberlain, it's Magic Johnson, it's Bill Russell. I mean,
(08:31):
it's generally Lebron, it's generally the same names that come up.
What I will say is right now, by default, I
would just say, by default it's Lebron James, and it's
Lebron James because a his body of work is strong
enough to be in the conversation of greatest ever and
(08:55):
and be compared to what the face of the league
has been historically, you know, at least in his era.
Of time, which is MJ. But I think it's really
because he wants to be the face of the league,
which I think is very different than airas Pass. I
think airs Pass guys wanted to be the guy. I
(09:16):
think Kobe wanted to be the guys. Shaq wanted to
be the guy. You know, you look at these other guys,
a Keem, Elijah One, you know, David Robinson, you know,
you keep going back, you know, Pat Ewing and all
those they wanted to be the guys. They wanted to
be the faces of the league. They wanted to be
what they were.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Going to be.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
Charles Barkley and all those guys. Penny Hardaway, well, Penny
Hardaway not so much like he was more kind of
like he kind of has a personality more like some
of these newer guys. The newer guys, it doesn't seem
like that's important to them. It seems like it's just
more about just playing and whatever it is that they're
(09:55):
interested in, whether it's music, whether it's fashion. You know,
they're they're into being strip clubs, you know, behind this
and you know, whatever it is.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
They seem to be okay with being really really good
basketball players. I'd say, Anthony Atwards wants to be the
face of the elite. There's a few guys that you'll
see they give you I want to be face of elite.
I don't get that from SGA. I don't get that
from yokiics. But we don't.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
It's it's just don't get it from Luca. It just
feels manufactured in the NFL. Like Tom Brady's the greatest
quarterback of all time, you know, like you know, like
if we're talking about somebody on par with Jordan or
whatnot as far as the titles and all that, tom
Brady's But.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
If their accomplishments, it's his accomplishments that place from there,
of course, but we.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Don't have the Hey, who's the face of the NFL? Now,
none of those conversations happened because.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
It's the it's the accomplishments.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Though, if we didn't have Patrick Mahomes accomplishing at the
level he's accomplishing at and achieving, we would have conversation.
I don't think if it's not Patrick Mahomes, who's the
face of the league.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
I don't care.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I don't think because I think I don't think the
NFL needs a face of the league because they the
star is the league. Like we always worried about what
was gonna happen if Brady retired or Peyton Manning retired.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
Are they gonna find the next guy?
Speaker 2 (11:18):
I remember this being a conversation where man, you know,
Roethlisberger and Manning and Braydon, these guys are gonna retire.
What's gonna happen next? Oh, I don't know. Patrick Mahomes,
Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen. The NFL does such a better
job just rolling out star after star, and it's not
about face of the league. The league is the star.
(11:41):
And with the NBA, all you hear about is Michael Jordan.
Michael Jordan. And that's fine, but let's stop trying to Hey,
is SGA going to be the face of the NBA?
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Now?
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Is who's the face of the league?
Speaker 2 (11:54):
No, the face of the league is Michael Jordan, because
that's all you keep hearing about when people discuss greatness
in that league.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
I feel like you gotta have your main character, your face,
and that's Patrick Mahomes. They can lean on Patrick Mahomes.
The NFL can lean into Patrick Mahomes, just like they
were able to lean into Tom Brady and at times
Peyton Manning. I really do. And again, like you say
face of the league, I mean there are faces in
(12:23):
the NFL. There have been faces plural of the league.
And just mentioning those two names I just mentioned, I
mean there was a point in time where Joe Montana
was the face of the league, but you didn't have
to look any further than the guy he was throwing
the ball to to say he's the face of the
league as well, and Jerry Rice. You had other quarterbacks
(12:44):
around the league that you could say fall into the
conversation of face of the league, just like you do now.
I mean when you had Montana, you had Kelly, you
had Marino, you had Dallas Dallas quarterback Troy a.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Men.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
I mean, you had some really really fine quarterbacks during
Joe Montana's run. But he was he was goated because
he kept winning. And I think that that's what you're
dealing with right now. Tom Brady in his era, he
was goaded because he kept winning, even more so than
(13:22):
Peyton Manning. And then now you look at Patrick Mahomes,
he's goated because he's winning. Even when he's not winning,
he's still winning because they're making it to the Super Bowl.
They're the best representation of the teams, you know, in
the league, one of the two. So when I look
at the NBA, who has established what team has been
(13:46):
able to establish that this is what they are and
this is the player that's going to do it, there
hasn't been one. There hasn't been one. And that's why
Lebron James in a way by default going to the
super team that he was going to, you know, getting
started in Miami with with uh with Who's Tall Buddy?
(14:07):
Dwayne Wade as Bosh, Chris Bosh. I mean, then you
go back, you got you got love and you got
Kyrie irving in Cleveland, like who's tall buddy?
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Who's tall buddy? Thank you.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
I appreciate the pool too. I just I just feel
like where we're at right now. By the way, Bosch
does kind of get lost in that hole. He does
next and he was like he was like the main
catalysts for the one year that they want it. I mean,
if there's no Chris Bosh, they don't win it. They
don't win it. But my point is is that what
(14:42):
team had, what franchise and player connected to that franchise
has established that type of dominance in the NBA.
Speaker 4 (14:49):
So in a way, you can't go to guy.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
If their team isn't put Like, okay, we talk about
the Joker like he does this, he does he's the
best that I die.
Speaker 4 (15:01):
He should have been MVP again he gets MVP, but
he's got one championship. Who is dominating when? Like, if
you ass Michael Jeffrey Jordan, what mattered most to him,
He'll tell you winning championships mattered the most of him.
You can you can look at stats and all these
(15:22):
other things.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
What what a decent golf course and a casino and uh.
Speaker 4 (15:27):
You know, a couple of rocket ships walking around? I
mean it could be where are you going with it?
I'm just saying.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
I'm just saying winning, winning was most important to him,
not MVPs, not not any of these other you know,
distinguished because those things.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
Come when you win. When you win at all, those
those achievements and those accomplishments automatically follow. So to me,
I feel like where we're at right now, no one
has really grab the bulls by the horns in the NBA.
Not a team, not a player, not a duo of players.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
I mean, there are some pretty nice duos out there,
but none have proven to be a dominant like you
had the opportunity with Jalen and Tatum and this year
being able to maybe come back repeat. Now the conversation
continues on that fell apart, fell off of the rails.
(16:29):
There's not a team or a player or a set
of players that has been dominant enough to be goaded
and put in the conversation. And the crazy thing is
that's why you continue to hear the conversations about Lebron
James because no one has been able to really offset
what Lebron James represents to the NBA just yet. Great Stars,
(16:53):
Young Stars, SGA now has the opportunity to make it
more of a conversation as it applies to him. But
it's not an everyday thing where that's how it takes place.
You got to do this for more than one season,
so you could set the stage by doing what you
do this season. But then now, what are you going
to do next year? What are you going to do
(17:15):
the year after that? What are you going to do
year after that? Because in order to get goaded, you
gotta win, and you gotta win more than one time.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
Be sure to catch live editions of Two Pros and
a Cup of Joe with Brady Quinn, LeVar Arrington and
Jonas Knox weekdays at six am Eastern, three am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 2 (17:37):
Everybody, it is Jonas Knox here and at the Home Depot.
It is time for pros to source the whole job
with one partner. Ask about all we can do for
you at the pro Desk the Home Depot Pro It's
about time. Speaking of a pro. John Harbaugh's a pro.
He's a pro football coach. And he had another former
(18:00):
pro football coach in the building to kind of take
a gander at how things were operating there in Baltimore,
none other than John Gruden, and the current Ravens head coach.
Talked about the presence of Gruden there at Ravens OTAs to.
Speaker 4 (18:15):
Give you a general overview.
Speaker 6 (18:16):
He studied us, you know, and basically the message was,
you know, if I was game planning against you your defense,
what would I do and how would I attack you guys?
And he didn't just stop there. He watched our offensive guys.
He talked to our offensive guys, looked at all the players,
had something for each player just you know, phenomenal and
very very detailed, great teacher too.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
At what point does John Gruden get another shot? Because
I feel like we're inching closer towards him getting another opportunity,
Like he's.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Out in the public more he does like as a
head coach.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
I why not go get a college team and build
a college program.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
I mean, what's he waiting for? Is he still getting
paid by the Raiders? Is? I doubt? I'm sure that's
probably run out by now.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
It's twenty twenty one when it took place, probably ran
out by now.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
You know.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
That's a hard one to answer, I believe, because you
got to take into consideration the amount of opportunities he's
already received to be a head coach for one, then
for two, what does that look like after everything that
took place? Depending on what side you fall on in
(19:34):
terms of the politics of it all, is that going
to be acceptable? It seems as though the climate of
society and culture isn't necessarily slowing down in the racial category,
but it certainly is taking shifts away from different racial groups,
(19:57):
and it's settling in on different ones is at different.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
Times, right, All right, So now you guys can be offended.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
Right, And this month in particular isn't even connected to
a racial group. It's just connected to a certain group,
you know, I don't know what, yes, you do?
Speaker 4 (20:17):
What do you know?
Speaker 1 (20:18):
What you mean?
Speaker 4 (20:21):
It's it's I happen to have a birthday in this
month too.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
By the way, it's not my community.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
But anyway, I think the point a lot of you
have a lot of pride in your birthday. Isn't wrong
with that? I do too, everybody should.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
My favorite color is blue, I don't.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
I mean, I just second favorite is black. Damn. I'm
just being honest. He's going to get an opportunity at
some point. I don't, do you think. I just feel like.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
As a head coach, well, all we've heard is glowing
reviews from players who were there in Vegas, whether it
was Max Crosby or spoke about him, like other players
have talked about Gruden's presence there and how disappointed they
were in him getting let go.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
And there's people that feel like he kind of got screwed.
What he did was dumb. He shouldn't have done it,
he shouldn't have said it, he shouldn't have written it.
But I think there were people that feel he got
kind of screwed over well, he wasn't an innocent bystand
by any stretch of the imagination. I mean, his actions
were his actions, and it came to like based on
(21:46):
he was a bystander that was impacted by someone else's
actions and them being impacted. And that's where it gets
a little like kind of sketchy. How do you make
sense of it?
Speaker 3 (21:59):
Because this dude not been that type of dude, then
this information doesn't come out. And then with this information
coming out, then it exposes this dude over here. And
you want to say he was an innocent bystander that
got clipped, but he wasn't innocent and the.
Speaker 4 (22:16):
Way he did because he did it.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
So it's kind of like he didn't get screwed, but
he did get screwed. It's like a contradiction. It's a
conundrum the web.
Speaker 2 (22:26):
Of Dan Snyder and the people that have been caught
up in the web and this being one of them,
because that's why this happened, because they went through the
emails they found that. I mean, it still is wild
to me to think that in all of those forty
thousand emails or whatever the number was, that this is
what they pulled from.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
It, because I'm certain there's way way, way more egregious
things than a coach planned a Dozens on a union
leader and he exchanges like because that's what that's all
it is, is playing. That's that's the Dozens, that's what
he was doing. And and and people get sensitive when
(23:10):
it's a different racial group that joins into But there's
some coaches that are really good trash talkers. Man, the
Dozens like you talk, that's on people like you talk.
Ass if a black dude said what what John Grutin said,
it wouldn't have been no, Like, it's it's normal, it's normal.
(23:31):
But there's certain rules and parameters I guess that that
play a part in. And how like, if you're in
the locker room, you can have those types of conversations
and cats will laugh at it, like you'll laugh that
people will join in. And that's why I think, you know,
the people that were sitting there trying to say, guys
were Uncle Tom's that were were sticking up for Grooton
(23:53):
when it had first initially happened, Like you saw Warren sapping,
different guys coming out to to be you know, support
John Grutin it's like if you know him, you know
he's not you know, he's not a racist.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I don't know John Gruton that well. I've met him
a few times. I don't know him that well. But
the guys that have played for him had very strong
opinions that were, you know, in favor of just John
Gruten being John Gruton in those moments.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
And again like sometimes you.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Know, things can be let you know, let off into
the main stratosphere because the information has been released, and
people it's like like even you know, again, I'll post
stuff on social and I'll tell people and that or
die this, that and the other, and they get like
all sensitive, like I don't know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It's like.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Locker room culture, like football facility culture. It's its own culture.
And if you haven't lived in it and you haven't
been a part of it, then you can speak to
it as a fan if you want to, But in reality,
it's like, what are you really doing it for it
because you don't You'll never understand it unless you lived
(25:07):
in it.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
It's I think people also get a little insecure about
that because that is one of the things I've talked
to Brady about.
Speaker 4 (25:14):
This before to where.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
Like there there should be a respect level to yeah,
you don't get it, you've never been there. Like I
played high school, for I know what a high school
football locker room's like.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
But do you know how like when people do that,
you know, do you know how Like it's pretty funny
when you hear somebody say, well, I played football, I
was in high school, I played youth league. Like it's
not even any reason to say it that because it's
it's so it's so insignificant from even college. It's like,
(25:50):
it doesn't make any sense to even say, well, I
was in the locker room in high school. It's not
it's not the same. It's like and I just so
when I hear you guys talk about the law, I don't.
I look at it and I go, yeah, you're right,
that is.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Your That is an experience that only a few a
fraction of society can speak to. And I've heard stories
from other people have told me stories about a weird
stuff that's happened in a locker room.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
I mean some of the most outlendo things, some of
the most outlets things you'll ever hear.
Speaker 4 (26:21):
I remember, David, some of if some of the stuff
came out that was being done in locker rooms. John
Grutin's emails would see like romper room compared to some
of the stuff that people do in the locker room.
I remember my buddy David Anderson, who played in the
NFL for a while. He told me a story about
there was alignment he played with on the Texans who
(26:43):
used to eat his food in the stall while he
was on the toilet. He would eat like McDonald's or
whatever he was eating that day while he was on
the toilet. He just thought that that was the more
efficient way to eat his lunch. And then also, you know,
drop the kids off at the same time.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
I mean, there's way worse than that. There's way worse
than that. It's just like super repulsive things that take
place in the locker room, man, and for better or
for worse. Like, the only time it becomes an issue
is when somebody you know, feels like they need to
tell all about it or whatever it may be. You know,
(27:22):
it becomes an issue when it's an issue. But for
the most part, there are always a handful of dudes
that are going to do some wild s in the
locker room.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, and that's why I think there should be a
little more leeway given to that.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
If that's where but that's where the line gets blurred
really badly. It gets blurred really badly, because what you
do know is if it does become public knowledge, it's
almost like secret like secret service, right like you get
(28:02):
sent on a mission.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
We sent you, we paid you your commission to do it.
But if you get caught, we don't know you. That's
that's how it is.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
If you are if you are going to do something
that's going to possibly come up and bring reproach on you,
this team, this league, we don't know you. We don't
know you, and we don't owe you. So in these moments,
it doesn't matter what your reputation was. It doesn't matter,
(28:37):
you know, how good of a person you are, doesn't
matter how many Super Bowls you got, doesn't none of
those things matter.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
All that matters is the.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
Damning information that made it to the public to be consumed.
And now you've been judged by the public. That's all
that matters. And once that happens, you have to disassociate
yourself with those types of people. And that's what happened
with John Gruden and Will that happen Like I felt
(29:09):
like that could have possibly happened to the coach buddy
from from Miami when he started suing and he's like,
all right, I'm going to sue, and I thought he
might be done, Brian Flores, Brian Flores, but he ends
up getting onto a team. So obviously what he said
and what he went through and what he was putting
(29:29):
out there wasn't egregious enough for the ownership pool the
ring to say that he's out. I don't know for
certain what John Gruden's status is and that you know,
in that circle, but you would think after all this time,
(29:50):
you said, what year, twenty twenty one, twenty twenty one,
that's a long time, bro, that's a long time to
circle back and be like, you know what, let's give
him another go, because what does that say about your
coaching pool and development to begin with?
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Yeah, I mean I've thought, you know, maybe as an OC,
maybe in some capacity like that, Just the fact that.
Speaker 4 (30:16):
He's getting as many.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
That teams are consulting with him, like you know, it
was New Orleans last year, it was you know, Baltimore
this year. It just feels like we're inching closer towards
it being more of a possibility of him getting a
chance at some level in the NFL. So you know,
we'll keep you posted if we have any more developments
on John Gruden potentially back in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
With his I get I'll get kicked off the air.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
I was about to use what he said, Oh, I him,
and then it would have been funny and then but
then I might have lost my job. But it's so
funny because if he was joking, like if we was
joking about that in the locker room, everybody would have
been left and they would have turned that on him.
They would have said something about him, They would have
they would have played the dozens on him. In fact,
(31:05):
I mean there were a lot of people that didn't
even like to do that. He was he was speaking
on to begin with. Yeah, so there's that.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
There's that.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
But you know, when color gets involved and race gets
involved and it becomes a thing, you know, the league
has to handle those things in a certain type of way,
and it's always going to be handled the same way. Yeah,
hidden women, racially driven, you know, racially insensitive deals, inequality
(31:36):
type of dips, you're gonna be in trouble. Man, like
you're gonna be in some serious trouble. They've taken teams
away from owners off of being inappropriate, and they have
taken jobs away from coaches for being inappropriate, and they
have taken jobs away from players for being inappropriate.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
So you got to choose wisely.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Be sure to catch live editions of Two Pros and
a Cup of Joe with Brady Quinn, LeVar Arrington and
Jonas Knox weekdays at six am Eastern, three am Pacific.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
Do you want to mention some news that just came
out a short time ago. Uh, not the biggest surprise
in the world. This was the expectation at some point
if they couldn't get a deal done. But that's a
wrap Jay r Alexander has been cut by the Green
Bay Packers, so that is Uh, that'll wrap up his
(32:29):
time with the Green Bay Packers. That according to Ian Rappaport, Hey,
what's your.
Speaker 4 (32:37):
Reaction to that, Lee? How you feel? How does that
make you feel?
Speaker 3 (32:41):
Lee?
Speaker 7 (32:41):
Well, I'm bummed that he just never panned out as
a great player for for the whole season. He was
always injured. He never really lived up to the full potential.
He was great, He's a great player still still great
years old, but whatever.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Rub it in Sorry, please distraught. That was one of
his Packers jerseys. Sorry, didn't you have a gy your
Alexander Jersey. No, never to get I don't get players
who get stay injured.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
Oh gosh, geez, oh they're there. I guess, uh, the
organization don't keep players that stay injured. I think it
was more he wanted out. Okay, yeah, they they offered
him a restructured contract.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
He said he wanted to stay, but he was always
I don't know, he was always saying something like he
wanted out.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
By the way, did you see LEBARGI happened to see
the latest on Jalen Ramsey. Speaking of defensive backs, tell
everyone so the very latest on Jalen Ramsey. This also,
according to NFL Network, Ramsey will stay away from the
Dolphins off season program. They're still trying to trade him. God,
(33:49):
I can't imagine why they haven't been able to execute
a trade yet. It was almost like, you know, they
let everybody know it advance. Yeah, we're trading this player.
I still don't understand, and I know it's well, why
beat around the you know, why not make it public
that you know if you're going to move on from
a guy, and move on from a guy, why let
any of that information out? If you want to get
(34:09):
a trade done, and you are actually motivated to get
a trade done and you want to move a player,
why would you give any tell at all that you're
trying to trade the guy. If have conversations, you know,
with teams, if teams ask, hey, anybody available, I don't know,
what do you think about Jalen Ramsey? But instead you
come out and you tell everybody you're trying to trade
(34:31):
the guy. Why would teams around the league make a
move when they can just sign him if he gets released?
Like Jerry Alexander and the Packers probably had several conversations
with teams, but they're like, dude, they're just gonna end
up releasing them anyways, because it's been so public. I
just I don't I don't understand the thought, and teams
still do it, still talking, Oh well, listen, we're going
(34:53):
to try to trade. Like Chris Greer, the GM for
the Dolphins, say oh, we're going to try and trade
Jalen Ramsey.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Why go publicly that? Why not keep that behind close tours?
I don't.
Speaker 3 (35:04):
I then didn Jalen Ramsey make it so that they
had to go public though? Didn't he say, you know,
bit farewell to everyone in Miami.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
I think it was after Chris Greer. Was it after Yeah,
that's why I don't understand, Like, if you really we
get it.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
It didn't work. It hasn't worked out there.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
But do you feel as though he may have leveraged
them into having to say something, you know, I don't
like if y'all don't release me or trade me or whatever,
like I'm gonna let people know I'm not coming back.
Speaker 4 (35:36):
Yeah, but they came first the market.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
Players do that all the time though, to where they'll
do something passive aggressive on social media like that's that's
you know, the new move in the NFL, like or
the new move in sports where if somebody wants out,
oh they they unfollowed the team and they.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Put not no longer a part of it, like it's
not in their bio that they're on the team.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
It's like the new it's like the new Facebook relationship thing.
It's complicated.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
It's a good thing.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Why don't you just say I'm looking for something strange? Okay,
just say that. But these but like so players will
post that all the time the organization. You don't hear
gms come out even if he did post something like
that and come out and say, oh, yeah, we are
trying to trade him. Okay, So why would I do
a deal with you if he's just gonna get cut.
I'll just wait until he's available and I don't have
(36:27):
to give anything up for him. Just doesn't make any
sense to.
Speaker 3 (36:30):
Me unless you really need him. And if you have
a real need for him and you believe that he's
got enough gas in the tank, then you don't want
somebody else to get a hold of him. So you
try to figure out a deal. What does that look like?
What would that type of deal look like? How much
money is is? Is he you know, is his contract
worth like? What does that look like? I think that
(36:51):
that would play the biggest role in what takes place here.
If that's a too that's a nut that's too big
to crack, you're not going to go get them. And
and Miami has to know that going into this. So
what is the scenario Why why would you have not
tried to salvage the situation with him? And if it
(37:13):
were not a salvageable situation and you are indeed moving
on from him. I would have been way more aggressive
with trying to move him, you know, earlier on like
pre draft, you know all that, like the start of
the NFL season, the new NFL season. I would have
been all over that to try to make that work.
Why is this why is this drug out into June? Well,
(37:37):
it's like the Kirk Cousins stuff. At this point, Kirk
Cousins has two options because he you know, he wants
to play, he wants an opportunity, and he wants to
be elsewhere. And he talked to the Falcons. He went
to Arthur Blank, he you know, gave him his case
as to why he you know, can you trade me?
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Can you move on?
Speaker 2 (37:54):
And the Falcons are like, no, no, we want to
keep around for a veteran insurance at the backup quarterback spot.
We picked up his ten million dollar option. So if
you're Kirk Cousins, and this is just the cruel reality
of where he's at this offseason, if you're Kirk Cousins
at this point in the offseason, you got two choices, right,
you got two options. Either you're playing for the Falcons
(38:15):
next year, or somebody gets hurt and if a team
has a starting quarterback who gets hurt and they're desperate,
that's when you would see them make a move. But
at this point, to your point, it's a little late
in the game to start. It's a little light like
wheeling and dealing, and for whatever reason, you know, at
least you know the Packers have moved on reportedly from
(38:36):
JayR Alexander. That'll be done later on today, and then
we still wait to see what happens with Jalen Ramsey.
Now Aaron Rodgers is a Pittsburgh Steeler quarterback. Speaking of
former Packers, jay R Alexander is going to be one.
Aaron Rodgers is one. He's now the starting quarterback for
the Pittsburgh Steelers, as he signed his one year deal
over the weekend, made it official one year, nineteen million
(38:59):
dollars with incentives thirteen million dollars in change, but really
the guarantee is ten million dollars, So basically it's a
one year, ten million dollar deal and he can get
to those other numbers if he hit certain incentives in
certain benchmarks in the contract.
Speaker 5 (39:16):
All that.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
Can we talk Can we talk about this whole Aaron
Rodgers situation, him wearing number eight, who were number eight
in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (39:26):
I think they're a ponter did. But now he's going
to wear a number three. Why is he wearing number eight?
That's not what I want.
Speaker 3 (39:35):
I want to talk about Aaron Rodgers getting a one
year deal and getting ten million guaranteed and having an
upwards of nineteen million and escalators and incentives in his contract. Again,
I will say this, and I said this when they
got Russ and I said this when they got Buddy
(39:58):
from Chicago, Josh Justin Fields, when they got filled. So
you're saying Tramisky, No, I'm gonna say. I'm gonna say,
with the quarterbacks they brought in last year, you got
discounted rates for both of them, one still being on
(40:19):
their their rookie contract, the other one just not having
any value at this point in time when you brought
them on. So you have two quarterbacks that are pretty
comparable and what their contracts look like, and so there's
no real you know, you have the feeling there's no
(40:41):
real loss if neither one of them proves out. Now
you do that one off season with two former starters
of two different organizations last season, that's fine, is it,
okay to do it two seasons in a row. It
works so good last year, Well, it didn't work so
(41:01):
good last year. Pushing through your sarcasm, it didn't work
very well last year. In fact, it did not work
to the degree of where you didn't want one of
the quarterbacks. Speculation says that you possibly wanted one of
the quarterbacks back, and both of them are gone and
(41:22):
you go back to a quarterback that was a starter
for you from before that. Really, which if you look
this up, Lee or you Jonas is Mason Rudolph eight
and four as the starting quarterback of the Pittsburgh Steelers.
I think he's a winning record quarterback during his tenure
(41:46):
as a Pittsburgh Steeler quarterback. Nonetheless, they did not prove
out and show that they were a Super Bowl contending
team with Mason Rudolph. And so now you bring him back.
You got Will Howard the draft pick.
Speaker 4 (42:03):
Is he the guy?
Speaker 3 (42:05):
So is the setup in the scenario of this to say,
Aaron Rodgers gives us one year to give Will the
opportunity to learn from Aaron Rodgers, watch his habits, watch
how he studies, study him, and learn from him.
Speaker 4 (42:23):
If something were to happen.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
Mason Rudolph is our safety net to put in so
that we can still try to be competitive for the season,
and then at some point we're going with will as
our starting quarterback. If that's what it is, then I
don't know at this point, is it? I feel like,
is it? It's prudent to let the plan be made known.
(42:47):
This is what we're planning on doing. This is why
we didn't sign Aaron Rodgers to a long term contract.
This is why we didn't sign Aaron Rodgers to a
large contract because this is what we're planning on doing.
But we do feel as though we can improve our team,
impact our team right now with a motivated Aaron Rodgers.
(43:08):
Which now the question becomes, with everything that he's gone
through and all the speculation with good authority, what it
is that he's experienced this offseason, with the personal things
he's had to get through, does it translate into Aaron
Rodgers coming in and having one amazing year And if so,
(43:29):
then now doesn't that create another issue where now the
conversation has to be we gave him a one year contract,
he played his ass off, he played well. Are you
rewarding him with a long term con Are you rewarding
him with a different contract, I think, or are you
moving on and sticking to the plan of what it
may have been to move on to Will Howard, who
(43:50):
you drafted in this year's draft class. I think he's
hit a one year at a time basis at this
point in his career. And I think he said as
much in interviews as well too, is that you know,
just gonna take it one year at a time.
Speaker 4 (44:03):
If he plays well enough this year and they.
Speaker 2 (44:05):
Have a good year and he looks, you know, more
like the Rogers of old, and what looks more like
the Rogers we saw in the back end of last
year when he played much better. I mean, I think
then the conversation becomes, well, let's just do it again,
Like why wouldn't we just do it again, especially if
they're out of contention and getting a top draft pick.
(44:26):
But at some point they're going to have to figure
out their quarterback of the future, and they've been scrambling
to do that for years now. I mean, you know,
Ben Roethlisberger got a red ass when they took Mason
Rudolph in the third round or whatever it was. I
remember talking about it at the time when Roethlisberger called
into a sports radio show in Pittsburgh and it was
(44:50):
like a Saturday Saturday afternoon. He called into some sports
radio show in Pittsburgh and was just sort of criticizing
the Steelers. Well, why would we take a quarterback there?
There were other positions of me that we needed, et cetera,
et cetera. They should have addressed their quarterback of the
future conversation a long ass time ago, because since Roethlisberger's
final year, what they had since an he picket didn't
(45:14):
work didn't work.
Speaker 4 (45:15):
It just it just didn't work. For whatever reason you had.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
Nothing has worked out. No we could give the names.
Nothing has worked out. In fact, the last days of
Ben Roethlisberger didn't work out. That didn't work out as well.
So it wasn't like you left him prematurely.
Speaker 4 (45:34):
He was done too. Is just that the idea of
replacing a replacement has not that has not surfaced me.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
So let me ask you that, because there was I
think it was Adam Schefter who said on Friday or
it was over the weekend at some point and he
made the mention that Aaron Rodgers is the Packers third option,
that they were all in on wanting to get Matthew Stafford.
That didn't work. They wanted to resign Justin Fields anyone elsewhere,
and so they end up with Rogers. Whether that's true,
(46:05):
who knows.
Speaker 4 (46:06):
But Mike, this is what I do know.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
Whether you kept Justin Fields, whether you got Aaron Rodgers,
whether you kept Russell Wilson, whether you brought in Mason Rudolph,
whether you drafted Will Howard, is there anything else we want?
Speaker 2 (46:22):
Well, whether you win and got let me ask you
this though, because let's let's play that out. That okay,
they wanted Matthew Stafford. Well there's other teams that wanted
Matthew Stafford as well too. He ended up staying with
the Rams. The Justin Fields conversation, well, they wanted Justin Fields.
He chose to go to the Jets. And I look
at that and I'm like, what does that mean? Why
(46:48):
would he choose the Jets over the Steelers? And you know,
the easy answer is, well, because of money. They offered
him more guaranteed money, so on and so forth. I
feel like the Steelers probably could have stepped up. It's
not like Justin Field's got this monster contract. In comparison,
to other quarterbacks in the NFL, the Steelers, you know,
had they wanted him bad enough, they would have stepped
(47:09):
up and made the move and made the money right
to try and keep him. But it just goes back
to Mike Tomlin has been through all these different combinations
of quarterbacks that they've been trying since Roethlisberger walked away,
and this feels like Mike Tomlin at the end of
this being like, hey man, we're going to give it
(47:31):
one last go. And Lvar you brought this up last offseason.
I think Tomlin's days are numbered, Like I think if
this doesn't work, you'd have to assume that that's that's
what comes next. And that's why I continue to have
the conversation the way that I continue to have the conversation,
like what is your ultimate end by bringing in Aaron Rodgers.
(47:55):
You're bringing him in at this this this price, this
price tag. Where does that price tag rank with all
the other quarterbacks in the league right now? That's not
even half, No, that's not even half of a one.
Speaker 3 (48:08):
Year guarantee for some of these upper echelonts qbs, it's
not even had because it's like starting at like forty
these days. Right, it's like high thirties forties per year. Yeah,
So you got him with ten million guaranteed and an
(48:28):
upwards of nineteen million dollars and he took it, and
he took it, So you got to take into consideration
what that means. He took well below market value of
a position that he could have required way more.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
He took it.
Speaker 3 (48:50):
Now people will sit out there and nail. Conventionally, the
conventional wisdom response to what I just said is he's
good enough, he's made enough. He can go prove that
he's that good and the money can come from somewhere else, right, Like,
this could be a different situation.
Speaker 4 (49:08):
But I don't.
Speaker 3 (49:09):
I don't think that that's it. I think that this
is the best price he could get if he's going
to continue to play, and this could be his best
opportunity to try to have success before he ends his career.
And if that's the case, I just feel like those
are hard circumstances. A one year contract, a team that's
trying to figure it out, just got rid of their
(49:30):
number one, all right, they bring in DK whatever, blase blah.
I just don't think that this is a recipe that
is going to yield a very good looking or great
tasting product that is consumable.
Speaker 4 (49:44):
I just I don't feel that way right now.
Speaker 5 (49:46):
Lee.
Speaker 4 (49:46):
You've got the number from what I'm seeing.
Speaker 7 (49:49):
If you were to look at his thirteen point six,
and even if you looked at his nineteenth, he would
still nineteen million. He would be ranked at nineteenth Steelers
just behind Justin Field at twenty million dollars ever annually
with the Jets, ahead of rookie cam Ward in Tennessee,
who's getting twelve this year.
Speaker 3 (50:05):
As a rookie, as a rookie, as a rookie on
a slotted scale. You guys don't think slotted scale contract.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
You guys don't think I if Rogers wanted to haggle
the Steelers and squeeze a couple more million out of them,
he couldn't come on, Darren Rodgers.
Speaker 3 (50:21):
I mean. But again, that's that's the point that I'm making.
The point is is that that is what he took.
That is what he's getting, and that is what they're
paying him. And you're gonna get if you're talking about
getting the top CEO for your company and you want
to steal him away for her away from this company
over here to bring him to your company and get
what you pay for. You get what you pay for
(50:43):
what you pay for, And I think that that's ultimately
what this comes down to. Like you could be thinking
you're getting a discounted, you know, rate for the same
thing that you're getting, but you're ultimately you're only worth
what people are willing to pay you. And whether it's
a car, whether it's like it's like I was talking
(51:04):
to somebody about mister Styx the other day and they
asked me, you know, they're they're thinking about getting a
boor bull and this that and the other and da
dah dah and this and that. We went through it,
talked through it, breeders died this, that did a lot
of homework, blase blah. This is what I paid for
when I wanted to get this dog in particular, and
that's what I paid for. And then he told me
(51:26):
what he was paying for to get his and I said, well,
that's what you're gonna get. I mean, that's that's fourteen
off of what I paid. So if you think you're
going to get the same the same quality, good luck.
I mean, maybe maybe it does happen. Maybe maybe you
(51:48):
do feel like, the quality of the dog is that
of one that you would have to pay top dollar for.
And maybe that happened, but maybe it didn't. But you
do know what you're getting for when you pay top
dollar for what you paid for.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
Did you just call Aaron Rodgers a borble?
Speaker 3 (52:04):
Uh?
Speaker 5 (52:05):
No?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
And if I did, I would have said he was
the borble that's fourteen off from the other barble, which
I mean, is he okay with me? Is he okay
with being in that situation? Like you're being paid, you're
being paid like a backup, but you're going to be
asked to do what starters do. That's right, Okay, Well
(52:27):
there you go. Stillers
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