May 21, 2025 • 40 mins
Colin discusses the NFL's decision to not ban the Tush Push and Oklahoma City's big Game 1 win over Minnesota in the Western Conference Finals. Colin addressed if UNC has set up Bill Belichick to succeed in Chapel Hill and if Josh Allen is too low on PFF's latest QB rankings. He also talks to Author Jeff Pearlman on the Brett Favre Netflix documentary, Aaron Rodgers' future, and the new-look Luka Doncic Lakers
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Here we go. It is a Wednesday, and there is
actually a lot to talk about. It's the Herd. Wherever
you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks
for making us part of your day, So Jmak. We
learned again today that the NFL owners run everything. Doesn't
(00:51):
matter what committees say, it doesn't matter what the commissioner says,
it doesn't matter what coaches say. It is an owner
run lead and we got another example of that today
with a toush push.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I think you and I are pretty much on the
same page with it, right, We're fine with this.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
I don't love it, but here's the very latest. The
NFL's Competition Committee said you should get rid of it.
The NFL's Health and Safety Commission Committee said you should
get rid of it, and the NFL owner said, eah,
we're going to keep it. It was close. They needed
(01:30):
twenty four votes to get.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Rid of it.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
It was twenty two. I think Jason Kelsey, former Eagle
Center podcaster, apparently spoke to owners and that, in my opinion,
was the difference. They're not going to ban it for now. Hey, listen,
clever coaches are like good accountants. They find loopholes schemes
right to benefit their clients, and sometimes the league rules, Nope,
(01:57):
we gave it to you for three years, We're not
going to give to you for four. I've always said
the NFL is a TV show, and the two things
they really care about are entertainment and safety, in no
particular order. They care about entertainment and safety, and to me,
the tush push kind of violates both. It looks dangerous
(02:17):
and it's ugly. Optics on TV aren't good. It's an
ugly play, and it almost failed. Twenty two votes needed
twenty four. I think Jason Kelsey, speaking on behalf of it,
a very respective player who was not you know, some
five star recruit. He was a grinder. He's classic NFL family.
(02:39):
The Kelseys have been great for the league. He spoke,
and I think he push pushed it into not being banned.
I think his ability to create that play and to
keep it from being banned. The Eagles have already posted
it on social media, the push stays on. I'm a
little surprised. I mean, we see this all the time.
(03:01):
Remember years ago, Cam Chancellor would jump over the line
and block kicks for the Seahawks, and the NFL felt
it is a little dangerous. Looking now, there wasn't a
ton of data that showed, you know, there was a
lot of guys getting hurt. But the NFL didn't like it,
and they said, I don't think so. The horse collar
tackle they got rid of it. The kickoffs they look
(03:22):
all funky now they think it's too dangerous. But I
think what helps the tush push. There is no current
data that a bunch of guys are getting hurt with it,
although I'm not sure a bunch of guys were getting
hurt when Cam Chancellor was jumping over a line to
block a kick either, But there's no data that shows
that it's hurting people. And the second thing is Jason
(03:46):
Kelsey's powerful. He is respected. He made a plea to
keep it, and I think it probably flipped one or
two owners. So the Competition Committee, they and the Health
and Safety Committee recommended the league ban it. We don't
(04:06):
like it, and usually those recommendations get something banned. But
in this instance the owners and they control it. They
control Goodell's salary, Roger Goodell's trying to get a raise here.
They control that, They control the length of the schedule.
It's the only sport in America where the owners control
the TV networks, not vice versa. They tell them what
they will pay, and then they can they can blow
(04:30):
those TV contracts up in the middle of them and
renegotiate it if they want. The NFL owners are all powerful.
You got a lot of NBA Baseball owners, NBA owners,
MLS owners selling stuff. You own an NFL team, Just
keep it, just keep it, and so the owners win again.
Here's Dion Dawkins, great left tackle for Buffalo. His opinions
(04:53):
are like a lot of players' opinions on it. You
don't love it, but it's phil is what do we
do with it? Here's Dean Dawkins.
Speaker 5 (05:03):
It's a very hard play for a player. It's a
very hard play for a player. You know you're down
there your head is down. You just have to kind
of just drive your legs and hit three people at
one time.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Like it's very hard thing to do.
Speaker 5 (05:18):
But it's so weird because we play a game of inches, right,
Like what's the best player to get an inch? The
tuch push, what's the best play to get a yard?
Maybe a QB sneak And it's hard to take it
out or it's hard to change it because it's so
(05:39):
necessary in the game because sometimes you just need to
fall forward and get the first down.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
And to the Philadelphia Eagles credit, they do it well.
I mean, Buffalo got to the AFC Championship and they
looked unprepared when they had Superman Josh Allen trying to
jump in the air and lean for a yard. It
looked it really looked like they didn't practice it. Philadelphia
practices it. They add decoys to it. I thought when
(06:09):
Kelsey left it wouldn't be as successful it is. It
does look a little dangerous, but so far, I don't
think there's any data that shows that it is. And
Philadelphia does it better than anybody else. That's their best argument.
We created it, we do it better than everybody else.
It's available to the entire league. Why are you banning it?
As of now it survives, but it was close. And
(06:31):
again I think Jason Kelsey highly respected him speaking to owners.
Probably push pushed it in Okay, Game one of the
Western Conference Finals is in the books, and it feels
like the series is in the books. So Oklahoma City
rolled through the NBA's regular season historically one by an
(06:53):
average of twelve point nine points. That like Jordan's Bulls
didn't do that. And then they rolled Memphis in the
first round, and then they old Minnesota last night. The
only team and actually only player to give him real
trouble is Jokic. Nikola Jokich, the Joker gave him trouble.
They even wore him down and Okase, like the Super
Bowl champion Philadelphia Eagles, are not really built on a player.
(07:16):
They're built on a general manager. Howie Roseman GM of
the Eagles, Sam Presty GM of the Thunder. They have
built such insanely deep and flexible rosters. You think the
coach is good, but is he necessary? They forced the
Tea Wolves to only score from the outside. In fact,
Minnesota only had twenty points in the paint. That's their
(07:38):
lowest total, and there are big team since twenty fifteen.
Julius Randall kept him in the game in the first half,
shot the ball well, hit a bunch of threes. Once
that dried up, the offense dried up. This is a
team that they're not necessarily huge. But you ever watch
a football team, like you'll watch college football when Alabama
was in its prime and the defense was just crushing people,
(07:58):
and you're like, do they have thirteen players on the field,
Like it looks like they have extra players. Oklahoma City's
defense looks like they're playing seven guys. So Jokic could
get his, but Murray didn't get his, Porter couldn't get his.
They just shut off lanes and avenues. And just think
about this. So Oklahoma City against a much better West
(08:20):
was thirty nine and thirteen. So they dominated the West.
They were twenty nine and one against the East. See
you're asking yourself, are the Pacers and the Knicks which
starts tonight? Are they just playing for second place? So
aunt Edwards didn't have a great night, didn't get a
lot of shots. Sometimes invisible. I think he's gonna have
(08:41):
to have four or five games where he scores thirty
plus and I'm not sure you can do this. This
is just the defense where a lot of these guys
are are just entering their athletic prime, long, twitchy, fast,
and Jokic is a great example. They really cut Jokic's
passing lanes so the joke could score, but the passing
(09:02):
lanes got cut down, and Jokich is a much more
totally refined offensive player than Aunt Edwards. Here's what's scary.
Oklahoma City's average age is twenty five for a team
that won sixty eight games by an average winning total
of thirteen points. So it it's by the second half.
(09:24):
Once Julius Randall's threes didn't drop, this looked like a
total mismatch. Younger, quicker, better defensively with a lot of
levers to pull. Here's Aunt Edwards after.
Speaker 6 (09:38):
I definitely got to shoot boards to thirteen shots, but
I'll say probably just get off the ball a little more.
Play without the ball. I think that'd be the answer,
because playing on the ball, he's going double and then
sitting the gaps all day. They clogged the paint. That's
what they do.
Speaker 7 (09:55):
They don't got.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Massage down there, so.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
Hey, bankms not make a shot side this because every
time I go to the Rams, like four people.
Speaker 8 (10:03):
At the paint.
Speaker 6 (10:04):
So yeah, I guess they just be cagged into paint.
They put like five four bodies in a paint and
make you kick it out. So just keep making the
right play.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Now, here's the good news for Minnesota. They'll eventually go
to go play at home where they're really good. Chris
Finch and his staff have been excellent at shifting around
to second and third gears and figuring out ways to
get the most out of the offense. But if you
watch the second half, they were just overwhelmed. Memphis got overwhelmed,
the West got overwhelmed, the East beat him one time
(10:34):
in thirty games. Oklahoma City looked really good led by defense.
Of course, a SGA is excellent, he gets the whistle.
But I think the core of this thing is the depth,
the roster, construction, the aggressiveness of the defense. You know,
generally in sports, a great defense slows down a great offense.
If you were the Bulls a MJ, you had both.
But this looked like a mismatch last night. In the
(10:57):
second half, it looked really really ugly. All right, so
jam something else came out this morning I love this
so pff they do this every year they come out
with a tiers of quarterbacks, and it was interesting. I've
got a lot of thoughts on it. In my lifetime,
there's always been one thing that's true with the quarterback position.
And once again with PFFS quarterback rankings, they ranked everybody
(11:21):
in the league. I think, once again, this happens since
I was a kid. It happened during the Lway years,
the Montana years, the Brady years, and now during the
Mahomes years. There is something that always is the case
and I'll talk about that coming up.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
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Speaker 1 (11:46):
Really interesting thing happening. I'm going to get to it
about fifteen minutes with college basketball. College basketball is getting
some really good news. I'm gonna talk about that in
fifteen minutes. Chris Simms will be around the corner as well.
If you haven't heard, it was a very close voice,
very close vote. The Tush push by a couple of
votes has survived again Philadelphia. They created it. Their argument
(12:13):
is it's not a loophole. It's just the quarterback sneak
modified amplified, and the owners did not take the recommendation
of you know, the Rules committee or the Health and
Safety committee. They both said Bannett, the NFL owners close vote,
said now we're going to keep it. We'll vote in
it again next year. So this is interesting. PFF. They
(12:37):
do this every year. They take every starting quarterback in
the NFL, all thirty two ahead of the season, and
they ranked them. They put them in tiers Tier one, two,
three and four, five and six. I don't care about
the middle bottom ones. So their Tier one, which I
totally agree with, is Mahomes, Jackson, Josh Allen, and Burrow.
I have no problem. That's what I would do. They're
(12:58):
Tier two. I don't disagree with that, Jalen Hurts, Jaden Daniels,
Matthew Stafford, Justin Herbert. They're Tier three, which is Jared Goff,
Gino Smith, and brock Perty. I think C. J. Stroud
is more talented than all those guys, although I think
it's close. I do think it's interesting. Sam Darnold's in
Tier five and in Tier three is Tua and Trevor Lawrence.
(13:23):
I disagree with that. But again, in my entire life,
I've always had this thing we've talked about. There's always
about seven quarterbacks maybe eight, at any one time in
the NFL, in any era that you just don't pick
up the phone. Somebody calls with Elway, you're not picking
up the phone. If you go back to Elway in
his prime, there were seven or eight guys, you're not
(13:46):
picking up the phone. John Elway, Dan Marino, Joe Montana,
Jim Kelly, Steve Young, Troy aik Ben and Warren Moon.
They were just really were to good players. There's no
reason to get on the phone and initiate conversation like
those are the seven guys. If you go to Brady's era,
it was Brady and Breeze and Peyton Manning and Big Ben.
I'd say Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers and maybe Philip Rivers.
(14:10):
Their GMS loved them. They won a lot of games,
and they were highly productive, and you got him every week.
I think right now, PFF got the eight right now.
I CJ. Stroud is the one. To me. I think
he either has to be the number one, tier two
quarterback or he's darn close. I think he's really good
(14:30):
He did pull back last year, but his offensive line
was atrocious, he lost two of his three best receivers,
and he still got into the playoffs and won a
playoff game. So other than that, I've always felt it's
about seven or eight guys at any one time in
the NFL that are somebody calls about him, you're not
really interested. I don't think Houston would take a call
on CJ. Stroud. I think he is a Tier two guy,
(14:54):
maybe barely, maybe the first guy out. We could argue
that it doesn't really matter because historically the guys in
Tier one and occasionally Tier two win all the Super Bowls.
So I think PFF got it right and don't have
a problem with any of the grades. I think clearly
in the league. Now mahomes Lamar Josh and Burrell have separated,
I don't think there's any question that's the first group.
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Speaker 1 (16:18):
So Mac Brown coached at North Carolina, then went on
to fame riches in a national title at Texas, and
then they went broadcasting, and then they went back to
North Carolina. They did a good job. He did a
good job. He raised a lot of money. North Carolina
got into bowl games. They put a lot of guys
in the NFL, but it does a basketball school. So
he retires his last year. I think he's six and
(16:40):
six and Bill Belichick takes over. So they asked him
about Belichick. And I'm not saying what he's saying is untrue,
but I could see where the Belichick people, the Belichick
camp wouldn't love what Mac Brown said when he was
asked about Belichick with guitar.
Speaker 10 (17:01):
As far as North Carolina and Bill Belichick, now, he's
arguably the best coach ever. They've committed money to it,
they've helped them with academics, they've lowered those standards some
so there's absolutely no reason that they shouldn't be successful.
And anymore, they've changed the roster. I think they've signed
maybe sixty something new transfers. So you've got a chance
(17:23):
to succeed at the highest level, and I expect them
to do that, and I'm proud for them.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
He may be right, but if you take out Notre Dame,
there is no top twelve college football program, top fifteen
college football program that can't get the best high schoolers in.
When you talk about academics, you know they've lowered the standards.
Notre Dame is different. They're a top fifteen program, and
(17:51):
it's a tough school to get in, and it's a
tough school to get through. Stanford, but they're not a
top fifteen program. They've had stretches. Stanford's another program where
you know there it's hard to get in. I've had
coaches tell me at Stanford you can't keep eighty five
guys on scholarship. They can't find enough players that academically
qualify for Stanford. Did they lower academic standards at Carolina?
(18:13):
My take has always been Carolina is one of those
schools that if they want to get a player in,
they'll get a player in. So I could see Belichick
people at blanching at that a little bit. But I
do think this is where I give Carolina a lot
of credit is they realized, listen, in our conference, there
(18:34):
is one big dog, and that big dog is Clemson,
and how are we going to catch Clemson? Well, Clemson
will not play the nil game. They're the only national
power that's not interested in it. And I think Carolina
smartly said Okay, they're not going to do it. This
is a moment in time to catch the big dog
(18:54):
Clemson in our conference. We're going to go completely pro
model and go all in on nil. And this is
a little bit what Oregon did with Chip Kelly. Mike
Pilotti did a good job, but it was always Washington
and USC with the big names in the conference. They
you know, they had national championships, and Oregon said, how
do we catch them? Well, Phil Knight, one hundred uniforms
(19:17):
to get LA kids be cool. We're gonna be the
cool program. We're not gonna like USC and Washington grab
on this tradition. We have no tradition. We're gonna go
one hundred uniforms and we're gonna go hire a guy
in Chip Kelly. They don't huddle. Oregon stopped huddling for
a long time. We're not gonna huddle it. I'll play
every thirteen seconds. And it worked, and Oregon is still
on top of Washington and USC. So to catch the
(19:41):
big dog in the conference, you got to take big swings.
And I look at Carolina and saying, hey, we got
a moment in time here. Clemson's not playing the nil game.
So let's go all in on nil, all in on
an NFL model, all in on Belichick and Jordan Hudson too.
So I respect what Carolina is doing. I think it's
the only way to be a disruptor is to look
(20:03):
at the leading models and do the opposite. This is interesting.
The Buffalo Bills, I was just told in my earpiece,
are going to do hard knocks. They've been selected. Now,
usually you get boring teams, or dysfunctional teams, or chaotic
teams or teams. That's why I hard knocks eliminates all
the good teams. So Buffalo is actually fascinating. So this
(20:23):
is a team that they're the only team I saw
this yesterday, the Buffalo Bills, not Philadelphia, the only team
to be favored in every game next year. So the
Eagles face Buffalo at the end of the season, and
right now, Buffalo's a one and a half point favorite
(20:45):
in that game. You can bet it. So my takeaway
on this is Buffalo. This sounds like a good problem.
Buffalo's in a really tough spot. Josh Allen just turned
twenty nine. He's audaciously ballented six six two fifty five
or more and a great runner. He's in the middle
of his prime and last season off his best season,
(21:09):
the Kansas City Chiefs were the single most vulnerable Chiefs
team since Mahomes arrived. O line issues, receiver maturity issues,
health issues, and Kansas City still beat him in the
AFC Championship. And when Sean McDermott got into those short
yardage situations with Josh Allen leaping over, I've got to
(21:32):
be honest, it looked like a defensive coach that was
a bit unprepared on third and fourth and one calls.
It was really bad. It was the opposite of the
tush push. It looked unpracticed. And so here's the problem.
Sean McDermott is a good coach. In fact, i'd say
he's a good coach. Is he Mark Jackson to the
(21:53):
Warriors where he's a good coach, a playoff coach, a
smart coach, but not the championship coach. And if you
look at the AFC now you've got Annie Reid, both
are bass. Sean Payton's in it. Oh oops, Mike Vrabel
(22:13):
just reappeared. So it's very easy when you watch one
of those music shows to spot great and lousy. It's
just not that hard. To see mediocre or bad or great?
What do you do with good to pretty good? And
it would be one thing if Buffalo had seven trophies.
(22:34):
They're the one team in the National Football League who
is now in its second run that's going to last
over a decade, that's good enough to get there often
gets there, and has no trophies. They're like the last
I mean, it was one thing when the Cubs won
a World Series, they were just bad forever, the lovable losers.
Now Buffalo's had the Jim Kelly era, the Josh Allen era,
(22:56):
where we're like, I think half those years they were
the best team in the NFL and they got no trophies.
So that adds to the tension in the city. If you
got trophies, like the Packers or the Eagles. In the
back room, it's a different vibe entirely. So how long
is Dion Dawkins going to remain healthy at left tackle?
I look this morning, Josh Allen's cap hit is going up.
(23:19):
It's kind of the Sean McDermott dilemma where he's not bad,
but I don't think he's great, but I think he's
good to pretty good. And the Warriors moved off Mark Jackson,
and it was a risk because Mark Jackson was a
good coach. So you do get to a point with Buffalo.
It's interesting that they're going to be the you know,
(23:42):
the HBO Mac Show or the HBO show Hard Knocks.
Usually it is a team with an outrageous personality at
coach or at quarterback. McDermott's pretty muted, pretty intense. I
do think Buffalo is interesting. But they're the own only
team favored to win every game next year, and yet
(24:04):
here we are. Do you really think Kansas City had
its worst, most vulnerable team. Now they have blown out
in the Super Bowl. This was their most vulnerable year,
and now it's Peyton, Now it's both Harbas's. Here comes Rabel,
and all of them have their quarterbacks. John Harbaugh's got
his quarterback. Jim Harbaugh's got his quarterback. Sean Payton's got
(24:26):
his quarterback. Mike Rabel. Drake may I think he's got
his quarterback. Sean does too, but the pressure is really
on him. By the way. Good news here, j mc.
I know we're not supposed to talk about this, but
I'm just reading this. What Pernielsen Live same plus same
day data first two rounds of the NBA playoffs average
(24:49):
four point two million viewers, three point three percent improvement
versus a year ago. Great, wonderful.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
So ratings we're talking about for the NBAG or no,
I remember yesterday you shut me down. You're like, oh,
they got their deal, they're fine.
Speaker 10 (25:06):
Who cares?
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Well? Can two things be true? Yes? Of course they
got seventy six billion. And baseball hockey and the NBA
and the MLS regular season ratings going forward are never
going to be great because we are an events society.
We're more distracted, there's more content, there's more platforms. Hockey
(25:27):
ratings regular season are awful. Baseball MLS? Where is MLS Apple?
Speaker 3 (25:32):
Where is hey as a songs or owner? Let's not
disparage the sport.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Let's be at two things are true. They got seventy
six billion, and the league is fine.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Well, listen, how about this? This ANEC data was what
they like to call. There's a guy who works here,
you know, he's a big Lakers fan, And I asked him, hey,
would you think of the game last night?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
The free throw merchant?
Speaker 3 (25:50):
He said, I didn't see the game, Johnny, Obviously I'm
talking about and he's like I had, I had my
nephew's birthday party to go to, and I just wondered,
Colin nationwide, if you you've got an invite on a
Tuesday night versus checkout thunder against things like no, no.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
That's a legitimate question. You're not skipping Lebron, I don't.
I think the increases in ratings will go now backwards
for Minnesota, OKC. I think it will go backwards.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Well, last year it was Dallas and who was it? Dallas, Minnesota,
which I don't think we're great rating.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Well, that was Luca. Luca that helped Power three around
the corner.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
And I heard one more Heard. The Herd streams twenty
four hours a day, seven days a week within the
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whenever you like.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
All right. He's a best selling author multiple times Jeff
Perlman New York Times best Selling Offer. He's got the
digital series press Box Chronicles on YouTube. I thought it
was interesting today because there's a there's an untold documentary
on Netflix on on Brett Farr. And he wrote a
book years ago, Gunslinger, The Remarkable, Improbable, Iconic Life of
(27:00):
Brett Farv, which I thought I'd said this at the time.
When I read it, I thought I thought Brent Farv
wasn't very nice to Aaron Rodgers, wasn't very helpful. It
made me like Aaron Rodgers, regardless of what I think today.
But it's a fascinating book. So I'm watching the documentary
on him, which is, you know, hero worship for thirteen minutes,
then they go after him. Jeff Pearlman, now joining us live,
(27:23):
knows Brett Farb knows, the Packers knows Aaron Rodgers, so
you know. So we were talking during the break. I've
always had this theory, and I call it the Green
Bay Quarterback theory. Is that Farv's a Southerner, Aaron Rodgers
is a hipster out West, and they morphed into the
same guy. Is that at the end they got needy,
a bit precious, a little rigid, weird, and yet they're
(27:44):
different personalities. But you have no owner. It's the smallest market.
You can't go to the grocery store. You have to
hide in a golf course. And it does affect you.
You become literally bigger than life. As good as Matt
Stafford is. Stan Kronky runs the show and soda is
McVeagh when when FARV started to unravel, Jeff Pearlman, were
you surprised by it or did you see things that
(28:07):
made you wonder?
Speaker 4 (28:09):
I actually think you make a really good point, which
is it's this god complex thing that happens when you're
a small market quarterback. You can't, like you said, you
can't go anywhere. People treat you like a god, literally
like a god. You are the king of the landscape,
and at some point it's just unsustainable. Either you get old,
you get hurt, you go somewhere else. Suddenly you're not
(28:30):
treated that way. So you're Brett Favre. Suddenly you're in
New York Jet, You're living in suburban New Jersey. You're
part of this franchise. You don't know, you're by yourself,
living in a hotel every day, and before you know it,
you're sending Penis pictures to an employee of the team.
Like I just think he got so used to being
a certain way, deified, glorified. All of a sudden he's
in a new situation and he doesn't have the maturity
(28:51):
of the personal development to handle it.
Speaker 7 (28:52):
I just think that's the very short story of it all.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah, so now let's let's let's go to Aaron. Uh. Aaron,
I thought I've always thought bright. I think he's well read.
I think he's interesting, he's a little iconic classic. I mean,
he's a different cat. He clearly pushes back in authority.
It could be the government, it could be vaccines, it
could be the media. He pushes back in authority. That's okay.
I am for that. Go back for the people that
(29:17):
haven't read the book. And your books are fascining. The
Walter Payton book I think had been lost in because
you've done so much. That's a fantastic book. And he's
the best running back I've ever seen, probably by far
so during the air and far of stuff. When I
read your book, I had sympathy for Aaron. I don't
think Brett was nice to him. Are you surprised what
he's sort of morphed into, which is kind of to
(29:40):
a fault.
Speaker 4 (29:42):
I do my own homework, guy, So it's interesting.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
I think, I'm sure you've dealt with these people too.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
Every now and then in sports, you come across someone
who believes from the beginning that he is the here's here,
the smartest people in the room.
Speaker 7 (29:56):
I am the smartest person in this room.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
Nobody is intelligence his knee, and I feel like Rodgers
has had that from a very young age. When he
arrived in Green Bay, he really far was terrible man
like terrible. I mean, there are moments of just like
treating him like absolute crap. There was the humiliating time
for Aaron Rodgers. It might sound kind of quaint in hindsight,
is he takes his helmet one day, he puts it
(30:19):
on a memorabilia table in the locker room. Everyone's signing
Aaron Rodgers' helmet before practice. He's scurrying around, can't find
his helmet. Someone says, that's yours. It's filled with signatures.
He has to go to practice as a rookie bringing
this signature filled helmet, and he's mortified, and he's humiliated.
But I just think over time, especially being in a
small Midwestern town surrounded by the Midwestern quaintness of Green Bay,
(30:44):
I think Aaron Rodgers really started to believe I'm the
smartest guy in the room.
Speaker 7 (30:47):
I know everything. I am very intelligent.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
I know more than the coaches, I know more than
my teammates, I know more than this fan base. And
again if you can contain that. In Green Bay, Wisconsin,
it's one thing you're treated as a guy, but once
you go national, once you go to a different franchise,
it doesn't really play out that well because people just
see you as kind of a duche.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
So I got to ask you, you know the Bus family. Well,
you wrote the book on the Lakers Dynasty of the
eighties and it's it's a fascinating book which got made
into an HBO series and it's it's really it's one
of those that you can't put down. It's I always
knew Kobe was difficult. Then I read the book and
I'm like, how did Phil Nutt go after him? It
(31:27):
was just crazy. But you know the Bus family. And
I've said this to a friend about a month ago.
I said, Luca's got a little shack. I'm not sure
how commited he is in the off season. I you know,
I'm there are games he shows up where I think
his mind is elsewhere. But he's good for the brand,
he's good for merch, he's insanely talented. Knowing how the
(31:50):
Bus family eventually made a decision to move off shack,
do you think the kids have some of those same
frustrations with Luca No that they literally had to call
a meeting about his cardiovascular health after the year.
Speaker 7 (32:07):
So it'd be impossible for me to put myself in
Genie Bus's head.
Speaker 4 (32:10):
Obviously, I think numb one day obviously had to make
that trade. Like you had to make that trade. You're
getting a young superstar in his prime. The problem is,
like you touched upon Luca. I don't even understand it.
You make all this money and you're one thing. You
need to be into shape.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
That's it.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
That's the biggest qualification of this job is you need
to be in shape. And the thing about Shack that's
interesting is when Shakers with the Lakers, until Kobe really
gained some power and really really started calling out Shack
behind the scenes for his lack of fitness. I don't
think the family was particularly bothered by it because he
Number one, he sold jerseys. Number two, he was charismatic.
(32:46):
Number three, he produced, and I think Luca technically is
the same thing. He does produce, he does sell jerseys,
He is pretty charismatic. I think it's going to get
really tricky once Lucas shows up a training camp thirty
pounds overweight, once other teammates start calling him out, once
you start hearing the whispers, because in this town in
Los Angeles, whispers.
Speaker 7 (33:05):
Traveled very quickly.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
And if the Lakers start struggling and you have this
star who's supposed to be great and he's on the
injury list yet again, and he looks gey yet again,
I just think, I don't know what their reaction is
going to be, emotionally or mentally.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
I just know they're going to be trapped yet again.
Speaker 4 (33:21):
All these Laker fans who think we've escaped, we're awesome,
we have Luca.
Speaker 7 (33:25):
It's a little bit of fool's goal. Potentially.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
You're a New Yorker. Where did you grow up in
New York?
Speaker 7 (33:33):
I grew up in a tiny town called Mayhopak, New York.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Okay, is that outside about.
Speaker 7 (33:38):
An hour north right outside in New York to the
hour north of the city.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
So I when I worked at the other place, I
always claimed it wasn't a Yankee town or a Giants town.
It's a Knicks town. Is that everybody loved the Knicks
baseball and football opinions. And so when I watch Madison
Square Garden, and I've said this on the air, I'm sorry.
That's the best basketball city in the country. It looks different,
(34:02):
it feels donald. So you tell you've been the Madison
Square Garden plenty of times. It kind of a spiritual
revelation for all New Yorkers. What are you going through
as a true New Yorker right now?
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Well, the funny thing is, first of all, I just
want to say I grew up. I was the one
kid in my school who is a New Jersey Nets fan.
So I was a big Hey give a coming a
break man. I was a big Pearl Washington, Buck Williams,
you know, Michael Quorn fan. But the Knicks owned you
were one hundred percent correct the Knicks or the universal
love of New York and the Rangers to a slightly
less degree. And when it's pumping, when the Garden is pumping,
(34:41):
when the team is playing, well.
Speaker 7 (34:43):
There is nowhere like it.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
Madison Square Garden has always maintained its electricity, the air
of excitement, the buzz when you had Patrick Ewing going,
when you had you know, you know, Latrell Spreewell going.
There's something about it that feels this and fierce. It's
just something different. You don't get to go into Laker
game or a Clipper game. You just it's something different,
(35:08):
and it's an advantage the Knicks half that you're not
going to get if you're the Pacers, or potentially in
the finals if you go to Oklahoma City.
Speaker 7 (35:14):
It's just something really.
Speaker 4 (35:16):
Raw, and it's kind of like this when you meet
a New Yorker and they're like, yo, you got to
go to this place and get a slice, and that
guy sucks and blah blah blah. That's Madison Square Garden.
It takes everything about New York and puts it in
one building.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
I don't know if you prepared for this, but I've
been joking that if I don't get invited to the
Belichick Belichick Jordan Hudson wedding, I'll be bitter because I'm
the only American media member supporting the relationship. And I
had this discussion last night. I said, Okay, if she
was thirty six, would you be okay with it? If
he was sixty four, would you be okay? I said,
In the end, I'm not judging people's relationships as long
(35:52):
as both people are here for it. Do I think
there's a little bit of her as a wilful, young
woman seeing opportunities. Yes, do I think Bill understanding she's
his social stockbroker on the internet, and she's a beautiful
young lady. They're both getting something out of it. It
doesn't bother me, but I feel like I'm on a
(36:13):
total island. Jeff Pearlman, what do you make of Jordan
Hunts and Bill Belichick?
Speaker 4 (36:19):
All Right, So I have a twenty two year old daughter,
and if she came home one day and said, Dad,
I want you to meet my new boyfriend. He's sixty
five years old or sixty seven years old, I think
I'd be a little troubled by this one. I don't
they can do what they want. They're can sending adults.
I think it's a little weird. I think her role
(36:39):
is definitely weird. I'm sure North Carolina is secretly freaking
out and thinking we didn't really I don't think we
knew what we signed up for with this one. I
think that's the big issue here, is like the sense
of control that she seems to have over his affairs.
If it was my daughter's boyfriend, I'd be freaked out.
I would not be happy. As a spectator. People can
do what they want.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Okay, Yeah, no, I've said that before too. I wouldn't
personally like it, but I do feel like, in a
weird way, both are using each other for what it
appears they want, and I don't like to be the moralist.
That's not who I am. All Right, before we go,
you have been writing a book for a year and
you do six seven, eight hundred interviews. It's I don't
(37:22):
know how you do it. It goes on sale in
October on tupac'scor Only God can judge me the many
lives of Tupac Shakur. Give me one revelation in the book,
because you obviously had some sense of his music, of
his iconic history, give me one revelation in the book
that it was a jaw dropping moment for you.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
Oh, I would say the biggest one is Tupac Shakur.
Everyone knows his ashes were sent off the Pacific in
a ceremony in Maui, but Tupac's mother, Fenny Shakur, actually
saved it and he's buried. I'm not going to say where,
but he is actually buried beneath the grave site in
a field in the most out of nowhere you would
(38:04):
never think place ever with a tombstone and a headstone,
and so Tubac Shakor who everythings was this cremated was
actually actually has a burial site that I actually went
to and stood at.
Speaker 1 (38:15):
So that was kind of min So is it in California?
Speaker 7 (38:19):
It is not in California. It is in the South.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Wow, you just you just started something. Now everybody's gonna
go crazy.
Speaker 7 (38:28):
I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
Yeah, I'm a Northwest kid. Jimmy Hendrix is buried up there. Okay,
all right, Jeff Pearlman. The book comes out in October
on Tubac. Only God can judge me. The many lives.
Good scene again, Jeff, and good luck on the book.
Speaker 7 (38:46):
All right, thank you so much. Take care.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Yeah, the far of the Green Bay situation with Farvan Rogers,
it is just different. I mean, Matt Stafford think about this,
Think how great Matt Stafford is. And Stan Kronk and
Sean McVay basically said, hey, here's the number, right, like,
here's the number. I mean, Mahomes has done team friendly deals.
(39:11):
Josh Allen is certainly just part of the bills fabric.
I always feel like if you're far Or you're Rogers,
you're a packer. But you're sort of living in a silo.
You're you know, you're not beholden to an owner, you're
not protected by anonymity in a vast North American city
(39:32):
where you can hide. I remember years ago talking to
a basketball player. He's a really nice guy, Damon Stottamar
and he played in Portland for years. He was in
one of the great high school basketball players in the
history of the Pacific Northwest. And he played in Portland.
And he said, you know, I actually love playing in Toronto.
And I'm like, really, it's like, you know, three or
four thousand miles away. He goes, I could hide. He goes,
(39:54):
I can't hide in Portland. And so I think Green
Bay is that times ten. I think I think it
does change you when you are not just romanticized or appreciated,
you are worshiped.
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three eastern nine am to
noon Pacific. Find your local station for the Herd at
Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every
day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio
or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Here we go. It is a Wednesday, and there is
actually a lot to talk about. It's the Herd. Wherever
you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks
for making us part of your day, So Jmak. We
learned again today that the NFL owners run everything. Doesn't
(00:51):
matter what committees say, it doesn't matter what the commissioner says,
it doesn't matter what coaches say. It is an owner
run lead and we got another example of that today
with a toush push.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I think you and I are pretty much on the
same page with it, right, We're fine with this.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
I don't love it, but here's the very latest. The
NFL's Competition Committee said you should get rid of it.
The NFL's Health and Safety Commission Committee said you should
get rid of it, and the NFL owner said, eah,
we're going to keep it. It was close. They needed
(01:30):
twenty four votes to get.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Rid of it.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
It was twenty two. I think Jason Kelsey, former Eagle
Center podcaster, apparently spoke to owners and that, in my opinion,
was the difference. They're not going to ban it for now. Hey, listen,
clever coaches are like good accountants. They find loopholes schemes
right to benefit their clients, and sometimes the league rules, Nope,
(01:57):
we gave it to you for three years, We're not
going to give to you for four. I've always said
the NFL is a TV show, and the two things
they really care about are entertainment and safety, in no
particular order. They care about entertainment and safety, and to me,
the tush push kind of violates both. It looks dangerous
(02:17):
and it's ugly. Optics on TV aren't good. It's an
ugly play, and it almost failed. Twenty two votes needed
twenty four. I think Jason Kelsey, speaking on behalf of it,
a very respective player who was not you know, some
five star recruit. He was a grinder. He's classic NFL family.
(02:39):
The Kelseys have been great for the league. He spoke,
and I think he push pushed it into not being banned.
I think his ability to create that play and to
keep it from being banned. The Eagles have already posted
it on social media, the push stays on. I'm a
little surprised. I mean, we see this all the time.
(03:01):
Remember years ago, Cam Chancellor would jump over the line
and block kicks for the Seahawks, and the NFL felt
it is a little dangerous. Looking now, there wasn't a
ton of data that showed, you know, there was a
lot of guys getting hurt. But the NFL didn't like it,
and they said, I don't think so. The horse collar
tackle they got rid of it. The kickoffs they look
(03:22):
all funky now they think it's too dangerous. But I
think what helps the tush push. There is no current
data that a bunch of guys are getting hurt with it,
although I'm not sure a bunch of guys were getting
hurt when Cam Chancellor was jumping over a line to
block a kick either, But there's no data that shows
that it's hurting people. And the second thing is Jason
(03:46):
Kelsey's powerful. He is respected. He made a plea to
keep it, and I think it probably flipped one or
two owners. So the Competition Committee, they and the Health
and Safety Committee recommended the league ban it. We don't
(04:06):
like it, and usually those recommendations get something banned. But
in this instance the owners and they control it. They
control Goodell's salary, Roger Goodell's trying to get a raise here.
They control that, They control the length of the schedule.
It's the only sport in America where the owners control
the TV networks, not vice versa. They tell them what
they will pay, and then they can they can blow
(04:30):
those TV contracts up in the middle of them and
renegotiate it if they want. The NFL owners are all powerful.
You got a lot of NBA Baseball owners, NBA owners,
MLS owners selling stuff. You own an NFL team, Just
keep it, just keep it, and so the owners win again.
Here's Dion Dawkins, great left tackle for Buffalo. His opinions
(04:53):
are like a lot of players' opinions on it. You
don't love it, but it's phil is what do we
do with it? Here's Dean Dawkins.
Speaker 5 (05:03):
It's a very hard play for a player. It's a
very hard play for a player. You know you're down
there your head is down. You just have to kind
of just drive your legs and hit three people at
one time.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Like it's very hard thing to do.
Speaker 5 (05:18):
But it's so weird because we play a game of inches, right,
Like what's the best player to get an inch? The
tuch push, what's the best play to get a yard?
Maybe a QB sneak And it's hard to take it
out or it's hard to change it because it's so
(05:39):
necessary in the game because sometimes you just need to
fall forward and get the first down.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
And to the Philadelphia Eagles credit, they do it well.
I mean, Buffalo got to the AFC Championship and they
looked unprepared when they had Superman Josh Allen trying to
jump in the air and lean for a yard. It
looked it really looked like they didn't practice it. Philadelphia
practices it. They add decoys to it. I thought when
(06:09):
Kelsey left it wouldn't be as successful it is. It
does look a little dangerous, but so far, I don't
think there's any data that shows that it is. And
Philadelphia does it better than anybody else. That's their best argument.
We created it, we do it better than everybody else.
It's available to the entire league. Why are you banning it?
As of now it survives, but it was close. And
(06:31):
again I think Jason Kelsey highly respected him speaking to owners.
Probably push pushed it in Okay, Game one of the
Western Conference Finals is in the books, and it feels
like the series is in the books. So Oklahoma City
rolled through the NBA's regular season historically one by an
(06:53):
average of twelve point nine points. That like Jordan's Bulls
didn't do that. And then they rolled Memphis in the
first round, and then they old Minnesota last night. The
only team and actually only player to give him real
trouble is Jokic. Nikola Jokich, the Joker gave him trouble.
They even wore him down and Okase, like the Super
Bowl champion Philadelphia Eagles, are not really built on a player.
(07:16):
They're built on a general manager. Howie Roseman GM of
the Eagles, Sam Presty GM of the Thunder. They have
built such insanely deep and flexible rosters. You think the
coach is good, but is he necessary? They forced the
Tea Wolves to only score from the outside. In fact,
Minnesota only had twenty points in the paint. That's their
(07:38):
lowest total, and there are big team since twenty fifteen.
Julius Randall kept him in the game in the first half,
shot the ball well, hit a bunch of threes. Once
that dried up, the offense dried up. This is a
team that they're not necessarily huge. But you ever watch
a football team, like you'll watch college football when Alabama
was in its prime and the defense was just crushing people,
(07:58):
and you're like, do they have thirteen players on the field,
Like it looks like they have extra players. Oklahoma City's
defense looks like they're playing seven guys. So Jokic could
get his, but Murray didn't get his, Porter couldn't get his.
They just shut off lanes and avenues. And just think
about this. So Oklahoma City against a much better West
(08:20):
was thirty nine and thirteen. So they dominated the West.
They were twenty nine and one against the East. See
you're asking yourself, are the Pacers and the Knicks which
starts tonight? Are they just playing for second place? So
aunt Edwards didn't have a great night, didn't get a
lot of shots. Sometimes invisible. I think he's gonna have
(08:41):
to have four or five games where he scores thirty
plus and I'm not sure you can do this. This
is just the defense where a lot of these guys
are are just entering their athletic prime, long, twitchy, fast,
and Jokic is a great example. They really cut Jokic's
passing lanes so the joke could score, but the passing
(09:02):
lanes got cut down, and Jokich is a much more
totally refined offensive player than Aunt Edwards. Here's what's scary.
Oklahoma City's average age is twenty five for a team
that won sixty eight games by an average winning total
of thirteen points. So it it's by the second half.
(09:24):
Once Julius Randall's threes didn't drop, this looked like a
total mismatch. Younger, quicker, better defensively with a lot of
levers to pull. Here's Aunt Edwards after.
Speaker 6 (09:38):
I definitely got to shoot boards to thirteen shots, but
I'll say probably just get off the ball a little more.
Play without the ball. I think that'd be the answer,
because playing on the ball, he's going double and then
sitting the gaps all day. They clogged the paint. That's
what they do.
Speaker 7 (09:55):
They don't got.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Massage down there, so.
Speaker 6 (09:59):
Hey, bankms not make a shot side this because every
time I go to the Rams, like four people.
Speaker 8 (10:03):
At the paint.
Speaker 6 (10:04):
So yeah, I guess they just be cagged into paint.
They put like five four bodies in a paint and
make you kick it out. So just keep making the
right play.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
Now, here's the good news for Minnesota. They'll eventually go
to go play at home where they're really good. Chris
Finch and his staff have been excellent at shifting around
to second and third gears and figuring out ways to
get the most out of the offense. But if you
watch the second half, they were just overwhelmed. Memphis got overwhelmed,
the West got overwhelmed, the East beat him one time
(10:34):
in thirty games. Oklahoma City looked really good led by defense.
Of course, a SGA is excellent, he gets the whistle.
But I think the core of this thing is the depth,
the roster, construction, the aggressiveness of the defense. You know,
generally in sports, a great defense slows down a great offense.
If you were the Bulls a MJ, you had both.
But this looked like a mismatch last night. In the
(10:57):
second half, it looked really really ugly. All right, so
jam something else came out this morning I love this
so pff they do this every year they come out
with a tiers of quarterbacks, and it was interesting. I've
got a lot of thoughts on it. In my lifetime,
there's always been one thing that's true with the quarterback position.
And once again with PFFS quarterback rankings, they ranked everybody
(11:21):
in the league. I think, once again, this happens since
I was a kid. It happened during the Lway years,
the Montana years, the Brady years, and now during the
Mahomes years. There is something that always is the case
and I'll talk about that coming up.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in newone Easter non am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (11:46):
Really interesting thing happening. I'm going to get to it
about fifteen minutes with college basketball. College basketball is getting
some really good news. I'm gonna talk about that in
fifteen minutes. Chris Simms will be around the corner as well.
If you haven't heard, it was a very close voice,
very close vote. The Tush push by a couple of
votes has survived again Philadelphia. They created it. Their argument
(12:13):
is it's not a loophole. It's just the quarterback sneak
modified amplified, and the owners did not take the recommendation
of you know, the Rules committee or the Health and
Safety committee. They both said Bannett, the NFL owners close vote,
said now we're going to keep it. We'll vote in
it again next year. So this is interesting. PFF. They
(12:37):
do this every year. They take every starting quarterback in
the NFL, all thirty two ahead of the season, and
they ranked them. They put them in tiers Tier one, two,
three and four, five and six. I don't care about
the middle bottom ones. So their Tier one, which I
totally agree with, is Mahomes, Jackson, Josh Allen, and Burrow.
I have no problem. That's what I would do. They're
(12:58):
Tier two. I don't disagree with that, Jalen Hurts, Jaden Daniels,
Matthew Stafford, Justin Herbert. They're Tier three, which is Jared Goff,
Gino Smith, and brock Perty. I think C. J. Stroud
is more talented than all those guys, although I think
it's close. I do think it's interesting. Sam Darnold's in
Tier five and in Tier three is Tua and Trevor Lawrence.
(13:23):
I disagree with that. But again, in my entire life,
I've always had this thing we've talked about. There's always
about seven quarterbacks maybe eight, at any one time in
the NFL, in any era that you just don't pick
up the phone. Somebody calls with Elway, you're not picking
up the phone. If you go back to Elway in
his prime, there were seven or eight guys, you're not
(13:46):
picking up the phone. John Elway, Dan Marino, Joe Montana,
Jim Kelly, Steve Young, Troy aik Ben and Warren Moon.
They were just really were to good players. There's no
reason to get on the phone and initiate conversation like
those are the seven guys. If you go to Brady's era,
it was Brady and Breeze and Peyton Manning and Big Ben.
I'd say Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers and maybe Philip Rivers.
(14:10):
Their GMS loved them. They won a lot of games,
and they were highly productive, and you got him every week.
I think right now, PFF got the eight right now.
I CJ. Stroud is the one. To me. I think
he either has to be the number one, tier two
quarterback or he's darn close. I think he's really good
(14:30):
He did pull back last year, but his offensive line
was atrocious, he lost two of his three best receivers,
and he still got into the playoffs and won a
playoff game. So other than that, I've always felt it's
about seven or eight guys at any one time in
the NFL that are somebody calls about him, you're not
really interested. I don't think Houston would take a call
on CJ. Stroud. I think he is a Tier two guy,
(14:54):
maybe barely, maybe the first guy out. We could argue
that it doesn't really matter because historically the guys in
Tier one and occasionally Tier two win all the Super Bowls.
So I think PFF got it right and don't have
a problem with any of the grades. I think clearly
in the league. Now mahomes Lamar Josh and Burrell have separated,
I don't think there's any question that's the first group.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd Weekdays
and Noone Eastern nn AM Pacific.
Speaker 9 (15:21):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David, and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 8 (15:27):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
Eastern two to four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and
of course the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 9 (15:34):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 8 (15:35):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Going on in the world.
Speaker 9 (15:40):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 8 (15:48):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together, I mean that says something, right, So.
Speaker 9 (15:53):
Check us out. We like to get you involved, to
take your phone calls, chop it up. As they say,
I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio,
maybe the.
Speaker 8 (16:02):
Most interactive show on planetar.
Speaker 9 (16:03):
Be sure to check out Cavino and Rich live on
Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app from five to
seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific, And if you
miss any of the live show, just search Kovin on
Rich wherever you get your podcasts, and of course on
social media that's Covino and Rich.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
So Mac Brown coached at North Carolina, then went on
to fame riches in a national title at Texas, and
then they went broadcasting, and then they went back to
North Carolina. They did a good job. He did a
good job. He raised a lot of money. North Carolina
got into bowl games. They put a lot of guys
in the NFL, but it does a basketball school. So
he retires his last year. I think he's six and
(16:40):
six and Bill Belichick takes over. So they asked him
about Belichick. And I'm not saying what he's saying is untrue,
but I could see where the Belichick people, the Belichick
camp wouldn't love what Mac Brown said when he was
asked about Belichick with guitar.
Speaker 10 (17:01):
As far as North Carolina and Bill Belichick, now, he's
arguably the best coach ever. They've committed money to it,
they've helped them with academics, they've lowered those standards some
so there's absolutely no reason that they shouldn't be successful.
And anymore, they've changed the roster. I think they've signed
maybe sixty something new transfers. So you've got a chance
(17:23):
to succeed at the highest level, and I expect them
to do that, and I'm proud for them.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
He may be right, but if you take out Notre Dame,
there is no top twelve college football program, top fifteen
college football program that can't get the best high schoolers in.
When you talk about academics, you know they've lowered the standards.
Notre Dame is different. They're a top fifteen program, and
(17:51):
it's a tough school to get in, and it's a
tough school to get through. Stanford, but they're not a
top fifteen program. They've had stretches. Stanford's another program where
you know there it's hard to get in. I've had
coaches tell me at Stanford you can't keep eighty five
guys on scholarship. They can't find enough players that academically
qualify for Stanford. Did they lower academic standards at Carolina?
(18:13):
My take has always been Carolina is one of those
schools that if they want to get a player in,
they'll get a player in. So I could see Belichick
people at blanching at that a little bit. But I
do think this is where I give Carolina a lot
of credit is they realized, listen, in our conference, there
(18:34):
is one big dog, and that big dog is Clemson,
and how are we going to catch Clemson? Well, Clemson
will not play the nil game. They're the only national
power that's not interested in it. And I think Carolina
smartly said Okay, they're not going to do it. This
is a moment in time to catch the big dog
(18:54):
Clemson in our conference. We're going to go completely pro
model and go all in on nil. And this is
a little bit what Oregon did with Chip Kelly. Mike
Pilotti did a good job, but it was always Washington
and USC with the big names in the conference. They
you know, they had national championships, and Oregon said, how
do we catch them? Well, Phil Knight, one hundred uniforms
(19:17):
to get LA kids be cool. We're gonna be the
cool program. We're not gonna like USC and Washington grab
on this tradition. We have no tradition. We're gonna go
one hundred uniforms and we're gonna go hire a guy
in Chip Kelly. They don't huddle. Oregon stopped huddling for
a long time. We're not gonna huddle it. I'll play
every thirteen seconds. And it worked, and Oregon is still
on top of Washington and USC. So to catch the
(19:41):
big dog in the conference, you got to take big swings.
And I look at Carolina and saying, hey, we got
a moment in time here. Clemson's not playing the nil game.
So let's go all in on nil, all in on
an NFL model, all in on Belichick and Jordan Hudson too.
So I respect what Carolina is doing. I think it's
the only way to be a disruptor is to look
(20:03):
at the leading models and do the opposite. This is interesting.
The Buffalo Bills, I was just told in my earpiece,
are going to do hard knocks. They've been selected. Now,
usually you get boring teams, or dysfunctional teams, or chaotic
teams or teams. That's why I hard knocks eliminates all
the good teams. So Buffalo is actually fascinating. So this
(20:23):
is a team that they're the only team I saw
this yesterday, the Buffalo Bills, not Philadelphia, the only team
to be favored in every game next year. So the
Eagles face Buffalo at the end of the season, and
right now, Buffalo's a one and a half point favorite
(20:45):
in that game. You can bet it. So my takeaway
on this is Buffalo. This sounds like a good problem.
Buffalo's in a really tough spot. Josh Allen just turned
twenty nine. He's audaciously ballented six six two fifty five
or more and a great runner. He's in the middle
of his prime and last season off his best season,
(21:09):
the Kansas City Chiefs were the single most vulnerable Chiefs
team since Mahomes arrived. O line issues, receiver maturity issues,
health issues, and Kansas City still beat him in the
AFC Championship. And when Sean McDermott got into those short
yardage situations with Josh Allen leaping over, I've got to
(21:32):
be honest, it looked like a defensive coach that was
a bit unprepared on third and fourth and one calls.
It was really bad. It was the opposite of the
tush push. It looked unpracticed. And so here's the problem.
Sean McDermott is a good coach. In fact, i'd say
he's a good coach. Is he Mark Jackson to the
(21:53):
Warriors where he's a good coach, a playoff coach, a
smart coach, but not the championship coach. And if you
look at the AFC now you've got Annie Reid, both
are bass. Sean Payton's in it. Oh oops, Mike Vrabel
(22:13):
just reappeared. So it's very easy when you watch one
of those music shows to spot great and lousy. It's
just not that hard. To see mediocre or bad or great?
What do you do with good to pretty good? And
it would be one thing if Buffalo had seven trophies.
(22:34):
They're the one team in the National Football League who
is now in its second run that's going to last
over a decade, that's good enough to get there often
gets there, and has no trophies. They're like the last
I mean, it was one thing when the Cubs won
a World Series, they were just bad forever, the lovable losers.
Now Buffalo's had the Jim Kelly era, the Josh Allen era,
(22:56):
where we're like, I think half those years they were
the best team in the NFL and they got no trophies.
So that adds to the tension in the city. If you
got trophies, like the Packers or the Eagles. In the
back room, it's a different vibe entirely. So how long
is Dion Dawkins going to remain healthy at left tackle?
I look this morning, Josh Allen's cap hit is going up.
(23:19):
It's kind of the Sean McDermott dilemma where he's not bad,
but I don't think he's great, but I think he's
good to pretty good. And the Warriors moved off Mark Jackson,
and it was a risk because Mark Jackson was a
good coach. So you do get to a point with Buffalo.
It's interesting that they're going to be the you know,
(23:42):
the HBO Mac Show or the HBO show Hard Knocks.
Usually it is a team with an outrageous personality at
coach or at quarterback. McDermott's pretty muted, pretty intense. I
do think Buffalo is interesting. But they're the own only
team favored to win every game next year, and yet
(24:04):
here we are. Do you really think Kansas City had
its worst, most vulnerable team. Now they have blown out
in the Super Bowl. This was their most vulnerable year,
and now it's Peyton, Now it's both Harbas's. Here comes Rabel,
and all of them have their quarterbacks. John Harbaugh's got
his quarterback. Jim Harbaugh's got his quarterback. Sean Payton's got
(24:26):
his quarterback. Mike Rabel. Drake may I think he's got
his quarterback. Sean does too, but the pressure is really
on him. By the way. Good news here, j mc.
I know we're not supposed to talk about this, but
I'm just reading this. What Pernielsen Live same plus same
day data first two rounds of the NBA playoffs average
(24:49):
four point two million viewers, three point three percent improvement
versus a year ago. Great, wonderful.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
So ratings we're talking about for the NBAG or no,
I remember yesterday you shut me down. You're like, oh,
they got their deal, they're fine.
Speaker 10 (25:06):
Who cares?
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Well? Can two things be true? Yes? Of course they
got seventy six billion. And baseball hockey and the NBA
and the MLS regular season ratings going forward are never
going to be great because we are an events society.
We're more distracted, there's more content, there's more platforms. Hockey
(25:27):
ratings regular season are awful. Baseball MLS? Where is MLS Apple?
Speaker 3 (25:32):
Where is hey as a songs or owner? Let's not
disparage the sport.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Let's be at two things are true. They got seventy
six billion, and the league is fine.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Well, listen, how about this? This ANEC data was what
they like to call. There's a guy who works here,
you know, he's a big Lakers fan, And I asked him, hey,
would you think of the game last night?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
The free throw merchant?
Speaker 3 (25:50):
He said, I didn't see the game, Johnny, Obviously I'm
talking about and he's like I had, I had my
nephew's birthday party to go to, and I just wondered,
Colin nationwide, if you you've got an invite on a
Tuesday night versus checkout thunder against things like no, no.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
That's a legitimate question. You're not skipping Lebron, I don't.
I think the increases in ratings will go now backwards
for Minnesota, OKC. I think it will go backwards.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Well, last year it was Dallas and who was it? Dallas, Minnesota,
which I don't think we're great rating.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Well, that was Luca. Luca that helped Power three around
the corner.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
And I heard one more Heard. The Herd streams twenty
four hours a day, seven days a week within the
iHeartRadio app. Search Herd to listen live or on demand
whenever you like.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
All right. He's a best selling author multiple times Jeff
Perlman New York Times best Selling Offer. He's got the
digital series press Box Chronicles on YouTube. I thought it
was interesting today because there's a there's an untold documentary
on Netflix on on Brett Farr. And he wrote a
book years ago, Gunslinger, The Remarkable, Improbable, Iconic Life of
(27:00):
Brett Farv, which I thought I'd said this at the time.
When I read it, I thought I thought Brent Farv
wasn't very nice to Aaron Rodgers, wasn't very helpful. It
made me like Aaron Rodgers, regardless of what I think today.
But it's a fascinating book. So I'm watching the documentary
on him, which is, you know, hero worship for thirteen minutes,
then they go after him. Jeff Pearlman, now joining us live,
(27:23):
knows Brett Farb knows, the Packers knows Aaron Rodgers, so
you know. So we were talking during the break. I've
always had this theory, and I call it the Green
Bay Quarterback theory. Is that Farv's a Southerner, Aaron Rodgers
is a hipster out West, and they morphed into the
same guy. Is that at the end they got needy,
a bit precious, a little rigid, weird, and yet they're
(27:44):
different personalities. But you have no owner. It's the smallest market.
You can't go to the grocery store. You have to
hide in a golf course. And it does affect you.
You become literally bigger than life. As good as Matt
Stafford is. Stan Kronky runs the show and soda is
McVeagh when when FARV started to unravel, Jeff Pearlman, were
you surprised by it or did you see things that
(28:07):
made you wonder?
Speaker 4 (28:09):
I actually think you make a really good point, which
is it's this god complex thing that happens when you're
a small market quarterback. You can't, like you said, you
can't go anywhere. People treat you like a god, literally
like a god. You are the king of the landscape,
and at some point it's just unsustainable. Either you get old,
you get hurt, you go somewhere else. Suddenly you're not
(28:30):
treated that way. So you're Brett Favre. Suddenly you're in
New York Jet, You're living in suburban New Jersey. You're
part of this franchise. You don't know, you're by yourself,
living in a hotel every day, and before you know it,
you're sending Penis pictures to an employee of the team.
Like I just think he got so used to being
a certain way, deified, glorified. All of a sudden he's
in a new situation and he doesn't have the maturity
(28:51):
of the personal development to handle it.
Speaker 7 (28:52):
I just think that's the very short story of it all.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah, so now let's let's let's go to Aaron. Uh. Aaron,
I thought I've always thought bright. I think he's well read.
I think he's interesting, he's a little iconic classic. I mean,
he's a different cat. He clearly pushes back in authority.
It could be the government, it could be vaccines, it
could be the media. He pushes back in authority. That's okay.
I am for that. Go back for the people that
(29:17):
haven't read the book. And your books are fascining. The
Walter Payton book I think had been lost in because
you've done so much. That's a fantastic book. And he's
the best running back I've ever seen, probably by far
so during the air and far of stuff. When I
read your book, I had sympathy for Aaron. I don't
think Brett was nice to him. Are you surprised what
he's sort of morphed into, which is kind of to
(29:40):
a fault.
Speaker 4 (29:42):
I do my own homework, guy, So it's interesting.
Speaker 7 (29:47):
I think, I'm sure you've dealt with these people too.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
Every now and then in sports, you come across someone
who believes from the beginning that he is the here's here,
the smartest people in the room.
Speaker 7 (29:56):
I am the smartest person in this room.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
Nobody is intelligence his knee, and I feel like Rodgers
has had that from a very young age. When he
arrived in Green Bay, he really far was terrible man
like terrible. I mean, there are moments of just like
treating him like absolute crap. There was the humiliating time
for Aaron Rodgers. It might sound kind of quaint in hindsight,
is he takes his helmet one day, he puts it
(30:19):
on a memorabilia table in the locker room. Everyone's signing
Aaron Rodgers' helmet before practice. He's scurrying around, can't find
his helmet. Someone says, that's yours. It's filled with signatures.
He has to go to practice as a rookie bringing
this signature filled helmet, and he's mortified, and he's humiliated.
But I just think over time, especially being in a
small Midwestern town surrounded by the Midwestern quaintness of Green Bay,
(30:44):
I think Aaron Rodgers really started to believe I'm the
smartest guy in the room.
Speaker 7 (30:47):
I know everything. I am very intelligent.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
I know more than the coaches, I know more than
my teammates, I know more than this fan base. And
again if you can contain that. In Green Bay, Wisconsin,
it's one thing you're treated as a guy, but once
you go national, once you go to a different franchise,
it doesn't really play out that well because people just
see you as kind of a duche.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
So I got to ask you, you know the Bus family. Well,
you wrote the book on the Lakers Dynasty of the
eighties and it's it's a fascinating book which got made
into an HBO series and it's it's really it's one
of those that you can't put down. It's I always
knew Kobe was difficult. Then I read the book and
I'm like, how did Phil Nutt go after him? It
(31:27):
was just crazy. But you know the Bus family. And
I've said this to a friend about a month ago.
I said, Luca's got a little shack. I'm not sure
how commited he is in the off season. I you know,
I'm there are games he shows up where I think
his mind is elsewhere. But he's good for the brand,
he's good for merch, he's insanely talented. Knowing how the
(31:50):
Bus family eventually made a decision to move off shack,
do you think the kids have some of those same
frustrations with Luca No that they literally had to call
a meeting about his cardiovascular health after the year.
Speaker 7 (32:07):
So it'd be impossible for me to put myself in
Genie Bus's head.
Speaker 4 (32:10):
Obviously, I think numb one day obviously had to make
that trade. Like you had to make that trade. You're
getting a young superstar in his prime. The problem is,
like you touched upon Luca. I don't even understand it.
You make all this money and you're one thing. You
need to be into shape.
Speaker 1 (32:25):
That's it.
Speaker 4 (32:25):
That's the biggest qualification of this job is you need
to be in shape. And the thing about Shack that's
interesting is when Shakers with the Lakers, until Kobe really
gained some power and really really started calling out Shack
behind the scenes for his lack of fitness. I don't
think the family was particularly bothered by it because he
Number one, he sold jerseys. Number two, he was charismatic.
(32:46):
Number three, he produced, and I think Luca technically is
the same thing. He does produce, he does sell jerseys,
He is pretty charismatic. I think it's going to get
really tricky once Lucas shows up a training camp thirty
pounds overweight, once other teammates start calling him out, once
you start hearing the whispers, because in this town in
Los Angeles, whispers.
Speaker 7 (33:05):
Traveled very quickly.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
And if the Lakers start struggling and you have this
star who's supposed to be great and he's on the
injury list yet again, and he looks gey yet again,
I just think, I don't know what their reaction is
going to be, emotionally or mentally.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
I just know they're going to be trapped yet again.
Speaker 4 (33:21):
All these Laker fans who think we've escaped, we're awesome,
we have Luca.
Speaker 7 (33:25):
It's a little bit of fool's goal. Potentially.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
You're a New Yorker. Where did you grow up in
New York?
Speaker 7 (33:33):
I grew up in a tiny town called Mayhopak, New York.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Okay, is that outside about.
Speaker 7 (33:38):
An hour north right outside in New York to the
hour north of the city.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
So I when I worked at the other place, I
always claimed it wasn't a Yankee town or a Giants town.
It's a Knicks town. Is that everybody loved the Knicks
baseball and football opinions. And so when I watch Madison
Square Garden, and I've said this on the air, I'm sorry.
That's the best basketball city in the country. It looks different,
(34:02):
it feels donald. So you tell you've been the Madison
Square Garden plenty of times. It kind of a spiritual
revelation for all New Yorkers. What are you going through
as a true New Yorker right now?
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Well, the funny thing is, first of all, I just
want to say I grew up. I was the one
kid in my school who is a New Jersey Nets fan.
So I was a big Hey give a coming a
break man. I was a big Pearl Washington, Buck Williams,
you know, Michael Quorn fan. But the Knicks owned you
were one hundred percent correct the Knicks or the universal
love of New York and the Rangers to a slightly
less degree. And when it's pumping, when the Garden is pumping,
(34:41):
when the team is playing, well.
Speaker 7 (34:43):
There is nowhere like it.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
Madison Square Garden has always maintained its electricity, the air
of excitement, the buzz when you had Patrick Ewing going,
when you had you know, you know, Latrell Spreewell going.
There's something about it that feels this and fierce. It's
just something different. You don't get to go into Laker
game or a Clipper game. You just it's something different,
(35:08):
and it's an advantage the Knicks half that you're not
going to get if you're the Pacers, or potentially in
the finals if you go to Oklahoma City.
Speaker 7 (35:14):
It's just something really.
Speaker 4 (35:16):
Raw, and it's kind of like this when you meet
a New Yorker and they're like, yo, you got to
go to this place and get a slice, and that
guy sucks and blah blah blah. That's Madison Square Garden.
It takes everything about New York and puts it in
one building.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
I don't know if you prepared for this, but I've
been joking that if I don't get invited to the
Belichick Belichick Jordan Hudson wedding, I'll be bitter because I'm
the only American media member supporting the relationship. And I
had this discussion last night. I said, Okay, if she
was thirty six, would you be okay with it? If
he was sixty four, would you be okay? I said,
In the end, I'm not judging people's relationships as long
(35:52):
as both people are here for it. Do I think
there's a little bit of her as a wilful, young
woman seeing opportunities. Yes, do I think Bill understanding she's
his social stockbroker on the internet, and she's a beautiful
young lady. They're both getting something out of it. It
doesn't bother me, but I feel like I'm on a
(36:13):
total island. Jeff Pearlman, what do you make of Jordan
Hunts and Bill Belichick?
Speaker 4 (36:19):
All Right, So I have a twenty two year old daughter,
and if she came home one day and said, Dad,
I want you to meet my new boyfriend. He's sixty
five years old or sixty seven years old, I think
I'd be a little troubled by this one. I don't
they can do what they want. They're can sending adults.
I think it's a little weird. I think her role
(36:39):
is definitely weird. I'm sure North Carolina is secretly freaking
out and thinking we didn't really I don't think we
knew what we signed up for with this one. I
think that's the big issue here, is like the sense
of control that she seems to have over his affairs.
If it was my daughter's boyfriend, I'd be freaked out.
I would not be happy. As a spectator. People can
do what they want.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Okay, Yeah, no, I've said that before too. I wouldn't
personally like it, but I do feel like, in a
weird way, both are using each other for what it
appears they want, and I don't like to be the moralist.
That's not who I am. All Right, before we go,
you have been writing a book for a year and
you do six seven, eight hundred interviews. It's I don't
(37:22):
know how you do it. It goes on sale in
October on tupac'scor Only God can judge me the many
lives of Tupac Shakur. Give me one revelation in the book,
because you obviously had some sense of his music, of
his iconic history, give me one revelation in the book
that it was a jaw dropping moment for you.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
Oh, I would say the biggest one is Tupac Shakur.
Everyone knows his ashes were sent off the Pacific in
a ceremony in Maui, but Tupac's mother, Fenny Shakur, actually
saved it and he's buried. I'm not going to say where,
but he is actually buried beneath the grave site in
a field in the most out of nowhere you would
(38:04):
never think place ever with a tombstone and a headstone,
and so Tubac Shakor who everythings was this cremated was
actually actually has a burial site that I actually went
to and stood at.
Speaker 1 (38:15):
So that was kind of min So is it in California?
Speaker 7 (38:19):
It is not in California. It is in the South.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Wow, you just you just started something. Now everybody's gonna
go crazy.
Speaker 7 (38:28):
I know, I know, I know.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
Yeah, I'm a Northwest kid. Jimmy Hendrix is buried up there. Okay,
all right, Jeff Pearlman. The book comes out in October
on Tubac. Only God can judge me. The many lives.
Good scene again, Jeff, and good luck on the book.
Speaker 7 (38:46):
All right, thank you so much. Take care.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
Yeah, the far of the Green Bay situation with Farvan Rogers,
it is just different. I mean, Matt Stafford think about this,
Think how great Matt Stafford is. And Stan Kronk and
Sean McVay basically said, hey, here's the number, right, like,
here's the number. I mean, Mahomes has done team friendly deals.
(39:11):
Josh Allen is certainly just part of the bills fabric.
I always feel like if you're far Or you're Rogers,
you're a packer. But you're sort of living in a silo.
You're you know, you're not beholden to an owner, you're
not protected by anonymity in a vast North American city
(39:32):
where you can hide. I remember years ago talking to
a basketball player. He's a really nice guy, Damon Stottamar
and he played in Portland for years. He was in
one of the great high school basketball players in the
history of the Pacific Northwest. And he played in Portland.
And he said, you know, I actually love playing in Toronto.
And I'm like, really, it's like, you know, three or
four thousand miles away. He goes, I could hide. He goes,
(39:54):
I can't hide in Portland. And so I think Green
Bay is that times ten. I think I think it
does change you when you are not just romanticized or appreciated,
you are worshiped.
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Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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Introducing… Aubrey O’Day Diddy’s former protege, television personality, platinum selling music artist, Danity Kane alum Aubrey O’Day joins veteran journalists Amy Robach and TJ Holmes to provide a unique perspective on the trial that has captivated the attention of the nation. Join them throughout the trial as they discuss, debate, and dissect every detail, every aspect of the proceedings. Aubrey will offer her opinions and expertise, as only she is qualified to do given her first-hand knowledge. From her days on Making the Band, as she emerged as the breakout star, the truth of the situation would be the opposite of the glitz and glamour. Listen throughout every minute of the trial, for this exclusive coverage. Amy Robach and TJ Holmes present Aubrey O’Day, Covering the Diddy Trial, an iHeartRadio podcast.
Good Hang with Amy Poehler
Come hang with Amy Poehler. Each week on her podcast, she'll welcome celebrities and fun people to her studio. They'll share stories about their careers, mutual friends, shared enthusiasms, and most importantly, what's been making them laugh. This podcast is not about trying to make you better or giving advice. Amy just wants to have a good time.