Colin’s joined by college football guru Josh Pate, host of “Josh Pate’s College Football Show”.
They start with Penn State’s loss to Oregon and the unfair criticism of James Franklin and Colin argues that he’s still a top ten coach, and Josh explains why the loss was the beginning of a brand new timeline for Franklin and Penn State because their best still wasn’t good enough (4:00).
They agree Dan Lanning would be crazy to leave Oregon for another job in the south and that he can accomplish anything he wants as coach of the Ducks (8:30).
They recap their experience of being at USC @ Illinois and Colin highlights that USC was dominated physically and struggles to play smash mouth football, but Josh counters that one more year with the portal could fix it (13:00).
They discuss the huge lift for Kalen DeBoer following in Nick Saban’s footsteps, and why Alabama’s win over Georgia was one of their biggest of the past decade (24:15).
Finally, Colin lauds the addition of the transfer portal for the parity it’s created in the sport now that great bench players now start elsewhere (35:00).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
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him from the Josh Py College Football Show. He's great
(01:04):
comes on the Herd volume. As many times as we
can get him on, we're going to I don't know
if you've been on the Herd yet. We'll get you on,
I promise. So I defended James Franklin for years. I
was like, listen, he's losing to Ohio State and Michigan.
You know, he's losing to the right people. I thought,
you're a favorite. You've got a lot of high end
(01:25):
first round draft guys. You gotta win that game. But
it was funny because I'm you know, I was watching.
I don't go online very much, especially to like fan boards,
but I did. I went to Penn State fan boards
just to see their reaction and then YEA, we want
him out of here. He's a bum. And my take
is James Franklin is kind of what I think most
(01:52):
college football coaches are. There's Kirby, there's Pete Carroll, there's
Nick Saban, there's Urban Meyer. I think Chris Peterson's one
of those. There's Dabbo, there's like in any industry, there's
like one percent, and then there's a bunch of guys
(02:13):
that are almost as good but may not recruit as
well or they're not schematically as good. And I think
James Franklin's in that. And I think if you gave
James Franklin Dante Moore and Dan Lanning Drew Aller, they
would have won the game. So I still think Franklin
is a top of the class, not a top six,
(02:33):
but somewhere seven to fifteen in a sport with one
hundred and forty you know, FBS schools. Or if you
lost faith in him after a game in which you're
a favorite at home, probably the better backfield and NFL
quarterback prospect, where do you land on him today?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I don't think any differently of him. But I treated
the Oregon game way way bigger than I've ever treated
a football game. And so I got to tell you
a little backstory. You and I. I've apparently been singing
out of the same hymnal as me Mal would say
about James Franklin, because he is very very good. Never
used the word elite, never used the word great, just
very very good, an eighth thrunger what we would call him,
(03:12):
an eighth thrunger on a ten rung ladder. Yeah, so
I remember, even in the spring. I've been up there
a couple of times over the past few months. They
never shied away from this concept that this year we're
all in, kind of what Ohio State sounded like last
year when I visited them in spring. We're all in.
We're making no excuses or apologies about it. We're all in,
all right. So every every external dynamic edge imaginable you
(03:35):
have on that organ game, they got a travel cross country,
you got the bye, you got the experienced roster, they
got newness everywhere you should. You got a way more
experienced than veteran coaching staff. So all of that wind out.
You finally got it in primetime. I just felt like
it was such a referendum moment. It's such an inflection
point in time in the James Franklin Penn State era,
(03:55):
and I know, coming out of it, if you really
want to just you know, shred the argument. You could say,
it's just one game, it's just one conference game, they
went to overtime. It's so much more than that. Anyone
pretending otherwise is just ignorant of Penn State football and
ignorant of the situation. So I think a whole new
timeline started the other night. I said this on the
following night's show. It may sound hyperbolic, but I'm dead
(04:17):
serious about it. I think a whole new timeline got started.
Now here's what we cannot know yet. We can't know
which flavor of timeline it is, because you could sell
me on either of these things being the case in
twenty twenty nine, and I could believe you. You could sell
me number one, Franklin's no longer at Penn State because
that Oregon game precipitated this really ugly slip down this
(04:39):
slope where eventually neither wanted anything to do with the other.
Maybe they just cut ties, maybe it got really contentious,
but he's not there in a couple of years. I
could see that. I could also see him believing everything
that I'm saying and you're saying about that game that
was the referendum game. This is where it's going to
be the ultimate test of my way of doing things,
(05:00):
the way I've built Penn State. And I think it
was such a reminder that your best, given your current
modus operandi, is not going to be good enough. All right,
that's the absolute peak of this version of you of
Penn State football, and it got taken down by probably Oregon,
not even close to ascending to what they will become.
(05:21):
So I could see him driving home that night, I
could see him waking up the next morning just it's
just you and you in the bathroom mirror and saying
to yourself, this is it. Several degrees of change are
needed here. Here there just rigid principles you've never bent on,
you're willing to bend on. Now there's a third rail
where he doesn't know to do any of that, and
(05:43):
it just is what it is. I don't know where
we're going with it, but I sense the same thing
you did. Even the portion of the fan base, Like
I've got some Penn State folks on my staff who
were the last holdouts who always sort of shouted down
the radical portion of the fan base when they would
criticize him. Fire James Franklin after a loss, and they
(06:03):
they didn't get overly emotional, which is what I noticed.
They were almost I don't know, they were apathetic afterwards,
and it was kind of a shrug and well, we
know he's never going to be bad enough to fire,
but we were also resigned to the fact that this
is this confirmation we're never going to see the mountaintop.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yeah, it's you know, It's funny. Anytime Dan Landing wins
a big game, everybody's like, you know, he's going back
to the SEC, And I'm like, folks, Oregon has the richest,
most committed booster in the sport. Their facilities are insane,
(06:41):
unbelievable home field advantage, and now they're in the first
of the second best conference. It didn't validate like when Oregon,
remember when they finished number two in the country. They
beat Colorado and and but I cover that team. They
were small defensively, they have a couple of good corners. Defensively,
they didn't have NFL bodies. They've always had good quarterbacks
(07:04):
and clever offenses. It was sort of like Harbaugh's first
team at Michigan that won ten games, and you're like, yeah,
but they don't look like Georgia. They don't even look
like Georgia. Eight years later you're like, that looks a
little bit like Georgia. Notre Dame Brian Kelly remember that.
They get to a national championship game and you're like, well,
(07:24):
at halftime he was laughing. He's like, yeah, we're not.
You got to do better than we tried.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
We tried, guys, we tried.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Oregon's not that Oregon's a great job. You don't leave Oregon.
Like there's seven or eight jobs you don't leave if
you're winning at USC, LSU, Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, Notre Dame, Michigan.
Just stay. I think Oregon is in that class. But
it's remarkable how often every time Dan Landing, like he
beats Ohio State, you know he's gonna get job offers
(07:54):
in the SEC. Would you leave if you were Landing
and Auburn Clemson offered you a job.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
No, My answer would have been different ten years ago.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
No.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
I think I can accomplish everything there that I can
accomplish elsewhere. I don't really think people know this. Look,
here's what anyone needs to understand. Dan's not leaving Oregon.
He's not leaving Oregon because at Oregon it's the only
place where you have a deal with the school and
you've got a separate deal with Phil Knight. Basically, I mean,
we talk about buyouts all the time, and typically you're
(08:30):
talking about, oh, it's going to cost eight million, ten million,
twelve million. When you really understand Dan Lanning's life there,
you're talking about a forty to fifty million dollar buyout's
No one's willing to hit that, nor should they. And
even if it wasn't that, so let's pretend that wasn't
the case. Let's just pretend all the rest of the
dynamics were in place at Oregon. You mentioned facilities. Another
(08:51):
thing people need to know is when you go up there.
Right now, you sit in his office, you look out,
it's cranes everywhere, it's earth moving everywhere because they're over
hauling it again. So this time next year they'll be
ahead of the pack again on that front. But I
just want, I just want you and I everyone else
go back to that game against Penn State the other
night and understand what you watched. Oregon they recruited a
(09:15):
very high level already. They've mastered evaluation in the portal.
You can't have one of those things without the other, okay,
otherwise you're just lighting money on fire. Nebraska spent over
a million dollars on the right tackle that hasn't seen
the field, so you got to be able to evaluate
as well. Marshall Malcow is a really good dude. Running
point for Dan landing up there, but Landing himself and
(09:35):
that staff they are really really good at Evaling. So
you turn on the Penn State game the other night.
They've got eleven guys they took out of the portal.
I think I counted ten of them are contributing big time.
They got three starting offensive linemen. They've got multiple dbs.
In fact, the guy that people were most crazy about,
Makai Hughes, the tailback that came from Tulane. That's the
(09:57):
only one that you would call quote unquote a bust.
And he's not really bus. He's just a depth provider, right.
They they're doing stuff, in other words, that you used
to get told you couldn't do. It was a chore.
You had to clear the hurdle one hundred and fifty
percent of what the Southern schools did to get talent there.
You don't have to anymore. You don't have to, So
what's the downside. As long as you don't mind a
(10:19):
couple of extra hours on your plane rides every now
and then, you've got it set up there. He's not
lying when he says they're all in on living an
organ like. He's not lying about that. They just happen
to find the right guy from the South who is
the closest removed to a Nick Saban to Kirby Smart
to now Dan Lanny. He looks like a psychopath. His
(10:39):
eyes are really like that, even when he just talks
to you on a normal Tuesday over lunch. It fits.
It's taken everything that you think is a stereotype because
it's kind of true about Southern football culture and what's
one down there forever and you just transplanted it up
to Oregon at the best of times.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
So you and I were at the USC Illinois game
and thank god I had cover because that stadium doesn't
have much and it was hot as hell. It was hot.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
So I went to the Georgia game later that night
and they cooled off. I got cooler as I went
down there.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
So we can argue about did they score too quickly?
There's certainly an argument both sides. I think I tend
to think when you're on the road and you can
get a touchdown, get it. But I could be wrong.
But one thing that has been brought up, and I
think it's fair. When he Lincoln Roddy was at Oklahoma,
(11:42):
they did run the football, but the defense didn't feel
like it made big stops in big moments. That was
kind of the knock. They were like Oklahoma under Stoops
was a little bit more physical. So when Brett Venables
took over for Lincoln, that's what he talked about, a
culture of toughness. We're going to get more physical. There
was this in reputations can be somewhat generalizing or stereotypes,
(12:05):
but there's some truth, grains of truth and everything, and
so it was like they're wide, it's for wide. There
were little softs of Brett Venables like we're getting better off,
we're getting tougher. So he comes to USC. So Alex
Grinch is a disaster, but he got on the plane.
And we've talked about this. When you take a new job,
whoever gets on the plane, they move their family. You
got to keep them for two years. So he goes
(12:26):
and hires Danton Lynn. UCLA's very very smart defensive coordinator,
very good and immediately without great personnel, you're like, oh,
this is an upgrade. And then I watch him against
Illinois and Illinois got dashed by Indiana. Illinois had struggled
with offensive line protection. I watch USC and they're young.
(12:48):
In some spots in the d front seven, they got
pushed around. They didn't they didn't offer there weren't I
mean you were there. There were big running lanes, like
on every big third down once or twice the quarterback
was rushed. And my take is, and this was suggested,
is is it practice? Is there an element of this
(13:10):
up Temple offense that over the course of time, even
Lynn's defense up Temple, it's getting softer. And my take is,
we all know there's a certain style from about October
fifteenth on, it gets cold, it gets windy. I mean,
they couldn't close out games last year, Josh against Maryland,
against Minnesota, they couldn't run the ball. Do you think
(13:34):
there is truth in this that, oh my god, we
got the right defensive coordinator and we can't go on
the road and play smash mouth defensive in your face
football already.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, there can be Okay, I would counter with this.
Josh Hipel just won with defense last year. Josh Hipel
went to the playoff at Tennessee. And you and I
know good andwell not only the offense he runs, but
the tempo they're practicing. Yet a Tennessee offense is chaos,
or a Tennessee practice is chaos. And yet somehow Tim
Banks and that defense not only fortified themselves last year,
(14:08):
they built themselves to where when Niko and Maliava couldn't
push the ball down the field when it was three
and out, defense carried Tennessee. They didn't win a national title,
they got to the playoff, which was further than anyone
expected them to go. So the first thing I would
do is I'd answer your question yes, and then I
would say they aught to look at Tennessee. They aught
to look at whatever Josh Hipel has figured out a
way to do. The other part of that is, though
(14:31):
you remember what was it like two years ago now,
after that season where they made the staff changes. I
remember Lincoln as playing his day. He's sat there and
he's just kind of reset the program, and he was
talking to the media and he was talking about how
we are leaving no stone unturned, We're going to reinvent
the way we do this and that, and one of
(14:52):
the things he said was, we're going to rethink the
way we practice. This is going to be a top
to bottom overhaul. Well, that's what he was talking about.
That's what you can't do overnight. You can't just overhaul
the roster overnight with the kind of bodies they need.
And so I still there's a part of me that
thinks there's a lot of validity what you're saying. But
I still think to myself, if they change nothing else,
(15:14):
but I give them another cycle portal in recruiting to
go just bring in the bigger bodies, which I trust
that they'll do. How different does it look? Just how
different does does better talent make it look? Because when
we went to that game the other day, that's one
of the games where I made it a point to
stand in the end zone because I wanted to see
that early on, I wanted to see that it was
so glaring, they got pushed around, they got put on skates,
(15:35):
it was so glaring. And then I, you know, you
work your way over to the USC sideline and they
just you can so clearly pick up on the fact
that they know what's happening to them. They know there's
not a whole lot they can do about it. They're
gonna they're gonna need picks, interceptions during his special teams.
They're gonna it. It's tough because you know, the jutstaposition
(15:57):
to that is later that night you go down to
Athens and you're talking Alabama Georgian and it's just non
negotiables for both of those teams. We're gonna load up
on big bodies. You know, the concept of us getting
beaten because we're second best physically, it's not even in
their it's not even in their lingo. They don't even
understand how to speak that they don't win all the games.
But it's not because of what happened to USC. So
(16:19):
you're still sitting there waiting for it. I'm still sitting
here waiting on it. They made front office changes, Okay,
they've got a high rated recruiting class right now. I
don't doubt they'll try and attack the portal like no
one's business this upcoming winter cycle. I just hope philosophically
that's where it is. Like, I hope those changes have
been made to where it's just better players. I'm skeptical,
(16:41):
you can hear my voice. I'm a little bit skeptical. But
I'm still hopeful too, because I think they got good
people in the building there.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
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(18:18):
So when Kaylin de Bor got hired, Greg Byrn texted
me after a tweet, I sind, kind of thank me.
I think a little bit for the perspective I had,
because after Kylen beat Georgia, I said, you know, the media,
myself included in fans, success is hard and it doesn't
come as fast as we want, and so it's difficult
(18:39):
and it gets people get worked up. And I'm like,
Kaylin de Bor was a hard hire. Dan Lannings from
the South, Dabbo Sweeney was popular. I mean, they're they're
Lane Kiffin there were a lot of potential hires post Saban.
You could have argued they weren't going to get Sark
because Texas money. But you could have gone after a Lane,
(18:59):
a dabble, a Dan Lanning, and he didn't. He went
and got a Midwest guy that was at Washington three
thousand miles away, and it's easy to go, Oh, he's
got a great resume. The South is different, the intensity
is different. Some Midwest Western people like Chip Kelly. One
time when they were I think he was offered Florida.
He's like, that's too much. I thought Philadelphia was rough,
but it's too much for me. And Jim McElwain, who
(19:21):
I knew from college, is like, yeah, this is different.
I'm more West, Midwest guy, and but I don't people
tend to think, Josh. Everybody knows that if you're Jim
Harbaugh and you go to the Chargers to replace Brandon Staley,
you have to change the culture. It's a disaster. But
people think it's easy when you go to Alabama and
you'll replace save it.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Well, you don't have to change the culture.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Well, yes you do. You have to be authentic to yourself,
you have to be author it doesn't matter what I
replaced Tony Corneiser.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
He was great.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I still didn't do the same show Tony did, right,
I did a different show, so I had there were
elements of the show you have to change. You have
to change certain things. And that's not a knock, It's
just that's the is. I think Alabama was a tougher
job than you think. The pressure is enormous. They were
struggling in the NIL to play to go to the top,
(20:10):
wrong with some Ohio states and Georgia's And when they
won that game, I found myself rooting for Alabama in
that first half. I was like, God, this is good coaching, Jesus,
this is good play calling, this is this is as
big a regular season when including Saban in like five years.
I thought it was so significant. And they've beaten Georgia
(20:30):
plenty of times. Did you feel it felt more like that,
a more of a beyond just a win at Georgia.
It felt like, Okay, this is the moment.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
I think it's one of the biggest games for the
program this decade, that goes back to when Saban is
still there. Yes, I could not. You cannot overstate the impact.
I mean think about where we are. We were talking
about inflection point with James Franklin. Okay, different standard at Alabama.
They've won their championships, but it was under the previous guy,
new guy, you don't know really, and go into the
alternate universe where they lose that game and they're coming
(21:04):
out of Athens already a two loss team and you
still got the rest of your conference schedule to go.
You probably have four minimum losses staring you in the face,
and what do you do? You mentioned Greg byrn buddy,
the only I wish you could have seen his face
walking off that field Saturday night. Greg Byrne was the
most relieved person in the entire building. That's the athletic
(21:24):
director at Alabama for those unfamiliar like because his reputations
on the line with this higher as well. And the
thing is, Greg Burn's never doubted for a second that
Kaylin de Boor is made of the right stuff. But
you don't play one hundred and sixty two college football games,
so it just comes down to these moments, like these
these key third downs, and you know a sequence here
(21:47):
and there that's going to determine whether you're a success
or a failure. That season. I got to tell you
about Deboor when he got there. I use the word ignorant.
Ignorant is not lack of intelligence. Ignorance is sometimes you
haven't experienced something. And I think he was maybe a
little bit ignorant to what you're talking about, the true
Southern football dynamic, Like I think he looked at it.
(22:09):
And I know this because I talked to him about it.
I mean, he just talked about winning principles, and he's right,
the same stuff wins everywhere. It's just the surroundings, the
externals are way different in the South than they are
anywhere not named. Ohio State basically out tried this.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
I've said that for years Ohio State's and SEC team
North that's the only one.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, So he got thrown into that. And I just
as much as you're try and wall yourself off from it,
it's really impossible. You cannot wall yourself off from it.
So I got to tell you now, people who have
observed him from the outside may not see this. If
you've been around Kaylan, or even if you're just like
a fan of the program, you follow him closer. He
(22:49):
since that Florida State game earlier this year, has been
like the third verse of lose Yourself, the part where
it's just it's no more games. I've been cut. I'm
bleeding all over the place. But I kind of get
it now. I kind of understand, like you get thrown
into the pot and it starts to boil and it
either consumes you or you adjust and then you thrive
(23:10):
in that environment. That's what I wondered about him, because
I knew this time was coming. It doesn't Saban didn't
avoid it at Alabama and he may be the greatest
of all time. Urban didn't avoid it at Florida. No
one avoids it. It's do you adapt to it and
thrive in it? Because that's the one or two percent
that are cut out to coach in the SEC and
major college football. And I'm telling you, it's like it's
(23:31):
like putting new keys in the ignition and it's kind
of turned in him and there's a lot of what
we would call degaffness dgaf neis that he kind of
has about himself that is very indicative of someone who
is now adjusted and who is acclimated to their surroundings.
And basically looked back and said, all right, game on.
(23:52):
If this is how it works down here. Game on.
You mentioned the coaching job they did the other night, Buddy,
that's an NFL coaching staff on that offensive side of
them they got, I mean, Ryan Grubb literally came there
when it didn't work out in Seattle. But they worked
Georgia's defensive staff pretty thoroughly. And think about the sentence
that just came out of my mouth, because you don't
really say that about anyone. And so now you know
(24:14):
their reward is they get to play Vandy this week.
And what stood out to me the most, and I
can't believe this is a sentence coming out of my
mouth either, to just give you an idea of how
that program's wired. Right now, they're walking off the field
in Athens, huge win, and they're no more headed into
the locker room than half the locker rooms talking about
the Vandy game. Half of them are in the locker room.
(24:37):
They're in Sandford Stadium. They're already looking ahead to the
Vandy game because that was the cattle pride to their
neck last year that they never fully recovered from. So
as much as the public circle at Georgia game, they
were already well aware before they left the building of
what's next week? Diego Pavia coming in there next week?
Their super Bowl last year. All right, they come into
(24:57):
our building. College game Day is going to be there.
So it was an eye opener to me because I
hadn't I hadn't been to Abama game this year in person,
so I hadn't been around them in person. Yeah, I
think that FSU game did something to him and it
may end up being the biggest blessing they could ever
suffer from, if that makes any sense.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
Yeah. When I worked in Tampa for two years, I
really learned because I love college football, but i'd grown
up around Oregon. Washington was a great program, and I
Kevin O'Connell was a photographer. He's still employee at WTVT.
I think it is Channel thirteen. And we went to
(25:35):
do a story on like Tuesday or Wednesday. Spurry Or
was the coach of Florida, and we went down there
and there were already fans parked in the parking lot
tail getting. It was Wednesday, and I'm like, I go
to Husky games like Friday night, maybe late Friday afternoon.
You'd show up at Husky Stadium. They were there Wednesday
(25:57):
and they'd been there. I mean, they had the they
had they're you know, they're cooking utensils out, they were
sitting in the chairs, playing you know, poker, and I'm like, wow,
this is different. And then the funny thing is i
remember listening to Southern smaller market radio and I'm like.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Bro, it is.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
March and that's all they're talking about.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
Like, yeah, you gotta you gotta live it. You have
to have experienced it. Because the first job I ever
got on air was fifteen eighty is wiol and Columbus, Georgia,
and it's it's in the heart, it's right there. Auburn, Alabama, Georgia,
FSU Florida, Clemson, South Carolina. The most underrated market in
the South. It's like market one P thirty something in
the country, but in the South. If you want to
(26:43):
talk college football, it's great. And you could take a
random Wednesday in June NBA Finals could be going on,
it doesn't matter. We're talking about the right side of
the offensive line, not the one deep colin. We're talking
about rotational pieces over there. And we're do we really
think this juco kid from Pearl River, Mississippi is really
(27:04):
going to be able to shine there? And it's just
so intense. You can back off. You can just shut
up and let guys go for ten minutes, and they're
as worst on it as they would be their own
children and their own family and their own financial situation.
It's really amazing.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
So I say this often, forty percent of America never
leaves the area code they were born in. People don't
like change. I did not grow up in a traditional
family with religion, you know, divorce parents. I had just
a British mother, and I just didn't have a traditional upbringing.
(27:39):
Thank god, I have good coaches. But so I tend
to embrace change because my life has been I've lived
in seven states, and so I understand people who aren't
comfortable with it that people that have lived in the
same cul de sac forever. I'm kind of jealous of that.
I understand my kids don't have like one set of friends,
and my wife and I have talked about that before.
(28:01):
Is that you sacrifice. Everybody makes sacrifices. I have moved
for commerce an opportunity, but it's probably hurt me in
terms of long term you know, friendships and relationships. My
friends are all over the country. So when the transfer
portal and the NIL came out in the college football playoff,
I was so excited. It's like, I've seen cal Arizona
State enough. I want to see Oregon and Ohio State.
(28:21):
I want to see Michigan and USC like I've seen
the regional stuff. But the unintended benefits that I didn't consider.
First of all, the playoffs way better than those half
empty stadium bowl games.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
That's a fact.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
Secondly, the NIL has not made the sport more lobsided.
The good teams are still good. The bad teams are
mostly still bad. But the transfer portal. I did not
predict this. I figured just the rich would get richer.
But the truth is kids want to play. And when
I watch Georgia now and a cornerback gets hurt, they
don't necessarily have a good backup. He's at Louisville, he's
(29:01):
at Texas Tech. Are you surprised? I look at the
sport now. You could change uniforms. I can't tell Oregon
from Bama, from Georgia from Ole Miss LSU. I can't
tell three four years ago, Josh, you could take uniforms off.
That's Georgia, that's Alabama, that's Ohio State. I think the
(29:24):
transfer portal. Everybody freaked out about it. I think it's
created a parody and an evenness that I haven't seen
in college football life.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
I've wrestled with this a lot. See, I used to
listen to you a lot talk about moving, and I
was the person you were talking about. I grew up
in West Central Georgia, never left there until into my thirties,
and so I'm very rooted and therefore I like tradition.
I like adhering to the stuff I've always known. All right, Well,
then work or opportunity moves me to Nashville's first time
(29:54):
I'd ever left home, first time I ever got out
of my cul de sac, actually, so that my worldview
and therefore my college football worldview kind of became rooted
in that. So I was one that sort of was
drug kicking and screaming across a lot of these lines.
And there's you know, there's always going to be stuff
to complain about, so anecdotally, if you don't like something,
(30:14):
you'll always be able to cherry pick. But I agree
with you, and I've had to adjust my thinking slash
perspective on a lot of this because it's undeniable when
you look I mean, Texas Tech could compete literally this year,
they could compete for a lot more than a Big
twelve sid Like it could happen. And so what I've
(30:34):
picked up on is everybody knows the transfer portal is
a big deal. That's a very fifty thousand foot evergreen
headline in college football. Drilled down a little bit when
we talked about Oregon a little while ago, when we
talked about Texas Tech, Like, I just did something on
our show the other night where I looked at the
hit rate, and I'm telling you, the programs and the
(30:56):
front offices in college football now that have really put
a print on putting good evaluators in those offices are
lapping the field. Miami is killing it not only because
they have money. Money is the oxygen. Okay, you're not
going to live without it anyway, it's a moot point.
You got to have the money that spend it properly.
And everyone's spending they're going after the same players. So
(31:17):
there is still very much a recruiting element to it,
but there's also a really really big evaluation piece to it.
So Miami they just overhauled their entire secondary colin there's
one OJ Frederic you'll see him Saturday against Florida State.
He's the only holdover. They looked at it and said,
this is not good enough. We just wasted cam Ward
last year. So they just imported a whole new secondary.
(31:39):
They hit on all of them. Oregon has three starting
offensive linemen from the portal. Not to mention, they got
Dante Moore back at quarterback. He's so good. By the way,
the kid who is starting and shining at col right
now had committed to Oregon, went to spring or went
to winter playoff practices and realize more was so good.
(32:01):
He asked for his release. He said, I'm not going
to be able to start here immediately, so I want
to go somewhere else. And they hated it, but they
let him go. But look at Texas Tech. Look what
they're doing LSU. You know, LSU is a wreck right now,
but not because of what Austin Thomas, who's the GM there,
and they did defensively, because they've gone from in the
eighties to the fifties to now the teens in national
(32:22):
defensive rankings because of the portal and evaluation in the portal.
They're not missing on guys, is my point. They what
they did not do is they did not go get
a tackle, a right tackle. They banked on the fact
they could develop one in house, and that has failed.
And that's why offensively, that along with quarterback injury, is
what they look like right now. But yeah, it's really amazing.
(32:43):
And what it also does is, you know, I was
at Tennessee last year the week of the Bama game,
and a lot of the staff was already talking about
their concern about their offensive line. The following year, well,
offensive line is not an issue for them because they
were able to rectify it in the portal. And so
you used to have this hopelessness as a fan where
(33:03):
if you knew you had a veteran laden union, right,
it was going to be minimum two years, maybe even
three years down the road. And now it could just
be you wake up one morning and there's a headline,
Oh a and m just went and got Mario Kraver
and Casey conceptsi on. We have an explosive downfield passing
game now and we didn't two days ago. That's great, Dad,
Was that like it was when you were growing up? No,
it was not, no, it was not no.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
No, Listen, I grew up in the Northwest, and you know,
even Don James, you had these down three year cycles
and Don was like the I mean Nick Saban, you know,
quoted him at his death, like and Washington was great.
But you'd have down cycles where you missed on a
recruiting class and you missed on two tackles, Like all right,
(33:47):
we screw that up. Let's go into the portal. So
I love what it's created, which is you could just
interchange uniforms and the top twelve teams. It just depends
on the Saturday. It depends on who has the best
I mean, good God, USC and Illinois. I'm like, well,
I like us he's quarterback and that Lemon kid more
but everything else but pretty even So Quick Trip found
(34:11):
this video from a few years ago where I swore
off coffee shops because they kept increasing prices. But Josh,
you're telling me Quick Trip might change my mind.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
I think so many They have fueled my fall tours
for a couple of years now. I had a relationship
with him just because a bunch of the execs a
Quick Trip watched the show and then that morphs into
you guys want to do some business with the show,
and they're all over the south, and so it's you know,
it's big red square QT on it and you pull
off and you got gas out front. But when you
(34:44):
go in, they were the first place, and still I
think the only place I've ever seen was just the
pure cold brew on tap. Entire station looks like looks
like a barb, but instead you got all the different
kinds of of col brews there. And you got to understand, man,
when you drive as much as I have, when you
drive all its long distances, we'll go storm chasing in
the spring. We'll go college football in the fall. I
(35:06):
have made it a habit to just look for the
quick trip sign. They've been awesome to us. I mean,
they have been a huge, huge staple on my show.
So yes, look, if this is the recruitment that I'm
following right now, five star hot coffee prospect here, I
just you got to take a visit. It's all about
the official visit. Once we can get you to visit,
I think you'll be in.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Josh, pay your money, brother.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Thanks the volume.
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him from the Josh Py College Football Show. He's great
(01:04):
comes on the Herd volume. As many times as we
can get him on, we're going to I don't know
if you've been on the Herd yet. We'll get you on,
I promise. So I defended James Franklin for years. I
was like, listen, he's losing to Ohio State and Michigan.
You know, he's losing to the right people. I thought,
you're a favorite. You've got a lot of high end
(01:25):
first round draft guys. You gotta win that game. But
it was funny because I'm you know, I was watching.
I don't go online very much, especially to like fan boards,
but I did. I went to Penn State fan boards
just to see their reaction and then YEA, we want
him out of here. He's a bum. And my take
is James Franklin is kind of what I think most
(01:52):
college football coaches are. There's Kirby, there's Pete Carroll, there's
Nick Saban, there's Urban Meyer. I think Chris Peterson's one
of those. There's Dabbo, there's like in any industry, there's
like one percent, and then there's a bunch of guys
(02:13):
that are almost as good but may not recruit as
well or they're not schematically as good. And I think
James Franklin's in that. And I think if you gave
James Franklin Dante Moore and Dan Lanning Drew Aller, they
would have won the game. So I still think Franklin
is a top of the class, not a top six,
(02:33):
but somewhere seven to fifteen in a sport with one
hundred and forty you know, FBS schools. Or if you
lost faith in him after a game in which you're
a favorite at home, probably the better backfield and NFL
quarterback prospect, where do you land on him today?
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I don't think any differently of him. But I treated
the Oregon game way way bigger than I've ever treated
a football game. And so I got to tell you
a little backstory. You and I. I've apparently been singing
out of the same hymnal as me Mal would say
about James Franklin, because he is very very good. Never
used the word elite, never used the word great, just
very very good, an eighth thrunger what we would call him,
(03:12):
an eighth thrunger on a ten rung ladder. Yeah, so
I remember, even in the spring. I've been up there
a couple of times over the past few months. They
never shied away from this concept that this year we're
all in, kind of what Ohio State sounded like last
year when I visited them in spring. We're all in.
We're making no excuses or apologies about it. We're all in,
all right. So every every external dynamic edge imaginable you
(03:35):
have on that organ game, they got a travel cross country,
you got the bye, you got the experienced roster, they
got newness everywhere you should. You got a way more
experienced than veteran coaching staff. So all of that wind out.
You finally got it in primetime. I just felt like
it was such a referendum moment. It's such an inflection
point in time in the James Franklin Penn State era,
(03:55):
and I know, coming out of it, if you really
want to just you know, shred the argument. You could say,
it's just one game, it's just one conference game, they
went to overtime. It's so much more than that. Anyone
pretending otherwise is just ignorant of Penn State football and
ignorant of the situation. So I think a whole new
timeline started the other night. I said this on the
following night's show. It may sound hyperbolic, but I'm dead
(04:17):
serious about it. I think a whole new timeline got started.
Now here's what we cannot know yet. We can't know
which flavor of timeline it is, because you could sell
me on either of these things being the case in
twenty twenty nine, and I could believe you. You could sell
me number one, Franklin's no longer at Penn State because
that Oregon game precipitated this really ugly slip down this
(04:39):
slope where eventually neither wanted anything to do with the other.
Maybe they just cut ties, maybe it got really contentious,
but he's not there in a couple of years. I
could see that. I could also see him believing everything
that I'm saying and you're saying about that game that
was the referendum game. This is where it's going to
be the ultimate test of my way of doing things,
(05:00):
the way I've built Penn State. And I think it
was such a reminder that your best, given your current
modus operandi, is not going to be good enough. All right,
that's the absolute peak of this version of you of
Penn State football, and it got taken down by probably Oregon,
not even close to ascending to what they will become.
(05:21):
So I could see him driving home that night, I
could see him waking up the next morning just it's
just you and you in the bathroom mirror and saying
to yourself, this is it. Several degrees of change are
needed here. Here there just rigid principles you've never bent on,
you're willing to bend on. Now there's a third rail
where he doesn't know to do any of that, and
(05:43):
it just is what it is. I don't know where
we're going with it, but I sense the same thing
you did. Even the portion of the fan base, Like
I've got some Penn State folks on my staff who
were the last holdouts who always sort of shouted down
the radical portion of the fan base when they would
criticize him. Fire James Franklin after a loss, and they
(06:03):
they didn't get overly emotional, which is what I noticed.
They were almost I don't know, they were apathetic afterwards,
and it was kind of a shrug and well, we
know he's never going to be bad enough to fire,
but we were also resigned to the fact that this
is this confirmation we're never going to see the mountaintop.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yeah, it's you know, It's funny. Anytime Dan Landing wins
a big game, everybody's like, you know, he's going back
to the SEC, And I'm like, folks, Oregon has the richest,
most committed booster in the sport. Their facilities are insane,
(06:41):
unbelievable home field advantage, and now they're in the first
of the second best conference. It didn't validate like when Oregon,
remember when they finished number two in the country. They
beat Colorado and and but I cover that team. They
were small defensively, they have a couple of good corners. Defensively,
they didn't have NFL bodies. They've always had good quarterbacks
(07:04):
and clever offenses. It was sort of like Harbaugh's first
team at Michigan that won ten games, and you're like, yeah,
but they don't look like Georgia. They don't even look
like Georgia. Eight years later you're like, that looks a
little bit like Georgia. Notre Dame Brian Kelly remember that.
They get to a national championship game and you're like, well,
(07:24):
at halftime he was laughing. He's like, yeah, we're not.
You got to do better than we tried.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
We tried, guys, we tried.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Oregon's not that Oregon's a great job. You don't leave Oregon.
Like there's seven or eight jobs you don't leave if
you're winning at USC, LSU, Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, Notre Dame, Michigan.
Just stay. I think Oregon is in that class. But
it's remarkable how often every time Dan Landing, like he
beats Ohio State, you know he's gonna get job offers
(07:54):
in the SEC. Would you leave if you were Landing
and Auburn Clemson offered you a job.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
No, My answer would have been different ten years ago.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
No.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
I think I can accomplish everything there that I can
accomplish elsewhere. I don't really think people know this. Look,
here's what anyone needs to understand. Dan's not leaving Oregon.
He's not leaving Oregon because at Oregon it's the only
place where you have a deal with the school and
you've got a separate deal with Phil Knight. Basically, I mean,
we talk about buyouts all the time, and typically you're
(08:30):
talking about, oh, it's going to cost eight million, ten million,
twelve million. When you really understand Dan Lanning's life there,
you're talking about a forty to fifty million dollar buyout's
No one's willing to hit that, nor should they. And
even if it wasn't that, so let's pretend that wasn't
the case. Let's just pretend all the rest of the
dynamics were in place at Oregon. You mentioned facilities. Another
(08:51):
thing people need to know is when you go up there.
Right now, you sit in his office, you look out,
it's cranes everywhere, it's earth moving everywhere because they're over
hauling it again. So this time next year they'll be
ahead of the pack again on that front. But I
just want, I just want you and I everyone else
go back to that game against Penn State the other
night and understand what you watched. Oregon they recruited a
(09:15):
very high level already. They've mastered evaluation in the portal.
You can't have one of those things without the other, okay,
otherwise you're just lighting money on fire. Nebraska spent over
a million dollars on the right tackle that hasn't seen
the field, so you got to be able to evaluate
as well. Marshall Malcow is a really good dude. Running
point for Dan landing up there, but Landing himself and
(09:35):
that staff they are really really good at Evaling. So
you turn on the Penn State game the other night.
They've got eleven guys they took out of the portal.
I think I counted ten of them are contributing big time.
They got three starting offensive linemen. They've got multiple dbs.
In fact, the guy that people were most crazy about,
Makai Hughes, the tailback that came from Tulane. That's the
(09:57):
only one that you would call quote unquote a bust.
And he's not really bus. He's just a depth provider, right.
They they're doing stuff, in other words, that you used
to get told you couldn't do. It was a chore.
You had to clear the hurdle one hundred and fifty
percent of what the Southern schools did to get talent there.
You don't have to anymore. You don't have to, So
what's the downside. As long as you don't mind a
(10:19):
couple of extra hours on your plane rides every now
and then, you've got it set up there. He's not
lying when he says they're all in on living an
organ like. He's not lying about that. They just happen
to find the right guy from the South who is
the closest removed to a Nick Saban to Kirby Smart
to now Dan Lanny. He looks like a psychopath. His
(10:39):
eyes are really like that, even when he just talks
to you on a normal Tuesday over lunch. It fits.
It's taken everything that you think is a stereotype because
it's kind of true about Southern football culture and what's
one down there forever and you just transplanted it up
to Oregon at the best of times.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
So you and I were at the USC Illinois game
and thank god I had cover because that stadium doesn't
have much and it was hot as hell. It was hot.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
So I went to the Georgia game later that night
and they cooled off. I got cooler as I went
down there.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
So we can argue about did they score too quickly?
There's certainly an argument both sides. I think I tend
to think when you're on the road and you can
get a touchdown, get it. But I could be wrong.
But one thing that has been brought up, and I
think it's fair. When he Lincoln Roddy was at Oklahoma,
(11:42):
they did run the football, but the defense didn't feel
like it made big stops in big moments. That was
kind of the knock. They were like Oklahoma under Stoops
was a little bit more physical. So when Brett Venables
took over for Lincoln, that's what he talked about, a
culture of toughness. We're going to get more physical. There
was this in reputations can be somewhat generalizing or stereotypes,
(12:05):
but there's some truth, grains of truth and everything, and
so it was like they're wide, it's for wide. There
were little softs of Brett Venables like we're getting better off,
we're getting tougher. So he comes to USC. So Alex
Grinch is a disaster, but he got on the plane.
And we've talked about this. When you take a new job,
whoever gets on the plane, they move their family. You
got to keep them for two years. So he goes
(12:26):
and hires Danton Lynn. UCLA's very very smart defensive coordinator,
very good and immediately without great personnel, you're like, oh,
this is an upgrade. And then I watch him against
Illinois and Illinois got dashed by Indiana. Illinois had struggled
with offensive line protection. I watch USC and they're young.
(12:48):
In some spots in the d front seven, they got
pushed around. They didn't they didn't offer there weren't I
mean you were there. There were big running lanes, like
on every big third down once or twice the quarterback
was rushed. And my take is, and this was suggested,
is is it practice? Is there an element of this
(13:10):
up Temple offense that over the course of time, even
Lynn's defense up Temple, it's getting softer. And my take is,
we all know there's a certain style from about October
fifteenth on, it gets cold, it gets windy. I mean,
they couldn't close out games last year, Josh against Maryland,
against Minnesota, they couldn't run the ball. Do you think
(13:34):
there is truth in this that, oh my god, we
got the right defensive coordinator and we can't go on
the road and play smash mouth defensive in your face
football already.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, there can be Okay, I would counter with this.
Josh Hipel just won with defense last year. Josh Hipel
went to the playoff at Tennessee. And you and I
know good andwell not only the offense he runs, but
the tempo they're practicing. Yet a Tennessee offense is chaos,
or a Tennessee practice is chaos. And yet somehow Tim
Banks and that defense not only fortified themselves last year,
(14:08):
they built themselves to where when Niko and Maliava couldn't
push the ball down the field when it was three
and out, defense carried Tennessee. They didn't win a national title,
they got to the playoff, which was further than anyone
expected them to go. So the first thing I would
do is I'd answer your question yes, and then I
would say they aught to look at Tennessee. They aught
to look at whatever Josh Hipel has figured out a
way to do. The other part of that is, though
(14:31):
you remember what was it like two years ago now,
after that season where they made the staff changes. I
remember Lincoln as playing his day. He's sat there and
he's just kind of reset the program, and he was
talking to the media and he was talking about how
we are leaving no stone unturned, We're going to reinvent
the way we do this and that, and one of
(14:52):
the things he said was, we're going to rethink the
way we practice. This is going to be a top
to bottom overhaul. Well, that's what he was talking about.
That's what you can't do overnight. You can't just overhaul
the roster overnight with the kind of bodies they need.
And so I still there's a part of me that
thinks there's a lot of validity what you're saying. But
I still think to myself, if they change nothing else,
(15:14):
but I give them another cycle portal in recruiting to
go just bring in the bigger bodies, which I trust
that they'll do. How different does it look? Just how
different does does better talent make it look? Because when
we went to that game the other day, that's one
of the games where I made it a point to
stand in the end zone because I wanted to see
that early on, I wanted to see that it was
so glaring, they got pushed around, they got put on skates,
(15:35):
it was so glaring. And then I, you know, you
work your way over to the USC sideline and they
just you can so clearly pick up on the fact
that they know what's happening to them. They know there's
not a whole lot they can do about it. They're
gonna they're gonna need picks, interceptions during his special teams.
They're gonna it. It's tough because you know, the jutstaposition
(15:57):
to that is later that night you go down to
Athens and you're talking Alabama Georgian and it's just non
negotiables for both of those teams. We're gonna load up
on big bodies. You know, the concept of us getting
beaten because we're second best physically, it's not even in
their it's not even in their lingo. They don't even
understand how to speak that they don't win all the games.
But it's not because of what happened to USC. So
(16:19):
you're still sitting there waiting for it. I'm still sitting
here waiting on it. They made front office changes, Okay,
they've got a high rated recruiting class right now. I
don't doubt they'll try and attack the portal like no
one's business this upcoming winter cycle. I just hope philosophically
that's where it is. Like, I hope those changes have
been made to where it's just better players. I'm skeptical,
(16:41):
you can hear my voice. I'm a little bit skeptical. But
I'm still hopeful too, because I think they got good
people in the building there.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
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(18:18):
So when Kaylin de Bor got hired, Greg Byrn texted
me after a tweet, I sind, kind of thank me.
I think a little bit for the perspective I had,
because after Kylen beat Georgia, I said, you know, the media,
myself included in fans, success is hard and it doesn't
come as fast as we want, and so it's difficult
(18:39):
and it gets people get worked up. And I'm like,
Kaylin de Bor was a hard hire. Dan Lannings from
the South, Dabbo Sweeney was popular. I mean, they're they're
Lane Kiffin there were a lot of potential hires post Saban.
You could have argued they weren't going to get Sark
because Texas money. But you could have gone after a Lane,
(18:59):
a dabble, a Dan Lanning, and he didn't. He went
and got a Midwest guy that was at Washington three
thousand miles away, and it's easy to go, Oh, he's
got a great resume. The South is different, the intensity
is different. Some Midwest Western people like Chip Kelly. One
time when they were I think he was offered Florida.
He's like, that's too much. I thought Philadelphia was rough,
but it's too much for me. And Jim McElwain, who
(19:21):
I knew from college, is like, yeah, this is different.
I'm more West, Midwest guy, and but I don't people
tend to think, Josh. Everybody knows that if you're Jim
Harbaugh and you go to the Chargers to replace Brandon Staley,
you have to change the culture. It's a disaster. But
people think it's easy when you go to Alabama and
you'll replace save it.
Speaker 2 (19:40):
Well, you don't have to change the culture.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Well, yes you do. You have to be authentic to yourself,
you have to be author it doesn't matter what I
replaced Tony Corneiser.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
He was great.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I still didn't do the same show Tony did, right,
I did a different show, so I had there were
elements of the show you have to change. You have
to change certain things. And that's not a knock, It's
just that's the is. I think Alabama was a tougher
job than you think. The pressure is enormous. They were
struggling in the NIL to play to go to the top,
(20:10):
wrong with some Ohio states and Georgia's And when they
won that game, I found myself rooting for Alabama in
that first half. I was like, God, this is good coaching, Jesus,
this is good play calling, this is this is as
big a regular season when including Saban in like five years.
I thought it was so significant. And they've beaten Georgia
(20:30):
plenty of times. Did you feel it felt more like that,
a more of a beyond just a win at Georgia.
It felt like, Okay, this is the moment.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
I think it's one of the biggest games for the
program this decade, that goes back to when Saban is
still there. Yes, I could not. You cannot overstate the impact.
I mean think about where we are. We were talking
about inflection point with James Franklin. Okay, different standard at Alabama.
They've won their championships, but it was under the previous guy,
new guy, you don't know really, and go into the
alternate universe where they lose that game and they're coming
(21:04):
out of Athens already a two loss team and you
still got the rest of your conference schedule to go.
You probably have four minimum losses staring you in the face,
and what do you do? You mentioned Greg byrn buddy,
the only I wish you could have seen his face
walking off that field Saturday night. Greg Byrne was the
most relieved person in the entire building. That's the athletic
(21:24):
director at Alabama for those unfamiliar like because his reputations
on the line with this higher as well. And the
thing is, Greg Burn's never doubted for a second that
Kaylin de Boor is made of the right stuff. But
you don't play one hundred and sixty two college football games,
so it just comes down to these moments, like these
these key third downs, and you know a sequence here
(21:47):
and there that's going to determine whether you're a success
or a failure. That season. I got to tell you
about Deboor when he got there. I use the word ignorant.
Ignorant is not lack of intelligence. Ignorance is sometimes you
haven't experienced something. And I think he was maybe a
little bit ignorant to what you're talking about, the true
Southern football dynamic, Like I think he looked at it.
(22:09):
And I know this because I talked to him about it.
I mean, he just talked about winning principles, and he's right,
the same stuff wins everywhere. It's just the surroundings, the
externals are way different in the South than they are
anywhere not named. Ohio State basically out tried this.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
I've said that for years Ohio State's and SEC team
North that's the only one.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, So he got thrown into that. And I just
as much as you're try and wall yourself off from it,
it's really impossible. You cannot wall yourself off from it.
So I got to tell you now, people who have
observed him from the outside may not see this. If
you've been around Kaylan, or even if you're just like
a fan of the program, you follow him closer. He
(22:49):
since that Florida State game earlier this year, has been
like the third verse of lose Yourself, the part where
it's just it's no more games. I've been cut. I'm
bleeding all over the place. But I kind of get
it now. I kind of understand, like you get thrown
into the pot and it starts to boil and it
either consumes you or you adjust and then you thrive
(23:10):
in that environment. That's what I wondered about him, because
I knew this time was coming. It doesn't Saban didn't
avoid it at Alabama and he may be the greatest
of all time. Urban didn't avoid it at Florida. No
one avoids it. It's do you adapt to it and
thrive in it? Because that's the one or two percent
that are cut out to coach in the SEC and
major college football. And I'm telling you, it's like it's
(23:31):
like putting new keys in the ignition and it's kind
of turned in him and there's a lot of what
we would call degaffness dgaf neis that he kind of
has about himself that is very indicative of someone who
is now adjusted and who is acclimated to their surroundings.
And basically looked back and said, all right, game on.
(23:52):
If this is how it works down here. Game on.
You mentioned the coaching job they did the other night, Buddy,
that's an NFL coaching staff on that offensive side of
them they got, I mean, Ryan Grubb literally came there
when it didn't work out in Seattle. But they worked
Georgia's defensive staff pretty thoroughly. And think about the sentence
that just came out of my mouth, because you don't
really say that about anyone. And so now you know
(24:14):
their reward is they get to play Vandy this week.
And what stood out to me the most, and I
can't believe this is a sentence coming out of my
mouth either, to just give you an idea of how
that program's wired. Right now, they're walking off the field
in Athens, huge win, and they're no more headed into
the locker room than half the locker rooms talking about
the Vandy game. Half of them are in the locker room.
(24:37):
They're in Sandford Stadium. They're already looking ahead to the
Vandy game because that was the cattle pride to their
neck last year that they never fully recovered from. So
as much as the public circle at Georgia game, they
were already well aware before they left the building of
what's next week? Diego Pavia coming in there next week?
Their super Bowl last year. All right, they come into
(24:57):
our building. College game Day is going to be there.
So it was an eye opener to me because I
hadn't I hadn't been to Abama game this year in person,
so I hadn't been around them in person. Yeah, I
think that FSU game did something to him and it
may end up being the biggest blessing they could ever
suffer from, if that makes any sense.
Speaker 1 (25:14):
Yeah. When I worked in Tampa for two years, I
really learned because I love college football, but i'd grown
up around Oregon. Washington was a great program, and I
Kevin O'Connell was a photographer. He's still employee at WTVT.
I think it is Channel thirteen. And we went to
(25:35):
do a story on like Tuesday or Wednesday. Spurry Or
was the coach of Florida, and we went down there
and there were already fans parked in the parking lot
tail getting. It was Wednesday, and I'm like, I go
to Husky games like Friday night, maybe late Friday afternoon.
You'd show up at Husky Stadium. They were there Wednesday
(25:57):
and they'd been there. I mean, they had the they
had they're you know, they're cooking utensils out, they were
sitting in the chairs, playing you know, poker, and I'm like, wow,
this is different. And then the funny thing is i
remember listening to Southern smaller market radio and I'm like.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Bro, it is.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
March and that's all they're talking about.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
Like, yeah, you gotta you gotta live it. You have
to have experienced it. Because the first job I ever
got on air was fifteen eighty is wiol and Columbus, Georgia,
and it's it's in the heart, it's right there. Auburn, Alabama, Georgia,
FSU Florida, Clemson, South Carolina. The most underrated market in
the South. It's like market one P thirty something in
the country, but in the South. If you want to
(26:43):
talk college football, it's great. And you could take a
random Wednesday in June NBA Finals could be going on,
it doesn't matter. We're talking about the right side of
the offensive line, not the one deep colin. We're talking
about rotational pieces over there. And we're do we really
think this juco kid from Pearl River, Mississippi is really
(27:04):
going to be able to shine there? And it's just
so intense. You can back off. You can just shut
up and let guys go for ten minutes, and they're
as worst on it as they would be their own
children and their own family and their own financial situation.
It's really amazing.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
So I say this often, forty percent of America never
leaves the area code they were born in. People don't
like change. I did not grow up in a traditional
family with religion, you know, divorce parents. I had just
a British mother, and I just didn't have a traditional upbringing.
(27:39):
Thank god, I have good coaches. But so I tend
to embrace change because my life has been I've lived
in seven states, and so I understand people who aren't
comfortable with it that people that have lived in the
same cul de sac forever. I'm kind of jealous of that.
I understand my kids don't have like one set of friends,
and my wife and I have talked about that before.
(28:01):
Is that you sacrifice. Everybody makes sacrifices. I have moved
for commerce an opportunity, but it's probably hurt me in
terms of long term you know, friendships and relationships. My
friends are all over the country. So when the transfer
portal and the NIL came out in the college football playoff,
I was so excited. It's like, I've seen cal Arizona
State enough. I want to see Oregon and Ohio State.
(28:21):
I want to see Michigan and USC like I've seen
the regional stuff. But the unintended benefits that I didn't consider.
First of all, the playoffs way better than those half
empty stadium bowl games.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
That's a fact.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
Secondly, the NIL has not made the sport more lobsided.
The good teams are still good. The bad teams are
mostly still bad. But the transfer portal. I did not
predict this. I figured just the rich would get richer.
But the truth is kids want to play. And when
I watch Georgia now and a cornerback gets hurt, they
don't necessarily have a good backup. He's at Louisville, he's
(29:01):
at Texas Tech. Are you surprised? I look at the
sport now. You could change uniforms. I can't tell Oregon
from Bama, from Georgia from Ole Miss LSU. I can't
tell three four years ago, Josh, you could take uniforms off.
That's Georgia, that's Alabama, that's Ohio State. I think the
(29:24):
transfer portal. Everybody freaked out about it. I think it's
created a parody and an evenness that I haven't seen
in college football life.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
I've wrestled with this a lot. See, I used to
listen to you a lot talk about moving, and I
was the person you were talking about. I grew up
in West Central Georgia, never left there until into my thirties,
and so I'm very rooted and therefore I like tradition.
I like adhering to the stuff I've always known. All right, Well,
then work or opportunity moves me to Nashville's first time
(29:54):
I'd ever left home, first time I ever got out
of my cul de sac, actually, so that my worldview
and therefore my college football worldview kind of became rooted
in that. So I was one that sort of was
drug kicking and screaming across a lot of these lines.
And there's you know, there's always going to be stuff
to complain about, so anecdotally, if you don't like something,
(30:14):
you'll always be able to cherry pick. But I agree
with you, and I've had to adjust my thinking slash
perspective on a lot of this because it's undeniable when
you look I mean, Texas Tech could compete literally this year,
they could compete for a lot more than a Big
twelve sid Like it could happen. And so what I've
(30:34):
picked up on is everybody knows the transfer portal is
a big deal. That's a very fifty thousand foot evergreen
headline in college football. Drilled down a little bit when
we talked about Oregon a little while ago, when we
talked about Texas Tech, Like, I just did something on
our show the other night where I looked at the
hit rate, and I'm telling you, the programs and the
(30:56):
front offices in college football now that have really put
a print on putting good evaluators in those offices are
lapping the field. Miami is killing it not only because
they have money. Money is the oxygen. Okay, you're not
going to live without it anyway, it's a moot point.
You got to have the money that spend it properly.
And everyone's spending they're going after the same players. So
(31:17):
there is still very much a recruiting element to it,
but there's also a really really big evaluation piece to it.
So Miami they just overhauled their entire secondary colin there's
one OJ Frederic you'll see him Saturday against Florida State.
He's the only holdover. They looked at it and said,
this is not good enough. We just wasted cam Ward
last year. So they just imported a whole new secondary.
(31:39):
They hit on all of them. Oregon has three starting
offensive linemen from the portal. Not to mention, they got
Dante Moore back at quarterback. He's so good. By the way,
the kid who is starting and shining at col right
now had committed to Oregon, went to spring or went
to winter playoff practices and realize more was so good.
(32:01):
He asked for his release. He said, I'm not going
to be able to start here immediately, so I want
to go somewhere else. And they hated it, but they
let him go. But look at Texas Tech. Look what
they're doing LSU. You know, LSU is a wreck right now,
but not because of what Austin Thomas, who's the GM there,
and they did defensively, because they've gone from in the
eighties to the fifties to now the teens in national
(32:22):
defensive rankings because of the portal and evaluation in the portal.
They're not missing on guys, is my point. They what
they did not do is they did not go get
a tackle, a right tackle. They banked on the fact
they could develop one in house, and that has failed.
And that's why offensively, that along with quarterback injury, is
what they look like right now. But yeah, it's really amazing.
(32:43):
And what it also does is, you know, I was
at Tennessee last year the week of the Bama game,
and a lot of the staff was already talking about
their concern about their offensive line. The following year, well,
offensive line is not an issue for them because they
were able to rectify it in the portal. And so
you used to have this hopelessness as a fan where
(33:03):
if you knew you had a veteran laden union, right,
it was going to be minimum two years, maybe even
three years down the road. And now it could just
be you wake up one morning and there's a headline,
Oh a and m just went and got Mario Kraver
and Casey conceptsi on. We have an explosive downfield passing
game now and we didn't two days ago. That's great, Dad,
Was that like it was when you were growing up? No,
it was not, no, it was not no.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
No, Listen, I grew up in the Northwest, and you know,
even Don James, you had these down three year cycles
and Don was like the I mean Nick Saban, you know,
quoted him at his death, like and Washington was great.
But you'd have down cycles where you missed on a
recruiting class and you missed on two tackles, Like all right,
(33:47):
we screw that up. Let's go into the portal. So
I love what it's created, which is you could just
interchange uniforms and the top twelve teams. It just depends
on the Saturday. It depends on who has the best
I mean, good God, USC and Illinois. I'm like, well,
I like us he's quarterback and that Lemon kid more
but everything else but pretty even So Quick Trip found
(34:11):
this video from a few years ago where I swore
off coffee shops because they kept increasing prices. But Josh,
you're telling me Quick Trip might change my mind.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
I think so many They have fueled my fall tours
for a couple of years now. I had a relationship
with him just because a bunch of the execs a
Quick Trip watched the show and then that morphs into
you guys want to do some business with the show,
and they're all over the south, and so it's you know,
it's big red square QT on it and you pull
off and you got gas out front. But when you
(34:44):
go in, they were the first place, and still I
think the only place I've ever seen was just the
pure cold brew on tap. Entire station looks like looks
like a barb, but instead you got all the different
kinds of of col brews there. And you got to understand, man,
when you drive as much as I have, when you
drive all its long distances, we'll go storm chasing in
the spring. We'll go college football in the fall. I
(35:06):
have made it a habit to just look for the
quick trip sign. They've been awesome to us. I mean,
they have been a huge, huge staple on my show.
So yes, look, if this is the recruitment that I'm
following right now, five star hot coffee prospect here, I
just you got to take a visit. It's all about
the official visit. Once we can get you to visit,
I think you'll be in.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Josh, pay your money, brother.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Thanks the volume.
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