May 8, 2024 • 31 mins
Timberwolves head coach Chris Finch joins the show to explain how he changed the culture in Minnesota from a perpetual lottery team to title contender
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Well, he's one of the smartest guys in the NBA.
He's led the Tea Wolves to three straight playoff appearances.
Seven different players on this team, despite having people as
good as Karl Anthony Towns, Rudy Gobert, and Ant, seven
guys are averaging ten plus this postseason, which is the
ultimate team. Rudy Gobert said, I've never been on a
team like this where everybody cares about themselves. Chris Finch
now joining us live. So let's talk about building that culture,
(00:49):
because you know, they've always talked about heat culture and
it's a real thing. It's like the term Villanova guys, like,
it's a real thing. When I think of Minnesota and
how you get the those players to play that length
of a season and yet are that committed defensively, it
looks collegiate if it was that easy to get guys
(01:10):
to do it, everybody would do it. Tell me the
buy in. Where did the buy in start as a coach?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, I mean the buyan started really in the offseason
and in the preseason when we realize, like, this is
who we have to be if we want to be
any good.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
I mean we have we have.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Rudy of course, defensive Player of the Year, but we
also have Jaden McDaniels, Nakiel, Alexander Walker, Anthony Edwards. These
guys are outstanding defenders in their own right. And if
we're not maximizing like those parts of their skill sets,
like we're not obviously playing to our strengths. And then
you know, Mike Connelly's got great experience, super competitive, been
(01:48):
in the league a long time. And then you know,
developing the defensive kind of skills within Kat and Naz Reed,
guys who like moved from the five positions the four
positions of getting more comfortable with playing in rotations and
playing in different schemes and all that kind of stuff.
It's been a work in progress, but if the want
(02:10):
two is there, you know these guys care.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
They got a high care factor.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
It shows their competitiveness, and they understand that it's driven
our success, Like we had success right out of the
gate today. This season we started I think seventeen and four,
most of it driven by our defense. So it's one
of the things that continues to defeat itself.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
You know, Ant is there's a playfulness and a joyfulness
to his game that I think matters. I think sometimes
you know some NFL NBA guys, like what I love
about Patrick Mahomes is he's having a hell of a
time out there and he likes you to be part
of it. But he's demanding. When I watch Ant Ants,
(02:50):
I mean there's a little Ymca trash talk to him,
but he wants you to play hard. And I know
that sounds kind of ethereal and weird, But when I
watch Ant, even though he has the ball in his
hands a lot, I would want to play hard for
him because he plays so hard on the defensive end.
There is something about Ant that is contagious and I
(03:10):
don't know how to explain it, but that's what I
see when I watch him. Can you explain that?
Speaker 4 (03:15):
Yeah, Well, you've nailed it, Colin.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
I mean that's not just him as a player, it's
him as a person like people. When I first got here,
they asked me, can he be a good leader? And
I said absolutely, because he has this personality where people
want to follow him. Every leader has one thing in common,
and that is people follow him, doesn't matter how they
get it happen. And so that's his personality off the
floor as well as on the floor, I mean, and
(03:37):
as far as as far as having fun, whether it's
Mahomes or Anthony, I mean, when you're the best player
on the floor, you're generally having fun. I mean, I
mean every the days when I was the best player
on the floor and basketball was a lot of fun
to play. But he has a joyfulness that he does
play and he's competitive, and he's demanding of his teammates
(03:59):
that they bring the same love of the game and energy,
you know, and also execution and those parts. He's still
learning and starting to just now kind of master some
of that himself. And I think that's also the thing
that his teammates love about him, is that he'll admit
what he doesn't know. He'll admit when he's wrong, and
he's not looking to blame or point fingers anywhere else
(04:20):
but take responsibility.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
You know you obviously the players love you, so you're
pro player and you have to be I think in
pro sports. But I thought and I Adam Silver has
been more pro player than David Stern. I don't like
a reasonably small fine for Jamal Murray. I thought it
was a very reckless act, especially under the basket with
all the bigs. I think, hey, I'd probably say I'm
(04:44):
going to go into that n season tournament thing in
Docia week or something. I don't know. I'm not asking
you to be the commissioner, but I thought that that
bothered me, and I like Jamal Murray. Have you talked
to it to your team? Maybe maybe it's a compliment
risk to you that you've got them so flustered and
ticked off that they're losing themselves. But now in retrospect,
(05:06):
how do you look at that moment?
Speaker 3 (05:08):
Yeah, I think you know, I'm in my opinion pretty clear.
The other day, I think it's it's it's inexcusable. It's
certainly dangerous. You know, I don't know if I've really
seen it before. I've seen some people slam water bottles
down and it's spilled out, but I've never seen kind
of a direct attempt to throw something on the floor
(05:28):
or near or at somebody, particularly in live play. I
didn't expect the suspension, to be honest, Colin, I I
and I'm fine with that.
Speaker 4 (05:37):
I don't think that.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
The league wanted to be able to, you know, to
have to decide anything based on players not playing. And
I'm fine with that. The monetary piece, you know, it
is what it is.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
I think.
Speaker 5 (05:52):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
You know, Rudy had carried a big fine for US
earlier this season when doing something highly inappropriate. So yeah,
I didn't think too much of it. I'm moving on.
We'll expect Jamal to play, and we expect him to
play extremely well. You know, I was with Jamal when
he was a rookie in Denver. You know, love him
(06:13):
as a guy. He's super competitive, as you can see.
It's one of the things I love most about him.
Speaker 4 (06:17):
He's clutch's, he cares. You know. It's as strange as
it sounds, it all comes from the right place. You know.
I didn't see it as catchulin.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
I saw it as this is a competitive guy who's
trying to do everything he can to get himself going.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
I want to circle back to the defense. Charles Barkley
said this, and I felt the exact same way. But
here's Barkley talking about your defense.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
We saw one of the best defensive teams I've ever seen.
You know, the stats don't lie. They are incredible defensively.
You take you talk about what even Rudy's not there,
but on the perimeter there guarding everything led by ant Man,
their best player. It's playing great defense and the rest
of those perimeter players, even with Dow Rudy Man, this
(07:05):
is one of the best defensive teams I've ever seen.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
So it's interesting. You used to be able to hand
check lean on bigs, so it was actually easier to
play defense in the old days. More was allowed. It's
almost like the NFL. It's much easier to play defense
ten years ago. Then they took all the clutching, grabbing,
hitting over the middle. It's harder to play great defense.
You have to exert incredible energy because you can't direct people.
(07:30):
So I'm watching your defense the other night, and I'm
thinking in a weird way, and I appreciated Adam Silver
doing this. Chris, the NFL's always been able to in season.
They'll kind of adapt to things if they see things
happening with the rules. Adam Silver, I think correctly said, guys,
scoring is getting too easy. Let's let these guys play.
I think the product's better in a weird way. That
(07:53):
benefited you in the Knicks greatly because you both have
the personnel to play defense. Do you think it's possible
that that little tweak didn't benefit the Lakers in the war,
it benefited your roster.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
I mean, we're definitely, uh, we've always been defensive first
all season long, and really kind of what the way
I see it, Collin is like the last I don't know,
twenty five thirty games of the season felt a lot
like playoff basketball to me.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
Yeah, so it was good.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
It was good for that, and you know it's good
for preparing those teams going into the playoffs with that
type of physicality. These players are so skilled and they're
so smart. It it was frustrating to watch, I think as
a product, to watch players game the game over the
last five six years. You know, they were they knew
what files they could easily bait. They were going to
get them every single time defensive had There's there's some files.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Where you couldn't do anything about it.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
If the guy just launches himself sideways into you, you
know they're trying to and I think that's where it started.
And to me, it makes a heck of a lot
of sense. Just get out of the game. The things
that aren't fouls. We shouldn't be able to trick the
officials into calling these things because we've we've put ourselves
in a in a corner with the rule book, and
that's kind of what happened.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
The league has been asking questions over the last few years,
how do we bring defense back into the league, And then,
you know, my standard answer is just let.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Us play it, you know, just let's let teams to
go back.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
And play it a little bit more and allow some
more physicality in and around the ball.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
In particular, be sure to catch live editions of The
Herd weekdays and noon eastern non a em Pacific on
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Speaker 1 (09:35):
Well, I would never rupture a Pateeller tendon because I'm
not an athlete and I stay away from physical contact.
You as a baller, as an alpha, is out You're
out there like a player. The players probably appreciate. Chris
Finch is hot, You're like Luca, you're playing a bit hurt,
and uh, how do the players react to your injury?
How's that played in the room?
Speaker 4 (09:55):
Well, I mean it's a ton of support and concern.
It's been great. Thank god it's my knee and not
Mike Conley. You got hurt. That was the biggest thing.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
And I, like you, Colin, have avoided playing pick up
basketball for the better part of thirty years to avoid such.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
A silly injury.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
So I happened to get it while standing, you know,
on the sidelines tonight. I couldn't get out of the way.
So my athleticisms failed me too.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Yeah. Stuff, when you get older, Chris, stuff breaks.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
It is.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
It's just it's just the way it works. Hey, get healthy.
Good luck. You got a game on your hands Friday.
The Nuggets are going to play hair on Fire, so
that's going to be crazy. And to congrats on all
your success. It's been a blast to watch.
Speaker 4 (10:37):
All right, appreciate it. Thanks Colin.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yeah, just a good guy, one of the smarter guys,
you know what. I love. He was in the D League,
you know, I mean he's like a player. In fact,
he's been around for a long time doing the D
league stuff development and in the league. You know, they're
a defensive team. The league's like, you know what, we're
going to swallow the Whistles, Nicks, t Wolves, OKC. Worked
right into their favor. Just like I said when the
(11:00):
NFL said, can't hit over the middle advantage, Andy Reid,
Sean mcvayh Kyle Shanahan, no question. J Mack with the news,
Turn on the news.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
This is the herd line News.
Speaker 7 (11:16):
All right, Let's start with the Tampa Bay Bucks and
Baker Mayfield. Pretty impressive season they had last year. In
the offseason, they hired O C Liam Cohen to help
Baker continue his success. Cohen spoke to the media and
talked about how Baker is embracing his role in Tampa.
Speaker 5 (11:34):
There's not many days I don't think Baker wakes up
and he doesn't have a chip on his left shoulder,
But there is definitely a feeling that this is his
team and.
Speaker 4 (11:44):
It's okay to fail.
Speaker 5 (11:45):
It's okay, you know, go out there and let it
rip and be yourself every single day no matter what,
because you're going to be the guy and we believe
in you, and I think that that's something that ultimately
he just hasn't really had the opportunity to have all
that often in his career. So you definitely feel a quiet,
you know, calming confidence. But he's still the same guy.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Had on forward looked like an head coaching candidate.
Speaker 7 (12:10):
Let me ask you, I sometimes wake up with a
chip on my shoulder. I'm curious how long is that
sustainable for an NFL quarterback like No, I just took
your team to the playoff, you were the number one pick.
Can you really continue to do that every day? Yes?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
There was a years ago on sixty Minutes. I forget
who was interviewing him, Larry Ellison, who's the founder of
an Oracle Oracle, and Larry's one of the Richard guys
on the earth, and they asked him a question during
it about He was talking about his upbringing, which is
a rough family and stuff a lot of doubt in
(12:43):
his family about him. He said, I had all the
ingredients necessary to be a billionaire. People doubted me. And
he has used at a jet fuel his entire life.
The white picket fence family, the kid that goes to
the prep school, this and that. There are advantages to that,
but man, if you look at me, my life's sports media, sports,
which I've been in Chip on the shoulder is really valuable.
(13:05):
Jet fuel not getting your way being turned down eye rolled,
mock laughed at you know, doubted. I think it really works.
I think. And also, even if you're great, a number
one pick, great, you've rarely been doubted. So I think
one of the problems with being a number one pick
in a world class talent is you're never doubted. And
(13:26):
I think I mean so, I think it even carries
like Tom Brady by the time he was the Goat,
still used it as jet fuel. I mean, Michael Jordan
didn't go number one, he went third. His first contract
wasn't very good. So it's like I think it just
I think in life are a lot of us are
just even what's the difference. The difference is desire and
(13:48):
relentlessness more than where you went to college. In my lifetime,
where you went to college can help, but it's not
nearly as important as your ability to don't be fragile,
don't be easily offended, be relentless, be able to have
thick skin and deal with bad, crappy days.
Speaker 7 (14:06):
Can you develop that thick skin or is that just
something you're born with I know on my side, my parents,
you know, both came to this.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Country born with it. You you. Larry Ellison's quote was
I had all the disadvantages necessary for success, meaning you know,
I had all this drive and ascension based on my childhood.
I don't think any I don't know this. I don't
think you're born with it. I think it's an experience
and you get you know, all the all the all
the downs create the ups in life. How's that simple
(14:36):
way to put it?
Speaker 7 (14:37):
So, yeah, I had that. You know, I thought I
was going to the NBA in fifth grade.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
I've told you this story.
Speaker 7 (14:40):
And then you know, you go to try out for
the freshman basketball team and you get cut and you're like, well,
I'm not going to the NBA. So that's why I'm
still playing basketball all these years to make up for
failures of like this.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
I saw a picture of you with dual ear rings.
You were compensating at a very early age, and I'm
just glad you ended up here.
Speaker 7 (14:58):
Yeah, my parents told me they were My parents were strict,
can't have earrings. So what did I do?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
Beach week?
Speaker 7 (15:02):
Senior year of high school. You graduate high school, you
go to the beach. I got both my ears pierced
against it.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
You know, my parents were strict. I think everybody's parents
were strict when we grow up.
Speaker 7 (15:10):
I'm not allowed to be strict. Now apparently parents can't
be strict now, Like that's like a thing.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
My son told me a month ago, Dad, not every
phone call has to be serious. So now I send
him funny stuff and I'm like it really hit. I
was like, Oh, I'm serious, Dad, I want to be
occasionally playful Dad. Funday. My son told me, he said, Dad,
you know, not every phone call we have to talk
about life's arcs and you know. And I'm like, yeah,
you're right. I'm kind of a buzzkill, all right.
Speaker 7 (15:39):
Next up is Travis Kelce. Boy got three super Bowl
rings and now he's dating Taylor Swift and according to Variety,
he's going to be an actor. Travis Kelsey is set
to join the cast of Ryan Murphy's new horror series Grotesquiary.
I hope I said that right. The show will premiere
this fall on FX and will be Kelsey's first major
(15:59):
acting Now, we hosted SNL before appeared on some showtime
show that neither of us have seen. Kind kind of
gotta gives Kelsey some props. Right, he's, you know, capitalizing
on his burgeoning fame. I'm giving him respect for this.
I like this.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
Well, NBA guys do it. Why can't a pro football
player do it?
Speaker 7 (16:17):
Certainly?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I mean, all these NBA guys have had shoe deals
for years. NFL guys don't. If this is how you capitalize,
crush it. Don't listen to the haters on the internet.
Who gives a rip? You take every dollar you can take.
Speaker 7 (16:28):
Yeah, well, we just talked about it. You gotta have
the thick skin ignore the haters.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yeah, just do what you want to do. Who gives
a rip of a right guy? And reddit Board pushes back?
Speaker 7 (16:36):
Yeah, I saved the best story for last Colin. I
don't think any other show is doing this today, but
it is. Imh.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
I love this.
Speaker 7 (16:43):
Okay. So Trey Young, right, we've talked about him as
a potential Lakers target. Quietly, Trey Young announced he has
left Clutch Sports. Saw that and he has now joined CIA.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Not going to the Lakers.
Speaker 7 (16:54):
There have been rumors that Trey could be the target
of the Lakers because we know the Clutch connection Lebron. However,
this move I don't want to say rules the Lakers out,
but if you look at what's happening in San Antonio,
they've had some clutch clients and have moved off of them,
just Trey Young. Remember Rachel Nichols was the one who
(17:15):
came up here and said, Trey Young and Wemby in
San Antonio. So did Trey Young see the writing on
the wall. I'm not gonna get to San Antonio. If
I'm with clutch, maybe I need to move off, get
to Cia. And now I get to San Antonio.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
I think that's a great spot for him.
Speaker 7 (17:30):
Potentially, Trey Young and Wemby, you like that, well, I.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Think they need another elite player. I like that. It
can't be Wemby and a bunch of guys. You gotta
have another star.
Speaker 7 (17:40):
So Trey has not given any indication he wants to
be traded, but he is one of the hot names.
There's Donovan Mitchell, potentially Paul George is out there, but
Trey Young's the interesting one. He's only twenty five, turns
twenty six in September.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
I like him more.
Speaker 7 (17:53):
Than you you do, but I like him a lot
in San Antonio. I mean that is I think he's
more of a factor in San Antonio than in LA.
He'll be the fall guy with Lebron and.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Eighty, you know that where everybody's the fall guy.
Speaker 7 (18:05):
Well the third guy, the full guy or the coach.
So now Colin this whole clutch stuff like.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Well, people ditch agents all the time.
Speaker 7 (18:13):
It doesn't mean anything.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Clutch bailed on Ben Simmons. They got rid of him,
which they should have should have done it earlier. So
I mean sometimes agents, baylon clients, clients bailon agents. It's
not it's transitional industry. It's okay, I don't look at it.
Go clutch. It's like this happens all the time. You
don't hear about it because not every client's as big
as Trey Young, But agencies let go of clients all
the time. I've changed the agent's multiple time. It's nothing personal.
(18:39):
It's just you're looking.
Speaker 7 (18:39):
If we're to write off Trey Young no longer a
Laker target, well, how are the Lakers upgrading? What are
they doing?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Well, he could still end up.
Speaker 7 (18:47):
With the Lakers, seems highly unlikely if you read the
tea Well, what are the tea leaves saying about Donovan Mitchell?
Where he let's see how the series goes to Boston.
Because then Mitchell says no to the extension. It says,
get me out of here. And you know it's Cleveland.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
Does Donovan Mitchell? Why does Donovan Mitchell have to leave
Cleveland just two? I mean they have good players. I
don't know why. Donovan Mitchell may be young, they don't
want him there. Donovan Mitchell can stay in Cleveland. Cleveland's
got good players.
Speaker 7 (19:14):
By the way, do you think Cleveland's gonna help Lebron
James in La remember the owner?
Speaker 1 (19:20):
But I don't under this whole Donovan Mitchell's got a
go thing.
Speaker 7 (19:23):
No, no, he doesn't have to go. He will be
offering an extension this summer.
Speaker 8 (19:26):
I prob million.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
I would give him that.
Speaker 7 (19:28):
He may not want to spend the next four years
in Cleveland.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
What Cleveland is? The springtime in Cleveland is it's a wonderland. Well,
I just think Evan Mobley is a good play They
got like three or four guys that can play. I
watch them. They're like competitive or not Boston, but they're.
Speaker 7 (19:43):
A competitive in the East. They're not considered like a top.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Five Well, yeah, they're kind of a top five team. East.
I think they are. You don't think they are.
Speaker 7 (19:52):
I think that team's getting broken up significantly. Whether it's Allan,
the coach Mitchell, something's happening if they get dusted here
by Boston, and that's probably happening.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Right m Jmack with the news.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Well, that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the herd.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Lie. I mean, have you ever been to Cleveland? I mean,
you didn't like Chicago.
Speaker 7 (20:11):
And I, well, wait a minute, wait, I had a
wonderful weekend in Chicago, like fifteen years ago.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
It was awesome and it's nicer, it's beautiful, it.
Speaker 7 (20:19):
Was fine in the spring a winner. No thanks, but
I've never been to Cleveland. I'm missing out.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
It's fine.
Speaker 7 (20:25):
They got the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame there.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Yeah, I mean it's fine. It's a it's a roust
belt Midwestern city. It's fine. Chicago's the jewel of the Midwest.
There's a lot of Saint Louis, Indiana stuff.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Going on in Chicago or Nashville.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I like Chicago. I'm into. I like the architecture. I
like big cities. Nashville is fine. The National Fun architecture
in the airport right, Well, I like that. I like that.
I like London, I like Chicago, I like Van Coop,
I like I like architecture, and I want to go
to Croatia. That's what I like. Wow, I like I
like that.
Speaker 6 (20:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
You know when I went to Florence, Italy, I could
have stayed. I could have done eight architectural tours. I
thought that stuff was amazing.
Speaker 7 (21:04):
Yeah, we're locking in a Europe. You like beaches, I do,
but we're locking in Europe this summer. We're taking taking
the kids.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
We'll see in the summer.
Speaker 7 (21:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Yeah, a little hot and little crowded.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
Not my scene, but we'll see you might as well take.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
Eight or nine of those muscle shirts. Good, it is hot,
all right Byron Scott taking a shot at Lebron. Let
you hear that.
Speaker 7 (21:29):
Next.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
Hey, I'm Doug Gottli.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
The podcast is called All Ball.
Speaker 7 (21:39):
We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's
more about the stories about what made these people love
their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way.
We talked to coaches, we talked to players. We tell
you stories. You download it you listen to it, I
think you like it. Listen to All Ball with Doug
Gottlieb on the iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get
(22:02):
your podcast. Tonight on FS one, two of the game's
most exciting young stars go ahead to head as Corbin
Carroll and the Vbacs take on Ellie De la Cruz
and the Reds All. The action begins tonight at six
point thirty Eastern on FS one.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
So Byron Scott was on Undisputed this morning, the former
Lakers star and coach as they seek their eighth coach
in fourteen years, it's a carousel. So he gave the
guys on Undisputed a very interesting take on who should
be the Lakers next.
Speaker 8 (22:40):
Coach, which and out of the eight or nine names
that I've heard, his name wasn't known. There is make
Lebron the coach. It's obvious to me at least that
he's making a lot of decisions just going on in
this organization from a coaching standpoint to a player standpoint.
So if you're going to allow him to make those decisions,
all right, sit on the bench and make.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
Those decisions as well.
Speaker 8 (23:02):
Beat a head coach as far as I'm concerned, the
only person that he's going to really trust is itself.
And since you're making a lot of these decisions anyway,
why not put him in NeSSI.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
HM, very interesting. So Rick Buker came on after that
and I asked him about byrons God's comments.
Speaker 9 (23:21):
Lebron, at thirty nine years old, is still their go
to guy, and but the fact that he's has tried
to suggest that he's the same player he's always been
because the numbers look familiar, is that I'm I can't
take you seriously. You know the game better than that,
you know what you were at one point. You're playing
(23:44):
no defense. You have to play big in order to
be functional as an offensive player. Good point, and that
screws up the rest of the team. So it's it's
not it's not legit. And and you know, I think
Byron is speaking for all the coaches that have been
fired to say we're gonna play. If you're gonna dictate
(24:08):
when you go in and out of the game and
how many minutes you play and how we're gonna run
our offense, why don't.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
You just go away? It reminds me a little of Belichick.
So when Belichick started the dynasty. It was do your
job and sacrifice for the team. Yes, I can argue
at the end, Bill got very selfish. I'm gonna be
the GM, I'm gonna be the coach. I'm only gonna
have guys that I want to coach. Yeah, well that's not.
Speaker 9 (24:30):
And I'm gonna only have coaches work for me that
I know what I'm familiar with Lebron.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Nobody could dispute this was a pretty unselfish player. High
school to early NBA. He elevated very marginal play. He
could have scored forty five a night. Now you can
argue he's a bit of a selfish player. More finger pointing,
less acknowledging. Your game has changed. I think your best
point there of the many, is he now dominates. He
(25:00):
has to play big to score. Yes, he finds the
weakness and bullies the smaller player more often.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (25:05):
In order for him to maintain the numbers and to
look there's a good the same player, he has to exploit.
The system has to work for him at the expense
of other players.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
If that makes sense.
Speaker 9 (25:21):
It does because if you look at the big games
that Austin Reeves and d Low and any number of player.
Anthony David, like all of those guys, Ruy Hottamurro like,
had some really nice games when Lebron didn't play, and
so when he plays, everybody is sort of catering to him,
which again is okay. But when you lose and you're
(25:43):
catering to a particular player, then you have to have
a little sort of self awareness and say.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Hey, maybe maybe. I mean, for.
Speaker 9 (25:50):
Example, in the Denver series, I thought that their best
chance of winning is if Lebron James guarded Nikola Jokic,
because then you have Anthony Davis off the ball. Lebron
can't guard Aaron Gordon, he's not athletic enough anymore, right,
or Michael Porter Junior.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Or he's not going to chase around Jamal Murray.
Speaker 9 (26:09):
And he's not going to chase around Jamal Murray. And
you see with nas Reed against Nikola Jokicic that if
you have somebody who's six eight six ' nine and
really strong and gets under him, that makes him uncomfortable.
Particularly if you have a shot blocker Carol Anthony Towns
or Rudy Gobert lurking, that makes things difficult. But I
(26:30):
don't believe that Lebron wanted to do the yeoman's work
of I'm just going to put my energy into the
defensive side of the ball, and Jokis is probably going
to score on me at time make you look bad.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Which I really don't like.
Speaker 9 (26:42):
I don't want that either, But for me, it's like,
if this gives us a better chance of winning.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
So I was thinking about this, Jay mcause I was
watching that back from earlier. Is that it you know,
it's kind of predictable that you would be a star
and you would get rich and you have championships and
then you'd kind of exert some of your leverager power.
Like that's just very human. Brady was interesting because he
never did that. He wanted to keep his New England
(27:11):
reputation and sort of his standing intact. He never bullied
the coach or the owner to get his way. But
then he went to Tampa and said, Okay, I'll tweak
this culture. I want this player, that player, that coach upstairs.
So Brady was different in Tampa. He was sillier and
more fun, more relatable. But Tom for the first time
(27:32):
said this, I want this, get the coach upstairs, get
me that tight end. He didn't do that with Belichick
in New England. He didn't do it with Craft. So
Tom did get selfish is the wrong word. Tom did
get more demanding and punitive to those who wouldn't listen
to him. But he kept his New England business separate.
You could never say that about him. Ever, you could
(27:53):
argue Peyton Manning did a little bit of that. Peyton
did a certain way, and then when Peyton went to
Denver it was like, I'm gonna take my money a
little bit here. I've been one for the team guy
a little bit, and so they want he. So Peyton
Mannings Indianapolis reputation is always about the team. In Denver,
he and l Way butted a little bit on salary.
He would not have done that in the championship windows
(28:15):
as much.
Speaker 7 (28:16):
Well two things. So, first of all, football is totally
different than basketball. Football is about the team. It always
has been. Basketball is the individual.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Well, it's about the team to you know Way.
Speaker 7 (28:26):
The Jewels are the stars. They run the league because
it's so difficult to find a superstar. You know, there's
only five starters versus you know eleven, no offense defense.
And secondly, there were reports and maybe Brady once he
gets here, he can clarify it that he went to
Kraft and was like, what's he doing drafting Garoppolo? Get
him out of here?
Speaker 1 (28:45):
And then Kraft went to Belichick's documented multiple times.
Speaker 7 (28:48):
Right, so he did call his shot once, but that, yeah,
you're right that that felt a little threatened.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
I don't know why, but in fairness, he was right.
Kraft was right. He had another Super Bowl. So in fairness,
Tom was like, before you replace me, I got a
lot in the tank. Tom won Super Bowl in New
England and goes to Tampon wins.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
It so right.
Speaker 7 (29:11):
Aaron Rodgers was similar, complaining about the Jordan Lovee and
two MVPs, but he did not get the Super Bowl.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
He made a lot of squawking and didn't deliver eight
and nine's not good enough.
Speaker 7 (29:22):
Wait a minute, he got two MVP awards.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh is this the NBA awards matter?
Speaker 7 (29:27):
They were the number one came.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
It's not basketball sport. I don't care about MVP. I
couldn't say the last five NFL MVPs, Aaron won a couple.
I'm sure Mahomes got one. Who cares, But.
Speaker 7 (29:39):
I'm saying they were right there on the cusp of
the Super Bowl. It just came up short. It's not
like no.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
The difference is Tom made it move. Tom got super
Bowls at two different places. Aaron squawked and he's like, yeah, dude,
you're eight and nine in a bad NFC. Jordan Love
comes in. He's better than you. When Tom left, the
palace burnt down. When Aaron left, it got better. So
the different Aaron made demand. I don't have a problem
(30:05):
with the quarterbacks making demands. What happens when you leave.
Packers are better today. New England's a tire fight.
Speaker 7 (30:12):
Wait a minute, a little revision is they're not better.
I mean Aaron Rodgers did not his final year, but
the two year before that they were the championship. They
was the number one or number two seed.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Green Bay is absolutely better today than Aaron's last two years.
They are last.
Speaker 7 (30:31):
Year, yes, but the year before that when they had
DeVante Adams come on, they were amazing. They lost that
snow game to San France. Remember that playoff game.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
We did both teams play in the snow. They did
both sounded like an excuse. Oh he lost his snow game.
I'm sorry. Tua can't throw a deep ball. In the
cold weather to you problem, damn it?
Speaker 7 (30:52):
How do I find like you back me into a
quarter right to defend this knucklehead Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
I'm not I'm not banging on him, but you can't
compare Tom. Tom's different. I'm gonna make a demand and
I'm gonna deliver the truth after it.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
But I'm okay with the demands.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
I'm okay with demands. If Lebron wants to demand something
in his prime is different than mellow demanding something is
probably I'm getting something for it.
Speaker 7 (31:14):
But Rogers and Brady are both stars.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
There's a different one's the goat and one is a
star quarterback. Like a lot of guys that won Super Bowls,
a lot of quarterbacks want to one's the greatest player
in league history. I want the hell of a football player.
That's a big gap between that. You're making the gap
like I'm making the gap, like no, no, no, Joe
Montana and one super Bowl guy and not the same quarterback.
(31:40):
They're not the same quarterback. Aaron's closer to Matt Ryan
than Brady
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Well, he's one of the smartest guys in the NBA.
He's led the Tea Wolves to three straight playoff appearances.
Seven different players on this team, despite having people as
good as Karl Anthony Towns, Rudy Gobert, and Ant, seven
guys are averaging ten plus this postseason, which is the
ultimate team. Rudy Gobert said, I've never been on a
team like this where everybody cares about themselves. Chris Finch
now joining us live. So let's talk about building that culture,
(00:49):
because you know, they've always talked about heat culture and
it's a real thing. It's like the term Villanova guys, like,
it's a real thing. When I think of Minnesota and
how you get the those players to play that length
of a season and yet are that committed defensively, it
looks collegiate if it was that easy to get guys
(01:10):
to do it, everybody would do it. Tell me the
buy in. Where did the buy in start as a coach?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, I mean the buyan started really in the offseason
and in the preseason when we realize, like, this is
who we have to be if we want to be
any good.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
I mean we have we have.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
Rudy of course, defensive Player of the Year, but we
also have Jaden McDaniels, Nakiel, Alexander Walker, Anthony Edwards. These
guys are outstanding defenders in their own right. And if
we're not maximizing like those parts of their skill sets,
like we're not obviously playing to our strengths. And then
you know, Mike Connelly's got great experience, super competitive, been
(01:48):
in the league a long time. And then you know,
developing the defensive kind of skills within Kat and Naz Reed,
guys who like moved from the five positions the four
positions of getting more comfortable with playing in rotations and
playing in different schemes and all that kind of stuff.
It's been a work in progress, but if the want
(02:10):
two is there, you know these guys care.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
They got a high care factor.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
It shows their competitiveness, and they understand that it's driven
our success, Like we had success right out of the
gate today. This season we started I think seventeen and four,
most of it driven by our defense. So it's one
of the things that continues to defeat itself.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
You know, Ant is there's a playfulness and a joyfulness
to his game that I think matters. I think sometimes
you know some NFL NBA guys, like what I love
about Patrick Mahomes is he's having a hell of a
time out there and he likes you to be part
of it. But he's demanding. When I watch Ant Ants,
(02:50):
I mean there's a little Ymca trash talk to him,
but he wants you to play hard. And I know
that sounds kind of ethereal and weird, But when I
watch Ant, even though he has the ball in his
hands a lot, I would want to play hard for
him because he plays so hard on the defensive end.
There is something about Ant that is contagious and I
(03:10):
don't know how to explain it, but that's what I
see when I watch him. Can you explain that?
Speaker 4 (03:15):
Yeah, Well, you've nailed it, Colin.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
I mean that's not just him as a player, it's
him as a person like people. When I first got here,
they asked me, can he be a good leader? And
I said absolutely, because he has this personality where people
want to follow him. Every leader has one thing in common,
and that is people follow him, doesn't matter how they
get it happen. And so that's his personality off the
floor as well as on the floor, I mean, and
(03:37):
as far as as far as having fun, whether it's
Mahomes or Anthony, I mean, when you're the best player
on the floor, you're generally having fun. I mean, I
mean every the days when I was the best player
on the floor and basketball was a lot of fun
to play. But he has a joyfulness that he does
play and he's competitive, and he's demanding of his teammates
(03:59):
that they bring the same love of the game and energy,
you know, and also execution and those parts. He's still
learning and starting to just now kind of master some
of that himself. And I think that's also the thing
that his teammates love about him, is that he'll admit
what he doesn't know. He'll admit when he's wrong, and
he's not looking to blame or point fingers anywhere else
(04:20):
but take responsibility.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
You know you obviously the players love you, so you're
pro player and you have to be I think in
pro sports. But I thought and I Adam Silver has
been more pro player than David Stern. I don't like
a reasonably small fine for Jamal Murray. I thought it
was a very reckless act, especially under the basket with
all the bigs. I think, hey, I'd probably say I'm
(04:44):
going to go into that n season tournament thing in
Docia week or something. I don't know. I'm not asking
you to be the commissioner, but I thought that that
bothered me, and I like Jamal Murray. Have you talked
to it to your team? Maybe maybe it's a compliment
risk to you that you've got them so flustered and
ticked off that they're losing themselves. But now in retrospect,
(05:06):
how do you look at that moment?
Speaker 3 (05:08):
Yeah, I think you know, I'm in my opinion pretty clear.
The other day, I think it's it's it's inexcusable. It's
certainly dangerous. You know, I don't know if I've really
seen it before. I've seen some people slam water bottles
down and it's spilled out, but I've never seen kind
of a direct attempt to throw something on the floor
(05:28):
or near or at somebody, particularly in live play. I
didn't expect the suspension, to be honest, Colin, I I
and I'm fine with that.
Speaker 4 (05:37):
I don't think that.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
The league wanted to be able to, you know, to
have to decide anything based on players not playing. And
I'm fine with that. The monetary piece, you know, it
is what it is.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
I think.
Speaker 5 (05:52):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
You know, Rudy had carried a big fine for US
earlier this season when doing something highly inappropriate. So yeah,
I didn't think too much of it. I'm moving on.
We'll expect Jamal to play, and we expect him to
play extremely well. You know, I was with Jamal when
he was a rookie in Denver. You know, love him
(06:13):
as a guy. He's super competitive, as you can see.
It's one of the things I love most about him.
Speaker 4 (06:17):
He's clutch's, he cares. You know. It's as strange as
it sounds, it all comes from the right place. You know.
I didn't see it as catchulin.
Speaker 3 (06:29):
I saw it as this is a competitive guy who's
trying to do everything he can to get himself going.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
I want to circle back to the defense. Charles Barkley
said this, and I felt the exact same way. But
here's Barkley talking about your defense.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
We saw one of the best defensive teams I've ever seen.
You know, the stats don't lie. They are incredible defensively.
You take you talk about what even Rudy's not there,
but on the perimeter there guarding everything led by ant Man,
their best player. It's playing great defense and the rest
of those perimeter players, even with Dow Rudy Man, this
(07:05):
is one of the best defensive teams I've ever seen.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
So it's interesting. You used to be able to hand
check lean on bigs, so it was actually easier to
play defense in the old days. More was allowed. It's
almost like the NFL. It's much easier to play defense
ten years ago. Then they took all the clutching, grabbing,
hitting over the middle. It's harder to play great defense.
You have to exert incredible energy because you can't direct people.
(07:30):
So I'm watching your defense the other night, and I'm
thinking in a weird way, and I appreciated Adam Silver
doing this. Chris, the NFL's always been able to in season.
They'll kind of adapt to things if they see things
happening with the rules. Adam Silver, I think correctly said, guys,
scoring is getting too easy. Let's let these guys play.
I think the product's better in a weird way. That
(07:53):
benefited you in the Knicks greatly because you both have
the personnel to play defense. Do you think it's possible
that that little tweak didn't benefit the Lakers in the war,
it benefited your roster.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
I mean, we're definitely, uh, we've always been defensive first
all season long, and really kind of what the way
I see it, Collin is like the last I don't know,
twenty five thirty games of the season felt a lot
like playoff basketball to me.
Speaker 4 (08:23):
Yeah, so it was good.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
It was good for that, and you know it's good
for preparing those teams going into the playoffs with that
type of physicality. These players are so skilled and they're
so smart. It it was frustrating to watch, I think as
a product, to watch players game the game over the
last five six years. You know, they were they knew
what files they could easily bait. They were going to
get them every single time defensive had There's there's some files.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Where you couldn't do anything about it.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
If the guy just launches himself sideways into you, you
know they're trying to and I think that's where it started.
And to me, it makes a heck of a lot
of sense. Just get out of the game. The things
that aren't fouls. We shouldn't be able to trick the
officials into calling these things because we've we've put ourselves
in a in a corner with the rule book, and
that's kind of what happened.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (09:09):
The league has been asking questions over the last few years,
how do we bring defense back into the league, And then,
you know, my standard answer is just let.
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Us play it, you know, just let's let teams to
go back.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
And play it a little bit more and allow some
more physicality in and around the ball.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
In particular, be sure to catch live editions of The
Herd weekdays and noon eastern non a em Pacific on
Fox Sports Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Well, I would never rupture a Pateeller tendon because I'm
not an athlete and I stay away from physical contact.
You as a baller, as an alpha, is out You're
out there like a player. The players probably appreciate. Chris
Finch is hot, You're like Luca, you're playing a bit hurt,
and uh, how do the players react to your injury?
How's that played in the room?
Speaker 4 (09:55):
Well, I mean it's a ton of support and concern.
It's been great. Thank god it's my knee and not
Mike Conley. You got hurt. That was the biggest thing.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
And I, like you, Colin, have avoided playing pick up
basketball for the better part of thirty years to avoid such.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
A silly injury.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
So I happened to get it while standing, you know,
on the sidelines tonight. I couldn't get out of the way.
So my athleticisms failed me too.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Yeah. Stuff, when you get older, Chris, stuff breaks.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
It is.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
It's just it's just the way it works. Hey, get healthy.
Good luck. You got a game on your hands Friday.
The Nuggets are going to play hair on Fire, so
that's going to be crazy. And to congrats on all
your success. It's been a blast to watch.
Speaker 4 (10:37):
All right, appreciate it. Thanks Colin.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yeah, just a good guy, one of the smarter guys,
you know what. I love. He was in the D League,
you know, I mean he's like a player. In fact,
he's been around for a long time doing the D
league stuff development and in the league. You know, they're
a defensive team. The league's like, you know what, we're
going to swallow the Whistles, Nicks, t Wolves, OKC. Worked
right into their favor. Just like I said when the
(11:00):
NFL said, can't hit over the middle advantage, Andy Reid,
Sean mcvayh Kyle Shanahan, no question. J Mack with the news,
Turn on the news.
Speaker 4 (11:13):
This is the herd line News.
Speaker 7 (11:16):
All right, Let's start with the Tampa Bay Bucks and
Baker Mayfield. Pretty impressive season they had last year. In
the offseason, they hired O C Liam Cohen to help
Baker continue his success. Cohen spoke to the media and
talked about how Baker is embracing his role in Tampa.
Speaker 5 (11:34):
There's not many days I don't think Baker wakes up
and he doesn't have a chip on his left shoulder,
But there is definitely a feeling that this is his
team and.
Speaker 4 (11:44):
It's okay to fail.
Speaker 5 (11:45):
It's okay, you know, go out there and let it
rip and be yourself every single day no matter what,
because you're going to be the guy and we believe
in you, and I think that that's something that ultimately
he just hasn't really had the opportunity to have all
that often in his career. So you definitely feel a quiet,
you know, calming confidence. But he's still the same guy.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Had on forward looked like an head coaching candidate.
Speaker 7 (12:10):
Let me ask you, I sometimes wake up with a
chip on my shoulder. I'm curious how long is that
sustainable for an NFL quarterback like No, I just took
your team to the playoff, you were the number one pick.
Can you really continue to do that every day? Yes?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
There was a years ago on sixty Minutes. I forget
who was interviewing him, Larry Ellison, who's the founder of
an Oracle Oracle, and Larry's one of the Richard guys
on the earth, and they asked him a question during
it about He was talking about his upbringing, which is
a rough family and stuff a lot of doubt in
(12:43):
his family about him. He said, I had all the
ingredients necessary to be a billionaire. People doubted me. And
he has used at a jet fuel his entire life.
The white picket fence family, the kid that goes to
the prep school, this and that. There are advantages to that,
but man, if you look at me, my life's sports media, sports,
which I've been in Chip on the shoulder is really valuable.
(13:05):
Jet fuel not getting your way being turned down eye rolled,
mock laughed at you know, doubted. I think it really works.
I think. And also, even if you're great, a number
one pick, great, you've rarely been doubted. So I think
one of the problems with being a number one pick
in a world class talent is you're never doubted. And
(13:26):
I think I mean so, I think it even carries
like Tom Brady by the time he was the Goat,
still used it as jet fuel. I mean, Michael Jordan
didn't go number one, he went third. His first contract
wasn't very good. So it's like I think it just
I think in life are a lot of us are
just even what's the difference. The difference is desire and
(13:48):
relentlessness more than where you went to college. In my lifetime,
where you went to college can help, but it's not
nearly as important as your ability to don't be fragile,
don't be easily offended, be relentless, be able to have
thick skin and deal with bad, crappy days.
Speaker 7 (14:06):
Can you develop that thick skin or is that just
something you're born with I know on my side, my parents,
you know, both came to this.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Country born with it. You you. Larry Ellison's quote was
I had all the disadvantages necessary for success, meaning you know,
I had all this drive and ascension based on my childhood.
I don't think any I don't know this. I don't
think you're born with it. I think it's an experience
and you get you know, all the all the all
the downs create the ups in life. How's that simple
(14:36):
way to put it?
Speaker 7 (14:37):
So, yeah, I had that. You know, I thought I
was going to the NBA in fifth grade.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
I've told you this story.
Speaker 7 (14:40):
And then you know, you go to try out for
the freshman basketball team and you get cut and you're like, well,
I'm not going to the NBA. So that's why I'm
still playing basketball all these years to make up for
failures of like this.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
I saw a picture of you with dual ear rings.
You were compensating at a very early age, and I'm
just glad you ended up here.
Speaker 7 (14:58):
Yeah, my parents told me they were My parents were strict,
can't have earrings. So what did I do?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
Beach week?
Speaker 7 (15:02):
Senior year of high school. You graduate high school, you
go to the beach. I got both my ears pierced
against it.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
You know, my parents were strict. I think everybody's parents
were strict when we grow up.
Speaker 7 (15:10):
I'm not allowed to be strict. Now apparently parents can't
be strict now, Like that's like a thing.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
My son told me a month ago, Dad, not every
phone call has to be serious. So now I send
him funny stuff and I'm like it really hit. I
was like, Oh, I'm serious, Dad, I want to be
occasionally playful Dad. Funday. My son told me, he said, Dad,
you know, not every phone call we have to talk
about life's arcs and you know. And I'm like, yeah,
you're right. I'm kind of a buzzkill, all right.
Speaker 7 (15:39):
Next up is Travis Kelce. Boy got three super Bowl
rings and now he's dating Taylor Swift and according to Variety,
he's going to be an actor. Travis Kelsey is set
to join the cast of Ryan Murphy's new horror series Grotesquiary.
I hope I said that right. The show will premiere
this fall on FX and will be Kelsey's first major
(15:59):
acting Now, we hosted SNL before appeared on some showtime
show that neither of us have seen. Kind kind of
gotta gives Kelsey some props. Right, he's, you know, capitalizing
on his burgeoning fame. I'm giving him respect for this.
I like this.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
Well, NBA guys do it. Why can't a pro football
player do it?
Speaker 7 (16:17):
Certainly?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I mean, all these NBA guys have had shoe deals
for years. NFL guys don't. If this is how you capitalize,
crush it. Don't listen to the haters on the internet.
Who gives a rip? You take every dollar you can take.
Speaker 7 (16:28):
Yeah, well, we just talked about it. You gotta have
the thick skin ignore the haters.
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yeah, just do what you want to do. Who gives
a rip of a right guy? And reddit Board pushes back?
Speaker 7 (16:36):
Yeah, I saved the best story for last Colin. I
don't think any other show is doing this today, but
it is. Imh.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
I love this.
Speaker 7 (16:43):
Okay. So Trey Young, right, we've talked about him as
a potential Lakers target. Quietly, Trey Young announced he has
left Clutch Sports. Saw that and he has now joined CIA.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Not going to the Lakers.
Speaker 7 (16:54):
There have been rumors that Trey could be the target
of the Lakers because we know the Clutch connection Lebron. However,
this move I don't want to say rules the Lakers out,
but if you look at what's happening in San Antonio,
they've had some clutch clients and have moved off of them,
just Trey Young. Remember Rachel Nichols was the one who
(17:15):
came up here and said, Trey Young and Wemby in
San Antonio. So did Trey Young see the writing on
the wall. I'm not gonna get to San Antonio. If
I'm with clutch, maybe I need to move off, get
to Cia. And now I get to San Antonio.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
I think that's a great spot for him.
Speaker 7 (17:30):
Potentially, Trey Young and Wemby, you like that, well, I.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
Think they need another elite player. I like that. It
can't be Wemby and a bunch of guys. You gotta
have another star.
Speaker 7 (17:40):
So Trey has not given any indication he wants to
be traded, but he is one of the hot names.
There's Donovan Mitchell, potentially Paul George is out there, but
Trey Young's the interesting one. He's only twenty five, turns
twenty six in September.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
I like him more.
Speaker 7 (17:53):
Than you you do, but I like him a lot
in San Antonio. I mean that is I think he's
more of a factor in San Antonio than in LA.
He'll be the fall guy with Lebron and.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Eighty, you know that where everybody's the fall guy.
Speaker 7 (18:05):
Well the third guy, the full guy or the coach.
So now Colin this whole clutch stuff like.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Well, people ditch agents all the time.
Speaker 7 (18:13):
It doesn't mean anything.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Clutch bailed on Ben Simmons. They got rid of him,
which they should have should have done it earlier. So
I mean sometimes agents, baylon clients, clients bailon agents. It's
not it's transitional industry. It's okay, I don't look at it.
Go clutch. It's like this happens all the time. You
don't hear about it because not every client's as big
as Trey Young, But agencies let go of clients all
the time. I've changed the agent's multiple time. It's nothing personal.
(18:39):
It's just you're looking.
Speaker 7 (18:39):
If we're to write off Trey Young no longer a
Laker target, well, how are the Lakers upgrading? What are
they doing?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Well, he could still end up.
Speaker 7 (18:47):
With the Lakers, seems highly unlikely if you read the
tea Well, what are the tea leaves saying about Donovan Mitchell?
Where he let's see how the series goes to Boston.
Because then Mitchell says no to the extension. It says,
get me out of here. And you know it's Cleveland.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
Does Donovan Mitchell? Why does Donovan Mitchell have to leave
Cleveland just two? I mean they have good players. I
don't know why. Donovan Mitchell may be young, they don't
want him there. Donovan Mitchell can stay in Cleveland. Cleveland's
got good players.
Speaker 7 (19:14):
By the way, do you think Cleveland's gonna help Lebron
James in La remember the owner?
Speaker 1 (19:20):
But I don't under this whole Donovan Mitchell's got a
go thing.
Speaker 7 (19:23):
No, no, he doesn't have to go. He will be
offering an extension this summer.
Speaker 8 (19:26):
I prob million.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
I would give him that.
Speaker 7 (19:28):
He may not want to spend the next four years
in Cleveland.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
What Cleveland is? The springtime in Cleveland is it's a wonderland. Well,
I just think Evan Mobley is a good play They
got like three or four guys that can play. I
watch them. They're like competitive or not Boston, but they're.
Speaker 7 (19:43):
A competitive in the East. They're not considered like a top.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Five Well, yeah, they're kind of a top five team. East.
I think they are. You don't think they are.
Speaker 7 (19:52):
I think that team's getting broken up significantly. Whether it's Allan,
the coach Mitchell, something's happening if they get dusted here
by Boston, and that's probably happening.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Right m Jmack with the news.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Well, that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the herd.
Speaker 1 (20:08):
Lie. I mean, have you ever been to Cleveland? I mean,
you didn't like Chicago.
Speaker 7 (20:11):
And I, well, wait a minute, wait, I had a
wonderful weekend in Chicago, like fifteen years ago.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
It was awesome and it's nicer, it's beautiful, it.
Speaker 7 (20:19):
Was fine in the spring a winner. No thanks, but
I've never been to Cleveland. I'm missing out.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
It's fine.
Speaker 7 (20:25):
They got the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame there.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Yeah, I mean it's fine. It's a it's a roust
belt Midwestern city. It's fine. Chicago's the jewel of the Midwest.
There's a lot of Saint Louis, Indiana stuff.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Going on in Chicago or Nashville.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I like Chicago. I'm into. I like the architecture. I
like big cities. Nashville is fine. The National Fun architecture
in the airport right, Well, I like that. I like that.
I like London, I like Chicago, I like Van Coop,
I like I like architecture, and I want to go
to Croatia. That's what I like. Wow, I like I
like that.
Speaker 6 (20:56):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
You know when I went to Florence, Italy, I could
have stayed. I could have done eight architectural tours. I
thought that stuff was amazing.
Speaker 7 (21:04):
Yeah, we're locking in a Europe. You like beaches, I do,
but we're locking in Europe this summer. We're taking taking
the kids.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
We'll see in the summer.
Speaker 7 (21:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Yeah, a little hot and little crowded.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
Not my scene, but we'll see you might as well take.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
Eight or nine of those muscle shirts. Good, it is hot,
all right Byron Scott taking a shot at Lebron. Let
you hear that.
Speaker 7 (21:29):
Next.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
Hey, I'm Doug Gottli.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
The podcast is called All Ball.
Speaker 7 (21:39):
We usually talk all basketball all the time, but it's
more about the stories about what made these people love
their sport and all the interesting interactions along the way.
We talked to coaches, we talked to players. We tell
you stories. You download it you listen to it, I
think you like it. Listen to All Ball with Doug
Gottlieb on the iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get
(22:02):
your podcast. Tonight on FS one, two of the game's
most exciting young stars go ahead to head as Corbin
Carroll and the Vbacs take on Ellie De la Cruz
and the Reds All. The action begins tonight at six
point thirty Eastern on FS one.
Speaker 1 (22:20):
So Byron Scott was on Undisputed this morning, the former
Lakers star and coach as they seek their eighth coach
in fourteen years, it's a carousel. So he gave the
guys on Undisputed a very interesting take on who should
be the Lakers next.
Speaker 8 (22:40):
Coach, which and out of the eight or nine names
that I've heard, his name wasn't known. There is make
Lebron the coach. It's obvious to me at least that
he's making a lot of decisions just going on in
this organization from a coaching standpoint to a player standpoint.
So if you're going to allow him to make those decisions,
all right, sit on the bench and make.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
Those decisions as well.
Speaker 8 (23:02):
Beat a head coach as far as I'm concerned, the
only person that he's going to really trust is itself.
And since you're making a lot of these decisions anyway,
why not put him in NeSSI.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
HM, very interesting. So Rick Buker came on after that
and I asked him about byrons God's comments.
Speaker 9 (23:21):
Lebron, at thirty nine years old, is still their go
to guy, and but the fact that he's has tried
to suggest that he's the same player he's always been
because the numbers look familiar, is that I'm I can't
take you seriously. You know the game better than that,
you know what you were at one point. You're playing
(23:44):
no defense. You have to play big in order to
be functional as an offensive player. Good point, and that
screws up the rest of the team. So it's it's
not it's not legit. And and you know, I think
Byron is speaking for all the coaches that have been
fired to say we're gonna play. If you're gonna dictate
(24:08):
when you go in and out of the game and
how many minutes you play and how we're gonna run
our offense, why don't.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
You just go away? It reminds me a little of Belichick.
So when Belichick started the dynasty. It was do your
job and sacrifice for the team. Yes, I can argue
at the end, Bill got very selfish. I'm gonna be
the GM, I'm gonna be the coach. I'm only gonna
have guys that I want to coach. Yeah, well that's not.
Speaker 9 (24:30):
And I'm gonna only have coaches work for me that
I know what I'm familiar with Lebron.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Nobody could dispute this was a pretty unselfish player. High
school to early NBA. He elevated very marginal play. He
could have scored forty five a night. Now you can
argue he's a bit of a selfish player. More finger pointing,
less acknowledging. Your game has changed. I think your best
point there of the many, is he now dominates. He
(25:00):
has to play big to score. Yes, he finds the
weakness and bullies the smaller player more often.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (25:05):
In order for him to maintain the numbers and to
look there's a good the same player, he has to exploit.
The system has to work for him at the expense
of other players.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
If that makes sense.
Speaker 9 (25:21):
It does because if you look at the big games
that Austin Reeves and d Low and any number of player.
Anthony David, like all of those guys, Ruy Hottamurro like,
had some really nice games when Lebron didn't play, and
so when he plays, everybody is sort of catering to him,
which again is okay. But when you lose and you're
(25:43):
catering to a particular player, then you have to have
a little sort of self awareness and say.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Hey, maybe maybe. I mean, for.
Speaker 9 (25:50):
Example, in the Denver series, I thought that their best
chance of winning is if Lebron James guarded Nikola Jokic,
because then you have Anthony Davis off the ball. Lebron
can't guard Aaron Gordon, he's not athletic enough anymore, right,
or Michael Porter Junior.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Or he's not going to chase around Jamal Murray.
Speaker 9 (26:09):
And he's not going to chase around Jamal Murray. And
you see with nas Reed against Nikola Jokicic that if
you have somebody who's six eight six ' nine and
really strong and gets under him, that makes him uncomfortable.
Particularly if you have a shot blocker Carol Anthony Towns
or Rudy Gobert lurking, that makes things difficult. But I
(26:30):
don't believe that Lebron wanted to do the yeoman's work
of I'm just going to put my energy into the
defensive side of the ball, and Jokis is probably going
to score on me at time make you look bad.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Which I really don't like.
Speaker 9 (26:42):
I don't want that either, But for me, it's like,
if this gives us a better chance of winning.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
So I was thinking about this, Jay mcause I was
watching that back from earlier. Is that it you know,
it's kind of predictable that you would be a star
and you would get rich and you have championships and
then you'd kind of exert some of your leverager power.
Like that's just very human. Brady was interesting because he
never did that. He wanted to keep his New England
(27:11):
reputation and sort of his standing intact. He never bullied
the coach or the owner to get his way. But
then he went to Tampa and said, Okay, I'll tweak
this culture. I want this player, that player, that coach upstairs.
So Brady was different in Tampa. He was sillier and
more fun, more relatable. But Tom for the first time
(27:32):
said this, I want this, get the coach upstairs, get
me that tight end. He didn't do that with Belichick
in New England. He didn't do it with Craft. So
Tom did get selfish is the wrong word. Tom did
get more demanding and punitive to those who wouldn't listen
to him. But he kept his New England business separate.
You could never say that about him. Ever, you could
(27:53):
argue Peyton Manning did a little bit of that. Peyton
did a certain way, and then when Peyton went to
Denver it was like, I'm gonna take my money a
little bit here. I've been one for the team guy
a little bit, and so they want he. So Peyton
Mannings Indianapolis reputation is always about the team. In Denver,
he and l Way butted a little bit on salary.
He would not have done that in the championship windows
(28:15):
as much.
Speaker 7 (28:16):
Well two things. So, first of all, football is totally
different than basketball. Football is about the team. It always
has been. Basketball is the individual.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Well, it's about the team to you know Way.
Speaker 7 (28:26):
The Jewels are the stars. They run the league because
it's so difficult to find a superstar. You know, there's
only five starters versus you know eleven, no offense defense.
And secondly, there were reports and maybe Brady once he
gets here, he can clarify it that he went to
Kraft and was like, what's he doing drafting Garoppolo? Get
him out of here?
Speaker 1 (28:45):
And then Kraft went to Belichick's documented multiple times.
Speaker 7 (28:48):
Right, so he did call his shot once, but that, yeah,
you're right that that felt a little threatened.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
I don't know why, but in fairness, he was right.
Kraft was right. He had another Super Bowl. So in fairness,
Tom was like, before you replace me, I got a
lot in the tank. Tom won Super Bowl in New
England and goes to Tampon wins.
Speaker 4 (29:10):
It so right.
Speaker 7 (29:11):
Aaron Rodgers was similar, complaining about the Jordan Lovee and
two MVPs, but he did not get the Super Bowl.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
He made a lot of squawking and didn't deliver eight
and nine's not good enough.
Speaker 7 (29:22):
Wait a minute, he got two MVP awards.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh is this the NBA awards matter?
Speaker 7 (29:27):
They were the number one came.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
It's not basketball sport. I don't care about MVP. I
couldn't say the last five NFL MVPs, Aaron won a couple.
I'm sure Mahomes got one. Who cares, But.
Speaker 7 (29:39):
I'm saying they were right there on the cusp of
the Super Bowl. It just came up short. It's not
like no.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
The difference is Tom made it move. Tom got super
Bowls at two different places. Aaron squawked and he's like, yeah, dude,
you're eight and nine in a bad NFC. Jordan Love
comes in. He's better than you. When Tom left, the
palace burnt down. When Aaron left, it got better. So
the different Aaron made demand. I don't have a problem
(30:05):
with the quarterbacks making demands. What happens when you leave.
Packers are better today. New England's a tire fight.
Speaker 7 (30:12):
Wait a minute, a little revision is they're not better.
I mean Aaron Rodgers did not his final year, but
the two year before that they were the championship. They
was the number one or number two seed.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Green Bay is absolutely better today than Aaron's last two years.
They are last.
Speaker 7 (30:31):
Year, yes, but the year before that when they had
DeVante Adams come on, they were amazing. They lost that
snow game to San France. Remember that playoff game.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
We did both teams play in the snow. They did
both sounded like an excuse. Oh he lost his snow game.
I'm sorry. Tua can't throw a deep ball. In the
cold weather to you problem, damn it?
Speaker 7 (30:52):
How do I find like you back me into a
quarter right to defend this knucklehead Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
I'm not I'm not banging on him, but you can't
compare Tom. Tom's different. I'm gonna make a demand and
I'm gonna deliver the truth after it.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
But I'm okay with the demands.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
I'm okay with demands. If Lebron wants to demand something
in his prime is different than mellow demanding something is
probably I'm getting something for it.
Speaker 7 (31:14):
But Rogers and Brady are both stars.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
There's a different one's the goat and one is a
star quarterback. Like a lot of guys that won Super Bowls,
a lot of quarterbacks want to one's the greatest player
in league history. I want the hell of a football player.
That's a big gap between that. You're making the gap
like I'm making the gap, like no, no, no, Joe
Montana and one super Bowl guy and not the same quarterback.
(31:40):
They're not the same quarterback. Aaron's closer to Matt Ryan
than Brady
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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