Urban Meyer Exit Strategy

Episode Transcript
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all of you are having a fantastic Tuesday morning, thanks
for spending it with us here on out Kick. And
we completed last night for those of you who may
have gone to bed a little bit early or maybe

(00:48):
a state up and then I just found something else
to do because it wasn't necessarily the most exciting game
of all time, but the Philadelphia Eagles hosted the Washington Redskins,
and effectively the wash Ington Redskins season came to a halt,
a screeching halt, if it hadn't already. And meanwhile, the
Philadelphia Eagles still alive to be able to win the

(01:10):
NFC East as they get ready to go on the
road this coming weekend with the Dallas Cowboys. But let's
begin with tonight's uh, last night's results, and in particular,
UH Carson Wentz came out was fine. You feel like
if you are an Eagles fan. As mediocre as the
performance has been so far this year, the Eagles are

(01:32):
now sitting at six and six, and this is a
team that I think it's eminently reasonable to believe could
win the NFC East. They will go on the road,
they can catch up with the Cowboys this coming uh,
this coming weekend, and this is the final four games
for the Philadelphia Eagles. They go to the Cowboys, Cowboys
are around a four point favored in that game on

(01:52):
Sunday afternoon. Uh, then they go on the road against
the Rams, the very difficult game. Then they get the Texans,
another very difficult game, and uh, then they finished against
the Redskins. So I think the likelihood is that they're
gonna go seven and nine. Personally, if I'm betting on
the way that the Eagles are gonna finish this season,
I think they'll lose to the Cowboys. I think they

(02:12):
will lose to the Rams. I think they will lose
to the Texans, and I think they will beat the
Redskins to finish out the season. So I still don't
believe that the Philadelphia Eagles are likely to make the playoff.
But for the Washington Redskins, this is brutal. Uh. They
lost Alex Smith to a broken leg. At the time
that they lost Alex Smith to a broken leg, they

(02:33):
were sitting at six and three and felt pretty good,
pretty comfortable about their spot at the top of the
NFC East. They lose Alex Smith and lose a very
close game to the Houston Texans, then they lose to
UH to the Dallas Cowboys, and now they've lost to
the Eagles. They finished with UH, let's be honest, a

(02:54):
game against the Giants. Who knows what's gonna happen now
that Mark Sanchez is a starting quarterback. Then they finished
on the road against the Jags, on the road against
the Titans, and they finished ano their game against the
Eagles that they get to play at home. It wouldn't
stun me at all if the Redskins will lose out.
Now here's the other thing about the Redskins, and something
that I think is intriguing. What are they gonna do

(03:15):
at quarterback? Are they really going to go with Mark
Sanchez for the final four games of the season. I
can't believe I'm gonna break the glass here and say it.
But if you consider the way that the Redskins were
received when they took Reuben Foster off of waivers in
the wake of his arrest for another domestic violence incident

(03:37):
with his girlfriend, is there any play at all here?
If you are the Washington Redskins to go ahead and
sign Colin Kaepernick, maybe then you can go out and
even sign Kareem Hunt too and say you are the
franchise that embraces fresh starts for everyone. The reason why
I raised that as an issue, At a minimum, the

(04:00):
Skins are gonna have to draft a quarterback in the
first round, I believe with their draft pick this year.
Because you've got Colt McCoy with a broken leg, it's
unlikely that he's gonna be a percent healthy by the
time the season starts in September, even if you believed
that he was the future of your franchise. Alex Smith
had a devastating broken leg that was even worse. It
looked like a worse break. In other words, not a

(04:22):
clean break than the the injury that Colt McCoy got.
So if your top two quarterbacks are both coming off
broken legs, it seems unlikely to me that you would
anticipate them being ready for the first game of the
season in September, or certainly ready in the preseason. Now.
Maybe the Redskins are convinced that Mark Sanchez is going

(04:43):
to be their quarterback of the future. I'm just saying
that tin of tossing it out as a as a
little bit of a wild a statement, but maybe that's
what they believe. Uh. More likely than not. I believe
they're gonna have to go out and make a move
in the quarterback market in addition to drafting so body
in the first round. Probably they may well have to

(05:03):
go out and sign a veteran. And it's not like
there are any veterans are available that you feel really
that strongly about. Uh. And and so I think the
the Washington Redskins are in dire straits here when you
think about what makes sense for them for the final
four games of the season, which is why I look

(05:23):
I I don't say this lightly, but I really genuinely
feel like maybe the decision could be made to consider
Colin Kaepernick here just because I don't know what other
quarterbacks are available that they could bring in. And if
they did it, then it would make Dan Snyder suddenly.

(05:43):
He would go from pariah for claiming Ruben Foster to
a saint overnight in the eyes of the media. And
maybe that's something that matters to him. Because Dan Snyder's
press coverage has typically been brutal. Everybody has hated him
in the d C area because he's never had very
much success as the owner of the Washington Redskins. Kareem

(06:07):
Hunt went through and cleared waivers. But if you are
the Redskins and you're trying to look down the road
towards your future, what if in one fell swoop, you
signed Kareem Hunt because you're gonna eventually need I know
they have Darius Guys who's enter injured, but you're gonna
eventually need another running back. At least Darius Guys may

(06:27):
or may not be back for the start of the
season in September. You can always use more than one
running back. What if they went and got Kareem Hunt,
they took Reuben Foster and The reason why they were
able to take those guys with off the field related
incidents is because they also went and signed Colin Kaepernick.
You may think I'm crazy. You may think I'm crazy

(06:49):
like a fox. I think that's the way you have
to think at this point. If you are Dan Snyder
and your season has basically blown up with back to
back broken legs at the quarterback position, I think this
is the time where everything has gone awry, and maybe
you're a little bit desperate now. Maybe he doesn't I
don't even know who else what other quarterbacks are on
the roster for the Redskins at this point. I know

(07:12):
that Mark Sanchez can't be your long time fixed at
the quarterback position. You're really I think if you're a
Redskins fan, probably want them to go ahead and lose
out because you want to be as high up in
the first round as you can be. And I think
you're almost entirely positively gonna have to go out and
draft a quarterback in the first round. And who that

(07:32):
quarterback is and whether he's ready to play starting Week
one seems like a risky proposition, uh, particularly because you're
coming off with with two injuries and Frankly, you may
like a quarterback better who you know is not gonna
be ready for a week one. I think it's fair
to say that the Baltimore Ravens new that Lamar Jackson

(07:53):
was unlikely to be ready for a Week one, and
so they felt comfortable taking him because they already had
a Joe Flacco. The Redskins really don't have that luxury
unless you legitimately believe. And I think that's uh, that's
really really optimistic that there's any way both these guys
Colt McCoy and Alex Smith, coming off of broken legs
are gonna somehow be ready for the start of the

(08:17):
of the season and come September, not to mention in
the preseason and everything else when the offense is being installed.
So the Redskins season has completely gone up in smoke.
It is an utter disaster now and I'm not sure
how you how you handle it now. I said yesterday
we would talk about the overall playoff picture once the

(08:37):
NFC was was clear finished with Week twelve, we had
to wait for Monday Night Football. The a f C
is really messy. The NFC, I'm not sure that it
is because they're frankly, aren't that many teams that are
in the mix to be able to make the playoffs.
I mean, when you look at the NFC right now,
the Rams are the number one seed, the New Orleans

(08:58):
Saints are the number two. See, and there's a pretty
substantial gap after those two teams, which right now would
get buys and be able to have home field for
the divisional round of the playoff games. Chicago Bears sitting
at eight and four. Not sure very many people believe
in the Chicago Bears, even though they're right now they're
the top of the NFC North. But I'm also not
sure anybody else can catch them because Minnesota Vikings are

(09:20):
a couple of games back. But let's continue. The Dallas
Cowboys sitting at seven and five, all right, They've got
a big game for first place in their division against
the Philadelphia Eagles coming up this weekend. Uh, We've got
the Seattle Seahawks sitting at seven and five at the
top of the wild Card. And then you've got the
Minnesota Vikings sitting at six five and one, and then

(09:42):
the Carolina Panthers or six and six. They've lost four
games in a row. Their half game out of the
wild card. UH. The Philadelphia Eagles are six and six UH,
and they are in the mix for the wild card.
And like you said, the Rock Washington Redskins, who I
don't believe we're gonna be able to finish very strong
at all, are sitting at six and six. Maybe even
the Tampa Bay Buccaneers sitting at five and seven, are

(10:04):
even in this playoff mix because I think eight Nate
might get you the final NFC wild card bid. I
think maybe even seven and nine could be in play
before all is said and done. Because a lot of
these teams that are in the playoff mix have very
difficult games coming up. We know that Minnesota and Seattle
are playing this weekend coming up. That's the two teams

(10:25):
at the bottom of the wild card race. One of
those teams gonna lose UH, and even the one that
wins is not gonna be that great of shape. And
UH and the Carolina Panthers, like I said, they've lost
four in a row. The Eagles and the UH and
the Cowboys, whoever doesn't win the NFC East might still
be in great shape to make a wild card run
either way, depending on how things shake out. So that

(10:48):
is where we are in the NFC in the wake
of the final game of the of the twelfth game
of the NFL season, So we turn our attention towards
a week thirteen. We will bring in our guy Charles
Davis here on the back side of this segment, and
we'll have him kind of walk us through what he
saw as as the major storylines of the twelfth game

(11:10):
of the NFL season. As we now have finished of
the regular season and everybody turns toward the final four games.
But again you may think I'm crazy. We'll take some
calls on this, probably an hour too. Is it a
wild idea of mine? If you are the Washington Redskins
and you have been under siege for your claim of

(11:31):
Reuben Foster, if you went ahead and said, you know what,
will claim Kareem Hunt too, and we'll go grab Colin Kaepernick,
wouldn't signing Colin Kaepernick basically protect the Washington Redskins from
any criticism for going after these guys with domestic violence past,
because you say, look, we believe in fresh starts here

(11:53):
with the Washington Redskins, And uh, I think most people
would say, you know what, they're signing Colin Kaepernick. I
don't think you'd get that much attention elsewhere. It reminds me, honestly,
of what happened with Urban Meyer when he was with
the Florida Gators. He had Tim Tebow, and because he
had Tim Tebow, nobody paid attention to all of the

(12:13):
other craziness, all of the arrests, all the violence, everything
else that was running awry at the Florida Gators because
Tim Tebow soaked up all the media atmosphere and attention,
and Tim Tebow was such a saint. I think Colin
Kaepernick would do the same thing. Now. I'm not sure
that the Redskins would make that move, but I do
know there aren't very many quarterbacks available who would make

(12:37):
very much sense. I guess you could sign Nathan Peterman.
I think he's still floating around out there. Uh. We'll
discuss uh, and I'll bring it up with Charles Davis
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(14:23):
Clay up decks Charles Davis. This is out Kicked the
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We bring in now my guy, Arles Davis. He's at
cf D twenty two. He joins us every single Tuesday
morning breakdown everything that happened. Uh, and We've got a

(15:07):
lot to get to. But first, right off the jump, here, um, Charles,
what would you do if you were the Washington Redskins.
You're sitting now at six and six. You have lost
two quarterbacks too broken legs, Colt McCoy and Alex Smith.
Expectations would be those guys are gonna have a long
offseason recoveries. Whether they're ready even at the beginning of September,

(15:31):
I think is a legitimate question. I'm not a doctor,
but it seems like it's it's unlikely that either one
of those guys would be a hundred percent by then.
Mark Sanchez as your quarterback right now, you have to
probably draft a quarterback. I would think in the first round.
There's not really anybody in the free agent market that
you could sign that looks like they could be a
big time playmaker. I said, if I wore and I

(15:53):
say this as a guy who understands how controversially is
if I wore uh Dan Snyder. Right now, I would
consider an explore signing Colin Kaepernick to compete with Mark Sanchez,
to see how he can do in the final four
games of the season. They've already signed Reuben Foster. You
know how controversial that was. You could maybe even go

(16:14):
out and pick up Kareem Hunt if you did this,
because you could argue, hey, you are a franchise that
believes in fresh starts. You're not going to pre judge
anybody based on what they did beforehand. What would you
do if you were Dan Snyder? Is my idea crazy?
Your idea is not crazy, Clay, You're here's the thing.
Colin Kaepernick should have been signed before, Mark Sanchez. Yeah,

(16:38):
I mean this is you know, if you're gonna, if
you're willing to sign Reuben Foster, there's no argument in
my mind that you can sign Reuben Foster. And that's okay,
but we don't want to touch Colin Kaepernick. You you
avoided your own argument. I I I agree with you,

(17:00):
totally avoided your own argument. Okay. Look, I'm I'm all
for everyone having their own opinions and beliefs and convictions
and I and I won't fight with teams that say, listen,
I'm not signing Kaepernick because in my mind I believe this. Okay,
I don't agree with them, but that doesn't mean that
they can't have their own opinion about the whole thing,

(17:20):
all right, I see it as a different thing than
than they do. But if you're gonna sign Reuben Foster,
which to me is absolutely ludicrous right from the jump
and the way that they handled it was ludicrous. And
for this reason, if you're gonna sign Reuben Foster, you
better have someone out in front. And this is not
a criticism of Doug Williams, because I know Doug and

(17:43):
consider him a very good friend. But that was not
his role to be out front and be the spokesperson
for signing Reuben Foster. All right. I mean, Clay, you
have not been in this position many different times, right,
And we've seen who gets tried to out in front.
You don't try to out the person that's not your
PR person. You don't try out a guy just on

(18:06):
a basic level in a hoodie to answer questions about
domestic islands. Right. I mean that's just like it's just
it doesn't matter who the person is. I'm care if
it's the slick is talker going, I don't care if
it's if it's a winner of the Harvard Debate competition.
You don't try them out like that. They better be
out there in the coat in the tie, and and
and and have some gravitas to the situation. So moving

(18:27):
on past that. Yeah, and at this stage, you know,
whoever you sign, you just have to expect minimal deal.
You're trying to get someone who can get you in
and added a huddle and get you up the line
of scrimmage and run something of a semblance of an
NFL looking play because who can absorb a playbook? At
this point, who can do all these things? I mean,

(18:47):
I can't believe on a football level, well, Washington has
absorbed and they're in the position that they are in
in terms of injuries and still in a position where
they might have an effect on the playoffs, let alone
at absolutely make the playoffs themself. I mean if they
make sure, we believe it. But if for them now
because of all but just to get to this point,
people just just go back and google their transactions and

(19:10):
injuries this year and ask yourself, how in the heck
did they win as many games as they did. If
they went two and two, they would find themselves potentially
in the playoff race as a wild card team, right
if you look at the NFC, If you look at
the NFC playoff race, Okay, you'll like this analogy. I
think the Kaepernick analogy I was using was you're in Florida.

(19:31):
You know what happened when Urban Meyer had Tim Tebow.
There was all sorts of arrest uh miss misbehavior, uh
you know downright, uh like an absolute almost I'm trying
to think of like a prison asylum almost right, Like
you had all sorts of craziness going on there. There
was a certain lawyer if you remember, correct, Yeah, there

(19:53):
was that. They got plenty of business during that that.
He was the team lawyer, yes, being called the team lawyer, right.
He the guy every time something happened, he was the
one making the statement about what happened with that player.
There are a lot of teams that have everyone top echelon, yes,
criminal justice attorney on on retainer in the in the

(20:14):
in their different cities. But the media was, and I
think fans as well, disguised because Tim Tebow was such
a saint that it was like all of his media
coverage kind of blanketed over the Gators, and as a result,
you didn't notice everything else that was going on because
Tim Tebow soaked up so much of the media oxygen

(20:35):
and attention and he was a saint, right, I think
that there there was that element right, No, no, no no,
I mean I think there's an element of that that
would come for the Washington Redskins and helped to cover
up the decision that they made with Ruben Foster. Heck,
I think they could even go and signed Kareem Hunt
if they signed Colin Kaepernick, because all the oxygen would
go to Cap. Yeah, And and the crazy part is

(20:59):
what Cap is going through and why he's not playing
what we're talking. There's no doubt there, there's zero doubt.
Like if you had to choose, like you said, this
off the but once you decide to sign Reuben Foster,
who's arrested again for domestic violence, you have broken the
glass on controversial signings, right Like. And if there's anybody

(21:22):
out there right now who believes, you know what, I
think that Reuben Foster or Kareem Hunt or any of
those guys are more controversial than Colin Kaepernick would be,
I think you're crazy, right. I think most reasonable fans
would agree that ka that Kaepernick pales in comparison to
the decisions of Reuben Foster and potentially Kareem Hunt. A
guy doesn't play in the league because of a belief

(21:46):
in our system that needs help, and other guys are
getting signed that are breaking laws of our country. Yeah,
I mean there's a total I'm with you. I mean,
there's a totally once you made the decision, and I
understand with you too. Look, I understand certainly the owners
who say, you know what, I don't want anything controversial

(22:07):
associated with my team at all, and that's at least consistent. Yeah, listen,
they have that right to to have their belief that
that person is not who I want in my organization.
But don't trot. Don't trot that at me and then
signed Greg Hardy. Don't don't do that to me. Okay,
don't tell them you believe this part, and then sign

(22:29):
a guy who who not has only been accused of
domestic violence, you pretty much believe that it happened. Okay,
we've got cream hunting now with the video. He's got
a lot to work through to put it mildly. Okay,
So if I see him being signed in and you know,
we can go on and on, and I hate to
always have Kaepernick loom over it, but in this situation,

(22:49):
the best quarterback out there that we know that it's
played in the league would be him. He hasn't played
in a while. But heck the idea that you signed
Mark Sanchez but we don't now I'm no on Colin Kaepernick.
You're kidding me right. Here are the quarterbacks forever and
that's not again, not a slam that's just backed. Here

(23:10):
are the quarterbacks that are that are free agents right now.
If you are the Redskins, EJ. Manual t J. Yates,
Kellen Clemens, Josh Johnson, Nathan Peterman, maybe Matt Moore, Paxton Lynch.
I mean, there there is not much out there in
terms of reclamation projects that you could And again, the
Redskins don't just have to think about these four games.

(23:31):
They got to think about the off season because these
guys with the broken legs, it seems to me, you're
unlikely to be ready to play almost such that the
Redskins are basically guaranteed to take a quarterback in the
first round. You're in the full quarterback market now, you're
absolutely in the full quarterback market. And every one of
those names that you just listed, Clay, there's not a
single one of them that you would look at, say,

(23:53):
Paxton Lynch that you would say, hey, not only could
we sign him in the off season, he possibly could
be the or back of our future the season. To
put Paxiston Lynch in there is that when he came
out of school, he was acknowledged by the league. Okay,
consensus likely first round draft pick, right, doesn't mean that
it's always correct. You and I both know that. And

(24:15):
and I'm in the business of of of going through
the NFL draft every year. And if you list all
the guys that I liked that didn't make it would
be a pretty long list. You'd also have a list
of guys that I like that did make it. That's
the way the draft goes. Okay, you're not gonna get
them all correct. Look, every year when teams draft Clay,
if they hit on their draft choices, they had a

(24:36):
heck of a year drafting. All right, that's a good
year draft. When I say hit, I mean make the team,
contribute to the team, etcetera. Obviously, the higher you draft,
the more you're expecting out of a player. Paxton Lynch
is an absolute bust because he didn't make it, No
one's picked him up, and he's still young. That's the
only reason I lift him as a potential, but out
of all that list, you would have to include him

(24:58):
in there as you're thinking to yourself, no chance does
he pilot my team down the road. You're just trying.
Those guys are stop gaps at best, all right, period,
stop gaps at best. Not a single one of them
that you would think going forward. And to your point
for Washington, whoever is in their player personnel department, it
is quarterbacks, quarterbacks, quarterbacks, college guys. Obviously you mentioned the

(25:21):
free agents. That doesn't sound like a very good list.
Is there anyone in Canada is real good? Right now?
I mean that's where you're going. I mean you're going there,
Candeter Brock come back and play. I mean that's that's
that's where they are. And and it's so unfortunate because
I've seen that team up close and personal this year.
They have battled so hard to be in this spot.
They've taken some bad losses and bounced back with some

(25:42):
incredible wins. They never should have really been in this
spot based off of all these injuries, yet they are
so to me that team has done Yeoman's duty just
to have this conversation. Uh, one of the things that
I think we grapple with on a regular basis in
sports is what are the midst of redemption? What can
you do that you are not allowed to come back from?

(26:05):
Are there any such things? Um? And I think it's
a larger societal issues certainly that gets asked all the
time because there are many out there who have made
substantial mistakes, particularly when you're young. Kareem Hunt. You saw
the video, Um, he has cleared waivers, he has not
been picked up. He did his interview with Lisa Salters
to sit down. What would you advise him going forward?

(26:28):
And if you were an NFL team, how would you
make a decision about him? But one, you know, I
think we I saw the Lisas Salters interview. I heard
the reporting later in the game, which kind of hit
it an odd time for that story. Game was like
a one score game, and I'm curious by the way

(26:49):
last night, UM, it's just it. Yeah, everyone, I'm not
saying what they're saying or what they're doing because I
am those guys collect those the ap peers. So this
is not a criticism. It just seemed like an odd
time to have an in depth conversation about that that
particular case, And of course Ruben Foster. But for me,

(27:11):
you know, they did report that Bruce Allen is it
feels like he's doing done an extentive die And essentially
what I heard, tell me, if you tell me, if
if you think I heard this correctly, what I heard
is that Bruce Allen has done his homework and he's
the president of of of Washington. He's done his homework
and it's not what it appears to be and he
has more information that we don't have. Did I hear

(27:32):
that correctly? I think I think that's the way that
I took it. And look, I am, this is me
putting my lawyer had on. One of the things that
troubles me in our society today is that we take
a lot, we take very strong and aggressive positions before
we know all the facts that have come out. And
all we know about the Reuben Foster case in general
is that back in May, this woman admitted that she

(27:55):
had totally made up. Whether it's true or not, I
don't know, but she told authorities, you know what, I
made up everything surrounding the allegations that I made against
him and May so she would do that in May.
Why do we assume that suddenly in November, she is
going to be a paragon of virtue when it comes
to speaking to authorities and making accusations against Reuben Foster. Now, maybe, look,

(28:18):
maybe Ruben Foster is an awful guy. Maybe everything is
that she said is true from the get go, and
she changed her mind for a reason that a lot
of people do who are in domestic violence because they're
in love with the person who is is victimizing them.
Maybe that's true, But maybe it's also true that this
is just a toxic relationship and that these two people
should never be around each other and they're constantly creating drama,

(28:42):
some of which is real, some of which is not.
There are a lot of people out there right now
who have been around a couple that should have never
been together and they just create disaster everywhere they go,
and maybe that's what's going on with this couple. So
that seems to be the story that we were told
last night as to why the Washington Redskins made a
decision that they did. But it certainly sounds, you know,

(29:03):
of zero to dispute that I just kept what I heard,
is what I said before. He feels like he has
more information than we do, and almost like and there'll
be a big reveal about that later, you know what
I mean. It's kind of one of those things. And
we do know that they said actually did not sign
him for this year because he's on the Commissioner's exempt list, right,
so he can't play anyway, this is signed him, go

(29:25):
through the process, find out everything that's going on, and
if it's anywhere in the realm of what you just described,
maybe he's going to be available to play next year
and hopefully he gets his personal life in order or
that drama goes away. I think for San Francisco it
wasn't just that there was an allegation I think underlying
and I'm saying this without anyone from San Francisco talking

(29:47):
to me or me talking to them, But to go
through all that previously, right, and then as you noted,
she said, Okay, it didn't happen that way, etcetera, blah
blah blah, he still gets to the two game suspension,
he goes through all that. It's the same woman. I mean,

(30:07):
what what, it's the same woman. You're still doing the
same thing, still dealing with the same stuff as before.
It makes it hard to believe in you all the time, right,
It makes it hard to keep going back right, you know.
So so you know, if if you were, if I
were a bad stand up comedian, it's like the Chris

(30:30):
Rock talking about you know what you talked about with
another woman. Oh, I know what you're thinking, I didn't
really do it. Yeah, we're gonna believe that. No, you know,
And that's what makes it very, very difficult. And I'm
with you. You're a lawyer. You know these things way
better than the rest of us do. Sports doesn't get

(30:51):
judged on legal terms like life does. And that's where
we run into all of this. Sports gets judged at
a whole different level. And you know this because you
live in both worlds. When you talk to people about
certain things legally, it's probably very clinical. They're almost dispassionate
in the conversation. Okay, I see, I see where you're

(31:13):
coming from. Clay, Okay, that makes sense. Okay, blah blah blah.
You adding a player like Ruben Foster, you add in
a team that this passion becomes passion and then and
when you say, hey, you know legally, he's oh no,
he's not right. How many times? How many times that
happened in your conversations all fight kicked in then right hold,

(31:33):
different ballgame, And so sports is just judged differently. It's
just the way it is. And I know a lot
of it comes from the root of people. And this
is not an accusation, this is just real. Hey, sports
is something we all would rather be doing and as
viewed as a game, not as a true life calling.
So you get judged differently. And you know, it's a

(31:56):
privilege to play this game. You should be doing this, this, this,
and this. Lets the privilege to go to work every day.
It's a privileg to be married every day. It's privile
to do all these things every day. But you don't
judge it the same way you had a couple of
the last question for you, and I'll give you a
two parter here to close out with us. And we're
talking to Charles Davis. Go follow him at CFD twenty two.
He's fantastics been getting up with us all early in

(32:17):
the morning all year long. Uh. Bears, Uh and Giants?
You had that game? How ominous is it for Bears
fans the way that they performed. I know that Mitch
Drabinsky wasn't playing, but Chase Daniel, What did you see there?
And also you have Falcons Packers coming up. How in
the world do you prep for that game given the
firing of Mike McCarthy and all of the off field

(32:39):
drama associated with it. Uh, two easy ones for you
to close out there. Yeah, for the Bears, I wouldn't
be I wouldn't take it too far. My question would
just simply be how hurt is Mitchell Trabisky. You're gonna
find that out. And you know, the indication we got
was that if it would have been a playoff game
last week, there's a very good chance he would have
played okay, So they wanted to make sure he was

(33:01):
totally healthy. We see this all the time. Heck, the
New Orleans Saints laid a big egg in Dallas. Let
Dallas played really well, but teams on streaks Eventually they
come to an end, someone jumps you off, you go.
The beauty For the Bears, no blood that week, right Clay,
Everyone in their division lost, so that helped them significantly
in terms of that. But the Rams come to town

(33:23):
on Sunday night, That's where that's where it gets real.
That's where we'll find out more about them. I think
they'll be back on the beam and play better because
their defense is pretty good. The Packers getting ready for
that when it's just simply going into me eyes wide open,
meeting with the new coaches. Who is Joe Philbin, who
has been around the block, and you know, trying to
get a sense in a pulse. Hopefully we'll be able

(33:44):
to talk to Mark Murphy the president, talk with with
with with Brian Gudain's the GM and get a pulse
and a sense about Okay, you made the decision. Obviously
you have something in mind, not necessarily who the next coaches,
but what needs to happen in this organization to go
forward and see what they tell us, because that's could
be a bigger narrative in a lot of ways, the
natural game itself, because both of these teams now pretty

(34:07):
much out of the playoffs, no doubt at all. Charles Davis,
it's always outstanding at CFD twenty two. We will follow
on Twitter, We will follow you to we'll talk to
you next week. Thanks a lock, Clay, take care, bring
in Eddie Garca. Let me find out what's shaking in
the world is sports? Ma man al Right, Clay, we
got a guy goes Scoreboard. Monday Night football in Philadelphia,
Eagles over the Redskins thirteen. Carson wins for Philadelphia over

(34:29):
the three yards passing and two touchdowns. Both teams are
now six and six on the season. Redskins going forward,
we'll have Mark Sanchez is our quarterback because McCoy there
starter suffered a broken leg at the end of the
first quarter. He's done for the year. He had recently
replaced Alex Smith, who was out for the year with
a broken leg. As well. A couple of quick games
in the NBA, Warriors over the Hawks eleven. Steph Curry

(34:49):
thirty points in the win for Golden State, and the
Nuggets beat the Raptors one of six, one of three.
Nicole Yokis with a triple double for Denver twenty three points,
eleven rebounds, fifteen assist Denver is tied with the Clippers
the top record the West. They beat the Raptors on
the road, who have the top record in the NBA.
To support brought to you by True Car. Online car
shopping can be confusing, but not anymore. With True Price
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(35:10):
will pay for your next car. So this is a
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Click Travis and the Geico OutKick the Coverage Studios good stuff.
As always, we are indeed here at the Geico out
Kicks Studios. When we come back, I put up a
pole question and I'm curious to share this with you.
Would you be okay with your team sound signing Kareem Hunt?
Thirty thousand of you voted. What were the results? I'll

(35:30):
tell you next on OutKick the Coverage. Welcome at Geico
out Kick Studios. Were brought to you by my Bookie
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(35:52):
conditions apply for entertainment purposes only. Void we're prohibited. We
are often running here finishing off our one. But go
ahead and tell you to line up the phone lines. Uh,
gonna go to your calls at the start of hour
two eight, seven, seven, six, three six nine. Gonna talk
about this issue a little bit more because I think
it's the top of mind for many different NFL fans

(36:14):
and certainly for football fans in general. And it's Kareem Hunt.
I asked the question yesterday and you can go vote
in this poll question if you scroll down UH and
find my name at Clay Travis UH. And this is
what I put on Twitter. Kareem Hunt is on waivers
and won't play for the rest of the year. But
would you be okay with your favorite NFL team claiming

(36:35):
him to play? Uh? To plan to use him next year?
So he's out for the rest of this year, your
team would be grabbing him to use potentially next year
after his punishment has served. Nearly thirty thousand of you
voted in this poll. Fifty three of you said yeste
percent of you said no and UH. And we were

(36:58):
talking about this just with Charles Davis. I am of
the opinion, having watched the video and everything else, that
if you need a running back, and you believe that
Kareem Hunt, when you do your due diligence, that there
are no other major issues in his background, which I
think is significant, And in meeting with him, if he
were willing to agree to you that he would be

(37:19):
a part of a zero tolerance concept. In other words,
if you do anything at all, you're immediately gone. I
think i'd sign Kareem Hunt. And I don't say that
because I don't think that domestic violence is an awful
thing or that violence is is not to be frowned upon.
There are a lot of guys in the NFL right
now who have done worse things than Kareem Hunt. The

(37:42):
Cincinnati Bengals have a running back, Joe Mixon, who broke
a woman's a college girls face on video at Oklahoma.
The Kansas City Chiefs still have Tyreek hill On under contract,
and he beat a pregnant his pregnant girlfriend and strangled her,

(38:03):
and he's playing in the NFL right now. What I
saw Kareem Hunt do was not good behavior, but it
was nowhere near what those two guys did. And they're
in the NFL and they're gonna be playing on Sunday.
And that doesn't even consider Greg Hardy. That doesn't even
consider a lot of guys over the past several years

(38:25):
who have behaved in a thoroughly indefensible fashion and have
not hardly missed any games at all. I mean, when
I watched that video, Kareem Hunt shoves a guy, and
the guy rams into the girl, and then he kicks
the woman u in her leg, I believe, while she's

(38:46):
laying on the ground. Awful behavior. I'm not trying to
defend it. But the way I think as a lawyer
is everything is a precedent. And if the precedent is
Joe Mixing can play in the NFL even though he
broke a girl's face on video, and Tyreek Hill can
play in the NFL even though he beat and strangled

(39:09):
his pregnant girlfriend. To me, Kareem Hunt is nowhere near
either of those things. And neither one of those guys
has ever missed an NFL game for their misbehavior. Now,
their misbehavior happened when they were in college, and certainly
they paid consequences for that behavior in college. But we're

(39:29):
talking about a team picking up a guy after something
bad has already happened. Kareem Hunt has paid a price.
He's been released by his team, and he's not allowed
to play the rest of this year. He's gonna have
a suspension that he has to serve. At some point
he is able to come back. And if I needed
a running back, and again I had done the due diligence,

(39:50):
and I convinced myself that what Kareem Hunt had done
wasn't a barrent behavior, that he was going to be
better in the future, that he was okay with the
zero tolerance policy for his behavior going forward. I would
sign him in a heartbeat. I would. Now, maybe that's
unacceptable to some of you. I'll open up the phone

(40:11):
lines eight seven seven nine six three six nine. Interested
in hearing you guys. Way in we'll start off hour
to discussing this Kareem Hunt incident and what the appropriate
responses from both individual teams and the NFL. My name
is Clay Travis. This is out Kick the coverage on
Fox Sports Radio Why from the Geico out Kick Studios,

(40:34):
where fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more
on car insurance. Visit Geico dot com for a free
rate quote. And it's never a good look when you
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(40:58):
that's c L a y for twenty percent savings. For
those of you waking up, appreciate you joining us. Four
hour two of the show. Encourage you to go download
the podcast. Make sure you don't miss anything from our one.
Charles Davis was outstanding. An hour three. Will be talking
with Petros Papa dakas Um. Last night, the final game
of the twelfth game of the NFL season, Monday Night Football.

(41:20):
The Philadelphia Eagles have climbed back into NFC East contention
back to back wins in division. Last week they beat
the New York Giants. This week they got past the
Washington Redskins, and the Redskins had another awful injury at
quarterback broken leg for Colt McCoy. That meant that Mark

(41:41):
Sanchez came in and effectively everything went awry. Now the
positive for the Washington Redskins. I believe we have the
play call of this the uh the ageless wonder. Adrian
Peterson went ninety yards for a touchdown that was on
the I believe the first play for Mark Sanchez after

(42:02):
he entered the game. This is what that sounded like.
Here's the play call. As Adrian Peterson goes ninety yards,
it says and for the injured Colt mccolly. Adrian Peterson
the runney back. He gets it to ap my plural
hall fifty twenty to the thirty ape. The races thirty
electrified ap yards for a touchdown. Okay, that play ninety yards.

(42:28):
Incredible that Adrian Peterson, at the age of thirty three
can still run away from everyone. He remains a medical marvel.
So a ninety yard touchdown run by Adrian Peterson on
the first play after Mark Sanchez comes in the game
to replace Colt McCoy for the rest of the game,
thirty one plays run by the Washington Redskins for a

(42:51):
total of eighty nine yards and three points. Again, first play,
ninety yard touchdown run by Adrian Peterson. Mark Sanchez then
ran thirty one more plays for a total of eighty
nine yards and three points. Uh, that is a break
the glass. Oh my god, let's go find the fire

(43:13):
extinguisher and try to put out the fire. That is
a disaster of the Washington Redskins offense. So in our
one I floated the question. I said, first of all,
you know, you've got two broken leg quarterbacks, so they're
not coming back this year, and they're probably not gonna
be ready in September, maybe it makes sense to go
ahead and uh and sign a guy, certainly to go

(43:36):
along with Mark Sanchez. The available quarterbacks out there EJ
Manuel t J Yates, Kellen Clemens, Josh Johnson, Nathan Peterman,
Matt Moore, Paxton Lynch, there's nobody out there that's really
very accomplished. And so I said, maybe it makes a
sense to break the glass and go get Colin Kaepernick,
particularly if you are the Washington Redskins right now and

(43:59):
you been getting raked over the proverbial coals via your
decision to sign Ruben Foster, which was a major point
of awkward discussion last night during the Monday Night Football broadcast,
And so I even said that if you were Dan Snyder,
you could potentially go signed Kareem Hunt. You need a

(44:20):
younger running back to maybe you want to pay Kareem
Hunt with Darius Guys who tore his a c L
before the season started, and you can argue we're giving
everybody a fresh start, and all of the attention would
go to your signing of Colin Kaepernick and nothing would
go to anything else. Now, the irony of Colin Kaepernick
going to work for the Redskins would be interesting for

(44:43):
the social justice warrior contingent, but I honestly don't think
there is a better quarterback available out there, And I
don't know if Colin Kaepernick wants to play football. I
don't know if he's even still doing regular football drills.
It could be a disaster for him if he actually
came back into the league, because it basically destroys his
martyr image, but I think it would go a long

(45:04):
way towards effectively ending the two year disaster that the
NFL got into surrounding the Colin Kaepernick protests. So those
are my thoughts, and in particular, I'm gonna open up
the phone line. I believe, having watched that video, that
Kareem Hunt deserves a second chance. You may not agree

(45:24):
with me, that's certainly your right. But if I ran
an NFL team and I thought we needed a running
back for next season based on what I've seen from
Kareem Hunt, I would do my due diligence. I would
sit down with him, I would figure out how much
other stuff might be out there, and I would tell

(45:46):
him that I have zero tolerance for any misbehavior on
his part. He needs to understand this is his last chance,
and I would sign him. And you guys may think,
oh my god, that's unbelievable. I know we live in
this era when everybody wants to climb up on to
a soapbox and scream about how outrage they are. I'm
not defending what Kareem Hunt did. I'm simply saying there

(46:07):
are people who have done worse in the NFL, and
if I were running an NFL team, my goal would
not be to have everybody be choir boys on my team.
It would be to find the best people who are
good at football. And some of those people who are
good at football have dark, troubling past that are that

(46:27):
are things that are not ideal. But I believe, and
I continue to believe, that if you are not in jail,
you are eligible to play football. And what I saw
from Kareem Hunt on that video would not disqualify him
from representing the Clay Travis UH team. Right. If I
were rich enough to own an NFL team and the
Bucks stopped with me, I would make the decision to

(46:49):
go sign Kareem Hunt if I needed a running back,
and if I could convince myself through my investigation that
there was nothing else out there. Nothing that I saw
in that video made him on employable forever. If you
go watch that TMZ video, he shoved a guy, a
man who ran into a girl, and then he kicked
the woman. His behavior was inappropriate. It was even to

(47:10):
a large extent, not defensible. But if he apologizes for
it and he's learned going forward that he can't put
himself into those situations again, I'd be fine having him
play for my team. Some of you disagree, many of
you may eight seven, seven, six three six nine. I'll
take your calls on this. Let me start by bringing
in the crew. Danny G. Would you sign Kareem Hunt

(47:33):
for your team if you owned an NFL franchise? Well,
I understand your argument, and it's obviously gonna vary from
team to team. For my favorite team, the Raiders, I
would say no, and it's just because the organization is
going through a cleansing right now. You when you were
in Los Angeles and kind of busy on the TV lot.
A few weeks back, Mark Davis came out and admitted

(47:55):
that that stench before and during and after the Redskins
game was actually true because at the time, the Raiders
had been denying it, the players, the front office, and
then now we find out that that actually did happen.
The O line having a beef with car because they
didn't know how to quite get on the same page
with the anthem, and what happened with the president tweeting

(48:16):
and all of that. So the Raiders since have been
busy cleaning out their locker room. That's why their O
line looks completely different right now, and you know the
mess they've been dealing with. And then two Fred Blitnikoff,
of course, the Great wide receiver. His daughter was murdered
in a domestic violence incident a while back, and they
just opened Tracy's Place of Hope for battered women. So

(48:38):
the Raiders for a long time have supported anti domestic
violence causes, and so it would be strange, I think
for my favorite team to bring in any sort of
player who has this on his resume. What about you,
Eddie Garcia Uh? For any player if I was my team,
if I'm the owner, any player that I would consider

(49:00):
UH signing that has had a history of domestic violence
would have to really go above and beyond UH proving
to me that he was a changed person, and before
I would even consider it. Um, and I do believe
in second chances. But again I I wouldn't be something
where uh you know, I said, well, if you did

(49:21):
step one, two and three, then we could sign you.
All of the onus would be on him. He would
have to show me that on his own he has
gone above and beyond to you know, get counseling, treatment, everything,
and then I would consider it. But it would be
a lot for him to have to do for me
to think about it. All right. Let me say this too,

(49:43):
the use of the term domestic violence, and I do
as well, doesn't really apply to Kareem Hunt. Okay. Domestic
violence defined is a violent or aggressive behavior within the home,
typically involving the violent abuse of a spouse or partner.
Kareem Hunt didn't know this girl for more than a
couple of hours. I think they met at the club

(50:05):
and they brought her back. This is domestic violence. I
think we use oftentimes the terms anonymous with uh, what
a man mistreating a woman? This is more accurately described
I think as simply violence. Right, it's it's it's violence
by by Kareem Hunt. That the investigators at least in
the city of Cleveland, is my understanding. Reviewed this video,

(50:28):
spoke to all the witnesses and did not feel like
they could prosecute a case based on what they saw here.
So there is a substantial difference I believe, between this
and what Ruben Foster is accused of. Ruben Foster is
accused of domestic violence directly involving a spouse or partner
that has gone on for multiple months, over a long

(50:51):
and pro prolonged period. Kareem Hunt is effectively accused of violence.
If this war, if there were no woman involved in
this video at all, If this was a hallway video
and Kareem Hunt was shoving a man and he threw
a punch or kicked the guy when he was on
the ground, I don't even think this would be a story.
I think the only reason this is a story is

(51:12):
because there is a woman involved. Right now. But do
you think that is appropriate? Well, I mean, I don't
view violence against a woman differently than violence against a man,
because I do. Whether that's right or wrong, I do no.
I I think that it is worse. I don't think
there's any doubt. But it's not domestic violence under the
definition of what domestic violence is. And therefore, I think

(51:35):
if you look at the larger context of who is
in the NFL right now, again, Joe Mixon did something
worse on video. He violently assaulted a woman and broke
her face in a restaurant on video, and he plays
running back for the Cincinnati Bengals. Tyreek Hill pled guilty

(51:57):
to strangling and choking uh and punching his pregnant girlfriend um,
and he still plays in the NFL. So I I
am looking at this entirely from a legal perspective. Right,
I have represented as a criminal defense attorney people accused
of all sorts of heinous acts murder, UH, domestic violence,

(52:20):
drug dealing, assault, UH disorderlated like all these different things
I have done. So I look at this from the
perspective of someone who has represented, as part of his
job people who have been accused of hainous acts, right.
And so I use the precedent of what exists already
in the NFL. And I watched the video of Kareem Hunt,

(52:42):
and I thought it was obviously inappropriate behavior, but not
criminal behavior. I think I agree with the Cleveland District
attorney here that this would be a difficult case to prosecute,
and so I think the standard that's being asked here,
and I think it's not an easy question, and I
think certainly there can be multiple answers and reasonable people

(53:02):
can differ. How do you respond to behavior like this
which is not of a criminal nature but is inappropriate?
And how do you determine whether or not someone is
able to play UH football? Could they clearly have the
ability like Kareem Hunt does based on this behavior. I

(53:23):
don't think it's an easy answer. I'm just saying I
would sign him if I believed that he was going
to change his behavior and not put himself into situations
like this anymore, if we had a zero tolerance UH status,
if I owned a team, and if I believed that
we needed somebody of his talents on my team. Do
you agree with me? Or do you think I'm crazy?

(53:44):
You can be both eight seven seven nine six three
six nine. Will go to your phone calls again that
phone number eight seven seven six three six nine. We
also have, by the way, UH a huge number of
you who have weighed in on Twitter. Thirty thousand of
you have voted in our Twitter poll would you be

(54:05):
okay with your team signing Kareem Hunt. Fifty of you
said yes. I tend to think if fifty say yes
right now, that a month from now it would be
well over right. People in the immediate aftermath of any
incident are most likely to be angry, and that anger
will fade over time. If you believe that a guy

(54:28):
or girl is UH is taken responsibility for their misbehavior
and that they may have learned from it, what are
the limits of redemption? Should Kareem Hunt be on an
NFL team, would you sign him? If you were an owner?
I don't really have any interest in you breaking down
the individual opinions of particular teams. I want you to
think about if you were an owner, you are the

(54:50):
owner of NFL franchise X, would you sign Kareem Hunt.
The buck is stopping at your desk eight seven seven
nine six three six nine. I am Clay Travis. This
is outkicked the coverage on Fox Sports Radio, and I
believe do I have yes? Everybody's got it to do? List,
drop off the dry cleaning, pick up some milk. Here's
an idea. Let's add save hundreds of dollars on car insurance.

(55:13):
Good thing is you don't have to drop off or
pick up anything. All you have to do is go
to Geico dot com and in fifteen minutes you could
be saving or more on car insurance, extra money in
your pocket. It just me maybe the most rewarding to
do you do today? Up next, it's more of your calls,
more of your reaction. What should happen with Kareem Hunt.
This is Outkicked the Coverage on Fox Sports Radio. Be

(55:35):
sure to catch live editions about Kick the Coverage with
Clay Travis weekdays at six am Eastern, three am Pacific.
Welcome back in out Kick about to take some of
your calls. Where you're here in the Geico OutKick Studios
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We treat you like you treat you. Got a comment
that I'm responding to right now. Cody Nelson says, you
definitely seem to be a champion for women, beaters and
domestic violence apologist. This is one of the things that

(56:19):
happens on social media. And here's my response to him.
I believe social media is frequently a competition to see
who can be the most outraged. Everybody wants to climb
up onto their pedestal and compete to see who can
be the most outraged by behavior. And I think that's
not healthy for our society. I think it's really not

(56:42):
because what it does is it leads to hyperbolic reaction. Oh,
that's the worst thing that's ever happened. There is very
little perspective. And this is me putting on my lawyer hat,
and what I do is I look around the league
and I look for precedent, and when I see this
video with dream Hunt, I don't see it as very

(57:02):
similar to Ray Rice. I think the Ray Rice video
was far worse. Furthermore, I think that many people out
there overreact because they think that's what people want to
see from them. You aren't saying what you actually believe
on social media. You are playing a character designed to

(57:24):
show your social value. And I think that the leagues
have drastically over responded to social media in general. And
I think so many people, even in my profession, are
afraid to say, you know what, I watched the Kareem
Hunt video and it was an ideal behavior. And I
can certainly understand why the Kansas City Achieves, who already

(57:47):
employed Tyreek Hill, would immediately release Kareem Hunt. But if
I were an NFL team owner, I'd watch this video.
I'd meet with Kareem Hunt if I were convinced that
he had changed his behavior and he wasn't gonna put
himself into situations like this again, sign him. I don't
think what happened in that video disqualifies him from playing

(58:09):
in the NFL. Ever. Again, that's my personal opinion. You
guys may disagree, but I don't think that saying oh,
you're going light on domestic violence, you don't care about
you like you like women beaters. No, it's stupid. The same.
That was my issue with last night's getting on a
moral high horse comments during Monday Night Football, and it

(58:30):
was so awkward in the middle of the game. If
you were watching it, the game is a close one
score contest. There's actually an interception that's thrown during the game,
and they're suddenly saying like Oh, it's unacceptable for Ruben
Foster to be signed, and they're discussing that during the game.
The NFL is a reflection of society. Society has an

(58:53):
issue with violence in this country. There is far too
much violence. Eddie Garcia said, well, isn't it worse that
the woman is the victim? He or I think a
little bit. It's worse when a powerful man it made
uses as a victim a woman or a child, But
if it were a much smaller man, it's still an

(59:14):
incredibly violent act. I think we allow far too much
violence in this country, and we try to draw lines.
My position would be violence is wrong regardless of who
the victim is, and trying to assess blame on violence
is a challenging and shifting dynamic. If that video just

(59:36):
had Kareem Hunt shoving a guy, it doesn't even make
remotely the news. The fact that he shoved a guy
and that guy hit the woman, and then he walked
over and kicked the woman while she was on the
ground is why this is a story. But violence in general,
if you put yourself into violent situations over and over

(59:59):
again as an adult man, in my opinion, you were
making a lot of bad decisions. So I said the
other day, Oh, like, it's amazing how many how often
people get in my social media and they're like, they
want to fight. I can't believe you have that opinion.
I would fight you if I saw you. But I'm
thirty nine years old, unless you are paying me, or
you are threatening members of my family or friends and

(01:00:22):
they are in legitimate mortal peril. I'm not going to
fight you. I make a living off my brain working
really well. Why would I risk that? Why would I
let you hit me in the head because I'm at
a bar and you bumped into me, and I'm going
to get in a fight with you. That's stupid eighteen
year old male behavior. And as you get older, you're like, man,

(01:00:46):
so much of violence is just wasted effort and energy
and it has no root in reality. And as you
get older, you also realize how often things that don't
seem very violent can lead to awful results. Two college
kids get in fight at a bar. One of them
hits the other one and he falls bad and he dies.

(01:01:07):
It happens every year in this country. Not the punch,
the fall boom. You happen to hit at the exact
wrong angle on your head and you die. I think
about that now. As the father of three sons, I
can't imagine dealing with a violent act like that. Violence
is not right. But people make mistakes, and I don't

(01:01:29):
believe you write them off forever. And I don't believe
that means that you don't that you don't take uh
domestic violence serious, or that seriously, or any of those things.
It just means that as a lawyer, you look at
all the evidence, you consider all the president, and Kareem
Hunt is nowhere near the worst actor in the entire NFL.

(01:01:50):
So let's take your calls. But first let me go
ahead and bring in uh Eddie Garcia. Find out what's
shake in the world of sports. All right, Clay, We'll
start with you. Geico Scoreboard, and on Monday Night Football,
it was the Eagles being the Redskins thirteen. Carson Wentz
had three and in six yards passing and two touchdowns
in the victory both teams and now six and six
on the season, one game back of Dallas in the
NFC East Race, Redskins will have to go for the

(01:02:11):
foreseeable future with Mark Sanchez as their quarterback after losing
starter Colt McCoy last night to a broken fabulary. He's
done for the year. McCoy had just replaced recently Alex
Smith as starting quarterback after Smith was lost for the
season with a broken leg. NBA games are note. Warriors
over the Hawks one eleven. Steph Curry and his second
game back from injury, had thirty points. He had eighteen

(01:02:31):
in the first quarter. Atlanta as a team had seventeen
points in the first quarter. Nuggets over the Raptors one
of six, one three. Nicola Yokich had a triple double
for Denver twenty three points, eleven rebounds, fifteen assist. Denver
is tied with the l A Clippers and the top
record of the West as they beat Toronto, the top
team in the Eastern Conference. College basketball Number ten Michigan
State knocks off number eighteen Iowa ninety to sixty eight.

(01:02:52):
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(01:03:13):
or call eight seven Auto. The only hard part figuring
out which way is easier. By the way, the other
thing about this show, I'll talk about subjects that make
everybody else in my industry cringe and running the opposite
direction because I think honest conversation matters in the world
of sports and beyond. Vast the vast majority of people
who do a national talk show or a local talk show,

(01:03:34):
or write about sports or talk about sports will not
touch Kareem Hunt other than to say it's awful and
he's an awful human being and there's no place for
domestic violence because they are afraid that if they say
anything other than that, they're gonna get attacked and somehow
they're gonna end up in trouble for not being angry

(01:03:55):
enough about domestic violence. That's the truth. Every single if
if you dave truth serum, do every single man in
my industry, that's what he would say. There's nothing to
be gained by me talking about this issue in a
serious fashion. All I'm gonna say is it's awful. No
team should ever sign him. He's an horrible human being.

(01:04:15):
I don't think that's helpful. I think that is what
social media has led us to, is people getting on
soapboxes and refusing to examine nuance, refusing to consider precedent,
refusing to look at the larger societal issues, and also
refusing to look at other things that have happened in
the NFL and put them into context as a reasonable
intelligent adult would. So's trying to do on the show.

(01:04:37):
You don't have to agree with me, as I always say,
you can be wrong. Let's go to who's up first? Here?
We got a bunch of your calls, um as we
talked about the Kareem hunt incident. Let's start with who
should I start with? We got Mike and Modesto. Mike
and Modesto, what you got? Heay? Let me just say
this first before I get the hurt. You're right, hey,
Daniel Snyder and the chief pressman who lives off his

(01:05:00):
daddy's knee. That's first of all, they have ruined his franchise.
They fired them in that fixed it for him then
right about it, and it's because it was drinking week
at all. It was only because you wanted to sign
Kirk Cousins. That's why he was fired. And now the
last two years were decimated on the offitsive line. Every
year it seems like, and I'll tell you this much,

(01:05:22):
Karl Hunt, Now you're absolutely right. The president the set
Ray Rice couldn't get a job because he was thirty.
He lost the step. The worst kind of could have
happened for him. Uh. Now you've got this situation with
the ostras eyes. Yes, I hope they're right about the
God they're just started Foster. That looks bad, But you
know what, it's talent. Like you say in your book,

(01:05:44):
tarent get second chances. It's makes it worth it. Hut
Son team was gonna grab hut because of his challenge
be the first one to do it. You have to
do it aslean Peterson did something just as heinous. If
they Rice he'd beat a child with child abuse. And
because of this talent, he's never missed any time once

(01:06:06):
he got off the suspension. It happens every day. I
hate to explain it for everybody. Clay, you're absolutely right
in your books. This is the best show because you
put it out there. You've covered your butt, you started
your own company. Now you kept me fired. Thank you
so much. Clay, you're there, Mike, give modesto lesson that

(01:06:26):
I give to everybody out there. You will always be
employed so long as your talent exceeds your problems. The
reason why ray Rice was not employed was because he
was a running back approaching the age of thirty years old,
and he had averaged three point four yards per carry
the year before. If he had been twenty two, I
think he'd be back in the league. I really do. Uh,

(01:06:47):
the risk and reward was not there. Because the reward
wasn't there, the payoff for ray Rice wasn't substantial enough. Now,
my issue with ray Rice is that everybody focused on
the NFL and the video and didn't focus on the
fact that New Jersey let him off with virtually no
punishment at all, even though he's on video knocking out
his fiance. Josh and North Carolina. What's up, Josh, Hey Claire,

(01:07:07):
thanks for taking my call of the show. I just
try to say I agree with you about dream Hunt.
I would just go through and do a more throw investigation.
I think because of him misrepresenting himself to the Chiefs organization,
which I can understand, but making sure there's been no
more incident like the one that happened that could potentially

(01:07:28):
come back. And I agree with you Josh there and
also I love people are like, well he lied to
the organization? Well, first of all, do you expect him
to say, yeah, I I I shoved a woman into
the wall and then I kicked her. What happened, Kareem?
Did you shove this woman and did you kick her
in the in the hallway? No? No, no, no, that's
not what happened. Okay, thanks, Like, of course he lied.

(01:07:51):
You lie when if you don't lie, you face severe consequences.
This is like the number one rule of humanity. But
like he lied to the NFL and he lied to
the Chiefs. Well, yeah, because he was guilty of a
of an act that he knew was gonna get him
suspended for a bunch of different games. Go to prison.

(01:08:12):
How many people there did it? Now you walked through
a prison, there's an awful lot of misdiagnosed and misconvicted
people there. Nobody did anything. It's the number one response
anytime you're facing serious consequences for your action. No, I
didn't do it. You gotta prove that I did it.
Mark in California, he never thought the video would come out.
He may not have even known there was a video
from that hallway, Mark in California. What's up? Yeah, So,

(01:08:35):
first point to find an owner. I'm gonna employ him. Second,
agree with you play that it's not domestic violence. Everyone
keeps using that term and following that instant incident. Domestic
violence is like calling it sexual assaulting. It's neither of those.
It's more along the lines of a simple assault. Lastly,
you know, I worked for a fortune and it's a

(01:08:58):
trend within companies the whole people accountable for off the
field behavior. And you see a lot of people getting
caught in these viral videos and next thing you know,
you see that they lost their job. And my company
does a lot of other fortunes to do it. So
it's it's not too surprising to see the ramifications for

(01:09:19):
Kareem on this. However, is it right? Is it wrong?
It is a trend among a lot of Fortune five
companies to hold people accountable they get caught in these
viral videos. Yeah, and you're right, and I think that's
instructive for a lot of people out there. You have
to assume always that there's an eye and a sky
on you because so much as is videoed in this
day and age. I write in my book and I

(01:09:40):
maintain that one of the big flaws that we have
applied in the modern country today is this idea that
what you say. Now it's different to get caught committing
a crime, a physical act of violence. But we've created
a world where every single day a company comes out
and says, oh, what's so and so said on Facebook
or Twitter or their social media accounts doesn't represent the company,

(01:10:02):
and we're firing them. What idiot thought that a Facebook
post by somebody when they're not at work represents the company. Like,
that's a real fallacy. I think that exists in our country.
That is not healthy, and I think it leads to
anger and division and discord because people are like, when
can I say what I actually believe? If you go
on Facebook and you say something that's inappropriate, right, whatever

(01:10:24):
that is, and then you end up getting fired from
your company, what do they always say? The company always says, well,
this this opinion does not represent what our country. What
our company believes. When did anybody ever believe that it did.
If you deliver a package to my house from fed
X and then you go uh in your free time

(01:10:46):
and you post on Facebook something politically scandalous and Facebook
sees it, uh, and it goes viral or whatever, in
fed X is like, hey, this person doesn't represent fed X.
They can't work here anymore. Why as what you say
in your private hours as a human being and as
a citizen in this country reflect what your employer believes.

(01:11:09):
Nobody believes that. Nobody believes that what I say Fox
Sports Radio believes right. I'm sharing my opinion every single day,
all day long. The company doesn't have an opinion. This
idea that the company has to distance itself from an
opinion that somebody else has is a fundamentally broken idea,

(01:11:33):
and I don't think it's helpful for our country. And
I said it back in my book talking about Kurt
Schilling and Jamal Hill, like they have the rights of
their political opinions, whether they're conservative or liberal. The idea
that ESPN endorses either of those opinions, to me, is crazy.
The company should not have an opinion. It should just
employ people and all those people have opinions, and some

(01:11:55):
of them you agree with and some of you don't.
As my mom used to say, opinions are but like butts,
everybody's got one and war in North Carolina. What's up?
Good morning, play, thank you, good morning, good morning. I
disagree a little bit about the Kareem hunt situation because
if let's say, if there's a policy in NFL for

(01:12:18):
no tolerance, zero tolerance policy, so if you do something
knowing that policy, you should not be employed. Okay, again,
I don't have any let me let me say this,
and I don't have any problem with the Kansas City
chiefs releasing him. I'm saying he serves the consequences for
violating the policy. Does he deserve to come back in
and get a job in the league going forward? That's

(01:12:40):
the question. I think that's out here right now. But
the thing is the NFL supersedes all the company, I mean,
all the teams. Then if there is an NFL policy,
teams have to follow that policy. So that's what I
meant that if if somebody does something, I mean, this
is not like Okay, I can kill one time, the

(01:13:01):
next time, I won't do it. Because I found out.
It's a bad thing. Same thing with Rice. Every every
NFL person or person who's watching NFL knows that is wrong,
and you still do it knowing that what happened was wrong.
Let's say, okay, let me take a step back and Mark, yeah, yeah,

(01:13:22):
let me just ask you this, what would you do?
Do you think Kareem Hunt should never play in the NFL. Again,
I'm not making the policy personally. I mean, if there
is an NFL policy, there is no like his zero toileans,
you follow that. If they say no, okay, we can
give him one one chance of rehab and stuff, that's fine.
I mean I follow that policy. I mean, I'm just saying,

(01:13:42):
you follow the policy of something which has been created.
You don't make another loophole to that policy. Okay, next
time the other team may hire him after he does
another thing. They said, well if he does it to
our when he's on him, yeah, it's a good call,
thank you. But the policy is if you commit an
act of domestic violence. And again it's an interesting question
here that I haven't heard anybody else point out. This

(01:14:05):
is not technically domestic violence. This is a violent act
of assault or battery, depending on what the uh, what
the definitions of the law are in Cleveland and in
the state of Ohio. It's not an act of domestic violence.
He didn't know this woman. Domestic violence typically is a
relationship based crime, predicated on knowing someone for a longer

(01:14:27):
period of time. This is just an act of violence.
So I'm not even sure that the NFL's domestic violence
policy directly applies here. Uh, it is a violent act
directed towards a woman, but it's not under the definition
of what typically is defined as domestic violence. That and
so even if you expand it and assume that it

(01:14:47):
is under the auspices of the NFL's domestic violence incident,
it might only require a six game suspension. So after
that six game suspension, he is then eligible to play
in the NFL. And the and I am asking is
would you sign him on your team after he serves
his suspension. He's not going to play the rest of
this year and maybe the first couple of games next year.

(01:15:09):
We'll continue to talk about this eight seven, seven, three
six nine. I'm Clay Travis is out kick the coverage
on Fox Sports Radio. Welcome back in. Let me go
ahead and tell you we got major breaking news, legit
breaking new. We don't have breaking news that often real
time early in the morning on the show. Welcome back
to the Geico out Kick Studios. And it's never a

(01:15:31):
good look when you untuck a long, bulky dress shirt.
That's why Untucket makes shirts specifically designed to be warner untucked.
Go to untucket dot com to see the new fall arrivals.
Untucket dot com your solution to perfecting casual use promo
code Clay that's c l A Y for savings que
the Newsboys the breaking news sounder. Here we go. Breaking

(01:15:54):
news from Fox Sports News out the University has released
news that urban Meyer is retiring and Ryan Day is
being promoted as the new coach at Ohio State. Urban
Meyer's final game will be the Rose Bowl against Washington.
He will then retire. So that is something that I've

(01:16:14):
been predicting on this show for several months that urban
Meyer would not return next year, and that news is
officially out now. Ryan Day, who served as the interim
while urban Meyer was serving his suspension to begin this season,
will now take over for Ohio State. Questions UH that
are going to be substantial as we unpack all of

(01:16:35):
this and UH and we'll open up phone lines. Well,
so we were talking about Kareem Hunt. Kareem Hunt discussion
is now tabled as we have major breaking news with
urban Meyer announcing that he is stepping down. They're gonna
have a press conference today at Ohio State. What I
have also predicted, and you can go back and listen
to old tapes here, I have said that urban Meyer

(01:16:56):
would step down. That I believe that was the most
likely thing we would that he would do, and then
he would sit out a year, and then he would
take over at USC because that would follow the pattern
that he had set at Florida Florida Gators. Urban Meyer
comes in, wins a couple of national championships, is dominant,
and wins at an incredibly high level, and then the

(01:17:18):
program that he built, the foundation, starts to collapse around him,
and he suddenly has health issues and he says, I've
got to retire. I can't keep this up. He sits
out for a year, and then he takes over Ohio State.
He builds Ohio State up rapidly. They win the first
College Football Playoff national championship and then for urban Meyer's

(01:17:40):
third national championship overall, and then he can't quite get
back there again to those heights, and now the foundation
of his program starts to crumble around him. Urban Meyer
is leaving Ohio State again to Wayne Haskins, one of
the three Heisman finalists. He may go pro talk about
the Washington Redskins. We were talking about the Redskins needing

(01:18:03):
a quarterback now in the wake of Colt McCoy and
the Alex Smith injury. Would it be shocking if they
went and drafted Dwayne Haskins, who is from that area.
Ohio State then goes back in has to rebuild around
Ryan Day. Who knows what they'll do on the defensive
side of the ball. I'd be surprised if he retains
Greg Siano, given how bad the defense has been at times.

(01:18:24):
Ryan Day will get the opportunity now to stamp this
program as his own again. If you're just waking up
major breaking news. Urban Meyer has announced that he is
retiring from Ohio State and Ryan Day is going to
replace him. The question immediately that spends forward for anybody,
and we'll talk to Petros Papadakis about this in the

(01:18:45):
next uh in the next segment, is could urban Meyer
be doing the same thing with Ohio State that he
did with Florida. Leave right as the foundation around him crumbles,
sit out for a year, blame his health, get healthy.
Then what job could be coming open? USC? The platform
seems to fit almost perfectly perfectly. Right, You got the

(01:19:07):
Pack twelve conference, which is frankly not of national significance
right now overall not that impressive. Similar frankly to what
the Big Ten was when he went to Ohio State,
the Big Ten now has become a higher echelon conference.
James Franklin rolling at Penn State, Jim Harbaugh doing decently
at Michigan Mark, Mark D'Antonio doing well at Michigan State.

(01:19:30):
Over the years. There are a lot in Scott Frost
now coming in at Nebraska. There are a lot of
coaches starting to do pretty well in the Big Ten.
Jump ship, go out to the Pack twelve where you
could dominate at USC and everybody else would not be
on your level. That's my philosophy. I don't buy it.
I think urban Meyer's fifty six, still relatively young. I
don't buy that he'll never coach again. Maybe he'll retire forever.

(01:19:53):
I don't necessarily buy it, will go continue to talk
about this will open up the phone lines for you
eight seven, seven, nine, ninths six three six nine Again
major breaking news, Urban Meyer stepping down as Ohio State
football coach. We are reacting to it in real time
when we return for the top of our three. This
is outkicked the coverage. Thanks for spending your Tuesday with

(01:20:13):
us on Fox Sports Radio. Welcome in to our number three.
If you're just waking up across the country. Major breaking news.
In the last twenty minutes. Urban Meyer has been announced
or has announced he's retiring at Ohio State. Urban Meyer

(01:20:36):
done at Ohio State, and now Ryan Day will be
taking over. Ryan day um is the interim coach who
coached Ohio State to three straight victories during urban meyer
suspension before the season began. Urban Meyer stepping down blaming
health reasons. It's eerily similar. It is a reflection, it

(01:20:57):
is a reinforcement. It almost of exactly what happened at Florida.
The program's foundation started to crumble around him, and urban
Meyer suddenly has health issues and has to make the
decision to leave. And so the immediate question that everybody
faces here is a couple of things. One, how is

(01:21:20):
Ryan Day gonna do. What staff will he put together?
What will he be able to do now that Ohio
State is being handed to him. Somebody go, look, dub
you look this up for me if you would. When
is the last time that Ohio State gave their job
to a head coach who had never been a head

(01:21:41):
coach before? Jim Trestle I believe was at Youngstown State.
John Cooper had been a head coach before. Urban Meyer
obviously had been a head coach before. I'm not counting
Luke Fickle because he was an interim I don't know
how long it has been. Somebody look it up. That
is a little bit of a risky move. Now in
so doing and promoting Ryan Day, they are basically following

(01:22:06):
the same model that Oklahoma followed. If you remember what
Oklahoma did, Bob Stoop's national championship winning coach at Oklahoma
steps down immediately, Lincoln Riley takes over young offensive hotshot
assistant and they have been on fire on the offensive
side of the ball ever since, been to two straight

(01:22:27):
college football playoffs. Now with Lincoln Riley, that is your
You don't have to be a head coach to take
over a premier program and become a stud example. Another
one easily Kirby Smart. Kirby Smart took over at Georgia
has clearly, notwithstanding the fourth and eleven decision and the

(01:22:48):
collapse against Alabama, the last two years, Kirby Smart has
clearly been one of the best straight from coordinator to
head coach hires in recent college football history. But the
easy precedent to point to, I think is Oklahoma, because
that's what, in an ideal sense, Ohio State would hope

(01:23:08):
that they can do, not skip a beat, maybe even
accelerate and be even better than they were before. And
certainly there is the precedent of Ryan Day having coached
for three games and having seen already what he can do.
So we will see whether or not Ryan Day can
take the next step and be akin to what we

(01:23:32):
saw from Lincoln Riley at Oklahoma. Now, for Urban Meyer,
that's question one. Question one is the future of the
Ohio State program. Also, this ties in with a lot
of the rest of the Big Ten. I think if
you're James Franklin waking up this morning, you're excited at
Penn State. I think if you are Jim Harbaugh at Michigan,
you're excited at Michigan. You never beat this guy. Maybe

(01:23:55):
you had a better chance against Ryan Day. I think
if you are an Ohio State fan, you're osciously optimistic
with Ryan Day. You probably want him to go out
and fix the defense because you feel pretty good about
the offensive side of the ball with everything else. So
that is uh the way that I would break this
down from the Ohio State and the Big Ten perspective.

(01:24:19):
He's a big loss for the Big Ten. Anytime you
have a national championship winning coach like Urban Meyer. Remember
with Urban Meyer retiring, this will mean that, pending the
outcome of this college football playoff, there are now only
three coaches that have ever won national championships coaching right
now in college football. Well, let me take a step back.

(01:24:39):
Mac Brown is coming back. So Mac Brown has won
a national championship. He will be at u n c
UH and he has won a national championship. But there
are only three coaches at programs that seem like they
could contend for a national championship going forward. Nick Saban
has obviously won a Ton Debo Sweeney at Clemson, Jimbo
Fisher has moved to Tech to say, and m seems

(01:25:01):
to be building the Aggies back to a championship level.
We'll see finishes eight and four, uh, tied for second
place in the Big Ten West and Mac Brown and
now urban Meyer is gone. Now, the other question that
is going to loom significant on the horizon here is
outside of Ohio State, is urban Meyer actually done? Urban
Meyer is only fifty six years old. I believe you

(01:25:23):
guys can confirm that he was only fifty six years old.
To me circle back by the way I asked this
question of dub Paul Bixter. Paul Bixler is the last
Ohio State coach to be named without any head coaching experience.
He got hired all the way back in nineteen to
coach Ohio State and he only spent one year as

(01:25:43):
a head coach. He had been an assistant at Colgate
and Ohio State prior to his one year at Ohio State.
So uh, this is a little bit of a risky
move given that he has never been that is Ryan
Day a head coach on his own before her. So uh. Now,
the other conversation that goes on here is I think

(01:26:04):
a substantial one. What is urban Meyer going to do?
Is urban Meyer going to stay retired? You can go
back to the tape on this show and we'll talk
about this with Petro's Papadeka is coming up next. I
said a couple of months ago that if you paid
attention to urban Meyer's history, that I believed urban Meyer
would be retiring in this offseason. And he obviously is retiring.

(01:26:27):
He'll coach his final game in the Rose Bowl against Washington.
And I said, if you follow urban Meyer's history, when
he retired at Florida, he set out for one year
and then he went to a new conference and took
the Ohio State job. All I'm saying is, what is
the most premier program in America in a conference that

(01:26:47):
urban Meyer has not coached in that is likely to
have potentially a head coaching vacancy at the end of
this season coming up the twenty nineteen season, it's USC's.
So if urban Meyer we're going to coach again, the
ghost of urban Meyer's coaching past is going to be

(01:27:08):
shadowing everything that Clay Helton does now. Because I think
a lot of people as they wake up on the
West Coast, a lot of SC fans, a lot of
Trojans are thinking, there's our guy. We should pay urban
Meyer whatever he needs, Let him sit out for a year,
let him get his health back in shape, and then
we can replicate the exact same pattern that we saw

(01:27:31):
at Florida, now at Ohio State, and potentially now at USC.
Get Urban into that southern California weather. Let him deal
with a conference that is on its death legs right now.
Let's be honest, the Pac twelve is clearly the fifth
most major conference in college sports right now. Zeroed doubt

(01:27:53):
that the Pack twelve, which was almost completely irrelevant in
their Friday night Pack twelve title game twenty thousand fans
there between Utah and Washington. Nobody cared about that Pack
twelfth championship game. It's a relatively weak conference, much like
the Big Ten was when Urban Meyer arrived. Urban Meyer

(01:28:14):
helped to build the Big Ten conference back to a
high level of prominence. Urban Meyer got there, then James
Franklin leaves from Vanderbilt, goes to Penn State, builds up
a Big Ten championship caliber team. Mark D'Antonio I feel
like was elevated by his games against Urban Meyer on

(01:28:35):
the national stage. Jim Harbaugh comes in to try to
compete with Urban Meyer. Nebraska hire Scott Frost. So a
lot of good young coaching talent, a lot of good
programs in the Big Ten that have gotten much better
since urban Meyer first went to Ohio State, and as
a result, Ohio State's ability to be head and shoulders

(01:28:57):
above everybody else at in the Big Ten and was diminished.
What urban Meyer effectively did at Ohio State was built
an SEC caliber program at Ohio State, and he won
so many games by just dominating everybody else in the
Big Ten because they didn't have the same caliber of
talent as him. He had SEC caliber talent they did not,

(01:29:19):
and as a result, urban Meyer one at an incredibly
high level. But what started to happen they started to
have major cracks in their foundation. If you look at
what urban Meyer did at Ohio State, the defensive side
of the ball started to fall apart. I mean, that's
just the truth. The defensive side of the ball. In

(01:29:40):
the last six road games allowed fifty five points to Iowa,
which cost the last year Ohio State a chance to
get into the College Football Playoff. They then allowed over
forty nine points or forty nine points to Purdue this
year and over fifty of Maryland and so three of

(01:30:03):
the last six games that Ohio State played on the road,
they allowed forty nine or more points against mediocre teams
Iowa mediocre, Maryland mediocre, and Perdue mediocre. So I think
urban Meyer's ability to be head and shoulders above everyone
else had started to slip. And as a result, even

(01:30:25):
though he got the win over Michigan and he gets
the Big Ten title, I think even the most died
in the wall Buckeye fan would say, you know what,
we did start to slip up a little bit. Urban
Meyer was not as dominant with what he had going
at Ohio State right now as he had been early
in his tenure. And I don't think there's any doubt

(01:30:46):
at all that that is in fact the case. And
so as dominant as urban Meyer was, and he was
incredibly dominant at Ohio State, I think the question going
forward is what will urban Meyer do now? Will he
legitimately retire and never coach college football again, or will

(01:31:08):
he find something else to do. He is only fifty
four years old, so urban Meyer is still younger right
now I believe then Nick Saban was when he took
over at Alabama. So if he sits out for a year,
urban Meyer would be fifty five years old, and that
USC job could be coming open. Just worth keeping in mind.

(01:31:32):
How good by the way it was urban Meyer at Florida.
I'm gonna read his exact his exact uh you know,
performance there in uh what is it, four five, six,
seven years at Ohio State, urban Meyer went eighty two
and nine overall and went fifty four and four in

(01:31:52):
the Big ten, fifty four and four. Here is urban
meyers finishing numbers in the division first, first, first, tied
for first, tied for first, first, tied for first. That's
urban Meyer in his division in the Big ten um.

(01:32:14):
And here is urban Meyer's finishing year record in terms
of the poll. They finished tenth one four six five,
and we'll see where they finished. So every year after
his first uh when they were they they've been basically
top ten every year that urban Meyer was at Ohio State.
So a very big name to replace, but again it's

(01:32:37):
eerily similar. Urban Meyer spent six years at Florida and
then retired for health related reasons. Urban Meyer now spending
seven years at Ohio State and then retiring for health
related reasons. Partly will he set out for another year
and then go elsewhere we will talk about this with
Petro's Papadakis up next for one of the foremost experts

(01:33:00):
on USC in the country. We will talk about that
with Petros Papadekas. Continue to unpack the major news of
the morning, again breaking while we've been live on the air,
Urban Meyer stepping down as the head coach of Ohio State.
He will coach the Rose Bowl game against Washington and
then be replaced by Ryan Day, and we will see

(01:33:21):
what ends up happening with the Ohio State program. And
again as we're assessing where Urban Meyer might go and
what he might do live in real time as this
news has broken up. Next we'll talk with Petros Papadakas.
But first send a holiday gift at families across America
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(01:33:42):
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Urban Meyer retiring. We continue to unpack it. Live news

(01:34:48):
breaking on OutKick the coverage on Fox sports Radio. Fox
Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.
Catch all of our shows at Fox sports radio dot
Com and within the I Heart Radio app search f
s R to listen live. Taylor Swift is uh the
walk up music for our boy. Petros papadakas welcome back,

(01:35:12):
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experience as a confident show. Particularly, we're about to be
joined by Petros Papadeas. If you're just waking up across

(01:35:35):
the country. Major breaking news, Urban Meyer is resigning, retiring,
whatever you wanna call it. Ryan Day taking over as
the next Ohio state coach will continue to break that down.
Petros Papadeka is about to join us. But first let's
find out from Eddie Garcia what else is shaken in
the world of sports. Well, we'll tell you about Monday
Night football in Philadelphia where the Eagles beat the Redskins.
Seen both teams and now six and six on the season.

(01:35:57):
One game backup Dallas in the NFC East Race. Big
injury for the Redskins in that game as quarterback. Colt
McCoy was lost for the year with a broken fibula.
He'll be replaced, at least in the short term by
Mark Sanchez. Of course, McCoy had replaced Alex Smith, who
was lost for the year as their quarterback with a
broken fibula. A couple of weeks ago, quick couple of
scores from the NBA Warriors over the Hawks one eleven,

(01:36:19):
Steph Curry thirty points of the Warriors. Nuggets beat the
Raptors one of six, one o three. Nicola Yokich a
triple double for Denver. It's three points, eleven rebounds, fifteen assists.
Denver's tied with the Clippers the top record in the West,
and Say beat Toronto, the top team in the East.
The NHL season continues tonight with the surprising Buffalo Sabers
hosting the Toronto maple Leaves at seven thirty Eastern. It's
our Discovered Card key matchup. Speaking of matchups, become a

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I'll kicked the coverage studios. Let's go ahead and bring
in the man, the myth, the legend, Petros Papa Dakas.
Let me go ahead and figure out if I got
any more ad reads than I need to do as
I go to rake here. Uh, we are coming to

(01:37:01):
Alive from the Geico alt Kick studios, where it's easy
to say more on car insurance with Geico, go to
Geico dot com or call seven Auto. The only hard
part figuring out which way is easier. We bring in now,
Petros Papa Dagas. Petros, your reactions as as urban Meyer
steps down, Well, I guess I'm not super surprised seeing

(01:37:22):
the way that the year played out and kind of
the public backlash, and then also the local support and
the tenure that he had in Florida was what six
or seven years, and now this is seven years and
he's not getting any younger. He didn't seem very happy
throughout the year, so that makes sense. Now. I know

(01:37:45):
there's gonna be a lot of rumors as to where
he's going to surface, like the Cleveland Browns and somebody
said something about usc some guy in Nashville. I don't.
I I said this. I said this a couple of
months ago. I said, if you follow the history of
Urban Meyer as a head coach, right, if you follow

(01:38:06):
what he has typically meant and what he has typically said, uh,
beyond a shadow of a doubt what Urban Meyer has
done at at Florida as the program started to uh
started to go down, right, And I think there's no doubt.
Even though Ohio State won the Big Ten this year,
I think even the most died in the wool Buckeye
fan would have to say, you know what, the program

(01:38:28):
did not seem like it was on very solid foundation
this year. Uh, they were fortunate Ohio State was to
win the title. Look, they they got a late win
against Penn State, they survived the two point conversion try
against Maryland, They won a lot of coach games. They
beat the crap out of Meryl. Yes, but you didn't
feel at least I didn't, especially with Dwayne Haskins likely

(01:38:49):
to leave. I don't feel like Ohio State was the
same kind of dominant team that they have been in
the past, and I think the defense has kind of
fallen apart. So anyway, if you follow the resident for
what he did at Florida, leaves Florida, says, I don't
have good health. I'm gonna sit out. Maybe I'm gonna retire,
never coach again, sits out one year less than that even,

(01:39:10):
and then takes the Ohio State job. Yeah, but he worked,
he worked for ESPN, but he was basically sitting out,
it seemed to me, waiting for that Ohio State opportunity.
He got it. We know how much pressure is going
to be on Clay Hilton. Is it not an easy
kind of line to follow that if Urban sits out

(01:39:33):
for another year, that he would be the first call
that USC would make if Clay Hilton doesn't have a
good year in nineteen. Well, first, you have the overriding
university issues of abuse with a gynecologist on campus. You
know about that, right, Yeah, And that's a massive issue
that affects the university at large in a substantial way.

(01:39:56):
And Urban Meyer. So you think because of the not
turning in over that situation, Well he he has many
detractors in the world of UH being complicit towards that
sort of thing. Yes, at Florida and in Ohio State.
But that being said, I think USC and their situation

(01:40:22):
is the way it is because they won't hire a
coach with the chops of Urban Meyer. They didn't want
Chris Peterson. They don't want somebody that's going to come
in there and change the foundation of what they have created.
USC does not operate like most athletic departments. That's why

(01:40:45):
they're in trouble. They have people that are there inside
the athletic department, nobody knows their name really publicly, and
they're holding on the power. And that's why they didn't
hire Greg Byrne when he was in Arizona. Now he's
at Alabama doing great. That's why they didn't hire Chris
del Conti who was at TCU, now he's in Texas

(01:41:07):
doing great. They could have had those a d s.
Those A d s wanted to be there. They could
have had Chris Peterson, he wanted to be there. When
are people going to figure out that USC doesn't want
a powerful voice now in one year from now, if
USC has a new university president and they've started to
root out some of their old guard the people that

(01:41:29):
enabled Pat Hayden and and Lynn Swan extending Clay Helton
when no one else was going to hire him if
that is the case a year from now, then maybe
what you're saying is true. But under USC's current structure,
there's no way they'd take a guy like urban Meyer
good or bad because they don't want him to move
their cheese, to change their their country club. Urban Meyer

(01:41:54):
is only fifty four years old. Granted he's had health
issues at Florida. Now he has health issues at Ohio State.
You seem to be bypassing the health issues like you
don't believe them. It's not that I don't believe them,
it's that I don't believe they stop him from being
a coach. You know. They do seem to pop up
whenever there's controversy, whenever things are not going well for

(01:42:17):
urban Meyer, it seems like his health gets brought up.
Remember back in the day when uh, it seemed like
Michael Jordan whenever he was like sick or a little
bit injured, Like he never limped after he made a shot, right,
But every time Jordan would miss a shot, he would
limp back, he would cough, you know, if he was sick,
like it was like he wanted you to know, hey,
I'm not a like Lebron with the with the wrist

(01:42:41):
brace after the finals. Yes, exactly like Lebron with the
with the freaking cast after the finals. So hey, yeah,
yeah you just so you know, I'm lucky to like
he had to put the cast on to go to
the postgame press conference, right, Like it was such a
dramatic thing. You couldn't wait, you know, twenty four more
minutes and put the cast on. You had to get

(01:43:01):
the cast put on before you went for the postgame
press conference. Um, it does seem like every time urban
Meyer is having stress or things are not going smoothly.
Like I said, I didn't never notice him on the
sideline during the Michigan game, looked like he was near death.
Um at any point in time, Whereas throughout the entirety
of the Maryland game, you would have thought the guy

(01:43:24):
was on the deathbed. So I do think that the
health conditions and look, if he sits out for a year,
he claimed that he got healthy, Uh during the year
that he set out after Florida. Maybe he's gonna get
healthy again in the year that he sits out. I
just find it hard to believe that he's fully done
with coaching at the age of fifty four. Do you
also find that hard to believe. Yes, I think it

(01:43:46):
makes a good point. So because he was such a
joyless broadcaster, which TV. Yeah, he wasn't John Madden, right,
It wasn't like he got in the booth and you
were like, oh wow, this guy's got a lot of
verve and vitality. Man, it's clear like he was like
thoroughly like just boring as a broadcaster. Well, he was

(01:44:08):
with a very good broadcaster, I always think, and Chris Spielman.
But one thing, Spielman barely does his smile on camera.
And urban Meyer was so like mean and stone faced.
I mean they'd come on camera before a game and
I'd be like, you know, what is this? It is

(01:44:28):
just like an s A T. This is terrible? Uh?
He did? He did seem like he was like a
proctor of giving you an exam at your at your
high school. Uh. And and and Stern urban Meyer. So
let's go to the big ten. Now, Okay, urban Meyer
is out of the picture right now. How do you
think Ryan Day will do? I think he'll do fine

(01:44:50):
for a while. But and I think they'll be very
good and dominant because they're Ohio State. They'll be very
good getting people in there. It'll be interesting to see
if they still have the gravity and cash a you know,
that'll really tell the tale. But those people are spoiled

(01:45:13):
and they want immediate success. So this guy's probably automatically
on the hot seat, which is unfortunate for him. But
and he I mean, if they lose to Purdue, people
are gonna want him fired. Yes, they go to Iowa
and and give up a fifty burger, people are gonna
want him fired. If they lose or win against Maryland

(01:45:35):
in overtime, people are gonna want him to be fired.
So he's on thin ice and uh, it might just
be an uphill battle no matter what. All right, So
if you are a big ten fan of Penn State,
Michigan State, Nebraska, certainly Michigan, good news for you or
bad news for you? This is great. What kind of

(01:45:56):
question is that I want to play defense or sense
when overtime starts? This is great news. One of the
great football coaches in the history of this century is
retiring from your conference. So you know, he's probably not
going to take another job in the conference. So if
I'm Scott Frost, Harma Brahm, anybody, uh Franklin, uh p

(01:46:23):
j Flack. I'd be I'd be having a beard right now,
and and and playing some music and dancing a little bit.
It's a great thing. The reason why I ask this
is because it sounds like crazy talk, But Oklahoma has
actually gotten better in the first two years since Bob
Stoops left and with Lincoln Riley in Ohio State. Well,

(01:46:46):
I thought the first three years as an interim for
Ryan Day. The first three games, sorry that Ohio State
looked better offensively, then they looked for the rest of
the year. Now you can say, well, that's just because
people caught up to what they were doing. There certainly
a lot of other things out there, but Lincoln Riley
has taken Oklahoma football to another level since Bob Stoops left.

(01:47:08):
Is it possible that the same thing could happen for
Ryan Day. That's the reason why I ask is this
good or bad? Because I don't I don't know. I mean,
I feel like Urban Meyer was a cloud in some
ways given what happened off the field on the Ohio
State program. And Ryan Day now gets to come in
with a clean slate and already really good talent. Right now,

(01:47:29):
you might be right for three or four years down
the road. We don't know if they'll identify and continue
to recruit at the same level that urban Meyer did,
But in the meantime, that program is pretty stacked that
he's taken over. That's a positive way to spend it.
And you know, you could say that about Clay Helton.
I mean the guys to coach at USC so they
recruit the best talent, and the best talent comes in.

(01:47:51):
But since we're talking about recruiting, I'd much rather if
I'm Jim Harbaugh recruit against Ryan Day, who nobody knows
what the guy looks like than urban Meyer. I'd much
rather walk into somebody's living room if I'm Scott frost
Uh the day after Ryan Day does as opposed to

(01:48:12):
the day after Urban Meyer. Controversies aside, name recognition and
being famous means a lot to these young guys, and
that's gone now from Ohio State. Which is not to
say Ryan Day can't have success. I just think it's
a good That's a very interesting angle. You ask about

(01:48:33):
those coaches about the impact on them, and the impact
is all positive. Doesn't mean Ohio States still not a
beast in the room. But I'd much rather recruit against
that guy. Than urban Meyer. Do you think urban Meyer
would have retired if the off the field incidents never

(01:48:56):
come up? It's hard to know for sure, But if
we never have any of the u any of the
ridiculous surrounding surrounding the domestic violence incidents and what is
assistant coaches knew and what they didn't know, do you
think there's any way he retires right now? Well, since
we're talking about it in this kind of soulless way
and I do not know him, and I'm not close

(01:49:18):
to the situation at Ohio State, my answer would be
just reading the tea leaves from far away. No, I
don't think so. I think whatever it is took a
toll on him, and took a toll on him personally
and physically, or whatever it is you want to take
from the stories and the praise and adulation he's received,

(01:49:39):
and he's gonna give it up, but it's hard to
believe he's done with coaching. I agree with what you're saying.
We're talking to Petros Papadacas. Follow him at Petros and
Money also at the Old p He's a M five
seventy l A Sports. Many of you will in the
l A area. Will be listening to him in the
afternoon as you drive home. He's started the morning off
with us. Appreciate him getting up. All right, let's lead

(01:50:01):
behind Urban Meyer here for sec your thoughts. Final question
for you, your thoughts on the college football playoff? Did
the committee get it right? Yeah? I think so. Were
you one of those arguing for Georgia from your south, Yeah,
but I I thought that, uh that the fourth and
eleven call, and and in particular the performance against L

(01:50:21):
s U. I wrote yesterday that I think the committee
got it right. Um. I think Georgia, you know, if
they are upset, they have only themselves to blame for
their performance against L. S U. And for what I
thought was the heinous, absurd, ridiculous decision to go with
a fake punt on fourth and eleven in a tie game. Uh. So,
I thought Georgia had their opportunity squandered. It. I think

(01:50:41):
the committee got it right. Certainly didn't look very good
that fake punt, did it? Oh? It was it? Does?
I mean, when you bring in your backup quarterback, uh
to be on the punt team, it's kind of a
red flag, you know, it's kind of a hey, you know,
like it's drawing attention to the fact that you're doing
something different than you would ordinarily be doing. Yeah, I

(01:51:05):
I enjoyed the game. I almost wanted to text you
in the middle of the game. The greatest team in
the history of college football is struggling a little bit
right now. I think you prematurely do things like that.
It's part of your nature, and that's okay. But I

(01:51:25):
I like Oklahoma. Their defense leaves a lot to be desired,
but they played pretty well against a really tough Texas
team and a team that's getting better and better in Texas.
I think they'll be very formidable next year as far
as the playoff goes, if Ellen or can remain healthy.
But Oklahoma is certainly, like you said, they're another another
level offensively. Clemson's earned it, uh Notre Dame. They're not

(01:51:49):
going to keep them out if they're undefeated, and they are.
And Alabama has been the class of football all year,
despite you know, the eight conference games and that whole
thing that kind of bought as me about the lack
of uniformity that we have in the in the playoff
that's been argued and talked about forever. I wish we

(01:52:09):
had more of a playoff, so more of the country
could be involved six or eight games I'd appreciate. But
as far as this year, yeah, I think they got
it right. I don't like the two SEC teams get in,
but if Georgia beats Alabama, I understand why I would
have happened. Good stuff as always, Petros, Papa Acas. Good

(01:52:30):
luck with Urban Meyers your next USC coaches. If l
A needed more drama, I think that'll give you something
to talk about today. Fight on Do you at Pedro's
and money at the old p go follow him on Twitter.
We come back. More Urban Meyer reaction again breaking news
Urban Meyers stepping down as Ohio State head football coach
Ryan Day taking over. We will continue to unpack. We'll

(01:52:52):
open up the phone lines. If you have any questions,
We'll talk with the crew eight seven seven three six nine.
This is I'll Kick the coverage on Fox Sports Radio.
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(01:53:13):
that's c l A Y. When you register for your
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Necessary terms and conditions apply for entertainment purposes only void
were prohibited. I can't believe that Ohio State didn't promote
Greg Ciano. They went with Ryan Day. I thought last year,
all those brilliant college football media that we're mad at

(01:53:35):
Tennessee fans because they didn't want Greg Ciano to be
their head coach. The defensive coordinator at Ohio State. Who's
gonna get fired now by Ryan Day. I thought that
all of those people in college football media were convinced
that Greg Ciano was the greatest college football coach of
all time and that Tennessee fans were idiots. Oh oh,

(01:53:56):
maybe Tennessee fans were right and they don't want to
admit it. I got Joel clad all triggered on Twitter.
He's firing away tweets at me early in the morning,
Joe clad Up defending Greg Ciano. Greg Ciano is not
a very good coach. Ohio State fans don't even want
him to be their defensive coordinator. All these jobs that
are open, nobody's hiring Greg Ciano. Guys not a good coach.

(01:54:17):
Guy's not a good choice. Remember, how mad people were
Tennessee last year? Ohio State they got a new job opening.
Who can they hire anybody? Oh? They went with Ryan
Day specifically. In Pete Damil's story, it says that does
not mention Greg Ciano is being shipped safe to get
to keep his job. Maybe some of these national media, Oh,

(01:54:39):
an apology to Tennessee fans and to me. Wouldn't that
be painful for them have to admit that I was wrong,
that I was right all along and they were wrong?
It would be incredible. Take some of your calls eight
seven seven three six nine, Tyler in South Carolina? What's up? Tyler?
Our phone's not working again? Is my Mike on? Am

(01:55:00):
I actually on the air? Yeah, you're on the air.
The question I think, uh, the question, yeah, of course.
The question that I think is out there that's hanging around,
is I'll go to you dub instead. Do you buy
into my theory that urban Meyer is going to sit
out for a year and become the next coach at USC?
I definitely I could see that. I'm while I've been listening,

(01:55:22):
I've been kind of thinking of other programs that big
programs that may have openings coming up and The only
one I can think of is, you know, maybe ou
if Lincoln Riley decides to go to the NFL, that
he could sit out a year or two and that
could be another job he could potentially take. Yeah, I
just I don't necessarily know that I buy Lincoln Riley
going to the NFL. I think the decision Lincoln Riley
will have to make about the NFL is this are

(01:55:45):
Baker Mayfield and Kyler Murray to transcendent meteor streaking across
the college football night sky that Lincoln Riley just happened
to have there at Oklahoma to be the perfect captains
of his offense. Or has he created such a successful
system that while Kyler Murray and Baker Mayfield may be

(01:56:07):
incredibly talented quarterbacks, he believes anybody can succeed in that system.
Like Steve Spurrier back in the day when he had
the fun and gun running at Florida, it didn't matter
who his quarterback was. He had created a system that
would work for everyone. Now, Danny Wherfele ran it better
than anybody did, but every quarterback that Steve Spurrier had

(01:56:29):
was pretty successful in that system. So does Lincoln Riley
think there's a next man up factor for after Kyler Murray.
If so, then staying at Oklahoma is perfectly fine. If not,
if he thinks he caught lightning in a bottle and
Baker Mayfield and Kyler Murray are transcendent and there's not
an easy example of them again, then I think he

(01:56:49):
could decide to go to the NFL because his his
stature would never be hotter, and certainly with the success
Sean McVeigh is having right now, is the time if
you have any kind of college football, big time scoring
pedigree to be hit heading to the NFL. That's the
reason why I think Cliff Kingsbury may not take the
USC offensive coordinator job. I think there's a decent chance

(01:57:11):
he jumps and goes to the NFL because he's so
hot right now he feels like it could be a
better set up. Um. But the Urban Meyer thing that
makes sense to me is he sits out for a year.
He's fifty four years old, He'll be fifty five years
old next year. I just find it hard to believe
that he is going to spend the rest of his
life not coaching. And I thought Petro's brought up that

(01:57:34):
Urban Meyer was not that good in media. He wasn't
like an incredibly electric television broadcaster. If he were John
Gruden or if he were John Madden, I could see
him becoming a guy who goes into the analyst realm
and never goes back into coaching because he's just gotten
his fill. And also he's so good at TV. I

(01:57:56):
just I think a guy like urban Meyer is gonna
want a challenge, and I think after sitting out for
another year, his health is going to get back in
in whatever working order it needs to be, and he
will be out there on the horizon looking for a job.
And I just see USC in the PACT twelve in particular,
as a place that would be the perfect destination for him.

(01:58:17):
Got a conference that is being left behind, much like
the Big Ten when he went to Ohio State. You've
got really the Pac twelve as a national afterthought. Urban
Meyer I think could go to USC out in l
a recruited an incredibly high level when at an incredibly
high level, and take advantage of a conference where, frankly,

(01:58:41):
the quality of play is not that high overall, much
like he did in the Big Ten, build USC back
up to a national title contender over the next four
or five years, and then I could see urban Meyer leaving.
Then if you got USC back to national championship or
national championship caliber after five or six years, I could

(01:59:02):
see urban Meyer leaving again and actually staying retired. Look,
urban Meyer went to Florida for six years, left because
of health reasons. Urban Meyer now has gone to Ohio
State for seven years and he's leaving for health reasons.
The situations are eerily similar. I would just say if
he sits out for a year, I think there's a
very good chance that urban Meyer ends up at a

(01:59:23):
job like USC. I don't necessarily see him going to
the NFL. I think that's probably the most likely outcome.
Will continue to unpack this story. I'll be talking about
it on my periscope and Facebook's. We'll talk about it tomorrow,
probably talk about it unlock it in as well our
FS one show, This is out Cake. The coverage on
Fox Sports Radio

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