June 3, 2025 • 41 mins
Shai Gilgeous-Alexander is good but is he really the greatest Thunder ever?
How will the Jaguars use Travis Hunter this season?
Guest: Jovan Buha
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
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dot com, or stream us live every day on the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio, our number two here
on the Herd. Jason McIntyre somehow still in for Colin Coward.
I've been replaced yet.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I don't know, Alex. Maybe that's coming. People are very
angry at me online.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
I love this.
Speaker 5 (00:38):
You're like off the rails takes this week.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
That crazy. I mean, you're going all in on.
Speaker 6 (00:46):
A rookie quarterback JJ and the Vikings before seeing him
actually play a single NFL snap.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
So let's let's not talk about that one anyway. We
got Jovon Buja, who covers the Lakers coming up in
five minutes. I had to ask him, are you pro
super teams or not? I'll tell you what he said
when he drops by the set, but let's say he
probably liked my take earlier.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Give me super teams or give me death? All right?
Speaker 2 (01:12):
NBA Finals are starting Thursday. Gosh, the wait is forever.
And I keep seeing this nonsense out there from these
yahoos who were like, hey, SGA wins the title, He's
the best player in Thunder history. And I'm like, we
talked about this as a staff last week and I said,
no way, just because he won the MVP in a championship,
(01:35):
even if he wins finals MVP, I don't care you
think that automatically makes him the greatest player in franchise history.
I'm sorry, Kevin Durant, undeniably, this isn't even This is
like a laughable discussion. I pushed this in the morning
meeting on Monday and they were like, yeah, that's obvious.
And then I'm seeing all these these clowns online saying, oh, yes, Ga, wow,
(01:56):
he got a title.
Speaker 3 (01:57):
Katie didn't get a title. Folks, we got.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
The side by side comparison. Okay, we forget what Kevin Durant.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Did it Oka see Okay, look.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
At these numbers. This is staggering. It's not even close.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
He is by far.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I mean, SGA would probably need three championships in my
mind to be the best player in franchise history. And
I did have to stay there a lot longer. He
has four playoff series wins. Can we pump the brakes?
And this is an issue I have with the NBA.
We just love to crown people instantly, like SGA's crushing
it in the mid range.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Awesome, wonderful, congrats, But we can't stop there.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
We need to say he's the greatest player in Thunder
franchise history, and he's brought the mid range back to
save the NBA. He's basically like Kobe and MJ in
the mid range, Like, do you see we're making quantum
leaps off a playoff run that's.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Been Yeah, he's been great. I got it.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
In the first round, they took down Memphis. I mean
they have a one jack squat. John Moran got hurt
when they were up thirty and otherwise you know SJA
loses that game. Okay, and then who they be in
the second round the Nuggets. Okay, that was a tough series.
Now many people had the Nuggets winning that series or
going to the finals. Again they have no bench. And
then in the third round they take down the Timberwolves.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
What do they want?
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Anthony Edwards their stars twenty three. Let's not act like
this is some kind of historic run. I know the
numbers say they're great, net rating blah blah blah, and
I'm not diminishing. I'm just putting things in context. Oka
see has been great. They've won I believe, eighty eighty
two games, so a lot of basketball games this season.
But can we just slow down crowning Sga is the
(03:40):
greatest player in franchise history. That's false. Can we stop
with this? They're one of the greatest teams in NBA
history according to some stats. That's not even close to true.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Guys.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Let's be last year's Celtics team would wipe the floor
with these guys. Okay, I don't think it's particularly close.
I mean, hell, that Nuggets team that won the title
when they actually had a bench and didn't have to
rely on Peyton Watson and Jalen Pickett. That Nuggets seems
probably better than these guys. This is a great team. Defensively,
they're great, they're bill awesome, But can we just slow down?
(04:14):
Even if they sweep the Pacers, which could be in play,
let's just let's provide some context.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
In reality.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
They're a really, really good basketball team, and they've had
an outstanding season, and Sga is awesome.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Can we leave it at that?
Speaker 4 (04:26):
Is that?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (04:27):
All right, let's welcome in Jovon Buha covers the NBA
and the Lakers for the Athletic All right, I just
wanted a rant.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
You're laughing here. You saw this Oklahoma City team.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
You were in Oka, see when the Lakers smacked them
by seventy five or whatever, and then the next night
they're winning in the fourth and Luca gets that dumb
ejection or the Lakers beat.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Them back to back.
Speaker 7 (04:50):
Come on, would have given them a better series than
the Timberwolves, thank you. But yeah, I mean they're they're
putting up historic numbers, so I want to give them
their respect for the season that they're having. But I
agree with you that if they win the championship, which
I think they will, if you look at some of
the recent title winners, I would pick the twenty twenty
(05:12):
four Celtics ahead of them.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I think the twenty twenty.
Speaker 7 (05:14):
Lakers would give them the real Lakers that would give
them a real series.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Forgot about them. Yeah, that team had KCP Kuzma.
Speaker 7 (05:22):
I mean, Lebron and ad were arguably two of the
top three or four players in the league.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Were they the number one seed.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
There were the number one seed. They were on a
sixty one pace.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Huh, we forgot about the bubble Lakers.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Yeah, what do you.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Think of the goofballs who were like, ah, that title
doesn't really count.
Speaker 7 (05:39):
I mean, look, so I was covering the Clippers at
the time, so I was on the opposite end of
watching a team who did not want to be there
and who crumbled under the pressure of the bubble and
being away from their families and obviously some real world
stuff going on at the time. But like I mean,
I think that was one of the tougher championships in NBA.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
History, undeniably. All Right, Bron has his podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
He's now partnering with Steve Nash and Luca Doncter was
on it.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
I'm assuming you listened and all that fun stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Any takeaways, any tea leaves to read from their podcast together.
Speaker 7 (06:12):
So one thing I think is worth noting with this
is this was filmed actually in Oklahoma City during that
road trip, So this is from early April, so that
they were sitting on this that they filmed several episodes
of Mind the Game in Oklahoma City because the producer,
Jason lives out there. So this is like a couple
months old, so I want to make note of that.
(06:34):
That's why they're talking about the Oklahoma City road trip
when they're talking. So that's why I don't think we're
going to see anything about like Luca and his extension
or Lebron and his free agency and like part two.
But I thought the interesting thing was just seeing how
those two interacted, because we haven't really seen them interact much,
just based on how postgame goes. Lebron likes to talk
(06:54):
at his locker, he goes a little bit earlier, Luca
goes for treatment, and then he goes to the podium,
so sometimes like they're kind of passing by each other
despite having their lockers next to each other. So we
haven't really seen them interact for extended periods outside of
like cracking jokes in the locker or maybe there's a
conversation one of them will pop into. So I think
just seeing those two interact for about thirty minutes or
(07:14):
so what was interesting.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
But no real takeaways.
Speaker 7 (07:17):
Obviously, it was a lot of like how they developed,
and a little bit about their tenure with the Lakers
and kind of where things are out at that time.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
I'm curious.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So Lebron partnered with Wade, who he was tight with,
and then Kyrie, who there was like a mutual respect,
and then ad he really wanted this is the first
one he didn't. I don't think he asked for Luca.
But Luca really respects him. How are we supposed to
infer that?
Speaker 7 (07:42):
I think Lebron really respects Luca though he said multiple
times that he's his favorite player in the league, because
really Luca is Lebron minus the athleticism, and you know,
he's got some hard in it. It's like, you know,
I think he's a hybrid of Lebron and Harden, you know,
without the maybe with like the Paul Pierce athleticism, right
or something like that, or maybe a little bit more
(08:03):
than I don't know, but he's so I think there's
a mutual admiration. Because of the size and because of
the way that he sees the game.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
They are very similar in that regard. So I think
Lebron respects him and is someone that he's trying to
take under his wing.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
So it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I was I'm sure you saw the video of Luca
at like a real Madrid game. He stood up in
the front row and of course, you know the body
language experts are like he's skinny.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Oh my gosh, he's losing weight. I don't did you
take away anything. I couldn't really tell.
Speaker 7 (08:35):
He looked a little slimmer, but I wouldn't take away
too much from it. I mean, I think that is
going to be his point of emphasis for this offseason
is getting in better shape. As JJ Redick said at
his exit interview Championship shape, and I think that was
a comment pointed toward Luca and then a couple other players.
Is last time I was on here, we kind of
talked about that.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
So I think that is going to be a point
of emphasis for him.
Speaker 7 (08:58):
But he is playing with Slovenia EuroBasket, which I think
is going to be good for him to keep him
in game shape throughout the summer. So I think we
might see a slimmer Luca going into training kick.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
But he did play last summer and then he got injured,
Like is there any concern like with that?
Speaker 7 (09:13):
I mean with calf injuries, there is always some concern
with just reinjury, and those can nag a little bit.
But if I just go back and look at that
was the most serious injury he's dealt with at the
NBA level. It was the longest injury ab since he
had of his career. Then he gets traded and he's
clearly shell shocked. There's an emotional element to it, and
within the aftermath of all that, I don't think he
(09:34):
was ever quite himself physically.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
Despite that, he was still putting up twenty eight, eight
and seven.
Speaker 7 (09:39):
Still, I mean, all the Lakers big statement wins, Luca
was the primary guy hitting big shots, making big plays
in the fourth So I think he put his imprint
on that team and their second half turnaround. But he
still has way more to improve in terms of getting
back to who he was before.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I'm forgetting where the report came from. But yesterday Alex
and I talked about Bronnie James. He's going to be
in the rotation next year, and don't I don't know
if this is an overreaction to seeing like Indiana and
Okay see having like big benches where they're playing. You
know TJ McConnell much better, obviously, but can Bronnie be
a poor man's TJ McConnell for ten minutes a game
(10:16):
next year?
Speaker 7 (10:17):
I think he can crack maybe like the fringes of
the rotation. He showed a lot of growth. Like I
think if you go back and watch where he was
in the G League in November compared to where he
was in the G League in March, two totally different players.
And it's not just like a confidence thing, Like he
tangibly improved his skill and is off the dribble, pick
and role play, passing, decision making, all that stuff really improved.
(10:38):
So I think he's shown some on the dribble or
off the dribble, on the ball chops that he didn't
really show in Summer League or at USC.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
That I think is encouraging.
Speaker 7 (10:47):
But I come back to the defensive end, where for me,
if he's going to get minutes, he has to be
that ninety four feet pest pressuring the ball. You know,
the pitbull who you put on an opposing ball handler,
and he's wanting to be uptive and making that player uncomfortable.
So I would like to see a little bit more
of that from him. But I think going in the
next season, could he be the eleventh or twelfth guy
(11:08):
in the rotation, maybe depending on how things shake out.
They make a trade where they trade three guys for one,
and all of a sudden you.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Have some depth issues.
Speaker 7 (11:16):
Perhaps he cracks the back end of the rotation, but
I don't think he's going to be top eight, top nine.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
I think that's probably premature.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Okay, so you mentioned the word trade, so obviously the
buzz out there is this is going to be the.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Busiest offseason since twenty nineteen.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I don't are the Lakers going to be involved in
a lot of it because it seems like they're in
a position where they can't do a ton.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Was that fair?
Speaker 7 (11:39):
They are limited with their resources both in free agency
they probably will only have the five point seven million
taxpayer exception and Les Lebron takes a fifteen to twenty
million dollar bacup, which it's not happening, So like probably
a five point seven million unless they can salary dump
someone into a team with cap space.
Speaker 4 (11:59):
Or with some cat flexibility.
Speaker 7 (12:01):
However, well maybe like a Maxi Kleibo or a Gay Vincent,
because those guys are are lower expiring figures.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Okay.
Speaker 7 (12:08):
The problem is to do that, you typically have to
attach an asset or two right, and they only have
one pick to trade, so when looking at their options,
I think they have to make a trade to make
any notable improvement, and that's likely going to come with
some combination of Ruy Hachimura twenty thirty one or twenty
thirty two for shund pick Dalton connect and some combination
(12:30):
of the maybe a Gay.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
Vincent a Maxi Kleb. But like it's hard to.
Speaker 7 (12:35):
You know, only trade out expiring contracts that know, like
people don't want like ruis a guy who can start.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Or be a key bench piece for you depending on
your roster.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Player, You're you're in good shape, right.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Yeah, I would probably fifth.
Speaker 7 (12:47):
I would want fifth or sick because he was the
Lakers fourth best player and they lost on the first show.
Oh yeah, I'm trying to think like the Knicks who
was Yeah, I think he needs a certain infrastructure where
like if you put him on Minnesota or okay, like
take Chat out or take Julius Randall out and you
have a bunch of good defenders around him and he's
just more of like a spot up, catch and shoot
(13:07):
guy around that I think he fits. But if like
he was the Lakers primary wing stoppers sometimes and it's
like that that's not gonna cut it.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
But Dorian Finney Smith is going to be back.
Speaker 7 (13:16):
With the Lakers, I think, so, yeah, he's got a
great relationship with Luca too, which you can't.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
He's it back to Dallas, right yeah, yeah, all right,
So let's re talk about Austin Reeves again.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
For some reason, people don't like the guy. He's polarizing
series against Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
What do you want to you know?
Speaker 7 (13:32):
I would even contend his series was not as bad
as people are making it out to be, like his
his isolation defense against Ant, the numbers were actually good
if you look at that. There was certain not not
to get too nerdy on you, but there were some
you know, isolation possessions where they're tracking points for possession
for certain offenders. In the first round, he was I
think top five against like him individually against Ant, and
(13:55):
he had the best defensive rating of any of the
five starters by a wide margin. So you can't point
to like they were much worse defensively with him on
the floor. And then even his numbers, like I went
through for a recent podcast, I did and looked at
all sixteen playoff teams their number three score. He was
right there with Aaron Gordon, chet Holmgren, Evan Mobley, and
(14:17):
that like sixteen to seventeen point per game range. So
it's like his percentages were bad and there were some
bad possessions where he switched on to Julius Randall and
Wan's or Jaden McDaniel's scored on him.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
Whatever. Yeah, but he wasn't. It wasn't D'Angel Russell from
the Denver.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
There was no zero.
Speaker 7 (14:32):
Points on zero for seven shooting performance, right, So any
I think defensively he held up on guards. He's fine,
it's it's one he has to guard bigger guys. That's
where it's a mismatch.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
So it's weird.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I keep hearing and again, I'm not blasting the finals.
I'm just not that excited about him that. Oh, okay,
See's set up for the next five years. Oh they're
gonna be unstoppable. We heard this about Denver with Yokichen Murray.
They're in their prime and they have been able to
get back to the finals Boston last year. Oh, Boston
set up, they're perfect. Tatum now done, They're going to
be apparently Holidays on.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
The way out.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Is this doing that over again or is there Wait
a minute, they're younger, they have more cap space, they
got a bunch of draft picks.
Speaker 4 (15:11):
That's the big one for Mixicill. It's the draft picks.
Speaker 7 (15:13):
So I mean, they're the second youngest team to make
the Finals in NBA history by average age, so that
I think is a factor in their favor. A lot
of these guys are extension eligible. They're still in their
rookie deals. So a lot of times, like basically whoever
you get drafted by, like they can control your contract
with the way restricted freegency works for like seven to
(15:33):
eight years.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
So a lot of these guys, if.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
The Thunder are willing to go into the luxury tax,
are going to be OKAC Thunder for the foreseeable future.
And then I look at the draft picks of they got,
I think something like twenty something first round picks over
the next six seven years.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
So even if they lose, it's high. It's a big no. Now,
they're not all good, they're not all good picks.
Speaker 7 (15:56):
But if they want to get into the honest sweepstakes,
let's say they lose or somehow Indiana pushes them to
like seven and it's a concerning series, they can go
get you honest, they could go get They could bring
KD back and he could add to his resume as
a thundera. Yes, so like they or let's say, like
Cason Wallace is someone I really like off their bench.
(16:17):
I think he's a guy who can start for a
lot of teams moving forward. If he grows into that
caliber player and they lose him in free agency or
they have to trade him because of his contract, well
they could go draft another version of him, a younger,
cheaper version.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
So like, they're really set up.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
We haven't seen a team be this set up because
like even going back to Denver for example, right like,
they made several trades and gave up all their first
round picks or a lot of them, and they did
a poor job drafting, They did a poor job signing
minimum guys and stuff like Okac has nailed the draft.
They've replenished their cupboard, and there will set up. So
I think this can be an exception here where like
(16:54):
we haven't really seen a team have this much draft equity,
have this much young talent in right now a wide
open league.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
So the Pacers are kind of in that.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I saw a number that said something like they haven't
paid the luxury tax since two thousand and four.
Speaker 7 (17:07):
Yeah, that's insanity and somehow they've always been like decent too.
They've never really tanked that they like, they're always like
thirty plus wins.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Let me ask, just macro zoom out. Is this finals
good for the league?
Speaker 4 (17:20):
I think so.
Speaker 7 (17:23):
I mean, I think we're in this new era of parody, seemingly.
And while I, as you teased, am pro super team
and pro big market, you know, give the I don't
mind if.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
The stars combine in a big market in a small
mar shirt. Sure, I just need stars together, but I'm
super team, you know, pro big market. But I think
this is good.
Speaker 4 (17:46):
For the league and showing you can build in different ways.
Speaker 7 (17:49):
And I think it is sort of like a palette
cleanse for the league after having there's been a concentration
of the California teams the Texas teams, and I think
we're having a little bit of a reset. But I
think these are two rabid fan bases, two of the
better fan bases in the league that have not had
titles Indiana and then Okay see now obviously more recently.
So one of these two teams is going to, you know,
(18:11):
have their their first title. And I think it's that
part's awesome. You got young talent. A lot of people
doubting both teams. Frankly, like, okay, see talking to players.
We talked about it before, like players were not afraid
of the thunder. I don't know if they are still
afraid of the thunder or not. But Indiana we had
to pull out the athletic. We talked to players anonymously.
(18:33):
They voted him the most overrated players.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Is your outlet? Oh god?
Speaker 7 (18:36):
So it's like, yeah, you know, I think both of
these teams have had to overcome some doubt.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
I just't I keep coming back to, like, you you
have a bunch of buddies I'm assuming who aren't hardcore
NBIA fans.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
Are they fired up about this exactly?
Speaker 4 (18:51):
That's the problem.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
That's kind of an issue. Like there's nobody polarizing in
this series. I mean maybe SGA.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
S Halliburton's a little I think Haliburt's at I mean,
if you're ANIX.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Wholiburton is no does she know who SGA is?
Speaker 4 (19:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (19:05):
Oh okay, but I covered him with the clippers, so
oh yeah, so it doesn't that it's a little different.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
But yeah, yeah, like Halliburton, I mean, my mom has
no clue who that guy, you know, and like I
think if you get Kyrie and Lebron, Kurry and kd
you know, even like Kobe and Gasol, like everybody knows
those guys. And I know the argument could be, well,
those these guys will be back here. Maybe Denver's hasn't
been back, Milwaukee hasn't been back.
Speaker 7 (19:28):
I think, okay, see, we'll be back Indiana. We'll see,
I mean maybe maybe Okay, Okay, see's pretty again.
Speaker 4 (19:35):
We'll set up. We'll see.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
I'm a little doubt on okay, so we'll see if
you could tell all right, so we'll get a couple
of quick ones. Big picture league.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
There's a report coming out last I guess in the
last hour.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
About Kevin Durant and Phoenix and Houston are perhaps working
on something.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
But is that because maybe Milwaukee asked for.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Amen Thompson in any Yiannist deal, hoping that Amen Thompson
could be there Sga.
Speaker 7 (19:59):
Maybe Well, that same report said that there's some uncertainty
with how available Jannis is because I think any team
going for Kevin Durant should be trying to go for you, honest,
because it's like, why not get the younger, currently better
superstar player. Right, he's about what five six years younger
than Katie? So why not get that guy who can
be set up for the next half decade or so.
(20:21):
So I think if I'm Houston, my priority number one
has to be throwing the kitchen sink to try to
get Yannest. That's the one guy I would try to keep.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
You look like a potential major stay.
Speaker 7 (20:32):
And the interesting thing is, like if you ask the
casual fan, they would probably say like Alprin Shangoun or
Jalen Green.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
Like Jailen Green.
Speaker 7 (20:39):
I think is that's kind of my my test for
like your perception of basketball is how you feel about
Jalen Green.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
And I don't think many people know, but you know.
Speaker 7 (20:49):
So I think Alman Thompson is the guy that I
would try to keep if I'm Houston.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Everybody else is on the table.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
And then so what does this Yannis may not be available?
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Is that formally asked.
Speaker 7 (21:01):
Out technically, but I mean it's I think he's gonna
get traded this summer.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Yeah, there's no point.
Speaker 4 (21:06):
You can't put the tooth paste back in the tube.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Yeah, And I will ask, is there a world where
he gets shipped to a small market team?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
Uh?
Speaker 4 (21:14):
And San Antoni. I mean in San Antonio.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
I think San Antonio is maybe the exception, depending on
what they're willing to put on the table.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Would you put Castle in a deal?
Speaker 7 (21:22):
I would, so, then what what do you mean to me?
Honest is a top three player in the league. So
it's like, who are your other two guys? I would say,
Shane Jokic. Well, Jokic, I came on here and broke
my MVP pick. So Jokic to me is and look,
I mean, especially if okay See disposes of Indiana in
(21:43):
a four or five game series, that's going to make
the Jokic is the best player in the league case
even stronger because the fact that he took was five
and a half guys, and he took okay See the
seven games, and like they just ran out of gas,
like game four, Game five, they could have won either
of those games. In the fourth they double digit leads.
Like I think that makes the yokich is the best
player in the league strung. But yeah, I would say, yeah,
(22:04):
Like with Castle, right, you're hoping he can become a
top three player. I don't think he's going to become
a top three player, So like, why not get the
guy who's still in his prime.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Yeah, I just don't know if you have enough around
Wemby and Giannis is at enough.
Speaker 7 (22:16):
Fox Fox two, you keep fun. I think that's a
pretty good. But as your third best.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
Player, he playoff series wins for deer and five.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
Zero, But as your third best player, you could do worse.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Yeah, all right, so this is unfair. But just listening
to where you put Sga.
Speaker 4 (22:30):
Third, you'd put I would put him third.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
Do you think Sga is a better player than Luca
right now?
Speaker 7 (22:35):
I think, right right now, yes, wow, But I think
it's I mean, we're talking, but I think I think
Luca's ceiling is higher. So like if we go back
to like twenty twenty four Luca, I think that player
is better than this current version ship.
Speaker 4 (22:48):
I just don't think he was at that level.
Speaker 7 (22:50):
So like, I think his like there's a little bit
more variance with Luca, But just because of the conditioning
and the injury and.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
People listening and watching, it'd be like, oh, Luca play defense.
Sga is surrounded by great defense.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
He's the worst defender in the starting yek. Now, he's
not a bad defense.
Speaker 7 (23:05):
He's still in above like he's an above average to
good defender. But he's the guy that if you're going
to target someone in their starting group you have, it's
no shade at him, because again, you're not.
Speaker 4 (23:14):
Going to target lou Dort. You're not gonna target.
Speaker 7 (23:16):
Chet, right, Luca might, Luca might, Luca will target anybody.
But I would say right now, I would say Shay's better.
But I think if I was going into next season,
depending on how things play out the rest of the series,
and maybe if we get some Luca update pictures going
in the next year, if I was doing like a
twenty twenty five twenty six ranking, I might put Luca ahead.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
All right, So I'll end with a hot take. I
kind of pitched it to the staff. I don't know
if we're going to do it this week. I think
SGA is basically James.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
Harden two point zero. I don't I don't want to
hear any of this Kobe nonsense and all this sud Like.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
He's James Harden, really good player who has kind of
an unstoppable run here getting into the basket, drawing fouls.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
No, he's not the three point shooter, but he's traded
that for the mid range.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I mean some of the stats about him in the
half court, drives to the basket, dribbles, whatever they are,
they're similar to what Harden was doing.
Speaker 3 (24:05):
Is that in Is that a ding on SGA?
Speaker 4 (24:07):
I think it is just because.
Speaker 7 (24:12):
Because of the playoff track record at this point we've
seen with Harden when you look at some of his
notable playoff performances, especially in games five to seven, game
six performances, game seven performances, like he shrinks from the moment.
And so I think with Shay already, I mean, Harden's
been to the finals, but he was in the finals
(24:33):
as a sixth man. He hasn't been to the finals
as the guy. He hasn't gotten over that hump yet.
So I mean, I know it's a bit reductive and
I don't know, but like we have the track record, right,
like people have written and gone through.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I guess the counter with oh case, he's been favored
in every series. Yeah, Harden usually when he was the
guy in Houston, was the dog and he did push.
Speaker 7 (24:51):
These except for the one year they won, his MVP year.
That was the year what twenty nineteen sixty five wins,
I mean them versus the Warriors was like Chris Paul
goes down and they're up three, They're up three to
two in that series. Then Chris Paul goes down and
then so but still it's like, I mean, at some point.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
You think he would have broken through.
Speaker 7 (25:14):
And I don't know, I mean in Brooklyn and in Philly,
Like it's just his his track record is is at
this point like he is who he is.
Speaker 4 (25:23):
So I think negative to call.
Speaker 7 (25:26):
I think Shay has a ways to go to catch
him as a regular season player like that, Harden's legacy
is largely carried by his regular season performances, the consistency,
the longevity, like he he's put up some monster seasons,
the playoff track record. I think if Shae wins the
title already best player. Negative Yeah, I mean, I think
you could argue some of those Houston teams were just
(25:47):
as like similar talent profile to these Thunder teams, right
like Thunder or Deeper.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
But like Trevor, it's like their third best player, Eric Gordon.
Speaker 7 (25:57):
I mean, I mean that's fair ella who play Capella?
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Is he gonna be a Laker?
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Maybe?
Speaker 7 (26:05):
I think that the five point seven might be a
little low for him, But depending on how the market place.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Can they get Nikaile Alex Deander Walker for five point
seven No shot.
Speaker 7 (26:12):
He's getting at least a full taxpayer remlea. It's like
fourteen millions over.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Fine, go out on one name. Give me one fun
name for.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
The Laker guy I really Liken've been out there or
a lot.
Speaker 7 (26:22):
Well, the guy I really like is Nick Claxton. I
think that's the guy that checks all the boxes. I
know he's slight right, and that's like the one knock
on him I guess would be. But like they had
the league's best defense with Jackson Hayes as their starting center.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
For a quarter of the season. You get me that guy.
Speaker 7 (26:37):
He can switch, a good rim protector, really good finisher,
lob threat.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
Like, that's a guy. He's twenty six. I want twenty
five to twenty.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Six, so we have the best defense with Jackson Ayes
for a.
Speaker 7 (26:47):
Twenty four that twenty four game stretch, they want twenty
and four league's best defense, Jackson Hayes was the primary center.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
It feels like Taxson Hayes is probably playing in China
next year, right.
Speaker 7 (26:57):
I think he'll get a contract, But he cost himself
a lot in my over the final month of that
season if.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
You can't work with Lebron and Luca like anyways, all right,
Jovann Buha, senior NBA reporter at the Athletic knows everything.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
He has a podcast. Dude, he's you've worked everywhere. He's
on the ride. What are you like?
Speaker 4 (27:13):
Thirty thirty two?
Speaker 3 (27:14):
She's what a lucky guy?
Speaker 4 (27:15):
All right? Man, be sure to catch live editions on
The Herd weekdays and Noone Eastern a em Pacific.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Back here on the Herd. Great stuff, Jovan Buha. You see,
I could talk to Lakers like literally all day. It's fun.
Let's go to Alex Curry with the news.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
No, no, no, turn on the news.
Speaker 5 (27:34):
This is the Herd Line news.
Speaker 6 (27:36):
We're actually going to start in baseball because this kind
of came out at the series you were at this weekend,
the World Series rematch, Yankee shortstop Anthony Volpi and Dodger
shortstop Miguel Rojas were asked to name their all time
batting orders starting from the two thousands. Obviously, both Aaron
Judge and Shoho Tani We're both on.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
The list, but take a look.
Speaker 6 (27:56):
At the rest here. Okay, we have him on here. Okay,
So for the Dodgers. You got show here Tanim Beth's
Breddie Freeman, Mat Camp, Freddy Bellinger, Justin Turner, will Smith kkrnandas.
Speaker 5 (28:07):
Miguel Rohaus, Clayton Kershaw.
Speaker 6 (28:09):
And then for the Yankees you have Derek Jeter, Bernie Williams,
Aaron Judge, Alex Rodriguez marked as Shara Robinson Cano, Jorge Pessada,
Set Gardner that the had So.
Speaker 5 (28:22):
Who which one are you taking here?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
A lot of those Dodgers players are like on the
current team.
Speaker 6 (28:27):
Yeah, and they also they've also won they've also won
two recent World series.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
So like that's I was living in New York during
the Derek Jeter run.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
It was just it was insane in the fall. Oh yeah,
it was insane, unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
I mean, this is a this.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Is a tough one, but I'm l Yankees right with
given that, like those are historical play those are historically
Derek Peters, Hall of Fake Bertie william Hall of Fath
right again, you.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Judge is going a rod and I mean to share
up should be all of fame.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yes, that's a stacked Yankees, but a lot of these
guys are still young on the Dodgers.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Is the only guy who's not really that recent, right,
what do you mean, like, yeah, most.
Speaker 6 (29:19):
Of these Dodgers Tody Tody still yeah, still the league
on the team.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Yeah, I would lean Yankee stars. That's what about you?
What do you got? That's fine? I mean, I bleeed blue.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So I'm going Dodgers.
Speaker 6 (29:32):
And we saw this weekend obviously Dodgers like still just
light you're ahead of the Yankees right right now. But again,
these are two teams that, like money talks. When you
have the money, you're going to get the top players.
And historically it was always the Yankees going out and paying,
like paying the paying to get their all stars. And
(29:55):
they have the World Series to show for it.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Obviously nothing since.
Speaker 6 (29:59):
The Jeter ruh they got closed last year.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
But I mean, honestly, I can watch O Tawny highlights
all day.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
Yeah, it's hard.
Speaker 6 (30:09):
It's also hard to bet against show Heytani right now,
like you're on any line.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
Upright Honestly, he's so he's like kind of goat level already.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Like yeah, they're calling him the.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Young So Friday night, I was at the game. Yankees
are rolling five.
Speaker 6 (30:23):
You saw Judge like had a home run the first
O Taani homer in the first it was back to
back dingers. Otani had two homers.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
So I think it's five to two Yankees. Oh yeah,
they starter who's there?
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Who's their picture? That I forget? He's their best play
he said it? Or no, he's the guy was.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
Unrolling and O Tani Tomahawks won out of the yard
and it's like, yeah, oh boy, and the Dodgers woke
up to feel all four runs. Yeah, and then the
Yankees both faded. Yeah, you gotta you gotta go Dodgers.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Well, and then it just exploaded. What was fine with it?
Eighteen eight, eighteen two eight Saturday. Yeah, just a beat down.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
This is good.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
I like the historical content.
Speaker 5 (30:59):
It's right. Okay, let's uh, let's head back to.
Speaker 6 (31:03):
The NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year betting market is
getting a ton of action as reports from OTA's across
the league come in.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
And they must like what Cleveland Beat reporters.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
Are saying because Shador Sanders has received the most tickets
and biggest handle of all rookies despite being a long
shot to win the award at plus two thousand.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
That's dumb money.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
That's why you know what I hope he goes out
there and proves everybody wrong.
Speaker 4 (31:33):
Is do it.
Speaker 6 (31:34):
Do it on the field instead of talking about it
on social media. And he's had a great attitude. He
has had a great attitude since getting drafted by Cleveland
despite everything and the way it went down.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
Obviously you've talked a lot about.
Speaker 6 (31:48):
His dad, Dion and and kind of being a big reason.
I think that he he got a lot of negativity
and got a lot of hate. But you also have
to remember Tom Brady is or one of Shador Sanders' mentors.
He was the one who called him after he got drafted,
and he obviously dropped in the draft, and Tom Brady
told Shador it doesn't matter where you're drafted, because all
(32:11):
that matters is day one at camp, because that's where
you're gonna fight for your spot on the field. And
if anybody can attest to that, it's Tom Brady, who
went in the sixth round, one hundred and ninety nine fick.
Speaker 5 (32:21):
He is the goat.
Speaker 6 (32:22):
He has more rings than any individual franchise. So he
has good people in his ear and he has good
people on his team besides his dad giving him some
good advice. I I don't believe he's gonna start the season.
I think Black is probably gonna start the season, but
I think Shador what about if he has I think
(32:44):
should If Shador has a good camp, I think he
can he can be a starter mid season for the Browns.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
So, first of all, if your thought is, hey, I
can't wait to bet into that market rookie of the year.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:56):
Offense, I don't think he's gonna have enough games under.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Bettle me who's in a quarterback battle with three other dudes.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
I don't think he's gonna have enough games under his belt.
But I do think he's going to start eventually for
the Browns.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
This is why casinos exist in the desert.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Dumb money people lighting it on fire, betting Shider Sanders.
Speaker 5 (33:16):
It's a lot. I mean, I try to help these people.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I try to talk Gambell.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I don't want to. They don't want to.
Speaker 5 (33:21):
You got to make the roster.
Speaker 6 (33:22):
There is a lot of guys competing for this. I
do think he again, I will say it again, I
do think he has a good chance to start mid season.
They don't think he's going to start the season for
the Browns.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
That they're going to go with Flacco.
Speaker 4 (33:34):
Give me a number.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
How many games will should your start this year?
Speaker 4 (33:37):
Allies?
Speaker 5 (33:38):
Can we get their schedule up?
Speaker 3 (33:39):
Do we have their schedule? I don't even think you
need it now.
Speaker 6 (33:43):
It's like, come on, I okay, so they have a
week nine by halfway through the season.
Speaker 5 (33:49):
Okay, right, you're.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Not bringing him out against the Jets or Ravens. Those
two have great defenses.
Speaker 5 (33:55):
Raiders on the road.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Yeah, niners. I don't think so.
Speaker 6 (34:00):
I mean if you're if he's in, he's then one, two, three,
four's so like seven maybe he starts six? Seven games? Wow?
Speaker 3 (34:07):
Okay Vegas nae back end of the season.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
All right, yeah, give me the under. I will smash
that under. No way does he start setting you. And
again I liked just for content. I liked him coming out.
I would have taken them second. But I'm going with
what the Browns have shown. Don't tell me, show me.
He's getting the fewest amount of reps.
Speaker 6 (34:28):
But they're going to put in Flacco to start the season.
Maybe give pickt a shot. I think should or I
think shudor find this way in there.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Dylan Gabriel, no fines. You heard Breer. You hurt Breer.
He crushed the drafts.
Speaker 6 (34:42):
Yeah, all right, Well, let's talk about the Steelers and
TJ Watt.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
They are.
Speaker 6 (34:50):
He wants to do contract and Pittsburgh doesn't want to
offer more than they already have. No Reports from Pittsburgh
say that the offer is pretty significant, but still doesn't
match what what. Of course, complicating this is the fact
that the Steelers haven't gotten and may never get Aaron
Rodgers in camp. Yeah, he's not even on the team.
So I don't even know why we keep talking about
(35:10):
Rogers with the Steelers yet.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
But but TJ is your guy.
Speaker 6 (35:17):
He's the top edge rusher on a great defensive team
with one of the greatest defensive coaches who has never
had a losing season in his eighteen year coaching career.
And TJ is first and has been first in every
defensive stats since his rookie year.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
So you're gonna have to give. Give the guy what
he wants. Give the guy what he wants. But they have.
Speaker 6 (35:36):
Bigger problems right now in this season, like they need
a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Wait, give the guy what he wants. He's like thirty
thirty one years old, isn't that risky? A lot of
tread on those tires.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
Now I'm still performing for how long? Still first?
Speaker 6 (35:50):
Still ranked first in the NFL. Yeah, it's entering the league.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
He's had a great career, but I'm given the contract
looking forward, and I.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
I would have said, I said, I would have traded
leader on this defense. Yeah, that's on a team that.
Speaker 6 (36:04):
Has been like one of the top defensive teams with
the best defensive coach and has never had a losing season.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
What that's gonna shake everything up?
Speaker 6 (36:13):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (36:13):
I mean they haven't had a playoff win with CJ. Watt,
and it's like, what are we paying? They don't have
a losing season? Good?
Speaker 2 (36:22):
I would trade I would have a losing season. I
would bought him out. I would trade Watt, not sign Rogers,
win four or five games, and then take the.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Quarterback tank, a top ten drive a tank. I mean,
I don't know what else you're gonna do.
Speaker 6 (36:33):
Every year they're reaching too much pride, too much pride
for Tomas and that's not gonna happen.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Absolutely not. It won't. But it shouldn't.
Speaker 6 (36:41):
No, no, because he's I do think this might be
Mike Tomin's first losing season in his career. But they're
not gonna tank I don't think it's going to be
that bad where they're going to be a top two
draft picking there.
Speaker 3 (36:54):
Hello, I mean that would be big.
Speaker 6 (36:56):
Yeah, but to get you can trade, you can trade
up for that, you don't tank. They're a franchise that
feels more like you trade for that, you don't tank
for that.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
Yeah, they're They're a blue blood. They're too proud.
Speaker 6 (37:08):
Yes, eight mic problem has never had a losing season
in eighteen years.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
Who had the song Ain't too Proud to beg? Is
that TLC? I don't know, Ain't too Proud to tank?
Should that should be their their theme? Coming up next?
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Well, that's the news, and thanks for stopping.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Coming up next?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Do the Jags have an issue with Travis Hunter? Liam
Cohen their new head coach? Spoke and not great in Jacksonville.
We all want to feel completely safe after locking up
at night and head into bed. That's the peace of mind.
Simply Safe provides. Get fifty percent off your new simply
Safe system with professional monitoring and your first month free
(37:56):
at simply safecolin dot com.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
There's no safe like simply six.
Speaker 4 (38:04):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays
A neon Eastern non am Pacific.
Speaker 8 (38:09):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 9 (38:14):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
Eastern two to four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and
of course the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (38:21):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 9 (38:23):
We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 8 (38:27):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 9 (38:36):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together. I mean that says something, right,
So check us out.
Speaker 8 (38:41):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up.
Speaker 9 (38:45):
As they say, I'd say, the most interactive show on
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Speaker 8 (38:50):
Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on
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Speaker 6 (39:06):
On the Box, another chapter in America's greatest ravelry at
bolt as the Red Sox take on Aaron Judge and
the Yankee.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
Or the Padres Battle of Brewer.
Speaker 6 (39:14):
Check local listings for the game in your area Saturday
at seven thirty Eastern.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Boy, I made the mistake, Alex what checking my mentions
during the commercial break?
Speaker 3 (39:26):
Jame back, We talk about this.
Speaker 6 (39:27):
You are not allowed to check your matchins during the show.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
I went to go get some candy, Mike and ikes, yeah,
I'm back on those, and I checked my mentions. If
people are angry about my NBA Finals take, I was like, oh.
Speaker 6 (39:39):
Well, that's the thing. It kind of goes both ways.
It's like, are you a fifty to fifty fan or
you're a hardcore fan. Hard court fans are going to
love this Finals. Fifty to fifty fans are like, again,
there's no name recognition for like these superstars and super teams.
Speaker 3 (39:52):
That we've had in the past. So it's you can
kind of go both ways, so.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Maybe you'll like this one better. So Travis Hunter is
the new Jacksonville superstar.
Speaker 3 (40:02):
They traded up for.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
Him and his coach talked about a little issue they're
having with the defense wanting Travis Hunter to practice, but
the offense needing Travis Hunter.
Speaker 10 (40:12):
Here's Liam Cohen, just the movement skills and some of
the man coverages, the feel and zone. You can definitely
see how natural it is for him. Still learning, still growing,
still trying to learn the calls as much as possible.
But when you see him just in the actual seven
on in team setting, he doesn't look out of place
(40:34):
by any means.
Speaker 4 (40:35):
Huh.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
So the defense needs Hunter obviously, the defense the secondary
was an abomination last year. But Trevor Lawrence, your superstar quarterback,
definitely needs Travis Hunter. You gave up a lot of
draft equity to get him. Folks, this has disaster written
all over it. So rookie coach Liam Hunters, Liam Cohen's
never been a head coach. You've got a rookie front office,
(40:57):
You've got a quarterback who's coming off another down year.
You do have a star wide receiver Brian Thomas, who
carried me in fantasy last year to a championship.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Thank you, Brian Thomas. But you need somebody opposite him,
and that should be Hunter.
Speaker 4 (41:11):
Hunter.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
By the way, also got married over the weekend. I'm
sure you guys saw that stuff on social media. I'm
not going to chime in on that.
Speaker 3 (41:18):
I know a lot of.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Guys have chimed in, but I'll stand down. I'll just
say we don't want Trevor Lawrence to succeed in Jacksonville.
It's just not happening, and I don't know if this
is the year for it. They're clearly not as good
as Houston.
Speaker 3 (41:32):
The Colts if.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
They can figure out quarterback with Anthony Richardson, probably third,
but then you got cam Ward lurking with the Titans.
I mean, is it possible that Jacksonville ends up fourth
in the division again?
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Final hour coming up? Ok see Indiana? Where are the
super teams?
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio, our number two here
on the Herd. Jason McIntyre somehow still in for Colin Coward.
I've been replaced yet.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
I don't know, Alex. Maybe that's coming. People are very
angry at me online.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
I love this.
Speaker 5 (00:38):
You're like off the rails takes this week.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
That crazy. I mean, you're going all in on.
Speaker 6 (00:46):
A rookie quarterback JJ and the Vikings before seeing him
actually play a single NFL snap.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
So let's let's not talk about that one anyway. We
got Jovon Buja, who covers the Lakers coming up in
five minutes. I had to ask him, are you pro
super teams or not? I'll tell you what he said
when he drops by the set, but let's say he
probably liked my take earlier.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Give me super teams or give me death? All right?
Speaker 2 (01:12):
NBA Finals are starting Thursday. Gosh, the wait is forever.
And I keep seeing this nonsense out there from these
yahoos who were like, hey, SGA wins the title, He's
the best player in Thunder history. And I'm like, we
talked about this as a staff last week and I said,
no way, just because he won the MVP in a championship,
(01:35):
even if he wins finals MVP, I don't care you
think that automatically makes him the greatest player in franchise history.
I'm sorry, Kevin Durant, undeniably, this isn't even This is
like a laughable discussion. I pushed this in the morning
meeting on Monday and they were like, yeah, that's obvious.
And then I'm seeing all these these clowns online saying, oh, yes, Ga, wow,
(01:56):
he got a title.
Speaker 3 (01:57):
Katie didn't get a title. Folks, we got.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
The side by side comparison. Okay, we forget what Kevin Durant.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Did it Oka see Okay, look.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
At these numbers. This is staggering. It's not even close.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
He is by far.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I mean, SGA would probably need three championships in my
mind to be the best player in franchise history. And
I did have to stay there a lot longer. He
has four playoff series wins. Can we pump the brakes?
And this is an issue I have with the NBA.
We just love to crown people instantly, like SGA's crushing
it in the mid range.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Awesome, wonderful, congrats, But we can't stop there.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
We need to say he's the greatest player in Thunder
franchise history, and he's brought the mid range back to
save the NBA. He's basically like Kobe and MJ in
the mid range, Like, do you see we're making quantum
leaps off a playoff run that's.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Been Yeah, he's been great. I got it.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
In the first round, they took down Memphis. I mean
they have a one jack squat. John Moran got hurt
when they were up thirty and otherwise you know SJA
loses that game. Okay, and then who they be in
the second round the Nuggets. Okay, that was a tough series.
Now many people had the Nuggets winning that series or
going to the finals. Again they have no bench. And
then in the third round they take down the Timberwolves.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
What do they want?
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Anthony Edwards their stars twenty three. Let's not act like
this is some kind of historic run. I know the
numbers say they're great, net rating blah blah blah, and
I'm not diminishing. I'm just putting things in context. Oka
see has been great. They've won I believe, eighty eighty
two games, so a lot of basketball games this season.
But can we just slow down crowning Sga is the
(03:40):
greatest player in franchise history. That's false. Can we stop
with this? They're one of the greatest teams in NBA
history according to some stats. That's not even close to true.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Guys.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
Let's be last year's Celtics team would wipe the floor
with these guys. Okay, I don't think it's particularly close.
I mean, hell, that Nuggets team that won the title
when they actually had a bench and didn't have to
rely on Peyton Watson and Jalen Pickett. That Nuggets seems
probably better than these guys. This is a great team. Defensively,
they're great, they're bill awesome, But can we just slow down?
(04:14):
Even if they sweep the Pacers, which could be in play,
let's just let's provide some context.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
In reality.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
They're a really, really good basketball team, and they've had
an outstanding season, and Sga is awesome.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Can we leave it at that?
Speaker 4 (04:26):
Is that?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (04:27):
All right, let's welcome in Jovon Buha covers the NBA
and the Lakers for the Athletic All right, I just
wanted a rant.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
You're laughing here. You saw this Oklahoma City team.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
You were in Oka, see when the Lakers smacked them
by seventy five or whatever, and then the next night
they're winning in the fourth and Luca gets that dumb
ejection or the Lakers beat.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Them back to back.
Speaker 7 (04:50):
Come on, would have given them a better series than
the Timberwolves, thank you. But yeah, I mean they're they're
putting up historic numbers, so I want to give them
their respect for the season that they're having. But I
agree with you that if they win the championship, which
I think they will, if you look at some of
the recent title winners, I would pick the twenty twenty
(05:12):
four Celtics ahead of them.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
I think the twenty twenty.
Speaker 7 (05:14):
Lakers would give them the real Lakers that would give
them a real series.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Forgot about them. Yeah, that team had KCP Kuzma.
Speaker 7 (05:22):
I mean, Lebron and ad were arguably two of the
top three or four players in the league.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Were they the number one seed.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
There were the number one seed. They were on a
sixty one pace.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Huh, we forgot about the bubble Lakers.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Yeah, what do you.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Think of the goofballs who were like, ah, that title
doesn't really count.
Speaker 7 (05:39):
I mean, look, so I was covering the Clippers at
the time, so I was on the opposite end of
watching a team who did not want to be there
and who crumbled under the pressure of the bubble and
being away from their families and obviously some real world
stuff going on at the time. But like I mean,
I think that was one of the tougher championships in NBA.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
History, undeniably. All Right, Bron has his podcast.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
He's now partnering with Steve Nash and Luca Doncter was
on it.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
I'm assuming you listened and all that fun stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Any takeaways, any tea leaves to read from their podcast together.
Speaker 7 (06:12):
So one thing I think is worth noting with this
is this was filmed actually in Oklahoma City during that
road trip, So this is from early April, so that
they were sitting on this that they filmed several episodes
of Mind the Game in Oklahoma City because the producer,
Jason lives out there. So this is like a couple
months old, so I want to make note of that.
(06:34):
That's why they're talking about the Oklahoma City road trip
when they're talking. So that's why I don't think we're
going to see anything about like Luca and his extension
or Lebron and his free agency and like part two.
But I thought the interesting thing was just seeing how
those two interacted, because we haven't really seen them interact much,
just based on how postgame goes. Lebron likes to talk
(06:54):
at his locker, he goes a little bit earlier, Luca
goes for treatment, and then he goes to the podium,
so sometimes like they're kind of passing by each other
despite having their lockers next to each other. So we
haven't really seen them interact for extended periods outside of
like cracking jokes in the locker or maybe there's a
conversation one of them will pop into. So I think
just seeing those two interact for about thirty minutes or
(07:14):
so what was interesting.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
But no real takeaways.
Speaker 7 (07:17):
Obviously, it was a lot of like how they developed,
and a little bit about their tenure with the Lakers
and kind of where things are out at that time.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
I'm curious.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So Lebron partnered with Wade, who he was tight with,
and then Kyrie, who there was like a mutual respect,
and then ad he really wanted this is the first
one he didn't. I don't think he asked for Luca.
But Luca really respects him. How are we supposed to
infer that?
Speaker 7 (07:42):
I think Lebron really respects Luca though he said multiple
times that he's his favorite player in the league, because
really Luca is Lebron minus the athleticism, and you know,
he's got some hard in it. It's like, you know,
I think he's a hybrid of Lebron and Harden, you know,
without the maybe with like the Paul Pierce athleticism, right
or something like that, or maybe a little bit more
(08:03):
than I don't know, but he's so I think there's
a mutual admiration. Because of the size and because of
the way that he sees the game.
Speaker 4 (08:12):
They are very similar in that regard. So I think
Lebron respects him and is someone that he's trying to
take under his wing.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
So it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I was I'm sure you saw the video of Luca
at like a real Madrid game. He stood up in
the front row and of course, you know the body
language experts are like he's skinny.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Oh my gosh, he's losing weight. I don't did you
take away anything. I couldn't really tell.
Speaker 7 (08:35):
He looked a little slimmer, but I wouldn't take away
too much from it. I mean, I think that is
going to be his point of emphasis for this offseason
is getting in better shape. As JJ Redick said at
his exit interview Championship shape, and I think that was
a comment pointed toward Luca and then a couple other players.
Is last time I was on here, we kind of
talked about that.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
So I think that is going to be a point
of emphasis for him.
Speaker 7 (08:58):
But he is playing with Slovenia EuroBasket, which I think
is going to be good for him to keep him
in game shape throughout the summer. So I think we
might see a slimmer Luca going into training kick.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
But he did play last summer and then he got injured,
Like is there any concern like with that?
Speaker 7 (09:13):
I mean with calf injuries, there is always some concern
with just reinjury, and those can nag a little bit.
But if I just go back and look at that
was the most serious injury he's dealt with at the
NBA level. It was the longest injury ab since he
had of his career. Then he gets traded and he's
clearly shell shocked. There's an emotional element to it, and
within the aftermath of all that, I don't think he
(09:34):
was ever quite himself physically.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
Despite that, he was still putting up twenty eight, eight
and seven.
Speaker 7 (09:39):
Still, I mean, all the Lakers big statement wins, Luca
was the primary guy hitting big shots, making big plays
in the fourth So I think he put his imprint
on that team and their second half turnaround. But he
still has way more to improve in terms of getting
back to who he was before.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I'm forgetting where the report came from. But yesterday Alex
and I talked about Bronnie James. He's going to be
in the rotation next year, and don't I don't know
if this is an overreaction to seeing like Indiana and
Okay see having like big benches where they're playing. You
know TJ McConnell much better, obviously, but can Bronnie be
a poor man's TJ McConnell for ten minutes a game
(10:16):
next year?
Speaker 7 (10:17):
I think he can crack maybe like the fringes of
the rotation. He showed a lot of growth. Like I
think if you go back and watch where he was
in the G League in November compared to where he
was in the G League in March, two totally different players.
And it's not just like a confidence thing, Like he
tangibly improved his skill and is off the dribble, pick
and role play, passing, decision making, all that stuff really improved.
(10:38):
So I think he's shown some on the dribble or
off the dribble, on the ball chops that he didn't
really show in Summer League or at USC.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
That I think is encouraging.
Speaker 7 (10:47):
But I come back to the defensive end, where for me,
if he's going to get minutes, he has to be
that ninety four feet pest pressuring the ball. You know,
the pitbull who you put on an opposing ball handler,
and he's wanting to be uptive and making that player uncomfortable.
So I would like to see a little bit more
of that from him. But I think going in the
next season, could he be the eleventh or twelfth guy
(11:08):
in the rotation, maybe depending on how things shake out.
They make a trade where they trade three guys for one,
and all of a sudden you.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
Have some depth issues.
Speaker 7 (11:16):
Perhaps he cracks the back end of the rotation, but
I don't think he's going to be top eight, top nine.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
I think that's probably premature.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Okay, so you mentioned the word trade, so obviously the
buzz out there is this is going to be the.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Busiest offseason since twenty nineteen.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I don't are the Lakers going to be involved in
a lot of it because it seems like they're in
a position where they can't do a ton.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Was that fair?
Speaker 7 (11:39):
They are limited with their resources both in free agency
they probably will only have the five point seven million
taxpayer exception and Les Lebron takes a fifteen to twenty
million dollar bacup, which it's not happening, So like probably
a five point seven million unless they can salary dump
someone into a team with cap space.
Speaker 4 (11:59):
Or with some cat flexibility.
Speaker 7 (12:01):
However, well maybe like a Maxi Kleibo or a Gay Vincent,
because those guys are are lower expiring figures.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Okay.
Speaker 7 (12:08):
The problem is to do that, you typically have to
attach an asset or two right, and they only have
one pick to trade, so when looking at their options,
I think they have to make a trade to make
any notable improvement, and that's likely going to come with
some combination of Ruy Hachimura twenty thirty one or twenty
thirty two for shund pick Dalton connect and some combination
(12:30):
of the maybe a Gay.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
Vincent a Maxi Kleb. But like it's hard to.
Speaker 7 (12:35):
You know, only trade out expiring contracts that know, like
people don't want like ruis a guy who can start.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Or be a key bench piece for you depending on
your roster.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Player, You're you're in good shape, right.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Yeah, I would probably fifth.
Speaker 7 (12:47):
I would want fifth or sick because he was the
Lakers fourth best player and they lost on the first show.
Oh yeah, I'm trying to think like the Knicks who
was Yeah, I think he needs a certain infrastructure where
like if you put him on Minnesota or okay, like
take Chat out or take Julius Randall out and you
have a bunch of good defenders around him and he's
just more of like a spot up, catch and shoot
(13:07):
guy around that I think he fits. But if like
he was the Lakers primary wing stoppers sometimes and it's
like that that's not gonna cut it.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
But Dorian Finney Smith is going to be back.
Speaker 7 (13:16):
With the Lakers, I think, so, yeah, he's got a
great relationship with Luca too, which you can't.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
He's it back to Dallas, right yeah, yeah, all right,
So let's re talk about Austin Reeves again.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
For some reason, people don't like the guy. He's polarizing
series against Anthony Edwards.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
What do you want to you know?
Speaker 7 (13:32):
I would even contend his series was not as bad
as people are making it out to be, like his
his isolation defense against Ant, the numbers were actually good
if you look at that. There was certain not not
to get too nerdy on you, but there were some
you know, isolation possessions where they're tracking points for possession
for certain offenders. In the first round, he was I
think top five against like him individually against Ant, and
(13:55):
he had the best defensive rating of any of the
five starters by a wide margin. So you can't point
to like they were much worse defensively with him on
the floor. And then even his numbers, like I went
through for a recent podcast, I did and looked at
all sixteen playoff teams their number three score. He was
right there with Aaron Gordon, chet Holmgren, Evan Mobley, and
(14:17):
that like sixteen to seventeen point per game range. So
it's like his percentages were bad and there were some
bad possessions where he switched on to Julius Randall and
Wan's or Jaden McDaniel's scored on him.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
Whatever. Yeah, but he wasn't. It wasn't D'Angel Russell from
the Denver.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
There was no zero.
Speaker 7 (14:32):
Points on zero for seven shooting performance, right, So any
I think defensively he held up on guards. He's fine,
it's it's one he has to guard bigger guys. That's
where it's a mismatch.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
So it's weird.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
I keep hearing and again, I'm not blasting the finals.
I'm just not that excited about him that. Oh, okay,
See's set up for the next five years. Oh they're
gonna be unstoppable. We heard this about Denver with Yokichen Murray.
They're in their prime and they have been able to
get back to the finals Boston last year. Oh, Boston
set up, they're perfect. Tatum now done, They're going to
be apparently Holidays on.
Speaker 3 (15:02):
The way out.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Is this doing that over again or is there Wait
a minute, they're younger, they have more cap space, they
got a bunch of draft picks.
Speaker 4 (15:11):
That's the big one for Mixicill. It's the draft picks.
Speaker 7 (15:13):
So I mean, they're the second youngest team to make
the Finals in NBA history by average age, so that
I think is a factor in their favor. A lot
of these guys are extension eligible. They're still in their
rookie deals. So a lot of times, like basically whoever
you get drafted by, like they can control your contract
with the way restricted freegency works for like seven to
(15:33):
eight years.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
So a lot of these guys, if.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
The Thunder are willing to go into the luxury tax,
are going to be OKAC Thunder for the foreseeable future.
And then I look at the draft picks of they got,
I think something like twenty something first round picks over
the next six seven years.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
So even if they lose, it's high. It's a big no. Now,
they're not all good, they're not all good picks.
Speaker 7 (15:56):
But if they want to get into the honest sweepstakes,
let's say they lose or somehow Indiana pushes them to
like seven and it's a concerning series, they can go
get you honest, they could go get They could bring
KD back and he could add to his resume as
a thundera. Yes, so like they or let's say, like
Cason Wallace is someone I really like off their bench.
(16:17):
I think he's a guy who can start for a
lot of teams moving forward. If he grows into that
caliber player and they lose him in free agency or
they have to trade him because of his contract, well
they could go draft another version of him, a younger,
cheaper version.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
So like, they're really set up.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
We haven't seen a team be this set up because
like even going back to Denver for example, right like,
they made several trades and gave up all their first
round picks or a lot of them, and they did
a poor job drafting, They did a poor job signing
minimum guys and stuff like Okac has nailed the draft.
They've replenished their cupboard, and there will set up. So
I think this can be an exception here where like
(16:54):
we haven't really seen a team have this much draft equity,
have this much young talent in right now a wide
open league.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
So the Pacers are kind of in that.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I saw a number that said something like they haven't
paid the luxury tax since two thousand and four.
Speaker 7 (17:07):
Yeah, that's insanity and somehow they've always been like decent too.
They've never really tanked that they like, they're always like
thirty plus wins.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Let me ask, just macro zoom out. Is this finals
good for the league?
Speaker 4 (17:20):
I think so.
Speaker 7 (17:23):
I mean, I think we're in this new era of parody, seemingly.
And while I, as you teased, am pro super team
and pro big market, you know, give the I don't
mind if.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
The stars combine in a big market in a small
mar shirt. Sure, I just need stars together, but I'm
super team, you know, pro big market. But I think
this is good.
Speaker 4 (17:46):
For the league and showing you can build in different ways.
Speaker 7 (17:49):
And I think it is sort of like a palette
cleanse for the league after having there's been a concentration
of the California teams the Texas teams, and I think
we're having a little bit of a reset. But I
think these are two rabid fan bases, two of the
better fan bases in the league that have not had
titles Indiana and then Okay see now obviously more recently.
So one of these two teams is going to, you know,
(18:11):
have their their first title. And I think it's that
part's awesome. You got young talent. A lot of people
doubting both teams. Frankly, like, okay, see talking to players.
We talked about it before, like players were not afraid
of the thunder. I don't know if they are still
afraid of the thunder or not. But Indiana we had
to pull out the athletic. We talked to players anonymously.
(18:33):
They voted him the most overrated players.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Is your outlet? Oh god?
Speaker 7 (18:36):
So it's like, yeah, you know, I think both of
these teams have had to overcome some doubt.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
I just't I keep coming back to, like, you you
have a bunch of buddies I'm assuming who aren't hardcore
NBIA fans.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
Are they fired up about this exactly?
Speaker 4 (18:51):
That's the problem.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
That's kind of an issue. Like there's nobody polarizing in
this series. I mean maybe SGA.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
S Halliburton's a little I think Haliburt's at I mean,
if you're ANIX.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Wholiburton is no does she know who SGA is?
Speaker 4 (19:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (19:05):
Oh okay, but I covered him with the clippers, so
oh yeah, so it doesn't that it's a little different.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
But yeah, yeah, like Halliburton, I mean, my mom has
no clue who that guy, you know, and like I
think if you get Kyrie and Lebron, Kurry and kd
you know, even like Kobe and Gasol, like everybody knows
those guys. And I know the argument could be, well,
those these guys will be back here. Maybe Denver's hasn't
been back, Milwaukee hasn't been back.
Speaker 7 (19:28):
I think, okay, see, we'll be back Indiana. We'll see,
I mean maybe maybe Okay, Okay, see's pretty again.
Speaker 4 (19:35):
We'll set up. We'll see.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
I'm a little doubt on okay, so we'll see if
you could tell all right, so we'll get a couple
of quick ones. Big picture league.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
There's a report coming out last I guess in the
last hour.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
About Kevin Durant and Phoenix and Houston are perhaps working
on something.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
But is that because maybe Milwaukee asked for.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
Amen Thompson in any Yiannist deal, hoping that Amen Thompson
could be there Sga.
Speaker 7 (19:59):
Maybe Well, that same report said that there's some uncertainty
with how available Jannis is because I think any team
going for Kevin Durant should be trying to go for you, honest,
because it's like, why not get the younger, currently better
superstar player. Right, he's about what five six years younger
than Katie? So why not get that guy who can
be set up for the next half decade or so.
(20:21):
So I think if I'm Houston, my priority number one
has to be throwing the kitchen sink to try to
get Yannest. That's the one guy I would try to keep.
Speaker 3 (20:30):
You look like a potential major stay.
Speaker 7 (20:32):
And the interesting thing is, like if you ask the
casual fan, they would probably say like Alprin Shangoun or
Jalen Green.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
Like Jailen Green.
Speaker 7 (20:39):
I think is that's kind of my my test for
like your perception of basketball is how you feel about
Jalen Green.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
And I don't think many people know, but you know.
Speaker 7 (20:49):
So I think Alman Thompson is the guy that I
would try to keep if I'm Houston.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
Everybody else is on the table.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
And then so what does this Yannis may not be available?
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Is that formally asked.
Speaker 7 (21:01):
Out technically, but I mean it's I think he's gonna
get traded this summer.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Yeah, there's no point.
Speaker 4 (21:06):
You can't put the tooth paste back in the tube.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Yeah, And I will ask, is there a world where
he gets shipped to a small market team?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
Uh?
Speaker 4 (21:14):
And San Antoni. I mean in San Antonio.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
I think San Antonio is maybe the exception, depending on
what they're willing to put on the table.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Would you put Castle in a deal?
Speaker 7 (21:22):
I would, so, then what what do you mean to me?
Honest is a top three player in the league. So
it's like, who are your other two guys? I would say,
Shane Jokic. Well, Jokic, I came on here and broke
my MVP pick. So Jokic to me is and look,
I mean, especially if okay See disposes of Indiana in
(21:43):
a four or five game series, that's going to make
the Jokic is the best player in the league case
even stronger because the fact that he took was five
and a half guys, and he took okay See the
seven games, and like they just ran out of gas,
like game four, Game five, they could have won either
of those games. In the fourth they double digit leads.
Like I think that makes the yokich is the best
player in the league strung. But yeah, I would say, yeah,
(22:04):
Like with Castle, right, you're hoping he can become a
top three player. I don't think he's going to become
a top three player, So like, why not get the
guy who's still in his prime.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
Yeah, I just don't know if you have enough around
Wemby and Giannis is at enough.
Speaker 7 (22:16):
Fox Fox two, you keep fun. I think that's a
pretty good. But as your third best.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
Player, he playoff series wins for deer and five.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
Zero, But as your third best player, you could do worse.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Yeah, all right, so this is unfair. But just listening
to where you put Sga.
Speaker 4 (22:30):
Third, you'd put I would put him third.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
Do you think Sga is a better player than Luca
right now?
Speaker 7 (22:35):
I think, right right now, yes, wow, But I think
it's I mean, we're talking, but I think I think
Luca's ceiling is higher. So like if we go back
to like twenty twenty four Luca, I think that player
is better than this current version ship.
Speaker 4 (22:48):
I just don't think he was at that level.
Speaker 7 (22:50):
So like, I think his like there's a little bit
more variance with Luca, But just because of the conditioning
and the injury and.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
People listening and watching, it'd be like, oh, Luca play defense.
Sga is surrounded by great defense.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
He's the worst defender in the starting yek. Now, he's
not a bad defense.
Speaker 7 (23:05):
He's still in above like he's an above average to
good defender. But he's the guy that if you're going
to target someone in their starting group you have, it's
no shade at him, because again, you're not.
Speaker 4 (23:14):
Going to target lou Dort. You're not gonna target.
Speaker 7 (23:16):
Chet, right, Luca might, Luca might, Luca will target anybody.
But I would say right now, I would say Shay's better.
But I think if I was going into next season,
depending on how things play out the rest of the series,
and maybe if we get some Luca update pictures going
in the next year, if I was doing like a
twenty twenty five twenty six ranking, I might put Luca ahead.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
All right, So I'll end with a hot take. I
kind of pitched it to the staff. I don't know
if we're going to do it this week. I think
SGA is basically James.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
Harden two point zero. I don't I don't want to
hear any of this Kobe nonsense and all this sud Like.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
He's James Harden, really good player who has kind of
an unstoppable run here getting into the basket, drawing fouls.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
No, he's not the three point shooter, but he's traded
that for the mid range.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I mean some of the stats about him in the
half court, drives to the basket, dribbles, whatever they are,
they're similar to what Harden was doing.
Speaker 3 (24:05):
Is that in Is that a ding on SGA?
Speaker 4 (24:07):
I think it is just because.
Speaker 7 (24:12):
Because of the playoff track record at this point we've
seen with Harden when you look at some of his
notable playoff performances, especially in games five to seven, game
six performances, game seven performances, like he shrinks from the moment.
And so I think with Shay already, I mean, Harden's
been to the finals, but he was in the finals
(24:33):
as a sixth man. He hasn't been to the finals
as the guy. He hasn't gotten over that hump yet.
So I mean, I know it's a bit reductive and
I don't know, but like we have the track record, right,
like people have written and gone through.
Speaker 2 (24:44):
I guess the counter with oh case, he's been favored
in every series. Yeah, Harden usually when he was the
guy in Houston, was the dog and he did push.
Speaker 7 (24:51):
These except for the one year they won, his MVP year.
That was the year what twenty nineteen sixty five wins,
I mean them versus the Warriors was like Chris Paul
goes down and they're up three, They're up three to
two in that series. Then Chris Paul goes down and
then so but still it's like, I mean, at some point.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
You think he would have broken through.
Speaker 7 (25:14):
And I don't know, I mean in Brooklyn and in Philly,
Like it's just his his track record is is at
this point like he is who he is.
Speaker 4 (25:23):
So I think negative to call.
Speaker 7 (25:26):
I think Shay has a ways to go to catch
him as a regular season player like that, Harden's legacy
is largely carried by his regular season performances, the consistency,
the longevity, like he he's put up some monster seasons,
the playoff track record. I think if Shae wins the
title already best player. Negative Yeah, I mean, I think
you could argue some of those Houston teams were just
(25:47):
as like similar talent profile to these Thunder teams, right
like Thunder or Deeper.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
But like Trevor, it's like their third best player, Eric Gordon.
Speaker 7 (25:57):
I mean, I mean that's fair ella who play Capella?
Speaker 3 (26:03):
Is he gonna be a Laker?
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Maybe?
Speaker 7 (26:05):
I think that the five point seven might be a
little low for him, But depending on how the market place.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Can they get Nikaile Alex Deander Walker for five point
seven No shot.
Speaker 7 (26:12):
He's getting at least a full taxpayer remlea. It's like
fourteen millions over.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Fine, go out on one name. Give me one fun
name for.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
The Laker guy I really Liken've been out there or
a lot.
Speaker 7 (26:22):
Well, the guy I really like is Nick Claxton. I
think that's the guy that checks all the boxes. I
know he's slight right, and that's like the one knock
on him I guess would be. But like they had
the league's best defense with Jackson Hayes as their starting center.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
For a quarter of the season. You get me that guy.
Speaker 7 (26:37):
He can switch, a good rim protector, really good finisher,
lob threat.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
Like, that's a guy. He's twenty six. I want twenty
five to twenty.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Six, so we have the best defense with Jackson Ayes
for a.
Speaker 7 (26:47):
Twenty four that twenty four game stretch, they want twenty
and four league's best defense, Jackson Hayes was the primary center.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
It feels like Taxson Hayes is probably playing in China
next year, right.
Speaker 7 (26:57):
I think he'll get a contract, But he cost himself
a lot in my over the final month of that
season if.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
You can't work with Lebron and Luca like anyways, all right,
Jovann Buha, senior NBA reporter at the Athletic knows everything.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
He has a podcast. Dude, he's you've worked everywhere. He's
on the ride. What are you like?
Speaker 4 (27:13):
Thirty thirty two?
Speaker 3 (27:14):
She's what a lucky guy?
Speaker 4 (27:15):
All right? Man, be sure to catch live editions on
The Herd weekdays and Noone Eastern a em Pacific.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Back here on the Herd. Great stuff, Jovan Buha. You see,
I could talk to Lakers like literally all day. It's fun.
Let's go to Alex Curry with the news.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
No, no, no, turn on the news.
Speaker 5 (27:34):
This is the Herd Line news.
Speaker 6 (27:36):
We're actually going to start in baseball because this kind
of came out at the series you were at this weekend,
the World Series rematch, Yankee shortstop Anthony Volpi and Dodger
shortstop Miguel Rojas were asked to name their all time
batting orders starting from the two thousands. Obviously, both Aaron
Judge and Shoho Tani We're both on.
Speaker 5 (27:54):
The list, but take a look.
Speaker 6 (27:56):
At the rest here. Okay, we have him on here. Okay,
So for the Dodgers. You got show here Tanim Beth's
Breddie Freeman, Mat Camp, Freddy Bellinger, Justin Turner, will Smith kkrnandas.
Speaker 5 (28:07):
Miguel Rohaus, Clayton Kershaw.
Speaker 6 (28:09):
And then for the Yankees you have Derek Jeter, Bernie Williams,
Aaron Judge, Alex Rodriguez marked as Shara Robinson Cano, Jorge Pessada,
Set Gardner that the had So.
Speaker 5 (28:22):
Who which one are you taking here?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
A lot of those Dodgers players are like on the
current team.
Speaker 6 (28:27):
Yeah, and they also they've also won they've also won
two recent World series.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
So like that's I was living in New York during
the Derek Jeter run.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
It was just it was insane in the fall. Oh yeah,
it was insane, unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
I mean, this is a this.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Is a tough one, but I'm l Yankees right with
given that, like those are historical play those are historically
Derek Peters, Hall of Fake Bertie william Hall of Fath
right again, you.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Judge is going a rod and I mean to share
up should be all of fame.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yes, that's a stacked Yankees, but a lot of these
guys are still young on the Dodgers.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Is the only guy who's not really that recent, right,
what do you mean, like, yeah, most.
Speaker 6 (29:19):
Of these Dodgers Tody Tody still yeah, still the league
on the team.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Yeah, I would lean Yankee stars. That's what about you?
What do you got? That's fine? I mean, I bleeed blue.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
So I'm going Dodgers.
Speaker 6 (29:32):
And we saw this weekend obviously Dodgers like still just
light you're ahead of the Yankees right right now. But again,
these are two teams that, like money talks. When you
have the money, you're going to get the top players.
And historically it was always the Yankees going out and paying,
like paying the paying to get their all stars. And
(29:55):
they have the World Series to show for it.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Obviously nothing since.
Speaker 6 (29:59):
The Jeter ruh they got closed last year.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
But I mean, honestly, I can watch O Tawny highlights
all day.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
Yeah, it's hard.
Speaker 6 (30:09):
It's also hard to bet against show Heytani right now,
like you're on any line.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
Upright Honestly, he's so he's like kind of goat level already.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Like yeah, they're calling him the.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Young So Friday night, I was at the game. Yankees
are rolling five.
Speaker 6 (30:23):
You saw Judge like had a home run the first
O Taani homer in the first it was back to
back dingers. Otani had two homers.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
So I think it's five to two Yankees. Oh yeah,
they starter who's there?
Speaker 3 (30:34):
Who's their picture? That I forget? He's their best play
he said it? Or no, he's the guy was.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
Unrolling and O Tani Tomahawks won out of the yard
and it's like, yeah, oh boy, and the Dodgers woke
up to feel all four runs. Yeah, and then the
Yankees both faded. Yeah, you gotta you gotta go Dodgers.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Well, and then it just exploaded. What was fine with it?
Eighteen eight, eighteen two eight Saturday. Yeah, just a beat down.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
This is good.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
I like the historical content.
Speaker 5 (30:59):
It's right. Okay, let's uh, let's head back to.
Speaker 6 (31:03):
The NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year betting market is
getting a ton of action as reports from OTA's across
the league come in.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
And they must like what Cleveland Beat reporters.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
Are saying because Shador Sanders has received the most tickets
and biggest handle of all rookies despite being a long
shot to win the award at plus two thousand.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
That's dumb money.
Speaker 6 (31:25):
That's why you know what I hope he goes out
there and proves everybody wrong.
Speaker 4 (31:33):
Is do it.
Speaker 6 (31:34):
Do it on the field instead of talking about it
on social media. And he's had a great attitude. He
has had a great attitude since getting drafted by Cleveland
despite everything and the way it went down.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
Obviously you've talked a lot about.
Speaker 6 (31:48):
His dad, Dion and and kind of being a big reason.
I think that he he got a lot of negativity
and got a lot of hate. But you also have
to remember Tom Brady is or one of Shador Sanders' mentors.
He was the one who called him after he got drafted,
and he obviously dropped in the draft, and Tom Brady
told Shador it doesn't matter where you're drafted, because all
(32:11):
that matters is day one at camp, because that's where
you're gonna fight for your spot on the field. And
if anybody can attest to that, it's Tom Brady, who
went in the sixth round, one hundred and ninety nine fick.
Speaker 5 (32:21):
He is the goat.
Speaker 6 (32:22):
He has more rings than any individual franchise. So he
has good people in his ear and he has good
people on his team besides his dad giving him some
good advice. I I don't believe he's gonna start the season.
I think Black is probably gonna start the season, but
I think Shador what about if he has I think
(32:44):
should If Shador has a good camp, I think he
can he can be a starter mid season for the Browns.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
So, first of all, if your thought is, hey, I
can't wait to bet into that market rookie of the year.
Speaker 3 (32:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (32:56):
Offense, I don't think he's gonna have enough games under.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Bettle me who's in a quarterback battle with three other dudes.
Speaker 6 (33:03):
I don't think he's gonna have enough games under his belt.
But I do think he's going to start eventually for
the Browns.
Speaker 3 (33:08):
This is why casinos exist in the desert.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Dumb money people lighting it on fire, betting Shider Sanders.
Speaker 5 (33:16):
It's a lot. I mean, I try to help these people.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
I try to talk Gambell.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I don't want to. They don't want to.
Speaker 5 (33:21):
You got to make the roster.
Speaker 6 (33:22):
There is a lot of guys competing for this. I
do think he again, I will say it again, I
do think he has a good chance to start mid season.
They don't think he's going to start the season for
the Browns.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
That they're going to go with Flacco.
Speaker 4 (33:34):
Give me a number.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
How many games will should your start this year?
Speaker 4 (33:37):
Allies?
Speaker 5 (33:38):
Can we get their schedule up?
Speaker 3 (33:39):
Do we have their schedule? I don't even think you
need it now.
Speaker 6 (33:43):
It's like, come on, I okay, so they have a
week nine by halfway through the season.
Speaker 5 (33:49):
Okay, right, you're.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Not bringing him out against the Jets or Ravens. Those
two have great defenses.
Speaker 5 (33:55):
Raiders on the road.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Yeah, niners. I don't think so.
Speaker 6 (34:00):
I mean if you're if he's in, he's then one, two, three,
four's so like seven maybe he starts six? Seven games? Wow?
Speaker 3 (34:07):
Okay Vegas nae back end of the season.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
All right, yeah, give me the under. I will smash
that under. No way does he start setting you. And
again I liked just for content. I liked him coming out.
I would have taken them second. But I'm going with
what the Browns have shown. Don't tell me, show me.
He's getting the fewest amount of reps.
Speaker 6 (34:28):
But they're going to put in Flacco to start the season.
Maybe give pickt a shot. I think should or I
think shudor find this way in there.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Dylan Gabriel, no fines. You heard Breer. You hurt Breer.
He crushed the drafts.
Speaker 6 (34:42):
Yeah, all right, Well, let's talk about the Steelers and
TJ Watt.
Speaker 4 (34:48):
They are.
Speaker 6 (34:50):
He wants to do contract and Pittsburgh doesn't want to
offer more than they already have. No Reports from Pittsburgh
say that the offer is pretty significant, but still doesn't
match what what. Of course, complicating this is the fact
that the Steelers haven't gotten and may never get Aaron
Rodgers in camp. Yeah, he's not even on the team.
So I don't even know why we keep talking about
(35:10):
Rogers with the Steelers yet.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
But but TJ is your guy.
Speaker 6 (35:17):
He's the top edge rusher on a great defensive team
with one of the greatest defensive coaches who has never
had a losing season in his eighteen year coaching career.
And TJ is first and has been first in every
defensive stats since his rookie year.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
So you're gonna have to give. Give the guy what
he wants. Give the guy what he wants. But they have.
Speaker 6 (35:36):
Bigger problems right now in this season, like they need
a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Wait, give the guy what he wants. He's like thirty
thirty one years old, isn't that risky? A lot of
tread on those tires.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
Now I'm still performing for how long? Still first?
Speaker 6 (35:50):
Still ranked first in the NFL. Yeah, it's entering the league.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
He's had a great career, but I'm given the contract
looking forward, and I.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
I would have said, I said, I would have traded
leader on this defense. Yeah, that's on a team that.
Speaker 6 (36:04):
Has been like one of the top defensive teams with
the best defensive coach and has never had a losing season.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
What that's gonna shake everything up?
Speaker 6 (36:13):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (36:13):
I mean they haven't had a playoff win with CJ. Watt,
and it's like, what are we paying? They don't have
a losing season? Good?
Speaker 2 (36:22):
I would trade I would have a losing season. I
would bought him out. I would trade Watt, not sign Rogers,
win four or five games, and then take the.
Speaker 3 (36:29):
Quarterback tank, a top ten drive a tank. I mean,
I don't know what else you're gonna do.
Speaker 6 (36:33):
Every year they're reaching too much pride, too much pride
for Tomas and that's not gonna happen.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
Absolutely not. It won't. But it shouldn't.
Speaker 6 (36:41):
No, no, because he's I do think this might be
Mike Tomin's first losing season in his career. But they're
not gonna tank I don't think it's going to be
that bad where they're going to be a top two
draft picking there.
Speaker 3 (36:54):
Hello, I mean that would be big.
Speaker 6 (36:56):
Yeah, but to get you can trade, you can trade
up for that, you don't tank. They're a franchise that
feels more like you trade for that, you don't tank
for that.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
Yeah, they're They're a blue blood. They're too proud.
Speaker 6 (37:08):
Yes, eight mic problem has never had a losing season
in eighteen years.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
Who had the song Ain't too Proud to beg? Is
that TLC? I don't know, Ain't too Proud to tank?
Should that should be their their theme? Coming up next?
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Well, that's the news, and thanks for stopping.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Coming up next?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Do the Jags have an issue with Travis Hunter? Liam
Cohen their new head coach? Spoke and not great in Jacksonville.
We all want to feel completely safe after locking up
at night and head into bed. That's the peace of mind.
Simply Safe provides. Get fifty percent off your new simply
Safe system with professional monitoring and your first month free
(37:56):
at simply safecolin dot com.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
There's no safe like simply six.
Speaker 4 (38:04):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Herd weekdays
A neon Eastern non am Pacific.
Speaker 8 (38:09):
Hey, Steve Covino and I'm Rich David and together we're
Covino and Rich on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 9 (38:14):
You could catch us weekdays from five to seven pm
Eastern two to four Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and
of course the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (38:21):
Why should you listen to Covino and Rich.
Speaker 9 (38:23):
We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what's going on
in the world.
Speaker 8 (38:27):
We have a lot of fun talking about the stories
behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture,
stories that well other shows don't seem to have the
time to discuss.
Speaker 9 (38:36):
And the fact that we've been friends for the last
twenty years and still work together. I mean that says something, right,
So check us out.
Speaker 8 (38:41):
We like to get you involved too, take your phone calls,
chop it up.
Speaker 9 (38:45):
As they say, I'd say, the most interactive show on
Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planetar.
Speaker 8 (38:50):
Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on
Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app from five to
seven pm Eastern, two to four Pacific, and if you
miss any of the live show, just search Kobe you
know Rich wherever you get your podcasts, and of course
on social Media. That's Cavino and Rich in America.
Speaker 6 (39:06):
On the Box, another chapter in America's greatest ravelry at
bolt as the Red Sox take on Aaron Judge and
the Yankee.
Speaker 5 (39:13):
Or the Padres Battle of Brewer.
Speaker 6 (39:14):
Check local listings for the game in your area Saturday
at seven thirty Eastern.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Boy, I made the mistake, Alex what checking my mentions
during the commercial break?
Speaker 3 (39:26):
Jame back, We talk about this.
Speaker 6 (39:27):
You are not allowed to check your matchins during the show.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
I went to go get some candy, Mike and ikes, yeah,
I'm back on those, and I checked my mentions. If
people are angry about my NBA Finals take, I was like, oh.
Speaker 6 (39:39):
Well, that's the thing. It kind of goes both ways.
It's like, are you a fifty to fifty fan or
you're a hardcore fan. Hard court fans are going to
love this Finals. Fifty to fifty fans are like, again,
there's no name recognition for like these superstars and super teams.
Speaker 3 (39:52):
That we've had in the past. So it's you can
kind of go both ways, so.
Speaker 2 (39:57):
Maybe you'll like this one better. So Travis Hunter is
the new Jacksonville superstar.
Speaker 3 (40:02):
They traded up for.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
Him and his coach talked about a little issue they're
having with the defense wanting Travis Hunter to practice, but
the offense needing Travis Hunter.
Speaker 10 (40:12):
Here's Liam Cohen, just the movement skills and some of
the man coverages, the feel and zone. You can definitely
see how natural it is for him. Still learning, still growing,
still trying to learn the calls as much as possible.
But when you see him just in the actual seven
on in team setting, he doesn't look out of place
(40:34):
by any means.
Speaker 4 (40:35):
Huh.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
So the defense needs Hunter obviously, the defense the secondary
was an abomination last year. But Trevor Lawrence, your superstar quarterback,
definitely needs Travis Hunter. You gave up a lot of
draft equity to get him. Folks, this has disaster written
all over it. So rookie coach Liam Hunters, Liam Cohen's
never been a head coach. You've got a rookie front office,
(40:57):
You've got a quarterback who's coming off another down year.
You do have a star wide receiver Brian Thomas, who
carried me in fantasy last year to a championship.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
Thank you, Brian Thomas. But you need somebody opposite him,
and that should be Hunter.
Speaker 4 (41:11):
Hunter.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
By the way, also got married over the weekend. I'm
sure you guys saw that stuff on social media. I'm
not going to chime in on that.
Speaker 3 (41:18):
I know a lot of.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Guys have chimed in, but I'll stand down. I'll just
say we don't want Trevor Lawrence to succeed in Jacksonville.
It's just not happening, and I don't know if this
is the year for it. They're clearly not as good
as Houston.
Speaker 3 (41:32):
The Colts if.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
They can figure out quarterback with Anthony Richardson, probably third,
but then you got cam Ward lurking with the Titans.
I mean, is it possible that Jacksonville ends up fourth
in the division again?
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Final hour coming up? Ok see Indiana? Where are the
super teams?
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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