April 29, 2025 • 33 mins
Colin points out the major difference between the Warriors and the Rockets as Golden State takes a commanding 3-1 lead despite Houston being the #2 seed in the Western Conference. He shares the latest reporting following Shedeur Sanders falling to the 5th round and why his father Deion Sanders gave him bad advice. Plus, Fox Sports NFL analyst Greg Olsen joins the show to explain what makes #1 overall pick Cam Ward special after a stellar season at Olsen's alma mater the University of Miami
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
noone Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at
Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every
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or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go live in Chicago. Wherever you may be,
however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part
of your day. Jmak I took the train to work today.
I haven't done that in my entire career. After what
was an amazing playoff game, I just got to look
at the ratings for the Lakers playoff game.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Seven and a half million people watch.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
You do not have to be a basketball fan if
you're a casual as a as KD calls it a casual.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Were you not glued to that game.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Last incredible theater. I can't believe Steve Kerr pulled off
the hack a shack to get Adams off the floor.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Genius stuff from Steve Kirk.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
So I'm watching that game last night and then I
go to the box Score this morning. Houston did so
many things that were good enough to win. Great field
goal percentage, didn't take a lot of threes, but hit
a lot of them. Very good on the glass, dominate
points in the paint. But what about late game execution.
That's the NBA playoffs. It was such a classic Warrior
(01:30):
playoff win. Draymond's on the floor getting the tee, the
game is shippy, Steph's good, but let's a teammate step
up and dominate the fourth and Jimmy Butler and they
have always like one young guy. This time it's POD's
who plays a key role. But this series has been
about who makes the play in the moment. That's the Warriors.
(01:51):
And you saw Houston's inexperience on display. Jalen Green, a
borderline All star for them, zero points in the second half,
three or four games, single digits, and again they're relying
on him his big game. They won the three. He
hasn't played well, lost all of them. So Houston's go
two scorers in the fourth quarter, Fred van Vliet and
(02:14):
a twenty two year old big that's it. Their final
shot is classic young team trying to win a game.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
A fifteen foot fallaway.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
So I think what makes this more impressive is that
basically the Warriors have conceded size and physicality. They're not
playing Kaminga, the barely playing Kaevon Looney, so they're conceding it. Nope,
you're gonna be bigger, stronger, more athletic, and deeper, but
we're gonna shoot twice as many threes. And it's not
like the Rockets didn't hit their threes. But this is
(02:45):
where Pods was so crucial last night. The Warriors always,
even in their great teams, there's always a bench guy
or a young guy that makes an impact. And Jimmy
Butler like a Wiggins, his team gets tired of him.
And then you go to the Finals and Wiggins is
playing the Celtics and you're like, oh, we wouldn't win
the finals without him. And last night in the fourth quarter,
it's like, yeah, they don't win the game without Jimmy Butler.
(03:07):
And this is how we've talked about this. I can't
believe they're doing it. I mean, there's so many advantages
for Houston, but this is how the playoffs work. You
gotta crawl before you walk. So three of the Rocket
starters are twenty three or younger.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Well, Colin, what about the bench.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Yeah, they go to the bench to a twenty three
year old and a twenty one year old, So it's
like it's just in fact, I would argue Steven Adams old.
Steven Adams was probably the most consistent Rocket last night, rebounding,
physicality and defense. So this is what scares everybody in
the West about the Warriors, that Curry doesn't have to
(03:44):
be great. They now have a second scorer who's often better.
Pods can light it up. Well, he felt like he
you know, you come with these young guys. Houston's got
tons of them. The Warriors got one young guy, and
Pods is like, can I take shots? Is this my moment?
And he felt it. So Pods will probably this point forward,
(04:05):
give you that a couple of games in the series.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
But I mean to be able to win.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
When Curry's not great, and Jimmy Butler can lead in
the fourth quarter. And then there was a rebound, the
very big rebound at the end of the game was
so classic. Jimmy Butler, you have all these trees.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
All this size, all this late.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
For the Houston Rockets, and here's scrappy, Jimmy Butler out
maneuvering out physical jumping and seizing the rebound. I mean
between Draymond's defense late on Sengun Seng gun, between Jimmy
Butler's rebound between you know, Buddy Healed, Classic Warriors. All
(04:44):
year long, people complained, Oh, let's get rid of Buddy Healed. No, nah,
not really remember the Warriors, the Miami Heat team that
had like Miller and Battier and they disappear for moments,
but how many big threes do they hit in the
heaels playoff runs for four years? This was a classic
Warrior performance and near Steve Kerr on Jimmy.
Speaker 5 (05:06):
Butler, it's the playoffs and he's Jimmy Butler, so this
is this is what he does. The rebound at the
end was just incredible, the elevation, the force, then of
course knocking down the free throws to clinch it, Jimmy
was just amazing.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Okay, So.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Probably the most fun yet the most difficult thing I cover,
and we cover all year long, is not games. It's
the NFL Draft. Because I've said this many times. You
get lied to for a month to two months up
to it, and so often during the draft, and every
(05:54):
few drafts there's a guy that really falls, precipitously falls.
This year it was Shedor Sanders, Aaron Rodgers, It's been
Dan Marino. There's every few years somebody fallows a lot
and so, but those stories don't come out until like
the fall and after the fall, right, and so Albert
Brer had a great article on Shoudeur Sanders, and one
(06:18):
of the things we talked about this is what I
was told on Friday after the herd. A GM told me,
if he doesn't go by pick thirty seven thirty eight,
he's now a backup. And there's a lot of teams
that do not want that circus as a backup. Albert
Breer in his article says teams generally want backups to
(06:38):
blend in with the furniture. It's white guys like t
Bow had trouble finding jobs, and white guys like Cam
Newton and Jay Cutler struggled at the end of their
career to find jobs. That's what we talked about, But
there were two other things that came out that I
hadn't heard of. These are huge factors. So a lot
of times when you go to these combine meetings, teams
(07:00):
give you things to challenge you. Teams will have a
player's worst players ready for him, and they'll show him
his worst plays and say, hey, why don't you explain him?
And Shadeur apparently didn't take to it well, and at
one point one of the few teams that actually was
interested in him said, well, what do you make of
this really bad play? And Shador said, you know, maybe
(07:21):
I'm not the guy for you. That's not the answer
since there were only three or four teams in the
first round that we're going to consider it now that
Pittsburgh apparently has a deal with Aaron Rodgers, so take
them out another moment. What they do during the film
and the combine in the meetings is teams will install mistakes,
(07:44):
intentionally plant it in the install and they want you
to catch him. Shador didn't, and when a coach called
him out once again, it didn't sit well. Say, bro,
there's not many teams needing quarterbacks, especially since Pittsburgh appears
to have a deal with Aaron Rodgers, and Tennessee's getting
cam Ward, so you're down to the Giants who were
(08:07):
not interested at all, and Cleveland, who traded out of
that two spot. Because clearly they were looking for next
year's class, like the Rams are. And I heard a
lot of this. What about John Elway? His dad didn't
want him to play? What about Eli Manning? John Elway's probably, Now,
let's take out the probably. He's the greatest quarterback prospect
(08:27):
of all time. I'm old enough to have watched them
in college. There was no Lway pre Lway. He was
a first ballot Hall of Famer talent. I mean you
think Andrew luck was bally Hooton talked about ad personality.
I mean Elway could have played for the Yankees. Okay,
his football family the Lway family. So he's not Elway.
(08:50):
And oh, by the way, he's not Eli, who was
a much better prospect.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
Go look up his draft review. You can look it
up on the internet.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Also, Eli's brother, maybe you've heard of him, Peyton was
the MVP of the league in Eli's last year in college.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
So he's not Eli.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
When you've got unbelievable skill, like Dion Sanders did, you
can sandbag interviews. Dion did and bragged about it. Elway
could have. Elway's dad can play a role. Eli's family
and Archie Manning wasn't jerky about it. He's just like,
I don't want him plan for the Chargers. So I
think this comes down to, let's be honest, Dad and
(09:25):
Shandor Sanders had a much higher opinion of themselves than
the league did. It happens, It's not the end of
the world. Again, I've said this before. Where you land
is more important than how high you land. Honestly, if
cam Ward was going to sit beside behind Matt Stafford
for two years of the Rams, probably a better place
to go than number one in Tennessee because you make
(09:46):
your money on your second contract. But here's something to
really think about, because one of the few teams that
was interested at least going into it in January and
February into the draft evaluation was the New York Giants.
Think about this. The Giants offered they wanted a quarterback.
They offered Tennessee two first round picks to get cam Wore.
(10:08):
Tennessee said no thanks. Then they traded three picks for
Jackson Dart. So one of the teams that was willing
to give up major picks for a quarterback eventually did,
and the worst interview shod Or had was reportedly with
that team. The New York Giants, So again, we just
(10:29):
Booberrosiasin also came out yesterday, a popular New York radio
host former NFL MVP quarterback with Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
He came out and.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Said he was told multiple teams owners said we're not
doing this entitled nonsense. So I think, in hindsight, and
this is why the draft is incredibly difficult to cover.
You're lied to constantly. I'm not lied to before a
Rockets Warriors game or a super Bowl or March Madness.
Nobody's lying to me. I've been saying this for years.
(10:58):
I have three or four executives really trust in the
NFL and not many others. In fact, my rule has
always been I will not ask an executive in the
NFL a question about a player if that team needs
that player. I could ask a GM like Brett Veach
in Kansas City about quarterbacks because he's got one, but
I'm not going to ask him about left tackles because
(11:19):
he doesn't, and I know he's going to give me
an answer that's fuzzy and I'm putting him in a
bad spot. So I think that the truth of the
matter is when you start looking at these stories, they're
coming out now.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
It's a classic example.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
There weren't many job openings, and once he became a backup,
once he turned off the giants, nobody wanted. They want
to back up. As Albert Breer said, to blend in
with the furniture. And he's not a blending he's not
from a blend in with a furniture family. Yeah, be
legendary before you call yourself. That's how about. That's a
(11:55):
rule going forward for quarterbacks. Just just be legendary. Gotta
be better than thirteen and twelve. Be legendary before you
do a draft room and it's painted all over the
draft room.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
And again it's not the end of the world.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
But what do we always say on the show when
you're a quarterback, everything is something, nothing's everything, But that
legendary is something, all right?
Speaker 3 (12:18):
J Macthez.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
I think we have a bunch of NBA playoff games tonight.
How many do we have tonight? Three or four playoff games?
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Tonight?
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Four games tonight Bucks Pacers starts at six pm Pacific time.
I think three sorry, three o'clock Pacific, six Eastern.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
That's an early start.
Speaker 6 (12:33):
Pacers Bucks the end.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Of the Yannis era, I can't wait for you to open.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
That the show with that tomorrow. All right, Yeah, first
show in Chicago. We're gonna go back back in forth
La and Chicago a little bit. Nobody cares about that
except me. Obviously, taking the train to work was fun today.
I'd never done that before. But coming up next, I've
argued about it. I think there's proof we were right
(12:58):
on it that the NBA doesn't need a face of
the league.
Speaker 6 (13:03):
We've got that next.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and newon Easter non a em Pacific on Fox Sports
Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app HI Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
We've talked about this a lot on this show, about
this need for the face of the league.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
First of all, I.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Do think an international player can be the face of
the NBA, because Shoe Otani is the face of baseball.
Could I have if I'd have told you fifteen years ago, Yeah,
the face of baseball. I mean, each Chiero was popular,
but the face of baseball will not be from the States.
You'd have said, whoa, whoa. The face of baseball is Otani.
(13:46):
Aaron Judges. Second, It's okay. Ovechkin hockey We've talked about
this MESSI is now the face of the MLS.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Folks, the borders, they're all fuzzy. Now it's globalization. It's
all fuzzy.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
But I do think it alps if you have a
domestic face of the league for basketball, I don't think
NBA is better if it's more domestic. In fact, I
think it's better if it's more European. I think in
European influence makes the game more skilled, especially with big guys.
But I do think there's an argument that if I
can watch you in March Madness for a couple of years,
(14:20):
like college football Baker Mayfield, then you go to the pros.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
I think it helps.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Because a lot of these international guys, they just don't
want to be faced of the league. Jokisch has no
interest but and checks a lot of boxes. Now, he
did go to a football school, he didn't make March Madness,
and he got drafted by the Minneapolis t Wolves. Minnesota
te Wolves. That doesn't help. But he's handsome, his game
is dynamic. The worst thing you can do is try
(14:48):
to force this. I mean, like the Jason Tatum thing.
Jason Tatum is a great player, but his game is
fundamentally great. Fundamentals don't feel like face of the league.
Tim Duncan was called called the big fundamental. He was
never the face of the league. It doesn't mean he
wasn't the best power forward. I think I heard Charles
Barkley say last week he thought Tim Duncan was the
(15:10):
best power forward of all time. I probably agree, but
he was a fundamental player. Jason Tatum might trout feel
more like that. You know, there is an esthetic to
being great now. I do think it helps if you
knock out Lebron and the Lakers. I do think it
helped last year beating and knocking out the defending champion
(15:34):
Denver Nuggets. I think that stuff really helps. But going
to Minneapolis, playing at Georgia, not making March Madness makes
it an uphill climb, and I think that's one of
the things about being faced in the league. In the NBA,
the NBA is very different. In the NFL, it's all
about winning. Nobody cares about anything else. Basketball is different.
Optics matter, style matters. The first player I fell in
(15:57):
love with was Doctor j. He wasn't the best shooter,
the best ball handler. He was cool, sweeping his hands
under the back. It is like, I've never seen anything
like that, and many. I mean, I've argued there's only
been five to six faces of the league ever, Magic
and Bird, more magic than Bird because Magic embraced it. Lebron,
(16:19):
MJ Staff, Kobe Shack, that's it. Duncan was never that
Kobe by himself. I didn't think was ever that it
was more of a Kobe Shack tandem deal. But the
ratings for these playoff games have been excellent. Lakers game
something got a big number. I don't think you have
to have Ocean's eleven was fine with a bunch of
good actors. The NFL as popular as it is, Farv retired,
(16:43):
Brady retired, Manning retired, Aaron's going to retire. Ratings go up.
But we live in a very distracted world right now.
And I will say this, The problem the NBA has
is its regular season ratings. Well, SODA's hockey and baseball.
So talked about this on the show a lot. We've
become an event nation with all the distractions, a very
(17:04):
polarizing political world. Trump, Biden, it doesn't matter. It's a
very polarizing world we live in. Biden was polarizing Trump's Polari.
So you're just losing people. But you know when you
don't lose them when the games matter World Cup, Olympics,
NFL Sunday, college football.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
And these playoff games.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
I think Ant has a chance to be the face
of the league. Most of the faces of the league,
if not initially, eventually got a great coach. Took Michael
a fewd to get Phil. I do think Chris Finch
has a low profile because he has no interest being
you know, front and center. But right now they're out
(17:46):
coaching JJ Reddick, who I like, but they are throwing
so many different lineups and so many different looks. Finch
within the league is very highly regarded, so it's not
always your first coach, and it's not what was the
highest profile coach. Lebron's a little bit of an outlier
where he's had multiple coaches. But most of the time
(18:08):
you get a Magic and a pat Riley, you get
a Michael and of Phil Jackson, you get a Staff
and a Steve Kerr. There's like a legendary coach. This
is the same with quarterbacks. You Marino has a Shoela,
Elway has got a Shanahan, Brady's got a Belichick, Mahomes
has an Andy Reid, Breeze has a Sean Payton most
of the time. Eventually, you need that great coach to
(18:31):
really understand you, to elevate you, to surround you with
the right people. So I think Ant has a shot
to be the face of the league. Knocking the Lakers
out will not hurt and it looks like they will.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern non am Pacific.
Speaker 7 (18:49):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 8 (18:55):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
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Speaker 3 (19:02):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 8 (19:04):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 7 (19:08):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well, other shows don't seem to have the
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Speaker 8 (19:16):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
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Speaker 3 (19:21):
So check us out.
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Speaker 2 (19:46):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
And it was too many amazing that Shador Sanders fell
on the draft with that one of my favorite people
at Fox, Greg Olsen, fourteen years in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Is now joining US Live. You know, I heard it
was funny after Friday show Greg before the second round.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
But after my show I called an executive in the
league and he said to me, he goes watch the
next six picks and the first six picks in the
second round, and he says, if those first six picks
in the second round, if they don't take Shadu or
what the league is telling you is we see him
as a backup now and backup quarterback. As Albert Breer
(20:27):
said today, we want it to be like mix in
with the furniture. Like backup quarterback is a guy that
can go into a local mall with sunglasses and nobody
recognizes them, not Cam Newton or Tim Tebow. So were
you shocked once he didn't go in the first were
you shocked to be fell.
Speaker 9 (20:44):
I think that's the name of the game, right. So
there's an inverse relationship in the NFL. So we'll just
start just generally speaking with most roster players, not just
the quarterback. There's an inverse ratio between the more you
bring with you, the more I don't want to call
it distraction, because sometimes it's a real net positive, right,
We'll call it attention. The more attention you bring upon yourself,
(21:05):
the more attention you go out and seek, the more
the teams will tolerate more of it, the better a
player you are.
Speaker 1 (21:12):
Right.
Speaker 9 (21:12):
So there's like this inverse relationship between those two elements.
Now you add into the fact that it's the quarterback, right,
the league has shown us and there's a million examples
the league has shown us they want guys that don't
there's no extra there's no concerns, there's no where's his
head at, where where's his attention? Lying? What are his priorities?
(21:33):
And again I don't know Shidor that well. Obviously Dion
and we all know his background. But I think as
the draft gets later and later, the element was is
the guy good.
Speaker 6 (21:43):
Enough to play in the NFL? Yes?
Speaker 9 (21:45):
Is he a top tier talent where we're willing to
then also take maybe everything else that comes with it.
And I think a lot of it's harmless. I think
a lot of it's attention seeking. I think it's an
environment that we've created in college where you know, there's
a lot more that comes with playing quarterback nowadays in
college than it was when I was in college.
Speaker 6 (22:02):
So I think that we've almost.
Speaker 9 (22:04):
Created that as a system and as a society, and
now teams have to make a decision if that guy's
not going to be my all pro quarterback, do I
want to put up with it? And I think that's
really the test that we saw play out over the
course of the draft. And listen, could he end up
being a steal there in the fifth round?
Speaker 3 (22:22):
Yes?
Speaker 9 (22:22):
Has he shown at two different spots in colleges that
he could go to teams that didn't necessarily have a
great tradition of winning and turn the program around and
bring attention and energy and buzz. Absolutely, he did it twice.
So I'm not throwing him yet. I'm not throwing him
to the Wolves and saying he has no career, but
I think he needs to take a good, hard reset
and say, you know what it's all about ball. It's
(22:44):
all about me giving myself to have a chance to
have a career in this league. And if it's as
a backup and then I worked to a starter, whatever.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
That path is.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
But the league I think has shown and the message
was pretty clear, you better be really really talented, especially
quarterback if we're going to put up with a lot
of other attention, a lot of other things.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
So you're a former Miami Hurricane. Cam Ward was a
zero star recruit. I watched him at Washington State. I thought, oh,
that's fun, but he's not an NFL guy. Then he
goes to Miami and I'm like, okay, that works. You
watch a lot of Hurricane football. Did you when you
were watching him this year? Did you think, oh, that's
the number one pick in the draft? I mean, did
you see it immediately?
Speaker 6 (23:28):
You know? So it's kind of funny.
Speaker 9 (23:30):
I think cam Ward is such a great example, especially
in this like college football landscape where the zero star
guy multiple colleges, three stops later, one year at Miami
and he's the number one overall pick and he couldn't
buy a scholarship at high school. And then all the
kids making ten you know, ten million dollar nil deals
that are five stars, are now on their fifth school.
(23:52):
They've all trended downward, and they're all fighting, not all,
but many of them are fighting for their lives. I
think it's a great reminder for everybody out there that
although the system is what it is, it's by no
means indicative of what your future is. On top of that,
to answer your question, I had dinner with Mario Chris
Ball tomorrow. Chris Ball the head football coach at Miami.
He was my tight end coach in Miami. I've known
(24:12):
him since I was sixteen. He recruited me when I
was a sophomore in high school when he was at
Rutgers with Greg Cianno, we go way back, and I
had dinner with him after spring ball, before summer camp,
before last season, and he said, Greg, we've had a
lot of like dogs and this, you know, the Sean
Taylors and the Antrell Roles and the you know Edger
and James, and we've had some really big time personalities
(24:35):
that have taken charge of a locker room. Here, he goes,
In all my years at Miami, I'm not sure if
we've had a guy like cam Ward who from day
one changed everything about who we were, our identity, how
we practice, how we met.
Speaker 6 (24:48):
He goes, wait till you see this kid this year.
Speaker 9 (24:50):
I went to the opening game down at the Swamp
in person on the sideline and watched him his first
ever start at Miami against Florida, and I came away
and I don't know if I would have said he's
the number one overall pick right.
Speaker 6 (25:00):
The footwork's a little awkward, he throws off plane.
Speaker 9 (25:03):
I wouldn't say it's how you would necessarily teach a
young kid to play. It's a little more mahomes Ish
as far as a little unconventional but special. But his
season is pretty remarkable what he did at Miami, the
culture and energy besides just the player.
Speaker 6 (25:19):
To a man at.
Speaker 9 (25:19):
Miami, when you said who is the most impactful player
in that locker room in the last five ten years,
it's cam Warden.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
Yeah, that's a great straight he looks as a great kid.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Explain to me, I would put Travis Hunter on offense,
and I'd want him in the offensive meeting rooms. But
he's too good if there's a show hey thing here,
probably too good not to play on defense. Explain to me,
install day, how does that work?
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What meeting is he in?
Speaker 1 (25:52):
All?
Speaker 9 (25:52):
Right? So if I was the coach, right, I have
the magic wand and I'm in charge, I'm putting him
to start in most defensive back meetings.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I think playing wide.
Speaker 9 (26:03):
Receiver young in the NFL is a little bit easier,
especially when you consider how talented he is physically. It's
a little bit easier to build offensive packages for a
wide receiver and start those out. You know, he might
have ten to fifteen calls in any game plan going
into any week than it is to do the opposite,
To spend all of your time on offense and then
(26:23):
we're going to build out a defensive coverage plan.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
It doesn't really work like that.
Speaker 9 (26:27):
Playing corner, especially young in the NFL, is incredibly difficult.
They're hard to find. They don't grow on trees. There
just are more wide receivers in all shapes and sizes
that can run, catch, athletic and create problems with the
ball in your hands.
Speaker 6 (26:43):
So I agree you got to use them on both.
Speaker 9 (26:45):
I would emphasize early, teaching him how to be an
all pro corner and then he can learn. And then offense,
there's there's packages, there's reversus screens. Teach them a handful
of the route tree, teach them the offense, and you
can slow play and almost protect him as an offensive
play caller because we can tell him exactly what your
(27:05):
role is. Here are the plays to be prepared for.
On defense, you're at corner. We've got to be able
to play man zone, too high, single high zone. We've
got to be able to play fire blit zones. The
other team could come out in two backs. They can
come out and spread. You could play to the boundary,
you could play to the field. Defense, there's a lot
more on your plate because you're reacting to what the
offense can do. Offensive play caller, I can control what
(27:28):
I expose him to, especially early, not overwhelm him, control
that side of the ball.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
So that's how I would handle him.
Speaker 9 (27:37):
I just think defensive back in the NFL nowadays, with
the passing of the league and the way the league
is going.
Speaker 6 (27:43):
You just can't find enough of those guys. And when
you find a special one, he needs to play defense.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
So your career at the end was with Pete Carroll.
One of the few draft picks that I felt was
kind of obvious. I didn't hit on many of them,
but I thought Ashton Gent Gino Smith is actually a
pretty darn good quarterback when he throws on play action,
when you force him to throw on third and eleven.
You know, that's the Mahomes Josh Allen where they can
(28:10):
make it work. You know Pete, you know how he
views the running game. Talk a little bit that about
that le Gent who's dynamic, but you can also get
short yardage with because he's so strong.
Speaker 6 (28:24):
Yeah, I'm with you.
Speaker 9 (28:25):
I think of all the drafts there in the top ten,
call it that one made the most sense. Like that,
just felt that's his Marshawn, That's that's his bel cow,
that's his guy. That is the identity of Pete. Play
great defense, control to run, play action. He went out
and got brought Gino with him. Gino understands what Pete
wants to be, understands the offense he wants to implement,
(28:46):
and then new factor, and he's got two young tight ends.
I would argue brock Powers he very well could be
the best young tight end to come out of college
in the last ten years. Like I think he's that special.
I thought he was that good when he was at Georgia.
So two young tight ends with mayor from Notre Dame
from the previous year that Rockbert Bowers going into a
second year, continue to invest in an offensive line. Now
(29:09):
a bellcout quarterback, running back, get under center with Gino,
play action on early downs. You're right, the guys that
make sixty five seventy million dollars, those guys are good
on first and second down, and they're good on third
and fifteen when everyone in the building knows it's a pass.
That's why there's Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes and Joe Burrow, etc.
The vast majority of the league. And this is not
(29:31):
a knock the vast majority of the league. The formula is,
you want to throw play action downs on first and
second down, and you do not want to be and
must pass downs. That is the formula on ninety percent
of NFL rosters.
Speaker 6 (29:43):
Until you have the.
Speaker 9 (29:44):
Elite of the elite and every down is a passing down.
But there's only a couple of those guys. So I
think the formula works. He has showed that it's worked
for a long time. He's got the quarterback that can
do it. He's got it back. Now he's got the
tight ends. Continue to invest in the offensive line, and
all of a sudden, this look like what a Pete
Carroll offense wants to be.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Finally, you played with Cam Newton, a spectacularly gifted athlete
who was also a good pocket guy when he wanted
to be. You also played in Chicago and you were
a big part of Cam's career the tight end. Okay,
so now the Bears, with a spectacularly talented quarterback in Chicago,
say we're going.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
To get another tight end.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
So I think that you could say, boy, Colston Lovelin
went high. They just got Romadonze, they had Cole Comet.
But there is to talk about why tight end is
so crucial for everybody but really athletic quarterbacks. And I mean,
you were Cam's guy, And I don't know, I just
(30:43):
look at Caleb and Colston and I think that's going
to work. And I loved the pick. Or is it
just this that tight ends mean more to young quarterbacks,
is that it.
Speaker 6 (30:54):
Well.
Speaker 9 (30:55):
I definitely think tight ends mean a lot to young quarterbacks.
I think that's been proving. There's a lot of examples
throughout it. I also think tight ends bring a lot
of value in today's style the way that these offensive
coordinators you look obviously Ben Johnson, now the style in
which these offensive play callers want to operate. The tight
end is a huge role in that because, again, like
we said, if you want to get under center, and
(31:16):
you want to get into early play action on run
fifty to fifty downs, and you want to be able
to keep the defense in single high coverages for all
your crossers and your layers and all your deep shots,
you can't be in a let you can't be in
ten personnel right. You can't have four wide receiver types
and one back in the back right. So you got
to have somebody that can keep you honest in the
why position, the tight end position. He could be an
(31:37):
off ball player, he's an on ball player. There's a
lot of ways to do it, but there needs to
be some form of threat on first and second down
that you're not just in past personnel in shotgun.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
The entire game.
Speaker 9 (31:49):
We've seen that that approach across the league is very difficult.
So now you bring in Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams. Now
you have Cole Comet, who you mentioned Rome Denze from
last year. Don't forget they got DJ Moore from the
Bryce Young trade, you know, a couple of years ago.
Now you add in you know, so all of a sudden,
now they've invested multiple offensive linemen. They're saying, we need
(32:12):
our number one overall pick to succeed. We got him
the coach, We've got him the line, we've got him
the skill players. Now we'll worry about going back and
worrying about building up the defense. But remember offensive coaches, Colin,
if you're good on offense and the defense struggles, you
can always find a new defensive coordinator.
Speaker 6 (32:29):
That's the formata we see that. I hate to.
Speaker 9 (32:32):
Say it, but when they were struggling in Philadelphia and
they couldn't get the defense right following Jonathan Gannon, all
of a sudden, a year later, who's available Vic Fangiel. Yeah,
all of a sudden in the Cincinnati they've got the
greatest offense in the league, offensive minded coach and Zach
Robinson and Zach Taylor.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Zach Taylor, and what do they do.
Speaker 9 (32:53):
They get rid of a defensive coordinator who was up
to be a head coach just a year or two before.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
So that's the formula.
Speaker 9 (32:59):
Get your young quarterback settled, get your new offensive minded
head coach, Ben Johnson, get him going on offense, and
then we have time to finish up complimenting the defense.
That's the NFL formula, and I think the Bears have
four to five wins built into this just by getting
organized offensively with Ben Johnson in company, I think there's
(33:19):
a four game elevation within that roster just by getting
organized offensively.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Greg Olsen, you do great work, my friend, as all
as I appreciate you stopping by
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
noone Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at
Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every
day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio
or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go live in Chicago. Wherever you may be,
however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part
of your day. Jmak I took the train to work today.
I haven't done that in my entire career. After what
was an amazing playoff game, I just got to look
at the ratings for the Lakers playoff game.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Seven and a half million people watch.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
You do not have to be a basketball fan if
you're a casual as a as KD calls it a casual.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Were you not glued to that game.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Last incredible theater. I can't believe Steve Kerr pulled off
the hack a shack to get Adams off the floor.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Genius stuff from Steve Kirk.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
So I'm watching that game last night and then I
go to the box Score this morning. Houston did so
many things that were good enough to win. Great field
goal percentage, didn't take a lot of threes, but hit
a lot of them. Very good on the glass, dominate
points in the paint. But what about late game execution.
That's the NBA playoffs. It was such a classic Warrior
(01:30):
playoff win. Draymond's on the floor getting the tee, the
game is shippy, Steph's good, but let's a teammate step
up and dominate the fourth and Jimmy Butler and they
have always like one young guy. This time it's POD's
who plays a key role. But this series has been
about who makes the play in the moment. That's the Warriors.
(01:51):
And you saw Houston's inexperience on display. Jalen Green, a
borderline All star for them, zero points in the second half,
three or four games, single digits, and again they're relying
on him his big game. They won the three. He
hasn't played well, lost all of them. So Houston's go
two scorers in the fourth quarter, Fred van Vliet and
(02:14):
a twenty two year old big that's it. Their final
shot is classic young team trying to win a game.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
A fifteen foot fallaway.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
So I think what makes this more impressive is that
basically the Warriors have conceded size and physicality. They're not
playing Kaminga, the barely playing Kaevon Looney, so they're conceding it. Nope,
you're gonna be bigger, stronger, more athletic, and deeper, but
we're gonna shoot twice as many threes. And it's not
like the Rockets didn't hit their threes. But this is
(02:45):
where Pods was so crucial last night. The Warriors always,
even in their great teams, there's always a bench guy
or a young guy that makes an impact. And Jimmy
Butler like a Wiggins, his team gets tired of him.
And then you go to the Finals and Wiggins is
playing the Celtics and you're like, oh, we wouldn't win
the finals without him. And last night in the fourth quarter,
it's like, yeah, they don't win the game without Jimmy Butler.
(03:07):
And this is how we've talked about this. I can't
believe they're doing it. I mean, there's so many advantages
for Houston, but this is how the playoffs work. You
gotta crawl before you walk. So three of the Rocket
starters are twenty three or younger.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Well, Colin, what about the bench.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
Yeah, they go to the bench to a twenty three
year old and a twenty one year old, So it's
like it's just in fact, I would argue Steven Adams old.
Steven Adams was probably the most consistent Rocket last night, rebounding,
physicality and defense. So this is what scares everybody in
the West about the Warriors, that Curry doesn't have to
(03:44):
be great. They now have a second scorer who's often better.
Pods can light it up. Well, he felt like he
you know, you come with these young guys. Houston's got
tons of them. The Warriors got one young guy, and
Pods is like, can I take shots? Is this my moment?
And he felt it. So Pods will probably this point forward,
(04:05):
give you that a couple of games in the series.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
But I mean to be able to win.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
When Curry's not great, and Jimmy Butler can lead in
the fourth quarter. And then there was a rebound, the
very big rebound at the end of the game was
so classic. Jimmy Butler, you have all these trees.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
All this size, all this late.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
For the Houston Rockets, and here's scrappy, Jimmy Butler out
maneuvering out physical jumping and seizing the rebound. I mean
between Draymond's defense late on Sengun Seng gun, between Jimmy
Butler's rebound between you know, Buddy Healed, Classic Warriors. All
(04:44):
year long, people complained, Oh, let's get rid of Buddy Healed. No, nah,
not really remember the Warriors, the Miami Heat team that
had like Miller and Battier and they disappear for moments,
but how many big threes do they hit in the
heaels playoff runs for four years? This was a classic
Warrior performance and near Steve Kerr on Jimmy.
Speaker 5 (05:06):
Butler, it's the playoffs and he's Jimmy Butler, so this
is this is what he does. The rebound at the
end was just incredible, the elevation, the force, then of
course knocking down the free throws to clinch it, Jimmy
was just amazing.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Okay, So.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Probably the most fun yet the most difficult thing I cover,
and we cover all year long, is not games. It's
the NFL Draft. Because I've said this many times. You
get lied to for a month to two months up
to it, and so often during the draft, and every
(05:54):
few drafts there's a guy that really falls, precipitously falls.
This year it was Shedor Sanders, Aaron Rodgers, It's been
Dan Marino. There's every few years somebody fallows a lot
and so, but those stories don't come out until like
the fall and after the fall, right, and so Albert
Brer had a great article on Shoudeur Sanders, and one
(06:18):
of the things we talked about this is what I
was told on Friday after the herd. A GM told me,
if he doesn't go by pick thirty seven thirty eight,
he's now a backup. And there's a lot of teams
that do not want that circus as a backup. Albert
Breer in his article says teams generally want backups to
(06:38):
blend in with the furniture. It's white guys like t
Bow had trouble finding jobs, and white guys like Cam
Newton and Jay Cutler struggled at the end of their
career to find jobs. That's what we talked about, But
there were two other things that came out that I
hadn't heard of. These are huge factors. So a lot
of times when you go to these combine meetings, teams
(07:00):
give you things to challenge you. Teams will have a
player's worst players ready for him, and they'll show him
his worst plays and say, hey, why don't you explain him?
And Shadeur apparently didn't take to it well, and at
one point one of the few teams that actually was
interested in him said, well, what do you make of
this really bad play? And Shador said, you know, maybe
(07:21):
I'm not the guy for you. That's not the answer
since there were only three or four teams in the
first round that we're going to consider it now that
Pittsburgh apparently has a deal with Aaron Rodgers, so take
them out another moment. What they do during the film
and the combine in the meetings is teams will install mistakes,
(07:44):
intentionally plant it in the install and they want you
to catch him. Shador didn't, and when a coach called
him out once again, it didn't sit well. Say, bro,
there's not many teams needing quarterbacks, especially since Pittsburgh appears
to have a deal with Aaron Rodgers, and Tennessee's getting
cam Ward, so you're down to the Giants who were
(08:07):
not interested at all, and Cleveland, who traded out of
that two spot. Because clearly they were looking for next
year's class, like the Rams are. And I heard a
lot of this. What about John Elway? His dad didn't
want him to play? What about Eli Manning? John Elway's probably, Now,
let's take out the probably. He's the greatest quarterback prospect
(08:27):
of all time. I'm old enough to have watched them
in college. There was no Lway pre Lway. He was
a first ballot Hall of Famer talent. I mean you
think Andrew luck was bally Hooton talked about ad personality.
I mean Elway could have played for the Yankees. Okay,
his football family the Lway family. So he's not Elway.
(08:50):
And oh, by the way, he's not Eli, who was
a much better prospect.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
Go look up his draft review. You can look it
up on the internet.
Speaker 1 (08:56):
Also, Eli's brother, maybe you've heard of him, Peyton was
the MVP of the league in Eli's last year in college.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
So he's not Eli.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
When you've got unbelievable skill, like Dion Sanders did, you
can sandbag interviews. Dion did and bragged about it. Elway
could have. Elway's dad can play a role. Eli's family
and Archie Manning wasn't jerky about it. He's just like,
I don't want him plan for the Chargers. So I
think this comes down to, let's be honest, Dad and
(09:25):
Shandor Sanders had a much higher opinion of themselves than
the league did. It happens, It's not the end of
the world. Again, I've said this before. Where you land
is more important than how high you land. Honestly, if
cam Ward was going to sit beside behind Matt Stafford
for two years of the Rams, probably a better place
to go than number one in Tennessee because you make
(09:46):
your money on your second contract. But here's something to
really think about, because one of the few teams that
was interested at least going into it in January and
February into the draft evaluation was the New York Giants.
Think about this. The Giants offered they wanted a quarterback.
They offered Tennessee two first round picks to get cam Wore.
(10:08):
Tennessee said no thanks. Then they traded three picks for
Jackson Dart. So one of the teams that was willing
to give up major picks for a quarterback eventually did,
and the worst interview shod Or had was reportedly with
that team. The New York Giants, So again, we just
(10:29):
Booberrosiasin also came out yesterday, a popular New York radio
host former NFL MVP quarterback with Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
He came out and.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Said he was told multiple teams owners said we're not
doing this entitled nonsense. So I think, in hindsight, and
this is why the draft is incredibly difficult to cover.
You're lied to constantly. I'm not lied to before a
Rockets Warriors game or a super Bowl or March Madness.
Nobody's lying to me. I've been saying this for years.
(10:58):
I have three or four executives really trust in the
NFL and not many others. In fact, my rule has
always been I will not ask an executive in the
NFL a question about a player if that team needs
that player. I could ask a GM like Brett Veach
in Kansas City about quarterbacks because he's got one, but
I'm not going to ask him about left tackles because
(11:19):
he doesn't, and I know he's going to give me
an answer that's fuzzy and I'm putting him in a
bad spot. So I think that the truth of the
matter is when you start looking at these stories, they're
coming out now.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
It's a classic example.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
There weren't many job openings, and once he became a backup,
once he turned off the giants, nobody wanted. They want
to back up. As Albert Breer said, to blend in
with the furniture. And he's not a blending he's not
from a blend in with a furniture family. Yeah, be
legendary before you call yourself. That's how about. That's a
(11:55):
rule going forward for quarterbacks. Just just be legendary. Gotta
be better than thirteen and twelve. Be legendary before you
do a draft room and it's painted all over the
draft room.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
And again it's not the end of the world.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
But what do we always say on the show when
you're a quarterback, everything is something, nothing's everything, But that
legendary is something, all right?
Speaker 3 (12:18):
J Macthez.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
I think we have a bunch of NBA playoff games tonight.
How many do we have tonight? Three or four playoff games?
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Tonight?
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Four games tonight Bucks Pacers starts at six pm Pacific time.
I think three sorry, three o'clock Pacific, six Eastern.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
That's an early start.
Speaker 6 (12:33):
Pacers Bucks the end.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Of the Yannis era, I can't wait for you to open.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
That the show with that tomorrow. All right, Yeah, first
show in Chicago. We're gonna go back back in forth
La and Chicago a little bit. Nobody cares about that
except me. Obviously, taking the train to work was fun today.
I'd never done that before. But coming up next, I've
argued about it. I think there's proof we were right
(12:58):
on it that the NBA doesn't need a face of
the league.
Speaker 6 (13:03):
We've got that next.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and newon Easter non a em Pacific on Fox Sports
Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app HI Welcome back.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
We've talked about this a lot on this show, about
this need for the face of the league.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
First of all, I.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Do think an international player can be the face of
the NBA, because Shoe Otani is the face of baseball.
Could I have if I'd have told you fifteen years ago, Yeah,
the face of baseball. I mean, each Chiero was popular,
but the face of baseball will not be from the States.
You'd have said, whoa, whoa. The face of baseball is Otani.
(13:46):
Aaron Judges. Second, It's okay. Ovechkin hockey We've talked about
this MESSI is now the face of the MLS.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Folks, the borders, they're all fuzzy. Now it's globalization. It's
all fuzzy.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
But I do think it alps if you have a
domestic face of the league for basketball, I don't think
NBA is better if it's more domestic. In fact, I
think it's better if it's more European. I think in
European influence makes the game more skilled, especially with big guys.
But I do think there's an argument that if I
can watch you in March Madness for a couple of years,
(14:20):
like college football Baker Mayfield, then you go to the pros.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
I think it helps.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Because a lot of these international guys, they just don't
want to be faced of the league. Jokisch has no
interest but and checks a lot of boxes. Now, he
did go to a football school, he didn't make March Madness,
and he got drafted by the Minneapolis t Wolves. Minnesota
te Wolves. That doesn't help. But he's handsome, his game
is dynamic. The worst thing you can do is try
(14:48):
to force this. I mean, like the Jason Tatum thing.
Jason Tatum is a great player, but his game is
fundamentally great. Fundamentals don't feel like face of the league.
Tim Duncan was called called the big fundamental. He was
never the face of the league. It doesn't mean he
wasn't the best power forward. I think I heard Charles
Barkley say last week he thought Tim Duncan was the
(15:10):
best power forward of all time. I probably agree, but
he was a fundamental player. Jason Tatum might trout feel
more like that. You know, there is an esthetic to
being great now. I do think it helps if you
knock out Lebron and the Lakers. I do think it
helped last year beating and knocking out the defending champion
(15:34):
Denver Nuggets. I think that stuff really helps. But going
to Minneapolis, playing at Georgia, not making March Madness makes
it an uphill climb, and I think that's one of
the things about being faced in the league. In the NBA,
the NBA is very different. In the NFL, it's all
about winning. Nobody cares about anything else. Basketball is different.
Optics matter, style matters. The first player I fell in
(15:57):
love with was Doctor j. He wasn't the best shooter,
the best ball handler. He was cool, sweeping his hands
under the back. It is like, I've never seen anything
like that, and many. I mean, I've argued there's only
been five to six faces of the league ever, Magic
and Bird, more magic than Bird because Magic embraced it. Lebron,
(16:19):
MJ Staff, Kobe Shack, that's it. Duncan was never that
Kobe by himself. I didn't think was ever that it
was more of a Kobe Shack tandem deal. But the
ratings for these playoff games have been excellent. Lakers game
something got a big number. I don't think you have
to have Ocean's eleven was fine with a bunch of
good actors. The NFL as popular as it is, Farv retired,
(16:43):
Brady retired, Manning retired, Aaron's going to retire. Ratings go up.
But we live in a very distracted world right now.
And I will say this, The problem the NBA has
is its regular season ratings. Well, SODA's hockey and baseball.
So talked about this on the show a lot. We've
become an event nation with all the distractions, a very
(17:04):
polarizing political world. Trump, Biden, it doesn't matter. It's a
very polarizing world we live in. Biden was polarizing Trump's Polari.
So you're just losing people. But you know when you
don't lose them when the games matter World Cup, Olympics,
NFL Sunday, college football.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
And these playoff games.
Speaker 1 (17:23):
I think Ant has a chance to be the face
of the league. Most of the faces of the league,
if not initially, eventually got a great coach. Took Michael
a fewd to get Phil. I do think Chris Finch
has a low profile because he has no interest being
you know, front and center. But right now they're out
(17:46):
coaching JJ Reddick, who I like, but they are throwing
so many different lineups and so many different looks. Finch
within the league is very highly regarded, so it's not
always your first coach, and it's not what was the
highest profile coach. Lebron's a little bit of an outlier
where he's had multiple coaches. But most of the time
(18:08):
you get a Magic and a pat Riley, you get
a Michael and of Phil Jackson, you get a Staff
and a Steve Kerr. There's like a legendary coach. This
is the same with quarterbacks. You Marino has a Shoela,
Elway has got a Shanahan, Brady's got a Belichick, Mahomes
has an Andy Reid, Breeze has a Sean Payton most
of the time. Eventually, you need that great coach to
(18:31):
really understand you, to elevate you, to surround you with
the right people. So I think Ant has a shot
to be the face of the league. Knocking the Lakers
out will not hurt and it looks like they will.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern non am Pacific.
Speaker 7 (18:49):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 8 (18:55):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
Eastern two to four Pacific on Fox Sports Video and
of course the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 8 (19:04):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 7 (19:08):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well, other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 8 (19:16):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together. I mean that says something, right.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
So check us out.
Speaker 7 (19:22):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up.
Speaker 8 (19:26):
As they say, I'd say the most interactive show on
Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planetar.
Speaker 7 (19:31):
Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on
Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app from five to
seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific.
Speaker 8 (19:38):
And if you miss any of the live show, just
search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcasts, and
of course on social media that's Covino and Rich.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
And it was too many amazing that Shador Sanders fell
on the draft with that one of my favorite people
at Fox, Greg Olsen, fourteen years in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Is now joining US Live. You know, I heard it
was funny after Friday show Greg before the second round.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
But after my show I called an executive in the
league and he said to me, he goes watch the
next six picks and the first six picks in the
second round, and he says, if those first six picks
in the second round, if they don't take Shadu or
what the league is telling you is we see him
as a backup now and backup quarterback. As Albert Breer
(20:27):
said today, we want it to be like mix in
with the furniture. Like backup quarterback is a guy that
can go into a local mall with sunglasses and nobody
recognizes them, not Cam Newton or Tim Tebow. So were
you shocked once he didn't go in the first were
you shocked to be fell.
Speaker 9 (20:44):
I think that's the name of the game, right. So
there's an inverse relationship in the NFL. So we'll just
start just generally speaking with most roster players, not just
the quarterback. There's an inverse ratio between the more you
bring with you, the more I don't want to call
it distraction, because sometimes it's a real net positive, right,
We'll call it attention. The more attention you bring upon yourself,
(21:05):
the more attention you go out and seek, the more
the teams will tolerate more of it, the better a
player you are.
Speaker 1 (21:12):
Right.
Speaker 9 (21:12):
So there's like this inverse relationship between those two elements.
Now you add into the fact that it's the quarterback, right,
the league has shown us and there's a million examples
the league has shown us they want guys that don't
there's no extra there's no concerns, there's no where's his
head at, where where's his attention? Lying? What are his priorities?
(21:33):
And again I don't know Shidor that well. Obviously Dion
and we all know his background. But I think as
the draft gets later and later, the element was is
the guy good.
Speaker 6 (21:43):
Enough to play in the NFL? Yes?
Speaker 9 (21:45):
Is he a top tier talent where we're willing to
then also take maybe everything else that comes with it.
And I think a lot of it's harmless. I think
a lot of it's attention seeking. I think it's an
environment that we've created in college where you know, there's
a lot more that comes with playing quarterback nowadays in
college than it was when I was in college.
Speaker 6 (22:02):
So I think that we've almost.
Speaker 9 (22:04):
Created that as a system and as a society, and
now teams have to make a decision if that guy's
not going to be my all pro quarterback, do I
want to put up with it? And I think that's
really the test that we saw play out over the
course of the draft. And listen, could he end up
being a steal there in the fifth round?
Speaker 3 (22:22):
Yes?
Speaker 9 (22:22):
Has he shown at two different spots in colleges that
he could go to teams that didn't necessarily have a
great tradition of winning and turn the program around and
bring attention and energy and buzz. Absolutely, he did it twice.
So I'm not throwing him yet. I'm not throwing him
to the Wolves and saying he has no career, but
I think he needs to take a good, hard reset
and say, you know what it's all about ball. It's
(22:44):
all about me giving myself to have a chance to
have a career in this league. And if it's as
a backup and then I worked to a starter, whatever.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
That path is.
Speaker 9 (22:51):
But the league I think has shown and the message
was pretty clear, you better be really really talented, especially
quarterback if we're going to put up with a lot
of other attention, a lot of other things.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
So you're a former Miami Hurricane. Cam Ward was a
zero star recruit. I watched him at Washington State. I thought, oh,
that's fun, but he's not an NFL guy. Then he
goes to Miami and I'm like, okay, that works. You
watch a lot of Hurricane football. Did you when you
were watching him this year? Did you think, oh, that's
the number one pick in the draft? I mean, did
you see it immediately?
Speaker 6 (23:28):
You know? So it's kind of funny.
Speaker 9 (23:30):
I think cam Ward is such a great example, especially
in this like college football landscape where the zero star
guy multiple colleges, three stops later, one year at Miami
and he's the number one overall pick and he couldn't
buy a scholarship at high school. And then all the
kids making ten you know, ten million dollar nil deals
that are five stars, are now on their fifth school.
(23:52):
They've all trended downward, and they're all fighting, not all,
but many of them are fighting for their lives. I
think it's a great reminder for everybody out there that
although the system is what it is, it's by no
means indicative of what your future is. On top of that,
to answer your question, I had dinner with Mario Chris
Ball tomorrow. Chris Ball the head football coach at Miami.
He was my tight end coach in Miami. I've known
(24:12):
him since I was sixteen. He recruited me when I
was a sophomore in high school when he was at
Rutgers with Greg Cianno, we go way back, and I
had dinner with him after spring ball, before summer camp,
before last season, and he said, Greg, we've had a
lot of like dogs and this, you know, the Sean
Taylors and the Antrell Roles and the you know Edger
and James, and we've had some really big time personalities
(24:35):
that have taken charge of a locker room. Here, he goes,
In all my years at Miami, I'm not sure if
we've had a guy like cam Ward who from day
one changed everything about who we were, our identity, how
we practice, how we met.
Speaker 6 (24:48):
He goes, wait till you see this kid this year.
Speaker 9 (24:50):
I went to the opening game down at the Swamp
in person on the sideline and watched him his first
ever start at Miami against Florida, and I came away
and I don't know if I would have said he's
the number one overall pick right.
Speaker 6 (25:00):
The footwork's a little awkward, he throws off plane.
Speaker 9 (25:03):
I wouldn't say it's how you would necessarily teach a
young kid to play. It's a little more mahomes Ish
as far as a little unconventional but special. But his
season is pretty remarkable what he did at Miami, the
culture and energy besides just the player.
Speaker 6 (25:19):
To a man at.
Speaker 9 (25:19):
Miami, when you said who is the most impactful player
in that locker room in the last five ten years,
it's cam Warden.
Speaker 3 (25:27):
Yeah, that's a great straight he looks as a great kid.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Explain to me, I would put Travis Hunter on offense,
and I'd want him in the offensive meeting rooms. But
he's too good if there's a show hey thing here,
probably too good not to play on defense. Explain to me,
install day, how does that work?
Speaker 3 (25:49):
What meeting is he in?
Speaker 1 (25:52):
All?
Speaker 9 (25:52):
Right? So if I was the coach, right, I have
the magic wand and I'm in charge, I'm putting him
to start in most defensive back meetings.
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I think playing wide.
Speaker 9 (26:03):
Receiver young in the NFL is a little bit easier,
especially when you consider how talented he is physically. It's
a little bit easier to build offensive packages for a
wide receiver and start those out. You know, he might
have ten to fifteen calls in any game plan going
into any week than it is to do the opposite,
To spend all of your time on offense and then
(26:23):
we're going to build out a defensive coverage plan.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
It doesn't really work like that.
Speaker 9 (26:27):
Playing corner, especially young in the NFL, is incredibly difficult.
They're hard to find. They don't grow on trees. There
just are more wide receivers in all shapes and sizes
that can run, catch, athletic and create problems with the
ball in your hands.
Speaker 6 (26:43):
So I agree you got to use them on both.
Speaker 9 (26:45):
I would emphasize early, teaching him how to be an
all pro corner and then he can learn. And then offense,
there's there's packages, there's reversus screens. Teach them a handful
of the route tree, teach them the offense, and you
can slow play and almost protect him as an offensive
play caller because we can tell him exactly what your
(27:05):
role is. Here are the plays to be prepared for.
On defense, you're at corner. We've got to be able
to play man zone, too high, single high zone. We've
got to be able to play fire blit zones. The
other team could come out in two backs. They can
come out and spread. You could play to the boundary,
you could play to the field. Defense, there's a lot
more on your plate because you're reacting to what the
offense can do. Offensive play caller, I can control what
(27:28):
I expose him to, especially early, not overwhelm him, control
that side of the ball.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
So that's how I would handle him.
Speaker 9 (27:37):
I just think defensive back in the NFL nowadays, with
the passing of the league and the way the league
is going.
Speaker 6 (27:43):
You just can't find enough of those guys. And when
you find a special one, he needs to play defense.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
So your career at the end was with Pete Carroll.
One of the few draft picks that I felt was
kind of obvious. I didn't hit on many of them,
but I thought Ashton Gent Gino Smith is actually a
pretty darn good quarterback when he throws on play action,
when you force him to throw on third and eleven.
You know, that's the Mahomes Josh Allen where they can
(28:10):
make it work. You know Pete, you know how he
views the running game. Talk a little bit that about
that le Gent who's dynamic, but you can also get
short yardage with because he's so strong.
Speaker 6 (28:24):
Yeah, I'm with you.
Speaker 9 (28:25):
I think of all the drafts there in the top ten,
call it that one made the most sense. Like that,
just felt that's his Marshawn, That's that's his bel cow,
that's his guy. That is the identity of Pete. Play
great defense, control to run, play action. He went out
and got brought Gino with him. Gino understands what Pete
wants to be, understands the offense he wants to implement,
(28:46):
and then new factor, and he's got two young tight ends.
I would argue brock Powers he very well could be
the best young tight end to come out of college
in the last ten years. Like I think he's that special.
I thought he was that good when he was at Georgia.
So two young tight ends with mayor from Notre Dame
from the previous year that Rockbert Bowers going into a
second year, continue to invest in an offensive line. Now
(29:09):
a bellcout quarterback, running back, get under center with Gino,
play action on early downs. You're right, the guys that
make sixty five seventy million dollars, those guys are good
on first and second down, and they're good on third
and fifteen when everyone in the building knows it's a pass.
That's why there's Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes and Joe Burrow, etc.
The vast majority of the league. And this is not
(29:31):
a knock the vast majority of the league. The formula is,
you want to throw play action downs on first and
second down, and you do not want to be and
must pass downs. That is the formula on ninety percent
of NFL rosters.
Speaker 6 (29:43):
Until you have the.
Speaker 9 (29:44):
Elite of the elite and every down is a passing down.
But there's only a couple of those guys. So I
think the formula works. He has showed that it's worked
for a long time. He's got the quarterback that can
do it. He's got it back. Now he's got the
tight ends. Continue to invest in the offensive line, and
all of a sudden, this look like what a Pete
Carroll offense wants to be.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Finally, you played with Cam Newton, a spectacularly gifted athlete
who was also a good pocket guy when he wanted
to be. You also played in Chicago and you were
a big part of Cam's career the tight end. Okay,
so now the Bears, with a spectacularly talented quarterback in Chicago,
say we're going.
Speaker 3 (30:21):
To get another tight end.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
So I think that you could say, boy, Colston Lovelin
went high. They just got Romadonze, they had Cole Comet.
But there is to talk about why tight end is
so crucial for everybody but really athletic quarterbacks. And I mean,
you were Cam's guy, And I don't know, I just
(30:43):
look at Caleb and Colston and I think that's going
to work. And I loved the pick. Or is it
just this that tight ends mean more to young quarterbacks,
is that it.
Speaker 6 (30:54):
Well.
Speaker 9 (30:55):
I definitely think tight ends mean a lot to young quarterbacks.
I think that's been proving. There's a lot of examples
throughout it. I also think tight ends bring a lot
of value in today's style the way that these offensive
coordinators you look obviously Ben Johnson, now the style in
which these offensive play callers want to operate. The tight
end is a huge role in that because, again, like
we said, if you want to get under center, and
(31:16):
you want to get into early play action on run
fifty to fifty downs, and you want to be able
to keep the defense in single high coverages for all
your crossers and your layers and all your deep shots,
you can't be in a let you can't be in
ten personnel right. You can't have four wide receiver types
and one back in the back right. So you got
to have somebody that can keep you honest in the
why position, the tight end position. He could be an
(31:37):
off ball player, he's an on ball player. There's a
lot of ways to do it, but there needs to
be some form of threat on first and second down
that you're not just in past personnel in shotgun.
Speaker 3 (31:48):
The entire game.
Speaker 9 (31:49):
We've seen that that approach across the league is very difficult.
So now you bring in Ben Johnson, Caleb Williams. Now
you have Cole Comet, who you mentioned Rome Denze from
last year. Don't forget they got DJ Moore from the
Bryce Young trade, you know, a couple of years ago.
Now you add in you know, so all of a sudden,
now they've invested multiple offensive linemen. They're saying, we need
(32:12):
our number one overall pick to succeed. We got him
the coach, We've got him the line, we've got him
the skill players. Now we'll worry about going back and
worrying about building up the defense. But remember offensive coaches, Colin,
if you're good on offense and the defense struggles, you
can always find a new defensive coordinator.
Speaker 6 (32:29):
That's the formata we see that. I hate to.
Speaker 9 (32:32):
Say it, but when they were struggling in Philadelphia and
they couldn't get the defense right following Jonathan Gannon, all
of a sudden, a year later, who's available Vic Fangiel. Yeah,
all of a sudden in the Cincinnati they've got the
greatest offense in the league, offensive minded coach and Zach
Robinson and Zach Taylor.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
Zach Taylor, and what do they do.
Speaker 9 (32:53):
They get rid of a defensive coordinator who was up
to be a head coach just a year or two before.
Speaker 6 (32:57):
So that's the formula.
Speaker 9 (32:59):
Get your young quarterback settled, get your new offensive minded
head coach, Ben Johnson, get him going on offense, and
then we have time to finish up complimenting the defense.
That's the NFL formula, and I think the Bears have
four to five wins built into this just by getting
organized offensively with Ben Johnson in company, I think there's
(33:19):
a four game elevation within that roster just by getting
organized offensively.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Greg Olsen, you do great work, my friend, as all
as I appreciate you stopping by
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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