Jason reacts live after the New York Knicks play an elite Game 5 to get a win vs. the Indiana Pacers and extend the Eastern Conference Finals. Both Jalen Brunson and Karl-Anthony Towns were special in an effort to beat Tyrese Haliburton and Pascal Siakam.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
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(02:02):
doing to hoops tonight. You're at the volume heavy Thursday.
Everybody hope all you guys are having a great week. Well.
The New York Knicks, with their season on the line,
played the best game that they've played in this postseason
from start to finish. This is a team that's had
a lot of success in this postseason, but it's been
pretty uneven. Even their wins, especially in the Celtics series,
felt like all of them came from substantial deficits where
they played poorly for the most part, but then played
(02:24):
great in these short bursts. A wired to wire dominant
performance by the New York Knicks kind of changing the
way they were defending as well. We'll talk a lot
about that and how it translates to Game six, as
well as how it could translate forward to a potential
NBA Final series. Lots of interesting stuff we're going to
get into tonight that at the tail end of the show,
we're going to take ten to fifteen minutes of mail
(02:45):
bag questions from you guys. You guys know the drill
before we get started. Subscribe to the Hoops and I
YouTube channels. You don't miss any more of our videos.
Follow me on Twitter at underscore JSNLTS. You guysn't miss
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if you leave a rating in a review. On that front,
Jackson is doing great work on our social media feeds.
Twitter Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow
us there, and then, like I mentioned off the top,
(03:06):
get those mail bag questions into the chat so that
we can hit them at the tail end of the show.
Any specific angles of the series you guys want to
dig deeper into, anything's fair game, you could drop them
in the chat. Also, when we finish here tonight, we're
heading over to playback. That's playback dot tv slash hoops tonight.
That's where we take callers, we watch film. It's more informal,
(03:27):
we just talk hoops. We kind of hang out more
as a community, and I've been really enjoying those those streams.
So make sure you guys hop over there with us
when we finish tonight on YouTube. All right, let's talk
some basketball. So the big takeaway in terms of the
schematic difference between Game five and Game six, or Game
four and Game five, and again, like most of the
case when it comes to situations like this, is just
(03:49):
the natural swings of urgency that take place in a
playoff series. I feel like we've had fewer of those
kinds of swings in this playoff run compared to some
recent years. I think that probably has something to do
with the overall level of physicality. But this is kind
of what happens in playoff series. His urgency kind of
oscillates back and forth, especially between two teams that are
relatively evenly matched, at least when it comes to their ceiling,
(04:11):
like these two teams, and the Knicks just came out
with a ton of urgency Jalen Brunson immediately it comes
out with a six to zero run, just obviously bringing
the aggression that he wasn't bringing down the stretch of
Game four, he kind of had a different feel in
terms of that intensity. Tyre's Halliburton just completely no shows
the game against some ball pressure, and here we are
sitting at three two.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
But what were the specifics?
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So the Knicks really went with a bunch of super
aggressive coverages tonight, tons of ball pressure, tons of denial
trying to prevent Tyre's Haliburton from even getting the ball.
This is something we talked a lot about going into
the series, and we did see briefly in at various
points throughout the series, especially down the stretch of Game
three when they got a win, but just out the
(04:55):
gates tonight, they were able to get Tyre's Halliburton to
be way less aggressive just by bringing a ton of pressure,
not just in the denials, but also when he had
the ball. It kind of felt like Tyreese was getting
rid of the ball just a beat too early tonight,
like where he would get downhill on a ball screen
and he'd already be jumping to turn around and pass
out of it before he's even really threatened in any
(05:15):
way as a scorer. And that's the impact of pressure.
Pressure makes ball handlers uncomfortable. Another big thing you saw
at night was off ball denials whenever anybody picked up
their dribble so or had a ball in the triple threat,
so like if you threw the ball to the high post,
or if a guy happened to pick up his dribble
because he overpenetrated and needed to stop boom. Everybody was
face guarding, denying, trying to prevent those easy kickouts, and
(05:37):
just in general, they made Indiana way way, way more
uncomfortable than they did in previous moments in the series.
In ball screens, they were blitzing, they were showing up high,
just really getting aggressive on the ball. You could hear
TIBs in that first or second time out on the
broadcast when they show what he was saying in the huddle,
he was like aggressive, aggressive, aggressive on our blitzes, on
(06:00):
our shows, and our pressure and our denials aggressive. The
point being you can take advantage of the dynamic that's
at play in terms of the urgency and it being
an elimination game.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
I like the idea of.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Going with super aggressive coverages in this type of game.
You're at home in front of Madison Square Garden and
that crowd is just ravenous. Right, You're facing elimination, so
you know you're gonna get a certain level of urgency
out of your guys. The refs are gonna let you
get away with a lot of physicality in this type
of game, and most of all, it prevents you from
coming out lethargic. These coverages puts you in situations where
(06:35):
you're asked to sprint and be aggressive, whether that's in
a ball pressure situation or just because you're rotating around
off the ball after the pass comes out. It requires
intensity to be that aggressive, and so it kind of
just brings it out of you out of necessity, right,
and Indiana really just came apart at the seams to
give you guys an idea. Their previous series high and
(06:56):
turnovers was fourteen at twenty tonight averaged just ten and
a half turnovers per game in this series. They doubled
that in tonight's game. That's the level of discomfort they caused.
Indiana scored just forty five points in the first half. Remember, guys,
first quarter of Game four they had forty three points.
So just two completely different Pacers offenses in the last
(07:19):
two games. Because of that intensity and physicality. And again,
like Tyres Alliburton, as he's known to do at times,
and it's been less often in this postseason run than
it was last year, but when teams bring super intense
defensive efforts, he can no show a game. And that's
what he did tonight, and that you know, when that happens,
it's really difficult for Indiana to score effectively. And it
(07:40):
is something to keep in mind for Oklahoma City. We'll
talk more about that later should we get to that
to that point, if if Indiana can close it out.
But I thought everyone for the Knicks was great on that,
especially on the defensive end of the floor.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Tonight.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
I specifically want to shout out Mitchell Robinson he didn't
get a ton of burn in the second half as
Tibbs went more in the direction of Josh Hart and
Josh I thought played well tonight. I thought it was
one of Josh's better games in the series. It's kind
of like making some of the shots he was missing earlier,
grabbing some of the contested rebounds he was missing earlier
in the series. Right type of game to play, Josh.
(08:14):
And there was a couple runs that they gave up
at various points, but in the first half in particular,
when they were making that initial push, I thought Mitchell
Robinson was everywhere. The big thing that really stands out
to me with Mitch's his recovery athleticism. You saw a
couple of his like transition defense sequences where he gets
a little too much dip on his chip and he
like just straight up like attacks someone in the air
(08:34):
and commits a foul, but again preventing the easy layup
and making the guys actually earn those points at the line.
But in general, in every single one of those situations,
whether it's a ball screen where he's pursuing, or he's
in rotation, or he's in just like a situation where
he's on the ball while everyone else is denying. He
just brings this level of athleticism and kind of it
just feels like he just engulfs whoever he's going after
(08:58):
in those situations.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
He's one of them.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Was fun to watch defensive players in the league when
he's really going. And I you know, Mitchell Robbinson is
an interesting player in terms of how he kind of
fits in the league beyond the scope of just a
backup center. There are some issues obviously in terms of
maintaining motor over larger minute loads and whether or not
he has the offensive utility to be a factor in
a more, you know, featured role. But when he when
(09:22):
he comes off the bench, and obviously for the last
two games in a starting role, and he's when he's
when he's out there in those limited minutes, he just
brings this absurd amount of energy and it can just
really be disruptive for their opponent. I thought Brunson and
Cat were both phenomenal and offense tonight again, Brunson kind
of a classic like we're not losing type of attitude,
(09:43):
Like you could just see it in his body language
and demeanor right out the gates. He knew that he
didn't do enough at down the stretch of Game four.
We watched the end of Game four after on playback
a couple of nights ago, and it's just kind of
weird how Brunson just wasn't looking to be aggressive down
the stretch and was just kind of passing out of
some situations that we typically see him.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Shoot out of. But he fixed that right away.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I mean, we were talking about Nie Smith not solving him,
so to speak, but really wearing him down over the
course of the series.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Strong signed tonight that he came.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Out and just straight up bested that matchup immediately out
the gates, and he's going to have to do that
again in Game six for the Knicks to win. And
then Karl Anthony Towns. He's been basically unguardable since the
fourth quarter of Game three. It seems like it's really
clicked for him that none of these dudes can guard
him in terms of one on one kind of face
up situations. He can just rip through whether it's right
(10:34):
or left, and just power through contact and get all
the way to the bucket. And you could tell Indiana's
trying really hard to send him to his left hand
but he was able to power through to his right
hand several times today and just get up through contact
and he just like rips his arms up through the
people that are reaching and grabbing, and he just has
a gift for finishing through contact. He was amazing tonight.
(10:56):
Really just a wired to wire dominant performance for the Knick,
and that if you're looking for a bit of optimism,
it's the first time in this series that they've had
that type of wire wire performance. And the last time
they had a wired to wire type of performance like
that was in Game six against the Celtics. If you
guys remember when they really were peaking at that point
(11:16):
in the series, and they're going to need to maintain
that peak if they're gonna have any chance to win
Game six. Game six will be the toughest game that
New York has played in the series. We talked after
Game four. These two teams, when they're at their best
are pretty similar. You could even argue that New York
ceiling is maybe a touch higher just because Kat and
(11:38):
Jalen Brunson are more reliable as one on one players
if they end up in slow down situations than a
Siakam or a Halliburton. But the difference is I know
what we're gonna get from Indiana on Saturday. We're going
to get the Pacers very best. They're gonna come out
the gates with a ton of pressure and pace and
aggressiveness and energy and all of it. I feel pretty
confident Haliburton's gonna have a big bounce back game. They
(12:01):
are going to be the best version of the Pacers
on Saturday night. With the Knicks, I literally have no
idea what to expect this Saturday, and I would imagine
most of you Knicks fans feel the same, Like they're
just as likely to roll over and get beat by
thirty as they are to win the game. And that's
what makes them really difficult to get a read on
(12:21):
for this type of game, because we've just seen so
many times, even in series that they've won in this
postseason look bad and it for extended stretches, and so
it's just kind of weird. I just don't know what
we're gonna get. But to be clear, I do know
that New York can win that game. In terms of
the schematics, I would try those same super aggressive coverages again.
(12:41):
It's the only time in the series they've had sustained
defensive success. Even going back to our playback session last night,
when we started watching some of the OKC Indiana tape
just in prep for a theoretical finals, there were a
lot of Oklahoma City had a lot of success. They
were also able to get Tyree Saliburton to just completely
diseng with that type of pressure. It might just be
(13:02):
your best chance to beat the Pacers. And also it
just keeps you aggressive. I mean, like, think of it
like this. If you're gonna give up a bunch of
advantages anyway, because when you're in your traditional defense you
get lost too often, might as well get lost in
the context of everybody flying around and trying to pressure
the ball and see if it can cause enough payoffs
to prevent those sorts of easy kind of tick tack
(13:23):
toe sequences where Indiana gets wide open shots over and
over again. I also think trying to bring the worst
out of Tyris Aliburn is the best way to give
yourselself a chance to win in that building. If you
let him get comfortable, I think you're just gonna lose.
And so again, ball pressure denial, same sort of stuff.
In Game six, I think you have to lean into that.
But again, the Knicks have clearly demonstrated in this series
(13:44):
at two different points down the stretch, at Game four
and then again tonight, that they can shake Indiana's offensive
foundation with their defense in Game six. If they do that,
they've got a very good chance to win. For the Pacers,
it's just about not allowing New York's pressure to dislodge
them from their offense. Haliburton's gotta shed the denials. Be
(14:04):
physical on the ball, throw the guy out of the way,
go get the basketball. Look to be more aggressive early
and often in the game. Don't pass the ball too
early out of your attacks. If you pass the ball
too early, if the defense hasn't committed to you in
any real way, there's no advantage that you're creating. You
create advantage by being a threat. You be a threat
by looking to get further deeper into your attacks. Just
(14:27):
that was just completely missing from Tyre's Halliburton tonight. Make
the defense react to you. One of the things we
saw in film, and this is something that I've talked
about a lot in this postseason dating back to the
Cavs series, But I really like when Haliburton is getting
denied and facing a lot of pressure and he's going
through one of those stretches where he's being a little
bit more uninvolved. Get him involved in the action, have
(14:48):
him be a screener. We saw some examples of that
again in the Oklahoma City tape last night where in
the one clutch game they played a lot of nemhard
on ball because Halliburton was struggling with dort Well, they
just used how Leburton as a screener and like you know,
double dragon stack type of actions to try to keep
him involved. And again, like when you and are in
a situation where you're like hugging, and you said, there
(15:09):
were so many examples tonight where like they're showing replays
and like Nix are literally like hugging pacers off the ball,
And again that's just playoff basketball. That's kind of contact.
They've been allowing off ball more or less this entire postseason,
in every series. But you've got to find a way to,
uh to have success in that context. And if you
have an on ball guys call it in them hard
(15:31):
or siakam and you have you have Halliburton go up
to set the screen and Michal Bridges is hugging him.
Mcal's probably not gonna help on screens, and so there's
a lot of advantages you can create there by either
having the guy turn the corner as Haliburton screening, or
if McHale comes off in any way, shape or form,
he can then slip out of it and then Tyros
Aliburton has an opportunity to attack with an advantage, but
(15:52):
he is attacked from Halliburton when he does get his catches,
when he does get his opportunities, he cannot just completely
disengage from the game offensively the way he did tonight.
And then on defense, I'm more or less okay with
how they've guarded Jalen Brunson. I thought they could have
been a little bit tighter on their help tonight. There
were a couple of situations where I thought they were
just a step light, especially from the low man position.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Aaron E.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Smith obviously can do a better job staying attached. He's
won that matchup over the tail end of this series,
but Brunson is what he is, and there's only so
much you can do. I'm not necessarily worried about the
specific coverage there with Kat, though I think they need
to throw more resources at him. They have to make
him a passer, more aggressive with the double teams earlier
(16:35):
with help, put him in a situation where he has
to make reads in traffic instead of just allowing him
to bulldoze his way to the rim in one on
one situations. Once Kat gets his momentum, he's just a
bowl in a china shop and he's going to win
that battle more often than not. You've got to put
him in a situation where he can't get his runway.
And the only way you're going to do that is
if you bring early help or doubles, and so I
(16:58):
want to see a lot of that in Game six.
Last note on the Pacers before we get to our questions.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
There.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
I'm a little concerned about a theoretical Oklahoma City matchup
after a little bit of the film that we watched
last night and from what I saw tonight. So we've
been going back and forth about this, and I haven't
really devoted a ton of energy towards watching all of
the tape because I want to wait till we know
what the actual matchup is. It would be annoying if
(17:28):
I did that and then all of a sudden we're
covering a Knicks Thunder Finals, right.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
But we've done a little bit of it.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
We watched a little bit of tape last night from
Oklahoma City, and I've been thinking through theoretical coverages and
stuff like that with Jackson. We've talked in segments on
the show, and you know, we came around to being
a little more positive in terms of just their ability
to pass through Oklahoma City's defense and some of their
smaller guards and their ability to slide their feet and
stay in front of Shay. But one of the things
(17:54):
that we saw last night in the Oklahoma City game
is Tyre's Halliburton wanted nothing to do with the basketball
down the stretch of a game, and they were just
going through Andrew emhard and using Halliburton a little bit
as a screener. And they lost that game in a
crunch time situation in Indiana. Now context there being substantially
earlier in the season, basically a different Pacers team. Nie
(18:17):
Smith wasn't even available in that game. There were several
sequences when Oklahoma City was pinching off of Ben Mathern,
and you could tell the Pacers are just a little
bit hesitant to throw that kickout pass because he's not
the level of shooter that Nie Smith is, and so
like again, the regular season basketball is regular season basketball,
and hopefully over the course of a series, Tyres would
be more comfortable, but it was a little discouraging to
(18:38):
see that he just didn't really seem to be comfortable
at all operating with the ball against Oklahoma City's defense.
The Knicks, they they've been like occasionally costplaying as a
good defense at various points in the season. They have
had no sustained defensive success at all at any point
in this postseason or in this entire season, dating for
(19:00):
from October all the way through to this point. The
point being, they are not going to They're not going
to be able to reach the level that Oklahoma City
can reach on that end of the floor, point being
you're going whatever it is you're seeing from New York,
it's going to be a substantially harder version of it
in the finals if you even get to that point.
(19:20):
And so again, step number one is you got to
be able to handle this pressure and you got to
be able to play Pacers basketball, because if you can't
figure it out against the Knicks, you have no chance
of figuring it out against the thunder. If I had
to pick right now for Game six, I think Indiana
wins and wins comfortably. But I absolutely think the Knicks
have a chance to win that series or that game.
And I think if they do win that game, all
(19:42):
of a sudden, they become the favorite to win the
series and have a great chance to go to the finals.
So if you're a Knicks fan, you just got to
think about it in a one game context. Go in
on Saturday, and you're in great shape to go to
the finals. Go in on Saturday, right, but you guys
know the job. It's not going to be easy. That
Pacers team and must win games at home as and
a literally a buzzsaw. So I think the Pacers are
(20:04):
to say bet, but the Knicks absolutely have their chance.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
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Speaker 2 (20:40):
All right, let's get to Jackson, and let's get to
some questions.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Let's do it.
Speaker 4 (20:44):
Let's sort of stay on that Game six, how the
Knicks would win topic for a minute here. If the
Knicks win Game six, do you think it would be
more about their defense and the pressure than the turnovers
they were able to generate tonight, or more about the
their offensive success via Catz sort of continued dominance in Brunson.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I think that the Knicks offense kind of feeds off
of their defense, their team that I think has been
at their best offensively this season when they're running out
in transition. So I think they're kind of connected to
a certain extent. I'm not particularly worried about Brunston and
cat being able to generate offense. There's a certain amount
of like role player shooting variable that you have to
(21:23):
factor in. Like I mean, I thought the four jump
shots that Landry Shammitt and Duce McBride hit tonight were huge,
Like they each hit a catch and shoot three and
then they each hit a kind of a tough off
the dribble jump shot in the mid range that were
important shots Seamit's was weird he like jumped way back
and almost had his feet on the three point line.
But like there's a certain amount of like that role
player shooting that could be a variable in that sort
(21:44):
of game. But I think it's all about the defense.
Like to put it very simply, the pacers are a
great shot generating machine, and if they allow that machine
to operate, they're just going to make the shots and
you're going to lose. The only chance you have is
to disrupt that engine, dislodge them from their offensive foundation
(22:05):
to where they're not moving the ball as well, they're
not playing with as much pace, they're starting to second
guess their decision making. Tyres Haliburton wants no parts of it.
That's where you have the opportunity to really slow the
game down, at least on that side of the floor,
and then just pushing off of missus, pushing off of turnovers,
and when it comes down to a close game late
in the half court, you like your chances with Jalen
Brunston and Karl Anthony Towns, right.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
So I think it has more to do with their defense.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
So you were saying, if you were going to finish
the sentence in like an old school sports caster, away
the Knicks win Game six if if they're able to
make Tyres Haliburton uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Yes, if they're able to I think in general, dislodging
Indiana from their foundation on offense, meaning like taking away
some of the easy transition opportunities, preventing the like, oh,
they're seventeen on the shot clock and they've already gotten
into action and created a wide open catch and shoot situation,
like ball pressure denial, preventing them from getting into their
stuff early, making them work deeper into the clock, and
(22:58):
making them play one on one.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
What is your take on the Knicks looking so good
in the last couple games, sort of extending leads with
Brunt in the minutes with Brunson, it's been on the bench.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
This has been something we looked into in the numbers
on playback one of the Knights a couple It was
like a couple of nights ago or something like that. Basically,
when Brunson's on and Kat's off, they're good, And when
Kat's on and Brunson's off, they're good and when both
of them have been on they've been a net negative
at this point in the postseason. And it's really not
all that complicated. There's a there's a simplified order of operations.
(23:31):
When you have one ball handler on the floor, that
dude just knows he's got to be super aggressive, and
that can like any basketball player knows that, if you
play alongside a bunch of ball handling talent, it can
be a more complicated process of like figuring out rhythm,
like sometimes you overpass, sometimes you underpass, Like there's a
lot of like who is it that's looking to be
aggressive in this part of the game. Having staggering gives
(23:54):
you a situation where it's like, hey, here are the
keys of the offense you're working you know, yeah, Deuce
is out there, Michale's out there on second side action,
but we're playing through you. And then it's a simple
fact that like every other New York Knicks player that
touches the floor is a dude that heats on the
defensive end and flies around in rotation. And so if
you have four of those dudes on the floor instead
of three, you're just a better defensive team. And honestly,
(24:16):
That's the thing that stood out in the numbers two
when we looked it's just the next defense with both
of them on the floor is just rough.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
Yeah, it's yeah, for sure on the point of the
next defense in the ball pressure as that was definitely
the big storyline from the night. Why do you think
they haven't done this earlier? Is it a coach coaching
tid not? His Tim's philosophy right now is easy word
about the personnel, like what has taken them so long
to make this kind of adjustment.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
Every basketball team has an identity. We've talked about this
a lot with regards to the Pacers and the Thunder.
We've talked about it, even with like Golden State. There's
like certain teams where it's like, we have a goal
to maximize our talent, grab every little bit of low
(25:02):
hanging fruit, and so this is the way that we're
looking to go. But those teams have depth. The Warriors
consistently have had you know, twelve to thirteen role players
that they've trusted to play big minutes. The Pacers have
had a bench they can go to. The Thunder have
a deep bench they can go to. I think that
Tibbs has looked at his team and been like, I
(25:22):
trust six of these dudes, so maybe seven. So we
need to keep their minutes high. And so as a
result of that, I can't be asking them to blitz
and deny and pick up full cord and do all
that sort of stuff. Urgency brought that out, But I
think another part of it too is like getting to
the like I thought Precious to a shift that he
played tonight was pretty effective. I think he came in
(25:44):
late too, but the when he came in that third
quarter stretch, I thought he was effective. The Delawn Wright
minutes have been effective on the defensive end throughout the series,
and the bits that he's been playing well Andrew Sham
it's been like good, like flat out goods for them.
So like digging deeper into the bench and putting those
guys in a position where they're playing more roles, like
(26:05):
eighteen minutes out of Duce McBride, fourteen minutes out of
Lander sham At, ten minutes out of the Lawn right.
That keeps everyone else's minutes down. Cat played thirty six minutes,
no other starter played over thirty four. You put yourself
in a situation where because you're using your depth. You're
more comfortable picking up well court denying being that physical.
I think they would have done it anyway under the circumstances,
just because of the intensity of the moment, and we
(26:26):
have seen in this postseason for stretches they really ratcheted
up defensively and they look great. But I think just
going with a shorter rotation has caused the Knicks, and
this has been a thing they've done most of the season.
Going with a shorter rotation most of the season has
put them in a situation where their base scheme has
had to involve a certain amount of passivity on the
(26:47):
defensive end of the floor.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Yeah, I feel like that sort of speaks to a bit,
like really shows the flaw in some of Tibbs's thinking.
It's like he hasn't even even not not that you
would if you were looking on paper, you would necessarily
think guys like Delon Wright, Precious to Chewa, and Landry
Shammitt would be playoff game changers. But it's sort of
like the moment those guys came in, they were effective.
(27:11):
It is a little not an indictment, It's not that
too strong.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Of a word.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
I don't mean it that strongly, but it does sort
of illustrate I think some of the issues that Knicks
fans have with TIBs. If he plays his start at
such such heavy minutes, doesn't necessarily give these other guys
a chance to carve out a role for themselves. Because
the moment those guys are given the minutes, in the
biggest moment of the season, they have been effective.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
There's a proven way to make basketball easy that Indiana
and Oklahoma City have capitalized on too. What I mean
by that is like, it's not like you if you
look at Indiana's roster, how many people were super high
on Obi Toppen before he played for the Pacers. How
many people were super high on Thomas Bryant before he
(27:54):
played for the Pacers. Like Ben Athern's a guy who's
been integrated at various points throughout throughout his young career
as being kind of a shot chucker and inefficient.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
You know, a guy who can't play off ball.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
When you put when you put these guys into a system,
a system that has simple rules. Here's how we run,
here's what we do on offense, Here's the way we defend.
When you put these guys in situations where like any
basketball player can be successful as long as they follow
these basic rules and these basic reads, you can turn
(28:26):
you know, fringe NBA talent. I'm not trying to say
these guys are fringe NBA town, but relative to what
we would consider to be like the types of rock solid,
playoff bench guys that we've thought about over the years,
you know, like Bruce Brown with the Nuggets, or you know,
Livingston and Nigudala with the Warriors back in the day,
or whoever. Like these guys are benefiting from the culture
(28:48):
that comes from the top down. So like to your point,
like if Tips started the season and said we're gonna
pick up full court and we're gonna we're gonna deny
and we're gonna be super physical with our ball pressure
and we're gonna run in transition like crazy, then you
get into a situation where you're running a ten eleven
man rotation from the start of the year. We might
(29:11):
look at Landry Shammitt and de Lawn right, and these
guys pressures to Chua as like different basketball players in
the big picture because they fit into like this scheme
and it's like just TIBs won a different route. TIBs
went that I want to lean on my top end
talent as much as possible, So we're gonna be a
team that cuts corners on defense all year long. And
so guess what, they've been inconsistent on defense in this postseason.
(29:34):
It's kind of like, you know, if there's one thing
that has stood out to me in a big way,
and it's it's funny because this is something I've always believed.
This is this is something I've always believed, but I
just it's at certain points I'll like undervalue it, you know,
especially as we've been thinking more about offense recently.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Getting a team to just.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Play the right way on a night in, night out
basis during the regular season matters just does. And we
are looking down the barrel of most likely Indiana Oklahoma
City Finals, and I would argue the Thunder played harder
all season than anybody. And I'd argue the Pacers played
harder over the second half of the season than anybody
out east, and here they are looking sharper and getting
(30:18):
more of that low hanging fruit and winning basketball games
as a result.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
Well, next question, does Cats dominance in the back half
of this series change your thought? Your perspective if the
Knicks should trade him this summer.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
There's a little bit of a matchup related thing here
going on with Indiana, which is like none of their
dudes are big enough to handle him. So I think
like there are versions of matchups that you could see
on a series by series basis that like, for instance,
like let's say that the Knicks made it to the finals,
the Thunder are a more physical team with a with
a pretty strong frontline defensively, now with Chet and Isaiah Hartenstein,
(31:01):
it's very possible that he looks ineffectual offensively in a
series like that. So, like, I don't want to sit
here and say that, I don't want to sit here
and undercut the work that Cat's done down the stretch
of the series. He has found out the Indiana kank
gard and he's having a lot of success now bulling
his way to the basket, and that I think matters.
But the flip side of it is is that everything
(31:22):
is matchup dependent, and we just have so many examples
over the years of Cat kind of struggling. And here's
the thing, guys, Let's see how Cat defends in Game six,
Like it's a big important game on the road must
win elimination game. Like he goes out in game six
and he defends the way that he needs to defend
and he puts in you know, twenty five and fifteen,
then yeah, we can start having a different conversation as
(31:43):
he's now done it in a high stake situation to
put himself in a situation where he can go to
the finals. But like to this point, if we like
really zoom out from this postseason, it's it's been a
little bit more complicated than just here are his points
per game totals for sure.
Speaker 4 (31:59):
Last before we go over to playback the draft, the
DraftKings line on Game six is Pacers minus four. I'm
gonna put you on the spot who is going to
win games? If if you had to pick right now, who
is gonna win Game six?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I think the Pacers will win and they'll cover. I
think I didn't pick the Pacers over the.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Knicks because of like anti Knicks anything or any sort
of like even matchup related stuff. I just think the
Pacers are a better team. I think they're a better
team on both ends of the floor because they're more
more consistently at their ceiling. I do think the Knicks
can win that game. But I just think the Pacers
are safe for bet because they've demonstrated that throughout this season.
(32:39):
They've also just been consistently an absolute buzz saw and
like must win games at home, and I just think
that I just think that's gonna be one of the
most difficult games that you could ever ask a team
to win, is go on the road to Indiana, they get,
they get to go to the finals if they win, Like, yeah,
it's gonna it's gonna be it's gonna be rough. And
(32:59):
so again, it's not that I don't think the Knicks
can win. I just think the Pacers are far and
away the safe bet, and I think it's more likely
than not that they win big, Like i'd be looking
at alternate spread bets in a game like that. All right, guys,
that's all I have for tonight. Again, we're heading over
to playback, So let's playback dot tv slash Hoops tonight.
We'll be taking callers and hanging out and having fun.
Make sure you guys head over there. For those of
(33:20):
you guys who are not following us, we'll be back
on YouTube Saturday night. We've got thirty eight of the
last forty one nights, but we are finally done going
every night, so we will be back on Saturday night
for Game six of the Eastern Conference Finals between the
Pacers and the Knicks.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
I will see you guys then. What's up guys?
Speaker 2 (33:39):
As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting
OOPS tonight. They would actually be really helpful for us
if you guys would take a second and leave a
rating and a review.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
As always, I appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
Guys supporting us, but if you could take a minute
to do that, I'd really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
The volume
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
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(02:02):
doing to hoops tonight. You're at the volume heavy Thursday.
Everybody hope all you guys are having a great week. Well.
The New York Knicks, with their season on the line,
played the best game that they've played in this postseason
from start to finish. This is a team that's had
a lot of success in this postseason, but it's been
pretty uneven. Even their wins, especially in the Celtics series,
felt like all of them came from substantial deficits where
they played poorly for the most part, but then played
(02:24):
great in these short bursts. A wired to wire dominant
performance by the New York Knicks kind of changing the
way they were defending as well. We'll talk a lot
about that and how it translates to Game six, as
well as how it could translate forward to a potential
NBA Final series. Lots of interesting stuff we're going to
get into tonight that at the tail end of the show,
we're going to take ten to fifteen minutes of mail
(02:45):
bag questions from you guys. You guys know the drill
before we get started. Subscribe to the Hoops and I
YouTube channels. You don't miss any more of our videos.
Follow me on Twitter at underscore JSNLTS. You guysn't miss
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if you leave a rating in a review. On that front,
Jackson is doing great work on our social media feeds.
Twitter Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow
us there, and then, like I mentioned off the top,
(03:06):
get those mail bag questions into the chat so that
we can hit them at the tail end of the show.
Any specific angles of the series you guys want to
dig deeper into, anything's fair game, you could drop them
in the chat. Also, when we finish here tonight, we're
heading over to playback. That's playback dot tv slash hoops tonight.
That's where we take callers, we watch film. It's more informal,
(03:27):
we just talk hoops. We kind of hang out more
as a community, and I've been really enjoying those those streams.
So make sure you guys hop over there with us
when we finish tonight on YouTube. All right, let's talk
some basketball. So the big takeaway in terms of the
schematic difference between Game five and Game six, or Game
four and Game five, and again, like most of the
case when it comes to situations like this, is just
(03:49):
the natural swings of urgency that take place in a
playoff series. I feel like we've had fewer of those
kinds of swings in this playoff run compared to some
recent years. I think that probably has something to do
with the overall level of physicality. But this is kind
of what happens in playoff series. His urgency kind of
oscillates back and forth, especially between two teams that are
relatively evenly matched, at least when it comes to their ceiling,
(04:11):
like these two teams, and the Knicks just came out
with a ton of urgency Jalen Brunson immediately it comes
out with a six to zero run, just obviously bringing
the aggression that he wasn't bringing down the stretch of
Game four, he kind of had a different feel in
terms of that intensity. Tyre's Halliburton just completely no shows
the game against some ball pressure, and here we are
sitting at three two.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
But what were the specifics?
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So the Knicks really went with a bunch of super
aggressive coverages tonight, tons of ball pressure, tons of denial
trying to prevent Tyre's Haliburton from even getting the ball.
This is something we talked a lot about going into
the series, and we did see briefly in at various
points throughout the series, especially down the stretch of Game
three when they got a win, but just out the
(04:55):
gates tonight, they were able to get Tyre's Halliburton to
be way less aggressive just by bringing a ton of pressure,
not just in the denials, but also when he had
the ball. It kind of felt like Tyreese was getting
rid of the ball just a beat too early tonight,
like where he would get downhill on a ball screen
and he'd already be jumping to turn around and pass
out of it before he's even really threatened in any
(05:15):
way as a scorer. And that's the impact of pressure.
Pressure makes ball handlers uncomfortable. Another big thing you saw
at night was off ball denials whenever anybody picked up
their dribble so or had a ball in the triple threat,
so like if you threw the ball to the high post,
or if a guy happened to pick up his dribble
because he overpenetrated and needed to stop boom. Everybody was
face guarding, denying, trying to prevent those easy kickouts, and
(05:37):
just in general, they made Indiana way way, way more
uncomfortable than they did in previous moments in the series.
In ball screens, they were blitzing, they were showing up high,
just really getting aggressive on the ball. You could hear
TIBs in that first or second time out on the
broadcast when they show what he was saying in the huddle,
he was like aggressive, aggressive, aggressive on our blitzes, on
(06:00):
our shows, and our pressure and our denials aggressive. The
point being you can take advantage of the dynamic that's
at play in terms of the urgency and it being
an elimination game.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
I like the idea of.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Going with super aggressive coverages in this type of game.
You're at home in front of Madison Square Garden and
that crowd is just ravenous. Right, You're facing elimination, so
you know you're gonna get a certain level of urgency
out of your guys. The refs are gonna let you
get away with a lot of physicality in this type
of game, and most of all, it prevents you from
coming out lethargic. These coverages puts you in situations where
(06:35):
you're asked to sprint and be aggressive, whether that's in
a ball pressure situation or just because you're rotating around
off the ball after the pass comes out. It requires
intensity to be that aggressive, and so it kind of
just brings it out of you out of necessity, right,
and Indiana really just came apart at the seams to
give you guys an idea. Their previous series high and
(06:56):
turnovers was fourteen at twenty tonight averaged just ten and
a half turnovers per game in this series. They doubled
that in tonight's game. That's the level of discomfort they caused.
Indiana scored just forty five points in the first half. Remember, guys,
first quarter of Game four they had forty three points.
So just two completely different Pacers offenses in the last
(07:19):
two games. Because of that intensity and physicality. And again,
like Tyres Alliburton, as he's known to do at times,
and it's been less often in this postseason run than
it was last year, but when teams bring super intense
defensive efforts, he can no show a game. And that's
what he did tonight, and that you know, when that happens,
it's really difficult for Indiana to score effectively. And it
(07:40):
is something to keep in mind for Oklahoma City. We'll
talk more about that later should we get to that
to that point, if if Indiana can close it out.
But I thought everyone for the Knicks was great on that,
especially on the defensive end of the floor.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Tonight.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
I specifically want to shout out Mitchell Robinson he didn't
get a ton of burn in the second half as
Tibbs went more in the direction of Josh Hart and
Josh I thought played well tonight. I thought it was
one of Josh's better games in the series. It's kind
of like making some of the shots he was missing earlier,
grabbing some of the contested rebounds he was missing earlier
in the series. Right type of game to play, Josh.
(08:14):
And there was a couple runs that they gave up
at various points, but in the first half in particular,
when they were making that initial push, I thought Mitchell
Robinson was everywhere. The big thing that really stands out
to me with Mitch's his recovery athleticism. You saw a
couple of his like transition defense sequences where he gets
a little too much dip on his chip and he
like just straight up like attacks someone in the air
(08:34):
and commits a foul, but again preventing the easy layup
and making the guys actually earn those points at the line.
But in general, in every single one of those situations,
whether it's a ball screen where he's pursuing, or he's
in rotation, or he's in just like a situation where
he's on the ball while everyone else is denying. He
just brings this level of athleticism and kind of it
just feels like he just engulfs whoever he's going after
(08:58):
in those situations.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
He's one of them.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Was fun to watch defensive players in the league when
he's really going. And I you know, Mitchell Robbinson is
an interesting player in terms of how he kind of
fits in the league beyond the scope of just a
backup center. There are some issues obviously in terms of
maintaining motor over larger minute loads and whether or not
he has the offensive utility to be a factor in
a more, you know, featured role. But when he when
(09:22):
he comes off the bench, and obviously for the last
two games in a starting role, and he's when he's
when he's out there in those limited minutes, he just
brings this absurd amount of energy and it can just
really be disruptive for their opponent. I thought Brunson and
Cat were both phenomenal and offense tonight again, Brunson kind
of a classic like we're not losing type of attitude,
(09:43):
Like you could just see it in his body language
and demeanor right out the gates. He knew that he
didn't do enough at down the stretch of Game four.
We watched the end of Game four after on playback
a couple of nights ago, and it's just kind of
weird how Brunson just wasn't looking to be aggressive down
the stretch and was just kind of passing out of
some situations that we typically see him.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
Shoot out of. But he fixed that right away.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I mean, we were talking about Nie Smith not solving him,
so to speak, but really wearing him down over the
course of the series.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Strong signed tonight that he came.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Out and just straight up bested that matchup immediately out
the gates, and he's going to have to do that
again in Game six for the Knicks to win. And
then Karl Anthony Towns. He's been basically unguardable since the
fourth quarter of Game three. It seems like it's really
clicked for him that none of these dudes can guard
him in terms of one on one kind of face
up situations. He can just rip through whether it's right
(10:34):
or left, and just power through contact and get all
the way to the bucket. And you could tell Indiana's
trying really hard to send him to his left hand
but he was able to power through to his right
hand several times today and just get up through contact
and he just like rips his arms up through the
people that are reaching and grabbing, and he just has
a gift for finishing through contact. He was amazing tonight.
(10:56):
Really just a wired to wire dominant performance for the Knick,
and that if you're looking for a bit of optimism,
it's the first time in this series that they've had
that type of wire wire performance. And the last time
they had a wired to wire type of performance like
that was in Game six against the Celtics. If you
guys remember when they really were peaking at that point
(11:16):
in the series, and they're going to need to maintain
that peak if they're gonna have any chance to win
Game six. Game six will be the toughest game that
New York has played in the series. We talked after
Game four. These two teams, when they're at their best
are pretty similar. You could even argue that New York
ceiling is maybe a touch higher just because Kat and
(11:38):
Jalen Brunson are more reliable as one on one players
if they end up in slow down situations than a
Siakam or a Halliburton. But the difference is I know
what we're gonna get from Indiana on Saturday. We're going
to get the Pacers very best. They're gonna come out
the gates with a ton of pressure and pace and
aggressiveness and energy and all of it. I feel pretty
confident Haliburton's gonna have a big bounce back game. They
(12:01):
are going to be the best version of the Pacers
on Saturday night. With the Knicks, I literally have no
idea what to expect this Saturday, and I would imagine
most of you Knicks fans feel the same, Like they're
just as likely to roll over and get beat by
thirty as they are to win the game. And that's
what makes them really difficult to get a read on
(12:21):
for this type of game, because we've just seen so
many times, even in series that they've won in this
postseason look bad and it for extended stretches, and so
it's just kind of weird. I just don't know what
we're gonna get. But to be clear, I do know
that New York can win that game. In terms of
the schematics, I would try those same super aggressive coverages again.
(12:41):
It's the only time in the series they've had sustained
defensive success. Even going back to our playback session last night,
when we started watching some of the OKC Indiana tape
just in prep for a theoretical finals, there were a
lot of Oklahoma City had a lot of success. They
were also able to get Tyree Saliburton to just completely
diseng with that type of pressure. It might just be
(13:02):
your best chance to beat the Pacers. And also it
just keeps you aggressive. I mean, like, think of it
like this. If you're gonna give up a bunch of
advantages anyway, because when you're in your traditional defense you
get lost too often, might as well get lost in
the context of everybody flying around and trying to pressure
the ball and see if it can cause enough payoffs
to prevent those sorts of easy kind of tick tack
(13:23):
toe sequences where Indiana gets wide open shots over and
over again. I also think trying to bring the worst
out of Tyris Aliburn is the best way to give
yourselself a chance to win in that building. If you
let him get comfortable, I think you're just gonna lose.
And so again, ball pressure denial, same sort of stuff.
In Game six, I think you have to lean into that.
But again, the Knicks have clearly demonstrated in this series
(13:44):
at two different points down the stretch, at Game four
and then again tonight, that they can shake Indiana's offensive
foundation with their defense in Game six. If they do that,
they've got a very good chance to win. For the Pacers,
it's just about not allowing New York's pressure to dislodge
them from their offense. Haliburton's gotta shed the denials. Be
(14:04):
physical on the ball, throw the guy out of the way,
go get the basketball. Look to be more aggressive early
and often in the game. Don't pass the ball too
early out of your attacks. If you pass the ball
too early, if the defense hasn't committed to you in
any real way, there's no advantage that you're creating. You
create advantage by being a threat. You be a threat
by looking to get further deeper into your attacks. Just
(14:27):
that was just completely missing from Tyre's Halliburton tonight. Make
the defense react to you. One of the things we
saw in film, and this is something that I've talked
about a lot in this postseason dating back to the
Cavs series, But I really like when Haliburton is getting
denied and facing a lot of pressure and he's going
through one of those stretches where he's being a little
bit more uninvolved. Get him involved in the action, have
(14:48):
him be a screener. We saw some examples of that
again in the Oklahoma City tape last night where in
the one clutch game they played a lot of nemhard
on ball because Halliburton was struggling with dort Well, they
just used how Leburton as a screener and like you know,
double dragon stack type of actions to try to keep
him involved. And again, like when you and are in
a situation where you're like hugging, and you said, there
(15:09):
were so many examples tonight where like they're showing replays
and like Nix are literally like hugging pacers off the ball,
And again that's just playoff basketball. That's kind of contact.
They've been allowing off ball more or less this entire postseason,
in every series. But you've got to find a way to,
uh to have success in that context. And if you
have an on ball guys call it in them hard
(15:31):
or siakam and you have you have Halliburton go up
to set the screen and Michal Bridges is hugging him.
Mcal's probably not gonna help on screens, and so there's
a lot of advantages you can create there by either
having the guy turn the corner as Haliburton screening, or
if McHale comes off in any way, shape or form,
he can then slip out of it and then Tyros
Aliburton has an opportunity to attack with an advantage, but
(15:52):
he is attacked from Halliburton when he does get his catches,
when he does get his opportunities, he cannot just completely
disengage from the game offensively the way he did tonight.
And then on defense, I'm more or less okay with
how they've guarded Jalen Brunson. I thought they could have
been a little bit tighter on their help tonight. There
were a couple of situations where I thought they were
just a step light, especially from the low man position.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Aaron E.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Smith obviously can do a better job staying attached. He's
won that matchup over the tail end of this series,
but Brunson is what he is, and there's only so
much you can do. I'm not necessarily worried about the
specific coverage there with Kat, though I think they need
to throw more resources at him. They have to make
him a passer, more aggressive with the double teams earlier
(16:35):
with help, put him in a situation where he has
to make reads in traffic instead of just allowing him
to bulldoze his way to the rim in one on
one situations. Once Kat gets his momentum, he's just a
bowl in a china shop and he's going to win
that battle more often than not. You've got to put
him in a situation where he can't get his runway.
And the only way you're going to do that is
if you bring early help or doubles, and so I
(16:58):
want to see a lot of that in Game six.
Last note on the Pacers before we get to our questions.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
There.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
I'm a little concerned about a theoretical Oklahoma City matchup
after a little bit of the film that we watched
last night and from what I saw tonight. So we've
been going back and forth about this, and I haven't
really devoted a ton of energy towards watching all of
the tape because I want to wait till we know
what the actual matchup is. It would be annoying if
(17:28):
I did that and then all of a sudden we're
covering a Knicks Thunder Finals, right.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
But we've done a little bit of it.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
We watched a little bit of tape last night from
Oklahoma City, and I've been thinking through theoretical coverages and
stuff like that with Jackson. We've talked in segments on
the show, and you know, we came around to being
a little more positive in terms of just their ability
to pass through Oklahoma City's defense and some of their
smaller guards and their ability to slide their feet and
stay in front of Shay. But one of the things
(17:54):
that we saw last night in the Oklahoma City game
is Tyre's Halliburton wanted nothing to do with the basketball
down the stretch of a game, and they were just
going through Andrew emhard and using Halliburton a little bit
as a screener. And they lost that game in a
crunch time situation in Indiana. Now context there being substantially
earlier in the season, basically a different Pacers team. Nie
(18:17):
Smith wasn't even available in that game. There were several
sequences when Oklahoma City was pinching off of Ben Mathern,
and you could tell the Pacers are just a little
bit hesitant to throw that kickout pass because he's not
the level of shooter that Nie Smith is, and so
like again, the regular season basketball is regular season basketball,
and hopefully over the course of a series, Tyres would
be more comfortable, but it was a little discouraging to
(18:38):
see that he just didn't really seem to be comfortable
at all operating with the ball against Oklahoma City's defense.
The Knicks, they they've been like occasionally costplaying as a
good defense at various points in the season. They have
had no sustained defensive success at all at any point
in this postseason or in this entire season, dating for
(19:00):
from October all the way through to this point. The
point being, they are not going to They're not going
to be able to reach the level that Oklahoma City
can reach on that end of the floor, point being
you're going whatever it is you're seeing from New York,
it's going to be a substantially harder version of it
in the finals if you even get to that point.
(19:20):
And so again, step number one is you got to
be able to handle this pressure and you got to
be able to play Pacers basketball, because if you can't
figure it out against the Knicks, you have no chance
of figuring it out against the thunder. If I had
to pick right now for Game six, I think Indiana
wins and wins comfortably. But I absolutely think the Knicks
have a chance to win that series or that game.
And I think if they do win that game, all
(19:42):
of a sudden, they become the favorite to win the
series and have a great chance to go to the finals.
So if you're a Knicks fan, you just got to
think about it in a one game context. Go in
on Saturday, and you're in great shape to go to
the finals. Go in on Saturday, right, but you guys
know the job. It's not going to be easy. That
Pacers team and must win games at home as and
a literally a buzzsaw. So I think the Pacers are
(20:04):
to say bet, but the Knicks absolutely have their chance.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
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Speaker 2 (20:40):
All right, let's get to Jackson, and let's get to
some questions.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Let's do it.
Speaker 4 (20:44):
Let's sort of stay on that Game six, how the
Knicks would win topic for a minute here. If the
Knicks win Game six, do you think it would be
more about their defense and the pressure than the turnovers
they were able to generate tonight, or more about the
their offensive success via Catz sort of continued dominance in Brunson.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I think that the Knicks offense kind of feeds off
of their defense, their team that I think has been
at their best offensively this season when they're running out
in transition. So I think they're kind of connected to
a certain extent. I'm not particularly worried about Brunston and
cat being able to generate offense. There's a certain amount
of like role player shooting variable that you have to
(21:23):
factor in. Like I mean, I thought the four jump
shots that Landry Shammitt and Duce McBride hit tonight were huge,
Like they each hit a catch and shoot three and
then they each hit a kind of a tough off
the dribble jump shot in the mid range that were
important shots Seamit's was weird he like jumped way back
and almost had his feet on the three point line.
But like there's a certain amount of like that role
player shooting that could be a variable in that sort
(21:44):
of game. But I think it's all about the defense.
Like to put it very simply, the pacers are a
great shot generating machine, and if they allow that machine
to operate, they're just going to make the shots and
you're going to lose. The only chance you have is
to disrupt that engine, dislodge them from their offensive foundation
(22:05):
to where they're not moving the ball as well, they're
not playing with as much pace, they're starting to second
guess their decision making. Tyres Haliburton wants no parts of it.
That's where you have the opportunity to really slow the
game down, at least on that side of the floor,
and then just pushing off of missus, pushing off of turnovers,
and when it comes down to a close game late
in the half court, you like your chances with Jalen
Brunston and Karl Anthony Towns, right.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
So I think it has more to do with their defense.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
So you were saying, if you were going to finish
the sentence in like an old school sports caster, away
the Knicks win Game six if if they're able to
make Tyres Haliburton uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
Yes, if they're able to I think in general, dislodging
Indiana from their foundation on offense, meaning like taking away
some of the easy transition opportunities, preventing the like, oh,
they're seventeen on the shot clock and they've already gotten
into action and created a wide open catch and shoot situation,
like ball pressure denial, preventing them from getting into their
stuff early, making them work deeper into the clock, and
(22:58):
making them play one on one.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
What is your take on the Knicks looking so good
in the last couple games, sort of extending leads with
Brunt in the minutes with Brunson, it's been on the bench.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
This has been something we looked into in the numbers
on playback one of the Knights a couple It was
like a couple of nights ago or something like that. Basically,
when Brunson's on and Kat's off, they're good, And when
Kat's on and Brunson's off, they're good and when both
of them have been on they've been a net negative
at this point in the postseason. And it's really not
all that complicated. There's a there's a simplified order of operations.
(23:31):
When you have one ball handler on the floor, that
dude just knows he's got to be super aggressive, and
that can like any basketball player knows that, if you
play alongside a bunch of ball handling talent, it can
be a more complicated process of like figuring out rhythm,
like sometimes you overpass, sometimes you underpass, Like there's a
lot of like who is it that's looking to be
aggressive in this part of the game. Having staggering gives
(23:54):
you a situation where it's like, hey, here are the
keys of the offense you're working you know, yeah, Deuce
is out there, Michale's out there on second side action,
but we're playing through you. And then it's a simple
fact that like every other New York Knicks player that
touches the floor is a dude that heats on the
defensive end and flies around in rotation. And so if
you have four of those dudes on the floor instead
of three, you're just a better defensive team. And honestly,
(24:16):
That's the thing that stood out in the numbers two
when we looked it's just the next defense with both
of them on the floor is just rough.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
Yeah, it's yeah, for sure on the point of the
next defense in the ball pressure as that was definitely
the big storyline from the night. Why do you think
they haven't done this earlier? Is it a coach coaching
tid not? His Tim's philosophy right now is easy word
about the personnel, like what has taken them so long
to make this kind of adjustment.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
Every basketball team has an identity. We've talked about this
a lot with regards to the Pacers and the Thunder.
We've talked about it, even with like Golden State. There's
like certain teams where it's like, we have a goal
to maximize our talent, grab every little bit of low
(25:02):
hanging fruit, and so this is the way that we're
looking to go. But those teams have depth. The Warriors
consistently have had you know, twelve to thirteen role players
that they've trusted to play big minutes. The Pacers have
had a bench they can go to. The Thunder have
a deep bench they can go to. I think that
Tibbs has looked at his team and been like, I
(25:22):
trust six of these dudes, so maybe seven. So we
need to keep their minutes high. And so as a
result of that, I can't be asking them to blitz
and deny and pick up full cord and do all
that sort of stuff. Urgency brought that out, But I
think another part of it too is like getting to
the like I thought Precious to a shift that he
played tonight was pretty effective. I think he came in
(25:44):
late too, but the when he came in that third
quarter stretch, I thought he was effective. The Delawn Wright
minutes have been effective on the defensive end throughout the series,
and the bits that he's been playing well Andrew Sham
it's been like good, like flat out goods for them.
So like digging deeper into the bench and putting those
guys in a position where they're playing more roles, like
(26:05):
eighteen minutes out of Duce McBride, fourteen minutes out of
Lander sham At, ten minutes out of the Lawn right.
That keeps everyone else's minutes down. Cat played thirty six minutes,
no other starter played over thirty four. You put yourself
in a situation where because you're using your depth. You're
more comfortable picking up well court denying being that physical.
I think they would have done it anyway under the circumstances,
just because of the intensity of the moment, and we
(26:26):
have seen in this postseason for stretches they really ratcheted
up defensively and they look great. But I think just
going with a shorter rotation has caused the Knicks, and
this has been a thing they've done most of the season.
Going with a shorter rotation most of the season has
put them in a situation where their base scheme has
had to involve a certain amount of passivity on the
(26:47):
defensive end of the floor.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Yeah, I feel like that sort of speaks to a bit,
like really shows the flaw in some of Tibbs's thinking.
It's like he hasn't even even not not that you
would if you were looking on paper, you would necessarily
think guys like Delon Wright, Precious to Chewa, and Landry
Shammitt would be playoff game changers. But it's sort of
like the moment those guys came in, they were effective.
(27:11):
It is a little not an indictment, It's not that
too strong.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Of a word.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
I don't mean it that strongly, but it does sort
of illustrate I think some of the issues that Knicks
fans have with TIBs. If he plays his start at
such such heavy minutes, doesn't necessarily give these other guys
a chance to carve out a role for themselves. Because
the moment those guys are given the minutes, in the
biggest moment of the season, they have been effective.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
There's a proven way to make basketball easy that Indiana
and Oklahoma City have capitalized on too. What I mean
by that is like, it's not like you if you
look at Indiana's roster, how many people were super high
on Obi Toppen before he played for the Pacers. How
many people were super high on Thomas Bryant before he
(27:54):
played for the Pacers. Like Ben Athern's a guy who's
been integrated at various points throughout throughout his young career
as being kind of a shot chucker and inefficient.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
You know, a guy who can't play off ball.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
When you put when you put these guys into a system,
a system that has simple rules. Here's how we run,
here's what we do on offense, Here's the way we defend.
When you put these guys in situations where like any
basketball player can be successful as long as they follow
these basic rules and these basic reads, you can turn
(28:26):
you know, fringe NBA talent. I'm not trying to say
these guys are fringe NBA town, but relative to what
we would consider to be like the types of rock solid,
playoff bench guys that we've thought about over the years,
you know, like Bruce Brown with the Nuggets, or you know,
Livingston and Nigudala with the Warriors back in the day,
or whoever. Like these guys are benefiting from the culture
(28:48):
that comes from the top down. So like to your point,
like if Tips started the season and said we're gonna
pick up full court and we're gonna we're gonna deny
and we're gonna be super physical with our ball pressure
and we're gonna run in transition like crazy, then you
get into a situation where you're running a ten eleven
man rotation from the start of the year. We might
(29:11):
look at Landry Shammitt and de Lawn right, and these
guys pressures to Chua as like different basketball players in
the big picture because they fit into like this scheme
and it's like just TIBs won a different route. TIBs
went that I want to lean on my top end
talent as much as possible, So we're gonna be a
team that cuts corners on defense all year long. And
so guess what, they've been inconsistent on defense in this postseason.
(29:34):
It's kind of like, you know, if there's one thing
that has stood out to me in a big way,
and it's it's funny because this is something I've always believed.
This is this is something I've always believed, but I
just it's at certain points I'll like undervalue it, you know,
especially as we've been thinking more about offense recently.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Getting a team to just.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Play the right way on a night in, night out
basis during the regular season matters just does. And we
are looking down the barrel of most likely Indiana Oklahoma
City Finals, and I would argue the Thunder played harder
all season than anybody. And I'd argue the Pacers played
harder over the second half of the season than anybody
out east, and here they are looking sharper and getting
(30:18):
more of that low hanging fruit and winning basketball games
as a result.
Speaker 4 (30:24):
Well, next question, does Cats dominance in the back half
of this series change your thought? Your perspective if the
Knicks should trade him this summer.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
There's a little bit of a matchup related thing here
going on with Indiana, which is like none of their
dudes are big enough to handle him. So I think
like there are versions of matchups that you could see
on a series by series basis that like, for instance,
like let's say that the Knicks made it to the finals,
the Thunder are a more physical team with a with
a pretty strong frontline defensively, now with Chet and Isaiah Hartenstein,
(31:01):
it's very possible that he looks ineffectual offensively in a
series like that. So, like, I don't want to sit
here and say that, I don't want to sit here
and undercut the work that Cat's done down the stretch
of the series. He has found out the Indiana kank
gard and he's having a lot of success now bulling
his way to the basket, and that I think matters.
But the flip side of it is is that everything
(31:22):
is matchup dependent, and we just have so many examples
over the years of Cat kind of struggling. And here's
the thing, guys, Let's see how Cat defends in Game six,
Like it's a big important game on the road must
win elimination game. Like he goes out in game six
and he defends the way that he needs to defend
and he puts in you know, twenty five and fifteen,
then yeah, we can start having a different conversation as
(31:43):
he's now done it in a high stake situation to
put himself in a situation where he can go to
the finals. But like to this point, if we like
really zoom out from this postseason, it's it's been a
little bit more complicated than just here are his points
per game totals for sure.
Speaker 4 (31:59):
Last before we go over to playback the draft, the
DraftKings line on Game six is Pacers minus four. I'm
gonna put you on the spot who is going to
win games? If if you had to pick right now, who
is gonna win Game six?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
I think the Pacers will win and they'll cover. I
think I didn't pick the Pacers over the.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Knicks because of like anti Knicks anything or any sort
of like even matchup related stuff. I just think the
Pacers are a better team. I think they're a better
team on both ends of the floor because they're more
more consistently at their ceiling. I do think the Knicks
can win that game. But I just think the Pacers
are safe for bet because they've demonstrated that throughout this season.
(32:39):
They've also just been consistently an absolute buzz saw and
like must win games at home, and I just think
that I just think that's gonna be one of the
most difficult games that you could ever ask a team
to win, is go on the road to Indiana, they get,
they get to go to the finals if they win, Like, yeah,
it's gonna it's gonna be it's gonna be rough. And
(32:59):
so again, it's not that I don't think the Knicks
can win. I just think the Pacers are far and
away the safe bet, and I think it's more likely
than not that they win big, Like i'd be looking
at alternate spread bets in a game like that. All right, guys,
that's all I have for tonight. Again, we're heading over
to playback, So let's playback dot tv slash Hoops tonight.
We'll be taking callers and hanging out and having fun.
Make sure you guys head over there. For those of
(33:20):
you guys who are not following us, we'll be back
on YouTube Saturday night. We've got thirty eight of the
last forty one nights, but we are finally done going
every night, so we will be back on Saturday night
for Game six of the Eastern Conference Finals between the
Pacers and the Knicks.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
I will see you guys then. What's up guys?
Speaker 2 (33:39):
As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting
OOPS tonight. They would actually be really helpful for us
if you guys would take a second and leave a
rating and a review.
Speaker 1 (33:48):
As always, I appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
Guys supporting us, but if you could take a minute
to do that, I'd really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
The volume
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