July 29, 2025 • 28 mins
Why NFL teams should NOT play their starters during preseason games
Tyler Guyton injured at Cowboys camp
Guests: GEOFF SCHWARTZ, BEN VOLIN
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Welcome back in to the Herd. I'm Danny Parkins in
for Colin. This is another surreal one for me because
when I was doing radio in Kansas City, I had
to also kind of cover, you know, the chiefs to
get us sound for the radio show. And I was
looking around and I was like, I don't know any
of these guys. One of these guys went to Syracuse.
(00:46):
That was the only football team I had ever covered before.
And I was looking at the list and I was like,
Jeff Schwartz, I'll go up to the Jewish offensive lineman
and we'll become friends. So Jeff Schwartz, Fox Sports analyst,
former linemen, host of Fare Bets with Chris Phlika, is
with us on the Herd.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
We've come very far, Jeff, from Kansas City.
Speaker 5 (01:05):
We certainly have. Yeah, I mean I came. I think
your show once a week against the best wishes of
the people in charge. For some reason, you didn't like it.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (01:13):
I think it was a rival, a rival with things right.
You guys were the station that didn't cover the chiefs.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I think that the show, it doesn't matter, but they
really didn't like that you and I.
Speaker 5 (01:21):
Liked each other. It was very odd. But I'm glad
to be with you now.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Yes, and we're glad to have you for four years
in a row. I have picked the Pittsburgh Steelers to
have their first losing season under Mike Tomlin, and I
have just every year I'm like, they can't keep getting
away with this, and then they do, and then this offseason,
I actually think the moves on the chessboard made sense,
and I like what they did, especially the John H.
(01:45):
Smith ad for what they need with Aaron Rodgers. So
I'll probably be wrong again, But do you buy into
what the Steelers have done heading into this year?
Speaker 6 (01:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I mean, look in the short term. Yes, I've also
been with you on losing money on Pittsburgh's under every
I did twice last year, took two wages. It didn't matter. Look,
I think that in the short term, this is the
best they could have done. But my thought process like
if the short term to worry about the long term, right,
the long term is this team will look vastly different
(02:14):
next season without Rogers their quarterback, right, and they get
older on defense with all their superstars. So in this year,
this is probably the best they could have done. Could
they have drafted Sanders at twenty one? Sure, but they
got Aaron Rodgers, right, who I think we all agree
right now better than Sanders. They went and got some
weapons on defense, they got some guys on offense, Like, yeah,
they did the best they could, but is it good
(02:35):
enough in this division to really do much damage? At ar?
Know right, Division winners every year tend to be the
best quarterback in the division. The best quarterback in the
division is not Aaron Rodgers, it's Lamar Or it's Joe Burrow.
Joe Burrow has the defensive issue, so it's probably the Ravens.
So what becomes of this Pittsburgh team? Do they win
ten games again and lose in the first round of
(02:55):
the postseason. I don't know what the end goal is
for this year, just to be camp in it, just
to make the playoffs against just be over five hundred.
So again, they did what they had to do to
put together a team this season, but long term this
does nothing for them.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
I agree with that. I just think they don't have
it in them to tank and rebuild. And yeah, they'll
win ten games, losing the wild card round to the
playoffs and then be in the exact same spot they
were in before. But they will be very interesting and
as you mentioned in the AFC, you got to be
more than interesting. I've seen you on social media talking
about Josh Simmons with the Chiefs. The explosiveness has left
(03:35):
that offense the last couple of years, which is bizarre
for a team that you know, won fifteen games and
two years ago wins the Super Bowl. Simmons at left tackle,
Worthy Rice Hollywood Brown healthy and playing together. What do
you expect from the Chiefs offense this season?
Speaker 5 (03:53):
I know people have Chiefs fatigue, and you're gonna have
it for one more season, guys, because more than about
last year, right, think about last year. So he entered
the season very clearly Race she Rice was going to
be the number one option on offense, and he was.
He had nearly thirty catches in three weeks, he gets hurt.
Now you're left with Hollywood Brown already hurt to hurt
the preseason Raere she Rice hurt, and Travis Kelcey. You
(04:16):
did not want to rely on to be your offense, right.
You wanted these other wide receivers to help you out.
So it turned into basically being a Travis Kelcey led
offense and then a bunch of guys sort of around him.
Now Worthy got better throughout the season, but it's hard
to rely on a rookie in this offense. We've seen
so many examples of first year wide receivers, not even
just rookies. But Juju mentioned this specifically. We played with
(04:38):
him the first time. He said, it took me twelve
weeks to figure out where I need to be in
the offense. Look at ray she Rice's first season. When
did it click About twelve weeks and into the playoffs,
So there was really no one there to help with
the passing game until the end of the season when
Brown came back. But by then again he never really
played with Patrick Mahomes entered this season where she Rice
(04:59):
healthy to go. Now he will be suspended, I would
imagine at some point, But Brown, healthy, ready to go
worthy year two, Travis Kelsey looks like he lost twenty pounds.
He looks great right now. I think last year, we
can admit, maybe came in a little bit overweight and
a little bitut of shape. This year not the case.
He looks fantastic this season. Right and you add in Royals,
you had the offensive line. Yet they lose Joe Tooney.
(05:20):
That's going to be a loss for them. They're figuring
out left guard right now. But Simmons looks like a
steel already. He looks great right now. Left tackle. He
was going to be off of the tackle one before
he got hurt. The question I have is why did
no one else know he was going to be able
to play so soon? The thought was, you draft Simmons
and he has to sit for a little bit. He's
the day one starter at tackle. You added obviously more
(05:43):
to play somewhere, left guard maybe or a right tackle.
So Danny, this feels like an offense it's just going
to return to what it's been now. It's never going
to be the Tyrek Hill offense. It's never going to
happen again that I was a special player, a special offense.
But does feel like they're going to return to passing
the ball down the field little bit because they have
healthy wide receivers.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in neon Eastern not am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I'm with You justin. Herbert is in that division, was
in the playoffs. Bo Nicks in the division in the playoffs,
Raiders upgrade at coach and quarterbacks certainly got better.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
We'll see what happens.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
But on Herbert specifically, people say he's all hype, he's
all hypothetically, he's all eye tests. What do you make
of what he's done and where he's going?
Speaker 5 (06:33):
I think like twenty seven teams that would like to
have that eye test in their buildings. Yeah. Sure, so
he looks to go throwing the football. Wow, look, Look,
of course, you get to a certain point of your career,
and he was there very quickly where the talent and
skills were very obvious, right from his first start, which
was odd enough to gets the Chiefs right, remember the
punctured long and he played against Kansas City in Week
(06:53):
two that year and incredible, immediately good. So when you
immediately become good. We started judging you on other things,
right back wins, which isn't really a stat per se,
but we judge you on that, and then we judge
you on like big moments in games, Right, do you
make those plays on third down? Do you make those plays?
And you know in two minutes, Jo, do you make
those plays? Now in the postseason? And Herbert's at the
(07:16):
point now where he's only going to be judging his
career on postseason success. That's all it is. We know
we can play, it's all in front of him. We
know that. So now it's a matter of postseason success,
and he hasn't had that yet. I think that's why
people are down on him when you say, like, oh,
he's so talented, he looks the part. Why is there
not the playoff success? It's always the next question. So
he's that's where he's out in his career. He's evolved
(07:38):
now is one of the better quarterbacks in the league,
so it only matters what he does in the postseason.
How many quarterbacks do we look at that way? Right, Mahomes,
Alan Jackson, Burrow, Jalen Hurts, probably now Stafford, maybe we
look at the otherwise, No one else. So Herbert's up
in that class now where he can do everything he
needs to do in the field, now do it in
the postseason.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
So you've played on a bunch of different teams, You've
seen a lot of different young quarterbacks. The reports are
Caleb Williams struggling very early with.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
The install of Ben Johnson's offense.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
But then you talk to people there and they're like,
we want him to be drinking out of a fire hose.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
We want to overload him early.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
We'll see what he can handle, then we'll scale it
back as it goes. In terms of realistic expectations of
this type of offense, that type of talent and all
of the newness, what would you say is reasonable to
expect from Caleb and the offense this year?
Speaker 5 (08:33):
So what you want to see when you have a
new coaching quarterback and I mentioned the Chiefs wide receivers
with Mahomes, it does take like eight to ten weeks
for a new offense to get going. Just does right
like you need to see. So you mentioned they throw
the whole playbook at him. They're going to do that
because they want to need to see what works for
Caleb Williams. He might Ben Johnson might have a thought, Okay,
(08:54):
these are the plays that I think will work for
Caleb Williams. You get into practice and preseason games don't work,
so they have to change and run different plays that
work for him. You also have to play this thing
against that defense, and it takes time to figure all
those things out. That's why it takes sometimes a ten
to twelve. Give you another example of how that works
on like the Eagles defense last season, right, it took
(09:15):
half a season to figure out what works, what calls
do we do, where do guys go, who needs to play?
What's the rotation? It just takes time, so you have
to have some patience here. The thing I will say, though,
is that the only reports that worry me is like
with a quarterback, like what, I think he's going to
be good, and I'll move off of that opinion if
(09:36):
I need to at some point based on some more evidence.
It does worry me, Danny, that we just haven't seen
at least reports right of like wow, like there's some
like you typically know with young guys, there's some woudness
in practice, and that the only part that worries me.
We haven't seen much of like wow, this This was
really great. It's also mostly been negative, which isn't great.
(09:59):
But I I understand how they're trying to build him
up in this offense.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
I'm going to ignore her the last fifteen seconds for
that answer as a parents mad for Scar because I
saw some wow in games last year. So give me
another couple of weeks before I get a little worried
that there's not enough wow moments in practice. We have
a Hall of Fame game this week, so that means
preseason is starting. I know it was practice, and I
(10:25):
know the Cowboys got lucky that Tyler Geiton did not
tear his acl as initially feared. But I am very
risk averse when it comes to playing guys in preseason,
and I know injuries can happen in practice.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
I understand that, and I know injuries are inevitable.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
Where do you come out on playing guys who matter
in meaningless football games.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
I'm on the side of playing them a little bit.
I saw it in my career, and I also just
go off of what we see the better coaches do.
Now to be fair that this is most of the
older guys that are the better coaches right there, young
that don't play their guys. But Andy Riidman plays the
starters every year, like there's a value in that. The
Chiefs start hot every year. When I was in Kansas City,
(11:09):
we had a tough training camp. We played our starters,
and we came out in Week one and kicked and
kicked butt like we were ready to go. There's always
risk in football. Injuries happen all the time. It's interesting
that the Bengals, for example, have talked about playing starters
this year because they start slow every year. Like you
do you need some of those reps, at least I
believe you do. Do you need to play half like
(11:30):
we used to play no? But also to mentally when
when you are playing in a preseason game, you treat
that week of practice or a couple of days for
the most part, like it's a game. So you mentally
prepare like you would for week one or week two
or week three. You start going through your checklist of
how do I get ready on Saturday nights? You know,
how do I warm up? How do I feel in paths?
(11:53):
Like all the little things you do, what's my pregame?
Routevough you mostly know what it is right, but you
get to rehearse that, so when you get to week one,
it's like you haven't done it in eight nine months.
And I get it's a physical sport. Things happen, but
you would also think, like, would it be odd if
a baseball player didn't take any live batting practice before
they or live at bats before they played a baseball game? Right,
(12:14):
Like you think that was a different kind of weird. Yeah,
I mean, I'm just saying, like two drives. I think
two drives the first game, one drive the first game
to the second game, and just something. And the injury thing,
like it's very rare. We think it happens all the
time when ones are playing ones. It doesn't happen. They
know how to play to not get hurt, if that
(12:35):
makes sense. So I'm a fan of playing some of
the preseason. I get why teams don't, but it seems
to work out for some of the better coaches in
the NFL.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
All right, So you host bear Bets with Chris Filika,
I've been a guest. I don't want you to keep
mentioning that I was sixty five percent against the spread
in the NFL last year.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
Stop bringing it up. Stop, But I want to get
you out of here with a bet.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
Yeah, anything on the board, a super Bowl, pick a crop,
I don't care, give me.
Speaker 5 (13:02):
Give me oh NFL Okay.
Speaker 4 (13:04):
Give me an NFL bet for this season, yes, sir, so.
Speaker 5 (13:09):
I think my my favorite one right now is the
Giants under five and a half wins. It's a little juice.
Speaker 7 (13:14):
Now.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
The problem is this with the Giants. Actually think they're
a better team this year than last season. Like they're
they're better quarterback, their healthy offensive line neighbors is good.
Like defensively they were good last year, added added abdul Carter.
But their schedule, Danny, is so hard, Like that's that's
the problem. Look at their schedule.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
It's ridiculous.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
I'll tell my head. It's like it's like Commanders, Cowboys,
two AFC West teams at New Orleans and then it's
like Eagles, Broncos, Niners, Lions, Bears. It's just horrific schedule.
And so that that's my concer. I actually think they're
better this year, but their schedule is very difficult. So
I have Giants under five and a.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Half wins, Yeah, at Washington, at Dallas, Kansas City and
the Chargers of the first four. That feels like zero
and four out of the shoot. Listen sen to Jeff Schwartz,
watch him. You're a good man and thorough Thank you, Jeff,
Thank you, buddy, appreciate it all right, we'll talk soon.
That's Jeff Schwartz, terrific Fox. NFL analy's coming up next,
Drake May I own a lot of stock in this kid.
(14:12):
I think he's going to be an absolute star. Is
he ready to take that next leap? We head to
Boston next the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions
of The Herd weekdays and neon Eastern not a Empacific.
Back in on the Herd. Danny parkins in for Colin.
I'll be back doing this again tomorrow. We've got an
(14:32):
NFL game on Thursday. We've made it to football season,
college football, right around the corner, trade deadline and baseball.
Any sort of slow time that people think it is
coming up in the past. Let's talk to a terrific
NFL reporter right now and head to Boston, where he's
covered with the NFL since two thousand and seven. Senior
NFL writer for the Boston Globe, Ben Volan joins us
(14:55):
on the Herd.
Speaker 4 (14:55):
Ben, thank you very much for the time.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
Very few teams in the NFL have undergone more change
than the Patriots from last year to this and Drake
May did not have much talent around them last year.
But I thought it quitted himself very well. I think
he looks like a future star. I own a lot
of stock in that kid. What are you expecting in
terms of a year one to year two growth for
Drake May with all these new people around him.
Speaker 6 (15:19):
Well, you know, for any NFL player, I think it
goes without saying. You want to see that big jump
from year one to year two, and especially for the Patriots,
you want to see that from Drake May. Now that
you've got a much better and more, much more credible
team around him. You've got a real coaching staff, with
all due respect to last year's coaches now with Mike Rabel,
(15:40):
Josh McDaniels running the offense, a lot of experience on
this staff. Now. Stefan Diggs is the best receiver of
the Patriots have had in a long time, assuming he
can come back healthy and be close to what he was.
They've spent the most money in free agency, over one
hundred and eighty million fully guaranteed. They brought in like
ten new starters on both sides of the new offensive lineman,
(16:01):
new defense, new receivers, just everything new to upgrade the
situation around Drake May. So yeah, if they go four
and thirteen again, that's a terrible sign for May and
the franchise. I think they want to see a nice
jump here in year two, not only in Drake May's performance,
but in the team's one loss record.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Off season videos with Cardi b are one thing. How
does Stefan Diggs look, Well, you know.
Speaker 7 (16:24):
Stefan Diggs. I got to say, it looks fantastic.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
And yes, he got off to a bad start with
that video in Miami, not what your new coaching staff
wants to see when you're joining a new team. But
Stefan Diggs showed up to the offseason program towards the end,
and then I think most impressively passed his physical to
start training camp, putting him at full go just eight
months after having ACL surgery. So I think a real
(16:48):
testament to how hard despite the video, how hard Stefan
Diggs worked on his rehab in the offseason, how hard
he's been, you know, putting in time both away from
the Patriots and now with the team and.
Speaker 7 (16:59):
He looked that's good.
Speaker 6 (17:01):
You know, it's almost to the point where it almost
might not be fair to him because he's coming back
from an ACL. Receivers that first month is going to
be a little slow, but he looks really good. His
teammate Kendrick Bourne said he jokes with Stephan Diggs says
he's going to have an Adrian Peterson type season. You
remember Adrian Peterson rushed for two thousand yards coming off
of his torn ACL. So again, maybe the expectations not
(17:23):
quite fair for Stephan Diggs, but physically he looks.
Speaker 7 (17:26):
Great so far.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
The Patriots maybe had the worst offensive line in football
last year in terms of talent and production. They used
this top five pick on Will Campbell. I've seen some
conflicting reports on how he's looked so far. What do
you think about how he's making the transition.
Speaker 7 (17:43):
Well, yesterday it.
Speaker 6 (17:44):
Was the first day in pads and he got tossed
around a little bit by veteran Keon White, and that
is a concern with Will Campbell. Keyon White is a big, lanky,
physical defensive end and Will Campbell, you know, we heard
it all throughout the pre draft process, the short arms
the narrow shoulders. Is he going to be able to
handle the defensive ends who have the long reach here
(18:06):
in the NFL? So day one not so great, also
a little surprising. I want to cut him some slack,
but the heat here in Foxborough has been very hot
this week and the heat definitely got on top of
Will Campbell the last couple of days, where you think
maybe a guy from LSU is maybe used to it,
but it's been very hot here and Will Campbell the
heat has definitely gotten to him. But it's early, It's
only two days in pads. He did have a much
(18:28):
better day today. But you know, the real question is
going to be the arm length thing. And I think
it's a real concern. It's one thing for him to
block guys in training camp and the preseason, but what
happens when he's got to go against Miles Garrett and TJ.
Watt and some of these you know, elite pass rushers
that the Patriots are probably going to face this year.
(18:48):
So we're not going to have the answers to that
question until Will Campbell steps on the field and does it.
Speaker 7 (18:53):
You know, so far, kind of an up and down performance,
but it is still early. For will Camp.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Yeah, it's early for everybody, and you know, we may
be should have talked about the addition of head coach
Mike Rabel at the start, because it's it's a homecoming.
It's in theory, a floor raising thing, it's discipline, it's competence.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
How what is a Mike Rabel training camp like so far?
Speaker 6 (19:15):
Well, I don't know how much credit he deserves versus
just the circumstances. But one thing that stands out compared
to last year is there is no drama. Last year,
Girod Mayo trying to build a program, had to deal
with Matthew Judon upset about his contract. They got a
big fight at practice, they had to throw judea On out.
He comes back to screen more at the coach. Just
a lot of drama. They eventually traded into Atlanta and
(19:37):
moved on. But Mike Rabel has had nothing of the
sort to deal with. Everyone is under contract, everyone is happy.
Everyone generally knows their role or knows what they're competing for.
And it's been very calm and business like and professional,
and that I think also speaks to the larger point
of why Mike Rabel was brought in. Just for credibility.
You know, Jerrod Mayo, with all thee respect was learning
(19:58):
on the fly, and that coach staff they gave him
last year, no one had any experience. The play callers
on both sides. We're doing it all for the first time.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
Now.
Speaker 6 (20:06):
It's Mike Rabel's been a head coach for six years.
He's one coach of the year. Josh McDaniels has been
a coordinator for fifteen years. All the defensive coaches are Vrabels,
guys from Tennessee. These are guys who have a plan,
they know what they want to do, and it's just
a very professional sort of training camp so far, with
no drama and no real hiccups yet.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
For Mike Rabel, how is Mike Rabel similar and how
is he different from Bill Belichick?
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Great question.
Speaker 6 (20:35):
Well, I think the fact that he's younger and a
former player just gives him boatloads of credibility with the players.
Like Jabrill Pepper is the safety was joking made a
joke to Mike Rabel, and Rabel's response was, Yeah, why
don't you go check out the Patriots.
Speaker 7 (20:50):
Hall of Fame and then get back to you.
Speaker 6 (20:51):
So it's like that was a great guy's got these
Super Bowl rings and he's in the Team Hall of Fame.
It's just gives him so much more credibility, which you know,
Belichick a genius. He can never you know, manufacture that
he was never a player the way Vrabel was. And Vrabel,
I mean he is the most active head coach I've
ever seen in practice. He puts on the scout team Penny,
he's playing free safety on the scout team defense, and
(21:13):
he's getting up in drills. He's coaching guys one on one.
He's wearing the blocking pad. Like Mike Rabel's forty nine,
almost fifty years old. Don't tell him that he still
thinks he's playing in the NFL. That he's so active.
I do see similarities as well. He's a very smart coach.
This is the guy that he stole a win over
Miami a couple of years ago, smartly going for two
(21:34):
you know, late, the analytics, following the analytics, that sort
of thing.
Speaker 7 (21:37):
But then also the way he coaches.
Speaker 6 (21:39):
And this is obvious because Rabel spent twelve years playing
for Belichick, so he's gonna take a lot of Belichick's tactics.
Speaker 7 (21:46):
But the one thing you see from vrabel Is.
Speaker 6 (21:48):
He's constantly quizzing guys and peppering them with questions and
keeping them on their toes, whether it's you know, what
did we talk about in the meeting yesterday? Or what
do you do in this situation on third and six
versus last time the Patriots won a division title. He's
just he's always quizzing guys and keeping them on their toes,
And that was like a staple of Bill Belichick's coaching style,
(22:08):
and it creates accountability as well, because you don't want
to be the one guy who kind of lets down
the position group or shows that you're not prepared. So
I I, you know, there are all kinds of similarities,
but you know, things that we're able to learn from Belichick.
But he's also being a younger guy and a former
player definitely his own man as coach.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
So it's years now.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Since the Bill Belichick Robert Craft professional divorce, but they.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Just can't quit each other.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Like sometimes it's like, Oh, you're doing something kind of
interesting and taking a shot together at the Netflix roast,
and then it's like, oh, that's kind of weird. You're
taking shots at each other because Robert Kraft wants to
get into the Hall of Fame, and he's like, I
took a huge risk on Bill Belichick. And then Bill
Belichick's at North Carolina issuing statements being like, I actually
took a big risk on you because you got like,
(22:57):
what do you make of it? Like, what content is
relevant here as to why we are still dealing with
the fallout of the professional separation between Robert Kraft and
Bill Belichick.
Speaker 6 (23:08):
Well, I think it just shows how bad the relationship
is between the two and it's only gotten worse since
Kraft fired Belichick a year and a half ago. So
I think you know it all, it's all there for
us to see just how poorly the how poor the
relationship is right now and that shot of alcohol they
took it the Netflix for us that you mentioned, I mean,
if you watch Belichick, you wanted nothing to do with
(23:30):
It's that craft kind to put them on the spot.
Belichick wanted nothing to do with that. For me personally,
being in the media, I love it. It's great material,
gives us something to talk about. But I think for
the fans, you know, the word divorce, as you said,
I think that's right. It's like watching your parents divorce
and it's like, can't we just stop the fighting, because
it just the more they fight, it just seems like
it detracts from everything they accomplished here over two decades,
(23:53):
and it really just it looks like, you know, Brady
was so much of the engine of this thing, and
these two are just like fighting for scratch apps of credit,
and it's like, you know, you know, I and a
lot of other people I think were on Team Bill
last year when that Apple documentary The Dynasty came out,
it was just the Crafts just like bashing Belichick needlessly
like that was that was a bad look for the Crafts,
(24:15):
and I think Belichick got a lot of sympathy out
of that.
Speaker 7 (24:18):
But then this little dust up, as you said, no,
you know, Belichick.
Speaker 6 (24:22):
Having this lengthy response about some innocuous quote that Kraft made.
It's like, well, now Belichick doesn't look great either. And
I think that's the point. The more these guys fight,
it doesn't look good for anyone. You know, you fight
with a skunk and everyone comes out smelling pretty badly.
Speaker 4 (24:37):
So I love it.
Speaker 6 (24:39):
It's great material, but I think for the fans and
for their legacy, I think it would behoove them all
to just kind of knock it off and just kind
of go their separate ways and let it be for
a while.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
How will you define success for Bill Belichick at North Carolina?
Speaker 6 (24:55):
You know, if you can win a few more games
than just what the schedule lays out for them. You know,
this first year it's going to be tough. They have
I think seventy new players on that roster and it's
still UNC football.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
I don't know what kind of recruiting they were able
to do.
Speaker 6 (25:09):
And you know, as the last few years in New
England proved with Belichick, he's not exactly.
Speaker 7 (25:13):
A miracle worker. When they have talent.
Speaker 6 (25:15):
He was great with the Patriots, and when they didn't
have talent, especially a quarterback, they were very mediocre and
then pretty bad at the end. So you know, I
for if you're Carolina, you just want a you want
Bill to sell out the stadium, you want to be
on national TV. I think that's a win in and
of itself for UNC, the fact that they've sold out
the season tickets already, they're gonna have a behind the
(25:36):
scenes documentary, They're going to be all over TV this fall.
So that's a win for the tar Heels and then
if you know to be impressed with the coaching job
by Belichick, you don't want to just see another seven
and five UNC season. You want to see ten and two,
winning a few games on the road, beating ranked teams
and showing some of that you know, Belichick magic that
he used to have with the Patriots.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Benvolan covers the NFL for the Boston Globe. Great stuff, man,
Thank you very much for the time.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
We appreciate you.
Speaker 7 (26:04):
Awesome, Thanks, Dadie, thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
And Patriots are a fascinating team. But really, Drake May,
I mean that quarterback class from last year, it's remarkable.
Jaden Daniels has the best rookie season any of us
have ever seen. When you combine the statistical performance, what
they asked of him to do, and then you know
the wins. Caleb Williams was the number one pick. The
(26:27):
Bears didn't even consider drafting anyone else. Drake May had
the least help. I mean, he had no coach, no
offensive line, and no pass catchers. And as the year
went on, it was just like, oh my god, Drake
May's making plays. The stats weren't insane, but just again,
if you watch the games, it was very clear he
belonged Justin Herbert by the way, little I test little
(26:50):
similarities between Drake May and my guy Justin Herbert. Then
Pennix only three games looked good. Bo Nick's twenty nine
touchdowns second most ever for a rookie in the playoffs.
His first games he was terrible. And then JJ McCarthy
is just sitting over there with a national championship with
an elite offensive head coach in Kevin O'Connell, and he
gets to come in to a team that won fourteen
(27:12):
games last year with one of the five best wide
receiver duos in the NFL. There's a real chance that
we're going to look back at last year's quarterback class
and in two years' like, is this the best quarterback
class ever?
Speaker 4 (27:24):
Is it going to be in that conversation like how
good can it be?
Speaker 6 (27:27):
So?
Speaker 3 (27:27):
And I think Drake May is at the focal point
there because they've made a ton of upgrades around him,
So all of those guys, and they've got joint practices,
by the way, the Patriots with the Vikings and the Commanders.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
So we're gonna get Drake May v.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Jaden, Drake May VJJ McCarthy coming up this training camp,
fun day here.
Speaker 4 (27:46):
On the Herd.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Thanks again to everybody for welcoming me and making it
so easy. Can't wait to get going on the new
expanded First Things First, which is coming up in just
a little bit. Before that, I'm back in for Colin tomorrow,
so you're not done with me yet. Danny Parkerson for
Colin on the Herd.
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
Welcome back in to the Herd. I'm Danny Parkins in
for Colin. This is another surreal one for me because
when I was doing radio in Kansas City, I had
to also kind of cover, you know, the chiefs to
get us sound for the radio show. And I was
looking around and I was like, I don't know any
of these guys. One of these guys went to Syracuse.
(00:46):
That was the only football team I had ever covered before.
And I was looking at the list and I was like,
Jeff Schwartz, I'll go up to the Jewish offensive lineman
and we'll become friends. So Jeff Schwartz, Fox Sports analyst,
former linemen, host of Fare Bets with Chris Phlika, is
with us on the Herd.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
We've come very far, Jeff, from Kansas City.
Speaker 5 (01:05):
We certainly have. Yeah, I mean I came. I think
your show once a week against the best wishes of
the people in charge. For some reason, you didn't like it.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
I don't.
Speaker 5 (01:13):
I think it was a rival, a rival with things right.
You guys were the station that didn't cover the chiefs.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I think that the show, it doesn't matter, but they
really didn't like that you and I.
Speaker 5 (01:21):
Liked each other. It was very odd. But I'm glad
to be with you now.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Yes, and we're glad to have you for four years
in a row. I have picked the Pittsburgh Steelers to
have their first losing season under Mike Tomlin, and I
have just every year I'm like, they can't keep getting
away with this, and then they do, and then this offseason,
I actually think the moves on the chessboard made sense,
and I like what they did, especially the John H.
(01:45):
Smith ad for what they need with Aaron Rodgers. So
I'll probably be wrong again, But do you buy into
what the Steelers have done heading into this year?
Speaker 6 (01:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I mean, look in the short term. Yes, I've also
been with you on losing money on Pittsburgh's under every
I did twice last year, took two wages. It didn't matter. Look,
I think that in the short term, this is the
best they could have done. But my thought process like
if the short term to worry about the long term, right,
the long term is this team will look vastly different
(02:14):
next season without Rogers their quarterback, right, and they get
older on defense with all their superstars. So in this year,
this is probably the best they could have done. Could
they have drafted Sanders at twenty one? Sure, but they
got Aaron Rodgers, right, who I think we all agree
right now better than Sanders. They went and got some
weapons on defense, they got some guys on offense, Like, yeah,
they did the best they could, but is it good
(02:35):
enough in this division to really do much damage? At ar?
Know right, Division winners every year tend to be the
best quarterback in the division. The best quarterback in the
division is not Aaron Rodgers, it's Lamar Or it's Joe Burrow.
Joe Burrow has the defensive issue, so it's probably the Ravens.
So what becomes of this Pittsburgh team? Do they win
ten games again and lose in the first round of
(02:55):
the postseason. I don't know what the end goal is
for this year, just to be camp in it, just
to make the playoffs against just be over five hundred.
So again, they did what they had to do to
put together a team this season, but long term this
does nothing for them.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
I agree with that. I just think they don't have
it in them to tank and rebuild. And yeah, they'll
win ten games, losing the wild card round to the
playoffs and then be in the exact same spot they
were in before. But they will be very interesting and
as you mentioned in the AFC, you got to be
more than interesting. I've seen you on social media talking
about Josh Simmons with the Chiefs. The explosiveness has left
(03:35):
that offense the last couple of years, which is bizarre
for a team that you know, won fifteen games and
two years ago wins the Super Bowl. Simmons at left tackle,
Worthy Rice Hollywood Brown healthy and playing together. What do
you expect from the Chiefs offense this season?
Speaker 5 (03:53):
I know people have Chiefs fatigue, and you're gonna have
it for one more season, guys, because more than about
last year, right, think about last year. So he entered
the season very clearly Race she Rice was going to
be the number one option on offense, and he was.
He had nearly thirty catches in three weeks, he gets hurt.
Now you're left with Hollywood Brown already hurt to hurt
the preseason Raere she Rice hurt, and Travis Kelcey. You
(04:16):
did not want to rely on to be your offense, right.
You wanted these other wide receivers to help you out.
So it turned into basically being a Travis Kelcey led
offense and then a bunch of guys sort of around him.
Now Worthy got better throughout the season, but it's hard
to rely on a rookie in this offense. We've seen
so many examples of first year wide receivers, not even
just rookies. But Juju mentioned this specifically. We played with
(04:38):
him the first time. He said, it took me twelve
weeks to figure out where I need to be in
the offense. Look at ray she Rice's first season. When
did it click About twelve weeks and into the playoffs,
So there was really no one there to help with
the passing game until the end of the season when
Brown came back. But by then again he never really
played with Patrick Mahomes entered this season where she Rice
(04:59):
healthy to go. Now he will be suspended, I would
imagine at some point, But Brown, healthy, ready to go
worthy year two, Travis Kelsey looks like he lost twenty pounds.
He looks great right now. I think last year, we
can admit, maybe came in a little bit overweight and
a little bitut of shape. This year not the case.
He looks fantastic this season. Right and you add in Royals,
you had the offensive line. Yet they lose Joe Tooney.
(05:20):
That's going to be a loss for them. They're figuring
out left guard right now. But Simmons looks like a
steel already. He looks great right now. Left tackle. He
was going to be off of the tackle one before
he got hurt. The question I have is why did
no one else know he was going to be able
to play so soon? The thought was, you draft Simmons
and he has to sit for a little bit. He's
the day one starter at tackle. You added obviously more
(05:43):
to play somewhere, left guard maybe or a right tackle.
So Danny, this feels like an offense it's just going
to return to what it's been now. It's never going
to be the Tyrek Hill offense. It's never going to
happen again that I was a special player, a special offense.
But does feel like they're going to return to passing
the ball down the field little bit because they have
healthy wide receivers.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
in neon Eastern not am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio
FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
I'm with You justin. Herbert is in that division, was
in the playoffs. Bo Nicks in the division in the playoffs,
Raiders upgrade at coach and quarterbacks certainly got better.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
We'll see what happens.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
But on Herbert specifically, people say he's all hype, he's
all hypothetically, he's all eye tests. What do you make
of what he's done and where he's going?
Speaker 5 (06:33):
I think like twenty seven teams that would like to
have that eye test in their buildings. Yeah. Sure, so
he looks to go throwing the football. Wow, look, Look,
of course, you get to a certain point of your career,
and he was there very quickly where the talent and
skills were very obvious, right from his first start, which
was odd enough to gets the Chiefs right, remember the
punctured long and he played against Kansas City in Week
(06:53):
two that year and incredible, immediately good. So when you
immediately become good. We started judging you on other things,
right back wins, which isn't really a stat per se,
but we judge you on that, and then we judge
you on like big moments in games, Right, do you
make those plays on third down? Do you make those plays?
And you know in two minutes, Jo, do you make
those plays? Now in the postseason? And Herbert's at the
(07:16):
point now where he's only going to be judging his
career on postseason success. That's all it is. We know
we can play, it's all in front of him. We
know that. So now it's a matter of postseason success,
and he hasn't had that yet. I think that's why
people are down on him when you say, like, oh,
he's so talented, he looks the part. Why is there
not the playoff success? It's always the next question. So
he's that's where he's out in his career. He's evolved
(07:38):
now is one of the better quarterbacks in the league,
so it only matters what he does in the postseason.
How many quarterbacks do we look at that way? Right, Mahomes,
Alan Jackson, Burrow, Jalen Hurts, probably now Stafford, maybe we
look at the otherwise, No one else. So Herbert's up
in that class now where he can do everything he
needs to do in the field, now do it in
the postseason.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
So you've played on a bunch of different teams, You've
seen a lot of different young quarterbacks. The reports are
Caleb Williams struggling very early with.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
The install of Ben Johnson's offense.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
But then you talk to people there and they're like,
we want him to be drinking out of a fire hose.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
We want to overload him early.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
We'll see what he can handle, then we'll scale it
back as it goes. In terms of realistic expectations of
this type of offense, that type of talent and all
of the newness, what would you say is reasonable to
expect from Caleb and the offense this year?
Speaker 5 (08:33):
So what you want to see when you have a
new coaching quarterback and I mentioned the Chiefs wide receivers
with Mahomes, it does take like eight to ten weeks
for a new offense to get going. Just does right
like you need to see. So you mentioned they throw
the whole playbook at him. They're going to do that
because they want to need to see what works for
Caleb Williams. He might Ben Johnson might have a thought, Okay,
(08:54):
these are the plays that I think will work for
Caleb Williams. You get into practice and preseason games don't work,
so they have to change and run different plays that
work for him. You also have to play this thing
against that defense, and it takes time to figure all
those things out. That's why it takes sometimes a ten
to twelve. Give you another example of how that works
on like the Eagles defense last season, right, it took
(09:15):
half a season to figure out what works, what calls
do we do, where do guys go, who needs to play?
What's the rotation? It just takes time, so you have
to have some patience here. The thing I will say, though,
is that the only reports that worry me is like
with a quarterback, like what, I think he's going to
be good, and I'll move off of that opinion if
(09:36):
I need to at some point based on some more evidence.
It does worry me, Danny, that we just haven't seen
at least reports right of like wow, like there's some
like you typically know with young guys, there's some woudness
in practice, and that the only part that worries me.
We haven't seen much of like wow, this This was
really great. It's also mostly been negative, which isn't great.
(09:59):
But I I understand how they're trying to build him
up in this offense.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
I'm going to ignore her the last fifteen seconds for
that answer as a parents mad for Scar because I
saw some wow in games last year. So give me
another couple of weeks before I get a little worried
that there's not enough wow moments in practice. We have
a Hall of Fame game this week, so that means
preseason is starting. I know it was practice, and I
(10:25):
know the Cowboys got lucky that Tyler Geiton did not
tear his acl as initially feared. But I am very
risk averse when it comes to playing guys in preseason,
and I know injuries can happen in practice.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
I understand that, and I know injuries are inevitable.
Speaker 3 (10:41):
Where do you come out on playing guys who matter
in meaningless football games.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
I'm on the side of playing them a little bit.
I saw it in my career, and I also just
go off of what we see the better coaches do.
Now to be fair that this is most of the
older guys that are the better coaches right there, young
that don't play their guys. But Andy Riidman plays the
starters every year, like there's a value in that. The
Chiefs start hot every year. When I was in Kansas City,
(11:09):
we had a tough training camp. We played our starters,
and we came out in Week one and kicked and
kicked butt like we were ready to go. There's always
risk in football. Injuries happen all the time. It's interesting
that the Bengals, for example, have talked about playing starters
this year because they start slow every year. Like you
do you need some of those reps, at least I
believe you do. Do you need to play half like
(11:30):
we used to play no? But also to mentally when
when you are playing in a preseason game, you treat
that week of practice or a couple of days for
the most part, like it's a game. So you mentally
prepare like you would for week one or week two
or week three. You start going through your checklist of
how do I get ready on Saturday nights? You know,
how do I warm up? How do I feel in paths?
(11:53):
Like all the little things you do, what's my pregame?
Routevough you mostly know what it is right, but you
get to rehearse that, so when you get to week one,
it's like you haven't done it in eight nine months.
And I get it's a physical sport. Things happen, but
you would also think, like, would it be odd if
a baseball player didn't take any live batting practice before
they or live at bats before they played a baseball game? Right,
(12:14):
Like you think that was a different kind of weird. Yeah,
I mean, I'm just saying, like two drives. I think
two drives the first game, one drive the first game
to the second game, and just something. And the injury thing,
like it's very rare. We think it happens all the
time when ones are playing ones. It doesn't happen. They
know how to play to not get hurt, if that
(12:35):
makes sense. So I'm a fan of playing some of
the preseason. I get why teams don't, but it seems
to work out for some of the better coaches in
the NFL.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
All right, So you host bear Bets with Chris Filika,
I've been a guest. I don't want you to keep
mentioning that I was sixty five percent against the spread
in the NFL last year.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
Stop bringing it up. Stop, But I want to get
you out of here with a bet.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
Yeah, anything on the board, a super Bowl, pick a crop,
I don't care, give me.
Speaker 5 (13:02):
Give me oh NFL Okay.
Speaker 4 (13:04):
Give me an NFL bet for this season, yes, sir, so.
Speaker 5 (13:09):
I think my my favorite one right now is the
Giants under five and a half wins. It's a little juice.
Speaker 7 (13:14):
Now.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
The problem is this with the Giants. Actually think they're
a better team this year than last season. Like they're
they're better quarterback, their healthy offensive line neighbors is good.
Like defensively they were good last year, added added abdul Carter.
But their schedule, Danny, is so hard, Like that's that's
the problem. Look at their schedule.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
It's ridiculous.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
I'll tell my head. It's like it's like Commanders, Cowboys,
two AFC West teams at New Orleans and then it's
like Eagles, Broncos, Niners, Lions, Bears. It's just horrific schedule.
And so that that's my concer. I actually think they're
better this year, but their schedule is very difficult. So
I have Giants under five and a.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Half wins, Yeah, at Washington, at Dallas, Kansas City and
the Chargers of the first four. That feels like zero
and four out of the shoot. Listen sen to Jeff Schwartz,
watch him. You're a good man and thorough Thank you, Jeff,
Thank you, buddy, appreciate it all right, we'll talk soon.
That's Jeff Schwartz, terrific Fox. NFL analy's coming up next,
Drake May I own a lot of stock in this kid.
(14:12):
I think he's going to be an absolute star. Is
he ready to take that next leap? We head to
Boston next the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions
of The Herd weekdays and neon Eastern not a Empacific.
Back in on the Herd. Danny parkins in for Colin.
I'll be back doing this again tomorrow. We've got an
(14:32):
NFL game on Thursday. We've made it to football season,
college football, right around the corner, trade deadline and baseball.
Any sort of slow time that people think it is
coming up in the past. Let's talk to a terrific
NFL reporter right now and head to Boston, where he's
covered with the NFL since two thousand and seven. Senior
NFL writer for the Boston Globe, Ben Volan joins us
(14:55):
on the Herd.
Speaker 4 (14:55):
Ben, thank you very much for the time.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
Very few teams in the NFL have undergone more change
than the Patriots from last year to this and Drake
May did not have much talent around them last year.
But I thought it quitted himself very well. I think
he looks like a future star. I own a lot
of stock in that kid. What are you expecting in
terms of a year one to year two growth for
Drake May with all these new people around him.
Speaker 6 (15:19):
Well, you know, for any NFL player, I think it
goes without saying. You want to see that big jump
from year one to year two, and especially for the Patriots,
you want to see that from Drake May. Now that
you've got a much better and more, much more credible
team around him. You've got a real coaching staff, with
all due respect to last year's coaches now with Mike Rabel,
(15:40):
Josh McDaniels running the offense, a lot of experience on
this staff. Now. Stefan Diggs is the best receiver of
the Patriots have had in a long time, assuming he
can come back healthy and be close to what he was.
They've spent the most money in free agency, over one
hundred and eighty million fully guaranteed. They brought in like
ten new starters on both sides of the new offensive lineman,
(16:01):
new defense, new receivers, just everything new to upgrade the
situation around Drake May. So yeah, if they go four
and thirteen again, that's a terrible sign for May and
the franchise. I think they want to see a nice
jump here in year two, not only in Drake May's performance,
but in the team's one loss record.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Off season videos with Cardi b are one thing. How
does Stefan Diggs look, Well, you know.
Speaker 7 (16:24):
Stefan Diggs. I got to say, it looks fantastic.
Speaker 6 (16:26):
And yes, he got off to a bad start with
that video in Miami, not what your new coaching staff
wants to see when you're joining a new team. But
Stefan Diggs showed up to the offseason program towards the end,
and then I think most impressively passed his physical to
start training camp, putting him at full go just eight
months after having ACL surgery. So I think a real
(16:48):
testament to how hard despite the video, how hard Stefan
Diggs worked on his rehab in the offseason, how hard
he's been, you know, putting in time both away from
the Patriots and now with the team and.
Speaker 7 (16:59):
He looked that's good.
Speaker 6 (17:01):
You know, it's almost to the point where it almost
might not be fair to him because he's coming back
from an ACL. Receivers that first month is going to
be a little slow, but he looks really good. His
teammate Kendrick Bourne said he jokes with Stephan Diggs says
he's going to have an Adrian Peterson type season. You
remember Adrian Peterson rushed for two thousand yards coming off
of his torn ACL. So again, maybe the expectations not
(17:23):
quite fair for Stephan Diggs, but physically he looks.
Speaker 7 (17:26):
Great so far.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
The Patriots maybe had the worst offensive line in football
last year in terms of talent and production. They used
this top five pick on Will Campbell. I've seen some
conflicting reports on how he's looked so far. What do
you think about how he's making the transition.
Speaker 7 (17:43):
Well, yesterday it.
Speaker 6 (17:44):
Was the first day in pads and he got tossed
around a little bit by veteran Keon White, and that
is a concern with Will Campbell. Keyon White is a big, lanky,
physical defensive end and Will Campbell, you know, we heard
it all throughout the pre draft process, the short arms
the narrow shoulders. Is he going to be able to
handle the defensive ends who have the long reach here
(18:06):
in the NFL? So day one not so great, also
a little surprising. I want to cut him some slack,
but the heat here in Foxborough has been very hot
this week and the heat definitely got on top of
Will Campbell the last couple of days, where you think
maybe a guy from LSU is maybe used to it,
but it's been very hot here and Will Campbell the
heat has definitely gotten to him. But it's early, It's
only two days in pads. He did have a much
(18:28):
better day today. But you know, the real question is
going to be the arm length thing. And I think
it's a real concern. It's one thing for him to
block guys in training camp and the preseason, but what
happens when he's got to go against Miles Garrett and TJ.
Watt and some of these you know, elite pass rushers
that the Patriots are probably going to face this year.
(18:48):
So we're not going to have the answers to that
question until Will Campbell steps on the field and does it.
Speaker 7 (18:53):
You know, so far, kind of an up and down performance,
but it is still early. For will Camp.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Yeah, it's early for everybody, and you know, we may
be should have talked about the addition of head coach
Mike Rabel at the start, because it's it's a homecoming.
It's in theory, a floor raising thing, it's discipline, it's competence.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
How what is a Mike Rabel training camp like so far?
Speaker 6 (19:15):
Well, I don't know how much credit he deserves versus
just the circumstances. But one thing that stands out compared
to last year is there is no drama. Last year,
Girod Mayo trying to build a program, had to deal
with Matthew Judon upset about his contract. They got a
big fight at practice, they had to throw judea On out.
He comes back to screen more at the coach. Just
a lot of drama. They eventually traded into Atlanta and
(19:37):
moved on. But Mike Rabel has had nothing of the
sort to deal with. Everyone is under contract, everyone is happy.
Everyone generally knows their role or knows what they're competing for.
And it's been very calm and business like and professional,
and that I think also speaks to the larger point
of why Mike Rabel was brought in. Just for credibility.
You know, Jerrod Mayo, with all thee respect was learning
(19:58):
on the fly, and that coach staff they gave him
last year, no one had any experience. The play callers
on both sides. We're doing it all for the first time.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
Now.
Speaker 6 (20:06):
It's Mike Rabel's been a head coach for six years.
He's one coach of the year. Josh McDaniels has been
a coordinator for fifteen years. All the defensive coaches are Vrabels,
guys from Tennessee. These are guys who have a plan,
they know what they want to do, and it's just
a very professional sort of training camp so far, with
no drama and no real hiccups yet.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
For Mike Rabel, how is Mike Rabel similar and how
is he different from Bill Belichick?
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Great question.
Speaker 6 (20:35):
Well, I think the fact that he's younger and a
former player just gives him boatloads of credibility with the players.
Like Jabrill Pepper is the safety was joking made a
joke to Mike Rabel, and Rabel's response was, Yeah, why
don't you go check out the Patriots.
Speaker 7 (20:50):
Hall of Fame and then get back to you.
Speaker 6 (20:51):
So it's like that was a great guy's got these
Super Bowl rings and he's in the Team Hall of Fame.
It's just gives him so much more credibility, which you know,
Belichick a genius. He can never you know, manufacture that
he was never a player the way Vrabel was. And Vrabel,
I mean he is the most active head coach I've
ever seen in practice. He puts on the scout team Penny,
he's playing free safety on the scout team defense, and
(21:13):
he's getting up in drills. He's coaching guys one on one.
He's wearing the blocking pad. Like Mike Rabel's forty nine,
almost fifty years old. Don't tell him that he still
thinks he's playing in the NFL. That he's so active.
I do see similarities as well. He's a very smart coach.
This is the guy that he stole a win over
Miami a couple of years ago, smartly going for two
(21:34):
you know, late, the analytics, following the analytics, that sort
of thing.
Speaker 7 (21:37):
But then also the way he coaches.
Speaker 6 (21:39):
And this is obvious because Rabel spent twelve years playing
for Belichick, so he's gonna take a lot of Belichick's tactics.
Speaker 7 (21:46):
But the one thing you see from vrabel Is.
Speaker 6 (21:48):
He's constantly quizzing guys and peppering them with questions and
keeping them on their toes, whether it's you know, what
did we talk about in the meeting yesterday? Or what
do you do in this situation on third and six
versus last time the Patriots won a division title. He's
just he's always quizzing guys and keeping them on their toes,
And that was like a staple of Bill Belichick's coaching style,
(22:08):
and it creates accountability as well, because you don't want
to be the one guy who kind of lets down
the position group or shows that you're not prepared. So
I I, you know, there are all kinds of similarities,
but you know, things that we're able to learn from Belichick.
But he's also being a younger guy and a former
player definitely his own man as coach.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
So it's years now.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
Since the Bill Belichick Robert Craft professional divorce, but they.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Just can't quit each other.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Like sometimes it's like, Oh, you're doing something kind of
interesting and taking a shot together at the Netflix roast,
and then it's like, oh, that's kind of weird. You're
taking shots at each other because Robert Kraft wants to
get into the Hall of Fame, and he's like, I
took a huge risk on Bill Belichick. And then Bill
Belichick's at North Carolina issuing statements being like, I actually
took a big risk on you because you got like,
(22:57):
what do you make of it? Like, what content is
relevant here as to why we are still dealing with
the fallout of the professional separation between Robert Kraft and
Bill Belichick.
Speaker 6 (23:08):
Well, I think it just shows how bad the relationship
is between the two and it's only gotten worse since
Kraft fired Belichick a year and a half ago. So
I think you know it all, it's all there for
us to see just how poorly the how poor the
relationship is right now and that shot of alcohol they
took it the Netflix for us that you mentioned, I mean,
if you watch Belichick, you wanted nothing to do with
(23:30):
It's that craft kind to put them on the spot.
Belichick wanted nothing to do with that. For me personally,
being in the media, I love it. It's great material,
gives us something to talk about. But I think for
the fans, you know, the word divorce, as you said,
I think that's right. It's like watching your parents divorce
and it's like, can't we just stop the fighting, because
it just the more they fight, it just seems like
it detracts from everything they accomplished here over two decades,
(23:53):
and it really just it looks like, you know, Brady
was so much of the engine of this thing, and
these two are just like fighting for scratch apps of credit,
and it's like, you know, you know, I and a
lot of other people I think were on Team Bill
last year when that Apple documentary The Dynasty came out,
it was just the Crafts just like bashing Belichick needlessly
like that was that was a bad look for the Crafts,
(24:15):
and I think Belichick got a lot of sympathy out
of that.
Speaker 7 (24:18):
But then this little dust up, as you said, no,
you know, Belichick.
Speaker 6 (24:22):
Having this lengthy response about some innocuous quote that Kraft made.
It's like, well, now Belichick doesn't look great either. And
I think that's the point. The more these guys fight,
it doesn't look good for anyone. You know, you fight
with a skunk and everyone comes out smelling pretty badly.
Speaker 4 (24:37):
So I love it.
Speaker 6 (24:39):
It's great material, but I think for the fans and
for their legacy, I think it would behoove them all
to just kind of knock it off and just kind
of go their separate ways and let it be for
a while.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
How will you define success for Bill Belichick at North Carolina?
Speaker 6 (24:55):
You know, if you can win a few more games
than just what the schedule lays out for them. You know,
this first year it's going to be tough. They have
I think seventy new players on that roster and it's
still UNC football.
Speaker 7 (25:07):
I don't know what kind of recruiting they were able
to do.
Speaker 6 (25:09):
And you know, as the last few years in New
England proved with Belichick, he's not exactly.
Speaker 7 (25:13):
A miracle worker. When they have talent.
Speaker 6 (25:15):
He was great with the Patriots, and when they didn't
have talent, especially a quarterback, they were very mediocre and
then pretty bad at the end. So you know, I
for if you're Carolina, you just want a you want
Bill to sell out the stadium, you want to be
on national TV. I think that's a win in and
of itself for UNC, the fact that they've sold out
the season tickets already, they're gonna have a behind the
(25:36):
scenes documentary, They're going to be all over TV this fall.
So that's a win for the tar Heels and then
if you know to be impressed with the coaching job
by Belichick, you don't want to just see another seven
and five UNC season. You want to see ten and two,
winning a few games on the road, beating ranked teams
and showing some of that you know, Belichick magic that
he used to have with the Patriots.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Benvolan covers the NFL for the Boston Globe. Great stuff, man,
Thank you very much for the time.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
We appreciate you.
Speaker 7 (26:04):
Awesome, Thanks, Dadie, thank you.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
And Patriots are a fascinating team. But really, Drake May,
I mean that quarterback class from last year, it's remarkable.
Jaden Daniels has the best rookie season any of us
have ever seen. When you combine the statistical performance, what
they asked of him to do, and then you know
the wins. Caleb Williams was the number one pick. The
(26:27):
Bears didn't even consider drafting anyone else. Drake May had
the least help. I mean, he had no coach, no
offensive line, and no pass catchers. And as the year
went on, it was just like, oh my god, Drake
May's making plays. The stats weren't insane, but just again,
if you watch the games, it was very clear he
belonged Justin Herbert by the way, little I test little
(26:50):
similarities between Drake May and my guy Justin Herbert. Then
Pennix only three games looked good. Bo Nick's twenty nine
touchdowns second most ever for a rookie in the playoffs.
His first games he was terrible. And then JJ McCarthy
is just sitting over there with a national championship with
an elite offensive head coach in Kevin O'Connell, and he
gets to come in to a team that won fourteen
(27:12):
games last year with one of the five best wide
receiver duos in the NFL. There's a real chance that
we're going to look back at last year's quarterback class
and in two years' like, is this the best quarterback
class ever?
Speaker 4 (27:24):
Is it going to be in that conversation like how
good can it be?
Speaker 6 (27:27):
So?
Speaker 3 (27:27):
And I think Drake May is at the focal point
there because they've made a ton of upgrades around him,
So all of those guys, and they've got joint practices,
by the way, the Patriots with the Vikings and the Commanders.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
So we're gonna get Drake May v.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Jaden, Drake May VJJ McCarthy coming up this training camp,
fun day here.
Speaker 4 (27:46):
On the Herd.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Thanks again to everybody for welcoming me and making it
so easy. Can't wait to get going on the new
expanded First Things First, which is coming up in just
a little bit. Before that, I'm back in for Colin tomorrow,
so you're not done with me yet. Danny Parkerson for
Colin on the Herd.
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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