Lakers-Clippers, Kawhi Leonard, parity, Russell Westbook, and duos

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
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Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports
Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on
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Sports Radio. Oh here we are on a marvelous Monday,

(00:27):
live in Los Angeles. This is the Herd. Wherever you
may be, and however you may be listening iHeartRadio, Fox
Sports Radio and FS one one hour from now. Where
Colin was right, where Colin was wrong, plenty of both.
Joy Taylor is joining me in a Monday when we
had amazing soccer, amazing and it was actually an incredible

(00:47):
sports weekend, unbelievable. It is a marvelous Monday, you're right
about that. Just let's just start rhyming holiday. So let
me start with the obvious thing. Kawhi Leonard chose the
Clippers along with Paul Joe. Well, well, well, well, well,
player movement didn't kill the NBA, now, did it, all?
You fearmongers? This morning, I've got the Clippers, the Lakers,

(01:10):
the Jazz, the Bucks, the Celtics, the Sixers, the Nuggets,
the Blazers, the Rockets, and the Warriors. Ten loaded legitimate
NBA playoff teams, and I think about eight to nine
of those could win the NBA championship, maybe all ten.
I love Denver, all the fearmongers killing the NBA super teams.

(01:31):
All nap didn't work. Leagues never had more parody. Seven
to the last ten years, a new champion and I've
got no idea who's winning next year. A salary cap league,
they can all go to the same place. B the
market corrected itself, Toronto one with one star C. I

(01:54):
do think Lebron was the soul of the NBA for
about a decade. He's no longer the pied piper. People
don't follow us every move folks. We live in a
country now where everybody is in such a rush to
race to Twitter and social media to win the argument.
We never let anything bake player movement. Let it bake

(02:18):
for a few years. Yes, Lebron comes in player empowerment.
You had the Miami Big Three, and Katie goes with
the Warriors kind of copies him, and he got the
Warrior dynasty. But then players started looking around, going, well,
Miami was lucky to win a second title in four years,
probably outside of Rayal and Shot should have won one.

(02:39):
And then Kad thing it ended quickly, and it was
everybody was ripping Kadi and ripping Lebron and it baked
a little bit. And then Toronto with one Star one
and everybody's like, yeah, you just team up with one
other good guy, and you don't need to really go
with the super team. You can just team up with
one Star. And then a bunch of good players in
Toronto corrected the market that it was allowed to bake

(03:02):
a little. This is what we do now. Colin Kaepernick
signs with Nike. Let's run to Twitter, get my phone,
and Nike stock is gone down and company's dad and
nobody likes it. And yeah, four days later, the Nike
stock is up. Let stuff bake, politics, sports business. Everybody
rushes to their phone. They got to win the argument,
and everything comes out a hot opinion. And like a microwave,

(03:26):
the first time you touch the tea, the coffee, whatever
you put in the microwave, it's a little hot. Oh,
let it cool down a little bit. Folks. Look at
sports in America today, you want to know who has
a competitive balance problem. You want to know who's got
a dynasty problem. It's not stars and big cities. It's
college football. Hey, Joey, guests, who'll play for the national

(03:49):
title again this year? What it might beat? Maybe? Is
it Clemson in Alabama? Well they play last year? Yeah,
far yeah far yeah fart yeah. Rural America, it's just
like American wealth today. We're all scared that New York
in LA and Silicon Valley has all the money. The
leading economy in America this morning. The fastest growing economy
in America today is Salt Lake City. A lot of

(04:13):
people making money in small towns too. Listen, look around
the NBA. Let it bake a little bit. There's no
competitive balance issue. We had player mobility and guys lined up.
The big three in Boston won once. Miami won twice
thanks to Ray Allen should have won once. Two years

(04:34):
into the Warriors situation, it was already restless. That's blown up,
and this morning I got players everywhere. I got two
good players, three good players in Utah and Denver and Portland.
By the way, Portland's got three centers. They'll probably make
a huge deal at the trading deadline to get better.
Golden State may trade D'Angelo Russell, get another good player
that fits back. We got all sorts of movement. This

(04:57):
league has always been controlled for the record by trade.
That's how Paul George got to the Clippers, which allowed
Kawai to then choose the Clippers. Right. Kawhi told the Clippers,
you got to get another star. So an eighty one
year old executive engineered a trade. And then Kawhi said, okay,
now come So as much as we get concerned about

(05:21):
free agent, it's trade engineered. This whole puppy. We're all good.
The NBA's fine. Just like the rest of us in America.
We should have a right to be mobile, change coast,
change bosses, change brands, change companies. NBA players do. There
is no competitive balance issue. Last ten years, NBA has

(05:48):
seven different champions, and you go ahead and bet on
the Clippers and Lakers. I have no idea who's winning
the NBA title next year. Let me shift to this.
A lot of people are saying this morning, who we Kawhi?
Leonard dis Lebron. Lebron is a very unique American athlete.

(06:12):
I would put him in the Muhammad al Lee class.
We've seen Megan Rapino, although most of us didn't know
that well a month ago. But let's just say Megan Rapino,
Muhammad al Lee, Lebron James. They are athletes. They're disruptors,
they're outspoken, they're political, they're dissenters, and they are incredibly rare.

(06:40):
Most women soccer stars just won't play soccer. They don't
want to blow back. Most NBA guys don't want to
be more than an athlete. They might being an athlete.
And Muhammad Ali, he was not typical. When you look
at Lebron, Megan Rapino, when you look at Muhammad Ali,
these are unique athletes in America. Look at who's dominating

(07:03):
sports today. Brooks Keepka doesn't talk, Mike Trout doesn't talk,
Christian Polistic doesn't talk. Kawhi Leonard doesn't talk, Tom Brady,
Russell Wilson mostly avoid politics. In fact, Michael Jordan and
Tiger Woods are the two biggest stars in the last
probably thirty years in sports. I mean literally, they left

(07:23):
their sport and the ratings died. Michael Jordan and Tiger
got ripped because they didn't want anything to do with politics.
Michael Jordan Today gets ripped, Republicans buy shoes, Tiger gets ripped.
Why won't you talk about social change because I don't
want to. Politics are messy. But Lebron's different. Lebron's worldview

(07:45):
is I'm gonna do more than just play basketball. I'm
gonna be a disruptor. I'm gonna change player mobility. Kawhi
Leonard didn't choose today to dis Lebron. Kawhi Leonard's worldview
just isn't the same as Lebron's. As Kad said, Lebron
comes to your team, it's a little bit of a circus.

(08:06):
By the way, I've gone to the circus. I like
the circus. But the circus is noise and its narratives
and its stories, and it's media and its press. And
Kevin Durant said it's a circus. Well, not many players
actually want to go play with Ringling brothers. The reality
is Kauai, according to stories this morning, didn't choose the

(08:31):
Lakers for two reasons. He was concerned about the super
team label, probably because he watched Durant and Lebron get repped,
and he also didn't like the Lakers dysfunction, which Lebron
has added to when you add superstar disruptor, political dissenter,

(08:53):
Muhammad Ali, Megan Rappino and Lebron are very comfortable in
that space. Lebron's brand is more than an athlete, but
in my lifetime, most great superstars would rather just be

(09:14):
a great athlete. And that's okay too. Lebron's worldview is
the stuff will write about. But it's rare and it
always has been. All right, Colin right, Colin wrong. In
fifty minutes you knew today. I know what you were thinking,

(09:36):
because I know what I was thinking. Another star bails
on Westbrook, so I will at least acknowledge that. Coming up,
Happy Monday, Marvelous Monday, Terrific Tuesday scheduled for tomorrow. Be
sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in

(09:56):
noon Eastern n a Empacific on Fox Sports Radio FS
one and the iHeartRadio app. It's great to have you
in a Monday a Rod. Later in the show, Colin right,
Colin wrong, and of course Joey Taylor heard news coming
up around the corner. Yesterday was a great American soccer day.
By the way, in the morning, I got the United
States Women. Then at night. I even flew after that game,
landed in LA watched the Men. It was an incredible

(10:19):
day of soccer. One one lost one, but both fun
to watch. So the Raptors, by the way, had a
chance to get Russell Westbrook this weekend and the best
GM in the NBA. Some say said no, thank you.
And Sam Presty, by the way, couldn't keep Paul George.
He couldn't keep Kevin Durant. Both Kevin Durant and Paul
George while playing with Westbrook. We're calling other teams. I

(10:44):
said this the triple double and the embrace of it
and the pursuit of it would come back to haunt Westbrook.
It now defines him. For all you young broadcasters and
you young athletes, be careful of the brand you and brace.
Magic Johnson and Lebron James have their record for most

(11:04):
playoff triple doubles, but they've never embraced it. They never
wanted to be defined by it. It's a stat and
they're not stat guys. Magic Johnson triple doubles, it never
talks about that. Lebron James triple doubles, no interest in
embracing that. Carmelo Anthony acknowledged in OKAC they were goosing
Westbrooks rebounding stats. He embraced it, he put his arms

(11:27):
around it, and it shifted his brand. When Russell Westbrook
came into the NBA, his brand go back his first
seven eight years in the league. It was, Oh my god,
crazy hops, crazy fun, unbelievably hyper athletic, unbelievably dynamic. Have
you seen this Westbrook guy? In the last three years,
his brand has become triple double, triple double. And the

(11:52):
NBA has never been more about playing well with others,
and his brand has never been more about a individual stat.
I said it at the time, the triple double. The
media pushed it, promoted it, market it, sell it hurt him.

(12:15):
He's a stat guy. Now he's a stat guy. And
the NBA players are not only more about winning than stats.
Good god, how many of the NBA players gave up
one hundred and ninety million guaranteed over the last week.
I count like six of them, five of them. And
not about the money. It's not about the individual stats.

(12:37):
It's about joining another star and winning a bunch of games.
Be careful embracing the brand you think is great. He
put his arms around it. It's about the number. His
brand now is an individual stat not what it was
years ago, which is, Oh, I'd love to play with
that guy. I'd love to watch that guy. I'd love

(12:58):
to see that guy. By the way, Harden's better without him,
Durant's better without him. Sabona is better without him, Oladipo
better without him. Want to bet Paul George is better
without him. Triple double turn off. NBA today is not
about getting your number. It's not even it's not even

(13:19):
by the way load management. It's not even about getting
your minutes. It's not even about getting cash. Stars are
giving up millions. I would never do it. It's about
winning and playing well with others. His brand now is
triple double and exhausted by the time the playoffs get here.
Remember this piece of videotape rest stop about the scream

(13:42):
of switch on D. It's a free and it's no good.
He is one of nine. I'm just shooting in the court.
I got he's got it, I've gotta hell challenge. That's
time of two. How another messages he's tired, he's got
nothing in the tag off is nothing. He's forty excruciating

(14:03):
heavily lean nine minutes. You gotta play forty minutes to
get trouble doubles. Winning January means exhausted. In May, he
embraced the wrong brand Joy with a news no, no,
turn on the news. This is the herd line news.

(14:25):
What a soccer weekend? Huh crazy? I had mooves so
much fun. Yesterday, great games. Well UNS women's national team
accomplished defeat that even Miah Ham couldn't pull off. They
went back to back Women's World Cups. They defended their
titles yesterday, defeating the Netherlands to nothing. Mega Ropedo Rapino
scored the first goal from the penalty spot in Rose
withvel seal the game in the sixty ninth minute to

(14:47):
give them their fourth World Cup. Her amazing stuff. You know,
I went yesterday and I went and looked up Mega
Ropedo's life story. It's really incredible. I mean, her family's had,
by the way, it's not all been rainbows and sunshine. No,
of course not. She's had, you know, a brother that's
been incarcerated. But you know, when that penalty kick was
so chill, You're watching somebody that she has been better

(15:12):
in the biggest moments. This is somebody. When you read
her life story, you get why she's not bothered by anything.
We also, I mean, that's really when it comes down
to it. When you watch champions in the biggest moments,
they look like they were meant to be there, like
they were made to be there, whereas you know, you
were I might be sitting there shaking and shivering and
sweating and nervous. It's like this is what they prepared

(15:34):
for their entire life, and it's just it's it's just
like combing your hair. It's just something that you do
every day. They were They were incredible yesterday. They really
it really makes you so proud. Second, let's one of
the things I said last week, and I think you
were here for that. It was Thursday, and I said,
I wish our men played with the aggressiveness of our women.

(15:55):
The two stars yesterday that scored goals for us, we're
both injured. So this wasn't a perfect World Cup. We
had injuries making Rapino missed a game, Rose scored a
goal she would Lavelle was hurt. So you know this
idea that it was all rainbow and sunshine, there were injuries,
There was a lot of noise and controversy, and I

(16:16):
mean to me, I wish our men played with this
kind of brisboto and this kind of confidence and this
kind of attacking style. Well that's kind of where it
comes from, right, like the ability to play through those
injuries and not allow the outside noise or the controversy
or I don't know, you know, the president of the
country that you're representing talking about you is being a

(16:38):
team and having confidence, and when you have that belief
in yourself, you're ever able to overcome all of those things.
They were incredible and you know, just as a minor notes,
the entire stadium was standing for equal pay afterwards. So
I think it's probably time we just take care of that.
So Magic Johnson says he's disappointed that Kauai chose the Clippers.
Before the news was made public, Lakers were allegedly amongst

(16:59):
the runners land Kawai, and Magic himself reportedly spoke to
Kawhi one on one. He told the La Times. For
the Lakers, there's disappointment, but joy two. In a perfect world,
you'd love to have Kawuhi. But hey, the Lakers ain't
going anywhere. Everybody tried. That's all you can do. I'm
a Laker man. I was hoping all day. But for
the league it turned out great, and for this town,
it's the king of basketball. You know, this really was

(17:21):
the If you're somebody who was not into the super
teams and you know the whatever we've been dealing with
with Golden State for the past couple of years and
Miami before that, and you know you're against all that,
this is the perfect case scenario for you. So you
can't have any complaints because Kawai did not join up

(17:41):
with Lebron and Anthony Davis. And yes he did join
another superstar in another star in Paul George, but the
league is so balanced now you can't make any arguments
for it. So if the new issues now you just
want to have. You know, it's funny. I'm listening to
all the shows. The team that's getting nobody's talking about
is den So Denver last year the best record right

(18:02):
for a long time, and it was the Joker, who
is one of the most skilled big men of our lives,
and all these young guys, Jamal Murroy became a star.
Denver MGA news. Denver's like, we like our team. We
just gotta bake this thing a little bit. Watch Denver,
Lakers gonna get talked about, Warriors gonna get talked about.
Jazz is gonna get talked about. Denver finished with a
second best record in the West, and they're just all back.

(18:25):
Their coach was arguably the best coach in the league.
They've got one of the best big bad NBA body,
but one of the best bigs. Denver is the by
the way, the Clippers, the quiet team just got Kauai.
I've never seen a great pro team. Nobody's talking about Denver.
Watch out. Yeah, they're just laying there, creeping. They're letting
everybody else get the attention, and they'll be there in
the end. And finally, we were just talking about Russell Westbrook.

(18:48):
Will he be in Okacy At the start of the season,
there's some rumblings about the Heat being interested. After the
Thunder traded Paul George, some more speculation has been coming
up about where he's going to go, and the Rockets,
weirdly enough, could be a potential destination, according to Sam
Ammick of The Athletic Rival. Execs have also pinpointed the
rock As as a likely suitor, which would come as

(19:10):
no surprise considering the way Darryl Morey has prioritized the
pursuit of stars. The notion of Westbrook sharing the floor
with two other ball dominant guards as unorthodox when Maria's
long held a belief that landing as many elite players
as possible is the path to championship glory. Okay, Tim Ellot,
so he's an analytics guy. Okay, he liked Mellow. Mellow
doesn't shoot threes. It was a mess. And Westbrook doesn't

(19:32):
shoot threes, Like he's an analytic. If you're an analytics guy,
if you were in a fashion and you dressed like me,
I'd be like, you know, you're off brand a little.
I thought he was the analytics guy, an analytic people
like threes. Mellow and Westbrook don't shoot threes. Well, I
don't get it. I don't get it. I mean a
lot of people were against the Butler move, which I
didn't think wasn't necessarily a bad mood but move, but

(19:55):
still held some question marks as far as what the
chemistry was going to be. But what answer Westbrook into
the situation makes no sense whatsoever. Now Westbrook in Miami,
to me makes a little more sense. Yes, But I
don't think if they have the pieces to make that happen.
That being said, nobody was even considering Butler going to
Miami and then poof, he's there. So you never count
pat Riley out what he's able to maneuver. However, Houston,

(20:17):
I mean, I just think that this is Houston trying
to figure something out because everybody else is making moves
and they're there every year and they can never get
over the humps. It's like, we got to do something.
But this, I mean, this makes no sense to me.
It just it just isn't a fit with which another
ball centric guard. Isn't that the knock on Chris Paul?
Isn't that the knock on hardened? So you have three balls? Actually,
I will say this about Westbrook's personality even fits Miami.

(20:39):
He's a fashion guy. I know he'd be perfect. Yeah,
and I think that Butler and him would actually play
well together like that. That's a fit to me. This
isn't This is not Joey with the news on our
marvelous Monday News and thanks for stopping by. All right,
Chris Bruce starred. What God's David's going on? It's crazy
in THEBA Chris Bruce All all right, So I go

(21:01):
to you know, I was with my kids all weekend,
and uh, I took Friday off and then nothing happened.
And then I went to bed and I woke up
Saturday morning. I'm like, oh, we got a little we
got a little movement. I'm on radio shows everywhere. So
a lot of people are saying, well, Chris, you had
you had the Clippers out of it, And your response
to that was Thursday morning, they were essentially out of

(21:22):
it because Kawai was not going to the Clippers unless
they had a second Star. And the Clippers understood this.
I'm told his latest Friday afternoon, Doc Rivers thought Kawhi
was going to the Lakers. Yeah, but they were trying
to get Paul George. But it was it was obviously
gonna be difficult within a few days to get that
type of trade done. But once the Clippers got the
second Star and Kawhi was giving them time, that's obviously

(21:46):
what the delay was for. Yes, but he was giving
them time. Once they got that, it made all the
sense in the world. Yeah, Kawhi took his time. You know,
this morning, a lot of people are gonna say, you know,
another guy didn't choose Lebron. I, as I said to
start the show, I don't see it as that Lebron
is Muhammad Ali. He is a disruptor, he is a dissenter,

(22:07):
he's unique, and that he's not a political but very political.
Most athletes don't want to beat Michael Jordan, don't want
anything to do with politics, don't anything can do. Kawhi
chose not anti Lebron, but anti drama. Lebron's teams are dramatic,
they're noisy, they're political there and I think a lot
of that with Kawhi looked at it and he just thought,

(22:29):
man I got magic, I got Lebron, I got the
LA media. It's clearly LA didn't bother him. Well, he
wanted LA. I mean, he wanted southern California. I think
the narrative that nobody wants to play with Lebron is
overstated because obviously Anthony Davis moves heaven and earth to
play with him at risk, has put his image on
the line right to play with him. So some players

(22:49):
want to play when the role players have never been
a problem. You had guys waiting around to see what
Kawai did to play with the Lakers and Lebron, so
role players have never been a Some stars may want to,
but other stars don't. I don't think it's because he's political.
I think it's because other stars want their own team.

(23:10):
Before I began reporting this out and finding out that
Kawuhi really was serious about going to the Lakers, I
was thinking, why in the world he just won the
championship with no other star, Why would he go to
someone else's team. Because even if Lebron would have done
exactly what he said to Kauai and a d I'm
gonna step back, I'm gonna be the point guard. I'm

(23:32):
gonna defer to you guys. And let's see, say Lebron's
the third leading scorer, averages twenty one points eleven assists.
It's still Lebron James's team, and many stars want their
own team, which I like. I respect that, So that's
one of the reasons. And then I think, like you said,
the drama, I don't think it has anything with Lebron's

(23:54):
politics and all that he's doing. I think though he
brings drama, I can't remember the last season there wasn't
drama circus. His teams are just noisy, and I'm wondering
like now this year with Boogie Cousins and Rondo, now
there are there's a lot of drama that can happen.
But before they did that, when when they got the
a D trade, I was just like, Okay, what what

(24:15):
dramas they're going to be to stir up? There? Really
shouldn't be any. But I think that's another thing players
want to avoid. But a lot of Look, these guys
respect Lebron and they're following in his footsteps. What Kawai did.
I said, Lebron is a boss and he is right.
This was the biggest boss move I've ever seen by

(24:35):
a player in the NBA. My twenty five years are
covered to get another star who has three years left
on this deal, just signed the deal last year, spurned Lebron,
spurned the Lakers, spurned his home area to get him
a year later to demand a trade and get it

(24:56):
done all within a week. That's incredible. Kawhi was apparently
a recruiter and now, and you know how I feel
about that. When John Wall and Derrick Rose and Westbrook
are like, I don't recruit, I'm like, social media is
all about salesmanship. Let's let the whole world now is
projecting my image, my brand. Westbrook's very much about style,

(25:19):
so he's projecting self and he's selling himself. Like apparently
Kawhi was a very good recruiter on the phone. One
of my favorite rappers of all time, cares One had
a lyric bad real bad boys move in silence, and
I can't think of a better description of Kawhi Leonard,
Like he had the entire NBA stumped. Kylin, like you

(25:41):
mentioned me, I thought he was going to the Lakers,
so many other people were saying he was going to
the Lakers. Then you have people saying he's definitely going
to the Clip or to the Raptors. Like he had
the entire league stumped. And to keep that quiet it
was amazing. And so he People underestimate Kauai because he's

(26:03):
so quiet. But if you look at the past few years,
he's gotten exactly what he wanted. He got out of
San Antonio, he wins the championship in Toronto, he gets
back to Southern California, he gets his second star. He
is a he's something else. What are they called gangsta?
He's gang We got another now we got another gangs

(26:27):
in La Okay. So I look at all these teams.
We have parody. I've said before, I'm not sure parody
gets better ratings because I don't think the Denver Nuggets
against the Clippers. How about the Milwaukee Utah Final? You
want again again? I everybody, everybody is just loving it today.
And I get it because everybody feels like in the
Big Land grab everybody got an acre and I get

(26:48):
it and I but at the end of the year,
the NFL dominates when they get the Packers and the
Eagles and the Patriots and the Steelers. Jacksonville was everybody's nightmare,
right like, Oh, Jacksonville Upper Bowl. I like watching the NBA.
I'm a diehardy, so I'll watch you taught Denver anything.
I mean this year, joy and I kept say, I
love the Eastern Conference playoffs. But to get the casual fan,

(27:08):
thirty percent of them moved in a lot of them don't.
I will tell you this, though, is this idea that
the Clippers now are a home run. I think it fits.
I'm not sure if the Lakers stuff fits. I mean,
this morning, I look at the Lakers and Rondo appears shot.
Boogie's had two major injuries and he's only making three
point five large, Danny Green's making four and a half

(27:28):
times more. Boogie's gonna look at that and think, really,
Danny Greene, I like, but what if you got to
play him thirty minute tonight. Jared Dudley's a good shooter
high IQ, but kind of can't defend the Lakers rosters. Odd. Look,
I think the Lakers did the best they could do.
Once Kauhi went to the Clippers, what was left. They

(27:50):
did the best they could do. And Boogie, First of all,
Boogie should understand that part of the reason he's not
getting big money is obviously the injuries, and obviously his
style of play in today's game, but it's also the
attitude problems. And because he was a good soldier in
Golden State doesn't make people think, oh he's he's changed,

(28:11):
You're gonna be a good soldier here. No, they understand
the culture they had in Golden stay Moss for two
years was perfect in New England before or after, So
so Boogie should understand if I want to get that
big bag in a year or two, I've got to
be a good soldier. If he starts acting up, I
don't think he will, but if he starts acting up,
has an attitude. The Lakers need to get rid of

(28:31):
him prompto. I mean, don't don't. I Well, first of all,
they still have Lebron in a d I know, but
you mentioned everybody but Lebron in a dre. They're shooting
improved that Danny Green can shoot, Quinn Cook can shoot,
they get they got shooters. I will say this, there's
some dysfunction like last year, but I will give the Lakers.

(28:52):
I thought Quinn Cook was a sneaky good move. That
was a sneaky good move. My only hesitation is we've
seen a lot of guys play well in Golden State
and then they go elsewhere and they can't do it.
But I that said, I do like Quinn Cook. I
like the Lakers, but I'm with you that the West
is just stacked. I think the eight playoff teams are
set in my view, and there is this much difference

(29:15):
between them. The Clippers I slightly favor over the Lakers
as the best team in the West. By the way,
there was a popular sports opinionist who once shared these thoughts.
The triple double will hurt Westbrook hurt? How is it
hurt him? His brand? Now? Is a stat by the way,

(29:37):
Magic Lebron lead the NBA all time in triple double playoffs.
Neither one talks about it, neither one wants to be
defined by it. They're both about the process, the team,
the community. Nobody wants to play with the best book not.
It has nothing to do with the triple double, though,
you don't if he averaged twenty five, ten and seven

(29:59):
with would the narrative be any different. But the triple
double became all we talked about for three Well that look,
I've stood by Russell Westbrook. I respect what he's done.
I think that's his legacy. He's going to be a legend, Colin.
He's a legend for the triple double. He won't win
a championship, not as the main guy. Maybe you know,
later in his career, if he becomes a role player somewhere,

(30:22):
he could win it like a Gary Payton did. But
he's not going to lead a team to a championship. Thus,
a trade for him, right, If you trade for Russell Westbrook,
and most gems around the league know it, you're trading
for relevancy, significance, to put fans in the stands. That's
what you're trade for and maybe a second round, maybe

(30:44):
a third round playoff appearance. That's it. You're not trading
to win a championship because you know he's not leading
you great, I'm a legend, basically, I'm a Alan Iverson's
a legend. Okay, I'd much rather be magic and he's not.
But west Brook's not that. He's not that. He's not
that type of players that level. You guys told me

(31:06):
for years this is the phase. This guy is amazing.
So this is all about you. I'm just saying nothing
against the guy, but I'm like, in the end, it's
like there are many players. Charles Barkley when he was
playing everybody all, he doesn't play defense, he doesn't want
to win. Barkley played very well with others in Phoenix,
very how about in Houston did he play well with others?

(31:28):
And Enix his others were Kevin Johnson was banged up
a lot, great but banged up all the time. Damn Marley.
They were significantly lower than Barkley. He's more talented. No,
I'm just saying, like, look, here's the this is where
Westbrook needs to go. Where I don't Miami, it'd be
a hell. Marry I mean, they're not going anywhere. They're

(31:48):
lower run playoff team. Let's say, Hell, mary Man h
New York. From what I'm told, not interested Houston. That's
just ridiculous. I mean, like you said, that's come on,
stop it. Uh Detroit, that's where he should go. That's
the because Detroit tried the typical let's tear it down
and get lottery picks and rebuild. They missed the playoffs

(32:09):
eight out of nine years, and then they decide, let's
flip the script. Let's try to be relevant and good now.
So they trade for Blake Griffin. Blake's not leading you
to a championship. They got in the in the eighth
seat of the playf go get Westbrook. Is he gonna
win you a championship? No? But you get Westbrook in
the East, you make the second round of the playoffs,

(32:31):
you maybe, if if things, maybe you get to the
conference finals. I'm just saying, like, you're relevant. If you're
the Detroit Pistons, you need it. You're the one team
I see where it fits with Blake and him work together.
I don't know, but at least one's a guard and
one's a forward. Let try it. I would never go

(32:51):
to Detroit again. Because the two players in the NBA
that hate me most, or Westbrook and Blake Griffin, you
put them on the same team. I'm not even gonna
land deport I'd be like Captain just eap flying. I
am not loved my wife. Maybe from this state. Nobody
likes me here Chris Bruce, are good seeing you, Bud,
David Griffin, Pelicans, GM, Holy Molis he had a great
month joining us. Next hour a Rod as well, Colin right,

(33:13):
Colin wrong, coming up next speaking against us, speaking a boss.
Did you notice who came out not just Kawai as
the big winner this week? That's next. Be sure to
catch live editions of the Herd weekdays and non Easter
ninety Empacific All Star Game will be on Fox. Listening
to broad Man for Get interviewed on the First Things

(33:33):
First this morning, all sorts of stuff. That London game.
By the way, Red Sox Yankees apparently made a fortune
and they're gonna send the Cubs and Cardinals over there
next year. So aluminum carry on from away. Luggage best
best luggage I've ever had, these these luggage. Joy's got one,
I've got one. I use it. Oh, weekend. I love
it awaytravel dot Com slash colin awaytravel dot Com slash

(33:54):
Colin twenty bucks off end of the promo code calls
you use yours all weekend. It's the best, best best
luggage in the country, and it's it's incredible, so you
know it just Jerry West is the logo, Like the
logo in the NBA is Jerry West. And I saw
Jerry West play for a year. I started watching sports
back in nineteen seventy two. I was born in sixty four.

(34:16):
Nineteen seventy two, I'm eight, and that was the year
the Miami Dolphins won a Super Bowl of the Washington
Redskins and Jerry West, Gayale Goodrich and Wilton the Lakers
were good. And that's the first year in a little
black and white TV in my rural hometown of Washington State.
That's the first year I remember watching sports. It was
nineteen seventy two. So I watched the Super Bowls, the

(34:36):
first game I ever remember watching. And then I remember
after that watching some it was like Wilt and Jerry
and Gale Goodrich, and Jerry became the logo and we
know he was a great player, but he's been an
unbelievable executive. So after this weekend. He helped build the
Lake Lakers dynasty. In the eighties, he traded for Kobe
on Draft Day. He convinced Shack scary moment gave a

(34:58):
a lot to get him Los Angeles. He demanded the
Warriors do not trade Clay Thompson for Kevin Love, threatened
to quit the Warriors if they made the move. He
oversaw Durant to the Warriors. Now he signed Paul George
and Kawhi Leonard. There's really I mean pat Riley's second.
But I will tell you this. I love millennials. I'm

(35:22):
pro millennial. I'm into my kids like I get it.
But man, do we want to bury the oil barons.
Bill Belichick runs the NFL. He's sixty seven. Nick Saban
runs college sports. He's sixty seven. Jerry West this weekend
ran the NBA. He's eighty one. Kawhi Leonard got a
phone call from Cool Magic, not interested, got a phone

(35:44):
call from Lebron not interested. Yet he went to dinner
with eighty one year old Jerry West at a steakhouse,
sat across from him and said, I like, you just
get me another player. And so Jerry did, by the way,
one of the reasons, according to reports this morning, that
Jerry West got him in for our FS one viewers
were showing Lebron over there with Jerry West at the

(36:05):
Summer League because Jerry West at eighty one didn't rush
to Twitter to get credit. Unlike Magic, he didn't call
the La Times to get credit. Jerry West did not
seek credit. Paul George's name was not uttered once in
free agency like the rest of you. My jaw hit
the floor when I heard the story. By the way,

(36:25):
Chris Paul Blake Griffin, remember those trades. You didn't hear
a thing here anything They traded everybody. You didn't hear
him a second before. This is one of the things
I love about Jerry West. I loved Darryl Moorey. But
the Houston Rockets average a leak per week the last
twelve years. The New York Knicks nine thousand promises, ten

(36:48):
thousand leaks, none of it transpires. The Lakers, Magic stop
calling newspapers. After you get off the phone with Kawhi, Leonard,
Jerry West, Belichick saman not great on social media, but
they're grown ups, and I do believe Kawhi Leonard does
not trust many people. I do believe from all the

(37:09):
stories I've read on Kawhi he there's an old saying,
love many trust few. I was told that years ago
by an older woman, and it's always stuck with me.
Love many trust few. Kawhi doesn't trust a lot of people.
But I think he sits in that steakhouse with Jerry
West and he's not the coolest and he's not the hippest,

(37:29):
but I think Kawhi Leonard trusts him, and Jerry keeps
it quiet and I listen. I think pat Riley does
the same. Should be noted. The Jimmy Butler move. I
didn't hear much about that, but I know there is
a lot of people in sports curry favor by leaking information,

(37:50):
and I live on it, so I love it. But
you know, Kawhi Leonard made a choice this weekend, and
it was a choice of trust and you to hear anything.
I mean, I'm reading these stories on Kawhi Leonard and
Paula George and this thing was going on for like
forty eight hours and not a peep, not a peep,

(38:12):
Colin Wright, Colin wrong. Top of the hour, I'm seeing
all these odds this morning about all these shifting odds
you know might take away on this stuff is in
the moment, it feels like a big win for the
NBA because Utah and Denver, A Dallas is good, Milwaukee obviously,

(38:34):
Toronto's got a rebuild, so it's it's not a huge
win for them. But you go to the Vegas board,
it's the Clippers won, the Bucks, the Lakers, the Warriors, Sixers, Warriors, Rockets, Jazz, Denver,
Boston and Portland. I want to throw this out. Do
not forget this. This is one of these things that
was not talked about this weekend. The Portland Trailblazers acquired

(38:55):
us On Whiteside last year of his contract. They also
have two other centers they like, Nurkitch bringing back slowly
off an injury, and Zach Collins. At the trading deadline.
The Portland Trailblazers are going to have a massive expiring
contract from Hassan white Side. They're going to play him

(39:18):
until the trading deadline because Nurkitch is hurt. The Portland Trailblazers,
who have maybe the best backcourt after Stephen Clan in
the league. Rodney Hood Nurk Jack Collins. They will be
able to move that Hassan white Side contract, and teams
are gonna line up for that baby because it's twenty
five million and it's expiring. Do not be shocked if

(39:41):
a team maybe in the East, is willing to give
them a really nice piece for Hassan white Sides expiring contract.
So nobody's talking about Portland. Keep your eye on the Blazers.
This is a time and I don't remember I think
we've seen it in college football where the South just
feels better. There's just more good high school football players
and the South, the West, and the East. I mean,

(40:02):
who's the third best team, fourth best team in the East.
There's going to be a team like a like a
Dallas that's not going to make the playoffs. I mean,
there's going to be a good NBA team. So right now,
I don't agree with this NBA championship odds. They have
it in Vegas Clippers, Bucks, Lakers, on six Ers, Warriors, Rockets.
I have the Rockets lower, I have the Jazz higher,

(40:25):
I have Denver higher. I'd say Clippers one, Warriors one A,
and then I'm just gonna wait and see on the Lakers.
I'm not rushing into a judgment. There's just the Lakers
make a great movie poster, the Clippers make a great movie.
I want to see if the poster becomes the movie.

(40:47):
I'm not sure. Next Colin right, Colin wrong? In La
one more Herd. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day,
seven days a week within the iHeartRadio app Search Herd
to listen live or on demand whenever you like. Ah,
here we go, hour two. This is the Herd, wherever
you may be in however you may be listening. iHeartRadio,

(41:09):
Fox Sports Radio FS one Joy Taylor's joining me. A
trade just got made and it's it's not insignificant. Actually
it's free agent signing. My bad, Avery Bradley is now
going to the Lakers. He's a point guard. They didn't
have one. Really. Rondo's a backup at this point in
his career. So Avery Bradley, remember him a couple of
years ago, played for the Celtics, and then he ended

(41:29):
up going to like Detroit, and then you go to
the Clippers and Blake Griffin trade. I think it was
so the Lakers basically went into this weekend with a
lot of needs and they answered him. They got some shooting,
they got more size, Jabale McGee, Boogie cousins, and they
also just landed a starting point guard, Avery Bradley, who
struggles with injuries. But so does Rondo at this point.

(41:51):
So the Lakers will not be one of the more
dynamic backcourts in the NBA, but their front court and
their wings are exceptional, and they do have shooters. So
that's this doesn't say on that significant, but Avery Bradley,
if he gets sixty five games out of him, is
a starting point guard in the NBA. He's not high end,
but he's serviceable. They were struggling with a serviceable part.
I was driving to work this morning. I kept thinking,

(42:12):
Lakers don't have a point guard that kind of matters
in the NBA. So they now they've signed Avery Bradley.
There you go. He's got a clear waivers two years,
about ten million bucks with the Lakers. Wow, all right,
Joy is joining us. Crazy weekend A rod later this hour.
You spent time down in the Bahamas. So you were

(42:34):
on the other side of the world. Yeah. Literally, I
don't know if I can be further away, but I
didn't miss I didn't miss all the fun the action
here in La No nor the great soccer yesterday. All right,
here we go, Colin right, Colin wrong. On a Monday
where Colin was right, Five of the ten All Stars
are on new teams. Player movements. Okay, don't be afraid
of it. It actually created great parody. Super Teams was

(42:56):
a blip. It happened, but they never win as many
titles as every buddy thinks. I think you just have
to remember it. Unlike baseball, this is a salary cap league,
and eventually there's too many great players, and there's too
many teams and there's not enough money for one team.
I don't think the Clippers are a dominant team. I
do think they should be favored to win the title.
But we kept saying this over and over. Stop fearing

(43:20):
player movement. It will sort itself out. Just give it time.
Where Colin was raw, I like Zion Williamson a lot.
I have said. I think he has a chance by
the end of his first year to be a kind
of a borderline All Star. Well, he played nine minutes
in Summer League and got hurt, which is one of
the things I've been told by scouts. They worry about
he plays with such volume and intensity and torque. He's

(43:44):
out nine minutes into it. By the way, Charles Barkley
told me to simmer down last week. He said, settle
down on telling everybody call him that Zion Williams is
going to be an All Star. He's got to get
better as a basketball player, because you know he's not
gonna be bigger, drong, winning guys in the NBA. We
won't be planning against North Carolina State Clifton. He's gonna

(44:06):
be playing against Anthony David, Blake, Drammen, So he kind
of get much better as a basketball player. I hate
all these guys on TV talking about he's big and strong.
I'm like, yeah, we called at the NBA, everybody's got
some big, strong guys. Yeah, and his jumper definitely needs

(44:27):
some work. But I do love him. Where Colin was right, Listen,
I'm not going to go on and on about it,
but the Westbrook situation, we've had two stars in their
prime flirting actively with rival teams when they're with Westbrook.
I think he's become too much about stats. And I
also think there are just certain players in the history
of me watching the NBA that are great talents they're
not necessarily winning basketball players. I always felt was about

(44:49):
Stephen Marbury. I'd pay to watch him play. I never
thought he was really a winning basketball player. I grew
up with a guy named World b Free have never
heard of him. He was unbelievable. I love World b
Free well and really a win basketball player, you know,
And I would say this, I get why Westbrook is popular.
He's fun. You know, It's like a Michael Vick component.

(45:11):
When Michael Vick played for Atlanta, you couldn't turn the
television off. I've never seen a player played quarterback like
Michael Vick. But over time we looked at Michael Vick
and went, you know, he wasn't necessarily a great, winning quarterback,
but he was good for the league and he was fun,
and he did kind of create a new group of
players getting the opportunity to play quarterback. The best athlete.
But I feel that about Westbrook. Great athlete, absolutely winning

(45:33):
basketball player. Not really where Colin was wrong. I don't
understand five NBA stars turned down Max money. You guys
fight so hard on this collective bargaming and then you
don't take advantage of it. Can you imagine me arguing
with my bosses almost going on strike to get vacation

(45:53):
time and then refusing to take it. Guys, it's a
hundred and ninety million dollars. You fight in these labor agreements,
and the NBA is a labor driven league. Unlike other sports.
You fight for the money and then you're all willing
to give it up. Like I know him makes shoe deals.
I know it. But the reason billionaires are billionaires. They

(46:15):
don't give up fifty million dollars guaranteed. I think agents
give up more money than bad poker players. I would
love to see players be a little more patient, but
I do get the current culture where you want to
join other dudes. Where Colin was right. NBA draft picks
are increasingly irrelevant. Again, They're not in the NFL, They're

(46:37):
not in maybe baseball or hockey. But the current basketball
culture is fine talent regardless of age, and get him paid,
and I think it actually can often hurt the player.
They get hurt earlier, they get hurt more. There's more busts.
Jerry West gave up five picks two draft swaps. I mean,
you saw what the Lakers gave up to get stars.

(46:58):
In college football, a player is able to build a
brand in college, come to the NFL physically at twenty two,
capable of dominating and just lead the NFL and jersey
sales and contribute in the NBA. Zion's rare. You start
kind of creating a brand in college because I know
who you are, and then you move into the NBA
and you can be an all star level player. I

(47:19):
think we're in such a rush to pay basketball talent
when it's like, what about their emotional growth? Nineteen years old?
Throwing me and Ritz Carlton's by myself with a bunch
of twenty eight year old veterans. Also, these young guys
that come into the league at eighteen, they break down.
They're not physically ready. Who at eighteen's ready to be
a pro athlete outside of maybe a golfer. So you know,
the basketball culture now as draft picks are not they're

(47:42):
just all they're just pieces to get you better players.
I mean, when you get an eighteen year old, how
long in most instances do you have to wait till
he can help you? In May and June seven years eight?
Where Colin was wrong. I never bought into Tom Brady
playing until he's forty five. I never have I've said
he's going to retire. Here Over the weekend, tom Brady

(48:05):
ran a forty yard dash. Okay, it was five one seven.
That beats his forty time when Tom Brady came out
of college. I'm not joking. Tom Brady at forty one
years old, takes such good care of himself. It's the
power of diet, lifestyle, physical discipline. He's still the best

(48:26):
clutch quarterback in the NFL. But I've never really bought
into this whole played a forty five thing. But there
is video now of him running this weekend of forty
beating his time eighteen years ago. He'd not retire anytime soon.
Where Colin was right. We sort of mocked the Lakers
last week when Magic rushed to the La Times and

(48:47):
leaked information. Can we just any time you see a
business and there's a bunch of leaks coming out of
closed doors, what that tells you is it's a political
business and there's a lot of people protecting themselves. You know,
Rob Polinka made sure he didn't look too bad. There

(49:08):
were leaks on that side. Magic going to newspapers and
I don't know Polinka. I know Magic a little, and
I like him, but it's always a bad sign. You
never hear anything leaking much from a like you know,
New England. You don't hear a lot of leaks from
well run organizations. And I think it in the end,
it was a little bit of the undoing that Kaide

(49:30):
didn't want to be part. There's a story this morning
where he just thought it was too combustible in the
front office for Los Angeles, too many leaks. Where Colin
was right, Christian Poulisic, don't let anybody tell you just
because you haven't loved soccer for thirty years, you can't
figure it out. This kid is by so far and

(49:50):
away the best American soccer talent on the planet now.
Three goals, three assists in the Gold Cup last night,
he was in the first half. It was one of
the best half I've ever seen him play, one of
the best first halfs I've ever seen an American soccer
player play. He won the award for the Gold Cup
despite the United States losing to Mexico as the best
young Talent. He had three opportunities in the first half

(50:12):
to score or help somebody else score. We just don't
have the finishers beyond him to wrap up the present
that he raps nicely. Soccer fans tend to be a
little defensive because they've been mocked forever, and they shout
down from the rooftops that you don't get the sport.
It doesn't take a genius to watch Christian Pulistic for
thirty minutes and go, oh god, he's way better than

(50:36):
anybody I've ever seen where our Jersey, where Colin was raw.
I thought the first time in Los Angeles that I
would see and face an earthquake. I would be courageous
and glib and smart, and I would essentially save America. Instead,
for five seconds, I didn't know it was an earthquake,

(50:56):
and then I just froze and say anything. And here's
the video tape from Thursday. They were one in six
against winning teams last year and suddenly they think, O
b J and Olivier Vernhon, they're having an earthquake right now. Yeah,
we are having an earthquake in Los Angeles. Yeah, I

(51:22):
was a big one. That was about ten seconds of
an earthquake in Los Angeles. I honestly I thought somebody
was gonna I thought somebody was grabbing my desk. I've
never been in an earthquake, certainly not on the air.
We'll take a break. We just we just had a
little earthquake, not that little. Yeah, I thought I was

(51:44):
going to be more courageous. You know what. That's unfortunate
because that that is, that is a revealing moment when
you're in a crisis and you freeze. Oh, I know
a situation. I don't want to be with you, And
this is why I should never. I didn't panic, but
I didn't do anything. Well, I mean, what are you
supposed to do. You're supposed to climb under your desk
or something, save America. I didn't do anything. I did

(52:06):
anyone need saving. I look at that face. That is
something that is a face of fear, of true fear.
That is so funny. I'm sorry you had to experience that.
I missed here. Yeah, I've I've felt earthquakes here before,
though that not that was a very serious earthquake, obviously
the ones I've felt before. And there were a couple

(52:26):
of local LA newscasters who during it jumped under their desk. Yeah,
I didn't. You didn't do that. I didn't want to
do that. I didn't know. It's a good look that
you didn't do that. There's what I'm saying. You didn't panic.
You just you know, you just a little frozen a
little bit. I'm not independable in crisis, but I'm not.
You're not gonna make a situation worse. There you go.
Thank you. H David Griffin has had one of the
great months in the history of the NBA front office

(52:47):
running the Pelicans. He gets Zion big, big trade with
the Lakers. He's at Summer League. He's gonna join us
next and to talk about what we're seeing in the
National Basketball Association, which is the kind of parody I've
never seen before. He's next. Plus around the corner, not
long from here, a Rod will be joining us from
the Baseball All Star Game. It's the All Star break.
Mike Trout's still great, and the Dodgers and Lakers are

(53:08):
on fire. That's coming up. Be sure to catch live
editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Easter nine am
Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app.
Great news, quick and easy way you could save money
go to Geico dot com. Geico dot com fifteen minutes
could save you a fifteen percent. Well you know it's
weird when you are running an NBA franchise, the personnel part,

(53:30):
and a star comes to you and says, hey, I
don't want to play here. You can get angry, you
can get mad, or you can just trade him and
get the most pieces possible. David Griffins, the executive vice
president of Basketball Operations. It worked for the Clippers for
seven or sons, excuse me, for seventeen years. Was GM
in Cleveland. They won that title. So Anthony Davis says,

(53:52):
I want out, and they have engineered a deal. I
don't think I've ever seen an NBA team make more moves,
from Derek Favors to JJ Ruddick, to their draft picks,
his Zion to my sleeper in the NBA draft, Jackson Hayes,
who I think is the sleeper in the NBA draft
within about two years. It's also Josh Hart, Lonzo Ball,
brandon Ingram in a football city. It will be impossible

(54:17):
to keep your eyes off the NBA franchise and joining
us from the summer league. It's our pleasure of you.
The Coward Global Satellite Network to David Griffin. David, first
of all, congratulations, it's been remarkable. It's been fun. Listen,
when a star comes to you and says, I don't
want to play here again, it's brutal, but you made

(54:37):
it work when you knew Anthony wanted out. What were
the next forty eight hours like for you? Yeah, I
think we were in a situation and we said from
the beginning when we held our press conference here either
all the way in or your all the way out.
It was very clear that he was not all the
way in. Basically throughout the summer we had very good conversations.
Anthony asked really good questions, but what it was clear

(54:59):
he wasn't with us, Missus Benson and our ownership group
and myself and our basketball team, we recognize that it
was time to move on, and we tried to create
the best opportunity for ourselves we could, and we're very,
very pleased with the way everything unfolded. Yeah, you have
a very nice mix of veterans. I know what I
get what JJ Drew Holiday, Derek Favors. Now, it's interesting.

(55:20):
I love Zion. I think he's magnetic. He has a
magic Johnson appeal where I think veterans will embrace him immediately.
There's no resent here. He's a wonderful kid, but the
current culture of basketball is you draft guys. They're eighteen
years old. They got a lot of room to grow emotionally.
What do you like about Zion and where is the
growth for him in your opinion? Well, I think going

(55:44):
back to Alvin Gentry and I the night of the lottery,
the NBA had arranged for us to sit with Zion
that night, So nine thirty following the lottery, we had
a chance to sit with Zion and we were so
taken with him as a kid. In probably the first
twenty minutes of the conversation that we asked if his
parents were there, and he had his parents come down
and we sat together as a group for about an

(56:04):
hour and a half, and it was really striking to
us that his family has raised him to be all
about team, to be all about others, and to be
all about the right things. This is a great kid.
He's a warm kid who cares about his teammates. He
recognizes this isn't about him. He wanted to be part
of a family, and so we told him that night,

(56:24):
when you choose us, we choose you, and we're going
to raise a family that loves each other enough to
tell each other what they need to hear, and he
wanted that. It's why he went to Duke. It's what
he appreciated about coach Kay's leadership, It's who we wanted
to be natively. So we feel like it's a really
good fit. Well, I can't wait to watch him play.
Now here's the downside. Everybody in the West apparently got better.

(56:47):
You could have a very good basketball team, but could
still end up ninth or eighth. It listened, Dallas is loaded.
I don't know if they stack up. What is the timeline?
How do you sell patients? How long do you think
this thing takes to really pop? David? Yeah, And in
terms of timing, we're not going to put a timeline

(57:07):
on it. I don't think we want to limit ourselves either.
You know what we wanted to do with the veterans
that we brought in, who are all extremely selfless, all
about winning first. From JJ's standpoint, a very vocal leader
who's going to model all of the right things professionally.
It lines up very well with who Drew Holiday is.
Drew's the face of this franchise, and we're going to

(57:29):
go as far as Drew and our veterans take us
Zion's going to be contributing to that, as are all
our young kids. But this is not something where we
expect him to be the one leading us there. We
expect our leaders to lead us there, if that makes sense.
And I think when you look at what we have
the potential to be coming into free agency, we looked
around the West and we said, tell me who's clearly

(57:50):
better than we are, And then everybody started making their
moves and you can start to see that it's it's
going to be a tough road to hoe, but you
can't raise young players in our opinion and environment where
winning doesn't matter. We want to be playing meaningful games
in April and May, and we hope to put ourselves
in that position. By the way you have worked with Lebroun.
He trust you, he likes you. A rich Paul we

(58:12):
know as well. You know Lebraun is in the Muhammad
Ali class. I said this earlier Megan Rapino, where he's
not just a star, he's political. He's a disruptor, he's
a dissenter, he is global, he sees the world differently.
And there are those who have said, listen, not everybody
wants to get into that space. It's just noisy and
it's dramatic. When you were with Lebron, obviously, there's you

(58:35):
want a title with him, you got a big ring.
Are there challenges to being with a modern day superstar
who is also more than just an athlete? Yeah, I
think so, And it's because of the noise around him.
It's not noise that he generates. It's because you have
embedded national media with his team always, there's always going

(58:56):
to be more coverage, there's more interest, there's more social media.
Obviously the things he does that get taken as cryptic
tweets and people claim he's passive aggressive. Lebron's not that
he's aggressive aggressive, and you always know where you stand
with Lebron. So his teammates, if you're able to help
them ignore the noise, all are in a space where

(59:17):
they feel pretty good around it. Where the lack of
comfort comes in is from people like me who want
to try to control more of that noise. And frankly,
you just have to get comfortable in your lack of
comfort because you're never going to control the noise. You
just have to be appreciative of the fact that he's
about all the right things, and at the end of
the day, he wants to win. And I think the
reason we had a good relationship was he understood that

(59:40):
our recognition of our role really is caretaking for that legacy.
You know, a hundred years from now, everybody knows Babe Ruth.
They don't know who cost him World Series. You're gonna
know who cost lebron Championships. And we didn't want to
be that group. Finally, when you executive types walk around
and you see Jerry West, who at eighty one just
pulled off another shocker, how is Jerry viewed among executives? Well,

(01:00:06):
I mean he's the gold standard obviously. I think we
all have a very keen awareness of the fact that
if you can ever model any of the things he's
done in his career, you would want to. I think
having had the opportunity at one time to meet Jerry
and actually have him offer me the job to replace
him in Memphis, he holds a really special place in

(01:00:26):
my heart personally, But everyone who does what we do
in this business look at ourselves and hope that one
day we can achieve anything that he has, because there's
just no better than Jerry. Yeah, by the way, we've
got video of you. I went through my first earthquake
last Thursday, and I've got video of you. You had
a very similar reaction. What Lord's name is going on?

(01:00:47):
Was it your first earthquake experience, David No, That's the thing.
It's why my reaction was so profound, was because the
day before, during our film session, we were interrupted in
the film session by the chandeliers swaying in light bulbs
falling out of them at the conference room we were in,
so we had to all run for the doorway. So

(01:01:09):
I was actually when that happened, I started looking up, thinking,
oh boy, which one of these fixtures is coming down? Congratulations,
you've done a remarkable job. You've got my favorite young
player on the Earth and Zion. Good for you, David Griffin, congrats,
Thank you so much. Colin appreciate it. Yeah, what a
job he's done. Just a tremendous job. Pelicans are again,

(01:01:32):
I don't know if they're a playoff team because you
start looking around the West right now. If they played
in the East, I'd taken them for a six seven seed.
But wow, So he was shocked, like I was, both
of us a little He looked more under control than
me during the earthquake, though I looked frightened. Well, I
can see what he's talking about. If he knew that
stuff could fall. I mean, obviously you're looking up. I

(01:01:52):
was looking for help. I mean, I don't understand why
you thought someone was moving your desk. Well, I've moved
my career. I figured another company wanted to get rid
of me. I was just gonna come up on set.
Well you're doing a show, and just like you gotta go.
You're out of here. Joy taking with the news. Turn
on the news. This is the herd Line News. Yeah,

(01:02:18):
I wasn't. It's not clean East, what dirty hair? You are? Not? No,
But like I said, at least you didn't make a
situation worse. It's always people that panic to make a
situation worse. So when you think of NBA coaches historically
known for their relentless defense, Tom Thibodeaux as somebody that
comes to mind, and he is a buyer in the
new look Clippers defense featuring Kawhi Leonard and Paul George.
He told The Athletic, I think this team has the

(01:02:40):
capability capability to be just as good as the two
thousand and eight Celtics. When you look at it, I
think it'll be seamless. You're talking about two elite defenders
that guard multiple positions, multiple effort. Guys, never quit on plays.
Even if you can get by them, they'll come from
behind and get the ball. It'll be very hard to
score against them. Now, the twenty eighteen Championship Celtics featured

(01:03:01):
the Defensive Player of the Year Kevin Garnett on that team. Obviously,
you know you have guys like Patrick Beverley on the
Clippers already. Kawhi Leonard is a two time Defensive Player
of the Year. Paul George is a six time All Star,
former Most Improved Player, and four time All Defensive Team honoring,
and he finished third this year and Defensive Player of
the Year voting. So yes, this is a perfect edition

(01:03:21):
and perfect collection of what the Clippers had already built on,
which was a smart, gritty team that will play defense,
is not scared to play defense. I know nobody wants
to make any picks yet, and it's you know, it's
it's all seems very even, and it's a little tricky
and a lat can happen. But they're pretty good. They're

(01:03:41):
really good. Yeah, they're really good, and you know you
it's just crazy. This came out of nowhere. I would
never think, Wow, yeah, Paul George and Kawhi Leonard would
be great together. And now it's like, why didn't we
all think of this from the beginning. I mean, obviously
it wasn't something that you thought was on the table,
but they are. This is the Clippers were fun to
watch last year, and I do think a part of
the reason that Kawhi is there is because they built

(01:04:02):
their team on winning and being functional and not being
about the noise and being about basketball, and that's what
Kawhi Leenard is about. It actually is is the perfect fit.
Kawai never felt like a fit with the Lakers. It
just was like, they're going to be incredible, and who
doesn't want to plan a team it's incredible, that's fun,
it's fun to win like that. But that's also really
not Kawai's brand. But I think they're going to be

(01:04:23):
From a defensive end, they're pretty unstoppable. They should be favored.
I'm not saying they'll win, but they should be favored
to win the championship. That that coach roster. Yes, yes,
So sticking with Kawai. The Raptors were always aware he
could leave this offseason, even if they won an NBA championship,
which they did, and Nick Nurse says he understood Kawhi's decision.
You can't blame a guy for wanting to go home, right,

(01:04:46):
That's what he texts me today. I'm going home, you know,
And and you know I just said, you've You've changed
a lot of lives, many by what you accomplished in
Toronto and mine especially, And thank him for what he did.
And we'll look to the future and we'll do it again.
What a healthy way to think in life. That's a

(01:05:06):
really healthy way for a human being to think. Well,
that's not the Raptors style, the Raptor's brand to be
vengeful or write a letter in comic sands like complaining
they were lucky to have him, first of all. And
I mean, they made the right moves to get him,
and they deserve credit for that for sure. But this
was always a we don't know what's going to happen situation.

(01:05:27):
They risked it all and they're the winners. Listen Toronto's
handling this with grace. I never understood why, Like Manny Ramirez,
left Boston and everybody's angry. It's like Manny took you
to a place Boston that you'd never been better than
the Yankees. Like if you would live in a city
and a guy comes to your city and gives you
something as a child you've been If somebody goes to

(01:05:49):
Chicago and you're a Cup fan and you get a
World Series and he leaves an hour later, thank him, right,
Like Toronto is doing this with total digma, as they should.
There's no space for them to ever be angry at
It wouldn't make sense and everyone would just think it's
comical that they would be in By the way, when
Lebron left Cleveland the second time, to Cleveland's credit and
Dan Gilbert's crees, they handled it how they lighted at

(01:06:10):
the first time. You know, thank you. Yeah, I mean, listen,
when people take you to places you can't get without them,
even if they don't you're not married forever, say thank
you and he doesn't owe them anything. Now that said,
they you know, they're looking towards building for the future.
Toronto is you were just talking about how we don't
really know who's going to stand up where in the
West and the Pelicans are interesting and fun, but are

(01:06:31):
they even going to make the playoffs? The East is
very even too now. And even though the Raptors still
have their core there. You know, they have Kyle Lowry,
they have Siakam, they have Sergibaka. I mean, you look
around the East. The Bucks, the Celtics I think are
going to be a lot better than people think they
are six or Celtics Bucks. I know you're not being
on Kyrie, but they're going to be good. There's The

(01:06:53):
East is still just as interesting as it was last year.
It's still very even. Finally, Kevin Durant, speaking of the Nets,
joins Lebron and make a number change this offseason. He
announced he will now wear number seven for the Nets.
I don't switching from number thirty five. It's his first
career jersey number change, and he says he's starting a
new chapter in his life. Okay, that's the Is it
an od Kaepernick or something or um? I think there

(01:07:15):
were some discussions about that. I don't know if it
is or if it isn't. If that's just the number
that he picked. Number seven is supposed to be the
perfect number, so maybe there's something with that. I don't know.
I have no idea for the record. I'm a huge
fan of single digit athletes like Jeter two, right, Kobe
I liked eight, Lebron six. I like single digits. Thirty
five to me feels like a spring training pitcher. I

(01:07:38):
don't like the number. Um, yeah, I mean it doesn't
feel as iconic as a number seven would feel. I
guess if if he was to do it that way.
I mean, twenty three obviously is to me is the
number of the six out of any jersey of all
time because of Jordan. But and then Lebron also gave
officially gave his number to Anthony Davis, so he's gonna

(01:07:58):
be wearing number six this year. I think it's actually
kind of symbolic. There's a lot of major changes that
happened in the NBA this offseason, and we're now going
to get to see a league where we really, for
the first time in a long time, nobody can really
go out there and say, without question, this is the
team that's going to be in the finals. So it is,
you know it all kind of keep your make sense,

(01:08:19):
keep your eye on Denver. Yeah, nobody watched them last year,
and then we looked up and thought, oh man, they're
deep the thing again, very really good. Joy with the news.
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by. Avery Bradley,
by the way, did sign with the Lakers. Got a
clear waiver. So the Lakers now have a point guard.

(01:08:40):
You're gonna have Avery Bradley, lebron A, d Kyle Kuzma,
Danny Green, and then you got Javail and Boogie off
the bench. It's a lot of talent. Here's the thing
in my life. I've seen what the Clippers just did work,
which is good front office, great owner, nice chemistry, veteran
head coach, add two really good pieces. I seen that

(01:09:00):
work a lot. Now what the Lakers did I have
not seen become championships, which is new head coach, shaky
front office, a lot of disparate parts, didn't have great
chemistry last year. Add some guys who can be tough
to get along with and make it work. The Clippers

(01:09:20):
feel like to me, I've seen this model, smart front office,
veteran coach, already good, great momentum, terrific culture. Just add
a little, just add a little. Lakers is a lot
of moving parts and a lot of stuff. Again, I
think the Lakers are a great movie poster. There's a
lot of stars. I think the Clippers will be a

(01:09:42):
great movie. I don't know how the Lakers work. I
would make the Clippers the favorite. I still contend I'll
everybody's burying Golden State. I'd put the Warriors second. Then.
I think there are about six teams Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Lakers, Denver, Utah.
I think there's a bunch of stuff out there. I'm
not as high on the Rockets. I think their window closed.

(01:10:04):
I'm not as high on the Celtics. They're good, I
don't think they're a legitimate championship team. I think Portland
a dark horse because of the Hassan Whiteside contract, they
can move at the trading deadline. I think with the Clippers,
I get a lot of answers in very few ifs.
With the Lakers, I get a lot of ifs. If
Anthony Davis, like three years ago, can stay healthy. If

(01:10:24):
Boogie Cousins despirally making three and a half million, is
engaged for the next year, if Rondo can play seventeen
minutes not twenty seven, if Danny Green gives me twenty
two minutes tonight. I don't want to play him for
twenty nine to thirty two. I just get a lot
of ifs with the Lakers. I don't feel like I
get a lot of ifs with the Clippers. So that's

(01:10:44):
kind of where I stand. I also think you are
asking a ton of Lebron James. Listen, there's a TV show.
It's one of these food shows. It's called Chopped. You
ever seen the show Chopped? I love Chopped. Okay, It's ridiculous,
and Top Junior is awesome too. So they of you
like Hamhawks, some licorice, cotton candy, lima beans, and pumpkin

(01:11:05):
pie sauce and say make a sou Flay and very
few people can do it now, Lebron. You're giving Lebron
a lot of disparate parts that I don't think necessarily fit.
As Joy and I have said, he doesn't necessarily always
fit with bigs, even though Anthony Davis is probably the
best big in the game. You're asking Lebron in his
seventeenth year, with a new coach and all new players,

(01:11:26):
to just wrap it up and give you Sue Flay.
That's asking a lot of Frank Vogel. Jason Kidd's got
his eyes on Frank Vogel, I got Lebron James. I
don't feel like you're asking Kawhi Leonard and Paul George
to do anything other than what they do. Play hard
on both ends. They will. I think you're asking a
lot of Lebron James to make this puppy all work,

(01:11:49):
and I don't know if he can do it. I
just don't know if he can do it. A rodge
around the corner, don't go anywhere. It's to Herd. Be
sure to catch live editions of The Herd week dayson
noon Easter nine a m. Pacific. The Stars shine bright
as the Best and the Majors celebrate the Midsummer Classic
the MLB All Star Game tomorrow at seven thirty Eastern
four thirty Pacific only on Fox. By the Way, Dodgers

(01:12:11):
Yankees best records. Cody Bellinger, who's also great defensively, is
having another monster year offensively. Between Mike Trout and Cody
Bellinger stars in LA. Let's go to via the Coward
Global Satellite Network. Alex Rodriguez, Fox Baseball Analyst, three time MVP,
fourteen time All Star. Yeah, let's talk about the Dodgers.
The Dodgers Alex did not spend big money outside of
Kershaw a few years ago. They've said Node Machado, not

(01:12:33):
to Harper. Now, the young talents wonderful, but this is
May and June and early July. Do you think the
teams that say no to the big stars pay a
price later? Or do you like what the Dodgers have done?
I love what the Dodgers have done. I mean from
their front office has been an incredible Obviously, Doc Robbers

(01:12:54):
has then a fantastic job circling that roster. And they're
not twenty five men deep. They're really forty menep And
the one issue they're gonna have to deal with is
they still have to praise Brandon Morrow from a couple
of years ago, who was locked lockdown seventh and ey
thinning guy Kenley Jansen is a couple of years older,
so you have to help him filling that gap. He

(01:13:15):
needs more help, not less help. Yeah, you know, it's
funny we're watching these NBA guys team up. Now. Philadelphia
did add a bunch of veteran star players. But it's interesting.
Do baseball players call in the offseason, Do they talk
about joining each other or is that just an NBA thing.
I think there's some of that that goes on, not

(01:13:36):
as much as the NBA, of course, calling with major
League Baseball, you need to have six full years of
Major League Baseball servers before becoming a free agent, so
free agencies becomes kind of your once in a lifetime
opportunity to make the big bucks. So not as much
as the NBA. Bryce Harper's one of my favorite players
in baseball, but I've always been a little reluctant to

(01:13:57):
give a power hit or a ten year deal because
he comes into a city and the fans and the
media want forty five jacks, and if you don't deliberate,
it's a failure. And I think sometimes there's pressure on
Joey Votto and Joe Mauer and now Bryce Harper where
the home runs, and I think hitting home runs can
be very psychological. Did you love the Harper deal for

(01:14:19):
the Phillies? Would you have made that move? I mean,
home runs a high risk, high reward. I do like
the deal for the Phillies, so yes, I would have
done that deal. But understanding the gift and the curse
of the Philadelphia Philly fans, they're smart, they're passionate, they
show up every day. That's also the curse for Bryce Harper.
He has to show up. You're not going to trick them.

(01:14:40):
You're not gonna fool them. They're too smart. But Bryce Harper,
he's too young, too good not to work out. The
only thing I caution is the thirteen years without a
divorce option an opt out could be challenging, and right
now it looks like potentially it could be a long
twelve and a half years left. Okay, NBA, everybody free out,
all the stars going to the same place. But we

(01:15:02):
got a bunch of teams that could win. Right now,
Big Market New York, Big Market LA appear to have
the best teams. But going forward, again, this is summer baseball.
You tighten the rotations a lot more pressure, do you
When you look at the Dodgers and the Yankees. If
I said today, pick one that plays and is built
for October, which one would it be for you? I

(01:15:25):
think right now they're both the best teams in baseball
for our macro a marathon. I think both of them
still have a challenge when it comes down winning eleven
games in October. And in order to do that, I
have one concern and it applies to both teams. In
a short series. The Dodgers can run into a team
that's feisty, that's young, that has great pitching, where ninety

(01:15:47):
feet actually means something. That's the San Diego Padres. They
just got swept at home. When you look at the
Yankees at a Maco, they're gonna home run you to death.
High risk, high reward. The Yankees when they scored two
runs are less are oh and thirteen. Both examples for
the Dodgers and the Yankees scream postseason baseball. If you're

(01:16:09):
Cashman and you're the Dodgers front office, you have to
address who pitches Game one, four and seven for the
Yankees and for the Dodgers. Who's gonna be the Fernando Valezuela.
Who's gonna be the Bob Weuch of nineteen eighty one,
the Hirscheizer of eighty eight. Until those two questions are answered,
I think the Dodgers and Yankees still have a lot
of questions to answer. Um, listen, we all we have

(01:16:30):
what they you know, everybody now because of analytics. I've
heard a million times in my life. Oh the baseball's jews,
blah blah blah, and Aowas. Myola's takeaway is no analytics
have changed. The game changes. App to me, athletes are
bigger and stronger. Everybody throws ninety six, you know, because
of analytics. Everybody's got that upgrade the launch angle on
the swing. I don't think it's the baseball. I just

(01:16:50):
I'm seeing all these big, strong athletes and guys throwing
ninety six. That's why we're setting records for home runs.
I mean, what do you see? I mean, look, Commissioner
Rob Manfred has been on the record that he's going
to look at the balls. I think we just have
to wait and see. We don't have enough of a
large sample size. I just wish that I stuck in
there for four more home runs. The way the balls
are flying out of here. Look, I think home runs

(01:17:13):
are good for baseball. They're fun. We're always trying to
make the game better. We just came back from London.
The Yankees and Red Sox absolutely killed it. It was
a global thing. We had the Yankees, the Red Sox,
the Royals, we had Prince Harry Megan. It was fantastic.
And now we're here at the Allstar Game with some
of the best, youngest players. It's really what we should
be talking about and leading with our greatest stories. By

(01:17:35):
the way, there is a wave of great young players,
and it seems to me that it's quicker it used
to be. You get drafted, even if you were like
a Wade Bogs, you go to the minor leagues, you
disappear for a few years, then you re emerge a
September call up, then you play. It feels like baseball

(01:17:55):
players are getting drafted and getting to the big sooner.
Am I missing something or is that happening? I mean,
and saber Metric's big data is suggesting that the way
to go is younger is better, and that's not always
the case. Because you have a guy like Justin Verlander
who's gonna start here tomorrow nineties, thirty six years old.
He's never been better, and he's already said Colin that

(01:18:17):
he wants to play into his forties, like Tom Brady,
like I did, Jeter Mariano. So if you take care
of yourself, you can still play into your forty forties,
but you're just more of an anomaly. Big data is
telling you that earlier is better, and they're double and
triple downing on kids that are in their young twenties
in the early thirties. You know, Mike Trout when the

(01:18:38):
Angels signed him, they're They're a good revenue team. They're
not the Yankees. You signed Mike Trout. And by the way,
the Twins did this with Joe Mauer, the Reds with
Joey Votto. It does limit some other moves. If you
ran a baseball team, and I'm not sure if that's
an aspiration for you over time, but if you had
a Mike Trout talent where you know you could move
him and get an all star shortstop, four draft picks,

(01:19:00):
a reliever. What is your take on a Mike Trout
talent you develop him, You're not a huge major market
revenue team, maybe you're like eighth in baseball. Would you
keep Trout and sign him? Would you move Trout and
get a boatload of picks? What would you do if
you got an all time talent like Trout? First of all,
Ladie Moreno, the owner of the Angels, is one of

(01:19:21):
the smartest owners in our game and the only Hispanic,
which I'm very proud of him. But the thing you
got to think about is Mike Trout is the easiest
decision in baseball. So is Clay Kershaw, so is Derek Jeter,
so is Lebron James. When you have the best, you
pay up and you just forget about it. In the
long term, there's gonna be no better investment the Angels
have than Mike Trout. The reason why is when you

(01:19:42):
go sit down with Fox and you go negotiate that contract,
the executive as a Fox are gonna start and end
with Mike Trout, and that is your anchor ten And
think of Mike Trout like Walmart. It starts and ends.
The things you have to worry about is a secondary
and tertiary moves after Mike Trout is the Altbert Poojo's
is the eyes that you bring in after that can
make you or kill you. By the way, finally, speaking

(01:20:05):
of London, it was an amazing TV event where you
shocked how much positive reception you know, England, the UK
gave to baseball like it was. I was shocked by
they were they wrapped their arms around it. What was
it like to be there, Colin, I gotta tell you
I was there on the ground and I went down

(01:20:27):
for Commissioner Manford in November to promote did about fifty
five interviews in a couple of days. I heard from
many Brits on the ground that they were more excited
about baseball Yankee, Red Sox than they were about the
NBA and the NFL. Now, those are just the people
on the streets stalking. The next day I went to
Wimbledon and did a little tennis with McEnroe. I counted

(01:20:49):
tens and tens and tens of different hats Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs,
Cardinals and what it is. Baseball has an opportunity to
be huge in international We had over seven hundred medium
one hundred and twenty thousand people watching live, thirty thousand
in the lawn watching outside. And the league has the
Commissioner's office has many many dozens of cities in Europe

(01:21:11):
calling to say when is Major League Baseball coming to
our city next? So it was a huge, huge success
for Major League Baseball. Alex Rodriguez Fox has the All
Star Game. He is our analyst obviously, you know a
Rod great talking to you and when you're in La,
stop by coming to the couch. We want to talk again.
Next time we talk Lakers, University of Miami and anything

(01:21:32):
you want to talk about all right, thanks, hey, Rod,
appreciate it all right? Good stuff. So the All Star
Game on Fox. We had great soccer. This it was.
It's been a really an amazing month. The US Open,
the Women's World Cup, the Gold Cup, the All Star
Game in baseball. Great last month. Back hour three, next
one more Herd. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day,
seven days a week. Within the iHeartRadio app, search Herd

(01:21:54):
to listen live or on demand whenever you like. Car
shopping can be con using a lot of terms. Dealer price,
less price invoice, truecar shows you what other people paid
for the car you want new, or use truecar dot com.
Let's go by the way. The Lakers have picked up
Avery Bradley, man, Frank Vogel's got a lot of new people.
This is gonna be. They're talented. You can't deny the

(01:22:17):
Lakers talent. I think the Clippers will fit more seamlessly early.
But let's go to Bill orm from the Athletic Laker
Writer since to twenty thirteen. Also cover the jazz by
the way Salt Lake City Tribune. All right, Bill, here
we go. First of all, Avery Bradley signing, what do
you make of it. I mean, I think it's a

(01:22:39):
good move at this point. I mean, obviously the free
agent market has dried up. At this point, the Lakers
had a lot of money to spend and a whole
lot of roster spots to fill it on. So Avery
Bradley's a guy who just a couple of years ago
and Boston was still shooting forty six percent from the field,
averaging sixteen points. Obviously fell off once he got moved
from Detroit to the Clippers, had a resurgence with Memphis.
You don't know which guy you're getting, but when you're

(01:23:00):
talking about the fourteenth move on the roster, that's probably okay.
It's okay to have a little uncertainty about what you're
getting if you're getting such a value. Looks like the
Lakers got him using their room exception, which is about
four million dollars. Uh, nothing really to lose there in
a chance that he could be pretty good, and it's
obviously a championship caliber player. This puts enormous pressure on
Frank Vogel to make it work. Unlike the Clippers, who

(01:23:21):
had a good year, good chemistry, veteran coach, You slide
Kauhai in boy, there's a lot of moving disparate parts here.
How does Frank Vogel do it? What does his history
tell us about this group? Well, I've sent since they
hired him that there's almost no pressure on Frank Vogel
considering the way he came into this job. Obviously he
was not the phone, wasn't ringing for head coaching positions

(01:23:44):
before the Lakers came calling. So, I mean he's in
a great position where you go from the unemployment line
to potentially having a champion run in a championship here.
But when you really get into the meat and potatoes
of the roster, like you said, Colin m I do
think it's a tough job. I mean, you have you
have a a player who you know is that becomes
the true leader of the team, no matter who the
coaches and Lebron. You have a second superstar to try

(01:24:05):
to keep happy. And then you have all these pieces
and you know some of them are back from last year,
but there's no continuity from last year's roster, and you
have some tough decisions to make in terms of lineups.
Rajon Rondo is a obviously a champion point guard, you know,
highly regarded in the locker room, you know, a legend
in a sense. But at the same time, his numbers
last year defensively were not good next to Lebron James

(01:24:28):
and and to and beyond that, his numbers next to
Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins in the year they were
together in New Orleans were even worse. So you may think, okay, fine,
start de Marcus, Anthony Davis, and Rajon Rondo, because those
are the biggest names, But is that what's actually gonna
gel the best on the court. I don't know. I mean,
there's probably a case Alex Caruso, who just got his
first real NBA contract. Tough nosed um doesn't make a

(01:24:50):
lot of mistakes. Winning player makes more sense as as
a starter with that lineup, and that you know is
not necessarily the Laker way when you have a big
name that you can throw out there. So it's gonna
be really in to see how he manages that. And
then also the depth behind Danny Green at the shooting guard.
They have a lot of twos all of a sudden,
including Avery Bradley, who you mentioned in Contavious Caldwell Pope,
who they brought back on a pretty big commitment as well.

(01:25:11):
So there's just a lot of players who are kind
of in the same range of caliber player that are
going to want a lot of minutes. I just think
there's gonna be a lot to sort out for Frank Vogel.
You know, Kawhi got on the phone with Paul George,
reportedly Kevin Durant, Kyrie Irving, Jimmy Butler. It leads me
to believe Bill that he always kind of wanted the Clippers,

(01:25:33):
He really did, and he just didn't know if it
could work. Am I reaching there? But I mean it
sounds like he was on a two three week process,
a call on stars to join him with the Clippers. Yeah,
I mean, it sure seems that way. And it then
leads you to the question of whether the Lakers got
a little bit duped into staying in the Kawhi Leonard
game for as long as they did. And obviously we

(01:25:54):
know what that costs them on the front end of
free agency. So, you know, Kawhi was linked to the Laker,
excuse me, to the Clippers throughout the year that was
seen as the logical move for him, and we heard it,
we heard it, we heard it, and then the Lakers
kind of relate to the game where it became they
thought they had a real shot, and they they moved
mountains to create the cap space for him, They held
off on making any other moves, and then ultimately Kawhi

(01:26:16):
did exactly what everyone thought he was going to do. So,
you know, it's kind of a you know, fool me once,
fool me twice sort of thing. But um, I think,
you know, the Lakers felt like they they had to
go all the way in if well, once they had
thought they had a single, a single shred of a
chance of getting him. Um. You know, I've read every
bit of every bit of copy I can over the

(01:26:39):
last forty eight hours on this. It kind of sounds
like Magic going public with his Kawhi phone call wasn't great.
Do you think it was a definitive deal breaker or
is that overstated? I have a hard time believing that
was that was the deal breaker, the thing that would

(01:26:59):
keep why from doing what he wanted to do, if
in fact, the Lakers were the team that that he
wanted to play with, if he wanted to do the
Lebron and Anthony Davis thing, I think that that would
have risen above Magic doing his thing off to the side.
But I think it's it's impossible to ignore the fact
that Magic Johnson continuing to have a role um you know,
having a loud voice speaking to reporters, you know, divulging

(01:27:20):
you know, information from his conversation that is not that
is not um project the Lakers as a you know,
a button down organization, as a team that has its
its house in order. Magic Johnson no longer obviously part
of the organization, but continues to be, you know, one
of the biggest faces in the history of the organization
and one of the one of its primary voices still

(01:27:41):
and so to have him out there, certainly, I don't
I don't think. I don't think it helped. Yeah, you know,
there was you know, some of the things I've read
is that Lebron would have stepped back for Kawhi and
Anthony Davis and really been the facilitator and pulled back
his numbers, which I think would be great. Do you
believe next year's team is Lebron on or Anthony Davis?

(01:28:01):
Is I think it's still Lebron's team, Colin. I mean,
he did the right I don't know if it's the
right thing, but he did a nice thing by by
giving the number twenty three over to Anthony Davis, trying
to facilitate some goodwill there, try to set this up
to be a longer partnership than just one year. I mean,
I don't think anyone thinks Anthony Davis is leaving the
Lakers after one year, but we can't ignore the fact

(01:28:22):
that he is a free agent and if things were
to go really off the rails, that's something the Lakers
have to live in fear of. So having Lebron doing
the work early to make make Anthony Davis feel like
there's some buy in I think is really important. But
for the time being, I mean, Lebron James, I know
he's gonna be thirty five. I know he's coming off
the injury. I know he played the fewest games, but
he is still the kind of the godfather of the

(01:28:45):
NBA right now. He is still, if not the best player,
he is it's biggest star. Still it is still he
is still the primary driver of the NBA brand, and
so for him to step back and not be the
the leader of his own team would be would probably
be the wrong move at this point. But as we
see him move a little bit deeper into this contract.

(01:29:07):
See if he plays me on this contract as Anthony
Davis moves deeper into his prime. I do think you'll
start to see a shift, but it won't be in
year one. Yeah, good stuff, Bill orm the athletic cover
the Lakers for several years. It's fun if nothing else, Bill,
thank you so much. That's the word for it, thanks, Colin. Yeah,
yeah it is. Avery Bradley got signed today. He's a
real player. So, I mean, I will say this, the

(01:29:29):
Lakers may have some dysfunction, but one thing they did
get that they didn't have last year, which to me
was inexcusable. They have shooters. Ay, that's the league and
beat Lebron plays well with shooters, drive and dish, Quinn
cook sneaky good pickup, Danny Green, Jared Dudley can hit
a jumper. Avery Bradley can hit a jumper. I mean,

(01:29:49):
last year I got a lot of dysfunction and no shooters.
I may have a little dysfunction, but Lebron's history is
I'll drive, get me guys who can finish it off
from the perimeter if I don't at the ten. So
I kind of like that part. I mean, Avery Bradley's
out there. You know he can shoot. Anthony Davis actually
for a big can occasionally pop at three. It's not

(01:30:11):
his game, So that part. The Lakers should be much
more dynamic from the perimeter, which was a huge issue
last year. Joy with the news, No no turn on
the news. This is the herd line news right colin
here it is. According to Seam Sharania of the Athletic
okayc is now receptive for the first time toward trade

(01:30:33):
calls for Russell Westbrook. So Westbrook and his agent that
Foucher and Thunder gm Sam Press the year now collaborating
together and examining alternative solutions. Now, the timing is a
little challenging because it's late in the summer due to
free agency craziness and it's locked a lot of teams
into some tight payroll spots. But Vegas has released their
odds on what team Rust will play for next season.

(01:30:55):
They have Yeah, so Thunder half the best odds. The
Knicks two to one odds, the Heat have four to
one odds, the Pistons and the Rockets six to one,
and the Timberwolves have seven to one odds. Were landing
Russell Westbrook neither one of us like the Houston thing, right,
I don't like the Houston thing. And then I just
don't see how it fits. I of course, Russell Westbrook
is a superstar, but we've seen how he plays, we

(01:31:16):
know how he plays, We've seen this. He's very much
set in his ways. He's not going to get down
there and then all of a sudden just mesh into
some new kind of system. And quite frankly, I really
don't know that Houston has a system that produces any success.
I mean, have they won anything? Like? They definitely get numbers,
definitely in the playoffs every single year, they produce MVPs,
but does it It's not translated into actual rings yet,

(01:31:38):
So I don't. I don't think that's the fit there. Obviously,
I love him with the Heat. I do think he
would be great with with Jimmy Butler. The Knicks is
very interesting too. Though the Knicks would be very interesting.
You could admit that would be fun, aren't you? And
I supposed to root for interesting? Well, yeah, I'm when
I'm being fan girl, and I'd root for the Heat.
But if I'm rooting for the most which I do

(01:31:59):
think that Jimmy Butler and Russell Weston in Miami would
be very interest would be Houston would be very interesting.
I mean, I would say, if if we're doing an
interesting meter, I'd put Houston at the top fold very
closely by the Knicks, just because of everything with Durant
and Kyrie and also just being the Knicks. And then
come after that, well, I mean, I don't know. I mean,

(01:32:22):
look at some of the moves that have been made,
even the Jimmy Butler move. Nobody was even talking about
that possibly happening. So I don't know what the Rockets
would have to get up to get him. I'm imagining
whatever the thunder are going to ask for him is
going to be astronomical. But we've already seen a big
move there, and how much more do they really need
after you know what they got for Paul George. So
Magic Johnson says he's disappointed that Kawhi chose the Clippers, obviously,
but before the news was made public, the Lakers were

(01:32:43):
supposed to be the front runners to land him. Imagine,
Magic himself reportedly spoke to Kauai. So he told the
La Times. For the Lakers, there's disappointment, but joy too.
In a perfect world. You'd love to have Kawhi, but hey,
the Lakers aren't going anywhere. Everybody tried, that's all you
can do. I'm a Laker man. I was hoping all
but for the league it turned out great, and for
this town. It's the king of basketball. He is right,

(01:33:04):
La is the center of the basketball universe currently. How
about the state of California. I mean, just just think
of the state of California. I'll start up north, Daron Fox,
Steph Play, Draymond Lebron, A D. Boogie Cousins, D'Angelo Russell, Kawhi,
Paul George, at like twelve All Star level guys. It's

(01:33:26):
another level. I'm kind of I am so torn about
this because I talked myself into it being a really
fun and villainous situation with Kawhi going to the Lakers,
but it also just doesn't fit Kawhi, Lebron or a
d How about Lebron the most, since he's already been
through it. But they're just those guys aren't villains. Okay,
So Anthony Davis is not a big talker. If nobody

(01:33:47):
discussed this, if Kawhi go to the Lakers, I've seen
what happens to the third wheel with Lebron when he's
a big Kawhi and Lebron would be great together, right,
Anthony Davis privately is way better off being the second
and often first option because I felt Kawhi goals, Kawhi
Lebron will worked those games work together. Anthony Davis would

(01:34:10):
become Chris Bosh Hello, yo, I'm over here. Yeah, and
who knows how that how that works moving forward? Like
this is a win now situation. There's the time to
sort that out. Finally, our women did it again, the
US women's national team or back to back World World
Cup champs. They did at their title yesterday, beating the
Netherlands to nothing. Yes, Megan Rapino scored the first goal

(01:34:30):
from the penalty spot and Rose Lavelle sealed the game
in the sixty ninth minute to win their fourth World Cup.
Not easy. Those games were tight. That tight. It was.
It was fun. It was great soccer. By the way,
have you seen the ratings? Yeah? Massive? Wek at ten. Yeah,
I mean it was, it was great. It was great soccer.
If you're a soccer fan, you can't not watch that.

(01:34:51):
And if you're an American, I mean, how can you
not love this team. They're they're everything that you want.
They're gritty, they fought through injuries. As you said earlier,
Rapino and Roosevelt were both injured. They're the ones that
scored to win the World Cup controversy. Let me read this.
We're going sorry, I'm doing this live in the air.

(01:35:11):
This is not an earth. Do you do this once?
To shows Okay, the women's World Cup final outrated last
year's men's World Cup final by twenty percent. Now, obviously
you know American teammate, but it shows you the popularity
of the American women's team. So that's because the men's
World Cup gets a fat number. This thing yesterday got
a ten overnight raining. Does everybody understand how big that is?

(01:35:33):
I certainly do. Let's sake, listen to make a Rapino
after the game real quick. I mean, the run that
we had was ridiculous. Going through all the Titans of
Europe was just so difficult, and this group is just amazing.
I mean, I think that we've been questioned and wondering
if we can get through everyone, but we've had so
much support as well along the way, and to be

(01:35:54):
able to make everyone happy and smile and be able
to have this moment for not only our group but
for the country. It's just incredible. I like her in
purple hair. I've got to be honest. I see purple
hair a lot, and I'm like, not a great look.
She really looks. Her girlfriend, Sue Bird actually wrote an
article I'm about her and said that she originally had

(01:36:15):
died at pink and then it kind of because she's
so blonde, kind of morphed into purple. But it all
worked out because the purple is awesome too. I've done
the hair dye thing once. I wouldn't recommend it for sportscasters. Yeah,
it's not it's not really her though. It's not your love.
Not earthquakes and hair dye. I don't do well with either. First.
I'm gonna agree with you there. Congrats to the women's scene. Yeah,

(01:36:37):
congrats to them. US women's national team. H Joy with
the news. Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping
by the herd Line new Yeah. You know, I will
say this. I am very pro players moving. I just
think it's I would be a complete hypocrite. Uh. You know,
this whole thing about recruiting um Damian Lillard talked about

(01:36:57):
this is that it's one thing like Jerry West and
Doc Rivers. I guess we're at Doc rivers Malibu house
having staked dinner and everything, you know, and and Jerry
West and they all decided that, you know, get me
into a player and all work. That does feel like
Kawhi was kind of on the Clippers mostly. He basically
made a bunch of calls and told Jerry West, I'll
come if you get the other guy. So it does

(01:37:17):
feel like Actually the Clippers were in the driver's seat,
but there were stipulations with it. Where my takeaway this
morning is Toronto never had a chance. That's nothing against Toronto,
but Toronto never had a chance. The Lakers did have
a chance, but his heart was with the Clippers. That's
what it feels like this morning. By telling Jerry you win,

(01:37:38):
just get me another player. I don't want to do
like Toronto again and have to play all those games.
So Damian Lillard talked about over the weekend, how listen, man,
you gotta get on the phone now. If you're an
NBA star, I think you see it a lot more now.
Whereas just players, recruiting players is more powerful than a

(01:37:59):
pitch meeting with the team. You know, that's just what
it is now, So I mean it's a huge part
of it is a huge part of the game now. Now.
I would also say this is that I know there's
often a lot of pushback on stars joining stars. For
the record, Jannis has said I'm not interested. Damian Lillard
has said I'm not interested. Jimmy Butler left other stars

(01:38:20):
to go to Miami. Not everybody wants to join forces.
Kevin Durant did, and by the way, after a year
he sounded restless. Lebron did in Miami and after a
year said I don't like being a villain. So I
hope the current trend is two stars per team. I
think gets really healthy and then put pressure on your

(01:38:41):
front office to get a bunch of good bench guys
and create chemistry. So all right, coming up, the dust
is settled. We got like fifteen duos in the NBA.
Who are the top ten? I'll give you mine in
best for last. Be sure to catch live editions of
The Herd weekdays and noon Easter not a Empacific on
Fox Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app. Great Havevian,

(01:39:04):
Chris Brussard, David Griffin, who has assembled quite a roster,
including Zion Williamson. Summer League's kind of been a bummer.
Zion got hurt. RJ. Barrett's not ready quite to go.
It's it's John Morant's not playing. Summer League has been
a disappointment. I was so jazzed up to see Zion
and the nine minutes and it ended. So that is
what it is. I mean, none of those guys outside
of John Moran and Zion maybe RJ. Barrett, I think

(01:39:25):
will make a huge impact wins and losses. But I
was excited to watch them play. Alex Rodriguez showed up
Baseball All Star Game next few days. Bill Orem just
stopped by in Vegas. We've had so many moves free agency, trade,
Lakers just acquired Avery Bradley. We've got a lot of
these duos now, and I don't recall a time in
my life where we had this many duos. A few

(01:39:47):
years ago, it felt like it was groups of three,
you know, it was like Rondo, Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett,
A Bosch, d Way Lebron. Now it's duo. So I
thought best for last my top ten current duos in
the NBA. Number one, I think it's Kawai and Paul George.
They average fifty five a game last year, most by

(01:40:07):
any current duo. Paul George at the All Star Break
was the MVP leader. Kawai won the finals MVP. They're
both terrific two way players. I think they're both in
their prime, though Paul George is getting close to getting
out of his prime. They've both had some injuries, but
these are great two way wing players. And if you
look at the personalities, Kawai's mostly about basketball. Paul George,

(01:40:32):
I think it's very comfortable being a one A to him.
I think it's the best duo in the league. Number two,
I think it's Stephen Clay. It's the best backcourt in
my life. Clays out until probably January or February. But folks,
it's all about shooting threes. These guys want a title
without k D. It's I don't. The only backcourt in
my life that's close to it is Jerry West and

(01:40:54):
Gail Goodrich back in the seventies. Can we not forget
about the reigning dynasty? You want to bury these great
teams like the Patriots and the Warriors. It's not just talent,
it's brains. Patriots and Warriors got a lot of brain
power in that building. Steph and Clay are still the
best backcourt of my mostly my life. Number three Lebron
and Anthony Davis now again two of the top five

(01:41:17):
or six players, But I don't know how they work together.
Anthony Davis last two years has had nagging injuries. He's
an all Star. He's terrific. He can defend the pick
and roll, you can move him outside. But I've also
seen in my life that Lebron always works great with
guards and shooters, even when they're kind of dysfunctional. He's
never been great with bigs. So I'm not denying the talent,

(01:41:39):
but I don't think this feels like Kawhi Paul and
Steph Clay. Number four, go ahead and ignore the Denver
Nuggets at your own peril. Jamal Murray and Nikolay Yokich.
By the way, both players points per game have gone
up every year they've played together. This is the beginning
of this group. Last year, the combined for fifty four wins.

(01:42:02):
They are just These guys are not in their prime yet.
These guys are moving into their prime. They are sensational
and they have a great coach. Number five Damian Lillard
CJ McCullum. Now CJ is a little spottier than Damon,
but last year Damon averts twenty six and CJ avert
twenty one. The thing I like about him too, not

(01:42:22):
a lot of big egos here. You know, it's not
easy to make two guards, your best two shooters and scorers.
You know, usually a perfect combination is a big, a wing,
a guard. The fact that these guys are pretty selfless
and egoless. I got them at number five. Number six.
Now we've never seen this before, but if Chris stops

(01:42:44):
Porzingis can stay healthy, He's a seven foot four slasher.
Luca Donze was the best European player at eighteen, came
over to the States one rookie of the Year. These
guys could be absolutely lethal. Ones a wing, one's a big,
They both run the floor, can both shoot. I'm not
sure if Dallas makes the playoffs, but as a duo,

(01:43:06):
these guys, as long as health isn't an issue, could
be sensational. Number seven Mike Conley and Donovan Mitchell. Folks,
I know you didn't watch Mike Conley play for the
last several years. He's been in the league twelve years.
Last year he averge twenty one a game and Donovan Mitchell.
And these guys, by the way, both play defense, so
you're talking about high IQ play. Both ends, both can shoot.

(01:43:30):
This is the perfect backcourt in Utah. All they needed
was a shooter and a point guard. Ricky Rubio love him.
Can't shoot. Conley and Mitchell again, Maybe it's because they
play in Utah are perfect together. Number eight Kemba Walker
and Jason Tatum. Jason Tatum last year Plateau. I actually
think he's really good. I just don't think he and
Kyrie Meshed. I don't know if this is championship pedigree stuff,

(01:43:53):
but let's not kid ourselves. Kemba fits, Kemba can score,
Kemba's low maintenance, and Tatum's a very good young talent.
Number nine Janis and Chris Middleton ones a remarkable player.
Now I put them lower because I think Middleton's not
an All Star in the West. I think he's an
All Star in the East. They paid him a lot

(01:44:14):
of money, but this is mostly an A plus and
a B. Number ten Russell Westbrook in the ball listen,
he said the ball was his best friend. He obviously
struggles with other star players. This seems a little harsh.
He's gonna end up making a lot of money somewhere else.
Russell Westbrook and the Ball is still one of the

(01:44:35):
best watches in the NBA. It's one of the best
television shows. You're just putting a little spin on it,
so it's not it's not exactly a jab. It's kind
of a jab. Now, I didn't put in a couple. Yeah,
you're you're missing a few on there. Okay. I have
some issues with the order as well, but Simmons and
and BT are not on there. Okay. They don't get along,
they don't work. I like their talent individually obviously, James

(01:44:58):
Harden and Chris Paul Okay, they have a fight right now.
They don't like each other either. Yea. There were conflicting
reports on that. I think they had some issues with losing,
which everyone does. I trust the blogs rumors, all right,
And I'm not saying that the reports were incorrect. They fought.
I'm just saying, isn't I think it's being ever blown.
And then Duran Irving, well, I can understand that because

(01:45:19):
Katie's not playing Katie isn't playing. Kav and Irving were healthy,
I would put them four, maybe three. I put them
pretty high, but I can't because Katie's out for a year. Yeah,
I mean that's understandable, but I am surprised as you
don't have uh Simmons an MB. I don't think Simmons
an mbid worked. I love them both individually, I don't

(01:45:41):
think it works like now, Elton Brand runs the team.
Super smart guy. He's like, you know, he signed Simmons early,
so they think it works. I also think CJ and
Dame are a little while. Where would you put them?
I mean I would just meet them up one spot.
Yeah's you know, it's funny the the mountain. You know,

(01:46:01):
I go to Utah lot, but when you're in the
Mountain range, the mountain time zones is different. It's not
West and it's not East, and it's not Midwest. We
kind of forget we have an other time zone. So
the two teams in this league that nobody pays attention
to are Denver and Utah. I'm not saying they're not great.
I'm just saying I think I think Dame and CJ

(01:46:22):
have more experienced. So that's that's why I would put
them above Mariano. Okay, who I think? Who I think
are great? How good is the West? It's like the
SEC in football. I think the sixth best team could
generally compete for second in any other conference. How good
is the West? I don't even think Dallas gets in
the West. This is so good and no one knows

(01:46:42):
who's going to really be on top, even though I
do agree that the Clippers is probably be favored at
this point. But the East is really even too. I
don't think that they would be able to think in
the same level as the West. Philadelphia and Milwaukee, you
don't you said, you just said you don't like Simons together.
But they got a bunch again, they got Horford. Now,
I mean, I still think they're gonna be good. The
Celtics are going to be a lot better than people think. Man, well,

(01:47:03):
Toronto's in a rebuild. Hey. By the way, two things.
Congratulations to Toronto handling Kawai's departure with dignity and class. Yes,
I just love how Toronto handled it. Love it. Congratulations
to the United States women's national team. Yes, people forget
their two goal scorers yesterday were injured. I mean this
was like the NBA Finals. They were putting injured players in.

(01:47:27):
They got a massive TV rating. What else? Congratulations the
All Star Game? Crook killed on. Okay, here's another one,
sort of god Chris Haynes Yahoo. The Lakers intend to
move Lebron James to the starting point guard position, So
it'll go Lebron one, probably Danny Green two, Kuzma three,

(01:47:49):
Anthony Davis four, Boogie five, Javail backup center, KCP, backup two, Avery,
backup to, backup to. Quinn took off the bench. Jared
Dudley off the bench. That's interesting, by the way, I mean, seriously,
we had a breaking story to the last minute of

(01:48:10):
the show. The only thing we're missing is in Earth.
Forget it. I had one last week. No more of those,
all right, for joining everybody here, David Griffin, Alex Rodriguez,
Bill Orum, Chris Brussard, Lebrono point guard, John Smoltz All
Star Game. One of the smart guys in the sport
will join us tomorrow. That's obviously from Cleveland, where a

(01:48:31):
Rod joined us today. Good stuff. I'm exhausted. We'll see
you tomorrow. It's the Herd

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Lakers-Clippers, Kawhi Leonard, parity, Russell Westbook, and duos