August 3, 2024 • 38 mins
John dives into the conversation surrounding Patrick Mahomes and his current contract with Kansas City after seeing other QB's sign contracts with a higher annual total (6:42). Later, John gives you his top 5 NFL venues (19:53), and lastly the 2023 trade that the Chicago Bears made with the Panthers and how it's been the gift that keeps on giving for the Bear and he gives his thoughts on if Ryan Poles should be getting an extension based on this trade alone (33:14).
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (01:59):
What is happening in everybody? Happy weekend? It's John your
buddy and this three and out and a little thing
we like to do the best of the week. And
we had a fun week. Training camp is often running.
Everyone is in pads. We even had a game that
was delayed because of crazy weather. I guess that's what
(02:22):
happens in Ohio in the early August. But we had
a lot going on this week because we had new
contracts with quarterbacks, and I dove into Mahomes contract and
he was asked about being underpaid. Turns out he makes
more money than anyone when it comes to actual money,
So we'll talk about that. I picked my top five
(02:44):
NFL venues, top five NFL atmospheres. Had some tough omissions,
but pretty fired up about my list and Ryan Poles.
When you really take a deep dive into the trade
that exchanged Bryce young number one pick last year for
what the Bears received and actually still get to receive
(03:07):
even in twenty twenty five, I do think it has
a chance to be the greatest trade of all time.
Long way to go on paper. Right now, with how
many starters they've got, it's already an elite trade, but
I believe it easily could be one of the best
trades in the history of sports. And I'll tell you why. But,
like I said, best of the week and let's dive
(03:28):
into it. But before we dive into football, you know,
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Last minute ticket's lowest price is guaranteed. I've told this
story before, but I'll talk about it a little bit
again because I think it applies to mahomes and when
I left Philadelphia in twenty twelve to move back to
(04:56):
the West Coast to do college scouting, because Daniel jerrem Maya,
who was obviously on NFL Network, and the lead draft
guy took over for Mayok When he took over the
Raiders GM job worked for the Eagles. That's how I
first met him, and when he got hired with the
NFL Network, I essentially begged for the West Coast job.
(05:17):
I wanted to get back back West, and luckily most
people in the building who had longer ten years than
me were West Coast people, and that obviously worked as
an advantage plush. I was relatively cheap labor, and when I
got back, I had to live somewhere, and at the time,
most of my friends, a lot of people I went
to college with, were all living in San Francisco. It
(05:39):
was booming because all the sales jobs with all the
tech companies like Oracle and Facebook and Apple and Google
and you name it. And it was much easier to
get a job in the city that did not exist
three or four years previously. So it was a lot
of fun, and I wanted to move to San Francisco.
(06:00):
Bluddy of mine, through a family friend, had just bought
a place and I moved in with him. And this
guy played baseball in college for an Ivy League school
and was really really smart and went to work in
finance and started making big cash very early in his
like right after he graduated college, Ivy League, elite, just
(06:23):
a dude's dude and brilliant. And when I moved in
with him, he was changing jobs and he was going
to work for a different firm like VC. I don't
know the exact like the way you would describe his industry,
but it was moving and shaken with cash investing in shit.
And one thing he was big on is he fought
for a title. He wanted to be like a vice
(06:46):
president at this firm, and that was a big deal
to him. And then like six months later, when the
bonuses came out, he's like, I kind of got screwed.
I didn't realize when I fought for this title. You know,
in my previous jobs, I saw these vps making big
money and I didn't put enough emphasis on it. And
he's like, the reality I learned is a title and
(07:09):
words shaking hands to create a deal are completely meaningless.
I would rather have been called an intern and doubled
the bonus. And I think you see that a lot
with these quarterback contracts, All these things are flying, all
these numbers are flying, and they're really hollow. How many
people listening to this right now that work in any industry,
(07:31):
that know, if you're trying to land a deal, If
you're working on a deal, words are pretty meaningless. Until
something is written on a contract and both sides have signed,
nothing really matters. And I think you see with these
quarterback contracts, these huge numbers, and I've been saying forever,
nothing is more meaningless than average per year. You know
(07:54):
who is obsessed with average per year? The agent? Why
makes them look good? And I don't blame them, That's
their job. The better they look, the more clients they get,
the longer their book of players grows, and the more
money they're firm and they make individually, that is their job.
But in terms of teams, the general manager, the head coach,
(08:16):
and most importantly the contract negotiator and the owner, what
are they obsessed with? Cash flow? How much do we
actually have to pay this player? Like I said, Jordan
Love in his contract is making seventy five million dollars
before Christmas, he gets a twenty five million dollar payment.
Now he gets another one in October, and he gets
(08:39):
another one the second week of December, So we get
seventy five million dollars before the end of this calendar year.
That's money now, and anyone knows money now is more
valuable than money in two years. Hell, we've just seen
the last three or four years historic amount of inflation.
You know, you always want more money upfront. But Patrick
(09:01):
Mahomes was asked recently about the contract he signed, and
a lot of people when he originally signed it thought
he was crazy because he signed a ten year contract.
People like, no one does that because you want the
ability to rehit free agency. And he just said, listen,
I'm happy for all the other guys. I feel very comfortable.
This is not verbatim what he said, but just kind
(09:23):
of giving you the cliffs of the version. I feel
very comfortable with where we're at. We've made some adjustments
to it, and I also feel very comfortable with the
group that I work with, meaning Andy and Brett Veach.
And let's face it, most players and most agents are
just using these teams, and rightfully so, to just get
as much money as humanly possible. They don't really trust
(09:46):
the GM or the owner. But Patrick Mahomes has learned
and like any human being, obviously most of us our
numbers aren't forty five or fifty or fifty five million
dollars a year. But if you get into business with people,
and the older you get, the more experience you have.
You've been in business with people you don't really trust,
you don't feel that comfortable with, You're not, you know,
(10:09):
dead set on buying into the future with these people.
And then sometimes you get in bed with people you
trust just unequivocally, like you don't even hesitate to go, Yeah,
what do you need? I'm in? What can I do?
And it's less about the money and more about the
belief and big picture of where we're gonna go because
(10:31):
this is gonna work. And when you trust and believe
in people, it's easier to make more money over the
long term. Now, Patrick Mahomes, don't get it twisted. He
will make and I heard Mike Florio say this between
twenty twenty three, so last season through twenty twenty six
more actual cash than any player who's under contract right now,
(10:54):
and that includes all the new contract sign He will
make two hundred and fifteen million dollars over the next
four years. The only guy who's remotely close to him
is Joe Burrow. Who's a couple million dollars less. That's
actual money, not fake numbers on a contract, not numbers
that can change if you have a catastrophic injury. That's
(11:15):
real cash flow. And listen, that's never how these contracts
are going to be reported. And unless you dive deep
and are obsessed with this type stuff, you could argue
it's kind of irrelevant how much cash these guys, whether
they get thirty million this year or forty six million
dollars this year. But when it comes to the best
(11:37):
player in the league, and let's face it, the most
important player currently in the NFL, Patrick Mahomes, he's the
highest paid guy in the league when it comes to
actual dollars. Right, So you can have all these fake numbers,
you can say this contract's bigger than that. Tua got
more guaranteed money on paper than Patrick Mahomes, None of
that means anything when one guy actually gets more cash.
(12:00):
And I think one thing Patrick Mahomes learned that only
a small percentage of players ever get to go through
is he learns that I should trust Andy Reid and
Brett Veach with everything because the more I win, the
more money I will make. The rest of my life,
like Joe Montana in twenty twenty four, is still really valuable.
(12:22):
Tom Brady, before he retired, signed a three hundred and
seventy five million dollar contract with Fox to broadcast games.
No one even knew if he could do it, and
they almost gave him four hundred million dollars. Why because
he's widely considered the greatest player in the history of
the sport and he has six seven Super Bowls? Would
(12:44):
he have signed that contract if he had two Super Bowls? No,
he would not have because that number wouldn't have been
that high. And I remember talking to a player who's
gonna be in the Hall of Fame one day, and
he was part of the negotiations for one of the
cbas and he's like, I don't think most people understand
we don't make that much money in the playoffs. And
that's true. If you make ten, fifteen, twenty thirty million
(13:08):
dollars during the regular season. Once you get to the playoffs,
it's slotted by round, meaning if you're the star pass
rusher or the star quarterback or the star wide receiver,
you make the same as the fifty second guy on
the roster, and it goes up by the round. But
you do realize when you win in the playoffs, like
Mahomes and Kelsey have done, like Peyton Manning has done,
(13:29):
winning Super Bowls, like Eli did winning a couple of
Super Bowls. Obviously Tom is the best example, and now
Patrick Mahomes is doing it. Gives you value in perpetuity.
You are always valuable from a marketing standpoint, and that's
what Patrick Mahomes has with the Kansay Chiefs. So if
on paper he looks like he's making a little less,
(13:49):
if people talk about why his contract, he doesn't give
a shit because he knows two things. One the most
important thing the actual money coming into his bank account.
And two he works with the best in the business.
Where if you were a player on just a random team,
even if you liked the coach and liked the GM, like,
why would you ever quote unquote take a discount or
(14:12):
quote unquote not fight for every penny you know, at
any moment, those guys could be fired at any moment,
they could try to replace you. Happens all the time,
literally with every team, and Patrick Mahoonmes has seen first hand.
One they'll invest in the team when a guy gets
really good right, like Chris Jones, they ended up taking
care of him, and when they have to make a
(14:34):
big picture, risky move, they've proven that they can make
it work. Tom experienced this for twenty years of Bill Belichick. Listen.
It was some of the things he did when the
news broke, You're like, Bill is nuts. And then it
tended to work out and they tended to always be
in the AFC Championship Game or the super Bowl, and
Tom obviously was a huge part of that and then
(14:57):
benefited and continues to benefit because of the success they had.
So I think one life lesson I've taken forever is
until it's on paper, nothing matters in titles, you know,
and you know the perception of something can be a
little overrated. You can call me an intern all day long.
(15:18):
If you're paying me ten million dollars, who cares.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
The NFL seasons right around the corner. Will be breaking
down all the off season storylines on the Colin Cowherd podcast,
my best takes guests like my buddy Nick Wright. Check
out the Colin Coward podcast, part of the Volume Network,
available on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Okay, Top five NFL venues. I'm fascinated by this because
I think college the NFL gets a bad rap of
the atmospheres aren't that great relative to Saturdays. And it's
true because there's nothing like LSU at night. There's nothing
like Penn State at night. There's nothing like one hundred
and ten thousand people at Michigan, you know, when Bama's
(16:14):
rocking Texas and Oklahoma Oregon at Autsam Stadium, like the
NFL doesn't have that. It's a communal experience. But I've
been to a lot of NFL games. They're fun, but
some are better than others. And when you look at
the top venues like Sofi Stadium, I've never been to
a stadium even remotely close to that, And I've been
(16:37):
to Dallas that was always kind of the cream day
ly krem but I think so Fi is laughed it. Obviously,
it's branded. It's just it's spectacular when you're inside. But
it's no one would ever say like God, LSU at night,
Sofi Stadium at night. Clearly you're not saying that the
(16:57):
Vegas Stadium awesome, bunch of random people flying in all
over the place. But the NFL does have some sweet atmospheres.
So I just ranked my top five NFL atmospheres and
I left a couple out part of it as this
team sucked for a while. But I think Denver historically
has been pretty sweet, mile High great football town. Seattle
(17:18):
had a stretch there with the Twelves which was as
good as it gets. I remember the Saints played a
Monday night game there and like Drew Brees couldn't even hear,
couldn't even function, and the Saints, I think they got
beat pretty bad. This might have been late in Breeze's tenure,
might have been like fifteen sixteen range, But I think
(17:40):
Seattle's come back to earth a little bit. That the
game two years ago with Russell coming back with Denver
was pretty awesome. But if they ever got good again,
that place is gonna rock start again. Five. I remember
watching the game there last year when the Niners played them,
and thinking there is something special. And I've talked about
this before, or like the Coliseum where the Raiders used
(18:02):
to play in Oakland, Candlestick just these old decrepit stadiums
that are just kind of football and when you go there,
it's really just about drinking beer, getting loud. Maybe eating
some crappy hot dog. But it's about football and football only,
and I think Cleveland still kind of has that, and
(18:23):
part of the reason I put them. They're good now.
The team's competitive, but there's nothing like hearing the fans
hit like the I don't even know if it's ten
or something, but it echoes throughout that place. Week one
against the Cowboys is gonna be nuts. I was listening
to Rabel who was on with the part of My
(18:43):
Take Guys, and he said his dad took him to
a game in the dog Pound. I don't know when
he was like junior high, and he was like, that's
the first time I'd ever seen weed and people just
getting blasted. And there's just something special about football in Ohio.
That stadium not great. They're clearly probably gonna build a
(19:06):
new one. I saw Andrew Berry wants to build a dome.
I got to push back on that one. I understand
why he would, analytical guy numbers geek, you can control
a lot better if there's a dome. When I think Cleveland,
when I think Baltimore, when I think Cincinnati, like Kansas,
I think outdoor cold. I hope if they ever do it,
(19:29):
they do not do a dome, but who knows. So
I go Cleveland at five. This is my only new stadium,
but I think this place the best opening in the
NFL is when everyone's doing skull, that place freaking rocks
and that stadium. I've never been there, but it looks
(19:52):
awesome on television. It pops on TV day or night.
And my buddies that works for the Eagle that went
there with the Super Bowl said the place is a
badass that atmosphere in Minnesota, and it's always been good.
But I think for a newer stadium that can't be
cheap to go do is just it's pretty sweet. It
(20:13):
has like a big ten vibe to it, like it
has a collegiate vibe to it. And I think a
lot of times you've seen it with Vegas, You've seen
it with the Niners, You've seen it with so Far,
seen it with the Cowboys. You kind of lose that
with the glitz and the glamour, which is understandable because
you price out the die hard guy that's really gonna yell.
I got news for you. When I go to a
(20:34):
game and I pay a lot of money for tickets,
like I'm not standing up all the time. I'm just
kind of sit there and enjoying it and listen. I'm
not proud to say that, but there is something about
people that used to be able to afford pretty good seats.
It just makes the place louder. The faster you get
to a wine and cheese crowd, the less likely you
(20:56):
are to have a crazy atmosphere. It's why these top
three stadium atmospheres all have something in common. They feel
old school. And number three is the Bills. I think
the Bills Mafia, the games in November, December and January,
the Snow Games. It just feels pretty special. It feels
like something that in ten years as all these places
(21:19):
have new stadiums, including the Bills with club seeds with boxes.
And I'm not saying this place. I went there once.
The team was pretty crappy, but and so it wasn't.
The atmosphere wasn't like what you would get with the
Josh Allen Bulls or the Jim Kelly Bulls Bills. I mean,
it's just the last of a dying breed. There's just
(21:41):
something unique about a small town city that has this
NFL team who's now good. The Snow I just think
that it's just awesome. I mean, it pops on television.
You just find yourself rooting for those people who the
Bills mean so much to. It's one of those franchises
(22:04):
that you think of Chris Berman if you're my age
and growing up watching his breakdowns on ESPN on Sundays.
But there's just no one circles the wagons like the
Buffalo Bills number two and you could have gone one
A and one B. I think Kansas City and Arrowhead.
I've been to a bunch of games Arrowhead. I was
(22:25):
going when they weren't as good in the late two thousands.
But I think a little like Buffalo and we'll see
if they get a new stadium. It's just an old
school stadium. It ain't that nice, and when you get there,
it's just about football. And now these people are going
to the games. It's in the middle of a dynasty.
I was listening to Edelman's podcast Part two with Ernie
(22:47):
Adams and they claimed the best game atmosphere on the
road they had played in over the dynasty was the
twenty eighteen AFC Championship game against Patrick Mahomes's first year
starting MVP, and they beat them in overtime, and they
both said that was just that was the coolest environment
as a road team that we had ever experienced. And
(23:09):
this was a team that had done it all. So
and this is Ernie Adams, who has known Bill for
fifty years and was on all the Patriot teams as
the right hand man. So they're not just saying this
it's a special environment. And I do believe that it
has something to do. You just naturally lose it when
you upgrade the stadium because it prices people out. Even
(23:30):
though to get to a Chiefs game now, even in
the older stadium is more expensive than it would have
been pre Andy Reid, but still it's gonna be way
less affordable. When you start adding all these incredible club seeds,
you quadruple the amount of suites. It just changes. I
saw it with Candlestick and Levi Stadium. It ain't the same.
(23:52):
It doesn't mean it's not fun, it doesn't mean it's
not cool to go to a big game there, but
it's never going to be this good. So Buffalo and
Kansas City, two places that obviously are desperate to upgrade
their stadiums, enjoy it while you can't. I mean truly.
I saw it with the Warriors when I started going
to Warriors games early on in the Steph Clay era
(24:12):
at Oracle, which is right next to the Coliseum, I
would argue one of the shittiest areas in all of America.
I would put that stretch sixty six and Hagenberger up
against any in America. Of just if you blew it
up tomorrow, not only would no one care, no one
would notice, and it would look very similar. But those
(24:32):
games at Oracle plays freaking rock Man, and it's not
the same at the new stadium. How can it be?
It's not the same crowd. So Kansas City and Buffalo,
and it's why there are certain places. Fenway Park is this,
Wrigley Field is this? Obviously, Lambeau is this that will
(24:58):
just battle the test of time. And even as the
world changes, even as the economics of stadiums change, it
doesn't feel like it matters at all. And in the
next ten fifteen years, Kansas City, Buffalo, Cleveland, we'll have
some sweet new stadium more likely look like Minnesota or
(25:20):
Dallas or so far you know their versions, and it'll
be like remember when arrow Remember what Arrowhead was like?
Remember those games at Orchard Park in that old crappy stadium.
Remember those games. I mean, I listen. Most people in
my life growing up are Niner people, and a lot
of their memories are a candlestick. Remember those games with
Joe Montana and Steve Young and Jerry Rice and even
(25:42):
Jim harbought candlestick. There's something nostalgic about that. So I've
never been there. I think I was supposed to advance.
I ended up going to another city and someone else went.
But they've been good for thirty plus years. The stadium
is so historic and it's just it's just it's an
awesome place. It's just it pops on television. Everyone knows
(26:05):
when you say the word lambo exactly what you mean
whenever you see someone on social media or whatever. I
got the chance to go to lambeau Field and just
go to I'm not even a Packer fan and just
went to the game. Obviously, the lambeau Leap is something
that just is very special in all of football at
(26:26):
any level, and it's just really really cool. And the
Packers because of their success. I've been to a lot
of games against them on the road. I've seen them
sell out against the Raiders. I've seen them sell out
against the forty nine ers. A lot of you that
if you've been to a game that your team's played
the Packers, A lot of Packer fans, And this is
a team that plays kind of in the middle of
(26:47):
nowhere and it's not some big, you know, metropolis, urban
major city, and they feel like one of the star
warts of the NFL. And I think obviously a big
reason is because of the quarterback, because of the success,
but you could also argue it's because of the staple
in lambeau Field. I would say Ryan Poll's tenure early
(27:18):
on was rocky. He made a trade that was pretty
embarrassing when he traded for Chase Claypool. But I don't
care who you look at. It could be Bill Walsh,
Bill Parcells, Bill Belichick. Everyone makes bad moves. Obviously, when
you don't have a a long resume on the job
(27:39):
as the boss and you're new to a job, a
move early on in your career that's bad is magnified.
Right when Belichick would make shitty moves in twenty sixteen,
no one cares. It's like, well, I have won four
Super Bowls and planning on went a couple more and
I'll see in three more AFC Championship games. Right. So,
Ryan Poles, I would say, has to quote dumb and
(28:03):
dumber totally redeemed himself because I think there's a chance
that the Bears trade with the Carolina Panthers will go
down as the greatest transaction in the history of American sports.
I looked at it today. It is insane and it
got me thinking because yesterday when I was recording the podcast,
I'd already recorded the main part of the podcast. When
(28:25):
were starting the mailbag, news broke about DJ Moore getting
a massive extension. I mean, the dude had ninety six catches,
thirteen hundred plus yards and eight touchdowns with I mean
multiple different quarterbacks, most of could not throw very well.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
What Dj Moore.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Is a stud. He was part of the deal. And listen,
anytime you make a trade, even if it's for a
great player or a big Draft day trade, there's luck involved.
I mean, let's face it, there is luck involved in
most transactions. I heard a story when I was in
Tahoe about Joe Lacup, the owner of the Warriors. Well,
(29:03):
he accumulated his wealth in the investing venture capital world
and he was partners with some guys and they were
one of the first big investors into a little company
called Google. And at the time Google, I don't know
if they were quite a company based out of a garage,
but they were closer to that than what they are now,
(29:26):
and they were not some can't miss home run. And
from my understanding, that transaction netted him well over half
a billion dollars and the investment a couple million dollars.
Whatever it was, it's an all timer. And even when
you hear these stories, like even if you believe in
what you're doing, it's hard to think about the best
(29:50):
best case scenario. And I think when you look at
the Chicago Bears, it was an easy trade for them
to make because they were essentially getting three first round picks.
They were swapping to nine, they were getting the following
year's first round pick, and they were getting DJ Moore,
which Ryan Pole said we valued as a first round pick,
which I would agree with him because when they traded
(30:12):
for him now they gave him an extension. He was
already under his second contract, so he was a cost
controlled player. I mean, they just gave a guy an extension.
He has two more years on his deal, so they're
getting out ahead of it. They also received two second
round picks won that first year and then another one
coming in twenty twenty five. But if you look at
it from the Carolina standpoint, they traded for Bryce Young,
(30:35):
that's their asset. They got Bryce Young, who I've heard
is having a pretty solid camp. And listen, I'm not
trying to act like he's got no shot, but if
you watched him his rookie year, the size. Even if
you think he can get better at playing and they
do a better job coaching around him, it's just hard
to envision a guy five to nine. You know, Bucks
seventy five gotfy weighed in at two hundred at the combine.
(30:57):
I think that was minimum fifteen pounds of weight, So
I'll give him one to eighty four to be some
high end top fifteen player. But the Chicago Bears, now
officially with extending DJ Moore, here is what they netted
from that trade. When they traded back to nine, they
actually then did another trade with the Philadelphia Eagles just
(31:21):
from nine to ten and selected the guy clearly they
would have taken at nine, and they got a fourth
round pick, which they used. This year, they drafted Darnell Wright,
who started seventeen games for them at right tackle. I'm
not acting like he's the next Lane Johnson, but based
on his rookie year is pretty good. And anytime you
(31:41):
get a starting tackle that's a win. Well, obviously, because
of they also had a second round pick last year,
which they traded up a couple spots and got Tyreek Stevenson,
who started sixteen games for them, across from their All
Pro Pro Bowl corner Jalen Johnson. So they got a
(32:03):
starting tackle and a starting corner. That's just year one. Then,
because the Panthers couldn't have been any worse, it led
them to get Caleb Williams. And let's remove the corner,
the right tackle and DJ Moore. There is not a
team in the history of football.
Speaker 4 (32:22):
NFL, AFL, UFL, xfl, USFLL, any European leagues who would
trade Caleb Williams.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
For Bryce Young. The Panthers, obviously last year, would have
taken Caleb Williams if he had been eligible to come out.
We all said it two years ago. If Kleb Williams
could have been in that draft, he would have been
number one overall. Bick, so they got an inferior player
if it was just one to one. But the Bears
already accumulated right tackle, starting corner Dj Moore and now
(32:54):
Caleb Williams. But because of that trade with the Eagles
going back one spot, they had an extra twenty twenty
four fourth round pick, and they took a punter. Who listen,
anytime you draft a kicker or a punter, great unknown
because a lot of undrafted guys at those positions come
on to be great players. This guy was the right
guy winner, So who knows. But if they get their
(33:18):
starting punter, their starting quarterback, starting right tackle, starting left
corner or right corner, depending on the day which angle
you're at, and Dj Moore. But we're not done yet.
We're not done. The trade is not over. They still
have a twenty twenty five second round pick coming. I
(33:39):
think if most of us were being objective, no bias, right,
not a Panther fan, not a Panther hater, not betting
on it or whatever, If we say, where are the
Panthers this season most likely to be drafting one through ten,
eleven through twenty or twenty one through thirty two, I
(34:01):
think if we did a poll like one of those
political polls, but one that actual people that you know
participated in. I think the overwhelming majority of people would
pick in the top ten. So if you're drafting in
the top ten, that means your second round pick is
usually pretty good. I was watching Giants Hard Knocks the
(34:23):
other night, I guess last night. Well, part of sucking
and having a top ten pick means you draft high
in the other rounds. So it's a great benefit. Because now,
granted they use their second round pick to get Brian
Burns pick thirty nine, but they had another second round pick.
I have to go look up where it came from.
But my point is when you stink. This is why
(34:45):
I've always defended when good teams have a rough year
or two drafting. You do know it's difficult drafting pick
twenty eight, which also means you're drafting at the end
of every round, so you are getting the shitty player
in theory in each round. It is difficult. It is
way easier to be drafting seventh and then carry over
(35:07):
through the rounds. You should have a good draft. If
you don't, that's on you. It's why once you're good
and you have good drafts like Veach like, you get
extra credit because you're not exactly swimming in the deep
end on that most of the talent is off the
board by the time your selection comes around. So listen,
(35:28):
there's luck involved in this. Even though based on what
they were getting, it was so much they had to
say yes, I would say this could not have gone
any better, and it could not be going that much better.
If Kayleb Williams becomes a top ten quarterback, I would
say regardless of these other players, you could argue it's
one of the great trades ever. If Darnel Wright is
(35:52):
their right tackle for the next eight nine years, If
Dj Moore continues to produce as he's been producing as
an entire career with random quarterbacks, If Tyreek Stevenson continues
to just start at corner one of the most important
positions on the field, If the if the dude they
drafted in the fourth round is just their hunter, and
(36:12):
if they get anything out of this twenty twenty five
second round, I don't see how it's humanly possible to
do more in a trade. I think this will easily
go down as the greatest trade not in NFL history,
in American history. Maybe there have been more transcendent trades.
Babe Ruth Right was once traded, Joe Montana was traded.
(36:36):
The bigger individual names at the time were traded, but
just in terms of a totality of what you accumulated
for the number one overall pick. Ryan Poul should get
an extension off this alone. He really should. I mean,
I don't know how it gets any better from from
(36:57):
a general manager. I really don't. If I was as
an owner, I would extend him right now, just based
on looking at the information we have, based on the trade,
and that's gotta be one. And David Tepper, listen, he's
in the invested in world. He's all time stock trader.
You're not gonna win them all. But it's tough when
you swing in wif on something like this. This one
(37:19):
is gonna be hard to shake. It's easy to go. Well,
it's water under the bridge, you know. It's sunk cost
Not sunk costs are all the same, right, Not sunk
costs are all equal. It's one thing. If you walk
in you're like, God, I bought a bunch of chicken
from Costco. It's all rotten. Whatever he spent fifty bucks
(37:41):
we model your whole house, have the roof leak and
ruin your entire floor a little different. I would say
they don't parallel each other, and I would put this
under one of those disastrous sunk costs.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
The volume
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Speaker 1 (01:59):
What is happening in everybody? Happy weekend? It's John your
buddy and this three and out and a little thing
we like to do the best of the week. And
we had a fun week. Training camp is often running.
Everyone is in pads. We even had a game that
was delayed because of crazy weather. I guess that's what
(02:22):
happens in Ohio in the early August. But we had
a lot going on this week because we had new
contracts with quarterbacks, and I dove into Mahomes contract and
he was asked about being underpaid. Turns out he makes
more money than anyone when it comes to actual money,
So we'll talk about that. I picked my top five
(02:44):
NFL venues, top five NFL atmospheres. Had some tough omissions,
but pretty fired up about my list and Ryan Poles.
When you really take a deep dive into the trade
that exchanged Bryce young number one pick last year for
what the Bears received and actually still get to receive
(03:07):
even in twenty twenty five, I do think it has
a chance to be the greatest trade of all time.
Long way to go on paper. Right now, with how
many starters they've got, it's already an elite trade, but
I believe it easily could be one of the best
trades in the history of sports. And I'll tell you why. But,
like I said, best of the week and let's dive
(03:28):
into it. But before we dive into football, you know,
I got to tell you about my friends, my partners,
and the official ticketing app of this podcast. Game Time
been hammering this for a long time. You guys need
to do something fun, because doing something fun is the
easiest way to relax, because listen, we're all high stressed people.
Grind in a way just swinging our pick on a
(03:51):
daily basis and sometimes Friday and Saturday comes, it's like,
what are we gonna do. I'll tell you what you're
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use the code John for twenty dollars off your first purchase.
Terms apply again. Create an account, redeem the code John
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John for twenty dollars off. Download the game Time app today.
Last minute ticket's lowest price is guaranteed. I've told this
story before, but I'll talk about it a little bit
again because I think it applies to mahomes and when
I left Philadelphia in twenty twelve to move back to
(04:56):
the West Coast to do college scouting, because Daniel jerrem Maya,
who was obviously on NFL Network, and the lead draft
guy took over for Mayok When he took over the
Raiders GM job worked for the Eagles. That's how I
first met him, and when he got hired with the
NFL Network, I essentially begged for the West Coast job.
(05:17):
I wanted to get back back West, and luckily most
people in the building who had longer ten years than
me were West Coast people, and that obviously worked as
an advantage plush. I was relatively cheap labor, and when I
got back, I had to live somewhere, and at the time,
most of my friends, a lot of people I went
to college with, were all living in San Francisco. It
(05:39):
was booming because all the sales jobs with all the
tech companies like Oracle and Facebook and Apple and Google
and you name it. And it was much easier to
get a job in the city that did not exist
three or four years previously. So it was a lot
of fun, and I wanted to move to San Francisco.
(06:00):
Bluddy of mine, through a family friend, had just bought
a place and I moved in with him. And this
guy played baseball in college for an Ivy League school
and was really really smart and went to work in
finance and started making big cash very early in his
like right after he graduated college, Ivy League, elite, just
(06:23):
a dude's dude and brilliant. And when I moved in
with him, he was changing jobs and he was going
to work for a different firm like VC. I don't
know the exact like the way you would describe his industry,
but it was moving and shaken with cash investing in shit.
And one thing he was big on is he fought
for a title. He wanted to be like a vice
(06:46):
president at this firm, and that was a big deal
to him. And then like six months later, when the
bonuses came out, he's like, I kind of got screwed.
I didn't realize when I fought for this title. You know,
in my previous jobs, I saw these vps making big
money and I didn't put enough emphasis on it. And
he's like, the reality I learned is a title and
(07:09):
words shaking hands to create a deal are completely meaningless.
I would rather have been called an intern and doubled
the bonus. And I think you see that a lot
with these quarterback contracts, All these things are flying, all
these numbers are flying, and they're really hollow. How many
people listening to this right now that work in any industry,
(07:31):
that know, if you're trying to land a deal, If
you're working on a deal, words are pretty meaningless. Until
something is written on a contract and both sides have signed,
nothing really matters. And I think you see with these
quarterback contracts, these huge numbers, and I've been saying forever,
nothing is more meaningless than average per year. You know
(07:54):
who is obsessed with average per year? The agent? Why
makes them look good? And I don't blame them, That's
their job. The better they look, the more clients they get,
the longer their book of players grows, and the more
money they're firm and they make individually, that is their job.
But in terms of teams, the general manager, the head coach,
(08:16):
and most importantly the contract negotiator and the owner, what
are they obsessed with? Cash flow? How much do we
actually have to pay this player? Like I said, Jordan
Love in his contract is making seventy five million dollars
before Christmas, he gets a twenty five million dollar payment.
Now he gets another one in October, and he gets
(08:39):
another one the second week of December, So we get
seventy five million dollars before the end of this calendar year.
That's money now, and anyone knows money now is more
valuable than money in two years. Hell, we've just seen
the last three or four years historic amount of inflation.
You know, you always want more money upfront. But Patrick
(09:01):
Mahomes was asked recently about the contract he signed, and
a lot of people when he originally signed it thought
he was crazy because he signed a ten year contract.
People like, no one does that because you want the
ability to rehit free agency. And he just said, listen,
I'm happy for all the other guys. I feel very comfortable.
This is not verbatim what he said, but just kind
(09:23):
of giving you the cliffs of the version. I feel
very comfortable with where we're at. We've made some adjustments
to it, and I also feel very comfortable with the
group that I work with, meaning Andy and Brett Veach.
And let's face it, most players and most agents are
just using these teams, and rightfully so, to just get
as much money as humanly possible. They don't really trust
(09:46):
the GM or the owner. But Patrick Mahomes has learned
and like any human being, obviously most of us our
numbers aren't forty five or fifty or fifty five million
dollars a year. But if you get into business with people,
and the older you get, the more experience you have.
You've been in business with people you don't really trust,
you don't feel that comfortable with, You're not, you know,
(10:09):
dead set on buying into the future with these people.
And then sometimes you get in bed with people you
trust just unequivocally, like you don't even hesitate to go, Yeah,
what do you need? I'm in? What can I do?
And it's less about the money and more about the
belief and big picture of where we're gonna go because
(10:31):
this is gonna work. And when you trust and believe
in people, it's easier to make more money over the
long term. Now, Patrick Mahomes, don't get it twisted. He
will make and I heard Mike Florio say this between
twenty twenty three, so last season through twenty twenty six
more actual cash than any player who's under contract right now,
(10:54):
and that includes all the new contract sign He will
make two hundred and fifteen million dollars over the next
four years. The only guy who's remotely close to him
is Joe Burrow. Who's a couple million dollars less. That's
actual money, not fake numbers on a contract, not numbers
that can change if you have a catastrophic injury. That's
(11:15):
real cash flow. And listen, that's never how these contracts
are going to be reported. And unless you dive deep
and are obsessed with this type stuff, you could argue
it's kind of irrelevant how much cash these guys, whether
they get thirty million this year or forty six million
dollars this year. But when it comes to the best
(11:37):
player in the league, and let's face it, the most
important player currently in the NFL, Patrick Mahomes, he's the
highest paid guy in the league when it comes to
actual dollars. Right, So you can have all these fake numbers,
you can say this contract's bigger than that. Tua got
more guaranteed money on paper than Patrick Mahomes, None of
that means anything when one guy actually gets more cash.
(12:00):
And I think one thing Patrick Mahomes learned that only
a small percentage of players ever get to go through
is he learns that I should trust Andy Reid and
Brett Veach with everything because the more I win, the
more money I will make. The rest of my life,
like Joe Montana in twenty twenty four, is still really valuable.
(12:22):
Tom Brady, before he retired, signed a three hundred and
seventy five million dollar contract with Fox to broadcast games.
No one even knew if he could do it, and
they almost gave him four hundred million dollars. Why because
he's widely considered the greatest player in the history of
the sport and he has six seven Super Bowls? Would
(12:44):
he have signed that contract if he had two Super Bowls? No,
he would not have because that number wouldn't have been
that high. And I remember talking to a player who's
gonna be in the Hall of Fame one day, and
he was part of the negotiations for one of the
cbas and he's like, I don't think most people understand
we don't make that much money in the playoffs. And
that's true. If you make ten, fifteen, twenty thirty million
(13:08):
dollars during the regular season. Once you get to the playoffs,
it's slotted by round, meaning if you're the star pass
rusher or the star quarterback or the star wide receiver,
you make the same as the fifty second guy on
the roster, and it goes up by the round. But
you do realize when you win in the playoffs, like
Mahomes and Kelsey have done, like Peyton Manning has done,
(13:29):
winning Super Bowls, like Eli did winning a couple of
Super Bowls. Obviously Tom is the best example, and now
Patrick Mahomes is doing it. Gives you value in perpetuity.
You are always valuable from a marketing standpoint, and that's
what Patrick Mahomes has with the Kansay Chiefs. So if
on paper he looks like he's making a little less,
(13:49):
if people talk about why his contract, he doesn't give
a shit because he knows two things. One the most
important thing the actual money coming into his bank account.
And two he works with the best in the business.
Where if you were a player on just a random team,
even if you liked the coach and liked the GM, like,
why would you ever quote unquote take a discount or
(14:12):
quote unquote not fight for every penny you know, at
any moment, those guys could be fired at any moment,
they could try to replace you. Happens all the time,
literally with every team, and Patrick Mahoonmes has seen first hand.
One they'll invest in the team when a guy gets
really good right, like Chris Jones, they ended up taking
care of him, and when they have to make a
(14:34):
big picture, risky move, they've proven that they can make
it work. Tom experienced this for twenty years of Bill Belichick. Listen.
It was some of the things he did when the
news broke, You're like, Bill is nuts. And then it
tended to work out and they tended to always be
in the AFC Championship Game or the super Bowl, and
Tom obviously was a huge part of that and then
(14:57):
benefited and continues to benefit because of the success they had.
So I think one life lesson I've taken forever is
until it's on paper, nothing matters in titles, you know,
and you know the perception of something can be a
little overrated. You can call me an intern all day long.
(15:18):
If you're paying me ten million dollars, who cares.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
The NFL seasons right around the corner. Will be breaking
down all the off season storylines on the Colin Cowherd podcast,
my best takes guests like my buddy Nick Wright. Check
out the Colin Coward podcast, part of the Volume Network,
available on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Okay, Top five NFL venues. I'm fascinated by this because
I think college the NFL gets a bad rap of
the atmospheres aren't that great relative to Saturdays. And it's
true because there's nothing like LSU at night. There's nothing
like Penn State at night. There's nothing like one hundred
and ten thousand people at Michigan, you know, when Bama's
(16:14):
rocking Texas and Oklahoma Oregon at Autsam Stadium, like the
NFL doesn't have that. It's a communal experience. But I've
been to a lot of NFL games. They're fun, but
some are better than others. And when you look at
the top venues like Sofi Stadium, I've never been to
a stadium even remotely close to that, And I've been
(16:37):
to Dallas that was always kind of the cream day
ly krem but I think so Fi is laughed it. Obviously,
it's branded. It's just it's spectacular when you're inside. But
it's no one would ever say like God, LSU at night,
Sofi Stadium at night. Clearly you're not saying that the
(16:57):
Vegas Stadium awesome, bunch of random people flying in all
over the place. But the NFL does have some sweet atmospheres.
So I just ranked my top five NFL atmospheres and
I left a couple out part of it as this
team sucked for a while. But I think Denver historically
has been pretty sweet, mile High great football town. Seattle
(17:18):
had a stretch there with the Twelves which was as
good as it gets. I remember the Saints played a
Monday night game there and like Drew Brees couldn't even hear,
couldn't even function, and the Saints, I think they got
beat pretty bad. This might have been late in Breeze's tenure,
might have been like fifteen sixteen range, But I think
(17:40):
Seattle's come back to earth a little bit. That the
game two years ago with Russell coming back with Denver
was pretty awesome. But if they ever got good again,
that place is gonna rock start again. Five. I remember
watching the game there last year when the Niners played them,
and thinking there is something special. And I've talked about
this before, or like the Coliseum where the Raiders used
(18:02):
to play in Oakland, Candlestick just these old decrepit stadiums
that are just kind of football and when you go there,
it's really just about drinking beer, getting loud. Maybe eating
some crappy hot dog. But it's about football and football only,
and I think Cleveland still kind of has that, and
(18:23):
part of the reason I put them. They're good now.
The team's competitive, but there's nothing like hearing the fans
hit like the I don't even know if it's ten
or something, but it echoes throughout that place. Week one
against the Cowboys is gonna be nuts. I was listening
to Rabel who was on with the part of My
(18:43):
Take Guys, and he said his dad took him to
a game in the dog Pound. I don't know when
he was like junior high, and he was like, that's
the first time I'd ever seen weed and people just
getting blasted. And there's just something special about football in Ohio.
That stadium not great. They're clearly probably gonna build a
(19:06):
new one. I saw Andrew Berry wants to build a dome.
I got to push back on that one. I understand
why he would, analytical guy numbers geek, you can control
a lot better if there's a dome. When I think Cleveland,
when I think Baltimore, when I think Cincinnati, like Kansas,
I think outdoor cold. I hope if they ever do it,
(19:29):
they do not do a dome, but who knows. So
I go Cleveland at five. This is my only new stadium,
but I think this place the best opening in the
NFL is when everyone's doing skull, that place freaking rocks
and that stadium. I've never been there, but it looks
(19:52):
awesome on television. It pops on TV day or night.
And my buddies that works for the Eagle that went
there with the Super Bowl said the place is a
badass that atmosphere in Minnesota, and it's always been good.
But I think for a newer stadium that can't be
cheap to go do is just it's pretty sweet. It
(20:13):
has like a big ten vibe to it, like it
has a collegiate vibe to it. And I think a
lot of times you've seen it with Vegas, You've seen
it with the Niners, You've seen it with so Far,
seen it with the Cowboys. You kind of lose that
with the glitz and the glamour, which is understandable because
you price out the die hard guy that's really gonna yell.
I got news for you. When I go to a
(20:34):
game and I pay a lot of money for tickets,
like I'm not standing up all the time. I'm just
kind of sit there and enjoying it and listen. I'm
not proud to say that, but there is something about
people that used to be able to afford pretty good seats.
It just makes the place louder. The faster you get
to a wine and cheese crowd, the less likely you
(20:56):
are to have a crazy atmosphere. It's why these top
three stadium atmospheres all have something in common. They feel
old school. And number three is the Bills. I think
the Bills Mafia, the games in November, December and January,
the Snow Games. It just feels pretty special. It feels
like something that in ten years as all these places
(21:19):
have new stadiums, including the Bills with club seeds with boxes.
And I'm not saying this place. I went there once.
The team was pretty crappy, but and so it wasn't.
The atmosphere wasn't like what you would get with the
Josh Allen Bulls or the Jim Kelly Bulls Bills. I mean,
it's just the last of a dying breed. There's just
(21:41):
something unique about a small town city that has this
NFL team who's now good. The Snow I just think
that it's just awesome. I mean, it pops on television.
You just find yourself rooting for those people who the
Bills mean so much to. It's one of those franchises
(22:04):
that you think of Chris Berman if you're my age
and growing up watching his breakdowns on ESPN on Sundays.
But there's just no one circles the wagons like the
Buffalo Bills number two and you could have gone one
A and one B. I think Kansas City and Arrowhead.
I've been to a bunch of games Arrowhead. I was
(22:25):
going when they weren't as good in the late two thousands.
But I think a little like Buffalo and we'll see
if they get a new stadium. It's just an old
school stadium. It ain't that nice, and when you get there,
it's just about football. And now these people are going
to the games. It's in the middle of a dynasty.
I was listening to Edelman's podcast Part two with Ernie
(22:47):
Adams and they claimed the best game atmosphere on the
road they had played in over the dynasty was the
twenty eighteen AFC Championship game against Patrick Mahomes's first year
starting MVP, and they beat them in overtime, and they
both said that was just that was the coolest environment
as a road team that we had ever experienced. And
(23:09):
this was a team that had done it all. So
and this is Ernie Adams, who has known Bill for
fifty years and was on all the Patriot teams as
the right hand man. So they're not just saying this
it's a special environment. And I do believe that it
has something to do. You just naturally lose it when
you upgrade the stadium because it prices people out. Even
(23:30):
though to get to a Chiefs game now, even in
the older stadium is more expensive than it would have
been pre Andy Reid, but still it's gonna be way
less affordable. When you start adding all these incredible club seeds,
you quadruple the amount of suites. It just changes. I
saw it with Candlestick and Levi Stadium. It ain't the same.
(23:52):
It doesn't mean it's not fun, it doesn't mean it's
not cool to go to a big game there, but
it's never going to be this good. So Buffalo and
Kansas City, two places that obviously are desperate to upgrade
their stadiums, enjoy it while you can't. I mean truly.
I saw it with the Warriors when I started going
to Warriors games early on in the Steph Clay era
(24:12):
at Oracle, which is right next to the Coliseum, I
would argue one of the shittiest areas in all of America.
I would put that stretch sixty six and Hagenberger up
against any in America. Of just if you blew it
up tomorrow, not only would no one care, no one
would notice, and it would look very similar. But those
(24:32):
games at Oracle plays freaking rock Man, and it's not
the same at the new stadium. How can it be?
It's not the same crowd. So Kansas City and Buffalo,
and it's why there are certain places. Fenway Park is this,
Wrigley Field is this? Obviously, Lambeau is this that will
(24:58):
just battle the test of time. And even as the
world changes, even as the economics of stadiums change, it
doesn't feel like it matters at all. And in the
next ten fifteen years, Kansas City, Buffalo, Cleveland, we'll have
some sweet new stadium more likely look like Minnesota or
(25:20):
Dallas or so far you know their versions, and it'll
be like remember when arrow Remember what Arrowhead was like?
Remember those games at Orchard Park in that old crappy stadium.
Remember those games. I mean, I listen. Most people in
my life growing up are Niner people, and a lot
of their memories are a candlestick. Remember those games with
Joe Montana and Steve Young and Jerry Rice and even
(25:42):
Jim harbought candlestick. There's something nostalgic about that. So I've
never been there. I think I was supposed to advance.
I ended up going to another city and someone else went.
But they've been good for thirty plus years. The stadium
is so historic and it's just it's just it's an
awesome place. It's just it pops on television. Everyone knows
(26:05):
when you say the word lambo exactly what you mean
whenever you see someone on social media or whatever. I
got the chance to go to lambeau Field and just
go to I'm not even a Packer fan and just
went to the game. Obviously, the lambeau Leap is something
that just is very special in all of football at
(26:26):
any level, and it's just really really cool. And the
Packers because of their success. I've been to a lot
of games against them on the road. I've seen them
sell out against the Raiders. I've seen them sell out
against the forty nine ers. A lot of you that
if you've been to a game that your team's played
the Packers, A lot of Packer fans, And this is
a team that plays kind of in the middle of
(26:47):
nowhere and it's not some big, you know, metropolis, urban
major city, and they feel like one of the star
warts of the NFL. And I think obviously a big
reason is because of the quarterback, because of the success,
but you could also argue it's because of the staple
in lambeau Field. I would say Ryan Poll's tenure early
(27:18):
on was rocky. He made a trade that was pretty
embarrassing when he traded for Chase Claypool. But I don't
care who you look at. It could be Bill Walsh,
Bill Parcells, Bill Belichick. Everyone makes bad moves. Obviously, when
you don't have a a long resume on the job
(27:39):
as the boss and you're new to a job, a
move early on in your career that's bad is magnified.
Right when Belichick would make shitty moves in twenty sixteen,
no one cares. It's like, well, I have won four
Super Bowls and planning on went a couple more and
I'll see in three more AFC Championship games. Right. So,
Ryan Poles, I would say, has to quote dumb and
(28:03):
dumber totally redeemed himself because I think there's a chance
that the Bears trade with the Carolina Panthers will go
down as the greatest transaction in the history of American sports.
I looked at it today. It is insane and it
got me thinking because yesterday when I was recording the podcast,
I'd already recorded the main part of the podcast. When
(28:25):
were starting the mailbag, news broke about DJ Moore getting
a massive extension. I mean, the dude had ninety six catches,
thirteen hundred plus yards and eight touchdowns with I mean
multiple different quarterbacks, most of could not throw very well.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
What Dj Moore.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
Is a stud. He was part of the deal. And listen,
anytime you make a trade, even if it's for a
great player or a big Draft day trade, there's luck involved.
I mean, let's face it, there is luck involved in
most transactions. I heard a story when I was in
Tahoe about Joe Lacup, the owner of the Warriors. Well,
(29:03):
he accumulated his wealth in the investing venture capital world
and he was partners with some guys and they were
one of the first big investors into a little company
called Google. And at the time Google, I don't know
if they were quite a company based out of a garage,
but they were closer to that than what they are now,
(29:26):
and they were not some can't miss home run. And
from my understanding, that transaction netted him well over half
a billion dollars and the investment a couple million dollars.
Whatever it was, it's an all timer. And even when
you hear these stories, like even if you believe in
what you're doing, it's hard to think about the best
(29:50):
best case scenario. And I think when you look at
the Chicago Bears, it was an easy trade for them
to make because they were essentially getting three first round picks.
They were swapping to nine, they were getting the following
year's first round pick, and they were getting DJ Moore,
which Ryan Pole said we valued as a first round pick,
which I would agree with him because when they traded
(30:12):
for him now they gave him an extension. He was
already under his second contract, so he was a cost
controlled player. I mean, they just gave a guy an extension.
He has two more years on his deal, so they're
getting out ahead of it. They also received two second
round picks won that first year and then another one
coming in twenty twenty five. But if you look at
it from the Carolina standpoint, they traded for Bryce Young,
(30:35):
that's their asset. They got Bryce Young, who I've heard
is having a pretty solid camp. And listen, I'm not
trying to act like he's got no shot, but if
you watched him his rookie year, the size. Even if
you think he can get better at playing and they
do a better job coaching around him, it's just hard
to envision a guy five to nine. You know, Bucks
seventy five gotfy weighed in at two hundred at the combine.
(30:57):
I think that was minimum fifteen pounds of weight, So
I'll give him one to eighty four to be some
high end top fifteen player. But the Chicago Bears, now
officially with extending DJ Moore, here is what they netted
from that trade. When they traded back to nine, they
actually then did another trade with the Philadelphia Eagles just
(31:21):
from nine to ten and selected the guy clearly they
would have taken at nine, and they got a fourth
round pick, which they used. This year, they drafted Darnell Wright,
who started seventeen games for them at right tackle. I'm
not acting like he's the next Lane Johnson, but based
on his rookie year is pretty good. And anytime you
(31:41):
get a starting tackle that's a win. Well, obviously, because
of they also had a second round pick last year,
which they traded up a couple spots and got Tyreek Stevenson,
who started sixteen games for them, across from their All
Pro Pro Bowl corner Jalen Johnson. So they got a
(32:03):
starting tackle and a starting corner. That's just year one. Then,
because the Panthers couldn't have been any worse, it led
them to get Caleb Williams. And let's remove the corner,
the right tackle and DJ Moore. There is not a
team in the history of football.
Speaker 4 (32:22):
NFL, AFL, UFL, xfl, USFLL, any European leagues who would
trade Caleb Williams.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
For Bryce Young. The Panthers, obviously last year, would have
taken Caleb Williams if he had been eligible to come out.
We all said it two years ago. If Kleb Williams
could have been in that draft, he would have been
number one overall. Bick, so they got an inferior player
if it was just one to one. But the Bears
already accumulated right tackle, starting corner Dj Moore and now
(32:54):
Caleb Williams. But because of that trade with the Eagles
going back one spot, they had an extra twenty twenty
four fourth round pick, and they took a punter. Who listen,
anytime you draft a kicker or a punter, great unknown
because a lot of undrafted guys at those positions come
on to be great players. This guy was the right
guy winner, So who knows. But if they get their
(33:18):
starting punter, their starting quarterback, starting right tackle, starting left
corner or right corner, depending on the day which angle
you're at, and Dj Moore. But we're not done yet.
We're not done. The trade is not over. They still
have a twenty twenty five second round pick coming. I
(33:39):
think if most of us were being objective, no bias, right,
not a Panther fan, not a Panther hater, not betting
on it or whatever, If we say, where are the
Panthers this season most likely to be drafting one through ten,
eleven through twenty or twenty one through thirty two, I
(34:01):
think if we did a poll like one of those
political polls, but one that actual people that you know
participated in. I think the overwhelming majority of people would
pick in the top ten. So if you're drafting in
the top ten, that means your second round pick is
usually pretty good. I was watching Giants Hard Knocks the
(34:23):
other night, I guess last night. Well, part of sucking
and having a top ten pick means you draft high
in the other rounds. So it's a great benefit. Because now,
granted they use their second round pick to get Brian
Burns pick thirty nine, but they had another second round pick.
I have to go look up where it came from.
But my point is when you stink. This is why
(34:45):
I've always defended when good teams have a rough year
or two drafting. You do know it's difficult drafting pick
twenty eight, which also means you're drafting at the end
of every round, so you are getting the shitty player
in theory in each round. It is difficult. It is
way easier to be drafting seventh and then carry over
(35:07):
through the rounds. You should have a good draft. If
you don't, that's on you. It's why once you're good
and you have good drafts like Veach like, you get
extra credit because you're not exactly swimming in the deep
end on that most of the talent is off the
board by the time your selection comes around. So listen,
(35:28):
there's luck involved in this. Even though based on what
they were getting, it was so much they had to
say yes, I would say this could not have gone
any better, and it could not be going that much better.
If Kayleb Williams becomes a top ten quarterback, I would
say regardless of these other players, you could argue it's
one of the great trades ever. If Darnel Wright is
(35:52):
their right tackle for the next eight nine years, If
Dj Moore continues to produce as he's been producing as
an entire career with random quarterbacks, If Tyreek Stevenson continues
to just start at corner one of the most important
positions on the field, If the if the dude they
drafted in the fourth round is just their hunter, and
(36:12):
if they get anything out of this twenty twenty five
second round, I don't see how it's humanly possible to
do more in a trade. I think this will easily
go down as the greatest trade not in NFL history,
in American history. Maybe there have been more transcendent trades.
Babe Ruth Right was once traded, Joe Montana was traded.
(36:36):
The bigger individual names at the time were traded, but
just in terms of a totality of what you accumulated
for the number one overall pick. Ryan Poul should get
an extension off this alone. He really should. I mean,
I don't know how it gets any better from from
(36:57):
a general manager. I really don't. If I was as
an owner, I would extend him right now, just based
on looking at the information we have, based on the trade,
and that's gotta be one. And David Tepper, listen, he's
in the invested in world. He's all time stock trader.
You're not gonna win them all. But it's tough when
you swing in wif on something like this. This one
(37:19):
is gonna be hard to shake. It's easy to go. Well,
it's water under the bridge, you know. It's sunk cost
Not sunk costs are all the same, right, Not sunk
costs are all equal. It's one thing. If you walk
in you're like, God, I bought a bunch of chicken
from Costco. It's all rotten. Whatever he spent fifty bucks
(37:41):
we model your whole house, have the roof leak and
ruin your entire floor a little different. I would say
they don't parallel each other, and I would put this
under one of those disastrous sunk costs.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
The volume
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Colin Cowherd
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