December 4, 2025 • 37 mins
Colin Cowherd breaks down why the Detroit Lions have taken a step back after last year’s 15-win season and explains why their matchup against the Dallas Cowboys on Thursday Night Football could spell trouble for Jared Goff and Dan Campbell’s squad. Colin also defends the Denver Broncos’ string of narrow victories, arguing that their late-game formula is sustainable under head coach Sean Payton
Later, Colin is joined by Greg Cosell of NFL Films for a deep dive into the Pittsburgh Steelers offensive struggles and why the Kansas City Chiefs offense hasn’t looked like the Patrick Mahomes–led machine we’re used to
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go, Cowboys playing a night against the Detroit Lions.
Greg Cosell one hour from now to break it all down.
What's wrong with Detroit? One is right with Dallas. Maybe
in La next week in Chicago. Today, It's the Herd
wherever you may be, however you may be listening. Thanks
(00:49):
for making us part of your day. I and Jmac
both like Dallas tonight. I think Dallas wins by a
touchdown or more tonight. I think a lot of the
NFL is trends and which way you're headed. I think
Dallas is headed in the right direction, playing with a
ton of confidence now healthier than they've been all season.
So you and I agree on that, and let's just
start with them. So the Cowboys over under win total
(01:12):
to start the year was seven and a half. I said,
bet the under. Detroit's was ten and a half. Ten
and a half, I said, bet the under. And here
we are week fourteen. They're pretty much the same. But
I think I'd rather be Dallas. I do. I like
where they're trending, and everybody's telling me it's injuries, or
(01:34):
it's the Frank Ragnow retirement, or it's Jared Goff. You
want to know why Detroit's not as good? They lost
Ben Johnson, the offensive coordinator. Now he's the coach of
the Bears, and the Bears are looking down at the Lions.
That's it. It's almost impossible. It's not hard. It's really
impossible to replace brilliance. I remember Nike two thousand and four.
(02:00):
Phil Knight steps down his CEO, Nike one of one,
a powerhouse, immediately starts losing market share to Adidas. Here
comes Phil, he comes back. We all know the story
of Steve Jobs left Apple. Apple was a powerhouse. They
begged to have him back ten years later. It's hard
to replace excellent people. I think Ben Johnson's different. I mean,
(02:23):
what a shock. Suddenly the Bears are as good as
any team in the league, running the football. They weren't
last year, and suddenly now the Lions are horrible on
third down? How with that offensive line? How would Jamir
Gibbs with a veteran quarterback. How they're good at tight end,
wide receiver? How because they lost Ben Johnson. That's it.
(02:45):
I remember when Washington you remember this, had Sean McVay,
Kyle Shanahan, and Matt Lafleur in the building with Washington,
they were making the playoffs. Those guys left. I mean,
it wasn't until last year, for one year, that the
regression stopped. Now they're bad again. You just can't replace
(03:05):
McVeigh and Shanahan on his staff, arguably the two best
coaches in the league after Andy Reid and I'll die
on this hill. The greater the talent you lose, the
wider the search has to be. You lose Jim Harbaugh Michigan.
You can't go in house. You lose Ben Johnson, you
(03:27):
can't go in house. The bigger the shoes I have
to fill, the more feet I need to see. And
when I watch the Lions, it's not Frank rag Noow,
it's not omar On Saint Brown is banged up. It's
not Jared Goff doesn't have mobility. He didn't have it
the previous three years. They're just not quite as clever
(03:48):
and not quite as unique, even among really good people.
Jerry Jones said, Dak is irreplaceable. Mike is great, but replaceable,
and Mikes were too good. He leaves. Dallas is now
second in the NFL in pressures. It's like, we're actually
better without Micah because we got some draft picks and
(04:09):
made some deals. But I mean, Miami still looking to
find the next Marino. How many quarterbacks they had forty?
I mean literally, Denver to replace Elway had to go
get an old Peyton Manning. So it's just it's the
Lions lost an all time offensive coordinator, an all time guy,
(04:30):
and I love Dallas tonight nothing quite feels the same
when I watch them. The players are great. It's not injuries.
They've been injury plague previous years. It's not the GM
he's great. They just lost an all timer who's now
with the Bears. So I saw a story this morning
and it said the Broncos are the second NFL team
in history to win four straight games by three points
(04:52):
or less. People are basically saying what Denver is doing
is not sustainable. You can't keep winning in the fourth
quarter like Denver's doing, and I would say, no, that's
absolutely sustainable. What's not sustainable is when the Patriots went
ten years without winning a Super Bowl, and those Randy
(05:13):
Moss years when you're scoring fifty and winning by three touchdowns,
they didn't win a super Bowl that year. Every other
Super Bowl Belichick and Brady were in in New England,
all but one were one possession games. Further record, Tom
Brady is the greatest quarterback ever in one possession games
sixty eight percent of games, sixty eight percent in one
(05:36):
score game, by the way, highest winning percentage when trailing
in the fourth quarter of the last two seasons, Andy
Reid and Sean Payton. So don't tell me it's Mahomes
because none of you like Bo Nicks. It's the coach.
Football has always been a game of inches. I go
back to the New England dynasty. Winning close is totally sustainable.
(05:59):
The New England dyning. The two things that always jump
out beyond Belichick and Brady art they never fumbled. Honest
to god, I was in New England at the time.
They never fumbled, and they were always way above average
on special teams. They didn't lead the league in sacks
very often. They didn't lead the league in touchdowns very often.
When I look at Denver, it's absolutely coaching and details.
(06:21):
For instance, fewest sacks allowed, that's coaching. How do I
know that's coaching because Caleb Williams last year was the
most ack quarterback. This year, he's one of the least acts.
They changed coaches, right, So like it is coaching and demanding,
not pandering. Bo Nicks not a big, strong guy breaking
(06:44):
tackles from defensive ends. He didn't get sacked. His dad
was a coach. He takes to coaching. Sean Payton. They're
also great on third down defense. Why that's situational coaching.
Red zone defense, situational coaching. And so when I look
at New England's dynasty, it was all about details. I
(07:07):
don't know how many times they led the NFL in
total offense. I would wager it wasn't as many as
you think. I don't know how many times that led
the league in touchdowns. By the Randy Marsh years, they
didn't win Super Bowls. So I've always thought, like Andy Reid,
Sean Payton. In fact, I looked this morning at the
top five last two years, the top five winning percentages,
(07:28):
winning its coaches in one score games. It's all offensive coaches.
No Mike Tomlin up there, it's all offensive coaches. So
to me, this idea that what Denver's doing is not sustainable.
I love NBA teams and baseball teams and pro football
(07:48):
teams that win close. I think it builds character, it
builds unity. Winn by blowouts, that's not sustainable. If you're
doing that in the NFL, probably doing it because you
have a really good rookie quarterback on a rookie deal,
and then when you have to eventually pay him and
have to get rid of stars, You're not winning by that.
(08:09):
That's not sustainable. You don't see NFL teams going four
years blowing people out. You'll rarely get a year like that.
But winning close, Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Tom Brady totally
sustainable to me. Being good on third down, offensively, not
getting sacked a lot, that's coaching. That's sustainable. Here's Sean
Payton on the way Denver's winning.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
I hate losing more than anything like in the world,
and so I think fear of failure is a very
significant motivating factor from a detail standpoint. And you know
there's nothing that's too small, that's not significant, that has
(08:55):
to exist outside the lines as well.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, I mean, I think highly organized people don't need
wide margins, right, highly organized people don't need wide margins margins.
I can read about a pro athlete that can't retire
in one hundred million dollars, and I'm like, well, I
know school teachers that are retired on one and live
very comfortable, great lives. If you need one hundred million
(09:21):
dollars to retire comfortably, you're not great in the details.
You're not very efficient. There's a quality of life at
one or two million dollars in retirement. Jmak. We both
like the Dallas Cowboys to night, Greg Cosell in one hour,
I was.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
Just looking at your Broncos, Colin. So, not only do
they struggle on the road this season, winning a bunch
of close games, but they faced four backup quarterbacks this
season and guess who they got this week the Raiders,
and they are huge favors in a dangerous game.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
But you know the last two years, who's led the
NFL in point differential. Lions Ravens. How they do in
the playoffs, They're they're not ready for it. Denver and
Chicago are like, yeah, we've been in close games. Denver's
trailed every game this year at one point, so the Lion,
the Ravens the last two years before this year, but
(10:13):
last year and the year before we saw this all
the time. NFC teams that played Baltimore just got destroyed.
It does you no value in the playoffs winning close.
To me, it builds a confidence in close games. I mean,
if you go back to Michael Jordan's great highlights, the
first one you think about that Cleveland series, it's a
game winning shot because they trailed, or the Utah shot,
(10:36):
game winning shot because they trailed. Michael Jordan's highlights with
the against the Knicks. You know, even Michael Jordan and
the greatest team ever and the greatest player ever. Do
you know how many like grueling six game series they
were in, how many times they actually lost at home?
You gotta win close, and I think it builds stuff
beyond just a w.
Speaker 4 (10:56):
The only thing is they're they're beating bad teams in
close games. Those Michael Jordan there that was were epic
playoff games this is like Davis Mills. Okay, this is
the Raiders ten to seven at home. I will just
costion you after this Raiders game this week, Packers, Jags, Chiefs, Chargers,
that will be the truth serum. For the Broncos, they'll
probably go one in three or two and two down
(11:17):
the street.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
What are you laughing at? Come on, here's her all
playoff teams. I have been hearing this now for weeks
about the Chicago Bears. Oh, this game's true serum. Yeah,
they just went to Philly. That was a great win
and knocked the barn door over. You know, like guys,
they keep winning, like Denver, Well this one, this next one.
I saw them play Kansas City and I was told, oh,
(11:39):
this game against the Chiefs will be true serum. They
won that one.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
Now by me, I was on the Broncos that one.
But by the way, do you have Broncos Super Bowl futures?
Are you gonna put towns a couple of some don't?
Speaker 1 (11:49):
I don't divulge all my super Bowl future, but put
your money where your mouth this big guy. I picked
Denver to win the division. I think their roster is great.
Speaker 5 (11:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
I like bo Nicks and Sean Payton History is Bumpy.
September better every month.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
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Speaker 1 (12:27):
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Speaker 1 (12:45):
You're now entering the old bull z Owne sponsored by
Credible Great Rates, Turn of the Bowl. So when I
got a job in Vegas out of college, I love boxing,
and boxing was already exploding. Thomas Hitman, her and Sugar Ray, Leonard,
Marvin Hack and I would go to these boxing events
and was amazing these fights and there'd be three judges,
(13:05):
each sitting in a different part of the ring. And
that's because you can all see a different fight based
on the angle. And so I'm reading a story this
morning that Old Miss players, an ol Miss athletic director
dispute Lane Kiffin's version of what was said as he
left folks different angles. Where are you sitting? I mean
(13:27):
movie critics Gene Siskel, one of the great movie critics
of all time, didn't like Silence of the Lambs. Sorry,
you know they rarely agreed on movies. I mean he
and Ebert. So the bottom line is there's three sides
to every story. Your side, my side, and the truth.
As they say, so Old Miss ad Old missus players.
(13:51):
They're bitter, they're angry, they got dumped. They're emotional, they're scorned.
They're gonna hear things one way Lane Kiff and leaving
Old Miss to LSU is hyped, optimistic, energized, can't wait.
Maybe maybe a little guilt, but he's hungry and aggressive
and things. He needed his job the right way at
(14:13):
Old Miss. And there's a reason we need divorce attorneys, somebody,
somebody to come in without emotion and make a decision.
Old Miss got dumped and they're angry, and you could
argue to have a right to be angry, But I
don't suddenly believe everything. Old Miss players and the athletic director,
(14:35):
and the boosters and the donors are saying all of us,
when dumped, are overly emotional, or at least emotional. So
I've argued from the beginning, you knew what you were
getting when you hired him, and Old Miss. Maybe not
for all programs, but for Old Miss, it was better
to have had Lane Kiffin and lost him than to
have not had Lane Kiffen at all. And Old Miss
(14:58):
the college football playoffs starts weeks. Everybody's betting against you.
Why because you go to the airport, flip people off
and scream ugly things, and you're not concentrating on your
players and your game plan and your team. I understand
being angry, but I'm less inclined to listen to people
(15:21):
who are highly emotional. I'm really if you're highly emotional
as a coach, a little league dad, a soccer or
pageant mom, I'm not really interested in your opinion. Okay,
So this idea that Lane Lane is just you know,
he's just embellishing it. He's hungry, he's excited. It's signing day,
(15:45):
it's a new job. I've had four new jobs in
my life. You can't see straight. You're so happy got
a new challenge. You're putting together a staff at signing day,
you can't wait. I couldn't even get my hair right.
The bottom line is the faster Ole Miss gets over it,
the better chance they have to win in the college
football playoff. Now, Joel Klatt and I right, But just
(16:07):
here's Joel Clap's opinion on Lane leaving the way Lane left.
Speaker 7 (16:14):
I don't begrudge this man his movement, and he's going
to go, and he thought LSU was going to be
a better opportunity for he and his family, you know,
more power to him, But that doesn't mean that there
are not consequences to those decisions. And he did leave
a team high and dry, and he left those players
high and dry. That's going to hurt his credibility moving forward.
And he also went to a place that, let's face
it is not as sound foundationally. They might have more resources,
(16:39):
but it's certainly a lot more crazy at LSU. It's like, listen,
you know you can go with a six to prom
and that six is going to be committed to you.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
You take the nine. She might be crazy. I think
LSU and Lane Kiffin both are a little crazy. It's
not a thirty year marriage. It's going to be like
a or for your relationship. And I can't wait to
watch Hollywood divorces are far more interesting than stable thirty
(17:07):
year marriages. Not saying they're better for society, they're better
for the kids. Yeah, Lane's a little crazy. LSU's a
little crazy. Okay. There is a reason eyewitness testimony is
the least reliable evidence. People are highly emotional. Take a
deep breath, ale miss, concentrate on you keep the thing
(17:30):
the thing. Bitterness doesn't win playoff games.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
One more heard. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day,
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Speaker 1 (17:43):
With that, Greg Cosel forty six years NFL Films always
joined us on Thursday. What's been more impressive to you
about the Cowboys? The offense, Greg, or the defense?
Speaker 8 (17:55):
I would think the defense, Colin, because look, as you
know what, the first five six weeks people are laughing
at their defense, and now you know they made those trades.
Obviously they got Kenny Clark before the season, but the
ind season trades they have made been really impressive. And
the trio of d tackles is as good a trio
as any in the league. And as you probably noticed,
(18:17):
three weeks ago, the rookie corner Revel from East Carolina
started to play, and then this past week on Thanksgiving,
he played pretty much every snap. And now what they've done,
and I think you'll continue to see this tonight, is
now they've played Revel and Bridges, who's got a lot
of length on the outside, and they've moved Bland to
(18:37):
the slot where he's better. Bland is not a very
good outside corner, so now they moved him into the
slot where he first really made his heay in the league.
And they're much better on the back end. But with
what they've done up front, the returner of overshown, the
trading for Logan Wilson, suddenly this defense, well it's not
top five in the league, but it's a good enough
(18:58):
defense to win game games.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right. So a game that's a little under the radar,
although Josh Allen games are never truly under the radar.
Bills play the Bengals and here's Joe Burraw. Yeah, and
my take is Cincinnati and Burrow are going to be
the number one spoiler in the end, and it may
not make the playoffs. But what did you see with
Burrow's first start, because the numbers tell me he was
(19:22):
pretty good.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Yeah, Burrow's always been a guy.
Speaker 8 (19:26):
First of all, he's so good pre snap and then
getting into the post snap operation phase. He's just one
of those guys. He's like a computer chip. He just
sees it. It's innate, it's in his DNA. And he's
always been a guy. Now, granted, he's got good receivers,
we understand that, but he's always been a guy that
understands the NFL that if it's one on one, you've
(19:46):
got to throw the football, and that if that doesn't work,
that means you don't need another quarterback.
Speaker 5 (19:51):
It means you need new receivers.
Speaker 8 (19:53):
But he's got receivers, so he's going to push it
down the field. They'll be one on ones against these
Bills corners and we'll see how.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
That plays out. On the other side.
Speaker 8 (20:02):
The Bills, to me, are one of the most fascinating
studies on offense in this league. They've got the most
physically gifted quarterback in the league.
Speaker 5 (20:10):
I don't know the reason why they choose not to
throw the ball.
Speaker 8 (20:13):
Maybe they don't like their receivers, but with the most
physically gifted quarterback in the league, they are not a
passing team.
Speaker 5 (20:20):
They don't throw the ball down the field.
Speaker 8 (20:21):
In fact, they don't want to throw it a whole
lot in terms of volume unless they're forced to. But
that's not the way they choose to play. And I
give Aaron Kromer, they're all line coach who's been doing this.
You probably know Aaron, he's been doing this for twenty
twenty five years. Absolutely one of the best in the league.
Their run game is so good, it's so multiple, it's
(20:42):
specific to the opponent. I mean last week against the Steelers,
Cook and Davis had.
Speaker 5 (20:48):
Forty one runs combined.
Speaker 8 (20:50):
Colin they did not pull an offensive lineman one time,
so it was all zone.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
It was all zone based.
Speaker 8 (20:57):
Yet we've seen them have that run game where they
have the counter run game with Hawes and Gilliam the
fullback and been successful through the year doing that. So
they are very specific to the opponent in how they
feel is the best way to attack.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
But this is a running football team and.
Speaker 8 (21:12):
They only really rely on Josh Allen when they think
they need to.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Okay, another game. It's basically the season for the Kansas
City Chiefs the Houston Texans. Let's start with Houston. So
I prefer offensive coaches. But if you're gonna go defense,
go young, Mike McDonald to me, Goo Ryans. I remember
before Demiko got the job, people in the Niners organization
were saying, We're never going to keep this guy. He's
(21:37):
just too stright, he's too bright. Well, so I watch
Houston's defense. It's the best in the league. Is it schemes?
Is it coaching? Because they make every quarterback struggle. It's
like they're playing with an extra man. What is it
about their defense? Is it just better personnel or coaching?
Speaker 8 (21:52):
It's both because obviously, if you look at the personnel,
they're really good at all three levels. And based on
my film study, I would argue that Cale and Bullock
is the best post safety in the league this season,
in his second year in the league.
Speaker 5 (22:04):
Out of USC.
Speaker 8 (22:05):
You're probably very familiar with them, being you know, from USC,
really good football player, really good, long, smart, good, good athlete.
But obviously we know about Hunter and Anderson. They're really
good inside too. No one talks about what they put
out there on the inside at the detackle position. But
the one thing about Tamiko Ryans is he's very technical,
(22:27):
so in specific situations he will bring pressure and they're
very good with their concepts. Now, based on the rest
of the league, they're not a high percentage pressure defense,
but they're very schematic and tactical with when when they
bring pressure, and they're very very good at it, and
they stunt, and they've got guys who can stunt, really
good athletes. So this is a really difficult defense to
(22:50):
play against. You and I are talking on a Thursday.
I have no idea what the status is. We know
Simmons the left tackle went on IR. I don't know
if Tray Smith the guard's gonna pla. We don't know
if Jowan Taylor's going to play. So imagine if you
have all these backups on your offensive line and now
you've got that defensive line that you've got to play against.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
By the way, what is the identity of the Chiefs
offense today? What is it?
Speaker 8 (23:14):
I would say it's Patrick Mahomes being special. And I'm
not trying to be sarcastic. I think the more you
watch and I watch, I think I've watched every Mahomes
game in the league since he's been in the league.
It almost seems to me watching his tape Colin that
more and more he's become an improvisational stud as opposed
to a pocket technician. Now that's not to say he's
(23:37):
not capable of playing from the pocket, of course he is.
He's extremely gifted. But it seems the more I watch,
the more it's become a case of him getting outside
of play design, making incredible plays. That's what he did
last week when he almost brought them back to victory,
you know, against the Cowboys.
Speaker 5 (23:53):
It seems there's more and more of that now.
Speaker 8 (23:56):
He's so good at it that they can kind of survive,
although they're six and six this year. I think this
is a game where he's going to move around a lot.
But I don't think they have a true identity in
the way I think you're using the word Ravens Steelers.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
I mean, it kind of feels again kind of this
is it for Pittsburgh. Is the Steelers offense broken?
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I'm not sure Steelers an offense or two words that
go together very much. These days.
Speaker 8 (24:26):
They're a tough offense to watch. I mean, you talk
about you know identity. I don't know what they are
other than the fact that they line up a lot
with the big people.
Speaker 5 (24:36):
They play with two.
Speaker 8 (24:36):
Tight ends, they play with three tight ends. I think
they'd like to run the football, but that's been very
up and down. You don't know from week to week
if they're going to have any kind of sustaining run game.
Speaker 5 (24:47):
I'm not sure what the past game is.
Speaker 8 (24:49):
They really don't work the middle of the field much
at all, which is not a function of the quarterback.
Aaron Rodgers can obviously still throw the football. Sometimes, I
feel watching their tape that their number one receiver is
becoming Darnell Washington at three hundred and eleven pounds. So
it's I'm not sure what they are on offense, and
I don't know if right now I feel like watching
(25:11):
their tape that you can hang your hat on anything
and say, hey, this is what they bring to the
table every single week.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
I want to talk about a team that we've kind
of forgotten about once they lost their tackles. But we've
talked about the Chiefs so much, we've talked about Denver
that quietly this defense with the Chargers. They're eight and four,
they're at home. I'm absolutely a live shot to beat Philadelphia.
I don't even know how they run the ball with
(25:37):
this offensive line. I have no idea. It's not good, right,
But it's mostly been a defensive story with Jesse Minter Again,
I'll ask you the question I did with Houston. Is
it coaching or scheme with a Chargers defense it's number
two or three in the league right now.
Speaker 5 (25:53):
Yeah, it's both.
Speaker 8 (25:53):
But I think one of the things that stands out
when you watch their defense, and they have a lot
of players people may not be aware.
Speaker 5 (26:00):
They don't know their names.
Speaker 8 (26:01):
They're not household names, but they've got a lot of
pieces that can line up in different positions and they're
very multi positional, multi dimensional. Look, we know about Derwin James,
he's the name everybody knows. Not a lot of people
probably know about tar Heeeb still a corner who plays
outside in their base, moves inside in their sub defenses,
(26:21):
and by the way, is very in the dime really
because they play nickel all the time. It's that big
nickel with Drwin James, so in their dying he plays
inside and he's a major part of.
Speaker 5 (26:31):
Their pressure packages.
Speaker 8 (26:32):
Tuoy Polot he's a guy that plays both outside and inside.
A really good player. I'm sure not a lot of
people are aware of him. Diane Henley really good linebacker.
Another guy that lines up in multiple positions within their
different defensive structures, so they have a lot of movable
chess pieces within their defense. And Jesse Minter obviously is
(26:54):
coaching really well, because when you ask guys to have
a lot of different responsibilities based on different personnel, that
means you're teaching really really well.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Yeah. Well, I want to talk about Jackson Dart for
a second, so I watch him sirst opposed with Drake May.
Drake May does everything well. Drake May was a little
reckless his first year, spend a lot of time in
the blue tent. He doesn't anymore. He cleaned it up. No.
I watch Jackson Dart, and the Giants are so desperate
at quarterback. They've been so bad for so many years.
They're just clinging to anything that work. They cling to
(27:24):
Tommy DeVito a couple of years ago. I watched Jackson.
I watch Jackson Dart, and I think he's a bit
of a splash player. He's memorable, he's confident. I is
he a guy that can throw forty two times a game.
What is the film say, not the media, not the fan.
What is the film say on Jackson Dart?
Speaker 8 (27:43):
Well, the first thing I want to say is we're
not going to define his whole career about what we've
seen this year.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
So I want people to understand that.
Speaker 8 (27:49):
So right now, Jackson Dart is a quarterback that is
not seeing things as clearly as you need to. And
when you're a quarterback that has mobility, Colin, and you
don't see things as clearly as you need to on
a consistent fasis, what do you do?
Speaker 5 (28:04):
You run?
Speaker 8 (28:05):
And that's what he does, and he's very good at it,
but he can't take the kind of hits we're looking
at now. He's spent almost every one of his games,
maybe with just one or two exceptions in the blue
ten and obviously he missed a couple of weeks dude
to being in the concussion protocol. So ideally, as he
plays more, he starts to see things with more clarity,
(28:25):
gets a better picture pre snap that translates to post snap.
He becomes more of a post snap operator and therefore
can drop in the pocket, see it and throw the football.
Because you can't play like this on a consistent basis.
It's it's not sustainable and he's not big, by the way,
so it's not as if that he can you know,
the body is it can handle all this. So we'll
(28:48):
see how it plays out. But like I said, I'm
not defining his whole career. He's a rookie on a
team that's not very good, so he's it's just how
it's playing out this year.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Okay, another young guy, Shador Sander. I can't go through
a segment. Yeah, second start you know again, what's the
film say on Shador?
Speaker 5 (29:07):
Yeah, Chador was not very good this week.
Speaker 8 (29:09):
And I think the way I always look at it
when I watch young guys, I feel the same way
about cam Ward is they are still playing a little
bit out of college speed. You have to get back
in the pocket. You've got to see it, you've got
to deliver the football. This week, he didn't see things
the way he needed to. He left a lot of
throws on the field by not turning it loose when
(29:30):
the design of the route concept was clean, it was there.
If he threw the ball this week when he should have,
Jerry Judy would have had one hundred and seventy five
receiving yards and that doesn't even include that play, which
was actually a second reaction and adjustment.
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Play that we just saw.
Speaker 8 (29:45):
But for the most part this week, the processing just
was was a little slow.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
Now again, he needs more reps.
Speaker 8 (29:52):
This is not a condemnation or a referendum on his
entire career and what it's going to be Colin. He
needs a lot of reps. He needs to play to
the speed of the NFL game, and right now he's
not doing that. And there's one thing that is very
coachable that he had this issue in college and it
flared up again this week. He has a tendency when
he moves to hold the ball with one hand. You
(30:14):
cannot do that in the NFL. That can be coached
and cleaned up.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Okay, the best game of the weekend Bears Packers. So
let's start with the Bears. I love it. It's so
old school Ben Johnson. Ben Johnson would run at fifty
five times, I mean, is it now? First of all,
when he got there, he went and got Drew Dolman
and Joe Tooney and Jonah Jackson, so it was very
clear what he wanted to do. Established for a young
quarterback a big time run game. Is it a beautiful
(30:40):
thing to watch when you look at film.
Speaker 5 (30:43):
Well, this week it was beautiful.
Speaker 8 (30:45):
They ran outside zone is their predominant run against the Eagles,
and the Eagles they played it the wrong way and
they know that you can't play outside zone by playing
laterally and just sliding down the line of scrimmage. There
has to be some kind of vertical knocked Now, you
don't want to shoot gaps, but there has to be
some kind of vertical knockback, and the Eagles didn't do that.
(31:05):
You know, they've got the second best running game in
the NFL, and a lot of people probably aren't aware
of that because all you want to talk about is
Caleb Williams. That's what most people want to talk about.
But their run game has been really solid. The Menungae
kid has been really good. He's a physical, sustaining, hard runner,
and when you compare him and combine him with Swift,
you've got a really nice run game.
Speaker 5 (31:26):
And the Old Lion is playing.
Speaker 8 (31:27):
Really, really well, and what he does really well, it's
almost the old Joe Gibbs philosophy colin of using motion
to change run support. Most people don't think of motion
as being a factor in the run game. But Joe
Gibbs did it, you know, years and years ago with
the Redskins, where you use motion and it dictates run
(31:47):
support and changes it in your favor. And that's one
thing that Ben Jonson has such a good feel for.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Okay, listen, I like Jordan Love. I had my questions
out of Utah State, but I said, if I didn't
say his name and I just said, there's a tall
kid that's athletic, with a big arm, takes risks and
doesn't throw a lot of picks, everybody would go, oh,
that's great. I think he's really talented. I think sometimes
there's just it looks to me like a franchise quarterback.
(32:13):
Good arm, moves, Yeah, nice kid, coachable, can ad lib
can be on script or off. What is your favorite
quality on film of the Packers young quarterback.
Speaker 8 (32:25):
I would say there's a comfort with which he plays,
which is not an next to no point, but there's
a comfort with which he plays. And I would say
that what has really stood out this year and he's
gotten better at his ball placement because they are phenomenal
on third down, Colin, they're the best third down conversion
offense in the league, and on third and seven plus,
(32:46):
which for most teams is pretty much it's time to punt.
They convert more than forty three percent on third and
seven plus. That is remarkable, It's almost unheard of. But
his ball location has gotten more consistent, more precise year
after year, and you combine that with an aggressive mindset,
which I believe is essential for a quarterback in this league.
(33:08):
He's an aggressive mindset thrower, and now that he's more
accurate and more precise with his ball location, he wins.
Speaker 5 (33:14):
On third down. And but again, you.
Speaker 8 (33:17):
Know, we've talked about coaching on the defensive side, coaching
on the offensive side. I think it's a really good
mix with Jordan Love and Matt Lafleur. We know Malaflor
likes to run the ball, but the other thing that
stands out is they do some really good things in
the red zone. You know, I'm not a believer in
the red zone. Actually, I heard Ben Johnson talk about this.
I'm not a believer in the red zone of just
(33:38):
throwing it up and hoping your receiver catches the ball.
I'm much more of a believer in schematics in the
red zone. And we saw that last week, and that's
actually going to be the play we show because I
think that that's so critical to be a will score
touchdowns in the red zone and not just relying on
guys going up and making a play, which is which
is a maybe yes.
Speaker 5 (33:57):
Maybe no deal.
Speaker 8 (33:58):
So this was last week against Detroit, and I actually
love this play in it it's really so simple. You know,
sometimes the really cool things are so simple when you
really look at them.
Speaker 5 (34:09):
So here's love. He's in the gun.
Speaker 8 (34:11):
Now what we're starting with here, we're going to start
with a two by two formation, meaning that there's two
receivers up top to the wide side of the field,
and there's two receivers to the boundary side of the formation.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
Now what's going to happen.
Speaker 8 (34:24):
Is the two key receivers here are Watson and Dobbs,
and we'll see that as we continue with the play. Now,
Dobbs will go in motion and the corner will follow.
Now you're playing man down here if you're a defense,
because there's not a lot of room.
Speaker 5 (34:36):
You're not playing zone, so you're playing man.
Speaker 8 (34:39):
So Dobbs is now stacked behind Watson and the corners
they switched their matchup because of the motion. So you know,
what you have now is the corner that was on
Dobbs is now matched to Watson and Dobbs is on
the outside.
Speaker 5 (34:52):
So this is really some very simple but very cool stuff.
Speaker 8 (34:57):
What you're going to see is Watson is going to
hangle his stem to the outside. Okay, so they're going
to do what we call a switch release. Watson's going
to angle his stem outside and Dobbs is going to
then angle his stem inside. But because the corners now
have to switch due to this switch release concept, what
happens is Dobbs ends up running now his out quick
(35:21):
outcut against a corner that's inside of him because of
everything they've done, the motion, the stack, the switch release.
So what happens is is he just has the leverage
on him so when he breaks to the outside, Colin,
it becomes pitching catch. It's just really beautiful stuff. It
looks so easy, but you know, this is just so
(35:42):
beautiful when you watch it, and to me, this is
what red zone, particularly low red zone offense meaning ten
yards in has to be about, not just throwing it
up to receivers, but this packer offense.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
And you're right about Jordan Love.
Speaker 8 (35:55):
He definitely looks like a franchise quarterback. He's so physically talented. Mentally,
he's getting better and better with each each week.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah, great stuff. Greg Cosel forty six years NFL Films.
Speaker 5 (36:07):
Thanks Greg, Thanks Colin, really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
What's interesting to me, folks about Jordan Love And you
see this a lot. So he had a really good
year in college the year before he came out, and
then the year he came out, it wasn't as good
a year because he lost coaches and a lot of
people bailed on him. But you had to go back
and look at the film from the previous year, and
it does show that we all know this bo Nix
(36:30):
is benefiting from Sean Payton and Caleb Williams is benefiting
from Ben Johnson. Well, that works in college as well.
You know, when Sark was a college coordinator, but he
was good enough to be a coach at Texas, it
was nice having Lane Kiffen and Sark as coordinators when
they're both excellent head coaches. So this coaching stuff matters
(36:53):
everybody in Green Bay. I hope you understand. You do
understand that Green Bay's a weller in operation. But I
don't get the critics of Jordan Love. I think he's
an incredibly special player, arm movement, size, and again, this matters.
Every time you put a mic in front of him,
says the right thing. I mean again, he never blows
(37:13):
up a locker room. There's no passive aggressive. You can
tell he cares about stuff beyond himself. It just again
that stuff matters for quarterback. I don't care about other positions.
Every time you talk to Jordan Love. And by the way,
Caleb's gotten very good at this. Caleb Williams, Chicago's media
is very aggressive. Jalen Hurts, hyper aggressive Philly media. Jalen
(37:37):
Hurts brings the heat down. Caleb Williams, Jordan Love. It's
so much a part of this is keep the thing
the thing, don't inflame situations. But Jordan is really special.
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
noon Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at
Fox Sportsradio dot com, or stream us live every day
on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go, Cowboys playing a night against the Detroit Lions.
Greg Cosell one hour from now to break it all down.
What's wrong with Detroit? One is right with Dallas. Maybe
in La next week in Chicago. Today, It's the Herd
wherever you may be, however you may be listening. Thanks
(00:49):
for making us part of your day. I and Jmac
both like Dallas tonight. I think Dallas wins by a
touchdown or more tonight. I think a lot of the
NFL is trends and which way you're headed. I think
Dallas is headed in the right direction, playing with a
ton of confidence now healthier than they've been all season.
So you and I agree on that, and let's just
start with them. So the Cowboys over under win total
(01:12):
to start the year was seven and a half. I said,
bet the under. Detroit's was ten and a half. Ten
and a half, I said, bet the under. And here
we are week fourteen. They're pretty much the same. But
I think I'd rather be Dallas. I do. I like
where they're trending, and everybody's telling me it's injuries, or
(01:34):
it's the Frank Ragnow retirement, or it's Jared Goff. You
want to know why Detroit's not as good? They lost
Ben Johnson, the offensive coordinator. Now he's the coach of
the Bears, and the Bears are looking down at the Lions.
That's it. It's almost impossible. It's not hard. It's really
impossible to replace brilliance. I remember Nike two thousand and four.
(02:00):
Phil Knight steps down his CEO, Nike one of one,
a powerhouse, immediately starts losing market share to Adidas. Here
comes Phil, he comes back. We all know the story
of Steve Jobs left Apple. Apple was a powerhouse. They
begged to have him back ten years later. It's hard
to replace excellent people. I think Ben Johnson's different. I mean,
(02:23):
what a shock. Suddenly the Bears are as good as
any team in the league, running the football. They weren't
last year, and suddenly now the Lions are horrible on
third down? How with that offensive line? How would Jamir
Gibbs with a veteran quarterback. How they're good at tight end,
wide receiver? How because they lost Ben Johnson. That's it.
(02:45):
I remember when Washington you remember this, had Sean McVay,
Kyle Shanahan, and Matt Lafleur in the building with Washington,
they were making the playoffs. Those guys left. I mean,
it wasn't until last year, for one year, that the
regression stopped. Now they're bad again. You just can't replace
(03:05):
McVeigh and Shanahan on his staff, arguably the two best
coaches in the league after Andy Reid and I'll die
on this hill. The greater the talent you lose, the
wider the search has to be. You lose Jim Harbaugh Michigan.
You can't go in house. You lose Ben Johnson, you
(03:27):
can't go in house. The bigger the shoes I have
to fill, the more feet I need to see. And
when I watch the Lions, it's not Frank rag Noow,
it's not omar On Saint Brown is banged up. It's
not Jared Goff doesn't have mobility. He didn't have it
the previous three years. They're just not quite as clever
(03:48):
and not quite as unique, even among really good people.
Jerry Jones said, Dak is irreplaceable. Mike is great, but replaceable,
and Mikes were too good. He leaves. Dallas is now
second in the NFL in pressures. It's like, we're actually
better without Micah because we got some draft picks and
(04:09):
made some deals. But I mean, Miami still looking to
find the next Marino. How many quarterbacks they had forty?
I mean literally, Denver to replace Elway had to go
get an old Peyton Manning. So it's just it's the
Lions lost an all time offensive coordinator, an all time guy,
(04:30):
and I love Dallas tonight nothing quite feels the same
when I watch them. The players are great. It's not injuries.
They've been injury plague previous years. It's not the GM
he's great. They just lost an all timer who's now
with the Bears. So I saw a story this morning
and it said the Broncos are the second NFL team
in history to win four straight games by three points
(04:52):
or less. People are basically saying what Denver is doing
is not sustainable. You can't keep winning in the fourth
quarter like Denver's doing, and I would say, no, that's
absolutely sustainable. What's not sustainable is when the Patriots went
ten years without winning a Super Bowl, and those Randy
(05:13):
Moss years when you're scoring fifty and winning by three touchdowns,
they didn't win a super Bowl that year. Every other
Super Bowl Belichick and Brady were in in New England,
all but one were one possession games. Further record, Tom
Brady is the greatest quarterback ever in one possession games
sixty eight percent of games, sixty eight percent in one
(05:36):
score game, by the way, highest winning percentage when trailing
in the fourth quarter of the last two seasons, Andy
Reid and Sean Payton. So don't tell me it's Mahomes
because none of you like Bo Nicks. It's the coach.
Football has always been a game of inches. I go
back to the New England dynasty. Winning close is totally sustainable.
(05:59):
The New England dyning. The two things that always jump
out beyond Belichick and Brady art they never fumbled. Honest
to god, I was in New England at the time.
They never fumbled, and they were always way above average
on special teams. They didn't lead the league in sacks
very often. They didn't lead the league in touchdowns very often.
When I look at Denver, it's absolutely coaching and details.
(06:21):
For instance, fewest sacks allowed, that's coaching. How do I
know that's coaching because Caleb Williams last year was the
most ack quarterback. This year, he's one of the least acts.
They changed coaches, right, So like it is coaching and demanding,
not pandering. Bo Nicks not a big, strong guy breaking
(06:44):
tackles from defensive ends. He didn't get sacked. His dad
was a coach. He takes to coaching. Sean Payton. They're
also great on third down defense. Why that's situational coaching.
Red zone defense, situational coaching. And so when I look
at New England's dynasty, it was all about details. I
(07:07):
don't know how many times they led the NFL in
total offense. I would wager it wasn't as many as
you think. I don't know how many times that led
the league in touchdowns. By the Randy Marsh years, they
didn't win Super Bowls. So I've always thought, like Andy Reid,
Sean Payton. In fact, I looked this morning at the
top five last two years, the top five winning percentages,
(07:28):
winning its coaches in one score games. It's all offensive coaches.
No Mike Tomlin up there, it's all offensive coaches. So
to me, this idea that what Denver's doing is not sustainable.
I love NBA teams and baseball teams and pro football
(07:48):
teams that win close. I think it builds character, it
builds unity. Winn by blowouts, that's not sustainable. If you're
doing that in the NFL, probably doing it because you
have a really good rookie quarterback on a rookie deal,
and then when you have to eventually pay him and
have to get rid of stars, You're not winning by that.
(08:09):
That's not sustainable. You don't see NFL teams going four
years blowing people out. You'll rarely get a year like that.
But winning close, Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Tom Brady totally
sustainable to me. Being good on third down, offensively, not
getting sacked a lot, that's coaching. That's sustainable. Here's Sean
Payton on the way Denver's winning.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
I hate losing more than anything like in the world,
and so I think fear of failure is a very
significant motivating factor from a detail standpoint. And you know
there's nothing that's too small, that's not significant, that has
(08:55):
to exist outside the lines as well.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, I mean, I think highly organized people don't need
wide margins, right, highly organized people don't need wide margins margins.
I can read about a pro athlete that can't retire
in one hundred million dollars, and I'm like, well, I
know school teachers that are retired on one and live
very comfortable, great lives. If you need one hundred million
(09:21):
dollars to retire comfortably, you're not great in the details.
You're not very efficient. There's a quality of life at
one or two million dollars in retirement. Jmak. We both
like the Dallas Cowboys to night, Greg Cosell in one hour,
I was.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
Just looking at your Broncos, Colin. So, not only do
they struggle on the road this season, winning a bunch
of close games, but they faced four backup quarterbacks this
season and guess who they got this week the Raiders,
and they are huge favors in a dangerous game.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
But you know the last two years, who's led the
NFL in point differential. Lions Ravens. How they do in
the playoffs, They're they're not ready for it. Denver and
Chicago are like, yeah, we've been in close games. Denver's
trailed every game this year at one point, so the Lion,
the Ravens the last two years before this year, but
(10:13):
last year and the year before we saw this all
the time. NFC teams that played Baltimore just got destroyed.
It does you no value in the playoffs winning close.
To me, it builds a confidence in close games. I mean,
if you go back to Michael Jordan's great highlights, the
first one you think about that Cleveland series, it's a
game winning shot because they trailed, or the Utah shot,
(10:36):
game winning shot because they trailed. Michael Jordan's highlights with
the against the Knicks. You know, even Michael Jordan and
the greatest team ever and the greatest player ever. Do
you know how many like grueling six game series they
were in, how many times they actually lost at home?
You gotta win close, and I think it builds stuff
beyond just a w.
Speaker 4 (10:56):
The only thing is they're they're beating bad teams in
close games. Those Michael Jordan there that was were epic
playoff games this is like Davis Mills. Okay, this is
the Raiders ten to seven at home. I will just
costion you after this Raiders game this week, Packers, Jags, Chiefs, Chargers,
that will be the truth serum. For the Broncos, they'll
probably go one in three or two and two down
(11:17):
the street.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
What are you laughing at? Come on, here's her all
playoff teams. I have been hearing this now for weeks
about the Chicago Bears. Oh, this game's true serum. Yeah,
they just went to Philly. That was a great win
and knocked the barn door over. You know, like guys,
they keep winning, like Denver, Well this one, this next one.
I saw them play Kansas City and I was told, oh,
(11:39):
this game against the Chiefs will be true serum. They
won that one.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
Now by me, I was on the Broncos that one.
But by the way, do you have Broncos Super Bowl futures?
Are you gonna put towns a couple of some don't?
Speaker 1 (11:49):
I don't divulge all my super Bowl future, but put
your money where your mouth this big guy. I picked
Denver to win the division. I think their roster is great.
Speaker 5 (11:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:58):
I like bo Nicks and Sean Payton History is Bumpy.
September better every month.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in neon eastern nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 6 (12:13):
Hey, It's Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington from The Odd
Couple on Fox Sports Radio. And in addition to hearing
us live weeknights from seven to ten pm Eastern on
Fox Sports Radio, we are excited to announce brand new
YouTube channel for the show.
Speaker 1 (12:27):
That's right, you can now watch The Odd Couple live
on YouTube every day.
Speaker 6 (12:33):
All you gotta do search Odd Couple FSR on YouTube
again YouTube, Just search Odd Couple FSR. Check us out
on YouTube and subscribe.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
You're now entering the old bull z Owne sponsored by
Credible Great Rates, Turn of the Bowl. So when I
got a job in Vegas out of college, I love boxing,
and boxing was already exploding. Thomas Hitman, her and Sugar Ray, Leonard,
Marvin Hack and I would go to these boxing events
and was amazing these fights and there'd be three judges,
(13:05):
each sitting in a different part of the ring. And
that's because you can all see a different fight based
on the angle. And so I'm reading a story this
morning that Old Miss players, an ol Miss athletic director
dispute Lane Kiffin's version of what was said as he
left folks different angles. Where are you sitting? I mean
(13:27):
movie critics Gene Siskel, one of the great movie critics
of all time, didn't like Silence of the Lambs. Sorry,
you know they rarely agreed on movies. I mean he
and Ebert. So the bottom line is there's three sides
to every story. Your side, my side, and the truth.
As they say, so Old Miss ad Old missus players.
(13:51):
They're bitter, they're angry, they got dumped. They're emotional, they're scorned.
They're gonna hear things one way Lane Kiff and leaving
Old Miss to LSU is hyped, optimistic, energized, can't wait.
Maybe maybe a little guilt, but he's hungry and aggressive
and things. He needed his job the right way at
(14:13):
Old Miss. And there's a reason we need divorce attorneys, somebody,
somebody to come in without emotion and make a decision.
Old Miss got dumped and they're angry, and you could
argue to have a right to be angry, But I
don't suddenly believe everything. Old Miss players and the athletic director,
(14:35):
and the boosters and the donors are saying all of us,
when dumped, are overly emotional, or at least emotional. So
I've argued from the beginning, you knew what you were
getting when you hired him, and Old Miss. Maybe not
for all programs, but for Old Miss, it was better
to have had Lane Kiffin and lost him than to
have not had Lane Kiffen at all. And Old Miss
(14:58):
the college football playoffs starts weeks. Everybody's betting against you.
Why because you go to the airport, flip people off
and scream ugly things, and you're not concentrating on your
players and your game plan and your team. I understand
being angry, but I'm less inclined to listen to people
(15:21):
who are highly emotional. I'm really if you're highly emotional
as a coach, a little league dad, a soccer or
pageant mom, I'm not really interested in your opinion. Okay,
So this idea that Lane Lane is just you know,
he's just embellishing it. He's hungry, he's excited. It's signing day,
(15:45):
it's a new job. I've had four new jobs in
my life. You can't see straight. You're so happy got
a new challenge. You're putting together a staff at signing day,
you can't wait. I couldn't even get my hair right.
The bottom line is the faster Ole Miss gets over it,
the better chance they have to win in the college
football playoff. Now, Joel Klatt and I right, But just
(16:07):
here's Joel Clap's opinion on Lane leaving the way Lane left.
Speaker 7 (16:14):
I don't begrudge this man his movement, and he's going
to go, and he thought LSU was going to be
a better opportunity for he and his family, you know,
more power to him, But that doesn't mean that there
are not consequences to those decisions. And he did leave
a team high and dry, and he left those players
high and dry. That's going to hurt his credibility moving forward.
And he also went to a place that, let's face
it is not as sound foundationally. They might have more resources,
(16:39):
but it's certainly a lot more crazy at LSU. It's like, listen,
you know you can go with a six to prom
and that six is going to be committed to you.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
You take the nine. She might be crazy. I think
LSU and Lane Kiffin both are a little crazy. It's
not a thirty year marriage. It's going to be like
a or for your relationship. And I can't wait to
watch Hollywood divorces are far more interesting than stable thirty
(17:07):
year marriages. Not saying they're better for society, they're better
for the kids. Yeah, Lane's a little crazy. LSU's a
little crazy. Okay. There is a reason eyewitness testimony is
the least reliable evidence. People are highly emotional. Take a
deep breath, ale miss, concentrate on you keep the thing
(17:30):
the thing. Bitterness doesn't win playoff games.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
One more heard. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day,
seven days a week within the iHeartRadio app. Search Herd
to listen live or on demand whenever you like.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
With that, Greg Cosel forty six years NFL Films always
joined us on Thursday. What's been more impressive to you
about the Cowboys? The offense, Greg, or the defense?
Speaker 8 (17:55):
I would think the defense, Colin, because look, as you
know what, the first five six weeks people are laughing
at their defense, and now you know they made those trades.
Obviously they got Kenny Clark before the season, but the
ind season trades they have made been really impressive. And
the trio of d tackles is as good a trio
as any in the league. And as you probably noticed,
(18:17):
three weeks ago, the rookie corner Revel from East Carolina
started to play, and then this past week on Thanksgiving,
he played pretty much every snap. And now what they've done,
and I think you'll continue to see this tonight, is
now they've played Revel and Bridges, who's got a lot
of length on the outside, and they've moved Bland to
(18:37):
the slot where he's better. Bland is not a very
good outside corner, so now they moved him into the
slot where he first really made his heay in the league.
And they're much better on the back end. But with
what they've done up front, the returner of overshown, the
trading for Logan Wilson, suddenly this defense, well it's not
top five in the league, but it's a good enough
(18:58):
defense to win game games.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
All right. So a game that's a little under the radar,
although Josh Allen games are never truly under the radar.
Bills play the Bengals and here's Joe Burraw. Yeah, and
my take is Cincinnati and Burrow are going to be
the number one spoiler in the end, and it may
not make the playoffs. But what did you see with
Burrow's first start, because the numbers tell me he was
(19:22):
pretty good.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Yeah, Burrow's always been a guy.
Speaker 8 (19:26):
First of all, he's so good pre snap and then
getting into the post snap operation phase. He's just one
of those guys. He's like a computer chip. He just
sees it. It's innate, it's in his DNA. And he's
always been a guy. Now, granted, he's got good receivers,
we understand that, but he's always been a guy that
understands the NFL that if it's one on one, you've
(19:46):
got to throw the football, and that if that doesn't work,
that means you don't need another quarterback.
Speaker 5 (19:51):
It means you need new receivers.
Speaker 8 (19:53):
But he's got receivers, so he's going to push it
down the field. They'll be one on ones against these
Bills corners and we'll see how.
Speaker 5 (20:00):
That plays out. On the other side.
Speaker 8 (20:02):
The Bills, to me, are one of the most fascinating
studies on offense in this league. They've got the most
physically gifted quarterback in the league.
Speaker 5 (20:10):
I don't know the reason why they choose not to
throw the ball.
Speaker 8 (20:13):
Maybe they don't like their receivers, but with the most
physically gifted quarterback in the league, they are not a
passing team.
Speaker 5 (20:20):
They don't throw the ball down the field.
Speaker 8 (20:21):
In fact, they don't want to throw it a whole
lot in terms of volume unless they're forced to. But
that's not the way they choose to play. And I
give Aaron Kromer, they're all line coach who's been doing this.
You probably know Aaron, he's been doing this for twenty
twenty five years. Absolutely one of the best in the league.
Their run game is so good, it's so multiple, it's
(20:42):
specific to the opponent. I mean last week against the Steelers,
Cook and Davis had.
Speaker 5 (20:48):
Forty one runs combined.
Speaker 8 (20:50):
Colin they did not pull an offensive lineman one time,
so it was all zone.
Speaker 5 (20:55):
It was all zone based.
Speaker 8 (20:57):
Yet we've seen them have that run game where they
have the counter run game with Hawes and Gilliam the
fullback and been successful through the year doing that. So
they are very specific to the opponent in how they
feel is the best way to attack.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
But this is a running football team and.
Speaker 8 (21:12):
They only really rely on Josh Allen when they think
they need to.
Speaker 1 (21:17):
Okay, another game. It's basically the season for the Kansas
City Chiefs the Houston Texans. Let's start with Houston. So
I prefer offensive coaches. But if you're gonna go defense,
go young, Mike McDonald to me, Goo Ryans. I remember
before Demiko got the job, people in the Niners organization
were saying, We're never going to keep this guy. He's
(21:37):
just too stright, he's too bright. Well, so I watch
Houston's defense. It's the best in the league. Is it schemes?
Is it coaching? Because they make every quarterback struggle. It's
like they're playing with an extra man. What is it
about their defense? Is it just better personnel or coaching?
Speaker 8 (21:52):
It's both because obviously, if you look at the personnel,
they're really good at all three levels. And based on
my film study, I would argue that Cale and Bullock
is the best post safety in the league this season,
in his second year in the league.
Speaker 5 (22:04):
Out of USC.
Speaker 8 (22:05):
You're probably very familiar with them, being you know, from USC,
really good football player, really good, long, smart, good, good athlete.
But obviously we know about Hunter and Anderson. They're really
good inside too. No one talks about what they put
out there on the inside at the detackle position. But
the one thing about Tamiko Ryans is he's very technical,
(22:27):
so in specific situations he will bring pressure and they're
very good with their concepts. Now, based on the rest
of the league, they're not a high percentage pressure defense,
but they're very schematic and tactical with when when they
bring pressure, and they're very very good at it, and
they stunt, and they've got guys who can stunt, really
good athletes. So this is a really difficult defense to
(22:50):
play against. You and I are talking on a Thursday.
I have no idea what the status is. We know
Simmons the left tackle went on IR. I don't know
if Tray Smith the guard's gonna pla. We don't know
if Jowan Taylor's going to play. So imagine if you
have all these backups on your offensive line and now
you've got that defensive line that you've got to play against.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
By the way, what is the identity of the Chiefs
offense today? What is it?
Speaker 8 (23:14):
I would say it's Patrick Mahomes being special. And I'm
not trying to be sarcastic. I think the more you
watch and I watch, I think I've watched every Mahomes
game in the league since he's been in the league.
It almost seems to me watching his tape Colin that
more and more he's become an improvisational stud as opposed
to a pocket technician. Now that's not to say he's
(23:37):
not capable of playing from the pocket, of course he is.
He's extremely gifted. But it seems the more I watch,
the more it's become a case of him getting outside
of play design, making incredible plays. That's what he did
last week when he almost brought them back to victory,
you know, against the Cowboys.
Speaker 5 (23:53):
It seems there's more and more of that now.
Speaker 8 (23:56):
He's so good at it that they can kind of survive,
although they're six and six this year. I think this
is a game where he's going to move around a lot.
But I don't think they have a true identity in
the way I think you're using the word Ravens Steelers.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
I mean, it kind of feels again kind of this
is it for Pittsburgh. Is the Steelers offense broken?
Speaker 5 (24:21):
I'm not sure Steelers an offense or two words that
go together very much. These days.
Speaker 8 (24:26):
They're a tough offense to watch. I mean, you talk
about you know identity. I don't know what they are
other than the fact that they line up a lot
with the big people.
Speaker 5 (24:36):
They play with two.
Speaker 8 (24:36):
Tight ends, they play with three tight ends. I think
they'd like to run the football, but that's been very
up and down. You don't know from week to week
if they're going to have any kind of sustaining run game.
Speaker 5 (24:47):
I'm not sure what the past game is.
Speaker 8 (24:49):
They really don't work the middle of the field much
at all, which is not a function of the quarterback.
Aaron Rodgers can obviously still throw the football. Sometimes, I
feel watching their tape that their number one receiver is
becoming Darnell Washington at three hundred and eleven pounds. So
it's I'm not sure what they are on offense, and
I don't know if right now I feel like watching
(25:11):
their tape that you can hang your hat on anything
and say, hey, this is what they bring to the
table every single week.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
I want to talk about a team that we've kind
of forgotten about once they lost their tackles. But we've
talked about the Chiefs so much, we've talked about Denver
that quietly this defense with the Chargers. They're eight and four,
they're at home. I'm absolutely a live shot to beat Philadelphia.
I don't even know how they run the ball with
(25:37):
this offensive line. I have no idea. It's not good, right,
But it's mostly been a defensive story with Jesse Minter Again,
I'll ask you the question I did with Houston. Is
it coaching or scheme with a Chargers defense it's number
two or three in the league right now.
Speaker 5 (25:53):
Yeah, it's both.
Speaker 8 (25:53):
But I think one of the things that stands out
when you watch their defense, and they have a lot
of players people may not be aware.
Speaker 5 (26:00):
They don't know their names.
Speaker 8 (26:01):
They're not household names, but they've got a lot of
pieces that can line up in different positions and they're
very multi positional, multi dimensional. Look, we know about Derwin James,
he's the name everybody knows. Not a lot of people
probably know about tar Heeeb still a corner who plays
outside in their base, moves inside in their sub defenses,
(26:21):
and by the way, is very in the dime really
because they play nickel all the time. It's that big
nickel with Drwin James, so in their dying he plays
inside and he's a major part of.
Speaker 5 (26:31):
Their pressure packages.
Speaker 8 (26:32):
Tuoy Polot he's a guy that plays both outside and inside.
A really good player. I'm sure not a lot of
people are aware of him. Diane Henley really good linebacker.
Another guy that lines up in multiple positions within their
different defensive structures, so they have a lot of movable
chess pieces within their defense. And Jesse Minter obviously is
(26:54):
coaching really well, because when you ask guys to have
a lot of different responsibilities based on different personnel, that
means you're teaching really really well.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Yeah. Well, I want to talk about Jackson Dart for
a second, so I watch him sirst opposed with Drake May.
Drake May does everything well. Drake May was a little
reckless his first year, spend a lot of time in
the blue tent. He doesn't anymore. He cleaned it up. No.
I watch Jackson Dart, and the Giants are so desperate
at quarterback. They've been so bad for so many years.
They're just clinging to anything that work. They cling to
(27:24):
Tommy DeVito a couple of years ago. I watched Jackson.
I watch Jackson Dart, and I think he's a bit
of a splash player. He's memorable, he's confident. I is
he a guy that can throw forty two times a game.
What is the film say, not the media, not the fan.
What is the film say on Jackson Dart?
Speaker 8 (27:43):
Well, the first thing I want to say is we're
not going to define his whole career about what we've
seen this year.
Speaker 5 (27:48):
So I want people to understand that.
Speaker 8 (27:49):
So right now, Jackson Dart is a quarterback that is
not seeing things as clearly as you need to. And
when you're a quarterback that has mobility, Colin, and you
don't see things as clearly as you need to on
a consistent fasis, what do you do?
Speaker 5 (28:04):
You run?
Speaker 8 (28:05):
And that's what he does, and he's very good at it,
but he can't take the kind of hits we're looking
at now. He's spent almost every one of his games,
maybe with just one or two exceptions in the blue
ten and obviously he missed a couple of weeks dude
to being in the concussion protocol. So ideally, as he
plays more, he starts to see things with more clarity,
(28:25):
gets a better picture pre snap that translates to post snap.
He becomes more of a post snap operator and therefore
can drop in the pocket, see it and throw the football.
Because you can't play like this on a consistent basis.
It's it's not sustainable and he's not big, by the way,
so it's not as if that he can you know,
the body is it can handle all this. So we'll
(28:48):
see how it plays out. But like I said, I'm
not defining his whole career. He's a rookie on a
team that's not very good, so he's it's just how
it's playing out this year.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Okay, another young guy, Shador Sander. I can't go through
a segment. Yeah, second start you know again, what's the
film say on Shador?
Speaker 5 (29:07):
Yeah, Chador was not very good this week.
Speaker 8 (29:09):
And I think the way I always look at it
when I watch young guys, I feel the same way
about cam Ward is they are still playing a little
bit out of college speed. You have to get back
in the pocket. You've got to see it, you've got
to deliver the football. This week, he didn't see things
the way he needed to. He left a lot of
throws on the field by not turning it loose when
(29:30):
the design of the route concept was clean, it was there.
If he threw the ball this week when he should have,
Jerry Judy would have had one hundred and seventy five
receiving yards and that doesn't even include that play, which
was actually a second reaction and adjustment.
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Play that we just saw.
Speaker 8 (29:45):
But for the most part this week, the processing just
was was a little slow.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
Now again, he needs more reps.
Speaker 8 (29:52):
This is not a condemnation or a referendum on his
entire career and what it's going to be Colin. He
needs a lot of reps. He needs to play to
the speed of the NFL game, and right now he's
not doing that. And there's one thing that is very
coachable that he had this issue in college and it
flared up again this week. He has a tendency when
he moves to hold the ball with one hand. You
(30:14):
cannot do that in the NFL. That can be coached
and cleaned up.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Okay, the best game of the weekend Bears Packers. So
let's start with the Bears. I love it. It's so
old school Ben Johnson. Ben Johnson would run at fifty
five times, I mean, is it now? First of all,
when he got there, he went and got Drew Dolman
and Joe Tooney and Jonah Jackson, so it was very
clear what he wanted to do. Established for a young
quarterback a big time run game. Is it a beautiful
(30:40):
thing to watch when you look at film.
Speaker 5 (30:43):
Well, this week it was beautiful.
Speaker 8 (30:45):
They ran outside zone is their predominant run against the Eagles,
and the Eagles they played it the wrong way and
they know that you can't play outside zone by playing
laterally and just sliding down the line of scrimmage. There
has to be some kind of vertical knocked Now, you
don't want to shoot gaps, but there has to be
some kind of vertical knockback, and the Eagles didn't do that.
(31:05):
You know, they've got the second best running game in
the NFL, and a lot of people probably aren't aware
of that because all you want to talk about is
Caleb Williams. That's what most people want to talk about.
But their run game has been really solid. The Menungae
kid has been really good. He's a physical, sustaining, hard runner,
and when you compare him and combine him with Swift,
you've got a really nice run game.
Speaker 5 (31:26):
And the Old Lion is playing.
Speaker 8 (31:27):
Really, really well, and what he does really well, it's
almost the old Joe Gibbs philosophy colin of using motion
to change run support. Most people don't think of motion
as being a factor in the run game. But Joe
Gibbs did it, you know, years and years ago with
the Redskins, where you use motion and it dictates run
(31:47):
support and changes it in your favor. And that's one
thing that Ben Jonson has such a good feel for.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Okay, listen, I like Jordan Love. I had my questions
out of Utah State, but I said, if I didn't
say his name and I just said, there's a tall
kid that's athletic, with a big arm, takes risks and
doesn't throw a lot of picks, everybody would go, oh,
that's great. I think he's really talented. I think sometimes
there's just it looks to me like a franchise quarterback.
(32:13):
Good arm, moves, Yeah, nice kid, coachable, can ad lib
can be on script or off. What is your favorite
quality on film of the Packers young quarterback.
Speaker 8 (32:25):
I would say there's a comfort with which he plays,
which is not an next to no point, but there's
a comfort with which he plays. And I would say
that what has really stood out this year and he's
gotten better at his ball placement because they are phenomenal
on third down, Colin, they're the best third down conversion
offense in the league, and on third and seven plus,
(32:46):
which for most teams is pretty much it's time to punt.
They convert more than forty three percent on third and
seven plus. That is remarkable, It's almost unheard of. But
his ball location has gotten more consistent, more precise year
after year, and you combine that with an aggressive mindset,
which I believe is essential for a quarterback in this league.
(33:08):
He's an aggressive mindset thrower, and now that he's more
accurate and more precise with his ball location, he wins.
Speaker 5 (33:14):
On third down. And but again, you.
Speaker 8 (33:17):
Know, we've talked about coaching on the defensive side, coaching
on the offensive side. I think it's a really good
mix with Jordan Love and Matt Lafleur. We know Malaflor
likes to run the ball, but the other thing that
stands out is they do some really good things in
the red zone. You know, I'm not a believer in
the red zone. Actually, I heard Ben Johnson talk about this.
I'm not a believer in the red zone of just
(33:38):
throwing it up and hoping your receiver catches the ball.
I'm much more of a believer in schematics in the
red zone. And we saw that last week, and that's
actually going to be the play we show because I
think that that's so critical to be a will score
touchdowns in the red zone and not just relying on
guys going up and making a play, which is which
is a maybe yes.
Speaker 5 (33:57):
Maybe no deal.
Speaker 8 (33:58):
So this was last week against Detroit, and I actually
love this play in it it's really so simple. You know,
sometimes the really cool things are so simple when you
really look at them.
Speaker 5 (34:09):
So here's love. He's in the gun.
Speaker 8 (34:11):
Now what we're starting with here, we're going to start
with a two by two formation, meaning that there's two
receivers up top to the wide side of the field,
and there's two receivers to the boundary side of the formation.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
Now what's going to happen.
Speaker 8 (34:24):
Is the two key receivers here are Watson and Dobbs,
and we'll see that as we continue with the play. Now,
Dobbs will go in motion and the corner will follow.
Now you're playing man down here if you're a defense,
because there's not a lot of room.
Speaker 5 (34:36):
You're not playing zone, so you're playing man.
Speaker 8 (34:39):
So Dobbs is now stacked behind Watson and the corners
they switched their matchup because of the motion. So you know,
what you have now is the corner that was on
Dobbs is now matched to Watson and Dobbs is on
the outside.
Speaker 5 (34:52):
So this is really some very simple but very cool stuff.
Speaker 8 (34:57):
What you're going to see is Watson is going to
hangle his stem to the outside. Okay, so they're going
to do what we call a switch release. Watson's going
to angle his stem outside and Dobbs is going to
then angle his stem inside. But because the corners now
have to switch due to this switch release concept, what
happens is Dobbs ends up running now his out quick
(35:21):
outcut against a corner that's inside of him because of
everything they've done, the motion, the stack, the switch release.
So what happens is is he just has the leverage
on him so when he breaks to the outside, Colin,
it becomes pitching catch. It's just really beautiful stuff. It
looks so easy, but you know, this is just so
(35:42):
beautiful when you watch it, and to me, this is
what red zone, particularly low red zone offense meaning ten
yards in has to be about, not just throwing it
up to receivers, but this packer offense.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
And you're right about Jordan Love.
Speaker 8 (35:55):
He definitely looks like a franchise quarterback. He's so physically talented. Mentally,
he's getting better and better with each each week.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah, great stuff. Greg Cosel forty six years NFL Films.
Speaker 5 (36:07):
Thanks Greg, Thanks Colin, really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
What's interesting to me, folks about Jordan Love And you
see this a lot. So he had a really good
year in college the year before he came out, and
then the year he came out, it wasn't as good
a year because he lost coaches and a lot of
people bailed on him. But you had to go back
and look at the film from the previous year, and
it does show that we all know this bo Nix
(36:30):
is benefiting from Sean Payton and Caleb Williams is benefiting
from Ben Johnson. Well, that works in college as well.
You know, when Sark was a college coordinator, but he
was good enough to be a coach at Texas, it
was nice having Lane Kiffen and Sark as coordinators when
they're both excellent head coaches. So this coaching stuff matters
(36:53):
everybody in Green Bay. I hope you understand. You do
understand that Green Bay's a weller in operation. But I
don't get the critics of Jordan Love. I think he's
an incredibly special player, arm movement, size, and again, this matters.
Every time you put a mic in front of him,
says the right thing. I mean again, he never blows
(37:13):
up a locker room. There's no passive aggressive. You can
tell he cares about stuff beyond himself. It just again
that stuff matters for quarterback. I don't care about other positions.
Every time you talk to Jordan Love. And by the way,
Caleb's gotten very good at this. Caleb Williams, Chicago's media
is very aggressive. Jalen Hurts, hyper aggressive Philly media. Jalen
(37:37):
Hurts brings the heat down. Caleb Williams, Jordan Love. It's
so much a part of this is keep the thing
the thing, don't inflame situations. But Jordan is really special.
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