3 & Out - Jerry Jones has no filter, What's going on with the Bengals, Will Levis out for the season
July 22, 2025 • 32 mins
John reacts to the comments from Jerry Jones talking about Micah Parsons and how we are slowly seeing that Jones needs to start taking a step back from the media because he has no filter with the comments that he makes season after season. Next, John discusses the trouble that continues with the Bengals and how if things don't change within that organization it won't matter how well Burrow plays, the team has no shot of winning. Later, John talks about Phillip Rivers retiring and how wrong he was about Will Levis.
04:51- Jerry Jones is losing his mind
23:04 - What's going on with the Bengals
26:53 - Phillip Rivers retires
28:01 - Will Levis out for the year
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
What is going on everybody? How are we doing? John
middlecop three and our podcasts. Today, we're gonna talk a
little football because it's football season. Well not quite. We're
probably eight nine days for every team in pads. We
got the Lions and the Chargers because they're playing in
the Hall of Fame game, kind of ahead of the curve.
(00:36):
But everyone will fallow suit this week and by the
middle end of next week we'll be in pads and
hitting around the league. But today Jerry Jones had some comments.
Want to hit on the Bengals as well. We'll kind
of fly around the league and also hit on something
it really bothered me. I'm not gonna lie that I
saw on social media. They just dug deep into my
(00:56):
soul that I wanted to comment on. We're not gonna
do a mail bag day, kind of a shorter podcast.
We'll do a huge mail bag tomorrow. So at job
Middlecoff is my Instagram firing those dms. Any football question,
any question in general, fire in those dms, get your
questions answered on the show. So we typically always include
(01:16):
that with the podcast. But we're just easing into this
season and we'll do a big, big mail bag as
part of anything that happens around the league as well tomorrow,
So firing those dms. If you listen on Collins feed,
make sure you subscribe to three and Out. Also YouTube,
got you covered. Subscribe to the channel as well. But
before we touch on Jerry Jones and the Cowboys, you know,
(01:38):
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lowest price guarantee. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys. I think
we have to acknowledge something that there are a lot
of parallels with Jerry and the Cowboys, going into as
he's been in his eighties to the final stretch of
(03:06):
Al Davis and the Raiders. It becomes a little chaotic
because of the owner, and obviously there are financial differences
the Cowboys if they became up for sale. We just
saw the Lakers be valued at ten billion dollars. I
think it's fair to say that the Cowboys would go
for double that, and their financial revenue ability is second
(03:31):
to none, and their brand is worldwide. They're definitely the biggest,
which is crazy because they haven't won a super bowling
along since the mid nineties. They are a cash cow
and Jerry's a huge part of that. And let me
say this, I admire Jerry the businessman because I think
people that I've always looked up to in any walk
(03:52):
of life, especially you know, when it comes to business
or sports or just professional endeavors, typically have some kahonas
have a little shit to him and have had points
and time in their life when they've had to make
a big decision and they've put their nuts on the table,
and Jerry obviously did that in the late eighties. His
(04:14):
stories well documented of self made guy who bought the
Cowboys when he didn't even really have the money. So
I respect that. But I'm also old enough to bet
around the block a few times and know a few
people that work in family businesses, clearly not as big
as the Cowboys, but successful operations. And anytime the quote
(04:35):
unquote patriarch, the old man, whether it's the dad the grandpa,
makes a lot of money and doesn't need anybody anymore,
yet is still involved in the operation. The older he gets,
sometimes the more difficult he becomes. He's not going to
listen to anybody. And I think when you look at
the current climate of sports, there's a consistent theme when
(04:57):
it comes to these negotiations. One the money being given
out in the team sports in America, Baseball, basketball, and
obviously football has never been greater. Pro sports and pro
athletes in my life have always made a lot of money.
The amount they are making now is I try not
(05:17):
to become numb to talking about it because of how
big the sums are. But the more and more you
see these numbers get thrown around just kind of becomes normal.
Even though when you are paying people hundreds of millions
of dollars, it's the equivalent of some of these people
that sell their tech companies. I mean, it's crazy how
much these guys are accumulating right now in professional sports.
(05:40):
And Jerry, you know, when I grew up anyone my
age in the nineties, pro sports was a lot more raw.
You would have a lot of public fights between coaches
and players, gms and players and owners in players. Social
media didn't exist, so when you would have track talks
(06:01):
or trade talks. It was just kind of no holds bar.
There was not a filter typically on either side. And
now we have kind of become a corporate version of that.
There is just too much on the line, right. There
was a lot of money on the line back then,
but the numbers have exponentially grown. So most negotiations in
(06:25):
most sports, especially football, when you hear the GM, the
coach and the owner talk, they typically don't say anything.
They give you the kind of go to, kind of
corporate jargon of we're gonna keep this in house. This
is between us and his representation. This is we do
(06:47):
not make our negotiations public. I'll give the Browns credit
when Jimmy has or when Miles Garrett went to the
Super Bowl and said I want to trade. I want
fucking out of here. It's like Stude's going on the
Super Bowl car wash and telling us how he feels.
I was like, if I was the Browns, I trade
(07:07):
him right now for like two ones and two twos.
It's you got an excuse to get rid of them.
Your team's gonna suck anyway, you might as well utilize
this powerful asset. But Jimmy Haslam said no because Miles
Garrett and Clutch, who represents him, said we want a meeting,
and Jimmy Haslam said, not so fast, my friend, No meeting.
Discuss the business with Andrew Berry, and Andrew Berry said,
(07:29):
we're not trading you. We want to keep you. We
plan on paying you. That was kind of it. We
just saw TJ. Watt get a huge contract. It wasn't
a public negotiation. Most of these come Fred Warrener, George Kittle,
not a public negotiation. Yeah, with Jerry Jones, give a
listen because today he gave as he does every single year,
(07:51):
kind of the state of the franchise, which most gms
and coaches do at the start of training camp this week,
I'm sure there'll be one with less Need and McVay.
I'm sure there was one with Jim harbaughd and Joe Ortiz,
just like in the next couple of days, Howie Roseman
and Nick Sirianni, Kyle Shanahan and John Lynch. Very normal,
that's normal business. You know you don't see at any
(08:12):
of these places is the owner standing right there. Let's
take a listen to Jerry.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
Today, just because we signed him doesn't mean we're going
to have him. He was hurt six games last year. Seriously,
we've signed I remember signing a player for the highest
paid at the position in the league and he got
knocked out two thirds of the year Dark Prescott. So
there's a lot of things you can think about when
(08:38):
you just as the player does, when you're thinking about
committing and guaranteeing money.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
I think one thing we all learn, for any of you,
obviously if you're married in a serious relationship, something you
learn as you get a little older as a guy
is like you don't need to say everything that comes
into your head, right, And I think this works for
your personal relationships, your professional relationships. Hell, I've really taken
this tactic on social media. I'm like, I got a
(09:06):
lot of thoughts. I used to share way too many
of them just because like, what's the point. Just keep
some stuff to yourself, right, And it's so different in
negotiations with the Rooneyes and TJ. Watt, Like sometimes it's
gonna get ugly behind the scenes. You know what no
one gets to know about that it's not all you know, rainbows,
(09:26):
unicorns and party. Right. Sometimes I'm sure there are things
said that like, god damn, this is called negotiation. They
don't do it in public because, you know why, there's
nothing to be gained. And in the eighties and the nineties,
when Jerry became a household name, that's how you did business,
and it was suitable. It was actually very normal. It
(09:49):
was not you weren't going against the grain if you
told the media, which obviously got back to the player,
how you felt and how things were going. That doesn't
take place anymore one these negotiations. There's so much money
in the line, who does it behoove to create a
more chaotic situation. Two, with social media, everything gets magnified
(10:14):
to the one hundredth degree. Now it just makes it
a more chaotic situation for your player. And listen, as
you get older, you can handle things said to you
that you couldn't before. But in pro sports, especially football,
when you are giving a player, as the Cowboys are
going to do with Micah Parsons, because the moment you
(10:34):
don't trade them before the draft, you are going to
pay him. And Jerry did this with Ceedee Lamb. He's
gonna do it again with Michael Parsons. You're gonna pay
him the most money in the history of the NFL
for a pass rusher that's going to happen. It's inevitable. Now,
you can argue over a couple million here and there,
but we know the number. So Jerry putting this out there.
You're dealing with a guy just like any team would
(10:55):
be the first extension you give a player somewhere between
the ages of twenty four and twenty so, unlike if
you're doing negotiations with some sixty five year old who's
been through the ringer for decades in business. He can
handle a lie. He's got thick skin. Just the reason
a lot of these guys have representation because going to
Drew Rosenhaus, going to Tom Condon, going to whoever, they've
(11:16):
seen it all. They've heard it all. They're not Jimmy
Haslam or excuse me, Jimmy Sexton doesn't get offended at
every time that you come back to a counter in negotiations.
You know why he's been negotiating these contracts for decades.
He's seen it all. Michael Parsons, this is the first
big contract of his life. This is more money than
(11:38):
he probably ever could have dreamed of a decade ago.
And you got the owner coming out and making comments
which are factual. He missed games, factual Dak Prescott shattered
his ankle. We all know that. But what good does
that do? And while it's a different situation than Al
Davis in the late two thousands, the parallels to me
(12:01):
feel like the owner aging not gracefully, doesn't know how
to pivot as times have pivoted. Unlike the Raiders, the
Cowboys don't have financial issues, but they do have an
ownership issue. They do have a guy that you could
see the look on Brian Schottenheimer's face if he saw
the video. Stephen, I would imagine, is not going to
(12:23):
do this whenever Jerry is no longer around, because it
makes it more difficult. You don't need to create animosity
in these negotiations. Here's the other thing Jerry has said
before this, we would rather pay a little more and
get it right. I would agree with that statement if
(12:43):
you're talking about free agents, because typically you've got to
pay more in free agency. You pay a you know,
a thirty forty fifty sticker price to get the guy services,
and for the most part you're not dealing with the
elite players. That's why they hit free agency but Jerry
says that, and most of the time he's giving out
these huge contracts to guys he's drafted. So when you
(13:07):
sign a guy you've drafted, no one knows that player
better than yourself. I remember, like, in the scouting process,
you get to know a guy, You get to know
the coaches, you get to know the assistance. And I
saw it when I was a GA and I watched
our guys get scouted, and you do all this work
on obviously the player, but the character, the love of football,
(13:29):
their work ethic, their toughness, their mental toughness, just how
good a guy they are to just how they treat people.
All that shit right, and you feel really good about
it and maybe pound the table in the draft room,
But until you get the guy in the building, you
don't realize how important he is to you as a player,
right the Chiefs did. We'll get into George Carloftis and
(13:50):
Trent McDuffie, and you know the guys they drafted who
are everything that they want in a guy. The Ravens
have been doing this forever. The Steelers are good at this,
to get your type players and just tough, old school
football guys. But Jerry, you drafted these guys like you've
been around them all the time, You've seen him as
a player through the good and the bad, Like, so
(14:12):
what are you waiting for? So I just assume that
the Cowboys are gonna pay mic historic amount of money
in about four or five weeks because that's what they've
consistently done with Dak So they did a couple of
years ago or last year with CD, and that's what
they'll do with Michah Parsons. But you just kind of
create this weirdness in your organization that you just gave
(14:34):
a first time head coach a job that let's face it,
I don't just like shitting on this guy because I
feel like that's the easy thing to do, but no
one else is giving him a head coaching job. Brian
Schottenheiber was not going to be a head coach for
anyone else, even though a decade plus ago he was
a coaching candidate, turned some jobs down, career went the
other way and it looked like it was never going
(14:55):
to become a head coach. But in twenty twenty five,
Jerry Jones was the only guy giving him a job.
And let's face it, like the players aren't idiots. He's
probably one of the lowest paid coaches in the league.
So Jerry a lot like Al Davis is. This guy
doesn't have me juice. Why'd I fucking listen to this guy?
If I'm good enough, I'll just do whatever I want.
Jerry's mad at me, but I was like, I'll just
(15:15):
go to him. And if you look around the league,
and this is what I said about, once training camp starts,
the GM and head coach will give a press conference,
and for the most part, maybe a GMS will do
like Coward Show or come on a podcast or whatever,
but they don't talk all the time. Right, the coach
is the voice of the organization because he's the boss.
(15:39):
And when the players think that, like, hey, if I
screw up, Kyle Shanahan's gonna bench me if I don't
run this route, right like Sean McVay is gonna cut
me and put me back on the practice squad. For
two plus decades, you knew Bill Belichick was in charge.
He didn't sign the checks, he didn't own the team,
but Bill was in charge. You screw up in Kansas
(16:01):
City like you answer to Andy, and that's the healthy
way to run an organization. Yet with the Cowboys, I
would say the Bengals on the same way, like you know,
the owners in charge. Even Shamar Stewart's agent said today
because Duke Tobin's like we need him here, said that,
like he shouldn't be talking. He's not running point on
(16:21):
this negotiation. It's above his pay grade, which is an
all timeline from an agent. But he's saying it because
that guy's not running point in the organization. He's not
in charge the owners of the GM And when you
run organizations like that, and let's face it, we like
Joe Burrow a lot more than we like Dak Prescott,
it's hard to win. It's why most people, despite having
(16:42):
Joe Burrow, Jamar Chase T. Higgins, you just bet against
the Bengals. It's why the Cowboys, it's like I actually
think they probably could be a little better than people think.
I think most people think they're just gonna suck. Wouldn't
shock me if they're just competitive, probably not a playoff team,
but like I could see them in mix to be
like eight nine wins. But I just could see them
(17:03):
in quode right and just quit on. Brian Shotdneimer and
that's just kind of what happens is your organization becomes
like this owner centric guy. This is not like George
Steinbrenner nineteen ninety six. Those days are over. Most of
these owners don't say shit. They just look at the
Excel spreadsheet and the money flowing in and they let
their GM and their head coach handle everything. Obviously they
(17:26):
get involved at the highest level, but they never talk.
They only talk. Win kind of forced a couple owners
meetings and that might be it, and maybe if they
fire a coach, but if things are going well, like
they're not gonna speak yet, Jerry can't help himself, like
he has to be the star of the franchise. And
it's it's kind of sad because I grew up the
(17:47):
Cowboys were a really big deal.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
They were the.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
Biggest deal in the NFL, right there with the forty
nine ers, the rivalry, and then to the late nineties,
what happened to him. Jerry's ego got in the way,
and you could argue his ego has been in charge
ever since. And beside like the ability to get parcels
and get that stadium built, which is cool, I've been there.
It's you know, it's crazy. It's probably almost not far
(18:09):
away from being like twenty years old, but awesome accomplishment.
What are his highlights last twenty five years? Seriously? And
he really only has himself to blame. But I also like,
I've been around not at the level of Jerry's well,
but enough successful old guys in their seventies, in their eighties.
My dad was a farmer, right, I knew a lot
(18:31):
of old school farmers. Usually doesn't age well. They talk
about how we did things back in the day. It's like, well,
that's thirty years ago. You might want to pivot here, buddy,
And I just think Jerry's pivoted as poorly as anybody
when it comes to just like times have changed. Man. Okay,
(18:58):
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Speaker 2 (20:47):
Couple other things. We kind of hit on the Bengals there,
but it's just it's really hard to overcome. I think
it's really hard to overcome chaos. You know. It's why
so many people that grow up in chaos. We all
have known them, maybe you did. You know, any situation
when you're young that impacts you the rest of your
(21:07):
life and as you get older, chaotic situations can really
derail you. And it's why the Bengals they have multiple
guys holding out a rookie, their star pass rusher. It's
kind of been a consistent theme in this organization. Despite
like they've drafted pretty well over the years, They've had
some pretty good teams on paper, but it's like kind
(21:28):
of always the same thing, you know, And I just
like I was just bet against the Bengals. No matter
you can tell me Joe Burrow throws fifty touchdowns, I'd
be like, yeah, it's still gonna be tough for them
to overcome the Mike Brown operation because that's not changing.
And I don't like tried to really read up onto
(21:49):
the situation with the rookie in the language. You know,
Florio's got an agenda. He's obviously on the agent side.
Mike Brown claims that like this is only this clause.
It's just about like go to jail or something. You know.
It's like, I don't know, it just shouldn't be this complicated,
That's what I know. It just should not be this complicated.
And it's always kind of sometimes that complicated with Mike Brown.
(22:12):
You know, think about a place that the Kanasae Chiefs
and they just are of a lot of credit that
several years ago. Let's face it, I mean, it's it's
aged incredibly well. At the time, even I thought, like
coach reid Man, feature are you sure you want to
trade Tyreek Hill. He's one of the great players we've
ever seen in the peak of his powers, and you
guys are gonna punt on him, like, yeah, we're just
we're just not comfortable, probably some things that we know
(22:35):
that you don't know, and we're just not paying them
thirty million dollars a year. So they punted and they
traded him before the draft. So they had two first
round picks and they got Trent McDuffie and George Karlofski's
Carloff diss. They just gave George a four year, ninety
three million dollar extension I think like sixty million dollars guaranteed,
And just knowing guys there, they love these two guys.
(22:58):
They love these two guys, and that draft, specifically those
two individuals has been a big reason. With Chris Jones
and Spags, they were a defensive team in the last
two years despite having winning the one of the great
offensive coaches and quarterbacks in the history of the sport.
And it's not just these guys are good players. McDuffie's
(23:20):
a really good starter, Carloffs is a really good starter.
I don't know if either of them are like Hall
of Fame, all time great players, but they're type. They're
championship level players, and they're winning players, and they're everything
you want off the field. From away, they operate from away,
they work from away. They play and or prepare to play.
(23:43):
And I think the Chiefs are a good example of
even when weird shit happens, they just feel we got
it handled, Like the Rashi Riice situation, he's gonna get suspended, Like, well,
we got it handled. When these situations happen with some
of these other teams, like, I don't know, man, So
you know the Chiefs, They've spent some money this offseason,
(24:04):
Trey Smith, Carl loftis and they're just paying money to
their type guys, right. And to be a good football
player in the NFL, I don't think much has changed
from previous generations. Obviously, you've got to be good and
have the physical capabilities, but your practice habits, how mentally
(24:25):
and physically tough you are, how serious you take football,
how much you want it. All the intangible stuff matters
now as much as it ever did. Philip Rivers. If
you told me when did Philip Rivers retire, it'd be
like five years ago announce his retirement. Today, I saw
a headline Philip Rivers announces his retirement. Hasn't Phil Rivers
(24:49):
been coaching the high school team for like three or
four years. Isn't his son like one of the big
recruits in the country. Kind of plays and throws just
like him. I think he's gonna end up at NC State,
but I don't know. Maybe he's fifteen sixteen years old. Obviously,
Rivers has like seventy five kids. But I just laughed
out loud when I saw Philip Rivers announce his retirement.
(25:10):
I always enjoyed Philip. I said this forever. I saw
within the last couple of weeks that Drew Brees is
gonna call one of the Netflix games on Christmas and listen.
I have a lot of respect for Drew. Obviously, it's
one of the all time great players of his generation.
Hall of Famer. I think he'd be an excellent like
GM or offensive coordinator, head coach. He's terrible on TV.
(25:31):
I mean, he's just not we're in the entertainment business.
He's not entertaining. I think Philip would have been awesome
on TV. I mean, Taylor made for definitely for the networks,
doesn't swear animated, excited. I think there's like a John
Madden kind of jovial, but the player version, I think
he would have been a star. Now I don't know
(25:52):
if he's ever gonna do it, but if I ran
a network, I know these networks are just they have
a hard on for like getting the most famous guy possible.
We've seen time and time again that is not and
obviously Phillip's not as famous as some of these other
guys that get these gigs, or he's not a former
cowboy quarterback. I would just keep hitting him up because
if he ever just retires from high school coaching and
(26:14):
get him in the booth, I think he would be
a star. Will Levis gotta be one of my all time.
It could have been heat of the moment, but I
remember watching a couple of times his junior year, so
the year before he declared, I definitely put this out
on the old Twitter. Then I thought he could be
the number one pick in the draft. Now I gotta listen.
I got a little thing for strong arm quarterbacks, and
(26:37):
Liam Cohen was his offensive coordinator. Kentucky was really good.
Liam Leaves Scangarello comes in his senior year. Will Levis
is just not really good. Has some games that you're
just shaking your head. Obviously, falls out of the first round,
goes to the Titans, gets shoulder surgery today, he's out
for the season. Unofficially, it ends his Titan career. He's
(26:58):
not gonna be the Titans ever again. After this, it
crossed my mind today. Now there are some years where
a team has like seven injuries at quarterback, you never
say never. I do think going into a season you
can just probably cross Will Levis never again be in
a too deep because you wouldn't want him as a
backup quarterback, right He's just too terrible, kind of a
(27:19):
screw around guy, and honestly, your backup quarterback you would
just want, if anything, to be really really limited. And
understand that. The problem with Will Levis is he thinks
he's like Patrick Mahomes or Josh Allen, and he clearly
is not. And he's just not instinctive. He's just not good.
I mean, there's just no way around it. Now he
has this major injury shoulder. But you know the Titans
(27:40):
cam Ward and cyon Ard to Will Levis. I want
to end on this because I think a lot of
you either have this happen to you or know people
that it has impacted. I started losing my hair in
my early twenties. My dad was bald, My uncles are bald,
(28:02):
my cousins are bald, My brother is bald. Keep my
fingers crossed than my son because it's my mother's or
his mother's jeans will not be bald. But the genetics
in my family when it comes to hair, let's say,
we're not exactly uh you know, Brad pitten River runs
through it. But here's the thing, we've come a long way.
(28:23):
Like when I was a kid, my dad, who was bald,
used to have like the the way worse version of
Trump's hair, right, he grew out the sides and he
had the comb over. I could never do that. Luckily.
The stigma of being bald, whether it's uh, you know,
finding someone to date you definitely, Hollywood, these guys are
(28:46):
wearing wigs. You could not be bald and be quote
unquote famous back in the day. Now, you know, from
Joe Rogan to Jason Statham to Bruce Willis, uh to obviously,
like we've had a fucking renaissance being bald. We're all
cool with it. No one cares. You can shape bit
(29:06):
your head that didn't exist like twenty five years ago.
The rock. I mean, we've had we've had a great run.
The stigma of being bald no longer exists. And I
didn't have a receding hairline right, which is a slow burn.
I had the hair falling off all over the top
of my head and a huge bald spot in the
back that was working its way forward. A lot of
(29:27):
you guys are receding, and you kind of hold on
for dear life. It's like a boat taken on water.
You know, you try to, you try to patch it up,
but then another hole pops and you just you can't
keep the boat above the water. So listen, I can.
I understand where you're coming from. And I think most
of us, especially if you're young, if you don't have
(29:48):
a significant other, you just like, can I am I
going to find a girl if I don't have any hair?
In mind, that's that's your biggest insecurity as a guy.
And then you realize, no chicks. I remember the first
time I ever shaped my head started dating and chicks
loved it, and I was like, who even cares? And
you realize you don't even look back, and then you
see all these other bald guys and you're like, God,
We're just a community that's thriving. Scotty Scheffler, who is
(30:13):
clearly has a receiving hairline, is crushing it. He's made
eighty five million dollars on the golf course like the
last three years. He is charting a path that I
don't want to say Tiger, but is passing a lot
of the all time greats. And if he can stay
healthy for a couple more years, he's clearly gonna go
down as one of the great players of all time.
He wins his fourth major, the oldest major, a place
(30:36):
where golf was invented, Scotland, Ireland, the Open. Taylor made
his probably is him and Nike, and Taylor made his
biggest sponsor put out these social media eclips. Was Scotty
celebrating on the eighteenth victory with his hat off and
you can see his receiving hairline, except Taylor made they
(30:59):
messed with the picture. They photo shopped his hair, They
refused to let him be bald, and I'm not gonna lie.
I was hurt by it. I played Tailor made clubs.
I love my irons. That the best set of irons
I've ever owned. But for them to do that, someone
in Taylor Made's digital department looked at Scotty and said,
(31:21):
we're not gonna allow a bald guy in this moment,
despite him balding sad because I thought we didn't just
have a renaissance. I thought the stigma of being bald
was basically over that. It's okay, and listen part of
he's married, he's got a kid, he's rich. He can
be bald, he can have hair, none of it matters.
(31:43):
So the greatest golfer of all time, Tiger Woods. I
don't know if you've seen him with his hat off,
especially through his late thirties early, you know, throughout his forties,
bald is a bat. I mean, Tiger has about as
many hairs as I do. Sad day, though Taylor Made,
I expected more as someone who's you don't sponsor me.
(32:03):
I've paid for your product. I appreciate your product. I
play your balls too. To do that to his hairline, man,
come on, haven't we come farther than that?
Speaker 1 (32:17):
The volume
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
What is going on everybody? How are we doing? John
middlecop three and our podcasts. Today, we're gonna talk a
little football because it's football season. Well not quite. We're
probably eight nine days for every team in pads. We
got the Lions and the Chargers because they're playing in
the Hall of Fame game, kind of ahead of the curve.
(00:36):
But everyone will fallow suit this week and by the
middle end of next week we'll be in pads and
hitting around the league. But today Jerry Jones had some comments.
Want to hit on the Bengals as well. We'll kind
of fly around the league and also hit on something
it really bothered me. I'm not gonna lie that I
saw on social media. They just dug deep into my
(00:56):
soul that I wanted to comment on. We're not gonna
do a mail bag day, kind of a shorter podcast.
We'll do a huge mail bag tomorrow. So at job
Middlecoff is my Instagram firing those dms. Any football question,
any question in general, fire in those dms, get your
questions answered on the show. So we typically always include
(01:16):
that with the podcast. But we're just easing into this
season and we'll do a big, big mail bag as
part of anything that happens around the league as well tomorrow,
So firing those dms. If you listen on Collins feed,
make sure you subscribe to three and Out. Also YouTube,
got you covered. Subscribe to the channel as well. But
before we touch on Jerry Jones and the Cowboys, you know,
(01:38):
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lowest price guarantee. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys. I think
we have to acknowledge something that there are a lot
of parallels with Jerry and the Cowboys, going into as
he's been in his eighties to the final stretch of
(03:06):
Al Davis and the Raiders. It becomes a little chaotic
because of the owner, and obviously there are financial differences
the Cowboys if they became up for sale. We just
saw the Lakers be valued at ten billion dollars. I
think it's fair to say that the Cowboys would go
for double that, and their financial revenue ability is second
(03:31):
to none, and their brand is worldwide. They're definitely the biggest,
which is crazy because they haven't won a super bowling
along since the mid nineties. They are a cash cow
and Jerry's a huge part of that. And let me
say this, I admire Jerry the businessman because I think
people that I've always looked up to in any walk
(03:52):
of life, especially you know, when it comes to business
or sports or just professional endeavors, typically have some kahonas
have a little shit to him and have had points
and time in their life when they've had to make
a big decision and they've put their nuts on the table,
and Jerry obviously did that in the late eighties. His
(04:14):
stories well documented of self made guy who bought the
Cowboys when he didn't even really have the money. So
I respect that. But I'm also old enough to bet
around the block a few times and know a few
people that work in family businesses, clearly not as big
as the Cowboys, but successful operations. And anytime the quote
(04:35):
unquote patriarch, the old man, whether it's the dad the grandpa,
makes a lot of money and doesn't need anybody anymore,
yet is still involved in the operation. The older he gets,
sometimes the more difficult he becomes. He's not going to
listen to anybody. And I think when you look at
the current climate of sports, there's a consistent theme when
(04:57):
it comes to these negotiations. One the money being given
out in the team sports in America, Baseball, basketball, and
obviously football has never been greater. Pro sports and pro
athletes in my life have always made a lot of money.
The amount they are making now is I try not
(05:17):
to become numb to talking about it because of how
big the sums are. But the more and more you
see these numbers get thrown around just kind of becomes normal.
Even though when you are paying people hundreds of millions
of dollars, it's the equivalent of some of these people
that sell their tech companies. I mean, it's crazy how
much these guys are accumulating right now in professional sports.
(05:40):
And Jerry, you know, when I grew up anyone my
age in the nineties, pro sports was a lot more raw.
You would have a lot of public fights between coaches
and players, gms and players and owners in players. Social
media didn't exist, so when you would have track talks
(06:01):
or trade talks. It was just kind of no holds bar.
There was not a filter typically on either side. And
now we have kind of become a corporate version of that.
There is just too much on the line, right. There
was a lot of money on the line back then,
but the numbers have exponentially grown. So most negotiations in
(06:25):
most sports, especially football, when you hear the GM, the
coach and the owner talk, they typically don't say anything.
They give you the kind of go to, kind of
corporate jargon of we're gonna keep this in house. This
is between us and his representation. This is we do
(06:47):
not make our negotiations public. I'll give the Browns credit
when Jimmy has or when Miles Garrett went to the
Super Bowl and said I want to trade. I want
fucking out of here. It's like Stude's going on the
Super Bowl car wash and telling us how he feels.
I was like, if I was the Browns, I trade
(07:07):
him right now for like two ones and two twos.
It's you got an excuse to get rid of them.
Your team's gonna suck anyway, you might as well utilize
this powerful asset. But Jimmy Haslam said no because Miles
Garrett and Clutch, who represents him, said we want a meeting,
and Jimmy Haslam said, not so fast, my friend, No meeting.
Discuss the business with Andrew Berry, and Andrew Berry said,
(07:29):
we're not trading you. We want to keep you. We
plan on paying you. That was kind of it. We
just saw TJ. Watt get a huge contract. It wasn't
a public negotiation. Most of these come Fred Warrener, George Kittle,
not a public negotiation. Yeah, with Jerry Jones, give a
listen because today he gave as he does every single year,
(07:51):
kind of the state of the franchise, which most gms
and coaches do at the start of training camp this week,
I'm sure there'll be one with less Need and McVay.
I'm sure there was one with Jim harbaughd and Joe Ortiz,
just like in the next couple of days, Howie Roseman
and Nick Sirianni, Kyle Shanahan and John Lynch. Very normal,
that's normal business. You know you don't see at any
(08:12):
of these places is the owner standing right there. Let's
take a listen to Jerry.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
Today, just because we signed him doesn't mean we're going
to have him. He was hurt six games last year. Seriously,
we've signed I remember signing a player for the highest
paid at the position in the league and he got
knocked out two thirds of the year Dark Prescott. So
there's a lot of things you can think about when
(08:38):
you just as the player does, when you're thinking about
committing and guaranteeing money.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
I think one thing we all learn, for any of you,
obviously if you're married in a serious relationship, something you
learn as you get a little older as a guy
is like you don't need to say everything that comes
into your head, right, And I think this works for
your personal relationships, your professional relationships. Hell, I've really taken
this tactic on social media. I'm like, I got a
(09:06):
lot of thoughts. I used to share way too many
of them just because like, what's the point. Just keep
some stuff to yourself, right, And it's so different in
negotiations with the Rooneyes and TJ. Watt, Like sometimes it's
gonna get ugly behind the scenes. You know what no
one gets to know about that it's not all you know, rainbows,
(09:26):
unicorns and party. Right. Sometimes I'm sure there are things
said that like, god damn, this is called negotiation. They
don't do it in public because, you know why, there's
nothing to be gained. And in the eighties and the nineties,
when Jerry became a household name, that's how you did business,
and it was suitable. It was actually very normal. It
(09:49):
was not you weren't going against the grain if you
told the media, which obviously got back to the player,
how you felt and how things were going. That doesn't
take place anymore one these negotiations. There's so much money
in the line, who does it behoove to create a
more chaotic situation. Two, with social media, everything gets magnified
(10:14):
to the one hundredth degree. Now it just makes it
a more chaotic situation for your player. And listen, as
you get older, you can handle things said to you
that you couldn't before. But in pro sports, especially football,
when you are giving a player, as the Cowboys are
going to do with Micah Parsons, because the moment you
(10:34):
don't trade them before the draft, you are going to
pay him. And Jerry did this with Ceedee Lamb. He's
gonna do it again with Michael Parsons. You're gonna pay
him the most money in the history of the NFL
for a pass rusher that's going to happen. It's inevitable. Now,
you can argue over a couple million here and there,
but we know the number. So Jerry putting this out there.
You're dealing with a guy just like any team would
(10:55):
be the first extension you give a player somewhere between
the ages of twenty four and twenty so, unlike if
you're doing negotiations with some sixty five year old who's
been through the ringer for decades in business. He can
handle a lie. He's got thick skin. Just the reason
a lot of these guys have representation because going to
Drew Rosenhaus, going to Tom Condon, going to whoever, they've
(11:16):
seen it all. They've heard it all. They're not Jimmy
Haslam or excuse me, Jimmy Sexton doesn't get offended at
every time that you come back to a counter in negotiations.
You know why he's been negotiating these contracts for decades.
He's seen it all. Michael Parsons, this is the first
big contract of his life. This is more money than
(11:38):
he probably ever could have dreamed of a decade ago.
And you got the owner coming out and making comments
which are factual. He missed games, factual Dak Prescott shattered
his ankle. We all know that. But what good does
that do? And while it's a different situation than Al
Davis in the late two thousands, the parallels to me
(12:01):
feel like the owner aging not gracefully, doesn't know how
to pivot as times have pivoted. Unlike the Raiders, the
Cowboys don't have financial issues, but they do have an
ownership issue. They do have a guy that you could
see the look on Brian Schottenheimer's face if he saw
the video. Stephen, I would imagine, is not going to
(12:23):
do this whenever Jerry is no longer around, because it
makes it more difficult. You don't need to create animosity
in these negotiations. Here's the other thing Jerry has said
before this, we would rather pay a little more and
get it right. I would agree with that statement if
(12:43):
you're talking about free agents, because typically you've got to
pay more in free agency. You pay a you know,
a thirty forty fifty sticker price to get the guy services,
and for the most part you're not dealing with the
elite players. That's why they hit free agency but Jerry
says that, and most of the time he's giving out
these huge contracts to guys he's drafted. So when you
(13:07):
sign a guy you've drafted, no one knows that player
better than yourself. I remember, like, in the scouting process,
you get to know a guy, You get to know
the coaches, you get to know the assistance. And I
saw it when I was a GA and I watched
our guys get scouted, and you do all this work
on obviously the player, but the character, the love of football,
(13:29):
their work ethic, their toughness, their mental toughness, just how
good a guy they are to just how they treat people.
All that shit right, and you feel really good about
it and maybe pound the table in the draft room,
But until you get the guy in the building, you
don't realize how important he is to you as a player,
right the Chiefs did. We'll get into George Carloftis and
(13:50):
Trent McDuffie, and you know the guys they drafted who
are everything that they want in a guy. The Ravens
have been doing this forever. The Steelers are good at this,
to get your type players and just tough, old school
football guys. But Jerry, you drafted these guys like you've
been around them all the time, You've seen him as
a player through the good and the bad, Like, so
(14:12):
what are you waiting for? So I just assume that
the Cowboys are gonna pay mic historic amount of money
in about four or five weeks because that's what they've
consistently done with Dak So they did a couple of
years ago or last year with CD, and that's what
they'll do with Michah Parsons. But you just kind of
create this weirdness in your organization that you just gave
(14:34):
a first time head coach a job that let's face it,
I don't just like shitting on this guy because I
feel like that's the easy thing to do, but no
one else is giving him a head coaching job. Brian
Schottenheiber was not going to be a head coach for
anyone else, even though a decade plus ago he was
a coaching candidate, turned some jobs down, career went the
other way and it looked like it was never going
(14:55):
to become a head coach. But in twenty twenty five,
Jerry Jones was the only guy giving him a job.
And let's face it, like the players aren't idiots. He's
probably one of the lowest paid coaches in the league.
So Jerry a lot like Al Davis is. This guy
doesn't have me juice. Why'd I fucking listen to this guy?
If I'm good enough, I'll just do whatever I want.
Jerry's mad at me, but I was like, I'll just
(15:15):
go to him. And if you look around the league,
and this is what I said about, once training camp starts,
the GM and head coach will give a press conference,
and for the most part, maybe a GMS will do
like Coward Show or come on a podcast or whatever,
but they don't talk all the time. Right, the coach
is the voice of the organization because he's the boss.
(15:39):
And when the players think that, like, hey, if I
screw up, Kyle Shanahan's gonna bench me if I don't
run this route, right like Sean McVay is gonna cut
me and put me back on the practice squad. For
two plus decades, you knew Bill Belichick was in charge.
He didn't sign the checks, he didn't own the team,
but Bill was in charge. You screw up in Kansas
(16:01):
City like you answer to Andy, and that's the healthy
way to run an organization. Yet with the Cowboys, I
would say the Bengals on the same way, like you know,
the owners in charge. Even Shamar Stewart's agent said today
because Duke Tobin's like we need him here, said that,
like he shouldn't be talking. He's not running point on
(16:21):
this negotiation. It's above his pay grade, which is an
all timeline from an agent. But he's saying it because
that guy's not running point in the organization. He's not
in charge the owners of the GM And when you
run organizations like that, and let's face it, we like
Joe Burrow a lot more than we like Dak Prescott,
it's hard to win. It's why most people, despite having
(16:42):
Joe Burrow, Jamar Chase T. Higgins, you just bet against
the Bengals. It's why the Cowboys, it's like I actually
think they probably could be a little better than people think.
I think most people think they're just gonna suck. Wouldn't
shock me if they're just competitive, probably not a playoff team,
but like I could see them in mix to be
like eight nine wins. But I just could see them
(17:03):
in quode right and just quit on. Brian Shotdneimer and
that's just kind of what happens is your organization becomes
like this owner centric guy. This is not like George
Steinbrenner nineteen ninety six. Those days are over. Most of
these owners don't say shit. They just look at the
Excel spreadsheet and the money flowing in and they let
their GM and their head coach handle everything. Obviously they
(17:26):
get involved at the highest level, but they never talk.
They only talk. Win kind of forced a couple owners
meetings and that might be it, and maybe if they
fire a coach, but if things are going well, like
they're not gonna speak yet, Jerry can't help himself, like
he has to be the star of the franchise. And
it's it's kind of sad because I grew up the
(17:47):
Cowboys were a really big deal.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
They were the.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
Biggest deal in the NFL, right there with the forty
nine ers, the rivalry, and then to the late nineties,
what happened to him. Jerry's ego got in the way,
and you could argue his ego has been in charge
ever since. And beside like the ability to get parcels
and get that stadium built, which is cool, I've been there.
It's you know, it's crazy. It's probably almost not far
(18:09):
away from being like twenty years old, but awesome accomplishment.
What are his highlights last twenty five years? Seriously? And
he really only has himself to blame. But I also like,
I've been around not at the level of Jerry's well,
but enough successful old guys in their seventies, in their eighties.
My dad was a farmer, right, I knew a lot
(18:31):
of old school farmers. Usually doesn't age well. They talk
about how we did things back in the day. It's like, well,
that's thirty years ago. You might want to pivot here, buddy,
And I just think Jerry's pivoted as poorly as anybody
when it comes to just like times have changed. Man. Okay,
(18:58):
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Speaker 2 (20:47):
Couple other things. We kind of hit on the Bengals there,
but it's just it's really hard to overcome. I think
it's really hard to overcome chaos. You know. It's why
so many people that grow up in chaos. We all
have known them, maybe you did. You know, any situation
when you're young that impacts you the rest of your
(21:07):
life and as you get older, chaotic situations can really
derail you. And it's why the Bengals they have multiple
guys holding out a rookie, their star pass rusher. It's
kind of been a consistent theme in this organization. Despite
like they've drafted pretty well over the years, They've had
some pretty good teams on paper, but it's like kind
(21:28):
of always the same thing, you know, And I just
like I was just bet against the Bengals. No matter
you can tell me Joe Burrow throws fifty touchdowns, I'd
be like, yeah, it's still gonna be tough for them
to overcome the Mike Brown operation because that's not changing.
And I don't like tried to really read up onto
(21:49):
the situation with the rookie in the language. You know,
Florio's got an agenda. He's obviously on the agent side.
Mike Brown claims that like this is only this clause.
It's just about like go to jail or something. You know.
It's like, I don't know, it just shouldn't be this complicated,
That's what I know. It just should not be this complicated.
And it's always kind of sometimes that complicated with Mike Brown.
(22:12):
You know, think about a place that the Kanasae Chiefs
and they just are of a lot of credit that
several years ago. Let's face it, I mean, it's it's
aged incredibly well. At the time, even I thought, like
coach reid Man, feature are you sure you want to
trade Tyreek Hill. He's one of the great players we've
ever seen in the peak of his powers, and you
guys are gonna punt on him, like, yeah, we're just
we're just not comfortable, probably some things that we know
(22:35):
that you don't know, and we're just not paying them
thirty million dollars a year. So they punted and they
traded him before the draft. So they had two first
round picks and they got Trent McDuffie and George Karlofski's
Carloff diss. They just gave George a four year, ninety
three million dollar extension I think like sixty million dollars guaranteed,
And just knowing guys there, they love these two guys.
(22:58):
They love these two guys, and that draft, specifically those
two individuals has been a big reason. With Chris Jones
and Spags, they were a defensive team in the last
two years despite having winning the one of the great
offensive coaches and quarterbacks in the history of the sport.
And it's not just these guys are good players. McDuffie's
(23:20):
a really good starter, Carloffs is a really good starter.
I don't know if either of them are like Hall
of Fame, all time great players, but they're type. They're
championship level players, and they're winning players, and they're everything
you want off the field. From away, they operate from away,
they work from away. They play and or prepare to play.
(23:43):
And I think the Chiefs are a good example of
even when weird shit happens, they just feel we got
it handled, Like the Rashi Riice situation, he's gonna get suspended, Like, well,
we got it handled. When these situations happen with some
of these other teams, like, I don't know, man, So
you know the Chiefs, They've spent some money this offseason,
(24:04):
Trey Smith, Carl loftis and they're just paying money to
their type guys, right. And to be a good football
player in the NFL, I don't think much has changed
from previous generations. Obviously, you've got to be good and
have the physical capabilities, but your practice habits, how mentally
(24:25):
and physically tough you are, how serious you take football,
how much you want it. All the intangible stuff matters
now as much as it ever did. Philip Rivers. If
you told me when did Philip Rivers retire, it'd be
like five years ago announce his retirement. Today, I saw
a headline Philip Rivers announces his retirement. Hasn't Phil Rivers
(24:49):
been coaching the high school team for like three or
four years. Isn't his son like one of the big
recruits in the country. Kind of plays and throws just
like him. I think he's gonna end up at NC State,
but I don't know. Maybe he's fifteen sixteen years old. Obviously,
Rivers has like seventy five kids. But I just laughed
out loud when I saw Philip Rivers announce his retirement.
(25:10):
I always enjoyed Philip. I said this forever. I saw
within the last couple of weeks that Drew Brees is
gonna call one of the Netflix games on Christmas and listen.
I have a lot of respect for Drew. Obviously, it's
one of the all time great players of his generation.
Hall of Famer. I think he'd be an excellent like
GM or offensive coordinator, head coach. He's terrible on TV.
(25:31):
I mean, he's just not we're in the entertainment business.
He's not entertaining. I think Philip would have been awesome
on TV. I mean, Taylor made for definitely for the networks,
doesn't swear animated, excited. I think there's like a John
Madden kind of jovial, but the player version, I think
he would have been a star. Now I don't know
(25:52):
if he's ever gonna do it, but if I ran
a network, I know these networks are just they have
a hard on for like getting the most famous guy possible.
We've seen time and time again that is not and
obviously Phillip's not as famous as some of these other
guys that get these gigs, or he's not a former
cowboy quarterback. I would just keep hitting him up because
if he ever just retires from high school coaching and
(26:14):
get him in the booth, I think he would be
a star. Will Levis gotta be one of my all time.
It could have been heat of the moment, but I
remember watching a couple of times his junior year, so
the year before he declared, I definitely put this out
on the old Twitter. Then I thought he could be
the number one pick in the draft. Now I gotta listen.
I got a little thing for strong arm quarterbacks, and
(26:37):
Liam Cohen was his offensive coordinator. Kentucky was really good.
Liam Leaves Scangarello comes in his senior year. Will Levis
is just not really good. Has some games that you're
just shaking your head. Obviously, falls out of the first round,
goes to the Titans, gets shoulder surgery today, he's out
for the season. Unofficially, it ends his Titan career. He's
(26:58):
not gonna be the Titans ever again. After this, it
crossed my mind today. Now there are some years where
a team has like seven injuries at quarterback, you never
say never. I do think going into a season you
can just probably cross Will Levis never again be in
a too deep because you wouldn't want him as a
backup quarterback, right He's just too terrible, kind of a
(27:19):
screw around guy, and honestly, your backup quarterback you would
just want, if anything, to be really really limited. And
understand that. The problem with Will Levis is he thinks
he's like Patrick Mahomes or Josh Allen, and he clearly
is not. And he's just not instinctive. He's just not good.
I mean, there's just no way around it. Now he
has this major injury shoulder. But you know the Titans
(27:40):
cam Ward and cyon Ard to Will Levis. I want
to end on this because I think a lot of
you either have this happen to you or know people
that it has impacted. I started losing my hair in
my early twenties. My dad was bald, My uncles are bald,
(28:02):
my cousins are bald, My brother is bald. Keep my
fingers crossed than my son because it's my mother's or
his mother's jeans will not be bald. But the genetics
in my family when it comes to hair, let's say,
we're not exactly uh you know, Brad pitten River runs
through it. But here's the thing, we've come a long way.
(28:23):
Like when I was a kid, my dad, who was bald,
used to have like the the way worse version of
Trump's hair, right, he grew out the sides and he
had the comb over. I could never do that. Luckily.
The stigma of being bald, whether it's uh, you know,
finding someone to date you definitely, Hollywood, these guys are
(28:46):
wearing wigs. You could not be bald and be quote
unquote famous back in the day. Now, you know, from
Joe Rogan to Jason Statham to Bruce Willis, uh to obviously,
like we've had a fucking renaissance being bald. We're all
cool with it. No one cares. You can shape bit
(29:06):
your head that didn't exist like twenty five years ago.
The rock. I mean, we've had we've had a great run.
The stigma of being bald no longer exists. And I
didn't have a receding hairline right, which is a slow burn.
I had the hair falling off all over the top
of my head and a huge bald spot in the
back that was working its way forward. A lot of
(29:27):
you guys are receding, and you kind of hold on
for dear life. It's like a boat taken on water.
You know, you try to, you try to patch it up,
but then another hole pops and you just you can't
keep the boat above the water. So listen, I can.
I understand where you're coming from. And I think most
of us, especially if you're young, if you don't have
(29:48):
a significant other, you just like, can I am I
going to find a girl if I don't have any hair?
In mind, that's that's your biggest insecurity as a guy.
And then you realize, no chicks. I remember the first
time I ever shaped my head started dating and chicks
loved it, and I was like, who even cares? And
you realize you don't even look back, and then you
see all these other bald guys and you're like, God,
We're just a community that's thriving. Scotty Scheffler, who is
(30:13):
clearly has a receiving hairline, is crushing it. He's made
eighty five million dollars on the golf course like the
last three years. He is charting a path that I
don't want to say Tiger, but is passing a lot
of the all time greats. And if he can stay
healthy for a couple more years, he's clearly gonna go
down as one of the great players of all time.
He wins his fourth major, the oldest major, a place
(30:36):
where golf was invented, Scotland, Ireland, the Open. Taylor made
his probably is him and Nike, and Taylor made his
biggest sponsor put out these social media eclips. Was Scotty
celebrating on the eighteenth victory with his hat off and
you can see his receiving hairline, except Taylor made they
(30:59):
messed with the picture. They photo shopped his hair, They
refused to let him be bald, and I'm not gonna lie.
I was hurt by it. I played Tailor made clubs.
I love my irons. That the best set of irons
I've ever owned. But for them to do that, someone
in Taylor Made's digital department looked at Scotty and said,
(31:21):
we're not gonna allow a bald guy in this moment,
despite him balding sad because I thought we didn't just
have a renaissance. I thought the stigma of being bald
was basically over that. It's okay, and listen part of
he's married, he's got a kid, he's rich. He can
be bald, he can have hair, none of it matters.
(31:43):
So the greatest golfer of all time, Tiger Woods. I
don't know if you've seen him with his hat off,
especially through his late thirties early, you know, throughout his forties,
bald is a bat. I mean, Tiger has about as
many hairs as I do. Sad day, though Taylor Made,
I expected more as someone who's you don't sponsor me.
(32:03):
I've paid for your product. I appreciate your product. I
play your balls too. To do that to his hairline, man,
come on, haven't we come farther than that?
Speaker 1 (32:17):
The volume
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Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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