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December 29, 2025 53 mins

Former NFL scout John Middlekauff reacts LIVE following the Week 17 Sunday Night Football matchup between Caleb Williams and the Chicago Bears vs. Brock Purdy and the San Francisco 49ers. John kicks off by reacting to another game of the year candidate as the 49ers outlast the Bears on SNF in Week 17. John discusses how it the 49ers control their own destiny for the NFC's number 1 overall seed if they can defeat the Seattle Seahawks in Week 18. John also discusses Brock Purdy's back to back career performances and head coach Kyle Shanahan's Coach of the Year consideration. John then dives into the Pittsburgh Steelers loss to Shedeur Sanders and the Cleveland Browns to set up a win or go home matchup with Lamar Jackson and the Baltimore Ravens in Week 18. John debates whether head coach Mike Tomlin or QB Aaron Rodgers should return in 2026 if the team misses the NFL playoffs. John then dives into the NFC South as the Tampa Bay Buccaneers and Carolina Panthers both lost in Week 17 to the Miami Dolphins and Seattle Seahawks, respectively, and how their Week 18 win or go home game for the NFC South title could forecast them exiting early in the playoffs. John flips the script and discusses the AFC South, which feature two of the hottest teams in the NFL, the Jacksonville Jaguars and the Houston Texans, and how he wouldn't be surprised if either of those teams ended up in the AFC Championship game. John then applauds the Las Vegas Raiders for losing to the New York Giants in Week 17, setting the team up to have the number 1 pick in the NFL Draft heading into their Week 18 game vs. the Kansas City Chiefs. John wraps up by reacting to a report from Jay Glazer regarding the Atlanta Falcons' interest in bringing back former QB Matt Ryan for a front office role.

03:45 - Bears-49ers Reaction

30:45 - Steelers-Browns

35:24 - Eagles-Bills

38:58 - Seahawks-Panthers | Bucs-Dolphins | NFC South

41:07 - Jaguars-Colts | Texans-Chargers | AFC South

43:39 - Giants-Raiders

46:17 - HRB MNF Picks 

46:56 - Falcons want Matt Ryan in front office

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume What is going on Everybody? John middlecop three
and Out podcast brought to you by my friends at

(00:23):
Zone Pouches. God, I love them, had about a whole
ten of them today as I watch football throughout the day.
A little boring until Josh Allen kind of came into
our life at the end with the against the Eagles
and then the Sunday night game the forty nine Ers somehow,
I don't know how beat the Bears in just a

(00:45):
nutty game, not much defense, a lot of offense, Ben Johnson,
Kyle Shanahan flexing their play calling muscles against not much resistance.
We will dive into all that. The Steelers blow it
against the UH, the Browns we had, the Bucks and
the Panthers who are not good, the Jags and the
Texans who are good. And could Matt Ryan be a

(01:08):
future GM for the Atlanta Falcons. Rumors are that Arthur Blank,
mister home Depot, is potentially seeking his services, so we
will dive into all that. So yeah, we'll talk some football.
You know, I need to subscribe to the podcast. If
you listen on Collin's feed, subscribe to the YouTube channel
so you never miss a thing. We'll be live after
the Rams game. They play the Falcons on Monday Night Football.

(01:32):
So let's just dive right in. Let's go right to
the end of the game. You know, the Bears get
the ball back down four with like a little over
two minutes to go. They got three timeouts. I don't
know a soul and the majority of people in my
life are forty nine er fans. I'm on a million
text chains. I'm thinking it, you're thinking it. The Bears

(01:54):
are gonna score. The only question is how fast do
they score? And listen, these drives are tough, even when
you're playing poor defenses. They have fifteen plays, they go
sixty three yards and I think the second to last play.
I don't want to say they got a little greedy,
because if the play works, he looks like a genius.

(02:15):
And let's face it, there is a fine line between
being a genius and being a failure. The hooking ladder
worked earlier day in the Bills game, which put them
in position to win the game. It's a historic play
going back to when I was in college when Chris
Peterson ran it against Oklahoma. I actually watched that YouTube
the other day. It was like fourth and sixteen or

(02:38):
something in regulation. When Zabranski hit the hooking ladder. When
it works, it is a cool play. And it did
work in terms of the execution of the catch and
the pitch, but it took a little extra time and
he stayed in bounds. They don't have any timeouts, and
the forty nine ers did a good job of gang tackling,
and everyone's a little messed up, and by the time

(03:00):
they know they didn't have a choice, they had to
spike the ball. They had four seconds, and let's face
the you get one play, and once you're in that scenario,
the forty nine ers defense is like Fred Warner walking
through that door. Literally he's on the sideline so he
can walk around, but he's not walking to the middle
of the field, right, you could have called a run.

(03:22):
Now if you do call a run and it doesn't work,
And they're one of, if not the best running teams
in the league, even though tonight they lean much more
in the passing game. I think you get crushed, so
you just go, hey, put it in my quarterback's hands.
His athletic ability, which is something the forty nine Ers
don't really have an answer for because they don't have
Fred Warner. They have no pass rush that you just go, well,

(03:44):
I just kind of hope and pray in these positions,
when you get that close to the goal line, the
field becomes so much wider than it does long. I
actually think the Bears, and I bet most forty nine
Ers fans would agree, would be more potent if they
were at like the twelve yard line than if they're
at the two or three yard line. And once he's

(04:04):
forced to scramble, which you knew he would if something
wasn't open immediately, even for a guy with a huge arm,
and I listen, I think you know, we'll dive into
both quarterbacks. But I think you can make the argument
that Caleb has the strongest arm in the league. There
definitely might be as strong of arms throughout the league,
Josh Allen. No one has a stronger arm than this guy.

(04:25):
But when you're in that spot, like if something's not
open immediately, you got to make a play. The forty
nine Ers defensive lineman did a good job. He scrambles
out and then the field becomes very compacted, so his
options are pretty limited, and his great skill of improvising
and definitely throwing the ball down the field is negated

(04:47):
a little bit, so like and let's face it, tonight,
one downfall of his is he missed some layups. He
made some. He had one throw tonight, a touchdown to
Lovelin that was like something Mike vis Krbrett Farv would do.
It's that forty yard ball on a rope that there
is no there is no like a arc to it.

(05:07):
It's just a straight rope like most Josh Allen has
that in the back, maybe like a younger Mahomes. No
one else in the league has that pass in the back.
Party doesn't have that pass in the back. He throws
the arcing ball. There's nothing wrong with the arking ball.
It works. That was essentially the game winner to Juwan Jennings,
the arking ball over the middle. But there's a small
percentage of guys that can throw that nowhere to be found.

(05:29):
So he's got to make a quick decision. It's kind
of all jumbled, and the Niners come away with a win.
And I think one thing that was clearly on full
display to the nation that if you give the two
best play callers, Ben Johnson and Kyle Shanahan teams that
don't have good defenses, they'll put up eighty points. And
that was I think there's two ways to look at it.

(05:50):
One because of the day and listen, I enjoy especially
that was a great matchup. I was entertained. I was entertained. Now.
I would not like that on a weekly basis. I
would not like that on a game in, game out
basis all over the league. But one scenario situation like
that to eleven win teams Sunday Night Football, sign me up.

(06:12):
It was extremely entertaining. Both the quarterbacks were making all
sorts of plays out of their ass Ricky piersall back
was incredible. Luther Burden looks like Antonio Brown. I'm recording
this right after the game. I hope he's okay. He
was laying there at the end of the game, so
hopefully he didn't get seriously injured. But that was great

(06:36):
And I think you know, one topic of conversation is
and listen, anytime you take over a shitty organization and
you get them, I would expect the Bears winning a
week so they'll get to twelve wins. That's a remarkable turnaround.
Liam Cohen takes over the Jags. I mean, the Jags
consistently draft in the top five, they are a clown

(06:57):
organization under shotgun. He gets there there immediately. Why Liam
Cohen's a stud that's really really impressive and that divisions
not easy like the culture train reck. And they're still
gonna win eight games. The Houston Texans are one of
the hottest teams in the league. They're gonna win twelve.
So I mean, it's it's impressive what he's doing. But
I would say when you watch Kyle Shanahan and you
see Nick Bosa thirty million dollars a year up with

(07:19):
his girlfriend in the box. You see Fred Warner with
his wife and his baby up in the box because
he's got a shattered ankle. The game literally right George
Kittle ruled out in the last I don't know if
it was late yesterday or early this morning out. I
think it was kind of trending that way all week,
But I don't know. He's just one of the great
forty nine ers of all time. And then probably you know,

(07:40):
pound for pound, and there's a lot of pounds. One
of the best players in a league history there left tackle.
I wasn't even off recording with Colin perty throws the
pick six trench, chasing him down, pulls his hamstring out.
For the game, he coached that entire game without I
don't know, one hundred million dollars worth of player. Obviously,
Fred and Nick have been gone for a while. Trent's

(08:02):
a thirty million dollar left tackle and George's twenty million
dollar tight end, and he's doing with Ricky Piersoll, who
you know, he's got like like a JJ McCarthy quality. Now,
the difference is like Ricky Piersoll is a player, but
he's injured all the time. And then you know, even
tonight he would get tackled and he'd be like, oh Ricky,
get up doing it with Kendrick Bourne. You know, McCaffrey's

(08:25):
just wearing them out. I wrote down he had twenty
seven touches. He might ended up with. It might have
been twenty eight touches between carries. I think twenty three
and catches. I think it was for let me double
check you at twenty three and for so twenty seven catches.
I mean, his old body's falling apart. Looks like he's
pulled his back, he pulled his listen. He's not gonna

(08:46):
win it because they were the favorites at the beginning
of the year, and that award is like do you
take over someone shitty and then win? Which is fair?
Which I have no problem. Ben Johnson, Mike Rabel and
Cohen they took over crap and they've taken them right
to the playoffs and all three teams are getting home
games in the first weekend. Remarkable. But what Kyle's doing

(09:09):
to be sixty minutes away with the team that he's
rolling out there. And Robert saw was part of the
two even though like he's just calling plays, keeping his
fingers cross hoping they work. Don't blame him, Like what's
he supposed to? He has no pass rush. They're lasted
the league in sacks, you know. I mean their best
edge rusher by a mile is an undrafted free agent

(09:30):
that the Eagles couldn't get rid of fast enough. Bryce
Up who's had one good season, like a six year career,
you know. And Alfred Collins, who was a second round
pick from Texas that most people thought the forty nine
ers were on drugs taken that high. They got backups
all over the place. Their best dB Upton stout of
rookie weighs like one hundred and fift pounds gets a
concussion a night. Leonor's really good player. I think he's

(09:53):
a little overrated sometimes, but he's listening. He's a solid starter.
Safety play can be a little hit or miss, can't
really cover anybody. And they have a chance to win
if they win this final game, thirteen games and be
the number one overall seat. That is absolutely insane. Now again,
I'm doing this right after the game, and I'm sure

(10:14):
there are implications why they did the two games on Saturday,
but the Niners got screwed. I would say Seattle got
screwed as well that game, Like I'm sorry the Pittsburgh
Steelers in the Baltimore Ravens should be forced to play
in a short week. You know, they are two teams
that are average at best. What we saw of the

(10:36):
Steelers today was an embarrassment. And they get to play
on Sunday night and get a normal week's rest and
the forty nine ers in Seattle in a game for
the number one overall seed. I mean, let's face it,
the Steelers and the Ravens are playing in a game
to be the underdog. The following week, they will be
the underdog, even though they're hosting the game, especially they're playing,
you know, the Texans, So this game is for the

(10:58):
number one overall seed and they get forced to play
on Saturday. I honestly don't understand it. Now. I'm sure
there's gonna be information coming out exactly the logistics why
they did it, but I'm baffled by that. And it's
just that's a fantastic game. I mean, Kyle versus Mike McDonald.
What Kyle has done again, He's not going to win
the award, but he's as deserving as he's ever been.

(11:22):
And to have this team at twelve wins, even if
they get smoked in this game in Seattle, is one
of the most remarkable accomplishments I can never remember. I've
been watching the forty nine ers since like nineteen ninety three.
Then this team has no business doing what they just did.
I have no clue how you know. The Bears didn't
literally score like every play they ran, but the defense

(11:43):
came through, they made some plays, and offensively, I mean,
Perty came back and over the last couple of weeks
he has been just a dominant, dominant force, and tonight
he was. He did have the pick six to open
up the game, which you know. I he can force
some balls into some spots. He did also throw an

(12:03):
interception to CJ. Gardner Johnson that they got a little
lucky that I get the rule, but he got bailed out.
It was a bad decision and he did not know
there was a flag. It was a poor decision. But
other than those two plays, he was a dominant, dominant
force on the field tonight. His mobility and accuracy combining.

(12:26):
Like Caleb has these physical skills that just jump off
the screen. My mother can see them. The power when
he runs, the arm strength, just the zip on the ball.
It's just jarring when you watch it. Purty, He's got
this smooth athleticism, like he's not nearly as fast as Caleb,

(12:46):
but he is pretty quick, and his instincts when he's
scrambling are pretty high level. And the difference of the
two quarterbacks and Collinsworth hit on this tonight is like
Caleb missed some layups for a guy that makes it.
I can live with missing lambs if you're hitting ten threes.
He missed some lambs. I don't give a shit, right, Yeah,
he missed some you know guys open in the flat.

(13:07):
He missed leveling on the corner, like it's kind of weird.
He should hit those guys. It's it looks like an
easy pass for him, but he misses them. He can
be a little inaccurate, right and tonight, I mean they
had a couple drops, but he was twenty five and
forty two. He's exactly Drew Brees where Purdy was twenty
four to thirty three. And most of his pass is
like hitting guys in stride. Because his entire gaming, his

(13:28):
entire game, And this is what I think the argument
for people that don't like him, because we live in
a physical skills type judgmental world. And I'm guilty of
this too. I like guys with physical skills. But I've
watched so much of Purty, like I appreciate what he
brings to the table and the timing and rhythm and
just understanding. I mean, there are stuff in tonight's game

(13:49):
where guys wouldn't be open, and he goes to the
checkdown so fast and all the running back makes one
guy's miss. It's an eleven yard you know game, and
his understanding of this offense, which is an elite offense.
It's been working for thirty plus years. If you watch
the Lway Doc Mike Shanahan's been kicking ass and taking
names with this thing since the mid nineties, and his

(14:12):
play caller is arguably the best in the league. So
if you can run at a high level and you're
playing defenses like the Bears, you will score on every drive.
You will have games where you can't account for five touchdowns.
And you know, Kyle gives them kind of cart blanche
and lets him run it. Clearly, he has a lot
of juice of the line of scrimmage. You hear him

(14:33):
cannon plays changing things to the line of scrimmage. But
his legs like one element that they had early in
this kind of Shanahan run. When they started taking off
with Jimmy Garoppolo, Jimmy Garoppolo did not have the athleticism.
It's why they took the swing on Trey Lance. They wanted,
like this hybrid player, what the Bears get with Caleb Williams.
You know what, turns out, Trey Lance wasn't that good

(14:54):
of an athlete. It was like his athleticism was overrated
because he was playing D one double A and when
he got to the NFL, people are like, God, he's
actually not that fast, and meanwhile Cale or I mean
Party comes like Perty's actually a really really good athlete
who's also really smart, really accurate, and kind of a
gun slinger. Like he's not mister like dink and dunk guy.

(15:15):
That's not how he wants to play. He actually will
make some throws who are like Brock, you do not
need to do that. But when he's on like tonight,
he is an unsoldble force. And he's been like that
for two weeks in a row. Now I understand the
Bears defense. This isn't the eighty five group, but that
was that was really impressive because here's the thing, like

(15:36):
last week against Philip Rivers, when your defense is that shitty,
and it is that shitty, they're not good. They just
don't have the players. It's not anyone's fault. It's not
because they have a bad coordinator. It's not because they
have a bad scheme. He's had a lot of injuries.
They have no pass rush. You could not have no
pass rush in twenty twenty five, which is a passing league,

(15:57):
and have any shot at success. It's literally impossible. But
when your offense is basically scoring on every single drive,
that's what they have to do, so there is no
margin for error with the offense, especially tonight when the
game starts with him throwing it to the other team
and them scoring a touchdown. So, you know, and obviously McCaffrey,

(16:18):
who I thought for the first time all season kind
of looked like the twenty twenty three version and by
the end of the game he was in a lot
of pain, but he's you know, one thing the forty
nine ers do a really good job of is they
draft a certain type of guy. They acquire a certain
type of guy, and toughness and just physicality is a

(16:41):
huge part of their game, and Christian embodies all of that, right,
Kittle embodies that, Trent Williams embodies that, and Christian was
just was a fucking monster tonight. He was so good.
In the first half, he had over one hundred yards
and he was just fantastic. And even the final drive
when he caught that that little screen where you could

(17:03):
tell he was huffing and puffing, which a couple of
plays later his Juwan Jennings for what turns out to
be the game winner. But you know, offensively from perty
to you know, Ricky Piersoll, the night had five catches
for eighty five yards, and Kyle was just was just dialding.
I mean both these coordinators, like I said, when you
when you give them no resistance, it is not a
fair fight. I mean, you watch all these coordinators around

(17:25):
the league. Now, weather, it's an aspect. It was a
cold night in the Bay Area. It was fifty degrees right.
It's why I say it all the time. We can't
relate to these Bills games. We can't relate to you know,
a sleet, snow, ten degree game, have nothing in common
with that. We don't live it, we don't understand it.
We wait in traffic to go to Tahoe and when

(17:46):
we get too cold, we turn around and we come home.
Right and hell, I mean shit, I moved two hour
playing flight away and it's seventy two degrees a day sweated.
So I think a huge element of it's different level football.
You're not having you know, that score, if you're playing
in Lambeau last night. I understand that. But these guys,

(18:06):
if you are not rushing the passer, if guys are
wide open, they will annihilate you. And once they find
your weakness, they were just that was an incredible performance
of offensive play going. It was also a pitiful performance
of defense. You know, so one thing I wrote down. Obviously,
both these teams are going to the playoffs. I mean,

(18:27):
if the forty nine Ers win next week, and I'll
assume the Bears win next week, you're looking at the
one in two seeds. So anytime you're the one and
two seed, like you have had a fantastic season over
the you know, the aggregate of the four plus months
you've been playing football, But you have no chance to
win a super Bowl if you're playing defense like that. None.

(18:48):
I think even the most die hard forty nine er
fan would admit that after an incredible win the night,
you cannot win a super Bowl with that level of defense.
It's not possible, right, Bears fans who listen, I thought
you were gonna win the game on that final drive.
And if you had won the game and next week
somehow you would end up with the one seed, you're

(19:08):
probably gonna be the two seed no matter what. Even
if you had won the night because Seattle, then the
forty nine Ers would arrested people Seattle would have won.
You're not winning a super Bowl, even though you have
this dynamic offense, I'm saying Luther Burden reminds me like
Antonio Brown, Like that guy is good. Lovelin is. I
didn't realize that was his first drop of the season.
The two running backs, DeAndre Swift I've always thought was

(19:31):
kind of an underachiever. What Ben Johnson has done with
him this year, he looks fantastic. Obviously, Meningait stud Cole
Kmet's a good player. They're just Dj Moore. I mean,
they're stacked their offense. They don't even have Roma Dunesday,
who I would sneaky watch for to get traded this
offseason to get some defensive BILP because they don't need
all these wide receivers. But I just think that you

(19:54):
cannot go far in the playoffs. Even in twenty twenty five,
and there were people at the lead league off tonight,
cream in their pants. They yearn for the league to
look like that, point after point, no tackling, that's ah,
that's a Roger Goodell wet dream right there, No physicality,
just touchdowns, everyone playing fantasy. That's the league office have

(20:16):
dreamed about that becoming the NFL because they think that'll
draw the most casual fans, get the most women to
watch and have the greatest you know, total number of
people watching means they can charge the most and make
the most money. That's that's the whole game they're playing.
That is the game they want. Now me, I like
a little bit more resistance, but hey, you know, I

(20:37):
just grew up in the nineties. But it is what
it is. And I think we'd all have to agree
that when your defenses are that bad, your ceiling is limited,
no matter how great your play callers are. And Kyle's been,
you know, arguably a top play caller in the league
for over a decade. Ben Johnson the last couple of years,

(20:58):
I've called him the Midwest version of Kyle Now all
season long as the head coach, right, he's, as Chris
Collins were said tonight, they are a running offense. He's
got to be looking at the box score and seeing
the forty nine ers ran thirty four times for two
hundred yards. He's so jealous. He said, we only ran
twenty two times for one hundred and ten yards because
both our quarterbacks through for three hundred yards. The difference

(21:19):
in the game was the forty niners ran for one
hundred more yards on the ground. Technically, ninety. But in
that accounts for time possession, controlling the ball, not giving
the ball back to Caleb. How many times a night
did the camera pan and there's Caleb sitting on the bench.
So the best way in a situation that they're in
to play good defense is not have to play defense.

(21:42):
Keep them on the side. So the Yeah, the forty
nine ers held the ball for six and a half
more minutes and had six more first downs. So that's
that's could be the difference in an extra drive. That
could be the difference in you know, an extra touchdown,
That could be the difference in the game. It's you know,
the margin for air. It's no different in the game.
That's the final score is fifteen to thirteen or a

(22:04):
game that final scores forty two to thirty eight. It
all comes down to a first down or two, that
change of possession, that force a punt, that maybe give
you good field position. And did the Bears the Bears
didn't even turn the ball over. Bears Bears got to
be saying we didn't turn the ball over. We had

(22:25):
to pick six and our quarterback accounted for i mean
countless touchdown and we lost the game. So Caleb threw
two touchdowns, Swift ran for two touchdowns, they had to
pick six and a field goal, and they lost the game.
That's if you would have told me at the start

(22:46):
of this game that the Bears would end up with
thirty eight points, I would have said, the forty doners
probably lose, right, I would have said, yes, probably thirty
eight to thirty. You know, probably a high scoring game.
But you know, the forty niners probably definitely do not
cover and lose the instead, instead they win. So that
that was just that was fantastic. Now, listen, that was

(23:08):
a huge win for the forty nine ers. I still
I can't get over that they are in this position
to play for the number one overall seed, which would
be pretty insane that they would never have to leave. Now.
Like I said, even if they win this game against Seattle,
I still think, you know, their playoff games will be
pretty difficult given their defensive situation. But if you win

(23:34):
next week and you only got to win two sixty
minute games, right and they're both at home, which they
are desperate for a buye because I would imagine what
Trent Williams pulling his hamstring that he's out this week,
especially short week, so maybe get George Kittle back, but
you lose Trent Williams. And I do think the Trent
Williams loss will be felt more against Seattle that has,

(23:57):
you know, more pass rushing prowess, and the Seattle's defensive
line is just dramatically better than the Bears. It's a
much different game against Seattle. Now, the Chicago Bears with
Ben Johnson are a much more powerful offense than what's
going on with Seattle, who can be a little hit
or miss. They kind of are one wide receiver dependent.

(24:18):
Charbonney had a good game, but that is this has
been a huge rivalry going back to Harbaugh and Pete Carroll,
through Pete Carroll and Kyle and now Mike McDonald and Kyle.
So just a fantastic game Saturday night. Little mad that
it's not Sunday. I think we're getting a little screwed
for some reason. Aaron Rodgers at forty two years old,

(24:40):
who just I mean played one of the worst I
mean that game, not all his fault, their offense, missing guys,
but we got to watch that potentially Snoop Huntley against
Aaron Rodgers to get the four seat that's on Sunday night. Like, guys,
this isn't twenty twelve, and I like that rivalry as
much as anybody, but I feel like we can do
better now. The Bears just basically win get the two seed.

(25:04):
Tonight is gonna suck for them. Right, You were so close,
you're driving It felt like it was all about to happen.
It cannot erase what has been the most remarkable turnaround
I can remember in a while. You just won the
freaking division, right, but you want it before this game
even started, with the Packers losing last night, But that

(25:25):
is that is a massive accomplishment, right. You not only
won the division your star head coach, you made one
of the teams in your division who had just dominated
the division the last couple of years way worse because
you stole their coach. You were now in a much
better situation with coaching stability than the Green Bay Packers,

(25:46):
whose coaches. It feels crazy to say, but you know,
people that around that team say he's like coaching for
his job, which I do think he would be hired immediately.
But there's a pretty good chance they're going to go
one and done now. They're also probably going to play
the Bears in the first round, which is a pretty
interesting wild card game. But I think you hold your

(26:08):
head eye. This is a little bit of a kick
in the nuts. Anytime that you lose to a team
that could not get a stop to save their life sucks.
But you got a little greedy with the hook and ladder,
but overall, you still won the division. You're hosting a
game at Soldier Field, Like that's pretty cool. You know,
that's a really big, a really big deal for the franchise.

(26:30):
I mean, this was a franchise that was in a
bad spot. I mean, you guys had good players, but
last year was really bad. I mean last year, you
guys were like one of the laughing socks of the league,
right there with the Jets. I mean it was losing
game after game, firing coach after Thanksgiving. And now you're
playing the forty nine ers in a game for like
the one or two seed with all the marbles on

(26:53):
the table and Sunday night in front of thirty million people.
Like things changed really really fast. And as someone that
just loves football that wants the big brands, like I
wish the Giants were good. I wish some of these
other teams the Cowboys were better. It makes the league better,
especially in the NFC. It's cool to see the Bears relevant.
It's cool to see the Bears mattering because obviously the

(27:15):
Lions fell off a cliff and the Packers are just
in shambles right now with their injuries. But what a game.
What a performance by Brock Purty, Christian McCaffrey, Pearsall, I mean, Piersoll,
Piers All looks like a pretty good pick. He's gotta
stay healthy. When he can just stay on the field,
he's one of those guys. If he's on the field,
he's awesome. But he can just disappear for a month.

(27:35):
It's like, what's his injury. It's like a calf, hammy, knee, Like, well,
what's one. He's like, well, combination all three. We're not
you know, Kyle's kind of being mum about it. It's like,
well that's that's not ideal. But just what a game.
What a game. I still can't believe the hooking ladder
that was little Greedy cost him because I think if
they just run a normal play, maybe get out of bounds,

(27:57):
you get multiple plays. With the four seconds, you only
get one play and just you know, some goal line.
I don't care if you're playing the best events of
all time or the worst events of all time. If
the play doesn't hit right away, you can derail in.
Whether it's Peyton Manning, Caleb Williams, or you know, pick
shitty quarterback X. The play can fall apart really really fast,

(28:20):
and it felt like it did right there. Other than that,
I don't even know. I'm just that was crazy. That
was That was a roller coaster right. Today's show is
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New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. Let's dive into a couple

(30:25):
other things. Speaking of things that was not a roller
coaster ride, the Steelers' performance today was an embarrassment to football.
It really was. And icing on the cake that news
came out after the game that I did Darnell Washington
break his arm? So DK Metcalf is not coming back
obviously out for week eighteen because he's escape suspended. They

(30:46):
just lose a guy that they have been very dependent
on throughout the season, who's just a really good player
in Washington. Their passing game was just inept their pass
rush Myles Garrett, I should saw the clip at halftime
of the NBC said he thought they were spending more
time trying to slow him down than they were worried

(31:07):
about winning the game, which I think is kind of
trying to toot his own horn a little bit, but
I don't blame him. But part of the point is, like,
what was that. I'm so mad at myself. I had
money on them. And then the stat comes out and
me and Colin talked about it because it kind of
went viral that the last five years they have played

(31:28):
a team who has been eight games plus under five hundred,
they have lost all the games and one of them
is a tie. So basically a game in late December
as a big favorite they always lose in this situation,
and I get these divisional games. It's one thing if
you're playing a divisional opponents like, oh, you know, Cleveland's
kind of had a weird year, but they're going to
go seven to ten or eight to nine. It's like

(31:49):
they were respectable, solid team. The Cleveland Browns have been
an embarrassment. And for you to have six points the
majority of the game, the final drive, you made some
nice throws, but sometimes on those final drives, you just
it just gets a little chaotic, like that did not
represent what we watched all weekend. When you're in a

(32:10):
position if you just beat the Browns, you the next
week means nothing. You can rest everybody. For you to
lose that game, it's just I just can't take them, seriously,
I really can't. They sucked me back in a couple
of weeks ago because they were playing good football in
the DK situation, Like, let's face it, like listen, there's
a lot of information with the DK. I have no

(32:32):
clue what happened, but clearly the league is never going
to allow anyone to hit fans, to hit the customers.
That's never gonna fly. These leagues are very sensitive with
that type stuff, and he had had a lot of
issues in Seattle getting personal foul calls. They were just
kind of over him and for you to make that

(32:54):
trade and get in a position where he's literally your
only wide receiver. And even to day, Kawarr mentioned this
after the game, Jalen Warren had like twelve carries for
like sixty five to seventy yards. It was worth Why
were you so obsessed with passing it? With Aaron Rodgers, Like,
it's twenty seventeen, run the ball, and they just didn't.
They got away from it. I thought their offensive coordinator

(33:16):
is like a run game guy. So I listen most
of these things with coaches and quarterbacks and ugly. Most
people do not end in like legendary status. Most people
do not go out like Derek Jeter is last at
bat with a hit, or John Elway his last game,

(33:37):
or Peyton Manning with the Super Bowl. Usually it's pretty ugly.
And this Aaron Rodgers experience like hasn't been that ugly
start to finish, but it's been a little weird. And
I'm not blaming him, I'm not blaming Tomlin, but the combination,
the end result, like you lose the Ravens. You're gonna
go nine to eight and miss the playoffs. I don't
ever want to hear if they go, if they lose

(33:59):
this game against the Ravens, about Tomlin returning and Aaron
Rodgers returning. If I was a Steeler fan, I'd be like,
I give you the power to be like, I quit.
No fucking way, we are not doing this again. We
are not doing it a year later, a year older,
We're not going through this again. We draw a line
in the sand. Can we have some balls and go?

(34:21):
Can we make some changes? For the love of God,
I mean that being said, I wouldn't job for these
dealers end up winning this game. But we'll see if
Lamar can return. But what an embarrassment. I mean truly,
if you're a Steeler fan, that felt And they've had
some low moments over the last couple of years, weird
endings that felt low. Because one thing to lose in

(34:42):
the playoffs, to Josh Allen, to Lamar Jackson, to Kansas
City to whatever, right, it's another thing with the division
on the line, to just cruise into this last week,
get like a get like a week eighteen by essentially
because you're locked into the four seed to lose to
the cli Eveland Browns. You also lost to Joe Flack

(35:03):
on the Cincinnati Bengals earlier this season. The Bill's Philly game,
I'm not even sure what to say, because the Eagles
were kicking their ass in the first half. That defense
looked awesome. The Bill's offensive line is a problem. They're
not that good. If you have a good defensive line,
you can get after him, and they were getting after
Josh Allen. They sacked them five times. Obviously his ankles

(35:25):
a little banged up. That being said, they still had
a chance to win. Made some incredible plays on that
last drive, including a hooking ladder. And listen, when you're
a player of Josh's caliber, and in my opinion he's
one of the most talented players in the history of
the league, you just got to make that pass. You
gotta hit that ball now. At the end of the day,
making or missing that pass, it's not gonna cost them

(35:48):
the division. Clearly, the Patriots are You're gonna beat the Dolphins.
Miami's not going into New England next week in winning
like the division was over because of other previous games.
But in that spot, like you gotta win it, and
the Eagles same thing. Like the first half, AJ Brown
Jalen was playing awesome and then they have seventeen yards

(36:10):
in the second half. I don't know what to make
of either team. I know this, I do not trust
either one. Now. The Eagles have way more talent. When
they have a good offensive drive, you're like, God, they
got good players, AJ Deavante god or Saquon Like, how
do you stop this offense? And then they just disappear
and do nothing forever. And when that defense rolling like

(36:30):
it wouldn't shock me if the Eagles won a couple
of playoff games or got bounced in the first round.
I'm a little less confident, and I would love to
see the Buffalo Bills make the Super Bowl. To win
a Super Bowl, I think it would be really cool
for the league. But I'm about as confident as they're
doing that as that they might lose in the first round.
They are a bizarre team. Clearly, his ankles rolled a

(36:53):
couple times. He'll have drives where he's not moving that well,
but then the final drive he's moving pretty welldependent on
him just pulling plays out of the crevices of his body,
and when he does it, it's incredible, but you know
then then he'll just miss a wide open shaker in
the back of the end zone that would have won
the game. Now it gets back to the extra point

(37:14):
on the first touchdown. If they just execute that, they
kick an extra point, they win the game. You don't
have to go for two, which I do respect, I
guess though there's not like what do they have to lose,
But it's not like if they don't get this two
point conversion, they're losing the division. So it's kind of
with house money. They're they're locked into a wild card spot.
They feel pretty comfortable playing the Patriots, who there's a

(37:35):
decent chance there that it's the two seven and the
Patriots verst them, which will probably be a Saturday or
Sunday night game, which signed me up for that. But
I'm not confident they're winning. I know that I'm not
confident in the Bills, and they were a team that
you know, most people coming into the season thought they're
this is the year. And right now you cannot feel
confident because you have zero points going into the fourth

(37:57):
quarter of a game at home. I get the are
good on defense, but that's just unacceptable. It can't happen.
I mean, it really can't happen. Now. One of the
drives was he was stopped at the goal line essentially,
but still, I mean, that's that's one where I don't
even know what to say. It's all good. They're gonna
get judged on the playoff games and if they win

(38:18):
a couple and they're in the ANFC championship game, then
we'll forget about this moment. But I think we all
see a scenario where they easily could be a one
and done team, which is crazy to say that, you know,
I think most people would tend to agree they have
the best player in the league playing quarterback for their team.
What else happened today? Bryce Young in a game where

(38:41):
if they win, they would have won the division. Now
one of my I mean, I Seattle had to be
the biggest lock of the day. They dominate on the road.
They have a massive talent gap between them and Carolina.
Bryce Young threw for fifty four yards, Like, you're not
beating a thirteen win team when your quarterback throws for

(39:02):
fifty four yards at home. And I just think you
watch Carolina, who I have zero faith. I mean, every
once in a while, he'll make a play scrambling around.
I just don't think he's a good player. And then
Baker Mayfield threw for over three hundred yards, but he
had multiple picks. He had a fumble where he got
sacked from behind. The Bucks are in complete shambles. They've

(39:23):
lost a bunch of games in a row. They have been, like, objectively,
I feel like one of the worst teams in the
league now for a while. They find ways to lose
every game. Theyre just don't look very good when you
watch them. I mean, defensively they're in shambles. Offensively they're
getting a little healthier, but it's not like they score
a bunch of points. I think the final the score

(39:45):
to day was twenty to seventeen, but they scored a
late touchdown, like with fifty seconds left to go in
the game. So it's twenty to ten with under two
minutes to go in the game. And they're playing the Dolphins.
They're not playing the Eagles here, so I just think
this game, these are two team tams. Let's be real,
don't deserve to make the playoffs. They do not deserve

(40:05):
to make the playoffs. The only reason is because of
this stupid rule that one of these teams has to
make the playoffs. But when you watch them play, they
are not playoff teams. They are terrible. And I'll promise
you this, whoever wins that game on Saturday afternoon, and
whoever they play in the first round, everyone and their
mother is going to bet on the road team to

(40:26):
beat them. That being said, the way gambling works, Tampa
Carolina probably ends up winning the game or covering, but
that that's a terrible game Saturday. If you told me,
it's like, hey man, I'm just I gotta do some
family stuff. I'll be ready to go for Seattle in
the forty nine ers. And I love football. I wouldn't
blame you at all. Wouldn't blame you at all. Two

(40:48):
of the hottest teams in the league right now are
the Jags in the Texans. Listen, the Jags were in
a tough spot because once yesterday happens and the Colts
are eliminated, you go, are the Colts gonna mail it in? Well,
because Philip Rivers is playing, They're gonna get a spirited
effort at home, and they did. But like it was

(41:10):
just a weird spot and obviously the Texans had one,
so the Jags have to hold serve and they got
it done. So you're looking at two teams. I mean,
it is crazy to say it's it's not unrealistic to
think that the Jags and the Texans are playing each
other in the AFC Championship Game. Now, depending on the

(41:30):
way the seeding ends up, maybe they match up in
the first round. So that's not even possible, which would
be a pretty big break for the other teams in
the AFC, like the Patriots, the Bills, and the Broncos,
given that one of these two teams will get knocked
out in the first round, where they clearly are two
teams that can beat anybody. I've been high on the

(41:51):
Texans since the beginning of the season. Obviously got off
to a slow start. They're fucking good. And I'll give
the Jags air, dude, they're really good as well. And
they're they have offensive pieces. Their defense is really well good.
Their team is just so well coached. They have a
physical nature to them. That's the one thing with the
Texans and the Jacks like that they are physical football teams.

(42:13):
You know that this is not like the Niners and
the Bears. Defense like you will get cracked. So props
of those two teams because that's a division that I
think everyone kinds of shits on, like both the southern
divisions do. And the irony is the AFC South or
excuse me, the NFC South. There's not a hotter team
right now than the New Orleans Saints. See Tyler Shuck.

(42:35):
I honestly didn't watch much of the game, but I
went back and just watched all of his passes today
during halftime of the Bills Eagles game. I mean, he
looks fantastic. His deep ball accuracy, he's good over the middle,
he's got good arm strength, his athleticism, he's just good.
I mean, they're just hot. They're playing really really good football.
And I saw the stat that they did it without

(42:58):
like three of their wide receivers. They're enter their guard,
their running backs. It's like he's playing with me, you
and three other guys and just looking like a really
really good player. I love it with a guy like that.
It's like, guys, they just took him in a high
in the second round. They're like, he's done enough. They're
not gonna draft it. They weren't drafted a quarterback anyway,
this year you've seen the quarterback last, like, who are
they drafting? Speaking of drafting a quarterback, you gotta give

(43:21):
the Raiders credit. Tanking is not something that people do
in the NFL because it's kind of impossible, but they
really tried. They told Max Crosby, we're gonna refuse to
put you on the field. Brock Bauers, you're going on
into reserve, and you know what, the Giants, you're gonna
kick our ass. Now it comes down to one game
and one man standing in their way, and I would

(43:43):
not put it past him at all for Andy Reid
to attempt to ruin the Raiders season. So these are
long historic rivals, though it hasn't been obviously much of
a rivalry of the last decade plus really for the
last twenty years, because the Raiders haven't been any good.
But this is an interesting game, right because the Chiefs

(44:04):
they're rolling out a quarterback who is not any good
and they can lose clearly to anybody. They just played
the Titans a couple of weeks ago and got throttled.
So I think the Raiders, if Pete Carroll, if I'm
John Spytech and I'm Mark Davis and I'm Tom Brady,
and I go, Pete, I need you to throw this game.
I cannot have you always compete. That is not what

(44:27):
we're doing. And if he says he's not going to cooperate,
I'm probably gonna fire him next week. Anyway, I'm firing
on Monday or Tuesday, and I will give someone a
raise who will listen and cooperate with me. Because tanking
will ruin leaks. It has had a huge negative impact
in the NBA because people tank all season. In the

(44:49):
NFL's borderline impossible. Look at the Browns. They had no
business winning today. They're literally the giants. You know why,
because no players care at all about draft picks. Max
Crosby said it last week. I don't give a shit
about the draft pick. I am paid to play sixty
minutes when we play another opponent to dominate that game.

(45:10):
That there's no guarantee the draft pick. Like, listen, I
think Fernando Mendoz is a very very fascinating prospect. I've
seen a lot of fascinating prospects and not be able
to play in the NFL. So that the Raiders thing
they took care of business today in really really good fashion.
I mean, the Giants destroyed them. But this game, I'm
telling you, this thing could get weird. And if I'm

(45:30):
the chiefs, I'm Andy and Veitch, I'm sitting down with
Clark Cutt and I said, we're gonna lose this game,
and we're gonna ruin their chances at this quarterback again.
Maybe the Dante more comes out as well, but props
the Raiders because they got it done. And last but

(46:02):
not least, I saw this story today from Jay Glazer
that Arthur Blank the Falcons played tomorrow against the Rams
and really quick hard rock. Bet. I like tomorrow, I'm
gonna take the Falcons plus seven and a half. I
just think that game has some weirdness written all over it.
That thing could just get weird and really weird really quick.

(46:24):
You know, the the Rams are coming off this Thursday
night game, so they get long rest. They fired their
special teams coordinator. A lot of weird stuff's been going
on with Puka. We'll see, you know, Davante's banged up.
I just think that game would not shock me. Be
Jean Robinson, if this thing just gets weird, if it
gets weird, and if it doesn't get weird and the

(46:45):
Falcons were to lose and they just maintained a disaster.
Jay Glazer reported that Matt Ryan has been contacted by
Arthur Blank about being essentially his John Elway. What John
Elway did for the Denver Broncos. And I always like
all these guys, Philip Rivers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning,

(47:06):
if they wanted to do be a head coach, be
an offensive coordinator, be a personnel guy, they'd be incredible
their knowledge of football, their love of football. But it's
hard in all their positions. You're seeing it with Tom Brady,
Like Tom wants to kind of be the puppet master,
but he also wants to be a Baker's Bay in Florida,
which I don't blame him at all, playing golf, hanging out,
having cocktails, like fucking around on the water. I would do.

(47:30):
But you can't kind of be the John Spytechs overlord
and be screwing around, you know, in Florida. That's not
the way it works. John Elway is at Gaza Ranch
and the Madison Club in Palm Springs now, but when
he was a GM of the Broncos, he was in
the office every day because it is a twenty four
to seven job when you are the GM. And if

(47:53):
Matt Ryan does do it, and I think, listen, he
would come in behind the eight ball. Because John Elway
had run an AFL team, he had worked in business,
he had done a lot of other things. By the
time he took that role, I think it was like
twenty ten, he had been out of the league for
twelve plus years. Like doing different things, working with other aspects,

(48:13):
because being a player and being an executive or a
coach are dramatically different things. Look at Vrabel got out
of football as a player, started as a you know,
a quality control guy and worked his way up. Same
thing with Tamiko. You have to learn your craft now
the one thing you can do as a personnel guy,
because Matt Ryan's gonna be wheeling and dealing with agents

(48:33):
now he doesn't know any of these guys. You think
he can hop on the phone like John Schneider or
Howie or John Lynch and do all this stuff. You know,
John Lynch is a good example. When he got the
job right, he had never been a personnel guy. He'd
been calling games a lot like Matt Ryan. The key
is you have to hire immediately a stud your right
hand guy becomes like your pseudo GM. John Elway had

(48:57):
that when he was the GM of the Broncos. He
had Matt Russell, he had Adam Peters, he had an
elite personnel department and they built a great team. So
Matt Ryan, I don't know his knowledge of like the
scouting community, but like he's never scouted a player, and
there's a difference of game planning a guy strengths and
weaknesses and setting a draft board, setting a free agency board,

(49:21):
understanding the values of individual players based on their numbers.
He's had Tom Condon make calls to Thomas Demetrov, Matt's
gonna want one hundred and fifty million dollars seventy five guaranteed,
fucking hang up, will take nothing less. It's a little
bit different when you're on the other end of that
phone call and you have to manage down, You have
to manage up, You have to deal with an owner
like it's complicated. It's not an easy job. But I

(49:43):
respect any one of these guys that has made an
ungodly amount of money which he has and wants to
dive into the fire because there ain't off days. You're
working seven days a week. This ain't work life balance
like they talk about on Instagram. I'll promise you that
shit don't exist in the NFL. You know, even as
a player, as a quarterback, where you worked more than

(50:04):
any of the other players, you still got way more
time off than the coaches in the GMS. That's not
the way when you're an executive. So if you do
do it, there's no half in, half out. And obviously
I would imagine it would not be cheap to get
his services. But if he was going to have any success,
and it couldn't be going worse than what the hell's
been going on there, right, I mean, what they've become

(50:26):
is pretty embarrassing. And I respect Arthur Blank, you know,
going to a guy he knows, but there's a fine
line of like hiring John Elway and having him be
very successful, or what we've seen with John Lynch, and
like when Jeff Saturday hired or when Jim Mersey hired
Jeff Saturday, right, because you don't know what you don't know,

(50:48):
and you are very very dependent on other people, and
I don't know your rolodex of knowing people. Part of
the way John Lynch was able to able to hire
Adam Peters because he used to call John Elway when
he was bored and be like, can I just come
to your draft meetings? I want to just learn what
you guys are doing. That's when he was calling games
for Fox, so Elway would bring him into draft meetings.

(51:11):
Who would he sit next to Adam Peters? How he
just established a relationship And like, has Matt Ryan been
doing that? Does Matt Ryan just call you know? I
don't know Jason Leight or wherever the Falcons? Like, can
I sit on draft meetings? Has he ever seen that
side of it? Because if you haven't, there's just no
way you just show up and be like, Hey, I
want to be a venture capitalist. I work at a bank.

(51:32):
That's kind of different. Man, It's not. It doesn't really
work that way, right, So I'm fascinated. I want it
to happen. I think it's a great storyline. It's just
cool if you're a Falcons fan. But he just he
would need help and it'd be fascinating to see what
he would do if he did get the gig. But

(51:53):
I like stories like that. I always admire these guys
that just miss it. And there's just like, like I said,
there's no you can't listen. Tom Brady's improved immensely on television,
but like these stories about him telling you gotta hire
Chip Kelly and he's you know, playing nine holes like

(52:14):
it's not gonna work that way. You know, it's it's
it's it's impossible. It's not the way the sport works.
You gotta be all in what do they say, ten
toes down right, all in the deep end of the pool.
There's no like, oh, to show up, you know, a
couple of days a week remote in Like there's no
remote work in the in the National Football League. When
I when I saw the headline that Paul de Podesta

(52:36):
worked for the Browns for ten years remotely in San Diego,
I honestly never Now I don't follow the Browns like
every single day, read every article. Maybe that was a
well known thing in Cleveland Brown's land, No wonder that
was a fucking disaster. He had to live in San
Diego and work remotely with the football team. What a joke. So,

(52:57):
Matt Ryan, if you're gonna do it, make sure you
hire good personnel people, you know, good cat people, because
it's a really really hard job audios, the volume
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The Burden

The Burden

The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.

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