May 8, 2025 • 43 mins
Colin can’t believe the defending champion Celtics blew another 20-point lead in the 4th quarter at home to fall to 0-2
He explains why the Cowboys might have made a mistake trading for wide receiver George Pickens
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Oh what a night?
Speaker 4 (00:30):
What a night?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I know what I said, occasionally a little off the
mark Live. It's The Herd wherever you may be and
however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part
of your day. Jmax, you are a Knicks fan. I
love what they've become. I think they're patient. Jalen Brunson's
the best quarterback in the city, regardless of what's forty
(00:53):
plays easy to root toward. Villanova, guys. I was in
a place last night at setting in Los Angeles with
about sixty people, and there wasn't a single Celtic fan there.
People could not believe the collapse wild It is the
only thing I can say.
Speaker 5 (01:11):
Really tough to repeat in this league. Colin and the
Boston Celtics, they're in trouble now.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
It's official.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Thirty plus years of watching covering the NBA. I have
never seen what just happened in Boston, and I thought
about it. I thought about it this morning. I've never
seen this. A world champion starts a series at home,
heavily favored both games, has twenty point leads in both games,
(01:38):
and not only loses, had no guts at the end.
The champs, it's supposed to have a champion's confidence. I
find the Celtics, honestly, after last night hard to root for.
All they are now is a math formula three pointers regardless,
and last night to me was not just a win
for the Knicks. It was a win for manalytics, which
is my term. It's a little analytic, but it's about
(02:01):
men and resilience and grit and toughness and not being
nervous Nelly in the clutch. This isn't just about the Celtics. Mikhale,
Bridges and og on the wing are dudes. Brunson and
Josh Hart, classic Villanova overachievers who again are never rattled
in the moment they're playing, you know, the double big lineup.
(02:22):
This is not just about the Celtics, but they are
the world champions. So that's the primary focus today and
I know what I said. The Knicks are not going
to win another game, I know it. But watching the
Celtics collapse, you know what I thought about. The math
nerds will not take over our sport. The basketball gods
are pushing back Wall Street, AI Tech. It's all being
(02:45):
taken over by analytics. Can we just have our basketball?
Boston missed seventy five threes in the last two games,
by the way, eleven for eleven on dunks. How about
a few more of those. I found myself at the
end sort of enjoying the collapse. These scrappy, tough, resilient
state in college Villanova guys. And that's what the Knicks are.
(03:07):
They're Villanova professionally and ironically. The last, the only bucket
the Celtics hit in the last eight minutes at home
with a deeper, better roster was a dunk. Remember those
used to have those?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
That was it.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
So when they went away from analytics, they actually scored.
So Boston completely earned last night. And again you gotta
give New York credit these and I think it's a
real thing. There's a term in the NBA Villanova guys,
Bridges and Brunson and heart. They just they stay in school,
they had to play defense mostly from the Northeast. Tough
(03:50):
guys been around big cities, recruited out of DC. It
could be New York, it could be Boston. They're never
afraid of the moment. And so that's not just hammer
on the Celtics. A lot of this is just the
Knicks being a team that never quits. I mean the
Villanova with Jay Wright, they didn't have five star guys.
They had three star guys. Cali Pari had the five
(04:11):
star guys, the one and done guys. So you know,
sometimes I'm sitting there watching it. I always said, playoff
basketball to me has always been one thing, actually two things,
but one thing. Really, get a bucket, get a stop.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
That's what he is.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Sometimes we talked about this yesterday. The crowd's going crazy
New York. Just go get a bucket. Maybe it's two freethos.
Go get a bucket, Go get a stop. And it's
like sometimes watching the Celtics and all their analytics go
down the drain, It's like, sometimes it is funny to
watch the math nerd get his pants pulled down.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
And that's what happened last night. That's what happened last night.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
And I'm going to say this, give the Knicks credit,
and I don't use this term much.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
That is an all time choke. I'll give you one.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
I'll give you the first game because you dominated the
next all year you got sloppy, and the next for
a good team, I'll give you the first. That's not
a choke. You lost the lead. It's in a little
embarrassing last night's to choke. That is a full on choke.
This team, by the way, Boston eleven for eleven on
dunke attemps. You want to try those. The closer they
(05:23):
get the basket, the more they make their shots. Here
was Josh Hart after.
Speaker 6 (05:30):
I don't think we even know we're capable of. I
think we have to continue to build. I think we
have to put together a full game. And I think
that's something that we haven't done during the course of
this playoffs. Continuing to get better no one else to
worry about that, yeah, and figuring out a way to
(05:53):
put together a full forty eight minute game.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So let's now focus on Jason Tatum can when we
finally put this the bed, he's the face of the league.
Thank god. We can stop arguing about that. But remember
this do you remember during the Olympics when Steve Kerr,
I don't know, I think he knows a little more
basketball than me and you. Steve Kerr wouldn't play Tatum
(06:20):
and Boston Southee was already upset.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Show to.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
What is wrong with Kerr. He knows more basketball than you, Sully.
He does, and they wouldn't play him. And this is
why ability without aggression. He wanted closers. If you can't
play for Boston and clutch moments, you're not going to
play for the country.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
This is what Steve Kerr saw.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Two of his last three shots were followays because I
think at his core he has to be convinced to
be aggressive. There was a moment at the end of
the game when Tatum drove in eighteen seconds left, gave
Boston Lee dunked it, and my reaction was WHOA, Well
that was aggressive.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Because he never does that. I mean it was like,
oh wow, it was off brand.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I mean, he's six 's eight long and athletic and
can beat guys off the dribble all night.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
Do it.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Last night was somebody swatten chalk out of Goodwill Hunting's
hand and Tatum is really what's ironic here juxtapost with Brunson.
He's the anti Brunson. Brunson is work boots and Tatum
is leather loafers and if it's a little drizzly outside,
best not wear them. I'm serious everything about Tatum. Tatum
(07:35):
gets anxious, he looks a little nervous. He's a bit passive,
he's indecisive, He's unbelievably talented. Brunson's pretty talented, tough as nails,
all grit, Villanova tough.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Like they're like opposite players.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
One guy has just put on the work boots, head down,
don't need marketing, never forget Jalen Brunson. And you do
not see this in the NBA much. Jalen Brunson's like,
all take a little less money. I want to play
with my guys. That is so Villanova. You know Villanova.
You go to Villanova. Class is hard, you play defense.
(08:13):
It's not one and done. Even with nil, they're not
gonna pay the most. Villanova is a culture. It's not
just the name of a university. And that's what the
Knicks play like. That's why they're so easy to root for,
Like not all New York teams are easy to root
for I get people that don't like the Yankees in
the payroll. The Knicks are fun and Brunson is the
(08:35):
anti Tatum, and Celtic fans know it. You could hear
them early in the game getting uncomfortable. And I'm not
an anti Tatum guy. But for when I was saying
this during the Olympics, I get it a DNP coaches decision.
When I've been saying this face of the league stuff,
It's like I have defended the passive nature of Tatum.
(08:57):
But man, there's a reason everybody loves MJ. I mean,
there is a reason six for six he punched Steve Kerr.
There's a reason why Kerr loves Draymond Green, Who's limited athletically,
who's limited offensively, but gives you everything, relentless. And so
I thought it was fitting last night as they were collapsing,
(09:19):
I'm like, it's the perfect team and guy to collapse
to the Knicks, the less talented villanova of pro basketball, resilient, tough,
they go into your place. I'm looking at this clutch
time numbers between Brunson and Tatum. I won't waste your
time on all of these. Forget the fact Brunson's got
(09:41):
twice as many points. Brunson's plus eighteen Tatum's minus sixteen.
Tatum's hurting his team. Brunson is sometimes exhausted, sometimes defensively
gets you know, abused a little because of his lack
of size, but he is never a detriment somewhere on
the floor or Jalen Brunson's making your team better. Here's
(10:02):
the Celtics coach after the collapse.
Speaker 7 (10:05):
I think game one wasn't inefficient as I thought. You
just missed some really good looks. I thought today he
passed up some some ones that he was able to take.
And so you know, their switchability, their ability to impact shifts, UH,
definitely impact them tonight. So yeah, they're missing easy layups
in the beginning of the game. I thought he missed
some a couple there in the third quarter. But yeah,
I mean they do a good h Ogina Noboy's a
(10:26):
good individual defender, and they have good shifts and help behind.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Boston could have blown both these games to Indiana and
it wouldn't feel the same. And it's not just a
Boston New York thing, That's not it. It's the culture
of the Knicks, which is man get a stop, get
a bucket, brunts in less money against analytics. It's who
(10:55):
you're losing to how you're losing. And the star of
New York is the anti Tatum to me, at least emotionally,
so j mach I thought of you on multi as
I was watching this game with friends, sitting around at
table with friends. I kept thinking, you were next door
to place eating, you know, at high end sirloin, all right,
(11:16):
And I kept thinking, he is having the time of
his life.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
It was the place I was at. And again, it's LA.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
So nobody likes Boston, but a lot of people in
LA don't like New York either.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
It was just wild to watch people's reaction.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
It was like the Celtics are collapsing in front of us,
and they just kept hoisting up these awful shots.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
Yeah, I'm looking at the numbers here. I know you
crush Tatum, and I get that. I will point out
Celtics starters two for eighteen in the fourth quarter shooting.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
This is not only on Tatum.
Speaker 5 (11:48):
No, it's not surprise Joe Modula escaped your opening right here,
because I don't know that he's going to survive the.
Speaker 3 (11:53):
Next three weeks.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
But Remember, if you're talking about face of the league.
I don't care about Peyton Pritchard or al Horford. I
don't care about Jalen Brown. This is somebody that's the
face of the league, and the team defends him when
a commentators are critical and everybody rushes to his defense. Okay,
but then you gotta on fourth down make the easy throw.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
And here's the numbers on the screen. Tatum fourth quarter
and overtime. Not great, obviously, not not outstanding.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
By the way, the critics, myself included, have always said.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
He's a top eight player. I go higher than that.
Speaker 5 (12:27):
But we have an eighty two game sample size of
Jason Tatum for four straight years being first team All NBA. Yeah,
eighty two games times four. Oh, and he's been bad
in two games, Like.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
I that's not fair.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
He has been suspect throughout his career on a fairly
regular basis in these moments.
Speaker 5 (12:48):
I mean, last years against Orlando he averaged like thirty one. Okay,
you know nobody cares about Orlando. Fine, and the finals
last year he had two games of thirty one points
in the finals against.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
There's a two game series. Two out of the five
he would I watched them against Golden State. Wilt, Yeah,
that was that was a tough one.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Is first, and.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
You say Jason Tatum. If you say, what is your
knock on Jason Tatum, everybody has the same knock.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
Don't trust him late. I sorry, I got it.
Speaker 5 (13:13):
There's some evidence of that. He's also had some big
game sevens. I think he had fifty one in a
game six against one.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
There are plenty of Boston reporters to tell you how
mean we are, but it is really when you put
him against Brunson, they are opposite players.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
You remember when they got Bridges the Knicks.
Speaker 5 (13:30):
I was like, they match up great with Boston, and
then it didn't bear out in the regular season.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
It has in the postseason, and.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Why is it working in the postseason and it didn't
in the regular season. This is my theory is New
York's a more physical team, and the NBA decides look
at how the physical teams. By the way, the Warriors
defensively are physical. The tea Wolves against the Lakers were
more physical. New York even at practice. There are more
(13:59):
physical team than Boston. Boston's pretty, Boston's outside, Boston doesn't
get to the free throw line, New York is a
in football terms. One of them is a passing offense.
One of them is a run game. So the Knicks,
as the NBA, allows you to play in the postseason
and get physical. You know, I'm watching the first game
and I'm like, oh, it's a blip. But last night
(14:21):
you're like, oh, this this team's got a full back,
this team has double tight ends.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
They're playing double bigs.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
I like, hey, reference that Tatum dunk where he drove,
and you're like, oh, wow, that was mectacular. Watch Mitchell
Robinson on that play, he was up way too far
by the three foot line.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
Tatum dusted him.
Speaker 5 (14:35):
So on the next play, the game ending, Mitchell Robinson
drops back. He's like, I'm conceding the jumper, and Tatum
like he just kind of wilted there at the end.
Speaker 3 (14:44):
Tough one.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
It's one thing to miss a final shot, but two
of his last three shots were fallaways on the baseline.
Speaker 5 (14:50):
How Alt michel Bridges Game one, rips the ball out
of Jalen Brown's hands.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
In the game two, blocks Tatum's past. He's great.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
No, we all loved McHale bridges to the Knick. We
all said, okay, they finally have their wing defender who
can give you twenty points on any night.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Nix in the finals will be really good for the league. Huh.
A lot of content for this show.
Speaker 5 (15:11):
New York Nixon, the fom Ser, the you'd be incorrigible
Brusard in companies that we go to the games, right.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Oh yeah, forty minutes from now, Albert breerstops buying the
Cowboys Steelers trade from yesterday and more thoughts on that,
plus what's going on in Minnesota with our quarterback situation.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
It's The Herd.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern non am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app Golf.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
It's called the Yips.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
When we can suddenly not you can't, you can't chip,
you can't pot, like does Boston have that? Boston looked
completely out of sorts, and it is amazing. You see
this with pro athletes where it just it just it
bleeds over the whole roster. Like Boston was like looking
(16:01):
for Tatum to take over, like that's everybody knows, that's
our most talented guy. So this idea that well, you know,
Peyton Pritchard missed some shots and well this guy was that.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
That's not what it's about.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
We all know who's getting the ball with Denver at
the end of the game, if you need a basket,
we all know who's getting the ball at OKC Sga,
not Chet Holmgren. Chet Holmgren got nervous at the free
throw line. We all know who's getting the ball with
the Knicks. Jalen Brunson's going to have the ball in
his hands and score makes up happen. Boston guys are
(16:32):
looking to Jason Tatum. We all know. I mean, that
was the Kobe Shack issue. They both wanted it, but
Shaq couldn't hit a free throw late, so Kobe needed
it and Shaq wanted it. Tim Duncan couldn't hit free
throws he had man who and Tony Parker. There are
exceptions when a guy is a liability like Yannis at
the end of the game at the free throw line,
but Tatum's not and everybody's looking around for Tatum and
(16:54):
when he wilts, it affects the entire team. You're now
entering the no bull zone sponsored by Credible Great Rates.
None of the bulls, so there's the story this morning
reported by the Pittsburgh Post Gazette Jerry Doulock. Mike Tomlin
was the one, and this is a tolerant guy. He's
(17:16):
dealt with drama day one. He's the one that wanted
George Pickens out of there and blessed the Cowboy fans heart.
They think they got just a steel here, But ask yourself,
how'd Chase Claypool do when the Steelers bailed on him?
Or what was the receiver Bryant, Mark Davis Bryant, what
(17:36):
happened to? What happened to Lavian Bell and Deontay Johnson,
Antonio Brown?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
What happened?
Speaker 1 (17:42):
So listen, Tomlin's patient, and he's like, yeah, let's get
him out of here. By the way, when Kyle Shanahan
bails on a quarterback, you should listen. When Warren Buffett
sells a stock, you should listen. When Mike Tomlin orders
a code red. You may want to pay attention because
he's like the most patient pro player guy in the league.
(18:03):
A lot of guys won't even they won't even put
guys like George Pickens was not on the board for
certain teams, no interest, like not interested the Atlanta Falcons
took an edge rusher James Pearce. He was not on
a dozen boards. Some teams just don't want the headache.
Pittsburgh drafts him. Tomlin deals with him. He's patient and
he said nah, and Mike Tomlin.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
Is two things.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
Great motivator and he knows when to bail on people.
And Jerry Jones, well, this is perfect for him because
he's a saver. This is what he did with Jason Garrett,
and he didn't have to save Jimmy Johnson or Bill Parcells,
so that relationship eroded very quickly. But Jason Garrett, Mike McCarthy,
Brian Schottenheimer, Chan Gaily, they got jobs they wouldn't otherwise get.
(18:49):
So it's almost like they're indebted to Jerry Jones. Finally,
Mike McCarthy was the one that went to Jerry last
year and said, like I'm done, and Jerry was trapped.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Nobody ever done that to Jerry.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
McCarthy's like I got a Super Bowl, I got my
thirty five forty five million, I don't need this circus.
So and then then then what Jerry'll do? And I
don't doubt that George Pickens is gonna have big games,
big moments, great moments, and he may have a really
nice season and everybody's gonna fall for it, and then
Jerry's gonna do I told you so. I'm saved him,
and then he'll overpay him. If you want to use
(19:24):
this kid for a year, play him. Helps the offense,
helps Dak Prescott. I'm not opposed to taking guys on
short term that elevate your offense. I'm not opposed to that,
but be very careful because we know this to be true.
I saw a story this morning trading for Pickens is
a bold move the Cowboys have needed for years. No,
it's another Jerry move that we're accustomed to, which he
(19:46):
likes to save. He likes he likes to find something
on the draft that, you know, the scrap heap and go, hey,
Dak Prescott, who found him in the fourth round, that's
what Jerry.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Hey, I gave Jason a shot.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Tony Romo undrafted that was more Bill Parcells than Jerry.
But that's Jerry's psychology. He likes that to save, to
prove he found something. He's a former wild catter. He'd
find the oil, he finds the gem, and you know,
we all know what that that's fine, but you should
probably keep really good coaches around, and you probably if
(20:24):
Pickens does have some great moments, and I'm sure he will.
He's a tremendous talent. Fall in like with him, don't
fall in love with Mike. Tomlin is like, yeah, let's
get him out of the building. Mike did that, Not
the GM, not the owner, not the quarterback.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
That's Mike.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Mike's like enough, Okay, just pay attention when Shanahan says
no to a quarterback, Warren Buffett sells a stock or
Tomlin moves off a guy. Go look at what they
have produced post Mike Tomlin and the answer is not
much consistently.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
J Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
On the News, this is the herd Line News.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
So there was actually another game in the NBA last night.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Nobody watched it, Denver against OKAC, and nobody watched it
because it.
Speaker 4 (21:14):
Was over before it started.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
Oklahoma City wins one forty nine to one oh six. Now,
Shae gilgers Alexander at thirty four and eight, but.
Speaker 4 (21:23):
This is mind bowing.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
He was plus fifty one in his minutes on the court.
That is the best in any playoff game since they
began tracking the stat in ninety seven.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Here's the MVP on his performance.
Speaker 8 (21:36):
We knew what was at State tonight. We uh, we
came out desperate. We why to just take care and
control the things that we knew we could, and we
did a pretty good job of that, specifically to start
the game when uh, let's start carried us through the
rest of the night.
Speaker 5 (21:57):
Kind of expected this from Boston, but Boston won the championship.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well Boston, by the way, At one point in this game,
like the first game in the series, they were scoring
easily and every time New York got close, Boston would
get it back up the twelve and fourteen. Yeah, I mean,
I just kind of felt like we see this about
once a playoff series when a team gets up. Golden
State did this against Houston. They waved the white flat
eight minutes in. Denver had no interest. Denver was gonna
(22:21):
rest guys, get them off the floor. I don't take
anything from it. Denver now goes home altitude advantage, home
court advantage is theirs. I mean, nice win, but it
doesn't Had they won a close game and had great
execution down the stretch, I would have been more impressed. Yeah,
that's what we questioned about okay See. We don't question
okay See can blow out teams. We questioned oha okac
(22:43):
in crunch time. Yeah, because they didn't play any crunch
time games, so they would have been better served and
winning a close game and getting some an exercise in
crunch time.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Minute.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
Who you think okayc still wins a series or they should?
Speaker 3 (22:58):
But I have questions.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
You get to a game seven with Gordon and Murray
and Jokich in Westbrook, you would get a bunch of kids.
Speaker 4 (23:06):
Game seven last year against Minnesota led by twenty lost.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Remember that Minnesota wasn't just a bunch of kids. You
had Cat and Go Bear as Mike Conley and.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I'm I'm torn here, but I listen. I'm just telling
people be careful betting on the NBA playoffs. It is
just too crazy right now. You don't know what scene's
gonna show up. Would it surprise you have Denver one by.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Twenty in game three?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
No, not at all.
Speaker 4 (23:30):
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if the Knicks go up
three nothing and then it's three three. You just don't
know what's gonna be.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Boston's had great success in their sports, so nobody's gonna
lose any sleep over Boston losing.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
But it's not just losing, it's how Boston's love.
Speaker 4 (23:45):
Yeah, two tough ones.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
Man up by twenty a second half. You got to
close that out. Let's go to the game tonight. Warriors
Timberwolves game two in Minnesota. Obviously know Steph Curry, but
Chris Finch of Minnesota and Steve Kerr Golden State neither
are happy about the physicality and the playoffs. Colin, maybe
you should take a listen to what their thoughts are
on this bully ball that's happening in the NBA postseason.
Speaker 9 (24:10):
Yeah, I mean, we'll certainly try to take justice into
our own hands wherever wee can. I think it's the
nature of physical sport. But by the same Tokio, you know,
my god, you should see some of these clips. They're
just like they's pulling guards and linemen out there.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Just take a shot to Rudy.
Speaker 9 (24:25):
So they had their bear hugging staff and they could
have called six fouls, but the league has established the
physicality and the playoffs.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Listen, I love it, you don't.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
But what it's funny is I'm gonna defend Kerr here
a little bit, because there is no question Butler and
Draymond are like old school tough guys, and and Minnesota's
Draymond gets.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
You know what, Draymond's classic.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
Draymond is so physical that you could call him for
a foul every play, and so you just sort of
he has moved the on what you can do. And
Mike Breen was complaining about this. But years and years ago,
the Utah Jazz when they had stocked in and hornisack
Jerry Sloan, the late Jerry Sloan who I watch play.
Sloan was a tough guy. I mean Jerry Sloan got
(25:13):
in fights on the floor like he was a tough guy.
So Utah, for being a dominant team for like eight
ten years, was never a great road team. They were
unbelievable at home and I could never figure it out.
And then John Ireland boys the Lakers, said the reason,
and I could not figure it out. And I'm sitting
there talking to him once and he said, because the
refs in Utah they don't want to call every foul
(25:36):
and this team is so absurdly over the top physical.
So Jerry Sloan that when you go on the road
the refs are like, Okay, we're gonna call those go
either way. Calls six or eight of those go against you,
the other team gets in the bonus. So those Utah
teams used to and they gave Michael Jordan teams trub Bowl.
They just moved the line on what kind of physicality
(25:58):
was acceptable. The Piston did this with a bad boysons
After a while, you're tackling guy.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
It's a shove. Doesn't look that bad.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
I mean, there was somebody send me a clip of
in the last round, Jabari Smith of the Rockets essentially
diving into Steph Curry's yest, no call whatsoever.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
It's to set a screen. And that's a fin just
talking about. They're like pulling guards in the NFL. The
counter kill. It's like a countertrait or whatever, and the
guards are just coming around blasting guys. I don't like it.
You seem to like it. Are you changing your tune
a little bit?
Speaker 1 (26:27):
No?
Speaker 4 (26:27):
On this physicality.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Listen, if you're a Knicks fan, you want this physicality
that plays into your game. You're not a pretty team.
You're not playing pretty basketball.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
It's mane Allen Runson is beautiful to watch.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Come on, I think the I think physical teams can
Draymond Green intimidates people, physical Jimmy Butler intimidates people. So
I think the Warriors of the Knicks, now that Steff's
not on the floor, Steve Kerr tonight is begging at
(27:00):
least Steve Kerr is praying that the referees let it
be ugly and that they can grab ant and they
can grab pickus.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
Curry's out.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
That's right, because Curry's not on the floor.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So so to me, New York and Golden State, they
are built for what Adam Silver whatever memo it is.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
I like watching physical basketball.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
Got it?
Speaker 5 (27:19):
It sounds like what you think is teams have to
be able to play both ways. You have to be
able to play this be too. Also, you've got to
be tough. And it's like Boston's a little too finesse.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Is listen?
Speaker 4 (27:28):
Okay, see he's kind of a finesse team.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
Cone they are. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Celtics do not get to the free throw line. Warriors
pro Jimmy Butler did not get to the free throw line.
If you're a by the way, that's why Draymond Green
has always been so important and Andre Igwood Dolla was
so important. Physical guys get them to the line, and
that's why Jimmy Butler is Do you know that the
(27:53):
best defensive team in the league since Jimmy Butler arrived.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
I didn't know that it's Golden State. I didn't realize
they are.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
So they are Tonight Warriors are like, oh, keep the
whistles in the dressing room.
Speaker 5 (28:04):
So do you think that this will Tonight's game will
be similar to O God?
Speaker 1 (28:07):
Yeah, so Minnesota, Yeah, I don't think.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
I don't think OKAC is a pretty team.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
I think they can be physical, but young teams are
never as physical as older team just bigger, older guys
that know how to push the envelope for sure.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Final stories to the NFL where the Steelers obviously just
moved off George Pickens and they wait for Aaron.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
Rodgers to make a decision. Now, this is wacky.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
In a recent interview, Steelers minority owner Thomas Toll was
discussing a business venture into AI Okay, and.
Speaker 4 (28:37):
Was asked about the Rogers situation.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
He said, I'm here to talk about AI, and the
Rogers situation is a more complex issue than artificial intelligence.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
What is he saying?
Speaker 5 (28:48):
Colin that Rogers is just holding their franchise hostage on why.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Aaron comes with a lot of stuff outside of football
and so whatever. I think when you're in your prime,
you can do that and everybody's fine. I don't think
Aaron has a big market because of that. I think,
you know, whatever you want to say about Aaron, there's
just a lot of moving parts with him.
Speaker 5 (29:07):
Do you think behind the scenes Rogers said, I don't
want Pickens, I want Lazard. Make that happen, and I'm coming.
Is that reasonable to.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
I think it would be a completely reasonable thing for
Aaron Rodgers to discuss. I would defend Aaron to the
core if Aaron said love Metcalf. I'm not sure how
comfortable I would be with a guy quitting on routes
like Pickens.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
That's totally fair for a quarterback.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
Okay, fine, but why not just go to Pickens?
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Then?
Speaker 5 (29:38):
If you're Rodgers, hey man, I was thinking of Joyning.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
What's how's your mindset?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
What's going on?
Speaker 4 (29:42):
Meet up with him?
Speaker 3 (29:43):
What's wrong with that?
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Mike Tomlin ordered a code writ Mike Tomlin said, I
can't handle it. You think Aaron at this age wants
the baby sit players.
Speaker 5 (29:52):
Is Tomlin sitting on that grenade for Rogers, so he
gets it because Tomlin also knows Mason Rudolph ain't geting
me know what I need rod Well, he needs.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
DK metcalf DK Metcalfe and Aaron are great for eacho.
He's going to get thirteen targets a game. But I
do think it's fair when you bring older quarterbacks that sometimes,
especially in the defensive culture like Pittsburgh. It's okay if
Aaron wants one guy, he wants his Alan Lazard or
I'm not Tom Brady wanted Gronk and Lenny Fernett Like
(30:22):
It's okay, listen, I'll come, but you got to give
me a little bit of a security blanket on third down.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
You got to give me my guy.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
How much of this is the offensive coordinator? Is Rogers
trying to get his own guy in there? Because we
know the largest history Listen there. I don't know which
reporter came on the show and said it, but Arthur
Sinson Rodgers will not work like unequivocally they are oil
and water.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
It will be a disaster.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Well, Arthur Smith comes from you know Arthur Smith.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
His dad is yes, yes, mister FedEx yes, So.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Arthur Smith comes with a bit of a twos has
a bit of a two.
Speaker 10 (30:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
No, I don't think it's I don't think it's a
perfect You know, Matt Lafleur is more conciliatory with Aaron.
Mike McCarthy early was a bit more conciliatory. Robert Sala
was a bit more conciliatory. Arthur Smith will just do
what I want to do.
Speaker 5 (31:09):
Who was a guy who coached in Denver and then
went to the Jets' dec Hackett?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Yeah again?
Speaker 4 (31:13):
Why am I to steamrolling that gay?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
Yea yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:16):
And steamrolling Arthur Smith?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
No, No, he's not.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Arthur Blank couldn't steamroll him at the owner of the
Atlanta Falcons J Mack with the.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
News, Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by
the herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Hope everybody understands what we watched last night, how historic
that was.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
That is a crazy.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
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Speaker 2 (31:55):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter nine Amps.
Speaker 11 (32:00):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together We're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You could catch
us weekdays from five to seven pm Eastern two to
four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 11 (32:14):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world. We have a lot of fun talking
about the stories behind the stories in the world of
sports and pop culture, stories that well other shows don't
seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact
that we've been friends for the last twenty years and
still work together. I mean that says something, right.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
So check us out.
Speaker 11 (32:33):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up. As they say, I'd say the most
interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive
show on planetar. Be sure to check out Covino and
Rich live on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
From five to seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific.
Speaker 11 (32:49):
And if you miss any of the live show, just
search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcasts and
of course on social media, that's Covino and Rich.
Speaker 5 (32:57):
Indianapolis five hundred as the Indy Car Series HiT's the
IMS Road Course for the sun CEO Grand Prix, the
fastest racing on Earth, continues live Saturday at four thirty
Eastern on Time.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
So teams that win the first two game of a
best of seven series on the road win the series
eighty six percent of the time.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I just I still think Boston's going to win the series.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
But the NBA, with this physical play that plays to
New York strengths, they're not a pretty team. They're a
tough team mentally, physically, emotionally. The Knicks are tough. Same
with the Warriors without staff. The Warriors in Game two
tonight in Minnesota, they're not going to win that game,
but they're better off the league not calling fouls because
you know, Golden State's got one way to win. So
(33:43):
Tom Thibodeau gets criticized as a head coach, but what
he did, and he's done this multiple times wherever he goes,
he creates a culture. He's not just diagramming plays. So
the Knicks have an identity. It's very Villanova and it's
not the most talented roster. But again, Jay Wright was
winning two Natties at Villanova. Calipari won one. But that
program at Kentucky didn't have the soul and the heart
(34:03):
of Villanova. And that's where Tib lays the foundation in toughness,
in grit, and then Jalen Brunson provides the soul and
he's a very good player. You know, there's no load
management with the Knicks. They're you know, they're the opposite
of the Clippers. In fact, he's been criticized Thibodeau for
load mismanagement. He plays his guys in practices too hard.
(34:24):
But I do think it's there's there's a real point
about what the culture is. Culture is very very hard
for you to define, for me to defile, what is culture?
You know your family's culture, Well, what is culture? Well,
we go to church. That's not culture. That's going to church.
The Knicks are five and zero on the road in
the playoffs and they've trailed in all five of those games,
(34:45):
and three of them were close games. And I think
this is the advantage to a TIB's team. When your
practice is hard, your team gets hard like Mike Vrabel
to New England, wats New England be a very fit
as a could team Rabel Andy Reid is known for
tough practices and that that's TIBs. That was pat Riley
(35:07):
as a coach. Tough practices create tough men, and it's
fearless basketball, and that's why when they get down laden games,
they don't care. And Jalen Brunton talked about this culture
and this identity of being so good in clutch time.
Speaker 10 (35:25):
Just going back to our days in college, just the
way that we practiced and we've prepared for games. It
was more mental than anything. And so when you get
to the real life or the real game situations, you
practice that you've been prepared for it. You just you've
been through moments like that. And so no matter what happens,
we're gonna be together as a team and then we're
(35:45):
gonna have each other's back regardless.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, it's and there's no gimmicks with the Knicks. There's
no like secrets.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
It's like you ever seen Adele, you know, it's like
there's no pyrotechnic, there's no firework show, great voice on stage,
here's the mic. She's singing, and that's kind of the
Knicks like they're gonna play tough, They're gonna play physical.
Brunson's gonna leave the offense. They've got some size, they've
upgraded at wing. Brunson's gonna have the ball late. They're
(36:16):
gonna have really dry spells offensively because they're just not
that gifted. They're not a pretty offense. Baskets don't come easy.
Even Brunson when he's scoring twenty eight to thirty four,
it doesn't look easy. He's on the floor, he's getting
banged around. But that really, that resilience is so valuable
for a tough team. This is just like Golden State.
(36:38):
Golden State's really good in clutch time because they've been
in so many clutch time games.
Speaker 3 (36:44):
By the way, this is.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
What you see with OKC ok They've not been in
these tight, close games and OKAC looks so nervous in
their Game one loss to Denver. They had not been
in games like that.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Last year.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Kansas City Chiefs were eleven to zero in one possession games.
There was a reason they were good because the last
two years they've been in so many close games. And
it becomes New England with Brady. You know, they Tom
would take least, they'd have a lot of depth they
didn't have outside of the Randy Moss years. It was
about smarts and efficiency. In New England was always so
good in close games against good teams because they won
(37:19):
so many, it just kept feeding off it. So, you know,
I was thinking about this. This doesn't happen very often
that a team wins fourteen games in the NFL, like
the Minnesota Vikings, and their reaction is, you know, I
think we're gonna go with a new, unproven guy, JJ McCarthy.
(37:41):
So I just saw a story this morning about Kevin
O'Connell and JJ McCarthy, you know, and he's in a
league where every good team knows who their quarterback is,
and even if it's a new quarterback like Donald of
the Seahawks, you kind of know what Donald is. Nobody
knows what JJ McCarthy is. I am a skeptic. First
(38:03):
of all, he played for a college team known for
a run game and defense. He was not asked to
win games, he was asked not to lose them. He's
got a modest arm, he's marginally athletic, and again he's
going into a very good division, and this team seriously
considered re signing Sam Darnold, so in fact, you go up.
(38:28):
We were looking this morning. I'm always so reluctant to
embrace a quarterback when everybody says, I don't know how
to describe it. He's a winner. Danny Whirfel was a winner.
Every Steve Spurrier quarterback at Florida was a winner. All
of Urban Myers quarterbacks everywhere he goes are winners. Alex
Smith was a winner and a good quarterback. So we
(38:52):
went this morning and we were looking at sort of
like what the draft people said about JJ McCarthy coming in,
And this was Dane Brugler. His strengths mental prep, weakness,
very few examples of him adjusting protections at the line,
played in an offense that leaned on the run game,
Lance zerline, who I trust. His strength is the ambiguous well,
(39:16):
he plays with a chip on his shoulder, weakness, modest
arm strength, average es capability. So all the stuff I'm
supposed to love is this sort of nebulous. He's a winner,
he plays with a chip, how's his arm, how's his
athletic ability? How's his size? He so and I've said
(39:37):
this before. If you think about who should be dominating
the NFL at quarterback, it should be Alabama guys and
Ohio State guys, right because they get the five start
of high school, then they win the most in college
and you'd think, oh, it's just linear, that guy's going
to be great. How many great Ohio State quarterbacks in
the NFL, because playing at Ohio State is fundamentally nothing
(40:00):
like the NFL. Well, you always have the best teammates,
you always have a lead. If you don't play particularly well,
well we'll just go to the ground game. And now
Ohio State has had a lot more teams historically like
that than Michigan. But those last two years with Michigan
and Harbaugh, they were pulverizing people. They didn't even have
(40:23):
to throw the football. I mean they were going into
Columbus and they had the Buckeys out of sorts.
Speaker 3 (40:28):
So it's been my.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
Take is these massive quinn Ewers went in the seventh round.
He was the last quarterback taken, and my take was
he didn't play trailing much outside of the Georgia games,
and frankly gets better protection in college than he'd ever
get as a pro. And he's got three wide receivers.
They're all pros and a pro tied end and pro
running back to That's not real life in the NFL.
(40:49):
You trail a lot, teams need you to save the
day a lot. JJ McCarthy's just never done it. So
I've got, I've got. I have so many questions about this,
and I know Kevin O'Connell is all fired up on this,
but it is very rare. Is I read a story
this morning about this fourteen wins and they're like, we're
gonna go with a new guy and a new guy.
(41:11):
I'll just say it. I'm a skeptic. Now, I'm not
a Zach Wilson skeptic. I think he can play a
little bit, but I'm I'm in the I think he's
closer to Jackson Dart than Jaden Daniels.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
That's how I would say.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
I think he's closer to the old miss guy that
everybody suddenly loved after he stopped playing. He got better
rafter he stopped playing, than he is the Jaden Daniels.
I'll just throw it out there, that's what you got, Minnesota.
How in the world you like Minnesota this year?
Speaker 3 (41:39):
I like their coach.
Speaker 4 (41:40):
I'm going in blind on mccarthytally.
Speaker 5 (41:43):
But to compare him to Jackson Dart, I mean you
were putting up the Jackson Dart stats against good teams
in the SEC, and he vomited all over himself.
Speaker 3 (41:50):
Terrible.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
McCarthy was the opposite.
Speaker 5 (41:52):
Delivered when it mattered, most game winning drive against Alabama.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Do you know the label time he had like thirty attempts.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
He's not going to need thirty attempts, dude.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Everybody in the NFL eventually needs thirty attempts. You are
trailing a lot in Minnesota in that division with Detroit,
Chicago and Green Bays offense, you're gonna be trailing in
the second half and have to throw it forty four times.
Speaker 5 (42:15):
You're aware they have this gentleman named Justin Jefferson who
catches passes film will double top receiver in the league.
Speaker 3 (42:21):
If it was just that easy, why don't they win
in playoff?
Speaker 8 (42:23):
Gets?
Speaker 4 (42:24):
So go ahead.
Speaker 5 (42:24):
Ranked the quarterbacks for me in that NFC North, the
tough tough division, toughest division the NFC.
Speaker 3 (42:29):
Rank them well, I mean, Jared GOB's been of a Super.
Speaker 4 (42:31):
Bowl, okay, so he's one, And I.
Speaker 1 (42:33):
Would say Jordan loves the second most proven. And third
is Caleb Williams.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
What is he proven?
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Well, we know how gifted he is.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
And that's the problem about the NFC.
Speaker 3 (42:43):
Jaden Daniels threw over thirty.
Speaker 5 (42:45):
Attempts like every time, eleven times every single time.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Okay, and Jaden Daniels played in a weaker division.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
They had no defense.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Is Minnesota's great?
Speaker 4 (42:56):
He was great last year. Keep an eye on the VIKINGSCU.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
Come on, my eyes are on them. I just don't
like what I see.
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Oh what a night?
Speaker 4 (00:30):
What a night?
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I know what I said, occasionally a little off the
mark Live. It's The Herd wherever you may be and
however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part
of your day. Jmax, you are a Knicks fan. I
love what they've become. I think they're patient. Jalen Brunson's
the best quarterback in the city, regardless of what's forty
(00:53):
plays easy to root toward. Villanova, guys. I was in
a place last night at setting in Los Angeles with
about sixty people, and there wasn't a single Celtic fan there.
People could not believe the collapse wild It is the
only thing I can say.
Speaker 5 (01:11):
Really tough to repeat in this league. Colin and the
Boston Celtics, they're in trouble now.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
It's official.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Thirty plus years of watching covering the NBA. I have
never seen what just happened in Boston, and I thought
about it. I thought about it this morning. I've never
seen this. A world champion starts a series at home,
heavily favored both games, has twenty point leads in both games,
(01:38):
and not only loses, had no guts at the end.
The champs, it's supposed to have a champion's confidence. I
find the Celtics, honestly, after last night hard to root for.
All they are now is a math formula three pointers regardless,
and last night to me was not just a win
for the Knicks. It was a win for manalytics, which
is my term. It's a little analytic, but it's about
(02:01):
men and resilience and grit and toughness and not being
nervous Nelly in the clutch. This isn't just about the Celtics. Mikhale,
Bridges and og on the wing are dudes. Brunson and
Josh Hart, classic Villanova overachievers who again are never rattled
in the moment they're playing, you know, the double big lineup.
(02:22):
This is not just about the Celtics, but they are
the world champions. So that's the primary focus today and
I know what I said. The Knicks are not going
to win another game, I know it. But watching the
Celtics collapse, you know what I thought about. The math
nerds will not take over our sport. The basketball gods
are pushing back Wall Street, AI Tech. It's all being
(02:45):
taken over by analytics. Can we just have our basketball?
Boston missed seventy five threes in the last two games,
by the way, eleven for eleven on dunks. How about
a few more of those. I found myself at the
end sort of enjoying the collapse. These scrappy, tough, resilient
state in college Villanova guys. And that's what the Knicks are.
(03:07):
They're Villanova professionally and ironically. The last, the only bucket
the Celtics hit in the last eight minutes at home
with a deeper, better roster was a dunk. Remember those
used to have those?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
That was it.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
So when they went away from analytics, they actually scored.
So Boston completely earned last night. And again you gotta
give New York credit these and I think it's a
real thing. There's a term in the NBA Villanova guys,
Bridges and Brunson and heart. They just they stay in school,
they had to play defense mostly from the Northeast. Tough
(03:50):
guys been around big cities, recruited out of DC. It
could be New York, it could be Boston. They're never
afraid of the moment. And so that's not just hammer
on the Celtics. A lot of this is just the
Knicks being a team that never quits. I mean the
Villanova with Jay Wright, they didn't have five star guys.
They had three star guys. Cali Pari had the five
(04:11):
star guys, the one and done guys. So you know,
sometimes I'm sitting there watching it. I always said, playoff
basketball to me has always been one thing, actually two things,
but one thing. Really, get a bucket, get a stop.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
That's what he is.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Sometimes we talked about this yesterday. The crowd's going crazy
New York. Just go get a bucket. Maybe it's two freethos.
Go get a bucket, Go get a stop. And it's
like sometimes watching the Celtics and all their analytics go
down the drain, It's like, sometimes it is funny to
watch the math nerd get his pants pulled down.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
And that's what happened last night. That's what happened last night.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
And I'm going to say this, give the Knicks credit,
and I don't use this term much.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
That is an all time choke. I'll give you one.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
I'll give you the first game because you dominated the
next all year you got sloppy, and the next for
a good team, I'll give you the first. That's not
a choke. You lost the lead. It's in a little
embarrassing last night's to choke. That is a full on choke.
This team, by the way, Boston eleven for eleven on
dunke attemps. You want to try those. The closer they
(05:23):
get the basket, the more they make their shots. Here
was Josh Hart after.
Speaker 6 (05:30):
I don't think we even know we're capable of. I
think we have to continue to build. I think we
have to put together a full game. And I think
that's something that we haven't done during the course of
this playoffs. Continuing to get better no one else to
worry about that, yeah, and figuring out a way to
(05:53):
put together a full forty eight minute game.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So let's now focus on Jason Tatum can when we
finally put this the bed, he's the face of the league.
Thank god. We can stop arguing about that. But remember
this do you remember during the Olympics when Steve Kerr,
I don't know, I think he knows a little more
basketball than me and you. Steve Kerr wouldn't play Tatum
(06:20):
and Boston Southee was already upset.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Show to.
Speaker 1 (06:25):
What is wrong with Kerr. He knows more basketball than you, Sully.
He does, and they wouldn't play him. And this is
why ability without aggression. He wanted closers. If you can't
play for Boston and clutch moments, you're not going to
play for the country.
Speaker 3 (06:41):
This is what Steve Kerr saw.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
Two of his last three shots were followays because I
think at his core he has to be convinced to
be aggressive. There was a moment at the end of
the game when Tatum drove in eighteen seconds left, gave
Boston Lee dunked it, and my reaction was WHOA, Well
that was aggressive.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Because he never does that. I mean it was like,
oh wow, it was off brand.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I mean, he's six 's eight long and athletic and
can beat guys off the dribble all night.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
Do it.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Last night was somebody swatten chalk out of Goodwill Hunting's
hand and Tatum is really what's ironic here juxtapost with Brunson.
He's the anti Brunson. Brunson is work boots and Tatum
is leather loafers and if it's a little drizzly outside,
best not wear them. I'm serious everything about Tatum. Tatum
(07:35):
gets anxious, he looks a little nervous. He's a bit passive,
he's indecisive, He's unbelievably talented. Brunson's pretty talented, tough as nails,
all grit, Villanova tough.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Like they're like opposite players.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
One guy has just put on the work boots, head down,
don't need marketing, never forget Jalen Brunson. And you do
not see this in the NBA much. Jalen Brunson's like,
all take a little less money. I want to play
with my guys. That is so Villanova. You know Villanova.
You go to Villanova. Class is hard, you play defense.
(08:13):
It's not one and done. Even with nil, they're not
gonna pay the most. Villanova is a culture. It's not
just the name of a university. And that's what the
Knicks play like. That's why they're so easy to root for,
Like not all New York teams are easy to root
for I get people that don't like the Yankees in
the payroll. The Knicks are fun and Brunson is the
(08:35):
anti Tatum, and Celtic fans know it. You could hear
them early in the game getting uncomfortable. And I'm not
an anti Tatum guy. But for when I was saying
this during the Olympics, I get it a DNP coaches decision.
When I've been saying this face of the league stuff,
It's like I have defended the passive nature of Tatum.
(08:57):
But man, there's a reason everybody loves MJ. I mean,
there is a reason six for six he punched Steve Kerr.
There's a reason why Kerr loves Draymond Green, Who's limited athletically,
who's limited offensively, but gives you everything, relentless. And so
I thought it was fitting last night as they were collapsing,
(09:19):
I'm like, it's the perfect team and guy to collapse
to the Knicks, the less talented villanova of pro basketball, resilient, tough,
they go into your place. I'm looking at this clutch
time numbers between Brunson and Tatum. I won't waste your
time on all of these. Forget the fact Brunson's got
(09:41):
twice as many points. Brunson's plus eighteen Tatum's minus sixteen.
Tatum's hurting his team. Brunson is sometimes exhausted, sometimes defensively
gets you know, abused a little because of his lack
of size, but he is never a detriment somewhere on
the floor or Jalen Brunson's making your team better. Here's
(10:02):
the Celtics coach after the collapse.
Speaker 7 (10:05):
I think game one wasn't inefficient as I thought. You
just missed some really good looks. I thought today he
passed up some some ones that he was able to take.
And so you know, their switchability, their ability to impact shifts, UH,
definitely impact them tonight. So yeah, they're missing easy layups
in the beginning of the game. I thought he missed
some a couple there in the third quarter. But yeah,
I mean they do a good h Ogina Noboy's a
(10:26):
good individual defender, and they have good shifts and help behind.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Boston could have blown both these games to Indiana and
it wouldn't feel the same. And it's not just a
Boston New York thing, That's not it. It's the culture
of the Knicks, which is man get a stop, get
a bucket, brunts in less money against analytics. It's who
(10:55):
you're losing to how you're losing. And the star of
New York is the anti Tatum to me, at least emotionally,
so j mach I thought of you on multi as
I was watching this game with friends, sitting around at
table with friends. I kept thinking, you were next door
to place eating, you know, at high end sirloin, all right,
(11:16):
And I kept thinking, he is having the time of
his life.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
It was the place I was at. And again, it's LA.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
So nobody likes Boston, but a lot of people in
LA don't like New York either.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
It was just wild to watch people's reaction.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
It was like the Celtics are collapsing in front of us,
and they just kept hoisting up these awful shots.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
Yeah, I'm looking at the numbers here. I know you
crush Tatum, and I get that. I will point out
Celtics starters two for eighteen in the fourth quarter shooting.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
This is not only on Tatum.
Speaker 5 (11:48):
No, it's not surprise Joe Modula escaped your opening right here,
because I don't know that he's going to survive the.
Speaker 3 (11:53):
Next three weeks.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
But Remember, if you're talking about face of the league.
I don't care about Peyton Pritchard or al Horford. I
don't care about Jalen Brown. This is somebody that's the
face of the league, and the team defends him when
a commentators are critical and everybody rushes to his defense. Okay,
but then you gotta on fourth down make the easy throw.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
And here's the numbers on the screen. Tatum fourth quarter
and overtime. Not great, obviously, not not outstanding.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
By the way, the critics, myself included, have always said.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
He's a top eight player. I go higher than that.
Speaker 5 (12:27):
But we have an eighty two game sample size of
Jason Tatum for four straight years being first team All NBA. Yeah,
eighty two games times four. Oh, and he's been bad
in two games, Like.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
I that's not fair.
Speaker 1 (12:41):
He has been suspect throughout his career on a fairly
regular basis in these moments.
Speaker 5 (12:48):
I mean, last years against Orlando he averaged like thirty one. Okay,
you know nobody cares about Orlando. Fine, and the finals
last year he had two games of thirty one points
in the finals against.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
There's a two game series. Two out of the five
he would I watched them against Golden State. Wilt, Yeah,
that was that was a tough one.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
Is first, and.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
You say Jason Tatum. If you say, what is your
knock on Jason Tatum, everybody has the same knock.
Speaker 3 (13:09):
Don't trust him late. I sorry, I got it.
Speaker 5 (13:13):
There's some evidence of that. He's also had some big
game sevens. I think he had fifty one in a
game six against one.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
There are plenty of Boston reporters to tell you how
mean we are, but it is really when you put
him against Brunson, they are opposite players.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
You remember when they got Bridges the Knicks.
Speaker 5 (13:30):
I was like, they match up great with Boston, and
then it didn't bear out in the regular season.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
It has in the postseason, and.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Why is it working in the postseason and it didn't
in the regular season. This is my theory is New
York's a more physical team, and the NBA decides look
at how the physical teams. By the way, the Warriors
defensively are physical. The tea Wolves against the Lakers were
more physical. New York even at practice. There are more
(13:59):
physical team than Boston. Boston's pretty, Boston's outside, Boston doesn't
get to the free throw line, New York is a
in football terms. One of them is a passing offense.
One of them is a run game. So the Knicks,
as the NBA, allows you to play in the postseason
and get physical. You know, I'm watching the first game
and I'm like, oh, it's a blip. But last night
(14:21):
you're like, oh, this this team's got a full back,
this team has double tight ends.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
They're playing double bigs.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
I like, hey, reference that Tatum dunk where he drove,
and you're like, oh, wow, that was mectacular. Watch Mitchell
Robinson on that play, he was up way too far
by the three foot line.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
Tatum dusted him.
Speaker 5 (14:35):
So on the next play, the game ending, Mitchell Robinson
drops back. He's like, I'm conceding the jumper, and Tatum
like he just kind of wilted there at the end.
Speaker 3 (14:44):
Tough one.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
It's one thing to miss a final shot, but two
of his last three shots were fallaways on the baseline.
Speaker 5 (14:50):
How Alt michel Bridges Game one, rips the ball out
of Jalen Brown's hands.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
In the game two, blocks Tatum's past. He's great.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
No, we all loved McHale bridges to the Knick. We
all said, okay, they finally have their wing defender who
can give you twenty points on any night.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Nix in the finals will be really good for the league. Huh.
A lot of content for this show.
Speaker 5 (15:11):
New York Nixon, the fom Ser, the you'd be incorrigible
Brusard in companies that we go to the games, right.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Oh yeah, forty minutes from now, Albert breerstops buying the
Cowboys Steelers trade from yesterday and more thoughts on that,
plus what's going on in Minnesota with our quarterback situation.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
It's The Herd.
Speaker 2 (15:27):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon eastern non am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app Golf.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
It's called the Yips.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
When we can suddenly not you can't, you can't chip,
you can't pot, like does Boston have that? Boston looked
completely out of sorts, and it is amazing. You see
this with pro athletes where it just it just it
bleeds over the whole roster. Like Boston was like looking
(16:01):
for Tatum to take over, like that's everybody knows, that's
our most talented guy. So this idea that well, you know,
Peyton Pritchard missed some shots and well this guy was that.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
That's not what it's about.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
We all know who's getting the ball with Denver at
the end of the game, if you need a basket,
we all know who's getting the ball at OKC Sga,
not Chet Holmgren. Chet Holmgren got nervous at the free
throw line. We all know who's getting the ball with
the Knicks. Jalen Brunson's going to have the ball in
his hands and score makes up happen. Boston guys are
(16:32):
looking to Jason Tatum. We all know. I mean, that
was the Kobe Shack issue. They both wanted it, but
Shaq couldn't hit a free throw late, so Kobe needed
it and Shaq wanted it. Tim Duncan couldn't hit free
throws he had man who and Tony Parker. There are
exceptions when a guy is a liability like Yannis at
the end of the game at the free throw line,
but Tatum's not and everybody's looking around for Tatum and
(16:54):
when he wilts, it affects the entire team. You're now
entering the no bull zone sponsored by Credible Great Rates.
None of the bulls, so there's the story this morning
reported by the Pittsburgh Post Gazette Jerry Doulock. Mike Tomlin
was the one, and this is a tolerant guy. He's
(17:16):
dealt with drama day one. He's the one that wanted
George Pickens out of there and blessed the Cowboy fans heart.
They think they got just a steel here, But ask yourself,
how'd Chase Claypool do when the Steelers bailed on him?
Or what was the receiver Bryant, Mark Davis Bryant, what
(17:36):
happened to? What happened to Lavian Bell and Deontay Johnson,
Antonio Brown?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
What happened?
Speaker 1 (17:42):
So listen, Tomlin's patient, and he's like, yeah, let's get
him out of here. By the way, when Kyle Shanahan
bails on a quarterback, you should listen. When Warren Buffett
sells a stock, you should listen. When Mike Tomlin orders
a code red. You may want to pay attention because
he's like the most patient pro player guy in the league.
(18:03):
A lot of guys won't even they won't even put
guys like George Pickens was not on the board for
certain teams, no interest, like not interested the Atlanta Falcons
took an edge rusher James Pearce. He was not on
a dozen boards. Some teams just don't want the headache.
Pittsburgh drafts him. Tomlin deals with him. He's patient and
he said nah, and Mike Tomlin.
Speaker 3 (18:26):
Is two things.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
Great motivator and he knows when to bail on people.
And Jerry Jones, well, this is perfect for him because
he's a saver. This is what he did with Jason Garrett,
and he didn't have to save Jimmy Johnson or Bill Parcells,
so that relationship eroded very quickly. But Jason Garrett, Mike McCarthy,
Brian Schottenheimer, Chan Gaily, they got jobs they wouldn't otherwise get.
(18:49):
So it's almost like they're indebted to Jerry Jones. Finally,
Mike McCarthy was the one that went to Jerry last
year and said, like I'm done, and Jerry was trapped.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Nobody ever done that to Jerry.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
McCarthy's like I got a Super Bowl, I got my
thirty five forty five million, I don't need this circus.
So and then then then what Jerry'll do? And I
don't doubt that George Pickens is gonna have big games,
big moments, great moments, and he may have a really
nice season and everybody's gonna fall for it, and then
Jerry's gonna do I told you so. I'm saved him,
and then he'll overpay him. If you want to use
(19:24):
this kid for a year, play him. Helps the offense,
helps Dak Prescott. I'm not opposed to taking guys on
short term that elevate your offense. I'm not opposed to that,
but be very careful because we know this to be true.
I saw a story this morning trading for Pickens is
a bold move the Cowboys have needed for years. No,
it's another Jerry move that we're accustomed to, which he
(19:46):
likes to save. He likes he likes to find something
on the draft that, you know, the scrap heap and go, hey,
Dak Prescott, who found him in the fourth round, that's
what Jerry.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Hey, I gave Jason a shot.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Tony Romo undrafted that was more Bill Parcells than Jerry.
But that's Jerry's psychology. He likes that to save, to
prove he found something. He's a former wild catter. He'd
find the oil, he finds the gem, and you know,
we all know what that that's fine, but you should
probably keep really good coaches around, and you probably if
(20:24):
Pickens does have some great moments, and I'm sure he will.
He's a tremendous talent. Fall in like with him, don't
fall in love with Mike. Tomlin is like, yeah, let's
get him out of the building. Mike did that, Not
the GM, not the owner, not the quarterback.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
That's Mike.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Mike's like enough, Okay, just pay attention when Shanahan says
no to a quarterback, Warren Buffett sells a stock or
Tomlin moves off a guy. Go look at what they
have produced post Mike Tomlin and the answer is not
much consistently.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
J Mack with the news.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
On the News, this is the herd Line News.
Speaker 4 (21:07):
So there was actually another game in the NBA last night.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Nobody watched it, Denver against OKAC, and nobody watched it
because it.
Speaker 4 (21:14):
Was over before it started.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
Oklahoma City wins one forty nine to one oh six. Now,
Shae gilgers Alexander at thirty four and eight, but.
Speaker 4 (21:23):
This is mind bowing.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
He was plus fifty one in his minutes on the court.
That is the best in any playoff game since they
began tracking the stat in ninety seven.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Here's the MVP on his performance.
Speaker 8 (21:36):
We knew what was at State tonight. We uh, we
came out desperate. We why to just take care and
control the things that we knew we could, and we
did a pretty good job of that, specifically to start
the game when uh, let's start carried us through the
rest of the night.
Speaker 5 (21:57):
Kind of expected this from Boston, but Boston won the championship.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well Boston, by the way, At one point in this game,
like the first game in the series, they were scoring
easily and every time New York got close, Boston would
get it back up the twelve and fourteen. Yeah, I mean,
I just kind of felt like we see this about
once a playoff series when a team gets up. Golden
State did this against Houston. They waved the white flat
eight minutes in. Denver had no interest. Denver was gonna
(22:21):
rest guys, get them off the floor. I don't take
anything from it. Denver now goes home altitude advantage, home
court advantage is theirs. I mean, nice win, but it
doesn't Had they won a close game and had great
execution down the stretch, I would have been more impressed. Yeah,
that's what we questioned about okay See. We don't question
okay See can blow out teams. We questioned oha okac
(22:43):
in crunch time. Yeah, because they didn't play any crunch
time games, so they would have been better served and
winning a close game and getting some an exercise in
crunch time.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Minute.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
Who you think okayc still wins a series or they should?
Speaker 3 (22:58):
But I have questions.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
You get to a game seven with Gordon and Murray
and Jokich in Westbrook, you would get a bunch of kids.
Speaker 4 (23:06):
Game seven last year against Minnesota led by twenty lost.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Remember that Minnesota wasn't just a bunch of kids. You
had Cat and Go Bear as Mike Conley and.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I'm I'm torn here, but I listen. I'm just telling
people be careful betting on the NBA playoffs. It is
just too crazy right now. You don't know what scene's
gonna show up. Would it surprise you have Denver one by.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Twenty in game three?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
No, not at all.
Speaker 4 (23:30):
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if the Knicks go up
three nothing and then it's three three. You just don't
know what's gonna be.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Boston's had great success in their sports, so nobody's gonna
lose any sleep over Boston losing.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
But it's not just losing, it's how Boston's love.
Speaker 4 (23:45):
Yeah, two tough ones.
Speaker 5 (23:46):
Man up by twenty a second half. You got to
close that out. Let's go to the game tonight. Warriors
Timberwolves game two in Minnesota. Obviously know Steph Curry, but
Chris Finch of Minnesota and Steve Kerr Golden State neither
are happy about the physicality and the playoffs. Colin, maybe
you should take a listen to what their thoughts are
on this bully ball that's happening in the NBA postseason.
Speaker 9 (24:10):
Yeah, I mean, we'll certainly try to take justice into
our own hands wherever wee can. I think it's the
nature of physical sport. But by the same Tokio, you know,
my god, you should see some of these clips. They're
just like they's pulling guards and linemen out there.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Just take a shot to Rudy.
Speaker 9 (24:25):
So they had their bear hugging staff and they could
have called six fouls, but the league has established the
physicality and the playoffs.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
Listen, I love it, you don't.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
But what it's funny is I'm gonna defend Kerr here
a little bit, because there is no question Butler and
Draymond are like old school tough guys, and and Minnesota's
Draymond gets.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
You know what, Draymond's classic.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
Draymond is so physical that you could call him for
a foul every play, and so you just sort of
he has moved the on what you can do. And
Mike Breen was complaining about this. But years and years ago,
the Utah Jazz when they had stocked in and hornisack
Jerry Sloan, the late Jerry Sloan who I watch play.
Sloan was a tough guy. I mean Jerry Sloan got
(25:13):
in fights on the floor like he was a tough guy.
So Utah, for being a dominant team for like eight
ten years, was never a great road team. They were
unbelievable at home and I could never figure it out.
And then John Ireland boys the Lakers, said the reason,
and I could not figure it out. And I'm sitting
there talking to him once and he said, because the
refs in Utah they don't want to call every foul
(25:36):
and this team is so absurdly over the top physical.
So Jerry Sloan that when you go on the road
the refs are like, Okay, we're gonna call those go
either way. Calls six or eight of those go against you,
the other team gets in the bonus. So those Utah
teams used to and they gave Michael Jordan teams trub Bowl.
They just moved the line on what kind of physicality
(25:58):
was acceptable. The Piston did this with a bad boysons
After a while, you're tackling guy.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
It's a shove. Doesn't look that bad.
Speaker 5 (26:05):
I mean, there was somebody send me a clip of
in the last round, Jabari Smith of the Rockets essentially
diving into Steph Curry's yest, no call whatsoever.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
It's to set a screen. And that's a fin just
talking about. They're like pulling guards in the NFL. The
counter kill. It's like a countertrait or whatever, and the
guards are just coming around blasting guys. I don't like it.
You seem to like it. Are you changing your tune
a little bit?
Speaker 1 (26:27):
No?
Speaker 4 (26:27):
On this physicality.
Speaker 1 (26:28):
Listen, if you're a Knicks fan, you want this physicality
that plays into your game. You're not a pretty team.
You're not playing pretty basketball.
Speaker 4 (26:37):
It's mane Allen Runson is beautiful to watch.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Come on, I think the I think physical teams can
Draymond Green intimidates people, physical Jimmy Butler intimidates people. So
I think the Warriors of the Knicks, now that Steff's
not on the floor, Steve Kerr tonight is begging at
(27:00):
least Steve Kerr is praying that the referees let it
be ugly and that they can grab ant and they
can grab pickus.
Speaker 4 (27:07):
Curry's out.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
That's right, because Curry's not on the floor.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So so to me, New York and Golden State, they
are built for what Adam Silver whatever memo it is.
Speaker 3 (27:17):
I like watching physical basketball.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
Got it?
Speaker 5 (27:19):
It sounds like what you think is teams have to
be able to play both ways. You have to be
able to play this be too. Also, you've got to
be tough. And it's like Boston's a little too finesse.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Is listen?
Speaker 4 (27:28):
Okay, see he's kind of a finesse team.
Speaker 3 (27:30):
Cone they are. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Celtics do not get to the free throw line. Warriors
pro Jimmy Butler did not get to the free throw line.
If you're a by the way, that's why Draymond Green
has always been so important and Andre Igwood Dolla was
so important. Physical guys get them to the line, and
that's why Jimmy Butler is Do you know that the
(27:53):
best defensive team in the league since Jimmy Butler arrived.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
I didn't know that it's Golden State. I didn't realize
they are.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
So they are Tonight Warriors are like, oh, keep the
whistles in the dressing room.
Speaker 5 (28:04):
So do you think that this will Tonight's game will
be similar to O God?
Speaker 1 (28:07):
Yeah, so Minnesota, Yeah, I don't think.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
I don't think OKAC is a pretty team.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
I think they can be physical, but young teams are
never as physical as older team just bigger, older guys
that know how to push the envelope for sure.
Speaker 5 (28:20):
Final stories to the NFL where the Steelers obviously just
moved off George Pickens and they wait for Aaron.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
Rodgers to make a decision. Now, this is wacky.
Speaker 5 (28:28):
In a recent interview, Steelers minority owner Thomas Toll was
discussing a business venture into AI Okay, and.
Speaker 4 (28:37):
Was asked about the Rogers situation.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
He said, I'm here to talk about AI, and the
Rogers situation is a more complex issue than artificial intelligence.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
What is he saying?
Speaker 5 (28:48):
Colin that Rogers is just holding their franchise hostage on why.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Aaron comes with a lot of stuff outside of football
and so whatever. I think when you're in your prime,
you can do that and everybody's fine. I don't think
Aaron has a big market because of that. I think,
you know, whatever you want to say about Aaron, there's
just a lot of moving parts with him.
Speaker 5 (29:07):
Do you think behind the scenes Rogers said, I don't
want Pickens, I want Lazard. Make that happen, and I'm coming.
Is that reasonable to.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
I think it would be a completely reasonable thing for
Aaron Rodgers to discuss. I would defend Aaron to the
core if Aaron said love Metcalf. I'm not sure how
comfortable I would be with a guy quitting on routes
like Pickens.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
That's totally fair for a quarterback.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
Okay, fine, but why not just go to Pickens?
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Then?
Speaker 5 (29:38):
If you're Rodgers, hey man, I was thinking of Joyning.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
What's how's your mindset?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
What's going on?
Speaker 4 (29:42):
Meet up with him?
Speaker 3 (29:43):
What's wrong with that?
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Mike Tomlin ordered a code writ Mike Tomlin said, I
can't handle it. You think Aaron at this age wants
the baby sit players.
Speaker 5 (29:52):
Is Tomlin sitting on that grenade for Rogers, so he
gets it because Tomlin also knows Mason Rudolph ain't geting
me know what I need rod Well, he needs.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
DK metcalf DK Metcalfe and Aaron are great for eacho.
He's going to get thirteen targets a game. But I
do think it's fair when you bring older quarterbacks that sometimes,
especially in the defensive culture like Pittsburgh. It's okay if
Aaron wants one guy, he wants his Alan Lazard or
I'm not Tom Brady wanted Gronk and Lenny Fernett Like
(30:22):
It's okay, listen, I'll come, but you got to give
me a little bit of a security blanket on third down.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
You got to give me my guy.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
How much of this is the offensive coordinator? Is Rogers
trying to get his own guy in there? Because we
know the largest history Listen there. I don't know which
reporter came on the show and said it, but Arthur
Sinson Rodgers will not work like unequivocally they are oil
and water.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
It will be a disaster.
Speaker 3 (30:43):
Well, Arthur Smith comes from you know Arthur Smith.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
His dad is yes, yes, mister FedEx yes, So.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Arthur Smith comes with a bit of a twos has
a bit of a two.
Speaker 10 (30:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
No, I don't think it's I don't think it's a
perfect You know, Matt Lafleur is more conciliatory with Aaron.
Mike McCarthy early was a bit more conciliatory. Robert Sala
was a bit more conciliatory. Arthur Smith will just do
what I want to do.
Speaker 5 (31:09):
Who was a guy who coached in Denver and then
went to the Jets' dec Hackett?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Yeah again?
Speaker 4 (31:13):
Why am I to steamrolling that gay?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
Yea yeah?
Speaker 4 (31:16):
And steamrolling Arthur Smith?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
No, No, he's not.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Arthur Blank couldn't steamroll him at the owner of the
Atlanta Falcons J Mack with the.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
News, Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by
the herd Line News.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Hope everybody understands what we watched last night, how historic
that was.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
That is a crazy.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
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Speaker 2 (31:55):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter nine Amps.
Speaker 11 (32:00):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together We're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio. You could catch
us weekdays from five to seven pm Eastern two to
four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 11 (32:14):
We talk about everything life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world. We have a lot of fun talking
about the stories behind the stories in the world of
sports and pop culture, stories that well other shows don't
seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact
that we've been friends for the last twenty years and
still work together. I mean that says something, right.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
So check us out.
Speaker 11 (32:33):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up. As they say, I'd say the most
interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive
show on planetar. Be sure to check out Covino and
Rich live on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
From five to seven pm Eastern two to four Pacific.
Speaker 11 (32:49):
And if you miss any of the live show, just
search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcasts and
of course on social media, that's Covino and Rich.
Speaker 5 (32:57):
Indianapolis five hundred as the Indy Car Series HiT's the
IMS Road Course for the sun CEO Grand Prix, the
fastest racing on Earth, continues live Saturday at four thirty
Eastern on Time.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
So teams that win the first two game of a
best of seven series on the road win the series
eighty six percent of the time.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I just I still think Boston's going to win the series.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
But the NBA, with this physical play that plays to
New York strengths, they're not a pretty team. They're a
tough team mentally, physically, emotionally. The Knicks are tough. Same
with the Warriors without staff. The Warriors in Game two
tonight in Minnesota, they're not going to win that game,
but they're better off the league not calling fouls because
you know, Golden State's got one way to win. So
(33:43):
Tom Thibodeau gets criticized as a head coach, but what
he did, and he's done this multiple times wherever he goes,
he creates a culture. He's not just diagramming plays. So
the Knicks have an identity. It's very Villanova and it's
not the most talented roster. But again, Jay Wright was
winning two Natties at Villanova. Calipari won one. But that
program at Kentucky didn't have the soul and the heart
(34:03):
of Villanova. And that's where Tib lays the foundation in toughness,
in grit, and then Jalen Brunson provides the soul and
he's a very good player. You know, there's no load
management with the Knicks. They're you know, they're the opposite
of the Clippers. In fact, he's been criticized Thibodeau for
load mismanagement. He plays his guys in practices too hard.
(34:24):
But I do think it's there's there's a real point
about what the culture is. Culture is very very hard
for you to define, for me to defile, what is culture?
You know your family's culture, Well, what is culture? Well,
we go to church. That's not culture. That's going to church.
The Knicks are five and zero on the road in
the playoffs and they've trailed in all five of those games,
(34:45):
and three of them were close games. And I think
this is the advantage to a TIB's team. When your
practice is hard, your team gets hard like Mike Vrabel
to New England, wats New England be a very fit
as a could team Rabel Andy Reid is known for
tough practices and that that's TIBs. That was pat Riley
(35:07):
as a coach. Tough practices create tough men, and it's
fearless basketball, and that's why when they get down laden games,
they don't care. And Jalen Brunton talked about this culture
and this identity of being so good in clutch time.
Speaker 10 (35:25):
Just going back to our days in college, just the
way that we practiced and we've prepared for games. It
was more mental than anything. And so when you get
to the real life or the real game situations, you
practice that you've been prepared for it. You just you've
been through moments like that. And so no matter what happens,
we're gonna be together as a team and then we're
(35:45):
gonna have each other's back regardless.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, it's and there's no gimmicks with the Knicks. There's
no like secrets.
Speaker 1 (35:56):
It's like you ever seen Adele, you know, it's like
there's no pyrotechnic, there's no firework show, great voice on stage,
here's the mic. She's singing, and that's kind of the
Knicks like they're gonna play tough, They're gonna play physical.
Brunson's gonna leave the offense. They've got some size, they've
upgraded at wing. Brunson's gonna have the ball late. They're
(36:16):
gonna have really dry spells offensively because they're just not
that gifted. They're not a pretty offense. Baskets don't come easy.
Even Brunson when he's scoring twenty eight to thirty four,
it doesn't look easy. He's on the floor, he's getting
banged around. But that really, that resilience is so valuable
for a tough team. This is just like Golden State.
(36:38):
Golden State's really good in clutch time because they've been
in so many clutch time games.
Speaker 3 (36:44):
By the way, this is.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
What you see with OKC ok They've not been in
these tight, close games and OKAC looks so nervous in
their Game one loss to Denver. They had not been
in games like that.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Last year.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
Kansas City Chiefs were eleven to zero in one possession games.
There was a reason they were good because the last
two years they've been in so many close games. And
it becomes New England with Brady. You know, they Tom
would take least, they'd have a lot of depth they
didn't have outside of the Randy Moss years. It was
about smarts and efficiency. In New England was always so
good in close games against good teams because they won
(37:19):
so many, it just kept feeding off it. So, you know,
I was thinking about this. This doesn't happen very often
that a team wins fourteen games in the NFL, like
the Minnesota Vikings, and their reaction is, you know, I
think we're gonna go with a new, unproven guy, JJ McCarthy.
(37:41):
So I just saw a story this morning about Kevin
O'Connell and JJ McCarthy, you know, and he's in a
league where every good team knows who their quarterback is,
and even if it's a new quarterback like Donald of
the Seahawks, you kind of know what Donald is. Nobody
knows what JJ McCarthy is. I am a skeptic. First
(38:03):
of all, he played for a college team known for
a run game and defense. He was not asked to
win games, he was asked not to lose them. He's
got a modest arm, he's marginally athletic, and again he's
going into a very good division, and this team seriously
considered re signing Sam Darnold, so in fact, you go up.
(38:28):
We were looking this morning. I'm always so reluctant to
embrace a quarterback when everybody says, I don't know how
to describe it. He's a winner. Danny Whirfel was a winner.
Every Steve Spurrier quarterback at Florida was a winner. All
of Urban Myers quarterbacks everywhere he goes are winners. Alex
Smith was a winner and a good quarterback. So we
(38:52):
went this morning and we were looking at sort of
like what the draft people said about JJ McCarthy coming in,
And this was Dane Brugler. His strengths mental prep, weakness,
very few examples of him adjusting protections at the line,
played in an offense that leaned on the run game,
Lance zerline, who I trust. His strength is the ambiguous well,
(39:16):
he plays with a chip on his shoulder, weakness, modest
arm strength, average es capability. So all the stuff I'm
supposed to love is this sort of nebulous. He's a winner,
he plays with a chip, how's his arm, how's his
athletic ability? How's his size? He so and I've said
(39:37):
this before. If you think about who should be dominating
the NFL at quarterback, it should be Alabama guys and
Ohio State guys, right because they get the five start
of high school, then they win the most in college
and you'd think, oh, it's just linear, that guy's going
to be great. How many great Ohio State quarterbacks in
the NFL, because playing at Ohio State is fundamentally nothing
(40:00):
like the NFL. Well, you always have the best teammates,
you always have a lead. If you don't play particularly well,
well we'll just go to the ground game. And now
Ohio State has had a lot more teams historically like
that than Michigan. But those last two years with Michigan
and Harbaugh, they were pulverizing people. They didn't even have
(40:23):
to throw the football. I mean they were going into
Columbus and they had the Buckeys out of sorts.
Speaker 3 (40:28):
So it's been my.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
Take is these massive quinn Ewers went in the seventh round.
He was the last quarterback taken, and my take was
he didn't play trailing much outside of the Georgia games,
and frankly gets better protection in college than he'd ever
get as a pro. And he's got three wide receivers.
They're all pros and a pro tied end and pro
running back to That's not real life in the NFL.
(40:49):
You trail a lot, teams need you to save the
day a lot. JJ McCarthy's just never done it. So
I've got, I've got. I have so many questions about this,
and I know Kevin O'Connell is all fired up on this,
but it is very rare. Is I read a story
this morning about this fourteen wins and they're like, we're
gonna go with a new guy and a new guy.
(41:11):
I'll just say it. I'm a skeptic. Now, I'm not
a Zach Wilson skeptic. I think he can play a
little bit, but I'm I'm in the I think he's
closer to Jackson Dart than Jaden Daniels.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
That's how I would say.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
I think he's closer to the old miss guy that
everybody suddenly loved after he stopped playing. He got better
rafter he stopped playing, than he is the Jaden Daniels.
I'll just throw it out there, that's what you got, Minnesota.
How in the world you like Minnesota this year?
Speaker 3 (41:39):
I like their coach.
Speaker 4 (41:40):
I'm going in blind on mccarthytally.
Speaker 5 (41:43):
But to compare him to Jackson Dart, I mean you
were putting up the Jackson Dart stats against good teams
in the SEC, and he vomited all over himself.
Speaker 3 (41:50):
Terrible.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
McCarthy was the opposite.
Speaker 5 (41:52):
Delivered when it mattered, most game winning drive against Alabama.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Do you know the label time he had like thirty attempts.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
He's not going to need thirty attempts, dude.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
Everybody in the NFL eventually needs thirty attempts. You are
trailing a lot in Minnesota in that division with Detroit,
Chicago and Green Bays offense, you're gonna be trailing in
the second half and have to throw it forty four times.
Speaker 5 (42:15):
You're aware they have this gentleman named Justin Jefferson who
catches passes film will double top receiver in the league.
Speaker 3 (42:21):
If it was just that easy, why don't they win
in playoff?
Speaker 8 (42:23):
Gets?
Speaker 4 (42:24):
So go ahead.
Speaker 5 (42:24):
Ranked the quarterbacks for me in that NFC North, the
tough tough division, toughest division the NFC.
Speaker 3 (42:29):
Rank them well, I mean, Jared GOB's been of a Super.
Speaker 4 (42:31):
Bowl, okay, so he's one, And I.
Speaker 1 (42:33):
Would say Jordan loves the second most proven. And third
is Caleb Williams.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
What is he proven?
Speaker 3 (42:39):
Well, we know how gifted he is.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
And that's the problem about the NFC.
Speaker 3 (42:43):
Jaden Daniels threw over thirty.
Speaker 5 (42:45):
Attempts like every time, eleven times every single time.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
Okay, and Jaden Daniels played in a weaker division.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
They had no defense.
Speaker 3 (42:55):
Is Minnesota's great?
Speaker 4 (42:56):
He was great last year. Keep an eye on the VIKINGSCU.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
Come on, my eyes are on them. I just don't
like what I see.
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Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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