Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Here we go.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
It's a Thursday. It is our number two. Appreciate you stoping.
But I'm going to the live tour Saturday.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
I maybe out there and grab my clubs, hit some
bombs out there, Jamat. I'm excited to watch.
Speaker 4 (00:44):
Isn't it cool to do sports against like real professional athletes.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
It's exciting. Bryson de Shamble will be out there. I'm
fired up for it. So it's just a fun time
of the year. Tomorrow night, Shador Sanders is going to play.
I the two ninety mile hour speeding tickets and the
pre draft interviews and the legendary you know, draft room.
(01:10):
I don't love that stuff. I don't. I don't think
he's a terribly serious young man, and I think the
position demands that we'll find out tomorrow though, is could
he be a great backup, or is he good enough
for Cleveland at the end of the year or at
the trade deadline to move him for a draft pick.
I think. I think Cleveland, who has two first round picks,
wants to this year get as many picks as they can.
(01:32):
If they can move Kenny Pickett here in the preseason,
if they could move Shador Sanders into the season. If
you get six round picks, you're just looking for nine, ten, eleven,
twelve picks. So if you give up six to move
up a couple slots, that's which's that's the game. It's
in an exact science. And speaking of inexact the Chicago
(01:55):
Bears new coach Caleb Williams, let's bring in Greg co
Sell for the first time in our football season in
forty six years. NFL film. So you spend your off
season watching, like you know, every snap of these quarterbacks,
the red zone stat that's what you do. So Yeah,
one of the things that always worries me about a
quarterback is if they have a college problem footwork, hero ball. Yeah,
(02:20):
and it becomes a problem very early in the NFL.
So they're either uncoachable or they don't have a coach
that knows how to fix it. So my concern on
Caleb is little hero ball holds it too long. Those
were knocks at USC. So when you looked at all
in hindsight the snaps, what do you see that absolutely
(02:43):
has to be worked on going into year two.
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Well, there's a lot to unpack with Caleb Williams. I
think that if you just watch his tape from a
year ago, some concerns are just his ability to sort
of have a feel in the pocket. He had a
tendency to step up when there was no need to
step up. So what that would do is it would
bring him closer to the offensive line and the pass rushers,
(03:08):
and so he created his own pressure at times. And
obviously he's just not a guy that saw it as
cleanly as you like, So he held the ball too long.
But think about this, Colin. You watch a ton of
college football as well. And this is not a test question,
but let's throw this out. What do quarterbacks in college
never do?
Speaker 6 (03:29):
Most of them? They do not huddle.
Speaker 5 (03:31):
So now you're with Ben Johnson, Okay, he's essentially a rookie.
Speaker 6 (03:35):
Now Caleb Williams.
Speaker 5 (03:36):
You almost have to forget about what happened last year
because Now what he's learning is he's learning very wordy
play calls that have a lot of alerts. Sometimes there's
two play calls that are built into a particular verbiage,
and then there's shifts, there's motions, there's all kinds of
things that he has to learn just to get from
(03:58):
the huddle to the line of scrimmage with a reasonable
amount of time on the play clock, so that when
the shifts and the motions happen, he has time to
see how the defense responds. This is the operational part
of playing quarterback that he's never really done before, not
to the level that Ben Johnson demands. So we have
to start from there before we even put him on
(04:19):
the field playing in a real game. So there's an
awful lot to learn for Caleb Williams. So this is
almost a rookie season all over again.
Speaker 6 (04:28):
As a pure.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
Talent throwing the football, he's phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
But before you.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
Get to that, there's so much more that he has
to learn, and I hope people understand that that's going
to take time.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
So Kevin O'Connell, JJ McCarthy, Kevin runs advanced schemes. This
is like McVeigh, you have Stafford. Matt Stafford is a
sharp guy, and that's one of the reasons that McVeigh
was so attracted to him in Detroit. I mean, I've
seen the study habits of Stafford. They're kind of legendary. Well,
do you think the advanced schemes, because I like Minnesota's
(05:03):
offensive personnel, do you think the advanced schemes helper hurt
JJ McCarthy helper hurt him.
Speaker 5 (05:09):
Well, I think they're advanced, but in other ways they're
theoretically simpler in the sense that what Kevin O'Connell is
really good at, just like Kyle Shanahan is really good at,
is they're really good at getting the primary read open
and available for the quarterback because they're really good at
understanding defenses, which is critical as a play caller. You're
(05:32):
not calling plays in a vacuum. You're calling plays based
on your sense of defensive tendency and probability. And one
thing Kevin O'Connell's really good at. We saw that with
Sam Darnold last year, which is why Sam had such
a good season. One of the reasons, anyway, is he's
so good at getting that primary read open, and that
will be critical for JJ McCarthy this year because my
(05:55):
guess is JJ McCarthy in these early stages of his
development is not going to be great yet at working
through progressions, certainly not full field progressions.
Speaker 6 (06:05):
So I think that's a critical.
Speaker 5 (06:07):
Piece of how JJ McCarthy can do this year, and
all that gets tied in with your footwork and the
timing of routes. There's so much that goes into that
that will be a work in progress as well.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
So I watched bo Nicks twice live in college. He's cut,
he's fast. Yeah, when you watched all his tape, my
take is we don't watch Denver as much as we
watch those NFC East teams, and people just don't realize
how good of an athlete is. When you look at
bon Nick's rookie tape, what are people missing about him?
(06:42):
Because his numbers were better than Jayden in many instances.
Speaker 5 (06:47):
I think what people miss and I would say I
probably missed it to some degree as well when I
did his college tape, even though I liked him, is
I think his arm is better than people give it
gave it credit for. And when I say arm strength,
I'm not talking about the ability to throw the ball.
Speaker 6 (07:01):
Sixty or seventy yards.
Speaker 5 (07:03):
I'm talking about the ability to stick throws in the
middle of the field, dig balls, you know, eighteen to
twenty two yards, in breaking routes between and over defenders.
Speaker 6 (07:13):
He threw the ball really, really well. Those are really.
Speaker 5 (07:17):
Armstringed throws, those kinds of throws, and I think that
he throws the ball a lot better than people give
him credit for.
Speaker 6 (07:24):
Now.
Speaker 5 (07:24):
I think there's clearly some things that he has to
work on. I'm sure Sean Payton would tell you that
he's only going into his second year. But I think
just in terms of sheer physical traits as a passer,
he's a lot better than he's been given credit for.
And you've probably been around him. He's a pretty big kid, Colin.
He's not a small guy. And he's a very good athlete.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
Yeah, very very good athlete. I noticed when I went
to the Utah Oregon game and I sat behind the bench,
and he is ripped. I mean he is. He's not
trying to shot off. He has just cut very little
body fat. So Drake May came in. I think we
both like Drake May. The comp was justin Herbert and
at the times I've watched him, and he does look
a little like Herbert. I mean the size, the number,
(08:06):
the way he moves. Is there anything you saw? Now
he's got a better coach. They spent three hundred million
bucks around him online play. What was your overall appraisal
of him in the rearview mirror? Now watching year one
and his growth.
Speaker 5 (08:23):
Very impressed given, as you know, colin a bad situation,
maybe one of the worst five zero lines in the
NFL A receiving corps that I mean, I would bet
a lot.
Speaker 6 (08:32):
Of people couldn't even name their receivers.
Speaker 5 (08:35):
So given the situation he was in, I thought he
handled himself really well. You'd expect him to be up
and down in that situation, and he was. But I
think overall, you're dealing with a kid that's big, he's physical,
he throws the ball really well, he can move. Yeah,
I mean, I don't think there's anything. And again we're
not there, so we don't know the mental capacity of
(08:56):
how he assimilates all the information that he needs to assimilate.
Speaker 6 (09:00):
Obviously, it's Josh McDaniels now as the OC. We'll see
how that goes.
Speaker 5 (09:04):
But you're dealing with a guy that has pretty higher
level traits and it might take some time. And he's
learning a brand new offense. I'm not sure people realize
how difficult that is. You've been around, you've seen play calls,
you've seen how all that works. That's hard. It's hard
to assimilate a brand new offense. He just went through
a rookie year where he had to work his tail
off mentally, and now all of a sudden, he's starting
(09:26):
from scratch with a whole new offense, probably brand new terminology.
Speaker 6 (09:30):
So that takes time. But when you talk.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
About the physical and athletic traits, he's got them.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
You know. This off season, you know, I know it's
a slow off season for all of us in the
talk show business, but there was a little bit of
a week long theory Jalen Hurts when gms and coaches
pulled privately their thoughts on the top ten quarterbacks, Jalen
Hurts was like nine and right take has always been.
I trust Greg Gosel and I've said this, he reminds
(10:01):
me of a more talented Dak Prescott. I like his EQ,
I like his IQ, I like his toughness, I like
his leadership. I don't love him from the pocket I
never loved Dak from the pocket. I just thought he
was a smart, tough, gritty leader. When you hear that
Jalen Hurts, the GMS, the scouts, the coaches are like,
he's ninth best. What is your takeaway? Un Hurts the quarterback?
Speaker 5 (10:25):
Well, I think every quarterback for the most part, and
it becomes a function in many ways of their team,
and Hurts is very much that kind of player. When
you think about the Eagles and how they won a
year ago the Super Bowl, my guess is most people
the first thing they say is not boy, that's Jalen
Hurts his team. I mean, this was a team with
(10:45):
a running back that had historical season. They've got the
best O line in football, they had the best defense
in football. Jalen Hurts is a piece of a really
good team, and they do a lot of things that
are difficult to defend. And let me get a few examples,
and I've spoken to coaches this offseason about it.
Speaker 6 (11:03):
They are a four down offense.
Speaker 5 (11:05):
Literally once they get to let's say the minus forty
five yard line or the fifty yard line. So now
what happens is defense is when it's third and eight
have to play them totally differently because you know what,
they're going to run the ball on third and eight.
Most teams will never consider running the ball on third
and eight, So now you have to think, how do
I play defensively because they're going to run the ball,
(11:26):
because if they get to fourth and two, they are
going to go for it. And Jalen Hurts is a critical,
critical piece of their third down and fourth down offense
and one of the things he does exceptionally well. And
I heard this a lot this offseason. Everybody talked about
AJ Brown and how critical it is that he can
win one on one on the outside because Jalen Hurts.
(11:48):
The best thing about his throwing Colin is he works
outside the numbers. He can throw the fade ball, he
can throw the goal ball, and AJ Brown gets a
ton of one on one because of the nature of
their run game, which of course Jalen Hurts is a
significant part of. So he's a critical piece in what
he brings. But if you're comparing him to let's say,
(12:08):
the quarterbacks that we think of as being the elite
guys that can, in a sense, be the guys that
win games by themselves, he probably does not fall into
that category.
Speaker 1 (12:19):
So I said, my prediction is when quarterbacks get old
and rich, they do not want to get hit. And
Aaron Rodgers last year Eli at the end of his career,
he didn't want to get hit. Brady was practicing how
to get sacked. When I watched Aaron at the end
of last year, it was a lot of underneath stuffs.
(12:41):
He didn't want to take hits and blame him the
Jets old life. Well, Pittsburgh can't solve their offensive linebrom
six years in a row now, Greg and their early
reports from camp are he's not throwing the ball down
the field and might take his outside of Matt Stafford.
Very few old, wealthy quarterbacks are willing to take a
helmet to the chin stripe. He is one of one.
(13:04):
I think the problem with Aaron in Pittsburgh is he,
like the Jets, he will not trust that O line.
What do you think of that?
Speaker 5 (13:14):
I wish I had time to tell you a great
Jim Kelly story, but that'll be for another time. But anyway,
you know, I think the key thing here is the
tackle position for the Steelers because Roderick Jones, going into
his third season, has not really shown that he's a
quality NFL offensive tackle, and that's a concern. Look, the
litmus test for offensive tackles in the NFL is can
they pass protect one on one on third down? And
(13:35):
right now the Steelers have a question about that. And
if that remains a question in the regular season, your
point about Rodgers is one hundred percent right.
Speaker 6 (13:43):
He's not going to want to get hit. He's going
to want to get rid of the football.
Speaker 5 (13:47):
He won't be immobile, but he certainly doesn't have the
mobility that he had four or five, six, seven years ago.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
So it'll be very interesting.
Speaker 5 (13:54):
And then Arthur Smith, obviously they'd like to run the
ball as the foundation of their Offense's going to be
the absolute critical piece. You know, Roger still throws the
ball as well as anybody, but I'm not sure at
this point in his career. Behind that old line, you
want to ask him to drop back forty times a game.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
No, you do not. So the Lions lose Benjo, they
lose two great coordinators. And I said, I've said multiple
times the Eagles go to a Super Bowl, lose their coordinators,
hire the wrong guys, and then at one point lost
six to seven games. We pay attention to quarterbacks and
head coaches. But a lot of coaches that are not
great scheme coaches need they're very reliant on a scheme, like,
(14:35):
for instance, Dan Campbell's not known Dan Campbell, Nick Serian,
You're not great scheme guys. They're culture guys. And so
losing Ben Johnson to me is a big deal. It
wouldn't be a big deal for Shanahan or Andy Reid,
but I think Dan Campbell is more of a culture
guy that is reliant on a great OC. When you
(14:59):
looked at Ben Johnson last year, did we even undervalue
him how important he was? I mean, I always felt
like everybody was backpedaling against them because they had so
much effectiveness with trick plays, a dominant O line. I
don't think Detroit's going to be as good this year.
I don't think they're going to be as clever and creative.
Speaker 5 (15:18):
It'll be interesting because here's the question that we don't
know the answer to, because now Jared Goff was in
that system with Ben Johnson for what three four years?
Speaker 6 (15:26):
I'm not sure we give Jared Goff enough credit.
Speaker 5 (15:28):
We just spoke about how Caleb Williams has so much
to learn Goff really mastered that offense, so the question
is how much input will he have. Johnny Morton, I believe,
is the new OC and he was there, so obviously
they can keep a lot of the same principles and concepts.
But now you get into game play calling, which we
(15:48):
won't know the answer to that at all. But schematically,
what Ben Johnson does to me is so good. The
spacing he has versus his own coverage, it's beautiful, really
defines it exceedingly well. But you know, you're dealing with
a quarterback in GoF, and as I said, I'm not
sure we give him enough credit because he doesn't in
many ways fit the mold of how we see quarterbacks
(16:09):
now in the NFL because he's not a run around guy.
But you know, Goff really handled everything in that offense.
There's so many elements to that, as we discussed with
Caleb Williams. So we'll see how Detroit is, but I
think GoF plays a big role in this.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
You know, it's funny you mentioned that because I read
it this week and I forget where I read it,
but somebody said on the online I thought it was smart.
They said Ben Johnson may be great and Caleb's greatly talented.
What if they're stylistically a bad match. Like Kyle Shanahan
does not want quarterbacks running out of his place. He
does not. Now I do wonder if Ben and Caleb
(16:49):
it's not his guy, he didn't draft him, if stylistically
it may not be a perfect fit.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
Greg, No, but no coach wants the quarterback to run
out of their place.
Speaker 6 (16:59):
I'm telling you as a fat column. You know, obviously
there's obviously there's certain.
Speaker 5 (17:03):
Guys that can do that really well, and then the
coaching staff goes, hey, great play, because they make great plays.
But no coach, you know, look, I've been a training camps.
I'm sure you have. These coaches work fifteen hours a day.
No offensive coordinator is calling a game or any play
to have the quarterback not execute it the way it's
supposed to be executed. Obviously, they understand there are times
(17:25):
that can't happen, but they don't want it not to
happen because the quarterback screws it up. They want it
not to happen because the defense happens to win the down.
So there's no coach that wants the quarterback to just
randomly break down and disrupt the play. So it's not
that Caleb Johnson's a bad fit. Caleb Johnson needs to
excuse me.
Speaker 6 (17:45):
Caleb Williams.
Speaker 5 (17:46):
Caleb Williams needs to learn all this and then as
a parachute as the last thing, then the ability to
make those special plays comes into play.
Speaker 6 (17:56):
But that can't be the first thing.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
And finally, I tried to be very positive with Shdeer Sanders.
I did not like what I heard about his interviews
pre draft. I did not like the kind of lack
of self awareness legendary in his draft room. But I
was like, listen, he's accurate, he moves pretty well, good pedigree.
And then he got two speeding tickets and I'm like, Okay,
(18:19):
you're not serious. You're not as serious. I need to
grown up for this position. And so I don't have
high hopes. And I said this for years. I think quarterback,
it's almost unfair, but we need you to be have
the maturity of your dad at twenty three. That's why
the Mannings all work. They're all like, you know, they're
very mature people. So I don't have a particularly high
(18:40):
hopes because I've seen a lack of self awareness and
judgment for Shaduer Is there anything on tape you love
or don't love as he plays tomorrow in the exhibition game.
Speaker 5 (18:50):
Well, I think what his tape showed, and look, he
was a fifth round pick, and he's a fifth round
pick for a reason. Now can fifth round quarterbacks make it?
Of course they can. So I'm not going to sit
here and say whether he will or won't. But I
think what you saw on tape was a quarterback that's
a little smaller than you'd ideally like, that throws the
ball well, but not incredibly well. I think he's accurate,
(19:11):
but not quite as super accurate as a lot of
people make out.
Speaker 6 (19:14):
And that's based on film study. That's not an opinion.
Speaker 5 (19:17):
And I've had that conversation, by the way, with coaches,
and he's essentially a pocket quarterback.
Speaker 6 (19:21):
He's not a statue.
Speaker 5 (19:23):
But if he were to be a really good NFL quarterback, Colin,
it would have to be because he's a pocket quarterback.
He's not a playmaker. He doesn't give you a playmaking dimension.
He's not Patrick Mahomes or Josh Allen. He's not going
to be that guy. So that's what he is. Those
kinds of quarterbacks in the NFL tend to be complementary pieces.
(19:43):
They can be really really good. I mean, you could
argue Jared Goff is that kind of quarterback. He's far
more talented than Schadur Sanders. But I mean, essentially, he's
a pocket quarterback. So he needs a really good coaching staff,
he needs team, he needs a lot of things around
him to be successful.
Speaker 6 (19:59):
Maybe he will be.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yeah. The two best pocket guys are Stafford and Golf,
and they are great throwers of the football. They are elite.
It's great. Yes, yeah, I mean I think Golf has
probably the most underrated arm in the league. Not the best,
but the most underrated arm in the league.
Speaker 5 (20:14):
Jared Goff and you know that Stafford. Let me tell
you something. Stafford is so highly respected in the league.
Everywhere I go, all people want to talk to me
about is Matthew Stafford and how great he is. And
I'm not sure fans in general think about him that way,
but he's so highly respected.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Greg Cosell, great seeing you his first appearance of many
And have yourself a great Friday in a great weekend.
Speaker 6 (20:39):
All right, thanks, Colin, really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Yeah, no, it's so Yeah, and again, I just it's
amazing to me that people would downplay two speeding tickets
for a fifth round quarterback in a week. Just I
had a situation. All these coaches in GMS, they watch
all these shows and they list they're just the information junkies.
(21:02):
I can remember just a small thing I remember as
an aside during the combine when Will Levis showed up
in the sleeveless shirt with a gun show and I
was like, Oh, so bad. He's trying to he wants,
he want, you know, he's trying. I had an NFC
coach call me after the show leave a message. I
called him back and put me on speaker phone with
(21:24):
somebody and they were laughing. They were like, oh god,
we just we just thought it was the most ridiculous thing.
And then I had an AFC executive. I had a
text with him two or three times, and he's like,
what you what matters to you. You're sending signals at
the Senior Bowl. You're sending signals at the Combine. Sometimes
(21:45):
in games, you're emotional, you do things that you know,
you know it's in the heat of the battle. But
when you're in a combine or a senior Bowl or
a practice. You're sending signals and these gms they're watching
all of it. You get two speeding tickets as a
fifth round quarterback. Every team that passed on him laughed
(22:06):
at him. The New York Giants, everybody, Jackson Dark Giants
were laughing at that. Remember how bad Shoodoor's interview reportedly
was with the Giants and they were like, we got
we got questions on self awarenes They were laughing at that.
So don't let your critics laugh. Make them wish hope
they sit in there going. Remember when Letterman left NBC
(22:27):
and went to CBS and Letterman had this hysterical opening
press conference. It was genuinely laugh out loud off the script. Funny,
you knew the NBC executives were watching that CBS press
conference going, we probably just should have paid him. He's
the funniest guy in the planet at the time.
Speaker 2 (22:45):
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Speaker 7 (22:55):
Like, Hey, this is Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
Join me every weekday morning on my podcast Straight Fire
with Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 7 (23:03):
This isn't your.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
Typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your
throat every day. Straight Fire gives you honest opinions on
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Speaker 7 (23:15):
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Speaker 1 (23:34):
It is early August. Mid August is a lot of
baseball teams getting ready for the postseason. Texas Ohio State
Labor Day weekend. Can't wait for that. J Mack with the.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
News on the News, this is the Herdline News.
Speaker 7 (23:55):
Colliard's starting with the team we rarely.
Speaker 4 (23:57):
Talk about around here, and that's the Chicago Barrison and Johnson.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
Ben.
Speaker 4 (24:02):
Ben's is stilling a new culture in Chicago, and it
starts with accountability. There's GM Ryan Poles said. Johnson has
been holding players to a standard and it starts with
the QB.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
I see a ton of growth.
Speaker 8 (24:16):
Ben has been hard on the quarterback position because of
everything you just said. There's a lot that rides on
the quarterback shoulders. So what he's doing is He's making
it hard now so that when we get to games
things slow down for us. He understands the growth and
development process of the quarterback position. There's gonna be days
(24:38):
that are really good, and there's gonna be days where
maybe you take a step back.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
Interesting, man, So, Colin, you know, you and I do
some interviews. I go on radio shows often. I will
say this, it's got to be real tough as a
football player, basketball player, coach GM you.
Speaker 7 (24:54):
Have to face the media every day and not step.
Speaker 4 (24:57):
In it and say something that you're gonna regret or
want to walk back instantly. Because with Caleb, there's been
some issues with Ben Johnson clearly, right. I mean you've
been banging on him almost three four days a week. Yeah,
And all it takes is one kernel from this guy.
Because I'm parsing the every word. You know, Bears bloggers,
social media, they're going through every word, and there's days
(25:18):
where you might take a step back.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Wait a minute, what year two?
Speaker 4 (25:22):
It's got to be step forward, it's got to be
linear what's going on here? And I just I don't
envy Poles having to go do all these interviews. It's
just especially with a new coach, new culture quarterback off
of the struggle bus.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
It just feels tough, and it does matter that Chicago
is a big, loud, aggressive media market. I listened to
Chicago radio. It's Cubs because the Cubs are good this year.
It's Cubs and Bears, and that's what they talk about.
And so there's a lot of eyes on it. And
it's not a very good ownership group. There's questions about upstairs.
I don't know if Poles is good or not. I
(25:56):
don't know. He's done some things. I like, he's done
some things I don't like. I like Ben Johnson a lot,
and I think Caleb is really gifted. I mean, even
Greg co Sell said, despite his problems, he said, when
he throws the football, it is beautiful.
Speaker 6 (26:09):
It is.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
He has got a power. He's like Mahomes. Mahomes is
like six to two. He's not that big of a guy.
The dad bought Mahomes has a cannon. Caleb Williams is
six feet tall, but he his arm is like it's
a top five or six arm in the league. He
has a huge power arm.
Speaker 7 (26:30):
I mean, listen to Saint Jacksonville.
Speaker 4 (26:32):
You know Ryot Jacksonville, GM goes on radio like seventeen
people hear it. You go on Chicago, it's a brushfire
every day. Let's move on to Pittsburgh, Colin, I don't
like this story one bit. So Aaron Rodgers, obviously new
to Pittsburgh, just got their offense, is kind of struggling.
So Rogers is struggling to develop chemistry with his receivers
(26:53):
who are not DK Metcalt. Listen closely to what Rogers
said here.
Speaker 9 (27:00):
Gotta get a row out of his head a little bit,
you know, because I think he's he's such a good kid.
He cares so much about whether it's my approval or
he's doing it right. And he just got to trust
himself because he's so damn talented. You know, the more
he could play free and not not sink out there,
the better he's gonna play. So the more he can
just trust what he's got and then just go out
(27:20):
and react, the better he's going to play.
Speaker 4 (27:23):
Okay, So to the backstory, Roman Wilson, kid out of Michigan,
is a young receiver. He was a rookie last year,
third round pick, and Aaron Rodgers meeting the media, felt
compelled to tell.
Speaker 7 (27:35):
Them, oh, this young guy.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
He's got to get out of his head a little bit.
I mean, I know it's August Cullin and I know
Rogers just got there.
Speaker 7 (27:42):
But that's like the antithesis of leadership.
Speaker 1 (27:45):
Is it not? Well that that? I don't know. I
I don't know if he'll Why.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
Do you go to the media, Tell Roman bro get
out of your head, go to the.
Speaker 7 (27:55):
Media and hype this guy up.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
Can you imagine if you were doing interviews when I
start on the so and you're like, yea j Max
got to get out of his head a little bit.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Well, that's what I told That's what That's what I
told management.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
I didn't have to tell the ones don't tell the media,
so I got to read about it.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Yeah, I you know. I mean, I think I have
a hard time criticizing Aaron Rodgers or Kevin Durant when
they give me content, and so I do think. I
do think there are certain people, certain athletes, who just
tell you how they feel. My only issue with Aaron is,
and it's not really an issue. Aaron does not want
to get hit. He's forty one in rich and Pittsburgh.
(28:33):
You got to sit in there. This is not a
great old they lost their left tackle, Najee Harris. This
is not a good old line, and so I think
they're bigger issue. I don't think Roman Wilson he's more
of it. I was never a huge of all the
great Michigan players. I thought he was kind of a
two or three in the NFL. I don't even know
if he's a two. Maybe he is, but it didn't
(28:53):
bother me that much.
Speaker 7 (28:54):
I mean, it doesn't.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
By the so Aaron Rodgers says that it's all over
Pittsburgh radio, TV, blog, social media, and I'm sure Roman
Wilson sees it. And now you're in the locker room
and everybody's looking at you knowing you're in your head.
That's just unnecessary crap, Colin. This is what Rogers does. Man,
He's divisive. He's not unifying.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
Well, I mean romand Wilson, if he's gonna make it
in the pros, that comment cannot be an obstacle. Well,
you don't get rainbows and palm palms every day. If
you can't handle some criticism by Aaron Rodgers, you're not
built for it. I mean, seriously, you got to really,
romand Wilson's gonna go home a Sleepless Night tonight. He'll
be fine.
Speaker 7 (29:36):
Praise publicly, criticized privately. A smart man once.
Speaker 4 (29:39):
I think that was Plato, Aristotle, somebody really smart.
Speaker 7 (29:42):
Anyways, final story, Colin, Let's go.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
To the Raiders.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Gino Smiths and Pete Carroll reuniting in Vegas in their
first game is Raiders. The duo will go to a
very familiar place to play, Seattle. Gino talked about returning
to his old home with his old.
Speaker 8 (29:58):
Coach man, looking forward to it, really looking forward to it,
looking forward to seeing my old teammates, whole coaches people
in the building.
Speaker 4 (30:05):
It'll be fun.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
Also going back with Pete. That's pretty cool.
Speaker 6 (30:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
I think Geno is a little Sam Darnold. If you
give him that extra second to stand in there and
throw it, he's good. He's very good. If you rush
him with Donald and Gino, you're gonna get mistakes. I
think the A line for the Raiders is fine in
their division. It's not as good as Denvers, and I
don't think it'll be as good as the Chargers. It
(30:33):
may be on par with Kansas City's where you're kind
of hoping. Josh Simmons works at left tackle, but I
think the Raiders are actually gonna be good. I just
don't know. I think in a lot of divisions, i'd
pick them as a dark horse wild card team and
a lot of division. If you put them in the AFCSALTH,
I think they could win the division. If you put
them in the NFCSALTH, I think they could battle. I
don't think they're as good as Tampa because a Baker,
(30:54):
but they could battle to win the division. I think
in this place they're battling for third because they don't
have Denver's roster, they don't have the Charger, they don't
have Mahomes, you know, and so it's I mean, Pete
didn't get an easy draw here. They've got three or
four great players. Rock Bowers and Max Crosby are first
(31:15):
ballot All Pro guy. Those guys are great players. Secondary
is a little underrated. But if they can protect Gino,
I think here's what I would say. The Raiders have
a chance to split every series in this division. And
you can't say that about the Giants in the NFC East.
(31:37):
You can't. Most fourth place teams do not have a
chance to split. There's some fourth place teams Indianapolis, you know,
if their quarterback plays as bad as it could be,
they're gonna get swept by somebody in division. I think.
I think the Raiders could split with the Chiefs, the Broncos,
and Kansas City. I think there'll be that improved.
Speaker 4 (31:58):
I got a couple moles in Vegas and Colin the
hype train for Ashton genty right now. I mean they're
saying like this guy is gonna right out of the
gate be an unbelievable player for the Raider.
Speaker 7 (32:09):
Now we'll see. I know it's a big leap from
Boise to the NF.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
I can't wait to I cannot wait.
Speaker 4 (32:14):
To watch, you know, I think you know, I would
not be surprised if it was a thirteen fourteen hundred
yard season from Ashton Gen.
Speaker 7 (32:21):
I was just put that out there.
Speaker 1 (32:23):
Well, fantasy football out there, okay. J McK with the news, Well.
Speaker 2 (32:28):
That's the news, and thanks for stopping by The Herd
Line News.
Speaker 1 (32:33):
I like my coaches to get in the middle of scrums.
We'll talk about that next.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd Weekdays
and Noone Easter nn A EM Pacific on Fox Sports
Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
App Saturday it's a baseball night in America as a
rising star Pete crow Armstrong leads the Cubs against the Cardinals,
or Bryce Harper and the Phillies battle the Rangers. Check
local listings for the game in your area, Saturday, sevent
easternn Fox.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
So it was about, uh, probably about four months ago,
four or five months ago. It was what are we
in August, July, June, Juan, it was teams were hiring
had just finished up hiring their coaches in the NFL.
So maybe it's probably about March. And I was talking.
I was driving on the four h five headed home,
(33:29):
and I was, Uh. I called a friend of mine
who's an executive in the NFL, who has done who
has hired multiple coaches in his career, his long career,
and he said, you know what you're really doing when
you hire a coach is in the NFL, you're hiring
a CEO. If they're good with schemes, that's a bonus.
And he mentioned like Shanahan and Andy Reid. He said, yeah,
(33:49):
that's a bonus, but they don't have to be. He said,
you know, Mike Tomlins hoisted a trophy. Pete Carroll has
been to a couple of super bowls there, walk around guys,
they're CEOs there, and he goes, you're what you If
you have a guy that's great with schemes, but he's
terrible in building a culture, that won't work. If you
(34:13):
have a guy who's not necessarily great with schemes, but
he can hire a great staff, he's great with culture
that can get you to super Bowls and win super Bowls.
And so when the Patriots hired Mike Vrabel, Vrabel's really smart,
but he's known as a culture guy. He builds toughness.
And so they got into a scuffle at New England
(34:37):
practice and Vrabel and this is this is very much
Mike Rabel. This is Dan Campbell talking about biiten kneecaps.
Dan Campbell is a smart guy, but he's a culture guy.
And he walked into Detroit and he was yelling in
and a dip in. He was tough. He was creating
a culture of toughness. Take his shirt off and bang
into you. Harbaugh does this, He'll take his shirt off,
(34:59):
He'll go up again. It's the sled. Harbaugh no schemes,
but Harbaugh's a culture builder. So Vrabel gets into a scuffle.
You know, they have some scuffle. He jumps into it
because head gets all bloody, and Drake May was talking
about him breaking up the camp scuffle.
Speaker 2 (35:15):
And it starts with the coach.
Speaker 10 (35:16):
Starts with the head coach. The intensity bring it every day, Uh,
you know, taking no crap and you know we're out
there on the field. But also it comes to a
time where with our guys offensively and get over there
and gets some tussles and kind of have some penalties
and extra after the whistle can get us some trouble.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
But for mentality, I like it so and again it helps.
It helps that Vrabel is a large man, but Nick
Saban's a culture builder and he's five six. You didn't
know that he's five to six, So that's not everything.
Urban Meyer's more of a bigger athletic man. Mike Tomlin's
a culture guy. Uh, Vrabel is, Dan Campbell is and
(35:53):
and then that's one of the things I have said.
I mean, I always thought, remember when the Bulls and
the Knicks, when we get into these series, the Miami
Heat and a Lonzo Morning and Patrick Ewing, I love
that Jeff Vandalls were physical series and the Knicks were
trying to establish physicality in that series, and Jeff Van
Gundy knew it. And Van Gundy's nuts anyway, I love him,
(36:16):
but he knew how important physicality was in this series,
and the NBA was going to let him fight, and
Van Gundy wanted to send the message, I'm I might
be five five and a half, but i I'll fight
with you. Look at Van Gun. This video is so good.
Van Gundy knew it was intentional. He didn't want to
(36:38):
get hit, but he knew he was sending a message.
You're not pushing my team around. This is a dog fight,
and I'll take my tie off. I'll fight you. That
is so incredibly powerful. That is so powerful and so
Invraibled does it. And that's what I've said about Mike McDaniel.
I don't question that. Mike McDaniel's small. He's a little guy,
(37:02):
and he's kind of snarky, and the media likes him
and the analytic guys love him. You know, Brandon Staley
was smart, but I didn't know if he could build
a culture. He'd get defensive at the microphone. Some guys.
Smart doesn't equal alpha, and there is that. You've got
fifty five men in the locker room and Nick Wright
came on this week, and we both think McDaniel is
(37:23):
super bright. But what are the Dolphins four years in?
What are Brian Flores? It took him eight games, remember
they were like one in seven. It took him eight
games to build the culture. But by like the ninth
tenth game of his Miami reign, and you didn't act
have to like Brian Flores. That team was good defensively
and physical. And Brian Flores is an alpha and he's loud,
(37:48):
and he's tough, maybe too much so, but I think
there is value in certain sports when you get to
the NBA playoffs and it is physical. I mean, Steve
Kerr is legendarily feisty. He got punched by Michael Jordan.
Part of what makes the Warriors work in their prime
was Draymond Green, Steve Kerr, andre Iguodala. It was a
(38:10):
tough team. They weren't big, they were feisty. There was
a lot of confrontation. Pat Riley's teams with the Lakers.
Pat's all slick in Armani suits. Pat was a fighter.
Pat when he went to the Knicks, Pat love physicality
and Pat would let guys know Pat would bark at rafts,
bark at everybody it mattered, And this was Nick right,
(38:31):
And this has always been a thing with Mike McDaniel.
I don't doubt he's smart. Can he build Lincoln Riley?
Same criticism. We know he's smart. Can he build a culture?
Why aren't his teams tougher? Here's Nick right this week
on Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 11 (38:47):
Some of the reason that the media loves him might
also be related to why his team pretty clearly does
not fear him the way they seem to some of
the more effective coaches. But I think that there is
an arrogance to the idea that that's in some ways
(39:08):
that football has talked about when it comes to the
actual physicality and toughness.
Speaker 7 (39:13):
Of the game that gets lost in some of the math.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
It's interesting and it's not just size again. Sabans six.
I think Sean McVay is about five nine, five ten.
I've talked to Rams players about McVeigh.
Speaker 4 (39:26):
He is.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
He is probably right now as good as any culture
builder in the league. He probably the best culture builder.
Mcvay's unbelievable in the locker room. He is unbelievable in
the film room. Like, and I'm talking as good as
anybody that's ever been Sean McVay, maybe as good as
any culture builder in league history's five nine Sabans five six.
But there is something. It's volume, its presence. Mcveagh's good looking.
(39:52):
You know, he was a good athlete, and I just
think this stuff matters. And the media thinks it's a
bunch of bull, But that's that's my thing. When Mike
Rabel's getting involved in the scuffle or Jeff Van Gundy
is it's intentional. It's like, guys, I'm in the fight
with you. Yeah, I'm And Drabel's got blood coming out
of his forehead. It's like, that's Mike Rabel. You go
(40:14):
back to Dan Campbell early. I thought it was a
little meat heady. I was wrong. I was like, boy,
this fighting kneecap stuff. This is embarrassing. I missed players.
I remember it was either the first or second year
of Detroit and they weren't good yet. I don't They
played Baltimore and I think they played him at home
and Baltimore beat them, and I went on the end.
I remember saying this, I said, I don't know how
(40:36):
good Detroit is. That team plays so hard, every stinking
the kneel down play. It was physical and I think
I don't know. I don't remember what year was. They
weren't great, they were getting close, but they played the Ravens.
I think it was. I think it was. You know,
you've heard of the word sweat equity. This is kind
(40:57):
of part of it. It was like early in the
process against the Ravens, and Ravens had far more talent,
and I was so blown away by how physical they were.
You don't get that unless the coach is building a
unique culture. You just don't get it. Did you guys
find what game that was? I don't know. I just
remember I was. I swear it was the Ravens. I
(41:20):
swear it was, but you know, maybe it wasn't.
Speaker 4 (41:24):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (41:25):
It's summer. I'll have to go back. I have to
chat GPT. I'll find out here in the break. Albert
Brear is joining us in the last hour. If you
miss Greg Cosell, we'll put him on the podcast as well.
Archie Manning is saying arch Manning's not going pro get
me stay may just uh me five six year red
(41:46):
shirt again. May stay at Texas forever. We'll talk about
that