July 10, 2025 • 50 mins
On a Thursday edition of The Best Of The Doug Gottlieb Show, Doug addresses the news that the NFL Owners and union head reportedly agreed to a non-disclosure over findings that might have made them look bad, and Doug shares his main takeaway.
In this week's installment of "Don't Call It A Throwback, Thursday", Doug and the crew feature the year 1999.
NFL Analyst John Middlekauff joins for his weekly hit to talk about the NFL-Union story, Kirk Cousins and all of the headlines around the NFL.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Thanks for listening to The Doug Gotleep Show podcast. Be
sure to catch us live every weekday three to five,
twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local
station for The Doug Gottlieb Show at Foxsports Radio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app
by searching apps car Boom Up America, Doug Gottlieb Show,
Fue Sports Radio. Doo Doo doo doo do do dude. Hey,
(00:28):
welcome in. It's the DG Show. My man Dan Byer's
back from guest hosting other shows. The whole crew is here.
We're excited to have you. It's a Thursday, which means
we got don't call it a throwback Thursday does mean
we missed our Wednesday midway, which I love and I
(00:51):
had a I know you guys did it. I didn't
do it because I wasn't here and I'm mad about it.
I had a great midway. What did you guys do?
The midway on?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Jason Damn Bayer came up with a great concept. I
think I think I will say im after after it
said that was fun, A great job. Yeah, it was
a great job.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
What was it?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Hold on? Hold on? Great.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
You don't even remember exciting plays in sports off the
heels of the inside the park home run, walking off. Great, Yeah,
that we had on Tuesday night. What are the most
exciting plays in all of sports?
Speaker 1 (01:29):
That's funny. That was not at all where I was
going with it. That was not in any way it
was where I was going with it. I mean, really,
I was going somewhere where trying trying to figure out
if I was thinking about travel for the summer, would
you rather do be a tourist, stay at hotels, maybe
move around hotels, or would you rather do the verbo
(01:51):
airbnb thing where then you just stayed a place for
a week and you become like a Greek citizen for
a week, which is more your style. But well, I
have to pocket that one for next week. For next week. Anyway,
we got a great show for you this just in
that you may that you may have heard Jalen Williams
signs an extension so the with the champion Oklahoma City Thunder.
(02:16):
So now the big three for the Thunder Thunder on
the hook for somewhere in the neighborhood of eight hundred
and fifty million dollars between three players over the next
however many years those max contracts, right, is that those
numbers are obscene, and you know, I the thunder, I'm sure,
I feel like this is what we have to do.
We have to keep these three guys and then all
(02:36):
the other ancillary parts. We do the best we can,
and if not, we'll use those draft picks to kind
of manipulate and get the best young players we can.
So those extensions I don't think going to effect for
another year, so they're still able to add some pieces
and do some cute math. But eventually you get to
the place where if any three of those players get hurt,
(03:01):
now you're where the where the Celtics are where you
got to think, okay, we can't really truly compete at
the top of the league that particular year. But let's
get to this kind of a weird story of the week. Ah,
Pablo Torre and Mike Florio And again Pablo is he's
(03:23):
very smart. He went to Harvard just you know, like anybody.
If you want to know how he went to Harvard, wait,
they'll tell you, or they'll wear a Harvard sweatshirt. But
super bright guys. Mike is a lawyer, and so somehow
they got this information that there was an alleged a
(03:45):
collusion between owners and the commissioner to have occurred after
the Deshaun Watson contract was signed and that trade was
agreed to, while no collusion was found and there was
no case against them, now it's been discovered there was
a secret agreement between the head of the players union
(04:06):
and Roger Goodell. And as you may have heard if
you were listening to Dan Byer and his update, there
is now a growing petition by NFL players to get
the head of the union to resign under pressure. I
think the problem with it is we don't know, like
so he's got to resign because there's collusion, but it
(04:28):
wasn't deemed to be collusion by UH by an investigation,
but it was boardline and borderline inappropriate. And so there
was some sort of agreement, secret agreement which is no
longer secret, which was in place, and because it was
kept secret from the players, then the union head muscow
(04:54):
right buyer. That's how I that's how I I read
this thing. You know again, My my thing is that
again a bit of a maa coopa with Pablo and
with Florio, because they've been all over this thing but
I also think that there's a world where any of
us who were in real time, in real time discussing
(05:17):
the Deshaun Watson fully guaranteed contract, we all said, this
is a bad idea. Again, and I don't know the
wording of any of these texts that were sent or
any discussions that were had, but the reality is having
fully multi year, fully guaranteed contracts for NFL players would
(05:38):
be an absolute abject disaster. It's hard enough in the NBA,
consider that in football you just don't have that grade
of a window and you're literally one play away from
never having a career or walking again. It just it
doesn't feel like it's collusion to go, hey, guys, this
(06:00):
might not be the best idea to give a five year, guaranteed,
no cut contract to somebody who's accused of sexual assault
forty times plus and oh yeah, by the way, he
suffered two ACL injuries in his life, and now you know,
at the end of that contract they've had to redo
it because you can't get out of it. And he
suffered too Achilles tenantaries like this stuff and by the way,
(06:22):
not that good. So this is not be being pro
owner or pro player. I don't have it by head
in the sand. Again, it's just really hard to decipher,
like we're making a big deal and accusing the owners
and Goodell of collusion when it was reviewed and it
(06:43):
did not meet the pre preponderance of evidence that would
have taken to go to trial. So there is no
true collusion, even if there's some borderline stuff there and
they you know, they pushed their beliefs. Oh yeah, by
the way, in the time since that deal, while there
has and that wasn't the first ever fully guaranteed contract.
(07:06):
Kirk Cousins had a fully guaranteed contract. It was only
for three years, and that's what players are gonna end
up running into, right. There has to be a balance there,
and if if Pablo Torre and Mike Florio aren't willing
to admit that, there has to be lessons learned by
NFL teams from the disaster, which is the Deshaun Watson contract.
(07:32):
That is, anyone who will this is this reminds me
by the way of when uh Durell Revis was with
the Jets and ultimately got traded. I think you had
traded to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, and what happened was
the Jets were telling Durell Revis, we think you're the
best cornerback in the league. So he held out. He's like, fine,
(07:54):
I need to be paid like the best cornerback in
the league, like Namdi Osimoi namdas I made sixteen million
at the time, the next highest paid cornerback was twelve
million dollars per year. And my point then, which is
my point now, is you're gonna use that as an example, Hey,
you gotta pay me sixteen million. Well, it was a
terrible contract. Why would I mimic a terrible contract? And
(08:17):
if I'm an NFL owner, I would say the same
thing about Deshaun Watson. Why would I mimic one of
the worst, if not the worst contract in the history
of sports. Explain that to me, you wouldn't. And if
Roger Goodell is reiterating like this is not good for business,
(08:41):
I don't know how you defend the Deshaun Watson contract.
I just do not. So I'm not pro owner, I'm
not anti player. And in the time since the Deshaun
Watson contract, the guarantees have continued to go up, the
money has continued to go up. And if there was
collusion they're doing a terrible job of it, terrible job
(09:05):
of buyer. Did I read these things incorrectly in terms
of we don't totally know, we don't know what Goodell
Or owners are alleged to have said, We only know
what they were accused of collusion, and it did not
read the threat did not meet the threshold for a
lawsuit going forward. Yet there is this clandestine meeting between
(09:29):
NFLBA and NFL that was agreed to, which's like, hey,
this is not a great look, let's not discuss it.
Here's some sort of agreement.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Yeah, and Doug I had to step away just because
of the Jalen Williams news, so I didn't hear your
whole piece about it. I feel that the Players Association,
in the group of players are up in arms one
hundred times more than probably anybody else should be in
terms of or anybody else is in wondering why was
(10:01):
this hidden? Why do the owners collude? And then now
why is their executive director of other ties to other places?
I think everybody health actually probably would fall in line
with the owners not saying that players shouldn't make as
much as they want, but that do we really want
(10:22):
teams to be giving fully guaranteed contracts that could you know,
handcuff them in future years if it doesn't work out
like it did with the Cleveland Browns. And so I
think that I think that the players have every right
to be mad. I just don't know if there's going
to be enough people to support what the players did
or what the players are mad about. Considering it did
(10:44):
seem that the owners did collude, but I think that
colluding on that certain topic is probably best overall for
the league.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Yeah, I agree with you. Again, there's a there's a
a a gray area between outright collusion, okay, and discussing
what's smart business. Right, Yes, there's a gray area, and
(11:14):
I feel like this has to have fallen into that
gray area, which is really the which is why there
was no lawsuit. So again, if I'm wrong, and if
we read the text and it's like, hey, by all means,
don't give them guaranteed contracts, suppress there. But if that
wording was in there, there would be a lawsuit. There's not,
(11:37):
you know.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Yeah, I think I also think that, and I am
not as well versed, so this is just an amateur guess,
but I would also think that the reason why the
NFLPA didn't go public with this is because they thought
maybe down the road that if he did have guaranteed contracts,
it would hurt a portion of their union, maybe not
the top end guys. And it's kind of what makes
(11:58):
the NFL it is, what makes the NF union so weak,
is that there's such a disparity between the top end
guys and everybody else.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
Yeah, they call those guys, they call everybody else the
rank and file, Yes, right, So the rank and file
needs to collect checks for as long as they can
collect checks for because their checks are not what the
quarterbacks are, the wide receivers are, the defensive ends are.
You know, the guys we talk about are the guys
they're gonna make so much money that yeah, maybe they
(12:28):
make a couple million dollars less, but it's not gonna
affect them. The guys we don't talk about the offense
of the other you know, the backup tackles, you know,
the the backup running backs, the fifth wide receiver, the
nickel corner, like those are the guys that are just
as important to the union. Any union is like that, right,
(12:50):
That's that's the part that people don't realize about unions.
Unions have to think of the rank and file first,
operating on the idea that whoever's at the very top
of the food chain, they're good. And if you're gonna
sacrifice anything, sacrifice that because it's just a numbers game, right,
This is a numbers game.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
If you're paying the top end guys, it seems like, okay, great,
but someone ends up having to take a hit on
the other end. And I believe in the most recent
CBA a lot of middle guys who could spend six
or seven years in the league are gone because it's
just easier to go with the twenty two to twenty
(13:32):
three year old rookie at that price. So I think
as the union, that would be my guess on why
it was kept quiet. And while yeah, the owners did this,
but if you started to allow guaranteed contracts for everybody,
then maybe you're pricing out a portion of your union.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Stuck out lip show here on Fox Sports, just a guess.
That's again, And my guess is that it's in that
gray area of what's good business what's not good business
for all of us. Let's look at the Deshaun Watson thing. Yeah,
as bad business, bad for business, and we probably shouldn't
(14:13):
do that again.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I think it would have been easy for those teams,
Kyler Murray and the Cardinals, or easy for those agents
to ask for what Deshaun Watson got considering everything that,
all the baggage that came with him, and then it's
difficult to negotiate off of that. And Kyler Murray maybe
would have warranted it, maybe he would have been worthy
(14:36):
of it. And while it sucks for Kyler Murray, I
think there is a domino effect that it isn't good
for the National Football League and it isn't necessarily good
for fans. That's why I feel kind of the players
are a bit out on an island and all of
this as well, because I think parody is one of
the things that drives the NFL and now the ability
to turn things around quickly. And if you're saddled by
(14:57):
bad contracts because you have stupid owners, I don't know
if that's good for or the overall portion of the league.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Well. I also think you mentioned parody. I don't know
if it's as much about parody as much as I
do think that even though it's more perception than reality
in terms of players playing for their checks and not
being guaranteed money. Reality is NFL players are guaranteed a
substantial sum of their salary substantial sum, but the perception
(15:28):
is they're not, which I think makes them somebody that
we want to cheer for as as fans as well. Hey,
whereas NBA players they are fully guaranteed contracts, there's a
perception there of they don't have to play hard because
they're still getting paid anyway. So I do think that
(15:49):
there's some added other benefits to having the perception nodding
up with the reality in terms of guaranteed contracts.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
This is the best of the Done Dot Lead Show,
Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
What I want you to do? I got Leave Show Fox
Sports Radio. Mm hmm. I hope you're having a great
day that I got. Leap show broadcasts every day right
here on Fox Sports Radio. We have the in the
Bonus podcast which follows this show, and you can download
it and any of our podcasts on a daily basis.
(16:27):
Do do Do, Do do do do your summer plans.
Call for a new job. Want to work with an
expert your local job market, find the right role. Just
call the local express employ professionals. Go to expresspros dot
Com let her never let Express never lets job seekers
charge your fee. We'll get you ready for summer League Tonight,
(16:50):
Bronnie uh versus Cooper Flag. The Dodgers continue to struggle.
That's why Jasu, in his normal cheery JP Morosi is
going to join us with talk some Baseball with Jay P. Morosi.
But we do this every Thursday. Yeah, we do this
(17:10):
every Thursday. It's a way for Jay Stu to tap
into his morning FMDJ wiring. It's a way for Dan
Byer to bring up all of his immense sports knowledge,
especially around golf. And it's away for me to talk
about old movies. We call it. Don't call it throwback Thursday.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
Don't call it a throwback throw back Thursday.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Jay Stu, what was the year you, Doug.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I'll take it from here. On last Day, nine night,
I want the listeners to take themselves back to nineteen
ninety nine. I'd like each participant on this show to
think of what you were doing in the year nineteen
ninety nine, because on this day, the sports world changed forever.
We were told that it was going to change forever,
(17:59):
and in indeed, twenty six later, we are still feeling
the effects of it. Brandy Chastain knocks in a penalty kick.
US women's soccer beats China and the World Cup final
and women's soccer. In fact, women's sports changed forever. There
was so much interest, It is so profitable, it's off
(18:21):
the charts. Congratulations to Brandy Chastain for being the person
to deliver that to us. The Women's World Cup soccer
team wins on this date twenty six years ago. Dan Byro,
when you think of nineteen ninety nine, what goes through
your mind?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
You're a graduated college fellas in the spring of nineteen nineteen.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Oh wow, you're a spring chicken man.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Yes, absolutely, nineteen ninety nine. We have the Open Championship
next week. Nineteen ninety nine may have been the pinnacle
of golf. You would have a tough time arguing you
had a better golf year than nineteen nine ninety nine
that unfortunately ended in tragedy with the passing of Payne
(19:04):
Stewart in that plane crash. However, prior to that, Paine
Stewart made such great headlines with the win at the
US Open in nineteen ninety nine at Pinehurst number two,
avenging what happened the year before at the Olympic Club.
It was for Stewart his second US Open Championship and
for the runner up there was Phil Mickelson. Remember Phil
(19:26):
was ready to leave the course in case his wife
went into labor with their first child. She ended up
Amy I believe, gave birth the next day to their
first child. But so many of us remember the late
great Paint Stewart winning at Pinehurst number two. But it
was also the year that Van Derveld blew the lead
at Carnousti at the Open Championship, which I would love
(19:48):
to talk about, but time permitting, I know we can't.
Tiger got back on the major train, winning the PGA
Championship at Medina, which was kind of the arrival of
Sergio Garcia, and then the Ryder Cup nineteen ninety nine.
Ben Crenshaw, he had a feeling about that on that
Saturday night, justin Leonard's pott the whole deal as the
(20:08):
US came back and beat Europe at the country Club
of Brookline. So what a huge year for golf in
nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Nineteen ninety nine was the lockout shortened Spurs Championship run.
They beat the New York Knickerbockers after a fifty game series.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
So shouting series, you should just do something.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Fifty game season. Sorry, fifty game season, seven game series.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Back to San Antonio with the Spurs up twenty two
to fourteen.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Shaquille O'Neal led Leaguan's scoring was the MVP twenty thirty
points a game with the Lakers. With the Lakers, and
remember that was the year that the season began with
Michael Jordan announcing he was retiring from basketball to get
(21:00):
baseball a shot. Oh no, that was that was That
was the second retirement. This is the second This is
the real retirement. Ninety eight was the Utah game winner
against Brian Russell. Ninety nine was his first year that
he didn't play before he rejoined the Wizards later on
his career.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
And of course, like that lockout. The only thing I
remember about that at lockout or that strike. Patrick Ewing
is going to be known for a lot of things.
I think he's a Hall of Famer, he's an awful
basketball coach, but he'll always, in my mind, be the
guy that was stupid enough to on in front of
reporters while they're talking about negotiations. For salaries. Say, NBA
(21:43):
players make a lot of money, but we spend a
lot of money too. I'd like to know who he
thought he was playing to on that one, who he thought, well,
he was getting the sympathy from the point ewing.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
You know what else happened in basketball? The year final four,
Saint Petersburg, Florida never went back. I remember because Ohio
State made it on the shoulders of Scoony Penn and
Michael Red. Then Scoony Penn's jersey was stolen before the
national semi final. State bad omen because they got yukonned.
And then Yukon took out Duke who everybody thought was
gonna win it. And the Duke, yes was the huskies
(22:22):
first national championship under Jim Calhoun.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
I love Duke, that's right, that's the Khalid la mein.
We shocked the world. We shocked the world.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
I remember that player wasn't he wasn't he called the chubster,
wouldn't he?
Speaker 1 (22:43):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Not a what of definition on that?
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Nope? But he could hoop.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
But he loved those guys. Yeah, yeah, I love chubby
guys that could play like professional athletics.
Speaker 5 (22:54):
Bartolo Cologne if you want to feel old. Nineteen ninety
nine was Kirk Arents his first year at IOWA, and
he's still there.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
I love it. It's a really good thank you.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
He's the number one earning movie that year.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
Come on, come on, of college football coaches. Yeah, let's
go to movies.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Let's go to movies.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Well, nineteen nine nine was also the year that Bob
Stoops was hired, wasn't it?
Speaker 3 (23:22):
And then I think they were a kind of all
in that same group.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
And then two thousand and one the National championship. So uh,
nineteen nine nine movies Star Wars Episode one, The Phantom Menace,
despite the fact that had Jar Jar Binks and a
bunch of CGI, it made four hundred and thirty million
dollars ross. Number two was the sixth sense I see
(23:45):
that people. Number three was Austin Powers, the spy who
shagged me. Yeah, baby, Yeah. Number four was Toy Story two,
Great Flake, great flick. Toy Story two was that was
not lots of hugging bear. That was Toy Story three,
and number five was yeah maybe the matrix was five.
(24:08):
The matrix.
Speaker 5 (24:09):
The matrix the best stat of all those.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Listen. I think the matrix came out in ninety eight,
right that it being five.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
Was like the un in the second year.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
The uh Christina's Teenager, my super hot girlfriend, Christina's teenager,
we were able to want to let him watch uh
the was it sixth Sense? For the first time. I
got a person's like unfiltered first time reaction to the
end of a sixth Sense. Which it's an amazing movie,
(24:43):
but it's not a great rewatch because the greatest part
of the movie is the reveal at the end, and
I got to watch him react to it, and that
was wonderful. It makes sense that the episode one of
Star Wars was the largest grossing despite all of its
uh all of itations, because everyone didn't know the limitations
(25:03):
when they paid to see it.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Yeah, which just I'm sure the DVD sales are still big, right,
but yes, jar Jar Binks threatened to cancel the entire series,
only was unable to to do that.
Speaker 5 (25:19):
I remember being very, very excited for The Phantom Menace
and I remember being like, I liked it, but it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
It didn't blow me away.
Speaker 5 (25:29):
I think maybe it was before that or a few
years after that did they did the original three re
releases where like they buffed up the graphics and added
like some new scenes.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
I just watched a New Hope the other day with
those those kind of modern or more recent graphics, and
it's cringey.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
You prefer like the old old, Like you can see
the lines passing through stuff. Joba the Hut is in
a scene and he steps over in and it's laughable.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
It's very blurry. He goes on on my bookie, had
my bookie. Yeah, it's kind of weird. So as as
George Lucas was making an episode one and releasing it,
I saw him do an interview with sixty Minutes and
they said, what are you listening to nowadays? Like, what's
what's on your discmand surprise to hear the answer. It
(26:21):
went in something like this, Wow, George Lucas, this is
Britney Spears her first hit, hit Me Baby, and it
launched a career that still goes today. I think she's
(26:42):
still doing a Vegas residency. But the I guess the
the singer songwriter that will always kind of match with
Britney Spears did this song the same year. Yeah, yeah,
(27:05):
get it now. I was a Christina guy over Brittany. Interesting.
Speaker 5 (27:10):
Yeah, she was way more talented Damns. Yes, Danby's are
kind of resident nineties pop expert on the show. Yes,
when you look back twenty six years of what has
happened to each of these artists, how do you kind
of summarize things? Who came out ahead, what impact?
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Well, I will say at the time, like there was
as far as great as Christina Aguilera was at the time,
nothing was bigger than Britney Spears and that song and
what it what it did. Ultimately, I would say, because
of the tough road that Britney drove for the last
what ten fifteen years whatever it's been, Christina actually would
(27:51):
probably come out. But I just I don't think that
there was ever a point where Christina Aguilera was bigger
than Britney Spears was at that point.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
So it was Britney Spears, Coke, and Christina Laria was
like Arci Cola.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I would say that that, Well, it's funny because Britney
was a Pepsi sponsor. But but if you wanted to
say that Coke was number one, I think it's very
fair to say that Christine the Aguilera was number two.
Then you have Jessica Simpson, others, Mandy Moore came along
at that time. She's now an actress. But yeah, yes,
Chris good parenthood.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
She's been on the Voice. Christina Aguilera, she was on
the Voice, and yeah, she had some great pipes, just great.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
She did really good. Really really can say so.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
She could really sing. Uh Where's We kind of talked
about this when I hosted Coward yesterday, which is like
the Cantlin Clark is she best played in the w NBA. No,
but she's the most popular player in the w n
B A right, Christina Aguila is a better singer, better
singer than Britney Spears, not close, but Britney Spears was
(28:51):
more popular.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
What you're saying is Christina Aguilera is the Brianna Stewart
to uh Hatel and Car.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Yeah, I would say she's the Page Beckers maybe or
the Sabrinette Escu. Yeah, that's fair because Brianna Stewart is
an earlier generation, so she'd be more Not Madonna's not
that that's like Cynthia Cooper's like Madonna, right, but nobody
(29:18):
actually cared, so not really Madonna.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
How about this? Yeah, how about taking a twelve year
old that loves the NFL right now, sitting them down
and saying, you know, in nineteen ninety nine, that was
the era when the Jaguars and Titans ruled the NFL,
because it was at that time, at least in the
AFC the Jaguars fourteen and two, Titans thirteen and three.
(29:42):
You would also say to that twelve year old, can
you believe the Dolphins actually made the playoffs that year
and they won a game and they beat the Seahawks,
because that also happened in the nineteen ninety nine NFL season.
It was Dan Marino's last victory as a quarterback, Doug,
you talk about the loss that the it took the
next week against the Jaguars, but Marino and the Dolphins
(30:03):
went to Seattle topped the Seahawks in an AFC wild
card matchup, but the Seahawks won the AFC West that year.
Jacksonville and Tennessee were tops in the AFC, but they
were both in the AFC Central. The Colts were the
division winner in the AFC East at thirteen and three.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
Peyton Mann in second year.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yes, first first year won three, second year lost three.
Speaker 5 (30:26):
He finally got some traction.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
You know, well, they drafted Edgrin James. That was a
big help and Marvin Edge.
Speaker 5 (30:35):
How long was Dan Marino was in the NFL? From
what eighty three to ninety nine? He was in the NFL?
Long time? Yes, yes, was it eighty three?
Speaker 1 (30:43):
In fact a long time, not Brady long time.
Speaker 5 (30:46):
But it feels like a lot, like I don't know,
to go from the early eighties to the late night
for some reason, that just feels like a long time.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
That that was the famous eighty three draft class, you.
Speaker 5 (30:54):
Know, seven sixteen seventeen year career.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
That's you know, have.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
Brought up the Music City miracle, but that had up
in January eighth, two thousand. Not apropos for this segment.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Rob Johnson was the quarterback of the Bills.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yes, Rob Johnson, I think I've told this story. He
lives in South Orange County. Dude is the most ripped
human being I've ever seen. Like it's clean, does hot yoga,
shows off, embarrasses all of us. He's Rob Luke. You
know Rob is in good shape.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Pause, No it's.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Not pause No, it's no. Yeah, he's just giving a compliment.
That's no way you would say. No, Jase, do you
say it? No?
Speaker 5 (31:42):
Yeah, we get it.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
No, No, home. Dan agrees with me on this one
pause pause me.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Well, you guys are two of the more hip guys ever,
so you can definitely tell what what I did. Well,
he threw you in there pause and no, h O
m O are not the same thing.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
All right, Let's go back to Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera.
I was always more of a Gimmy gimme moore fan
for Brittany and let's get dirty for Christina Aguilar's dirty
is great?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Ever really a fan of either give Me, give Me More?
Speaker 5 (32:13):
That's an underrated song.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Yeah, we forgot about baseball, but that's because the Yankees
beat everybody except they swept the Rangers, beat the Red
Sox in five games, and then beat the Braves.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Is that the World Series?
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Was that the first World Series for teater No.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Ninety six, ninety eight, ninety nine, two thousand.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
My bad? There was that Maria Rivera's first first because
they had Wetland.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Rivera was a setup man for wet one and six.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
And then in ninety.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
Nine MVP There You Go series MVP.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Fox Sports
Radio Dot com and within the iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
App, Doug otlib Show, Fox Sports Radio m John Metalcalffill
join us after we get an update from Dan Byer.
Coach Prime's making some waves and Dion's an interesting one man.
Like as much as I think everybody would expect him
(33:23):
to be, Hey, pay the players as much as they
can actually make. Uh, and then some just money, money, money, money, money.
The fact is, if you actually listen to many of
the things he says, whether they apply to Colorado or not,
it's about what we college coaches call the right things.
You know, guys have to earn things. Guys should stay
at their schools, a degree has a value to them,
(33:45):
and yeah, they should make some money. But like, let's
not go crazy here. A lot of these guys are
getting paid for something we hope they can do and
it's not true. Nil. Here's Dion talking about nil in
college football.
Speaker 6 (34:00):
I wish it was a cap, you know, like the
top of the line player makes this, and if you're
not that type of guy, you know you're not gonna
make that.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
That's what the NFL does.
Speaker 6 (34:08):
So the problem is you got a guy that's not
that durn good, but he could go to another school
and they give him a half a million dollars and
you can't you can't compete with that. That don't make sense. Say,
all you have to do is look at the playoffs
and see what those teams spent. And you understand, during
the white end the playoffs, it's kind of hard to
compete with somebody who's giving twenty five thirty million dollars
of during freshman class. Right, It's crazy. The teams that
(34:33):
pays the more, pays the most is gonna be then it.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
I mean, he's right, you know, it's like, well, no, no,
he's right. I mean even Indiana, who I didn't think
should have been in the collegeball playoff, they spent a
ton of money in order to get there in terms
of their personnel. The new agreement is supposed to have
a cap on spending twenty two million dollar and you know,
(35:01):
I think thirteen of its supposed to go to college
to football. But you can also add in nil, which
is sometimes real sometimes not anil. In college basketball, I
got all but three picks right, and I picked every
game based upon who's spent the most money. That's it.
So it is really the haves and the have nots.
(35:23):
And the part he didn't discuss is that the other
real world discussion that isn't at is, Hey, you do
realize that a lot of schools were going to lose
some Olympic sports because if you want to compete in
the revenue generating sports, that money is not You're not
making tons of profit at MAX schools, not making tons
(35:46):
of profit at all these other schools of football. You're
not making a huge money if you don't have football,
you're still trying to pay to play in basketball, women's basketball,
and potentially football. That means you're not going to be
able to fully fund properly Olympic sports. But he's just
talking about competitive balance, says it's lacking because there's no cap.
(36:07):
John Mitlcoff joints just three and outs to the podcast.
He spent some time in Fresno State in college football
before moving on to the NFL, before moving on to
becoming a star podcaster. What do you think of what
Dion said?
Speaker 7 (36:18):
Well? I followed that a lot of the comments pretty closely.
Kenny Dillingham had some too. You know Texas Tech and
you know you're a got some big twelve roots. They
have that oil guy that's former players. They have spent
big time money, and Dillingham was saying yesterday like, guys,
be ready, this team is gonna be really, really good.
(36:39):
And essentially what he's saying is like they broke the
bank this offseason when it came to football. They had
arguably the best transfer portal class. You know, you're in
it now, and I know it's different than like you know,
Ohio State, Michigan and Alabama like recruiting and stuff football wise,
but whenever I see like this guy's a great recruiter,
I think that used to really matter, like ed Ojeron
(37:02):
or Tosh or some of these guys in football, especially
like when I was in high school or in college
in the two thousands, There is no such thing as
a great recruiter anymore. Like are you paying the most money?
And like you said, even when the cap comes, like
in the NFL, if I'm giving whoever an extension TJ.
Watt or Travis Kelcey or obviously the quarterbacks, the whatever
(37:24):
they're going to make State Farm or Chevy, that has
nothing to do with anything with the team. Where if
Kirby Smart goes, well, hey what even once this gap comes,
I can pay you let's just take a number five
hundred thousand dollars with the cap, but I can also
get you half a million dollars in nil, Like he's
part of that. Like the other schools don't have that
(37:45):
capabilia Ohio State. I mean, there's a group of fifteen
twenty that it's only going to continue to separate. Now,
you could argue, you know, in college football, college basketball
could be a little random, right because of the tournament.
Where in football, on the aggregate of the season, typically
the same teams year and year out, give or take,
are competing, that that's only going to continue to separate.
(38:08):
But now it's so conference aligned because of the SEC
money and the Big ten TV money, the advantages they have,
They've always had advantages. Now it's only separated. Why Texas
Tech can even you know, dream of competing is because
they have I don't know their version. It's not quite
it's not apples apples, but like a Phil Knight or
(38:28):
you at Oklahoma State, like you have to have a
special individual with huge money to even be in the
conversation or else you really got no shot.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
I completely agree. And recruiting, recruiting does matter. Recruiting does matter. Okay,
you still have to connect with the kid. You have
to paint for them a vision. You're not always they're
not always going not all of them go to where
the top dollar is. You know. I think again, high
level football, I major ball, High major basketball a little
(39:01):
different than what we're doing. But you still are recruiting,
and some of it is you got to recruit at
our level, Recruit guys you're not gonna get, you know, Like,
I'll just be honest with you, John, I'm recruiting the
top twenty kids the class of twenty twenty six in
the state of Wisconsin. I'm recruiting all twenty top the
(39:23):
ones I've evaluated is the top twenty. I'm recruiting all
of them. There's only one that I've offered a scholarship to,
and I think he's a little bit above our level,
but I think this would be a level where he
can come in and play initially. And then I'm only
going to say I told him. I gave him till
the end of the July cycle. We offered him like
almost a year ago, and then after that, and now
I'll start offering because he's the guy I want to
(39:43):
build around. Like the recruiting class anyway. Point is, I
know I'm not gonna get all of them. I'm not
going to offer all of them, but I want them
to get to know me, and I want to get
to know them that way in a year, in two years,
in three years, when they hit the transfer portal, which
many of the high percentage of are, then there's already
a relationship there, and I already know if I want him,
(40:04):
if I don't want him, he already knows if he
likes me or doesn't like me. So it does.
Speaker 7 (40:08):
And that was a big advantage for UCLA a couple
of years ago when Chip the two years ago they
had a really solid defense. A lot of those guys
had transferred. They were from la you know, from Michigan
or whatever. It came home. So I totally understand what
you're talking. That's where you're right recruiting. But that's different, right,
You're like recruiting for their second recruiting cycle. You know,
(40:29):
it's just a different world.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's a it's a totally different world. Let's get to
some of Let's get to the the collusion thing. Okay,
we don't know the details of it, and I do
know that because you got Florio, who is a lawyer. Uh,
and you have Pablo, who is you know, a Harvard dude,
brilliant like a lawyer that you know there's something there,
(40:56):
But there's a there's a fine line between hey, hey,
this is not good business to give to Shaun Watson
a five year guaranteed contract in this sport especially and
outright collusion, which is suppressing wages and elimiting the guarantees.
What do you think really happened between the union and
the owners after Deshaun Watson signed his deal?
Speaker 7 (41:19):
Yeah, I mean to me, I read a couple of headlines.
I'm like, I don't really see anyone. To me, collusion
typically is someone getting royally screwed, and I didn't really
see anyone getting royally screwed here. The other thing is
like Tyler Murray, well, you know, one of those texts
was like a good job, Michael on signing that deal. Well,
Kyler didn't have to sign the deal, right, no one
(41:39):
was forcing him. It was after his third year. He
could have played it out again, like no one's forcing
any of these people to sign deals. And the other thing,
when it comes, you know, specifically out of the conversation,
was around the quarterbacks. How often new quarterbacks not see
like the majority of their contract. It's it's very very rare.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
That, you know.
Speaker 7 (41:56):
Russell Wilson is an example of like got cut way short.
Now guaranteed money was so high. He still got a
ton of money, But like did Tyler get screwed? Last
time I checked, He's made like a couple hundred million
dollars the last three four years. So it's like, I
see everyone getting rich in this business model, and you've
been through way more negotiations in your life than me.
(42:16):
I mean, isn't when I read some of these conversations,
Like my first talk was, you know, my dad was
a farmer for a long time. Dealt with banks is
not just called business like I mean, I just it'd
be one thing if the wages or something hadn't gone
dramatically up. But from my advantage point, it feels like
(42:37):
everyone I would say that there's not a business in
the history of America that's created more millionaires when coaches, players, obviously, owners,
people involved, help people on the outside, media members when
it comes to football, and business continues to just roll.
So I to me, it was it was more of like, yeah,
(42:57):
this is means nothing. I didn't do anything for me.
But again, I'm not those stories.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
I I I totally, I totally agree that it's like
we're chasing something like, oh, yeah, they're the bad guys.
Like yeah, I again, if you remember when Kyler Murray
signed the new deal, you know it was after Kyler
Murray had been accused of playing call of duty too much? Right,
is this a guy we really want? And oh yeah?
But it was also if you remember coming off an
(43:25):
injury too, an't he Uh.
Speaker 7 (43:28):
No, I think he got injured the next year or
maybe he did. I can't even remember, but it was
after a third year, like the first time you can
negotiate with a with the with the first rounders. Yeah,
and like they didn't have to do that like other quarterbacks.
Hel Lamar didn't get a contract then. But the other
thing is we actually kind of murder was the number
one overall pick. He had already signed like a forty
(43:48):
million dollar contract, then he got another two hundred plus
million dollar contract. I just don't think anyone on the outside,
mainly the consumer who usually drives a lot of these,
like if they're all into this, it's like, well, who's
who's really getting screwed here, and I think most of
us come to the conclusion that nobody really yeah.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Yeah, it is the Doug Outlive Show, it is Fox
Sports Radio, Dallas Cowboys, Michaeh Parsons. You know it does
feel like you know he's playing on the fifth year option.
What I mean, we all it's funny. Most people think
he'll be a free agent at the end of the year.
He won't. They can franchise tag him. Jerry, of course,
(44:27):
could have signed him last offseason, did not. Says he'd
rather wait and pay more than pay too much to
a guy he doesn't want. Where do you think we
are with Parsons and the Cowboys?
Speaker 7 (44:40):
To me, that's super far about waiting and to pay more.
It's like seedy Lamb and Michael Parsons. Jerry, where your
draft picks. You've been around these guys every day for
whatever five years. I mean, what's for you waiting? You've
seen them their entire career on and off the field.
You've been around them all the time. So it's like
kind of know what he is. I mean, Micah is
like thread making the bank for one of them over
(45:01):
with you. We would trade him like the TJ Watt
hendrickson those older players, that's just like complicated negotiation business.
The micro thing is pretty simple, Like the number is
kind of his number, you know, give or take. Maybe
a couple million you can argue over. But like, why
you know Micah Parson's gonna show up for training camp.
(45:21):
I know he played good copter and the off season,
the spring ball, but recent history would say, guys in
his shoes, you know, kind of make it difficult, you know,
Nick Bosa, We've just seen other guys. Now we see
a lot of teams just sign the contract. I would say,
give or take sometime between you know, post draft to
(45:44):
right around the next couple of weeks so they don't
have to deal with this drama. I think Jerry has
a pretty clear history of like I'm just gonna sign
him like August twenty eight, you know, last possible second.
So that would be my expectation.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Yeah, that's what he does, and it ends up give
than the guys a chance to take some time off
of training camp.
Speaker 7 (46:03):
I think I think the TJ. Watt things a little
more complicated. You know, these older guys, they have a
lot of wear and hair on them, but they're really
important and excellent players, Henderson TJ. Watt. You know, it's
in fairness to them. It's like they see the amount
of money other their quote unquote peers are getting and
it's like, well, if I were to shattered my leg,
(46:24):
and these negotiations are hard, Like I understand both sides,
and I don't think there's an easy answer to it.
It's like if you just break here TJ. Watt, here's
another one hundred million dollars guaranteed, or we just kind
of play, you know, a staring contest, you know, because
I think Steelers probably all have to give him, like
a fifty million dollar a little bonus he probably wants,
(46:45):
like what Max Crosby and Miles Garrett just got. But
the problem is he goes, I know you need me
because you guys are all in on this season. That
situation just feels a little just weird, you know what
I mean. The Steelers have always felt a little even
when they quote unquote not been at the same level
last four or five years, like he kind of had
an idea. But now these last couple of years bringing
in Russell Wilson, this situation feet a little of Steeler
(47:08):
like for the first time of the Talblin era.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
I totally agree. What do you make of Kirk Cousins, Like, yeah, hey,
if I know they're going to drive the quarterback, I
would have stayed in Minnesota.
Speaker 7 (47:20):
I think the easy person to say that, Remember it
was again, I think we're playing like Monday Morning quarterback
of what really could have happened here because I think
Kevin O'Connell liked him, wanted them, but I think the
organization was kind of ready to move on.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Remember he had he had a torn achilles tendon, right,
and yes, yes they offered him a deal, but it
wasn't close to the deal that Atlanta offered him.
Speaker 7 (47:45):
Right, And it wasn't. Wasn't it more like, I mean
a one yearish like forty fifty You know, they gave
him essentially ninety million dollars. Yeah, I guarantee I think
anyone was even coming close to that, even if you
take away minnesot To, I don't think he had that
many options. Yeah, so I think it's easy for him
to say, I don't waive them. They offered him ninety million. Honestly,
(48:08):
it's a reflection of the organization when they gave him
that money. They didn't realize because they had new coaching staff,
they hadn't fallen in love with Michael Pennix. So they
signed them in the middle of March, and then they
start doing their private workouts meeting with Penix, and they
fall in love with the guy. So, if anything, is
more of a reflection of the herky jerky nature of
the Atlanta for An office because they knew they were
(48:31):
drafting Pennix. Let's let's be real, they would have given
like ten million dollars to UH for like a flat
okase keenum. I got just a high level back up,
impressive guy that got to help the young guy, and
it'll probably even end up being the backup.
Speaker 1 (48:44):
What we want, which by which, by the which, by
the way, is what the Vikings did, right, exactly the Vikings.
The Vikings went and they're like, hey, we're gonna go
cheap and we're gonna draft a guy, which is what
the Vikings would do. The other part to it is this,
and I was thinking about this that Cousins complained about this.
Kirk Cousins has mastered the business side of this thing,
(49:04):
the business right, So forgive the Falcons for treating it
like it's a business right, like he wants all kinds
of feelings like old on, dude, you know you were
all about business, three year guaranteed contract when you're with
the Vikings. Then they re up to you, Hey, it's business,
it's not personal. And then you go to Atlanta because
(49:25):
of business. Then they treat you like it's business, and
now you're bothered because it's not personal.
Speaker 7 (49:30):
I also think anyone in Cousin Hughes torn Achilles, regardless
of that, he'd already made like whatever, two hundred and
eighty three hundred million dollars in issues torn Achilles. Older player,
this team that's kind of desperate, but they kind of
got some interesting weapons. They got like a Shanahan disciple
McVeigh disciple running the offense, so you know what you're doing.
It was actually made kind of sense, Like I don't
(49:52):
blame him for taking the contract, but like all of
a sudden, they you know, like they got married and
then a month and they're like, we're in an open relationship.
He's like, what did I sign up for? But at
the time, it's like you were in love, so it's
I think it's easy. He was rattled by it. But
this is also what happens when you bounce around teams,
you know, the the equity just falls off a clip.
(50:13):
I mean Peyton Manning was now granted his arm wasn't
really working. John Alway called him into his office and said, like, hey,
Peyton were giving me a backup for a minute. Remember
that like this football, I mean, it's kind of cut
throat at times. And I think Cousins for the first
time truly in his career where he was like the
starter got I guess, a little bit of a humble pie.
(50:33):
But if you were giving me ninety million dollars, like
I don't know, I'd figure out a way to get
around it, figure it out. O.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
I agree. He's John Middlecoff three. Now it's the podcast.
He's the host of the volume podcast That Work. Johnny,
have a great weekend. Thanks for joining us, Bud
Thanks for listening to The Doug Gotleep Show podcast. Be
sure to catch us live every weekday three to five,
twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local
station for The Doug Gottlieb Show at Foxsports Radio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app
by searching apps car Boom Up America, Doug Gottlieb Show,
Fue Sports Radio. Doo Doo doo doo do do dude. Hey,
(00:28):
welcome in. It's the DG Show. My man Dan Byer's
back from guest hosting other shows. The whole crew is here.
We're excited to have you. It's a Thursday, which means
we got don't call it a throwback Thursday does mean
we missed our Wednesday midway, which I love and I
(00:51):
had a I know you guys did it. I didn't
do it because I wasn't here and I'm mad about it.
I had a great midway. What did you guys do?
The midway on?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Jason Damn Bayer came up with a great concept. I
think I think I will say im after after it
said that was fun, A great job. Yeah, it was
a great job.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
What was it?
Speaker 2 (01:11):
Hold on? Hold on? Great.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
You don't even remember exciting plays in sports off the
heels of the inside the park home run, walking off. Great, Yeah,
that we had on Tuesday night. What are the most
exciting plays in all of sports?
Speaker 1 (01:29):
That's funny. That was not at all where I was
going with it. That was not in any way it
was where I was going with it. I mean, really,
I was going somewhere where trying trying to figure out
if I was thinking about travel for the summer, would
you rather do be a tourist, stay at hotels, maybe
move around hotels, or would you rather do the verbo
(01:51):
airbnb thing where then you just stayed a place for
a week and you become like a Greek citizen for
a week, which is more your style. But well, I
have to pocket that one for next week. For next week. Anyway,
we got a great show for you this just in
that you may that you may have heard Jalen Williams
signs an extension so the with the champion Oklahoma City Thunder.
(02:16):
So now the big three for the Thunder Thunder on
the hook for somewhere in the neighborhood of eight hundred
and fifty million dollars between three players over the next
however many years those max contracts, right, is that those
numbers are obscene, and you know, I the thunder, I'm sure,
I feel like this is what we have to do.
We have to keep these three guys and then all
(02:36):
the other ancillary parts. We do the best we can,
and if not, we'll use those draft picks to kind
of manipulate and get the best young players we can.
So those extensions I don't think going to effect for
another year, so they're still able to add some pieces
and do some cute math. But eventually you get to
the place where if any three of those players get hurt,
(03:01):
now you're where the where the Celtics are where you
got to think, okay, we can't really truly compete at
the top of the league that particular year. But let's
get to this kind of a weird story of the week. Ah,
Pablo Torre and Mike Florio And again Pablo is he's
(03:23):
very smart. He went to Harvard just you know, like anybody.
If you want to know how he went to Harvard, wait,
they'll tell you, or they'll wear a Harvard sweatshirt. But
super bright guys. Mike is a lawyer, and so somehow
they got this information that there was an alleged a
(03:45):
collusion between owners and the commissioner to have occurred after
the Deshaun Watson contract was signed and that trade was
agreed to, while no collusion was found and there was
no case against them, now it's been discovered there was
a secret agreement between the head of the players union
(04:06):
and Roger Goodell. And as you may have heard if
you were listening to Dan Byer and his update, there
is now a growing petition by NFL players to get
the head of the union to resign under pressure. I
think the problem with it is we don't know, like
so he's got to resign because there's collusion, but it
(04:28):
wasn't deemed to be collusion by UH by an investigation,
but it was boardline and borderline inappropriate. And so there
was some sort of agreement, secret agreement which is no
longer secret, which was in place, and because it was
kept secret from the players, then the union head muscow
(04:54):
right buyer. That's how I that's how I I read
this thing. You know again, My my thing is that
again a bit of a maa coopa with Pablo and
with Florio, because they've been all over this thing but
I also think that there's a world where any of
us who were in real time, in real time discussing
(05:17):
the Deshaun Watson fully guaranteed contract, we all said, this
is a bad idea. Again, and I don't know the
wording of any of these texts that were sent or
any discussions that were had, but the reality is having
fully multi year, fully guaranteed contracts for NFL players would
(05:38):
be an absolute abject disaster. It's hard enough in the NBA,
consider that in football you just don't have that grade
of a window and you're literally one play away from
never having a career or walking again. It just it
doesn't feel like it's collusion to go, hey, guys, this
(06:00):
might not be the best idea to give a five year, guaranteed,
no cut contract to somebody who's accused of sexual assault
forty times plus and oh yeah, by the way, he
suffered two ACL injuries in his life, and now you know,
at the end of that contract they've had to redo
it because you can't get out of it. And he
suffered too Achilles tenantaries like this stuff and by the way,
(06:22):
not that good. So this is not be being pro
owner or pro player. I don't have it by head
in the sand. Again, it's just really hard to decipher,
like we're making a big deal and accusing the owners
and Goodell of collusion when it was reviewed and it
(06:43):
did not meet the pre preponderance of evidence that would
have taken to go to trial. So there is no
true collusion, even if there's some borderline stuff there and
they you know, they pushed their beliefs. Oh yeah, by
the way, in the time since that deal, while there
has and that wasn't the first ever fully guaranteed contract.
(07:06):
Kirk Cousins had a fully guaranteed contract. It was only
for three years, and that's what players are gonna end
up running into, right. There has to be a balance there,
and if if Pablo Torre and Mike Florio aren't willing
to admit that, there has to be lessons learned by
NFL teams from the disaster, which is the Deshaun Watson contract.
(07:32):
That is, anyone who will this is this reminds me
by the way of when uh Durell Revis was with
the Jets and ultimately got traded. I think you had
traded to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, and what happened was
the Jets were telling Durell Revis, we think you're the
best cornerback in the league. So he held out. He's like, fine,
(07:54):
I need to be paid like the best cornerback in
the league, like Namdi Osimoi namdas I made sixteen million
at the time, the next highest paid cornerback was twelve
million dollars per year. And my point then, which is
my point now, is you're gonna use that as an example, Hey,
you gotta pay me sixteen million. Well, it was a
terrible contract. Why would I mimic a terrible contract? And
(08:17):
if I'm an NFL owner, I would say the same
thing about Deshaun Watson. Why would I mimic one of
the worst, if not the worst contract in the history
of sports. Explain that to me, you wouldn't. And if
Roger Goodell is reiterating like this is not good for business,
(08:41):
I don't know how you defend the Deshaun Watson contract.
I just do not. So I'm not pro owner, I'm
not anti player. And in the time since the Deshaun
Watson contract, the guarantees have continued to go up, the
money has continued to go up. And if there was
collusion they're doing a terrible job of it, terrible job
(09:05):
of buyer. Did I read these things incorrectly in terms
of we don't totally know, we don't know what Goodell
Or owners are alleged to have said, We only know
what they were accused of collusion, and it did not
read the threat did not meet the threshold for a
lawsuit going forward. Yet there is this clandestine meeting between
(09:29):
NFLBA and NFL that was agreed to, which's like, hey,
this is not a great look, let's not discuss it.
Here's some sort of agreement.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Yeah, and Doug I had to step away just because
of the Jalen Williams news, so I didn't hear your
whole piece about it. I feel that the Players Association,
in the group of players are up in arms one
hundred times more than probably anybody else should be in
terms of or anybody else is in wondering why was
(10:01):
this hidden? Why do the owners collude? And then now
why is their executive director of other ties to other places?
I think everybody health actually probably would fall in line
with the owners not saying that players shouldn't make as
much as they want, but that do we really want
(10:22):
teams to be giving fully guaranteed contracts that could you know,
handcuff them in future years if it doesn't work out
like it did with the Cleveland Browns. And so I
think that I think that the players have every right
to be mad. I just don't know if there's going
to be enough people to support what the players did
or what the players are mad about. Considering it did
(10:44):
seem that the owners did collude, but I think that
colluding on that certain topic is probably best overall for
the league.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
Yeah, I agree with you. Again, there's a there's a
a a gray area between outright collusion, okay, and discussing
what's smart business. Right, Yes, there's a gray area, and
(11:14):
I feel like this has to have fallen into that
gray area, which is really the which is why there
was no lawsuit. So again, if I'm wrong, and if
we read the text and it's like, hey, by all means,
don't give them guaranteed contracts, suppress there. But if that
wording was in there, there would be a lawsuit. There's not,
(11:37):
you know.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Yeah, I think I also think that, and I am
not as well versed, so this is just an amateur guess,
but I would also think that the reason why the
NFLPA didn't go public with this is because they thought
maybe down the road that if he did have guaranteed contracts,
it would hurt a portion of their union, maybe not
the top end guys. And it's kind of what makes
(11:58):
the NFL it is, what makes the NF union so weak,
is that there's such a disparity between the top end
guys and everybody else.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
Yeah, they call those guys, they call everybody else the
rank and file, Yes, right, So the rank and file
needs to collect checks for as long as they can
collect checks for because their checks are not what the
quarterbacks are, the wide receivers are, the defensive ends are.
You know, the guys we talk about are the guys
they're gonna make so much money that yeah, maybe they
(12:28):
make a couple million dollars less, but it's not gonna
affect them. The guys we don't talk about the offense
of the other you know, the backup tackles, you know,
the the backup running backs, the fifth wide receiver, the
nickel corner, like those are the guys that are just
as important to the union. Any union is like that, right,
(12:50):
That's that's the part that people don't realize about unions.
Unions have to think of the rank and file first,
operating on the idea that whoever's at the very top
of the food chain, they're good. And if you're gonna
sacrifice anything, sacrifice that because it's just a numbers game, right,
This is a numbers game.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
If you're paying the top end guys, it seems like, okay, great,
but someone ends up having to take a hit on
the other end. And I believe in the most recent
CBA a lot of middle guys who could spend six
or seven years in the league are gone because it's
just easier to go with the twenty two to twenty
(13:32):
three year old rookie at that price. So I think
as the union, that would be my guess on why
it was kept quiet. And while yeah, the owners did this,
but if you started to allow guaranteed contracts for everybody,
then maybe you're pricing out a portion of your union.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Stuck out lip show here on Fox Sports, just a guess.
That's again, And my guess is that it's in that
gray area of what's good business what's not good business
for all of us. Let's look at the Deshaun Watson thing. Yeah,
as bad business, bad for business, and we probably shouldn't
(14:13):
do that again.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
I think it would have been easy for those teams,
Kyler Murray and the Cardinals, or easy for those agents
to ask for what Deshaun Watson got considering everything that,
all the baggage that came with him, and then it's
difficult to negotiate off of that. And Kyler Murray maybe
would have warranted it, maybe he would have been worthy
(14:36):
of it. And while it sucks for Kyler Murray, I
think there is a domino effect that it isn't good
for the National Football League and it isn't necessarily good
for fans. That's why I feel kind of the players
are a bit out on an island and all of
this as well, because I think parody is one of
the things that drives the NFL and now the ability
to turn things around quickly. And if you're saddled by
(14:57):
bad contracts because you have stupid owners, I don't know
if that's good for or the overall portion of the league.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Well. I also think you mentioned parody. I don't know
if it's as much about parody as much as I
do think that even though it's more perception than reality
in terms of players playing for their checks and not
being guaranteed money. Reality is NFL players are guaranteed a
substantial sum of their salary substantial sum, but the perception
(15:28):
is they're not, which I think makes them somebody that
we want to cheer for as as fans as well. Hey,
whereas NBA players they are fully guaranteed contracts, there's a
perception there of they don't have to play hard because
they're still getting paid anyway. So I do think that
(15:49):
there's some added other benefits to having the perception nodding
up with the reality in terms of guaranteed contracts.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
This is the best of the Done Dot Lead Show,
Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
What I want you to do? I got Leave Show Fox
Sports Radio. Mm hmm. I hope you're having a great
day that I got. Leap show broadcasts every day right
here on Fox Sports Radio. We have the in the
Bonus podcast which follows this show, and you can download
it and any of our podcasts on a daily basis.
(16:27):
Do do Do, Do do do do your summer plans.
Call for a new job. Want to work with an
expert your local job market, find the right role. Just
call the local express employ professionals. Go to expresspros dot
Com let her never let Express never lets job seekers
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(16:50):
Bronnie uh versus Cooper Flag. The Dodgers continue to struggle.
That's why Jasu, in his normal cheery JP Morosi is
going to join us with talk some Baseball with Jay P. Morosi.
But we do this every Thursday. Yeah, we do this
(17:10):
every Thursday. It's a way for Jay Stu to tap
into his morning FMDJ wiring. It's a way for Dan
Byer to bring up all of his immense sports knowledge,
especially around golf. And it's away for me to talk
about old movies. We call it. Don't call it throwback Thursday.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
Don't call it a throwback throw back Thursday.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Jay Stu, what was the year you, Doug.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I'll take it from here. On last Day, nine night,
I want the listeners to take themselves back to nineteen
ninety nine. I'd like each participant on this show to
think of what you were doing in the year nineteen
ninety nine, because on this day, the sports world changed forever.
We were told that it was going to change forever,
(17:59):
and in indeed, twenty six later, we are still feeling
the effects of it. Brandy Chastain knocks in a penalty kick.
US women's soccer beats China and the World Cup final
and women's soccer. In fact, women's sports changed forever. There
was so much interest, It is so profitable, it's off
(18:21):
the charts. Congratulations to Brandy Chastain for being the person
to deliver that to us. The Women's World Cup soccer
team wins on this date twenty six years ago. Dan Byro,
when you think of nineteen ninety nine, what goes through
your mind?
Speaker 3 (18:38):
You're a graduated college fellas in the spring of nineteen nineteen.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Oh wow, you're a spring chicken man.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Yes, absolutely, nineteen ninety nine. We have the Open Championship
next week. Nineteen ninety nine may have been the pinnacle
of golf. You would have a tough time arguing you
had a better golf year than nineteen nine ninety nine
that unfortunately ended in tragedy with the passing of Payne
(19:04):
Stewart in that plane crash. However, prior to that, Paine
Stewart made such great headlines with the win at the
US Open in nineteen ninety nine at Pinehurst number two,
avenging what happened the year before at the Olympic Club.
It was for Stewart his second US Open Championship and
for the runner up there was Phil Mickelson. Remember Phil
(19:26):
was ready to leave the course in case his wife
went into labor with their first child. She ended up
Amy I believe, gave birth the next day to their
first child. But so many of us remember the late
great Paint Stewart winning at Pinehurst number two. But it
was also the year that Van Derveld blew the lead
at Carnousti at the Open Championship, which I would love
(19:48):
to talk about, but time permitting, I know we can't.
Tiger got back on the major train, winning the PGA
Championship at Medina, which was kind of the arrival of
Sergio Garcia, and then the Ryder Cup nineteen ninety nine.
Ben Crenshaw, he had a feeling about that on that
Saturday night, justin Leonard's pott the whole deal as the
(20:08):
US came back and beat Europe at the country Club
of Brookline. So what a huge year for golf in
nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Nineteen ninety nine was the lockout shortened Spurs Championship run.
They beat the New York Knickerbockers after a fifty game series.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
So shouting series, you should just do something.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
Fifty game season. Sorry, fifty game season, seven game series.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Back to San Antonio with the Spurs up twenty two
to fourteen.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Shaquille O'Neal led Leaguan's scoring was the MVP twenty thirty
points a game with the Lakers. With the Lakers, and
remember that was the year that the season began with
Michael Jordan announcing he was retiring from basketball to get
(21:00):
baseball a shot. Oh no, that was that was That
was the second retirement. This is the second This is
the real retirement. Ninety eight was the Utah game winner
against Brian Russell. Ninety nine was his first year that
he didn't play before he rejoined the Wizards later on
his career.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
And of course, like that lockout. The only thing I
remember about that at lockout or that strike. Patrick Ewing
is going to be known for a lot of things.
I think he's a Hall of Famer, he's an awful
basketball coach, but he'll always, in my mind, be the
guy that was stupid enough to on in front of
reporters while they're talking about negotiations. For salaries. Say, NBA
(21:43):
players make a lot of money, but we spend a
lot of money too. I'd like to know who he
thought he was playing to on that one, who he thought, well,
he was getting the sympathy from the point ewing.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
You know what else happened in basketball? The year final four,
Saint Petersburg, Florida never went back. I remember because Ohio
State made it on the shoulders of Scoony Penn and
Michael Red. Then Scoony Penn's jersey was stolen before the
national semi final. State bad omen because they got yukonned.
And then Yukon took out Duke who everybody thought was
gonna win it. And the Duke, yes was the huskies
(22:22):
first national championship under Jim Calhoun.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
I love Duke, that's right, that's the Khalid la mein.
We shocked the world. We shocked the world.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
I remember that player wasn't he wasn't he called the chubster,
wouldn't he?
Speaker 1 (22:43):
Yep?
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Not a what of definition on that?
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Nope? But he could hoop.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
But he loved those guys. Yeah, yeah, I love chubby
guys that could play like professional athletics.
Speaker 5 (22:54):
Bartolo Cologne if you want to feel old. Nineteen ninety
nine was Kirk Arents his first year at IOWA, and
he's still there.
Speaker 2 (23:02):
I love it. It's a really good thank you.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
He's the number one earning movie that year.
Speaker 5 (23:12):
Come on, come on, of college football coaches. Yeah, let's
go to movies.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Let's go to movies.
Speaker 1 (23:17):
Well, nineteen nine nine was also the year that Bob
Stoops was hired, wasn't it?
Speaker 3 (23:22):
And then I think they were a kind of all
in that same group.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
And then two thousand and one the National championship. So uh,
nineteen nine nine movies Star Wars Episode one, The Phantom Menace,
despite the fact that had Jar Jar Binks and a
bunch of CGI, it made four hundred and thirty million
dollars ross. Number two was the sixth sense I see
(23:45):
that people. Number three was Austin Powers, the spy who
shagged me. Yeah, baby, Yeah. Number four was Toy Story two,
Great Flake, great flick. Toy Story two was that was
not lots of hugging bear. That was Toy Story three,
and number five was yeah maybe the matrix was five.
(24:08):
The matrix.
Speaker 5 (24:09):
The matrix the best stat of all those.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
Listen. I think the matrix came out in ninety eight,
right that it being five.
Speaker 5 (24:16):
Was like the un in the second year.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
The uh Christina's Teenager, my super hot girlfriend, Christina's teenager,
we were able to want to let him watch uh
the was it sixth Sense? For the first time. I
got a person's like unfiltered first time reaction to the
end of a sixth Sense. Which it's an amazing movie,
(24:43):
but it's not a great rewatch because the greatest part
of the movie is the reveal at the end, and
I got to watch him react to it, and that
was wonderful. It makes sense that the episode one of
Star Wars was the largest grossing despite all of its
uh all of itations, because everyone didn't know the limitations
(25:03):
when they paid to see it.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
Yeah, which just I'm sure the DVD sales are still big, right,
but yes, jar Jar Binks threatened to cancel the entire series,
only was unable to to do that.
Speaker 5 (25:19):
I remember being very, very excited for The Phantom Menace
and I remember being like, I liked it, but it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (25:28):
It didn't blow me away.
Speaker 5 (25:29):
I think maybe it was before that or a few
years after that did they did the original three re
releases where like they buffed up the graphics and added
like some new scenes.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
I just watched a New Hope the other day with
those those kind of modern or more recent graphics, and
it's cringey.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
You prefer like the old old, Like you can see
the lines passing through stuff. Joba the Hut is in
a scene and he steps over in and it's laughable.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
It's very blurry. He goes on on my bookie, had
my bookie. Yeah, it's kind of weird. So as as
George Lucas was making an episode one and releasing it,
I saw him do an interview with sixty Minutes and
they said, what are you listening to nowadays? Like, what's
what's on your discmand surprise to hear the answer. It
(26:21):
went in something like this, Wow, George Lucas, this is
Britney Spears her first hit, hit Me Baby, and it
launched a career that still goes today. I think she's
(26:42):
still doing a Vegas residency. But the I guess the
the singer songwriter that will always kind of match with
Britney Spears did this song the same year. Yeah, yeah,
(27:05):
get it now. I was a Christina guy over Brittany. Interesting.
Speaker 5 (27:10):
Yeah, she was way more talented Damns. Yes, Danby's are
kind of resident nineties pop expert on the show. Yes,
when you look back twenty six years of what has
happened to each of these artists, how do you kind
of summarize things? Who came out ahead, what impact?
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Well, I will say at the time, like there was
as far as great as Christina Aguilera was at the time,
nothing was bigger than Britney Spears and that song and
what it what it did. Ultimately, I would say, because
of the tough road that Britney drove for the last
what ten fifteen years whatever it's been, Christina actually would
(27:51):
probably come out. But I just I don't think that
there was ever a point where Christina Aguilera was bigger
than Britney Spears was at that point.
Speaker 5 (27:57):
So it was Britney Spears, Coke, and Christina Laria was
like Arci Cola.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
I would say that that, Well, it's funny because Britney
was a Pepsi sponsor. But but if you wanted to
say that Coke was number one, I think it's very
fair to say that Christine the Aguilera was number two.
Then you have Jessica Simpson, others, Mandy Moore came along
at that time. She's now an actress. But yeah, yes,
Chris good parenthood.
Speaker 5 (28:21):
She's been on the Voice. Christina Aguilera, she was on
the Voice, and yeah, she had some great pipes, just great.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
She did really good. Really really can say so.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
She could really sing. Uh Where's We kind of talked
about this when I hosted Coward yesterday, which is like
the Cantlin Clark is she best played in the w NBA. No,
but she's the most popular player in the w n
B A right, Christina Aguila is a better singer, better
singer than Britney Spears, not close, but Britney Spears was
(28:51):
more popular.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
What you're saying is Christina Aguilera is the Brianna Stewart
to uh Hatel and Car.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Yeah, I would say she's the Page Beckers maybe or
the Sabrinette Escu. Yeah, that's fair because Brianna Stewart is
an earlier generation, so she'd be more Not Madonna's not
that that's like Cynthia Cooper's like Madonna, right, but nobody
(29:18):
actually cared, so not really Madonna.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
How about this? Yeah, how about taking a twelve year
old that loves the NFL right now, sitting them down
and saying, you know, in nineteen ninety nine, that was
the era when the Jaguars and Titans ruled the NFL,
because it was at that time, at least in the
AFC the Jaguars fourteen and two, Titans thirteen and three.
(29:42):
You would also say to that twelve year old, can
you believe the Dolphins actually made the playoffs that year
and they won a game and they beat the Seahawks,
because that also happened in the nineteen ninety nine NFL season.
It was Dan Marino's last victory as a quarterback, Doug,
you talk about the loss that the it took the
next week against the Jaguars, but Marino and the Dolphins
(30:03):
went to Seattle topped the Seahawks in an AFC wild
card matchup, but the Seahawks won the AFC West that year.
Jacksonville and Tennessee were tops in the AFC, but they
were both in the AFC Central. The Colts were the
division winner in the AFC East at thirteen and three.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
Peyton Mann in second year.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Yes, first first year won three, second year lost three.
Speaker 5 (30:26):
He finally got some traction.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
You know, well, they drafted Edgrin James. That was a
big help and Marvin Edge.
Speaker 5 (30:35):
How long was Dan Marino was in the NFL? From
what eighty three to ninety nine? He was in the NFL?
Long time? Yes, yes, was it eighty three?
Speaker 1 (30:43):
In fact a long time, not Brady long time.
Speaker 5 (30:46):
But it feels like a lot, like I don't know,
to go from the early eighties to the late night
for some reason, that just feels like a long time.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
That that was the famous eighty three draft class, you.
Speaker 5 (30:54):
Know, seven sixteen seventeen year career.
Speaker 2 (30:56):
That's you know, have.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
Brought up the Music City miracle, but that had up
in January eighth, two thousand. Not apropos for this segment.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
Rob Johnson was the quarterback of the Bills.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yes, Rob Johnson, I think I've told this story. He
lives in South Orange County. Dude is the most ripped
human being I've ever seen. Like it's clean, does hot yoga,
shows off, embarrasses all of us. He's Rob Luke. You
know Rob is in good shape.
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Pause, No it's.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Not pause No, it's no. Yeah, he's just giving a compliment.
That's no way you would say. No, Jase, do you
say it? No?
Speaker 5 (31:42):
Yeah, we get it.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
No, No, home. Dan agrees with me on this one
pause pause me.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Well, you guys are two of the more hip guys ever,
so you can definitely tell what what I did. Well,
he threw you in there pause and no, h O
m O are not the same thing.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
All right, Let's go back to Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera.
I was always more of a Gimmy gimme moore fan
for Brittany and let's get dirty for Christina Aguilar's dirty
is great?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Ever really a fan of either give Me, give Me More?
Speaker 5 (32:13):
That's an underrated song.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Yeah, we forgot about baseball, but that's because the Yankees
beat everybody except they swept the Rangers, beat the Red
Sox in five games, and then beat the Braves.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
Is that the World Series?
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Was that the first World Series for teater No.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Ninety six, ninety eight, ninety nine, two thousand.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
My bad? There was that Maria Rivera's first first because
they had Wetland.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
Rivera was a setup man for wet one and six.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
And then in ninety.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
Nine MVP There You Go series MVP.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Fox Sports
Radio Dot com and within the iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1 (32:59):
App, Doug otlib Show, Fox Sports Radio m John Metalcalffill
join us after we get an update from Dan Byer.
Coach Prime's making some waves and Dion's an interesting one man.
Like as much as I think everybody would expect him
(33:23):
to be, Hey, pay the players as much as they
can actually make. Uh, and then some just money, money, money, money, money.
The fact is, if you actually listen to many of
the things he says, whether they apply to Colorado or not,
it's about what we college coaches call the right things.
You know, guys have to earn things. Guys should stay
at their schools, a degree has a value to them,
(33:45):
and yeah, they should make some money. But like, let's
not go crazy here. A lot of these guys are
getting paid for something we hope they can do and
it's not true. Nil. Here's Dion talking about nil in
college football.
Speaker 6 (34:00):
I wish it was a cap, you know, like the
top of the line player makes this, and if you're
not that type of guy, you know you're not gonna
make that.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
That's what the NFL does.
Speaker 6 (34:08):
So the problem is you got a guy that's not
that durn good, but he could go to another school
and they give him a half a million dollars and
you can't you can't compete with that. That don't make sense. Say,
all you have to do is look at the playoffs
and see what those teams spent. And you understand, during
the white end the playoffs, it's kind of hard to
compete with somebody who's giving twenty five thirty million dollars
of during freshman class. Right, It's crazy. The teams that
(34:33):
pays the more, pays the most is gonna be then it.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
I mean, he's right, you know, it's like, well, no, no,
he's right. I mean even Indiana, who I didn't think
should have been in the collegeball playoff, they spent a
ton of money in order to get there in terms
of their personnel. The new agreement is supposed to have
a cap on spending twenty two million dollar and you know,
(35:01):
I think thirteen of its supposed to go to college
to football. But you can also add in nil, which
is sometimes real sometimes not anil. In college basketball, I
got all but three picks right, and I picked every
game based upon who's spent the most money. That's it.
So it is really the haves and the have nots.
(35:23):
And the part he didn't discuss is that the other
real world discussion that isn't at is, Hey, you do
realize that a lot of schools were going to lose
some Olympic sports because if you want to compete in
the revenue generating sports, that money is not You're not
making tons of profit at MAX schools, not making tons
(35:46):
of profit at all these other schools of football. You're
not making a huge money if you don't have football,
you're still trying to pay to play in basketball, women's basketball,
and potentially football. That means you're not going to be
able to fully fund properly Olympic sports. But he's just
talking about competitive balance, says it's lacking because there's no cap.
(36:07):
John Mitlcoff joints just three and outs to the podcast.
He spent some time in Fresno State in college football
before moving on to the NFL, before moving on to
becoming a star podcaster. What do you think of what
Dion said?
Speaker 7 (36:18):
Well? I followed that a lot of the comments pretty closely.
Kenny Dillingham had some too. You know Texas Tech and
you know you're a got some big twelve roots. They
have that oil guy that's former players. They have spent
big time money, and Dillingham was saying yesterday like, guys,
be ready, this team is gonna be really, really good.
(36:39):
And essentially what he's saying is like they broke the
bank this offseason when it came to football. They had
arguably the best transfer portal class. You know, you're in
it now, and I know it's different than like you know,
Ohio State, Michigan and Alabama like recruiting and stuff football wise,
but whenever I see like this guy's a great recruiter,
I think that used to really matter, like ed Ojeron
(37:02):
or Tosh or some of these guys in football, especially
like when I was in high school or in college
in the two thousands, There is no such thing as
a great recruiter anymore. Like are you paying the most money?
And like you said, even when the cap comes, like
in the NFL, if I'm giving whoever an extension TJ.
Watt or Travis Kelcey or obviously the quarterbacks, the whatever
(37:24):
they're going to make State Farm or Chevy, that has
nothing to do with anything with the team. Where if
Kirby Smart goes, well, hey what even once this gap comes,
I can pay you let's just take a number five
hundred thousand dollars with the cap, but I can also
get you half a million dollars in nil, Like he's
part of that. Like the other schools don't have that
(37:45):
capabilia Ohio State. I mean, there's a group of fifteen
twenty that it's only going to continue to separate. Now,
you could argue, you know, in college football, college basketball
could be a little random, right because of the tournament.
Where in football, on the aggregate of the season, typically
the same teams year and year out, give or take,
are competing, that that's only going to continue to separate.
(38:08):
But now it's so conference aligned because of the SEC
money and the Big ten TV money, the advantages they have,
They've always had advantages. Now it's only separated. Why Texas
Tech can even you know, dream of competing is because
they have I don't know their version. It's not quite
it's not apples apples, but like a Phil Knight or
(38:28):
you at Oklahoma State, like you have to have a
special individual with huge money to even be in the
conversation or else you really got no shot.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
I completely agree. And recruiting, recruiting does matter. Recruiting does matter. Okay,
you still have to connect with the kid. You have
to paint for them a vision. You're not always they're
not always going not all of them go to where
the top dollar is. You know. I think again, high
level football, I major ball, High major basketball a little
(39:01):
different than what we're doing. But you still are recruiting,
and some of it is you got to recruit at
our level, Recruit guys you're not gonna get, you know, Like,
I'll just be honest with you, John, I'm recruiting the
top twenty kids the class of twenty twenty six in
the state of Wisconsin. I'm recruiting all twenty top the
(39:23):
ones I've evaluated is the top twenty. I'm recruiting all
of them. There's only one that I've offered a scholarship to,
and I think he's a little bit above our level,
but I think this would be a level where he
can come in and play initially. And then I'm only
going to say I told him. I gave him till
the end of the July cycle. We offered him like
almost a year ago, and then after that, and now
I'll start offering because he's the guy I want to
(39:43):
build around. Like the recruiting class anyway. Point is, I
know I'm not gonna get all of them. I'm not
going to offer all of them, but I want them
to get to know me, and I want to get
to know them that way in a year, in two years,
in three years, when they hit the transfer portal, which
many of the high percentage of are, then there's already
a relationship there, and I already know if I want him,
(40:04):
if I don't want him, he already knows if he
likes me or doesn't like me. So it does.
Speaker 7 (40:08):
And that was a big advantage for UCLA a couple
of years ago when Chip the two years ago they
had a really solid defense. A lot of those guys
had transferred. They were from la you know, from Michigan
or whatever. It came home. So I totally understand what
you're talking. That's where you're right recruiting. But that's different, right,
You're like recruiting for their second recruiting cycle. You know,
(40:29):
it's just a different world.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's a it's a totally different world. Let's get to
some of Let's get to the the collusion thing. Okay,
we don't know the details of it, and I do
know that because you got Florio, who is a lawyer. Uh,
and you have Pablo, who is you know, a Harvard dude,
brilliant like a lawyer that you know there's something there,
(40:56):
But there's a there's a fine line between hey, hey,
this is not good business to give to Shaun Watson
a five year guaranteed contract in this sport especially and
outright collusion, which is suppressing wages and elimiting the guarantees.
What do you think really happened between the union and
the owners after Deshaun Watson signed his deal?
Speaker 7 (41:19):
Yeah, I mean to me, I read a couple of headlines.
I'm like, I don't really see anyone. To me, collusion
typically is someone getting royally screwed, and I didn't really
see anyone getting royally screwed here. The other thing is
like Tyler Murray, well, you know, one of those texts
was like a good job, Michael on signing that deal. Well,
Kyler didn't have to sign the deal, right, no one
(41:39):
was forcing him. It was after his third year. He
could have played it out again, like no one's forcing
any of these people to sign deals. And the other thing,
when it comes, you know, specifically out of the conversation,
was around the quarterbacks. How often new quarterbacks not see
like the majority of their contract. It's it's very very rare.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
That, you know.
Speaker 7 (41:56):
Russell Wilson is an example of like got cut way short.
Now guaranteed money was so high. He still got a
ton of money, But like did Tyler get screwed? Last
time I checked, He's made like a couple hundred million
dollars the last three four years. So it's like, I
see everyone getting rich in this business model, and you've
been through way more negotiations in your life than me.
(42:16):
I mean, isn't when I read some of these conversations,
Like my first talk was, you know, my dad was
a farmer for a long time. Dealt with banks is
not just called business like I mean, I just it'd
be one thing if the wages or something hadn't gone
dramatically up. But from my advantage point, it feels like
(42:37):
everyone I would say that there's not a business in
the history of America that's created more millionaires when coaches, players, obviously, owners,
people involved, help people on the outside, media members when
it comes to football, and business continues to just roll.
So I to me, it was it was more of like, yeah,
(42:57):
this is means nothing. I didn't do anything for me.
But again, I'm not those stories.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
I I I totally, I totally agree that it's like
we're chasing something like, oh, yeah, they're the bad guys.
Like yeah, I again, if you remember when Kyler Murray
signed the new deal, you know it was after Kyler
Murray had been accused of playing call of duty too much? Right,
is this a guy we really want? And oh yeah?
But it was also if you remember coming off an
(43:25):
injury too, an't he Uh.
Speaker 7 (43:28):
No, I think he got injured the next year or
maybe he did. I can't even remember, but it was
after a third year, like the first time you can
negotiate with a with the with the first rounders. Yeah,
and like they didn't have to do that like other quarterbacks.
Hel Lamar didn't get a contract then. But the other
thing is we actually kind of murder was the number
one overall pick. He had already signed like a forty
(43:48):
million dollar contract, then he got another two hundred plus
million dollar contract. I just don't think anyone on the outside,
mainly the consumer who usually drives a lot of these,
like if they're all into this, it's like, well, who's
who's really getting screwed here, and I think most of
us come to the conclusion that nobody really yeah.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Yeah, it is the Doug Outlive Show, it is Fox
Sports Radio, Dallas Cowboys, Michaeh Parsons. You know it does
feel like you know he's playing on the fifth year option.
What I mean, we all it's funny. Most people think
he'll be a free agent at the end of the year.
He won't. They can franchise tag him. Jerry, of course,
(44:27):
could have signed him last offseason, did not. Says he'd
rather wait and pay more than pay too much to
a guy he doesn't want. Where do you think we
are with Parsons and the Cowboys?
Speaker 7 (44:40):
To me, that's super far about waiting and to pay more.
It's like seedy Lamb and Michael Parsons. Jerry, where your
draft picks. You've been around these guys every day for
whatever five years. I mean, what's for you waiting? You've
seen them their entire career on and off the field.
You've been around them all the time. So it's like
kind of know what he is. I mean, Micah is
like thread making the bank for one of them over
(45:01):
with you. We would trade him like the TJ Watt
hendrickson those older players, that's just like complicated negotiation business.
The micro thing is pretty simple, Like the number is
kind of his number, you know, give or take. Maybe
a couple million you can argue over. But like, why
you know Micah Parson's gonna show up for training camp.
(45:21):
I know he played good copter and the off season,
the spring ball, but recent history would say, guys in
his shoes, you know, kind of make it difficult, you know,
Nick Bosa, We've just seen other guys. Now we see
a lot of teams just sign the contract. I would say,
give or take sometime between you know, post draft to
(45:44):
right around the next couple of weeks so they don't
have to deal with this drama. I think Jerry has
a pretty clear history of like I'm just gonna sign
him like August twenty eight, you know, last possible second.
So that would be my expectation.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Yeah, that's what he does, and it ends up give
than the guys a chance to take some time off
of training camp.
Speaker 7 (46:03):
I think I think the TJ. Watt things a little
more complicated. You know, these older guys, they have a
lot of wear and hair on them, but they're really
important and excellent players, Henderson TJ. Watt. You know, it's
in fairness to them. It's like they see the amount
of money other their quote unquote peers are getting and
it's like, well, if I were to shattered my leg,
(46:24):
and these negotiations are hard, Like I understand both sides,
and I don't think there's an easy answer to it.
It's like if you just break here TJ. Watt, here's
another one hundred million dollars guaranteed, or we just kind
of play, you know, a staring contest, you know, because
I think Steelers probably all have to give him, like
a fifty million dollar a little bonus he probably wants,
(46:45):
like what Max Crosby and Miles Garrett just got. But
the problem is he goes, I know you need me
because you guys are all in on this season. That
situation just feels a little just weird, you know what
I mean. The Steelers have always felt a little even
when they quote unquote not been at the same level
last four or five years, like he kind of had
an idea. But now these last couple of years bringing
in Russell Wilson, this situation feet a little of Steeler
(47:08):
like for the first time of the Talblin era.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
I totally agree. What do you make of Kirk Cousins, Like, yeah, hey,
if I know they're going to drive the quarterback, I
would have stayed in Minnesota.
Speaker 7 (47:20):
I think the easy person to say that, Remember it
was again, I think we're playing like Monday Morning quarterback
of what really could have happened here because I think
Kevin O'Connell liked him, wanted them, but I think the
organization was kind of ready to move on.
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Remember he had he had a torn achilles tendon, right,
and yes, yes they offered him a deal, but it
wasn't close to the deal that Atlanta offered him.
Speaker 7 (47:45):
Right, And it wasn't. Wasn't it more like, I mean
a one yearish like forty fifty You know, they gave
him essentially ninety million dollars. Yeah, I guarantee I think
anyone was even coming close to that, even if you
take away minnesot To, I don't think he had that
many options. Yeah, so I think it's easy for him
to say, I don't waive them. They offered him ninety million. Honestly,
(48:08):
it's a reflection of the organization when they gave him
that money. They didn't realize because they had new coaching staff,
they hadn't fallen in love with Michael Pennix. So they
signed them in the middle of March, and then they
start doing their private workouts meeting with Penix, and they
fall in love with the guy. So, if anything, is
more of a reflection of the herky jerky nature of
the Atlanta for An office because they knew they were
(48:31):
drafting Pennix. Let's let's be real, they would have given
like ten million dollars to UH for like a flat
okase keenum. I got just a high level back up,
impressive guy that got to help the young guy, and
it'll probably even end up being the backup.
Speaker 1 (48:44):
What we want, which by which, by the which, by
the way, is what the Vikings did, right, exactly the Vikings.
The Vikings went and they're like, hey, we're gonna go
cheap and we're gonna draft a guy, which is what
the Vikings would do. The other part to it is this,
and I was thinking about this that Cousins complained about this.
Kirk Cousins has mastered the business side of this thing,
(49:04):
the business right, So forgive the Falcons for treating it
like it's a business right, like he wants all kinds
of feelings like old on, dude, you know you were
all about business, three year guaranteed contract when you're with
the Vikings. Then they re up to you, Hey, it's business,
it's not personal. And then you go to Atlanta because
(49:25):
of business. Then they treat you like it's business, and
now you're bothered because it's not personal.
Speaker 7 (49:30):
I also think anyone in Cousin Hughes torn Achilles, regardless
of that, he'd already made like whatever, two hundred and
eighty three hundred million dollars in issues torn Achilles. Older player,
this team that's kind of desperate, but they kind of
got some interesting weapons. They got like a Shanahan disciple
McVeigh disciple running the offense, so you know what you're doing.
It was actually made kind of sense, Like I don't
(49:52):
blame him for taking the contract, but like all of
a sudden, they you know, like they got married and
then a month and they're like, we're in an open relationship.
He's like, what did I sign up for? But at
the time, it's like you were in love, so it's
I think it's easy. He was rattled by it. But
this is also what happens when you bounce around teams,
you know, the the equity just falls off a clip.
(50:13):
I mean Peyton Manning was now granted his arm wasn't
really working. John Alway called him into his office and said, like, hey,
Peyton were giving me a backup for a minute. Remember
that like this football, I mean, it's kind of cut
throat at times. And I think Cousins for the first
time truly in his career where he was like the
starter got I guess, a little bit of a humble pie.
(50:33):
But if you were giving me ninety million dollars, like
I don't know, I'd figure out a way to get
around it, figure it out. O.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
I agree. He's John Middlecoff three. Now it's the podcast.
He's the host of the volume podcast That Work. Johnny,
have a great weekend. Thanks for joining us, Bud
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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