March 19, 2024 • 35 mins
FOX Sports Radio Weekend host Martin Weiss is in for Rob, and he and Chris discuss the on-court similarities between Anthony Edwards and Michael Jordan, share their thoughts on the narrative that Jayson Tatum has been unfairly criticized for not winning an NBA championship during his career so far and debate whether Allen Iverson and Steph Curry are really the most influential NBA players of the last 40 years.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
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Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to the Best of the Odd Couple with
Chris Brusa and Ron Harker.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
What a dunk? That's the first thing I want to say.
What a dunk?
Speaker 4 (00:36):
Anthony Edwards arguably the most exciting player in the NBA.
Who's battling in for that John Morant? But John's not
playing this year.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
He's injured. So I don't know who would be more.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
Exciting of a player exciting than Anthony Edwards. Last night
Martin in a game with Utah, he had thirty two points,
eight dimes, seven boards to lead Minnesota to a victory
over the Jazz. Remember they are playing Minnesota without not
(01:11):
only Carl Anthony Towns, their second best player and a
multiple time All Star, but also without Rudy Gobert, who
may be on the verge of winning this fourth straight
or not fourth straight, but fourth Defensive Player of the
Year award. That was tie Ben Wallace and the Ken
Bae Matumbo for the most all time. So they needed
(01:34):
a win without their big guns or two of their
three big guns, and Anthony Edwards delivered. And what everyone's
talking about is this dunk he had over John Collins.
And I'm telling you, Martin, every time Edwards goes up
for dunk or a block, He's got the block of
the year, maybe the dunk of the year. It really
(01:57):
I'm not even like, I don't feel like I'm exaggerating.
Obviously it's not true, but it looks like he's jumping
off a trampoline. He is so explosive to the hoop,
it's just crazy. What'd you think of that dunk? And
am I tripping?
Speaker 5 (02:14):
No, You're absolutely not tripping.
Speaker 6 (02:15):
But first of all, I do have to take him
minute and chastise one of the dunkers our of my generation,
at least Blake Griffin, because before Blake Griffin, people were
grabbing the rim. Now with Blake, after Blake Griffin kind
of took the dunk contest by storm Lob City and
all of that, we got a whole bunch of guys
who are throwing it down quite literally, as opposed to
(02:36):
dunking and the hanging on the rim. I'm convinced that
Anthony Edwards ended up dislocating that finger because he didn't
grab the rim and hang up there for a second.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
He hit John Collins head.
Speaker 6 (02:47):
That's what if he had grabbed on the rim. If
he had grabbed on the rim, he wouldn't have hit
his head.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
How he was too far I think is I feel
like and Dwight Howard.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Did this in the dunk contest we had the Superman.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Cap on and like you said, Blake Griffin did it
over Timothy Miles, gov and Kendrick.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Perkins, which was I think was his best dunk.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
I gotta be honest, Martin, I think a lot of
times just throwing it in is more impressive because you
know how high you have to get up to throw
the ball down into the rim without it bouncing off
the back of the rim or something like that. Man,
I loved the dunk last night, So you had an
(03:33):
issue because he didn't grab the rim.
Speaker 5 (03:34):
I didn't have an issue though.
Speaker 6 (03:35):
I'm just being it's just a point of clarification that
we have now, to me, at least lowered the standard
of what the dunk is at this point.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
So this is lower. No, because because when I was
a kid, Chris.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
When I was a kid, you a mighty did it.
Speaker 6 (03:52):
You were dunking on somebody, hanging on the rim, putting
your chestnut to somebody's face and saying, ah, deal with
me now right.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
People still do that.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
But when you leave from so far out and you
can't get to the rim if you're high enough to
throw it in.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
I'm impressed. No, I'm impressed. So I will sit like
the old man, get off my law now, not me.
Speaker 6 (04:14):
But you know, I'm sorry. I'm sitting in Rob Parker's chair,
so I guess it's just rubbed off. But no, I'll
say this about Anthony Edwards and that dunk. First of all,
I fully agree with you. He's one of the best
tickets you can buy in the NBA right now in
terms of putting on a show to me. And he's
really consistent night in, night out. Now, may he may
come late to the game or you know, lout of
the locker room. He might miss it. Get him there,
(04:37):
he might miss the second the second half tip. But
but no, in terms of just pure athleticism, pure just
and I kind of really like to see the adversity
that he's going through right now as a player without,
like you said, his other all star cruning to the
towns and Rudy Gobert, who is playing got a defensive
Player of the Year level right now. To watch him
(04:58):
put the team on his back to me has been real.
And I know last offseason. We see this all the
time when guys go play for Team USA, right and
then come back and they their game is elevated to
a different level. I think that's what happened with Anthony
Edwards this last year. He played really well over the
summer playing with Team USA, and then after he came
back to the NBA, you see his game risen to
(05:20):
another level. And I'm hoping that they do make some
noise in the playoffs because I agree with you wholeheartedly.
And this is the best ticket you can buy in
the NBA to go watch a show. Let's just say
this the best young ticket you can buy in the
NBA to go watch a show, right Because don't get
me wrong, Steph Curry still doing this thing, Lebron's still
doing his thing, but this guy is exactly you can
(05:43):
see he's at the beginning of something great, being only
twenty two years old. And I mean, I love his game,
all the way he plays, and it's just evident that
he's gonna go try this. Like just a few days ago,
a few weeks ago, at this point, he tried to
catch Anthony Davis.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
You're coming over Anthony Davis the top of Anthony.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
Going after every bat, and it's reminiscent of a guy
that used to dunk on everybody to Kimba Mutumble got him,
Alonzo Morning got him, Patrick Ewing got him, Shack got him,
and of course that would be none other than Michael
Jordan and Anthony Edwards. Martin is drawing comparisons to Michael Jordan.
(06:25):
Patrick Beverly has said it, other people have said it,
and I reached out to the Goat himself, yes, mj
today via text, and he told me he does, indeed
see the similarities in his game and Anthony Edward's game,
and I think the similarities are these Martin. Then let
(06:46):
me say this first. There's two kinds of people that
get compared to Michael Jordan. There's those that people think
could maybe be the Goat, and that's Lebron right Lebron.
His game is nothing like Michael Jordan's, but he was
compared to Mike because can he be better?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Can he be as good?
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Anthony Edwards is the other type where stylistically.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
They get compared to Michael Jordan.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
I don't think anybody as great as we think Anthony
Edwards's future could be. None of us are thinking he's
gonna be the goat, or even in that conversation he
may be a surprise us, but right now nobody's thinking that.
And here's the stylistic similarities. I see one, obviously, the
high flying elements of his game, dunking on people.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Aggressive.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Two he loves to play defense Martin. We saw that
with Team USA. We've seen that this year where the
Timberwolves are top two defensive team in the league. Yes,
you have go Beart, but you also have Anthony Edwards
getting after it on the perimeter.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Three. He loves to play. He ain't trying to low manage.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I remember talking to Michael Jordan a few years ago
and we're talking about the possibility of them lowering the
eighty two games, making it smaller. He could not understand.
It was almost like he was offended. How in the
world could players want get the eighty two games lessened?
Like He's like, man, I want to play every night,
And you can see that by his record. He played
(08:13):
almost every night when he wasn't hurt. And Anthony Edwards
is like that. And Martin, we.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Saw that last night.
Speaker 4 (08:20):
He dislocates his fingers you said, goes into the locker room,
gets it popped back into the place and then taped,
and goes back out to the game to play. A
lot of guys in this day and Age would have
been like, man, I'm good, you know, we'll get him
another day. I'm chilling. And he went out there to
play and he said, I don't want to load manage.
So all those are ways that and he's charismatic and
(08:43):
all that too, but those are some similarities I do
see with him and Michael Jordan and look, Victor win
Benyama's gonna be the face of the NBA.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
I think that's clear. But outside of him, there's gonna be.
Speaker 4 (08:58):
Other faces, and I think one of them will be
Anthony Edward. What do you think of the MJ comparison?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
I don't I like it. Actually, it's something that you know.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
It's like you said, it's black swimmers in a way
to really comp somebody to Michael Jordan or Tom Brady
or something like that, because it's like, all right, dude,
wait a.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
Second, you can't do it quite yet.
Speaker 6 (09:16):
You got to see some wins, you gotta see some rings,
so on and so forth. But if you're just talking
about style and play style and athletic ability, he's right
up there with Kawhi in my mind in terms of
guys who remind me of Michael Jordan when they play
like well for different reasons, sure, but it's like, but
(09:37):
I mean, I love his competitiveness. And while you say
Victor winn Byama is going to be the face of
the NBA, I get where you're coming from with that,
but I do wonder if we've seen a lot of
foreign born players kind of take that mantle from here
and there, like Jokic or Janniss as the best player
in the league or you know, the face of the
(09:58):
league or so on. It makes me wonder about American
born players and where they are. I think Anthony Edwards
is our best shot at that one as an American player,
But in terms of just his ability and his competitiveness,
to me, he is breathing life into a league that
you know is still from the media side of things,
still really focused on the main players of the past,
(10:20):
with Steph and Lebron, Kevin Durant, so forth and so on.
To me, Anthony Edwards is a type of guy who
can break through that conversation because again, when you go
watch him play, he's attempting, not necessarily completing, but attempting
something like this almost every night. And what I don't
appreciate is there's two dunks going on in this segment,
(10:41):
Anthony Edwards dunking over John Collins and you dunking on
me talking about how you're texting Michael Jordan.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Well, it's something for you to shoot to and aspire to,
young man.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
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Speaker 7 (11:04):
Paulie Fosco here with Tony Fusco. You know, as the
host of the number one rated Paully and Tony Fusco show,
we get tons and tons of fan mail every day.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Piles of it.
Speaker 7 (11:14):
In fact, Tony, why don't you open up one of
those letters right now and read what's inside.
Speaker 8 (11:17):
Hey, listen to this. Dear Paulie and Tony, your sports
takes the dumbest and most terrible.
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Wait open this other one.
Speaker 8 (11:25):
Dear Paulie and Tony, you suck more than anyone.
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Wait, try this one.
Speaker 8 (11:30):
Dear Paulie and Tony, you guys are the absolute best.
Speaker 5 (11:34):
There you go, coming up with the stupidest take.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Get it.
Speaker 7 (11:38):
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Speaker 4 (11:44):
Yeah, Lebron James and JJ Reddick have started a new
podcast called Mine for the Game. Obviously you listen to
JJ Reddick and he's a very intelligent basketball mind. It
was a was a good player, obviously not great, not
an All star, but he was a good player. He
was more than like, you know, just a shooter. I
(12:06):
mean he was mainly a shooter, but he was good
enough to start and.
Speaker 5 (12:09):
You know, had some nice season. He was a college
all timer.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Yeah, college, he was great at Duke. He was He's
a Duke all time great at Duke. And he's better
than the Steve Kurz, the Tim Leglis. You know what
I mean the Kyle Korvers. Those guys were just purely
spot up shooters. And of course that was his forte
and what he did best and mostly but he was
(12:34):
he was a level above him real quick.
Speaker 6 (12:36):
When I was in high school, JJ Reddick was one
of the players I tried to model my game after,
no kidding.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
When he was at Duke, he was not did you
come so was your game shooting?
Speaker 9 (12:45):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (12:45):
I could shoot, but really I never got I never
got past sophomore year, JJ, because I couldn't handle the balls.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
I could shoot and I could jump. That was about it.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
It's interesting because I bet I don't know how much
time you spend around young players to day, but I
bet two things that well, let me say, I bet
there are a lot of guys that can handle the
rock that they you know, they probably practice it more now.
They do let you carry today, so that helps it out.
(13:15):
But I just think today, I bet more so many
young players are focused on a handle and three. And
I tell young players, look, work on your handle, man,
because if you you notice from playing, if you have
a handle, nobody can mess with you. No, you don't
have to worry about full court pressure. You know you
(13:38):
you can get where you want to on the court,
and especially if you're a guard. If you're a guard
and you don't get frazzled by people really getting up
in your grill defensively because you handle so well.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
That's a huge advantage. So young young.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
Cats out there, are you fathers who are and mothers
who are working with your young boys. Work on the
handle and the J and I'm even gonna say the
mid range J Martin. Lot of kids want to just
work on the three today, But I would say, don't
forsake the mid range. I get it, the three is
king right now. But if you've also got a mid
(14:15):
range game, think about it. If you got handle, you
got a three, so you handle, you can get to
the bucket, and you got a three point shot. What
are they gonna do with you if you also have
a mid range game? And toerr, they don't know if
you're going all the way to the cup. They don't
know if you're gonna take the three.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
And you know that.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
I think one of the great things about like the
greatest finishers, Martin, I think have the mid range game
because if I'm driving, you don't know if I'm going
all the way to the whole or if I'm gonna
pull up and stop on a dime and shoot that
mid range jumper Jordan Kobe Kawhi, A lot of the
guys that really Kyrie, they're great finishers, they can shoot
(14:57):
in the mid range.
Speaker 6 (14:58):
Well, if you're not a three level scorer, you can't
be great one. So that's part of the problem right there.
And it's honestly one of the knocks out I would
have on Jason Tatum. We guy we're about to talk about,
because that, I think is what's stopping him from being
like one of the Obviously he's a great offensive player,
but really taking the mantle of being one of the
all time great offensive players is he don't pull up
from the mid range.
Speaker 5 (15:18):
He's got no miny. It's all three or trying to
get to the rim.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Well, let's talk about him because Lebron James I mentioned
their podcast Lebron and JJ Reddick, and they they brought
up Jason Tatum, and here's what Lebron said.
Speaker 9 (15:33):
There's a great saying that says the best teacher in
life has experience as well. And we look at Tate.
I mean he's twenty five years old, he's twenty five
years old, and I believe he's been to the conference
finals four times, been to the obviously the NBA finals
once he's twenty five. I didn't. I mean I didn't
win my first one until I was twenty. He's eight.
I think Joker won his first one at twenty seven.
I think MJ was twenty eight as well. You know,
(15:55):
we have a lot of expectations on JT, but he's
experienced a lot of winning in his career so far.
And obviously, you know, everyone wants to see him get
over the hump. But four conference finals in a finals
appearance before the age of twenty six is that's elite.
And like you just said, he's continued to grow, and
you know they are in a position where they can
(16:17):
make another title run. And like I said, personnel helps,
you know, Adam persingis and and getting Drew for a
bag of Las Petato chips that helps as well. That
helps as well. But you know, Jat is definitely the
you know when you when you when you go and
he start scouting for Boston, He's a He's the number
one guy for sure.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Here's the other thing, because I think Lebron makes an
outstanding point and here.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Here's one point he didn't make. Martin.
Speaker 4 (16:44):
Jason is twenty six now, just turned twenty six recently.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
In his seventh season.
Speaker 4 (16:50):
So in his six seasons that have been completed, Martin,
the dude's been the four conference finals, all right, And
I would argue he was definitely the best player on
three of those teams. If you want to say the
first year, Jalen Brown was better. Jalen average like two
(17:12):
more points than Jason did in that conference finals against Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
You can go there, but you you would.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
I mean, he's been the best player at this young
age on a conference semi finalist or conference finalists, I
should say three times at least. And you might even
want to argue he was the better player that year.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
For the Celtics. I'm looking up now, was he there? Leading?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
You know, you had Kyrie on that team, but remember
Kyrie was hurt. But Kyrie was their best player, but
he got hurt during the playoffs and that's when you
know Tatum kind of stepped up and began to become
what he is. But what are your thoughts on what
Lebron said. I think it's pretty fair.
Speaker 6 (17:59):
I think it is fair, and I think when you
look at Jason Tatum, it may be a question of
just not if, but when, because again, he is almost
always in the conversation of them.
Speaker 5 (18:08):
He's almost always in the final four of the NBA. Right,
you look at where he ranks for his age.
Speaker 6 (18:14):
I mean, he's top ten in almost every relevant playoff
stat below. I mean for guys who are under or
now he's twenty six obviously, but because he just turned
twenty six two weeks ago. But from twenty five and under,
he's third amongst NBA players in playoff points right, trailing
only Lebron and Kobe Bryant.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Sixth and regular season wins. Like he's a guy again,
four conference championships.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
I mean, he's he is the type of guy to
me that we criticize because he hasn't gotten over the
hump very much like Jokis was criticized for not getting
over the hump, and once he got over the hump,
everybody was like.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
Okay, exhale, He's one of the greats. All right, cool,
he's one of the great.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Fairness to that, because I mean, Michael Jordan looked. Jordan
was beloved by a lot of people to come fly
with me.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Videos were before he won a championship.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
The Jordan sneaker phenomenon was before he won a championship.
So I'm not gonna see here and act like, you know,
Jordan wasn't beloved before the championships. But Martin, there was
a lot of criticism of him. There was at all. Yeah,
he can put up all these numbers, he can score
all these points. He's flashy, his game looks great, but
(19:32):
he's not magic or bird that I mean, that was
those were I had debates about that, and that was
written all throughout the papers and things like that, and
everybody kind of goes through it. Lebron again, everybody recognized
how great he was, but there was criticism of him
until he started winning championships.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
And so this is fair and you're right. Jokic is
a great example because Jokic, I mean, there were the analytics.
Speaker 4 (19:59):
Guy loved him, but a lot of people were like, man,
come on this dude, you know he's slow. He puts
up these numbers, but what's he doing in the playoffs.
So look, this is kind of just how it works.
When you're that caliber of player, you know, you get criticized.
It's it's kind of like Martin, your high school coach
(20:19):
or whatever level, saying if I didn't believe in you,
I wouldn't yell at you.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Sure be worried when I don't say a thing to
you anymore.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Because they yell at you because they see the greatness
in you that they want to bring out. And that's
kind of like, you know, Jason Tatum, be worried when
don't nobody criticize you because you don't win.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
They're like, all right, you know, I mean they don't
think you that level.
Speaker 6 (20:44):
All of the things that are true about Jason Tatum's
playoff career in terms of the wins and losses and
series and so forth, they're also true of Jalen Brown's
playoff career. And we're not having the same conversation all
the prospective.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
I mean, as great as Jalen is, he's just not
as good as Jason.
Speaker 6 (20:58):
But I mean Jason Tatum right now, you know, Chris,
he's fourth in playoff games played before turning twenty five
years old, trailing only Kobe, Tony Parker and Kawhi Leonard.
Speaker 5 (21:08):
Right, so seventy four playoff games. That's a ton. He's
got a ton of playoff experience.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
But we do it selectively because you want to forget
the close out game they had against Philly, Right, are
the game that forty one where exactly fifty one in
a potential elimination game, Right, Like, he's had big time
moments on big stages.
Speaker 5 (21:30):
It's just has he gotten it done on the biggest stage?
Not quite?
Speaker 6 (21:34):
Then it doesn't help when you lose to a playing
team like Miami or something like that. But like, it's
really to me one of those moments where we take
So we do this a lot in sports, where you'll
take the best player and criticize him as a result
of the team's success or failures.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
And that's what it is with Jason Tative.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
For me, I think before we go to the next seg,
do you think this is the year they get it done.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
I got Denver over Boston the finals.
Speaker 6 (22:00):
It's gonna be tough because I just don't love the
way that they play. Like we talked about Tator to
have a mid range game. Nobody on Boston really has
a mid range game, and we see it every year
in the playoffs. You have to be able to get
have bucket getters on your team, guys that can one
on one win their.
Speaker 5 (22:15):
Matchup and turn the water off.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
When the other team's on a ten to oher run,
a twelve ozher run, you give the ball to this
guy and you know you're gonna get a good shot,
get to the free throw line, get an a one
something to slow down the other team. Boston doesn't have that.
Boston is playing math at a way that I don't
think will be rewarded in the postseason.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Odd Couple
with Chris Brussard and Rob Parker weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
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Speaker 4 (22:44):
All right, Mart, we were talking about Lebron's podcast with
JJ Reddick. I think it's a great idea. I'm looking
forward to listening to it regularly. Two very smart basketball minds,
one of them, of course, legendary and Lebron. And on
their first one they talked about a plethora of things
we already brought up to Jason Tatum stuff and discussed that,
(23:06):
but they are Lebron also gave his views and quickly, Mart,
it'll be interesting when they do this podcast because already
we've done two. We're doing two topics on them both
are from what based off what Lebron said, all right,
when we talked about it on First Things First, it
was what Lebron said, It'll be interesting if as this
(23:31):
podcast goes on, are people because everybody's gonna be reacting,
other players or next players gonna do podcasts on it.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
We're gonna talk about it on radio and television. Is
it gonna.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
Always be something Lebron said, like it is Reddick. I mean,
is he gonna get any like attention from this?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
You know what I'm saying? Well, I mean, it'll be interesting.
Speaker 6 (23:54):
I think he'll get the attention that he was looking
for the other day when he was talking about how
if he does a video about how Zion Williamson is
running the point, he only gets five thousand views, but
he criticizes Doc Rivers and he goes viral. Maybe just
maybe he could sneak all his basketball analysis in with
this when they they started getting some attention to that.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Right right, I feel you? All right?
Speaker 4 (24:14):
So, anyway, Lebron talked about the players he thinks are
the most influential in the modern era.
Speaker 9 (24:21):
Hereios Stephan Allen Iverson are the two biggest influential guys
in our game since since I've been watching and covering it. One.
They're six three six ' four if you want to
Steph's not.
Speaker 10 (24:36):
Six to four if you want if you want to
look on the back of a basketball card, you know
you always lot toll on the back of the back
of the basketball card. Allan Iverson and Steph they were
just so relatable and kids felt like they could be them.
Speaker 9 (24:51):
They were there. They were guys that was not always
counted on. They were small and stature, and they just
defined the odds.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
All right. Well, first of all, I mean Lebron hurt
himself by talking about they were six four because Steph
is six Steph is a legit six to two. He's
listed at six to two, and you know I've obviously
talked to him before. He's about that.
Speaker 4 (25:14):
Iver since listed at six feet and he's six feet
probably at best, he probably is a legit six feet.
Speaker 6 (25:24):
I mean I'm tall if he's five eleven, like I'm
tall than Alan Iverson. I've stiod in the same room
with them, and I'm tall about six one six two.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Yeah, don't you think he's probably six feet I'll be
at worse five eleven, but probably a legit six feet
or right right under it. But so that that hurts
when you overstated that much.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
It's like, Okay, where are you going with this?
Speaker 9 (25:49):
Well?
Speaker 5 (25:49):
I was just think it's funny that he said he's
been covering the game for so long. No, you haven't.
You're playing the game for so long.
Speaker 4 (25:55):
But we're gonna say Lebron was born in eighty four,
so so when he started watching it probably closely. I mean,
if you want to say ninety one, when he was
seven years old, I mean that's obviously the Jordan era. Yeah, yeah,
I'll say this. I don't think those are the two
(26:18):
most influential. I think the two most influential in that
time period, So let's say from nineteen ninety one is
clearly Michael Jordan.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
Jordan because I mean, everybody wanted to emulate him. He's
a cultural icon. He's darned near mythical at this point.
The sneakers, I mean, you guys had you know, we
used to call the converse docs doctor Jay's you know
a lot of players Warren, but we all called him
(26:49):
Docs because he was the most exciting and best player
that worem Magic and Bird wore the converse weapons, you know,
but you know, the people didn't really associate them totally
with those two players.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
You know, you had a Jordan was the first to
just blow up the signature shoe.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
And obviously nobody's done it since him, like him, But
you know, he's the reason the Lebron's and the Iversons
and the Derek Roses and all of these guys have
their signature shoes.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
So that's clearly influential.
Speaker 4 (27:24):
He I also would say this, he was obviously the
biggest player even with Magic and Bird there of the
Dream Team and that team, Martin sparked the international revolution,
if you will, in terms of basketball.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
They saw Mike. Everybody loved Mike.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
He went worldwide and his greatness along with the other players,
but mostly him, is it really you know, sparked an
interest and a desire and even a focus on getting
better in all these the countries around the world.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
And you know, Jordan, like I said, it's just mythical.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
You can't take him away. I think even for the worst,
it wasn't his fault. Well, because he was so athletic
and game was so exciting. Martin a lot kind of
a generation of players and even scouts started putting too
much emphasis on athleticism. It was unbalanced, and they even
though he had skills and was very fundamentally sound, people
(28:28):
just looked at the awe inspiring plays and for a
good chunk of time, remember there are a lot of
guys getting drafted solely on athleticism, stro Miles Swift and
Chris Wilcos, guys that weren't that skilled, but they were
getting driveted. Oh they're long, they can jump out the gym.
That you know, we can give them the skills, and
(28:50):
it didn't pan out for guys like that. And if
you look before Jordan and even since Martin, Magic Bird Oscar,
now you got Steph Harden, Luca.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
It's about skills, right.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
These are great players that aren't what we call athletic,
you know in basketball terms, running jumping out the gym,
but they're skilled. And that's was before Jordan and has
brought it back after him.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
But Steph obviously changed the game. That's it.
Speaker 4 (29:27):
Now, what I will give Iverson if Lebron's talking about culturally,
Martin Iverson was the first player to wear corn rolls.
And you know, being African American, you grew up and
you're younger than me, but I ain't growing up in
the seventies.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
I mean, even brothers, A lot of kids had corn rolls.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
Sure, you know, it was just I mean, my daughters
obviously weren't in the seventies, but they had.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Corn rows as girls. You know, corn rolled their hair.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
That's a popular hairstyle in the black community, but no
one had ever done it like in a mainstream setting. Obviously,
people weren't going to work like that. Cops weren't having
their hair like that. No athletes wore their hair like that.
It was kind of you as too black, and Irison
(30:12):
wore My first time I saw him do it was
that the All Star Game, if I remember correctly.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Maybe it was a little before, but I think it
was the All.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
Star Game nineteen ninety seven in Cleveland, Ohio, and I
think he might have been in.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
The rookie game. But he wore the corn rolls, and
obviously the rest is history.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
He made it mainstream with the tattoos, Martin. Black people
wasn't getting tattoos like that before. Sure, now all these
brothers in the league got tattoos all over their bodies.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
You know.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
He kind of was the embodiment of the fusion of
hip hop and basketball, I tell you, and so all
of that is definitely true with ivers.
Speaker 6 (30:52):
I tell you, Chris, my favorite basketball player growing up
was Allen Iverson, hands down, without a doubt Number one
with the bullet do not And as part of the
reason why I was anti Kobe because Kobe beat him
in the finals, I was mad about it, like that
was like, say.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
I got his though he did Game one at least.
Speaker 5 (31:10):
How about this.
Speaker 6 (31:11):
I stayed home from a friend's birthday party and I
don't know, probably second or third grade to watch that game.
I will never forget watching that on standard definition back
in New Orleans, Louisiana. But in terms of like for
I kind of consider me and Lebron contemporaries.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
He's got about four or five years on me. But
I was in middle school.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
We would have been in high school at the same time,
right if we had gone to the same school. I
one hundred percent agree with him, which is probably rare
that I probably one hundred percent agree with Lebron because
he does a lot of out there type of stuff.
But I won one hundred percent agree with him in
terms of Iverson and Steph because when I was over Jordan. Well,
(31:52):
I don't know how much Jordan he was remembering at
the time, but so you're taking Jordan, now, okay, I'm
taking Jordan.
Speaker 5 (31:58):
Now obviously Jordan was the major influence.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
But to me, we saw that in what Kobe Bryant
was trying to do.
Speaker 5 (32:05):
You know what I'm saying as opposed to like but
Iver said, man, Sue, he's a player kind of similar.
Speaker 6 (32:11):
And I've heard this, I believe on your show before
on TV with Kyrie, where his impact on the game
far out weighs anything that he did in his NBA legacy,
right in terms of championships, MVPs, whatever, his impact in
the game, the way he changed an icon, the way
the clothes that he wore, his hairstyle, the tattoos, the
(32:35):
interviews you talk about practice, man, like all of that.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
I remember sitting there, like.
Speaker 5 (32:40):
I'll tell you this. I had an opportunity. My neighbor
was friends with Tim Floyd when he was the head
coach of the New Orleans then Hornets. Right, they asked,
my mom got me for Christmas an opportunity to be
a ball boy for one game. She said, you could
pick whatever game you want to is.
Speaker 6 (32:56):
It was without question the Philadelphia seventy six ers, because
I had to see Allen Iverson in person. That way,
it was without a doubt like he clearly, I mean,
the impact that he had on my generation is incredible.
The one person I would say that he didn't that
he should have added in here is Kobe Bryant because
(33:17):
very much like Randy Moss, when somebody makes a catch,
he said, oh he got lost. I mean, to this day,
you shoot a piece of paper into the trash, can
they say Kobe like to this day. So that's the
one guy I would add in. And honestly, Steth Curry
is the reason why I can't play pick up basketball
anymore because if some one more snot no seventeen year
old kid, takes a pull up three on a fast break,
(33:39):
I'm ready to scream and cry because that's a bad
shot from the era that I came from playing.
Speaker 5 (33:44):
So now everybody hoped that they can shoot threes.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
As you know, we had my group, the King Movement,
had a basketball tournament in conjunction with the word Church
in Cleveland. It was called the Midnight Rumble and we
five thousand dollars to the winner. So it was some
great players guys that were recently high school stars in
Cleveland played college ball and watching it, Martin, it was
(34:09):
just it was just the difference in the game and
the way kids grow up playing now, because guys either
went all the way to the cup or shot a three,
or like drove and kicked.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
It out for three. I mean, just like you're kind
of seeing the NBA.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
There were a couple guys that had crazy mid range games,
but for the most.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
Part, most guys weren't dribbling.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
And then stopping on the dime and pulling up for
a mid range. There are a lot of times they
could have, but they went all the way to the basket,
and it is I mean, Steph changed the game. I remember,
we'll close on this before the twenty fifteen finals and
I picked the Cavs in six, and maybe that would
have been true had Kyrie and Kevin Love not gotten hurt.
(34:57):
But I remember talking to Lebron before the series and
I said to him, I said, Doe, they remind you
of the Spurs that you know twenty fourteen, who had
beaten the Heat because they moved the ball, they shoot
the three. And he was like, nah, nah, He was like,
they they are totally jump shooting team.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
They not jump shooting teams don't win championships.
Speaker 4 (35:19):
And at that time it was pretty much true that
Spurs team had Tim Duncan as an anchor for if
they needed to go inside because the threes weren't falling.
But now it has because he STEP's changed all that.
He's totally defied conventional wisdom and now jump shooting teams
can win championships
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday from seven
pm to ten pm Eastern four to seven Pacific on
Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for The Odd
Couple at Foxsports Radio dot com, or stream us live
every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to the Best of the Odd Couple with
Chris Brusa and Ron Harker.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
What a dunk? That's the first thing I want to say.
What a dunk?
Speaker 4 (00:36):
Anthony Edwards arguably the most exciting player in the NBA.
Who's battling in for that John Morant? But John's not
playing this year.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
He's injured. So I don't know who would be more.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
Exciting of a player exciting than Anthony Edwards. Last night
Martin in a game with Utah, he had thirty two points,
eight dimes, seven boards to lead Minnesota to a victory
over the Jazz. Remember they are playing Minnesota without not
(01:11):
only Carl Anthony Towns, their second best player and a
multiple time All Star, but also without Rudy Gobert, who
may be on the verge of winning this fourth straight
or not fourth straight, but fourth Defensive Player of the
Year award. That was tie Ben Wallace and the Ken
Bae Matumbo for the most all time. So they needed
(01:34):
a win without their big guns or two of their
three big guns, and Anthony Edwards delivered. And what everyone's
talking about is this dunk he had over John Collins.
And I'm telling you, Martin, every time Edwards goes up
for dunk or a block, He's got the block of
the year, maybe the dunk of the year. It really
(01:57):
I'm not even like, I don't feel like I'm exaggerating.
Obviously it's not true, but it looks like he's jumping
off a trampoline. He is so explosive to the hoop,
it's just crazy. What'd you think of that dunk? And
am I tripping?
Speaker 5 (02:14):
No, You're absolutely not tripping.
Speaker 6 (02:15):
But first of all, I do have to take him
minute and chastise one of the dunkers our of my generation,
at least Blake Griffin, because before Blake Griffin, people were
grabbing the rim. Now with Blake, after Blake Griffin kind
of took the dunk contest by storm Lob City and
all of that, we got a whole bunch of guys
who are throwing it down quite literally, as opposed to
(02:36):
dunking and the hanging on the rim. I'm convinced that
Anthony Edwards ended up dislocating that finger because he didn't
grab the rim and hang up there for a second.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
He hit John Collins head.
Speaker 6 (02:47):
That's what if he had grabbed on the rim. If
he had grabbed on the rim, he wouldn't have hit
his head.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
How he was too far I think is I feel
like and Dwight Howard.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Did this in the dunk contest we had the Superman.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Cap on and like you said, Blake Griffin did it
over Timothy Miles, gov and Kendrick.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Perkins, which was I think was his best dunk.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
I gotta be honest, Martin, I think a lot of
times just throwing it in is more impressive because you
know how high you have to get up to throw
the ball down into the rim without it bouncing off
the back of the rim or something like that. Man,
I loved the dunk last night, So you had an
(03:33):
issue because he didn't grab the rim.
Speaker 5 (03:34):
I didn't have an issue though.
Speaker 6 (03:35):
I'm just being it's just a point of clarification that
we have now, to me, at least lowered the standard
of what the dunk is at this point.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
So this is lower. No, because because when I was
a kid, Chris.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
When I was a kid, you a mighty did it.
Speaker 6 (03:52):
You were dunking on somebody, hanging on the rim, putting
your chestnut to somebody's face and saying, ah, deal with
me now right.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
People still do that.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
But when you leave from so far out and you
can't get to the rim if you're high enough to
throw it in.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
I'm impressed. No, I'm impressed. So I will sit like
the old man, get off my law now, not me.
Speaker 6 (04:14):
But you know, I'm sorry. I'm sitting in Rob Parker's chair,
so I guess it's just rubbed off. But no, I'll
say this about Anthony Edwards and that dunk. First of all,
I fully agree with you. He's one of the best
tickets you can buy in the NBA right now in
terms of putting on a show to me. And he's
really consistent night in, night out. Now, may he may
come late to the game or you know, lout of
the locker room. He might miss it. Get him there,
(04:37):
he might miss the second the second half tip. But
but no, in terms of just pure athleticism, pure just
and I kind of really like to see the adversity
that he's going through right now as a player without,
like you said, his other all star cruning to the
towns and Rudy Gobert, who is playing got a defensive
Player of the Year level right now. To watch him
(04:58):
put the team on his back to me has been real.
And I know last offseason. We see this all the
time when guys go play for Team USA, right and
then come back and they their game is elevated to
a different level. I think that's what happened with Anthony
Edwards this last year. He played really well over the
summer playing with Team USA, and then after he came
back to the NBA, you see his game risen to
(05:20):
another level. And I'm hoping that they do make some
noise in the playoffs because I agree with you wholeheartedly.
And this is the best ticket you can buy in
the NBA to go watch a show. Let's just say
this the best young ticket you can buy in the
NBA to go watch a show, right Because don't get
me wrong, Steph Curry still doing this thing, Lebron's still
doing his thing, but this guy is exactly you can
(05:43):
see he's at the beginning of something great, being only
twenty two years old. And I mean, I love his game,
all the way he plays, and it's just evident that
he's gonna go try this. Like just a few days ago,
a few weeks ago, at this point, he tried to
catch Anthony Davis.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
You're coming over Anthony Davis the top of Anthony.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
Going after every bat, and it's reminiscent of a guy
that used to dunk on everybody to Kimba Mutumble got him,
Alonzo Morning got him, Patrick Ewing got him, Shack got him,
and of course that would be none other than Michael
Jordan and Anthony Edwards. Martin is drawing comparisons to Michael Jordan.
(06:25):
Patrick Beverly has said it, other people have said it,
and I reached out to the Goat himself, yes, mj
today via text, and he told me he does, indeed
see the similarities in his game and Anthony Edward's game,
and I think the similarities are these Martin. Then let
(06:46):
me say this first. There's two kinds of people that
get compared to Michael Jordan. There's those that people think
could maybe be the Goat, and that's Lebron right Lebron.
His game is nothing like Michael Jordan's, but he was
compared to Mike because can he be better?
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Can he be as good?
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Anthony Edwards is the other type where stylistically.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
They get compared to Michael Jordan.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
I don't think anybody as great as we think Anthony
Edwards's future could be. None of us are thinking he's
gonna be the goat, or even in that conversation he
may be a surprise us, but right now nobody's thinking that.
And here's the stylistic similarities. I see one, obviously, the
high flying elements of his game, dunking on people.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
Aggressive.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Two he loves to play defense Martin. We saw that
with Team USA. We've seen that this year where the
Timberwolves are top two defensive team in the league. Yes,
you have go Beart, but you also have Anthony Edwards
getting after it on the perimeter.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
Three. He loves to play. He ain't trying to low manage.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
I remember talking to Michael Jordan a few years ago
and we're talking about the possibility of them lowering the
eighty two games, making it smaller. He could not understand.
It was almost like he was offended. How in the
world could players want get the eighty two games lessened?
Like He's like, man, I want to play every night,
And you can see that by his record. He played
(08:13):
almost every night when he wasn't hurt. And Anthony Edwards
is like that. And Martin, we.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
Saw that last night.
Speaker 4 (08:20):
He dislocates his fingers you said, goes into the locker room,
gets it popped back into the place and then taped,
and goes back out to the game to play. A
lot of guys in this day and Age would have
been like, man, I'm good, you know, we'll get him
another day. I'm chilling. And he went out there to
play and he said, I don't want to load manage.
So all those are ways that and he's charismatic and
(08:43):
all that too, but those are some similarities I do
see with him and Michael Jordan and look, Victor win
Benyama's gonna be the face of the NBA.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
I think that's clear. But outside of him, there's gonna be.
Speaker 4 (08:58):
Other faces, and I think one of them will be
Anthony Edward. What do you think of the MJ comparison?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
I don't I like it. Actually, it's something that you know.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
It's like you said, it's black swimmers in a way
to really comp somebody to Michael Jordan or Tom Brady
or something like that, because it's like, all right, dude,
wait a.
Speaker 5 (09:15):
Second, you can't do it quite yet.
Speaker 6 (09:16):
You got to see some wins, you gotta see some rings,
so on and so forth. But if you're just talking
about style and play style and athletic ability, he's right
up there with Kawhi in my mind in terms of
guys who remind me of Michael Jordan when they play
like well for different reasons, sure, but it's like, but
(09:37):
I mean, I love his competitiveness. And while you say
Victor winn Byama is going to be the face of
the NBA, I get where you're coming from with that,
but I do wonder if we've seen a lot of
foreign born players kind of take that mantle from here
and there, like Jokic or Janniss as the best player
in the league or you know, the face of the
(09:58):
league or so on. It makes me wonder about American
born players and where they are. I think Anthony Edwards
is our best shot at that one as an American player,
But in terms of just his ability and his competitiveness,
to me, he is breathing life into a league that
you know is still from the media side of things,
still really focused on the main players of the past,
(10:20):
with Steph and Lebron, Kevin Durant, so forth and so on.
To me, Anthony Edwards is a type of guy who
can break through that conversation because again, when you go
watch him play, he's attempting, not necessarily completing, but attempting
something like this almost every night. And what I don't
appreciate is there's two dunks going on in this segment,
(10:41):
Anthony Edwards dunking over John Collins and you dunking on
me talking about how you're texting Michael Jordan.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Well, it's something for you to shoot to and aspire to,
young man.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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Speaker 7 (11:04):
Paulie Fosco here with Tony Fusco. You know, as the
host of the number one rated Paully and Tony Fusco show,
we get tons and tons of fan mail every day.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Piles of it.
Speaker 7 (11:14):
In fact, Tony, why don't you open up one of
those letters right now and read what's inside.
Speaker 8 (11:17):
Hey, listen to this. Dear Paulie and Tony, your sports
takes the dumbest and most terrible.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
Wait open this other one.
Speaker 8 (11:25):
Dear Paulie and Tony, you suck more than anyone.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
Wait, try this one.
Speaker 8 (11:30):
Dear Paulie and Tony, you guys are the absolute best.
Speaker 5 (11:34):
There you go, coming up with the stupidest take.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
Get it.
Speaker 7 (11:38):
Just listen to the Tony Fusco Show on the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Yeah, Lebron James and JJ Reddick have started a new
podcast called Mine for the Game. Obviously you listen to
JJ Reddick and he's a very intelligent basketball mind. It
was a was a good player, obviously not great, not
an All star, but he was a good player. He
was more than like, you know, just a shooter. I
(12:06):
mean he was mainly a shooter, but he was good
enough to start and.
Speaker 5 (12:09):
You know, had some nice season. He was a college
all timer.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
Yeah, college, he was great at Duke. He was He's
a Duke all time great at Duke. And he's better
than the Steve Kurz, the Tim Leglis. You know what
I mean the Kyle Korvers. Those guys were just purely
spot up shooters. And of course that was his forte
and what he did best and mostly but he was
(12:34):
he was a level above him real quick.
Speaker 6 (12:36):
When I was in high school, JJ Reddick was one
of the players I tried to model my game after,
no kidding.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
When he was at Duke, he was not did you
come so was your game shooting?
Speaker 9 (12:45):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (12:45):
I could shoot, but really I never got I never
got past sophomore year, JJ, because I couldn't handle the balls.
Speaker 5 (12:51):
I could shoot and I could jump. That was about it.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
It's interesting because I bet I don't know how much
time you spend around young players to day, but I
bet two things that well, let me say, I bet
there are a lot of guys that can handle the
rock that they you know, they probably practice it more now.
They do let you carry today, so that helps it out.
(13:15):
But I just think today, I bet more so many
young players are focused on a handle and three. And
I tell young players, look, work on your handle, man,
because if you you notice from playing, if you have
a handle, nobody can mess with you. No, you don't
have to worry about full court pressure. You know you
(13:38):
you can get where you want to on the court,
and especially if you're a guard. If you're a guard
and you don't get frazzled by people really getting up
in your grill defensively because you handle so well.
Speaker 3 (13:51):
That's a huge advantage. So young young.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
Cats out there, are you fathers who are and mothers
who are working with your young boys. Work on the
handle and the J and I'm even gonna say the
mid range J Martin. Lot of kids want to just
work on the three today, But I would say, don't
forsake the mid range. I get it, the three is
king right now. But if you've also got a mid
(14:15):
range game, think about it. If you got handle, you
got a three, so you handle, you can get to
the bucket, and you got a three point shot. What
are they gonna do with you if you also have
a mid range game? And toerr, they don't know if
you're going all the way to the cup. They don't
know if you're gonna take the three.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
And you know that.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
I think one of the great things about like the
greatest finishers, Martin, I think have the mid range game
because if I'm driving, you don't know if I'm going
all the way to the whole or if I'm gonna
pull up and stop on a dime and shoot that
mid range jumper Jordan Kobe Kawhi, A lot of the
guys that really Kyrie, they're great finishers, they can shoot
(14:57):
in the mid range.
Speaker 6 (14:58):
Well, if you're not a three level scorer, you can't
be great one. So that's part of the problem right there.
And it's honestly one of the knocks out I would
have on Jason Tatum. We guy we're about to talk about,
because that, I think is what's stopping him from being
like one of the Obviously he's a great offensive player,
but really taking the mantle of being one of the
all time great offensive players is he don't pull up
from the mid range.
Speaker 5 (15:18):
He's got no miny. It's all three or trying to
get to the rim.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Well, let's talk about him because Lebron James I mentioned
their podcast Lebron and JJ Reddick, and they they brought
up Jason Tatum, and here's what Lebron said.
Speaker 9 (15:33):
There's a great saying that says the best teacher in
life has experience as well. And we look at Tate.
I mean he's twenty five years old, he's twenty five
years old, and I believe he's been to the conference
finals four times, been to the obviously the NBA finals
once he's twenty five. I didn't. I mean I didn't
win my first one until I was twenty. He's eight.
I think Joker won his first one at twenty seven.
I think MJ was twenty eight as well. You know,
(15:55):
we have a lot of expectations on JT, but he's
experienced a lot of winning in his career so far.
And obviously, you know, everyone wants to see him get
over the hump. But four conference finals in a finals
appearance before the age of twenty six is that's elite.
And like you just said, he's continued to grow, and
you know they are in a position where they can
(16:17):
make another title run. And like I said, personnel helps,
you know, Adam persingis and and getting Drew for a
bag of Las Petato chips that helps as well. That
helps as well. But you know, Jat is definitely the
you know when you when you when you go and
he start scouting for Boston, He's a He's the number
one guy for sure.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Here's the other thing, because I think Lebron makes an
outstanding point and here.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Here's one point he didn't make. Martin.
Speaker 4 (16:44):
Jason is twenty six now, just turned twenty six recently.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
In his seventh season.
Speaker 4 (16:50):
So in his six seasons that have been completed, Martin,
the dude's been the four conference finals, all right, And
I would argue he was definitely the best player on
three of those teams. If you want to say the
first year, Jalen Brown was better. Jalen average like two
(17:12):
more points than Jason did in that conference finals against Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
You can go there, but you you would.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
I mean, he's been the best player at this young
age on a conference semi finalist or conference finalists, I
should say three times at least. And you might even
want to argue he was the better player that year.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
For the Celtics. I'm looking up now, was he there? Leading?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
You know, you had Kyrie on that team, but remember
Kyrie was hurt. But Kyrie was their best player, but
he got hurt during the playoffs and that's when you
know Tatum kind of stepped up and began to become
what he is. But what are your thoughts on what
Lebron said. I think it's pretty fair.
Speaker 6 (17:59):
I think it is fair, and I think when you
look at Jason Tatum, it may be a question of
just not if, but when, because again, he is almost
always in the conversation of them.
Speaker 5 (18:08):
He's almost always in the final four of the NBA. Right,
you look at where he ranks for his age.
Speaker 6 (18:14):
I mean, he's top ten in almost every relevant playoff
stat below. I mean for guys who are under or
now he's twenty six obviously, but because he just turned
twenty six two weeks ago. But from twenty five and under,
he's third amongst NBA players in playoff points right, trailing
only Lebron and Kobe Bryant.
Speaker 5 (18:34):
Sixth and regular season wins. Like he's a guy again,
four conference championships.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
I mean, he's he is the type of guy to
me that we criticize because he hasn't gotten over the
hump very much like Jokis was criticized for not getting
over the hump, and once he got over the hump,
everybody was like.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
Okay, exhale, He's one of the greats. All right, cool,
he's one of the great.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Fairness to that, because I mean, Michael Jordan looked. Jordan
was beloved by a lot of people to come fly
with me.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
Videos were before he won a championship.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
The Jordan sneaker phenomenon was before he won a championship.
So I'm not gonna see here and act like, you know,
Jordan wasn't beloved before the championships. But Martin, there was
a lot of criticism of him. There was at all. Yeah,
he can put up all these numbers, he can score
all these points. He's flashy, his game looks great, but
(19:32):
he's not magic or bird that I mean, that was
those were I had debates about that, and that was
written all throughout the papers and things like that, and
everybody kind of goes through it. Lebron again, everybody recognized
how great he was, but there was criticism of him
until he started winning championships.
Speaker 3 (19:52):
And so this is fair and you're right. Jokic is
a great example because Jokic, I mean, there were the analytics.
Speaker 4 (19:59):
Guy loved him, but a lot of people were like, man,
come on this dude, you know he's slow. He puts
up these numbers, but what's he doing in the playoffs.
So look, this is kind of just how it works.
When you're that caliber of player, you know, you get criticized.
It's it's kind of like Martin, your high school coach
(20:19):
or whatever level, saying if I didn't believe in you,
I wouldn't yell at you.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Sure be worried when I don't say a thing to
you anymore.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Because they yell at you because they see the greatness
in you that they want to bring out. And that's
kind of like, you know, Jason Tatum, be worried when
don't nobody criticize you because you don't win.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
They're like, all right, you know, I mean they don't
think you that level.
Speaker 6 (20:44):
All of the things that are true about Jason Tatum's
playoff career in terms of the wins and losses and
series and so forth, they're also true of Jalen Brown's
playoff career. And we're not having the same conversation all
the prospective.
Speaker 4 (20:54):
I mean, as great as Jalen is, he's just not
as good as Jason.
Speaker 6 (20:58):
But I mean Jason Tatum right now, you know, Chris,
he's fourth in playoff games played before turning twenty five
years old, trailing only Kobe, Tony Parker and Kawhi Leonard.
Speaker 5 (21:08):
Right, so seventy four playoff games. That's a ton. He's
got a ton of playoff experience.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
But we do it selectively because you want to forget
the close out game they had against Philly, Right, are
the game that forty one where exactly fifty one in
a potential elimination game, Right, Like, he's had big time
moments on big stages.
Speaker 5 (21:30):
It's just has he gotten it done on the biggest stage?
Not quite?
Speaker 6 (21:34):
Then it doesn't help when you lose to a playing
team like Miami or something like that. But like, it's
really to me one of those moments where we take
So we do this a lot in sports, where you'll
take the best player and criticize him as a result
of the team's success or failures.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
And that's what it is with Jason Tative.
Speaker 4 (21:53):
For me, I think before we go to the next seg,
do you think this is the year they get it done.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
I got Denver over Boston the finals.
Speaker 6 (22:00):
It's gonna be tough because I just don't love the
way that they play. Like we talked about Tator to
have a mid range game. Nobody on Boston really has
a mid range game, and we see it every year
in the playoffs. You have to be able to get
have bucket getters on your team, guys that can one
on one win their.
Speaker 5 (22:15):
Matchup and turn the water off.
Speaker 6 (22:17):
When the other team's on a ten to oher run,
a twelve ozher run, you give the ball to this
guy and you know you're gonna get a good shot,
get to the free throw line, get an a one
something to slow down the other team. Boston doesn't have that.
Boston is playing math at a way that I don't
think will be rewarded in the postseason.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Odd Couple
with Chris Brussard and Rob Parker weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 4 (22:44):
All right, Mart, we were talking about Lebron's podcast with
JJ Reddick. I think it's a great idea. I'm looking
forward to listening to it regularly. Two very smart basketball minds,
one of them, of course, legendary and Lebron. And on
their first one they talked about a plethora of things
we already brought up to Jason Tatum stuff and discussed that,
(23:06):
but they are Lebron also gave his views and quickly, Mart,
it'll be interesting when they do this podcast because already
we've done two. We're doing two topics on them both
are from what based off what Lebron said, all right,
when we talked about it on First Things First, it
was what Lebron said, It'll be interesting if as this
(23:31):
podcast goes on, are people because everybody's gonna be reacting,
other players or next players gonna do podcasts on it.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
We're gonna talk about it on radio and television. Is
it gonna.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
Always be something Lebron said, like it is Reddick. I mean,
is he gonna get any like attention from this?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
You know what I'm saying? Well, I mean, it'll be interesting.
Speaker 6 (23:54):
I think he'll get the attention that he was looking
for the other day when he was talking about how
if he does a video about how Zion Williamson is
running the point, he only gets five thousand views, but
he criticizes Doc Rivers and he goes viral. Maybe just
maybe he could sneak all his basketball analysis in with
this when they they started getting some attention to that.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Right right, I feel you? All right?
Speaker 4 (24:14):
So, anyway, Lebron talked about the players he thinks are
the most influential in the modern era.
Speaker 9 (24:21):
Hereios Stephan Allen Iverson are the two biggest influential guys
in our game since since I've been watching and covering it. One.
They're six three six ' four if you want to
Steph's not.
Speaker 10 (24:36):
Six to four if you want if you want to
look on the back of a basketball card, you know
you always lot toll on the back of the back
of the basketball card. Allan Iverson and Steph they were
just so relatable and kids felt like they could be them.
Speaker 9 (24:51):
They were there. They were guys that was not always
counted on. They were small and stature, and they just
defined the odds.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
All right. Well, first of all, I mean Lebron hurt
himself by talking about they were six four because Steph
is six Steph is a legit six to two. He's
listed at six to two, and you know I've obviously
talked to him before. He's about that.
Speaker 4 (25:14):
Iver since listed at six feet and he's six feet
probably at best, he probably is a legit six feet.
Speaker 6 (25:24):
I mean I'm tall if he's five eleven, like I'm
tall than Alan Iverson. I've stiod in the same room
with them, and I'm tall about six one six two.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Yeah, don't you think he's probably six feet I'll be
at worse five eleven, but probably a legit six feet
or right right under it. But so that that hurts
when you overstated that much.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
It's like, Okay, where are you going with this?
Speaker 9 (25:49):
Well?
Speaker 5 (25:49):
I was just think it's funny that he said he's
been covering the game for so long. No, you haven't.
You're playing the game for so long.
Speaker 4 (25:55):
But we're gonna say Lebron was born in eighty four,
so so when he started watching it probably closely. I mean,
if you want to say ninety one, when he was
seven years old, I mean that's obviously the Jordan era. Yeah, yeah,
I'll say this. I don't think those are the two
(26:18):
most influential. I think the two most influential in that
time period, So let's say from nineteen ninety one is
clearly Michael Jordan.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
And Steph Curry.
Speaker 4 (26:29):
Jordan because I mean, everybody wanted to emulate him. He's
a cultural icon. He's darned near mythical at this point.
The sneakers, I mean, you guys had you know, we
used to call the converse docs doctor Jay's you know
a lot of players Warren, but we all called him
(26:49):
Docs because he was the most exciting and best player
that worem Magic and Bird wore the converse weapons, you know,
but you know, the people didn't really associate them totally
with those two players.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
You know, you had a Jordan was the first to
just blow up the signature shoe.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
And obviously nobody's done it since him, like him, But
you know, he's the reason the Lebron's and the Iversons
and the Derek Roses and all of these guys have
their signature shoes.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
So that's clearly influential.
Speaker 4 (27:24):
He I also would say this, he was obviously the
biggest player even with Magic and Bird there of the
Dream Team and that team, Martin sparked the international revolution,
if you will, in terms of basketball.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
They saw Mike. Everybody loved Mike.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
He went worldwide and his greatness along with the other players,
but mostly him, is it really you know, sparked an
interest and a desire and even a focus on getting
better in all these the countries around the world.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
And you know, Jordan, like I said, it's just mythical.
Speaker 4 (28:04):
You can't take him away. I think even for the worst,
it wasn't his fault. Well, because he was so athletic
and game was so exciting. Martin a lot kind of
a generation of players and even scouts started putting too
much emphasis on athleticism. It was unbalanced, and they even
though he had skills and was very fundamentally sound, people
(28:28):
just looked at the awe inspiring plays and for a
good chunk of time, remember there are a lot of
guys getting drafted solely on athleticism, stro Miles Swift and
Chris Wilcos, guys that weren't that skilled, but they were
getting driveted. Oh they're long, they can jump out the gym.
That you know, we can give them the skills, and
(28:50):
it didn't pan out for guys like that. And if
you look before Jordan and even since Martin, Magic Bird Oscar,
now you got Steph Harden, Luca.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
It's about skills, right.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
These are great players that aren't what we call athletic,
you know in basketball terms, running jumping out the gym,
but they're skilled. And that's was before Jordan and has
brought it back after him.
Speaker 3 (29:24):
But Steph obviously changed the game. That's it.
Speaker 4 (29:27):
Now, what I will give Iverson if Lebron's talking about culturally,
Martin Iverson was the first player to wear corn rolls.
And you know, being African American, you grew up and
you're younger than me, but I ain't growing up in
the seventies.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
I mean, even brothers, A lot of kids had corn rolls.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
Sure, you know, it was just I mean, my daughters
obviously weren't in the seventies, but they had.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Corn rows as girls. You know, corn rolled their hair.
Speaker 4 (29:52):
That's a popular hairstyle in the black community, but no
one had ever done it like in a mainstream setting. Obviously,
people weren't going to work like that. Cops weren't having
their hair like that. No athletes wore their hair like that.
It was kind of you as too black, and Irison
(30:12):
wore My first time I saw him do it was
that the All Star Game, if I remember correctly.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Maybe it was a little before, but I think it
was the All.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
Star Game nineteen ninety seven in Cleveland, Ohio, and I
think he might have been in.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
The rookie game. But he wore the corn rolls, and
obviously the rest is history.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
He made it mainstream with the tattoos, Martin. Black people
wasn't getting tattoos like that before. Sure, now all these
brothers in the league got tattoos all over their bodies.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
You know.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
He kind of was the embodiment of the fusion of
hip hop and basketball, I tell you, and so all
of that is definitely true with ivers.
Speaker 6 (30:52):
I tell you, Chris, my favorite basketball player growing up
was Allen Iverson, hands down, without a doubt Number one
with the bullet do not And as part of the
reason why I was anti Kobe because Kobe beat him
in the finals, I was mad about it, like that
was like, say.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
I got his though he did Game one at least.
Speaker 5 (31:10):
How about this.
Speaker 6 (31:11):
I stayed home from a friend's birthday party and I
don't know, probably second or third grade to watch that game.
I will never forget watching that on standard definition back
in New Orleans, Louisiana. But in terms of like for
I kind of consider me and Lebron contemporaries.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
He's got about four or five years on me. But
I was in middle school.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
We would have been in high school at the same time,
right if we had gone to the same school. I
one hundred percent agree with him, which is probably rare
that I probably one hundred percent agree with Lebron because
he does a lot of out there type of stuff.
But I won one hundred percent agree with him in
terms of Iverson and Steph because when I was over Jordan. Well,
(31:52):
I don't know how much Jordan he was remembering at
the time, but so you're taking Jordan, now, okay, I'm
taking Jordan.
Speaker 5 (31:58):
Now obviously Jordan was the major influence.
Speaker 6 (32:00):
But to me, we saw that in what Kobe Bryant
was trying to do.
Speaker 5 (32:05):
You know what I'm saying as opposed to like but
Iver said, man, Sue, he's a player kind of similar.
Speaker 6 (32:11):
And I've heard this, I believe on your show before
on TV with Kyrie, where his impact on the game
far out weighs anything that he did in his NBA legacy,
right in terms of championships, MVPs, whatever, his impact in
the game, the way he changed an icon, the way
the clothes that he wore, his hairstyle, the tattoos, the
(32:35):
interviews you talk about practice, man, like all of that.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
I remember sitting there, like.
Speaker 5 (32:40):
I'll tell you this. I had an opportunity. My neighbor
was friends with Tim Floyd when he was the head
coach of the New Orleans then Hornets. Right, they asked,
my mom got me for Christmas an opportunity to be
a ball boy for one game. She said, you could
pick whatever game you want to is.
Speaker 6 (32:56):
It was without question the Philadelphia seventy six ers, because
I had to see Allen Iverson in person. That way,
it was without a doubt like he clearly, I mean,
the impact that he had on my generation is incredible.
The one person I would say that he didn't that
he should have added in here is Kobe Bryant because
(33:17):
very much like Randy Moss, when somebody makes a catch,
he said, oh he got lost. I mean, to this day,
you shoot a piece of paper into the trash, can
they say Kobe like to this day. So that's the
one guy I would add in. And honestly, Steth Curry
is the reason why I can't play pick up basketball
anymore because if some one more snot no seventeen year
old kid, takes a pull up three on a fast break,
(33:39):
I'm ready to scream and cry because that's a bad
shot from the era that I came from playing.
Speaker 5 (33:44):
So now everybody hoped that they can shoot threes.
Speaker 4 (33:48):
As you know, we had my group, the King Movement,
had a basketball tournament in conjunction with the word Church
in Cleveland. It was called the Midnight Rumble and we
five thousand dollars to the winner. So it was some
great players guys that were recently high school stars in
Cleveland played college ball and watching it, Martin, it was
(34:09):
just it was just the difference in the game and
the way kids grow up playing now, because guys either
went all the way to the cup or shot a three,
or like drove and kicked.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
It out for three. I mean, just like you're kind
of seeing the NBA.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
There were a couple guys that had crazy mid range games,
but for the most.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
Part, most guys weren't dribbling.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
And then stopping on the dime and pulling up for
a mid range. There are a lot of times they
could have, but they went all the way to the basket,
and it is I mean, Steph changed the game. I remember,
we'll close on this before the twenty fifteen finals and
I picked the Cavs in six, and maybe that would
have been true had Kyrie and Kevin Love not gotten hurt.
(34:57):
But I remember talking to Lebron before the series and
I said to him, I said, Doe, they remind you
of the Spurs that you know twenty fourteen, who had
beaten the Heat because they moved the ball, they shoot
the three. And he was like, nah, nah, He was like,
they they are totally jump shooting team.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
They not jump shooting teams don't win championships.
Speaker 4 (35:19):
And at that time it was pretty much true that
Spurs team had Tim Duncan as an anchor for if
they needed to go inside because the threes weren't falling.
But now it has because he STEP's changed all that.
He's totally defied conventional wisdom and now jump shooting teams
can win championships
Hosts And Creators
kelvin washington
Rob Parker
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