Colin Cowherd Podcast - Cowboys HUMILIATED, Bears Getting Better, Eagles Underachieve, Packers A SB Team? Ohio State’s GOOD Loss To Oregon - The Herd with Colin Cowherd

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Speaker 2 (01:00):
All right?

Speaker 1 (01:00):
We got a lot to talk about, mostly the cowboys
asking oh god, that was that may have been the
worst thing I've seen this year. By the time we're
doing this, it was forty six to nine, and we
just decided to do this a few minutes early, so
the final score wasn't quite finished. I'm sure Detroit added

(01:22):
more to it. Our Week six reaction presented by Uber
Eats get almost almost anything for Game Day. John Middlecoff,
former NFL scout for the Eagles three and Out podcasts,
for the volume, I mean, there's some million things I
had said Friday on FS one, the slow Oil leak
would begin this week with a schedule. Too many good quarterbacks. God,

(01:44):
you could tell early seven to three Cowboys bad tackling
dak an end zone pick.

Speaker 2 (01:51):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
It's my take on Dallas is this roster is if
you're going to pay Dack that kind of money you're
after hit not just you have to third round, fourth round,
fifth round picks have to become stars. You have to
find a couple pookin the kolas in the fifth John,
this roster, this Cowboy roster is just not very good,
is it.

Speaker 2 (02:12):
Well, with the injuries they have, they would not beat
any good team in the NFC. They would get boat raced.
When you think about all the good teams in the
NFC all have excellent offenses. Right Detroit clearly one of
the best. They could score forty on them with their
eyes closed, the forty nine ers, the Packers, the way
Washington's fighting right now, the Vikings you know Caleb all right,

(02:33):
the way that offense is humming. So the defense, with
their injuries, stands no chance if they are going to win.
How often do you win a game in which they
did last week, which I gave them credit because it
was a gritty performance on the road. Must win. When
the quarterback throws two interceptions, he has another fumble, and
you get a blocked field goal, it never happens. It

(02:55):
shows you how inpt last week fields and that offense was.
When he threw the pick today, Oh you know, I
said last week? Is he one of the more bizarre
players the way? You know? Because obviously he's good and
has awesome moments, but then he consistently lets you down
in the playoffs. But he's played very well in some
huge regular season games that are being watched by thirty

(03:18):
plus million. He plays for the Cowboys. But god, he
throws a lot of picks. You know that that ed
zone pick then turns into a field goal, So that's
a six point swing, and then the routes on and
they had no if they were going to win today,
it was gonna have to be like thirty five to
thirty and he just kind of imploded and looked like
a different guy and started their offensive line and all
their offensive weapons got tapped out after well, you know,

(03:39):
five minutes into the second quarter.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
I've said, like for years, I've compared him to Kirk
Cousins with more mobility, but I think Kirk showing it
again in Atlanta. Kirk's a better thrower of the football.
Kirk doesn't make a ton of mistakes and friends, is
more accurate, just just a more accurate thrower to the football.
If you asked, if you asked, I mean, right now,
I get Kirk Cousins. He's got about half of Dak's

(04:04):
contract and he's a better thrower of the football. And
so we always love all these mobile quarterbacks. But the
truth is with Aaron Rodgers and Dak right now, they're
not very mobile. I mean that. I mean, hell, I
watched Baker Mayfield and bow Knicks today. Bo Nix is fast.
You don't have to love him, but Jesus the kid
brought dirty moves really well. So I think Mike McCarthy
is paying the price for Jerry Jones ego. Now you know,

(04:25):
an eighty one year old guy wants to be the
general manager call press conferences. And I've said this before,
I just don't know how good of a job this is.
You walk into a job. I mean, let's be honest,
there's two great jobs to take in this league. You
got a star quarterback and you're gonna have to pay him,
or you have a talented rookie quarterback by caliber Jaden
Daniels on a rookie contract. So now I got to

(04:45):
play around with some chess pieces. I can go buy
a pass rusher. What you don't want to have is
an average guy that you're overpaying. And Kirk Cousins deal
right now is a very solid deal. It's not egregious.
They don't have to get rid of anybody the Dak deal,
which hasn't even started the new one yet. I think
this is going to be a downhill trajectory for years

(05:07):
to me.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
I do think Jerry's drafted relatively well though. I mean
they've won twelve games three straight years, but they kind
of hit the point this year where they lost a
bunch of guys in free agency and they were going
to have to double down obviously on Dak and then
Micah hadn't even been paid and they paid CD. So
now those John becomes an NBA squad. But let's be.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
Honest, though, the last two years, Aaron Rodgers leaves the NFC,
a lot of these, Jordan loves a lot of the
you know, Chicago did nev Caleb Washington was a mess.
San Francisco was great, Detroit was good. Now they're exceptional.
The last two years, the NFCS had a pretty weak
middle and bottom. Well that's the yeah, yeah, that I

(05:49):
mean Green Bay Detroit. So there was this window and
we're like, oh, they won twelve games, that's a nine
win team in the AFC.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
That's fair because they weren't. Then they'd get into the
dance and they would get beat at home by the Niners.
They would get rolled at home by the Packers. They
would go on the road and get beat by the Niners.
So it's like, well, they got their chances with it inflated. Yeah,
that is fair because the comp the division was Listen,
they always played Philly tight, right, They're probably gonna split
those games most years. And they got to beat up

(06:19):
on Washington in the Giants, and clearly Washington today to
me was actually a big winner. I was like, damn,
they might be a little better than I thought. Yeah,
sometimes I'm more impressed with them in a loss than
I have with some of there. But that's a problem
for the Cowboys and the Eagles because I'm watching the
Eagles a day and Sirianni's screaming at fans. It's like, hey, Nick,
calm down, buddy. I mean, you're barely beating the Browns

(06:39):
is like a ten point favorite at home. Your fans
aren't happy with you, and then they have a point.
And the Cowboys, this was obviously a bad matchup for
them given their injuries, but they're just getting their butt
kicked at home. And Dak talked about it this week.
He's like, listen, you know, we got to start. We
got to take care of business at home. It ain't
even close. It ain't even close.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
Listen, go back to last year. Hackers, Saint Ravens, Lions
have humiliated them at home. Now, those are good teams,
that's near the top of the league.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
Well, that's to your argument then they're twelve wins, a
little inflated. And then when you get them against the
big boys, they get some track. The Eagles, who they're
comfortable playing, they're getting work. Look at the Niners game
last year, I mean, what was the planal score of that?
Like forty five to ten? You got this thot So
I think.

Speaker 1 (07:28):
I think you have to really, this will sound crazy.
I would considering. Listen, you're gonna pay. They already paid
Dak and CD. Would you consider to get draft capital?
You get a first round pick for Micah.

Speaker 2 (07:44):
You get, you'd get more than that. I get. I
met people ask me, cowboy fan, should we just do this?
What's the point Our defense isn't even close? Why wouldn't
we just start over?

Speaker 1 (07:53):
And Hutchison's injury today is hurt breaking for Detroit. But
before that injury, he's not Miles Garrett. He's not high,
he's not Nick Bosa, He's not He's not as big
as strong. He can be overwhelmed by like a Trent Williams.
He can disappear in big spots with top tackles.

Speaker 2 (08:10):
I think.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
Micah a lot of teams would use an edge rusher.
I think you have to think about moving off it,
getting a first and a third and just going into
the because what Dallas has to find now, John, they
got to find cheap, good players. And so I do
want to say this about Detroit. Tom Brady made a
point today and I thought it was a really good one.

(08:35):
He said, Detroit has something that is really special. They
can play power football. They can play efficient football with
that offensive line. They can play keep away just grind
you out, or they can throw the ball. But they
can also get clever with Ben Jompson. It's a really
fun offense for players. It's very rare, John, Usually you

(08:57):
have to pick your spots and they don't have a
mobile quarterback. But shit, they can road grade you. They
can go over the top with Williams. They do trick
plays with Ben Johnson. Hutchison's injury is just devastating and gutting.
But I gotta tell you there's not a lot of
offenses in the league that can beat you like six ways.
I thought it was a good point I Detroit. I

(09:18):
mean Dallas today had no answers and yeah, plus injuries,
but they did seven eight different ways to beat you.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
Well, with McCaffrey out as the most complete offense in
the league. And one thing they even had over the
forty nine ers last year is their offensive line is
just better. I mean, Brady mentioned that Pine Stools the
best right tackle in the NFL. You know now that
you know Lane's an aging player, you know the thing
that hit me when he's laying on the ground. And
I would imagine beating a team seven hundred to nothing
in the locker room, It's it's not gonna be as

(09:46):
joyous as sometimes they can be with Dan Campbell. It's
gonna be a weird vibe for them. I think the team,
and you know their general manager comes from the Rams,
Brad Quinn, bray Quinn is his name, and he he's
seen Brad Wessein Brad Quinn yeah, or excuse me, Brad Holmes.
And he saw Les and Shawn and that operation get

(10:09):
really aggressive over the years. And he was part of
an aggressive trade when they did the samh the Matt
Stafford Jared Goff trade. Don't you call the Raiders. I
mean that thing is just that's a tire fire burning
even stronger by the week and just say, hey, listen,
we'll give you two ones for Max Crosby. Yeah, like seriously.
You know Max Crosby played his college football at a

(10:29):
smaller school in Michigan. Yeah, the Raiders are going nowhere
with him. Obviously DeVante separate, but hey, because you can't.
You have games like today before He's laying there on
the ground and some of their players are in tears.
I mean Jared Gofwelklet he was crying because Jared's no
dummy like he's He's been to a Super Bowl, he
got close last year. He knows that's their best player

(10:50):
on their team at the most important non quarterback position
in the NFL. Laying there with We obviously didn't see
the replay what I would have magine, and there might
have been a bone sticking out of his leg. It
took a long time for them to get him in
the car.

Speaker 1 (11:02):
Well, Fox, I wouldn't show it.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Yeah, so I if you told me it was a
compound fracture, that's kind of what I expected to me.
Max Crosby honestly kind of fits their ethos and their culture.
Like if I'm the Lions, Max Crosby makes more sense
than giving the farm for Micah Parsis, who's a little
bit more of a one trick pony, would you offer
two ones for Max Crosby. Obviously there's financial, you know,
situations there, but I think I would go all in

(11:26):
on this because if you're Detroit, you're thinking if our
defense two weeks ago or three weeks ago against Geno's, like,
what the hell is this? You can't win a super
Bowl and you can't cover. But if you subtract that game,
they've been actually pretty good on defense, Like they look
like a different team today, but you're not winning a
super Bowl. I don't think with him on gone for
the year with no replacement, And to me, Max Crosby

(11:48):
and would be worth it to quote unquote overspend a
little bit to get them.

Speaker 1 (11:53):
And also, you know the Raiders would do it because
they want multiple ones because they want to be able
to have chess pieces to move up the board if
they are like fourth or fifth, they're going to get
a quarterback.

Speaker 2 (12:05):
That's obvious.

Speaker 1 (12:05):
No, I think that's great. I think there's a couple
of things that are going to happen at the trade deadline,
so the Cowboys are humiliated. Max Crosby to the Lions,
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Speaker 1 (13:44):
There's no order we have to go in today. I
do want to go back. I want to go to
the Chicago Jacksonville game because I don't know if I've
felt this way about the Chicago Bears. And I'm not
joking in a decade. So thirty five sixteen over Jacksonville. Listen,
Caleb's gotten better every week and Jacksonville Doug Peterson's probably

(14:08):
the next coach to get fired. I mean, they don't
do anything well, but John, you start looking at that
performance today. He in over the last three to four weeks,
his confidence and I think some of that stuff was
generated from scheme and play calling. Some of it wasn't.
But twenty three to twenty seven four tds fifty percent

(14:30):
on third down and by the way, Keenan Allen is
back today. I looked at that Chicago team and I'm like,
I've has any other team in the league gotten noticeably
better four to five weeks.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
In a row? Can I push back a little bit? Sure? Sure,
because I do think listen, part of making the playoffs,
especially with a team like the Bears, who haven't been
good in a long time, you're gonna have to spit
your playing a last play schedule win games against bad teams,
right right, you can get to nine to ten wins.
Five of them are gonna come against crappy opponents, and
they're doing that, so they deserve credit. There are four

(15:04):
wins come against four teams who have each won one game. Right.
The Jags are terrible, The Panthers are probably worse. The
Titans are probably worse than both of them. You know,
I mean we're talking bad teams now, right. This is
not college. You don't set your schedule here, so you
just play the way it breaks. They play down the stretch.

(15:26):
If they do this in some games against the Lions,
against Minnesota, I'll be the first to say this didn't
be a scary team in the playoffs. They go a
stretch where they basically play six divisional games, all starting
within like I think in like three weeks from now
with the Packers till the end of the season, with
the forty nine ers thrown in there, I'll be very
interested to see how they look because we've seen them
against one good team this year. Now, like you said,

(15:48):
young quarterback new to the NFL, listen, I'm not trying
to act like you shouldn't put all your eggs in
the basket on the game September tenth, more than the
middle of October with a rookie quarterback. But they got
destroy against the Texans, who are a clear playoff team.
So it's they're doing what they're supposed to do. They
clearly have a lot of confidence the wide receivers. Caleb

(16:08):
to me, he's much I would say more, feels more
comfortable throwing the ball down field.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
No, and and by the way he's developed our relationship
now with two players Cole Comette and DJ Moore, he
is clearly comfortab now Keenan Allen's probably a progression in
three weeks, but there is something to be said, Like
he made a couple throws to cole Comett today and
it's like, Okay, he's found his tight end, he's got
his deep threat. Sometimes it takes like bow Nicks in

(16:37):
Courtland Sutton Obviously bow trusts him, doesn't trust the other guys.

Speaker 2 (16:41):
I I don't know.

Speaker 1 (16:42):
I kind of look at it and I think to myself,
they'll probably go two and four against those teams in
their division. But I do think but.

Speaker 2 (16:49):
If the Colline they go two and four, they're probably
in the playoffs because they got some other crappy teams
coming up on the schedule. And if they were to
beat Washington, I think they play him next week. All
of a sudden, you're looking, they would all they have
to go to and four and if they be I
think they got Seattle late in the year to get
to nine wins and that's probably a wild card spot.
So to me, there's a big difference to and four,
like oh, I mean it's ozho and six because to me,

(17:13):
you look at their division, they're the fourth best team obvious,
that's the best division.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
That's the best division now easily in the NFL.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
This isn't a bad thing to say because you go, well,
the Packers obviously are good. The Lions, you know, if
they can somehow get a replacement for Hutchinson or a
juggernaut and the fight he's got to lost the game,
and we're one of the best coach teams in the league.
So I've torn with him because I tip your hat.
You do what you're supposed to do. But they're doing
it against the number one teams you would want to

(17:41):
play for, Like we need to win this week, you
would sign up for the teams they're playing. They played
the Patriots in a couple weeks. There's another win.

Speaker 1 (17:48):
I will say this Eberflus is interesting because, like Robert Sala,
I think he's really good on his side of the ball.
And the difference is Aaron doesn't extend pocket like Caleb.
And you know Caleb today, you know I just told
to the numbers.

Speaker 2 (18:05):
I mean he was.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
Almost like perfect even his postgame interview, like he just
he's confident without being obnoxious, like he's getting very comfortable.
Even after justin Field's wins, I felt they were a
little bit of a mirage. I'd be like, Okay, like
today you're like today Caleb sat in the pocket like

(18:25):
and clearly is connecting with his guys, and I'm like,
this is a he can sit in the pocket and throw.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
Totally agree, and I'm not comparing them to last year's
fraudulent wins with the Chicago Bears. I'm just saying that
the power of their opponents has a little feel. We're
seeing what's happening with Lane in Ole, miss. You watch
the first four weeks, like, gee, this team could go
eleven and one. All of a sudden they start playing
some better teams and now you're like, are they going
to get to nine and three? And it's because of

(18:54):
the of the talents and I mean the strength of
the teams they have to go through, starting with their division,
the forty nine ers, and it's just we've seen him
play one good team and it was I put it
more on the coaching staff too. Warner said something that
have you ever flown JSX? You ever heard of that?

Speaker 1 (19:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Yeah, it's incredible, and they starlink. I was on the
plane today you could watch it was like faster than
my TV at my house and I'm watching the game
in Warner's like, you know what, Shane Waldron told me
he doesn't script any plays. And you can tell Warner
was it's a little weird. You know, most most coaches
do the first fifteen. He's just a field guy. I'm
like Kyle Shannean scripts the second half as well at halftime.

(19:31):
I mean most coaches coming back to Bill Wallash. So
that's just your field coach, offensive guy with a young quarterback.
But you comet stud obviously, Keenan back Romes. They've developed
a little chemistry Roman Caleb and Dj is a special player.
So they just have so many weapons. Can the O
line hold up against the better teams they play and

(19:51):
not get Caleb killed which we saw in the one
primetime game. Yeah, because when he's comfortable some of the
touch passes day we're not there or four weeks ago,
regardless of who's toast, that was.

Speaker 1 (20:04):
Yeah, he made a couple of He made a throw
last week Dj Moore back of the end zone that
was like a veteran play as a Mahomes throw. That
was like, Okay, that's a big boy throw today. He
wasn't forced into that situation much, but okay, I want to.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
Give a conversation about that. The other quarterback though really quick.
It was on the other side, you know.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
Trevor Lawrence Trevor. Because first of all, that staff it's
not working. You know, Doug Peterson had a reputation, so
I was totally wrong. I thought he was a perfect fit,
kind of a casual guy. I thought it was gonna work.
But you know, when he went to Philadelphia at work,
because Laurie and Howie are so intense, and so they're

(20:43):
hovering over the franchise right like you know that. I mean,
everybody in Philly we know they're security guy, and the
talk radio.

Speaker 2 (20:51):
Is on you.

Speaker 1 (20:51):
If you have one bad situational series. Philadelphia holds its
coach is responsible. You go down to Jacksonville, nobody's paying
attention and it's like the worst of Doug Peterson's come out.
They're loose, they're not good on details. That was the
knock when he went to Philly. It's like, you know,
and he's calling the plays. You know, he loves to

(21:14):
give guys ice cream. He's always rewarding him. He's like
the stepdad everybody loves. You can't do that in Philadelphia.
You'll get your ass wrung out by WIP radio, the fans.
I mean, that's Philadelphia is one of those studies. They
hold you accountable. Jacksonville doesn't. And I think the team
just feels loose and inefficient.

Speaker 2 (21:35):
I don't disagree with anyone that makes the argument. By
the time, if someone's listening to this Monday morning at breakfast,
he might get relieved of his duties. I do think
they'll watching Trevor Lawrence, like separate from coaching just to
make basic passes. And there were times today where his
guys It's the NFL, had some bad drops. So I'm
not acting like this guy's jim Arcus Russell here or

(21:56):
Joey Harrington. But for someone that got two hundred million
dollars based on I would say limited production and success,
it did feel a little bit like what bad NBA
teams do, like the Washington Wizards when they gave Bradley
Beal two hundred and fifty million dollars. And I don't
know if this is going to work in that operation.

(22:17):
That's right, and listen. I think at this point in time,
I don't think it's really debatable that his career has
been a borderline. I mean for him, not really. He's
made a bunch of money, but as a player, the
hype was very similar to Andrew Locke, and you watch
the guy play, he's not even in the same It
wasn't even on the same level as Caleb Williams that
a lot of people were making fun of like three
weeks previously. Oh, Caleb was.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
You know there's sometimes John, something happens where there's a
convergence of things either good or bad. So you have
sort of casual not tied on the details. Doug Peterson,
a quarterback who reportedly likes the game, doesn't live for it,
a media that's toothless, and a market nobody pays attention to.

(23:00):
So if you have a bad series, nobody calls you out.
And there they've all joined together and it's it's what
happened to why Nick Saban and guys like Nick Saban
after wins called good press. You know, rat poison is
that everybody acts the same way when they lose their pissed,

(23:24):
but when you win, you get sloppy and lazy, and
Jacksonville feels like a sloppy franchise to me. All these
things converge. A quarterback that likes the game, but that
was the knock. That was the knock very early in
his career. Like, he doesn't live for it, he's not
obsessed by it, and Breeze was obsessed Manning was Mahomes
is obsessed, and I just think all these things are

(23:45):
adding up to a to a big soft pillow of
a team.

Speaker 2 (23:49):
Yeah. To me, just their record speaks for itself since
the Cons have owned the family. Just google where they've
drafted every single year. I mean the majority is not
the top ten, it's the top five. I mean that's
that's hard to do, all right.

Speaker 1 (24:01):
He's a former scout for the Eagles. Philadelphia twenty, Cleveland
sixteen Deshaun Watson. We could go on. I mean, he's
playing because the owner wants him to play, and Kevin
Stefanski's taken the sword for the organization. Deshaun just can't play.
But it is interesting about Philly. So they were an
eight and a half point favorite today and j Mack
was all over this, and I'm like, I'm not taking

(24:21):
an eight and a half point favorite because Philadelphia is weird.
So if I just if you didn't watch the game,
and I said Jalen Hurts was sixteen to twenty five,
fourteen Rushes two sixty four to two TDS, Aj Brown
DeVante Smith had touchdowns, you would think, Jesus, they look
great when I watched them, I'll get to Sirianni in

(24:42):
a second. Well, when I watched Philadelphia, I feel like
they leave so much on the floor, so much on
the table. Is that, first of all, they're not the
same team without AJ Brown. He's clearly a difference maker.
Very rarely does a receiver have that kind of impact.
I mean, you could Brandon Ayuke didn't do so squad
for weeks. San Francisco could still score points. Ceedee Lamb,

(25:03):
you take him out. Dallas can't score I mean, and
AJ Brown is really I mean, I've never seen a
coach when he loses a player act like Mike vrabelbin
when they lost to AJ Brown, Like Vrabel was like, okay,
I can't remember that press conference. It's like I can't
win here, like it's over. And Vrabel's not somebody who loves,

(25:24):
you know, outspoken receivers. That's not his game. So but
twenty sixteen, I just I look at Philadelphia and I
think the coach is screaming at fans.

Speaker 2 (25:35):
I feel I don't know, I feel.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
Like the roster's closer to an A and the performance
always feels like a b am I wrong.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
Yeah to me? The quarterback, like you said, we can
get into Syriana here in a minute, if we just
use Jalen in a vacuum, Well, three of the plays
he hit aj Brown twice on big go routes and
then he hit DeVante Adams or DeVante Smith on a
big play. So what does that account for hundred and
twenty five hundred and thirty of the two hundreds.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
Those guys are between the two one hundred and seventy
five yards.

Speaker 2 (26:05):
Yeah, so to me, he's a go ball thrower, which
when all you do is throw a gobal, this isn't
college or high school that those don't hit often in
the pros and kind of a scramble run around guy.
He cannot pick you apart in the pocket. There was
one point in time today in the game where I
think Vilma was like, I don't know why these fans
are booing. You don't know why. It's thirteen to ten

(26:26):
against the Browns. They can't move the ball and Jalen's
the ball's flying all over the place. There is no
rhythm to their offense. It looks very similar as it
did last year. And at one point in time I
looked down at the box score, I'm like, I'd have
to find a way to get the ball to Saquan
even more. Yeah, And I think sometimes coaches, you know
he had when I look down, he was like fifteen

(26:47):
rushes and he was averaging a little less than three
yards of carry. Yeah, so most coaches freak out and go,
this isn't working. Well. You don't have Peyton Manning or
Tom Brady slinging the pill around. So just keep the
Kyle Shanahans McVeigh back when he had Todd Gurley. They
will stick with it because when you ever you have
Derrick Henry, eventually the guy might break a play for
thirty yards. Slows down the game, makes it easier on

(27:09):
your quarterback. And I think they have been way too
quick to get away from Saquon because really the only
passes they're hitting are these kind of bombs down the field.
It's why when you remove AJ, they look even worse.
I mean, if AJ obviously had been hurt like he
had previous weeks, I think they lose today.

Speaker 1 (27:25):
Let me give you a comp if their defense was
the Legion of Boom and Seattle, they could win a
Super Bowl. Because when you go back and look at
Russell Wilson's career, what we know now happened late in Seattle,
Denver and Pittsburgh. He was great with the rainbow throws
over the top or when he was moving. He had
a great running back. But if you ask Russell to

(27:48):
sit in the pocket, Pete Carroll and John Snyder and
Peyton were like, it doesn't work. So Philadelphia has not
had a great defense, especially in the back end. So
they lose, you know, they give up points. But for years,
in years, I said this Friday on the show is
I was full. I thought Russ was engineering stuff. Let
Russ cook. I bought into it. And then all of
a sudden, you're like, boy, when you take away that

(28:08):
defense and Marshaw and You're like, I don't know. He
can't go toe to toe with the big guys from
the pocket. If you can contain him, bring the rush
ends in and just box him in. Russell's a very ineffective.
Part two is a better pocket guy than Russell Wilson.
And I look at Jalen Hurts and I and I
see a little Russell Wilson where over the top, Yes,
surround it with the I mean, good guy. He had

(28:28):
the best center in a decade Lane Johnson, aj Brown.
It's easy to look like it's you. But to your
point in the pocket, I don't trust him.

Speaker 2 (28:38):
Well, that's the thing watching Washington play today, Jaden is
such a better thrower standing there within the tackle box,
if not really even close. Well, he's got a better arm,
he's more naturally accurate. Most people thought. You know, whenever
you text people in the league when Jalen Hurts are struggling,
they all go, yeah, it kind of reminds me Oklahoma again,
kind of reminds me of the guy that everyone scat

(29:00):
in thought is when he got drafted second round, the
Eagles didn't just get questioned because they drafted a quarterback
in the second round. When they had wentz it was
they took him that high. He was like, damn. And
sometimes it comes out like he's not a great thrower
of the football. Obviously he throws a good go ball,

(29:20):
but just a good thrower of the football in the pocket.
We just talked about Kirk Cousins. I had Jay Gruden
on the pod like a month ago. He's like, if
you don't touch him, he might be the best seven
on seven player in the league right just throwing. Just
he's a good thrower of the football. Jalen. I don't
know if he's not comfortable, it's not natural. He doesn't
have great velocity on just sitting in the pocket throws,

(29:42):
which is weird for a guy that does have a
powerful arm on the loop throw. You know, Russell had
a better ball in his prime than Jalen, just throwing
like an outrout or whatever. He just wasn't that comfortable
throwing it over the middle from the pocket because he
couldn't see. Jalen's a little shorter. He's taller than Russell,
but shorter than average quarterback. So maybe it's just not
as comfortable seeing stuff because he clearly when he moves

(30:05):
is better outside the tackles making plays. But you can't
run a consistent offense play in that way. Yeah, it's very,
very difficult. So now it's going to be another coach
or a coordinator's fault. Maybe it's just a player.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
Yeah, let me ask you. So, Sirianni, knowing he's on
the hot seat, knowing that his sort of demeanor has
been dubbed juvenile, comes in, shaves his head at one point,
yelling at fans like it to me, it's just bro,
you're the head football coach. Of the Philadelphia Eagles. Like

(30:37):
he just feels like he doesn't have a self awareness.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
You know.

Speaker 1 (30:43):
It's almost like Baker's first couple of years in the league.
You knew he was talented, but you're like, dude, you're
starting fires at the podium on Wednesday.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
Just don't.

Speaker 1 (30:50):
You don't have to win and be the snarkiest, funniest
guy at the podium. Just let other people win. And
now Baker's matured. But I feel like Nick sometimes doesn't
get it.

Speaker 2 (30:59):
Yeah to me, I don't know if there's a wager
you can place with our friends at DraftKings, but I
think he's a borderline lock to not be the head
coach for the Eagles in twenty twenty five. Yeah, and
that's not making a prediction. They're missing the playoffs and
making the playoffs, Like he will not be the coach
next year. Like this thing him screaming at the fans
is just in what world? In a game that you

(31:21):
barely just beat what many consider as one of the
worst transactions not in football, in like sports history with
Deshaun Watson, the quarterback who was pretty bad today again,
and you are struggling to win the game and you're
screaming at the fans. He'd be one thing if he
was kicking ass and they're still chanting fire, Sirianni, I

(31:41):
would get it. It's like, bro, let's you know, cooler
jets here now. I saw, Jalen Hurt said after the game.
Is one thing that the players talk to Nick about
during the bye week was to get back to his
crazy ways, get back to his roots of being emotional
he had been to. I don't know stoic, I guess

(32:02):
for their taste over the beginning of this season, but
if that what you're trying to get back to, like,
what are we doing? I see under no scenario. I
don't This team's not win the Super Bowl, So I
just don't see how serious Sirianni knows what's going on.
Like the head shave, what did that symbolize to you?
A guy searching a guy? Maybe you got a bad haircut.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
I remember remember when Robert Sala came in with the
black beard, like darkened his beard, and it's just like, bro,
you're you're on camera like twelve minutes on national TV
in an NFL game. Every week, it did feel like
you were trying to make some sort of statement and
I I mean, I think we know now that sala

(32:44):
and Adam Schefter reported that he was he was affected
by the noise. I think Sirianni's affected. I think Philadelphia
is probably the loudest NFL city because talk radio is
so powerful in that city. In the media, there's multiple newspapers.
It's a it's a kind of a working class for
a big sophisticated city. It's it's you know it, it's loud,

(33:05):
and if your Andy Reid could shut it out. But
I think it affected. I think it affects Sirianni.

Speaker 2 (33:12):
Yeah. I mean, I can't speak for every city in America,
but there can't be many places where every single person
in the city, I mean, there's just nothing more important.
And it's a die hard football or I mean just
sports town where you could find the richest guy the
nicest neighborhood, and you could find the poorest guy in
the street and they'd all have a take on the Eagles.
And that Andy's just had a little thicker skin, obviously

(33:35):
had early success. He's just I mean, a much higher
level guy. But I think when you're really emotional like that,
in an emotional place, it's probably not a good combination,
and let's face it, like some guys with more experience
and who have been around the block, like Rabeld be
more equipped to handle it. Obviously, Belichick, you know these guys.

(33:59):
This is a guy six seven years ago was a
position coach no one had ever heard of, and all
of a sudden, you get thrust into the limelight with
a team that then is highly compensated, a lot of
star power. It's not like this is the little engine
that could you look around, high draft picks on defense everywhere,
highly paid wide out, star running back, fifty million dollars, quarterback,

(34:20):
a GM that everyone knows his name, wheeler and dealer,
an owner that is giving you an unlimited check book.
I thought today when it was like thirteen ten and
the Browns were driving and I think it was headed
to the fourth quarter, I'm like, he might have fifteen
minutes left for this job if he loses this game
to the Browns and to Shaun Watson and given their
touchdown came off a block field goal touchdown, I could

(34:43):
see Jeffrey Lurie. I don't know exactly who he would elevate, Fangio, Kellen,
but I could just see him like this is over
and Nick Sirianni honestly could have been fired before Doug
Peterson if he had lost that. That was an enormous
win just to keep the guy's career going.

Speaker 1 (34:58):
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(35:19):
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Green Bay thirty four, Arizona thirteen. So this was my
favorite pick of the week. On my Blazing five, I

(35:43):
went three to oh today, I have the Jets plus
the points tomorrow, so it was a good day. So
the reason I took Green Bay because Arizona beat San
Francisco and you think, oh, okay, and they're getting five points.
I don't trust them. I think Kyler Murray and I
have this sourced from a player, a coach and an

(36:03):
executive is not terribly mature nor totally accountable. He's just
absolutely gifted and off a win over the Niners, they
didn't look like then thirteen penalties, I think they've trailed
at one point like twenty four to three or time.
I mean, they were getting shell They didn't look like
they prepared. And this is why I bet against them,

(36:26):
is that is Green Bay in their division is looking
around thinking, hey, Jordan, we got to get this thing rolling.
Our division's good. Arizona beat San Francisco. It looked like
they took the week off of practice. And I think
a lot of it's Kyler Murray who have defended but
John when they only had twenty three minutes time of possession.
Now Harrison got hurt, they had Connor, they got beat up.

(36:46):
But that's the NFL. But I think there is something
I really believe, and I've heard this again from a
star player, an executive, and a coach in that organization.
Kingsbury ready to go to Colt McCoy. I was told
that by somebody around his staff, like he was done

(37:06):
with it. He played nice to the media, he was
done with it. I know they moved off. Josh Rosen
and I know they're paying Kyder Murray. I don't know
if you can ever win big time with him. We'll
get to Green Bay in a second. But they just
they have too much talent to just not even compete
for the first half.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Yeah, to me, I think if you remove a couple
of those Bruce Arians, Todd Bowles, years with Carson Palmer,
this organization, most of my life has just kind of
been the same, and this team specifically has more talent
than some of the crappy Cardinal teams over the decades.
But when I saw the weather and those guys bundled up,

(37:48):
I thought, you know, my cousin was on the Fresno
State team that almost beat USC and the height of
their dynasty in two thousand and five, and they took
went toe to toe with them, and they were fifteenth
in the country. And after that loss, they didn't even
move in the rankings. The next week they played Reno
and this was like, you know, early November. It was
freezing cold. He said. The moment two guys, our first

(38:09):
two guys stepped off the plane and it was freezing cold.
They freaked out. He's like, oh, we knew he had
no chance and they got blown out and because coming
from you know, Fresno was like eighty five ninety degrees
and when I saw that weather when I got off
the plane today, it was pretty hot. Starts sweating pretty quickly,
and that that's a bad like this is not going
to be a team that travels well because he's a

(38:30):
roller coaster player to begin with. A lot of his plays,
like Jalen, come from kind of freelancing, like let's face it,
and they have shown this year, like when they play
well and show a little fight and he gets their
healthy freelancing. Yeah, he can make plays. They've also got
boat raced a couple times and look completely lifeless. And
today I would say, about ten minutes into that game,

(38:50):
probably if you didn't want to wash Jordan Love and
weren't a Packer fan, the game was irrelevant because they
were going to toy with them. It was a joke.
So yeah, it starts with it always starts with your player,
how much he cares, how hard he wants it. I
do think it's just a very hard player to play
with the way he plays. I mean a lot of
his great highlights when you think about it over the
years are kind of freelance plays not necessarily like three

(39:13):
step drop great hitch hit the out round Like, that's
not really his style.

Speaker 1 (39:19):
Green Bay is obviously good. The question with me because
I think Jordan loves a little more far than Aaron Rodgers.
He had a ball up the sideline today. He just
threw a balloon, a hot air balloon up. Dobbs made
the catch, kind of clever, got into the end zone.
I'm like, that's not a great He's just.

Speaker 4 (39:33):
Clips fifteen times this season, and he's missed a couple
of games, so he lets it grip and I like
that about him. And that was the thing on Utah State.
People are like, he he can, He's gonna make some
bad throws. But Mahomes has a crappy pick every weekend.
So I kind of live with it if you have
some it, and I think Jordan's got a lot of it.

(39:54):
There are so many mouse to feed. I mean they
have like two or three tight ends. I like, there's
a lot of mouse to feed. And there are a
lot of young guys and none of them have been
paid yet. And there was a rumor that Romeo Dobbs
was unhappy like last week of the week before and
Green Bay is like a low ego franchise, but generally
there's a pecking.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
Order to an organization. Well, outside of Jordan, nobody's getting
paid offensively, And I'm just I'm interested to I know
they're talented. Are they a super Bowl team? Do they
have the maturity to go on the road? What do
you make of them?

Speaker 2 (40:31):
I think they definitely have the talent to be a
super Bowl contender, yes, and to make a run in
the NFC. And it all comes down to, like they
beat the Niners last year, if Jordan doesn't get kind
of squirrely down the stretch of that game, So to me,
can he get on a streak for a three game
stretch like Joe Flacco or Eli Manning Because he's probably
more talented than those guys I just listed, right, just

(40:51):
in terms of mobility, arm strength, like you said he's got,
He's more far than Rogers. The problem when you play
like that, some of Farv's most iconic moments actually went
against them, right, crazy picks in playoff games because they're
in the playoffs right and in depending Once all these
teams start playing each other like they could still win
the division, there's now that Hutchinson's injured. We'll see as

(41:13):
Minnesota plays better teams what it looks like. And I'm
not trying to diminish anything they've done, but you know,
we'll see how long, Like are they just gonna they're
gonna roll the fifteen wins? Or what happens when they
have a two game losing streak? You know, the Packers.
These guys now have been through a lot together, like
the young nucleus, So I like him. I mean you
watch him on days like today, It's like, damn bit.

(41:35):
They could score on anybody because they got wide receivers
for days. And like you said, that quarterback. Their coach
is really good, like Lafleurs, really established himself. He doesn't
get the credit as McVeigh or Kyle, even Kevin O'Connell.
But never forget he's he's wont some playoff games. I
know he hasn't been to the super Bowl, but him
and Aaron, he resurrected Aaron's career and then took Jordan

(41:56):
Love from last year crappy first half the GM saying yeah,
we'll see how these last ten games go, right, basically
saying this guy's career as our starting quarterbacks in jeopardy
to then coaching them up down the stretch to now,
what's the record nowt four to two or three and two,
like yeah, these one games with the leak, willis like
he's got a lot of different pitches. I like the

(42:16):
Packers coming into the season still do to me. Usually
their success also comes down to, like does their defense
come to play in big games, because historically with the
Rogers teams it did not.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
One year it did and they won the Super Bowl.

Speaker 2 (42:27):
The other thing for them is now depends on seating,
like they might be better on the road, like go
to Dallas and a dome, go to Minnesota in a dome.
They have always this great passing game. And then when
they get the number one seed or two seed, they
play these home games and it's negative ten degrees. So
it's like, well, you're not gonna throw for three hundred
yards in this Yeah, where they you put them last
year in Dallas, It's like, okay, throw it away. They

(42:50):
don't mind going out to San Francisco in January when
it's you know, sixty seven degrees at kickoff. They're better
off playing. I know LA won't have a home game,
but a game like that actually playing Minnesota. I don't
think they would be uncomfortable playing at Minnesota in a
playoff game at all. They would much rather. I think
they're the way they're built offensively, they're better suited to

(43:11):
go to one of these warmer weather cities on the
road in a playoff game where if he gets hot,
they can easily score thirty points.

Speaker 1 (43:18):
Okay, my controversial take of the week. LA Chargers beat
Denver twenty three sixteen. Got off to a huge lead
and held on. So we did something this week. I
think it was Friday on the show and I was saying,
you know, would I take well, no, so I take

(43:39):
pretty almost over. I'm not taking him over Lamar Mahalmes
or Allen, but there's a lot of guys in there,
like Kayleb Williams. I said, I think Caleb's more talented
or Jayden Daniels. I think Jayden's more talented, and nobody
really had a reaction until I said bow Nicks, I
would take him over. Brought purty. So before we get
to the Chargers Denver game. One of the things I

(44:02):
think a lot about is there is a huge difference
the Niner quarterback position and Brock clearly had a lot
of college starts. Like bow Nicks, he throws an accurate ball.
They both move way better than most people give him
credit for. I mean, bo today had a run. He
was like racing past a like an edge linebacker and
for a first down. I mean it was just sprinting.

(44:23):
And brock Purty moves better than people think. But I
think it's it's they're two different asks in this league,
and the ask for brock Purty was don't screw it up.
We've got an all star team and the best scheme
guy in the league. Are you good cognitively and can
you throw completions? That's also the Niners are one of

(44:44):
the better yards after the catch team, So there's a
lot of stuff where you get yardage and guys, you know.
In Denver it was viewed as a five and a
half win roster. In Vegas, one receiver, I like a
lot Courtland something a lot Mims is unproven. Franklin's a
rook tight ends are okay, left tackles good, right side
of the old lines wonky, and so the ask in

(45:07):
a division with herbon Andy Reid is substantially harder. Like today,
he had a terrible first half, they were missing two
offensive line starters. Second halfy is pretty good, although the
coverage changes. I didn't think it was a hot take.
I think it's very close. I like Bownicks more than
brock Purty. One guy's a first round pick, one guy's

(45:27):
a seventh, but I can't hold that against him. Where
to you what is this seat? Because we don't think
these guys are mahomes. I'm guessing you think bow Nicks
has a lower ceiling than brock Purty.

Speaker 2 (45:42):
That's my guess. I think that's I think that takes
pretty insane the information we have right now, because I
think the way you describe brock Purty is two years
ago when he gets inserted after Trey Lance goes down
and Jimmy Garoppolo goes down. But if you watch the
way he played last year, and if you watch the
way he's playing right now, he has been pretty excellent

(46:03):
this season. Yeah, like played at a really like I
mean ran circles around Seattle the other night. Yeah. And
I think sometimes we talked about Deebo Samuel the wide receiver,
like he's Jerry Rice or Randy Moss. I mean, you
can't really run routes. He's not exactly mister Marvin Harrison
senior out there. Kittle's banged up a lot. Obviously a
good player, but a lot of teams have good tight ends.

(46:24):
Like that's what's there's a ton of tight ends all
over the NFL. How many guys right now are playing
better than Bruck Perdy because listen, we could say, oh,
Caleb one day, let's see Caleb win one big game.
Brock's been in big game from the moment he started
and the last two years, starting last year and then
this year, every game really matters. And if you lose
his disaster and Super Bowl or bust, like I don't

(46:46):
know bo Nicks who again, I like that first the
game was over at halftime because of how shitty he was,
so unless like Jim Harball was gonna die at halftime
for whatever illness he had, Like they were not winning
that game.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
But couldn't argue this.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Though, But you're talking physical skill. You're talking physical skills.
I'm like, eventually you got to play right. So a
lot of these guys in all positions have great physical
skills and then you play football, and like Drew Brees
didn't have the physical skills even remove like the Rogers
and the Brady of hundreds of guys that were drafted,
maybe not one hundred, I don't know how many that

(47:20):
would it. Let's say fifty guys who were drafted over
a decade period that should have ran circles around him
and couldn't hold his jock because eventually just got to
play quarterback.

Speaker 1 (47:28):
Well, but so it's a circumstance league. So Mahomes is
not having a good year. He's like nineteenth on quarterback
grades with Andy Reid, Why weapon circumstances? Rashie, Rice Hurt,
Josh Allen just had a game. It's as worst as
a pro why circumstances? Running backs? Hurt didn't have a
slut guy. So even the greatest guys in the league

(47:51):
come down a lot when they don't have much to
work with. Dak Prescott has one receiver that's been bad
a lot this year. Now that's not Mahomes around. But
my point is everybody, even the greatest in the world.
I mean, let's be honest, Lamar's having a great year.
Well god, I mean, Zay Flowers is one of three
guys I trust, Mark Andrew brus I mean, they have

(48:12):
a great staff.

Speaker 2 (48:13):
I mean Baltimore, Barrick Henry's been a home run for them.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Yeah, I mean so long Lamar's having his best year.
So my take is people are forgetting Denver was a
five win team in Vegas. Vegas only cares about So
if you take Courtland Sutton out, I'd argue they don't
have a very good offensive player in the roster.

Speaker 2 (48:33):
Yeah. I think when you add context to everything you're saying,
I think when people see that, they go if I
would have put Bo Nicks on the twenty two forty
nine ers as a rookie, are they playing Billy in
the super Bowl or I mean in the NFC Championshiphip?
And that's what Brock was uniquely suited. Now, he got
a weird situation where he got to sit all out

(48:53):
of the year and then come in right at the
peak when the team was coming. But I do think
if you just look at the last two years when
he's been the full time star, like if I'm Kyle
and John, they are like five quarterbacks. The thing with
Mahomes or Alan, even Lamar, even though Lamar basically plays
well every game. Now it's like I don't care what
I can watch Patrick Mahomes have a shitty half, it
means nothing to me. It's like watching Steph Curry go

(49:15):
over ten. You know, Josh Allen have some bad games,
Like what are we arguing at this point? Like he's
those guys are elite, so obviously, Alan, Mahomes and Lamar
no brainers to me. If you can watch Herbert today
went healthy with Jim Harbaugh and go that's ain't one
of the best players in the league. Like we're not
on the same wavelength. I'm not even gonna speak with
you because it's a waste of time. Like that's an

(49:36):
elite player. And I would trade Brock Purty for that guy,
and so would Kyle and John. I would throw CJ.
Stroud in there, who's I think pretty special and plays
in that offense and looks awesome. I don't think and
I don't think you could argue anyone else like Caleb.
Like all these guys, none of them have played in
the big game. I've seen Brock and I've seen Dak
in big games when they both had really good teams

(49:58):
and one guy not screw and the other guy screwed up,
like I've seen it with Jared Goff too. Again, these
are good players, but I'm giving him the nod over
these guys, and that's kind of the crew. So, yeah,
is brock Purty ever going to be the best quarterback
in the league? But is he better than most guys
like consistently from six to seven to like twelve, which
I think we all kind of speak the range he's

(50:19):
in and that the answer is yes. And is he
a big no? Is he a strong no? But can
he play football? Can he play football? And I think
the answer is a resounding yes for a guy that
is very difficult to play for. Right, It's not easy
to like, it's hard to play for Andy Reid like it.
It is hard to play for Bill Watsh. That's the
other thing. I think we act like it's easy to

(50:40):
play for these guys the way Tom, like Tom would
be like, look, this was a difficult environment. This is not.
That's why so many guys fail because cognitively and mentally
they just get wiped out. They can't handle it. And
this guy. The other thing that I why I have
so much I say confidence speaking about him and defending
him in arguments like this is obviously as a teammate,

(51:02):
you're gonna support guys, but I think there's a different level,
like Trent Williams, who's a first bout Hall of Famer,
and Fred Warner, who was his number one supporter of
the moment he started because he saw him every Dan
Scout team. They have been. The way they've spoke about
him from day one is like, I don't think these
guys just throw that out. I'm removing Kittle, who could
just say whatever, some of these other guys. I'm just
talking about those two guys first bout Hall of Famers then,

(51:24):
aren't mister you know, give you a bunch of compliments.
Twenty four to seven got a little Belichick in the
way they speak about others. You really got to impress them.
And it's like and then the way Kyle talks about him,
because let's face it, like Jimmy Garoppolo when he was
good was like a GoF Dak lights kind of yeah.
And Brock Perdy on his worst day is that like

(51:45):
he's so much to me, he's better player than Dak,
And I like, I think Dak's fine. He's a better
player than going.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
He throws a better ball too. Dank's not a good thrower.
Deck's never been an elite thrower ever that, but they
are also like arguments like the Bears.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
Like obviously the Niners, the Bears called them Caleb for Brock,
they would say no, But the Bears would say no too,
because they got this guy on the contract. Like there
are all these variables and this is in the NBA,
but there is no guarantee that we'll see when Caleb
plays these big games at Green Bay. I've seen Brock
play the teams or against the Lions, right, or against

(52:22):
the Eagles like that. That's a different level than playing
the Jags were about to fire their coach, right, that's all.
That's all I'm saying these guys.

Speaker 1 (52:29):
But no, no, no, I think Shanahan, deebo I, U Kittle,
Trent Williams and that scheme. You literally can't play the
position if you can't succeed to some level. That was
Trey Lance. He just couldn't. He couldn't make throws. So
it'll be fun to play out. I think Brock Pertty
is a better quarterback probably today. Bonnicks had a good

(52:49):
second half. Game was over. It was very Chargers like
the Chargers, I mean, they were never in doubt losing
that game. But God, did they mail it into the
second half. It was a weird that Jim Harball left
the field. He went to the locker room before the game.
I couldn't.

Speaker 2 (53:03):
Did he think I can't? Also, he went to the
blue tent. First coach I've ever seen go to the
blue ten.

Speaker 1 (53:06):
I don't even know what that. I don't want to speculate.
That was odd. Okay, there's two college games. Because there's
some games I'm not going to waste anybody's time on.
So I want to talk Ohio State and Oregon. So

(53:26):
all summer long, John, I'm sure you heard me say
Oregon's gonna win in Eugene. They'll meet later. Ohio State
will win. But Oregon's won now thirty five to thirty
six games there. Even when they played poorly, they win.
So Ohio State I predicted. I said they're going to
go on the road, They're going to have a bunch
of penalties. They had eight. I said clock management will
be harder. Last play of the game it was. I said,

(53:47):
it's very hard to ask a bunch of nineteen twenty
year old kids to go and play in Eugene. I've
sat in that stadium ten times. You can't. You and
I could be eight feet apart. You can't hear yourself.
It's sunken into the ground. It's not one hundred thousand,
it's sixty and you can't. It's just insanely loud. So
but I looked at Ohio State and my take was, well,

(54:08):
both the receivers Smith and Amika like Buka, I think
the last name is both were sensational. One had nine catches,
one had ten. They ran the ball. Will Howard was
twenty eight to thirty five. My tach was through a take. Yeah,
I mean my take was. My only disappointment is Oregon

(54:30):
averaged almost seven and a half yards of play Dylan Gabe,
I mean they had five hundred yards of offense, So
you know, and listen, I don't love that for Ohio
State because I think they have so many elite athletes.
I don't think Oregon should. I mean, Oregon got pushed
around by different defenses this year, including Idaho. They're obviously
a better team. But my takeaway on Ohio State is

(54:53):
they're going apoplectic, and I'm like, no, that that's what
it looks like when an eventual national champion plays in
one of the five loudest stadiums against a team that's
also capable of being in the Final Four. That's as
good a loss as you can have.

Speaker 2 (55:10):
Yeah, I personally just hate Ohose State and this is
one of those teams my whole life I've just kind
of rooted against. You don't really have a reason. But
you know, I'm not the biggest Chip Kelly fan either,
and I wanted to hop on the bandwagon about Ryan
Day and his record, but that's that's not the game
to do it, Grace, you lose to Vanderbilt, like, I

(55:30):
gotta kind of eat it on anything, you know, if
you're coming at me about Kaylin Duboor. But I do
think it's fair though at the end of the game,
he has a time out to run it out. You know.
I think there's a lot of people that I think
it's up for debate a little bit. Did they mean
to have the twelve guys out there? Because you can
throw a penalty without it. If it does happen, it

(55:52):
works in your favor, but it also can work against
you and give him some free yardage. But regardless, for
the game to end like it did, him sliding when
they got a time out, their back pocket, and let's
face it, that is they've had some worst losses. I
would say the last couple of years to Harbaugh, much
more embarrassing than that now. Honestly, when he kicks the
field goal late in the game, I thought they're gonna
win it Ohio State. I was like, Oh, this is

(56:14):
gonna be a crowning achievement for Ryan Day. And so
it's whoever had lost that game. I think he kind
of hold your head up high the next day in
the meeting with your squad at Newton. But there is like,
there's got to be some truth to of all the
guys that took over great programs. Urban handed it to them.
And when Jim Harbust's saying, you're born on third base

(56:36):
this program. I had gone to the Cotton Bowl yesterday
and so we get to a bar after we watched
the whole second half, and some people started sitting with us,
a bunch of big ten people, and I said, you
could make the argument for the last twenty I'm not
talking about total national championships. I'm just talking about effort,
the money behind it, the willingness, the consistently you could
even go back to the nineties. This is the best

(56:57):
college football program in America. Ohiuse State. Would you make
that argument? I don't Saban accomplished more. I went, but
I'm just talking about the whole as a program, subtract
a coach.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
Yeah, I was sitting. I went to dinner with Mike Godfrey,
the college basketball coach at Bama North Carolina State, and
he asked me Mount Rushmore of college football programs, and
I said Bama, And the second one I said was
Ohio State. Michigan was good last several years, but USC
has been irrelevant for ten. Michigan doesn't have I mean,
take out the Harbor Natty. They went a long time

(57:29):
without it. And I said to them, Georgia went twenty
years and didn't matter. I said, Obama. Well, I said Bama,
Ohio State. I said, because of history, if you count
one hundred years, I take Notre Dame. You can't Notre
Dame is college football. I said, There isn't a four.
It depends on who's hot, LSU, Oklahoma. It could be Georgia,

(57:52):
but there's no set in stone four. But I think
it's Bama, Ohio State, and Notre Dame. And we can
argue about it. I the thing is they've struggled against
top ten teams. But the Clemson game was close, the
Georgia game was close, the Michigan games they're in it,
the Oregon game. Some of these games, to be honest,
they've been either on the road or neutral fields. They

(58:15):
haven't played a lot of these top ten teams at home.

Speaker 2 (58:18):
I agree, But when you know, you know, a huge
thing that all these coaches love to talk about is
the process because it comes from Saban. The process. Well,
he could talk about the process because his results were wins,
so you wanted to know how he got there. Like
I want to know how Jeff Bezos built his business.
I don't want to hear from the guy that went bankrupt, right,
So it's like you ultimately judged on this sport, win

(58:39):
or lose the game, and I think there is I
think it is fair to go and when they get
in these big spots, whether it's against Georgia, whoever, the
teams end up being because I think it's fair to
say after watching college football over the course of so far,
whatever five six weeks, it's going to be pretty You know,
Texas has sloaded, Ohio State's loaded, but they can lose
like if Quinn yours up like they could lose in

(59:00):
the Elite eight, so can Ohio State and you were
you had faith Saban or Urban, We're gonna win the game.
I think it is fair for any Ohio State fan
to go. I don't know for a fact, I don't
feel great about my gay closing this game out. Even
though our team is it's it's not really arguable they
them and Texas have the best rosters in the country.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
No, Texas and Ohio State are the best teams. I've seen.
Bama's defense leaks oil, Georgia's offense is limited. I think
Ohio State and Texas are like a notch above everybody.
I think if the Buckeyes were on a neutral field
it was like a bowl game, or if it was
in Columbus, they would have won that game. I think
I think Oregon. I think that home field is literally
a touchdown. I think that. I mean, I really think,

(59:40):
hey Will Howard despite the fact they couldn't hear, I mean,
they ran the ball, their two receivers were good, Howard
was accurate. I came out of that game and I'm like,
if they meet again, Ohio State's winning that game and
that's not a shot. Because I had said Oregon's gonna
win this, It's gonna be close. I took the points
money line. I was like, Oregon's gonna in this. I

(01:00:01):
think I was kind of I mean, they had eight penalties.
Couldn't hear a couple of times. I was kind of
impressed with Ohio State.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
I really was.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
I was surprised. I mean, Oregon his recruit for if
you don't follow Oregon football, they have the best NIL
like west of the Mississippi. I mean they have all
this still night money. Dude, they have nothing but four
and five star guys. I mean they don't even they have.
I don't think people understand how well they recruit and

(01:00:28):
how well the NIL Like Oregon outside of Texas may
have the best NIL in the country.

Speaker 2 (01:00:33):
Well I'll say this being at the Texas game. Obviously
Oklahoma their offense is anemic, but they do have a
good defense. I've been hard on this guy over the years,
just because he didn't win that much. Sark as a
play caller is elite, Like it was really impressive. I
do hesitate, though, like his quarterback. I know he was
coming off an injury. I'm sitting there live going, well,

(01:00:55):
this ain't the number one pick, and those the game's
going when I draft this guy in the first round.
And Sark was really good at kind of scheming around him,
throwing a lot of that, and he ran the ball.
And Sark the one thing with Ryan Day loves the pass.
Sark loves the pass too. Both of them probably have
four NFL guys and two each on their team in

(01:01:17):
their backfield, and that is an area if you are
just willing, you see this with Shanahan, some of these
co even Andy Reid has turned in like, just hand
the ball off a lot and we'll just bludgeon you
that way. And those guys are just a little more
quick to let it fly. And I think that is
the thing that makes me the most nervous with Day
and Sark because they're teams I mean in Texas, the
size of their defensive line, the speed of their dbs,

(01:01:40):
the talent at wide receiver. I just think you were
if you remove the Michigan game, who I think is
fair to say Michigan is not that good, right, so
you just go, can you win a national championship with
this guy playing quarterback? He's just a little erratic, but
their talents is is really really high and is to me,
you put Oregon's talent on their level?

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
No, I I thought they. I think Oregon is in
the running for the third best team in the country.
I think it's Texas, Ohio State, and I think there's
about four teams, Oregon, Georgia. They can play with anybody.
And I thought Oregon played their butt off. But I
came out of that game. I was like, if I
was Oregon, I wouldn't want to play Ohio State again.

(01:02:22):
I'd have no interest playing those guys again. Okay, USC
and Penn State go to overtime. It's a wild shootout.
Uh USC loses by a field goal. Lincoln Riley is
now five and eight in his last thirteen games. So
here's my overview, because I don't think he's terribly likable.

(01:02:44):
The way he left Oklahoma. He gets snippy with the media.
There's sort of an air of I'm above the phrase sometimes,
which I don't think people love. But here I go
back to this is that Miller Moss is a good
college quarterback, but he doesn't move. He's he's pure pocket.
That's not really Lincoln's I mean he went and got

(01:03:05):
the UNLV guy out of the portal who moves well,
which told me he did have some concerns about we're
just kind of a one dimensional team. But here's what
bothers me. He's been there three years in an era
of the transfer portal, and USC's transfer portal money is
now twelve thirteen million. They're not poppers. They got money.
They have two playable offensive tackles in the program. Two.

(01:03:29):
They have an immobile quarterback, the better athletes the backup.
They have one Woody Marx, one legitimate Mississippi State kid
running back. This is USC john even when they've had
coaches that have missed. I mean Paul Hackett got Carson
Palmer and Troy Palomano. The brand is huge. If you

(01:03:53):
look at Southern California recruiting this year, they're just not
getting any of the players. I mean they get They
may have two of the top twelve players. There is
a detached deel with Lincoln. He not that he doesn't
love his job and love the kids, but he doesn't.
He feels almost detached or above it. And it's like

(01:04:13):
sometimes I like Saban to lose his shit when he
was at Bama or Brian Kelly turn red as a
plumb you know, they're so engaged. Lincoln sometimes can come
off as sort of above it all, and I think
it's a turn off the local high school coaches, and
it just doesn't feel right to me.

Speaker 2 (01:04:31):
You know who. The way you just describe reminds me
of the USC version that we saw with Lane Kifvin.
He was kind of aloof and not connected to the program.
It just felt like there was a disconnect between the two.
And remember the Lane that we've seen Alabama. Obviously at
Old Miss feels a lot different as a human being,
much more personable. I'm talking with the media, connecting with people.

(01:04:55):
He just feels like a different guy. And when I
was I got to the Oklahoma game really early, and
I've adopted them as my program because I know people
within the program. So I was talking and they're like, heyah,
we got so many injuries, and it's like, uh, they
get hurt in practice. He's like, yeah, we practice around
here now like an NFL team, And I said a
lot different than with Lincoln, and they all laughed, like

(01:05:17):
it's a lot more physical around here. Yes, yeah, yeah,
And I think when you look at Kirby and Nick
or defensive guys. So in Harbaugh essentially was a defensive
guy too. It's inevitable their programs are going to be physical.
Sark and and I think Ryan Day are good examples
of they got a little Lincoln in them. They would
much rather just score fifty throw the ball around. But

(01:05:38):
I would say both those two guys are elite recruiters
and it matters to them a lot. And the one
thing watching Sark And I'm not trying to flip flop
on them, but I was like, this guy really embraced
I know they're good now, but you could just feel
the vibe of him and his staff like he likes
being there, the vibe of Texas, the fans, the program

(01:05:59):
and listen, I'm not I don't like o ill State.
Ryan Day takes a lot of pride in that program.
You can tell it means a lot too. Oh my god,
postgame interviews. So you use the other two top offensive
guys right now in the country, Ryan Day and Sark
the way you just describe Lincoln, Well, those guys, I mean,
are feels like they're addicted to recruiting. And it's not
like you know, they all got all these schools got money,

(01:06:20):
and then their passion for their program feels pretty deep
in their soul. This is why I was against the hire.
Not because Lincoln didn't have a great resume in USC
shouldn't want him. But there's a small Texas kid who
kind of you know, got to cut his teeth at
Texas Tech, working his way up and then got to
inherit Oklahoma, which is an all time great program, which

(01:06:41):
just loaded with offensive weapons. You know, a couple of
them fell into their lap. Baker Mayfield just walked on
the program. They didn't recruit him, he just he showed
up on He was our starter for three years. Tyler
was just out there, you know, they just got him
in the recruiting portal. Jalen Hurtz was kicked out of Alabama.
So it's like it was kind of some unique circumstances.

(01:07:01):
And now you look at this. Caleb was a good
Land and he kept a close relationship, but like, why
doesn't he have like ten Calebs being at Oklahoma. There's
like Trent Williams, all these guys like Bob Stoops. Over
the years when I was at Fresno State, Pat Hill,
Fresno State football meant more than his family beside his family.
Nothing meant more to his life. When you watch Lincoln,
it's like got a game one hundred and twenty million,

(01:07:22):
like it was just a number he couldn't refuse.

Speaker 1 (01:07:25):
You know, john USC is one of not the best
programs right now, but it's one of the five to
eight biggest brands in college football. And Notre Dame, Bama, Georgia, Oklahoma,
Ohio State, Michigan, those guys. When Michigan was really down,
they still had Taylor Lawan going in the first round.

(01:07:47):
Now Brady Hoak, they didn't have the kind of It
took Hardbob about three years to build a back up.
But the first sign. You can look at a program
and they may not win national championships and Ryan Day
may lose a lot of close games to big rivals.
They the first and second round are littered with Buckeyes.

(01:08:07):
There's NFL players everywhere. Begins a receiver, fact and their
receiving cord this year is better than about a third
of the NFL once. USC right now has a running
back in Woody Marks that's probably a fifth round guy.
They have a center Monheim play a second or a
third round guy. He's probably a guard or a right
tackle or a center in the NFL play a third

(01:08:27):
round guy Kamari Ramsey's not eligible for the draft, but
he's on the back end of the defense. He'll get
He'll get drafted second or third round. He's a good player,
best defensive player. That's about it. John thattt that that's
about it. So three years in, with the transfer portal
and a healthy nil bank, they just don't have enough

(01:08:49):
good players.

Speaker 2 (01:08:50):
Yeah, to me, you can't, Like, I get it. Recruiting sucks,
but they pay it a ten eleven million dollars to
figure this out. And if you're going to do this
for a profession, you don't have a choice. Practice, Like,
do you think Sark wants to be on the phone
as we're speaking right now on Sunday night with some
junior in high school somewhere of course now? But he
wants to win. And I do wonder if you look

(01:09:10):
back at Oklahoma they were It's just it's a unique
spot for a small town Norman. They've been good for
seventy years and it's kind of recruits itself, and they
were good when he took over. This thing was much
more when Sark took over Texas. I gave my lot.
It was terrible, and within a couple of years, I'm
standing there on the sideline watching the size of his

(01:09:31):
offense and defensive li whoa I've been If you look
at Ohio State and I'd have to text like to
get exact numbers. If I just had a guess, Texas
has five guys, they'll be drafted the top forty. I'm
not even counting the quarterback. I just counting skill guys
running back, probably an offensive line and a defensive line,

(01:09:51):
and a linebacker may have a dB. I'm just I'm
not talking quarterback. So yeah, I mean I think USC.
I think it's so far away. Obviously I didn't watch
much of the Penn State game, but the Minnesota game,
even the Michigan game, how hard they had to play
to just keep that thing close against It was just

(01:10:13):
I don't think you can fake toughness. And I think
in life, you know, for most of our jobs, it's
more mental toughness, right, It's having mental just the ability
to battle through things, tough days, the good times. Just
that's most successful people. Colin Coward, you name any industry.
In football, there's this balance of mental and physical toughness.

(01:10:33):
And as a football coach like Saban can't fake being
a tough guy. Like when I was around Pat Hill,
He's He's just naturally a tough guy. Right, Kirby Smart
is just a tough guy. And I think Sark and
Ryan Day can get away with a little bit because
of their programs and the economics behind it. But they
recruit really hard, and they try really hard. And I
just look at Lincoln and go, he just does he

(01:10:54):
care that much about recruiting. James Franklin say this about him.
I would imagine if you just got Link and James
Franklin on a whiteboard in front of like the ten
best football coaches in America and saying press them, Lincoln's
gonna win. But if I said, get on the phone
and build a freaking team to try to win a
national championship, I'll take James Franklin's roster. Ten out of
ten times.

Speaker 1 (01:11:15):
I've been in the room, I've been in a room
with James Franklin. Once it was at ESPN. I went
about eight years ago. James Franklin literally walked in huge smile,
races over me, eye contact, big smile, and I remember
leaving that and I'm like I told something a buddy,
I'm like, no, wonder, he's such a great recruiter. I

(01:11:38):
wanted to go play with him. In three seconds, eyes
on me, Lock, big smile. You love college football. I
love you for that. And I remember thinking, Oh, that's
why he's got the pennant. This is why he's gonna
be successful. Like in college, that doesn't matter in the pros, right,
you select the players, but the high school players they

(01:11:58):
select you. And so I don't feel that dynamic personality
and it does matter. You could make an argument it's
like Lincoln's a little Cliff Kingsbury in that I don't
think Cliff liked recruiting, and I don't think he was
great at the managing. And I think in the end
Cliff's smart as hell, but not everybody is the right personality.

(01:12:19):
And I listened five and eight in your last thirteen games.
Don't want to waste too much time talking to USC,
but it's listen. I can tell you this. They're not
happy in the administration. Well there's hand a lot of
money boosters are not happy. John Middlecoff Eagle Scout three
and Out podcasts, This thing Cruise our fifteen flew by

(01:12:42):
the day, Buddy Fight on.

Speaker 2 (01:12:48):
The volume.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
Thanks so much for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast,
take a moment, rate and review

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Colin Cowherd Podcast - Cowboys HUMILIATED, Bears Getting Better, Eagles Underachieve, Packers A SB Team? Ohio State’s GOOD Loss To Oregon

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