Data Beats Opinions

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome in podcast listeners. Hope all of you are having
a fantastic Friday as you roll into the weekend. We've
got a great show for you. The Governor of Oklahoma
swings by UH to talk with us about what it
was like to be there at the Oklahoma City Thunder
game when the Utah Jazz had Rody Gobert test positive
and suddenly the game was stopped. We'll discuss that with
him wild seen there, as well as what it's like

(00:21):
to be a governor right now who is considering and
planning as he is to just reopen his state. All
of that plus will be joined by Lance Taylor, and
also we'll chat with Ryan Glaspiegel. We have hired a
bunch of new people at OutKick. I am ecstatic about that, UH,
and Ryan has already posted his first article. Encourage you
to go read it. At OutKick. We are growing the

(00:43):
OutKick business at a time when a lot of places
are shutting down, and UH, We're gonna have a lot
of fun and a lot of good conversations and articles
from him in the weeks and months ahead. All that
still to come, but the podcast begins now. It's live
six to nine am. Eastern, but fortunately for you, you you
get it now and enjoy. I'll kick the Coverage with
Clay Travis live every weekday morning from six to nine

(01:07):
a m. E Stern three to six am Pacific on
Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for OutKick the
Coverage at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us
live every morning on the I Heart Radio app by
searching fs are you're listening to Fox Sports Radio. I

(01:29):
told you yesterday that I would talk about the name,
image and likeness aspect of the n C Double A's decision,
and also I wanted to talk about the bigger picture
of college athletics in general, because I do believe it's
a big story that deserves a lot of attention. Both
of those kind of intersecting simultaneously. Uh So, let me

(01:51):
begin with this. One of the biggest questions that I
have gotten ever since Rudy Gobert stepped off of the court, is, Hey, Clay,
what do you think is gonna happen with sports going forward?
It's probably the number one question that I have gotten.
It's probably the number one question most of you have
wondered about in general, and of all the sports, the

(02:13):
number one sport that I've been questioned about the most
is football, and that's not gonna surprise you because football
dominates and people care more about football than they do
anything else in this country in terms of viewership, and
so a lot of you out there would say, right now, hey,
if I could, if I gave you an option, if
I said to you, hey, you can sign the uh,

(02:36):
you can sign away the NBA season, the Major League
Baseball season, UH, the MLS season, and also the NHL season.
You'll sign away the paperwork on all of that. If
I guarantee you that college football and the NFL will
both be back in every game will be played. I
think a huge percentage of my audience right now that

(02:59):
is listening to me would say, you know what, that
is a trade that I would be happy to make.
I really do think that the vast majority of you
would believe that. And one of the big questions associated
with that has been to the NFL's credit. On this show,
I have praised the NFL to the high heavens for

(03:20):
not changing their decision when it came to free agency.
It was wildly popular. There were a lot there's a
lot of pressure on the league to change their decision
when it came to free agency, they didn't do it. Uh,
And they made the right decision to keep going. And
also there was a large discussion about whether or not
the NFL Draft should go on, and that happened and
it worked flawlessly, and it made a ton of decision

(03:42):
as well. And UH, and I have said that it's
important for the message to get out there, UH, that
the NFL plans on being back in the fall. And
I think the NFL will be back in the fall.
I'm a season ticket holder for the Tennessee Titans in
my hometown of nash where I live, and I believe
that not only will the NFL be back, I think

(04:05):
that NFL fans will be able to attend some NFL
games this year because I think things are gonna get
a lot better in the summer. I think if you
look at the direction we're going in terms of finding
treatments for the coronavirus, I think there's a lot of
reason for optimism and positivity that is out there in
the public in general. Okay, I believe that to be

(04:26):
the truth, beyond the shadow of a doubt. UM. Now,
a lot of you have also said, well, what do
you think Clay is going to happen as it pertains
to the return of college football, And I haven't talked
a lot about that, uh in general on this show
because there's so many different moving parts, other than to say,

(04:48):
in a general sense, I believe college football will be played,
and I certainly believe college football will be played in
the South. You already got a bunch of Southern states
opening up Tennessee, you got uh, you got Florida starting
to open up on Monday. You've got Georgia, You've got Texas,

(05:09):
You've got Oklahoma, and oh, by the way, well, you're
gonna talk with Oklahoma's governor later in this program, so
I will talk directly with him, uh, and we will
discuss this straight up, like what do you think is
going to happen going forward? You're responsible for Oklahoma and
Oklahoma State. All of that we will discuss. But the

(05:30):
number of colleges that have come out and said, hey,
we're gonna be back in the fall is pretty seismic.
And let me explain and give you some of those
schools because they're from a variety of the country right
right now, and these numbers are constantly changing, uh. Right now,
here are the universities that I have seen announced that

(05:53):
they are going to be back in the fall, that
they're planning on students being back on campus and being
back and rolling Alabama, l s U, Georgia, Oregon, Perdue, Miami, Iowa,
Iowa State, Missouri, Washington State, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma State. Now,

(06:15):
we're gonna talk with the Governor of Oklahoma later in
the program, and I'll ask him specifically about the decision
at Oklahoma and at Oklahoma State. I should say we're
scheduled to talk to the governor of Oklahoma, because crazy
things can always happen, obviously with politician schedules, but he
is scheduled to join us right now in the program,

(06:36):
and so I will directly ask him about the decision
at Oklahoma and Oklahoma State, and how do you make
that decision about working with those universities whether they're gonna
come back. All of those schools are sending an important
message that they believe students need to be back on
campus in the fall, and I believe that's true for

(06:56):
both college kids and also for elementary kids. And people say, Okay,
what do you think. I think the best way you
can demonstrate what you really think is bet by your
own lifestyle decisions. Let me explain what I mean. I
believe that I have three kids. Like many of you

(07:18):
out there who have children, or certainly if you have
grandchildren as well, the most important thing in my life
is my three boys. I have a twelve year old,
I have a nine year old, and I have a
five year old. I got a kid who didn't have
to finish sixth grade, I got a kid who didn't
have to finish third grade, and I got a pre K.
So next year I will have a seventh grader, I

(07:40):
will have a fourth grader, and I will have a
kid and gardner. I believe all three of those boys,
who I love more than anything in the world and
who mattered to me more than anything in the world,
I believe all three of them should be back in school.
If they were college kids, I would believe they should
go back to wherever college campus they are attending, and

(08:02):
they should be in school for the fall on their
college campus. So you say, what is the basis by
which you make that decision. It's a good question, it's
a fair question. The data reflects that college kids are
more likely and elementary school kids, and your infants. All
of those groups are more likely to die of the

(08:26):
flu than they are to die of the coronavirus. This
is incontrovertible fact. If you are twenty two are younger,
you are statistically more likely to die from the flu
than you are to die from the coronavirus. That is
not true for all ages. Okay, that is statistically true

(08:50):
for people who are twenty two years or younger. Almost
none of them are remotely impacted by the coronavirus in
any way. We need to get him back in school.
And as part of getting those kids back in school
when college is open back up, we also need all
the kids who are playing college football to be back

(09:10):
in school. We need them to be playing as well.
Now the challenge for colleges, and I gotta give credit
to Mitch Daniels, who's a former governor from the state
of Indiana who is now the president of Purdue University
in Indiana. He was the first person who I saw
as a president of a university to actually step out
there and say this publicly. One of the things that

(09:35):
scares me about our society today. Baby scares me more
than anything, certainly scares me more than the coronavirus is
If facts make people uncomfortable, there's lots of people who
won't say them. This is a big deal right as
we talk about the return of sports. It is a

(09:56):
fact that young, healthy people are in virtually no danger
from the coronavirus. That is in controvertible fact. If you
are in your twenties or your teens, and you are
listening to me right now, you physically yourself are in

(10:17):
virtually no danger of dying of the coronavirus. Now, that
doesn't mean that there might not be a teenager or
a twenty something or somebody who's in their young thirties
that dies of the coronavirus, right, I can tell you
right now, Hey, the most dangerous part of your trip

(10:40):
is very frequently the drive to the airport. The odds
of you being on a commercial jetliner and it crashing
are virtually zero. Doesn't mean it's not gonna happen, right
There will be a commercial jetliner that goes down at
some point in the next decade and a lot of

(11:03):
people will die on it. Some of those people will
have said, oh, man, I never I knew I never
should have gone on an airplane before. But the statistical
probability of that happening is nearly zero. We got airplanes,
even now with the way the economy is shut down,
we got airplanes taken off all over the country, flying everywhere.

(11:25):
The chances of your plane going down are almost zero. Similarly,
the chances of you dying of the coronavirus are almost zero.
Doesn't mean there're zero right, people will die at young
ages of the coronavirus. Statistically it will be almost zero percent.

(11:45):
It's not gonna be zero percent, But there is risk
to everything that we do in life, and we have never,
to my knowledge shut down a university in my life,
certainly in recent history, because some people might die of
the flu. And there are way more people who are

(12:09):
going to die of the flu that our college age
every year than so far have died of the coronavirus.
So the safest thing for the country, honestly, is for
college football to come back, and also for all of
those college kids out there to be on campus spreading
the coronavirus among each other. We need for her immunity

(12:33):
to start to happen, and the best way for her
community to happen is for people who have almost zero
risk of serious health consequences to be passing this virus
around amongst themselves. And this is the next step beyond
what Mitch Daniels said. We can't stop a virus from spreading.

(12:54):
It's almost impossible. The way that you stop coronavirus and
get sports back is by one of two things. Either
we find a vaccine and everybody can be vaccinated across
the entire country, and that means that nobody is able
to get this virus. Right the vaccine, Remember, doesn't mean

(13:15):
the virus doesn't exist. It just means you can't get
it because you've already been exposed to it, and because
you already have the vaccine. We have measles, moms, rubella,
chickenpox vaccines. Remember this is significant. It doesn't mean that
the virus doesn't exist. Certainly, the virus still exists in
some ways. This is why vaccination is so important. But

(13:41):
in general, those viruses don't spread because people have been
vaccinated against them. Right, So, if you're vaccinated against the coronavirus,
it doesn't mean that the coronavirus is not still going
to exist, that COVID nineteen is not still going to exist.
It just means it won't spread right, that's one way
you can stop it, and it might take a year
or more. We don't know how long it's gonna take

(14:03):
to actually have a virus that's able to be beaten
by a vaccine. The other way you beat the coronavirus,
and this is what Sweden is discussing, is you beat
it by her immunity. What has her immunity? That is
when a significant enough portion of the population already has

(14:26):
the antibodies to the virus because they've already had it
such that it doesn't spread anymore. And people talk now about, oh,
we gotta be concerned about the second wave if we
in the lockdown and people go back out and go
back to work, and oh my god, what are you
gonna do when the outbreak happens on a college campus.

(14:47):
I think it's actually a good thing if the outbreak
happens on a college campus. We want outbreaks to happen
in our young, healthy community, as opposed to in nursing
homes where people are old and unhealthy and where the
outbreak can end up killing people. We need and want
this outbreak to spread among young, healthy populations. Now, colleges

(15:12):
are gonna have to come up with policies to protect
older professors or janitors or health workers on the campus
who are older and more susceptible to the virus. But
for eighteen to twenty two year old the best thing
they can do is actually not be sheltered. It's to

(15:33):
be able to go out in public and spend their
time circulating, keeping the economy rolling, going and learning at
school because a huge percentage of those kids who get
this would be asymptomatic, but they would mostly be surrounded
by other kids of their own age, meaning this virus

(15:54):
would burn out really, really quickly among college campuses. Right.
It would spread, if this is as contagious as we
seem to think, rapidly through dorms and through college classrooms
and through college facilities, but the vast majority of people
who get it would be young and healthy, and therefore

(16:17):
there would be nothing to fear. Within a month most colleges,
or six weeks most colleges would have HERD immunity, which
would be the best thing that could possibly happen to
our country because the millions of college kids that get
this and or have already had it, by the way,
would help us to stop the pread spread of the

(16:39):
virus going forward. All of this is why it's integral
that we have kids back on a college campus and
returned to a sense of normalcy, and that then leads
to college football. Coming back to now, what would college
football look like. I can make an argument for you
that college football and college scientists, if they're looking at

(17:03):
the data, would say, hey, we can have crowds on
the college campus, but no one under the age of
forty or forty five or maybe fifty is allowed to
attend a college football game this fall. And some of
you are like, Wow, that's a crazy idea, And I'm
thinking to myself, Well, the data, if you look at it,

(17:25):
reflects that if you are under the age of fifty
and otherwise healthy, you have almost nothing to fear from
the coronavirus in terms of hospitalization, in terms of death.
Now again, I'm not saying that if you know a
forty six year old, he or she might not die
from the coronavirus. I'm not saying that a eighteen year

(17:47):
old or twenty eight year old might not die of
the coronavirus either. What I'm telling you is they are
statistical anomalies. They are outliers. They are not representative of
the larger population. And I'm also saying, hey, if you
are a college kid and you have immune system issues,

(18:07):
or if you are really unhealthy, you shouldn't be back
on a college campus. Colleges should also allow kids who
feel like they aren't able or willing, or it's not
smart for them to be on a college campus. They
should also allow them to remotely be able to sit
back and watch their classes remotely, like a lot of

(18:30):
kids have finished their spring semesters doing. But we gotta
get the average, the normal, the young, and the healthy
eighteen to twenty two year old back on campus. And
I hope we're gonna be able to play college football
as well if we follow maybe a guideline of either

(18:51):
not having fans present, or if we're gonna have fans present,
put in an age restriction in terms of who's allowed
to enter into the stadium. And maybe we also say, hey,
only a third of the seats in the stadium are
able to be occupied. Heck, maybe we say only college
kids can go to games. Ostensibly, the reason why the

(19:12):
college and university exists there is to allow um college
kids to be student athletes and be able to watch
their fellow student athletes. Maybe the answer is only college
kids are allowed to go to these games. Maybe you
have to have a student I D in the fall
to be able to get on the college campus. And

(19:33):
we're trying to create a bubble surrounding those college campuses.
So those eighteen to twenty two year olds are the
only ones who who are able to UH to get
to to get into the games. And maybe you allow
those college kids to spread out in the stadiums so
that you know they're fifteen or twenty thousand college kids there,

(19:53):
and maybe you allow them to spread out in the
stadium so that there is more flexibility there. I don't
know what the answer is going to be. We have
a lot of summer to get through to see what
the data shows us now. But I've seen enough data
to know that college kids need to be back on
campuses and that it makes complete sense. Now. I told
you I was going to talk about name, image and likeness,

(20:15):
and I will do that in the next segment here
coming up at the top of UH the next hour,
we'll do that. Maybe at the top of our two
I'll talk about name, image and likeness. This is outkicked
the coverage with Clay Travis welcoming in Lance Taylor jocks
down in Birmingham. He is at the Lance Taylor on Twitter.

(20:39):
Uh lt. What's the latest so far as you understand
it in the state of Alabama. In Tennessee, we can
now go to restaurants, we can go to retail stores. Um,
everything is slowly starting to open up, albeit in a
totally different way. What are you seeing in your state? Well,
I think to see its taking a big step. We

(21:01):
have taken a baby step. Our governor at k I
V came out a couple of days ago and no restaurants.
I can't get my hair cut still. I don't understand that.
I mean, I drive by a home depot and there's
three people there, but I can't win in a one
on one situation to get my hair cut. UM. Retail
right now is at um of max capacity. So again

(21:25):
we're slowly moving, I guess in the right direction. You know,
I hate it for restaurants, and I've been doing a
ton of the curb side and carry out and I'll
continue to do that. But you know the weather has
been so nice. They're forecasting five and sunny all weekend
here and bringing him and I just don't you know
what these outdoor patios and you know, I mean said
this up strategically, we're doing capacity and every third or

(21:47):
fourth table is going to be marked up and you
can only have six tops, and I mean, I just
think we can use common sense and slowly get this
thing going in a better direction. But we're you know,
a little bit behind you, guys. Unfortunately we're talking to
Lance Taylor. So how do you think that this is
one of the interesting things. I can't even imagine what

(22:07):
the haircut places are gonna be like in this country
when the haircut places officially opened back up. I mean,
this is I know there are a lot of people
probably out there that are cutting their own hair. Barbershops
are locked down most places. I mean, this is gonna
be one of the hugest rushes I would imagine for
haircuts probably in the history of America. Right, Yeah, I

(22:29):
can't even imagine. Um, you know, I don't know how
you know, you go about getting your haircut. Typically, like
one of my best friends on the Swan and I'm
a complete payment his ask because I'm just the guy
that shows up without an appointment. Yeah, that's what I know.
He's got all these He's got all these desperate housewives
that have you know, got their cut and color scheduled
for like six weeks in advance, and I just time

(22:50):
it out. I'll sit there and just play around on
my phone until he has a quick five to ten
at an opening and I'll just jump in. But I
think it's gonna be nearly impossible because you know everyone,
I mean, you know, I'm not going to name names,
but you watch certain we'll just say sports programs or
even news programs now and you see a lot of
blonds that are now brunettes because the roots have drawn out.

(23:10):
So yeah, you know, I think there, man, I'm sure
there's some of these people that are underground and they're
actually going to uh oh yeah, there's no they said
it was a new speakeasy. Is the uh the salon,
the stylist going out or or you actually come in
and you do some kind of knock to get your
hair done. So I'm sure behind the scenes some of
this is happening, But you're right, I mean, the demand
for this is going to be insane. And imagine, you know,

(23:33):
on top of that, just like nail technicians for for
the chicks to get the manner manicures and the pedicures. Yeah,
I mean it's wild too. Uh, it's wild to think about.
And you know, I know, like if you're a high
end athlete, like you found a way to work out,
and I'm sure high end athlete trainers are still working
out too. I think if you're super high end, I

(23:54):
think a lot of people have been bringing in their
own like stylist, right Like, even though we're on the
lockdown and everything else, I think the super high end
have probably made out all right. Well. Yeah, because if
you're a stylist and uh, you know, and you look
at the numbers and you're not really worried about this
affecting you, and your bottom line has been cut into

(24:15):
I mean, I mean they can't earn right now. They're
completely shut down. And somebody's gonna pay me two it
and fifty dollars to go to their house for an hour,
or they're going to come to my shop for an hour. Yeah,
I'm gonna make that happen. We're talking to Lance Taylor. Uh.
The big story has been certainly the quarterback position, and
too has been a part of that. He's now been
drafted by the Dolphins and Jamis Winston is now with

(24:41):
the Saints. The reason why I bring up Jamis is
Jamis is from the Birmingham area in general, Hugheytown, Alabama.
I think, if I'm not mistaken, but he's never really
been a beloved figure in the state of Alabama. It
doesn't seem like which do you think, Alabama? Uh, you know,
the state of Alabama and Joe Role. Obviously Auburn people

(25:01):
aren't big to a fans, but how much more popular
is to uh even having gone to Alabama than Jamis Is.
So it's not even close. Like most places, if they
have a first round quarterback come out of a football
crazy place, most places would be all in on Jamis.
It's always kind of surprised me that the state of

(25:22):
Alabama doesn't seem like it's really much of a Jamis
Winston state. Right, Does that make sense? Well? Yeah, I'll
start here though. Just the attitude of the two players.
I mean, you know, one seemed cocky, one seemed confident,
and then you just put the baggage in Tallahassee with
Jamis and you know, I mean obviously the one thing
that really jumps out is you know that documentary, what

(25:44):
was it called the hunting Ground. Yeah, um, yeah, I
think that was the name of the But you know,
you've got that. You just had a lot of situations
with Jamis and with two of I mean, it's just
been a clean slate, and he just seems like, you know, uh,
one of these poster boys. So I guess what I'm saying,
as Auburn fans are more likely probably to be rooting
for tuh even though he went to Alabama than they

(26:06):
are Jamis, even though he didn't have any real connection Auburn.
Maybe unique because Florida State beat Auburn in the title game,
But I just think it's kind of fascinating the dynamic
around Jamis Winston. Yeah, and I think maybe some people
were upset that he went out of state. You know this, Yeah,
factory went out. He went out of state to play
not only for then one of the premier college football
programs that ultimately wins. Not only at heism trove people

(26:29):
to the national championship, but he went to play for
one of the iconic college baseball coaches of all time
in Mike Martin. So you know, Jamie's for a lot
of people believe would end up going the Major League
baseball path ends up going number one overall. But I
see what you're saying. I mean, anybody, and you were
dead on with Uee Town, anybody that comes from a
small community like that, you typically the state rallies around
that guy. But I wonder if it's just a combination of,

(26:50):
you know, some of the character issues and the fact
that he did Bolton go out of state when you
look at at to UH, what do you expect from
him in uh in the NFL? Not a surprise that
Nick Say even came out and said, Hey, he reminds
me of a left handed Drew Brees. He's gonna say
positive things about his quarterback. Do you believe that to
a will be in All Pro caliber player? Would you

(27:11):
put money on it? You know I wouldn't because of
this now, Clay, if you were to tell me that
he you know, averages playing you know, fifteen games per
season over ten years, I think he's gonna be a
Hall of Fame guy. And obviously gotta have some talent
talent around you, but he is, I mean, he's an
elite guy. And we watched him in Alabama and you
can say what you want about the talent surrounding to

(27:33):
uh A, J McCarron was really good. He wasn't close
to what it is I mean to the accuracy. I mean,
he's got the intangibles, but the problems of durability. So
I would bet against it just based on the fact
he couldn't stay healthy for full twelve game seasons in
UH college football in the SEC, I just don't think,
you know, and especially once we get to a seventeen
game season in the NFL, I just don't see the

(27:54):
durability being there. I hope it is for two because
he shames again like a great kid, and I do
believe if he stays he's healthy, he's gonna be a
Hall of Fame quarterback. Um, And that's really the question
is whether or not he can stay healthy. What about
Joe Burrow? On the other hand, we didn't talk to
you last week on Friday. We missed you after the draft.
So what do you think about Joe Burrow? The over
under right now for Burrow? I believe, at least at

(28:16):
Fox bet is twenty one and a half touchdowns. He's
the favorite to win the Offensive Rookie of the Year.
Do you like either of those bets? Uh? No, not
necessarily again, I don't know. You can say, and you
can make the argument, it's an easy argument. Outside of
Cam Newton two of the ten, Joe Burrow has the
greatest college football season we've ever seen. Those numbers are

(28:37):
completely ridiculous what he was able to do end routes
one fifteen and winning a national championship. But I would
even ask you this. I mean two things. Andy Dalton
had a a you know, an above winning percentage, a
percentage when he was at Cincinnati. Forgot what the exact
numbers were, but he went to the postseason five times.
Will he even equal what Andy Dalton did as far

(28:59):
as win percentage of starting quarterback? Will you even get
to the postseason? And on top of that, if I
ask you even money right now, would you take your
money in Las Vegas and you can go, will Joe
Burrow ever won a postseason game? Yes? Or no? Which
way do you lean on that? It's first of all,
it's a great point because I do think that a
lot of people believe, you know, they hear the Bengals
and they think, oh, they've always stunk. The last two

(29:20):
quarterbacks the Bengals have drafted Carson Palmer and Andy Dalton
with high draft picks have both panned out, which makes
it all the more debilitating. I think the Bengal fans
that I believe I'm correct they haven't won a postseason
game since I think that's accurate. I don't have the
Bengals postseason studs in front of me right now. You
know you're you're right. It's been years. Okay, so uh

(29:42):
so winning a game in the postseason is really hard
to do and it's underrated. How many really good quarterbacks
have only won a game or two or have never
done it. I would go over because I do think
that at some point in time, Bengal ands are gonna
be get static. They're not gonna like you know that

(30:03):
it's not going to continue forever. But I mean there's
a guy up up the road a little bit in
Matthew Stafford, who has been really good with the Detroit Lions.
And I was looking at the data because my wife
was talking about this. I think it's nineteen fifty six.
The Detroit Lions have won one playoff game since nineteen
fifty six. Matthew Stafford hasn't won any I believe Matthew Staffords.

(30:28):
Stafford's border line of league quarterback. I would put him
in the top ten, probably eight, nine or ten. Right now.
In the NFL, I was gonna bring him up. Matthew
Stafford's never want a postseason game. Dak Prescott going into
year fours, the starting quarterback with the Dallas Cowboys is
won one. It is a difficult thing to do, and
if I was putting money on it right now, I
lean Joe Burrow doesn't want to postseason game. Because you
mentioned the two quarterbacks Carson Palmer and Andy Dalton. I

(30:51):
think he's gonna be somewhere in between those. You know,
I think a best case scenario, and I could be
completely wrong and he could end up being, you know,
the next Yew Montana. But I think the best case
scenario for Burrow is kind of a Carson Palmer career
without the injuries. Yeah, Burrow to me, the way he
moves in the pocket and the way he sees down
the field, if they can surround him with enough weapons
and protect him. I like his ability to make plays

(31:13):
because I like his decision making. But to your point,
I mean, it is super hard to actually win a
playoff game, and certainly, I mean, I don't have to
say that the Bengals fans who know because they have
a one one since LT Thanks my man. As always,
we will we'll talk to you next week and uh
hopefully we'll have some better news continuing to develop around

(31:35):
the return of sports. Yeah, I hope so. I love
your optimism. Have a great weekend play. This is outkicked
the coverage with Clay Traffics. One are the interesting storylines
that we've been following, certainly on this show for a
while is all of the different quarterbacks that are out

(31:57):
there that we're looking for homes that aren't necessarily uh bad,
quarterbacks that have won games at the at the NFL level,
maybe even have won a Super Bowl or played in
a Super Bowl in the case of Joe Flacco and
Cam Newton, and I would classify their being right now

(32:17):
five guys out here that are in the backup role
and either have a job or may have a job
before all is said and done. And I was thinking
maybe I could rank these guys in terms of the
likelihood and you know, by the way, this might turn
into a whole hour of the show as we continue
to roll in May and uh, and there aren't a

(32:40):
ton of stories that are out there, But you think
about this. Marcus Mariota has signed with the Oakland Raiders,
right in theory he could be able to to play
going forward, Uh, if he replaces Derek Carr. Jamis Winston
has now signed with the New Orleans Saints. We know
that Cam Newton is an understrict and free agent. We

(33:01):
know that Andy Dalton is available, and we know that
Joe Flacco is available. Right Like, these are five guys
out there that all potentially could start a game in
and it wouldn't be crazy, right by which I mean, uh,
they aren't necessarily expected to start anywhere right now, but
if they start a game in, it wouldn't blow your

(33:23):
mind that that would occur. Which one is most likely
to win a game or multiple games in as you
rank them? Joe Flacco has won a Super Bowl, Cam
Newton has played in a Super Bowl and one an
m v P. Andy Dalton played in a decent amount

(33:44):
of playoff games. Marcus Mariota has won a playoff game,
Jamis Winston never played in the playoffs. Before ranking them
one to five, who's most likely to be starting at
the end of the season, Let's say, how would you
assess these guys one to five in terms of who's

(34:05):
most likely to be starting at the end of the year.
I'm gonna go with Andy Dalton one. Okay, I think
that Andy Dalton wherever he ends up, it's kind of
a it's kind of a questionable move, right, I'm gonna
call an audible. I'm gonna call an audible on my

(34:27):
live list. I'm gonna go with Marcus Mariota one because
I think there's enough discomfort right now with uh the
situation at at Oakland that I think Marcus Mariota is
the most likely to be starting at the end of
the year. I think Andy Dalton is the second most likely.

(34:47):
I could really flip flop those, but I'm gonna go
with Mariota over Andy Dalton. In the third spot, I'm
gonna go with Cam because I think at some point
Cam will are the game in I think that In
the four spot, I'll go Jamis because obviously, if Drew

(35:09):
Brees gets started, the question gets injured, the question would
be who were they going to start? And I think
they might have to start Taysom Hill because they're pin
him sixteen million dollars, Although who knows exactly whether Jamis
might be the guy there, and then I'll go with
Flacco in the sixth position. And by the way, I
also could have included Nick Foles. And if I include

(35:30):
Nick Foles, I bump him all the way up to
number one on the list because I think he might
win the outright job over Mitch Drabinsky. Before all is
said and done. Point here is there are a lot
of guys out there. A lot of times we talk
about in the NFL, hey, there aren't enough quarterbacks for
the jobs that are available. I feel like right now

(35:54):
there are way more quarterbacks than there are jobs available
for those guys. So as you break down this scenario
looking forward, uh, to me, this is really kind of
fascinating to think about, are there gonna even be enough
jobs for all these guys? Because I do think Cam
and Flacco, for instance, could find themselves on the outside

(36:15):
looking in, maybe even having to wait till there's an
injury to find a gig. And obviously Cam's injury situation
factors in here in a big way himself, because teams
don't want to risk anything on him until they can
actually do the work themselves. This is gonna turn into
I think a big debate and a big topic because
if your quarterback, whoever he is, doesn't start off really strong,

(36:40):
then there are going to or he gets injured, or
he gets deemed up a little bit. They're gonna be
a lot of sort of bullpen quarterback pitchers here who
are able to come in and potentially take over, and
all of them are going to be looking to be
next year's version of either Ryan Tannehill or Teddy Bridgewater
eyes who began the season as backups and made themselves

(37:03):
a ton of money. Because Teddy Bridgewater twenty million a
year uh sixty million overall looks like Ryan Tannehill ninety
one million. Basically overall, there's a lot of money to
still be made even as a backup in the NFL
if you can resurrect your career, and there are a
lot of guys on this list that are hoping to
do that for sure. Be sure to catch live editions

(37:23):
about kick the coverage with Clay Travis week days at
six am Eastern three am Pacific. And certainly one place
where people could be having a good Friday is if
you're in the college athletics business and you are a
top recruit and you're around sixteen years old, right now,
because as a result of the n C double A
embracing the new policy as it determines for name, image

(37:46):
and likeness, there are theoretically going to be players who
are able to make money off their name, image and
likeness in college now. Uh Now, I think it's gonna
be utterly fascinating to see what the market actually is
for college players, because my general consensus is there's only
five or six guys on most campuses that have much

(38:08):
of a value when it comes to name, image and likeness.
I could be wrong about this, but I think the
general rule is going to be, hey, if people know you,
you're the quarterback, if you are a point guard, if
you're a star player on the basketball team. It's almost
all going to be football players or basketball players, right.
I don't think anybody would really argue there. Uh, maybe

(38:28):
some women's basketball players will get a little something, but
by and large, it's gonna be a name, image and
likeness that benefits football players and men's basketball players, and
it's not gonna be everybody. Right, It's not gonna be
every basketball player that has a value because most of them, frankly,
aren't that well known, and it's not gonna be every
football player, because again most of them are not well known.

(38:49):
But the general consensus has been that the overall benefit
is going to be towards the overall top programs, and
I kind of would back against this, And let me
explain why this is a little bit of a counterintuitive idea,
for why I believe that that general consensus opinion might
possibly be wrong. Let me explain why I think right now,

(39:13):
if you are a college kid and you have offers
from top programs in the country, you go to a
top program. In other words, let's pretend you're in the
state of Michigan. You're not choosing to go to Eastern
Michigan or Western Michigan over the University of Michigan to
play basketball or football. There's zero percent chance unless your

(39:35):
dad or something is the coach, that you would make
that decision. If you are in California, and I know
this is gonna pain Eddie Garcia because he is a
Fresno State fan. But if you're in California, you're typically
not gonna pick Fresno State or San Diego State over
USC or U c l A. You're just not gonna
do it right. Typically, same thing if you are in Florida.

(39:59):
You're not gonna used to go to Lane Kiffin's old
school of f A U or two f i U
over the University of Miami. And you're not gonna choose
by and large, Central Florida over Florida like right, those
are decisions, or South Florida over Florida State. Those are
decisions that are not usually made. All right, I'm skipping

(40:19):
around the country to give you a geographic sense. It's
true in Florida, it's true. In Michigan. It's true in California.
Same thing in Texas. Right, you're not typically picking even
a big school like Texas Tech or Houston, which are
obviously they've had good success, over the University of Texas. Probably, right, Okay,

(40:41):
that's true. I think almost all of you are nodding
your heads and you're saying, yeah, you know what, You're
gonna go to the bigger school. How might things change? However,
if you're not the top recruit in any of those classes.
Let's pretend that you're getting the signing at Michigan and
Michigan signing twenty five guys, and let's say you're at

(41:03):
the University of Texas. You're the twenty or second guy
in that class of at Michigan, at Texas, at USC
at at Florida. Might it make more sense for you
to be the top target of a lesser school? In

(41:24):
other words, what if you're interested in staying home and
going to the University of Houston, and the University of
Houston has got a big booster who owns a car dealership.
He might be willing to give you more to go
to the University of Houston. Then Texas might be willing
to give you as the twenty best player in their
recruiting class. You're a four star for Texas, let's say,

(41:47):
or a high three star. You're a good player, not
a great player. You're a big time recruit for the
University of Houston, or for Central Florida or or Fresno State.
Is it possible that those schools actually might have a
much better chance to compete on name, image and likeness

(42:10):
than the schools that are already popular. I think the
answer might well be yes, And I think it's a
counterintuitive way to think about it. But if you think
I don't know what city you're all in, obviously you're
listening in all fifty states. But let's say let's go
to Southern Miss. Let's pretend that you are a kid
from near Southern Mrs. Campus and you are a four

(42:34):
star kid that can go to Alabama or Auburn. But
Alabama and Auburn aren't ecstatic about you. It's not like
you're a five star. You're not the peak of their class.
Is it possible that a car dealer in Hattiesburg, Mississippi
might give you more to stay home and go to
Old Miss, sorry to go to Southern Miss. Then you

(42:54):
would get to go to Old Miss or to go
to Alabama or Auburn. I think that's not just possible,
I think it's even likely so name, image or likeness.
A lot of people are saying, oh, this is just
gonna make the rich richer. I think there's actually an
argument that this might allow some some competition from a

(43:17):
lower level school, because you might be willing to take
seventy dollars to go to Southern Miss if you're just
getting a scholarship to go to Alabama, right, I mean
that seems logical. You might go to Fresno State over
usc if it comes with a hundred grand because there's
a booster who really wants you to stay and go

(43:39):
at Fresno State. You might go to Central Florida over
the University of Florida. If somebody who's a big fan
of Central Florida has the money to persuade you to
stay there. I want you guys to think flexibly about this.
I think it could be very very much true. All right.
I want you guys to to break that down. I
want you to think about it as we roll into

(44:01):
the program. Up next, We've made a bunch of new
hires at OutKick. I'm very excited about them. One of
them is Ryan Glaspiegel, who's gonna be writing and it
is already writing at OutKick. You can go check out
what he writes at OutKick dot com. You won't miss
anything at all from his writing. If you go follow
him at sports or poor, or if you just check
out out kick every day, you'll see everything that we're

(44:22):
putting up there. Uh. And he's gonna be great. We're
gonna talk about a lot of different stories, including the
Michael Jordan documentary, What does it do for Jordan's legacy?
What in the world's gonna happen with Dan Lebotard as
he's feuding with his ESPN bosses, and how does all
of this controversy shake out in terms of potential refunds
to cable subscribers over games not going on. We'll talk

(44:44):
about that next. This is OutKick the Coverage with Clay Travis.
We're joined now by a guy that I'm really excited
to to now be able to call, I guess a colleague.
He is now writing for OutKick for OutKick the Coverage
dot com. He's already got a good piece up about
some of the controversy surrounding uh Dan Lebotard in his

(45:06):
relationship with his bosses at ESPN and maybe ESPN Radio.
We don't know exactly what's going on there, but The
New York Post had an interesting story and we're gonna
get to that with him. But first, I'm just excited
to say welcome to OutKick and I'm excited to have
you on the program talking about a lot of your
different articles. Encourage people to go check out OutKick dot
com and you can go follow Ryan and keep up

(45:28):
with everything he's doing at at Sports Rapport UH and
I'll tweet that link out for his Twitter handle when
we post the podcast. You can follow me as always
at Clay Travis on Twitter. Excited to have you, Ryan,
been reading you for a long time. I think you're
gonna be a great fit with us at OutKick. I'm
very excited to be there, obviously, as you wrote in
my in your introductory story introducing Bobby Barack, Mike Shamberger

(45:53):
and I. I wrote for Outkicked twice in twelve back
when I was really just trying to get any type
of footholl in the industry, and I've always appreciated that.
I think it was the first national sports outlet to
publish met on, so it's really fascinating that it's come
full circle like this about eight years later. Yeah, for

(46:15):
people out there who aren't aware, I started out kick
in two thousand eleven, and for a long time we
had a bullpen when I was calling the Bullpen section
where users could submit articles, and at some point we
may circle back around and allow that to occur. But
the idea was there are a lot of people out
there who would like to be able to reach an
audience with their opinion written opinion about the world of sports,

(46:38):
but you may not have a way to do that,
And so I started writing online back in two thousand
four on my own website, which is how I ended
up getting into radio and getting into TV. I'm forty
one now, but I'm certainly cognizant of the fact that
there are a lot of people out there who are like, man,
how do you get into sports media? And everybody has
a different path. But long before I knew Ian would

(47:00):
circle back around, he had two different articles that were
up on out Kick in UH in two thousand twelve
as a part of that program, and that was at
times a way to find good talent. And certainly you've
been working hard for the past eight years and now
you're in some ways back where you started, although uh
making a little bit more money than you made eight
years ago. But let's let's kind of dive into a

(47:22):
bunch of different stories here. You're gonna be covering a
sports media a lot of different angles that you're gonna
be covering, And I want to start with this, UH
the Last Dance documentary, which I know you've watched a lot.
We're gonna be writing about it quite a bit at
OutKick going into Monday for people who are watching episodes
five and six on Sunday, Ken Burns. We kind of

(47:43):
hit on this a little bit on Thursday, Ken Burns,
who is a and I get think. I think it's
fair to say world renowned, renowned documentarian. Uh did the
documentaries on baseball, did the documentary on the Civil War,
which is really kind of where he made his name
for himself. UH recently has done I think the Country
Music Dot coumentary, these long form, aggressive examinations of particular

(48:05):
segments of American society. And he's upset because he's like,
this is not really a true documentary because guys like
Michael Jordan at least and maybe more had the ability
to decide what went in and out of this documentary.
Do you agree with his criticism and what do you
think the public thinks of his criticism? So it's an

(48:26):
interesting two part question. I do agree with his criticism
that this is not journalism in the purest sense of
the word. What you have to look at this project
as is it's m j retelling his own story, and
so it's not necessarily journalism. I see it more as

(48:47):
like kind of an autobiography that's a good analogy pulls
and autobiography and expects it to be a completely unbiased work.
Look at the world that they experience, and so no,
I don't think that this is Look, there are some
journalistic um parts components of this documentary, but no, it's

(49:10):
not pure journalism. But and then as far as the
public goes, I don't really think that the public cares.
I mean, the numbers are telling that story. This is
shattered records for previous ESPN documentary. So I mean about
six million people have watched all four episodes. The previous
record for an ESPN documentary was about bo Jackson thirty

(49:35):
thirty and that came with a lead in of Johnny
Manziel winning the Heisman that five million people watched. So
it was actually, yeah, a lot of people watched it,
but they were already on ESPN. It wasn't a destination.
Now it's a sports desert. Yeah, ESPN of the Draft
last week, but they didn't have it the week before,

(49:56):
and they didn't have it this past Sunday. And this
doc commentaries just dominating cable. So I think that the
American public just loves Michael Jordan's I mean, thirty million
people watched him in the NBA Finals against the Jazz.
We're not going to see those numbers in the NBA
anytime soon. The footage well not journalistic, it's titilating. I mean,

(50:19):
we're getting the story of Dennis Rodman going on a
mid season vendor of Las Vegas with Carmen Electrons, so
they they know how to give the people what they want,
even if that isn't necessarily journalistic period. We're talking to
Ryan glass Peogle at Sports Report. He's a writer for
OutKick and he's gonna be doing a lot of different

(50:39):
things other than just writing, including coming on this radio
program regularly to talk about some of the big stories
that are out there that he's writing an OutKick and
that we're talking about. Um So, I'm curious, uh, in general,
what do you think the long range impact is? And
I know we've only watched four of the ten episodes
so far. What is this, dude for Michael Jordan's legacy?

(51:02):
What kind of impact does it have going forward for him? Well,
I think the biggest impact that it has on his
legacy is people. I don't know what seven and under.
So I'm thirty three and I have pretty um strong
memories of the second three Pete. I don't have that
grade of memories like just queer of memories of the

(51:23):
first one, but now I think people twenty seven and
below are getting a glimpse of just how ruthlessly competitive
he is. I mean the fact that he's still holding
a grudge about Isaiah Thomas and the Pistons not shaking
his hand. Nearly thirty years later, he's still calling um
Isaiah and aho when he sees footage of that, like

(51:46):
this is a really petty person. And then beyond that,
he was just I don't remember who tweeted this, I'm
I'm stealing somebody's feet. But it's like nobody has ever
looked cooler playing basketball than Michael when they go on
that kind of highlight montage of him doing those just
not just dunk but where he would like glide through

(52:07):
the air and stay up for like a half second
longer than you can physiologically expect of any other human being,
can sort his body, switch the ball from right to left,
go under the rim, like kiss it off the backboard,
like nobody does cool stuff like that anymore. And he
was doing that almost on a nightly basis. It really

(52:30):
is remarkable, and I mean, I consider myself fortunate to
have been able to watch Michael Jordans on a Nightly
Basis with w g N back in the day. Uh,
and Uh, we're talking to Ryan glass Peagle now as
we go forward in this documentary and kind of think
about things. One you mentioned the competitiveness. I feel like
I'm curious if you agree that genuine hate for opponents

(52:54):
is much less common now than it was in the sixties,
seventies and eighties. Now. I'm forty one, so I certainly
don't remember the discord out there, But it seems clear
that Michael Jordan when he says like I hated them
then and I hate them now, like that's not fake.
He doesn't like Isaiah Thomas, he doesn't like the Detroit Pistons.

(53:16):
I don't know how many people who are playing currently
in the NBA or Major League Baseball or the NFL
would say that twenty some odd years after their career
is over. Do athletes today hate each other less than
they did in years past? If so, why, And a
second part of that is athletes disliking each other does

(53:38):
it make the sport better? Uh? You know, it's an
interesting question again. Um, do you hear behind the scenes
that like Lebron and Steph Curry don't like each other?
But it only manifests and passive aggression and not aggressive
aggression like you see the extent to which Isaiah and
Jordan's still vehemently dislike each other. Um, I don't know

(54:02):
what the exact reason for it is. I mean some
people have said, oh, they come up together in a use,
so like the basketball family gets formed at like a
much younger age, where like nationally the best probably twelve
thirteen fourteen year olds in the country all know each other,
so they do have like their teammates, they they just

(54:25):
they when when you when you've known somebody from your
adolescents in your teenage years, um, even if they are
somewhat of a rival, maybe you have a little bit
more of a soft spot for them. I think though,
that if we see in next season, then the next
at full strength and the Warriors at full strength, those

(54:49):
are gonna be games where we really think that like
Kevin Durant and Draymond Green hate each other, and it's
going to be a pretty amazing spectacle. But I do
agree with you that I don't think that for whatever reason,
maybe it's say you, maybe it's just that, um, the
people are so really obsessed with their personal brand and

(55:11):
maybe like the marketing advisors are in their ear saying
that like hate and spite and pettiness is a bad book.
But I do think that if we see like a
Nets Warriors NBA Finals, then that would like really come
out and um bring turned back the clock. But no,
I agree with you. It's not nearly as um combative

(55:34):
as it used to. And I do think that like
that that made those matchups more compelling when like it
would have killed Jordan's for thirty years if they are
longer the rest of his life, if he never got
past the bad boy piss. Yeah, I don't. I don't
think there's any doubt. And I understand the argument of

(55:55):
it's much healthier to not hate your rival. I think
that's one sent true. Uh, And so I I understand
that like, hey we just lost, let's go hug at
mid court or let's go hug at midfield or whatever
it may be. I understand that that is healthier. But
I think good old fashioned hate in sports from a

(56:18):
conflict perspective drives a lot more ratings. Because if I'm
a fan, I the only thing that I would ask
of a team that I root for is I want
the players on the team to be at least as
angry when they lose as I am when my team loses, right, Like,
I don't think that's a tremendous amount to ask. If
I'm spending thousands of dollars on season tickets and your

(56:41):
your team goes out and uh, and they lose and
they look like crap. Um, I think that. I I
don't want like guys to be laughing and yucking it
up afterwards. I want them to be as angry when
they're driving home in their cars as I am. And
I think there are a lot of pro athletes that
aren't as angry. I think they get over it easier.
And I think, honestly, uh and Um just texted me

(57:03):
this as we're having this conversation. Uh. He said, this
is why college sports is better than pro sports, because
the rivalries in college sports, by and large are more
intense than the rivalries I would say are in pro sports. Yeah.
I guess that's true for an extent, But I'd go
back to like Lebron versus the Warriors, and I think

(57:25):
that's a pretty intense rivalry. I guess that, like, it's
really tough because I can't go back and look at
and um find examples off the top of my head
that are greater than Bulls versus Pistons are on that level. Like,
I just don't have that type of immediate and call

(57:46):
back to that era. But I don't know, I wouldn't.
I'm a pro sports guy over college sports. I think
to some extent that asked to do with where you
grow up regionally, I mean I grew up in New England,
where UM Yankees read sucks is like a heated rival
I was almost in a ground zero town for that,
like around Hartford, Connecticut. So when you're like halfway between

(58:09):
Boston and New York and it's like forty five per
cent for one team and for the other, there's a
pretty heated fan rivalry there. And then as far as
college goes, I mean I went to Wisconsin, so I
have a lot of like Big Ten rivalry hatred now,
but I didn't have that necessarily growing up. All right,

(58:29):
let's talk about rivalry and hatred some more, and let's
move into let's move into ESPN Radio, which is an
incredible transition here. So this is not going to surprise
anybody who listens to this program. I think that Fox
Sports radio, And I've said this on the air, and
I've said it a long time, and also I'm biased, right,
I think that Fox Sports Radio has put together the
best collection of talent. Don Martin and Scotch Shapiro are

(58:51):
who run Fox Sports Radio that has ever existed in
national sports. Stalker Radio starts with me, and obviously I'm
a fan of myself, is it anybody who ever listened
to this show knows? And then it leads into Dan Patrick,
who is a legend in the world of national sports
talker radio. Colin Cowherd, who probably right now I would
argue is the single most influential You can take another person,

(59:12):
but I would argue that Colin Coward single most influential
person in sports talk radio right now. Uh. And now
he's on from from twelve to three Eastern Eastern time.
Doug Gottlieb, who I think is incredibly and uniquely talented.
By the way, all of these guys, by and large
hosting solo, which is a hard thing to do as well. Uh,
not to say that there's not a lot of great
people who also support him. There always is, including on

(59:34):
this show with Danny g and Roberto and Dub and
and Eddie. Everybody has an important role on this show,
but solo hosting is in general much tougher than a
tandem show. UH. And then you roll into UH after
Doug Gottlieb, Chris Brussard and UH and Rob Parker, who
are doing fantastically well in the odd couple. R J
Bell is doing well. We run through All the Night crew.

(59:56):
I'm not an expert on All the Night Crew. I
apologize for not giving them shouts out, and Ben Maller
leads into me, that's a hell of a lineup, right,
twenty four hours a day, UH, seven days a week,
always going, lots of great people on the weekends. Everything else.
ESPN for a long time was very stable, you know,
they had a really set ratio. Part of the reason
why Fox Sports Radio has done well is getting to

(01:00:16):
hire away Colin Cowherd and Doug Gottlieb who used to
be with the ESPN Radio Now it sounds Dan Patrick right,
so basically other than me, they basically have just grabbed
everybody who used to be all stars for ESPN and
now they're performing at a high level where like the
Yankees of sports talk radio, we've gone and and and
snagged away the best performers elsewhere. That's a good point. Uh.

(01:00:38):
Used to be that that ESPN was incredibly stable Mike
and Mike did fantastically well for a long time. The
New York Post reports that, uh, the show that we're
up against, uh and frankly the show that we've been
doing very well against for a long time in terms
of grabbing listeners. Uh, Mike Golic and Trey Wingo. That
Tray Wingo wants out and that would be another change

(01:01:00):
to that morning show since we have started here. Uh
that uh Stephen A. Smith we know is no longer
on radio obviously a very talented guy who used to
be at Fox Sports Radio, UM, and do this morning show.
I believe I'm not mistaken. Uh. And then they also
have got Dan Lebotard, who show does fantastically well on podcast,
not as well from a ratings perspective, because it's a

(01:01:20):
unique kind of interesting vibe that he has. And Will
Kine is reportedly leaving. I like Will, He's a good dude.
He's leaving reportedly and go into Fox News. That basically
means that all of the ESPNS radio lineup could be changing,
and in particular, the New York Post said, and this
is a long lead up, but it is interesting. The
New York Post said that Dan Lebotard show is on

(01:01:43):
its way out in addition to the morning show potentially
changing there and also uh to the situation changing as
it pertains to the wil Kaine spot. What are you
hearing about ESPN Radio? What has Dan Lebotard said about this?
And what do you think is going to happen? Well,
so there's a many part questions. Bus Barak and I

(01:02:05):
reported several months ago that Trade Windo does not want
to do that morning show anymore. He's not a morning
person and until he wasn't a radio person, and so
um he I think what Wingo. I'm not sure exactly
how old he is. That he's been at ESPN a
long time, he's made a lot of money, and he

(01:02:27):
doesn't want to do that role anymore. And so it's
an interesting question then whether they keep Mike Golick and
Mike Golick Jr. In the spot and put in a
new co host, or whether they blow it up. Bobby
Burak has a story on OutKick This Morning in which
he theorizes that Max Kellerman and Keishawn Johnson could be

(01:02:47):
a potential pairing for that morning show. Um as far
as will Kine goes, I mean, my reporting um on
background has been the same as what's on Office Sports,
New York Post and Washington Post is said, which is
that he's near a deal with Fox News and Foxes
streaming service Fox Nation, but that hasn't been completed yet.

(01:03:08):
And so look, we've seen a lot of football games
where you've got first and goal of the three and
the ball doesn't get in the end zone. But still
I think it's probably likely that that's what's going to happen.
And then as far as Damn Lebatar, that's the most
intriguing mystery here. The word Marshand used for whether um

(01:03:29):
LeBatard show would be leaving ESPN Radio was that it
could leave ESPN Radio, and that's because he's had long
standing disagreements with executives over there. And right now, if
Norby Williamson, who's in charge of the ESPN Radio, he's
also in charge of the daytime studio shows on ESPN

(01:03:49):
like Sports Center, Get Up and First Take, and um
Norby is a guy who wants the personalities on his
show to do meet and potatoes sports talk like the
draft is coming up. Let's have milk kiper on, Let's
have Todd McShay on, Let's ask them about Chua, asked
them about Justin Herbert, etcetera, etcetera. That's not this type

(01:04:12):
of show Demn LeBatard once or has ever wanted to do.
And let me let me pause you. Let me pause
you there for a second. That's what the audience wants, right,
and that that's an interesting question. It may not be
what the podcast audience wants. But you know, I always
say on this show, we're gonna talk football. Right when
it's the NFL Draft, You're gonna tune into out Kick

(01:04:33):
and we're gonna be talking about where two was gonna
go and all those different things. Now, Dan Lebotard is
about a decade older than me. Maybe if I've been
doing this show for another decade, I'll be like, Hey,
I don't care about what happens in the NFL Draft,
but I was pretty excited to sit down on my
couch and see who was gonna go draft to what
was gonna happen. The data is undeniably behind the ESPN

(01:04:54):
on this that if you listen to sports talk radio,
by and large, you want to hear sports. Doesn't mean
we do a lot of things that art sports on
this show too. And I certainly think the Labatard is
a really talented guy, but I understand where his bosses
are coming from. There. Not to cut you off, but
I just want to interject there there are right, that's
what the terrestrial radio audience wants. It may not be
what the podcast audience wants, though, and that's an interesting

(01:05:16):
aspect as well. I agree with that, but there's a
lurking variable here, and that's uh show in um in
June of let's go back about two years, Jimmy Pittaro
was in his first three or four months at the job.
He replaced John Skipper, who left ESPN under some like

(01:05:37):
murky circumstances. Skipper and LeBatard were very close and Labatard
was had a deal coming up, and so as a
way of like ensuring continuity, the Pataro regime signed LeBatard
to a four year deal. So see, he still has
over two years left on his contract. At three and

(01:05:59):
a half million dollars a year, the rest of his
show probably makes about a million dollars a year combined,
if not a little bit more, and so they've got
these contracts at a time where Disney is furloughing people
all over the company, Bob Iger is taking a big
pay cut. They've asked all of ESPN's UM top paid

(01:06:23):
talents to take pay cuts. It's not like an easy
time for them to just take nine or ten million
dollars and guaranteed pay and eat it. And so it's
the UM. Like I I do think that by the
time Lebertards contract ends, I don't see him signing an

(01:06:44):
extension for terrestrial radio. That's not to say he couldn't
remain at ESPN in like a digital and maybe serious
XM capacity, But in terms of are we going to
see a press release in six week that Lebotarde show
is coming and on radio, I think that that's a

(01:07:05):
much more difficult question than you can just say cut
and dry. Yeah, he's going to be out because Norby
wants Pat McAfee and that can you come back with
us for another segment because I have a couple more
questions for you. Yeah, of course this is outkicked the
coverage with Clay Travis. So Ryan, when I cut you

(01:07:29):
off there we finished the last conversation there you were
talking about what you thought Dan Lebotard would do. You
were talking about some of the things that you think
might happen at ESPN Radio in general. He went on
and I don't blame him for this. He went on
his show and this is what you wrote about and
fired back at the New York Post story suggesting that
his show was on the way out. Who do you

(01:07:50):
think is leaking the idea that Lebotard show is on
its way out? And what do you think the way
he fired back tells us about this story. I you know,
as far as who's leaking it, I have some series,
but I absolutely hate when I have a story and
people say this person leaked it to you. Start out
of respect for Andrew Marcia, and I'm gonna her frame

(01:08:12):
from doing that publicly. And then as far as what happens,
I think that he's on ESPN Radio for the rest
of is my guest, And then maybe they could reach
a happy medium where they put him on serious Channel one.
So he's still in the ESPN um ecosystem. The ad

(01:08:33):
sales people can still um capitalize on the fact that
he has some very like passionate listeners who support his sponsors.
His podcast can continue to do well on ESPN, and
he's got a bunch of people like Nina Kins and
Marty Smith who are underneath his podcast umbrella that can
continue to flourish. But if I had to guess, I

(01:08:57):
don't think that when his deal is up in two
and a half years that he will remain with ESPN
at that time. All right, Uh, And this is a
big question that we talked about on the show Wednesday.
We didn't talk about it as much Thursday, but it
got a lot of interest, and we put up a poll,
and I know you saw it. Who do you think
ultimately gets left holding the bag when it comes to

(01:09:19):
the sports games that are not sports games always an
interesting phrase, the games that are not airing on the
sports networks. Um, right now, fans are continuing to pay
full freight for ESPN, for f S one, NBC Sports Network,
all of these different cable networks which are predicated on
having live sports, and they're starting to be some pressure

(01:09:40):
on the Comcast and the direct TVs and dish networks
of the world, either levied by those companies or levied
by their consumer saying, wait a minute, why are we
paying full freight when there aren't actually games going on here,
what's the resolution? How significant do you think the threat
is to these able networks over the challenge of these

(01:10:02):
games not existing in the in the seasons, maybe who knows,
ending up getting canceled. It's a pretty serious threat, but
I'm also hopeful or at least optimistic that it's going
to be a temporary one. So the when we look
at what's going to end up ultimately having been canceled,
I think that it's pretty clear that the rest of

(01:10:24):
the NBA regular season isn't going to happen, and that
there's going to be probably like an eighty two a
game Baseball regular season, and so those missed regular season games,
the majority of which are going to be on the RSNS,
but some of them will also be on ESPN, t N,
t FS one F MLB games. Um, if those games

(01:10:47):
get missed, I do think that we're going to see
the networks give partial refunds to the cable distributors. The
cable distributors give partial refunds to the consumers. But the
if games get postponed and still happen, like if there's
still an NBA Playoffs, that happens in a Disney World

(01:11:07):
bubble or whatever UM, then ESPN and t N T
aren't gonna nearly be on the hook for as much
as some analysts might think. So if games get postponed
and still happen, then I think that the ecosystem will
carry on as normal now as far as you get
caught voting the bag. If so, in that case scenario,

(01:11:29):
ESPN is to give a refund to the distributor, to
distributor gives refunds to the consumer, then the networks are
gonna work out a deal with the league, and then
the UM the leagues are going to have to work
out a deal with the players. So I think that
the burden when it all shakes out, and there's gonna
be a lot of lawsuits and a lot of acrimony.

(01:11:50):
But some of it's going to be held by the players,
some of it's going to be held by the owners,
some of it's going to be held by the keybole channels.
Some of it is going to be held by the
distributors because like Direct TV and Comcast pay let's say
nine fifty a month for ESPN, but then they turn
around and charge the consumers more because they're not charging

(01:12:12):
it at the price at the retail price that they're
getting it for wholesale. So to answer your question, I
think that there is like an evenly distributed burden chain
that goes from players to cable networks, but that fans
are going to get partial refunds, but the refunds that
fans end up getting, and not even just fans keyboard

(01:12:34):
subscribers who don't have ESPN. It's not going to be
like in some astronomical life changing some I mean, maybe
you'll see people get like twenty five or thirty bucks
back as a credit towards future bills when this is
all done and settled, But in the meantime, you add
that up to a hundred million or whatever cable subscribers,

(01:12:58):
and it's a big burden to bear across the whole
sports supply chain. Outstanding stuff. I'm excited to have you
without Kick. He's Ryan glass Peagle at sports Rapport on Twitter.
We're gonna be having him more and more on the program.
Go read him at out Kick. Fox Sports Radio has
the best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch all
of our shows at Fox sports radio dot com and

(01:13:20):
within the I Heart Radio app search f s R
to listen live. We are scheduled to be joined I
tease this earlier in the show, but I believe it
is a pent of certainty. Now, although you never know,
never know with guests. One of the things you learn
when you do a show is anybody's ever done radio
knows this. There are lots of times you're like, oh,
we got this guest lined up, he's a d pent,

(01:13:41):
gonna be good to go, and then boom, something happens
and uh and tosses it a bit, a bit askew.
But right now we are scheduled to be joined by
Oklahoma Governor Kevin Stitt, who is opening up their state,
and I'm going to discuss, um the the impact of
of opening up a state. Also, he's got Oklahoma and

(01:14:01):
Oklahoma State big time football and basketball programs there. And
I'm told he's got an interesting story about being in
the arena for the Oklahoma State game against the Utah
Jazz Rudy Gobert test positive and everything shuts down right
then and there. Um, that will be an interesting interesting
thing to examine with him as well. Um, And we

(01:14:25):
start off the show, and we've talked about this a
decent amount as we moved throughout the show, to me
one of the big stories as we go into this weekend,
and a lot of different states are either opening up
or they're gonna be starting to open back up on Monday. Uh,
you got Florida announcing that they're opening up, Georgia, the
governor of Oklahoma who we're gonna talk to. And I'm

(01:14:46):
actually curious about the decisions that are made in Oklahoma.
Uh we uh we know Tennessee where I live, Uh, Georgia, Texas, Colorado,
their states all over the country that are starting to
open up. Many also are not starting to open up.
And one of the interesting things about doing national radio
is certainly there are a wide range of ways and

(01:15:09):
responses that people have dealt with the coronavirus. Whether it's
in whether it's in the state of New York and
certainly in New York City in particular, not upstate where
almost nothing happened, but in the City of New York
where everything kind of was totally different. Or whether it's
in California, where not much has happened. Then we've certainly
talked about the difference there where Texas and Florida have

(01:15:29):
not had much of an issue in Oklahoma, but I've
started to be impressed by the number of states that
are coming out and essentially announcing, hey, we are opening up.
Our plan is for kids to be back in school
in uh in all these different states, right, go back
to school in college and Oklahoma and Oklahoma State, which

(01:15:52):
I'll specifically ask the governor about in this next interview segment,
assuming that we got that scheduled and ready to roll,
but also we're s in it at Oregon. All over
the country right, universities are making statements, Hey, we're coming
back and we plan to be back in the fall.
We're seeing it at Alabama, at l s U, at Georgia,
at Washington State, UM at Miami, a ton of different

(01:16:16):
places that play big time college sports are basically letting
it be known, Hey we're coming back. Iowa and Iowa State,
And every day it's like a new university comes out
and makes that statement, and I gave credit to him.
I'm gonna keep giving credit to him. Perdue was the
first school that I saw come out and definitively say hey,
we're gonna be back in the fall. And I think

(01:16:37):
a big reason why Purdue felt comfortable making that statement
is they have a really plugged in former Governor Mitch Daniels,
who is the president of Purdue University right now, and
he looked at all the data, and the data reflects
that college kids are not in serious danger from the coronavirus.
And I said this an hour one. So people are like, well,

(01:16:59):
what are you talking about their upset on Twitter? I
look at the data. Right. You don't have to agree
with me about any different opinion that I have, but
I do find it incredibly important that the data behind
every opinion that I have is real, and it's authentic
and it's accurate. Right. So if I come out to
you and I'm like, hey, I think Drew, I I
think that that Tom Brady is gonna win the super

(01:17:21):
Bowl this year. Tom Brady obviously down with the Tampa
Bay Bucks. If I say I believe Tom Brady is
gonna win the super Bowl this year because he's been
to three super Bowls before and he's won one of them,
a lot of you out there will be like what
you'd be like a record scratch moment, because you're aware
that Tom Brady so far has been to nine Super
Bowls and that he has won six of them. My

(01:17:44):
opinion is could be I'm not ready to make an
opinion on who I think is gonna win the super Bowl,
by by the way, but my opinion could certainly be
I think Tom Brady joining the Tampa Bay Buccant the years,
is going to win the super Bowl this year. That's
an opinion that I have. That's an opinion that you
could have. What's important about my opinion is I need

(01:18:06):
to build it based on facts. And facts behind why
I believe Tom Brady will win the super Bowl could
include the fact that he's been denying super Bowls already
and he's won six of them. If I told you
I believe Tom Brady is going to win the super
Bowl this year in Tampa Bay, and as evidence of

(01:18:27):
why I believe that to be true, I said, well,
Brady has been to three Super Bowls and he's won
one of them. You justifiably could say, WHOA, your facts
are wrong, Therefore I'm not likely to follow your opinion. Okay.
One of the big problems we have in this country
today is there's a confusion between fact and opinion. A

(01:18:51):
fact is somebody threw a touchdown pass. An opinion is
and here's why I think he's gonna throw another Right,
sports fans, I think can follow that this guy hit
forty home runs last year, Therefore I think he's gonna
hit fifty next year. A fact is something that is
in controvertibly true. We can agree on it. The sky

(01:19:15):
is blue is a fact. An opinion of the weather
man is tomorrow we're gonna have rain. It can be
a reasonable opinion based on facts that he is seeing,
but it's his opinion based on looking at the data, right,
So there's a big difference between fact and opinion, and
I think it oftentimes gets confused. It is a fact.

(01:19:36):
It is a one hundred percent fact that young people
in this country are more in danger of dying of
the flu than they are of dying of the coronavirus.
There's people basically twenty two and younger right, elementary school kids,
babies all the way up to twenty two year old

(01:19:58):
who are graduating from college. There are more people who
have died of the flu in that age range zero
to twenty two than there are that have died of
the coronavirus. And to credit Mitch Daniels, it's like sharing
that fact makes people uncomfortable because it conflicts with the

(01:20:20):
way that they feel because you watch the news and
they would have you convinced that if you step outside
you're going to die. If you are twenty two and younger,
your odds are you're gonna be fine. Now again, I
said this an hour one. That doesn't mean that you're
a gonna be fine. Certainty is hard to find. There
will be some people under the age of twenty two

(01:20:41):
who die. Just like as I said an hour one.
The general rule is you're pretty safe when you fly
in an airplane, safer even than being in a car.
But some people are gonna die an airplane crashes. Doesn't
mean that you specifically are likely to be in danger,
just means that a hundred percent certainty in life is
hard to find. I can't guarantee a hundred percent that

(01:21:07):
I'm gonna make it down the stairs outside of my office.
When I finished the radio show today, I told my
nine year old, Hey, when I finished the show today,
I'm gonna go outside and play you in a game
of horse. Just had that conversation with him. When I
go down the stairs, it's possible that I'm gonna trip
and fall and break my leg. I can't one hundred

(01:21:30):
percent guarantee that I'm gonna make it down the stairs
without breaking my leg and falling right, Probably a ninety
nine chance that I'm gonna make it down the stairs.
The odds are that I'm gonna be fine. I'm gonna
be outside shooting uh game of horse against my son
here shortly. But maybe I'll fall break a leg and
I won't be able to do that and I have

(01:21:50):
to get taken away in an ambulance. There's certainly the
possibility that that could happen. Similarly, there is the possibility
that a young per and can get sick and die
of the coronavirus. It's not, however, likely at all based
on the data, And the data tells us moreover, that
we need to be comfortable saying that and recognizing that

(01:22:13):
college kids belong back on campus and that college athletics,
as a result, is able to take place as well,
not that necessarily fans are gonna be present, but that
college athletics are going to be able to take place
if college students are back on campus. And as a
part of that another little aspect here, I'm fascinated by

(01:22:37):
the decision to get college kids back on campus, and
also by the decision that is out there that we've
been talking about a little bit during the program of name,
image and likeness. There's a general consensus, as the n
C double A has now gotten comfortable with the idea
that college kids can make money off of their likeness,

(01:22:58):
there's a general consensus that this is going to benefit
the big schools at the at the cost of the
small schools. Dan Wetzel, who we have on this program
a lot as a Yahoo Sports national columnists, actually had
an interesting take on this, and he said he kind
of believes the different side of this, which is this

(01:23:18):
will allow smaller schools to compete more so with big
schools than they may be have in the past. And
his theory, which we talked about some an hour two
and I think I buy in on, is his theory
is that right now, if I give you the option,
let's pretend that you are seventeen years old and you
are a senior in high school, and I say to you,

(01:23:39):
let's pretend that you are in let's say the state
of Alabama, and I say to you, hey, you're a
really good player. State of Alabama. Universities that have offered
you a scholarship, are Troy you a B FBS, big
school Alaba, Emma, and Auburn. Okay, Troy, you a B,

(01:24:04):
Alabama and Auburn. Every single person out there listening right
now is like, I'm gonna go to Alabama or aubur right,
Not because uh, you are necessarily a huge Alabama or
Auburn fan, although maybe you are, but because you're like,
I want to go to the best possible school I
can go to to play football. Nobody's gonna go to Troy,

(01:24:26):
Nobody's gonna go to you a B. But what if
Troy and you a B have big boosters and instead
of the twentie best player in the Alabama recruiting class
where you may not get very much at all, you
could be the best recruit for Troy or you a B.

(01:24:46):
That could potentially make a lot of sense. We talked
about that an hour two. I want you to keep
it in the back of your mind as we continue
to think about what the impact of name, image and
likeness might be. But first, in order for name, image
and likeness to matter, we have to have cole of athletics.
Will we have college athletics in the fall. We are
gonna be joined by the Governor of Oklahoma I am
told he is ready to roll and he will be

(01:25:08):
good to go with us. He is the Governor of Oklahoma,
Kevin Stitt. I will ask him that question specifically as
we get geared up for the return of college athletics.
What does he expected Oklahoma and Oklahoma State and what
was it like to be present in the building when
the game between the Utah Jazz and the Oklahoma City
Thunder was called, which set off all of the craziness

(01:25:31):
that has since ensued in the world of sports. We
will discuss it. This is out kicked the coverage with
Clay Travis excited to welcome in now the governor of Oklahoma,
Kevin State and Governor. We're gonna get into a couple
of different interesting issues as it pertains to the intersection
of sports and UH and the state of Oklahoma for sure.

(01:25:52):
But I want to start with you are in attendance
when UH, when Rudy Gobert tested positive and Oaka Homa
City the game against the Jazz, it just shut down
there in Oklahoma City. What was your experience like on
that evening. I don't know that I've heard anything at
all about it from the governor perspective at all, what

(01:26:13):
was that evening? Like, tell me the story. Well, it
was it was really interesting. I went over there. I
took my ten year old son with me. He brought
his sharpie and a basketball and he was wanting to
get some autographs. And we went to UH. We were
meeting with the company in Oklahoma that was expanding, so
it was kind of a commerce trip. And UH we
were there in the kind of the restaurant area at

(01:26:34):
the Jazz or excuse me, at the Thunder where we play,
and the jazz and showed up and it was about
seven fifty for UH was a seven fifth or six
fifty six fifty for a seven o'clock game. And I
got a call from my Department of Health. This was
early on March eleven, and they just told me. They said, hey, Governor,
we just found out we tested one of the jazz players.

(01:26:55):
They were positive. I said, who knows, and they said,
you're the first one. Nobody knows. So that's when I
went and UH. I went and got Clay Bennett. We
went to a conference room. I told him the news.
We got the commissioner, the NBA commissioner on the phone,
and we sent the players back to the locker room,
and I mean it was literally I think they had
seen the national anthem, that warm ups were done, everything

(01:27:17):
was ready to go, and uh we kind of caucused
there with the n b A and and we knew
at that point that the players have been around each other,
and so just out of an abundance of caution, we
went ahead and uh postponed that game and called that
game and then um so that's kind of that's kind
of how it went down. It was. It was a crazy,

(01:27:37):
uh crazy day. Uh. And then we were walking through
the bottom of the stadium there and uh my my
ten year old son turned to Mr Bennett, the owner
of the Thunder, and said, am I gonna be able
to get an autography? Clay said, Rimton, I'm gonna get
you all the autographs you watch. Uh, it was pretty funny.
So let me just kind of go back into that story,

(01:27:58):
because that's an incredible sty And I don't know if
you even told that story hardly or at least I
haven't heard it in the in the national media. So
when you get that news, your immediate thought is what,
because I mean, that's like an earth shattering thing. You
happened to be at the Oklahoma City Thunder game. As
the governor of the state of Oklahoma, we're in the
early days of the coronavirus outbreak. No athlete, I mean

(01:28:21):
that this this thing rocked to the the entire nation
in a big way. And your immediate thought is what
when they come and tell you, hey, Rudy Gobert has
tested positive, because hardly anybody knows at that point. Yeah,
I mean, it was. It was a gut punch. I was.
I remember I was staying in the restaurant. I got
a phone call. I stepped away from my meeting because
it was my Department of Health, and of course we
were in regular contact, and I'm like, oh, man, this

(01:28:43):
is gonna be bad news. And so he called me
and just said Governor. He said, uh, we just found
out that the Utah jazz player tested positive. He got
sick when he was here. He went to our ou
Health Science Center. We tested him. We just got the
results back. And I was just kind of, you know, stunned,
and so uh we knew we needed to Uh, I
need to get with h the ownership of the thunder

(01:29:05):
and we need to make a decision pretty quickly. I
didn't know how much exposure he had to the other players,
but I knew they had traveled together. And so once
we got all the facts, we got on the phone
with the NBA commissioner. So it was real. It was
a really surreal moment. And then, you know, fifteen minutes
after we called that game, uh, then the NBA canceled
for the season, and all the other sporting events uh

(01:29:25):
ended up canceling. So kind of a surreal deal. But
of course, uh, you know, Mr Bennett was concerned about
his his uh players, and we were concerned about the fans,
and and then we were all talking about how do
we uh not panic the crowd as we as we release,
and so we just uh uh we didn't break until
the next day, but we just said, hey, we just

(01:29:45):
had the the announcer state to do to unforeseen circumstances,
we're gonna postpone this game, and you know, please leave
orderly and and uh so that's kind of how it
went down, and and uh it is kind of a
part of history, I think, because this is just it's
I think it's a watershed moment for all of us
in the US. We were dealing with something that we've
nobody knew exactly how it was affecting or how it

(01:30:06):
was transmitting to that time, or how infectious it was,
and and so out of an abundance of caution, I
think we made the right decision that that night. I
think you dis definitely made the right decision. Governor. Now,
Rudy Gobert was never at the arena? Is that? Is
that what I understand to be true? That's right, we
had him. He was sequestered over at his hotel room
or waiting on the results of the test. And then

(01:30:27):
as soon as we found out, we sent our Department
of Health up to test all of the players. So
we went in and tested all the Utah jazz players.
And uh, this is kind of an interest. In fact,
their ownership was so was so appreciative they sent a
check back to our state, our health department to cover
the costs of those tests because we immediately went in
that night at ten o'clock and tested all their players

(01:30:49):
before they got on the flights and went back to Utah. Now, uh,
you said you talked with Adam Silver. I mean that
that again. This is going to be I think an
incredible documentary one day. I think this will be kind
of the moment where they start to trace everything, uh,
in terms of the fallout in the world of sports.
And what was Adam Silver's reaction like as the commissioner

(01:31:09):
of the NBA, did it seem as if he might
have anticipated a story like this happening or was he
kind of shocked in your in your estimation, you know,
our my ESTI messig he was. He was shocked because
he was telling Clay, you know, really, it's a state
health department. And Mr Bennett Clay was like, love, got
the governor right here with me. So we were kind
of caucusing, and I don't think the NBA at that

(01:31:30):
point had made a decision or what they were gonna do.
And and so to me it was a shock. It was,
uh man, this is our worst fear. We we we
had no idea this guy was here. But we were
a little upset of he was the player, was I
think maybe showing some symptoms. Why would he fly to
Oklahoma City? But you know, we can play Monday morning quarterback. Uh.

(01:31:50):
We just didn't know at that time what was happening,
and and um um, but we made the right decision
and I think that that the NBA did as well.
And and but good news is Americans, Oklahomas have really
started to flatten this curve and we've done a really
good job. And now we're we're talking about our measured
reopening plan, which we're excited about. Yeah, let's talk about

(01:32:11):
that in a second before we get into specifically what
you're gonna be doing in Oklahoma. And we're talking to
the Governor of Oklahoma, Kevin Stitt, who was at that
game between the Jazz and the Thunder when really kind
of the intersection of sports in the coronavirus blew up
in a big way. Uh. I believe the presidents of
the University at Oklahoma and Oklahoma State have both said

(01:32:32):
that they plan on opening for the fall. And I
know you're starting to open up the state of Oklahoma
today with people being able to go back out. Now
get into what people in Oklahoma can do and what
you're seeing on the ground in your state. But a
lot of people out there who listen to me are
really focused on the return of college athletics. They got
kids and they want to know if they're gonna be

(01:32:53):
able to go back to college. With what you're seeing
on the ground in Oklahoma, how important is it to
get kids back on campus at Oklahoma and Oklahoma State. Well,
we're we're seeing some really positive trends here in Oklahoma.
You know, you've got to remember, why did we shut
down in the first place. Why did I issue fifteen
executive orders. It was really to flatten the curve and

(01:33:14):
protect our healthcare workers and our hospital systems. Because in
early March, some of those modelers were showing, hey, we're
gonna have five thousand hospitalizations. Uh. So we've done a
great job. So right now the stats are we have
two d people in the hospital across the state of Oklahoma,
uh being treated for COVID. We have four thousand, six

(01:33:36):
hundred hospital beds, So we have built up our PPE supply.
So now it's time for a measured reopening. And we think,
you know, that college experience is so important for young people.
We think the education experience the online is has been
has been good, but uh, we we do think that
there is some interaction and some things that uh, you

(01:33:56):
missed by not being there on college campus. So we're
excited to get our young people back into school, not
only higher ED, but also I've been meeting with the
superintendent of our common Education system and we're wanting to
get them back going in the fall as well. And
I said this yesterday on the show. I have a
twelve and nine and a five year old, and I
a hundred percent, based on looking at the data, want

(01:34:17):
them back in school in August when schools opened back
up in Nashville, Tennessee, where I live. You have six kids,
so I imagine as a governor, you're also a dad.
So it's not as if you're looking at this completely
without the perspective of what a parent would have you want.
I imagine, as you're opening back up the state, your
kids to be back in school as soon as they

(01:34:38):
can as well. Oh absolutely, My my wife is uh
uh pulling her hair out trying to wrangle We've got
five kids at home and then our oldest daughter and
she's a freshman in college, so she's back at home now,
and and so trying to get all the kids lined
up with zoom calls and all about with their classes
and all the classrooms, and uh, my wife is like,

(01:34:59):
this is exactly why I don't homeschool. And uh, your
your wife, and a lot of dads and moms out
there across the whole country. You're saying that including this one. Yes,
and yesterday I popped in on my third grader and
he was, you know, said high to his zoom class.
So that was pretty neat. Uh uh saying hi to
all of his all of his class. But yeah, we're
going through it, just like all the other parents around

(01:35:21):
America are. So what is the So when you decide
to open back up a state, obviously a big decision,
one of the biggest decisions that a governor can have. Uh.
And the great thing about the United States policy of
federalism is every state and every governor gets to look
at what's actually taking place inside of his borders or
her borders to figure out what makes the most sense. Um,

(01:35:43):
how do you decide that? What is the data that
you're looking at, and what is it gonna look like
going forward, Say, when restaurants open back up in Oklahoma today,
what do you expect him to look like? Yeah? Well,
first off, we have always from the very beginning, I've
said I'm gonna make decision is based on the data
that's happening in Oklahoma, not what we're seeing on television,

(01:36:05):
not what we're seeing happening in other states. And I
was one of nine states that did not issue a
stay at home order because we issued a safer at
home for our elderly most vulnerable population because when you
look at our data of our deaths in Oklahoma have
been over the age of sixty five, We've only had
five deaths under our median age in Oklahoma, which is

(01:36:28):
thirty eight years old, eleven deaths under the age of
fifty and eight percent of our death have also had
code morbidities, so in other words, they had other underlying
health issues. So really that most vulnerable is who we
were trying to protect. But we've been looking at the
scientific data in Oklahoma for the decisions from the very
beginning and not getting pressure from what we're seeing on

(01:36:48):
television or what we're seeing in other states. But yes,
it's a very difficult decision, and so that's why we're
doing this in phases. We watched the we've we've met
all four of the White House gates on reopening, and
we think it's time to do a measured reopening, which starts.
It started actually last Friday within some select cities we
did some appointment only and then this Friday we have

(01:37:09):
restaurants opening up across the state and a very uh,
you know, structured limited guidance with separation of tables and
menus that are disposable and condiments and extra sanitation and
masking of the workers and all that. But we're gonna
be watching the data, and if anything happens, we reserve
the right to extend the phase two out further or

(01:37:31):
even back up a little bit on on what we're
doing and what we're seeing based on the numbers in Oklahoma.
So you're on obviously innate nationwide sports talk show, and
we've been talking a lot about sports, but a lot
of different governors have been weighing in. You have the
Oklahoma City thunder in in your state, obviously, you also
have a huge Oklahoma and Oklahoma State fan base for

(01:37:53):
college sports. How important is the return of sports to
a sense of normalcy not only in your state but
in the country so far as you see it, well,
I think it's huge. I mean, I'm a huge college
football fan. We don't have any pro football in Oklahoma,
so we we love the Sooners, we love the Cowboys.
I went to Oklahoma State, and so just this normalcy

(01:38:15):
in the fall, you can't hardly imagine, you know, like
without college football at least for you know, college football fans.
So it's just part of our part of our fall
ritual here in Oklahoma for sure. So we're looking forward
to getting back to that normalcy. And I'm sure other
other college football fans and and uh colleges around the
around the country are looking forward to that too. But

(01:38:36):
for and from an economic standpoint, you know, the college
football is a huge economic driver for most of the
of the state schools and universities, certainly in Norman and
in Stillwater. There's probably a lot of people out there
who's listening to us. Everybody is huge fan of a
favorite college football team. What's it like to be the
governor of a state when I'm assuming if you went

(01:38:57):
to Oklahoma State, you are in Oklahoma State cowboy fan,
but now you're representing the whole state. Well, and that's
got to be kind of an interesting fan interesting perspective
just from a sports fan perspective, to be in charge
of representing your rival as well. Yeah it is. You know.
The the interesting thing is I grew up in Norman,
So I grew up in Norman as an OU fan,

(01:39:19):
and and then I went to Stillwater for college and
so yes, I'm a huge Okahoma State fan, and when
you become governor, you're you're a little more neutral. And
uh so I love both love both schools, but I
get harassed a little bit from my Oaklahoma State uh
college friends calling me a trader when they see me
on the sidelines of the o U game. And then
the OU fans, uh, you know, harassed me a little

(01:39:42):
bit because I went to Oklahoma State. So it's it's
a lot of fun. And I'll tell you, Um, we
enjoyed bedlam, which is what we call the o U
O s U game here. Um. And then I love
going to the o U Texas game and met Governor Abbot,
so we flipped the coin at the fifty yard line
for the Red River rivalry last year. And so, uh,
we're just huge college football fans here in Oklahoma. Well,

(01:40:03):
I don't know the answer to this, and I imagine
a lot of people are curious. What kind of role
would the governor of Oklahoma have in terms of making
helping to make a decision about whether Oklahoma and Oklahoma
State football come back? I mean, is that something where
you're on a call with the Big twelve You may
not even know because I don't imagine there's a lot
of precedent in these situations. But how much of an

(01:40:24):
impact or a influence do you believe you'll have on
the decision of whether college football is played, which I
know all of our audience hopes and anticipates it will be.
How much of an impact do you think you'll have
in those decisions? Well, as far as, uh, the influence
from from the University of Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and our
higher regions, Yes, we're on the phone with with those

(01:40:45):
folks and uh uh you know, obviously we want to
look at the data. We're gonna be safe. But as
far as the Big twelve in the n c A uh,
not much from my perspective. So the influence that I
would have would would be just with the presidents about
O you an L. S U and then our chancellor
of higher education. This has been outstanding. I know you're
a busy man, got a lot going on in the state.

(01:41:06):
Congratulations on starting to open back up. And also your
numbers in Oklahoma, as you said, the hospitalization numbers very low.
And hey man, looking forward to being able to watch
Bedlam this fall. Fingers crossed. All that's gonna keep happening,
and thanks for all the work that is Governor Kevin
Stitt from Oklahoma, thanks my man, he thank you so much.

(01:41:27):
This is outkicked the coverage with Clay Travis. Welcome back
in final segment of the week. UM, I hope all
of you have had a good week hanging out with us.
We got a new month. I wanted to uh to
finish off the week here by telling you that there's

(01:41:51):
a lot of data that continues to be very positive
about this nation in the battle with the coronavirus. And
I know, look, it's easy to find doom and gloom,
it's easy to be pessimistic, but the overall trend lines
continue to be very positive in terms of let me
just give you a few In terms of the total deaths, right,

(01:42:12):
which is the number one thing that people pay attention to,
Those are declining. Those are onent on decline as a
statistical measure if you look at them and plot them
on a graph, doesn't mean that on any given day
a particular state or region might not have a bad number,
right and blip up that can happen, and certainly every

(01:42:34):
day fluctuates as we look at all of this data.
But the general trend line is that we are on
the back side of this outbreak, right, that we have
peaked overall, and that the numbers every single day, they
may not always go down, but the general trend line
is a decline. That is unmistakably true. Same thing is

(01:42:55):
true about the total new daily cases and also more importantly,
the total new daily case infection rate of the cases
that we are getting done. All right, so what do
I mean What do I mean by that? I mean,
let's say that we have a hundred thousand cases that
we do well. We can have a twenty thousand number

(01:43:16):
of people who test positive for the coronavirus, and that
would be a uh positive rate. But now we are
testing nearly two hundred thousand people, and so if twenty
five thousand or you know, people test positive, it looks
like the number of new cases is going up, but

(01:43:37):
the percentage testing positive would actually have gone down substantially, right,
because instead of testing a hundred thousand people, you're testing
two hundred thousand people. So the number of people that
are testing positive on a day to day basis is declining.
That is, we are having a lower percentage of positive

(01:43:58):
test results. Even though sometimes the numbers may still be
going up now. The overall numbers are still trending down
right relative to past past days and weeks. But on
a day to day basis, sometimes people don't look at
these numbers that well and they say, oh, well, yesterday
we had twenty five thousand cases and today we have

(01:44:19):
thirty thousand cases. Well, that probably very often when the
number is going up is a function of a lot
more tests having taken place. Why does this matter? Some
of you are out there like, Hey, I just want
to hear about sports. It matters because you just heard
from the governor of Oklahoma, and the governor of Oklahoma
is they're looking at the data in his individual state

(01:44:42):
and they're opening back up Oklahoma, and as these states
open back up, sports become more and more likely. Look,
we already know that there are a lot of positive
directions that sports are moving, right. I started off the
show by talking with you guys about the fact that
Tiger W. Goods and Phil Mickelson and Tom Brady and

(01:45:04):
Peyton Manning are going to play a golf tournament, right,
and so we know that's gonna happen. We talked about
it a lot yesterday out kick broke that news. It's
supposed to happen on Memorial Day weekend, will air on
t n T. Continuing progress in a really good way
on Nascar, UH, continuing to hear positive things about the UFC,
which is already scheduled to go back. Everybody else is

(01:45:27):
still up in the air. There's all these different plans
that are going on. But as we move into May,
this backside of the curve should become even less and
less of an issue. Fewer people are gonna die, Things
are gonna be moving in a very very positive direction.
So fingers crossed that things are gonna get better faster

(01:45:50):
than we expect. But we no longer have to have
our fingers crossed and be saying, hey, I hope things
are gonna get better. Things are one hundred percent getting
better in this country on a day to day basis,
every single day out there, and in the end that
is ultimately going to lead to more sports. Now. Some
people have been upset with me for sharing all the

(01:46:12):
factual data with you guys, for being as honest as
I possibly can on a day in and day out
basis talking about the coronavirus. But I view my role
as a little bit different than traditionally it would be
when we're reacting to Monday night football ending, or the
week that just happened in college football, or the NFL,
or the NBA Playoffs or World Series or whatever. It

(01:46:33):
might be a lot of times we are here to
talk about sports. I feel like for the last couple
of months, we've been here for you to talk about life.
And at some point that is going to change and
we're going to go back to a traditional discussion of
sports more so than we've been doing for the past
couple of months. But the important thing is we are

(01:46:55):
here for you. We have continued to be here for
you on this show. We haven't missed a single day,
uh since Rudy Gobert walked off the court, Sorry, you
didn't even walk off the court since he tested positive.
We just heard the story from the governor of Oklahoma
about exactly what went down that day in Oklahoma City.
Since that happened, we have been here with you every

(01:47:16):
single day, even though sports by and large has not
even been taken place. And what I find to be
incredibly gratifying is the number of you out there listening
on the podcast has grown even though we don't even
have sports to talk about in a in a large
sense in terms of a day to day reaction to sports.
UH and I think that's because there is a great
craving out there in the country for somebody to reasonably

(01:47:40):
share facts with you and uh and tell you the truth,
which is that sports are gonna return return sooner rather
than later, and that we are going to uh to
to be able to have them again. And when we do,
we'll be sitting right here with you like we are
every single morning even while sports are not going on.
As we enter into the new month of May, i'd
encourage you to go subscribe to the podcast. If you

(01:48:02):
haven't already, you can track me down on Twitter. Follow
me there. My name is Clay Travis at Clay Travis
on Twitter. You can find the Outkicked Podcast just by
typing Outkicked podcast in Google uh and you'll be able
to go subscribe and see every single minute of the show.
My thanks to all of our guests this week, but
in particular to the Oklahoma Governor who we just had
on great segment there. If you didn't hear it, encourage

(01:48:24):
you to go back and listen. UH. My thanks to
Ryan Glasspiegel who's now an employee at Outkicked the Coverage. Also,
as always, we try to talk to Lance Taylor on
Friday and make sure that we bring him in. UH.
He is there hanging out with us as well. We
want to thank him and as always on behalf of
the crew. For Danny g for Dub, for Roberto, and
for Eddie Garcia. Thanks for listening to us for another week.

(01:48:46):
We'll be back on Monday, same bad time, same bad channel.
This has been outkicked the coverage. Have great weekends with
your family and we'll be here with you on Fox
Sports Radio when you come back on Monday.

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