May 26, 2025 • 51 mins
The Knicks taking game 3 and keeping the Eastern Conference Finals alive. Colin lays out the biggest changes to NFL teams, holding that it's a coaches and quarterbacks league and giving nods to the Titans and Bears. Then, it's on to Colin Right/Colin Wrong before former NFL quarterback Matt Hasselbeck stops by to talk about storylines in the NFL and what happens when older quarterbacks have leverage.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
It is Memorial Day. Welcome in. This is the Herd
wherever you may be and however you may be watching
or listening. Thank you to the families who are serving
and have served. It can be a tough day for
many military families that you're in our thoughts. The liberties
and freedoms we enjoy are due to you and your
(00:51):
sacrifice and commitment to this country. And thank you for
all joining us. A lot of choices on a Monday, Jmac,
the one team on this NBA slate that you've always
been a fan of as the New York Knicks. And
they were in a rough, rough spot at about eight
thirty Central where I'm his last night, they were getting
(01:12):
blown out, and then something magical happened. You must field.
We had a series today.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, Tom Thibodeau pressed the right buttons at the right time,
and the Knicks are back in the series.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
Coward, let's go all right.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
They were down oh two, they were on the road,
down twenty point. Their star was in foul trouble Jalen Brudson.
It was one of those what kind of man are you? Games?
And Carl Anthony Towns. Two things happened. Number one, Karl
Anthony town said, I'll show you what kind of man
I am. I'm going to single handedly take over the
(01:47):
fourth quarter. Listen the dude he has quarters like this.
He averages twenty three a game in his career. When
he was in his prime, Carl Anthony Towns always ended
up near the top of those GM surveys they do.
Who would just start a franchise with? He doesn't play
any defense, He's a little quirky, but he can dominate games.
I've been to three or four games where he was playing,
(02:09):
and he was the best player on the floor at
some point in all those games. So, and the second
thing that happened, and this does not happen very often
for the Pacers, they lost their way offensively. So Halliburton
end of the third quarter beginning of the fourth. So
in the third beginning of the fourth, about four and
a half minutes he was on the bench. In that time,
(02:32):
a fifteen point lead evaporated to four. And then he
comes back in and they just never quite felt the
same again Indiana. It's hard to get them off their
offensive game. But even when the Knicks were down four, three,
two points, it felt like they were in control. So
the Pacers are a rhythm team and that they have
(02:55):
the fastest pace in the league, and they get out
of their them and all of a sudden you had
Nie Smith and other guy's McConnell trying to run the offense.
Is like, bro that that's not it. This is Aliburton's offense.
They lost their quarterback. They only shot thirty six percent
in the second half at home and shot forty two percent.
That's the worst half of basketball for the Pacers. And
(03:18):
just to give you in the playoffs, to give you
another example, it flashed on the screen at one point
in the first half, they had fourteen fast break points.
They were running the Knicks out of the arena. In
the second half total two fast break points. Haliburton sits
they lose their rhythm he comes back in tries to
(03:40):
kick start it and he never could. And what did
we talk about last week. Whoever controls the tempo is
going to win the games and or the series. And
the Knicks compressed it, slowed it down. And also in
this matters, the Knicks hit their last fifteen free throws.
(04:01):
I know that's not a glamorous headline, but remember Game one,
the Knicks had control and they were missing free throws.
Open the door. This was the opposite. They were controlling
tempo in Game one, they lost tempo, miss free throws.
Here late, they controlled tempo, hit free throws, and so
(04:21):
they were a better roaded team than they were a
home team. The road team has won every game in
this series. So the next slowed it down, hit the freebies,
and I thought their defensive rotations were much better, especially
when you had once Haliburton sat down for that stretch.
And you see this in football all the time. You
have momentum, you have a bad series, you have a fumble,
(04:44):
there's a turnover, and you can never find the momentum again.
It's hard. Momentum matters, and especially matters in playoff games.
So we have ourselves a series the Knicks Blue Game one,
it kind of felt like they stole Game three, Indiana.
I don't like the better team in game two. We've
got a series and here's tips.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
Him play out basketball. I know you guys like roll
your eyes when they say no lead is safe. But
no lead is safe because I think with the three
point shot, people make up ground quickly. Pace the game,
make up ground quickly. See you see comebacks all the time,
and if you let up just a little bit, that's
that's what happens.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So you just do not see the Pacers very often
lose their way offensively. But that four and five minute
stretch where Halliburton left and you just saw the lead shrink.
He came back in, he sort of righted the ship.
He hit a three. It felt a little better. But
by that point the Knicks had growing confidence. And it
(05:47):
should also be noted Kat did a lot of his
damage with Jalen Brunson on the bench, which we'll get
to after the commercial. Okay, so this is a story
you may be wondering. I don't think it's going to
make a big deal either way. But Aaron Rodgers, according
(06:08):
to Jeremy Fowler, there are people in the NFL and
Jeremy Fowler works at ESPN, very good reporter. He is
saying there are people in the NFL, many that believe
Aaron Rodgers is waiting on Minnesota. I don't know that
to be true, but I will say this, Aaron loves
to make people think he's a mystery and the media
can't figure him out. And he does that because it
(06:30):
invalidates us, and we're the one group of people he
can't control. He's worshiped by football people, he's love by teammates,
the one group he can't control us, and so he
wants to invalidate us. And he's not JD. Salinger. It's
not that mysterious. The Steelers are a shaky fit and
Aaron knows it. He doesn't want to offend Mike Tomlin.
(06:51):
It may be if he wants to play his best spot,
but they can't figure out offense. I've done over this
a million times. They're toned af to offer. They they
I think they're now making moves just to make moves.
Let's just move off George Pickens and let's get a pick,
and let's overspend for DK Metcalf and they're just making
(07:12):
moves to make moves. So there are reports and I
don't care about his personal life. That Aaron's personal life,
he's going through some turbulence. You wish him well. I
don't want to get into any speculation there, but I
just think Aaron is too smart to think the Steelers
are a good fit. The O line's been a wreck
for years. The oh coordinator position they've run through him.
(07:33):
They lost Naugee Harris, their left tackle. And by the way,
it does matter. He went from Green Bay, which has
always had an offensive culture. They always get quarterback right,
they always have offensive coaches, they always have good offensive lines.
Green Bay does offense right, and they've been doing it
right for thirty years. Pittsburgh does defense right. And the
only two times they've done offense right they had Terry
(07:54):
Bradshaw on Big Ben and in between that, they're not
the same franchise. They win games that don't win big games,
and that's what Pittsburgh's going through right now. They've been
a bottom ten total offense six years in a row,
and that's hard to do when you look at the
two New York franchise and Carolina. It's a bad offense
in this league, and the Bears so the Vikings makes
a ton of sense. Great brilliant offensive head coach and
(08:17):
play caller. They play indoors. He knows the division they
have justin Jefferson. They upgraded their offensive line in the offseason.
There's also a story that's interesting. So Aaron was apparently
on some podcast and said, when asked about the Saints,
because we don't know exactly what the Saints are doing.
Is it going to be is Spencer Rattler?
Speaker 5 (08:37):
You know?
Speaker 1 (08:39):
And Aaron Rodgers was quoted saying, yeah, I'm too old.
I don't want to live in Louisiana. Sorry. So what
that means is where Aaron plays matters to Aaron, he
is thinking about it. He doesn't want to live in
New Orleans. So that's another reason. Indoors, he knows the
(09:00):
division NFC. He moved over to a defensive culture plan
outdoors in the Northeast with the Jets and it was
a mess. Aaron doesn't want to do that again. So
and Jeff Pearlman came on last week. He wrote a
book about Brent Farv, and Aaron was all through the
book and Farv didn't treat Aarin very well. And I
(09:21):
grew to kind of respect what Aaron had to go through,
but he made a point about where Aaron's played, and
the fit is really crucial when you consider Aaron's personality.
Speaker 6 (09:33):
They just think over time, especially being in a small
Midwestern town surrounded by the Midwestern quaintness of Green Bay.
I think Aaron Rodgers really started to believe I'm the
smartest guy in the room.
Speaker 7 (09:45):
I know everything.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
I am very intelligent. I know more than the coaches,
I know more than my teammates, I know more than
this fan base. And again, if you can contain that
in Green Bay, Wisconsin, it's one thing you're treated as
a guy, but once you go national, once you go
to a different franchise, it doesn't really play out that well.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
It certainly didn't in New York. Now, the culture in
Pittsburgh is better than New York, but like the Jets,
they can't get offense right. So whether the story is
true or not, it makes a lot of sense. I've
said this. I think he was waiting for brock Perty's
contract he get signed that eliminated the Niners. I think
that was his first choice. His second choice was Minnesota.
(10:23):
This is just a guest by me, but this story
comes out and this is what I felt is Aaron's
too smart to think, you know, Pittsburgh's gonna work for me.
I don't think they're a game better if he plays there.
I don't. I think Pittsburgh now is in the space
where they're just making moves to make moves. I don't
know DK Metcalf was overpaid. Pickens trade probably right once
(10:45):
you acquire Dk Metcalf, But I didn't love the offseason
for the Steelers. J.
Speaker 5 (10:52):
Mack.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
There's a lot of things going on today. Colin Wright,
Colin wrong in fifty minutes. There was a story over
the weekend about Caitlin Clark's value to the WNBA. It
is I don't know if people understand this, like what
is happening, how popular she is. It's insane, and I
(11:16):
think it is time. I like the fact that this
story was published, meaning WNBA coaches, players, executives can now
read her relevance, which is not only is it transcendent,
it's transformational to the league. How was your weekend?
Speaker 4 (11:32):
By the way, my weekend was excellent.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
I ran into your friend Lebron yesterday at a volleyball
tournament out here in LA But if I could quickly
go back to Aaron Rodgers for a second. Does he
totally want to be Brett Farv Jets then Vikings close
out the career.
Speaker 4 (11:46):
Is that what he's wanting to do?
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Like copy Brett Farv? It is just so embarrassing and pathetic.
But I don't want to bash Aaron Rodgers. He went
through some stuff last week. I'm sure you saw with
an ex girlfriend kind of throwing him under the bus
for not being a nice guy.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Which should surprise nobody. But just disappointing stuff.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Eric, Come on, yeah, we wish Aaron the very best
and the Steelers the very best. Coming up next the
information about how big Caitlin Clark is. It's sort of staggering.
Matt Hasselbeck stops by. I'm going to give you my
list of the four newcomers in the NFL this year
that will change outcomes. I think there's only four, only
(12:25):
four people in the NFL that moved and will changed outcomes.
It's the hurt.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in newon Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Welcome back on this Memorial Day, Matt Hasselbeck calling right
and wrong in forty minutes. So, a associate professor of
finance at Indiana University broke down the economic scale of
Caitlin Clark, who is just a phenomenon. So she generated
(13:11):
last year twenty six and a half percent as a
rookie on a terrible team, twenty six and a half
percent of the economic activity in the league. Listen to
some of these numbers. Her stardom not slowing down. The
Fever averaged more than the Pacers did per game throughout
(13:35):
the league. If she played in your town, attendance for
the league rose thirty percent. The valuation of the fever
ninety million dollars for the Fever before she arrived, now
three hundred and forty million. That's four times, four times
(13:55):
valuation increase. Lebron didn't do that when he went back
to Cleveland. He certainly didn't do it going to Miami
or the Lakers. MJ didn't do that with the Bulls.
We're talking one player. She is Steve Jobs. She's taking
an insolvent company and turning it into a powerhouse. So
listen to this. WNBA merchandise exploded five hundred percent increase.
(14:18):
That's one player. I mean literally half the merchandise in
the league she's selling. So you better get comfortable with
the fact that if she comes to your arena, ticket
prices will jump one hundred and forty percent. She will
be more popular than your entire roster. So and my
take is, ride the wave, enjoy the fruits, be grateful
(14:42):
you went commercial to private. Now we can go back
to Fly in Spirit airlines. But nothing kills team spirit
like Fly in Spirit. So you got to come to
grips with it. She is not only transcendent, she is transformational.
She has changed the league. And Hollywood has always understood this.
The actors and the directors have always understood this. The
bigger the stars, the better the catering, egg rolls for everybody,
(15:06):
chicken and beef options. So this is a whole different ballgame.
We're talking about these numbers. She is mission very possible.
What you are seeing now is I don't think I
don't even think the PGA with Tiger exploded like this.
I mean, these numbers are insane. And you know, I
was talking to a group of people last night that
(15:29):
aren't sports fans, and they, you know, they asked, like,
how long will it last, and what do you make
of it? My take is, well, think about how deep
the reservoir of men's basketball talent is in the world.
I mean, you know, you can go to Spain, Lithuania,
you can go anywhere. You can go anywhere in the
United States, you can go to Portugal. There's talent everywhere
(15:51):
in the world for men's basketball, and men's basketball has
been ahead of women's basketball. My entire life is that
we've never found a duplicate for Steph Curry. We never have.
Nobody plays like him, nobody looks like him, nobody shoots
like him in women's basketball. And his greatest Curry is
(16:11):
he wasn't the best player in the league. He was
the most transformational. People take shots now they wouldn't have considered,
but we've never found a duplicate in the men's game
for Steph Curry. The gap between Caitlin and anything resembling
her is Curry fourfold. So it's not going to end.
This is at the beginning of it. The professor states
(16:33):
that there's a chance she will have a billion dollar
economic impact for the WUNBA this year. Again, ride the wave.
People enter your life all the time and make it better.
Thank them. J Mack with the news.
Speaker 8 (16:54):
No, no, no, this is the Herdline news.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
All right, Cole, Let's get started with a big story
out here in La Show. Hey Otani, big appearance over
the weekend, throwing live batting practice for the first time
since his left shoulder surgery. Otani only threw twenty two pitches.
There were five plate appearances to three batters. After the session,
Otani said, I haven't thrown in a while, so it
was nice to be able to feel like a pitcher
(17:22):
obviously when.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
He has thrown. I mean, hey, guys, incredible.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Now I'm curious, do you think this is a situation
where the Dodgers are like, hey, we need Otani back.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
I mean, they are only up one in the West.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Over the the Giants and Addres are closing in.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Listen, he's a great pitcher, so obviously he makes the
team better when he pitches. And they've had a ton
of pitching injuries. I think pitching injuries if you look
at Tommy John surgeries, they've skyrocketed the last five to
ten years. It's an industry issue. But the Dodgers, because
they're such a big brand and talked about like everybody
looks at the Dodgers and they can't stay healthy. There
is no question that Otani they want Otani available that
(18:00):
I think part of the negotiations were he's gonna pitch.
If you add o Tawny, he would arguably the be
the ace of the staff. And so, I mean they
have some good arms, but they've got guys who have
been injured before, like last known who they got from Tampa.
So it's I think you're gonna notice his value in August, September,
(18:20):
and October. That's when all this will matter the most totally.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
Let's let's get to the NBA where the Timberwolves on
Saturday night, but what a beatdown on the Thunder just
absolutely ran him out of the building one three to
one on one, I mean, Colin winning by forty two points.
I don't know how much of this you watched it.
The fourth quarter was unwatchable but interesting. Note here Sga,
the MVP of the league, was sitting on the bench
late in the game wearing a microphone. The broadcast caught
(18:46):
him talking about the loss.
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Take a listen.
Speaker 9 (18:50):
Earlier, they were more physical earlier, and they made shot
to do missun the others.
Speaker 4 (18:59):
And then on top of.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
This, they had a great night.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
We had a bad night.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
So it's like forty.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
But if we like take care of these, we can
still lose because of this night.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
But it doesn't look like this.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
Well, I you know what. I was talking to my
friend Jason tim flast night at the Volume, we talked
about this. Of all the teams remaining, I kind of
feel like I get the same team with the Knicks
Homer Way, same team with the Pacers home and away,
same team t Wolves home and away. OKAYC because of
their youth, I don't feel like it's the same offense
(19:33):
young players on the road historically in the playoffs and
rotational players, and they have the deepest bench, right so
and so when you look at OKAC and the numbers
validate this, they're not the same offense away from home.
They're the youngest team and the deepest team. But those
rotational guys, you know, we've talked about this. When you
(19:55):
get to the playoffs, your stars shine wherever. Your rotational
guys are always better at home. They're always more comfortable.
They're often younger players or more limited players. So okay, see,
I feel there is a gap between home made case okay,
see and road thunder.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And listen, naz Reid goes home and can actually make shots.
I mean I think he got every three pointer in Okay.
I will say the one interesting angle here is, you know,
I can understand you don't show up. You lose by
twenty Colin. This was almost like a we're laying down,
you know, we kind of give up. Remember this happened
against Memphis in Game three. They were up two oh
and Memphis goes up thirty, but then Ja Morant got
(20:33):
hurt and okaysee came back. So I think you're onto
something with this young team. Obviously, tonight is the series.
If oka See wins, it's over up three to one.
Speaker 4 (20:41):
But if minute, I vote to wins, and I think
they got a shot at home.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Right, Yeah, they're well thunder or seven and one at
home with a lot of blowouts. We watched them play Denver.
There are three and three on the road. We saw
Denver give them problems up in Denver. Now some of
that may be altitude. I'm tonight's close. What does this spread?
Three or four points? I think it should go either way. Game.
It's gonna be a must watched fourth quarter.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
I know the audience is gonna be upset after missing
on Game one in both series.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
I have not bet or looked at a line since that.
I'm like, I don't get that.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
I don't understand how the Knicks loses, how the timberrules
are getting blown out.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
So I haven't looked at the line yet.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I'm not betting it, but I do think this is
another Anthony Edwards put the team on his back.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
He outscored OKC in the first quarter.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Yeah, in Game three and that was kind of like
a lights out moment Colin Finals story. This is adding
to the Aaron Rodgers from earlier. How about this one?
Speaker 8 (21:32):
There are reports.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Saying that Falcons.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Backup quarterback Kirk Cousins is on Pittsburgh's radar. The Falcons
got Cousins last year and of course then drafted Pennix,
and Cousins is kind of like the odd man out there.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
It's gonna be Penis's team.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
The fact that this story is emerging on the same
weekend as the Aaron Rodgers maybe not going to Pittsburgh thing.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I think there's some smoke here for sure.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
I just don't know if Cousins is gonna work outdoors
in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
I don't think that's a good match at all.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Listen, Tomlin appears to be safe. I think he's signed
an extension in the last year or too. Pittsburgh, if
they listen, when you have Lamar Jackson and Burrow in
your division, okay, those are two of the top five
quarterbacks in the league. You have to find a franchise quarterback.
You can't keep going out and hamming eg of it
with Kenny Pickett and Will Howard. How do you get
(22:24):
a franchise quarterback you win five to six games and
have a top eight pick. Pittsburgh in my lifetime, has
been great twice. Bradshawn is prime, Big Ben in his prime.
Outside of that, they don't win big games. They just
do not, even with Tomliner, Bill Kower, Chuck Nolan. So
(22:44):
to me, this is the step back year, and I
think if you can get into that six seven, you
know you're still viable. Your defensive win games, you're not
trying to lose, but you're limited. I would have no
problem Pittsburgh just saying listen, we're gonna go with these
young guys. Get It'd be one thing if you didn't
have Lamar Jackson ten times in the next five years minimum,
(23:05):
Burrow ten times the next five years minimum.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Well, I like your idea of Hey, maybe you Ham
and Naggett with Nathan Rudolph and Will Howard. Hey, why
don't you add instead of five six wins, go to
three four and trade DJ Watt. Go get a bunch
of picks, and you're set up for and it's early
what could be a great twenty twenty six draft.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Well, I don't want to trade TJ. Watt without getting
a guarantee back. The problem with I would trade TJ.
Watt if I could get the number one pick and
it's arch Manning.
Speaker 4 (23:31):
There's no way, no, no, nobody's doing that.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
But I'm not.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
What if you a potential contender, somebody who wants to
make the playoffs badly, you know, let's go Jacksonville Jackson
will say nay, we'll give up our first or any
team you want. I would consider moving off, moving off
of what would you not?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Listen?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Listen? Take quarterback out. You can move off virtually everybody
except a great left tackle, Like I'm not going to
move off Miles Garrett. Take quarterbacks out. You don't want
to move off a great left tackle? That he's the
insurance policy for your star quarterback. But we've seen Belichick
fire and Andy Reid fired. You can move off legendary coaches.
(24:12):
We've seen Montana play for the Chiefs, Brady play for
the box. Like the idea that getting older with that
with a handful of injuries, TJ. Watt can't be on
the market, Like, get over it. He's a great player
who would have massive value on the market. Not saying
you'd do it. You take calls for that. He's a
(24:33):
great player. He's had multiple injuries.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Now he'd pay on Washington. They're gonna Washington could be
a super Bowl team. I don't know, you know, maybe
they'll give up their first next year. But I would
just bought them out.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
I like your idea.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I know that's a tough selle to the fan base
that's been proud fan base. They make the playoffs five
hundred every year. That's irrelevant. You want to be a contender.
You got a bottom mountain.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Jamack with the news, Well that's the news, and thanks
for stopping by Third Line News. So it is a
little bit instructive here that Carl Anthony townsh did his
great work last night in the fourth quarter, you know,
and Jalen Brunson was not on the floor for a
lot of it. So now I think the Pacers are
(25:15):
a better team. I think they get more consistently easier
looks on offense, and I think they're gonna win the series.
But the most interesting part in this series for the
Knicks is that it's not complicated to see what they
are and what they're not. It's right up. They're not pretty,
(25:37):
they don't shoot the three particularly well, and that Brunson
and Kat often flourish when the others off the floor
your turn, no, it's your turn. No, it's a your turn,
my turn offense too often. And they're both poor defenders,
so well coached offensive teams pick on them. So I
(26:00):
would move off a talented erratic Cat, although I think
he's talented, because I don't think Brunson and Cat on
the floor. People just go after him and bad defenders,
And I think it also we know what they're not,
we know what they need. They need KD, who is
a catch and shoot player, which is very valuable because
(26:23):
you're gonna get Cat's points, You're gonna get twenty three
to twenty five a game, better defender and he can
play complimentary basketball with Jalen Brunson. Cat really doesn't. It's
not all the Cat's a bad guy. But if you
have him on the floor and Brunson, Brunson's not big,
he's not long, he's not a great defender, liability. So
Brunson leaves and Cat's like, Okay, now it's my turn.
(26:45):
And not surprisingly, he's great because he's a gifted offensive player. Again,
he averages twenty three in his career. But Katie is
great without the ball in his hands. Katie is a
plug and play, catch and shoot player. He is better
defensively than Karl Anthony Towns. And I mean, you know,
I mean think about this. When Karl Anthony Towns was
in Minnesota before Ant arrived, he was at number one
(27:08):
scoring option. So Carl Anthony Towns has a market. He's
gonna average twenty two points a game for somebody. But
I do think the Knicks, what you're seeing in this series,
it's a pretty simple. You could be a basketball casual.
They can't shoot the three consistently, KD. They need a
star who doesn't need the ball in his hands a
lot KD. They need length. If they keep Mitchell Robinson
(27:32):
and move off Cat. They need length KD, they need
a willing defender KD. They need a high basketball IQ
because Brunson, Michale Bridges, this is a smart basketball team
and a pretty relentless coach KD. It all fits like
I and I listen. I go back when they were
(27:53):
beating Boston and I'm like, I don't know if they
need KD. But playoffs are layers steps. You know, against Detroit,
you're like, wow, why are the Knicks struggling with Detroit?
Because Detroit muddies it up and they had a hard
time getting consistent baskets. And then you play Boston in
your defense befuddles them and brunts and is great, and
(28:16):
so you forget about that. But then they play Indiana
and you're watching and you're going, yeah, they kind of
need they need another shooter. And all these teams now
with the multiple aprons, they're all going to be moving pieces.
It is harder to move big pieces. But Cat's going
to market. I don't think Kean Brunson in playoff basketball works.
And if you're asking me everything, they need catch and shoot,
(28:38):
plug and play high IQ, hit a three pointer. If
Kat leaves, they need length and a willing defender. Every
box is checked with KD. And let's be honest about Kat.
The dude has value. You can't tell me he doesn't.
He is a I mean you saw yesterday he is
a at times an unstoppable offensive player who attacks downhill.
(29:02):
And here's Kat after.
Speaker 9 (29:04):
So opportunity to utilize all those hours I'll put into
the gym, and the game wasn't looking great for me
as well, but for all of us then I just
wanted to do whatever it takes to help put us
in a position to win.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, it's not a criticism. The guy's got to market.
This is pro sports. Michael Jordan finished with the Wizards.
You know, it's never pretty in the end. But Kat's
not in his prime, but he has quarters like last night,
and they're fairly regular. And by the way, I was
thinking about this, if if Jason Tatum is out for
the Celtics next year and we don't even know what
(29:41):
Cleveland is right now, right like, we're not sure what
Cleveland is. We know Indiana is gonna be good, but
they're gonna have a Miles Turner dilemma. They're not gonna
be able to keep him because they're gonna keep past
Gal Siakam, you have to. You're gonna keep Halliburton. You've
got a bunch of other rotational guys you like. They're
gonna probably lose Miles Turner, so they're gonna lose some
of their length, and term matters for big teams. If
(30:03):
Yanna stays in Milwaukee, it matters. So there's gonna be
a lot of movement, a lot of little pieces moving
in New York. And I think this series has really
you can be a basketball casual, you know what they need,
and I think Katie checks all of those boxes. Colin Wright,
Colin Wrong twenty five minutes from now coming up. The
players who absolutely there's four maybe a coach, maybe a
(30:27):
player that I think change outcomes in the NFL. This
is all based on the story that came out today
regarding the most valuable New plea year player for every
team in the league.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and neon Easter, not a em Pacific.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Hour two on a Memorial Day Monday. It's the Herd.
Wherever you may be, however, and you're listening. Thanks for
making us part of your day. J mcmatt. Hasselbeck is
around the corner. You've got a story on Caitlin Clark
at the bottom of the hour. I hope you had
(31:12):
a great weekend. You ran into Lebron James, you said,
in a volleyball tournament, a.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
Used volleyball tournament. He attracted a big crowd. Hey, quick question.
Let me ask you, and I know you're not a
big social media.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
Guy on weekend, You've got a bubbly life out there
in the Midwest. When you put something out about Caitlin
Clark during one of her games, do you see like
a just a tsunami of a reaction. Everybody seems to
have thoughts on Caitlyn Clark. Is she's probably more polarizing
than any NBA player right now.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Yeah, I don't get the polarizing. She's good. Yeah, let's
enjoy her. I don't get, like I understand. I do
understand a little bit of the animosity with players. You know,
It's like when Bryce Harper came in baseball, nobody paid
attention to us. Now you like the flashy new player
and her game is flashy, so I get some animosity.
But I always felt this. I remember when Manny Ramirez
left the Red Sox and he came back, and people
(32:02):
were like, yeah, I don't know if I like him
and might take his You're the Red Sox. You could
never beat the Yankees. I don't care what you think
of Kurt Shilling or Manny Ramirez. You beat the Yankees.
You won rings with them. Like, if somebody makes my
life better, like, I don't care if it's your ex wife,
If you had fifteen great years, appreciate it. That's a
big chapter in your life. That was good. So Kaitlin
(32:25):
Clark's making everybody's life better. You can fly Spirit Airlines
or you can upgrade to private. That alone is a
thank you card in gift. I mean to me, I
don't get the polarization. All right, we do it every Monday.
Colin right, Colin wrong, and plenty.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
Of votes where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Well, my inclination was when the push push got pushed through,
it was because of Jason Kelsey, the soon to be
Hall of Famer center for the Philadelphia Eagles, who stood
in front of the owners in a suit, got in
a stance and made a declaration that it was safe.
And the stories out today is Jason Kelsey indeed was
(33:05):
the reason he changed about three to four votes that
it passed. Listen, the Health and Safety Committee of the
NFL wants to get rid of it, so it had
to be an influencer. It had to be somebody with
great conviction to sell it, an owner or a player
or a coach. And the reports are it was as
we speculated Jason Kelsey.
Speaker 8 (33:26):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
PFF came out last week ranked quarterbacks, all of them.
Dak Prescott was seventeenth, one spot ahead of two um
and that's exactly right. I know y'all love him. He's
a cowboy and he's rich. And his intangibles from maturity
to focus to leadership, I agree they're a plus. But
as a thrower of the football, as an athlete, it's
(33:50):
CC plus B minus. He is, especially after a second
major surgery in the middle of the pack. And I
appreciate PFF nailing.
Speaker 8 (34:00):
Where Colin was wrong.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
The Lakers need a deal, Austin reeves. I don't get
the fascination, but Dan Woike reporting the organization loves him
and the only have to pay him next year fourteen million,
and they see him as an absolute steal. I see
him as a guy that got worked athletically against Minnesota's
wing players. I see him as a guy that should
(34:24):
be the fourth best player on a championship level team.
I think he's a little less talented than Derek White,
who I feel the same way about. If he's your
fourth best player, you should be buying for championships. But
I'm wrong. Apparently, where Colin was right, Insiders now saying
Jeremy Fowler reports that Aaron Rodgers many believe has his
(34:45):
eye on Minnesota and that is why he hasn't signed
with Pittsburgh. It's not just necessarily the personal reasons. I
don't know it to be true, but I have speculated
he's too smart to think Pittsburgh's a good fit. Burrow
twice a year with better offensive teammates and a better
offensive coach Lamar Jackson in a better organization twice a year.
(35:10):
Pittsburgh is a bunch of l's even with Aaron Rodgers,
and I think he knows it.
Speaker 8 (35:14):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Zach Ede made the All Rookie team, the former produced star.
I didn't understand the pushback on him. Mark Few came
on our show and said he never faced an offensive
college player that unstoppable. Dan Hurley came on the hurt
and said, the NBA doesn't know what they're talking about.
He's going to work in this league and for Memphis.
He made the All Rookie team. He's a guy that
(35:38):
just kept grinding. He got better sophomore junior, junior's senior year,
and I think you're gonna see continued improvement. He clearly
has an excellent work ethic. Where Colin was wrong, the
Eagles signed an extension to Nick Siriani. You know, I
don't quite get the vibe. I think there's a lot
of circumstances like Howie Roseman and Jalen Hurts and say
(36:00):
Barkley in the old line that elevated him. But you
know what, the players like him. I don't have to
get everybody. I mean, Philadelphia is a loud, high volume,
high intensity town, and there's an argument he fits the
Eagles more than any other team. So I can take
it wrong on that.
Speaker 8 (36:16):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Oh, Jordan Hudson reportedly wearing a new ring and not
wanted Belichick's Super Bowl rings. It could be an engagement ring.
Since I'm the only American media member that does appear
to approve of this relationship, once again proving I am
not only America's honesty broker, but I'm a hopeless romantic.
I see it working. I think they like each other.
(36:41):
Relationships can be complicated, but there is a report that
they have a future, that these two are a real thing.
Where Colin was right NBA Western Finals between Minnesota and OKC.
As a ratings dud I said, I think the Knicks
Pacers is going to get great eight numbers, and it has.
(37:01):
This is not a needle mover. Sga is not a
dynamic player. He's just a great score. It's a small
market and Minnesota is not a huge basketball brand, so
it doesn't surprise me that this is just not moving
the needle. Like I think tonight could be the best
game of the series. If Minnesota wins it, I think
that helps. If OKC wins, I think the ratings are
just going to be abysmal. We've had this before Duncan
(37:23):
in the Spurs when they were running the league. We're
not a captivating team. Duncan was great, but he was
a big fundamental. He wasn't dynamic, he wasn't a big personality.
Speaker 8 (37:32):
It happens where Colin was raw.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Kenny Pickett, now viewed as the front runner for the
Cleveland Browns quarterback kick. I don't get it. Just I'm
gonna die on this hill. Shador Sanders is going to
win this job. Picket's on his third team in four
years in his NFL career, fifteen touchdowns, fourteen picks. I
don't get it. You know, nice kid. I think he's
a backup. I think he loves football. But I said
(37:59):
it when he came out. He's more of a second mid,
third round picked. He didn't pop on TV. He did
have one great college play where he was gonna slide.
He faked it, stood ran, We all ran on a
thousand times. But I don't see it as a franchise quarterback.
Colin right, Colin wrong on a Monday. And with that,
Matt Hasselbeck, eighteen years in the NFL joins US live.
(38:20):
I don't ask you about the tush push. You can
tell from the committees the league wants to get rid
of it, and Jeffrey Lewie has you know, the Eagles
are a respected franchise. And Jason Kelcey obviously, you know
he's just one of those guys, the grinder he's loved
by the NFL community. Do you think that passes for
a year? If I said five years, Tush push, do
(38:40):
you think it's gonna last?
Speaker 7 (38:44):
No, I don't think it's gonna last. And I don't
think they want.
Speaker 10 (38:46):
To get rid of it. I just think they don't
know what to do with it. You know, they really don't.
And it's it's I think you said it earlier. It's
a health and safety issue. That's how you move the
needle on these things. There's probably just no data that
shows that this is a play people get injured.
Speaker 5 (39:01):
You know what.
Speaker 7 (39:01):
The NFL doesn't want.
Speaker 10 (39:02):
They don't want wasted plays like the extra point when
they moved it back, and they don't want plays that
the injury rate goes up, you lose star players.
Speaker 5 (39:10):
You know.
Speaker 10 (39:10):
I thought actually in the Super Bowl when Chris Jones
went down, I thought, oh, well, if he gets hurt
on this play, then this play has no has no future.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
But I just don't think the data is there.
Speaker 10 (39:20):
And you know, Jason Kelsey talking to the team, to
the you know, to the competition committee, that's not unusual.
Like I remember, you know, one time on the extra
point they brought in Adam Van Terry to talk about
that extra point situation. They brought in different long snappers
that had gotten hurt on extra point plays, and you know,
they brought in special teams.
Speaker 7 (39:40):
People to talk about the kickoff and the kickoff return.
So it's not unusual.
Speaker 10 (39:43):
I just think that some people present their case better
than others, and I would imagine Jason Kelsey was probably
pretty persuasive.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
So on the Aaron Rodgers thing, when you're I mean,
at some point players get older, like Kirk Cousins, and
you do have leverage because you have two hundred million
dollars in the bank and you don't want to play
you don't want to play it. Aaron certainly earned it,
He's made a fortune. There's talk about personal stuff. My
take has always been smart people are often too smart
(40:12):
to try to fool me that they're interested in something
that's not smart. Pittsburgh's a tone deaf offensive culture. Minnesota
is a really good offensive culture. If you are a
quarterback and you maybe have a year or two left
of all the teams New Orleans, Minnesota, Pittsburgh, what would
be your process on eliminating and including teams? What does
(40:35):
matter to an older quarterback?
Speaker 10 (40:37):
Well, who likes me back. That's a really important thing. Like, yeah,
I've been seeing the reports that Aaron Rodgers would prefer Minnesota,
who would not like everyone would great great play caller,
great head coach, great skill around you, amazing defense on
the other side of the ball. Yeah, I get it,
but they seem to be already settled on JJ McCarthy
as their quarterback. So I don't think listen to quarterback
(41:00):
free agency situation when you're at the end of your career.
It's very similar to musical chairs. There's only a certain
amount of chairs when the music stops. The music stops.
And so I've been saying this for a long time.
I believe I said it on your show. Aaron Rodgers
is gonna be with the Pittsburgh Steelers. All this other
talk about all these other teams, it's not happening. I
do not see it happening. There's no rush for a
(41:22):
veteran quarterback. I think I said it on your show.
There's no way he's signing before May twenty seven. Absolutely
no way you signed before phase phase three. There's no
reason to, especially if you're a guy has experienced as
a rod So I mean to me, I think that
June ninth time when they have that mandatory mini camp,
is like, all right, if it's not you, then we
(41:43):
got to move on as the Steelers. But to me, listen,
is it the best situation out there? No, but it
needs to be mutual acceptance. And the music's about to
stop soon here and he's gonna have to sit down
or get out.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
So I forget how you feel about Brock. Pretty I
like him, but I do feel much like a Dak
Prescott or Atua. He needs an offensive coach. He's got
to have some weaponry. His contract, now that it's all
been laid out, is not as punitive as initially thought.
(42:20):
But my take is older teams get hurt more often
and it takes longer to recover. So if you told
me Trent William spraindon me in week two, I'd be like,
this isn't going to be good. Whereas a you know,
a guy like An Allan, a Lamar, a Burrow Can
it is more able to overcome that stuff. When you
looked at the Brock pretty numbers, knowing this is a
(42:42):
pretty old team at running back, at linebacker, at left tackle,
at tight end, are you good with it? Well?
Speaker 10 (42:49):
A couple of things. As a quarterback who played on
the old CBA, I see all of these quarterback numbers
and I'm like, what you know, I feel like I
was born at the wrong time. Like that's the first thing.
But you like Brockberty. I love Brockberty. I put myself
in the category of Kyle Shanahan John Lynch.
Speaker 7 (43:05):
I think he's an absolute baller.
Speaker 10 (43:07):
I think he's one of the most underrated quarterbacks in
the entire game. I think he does things that quarterbacks
don't get credit for, things that don't show up on
your passer rating. I think he's a really good player.
I also think that this is kind of a team
friendly deal. He didn't handcuff them to the level that
I believe that he could have, So I think this
(43:27):
is a dangerous team. I think this is a team
last year that had a terrible season. I think they
could be a playoff team next year. I hear what
you're saying about age and losing some other good players,
but I think this is still a team that I
believe in and for a good part. Yeah, he's a
quarterback that needs a great coach and a great system.
Great what quarterback doesn't want that, So put me on.
(43:52):
Put me down as a team that believes in this quarterback.
I like the signing and I think this is a
good team to watch this year.
Speaker 1 (43:59):
Okay, I want to ask you about I said, it's
a head coach quarterback league. Very few players, even at TJ.
Watt are not worth a point. That's just the way
the league is. You get the right coach and you
get the right quarterback, you're gonna win sixty five to
seventy five percent of your games. You're gonna win your division.
That's why the AFC is so much easier to predict
than the NFC because you have more great quarterbacks. So
I said, there are four people of all the additions
(44:20):
in the NFL that I think change outcomes. And my
take was they were so bad at quarterback at Tennessee.
I think cam Ward will change outcomes. I think Vrabel
takes over for a coach that was probably a coordinator
elevated to a spot that was a little much that early.
I think Geno Smith is one of those guys nobody
wants to admit. You give him time to throw in
(44:42):
a run game, He's pretty good. And I do think
Ben Johnson this would be my most controversial based on
Taylor Williams and your belief in him. Would you push
back on any of these specifically?
Speaker 10 (44:55):
I mean, I kind of agree with cam Ward. He
gives you something. I just don't know if anybody's gonna care.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Kind of amazing to me.
Speaker 10 (45:01):
The lack of attention some teams get Tennessee, Jacksonville, some
of those teams, I feel like they deserve more.
Speaker 7 (45:07):
Mike Vrabel I liked that a lot.
Speaker 10 (45:09):
I don't think I would pin it just on Gino, though,
I think for me, I think what's special about That's it?
Speaker 7 (45:15):
And I like Gino. I really like Geno a lot.
Speaker 10 (45:17):
I really think that Pete Carroll, Chip Kelly, you know
this weird Tom Brady involvement. I think that's probably the
top edition for me. And you know, we got Ashton gent,
we got most dirt. Like, I think that really is
going to be a team effort there. I don't know
that I would put Geno as the face of it,
even though I think I agree with you. Ben Johnson's
(45:39):
interesting to me. I think he's going to be hired
much like much like Sean McVay was.
Speaker 7 (45:45):
He was hired.
Speaker 10 (45:46):
Sean McVay was hired to see if he could fix
golf and Gurley, you know the La Rams. I think
they were Saint Louis to La you know, Todd Gurley,
Jared Goff. Who's the right coach for those two guys.
Ben Johnson's coming in to see if he can turn
Caleb Willi into a quarterback who maximizes his potential, who
realizes his potential. Last year, he just looked like a
(46:07):
guy that was kind of massaging the ball in the
pocket and then tried to, like, you know, be an
athlete and outrun people. It would look like a college
quarterback trying to play in the NFL. I think Ben
Johnson's going to be the guy that either can or
can't get Caleb to realize that potential. And Ben Johnson's
not going anywhere, So this is I think a one
year opportunity for Caleb to kind of prove that he
(46:28):
is or isn't who he kind of thought he was
before he was drafted.
Speaker 1 (46:32):
Finally, you see the position of quarterback differently than us
because you played it your experience, you can coach it.
If you look at Burrow, Andrew Luck, Lamar Jackson, Mahomes,
almost all the great quarterbacks. They're not slow builds. In
September of the first year, Burrow was throwing for three
hundred and twenty five yards with an atrocious line and
a coach we didn't know. So generally, if you have it,
(46:56):
we see it pretty quickly, especially for first round quarterbacks.
Jayden Daniels was like twenty eight of thirty one and
back to back weeks or thereabouts. How long? Because I
think the weapons on the old line are pretty good. Now,
how long will you give Caleb before you say warning,
(47:17):
I'm not It can't just be wins, because you can
win games in this league and not play well. What
will you look for with Caleb based on what you've
seen and how long will you give him to become
a hit?
Speaker 7 (47:29):
I would have patience with him.
Speaker 10 (47:30):
I think he's got enough talent and enough upside to
have patience with him.
Speaker 7 (47:35):
I don't think it's a quick I don't think you
know right away.
Speaker 10 (47:37):
I mean Troy Aikman started out really poorly his rookie year,
Like they didn't do well. Peyton Manning, you know, I
think he might have led the league in interceptions. Eli
Manning get bench for Kurt Warner, Like there's all these
stories of young quarterbacks. He doesn't start out well. Quarterback
is such a team game. You need the people around
you to play well. When you go to the team
(47:59):
that has the first pick in the draft, they're usually
not a great team.
Speaker 7 (48:02):
Now, in Caleb situation.
Speaker 10 (48:03):
I believe they've built it really well around him, especially
this year, and they blamed everybody else in the building
besides him, and so now I just think the spotlight's
going to be on him. I would have patience, But
at the same time, I don't know if Chicago Willy,
I think they open up against Brian Flores's defense. That's
a beast of a defense with all their all out pressure,
(48:25):
their simulated pressure. I wouldn't wish that for any young quarterback.
But at the end of the year, I think a
decision will be made on him one way or the other.
And it's just fair to say if you watch the film,
he's off to a very very slow start.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Matt Hasselback on a Monday, Happy Memorial Day to you
and your family.
Speaker 10 (48:45):
Appreciate it, Bud, you too see a com.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
All right, Matt Hasselback always good on the show today,
Jay Mac you were smirking, so you were looking at
something with great intensity. As I was talking there, what's
going on?
Speaker 3 (48:57):
Well, you know, like there's this huge discussion Aaron Rodgers
happening with the Steelers, and it's weird. The Steelers fan
base seems a little torn, like do we want him
or do we not? And I just wonder, you know,
you never know when your stuff's gonna cut through. I
got to give you a shout out for your USC
Notre Dame. That seemed kooky.
Speaker 4 (49:14):
When you floated it was it last year and now
it's coming true.
Speaker 3 (49:17):
But your idea of hey, you know what, let's not
add Rogers, Let's go Mason Rudolph and Will Howard and
see how that works. I wonder if Steelers fans here
in the coming week, it's just gonna say I don't
want the Rogers drama, the nonsense.
Speaker 4 (49:31):
There's just always something.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
The baseball team's terrible, the hockey team's not making the playoffs.
They don't have NBA University of Pittsburgh's math. So the
Steelers are like it, there's football season and waiting for
football season in Pittsburg. And so I think it's hard
when and you go into these psych I can remember
there being years that Willie Stargell and the Pirates were
winning the World Series and the Steelers were great. I
(49:56):
mean it goes in cycles. Right now, Pittsburgh, they've been
great when they've had a great quarterback and they're right now.
Remember what we said last year the Cowboys had the
worst running back room in the league. We were right.
We said it's Dak needs help. The Steelers have the
worst quarterback room. I wouldn't be surprised if you know
(50:20):
the Kirk Cousins thing. I guess, but that just feels
like you're just plugging a hole here. It's a little
whack a mole Offensively, I think your play is go
with the young guys, keep the culture strong. You're not
gonna win a bunch of games, and then go big
game hunting next year and you may have to part
with a TJ. Watt to go from like the eighth
(50:41):
spot to the second spot and get the kid out
of Penn State.
Speaker 7 (50:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:44):
By the way, remember how Belichick was not really wanted
by any teams.
Speaker 4 (50:48):
They were like, hey, he's too old to rigid ones.
Speaker 3 (50:50):
I wonder if we're really close to that point with
Aaron Rodgers and we're just like, it's the Steelers are
nothing like sorry, the Vikings don't want you, the Niners don't.
Speaker 4 (50:58):
Want like, are we there yet? It's just like no
thanks on Aaron Rodgers. That ship is saled.
Speaker 1 (51:06):
We will never know until Aaron speaks it into truth
because Aaron, you know, he wants to be mysterious. So
my take is if he wanted to sign, he would.
Hasselbeck says, it's May twenty seventh, so I don't. I don't.
My takes always been if he goes to Pittsburgh, I
think they win one more game than they are now.
I mean, I think that's what he's become. An older
(51:27):
pocket quarterback who looked cold in outdoor, windy cold games.
He looked old and cold is what he looked like,
all right, Live in Chicago. It's the herd.
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
noon Pacific. Find your local station for the Herd at
Fox Sportsradio dot com, or stream us live every day
on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowher
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
It is Memorial Day. Welcome in. This is the Herd
wherever you may be and however you may be watching
or listening. Thank you to the families who are serving
and have served. It can be a tough day for
many military families that you're in our thoughts. The liberties
and freedoms we enjoy are due to you and your
(00:51):
sacrifice and commitment to this country. And thank you for
all joining us. A lot of choices on a Monday, Jmac,
the one team on this NBA slate that you've always
been a fan of as the New York Knicks. And
they were in a rough, rough spot at about eight
thirty Central where I'm his last night, they were getting
(01:12):
blown out, and then something magical happened. You must field.
We had a series today.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, Tom Thibodeau pressed the right buttons at the right time,
and the Knicks are back in the series.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
Coward, let's go all right.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
They were down oh two, they were on the road,
down twenty point. Their star was in foul trouble Jalen Brudson.
It was one of those what kind of man are you? Games?
And Carl Anthony Towns. Two things happened. Number one, Karl
Anthony town said, I'll show you what kind of man
I am. I'm going to single handedly take over the
(01:47):
fourth quarter. Listen the dude he has quarters like this.
He averages twenty three a game in his career. When
he was in his prime, Carl Anthony Towns always ended
up near the top of those GM surveys they do.
Who would just start a franchise with? He doesn't play
any defense, He's a little quirky, but he can dominate games.
I've been to three or four games where he was playing,
(02:09):
and he was the best player on the floor at
some point in all those games. So, and the second
thing that happened, and this does not happen very often
for the Pacers, they lost their way offensively. So Halliburton
end of the third quarter beginning of the fourth. So
in the third beginning of the fourth, about four and
a half minutes he was on the bench. In that time,
(02:32):
a fifteen point lead evaporated to four. And then he
comes back in and they just never quite felt the
same again Indiana. It's hard to get them off their
offensive game. But even when the Knicks were down four, three,
two points, it felt like they were in control. So
the Pacers are a rhythm team and that they have
(02:55):
the fastest pace in the league, and they get out
of their them and all of a sudden you had
Nie Smith and other guy's McConnell trying to run the offense.
Is like, bro that that's not it. This is Aliburton's offense.
They lost their quarterback. They only shot thirty six percent
in the second half at home and shot forty two percent.
That's the worst half of basketball for the Pacers. And
(03:18):
just to give you in the playoffs, to give you
another example, it flashed on the screen at one point
in the first half, they had fourteen fast break points.
They were running the Knicks out of the arena. In
the second half total two fast break points. Haliburton sits
they lose their rhythm he comes back in tries to
(03:40):
kick start it and he never could. And what did
we talk about last week. Whoever controls the tempo is
going to win the games and or the series. And
the Knicks compressed it, slowed it down. And also in
this matters, the Knicks hit their last fifteen free throws.
(04:01):
I know that's not a glamorous headline, but remember Game one,
the Knicks had control and they were missing free throws.
Open the door. This was the opposite. They were controlling
tempo in Game one, they lost tempo, miss free throws.
Here late, they controlled tempo, hit free throws, and so
(04:21):
they were a better roaded team than they were a
home team. The road team has won every game in
this series. So the next slowed it down, hit the freebies,
and I thought their defensive rotations were much better, especially
when you had once Haliburton sat down for that stretch.
And you see this in football all the time. You
have momentum, you have a bad series, you have a fumble,
(04:44):
there's a turnover, and you can never find the momentum again.
It's hard. Momentum matters, and especially matters in playoff games.
So we have ourselves a series the Knicks Blue Game one,
it kind of felt like they stole Game three, Indiana.
I don't like the better team in game two. We've
got a series and here's tips.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
Him play out basketball. I know you guys like roll
your eyes when they say no lead is safe. But
no lead is safe because I think with the three
point shot, people make up ground quickly. Pace the game,
make up ground quickly. See you see comebacks all the time,
and if you let up just a little bit, that's
that's what happens.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So you just do not see the Pacers very often
lose their way offensively. But that four and five minute
stretch where Halliburton left and you just saw the lead shrink.
He came back in, he sort of righted the ship.
He hit a three. It felt a little better. But
by that point the Knicks had growing confidence. And it
(05:47):
should also be noted Kat did a lot of his
damage with Jalen Brunson on the bench, which we'll get
to after the commercial. Okay, so this is a story
you may be wondering. I don't think it's going to
make a big deal either way. But Aaron Rodgers, according
(06:08):
to Jeremy Fowler, there are people in the NFL and
Jeremy Fowler works at ESPN, very good reporter. He is
saying there are people in the NFL, many that believe
Aaron Rodgers is waiting on Minnesota. I don't know that
to be true, but I will say this, Aaron loves
to make people think he's a mystery and the media
can't figure him out. And he does that because it
(06:30):
invalidates us, and we're the one group of people he
can't control. He's worshiped by football people, he's love by teammates,
the one group he can't control us, and so he
wants to invalidate us. And he's not JD. Salinger. It's
not that mysterious. The Steelers are a shaky fit and
Aaron knows it. He doesn't want to offend Mike Tomlin.
(06:51):
It may be if he wants to play his best spot,
but they can't figure out offense. I've done over this
a million times. They're toned af to offer. They they
I think they're now making moves just to make moves.
Let's just move off George Pickens and let's get a pick,
and let's overspend for DK Metcalf and they're just making
(07:12):
moves to make moves. So there are reports and I
don't care about his personal life. That Aaron's personal life,
he's going through some turbulence. You wish him well. I
don't want to get into any speculation there, but I
just think Aaron is too smart to think the Steelers
are a good fit. The O line's been a wreck
for years. The oh coordinator position they've run through him.
(07:33):
They lost Naugee Harris, their left tackle. And by the way,
it does matter. He went from Green Bay, which has
always had an offensive culture. They always get quarterback right,
they always have offensive coaches, they always have good offensive lines.
Green Bay does offense right, and they've been doing it
right for thirty years. Pittsburgh does defense right. And the
only two times they've done offense right they had Terry
(07:54):
Bradshaw on Big Ben and in between that, they're not
the same franchise. They win games that don't win big games,
and that's what Pittsburgh's going through right now. They've been
a bottom ten total offense six years in a row,
and that's hard to do when you look at the
two New York franchise and Carolina. It's a bad offense
in this league, and the Bears so the Vikings makes
a ton of sense. Great brilliant offensive head coach and
(08:17):
play caller. They play indoors. He knows the division they
have justin Jefferson. They upgraded their offensive line in the offseason.
There's also a story that's interesting. So Aaron was apparently
on some podcast and said, when asked about the Saints,
because we don't know exactly what the Saints are doing.
Is it going to be is Spencer Rattler?
Speaker 5 (08:37):
You know?
Speaker 1 (08:39):
And Aaron Rodgers was quoted saying, yeah, I'm too old.
I don't want to live in Louisiana. Sorry. So what
that means is where Aaron plays matters to Aaron, he
is thinking about it. He doesn't want to live in
New Orleans. So that's another reason. Indoors, he knows the
(09:00):
division NFC. He moved over to a defensive culture plan
outdoors in the Northeast with the Jets and it was
a mess. Aaron doesn't want to do that again. So
and Jeff Pearlman came on last week. He wrote a
book about Brent Farv, and Aaron was all through the
book and Farv didn't treat Aarin very well. And I
(09:21):
grew to kind of respect what Aaron had to go through,
but he made a point about where Aaron's played, and
the fit is really crucial when you consider Aaron's personality.
Speaker 6 (09:33):
They just think over time, especially being in a small
Midwestern town surrounded by the Midwestern quaintness of Green Bay.
I think Aaron Rodgers really started to believe I'm the
smartest guy in the room.
Speaker 7 (09:45):
I know everything.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
I am very intelligent. I know more than the coaches,
I know more than my teammates, I know more than
this fan base. And again, if you can contain that
in Green Bay, Wisconsin, it's one thing you're treated as
a guy, but once you go national, once you go
to a different franchise, it doesn't really play out that well.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
It certainly didn't in New York. Now, the culture in
Pittsburgh is better than New York, but like the Jets,
they can't get offense right. So whether the story is
true or not, it makes a lot of sense. I've
said this. I think he was waiting for brock Perty's
contract he get signed that eliminated the Niners. I think
that was his first choice. His second choice was Minnesota.
(10:23):
This is just a guest by me, but this story
comes out and this is what I felt is Aaron's
too smart to think, you know, Pittsburgh's gonna work for me.
I don't think they're a game better if he plays there.
I don't. I think Pittsburgh now is in the space
where they're just making moves to make moves. I don't
know DK Metcalf was overpaid. Pickens trade probably right once
(10:45):
you acquire Dk Metcalf, But I didn't love the offseason
for the Steelers. J.
Speaker 5 (10:52):
Mack.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
There's a lot of things going on today. Colin Wright,
Colin wrong in fifty minutes. There was a story over
the weekend about Caitlin Clark's value to the WNBA. It
is I don't know if people understand this, like what
is happening, how popular she is. It's insane, and I
(11:16):
think it is time. I like the fact that this
story was published, meaning WNBA coaches, players, executives can now
read her relevance, which is not only is it transcendent,
it's transformational to the league. How was your weekend?
Speaker 4 (11:32):
By the way, my weekend was excellent.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
I ran into your friend Lebron yesterday at a volleyball
tournament out here in LA But if I could quickly
go back to Aaron Rodgers for a second. Does he
totally want to be Brett Farv Jets then Vikings close
out the career.
Speaker 4 (11:46):
Is that what he's wanting to do?
Speaker 3 (11:47):
Like copy Brett Farv? It is just so embarrassing and pathetic.
But I don't want to bash Aaron Rodgers. He went
through some stuff last week. I'm sure you saw with
an ex girlfriend kind of throwing him under the bus
for not being a nice guy.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Which should surprise nobody. But just disappointing stuff.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Eric, Come on, yeah, we wish Aaron the very best
and the Steelers the very best. Coming up next the
information about how big Caitlin Clark is. It's sort of staggering.
Matt Hasselbeck stops by. I'm going to give you my
list of the four newcomers in the NFL this year
that will change outcomes. I think there's only four, only
(12:25):
four people in the NFL that moved and will changed outcomes.
It's the hurt.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in newon Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Welcome back on this Memorial Day, Matt Hasselbeck calling right
and wrong in forty minutes. So, a associate professor of
finance at Indiana University broke down the economic scale of
Caitlin Clark, who is just a phenomenon. So she generated
(13:11):
last year twenty six and a half percent as a
rookie on a terrible team, twenty six and a half
percent of the economic activity in the league. Listen to
some of these numbers. Her stardom not slowing down. The
Fever averaged more than the Pacers did per game throughout
(13:35):
the league. If she played in your town, attendance for
the league rose thirty percent. The valuation of the fever
ninety million dollars for the Fever before she arrived, now
three hundred and forty million. That's four times, four times
(13:55):
valuation increase. Lebron didn't do that when he went back
to Cleveland. He certainly didn't do it going to Miami
or the Lakers. MJ didn't do that with the Bulls.
We're talking one player. She is Steve Jobs. She's taking
an insolvent company and turning it into a powerhouse. So
listen to this. WNBA merchandise exploded five hundred percent increase.
(14:18):
That's one player. I mean literally half the merchandise in
the league she's selling. So you better get comfortable with
the fact that if she comes to your arena, ticket
prices will jump one hundred and forty percent. She will
be more popular than your entire roster. So and my
take is, ride the wave, enjoy the fruits, be grateful
(14:42):
you went commercial to private. Now we can go back
to Fly in Spirit airlines. But nothing kills team spirit
like Fly in Spirit. So you got to come to
grips with it. She is not only transcendent, she is transformational.
She has changed the league. And Hollywood has always understood this.
The actors and the directors have always understood this. The
bigger the stars, the better the catering, egg rolls for everybody,
(15:06):
chicken and beef options. So this is a whole different ballgame.
We're talking about these numbers. She is mission very possible.
What you are seeing now is I don't think I
don't even think the PGA with Tiger exploded like this.
I mean, these numbers are insane. And you know, I
was talking to a group of people last night that
(15:29):
aren't sports fans, and they, you know, they asked, like,
how long will it last, and what do you make
of it? My take is, well, think about how deep
the reservoir of men's basketball talent is in the world.
I mean, you know, you can go to Spain, Lithuania,
you can go anywhere. You can go anywhere in the
United States, you can go to Portugal. There's talent everywhere
(15:51):
in the world for men's basketball, and men's basketball has
been ahead of women's basketball. My entire life is that
we've never found a duplicate for Steph Curry. We never have.
Nobody plays like him, nobody looks like him, nobody shoots
like him in women's basketball. And his greatest Curry is
(16:11):
he wasn't the best player in the league. He was
the most transformational. People take shots now they wouldn't have considered,
but we've never found a duplicate in the men's game
for Steph Curry. The gap between Caitlin and anything resembling
her is Curry fourfold. So it's not going to end.
This is at the beginning of it. The professor states
(16:33):
that there's a chance she will have a billion dollar
economic impact for the WUNBA this year. Again, ride the wave.
People enter your life all the time and make it better.
Thank them. J Mack with the news.
Speaker 8 (16:54):
No, no, no, this is the Herdline news.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
All right, Cole, Let's get started with a big story
out here in La Show. Hey Otani, big appearance over
the weekend, throwing live batting practice for the first time
since his left shoulder surgery. Otani only threw twenty two pitches.
There were five plate appearances to three batters. After the session,
Otani said, I haven't thrown in a while, so it
was nice to be able to feel like a pitcher
(17:22):
obviously when.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
He has thrown. I mean, hey, guys, incredible.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Now I'm curious, do you think this is a situation
where the Dodgers are like, hey, we need Otani back.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
I mean, they are only up one in the West.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
Over the the Giants and Addres are closing in.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Listen, he's a great pitcher, so obviously he makes the
team better when he pitches. And they've had a ton
of pitching injuries. I think pitching injuries if you look
at Tommy John surgeries, they've skyrocketed the last five to
ten years. It's an industry issue. But the Dodgers, because
they're such a big brand and talked about like everybody
looks at the Dodgers and they can't stay healthy. There
is no question that Otani they want Otani available that
(18:00):
I think part of the negotiations were he's gonna pitch.
If you add o Tawny, he would arguably the be
the ace of the staff. And so, I mean they
have some good arms, but they've got guys who have
been injured before, like last known who they got from Tampa.
So it's I think you're gonna notice his value in August, September,
(18:20):
and October. That's when all this will matter the most totally.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
Let's let's get to the NBA where the Timberwolves on
Saturday night, but what a beatdown on the Thunder just
absolutely ran him out of the building one three to
one on one, I mean, Colin winning by forty two points.
I don't know how much of this you watched it.
The fourth quarter was unwatchable but interesting. Note here Sga,
the MVP of the league, was sitting on the bench
late in the game wearing a microphone. The broadcast caught
(18:46):
him talking about the loss.
Speaker 4 (18:48):
Take a listen.
Speaker 9 (18:50):
Earlier, they were more physical earlier, and they made shot
to do missun the others.
Speaker 4 (18:59):
And then on top of.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
This, they had a great night.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
We had a bad night.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
So it's like forty.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
But if we like take care of these, we can
still lose because of this night.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
But it doesn't look like this.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
Well, I you know what. I was talking to my
friend Jason tim flast night at the Volume, we talked
about this. Of all the teams remaining, I kind of
feel like I get the same team with the Knicks
Homer Way, same team with the Pacers home and away,
same team t Wolves home and away. OKAYC because of
their youth, I don't feel like it's the same offense
(19:33):
young players on the road historically in the playoffs and
rotational players, and they have the deepest bench, right so
and so when you look at OKAC and the numbers
validate this, they're not the same offense away from home.
They're the youngest team and the deepest team. But those
rotational guys, you know, we've talked about this. When you
(19:55):
get to the playoffs, your stars shine wherever. Your rotational
guys are always better at home. They're always more comfortable.
They're often younger players or more limited players. So okay, see,
I feel there is a gap between home made case okay,
see and road thunder.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And listen, naz Reid goes home and can actually make shots.
I mean I think he got every three pointer in Okay.
I will say the one interesting angle here is, you know,
I can understand you don't show up. You lose by
twenty Colin. This was almost like a we're laying down,
you know, we kind of give up. Remember this happened
against Memphis in Game three. They were up two oh
and Memphis goes up thirty, but then Ja Morant got
(20:33):
hurt and okaysee came back. So I think you're onto
something with this young team. Obviously, tonight is the series.
If oka See wins, it's over up three to one.
Speaker 4 (20:41):
But if minute, I vote to wins, and I think
they got a shot at home.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Right, Yeah, they're well thunder or seven and one at
home with a lot of blowouts. We watched them play Denver.
There are three and three on the road. We saw
Denver give them problems up in Denver. Now some of
that may be altitude. I'm tonight's close. What does this spread?
Three or four points? I think it should go either way. Game.
It's gonna be a must watched fourth quarter.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
I know the audience is gonna be upset after missing
on Game one in both series.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
I have not bet or looked at a line since that.
I'm like, I don't get that.
Speaker 3 (21:13):
I don't understand how the Knicks loses, how the timberrules
are getting blown out.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
So I haven't looked at the line yet.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
I'm not betting it, but I do think this is
another Anthony Edwards put the team on his back.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
He outscored OKC in the first quarter.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Yeah, in Game three and that was kind of like
a lights out moment Colin Finals story. This is adding
to the Aaron Rodgers from earlier. How about this one?
Speaker 8 (21:32):
There are reports.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Saying that Falcons.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Backup quarterback Kirk Cousins is on Pittsburgh's radar. The Falcons
got Cousins last year and of course then drafted Pennix,
and Cousins is kind of like the odd man out there.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
It's gonna be Penis's team.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
The fact that this story is emerging on the same
weekend as the Aaron Rodgers maybe not going to Pittsburgh thing.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I think there's some smoke here for sure.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
I just don't know if Cousins is gonna work outdoors
in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
I don't think that's a good match at all.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Listen, Tomlin appears to be safe. I think he's signed
an extension in the last year or too. Pittsburgh, if
they listen, when you have Lamar Jackson and Burrow in
your division, okay, those are two of the top five
quarterbacks in the league. You have to find a franchise quarterback.
You can't keep going out and hamming eg of it
with Kenny Pickett and Will Howard. How do you get
(22:24):
a franchise quarterback you win five to six games and
have a top eight pick. Pittsburgh in my lifetime, has
been great twice. Bradshawn is prime, Big Ben in his prime.
Outside of that, they don't win big games. They just
do not, even with Tomliner, Bill Kower, Chuck Nolan. So
(22:44):
to me, this is the step back year, and I
think if you can get into that six seven, you
know you're still viable. Your defensive win games, you're not
trying to lose, but you're limited. I would have no
problem Pittsburgh just saying listen, we're gonna go with these
young guys. Get It'd be one thing if you didn't
have Lamar Jackson ten times in the next five years minimum,
(23:05):
Burrow ten times the next five years minimum.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Well, I like your idea of Hey, maybe you Ham
and Naggett with Nathan Rudolph and Will Howard. Hey, why
don't you add instead of five six wins, go to
three four and trade DJ Watt. Go get a bunch
of picks, and you're set up for and it's early
what could be a great twenty twenty six draft.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
Well, I don't want to trade TJ. Watt without getting
a guarantee back. The problem with I would trade TJ.
Watt if I could get the number one pick and
it's arch Manning.
Speaker 4 (23:31):
There's no way, no, no, nobody's doing that.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
But I'm not.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
What if you a potential contender, somebody who wants to
make the playoffs badly, you know, let's go Jacksonville Jackson
will say nay, we'll give up our first or any
team you want. I would consider moving off, moving off
of what would you not?
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Listen?
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Listen? Take quarterback out. You can move off virtually everybody
except a great left tackle, Like I'm not going to
move off Miles Garrett. Take quarterbacks out. You don't want
to move off a great left tackle? That he's the
insurance policy for your star quarterback. But we've seen Belichick
fire and Andy Reid fired. You can move off legendary coaches.
(24:12):
We've seen Montana play for the Chiefs, Brady play for
the box. Like the idea that getting older with that
with a handful of injuries, TJ. Watt can't be on
the market, Like, get over it. He's a great player
who would have massive value on the market. Not saying
you'd do it. You take calls for that. He's a
(24:33):
great player. He's had multiple injuries.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Now he'd pay on Washington. They're gonna Washington could be
a super Bowl team. I don't know, you know, maybe
they'll give up their first next year. But I would
just bought them out.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
I like your idea.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I know that's a tough selle to the fan base
that's been proud fan base. They make the playoffs five
hundred every year. That's irrelevant. You want to be a contender.
You got a bottom mountain.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Jamack with the news, Well that's the news, and thanks
for stopping by Third Line News. So it is a
little bit instructive here that Carl Anthony townsh did his
great work last night in the fourth quarter, you know,
and Jalen Brunson was not on the floor for a
lot of it. So now I think the Pacers are
(25:15):
a better team. I think they get more consistently easier
looks on offense, and I think they're gonna win the series.
But the most interesting part in this series for the
Knicks is that it's not complicated to see what they
are and what they're not. It's right up. They're not pretty,
(25:37):
they don't shoot the three particularly well, and that Brunson
and Kat often flourish when the others off the floor
your turn, no, it's your turn. No, it's a your turn,
my turn offense too often. And they're both poor defenders,
so well coached offensive teams pick on them. So I
(26:00):
would move off a talented erratic Cat, although I think
he's talented, because I don't think Brunson and Cat on
the floor. People just go after him and bad defenders,
And I think it also we know what they're not,
we know what they need. They need KD, who is
a catch and shoot player, which is very valuable because
(26:23):
you're gonna get Cat's points, You're gonna get twenty three
to twenty five a game, better defender and he can
play complimentary basketball with Jalen Brunson. Cat really doesn't. It's
not all the Cat's a bad guy. But if you
have him on the floor and Brunson, Brunson's not big,
he's not long, he's not a great defender, liability. So
Brunson leaves and Cat's like, Okay, now it's my turn.
(26:45):
And not surprisingly, he's great because he's a gifted offensive player. Again,
he averages twenty three in his career. But Katie is
great without the ball in his hands. Katie is a
plug and play, catch and shoot player. He is better
defensively than Karl Anthony Towns. And I mean, you know,
I mean think about this. When Karl Anthony Towns was
in Minnesota before Ant arrived, he was at number one
(27:08):
scoring option. So Carl Anthony Towns has a market. He's
gonna average twenty two points a game for somebody. But
I do think the Knicks, what you're seeing in this series,
it's a pretty simple. You could be a basketball casual.
They can't shoot the three consistently, KD. They need a
star who doesn't need the ball in his hands a
lot KD. They need length. If they keep Mitchell Robinson
(27:32):
and move off Cat. They need length KD, they need
a willing defender KD. They need a high basketball IQ
because Brunson, Michale Bridges, this is a smart basketball team
and a pretty relentless coach KD. It all fits like
I and I listen. I go back when they were
(27:53):
beating Boston and I'm like, I don't know if they
need KD. But playoffs are layers steps. You know, against Detroit,
you're like, wow, why are the Knicks struggling with Detroit?
Because Detroit muddies it up and they had a hard
time getting consistent baskets. And then you play Boston in
your defense befuddles them and brunts and is great, and
(28:16):
so you forget about that. But then they play Indiana
and you're watching and you're going, yeah, they kind of
need they need another shooter. And all these teams now
with the multiple aprons, they're all going to be moving pieces.
It is harder to move big pieces. But Cat's going
to market. I don't think Kean Brunson in playoff basketball works.
And if you're asking me everything, they need catch and shoot,
(28:38):
plug and play high IQ, hit a three pointer. If
Kat leaves, they need length and a willing defender. Every
box is checked with KD. And let's be honest about Kat.
The dude has value. You can't tell me he doesn't.
He is a I mean you saw yesterday he is
a at times an unstoppable offensive player who attacks downhill.
(29:02):
And here's Kat after.
Speaker 9 (29:04):
So opportunity to utilize all those hours I'll put into
the gym, and the game wasn't looking great for me
as well, but for all of us then I just
wanted to do whatever it takes to help put us
in a position to win.
Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, it's not a criticism. The guy's got to market.
This is pro sports. Michael Jordan finished with the Wizards.
You know, it's never pretty in the end. But Kat's
not in his prime, but he has quarters like last night,
and they're fairly regular. And by the way, I was
thinking about this, if if Jason Tatum is out for
the Celtics next year and we don't even know what
(29:41):
Cleveland is right now, right like, we're not sure what
Cleveland is. We know Indiana is gonna be good, but
they're gonna have a Miles Turner dilemma. They're not gonna
be able to keep him because they're gonna keep past
Gal Siakam, you have to. You're gonna keep Halliburton. You've
got a bunch of other rotational guys you like. They're
gonna probably lose Miles Turner, so they're gonna lose some
of their length, and term matters for big teams. If
(30:03):
Yanna stays in Milwaukee, it matters. So there's gonna be
a lot of movement, a lot of little pieces moving
in New York. And I think this series has really
you can be a basketball casual, you know what they need,
and I think Katie checks all of those boxes. Colin Wright,
Colin Wrong twenty five minutes from now coming up. The
players who absolutely there's four maybe a coach, maybe a
(30:27):
player that I think change outcomes in the NFL. This
is all based on the story that came out today
regarding the most valuable New plea year player for every
team in the league.
Speaker 2 (30:43):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and neon Easter, not a em Pacific.
Speaker 1 (30:51):
Hour two on a Memorial Day Monday. It's the Herd.
Wherever you may be, however, and you're listening. Thanks for
making us part of your day. J mcmatt. Hasselbeck is
around the corner. You've got a story on Caitlin Clark
at the bottom of the hour. I hope you had
(31:12):
a great weekend. You ran into Lebron James, you said,
in a volleyball tournament, a.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
Used volleyball tournament. He attracted a big crowd. Hey, quick question.
Let me ask you, and I know you're not a
big social media.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
Guy on weekend, You've got a bubbly life out there
in the Midwest. When you put something out about Caitlin
Clark during one of her games, do you see like
a just a tsunami of a reaction. Everybody seems to
have thoughts on Caitlyn Clark. Is she's probably more polarizing
than any NBA player right now.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Yeah, I don't get the polarizing. She's good. Yeah, let's
enjoy her. I don't get, like I understand. I do
understand a little bit of the animosity with players. You know,
It's like when Bryce Harper came in baseball, nobody paid
attention to us. Now you like the flashy new player
and her game is flashy, so I get some animosity.
But I always felt this. I remember when Manny Ramirez
left the Red Sox and he came back, and people
(32:02):
were like, yeah, I don't know if I like him
and might take his You're the Red Sox. You could
never beat the Yankees. I don't care what you think
of Kurt Shilling or Manny Ramirez. You beat the Yankees.
You won rings with them. Like, if somebody makes my
life better, like, I don't care if it's your ex wife,
If you had fifteen great years, appreciate it. That's a
big chapter in your life. That was good. So Kaitlin
(32:25):
Clark's making everybody's life better. You can fly Spirit Airlines
or you can upgrade to private. That alone is a
thank you card in gift. I mean to me, I
don't get the polarization. All right, we do it every Monday.
Colin right, Colin wrong, and plenty.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
Of votes where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (32:42):
Well, my inclination was when the push push got pushed through,
it was because of Jason Kelsey, the soon to be
Hall of Famer center for the Philadelphia Eagles, who stood
in front of the owners in a suit, got in
a stance and made a declaration that it was safe.
And the stories out today is Jason Kelsey indeed was
(33:05):
the reason he changed about three to four votes that
it passed. Listen, the Health and Safety Committee of the
NFL wants to get rid of it, so it had
to be an influencer. It had to be somebody with
great conviction to sell it, an owner or a player
or a coach. And the reports are it was as
we speculated Jason Kelsey.
Speaker 8 (33:26):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
PFF came out last week ranked quarterbacks, all of them.
Dak Prescott was seventeenth, one spot ahead of two um
and that's exactly right. I know y'all love him. He's
a cowboy and he's rich. And his intangibles from maturity
to focus to leadership, I agree they're a plus. But
as a thrower of the football, as an athlete, it's
(33:50):
CC plus B minus. He is, especially after a second
major surgery in the middle of the pack. And I
appreciate PFF nailing.
Speaker 8 (34:00):
Where Colin was wrong.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
The Lakers need a deal, Austin reeves. I don't get
the fascination, but Dan Woike reporting the organization loves him
and the only have to pay him next year fourteen million,
and they see him as an absolute steal. I see
him as a guy that got worked athletically against Minnesota's
wing players. I see him as a guy that should
(34:24):
be the fourth best player on a championship level team.
I think he's a little less talented than Derek White,
who I feel the same way about. If he's your
fourth best player, you should be buying for championships. But
I'm wrong. Apparently, where Colin was right, Insiders now saying
Jeremy Fowler reports that Aaron Rodgers many believe has his
(34:45):
eye on Minnesota and that is why he hasn't signed
with Pittsburgh. It's not just necessarily the personal reasons. I
don't know it to be true, but I have speculated
he's too smart to think Pittsburgh's a good fit. Burrow
twice a year with better offensive teammates and a better
offensive coach Lamar Jackson in a better organization twice a year.
(35:10):
Pittsburgh is a bunch of l's even with Aaron Rodgers,
and I think he knows it.
Speaker 8 (35:14):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Zach Ede made the All Rookie team, the former produced star.
I didn't understand the pushback on him. Mark Few came
on our show and said he never faced an offensive
college player that unstoppable. Dan Hurley came on the hurt
and said, the NBA doesn't know what they're talking about.
He's going to work in this league and for Memphis.
He made the All Rookie team. He's a guy that
(35:38):
just kept grinding. He got better sophomore junior, junior's senior year,
and I think you're gonna see continued improvement. He clearly
has an excellent work ethic. Where Colin was wrong, the
Eagles signed an extension to Nick Siriani. You know, I
don't quite get the vibe. I think there's a lot
of circumstances like Howie Roseman and Jalen Hurts and say
(36:00):
Barkley in the old line that elevated him. But you
know what, the players like him. I don't have to
get everybody. I mean, Philadelphia is a loud, high volume,
high intensity town, and there's an argument he fits the
Eagles more than any other team. So I can take
it wrong on that.
Speaker 8 (36:16):
Where Colin was right.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Oh, Jordan Hudson reportedly wearing a new ring and not
wanted Belichick's Super Bowl rings. It could be an engagement ring.
Since I'm the only American media member that does appear
to approve of this relationship, once again proving I am
not only America's honesty broker, but I'm a hopeless romantic.
I see it working. I think they like each other.
(36:41):
Relationships can be complicated, but there is a report that
they have a future, that these two are a real thing.
Where Colin was right NBA Western Finals between Minnesota and OKC.
As a ratings dud I said, I think the Knicks
Pacers is going to get great eight numbers, and it has.
(37:01):
This is not a needle mover. Sga is not a
dynamic player. He's just a great score. It's a small
market and Minnesota is not a huge basketball brand, so
it doesn't surprise me that this is just not moving
the needle. Like I think tonight could be the best
game of the series. If Minnesota wins it, I think
that helps. If OKC wins, I think the ratings are
just going to be abysmal. We've had this before Duncan
(37:23):
in the Spurs when they were running the league. We're
not a captivating team. Duncan was great, but he was
a big fundamental. He wasn't dynamic, he wasn't a big personality.
Speaker 8 (37:32):
It happens where Colin was raw.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Kenny Pickett, now viewed as the front runner for the
Cleveland Browns quarterback kick. I don't get it. Just I'm
gonna die on this hill. Shador Sanders is going to
win this job. Picket's on his third team in four
years in his NFL career, fifteen touchdowns, fourteen picks. I
don't get it. You know, nice kid. I think he's
a backup. I think he loves football. But I said
(37:59):
it when he came out. He's more of a second mid,
third round picked. He didn't pop on TV. He did
have one great college play where he was gonna slide.
He faked it, stood ran, We all ran on a
thousand times. But I don't see it as a franchise quarterback.
Colin right, Colin wrong on a Monday. And with that,
Matt Hasselbeck, eighteen years in the NFL joins US live.
(38:20):
I don't ask you about the tush push. You can
tell from the committees the league wants to get rid
of it, and Jeffrey Lewie has you know, the Eagles
are a respected franchise. And Jason Kelcey obviously, you know
he's just one of those guys, the grinder he's loved
by the NFL community. Do you think that passes for
a year? If I said five years, Tush push, do
(38:40):
you think it's gonna last?
Speaker 7 (38:44):
No, I don't think it's gonna last. And I don't
think they want.
Speaker 10 (38:46):
To get rid of it. I just think they don't
know what to do with it. You know, they really don't.
And it's it's I think you said it earlier. It's
a health and safety issue. That's how you move the
needle on these things. There's probably just no data that
shows that this is a play people get injured.
Speaker 5 (39:01):
You know what.
Speaker 7 (39:01):
The NFL doesn't want.
Speaker 10 (39:02):
They don't want wasted plays like the extra point when
they moved it back, and they don't want plays that
the injury rate goes up, you lose star players.
Speaker 5 (39:10):
You know.
Speaker 10 (39:10):
I thought actually in the Super Bowl when Chris Jones
went down, I thought, oh, well, if he gets hurt
on this play, then this play has no has no future.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
But I just don't think the data is there.
Speaker 10 (39:20):
And you know, Jason Kelsey talking to the team, to
the you know, to the competition committee, that's not unusual.
Like I remember, you know, one time on the extra
point they brought in Adam Van Terry to talk about
that extra point situation. They brought in different long snappers
that had gotten hurt on extra point plays, and you know,
they brought in special teams.
Speaker 7 (39:40):
People to talk about the kickoff and the kickoff return.
So it's not unusual.
Speaker 10 (39:43):
I just think that some people present their case better
than others, and I would imagine Jason Kelsey was probably
pretty persuasive.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
So on the Aaron Rodgers thing, when you're I mean,
at some point players get older, like Kirk Cousins, and
you do have leverage because you have two hundred million
dollars in the bank and you don't want to play
you don't want to play it. Aaron certainly earned it,
He's made a fortune. There's talk about personal stuff. My
take has always been smart people are often too smart
(40:12):
to try to fool me that they're interested in something
that's not smart. Pittsburgh's a tone deaf offensive culture. Minnesota
is a really good offensive culture. If you are a
quarterback and you maybe have a year or two left
of all the teams New Orleans, Minnesota, Pittsburgh, what would
be your process on eliminating and including teams? What does
(40:35):
matter to an older quarterback?
Speaker 10 (40:37):
Well, who likes me back. That's a really important thing. Like, yeah,
I've been seeing the reports that Aaron Rodgers would prefer Minnesota,
who would not like everyone would great great play caller,
great head coach, great skill around you, amazing defense on
the other side of the ball. Yeah, I get it,
but they seem to be already settled on JJ McCarthy
as their quarterback. So I don't think listen to quarterback
(41:00):
free agency situation when you're at the end of your career.
It's very similar to musical chairs. There's only a certain
amount of chairs when the music stops. The music stops.
And so I've been saying this for a long time.
I believe I said it on your show. Aaron Rodgers
is gonna be with the Pittsburgh Steelers. All this other
talk about all these other teams, it's not happening. I
do not see it happening. There's no rush for a
(41:22):
veteran quarterback. I think I said it on your show.
There's no way he's signing before May twenty seven. Absolutely
no way you signed before phase phase three. There's no
reason to, especially if you're a guy has experienced as
a rod So I mean to me, I think that
June ninth time when they have that mandatory mini camp,
is like, all right, if it's not you, then we
(41:43):
got to move on as the Steelers. But to me, listen,
is it the best situation out there? No, but it
needs to be mutual acceptance. And the music's about to
stop soon here and he's gonna have to sit down
or get out.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
So I forget how you feel about Brock. Pretty I
like him, but I do feel much like a Dak
Prescott or Atua. He needs an offensive coach. He's got
to have some weaponry. His contract, now that it's all
been laid out, is not as punitive as initially thought.
(42:20):
But my take is older teams get hurt more often
and it takes longer to recover. So if you told
me Trent William spraindon me in week two, I'd be like,
this isn't going to be good. Whereas a you know,
a guy like An Allan, a Lamar, a Burrow Can
it is more able to overcome that stuff. When you
looked at the Brock pretty numbers, knowing this is a
(42:42):
pretty old team at running back, at linebacker, at left tackle,
at tight end, are you good with it? Well?
Speaker 10 (42:49):
A couple of things. As a quarterback who played on
the old CBA, I see all of these quarterback numbers
and I'm like, what you know, I feel like I
was born at the wrong time. Like that's the first thing.
But you like Brockberty. I love Brockberty. I put myself
in the category of Kyle Shanahan John Lynch.
Speaker 7 (43:05):
I think he's an absolute baller.
Speaker 10 (43:07):
I think he's one of the most underrated quarterbacks in
the entire game. I think he does things that quarterbacks
don't get credit for, things that don't show up on
your passer rating. I think he's a really good player.
I also think that this is kind of a team
friendly deal. He didn't handcuff them to the level that
I believe that he could have, So I think this
(43:27):
is a dangerous team. I think this is a team
last year that had a terrible season. I think they
could be a playoff team next year. I hear what
you're saying about age and losing some other good players,
but I think this is still a team that I
believe in and for a good part. Yeah, he's a
quarterback that needs a great coach and a great system.
Great what quarterback doesn't want that, So put me on.
(43:52):
Put me down as a team that believes in this quarterback.
I like the signing and I think this is a
good team to watch this year.
Speaker 1 (43:59):
Okay, I want to ask you about I said, it's
a head coach quarterback league. Very few players, even at TJ.
Watt are not worth a point. That's just the way
the league is. You get the right coach and you
get the right quarterback, you're gonna win sixty five to
seventy five percent of your games. You're gonna win your division.
That's why the AFC is so much easier to predict
than the NFC because you have more great quarterbacks. So
I said, there are four people of all the additions
(44:20):
in the NFL that I think change outcomes. And my
take was they were so bad at quarterback at Tennessee.
I think cam Ward will change outcomes. I think Vrabel
takes over for a coach that was probably a coordinator
elevated to a spot that was a little much that early.
I think Geno Smith is one of those guys nobody
wants to admit. You give him time to throw in
(44:42):
a run game, He's pretty good. And I do think
Ben Johnson this would be my most controversial based on
Taylor Williams and your belief in him. Would you push
back on any of these specifically?
Speaker 10 (44:55):
I mean, I kind of agree with cam Ward. He
gives you something. I just don't know if anybody's gonna care.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Kind of amazing to me.
Speaker 10 (45:01):
The lack of attention some teams get Tennessee, Jacksonville, some
of those teams, I feel like they deserve more.
Speaker 7 (45:07):
Mike Vrabel I liked that a lot.
Speaker 10 (45:09):
I don't think I would pin it just on Gino, though,
I think for me, I think what's special about That's it?
Speaker 7 (45:15):
And I like Gino. I really like Geno a lot.
Speaker 10 (45:17):
I really think that Pete Carroll, Chip Kelly, you know
this weird Tom Brady involvement. I think that's probably the
top edition for me. And you know, we got Ashton gent,
we got most dirt. Like, I think that really is
going to be a team effort there. I don't know
that I would put Geno as the face of it,
even though I think I agree with you. Ben Johnson's
(45:39):
interesting to me. I think he's going to be hired
much like much like Sean McVay was.
Speaker 7 (45:45):
He was hired.
Speaker 10 (45:46):
Sean McVay was hired to see if he could fix
golf and Gurley, you know the La Rams. I think
they were Saint Louis to La you know, Todd Gurley,
Jared Goff. Who's the right coach for those two guys.
Ben Johnson's coming in to see if he can turn
Caleb Willi into a quarterback who maximizes his potential, who
realizes his potential. Last year, he just looked like a
(46:07):
guy that was kind of massaging the ball in the
pocket and then tried to, like, you know, be an
athlete and outrun people. It would look like a college
quarterback trying to play in the NFL. I think Ben
Johnson's going to be the guy that either can or
can't get Caleb to realize that potential. And Ben Johnson's
not going anywhere, So this is I think a one
year opportunity for Caleb to kind of prove that he
(46:28):
is or isn't who he kind of thought he was
before he was drafted.
Speaker 1 (46:32):
Finally, you see the position of quarterback differently than us
because you played it your experience, you can coach it.
If you look at Burrow, Andrew Luck, Lamar Jackson, Mahomes,
almost all the great quarterbacks. They're not slow builds. In
September of the first year, Burrow was throwing for three
hundred and twenty five yards with an atrocious line and
a coach we didn't know. So generally, if you have it,
(46:56):
we see it pretty quickly, especially for first round quarterbacks.
Jayden Daniels was like twenty eight of thirty one and
back to back weeks or thereabouts. How long? Because I
think the weapons on the old line are pretty good. Now,
how long will you give Caleb before you say warning,
(47:17):
I'm not It can't just be wins, because you can
win games in this league and not play well. What
will you look for with Caleb based on what you've
seen and how long will you give him to become
a hit?
Speaker 7 (47:29):
I would have patience with him.
Speaker 10 (47:30):
I think he's got enough talent and enough upside to
have patience with him.
Speaker 7 (47:35):
I don't think it's a quick I don't think you
know right away.
Speaker 10 (47:37):
I mean Troy Aikman started out really poorly his rookie year,
Like they didn't do well. Peyton Manning, you know, I
think he might have led the league in interceptions. Eli
Manning get bench for Kurt Warner, Like there's all these
stories of young quarterbacks. He doesn't start out well. Quarterback
is such a team game. You need the people around
you to play well. When you go to the team
(47:59):
that has the first pick in the draft, they're usually
not a great team.
Speaker 7 (48:02):
Now, in Caleb situation.
Speaker 10 (48:03):
I believe they've built it really well around him, especially
this year, and they blamed everybody else in the building
besides him, and so now I just think the spotlight's
going to be on him. I would have patience, But
at the same time, I don't know if Chicago Willy,
I think they open up against Brian Flores's defense. That's
a beast of a defense with all their all out pressure,
(48:25):
their simulated pressure. I wouldn't wish that for any young quarterback.
But at the end of the year, I think a
decision will be made on him one way or the other.
And it's just fair to say if you watch the film,
he's off to a very very slow start.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
Matt Hasselback on a Monday, Happy Memorial Day to you
and your family.
Speaker 10 (48:45):
Appreciate it, Bud, you too see a com.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
All right, Matt Hasselback always good on the show today,
Jay Mac you were smirking, so you were looking at
something with great intensity. As I was talking there, what's
going on?
Speaker 3 (48:57):
Well, you know, like there's this huge discussion Aaron Rodgers
happening with the Steelers, and it's weird. The Steelers fan
base seems a little torn, like do we want him
or do we not? And I just wonder, you know,
you never know when your stuff's gonna cut through. I
got to give you a shout out for your USC
Notre Dame. That seemed kooky.
Speaker 4 (49:14):
When you floated it was it last year and now
it's coming true.
Speaker 3 (49:17):
But your idea of hey, you know what, let's not
add Rogers, Let's go Mason Rudolph and Will Howard and
see how that works. I wonder if Steelers fans here
in the coming week, it's just gonna say I don't
want the Rogers drama, the nonsense.
Speaker 4 (49:31):
There's just always something.
Speaker 1 (49:33):
The baseball team's terrible, the hockey team's not making the playoffs.
They don't have NBA University of Pittsburgh's math. So the
Steelers are like it, there's football season and waiting for
football season in Pittsburg. And so I think it's hard
when and you go into these psych I can remember
there being years that Willie Stargell and the Pirates were
winning the World Series and the Steelers were great. I
(49:56):
mean it goes in cycles. Right now, Pittsburgh, they've been
great when they've had a great quarterback and they're right now.
Remember what we said last year the Cowboys had the
worst running back room in the league. We were right.
We said it's Dak needs help. The Steelers have the
worst quarterback room. I wouldn't be surprised if you know
(50:20):
the Kirk Cousins thing. I guess, but that just feels
like you're just plugging a hole here. It's a little
whack a mole Offensively, I think your play is go
with the young guys, keep the culture strong. You're not
gonna win a bunch of games, and then go big
game hunting next year and you may have to part
with a TJ. Watt to go from like the eighth
(50:41):
spot to the second spot and get the kid out
of Penn State.
Speaker 7 (50:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:44):
By the way, remember how Belichick was not really wanted
by any teams.
Speaker 4 (50:48):
They were like, hey, he's too old to rigid ones.
Speaker 3 (50:50):
I wonder if we're really close to that point with
Aaron Rodgers and we're just like, it's the Steelers are
nothing like sorry, the Vikings don't want you, the Niners don't.
Speaker 4 (50:58):
Want like, are we there yet? It's just like no
thanks on Aaron Rodgers. That ship is saled.
Speaker 1 (51:06):
We will never know until Aaron speaks it into truth
because Aaron, you know, he wants to be mysterious. So
my take is if he wanted to sign, he would.
Hasselbeck says, it's May twenty seventh, so I don't. I don't.
My takes always been if he goes to Pittsburgh, I
think they win one more game than they are now.
I mean, I think that's what he's become. An older
(51:27):
pocket quarterback who looked cold in outdoor, windy cold games.
He looked old and cold is what he looked like,
all right, Live in Chicago. It's the herd.
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