June 2, 2025 • 36 mins
Rob and Kelvin debate whether or not head coach Tom Thibodeau should be fired after the New York Knicks were unceremoniously bounced out of the NBA Playoffs, and argue whether Deion Sanders is justified for suggesting that disparaging media reports are the reason why his son Shedeur slipped in the NFL Draft. Plus, NBA champion and FOX Sports Radio NBA analyst Antonio Daniels swings by to discuss Thibs’ future with the Knicks, how New York can re-tool around Jalen Brunson and Karl-Anthony Towns, why he’s expecting the Oklahoma City Thunder to roll over the Indiana Pacers in the upcoming NBA Finals, and much more!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday from seven
pm to ten pm Eastern four to seven Pacific on
Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for The Odd
Couple at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us
live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to the Best of the Odd Couple.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
So obviously the finals are set. We know it's the
Pacers and the Thunder. We'll get into that. The finals
doesn't start till Thursday, but there's some stuff we need
to you know, hash out and talk about of the
fallout because the last series, of course, was the Pacers and.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
The Knicks and Rob G.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
I don't think I don't know we didn't talk about this,
But do we have the sound or no from Jalen
Brunton when they were asking him about.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yeah, like is that a real question? It was kind
of like, am I right? Rob G? Is that fair?
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Right?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
It was like, is that a real right? Yeah? No,
He's gonna talk to me. Now, he didn't know what
I was gonna be saying.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Okay, he didn't know, But my point is this, and
I know if you're Nick fans, you know they were
ready in the streets and they were naming streets after
players and all that. But if you're a New York
Knick fan and you don't think what happened this season
was a failure, then you have no idea what's going on.
The twenty twenty four to twenty five season was a
(01:29):
big failure for the New York Knicks. You went out,
you got Karl Anthony Towns, you made a big trade
Miquel Bridges, you gave a five first round picks, right,
You did all these things, and the idea that last
year went to second round lost right in seven games
to the Patriots. You wanted to be better, you thought,
(01:49):
blah blah blah. You made all those moves. Not only that,
you beat the defending champs, and you can talk about, oh,
you know, oh the Celtics got Tatum got hurt. No, no, no,
they won the first two games in Boston being down
by twenty.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Once you do that, you tear up the script.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So all the people didn't think the Knicks were gonna
go because they couldn't beat the Celtics because of all
what happened in regular seasons that changed and so should
have the expectations of this basketball team, which was that
they were gonna finally get to the championship for the
first time in twenty five years, right since nineteen ninety nine.
(02:34):
Prince sang about it. The Knicks were about it back then,
and now this year they have the Celtics beating up.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
The only team in their way.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Is the Indiana Pacers, a team that nobody talked about
all year, a team that no one expected to beat
the Cavaliers, and a team you had down by fourteen
with two thirty eight to go, down by nine with
fifty seconds to go. You win Game one at Madison
Square Garden and you're.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Going to the finals.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Okay, you would have had a chance to go to
the finals right there.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
And guess what they didn't do it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
They choked that down, lost Game two at home, and
basically the series was over. I told you after they
lost Game one they weren't going to the finals. You
don't recover from that. They forced a Game six and
guess what, their stars don't show up in Game six
at Indiana have awful shooting nights.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
Ray Charles could see that. I mean, like just awful.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Don't celebrate the New York Knicks for what they did
in the excitement they gave the city, had people in
the streets, had rats carrying pizza all over town, and celebration.
None of it mattered, Kelvin, none of it. They failed
(04:03):
this season. The Knicks should be in the NBA Finals,
not the Indiana Pacers. And for that reason, if I'm
the Knicks, I gotta look at TIBs and.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Honestly make a change. And if you ask me who
I got the who.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
His name is Michael Malone, who coached the Denver Nuggets
to a soup to an NBA Finals championship.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
There you go.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
All right, let me say this, And I never in
my life thought I would be sitting up here defending
the Knicks. What in the world has the world come to?
All right, Rob, Now this is where I gotta bring
you back down to reality a little bit. None of
us went into this Eastern Conference playoffs thinking the Knicks
really had a shot.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
In fact, we.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Came on, all of us talking about how they underachieved
and they were one of the worst three seeds or
are like, oh nobody believes it is.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
They don't even beat the good teams.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
And not only did they come in and beat solid
teams and the Pistons and upcomings team. They beat the
raigning champs, and then they beat the Pacers, who, by
the way, were thirty four and fourteen since January first.
The only team better than them are in the finals
the Oklahoma City Thunder. So the Pacers have actually been
it's our fault for ignoring them as being the second
(05:30):
best team in the NBA since the beginning of twenty
twenty five. So the Knicks come in, they beat a
young Pistons team who has a really good team, They
beat the rainning Champs, and.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
They lose admirably in six to the Pacers.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
Now, also when you look at what they've done for
an organization that is underachieved for twenty five thirty years,
to me, they have something to hang their hat on.
They have officially won thousand percent, unequivocally found their guy,
and we know how hard that is in sports. And
Jalen Brunton is no but he's a heck of a player,
one of the best clutch players in the league, one
(06:04):
Cutch player of the Year. And then you have a
guy in kar Anthony Towns who you say, okay, the trade.
He played well, there's some things we can work on,
and that's a conversation for another day.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
But to me, the next overachieve. We literally kept.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
Going, Okay, this is about it. Now they'd had their fun, Okay,
there's no all right, well their selth's gonna come back again. Okay, well,
I mean now, and then PACER's gonna and they got
six out of this. And so to me, I'm looking
at the Knicks and saying, they played hard. You never
ever ever felt like they quit. They literally competed all
in all the games. And I even gotta give teams
who I never want to give credit to because all
(06:37):
he does is look like another version of Darvin Ham
with his hands in his pockets instead is are hands voted.
But we talked about and I said, man, he's got
to start playing that bench a little bit. He's got
to get there's no way they can sustain those legs.
Those legs are gonna go out on them. And they
sustained throughout the season. Michel Bridges, who is the iron
man calling them out, Hey, man, we gotta we gotta
get some breaks. We're tired. They fall through that as
(06:58):
a team, they get postseason guys are playing too much again.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
He starts to play the Bitch.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
He plays right, he plays Sammy, he plays goes to
Mitchell Robinson more, he plays the McBride. He starts to
play some guys, and I gotta give him credit that
he at least was trying to do something. So this
was an overachievement. It to me they have some things
that if I were the general manager, absolutely we're addressing.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
There's some things to fix.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
But man, there's no way if I'd have told you
starting in the beginning of the season the Knicks would
be a game and a half away from being in
the finals, did you would think that was they underachieved?
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Now, I don't even know how you could even think
about them underachieving. When they beat the defending champs that
nobody expect him to beat, and they're up by fourteen
against the Pacers at home. It's one thing if they
got molly wopped and got swept by the Pacers and
they were just better.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
But they coughed up a historic choke.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
If you can't get fired off a historic choke, you
can never get fired.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
I'm dead serious.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Like the idea that you think they underachieved blowing and
not only did they do that?
Speaker 3 (08:09):
You thought they bounced.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Back in game two, right, because all right, I was
just one game, one game. They they not only did that,
they lost game two at home to the Pacers, and
and so you're in a two to zero hole, which
you're not gonna bounce back.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
There's no way you can look at that and call
that an over.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
So how did I How am I not firing Missoula
Missoula because they won a championship, but then.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
They need a championship team.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
No, No, do not lose two games from the twenty
because they won one. It does I'm saying based off
that they lost one. They and he literally just got
them further than any any team they got into twenty
five years. And again I'm not sitting there reacting like
he's Phil Jackson. But if my star player comes out
(08:54):
and it gives him a major endorsement, my player I
am absolutely tied to in Jalen Brunton. He ain't go nowhere,
and he is my guy, and he sings a ringing endorsement.
The guys got me further. Now I'm in the playoffs
two years in a row, which does not happen to
the Knicks all the time. Two years in a row,
and not only two years in a row, I improve, I
get further than I did the next year. I don't
(09:15):
see why they're gonna end up firing that Guy's it
because they.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
Did it before. Can I give you an example?
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yes, Can I give you Rick Carlile and the Detroit Pistons.
Can I give you an example? And I want you
to listen to this example. The Pistons had gotten further
than they had ever gone with Rick Carlile. And guess
what they looked and said, there's Larry Brown. And at
that time, Larry had never won a championship in the NBA.
But he was a better coach at that time than
(09:42):
Rick Carlile. If you're the Knicks and Timbs, he's never
been able to go further with any team he's been.
Mike Malone, Michael Malone is available. Mike Malone is not
a question mark whether he can get a team to
where you need to go.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
He's available.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Teams you upgrade when you have a chance to upgrade.
And that's the exemple I'm gonna give you because I
have seen it before. Smart teams go. Thank you, Tibbs,
you got it to a certain point, keV is his difference.
First of all, there's a massive different.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Rick Carlile was just starting to coach facts or none fact.
But he's still want to go facts or no facts. Now,
he was a new coach that they thought, all right, cool,
that was cute.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
Get out of here.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Here comes this forty five fifty year veteran and uh
and your boy Brown, Larry Brown. So this is not
the same where Timms is a veteran quarter coach who
has been there, who is veteran.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Players love and adore him. I'm not stamping him.
Speaker 4 (10:42):
I'm just saying, if Jalen Brunson and your front off
has already come out and say he's their guy, he's
gonna be their guy.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
And again the team is overachieved.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
None of us thought they would do this in the
beginning of this playoffs and they lost to the Pacers,
who have the second best record since the turn.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
It changes changes once you beat the Celtics. Come on, man,
you don't go backwards once you've already and they were
the better team than the Celtics. Said no, no, they
literally weren't.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
They were the best teams, the only team better than
these of January first.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
Who had who had a higher seed in the playoffs?
Speaker 4 (11:11):
I just said, I don't care about that.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Who had a higher seed? Does it matter? Does? January four?
Speaker 1 (11:19):
The favorite in that series? Was it the Knicks or
the Pacers? The Pacers were playing were they were not
the favorite?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
The Pacers the only team that played better than there's
the two teams in the Whigs.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Who was the higher seed and who was the favorites?
I'm asking you the Celtics underachieved. We've all talked about that.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
We're talking about I'm talking about with the Knicks and
the Pacers.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
Two questions.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
So higher seeds, No, the Knicks, I'm talking about the
about the Celtics, the.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Knicks, okay? And who was the favorite in that series? Actually?
I was it the Knicks? Yes? It was all right.
Speaker 4 (11:57):
So if you hold on, if you're all adamant, why
did you pick the Pacers to win?
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Because I still didn't believe in and TIBs And that
there's your point. I don't believe in Taylors. I don't
believe in TIBs. I don't care if they call you
mister TIBs. I want you, mister out.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Odd Couple
with Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 5 (12:26):
You mentioned it right off the top, Shador Sanders fell
to the fifth round, and if depending on who you ask,
it had less to do with his on field performance
and everything to do with him off the field, specifically
the way he conducted himself when he met with teams
at the combine and during the draft process. According to
at least one report, he had a particularly disappointing meeting
(12:49):
with the New York Giants. They wouldn't say exactly what
it was, just that they came away very unimpressed with him,
that he seemed uninterested in selling himself to the franchise
and what he could bring to them, And the word
that was thrown around by a lot of outlets was unprofessional.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
And then and then in one of the meetings he
had headphones on them. That was alleged.
Speaker 5 (13:09):
So according to dion Sanders on the latest podcast of
episode of Say What Needs to be Said.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
Say what you need to say, Dionna is not a
family's reports.
Speaker 6 (13:18):
Take a listen when you sit up there and say
something like he went in a meeting unprepared, like dude,
Chador Sanders, who's had six different coordinators, who has still
functioned and went up, leveled up every time we brought
somebody new in.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
And you're gonna tell me every situation.
Speaker 6 (13:37):
You're gonna tell me he had on headphones, Chadors, anybody
know my son? I understand he's a professional, Like he's
gonna go into a meeting with headphones on, Like, Yo.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Here's my issue. Seriously, I wasn't in there. Dion wasn't
in there. We don't know, Okay, we gotta.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Go out of respect of who Dion is. Okay, everybody's
lying on Chador against Dion, a Hall of fame of
one of the greatest football players that played in the National.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
Football League for sure.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Played Major League Baseball too, Okay, Like seriously, and the
whole idea that these are fake stories that they put
out a narrative whatever. All these different teams, they have
their own scouts or own people. A report comes out
that's going to chase you. If that wasn't your situation
or what you experience, or if you wanted to pick
(14:31):
up the phone and called Dion or.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Whatever it is you do you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
I can't buy into the idea that somehow Chador was
wrong and everybody just went on a one report or
some and the anonymous quotes. I wish people would stop this.
This is how you know they don't know anything about journalism.
Some of the biggest stories ever broken and most important
(14:55):
news and information we've ever gotten in this country, or
anonymous sources okay and anything. And the people who are
the bosses at these outlets, they know who said it.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
A reporter can't just put it out. Well, where'd you
get that from?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I got it from the owner of the team or
the general manager of the team.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Okay, Then we were rolling with it, not the.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Guy who's uh working the door at security who says this.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Like it's vetted number two, which if there was on
a podcast and they were really asking questions if that's
the case and it was made up, and you know,
and they just ran with this report. Why didn't Tom Brady,
who supposedly his mentor okay, who has worked with Shador
(15:43):
and knows the kid and all that. Why did the
Raiders pass over Shador five times? Cause if I was
Tom Brady and I was a sixth round pick, and
people picked over me, passed on me.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
And I see this kid who's a bonafar.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
We're supposed to be number one and he's dropping and
I'm the Raiders. Tom Brady, you want to change in
the organization, that's where you change the organization. I don't
care what the reports are. We're taking Chador. He's gonna
be our quarterback for the future. That was on the table,
and even Tom Brady, Rob g didn't they have five
(16:19):
or six picks in the first five rounds because they
know they had multiple in one round at least, so
they passed over him.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
Come on, be fair.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
People are trying to hold on to their jobs, general managers,
scouting directors. Right, it's not an exact science. It's not
and we talked about it before. They're wrong more than
they're right, and they could be wrong on Shador, but
don't act like it's just what one report surfaced and
that was the only thing that was made people not
(16:52):
pick sha Door. First of all, there were only four
teams looking for a quarterback that's number one, So twenty
eighteen twenty six teams didn't pass on them.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
They didn't want the quarterback, right, it only takes four.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
And guess what, Tom Brady not pushing the Raiders to
get him is my validation because he knows the kid.
How in the world what an extra pick? Did you
just not take a flyer? You've been dying for a
quarterback with the Raiders, dying for a quarterback, and they
didn't do it. So I'm just I'm not gonna sit
(17:28):
there and buy it. And I get it. That's his kid, kid.
You know that you have kids. I don't have kids.
They can't do anything wrong in their parents' eyes. You
know privately you'll scold your kids, but you wouldn't do that,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
Well, Tom said that he wasn't a part of valuation,
which I don't fully buy. I mean, but he worked
with him. As I'm saying, you're Tom Brady, he didn't worry,
thank you. And I've been right to.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Say he's a mentor and you're not a mentor. Mentor
if you haven't looked at him or evaluate him as
a quarter.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
He's saying he has a valuation team with the Raiders.
It's what he's saying. That was his cop out. I
don't buy that and that maybe you literally weren't in
the room. Absolutely are, Tom Brady, you have something to
say with that.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
That's just like having a hat in your locker that
says make America great.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I don't even know what I don't know. Oh wow, Mega,
what does that even mean? I don't even know what
that means. No, So a couple of things I think there.
I think what we're witnessing is a little bit of
half truth. What I mean is, so let's say somebody
said he walks in with headphones, and let's say he literally,
like actually walked into the facility with headphones in but
(18:32):
not in the meeting. But it comes out now it
looks like it's in the meeting, but it's you know
how things get misconstrued. They can't walk in with headphones.
How about if he walked in with headphone. That is
a possibility. We want to make sure. But to me,
I go back to this, I do believe a large
portion of what we're seeing is in response to not
just should dore Dion. I think there is a part
(18:53):
of people and organizations that were fearful of Dion. And
what I mean by that is we draft him, but
we're playing Joe Blow in front of him, and Dion
is saying, Joe Blow shouldn't be starting my shun. And
because the thing, it becomes a thing because unlike a
lot of dads and even famous dads, they don't have
a megaphone or microphone like Deon Sanders. The man has
about three different shows on three different streaming apps. He's
(19:16):
massive on social media. He he has an entire state
of Colorado loving him.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Didn't stop the Lakers from drafting the Alonzo ball. His
dad was out out front. It didn't stop them because
they thought they had they thought they had got well.
But that's what I'm saying with Shador, because you would
endure a loud parent if I got a superstar kid
and I'm not worried about whether he's gonna play or
no bar ball while big.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
In that moment those handful of months is not Dion great.
I get, I get what you're saying. So I do
think there's an element of folks like what if we
and dionna is a coach, does a does the cries
become oh is Deon should be the coach? Should we
fire and then have the son and the father. I
think that was a real thing. I also think just
people misunderstanding because now we get a you got the
(20:00):
color analyst who was spoken out about how great Shador
has been, what a great guy is, how fantastic of
a football player he's been so far in the OTAs,
and he said, man, he's very confident, like very confident,
but not cocky. And I think people the misconstrued him.
And I was talking to Robgi earlier. If you saw
a video of the number two and number one quarterbacks
(20:21):
we thought would be cam Ward did Shador Sanders going
at it at a joint training session, you would have
thought them dudes hated each other. It was the most
trash talking, hardcore you'd been like, oh, mak, this is intent,
my lion, Robbi, it was intent, But that's just how
they are. Shaduur Deon Sanders, his players, his sons. He
(20:42):
demands nothing but respect from them. So it is goes
against everything we've seen from him to not be respectful,
to hear him not being respectful because we've had twenty
something years of him being that and a going last point,
when you just look at again what the kid did
on the field, it just didn't make sense, which is
why it was such a big deal that he went
(21:02):
down the fifth because if he wasn't supposed to be
drafted higher, or wasn't a better talent, we wouldn't have
had those conversations. What made this one of the biggest
drops in the draft history is that he was good.
He did throw for fourteen thousand yards, one hundred and
thirty four touchdowns to only twenty seven interceptions, seventy four
percent completion rate, one of the worst.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Offensive lines in college football.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Yet he threw a guy to a Heisman Trophy and
I didn't, And that's why people were shocked.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Then all of a sudden, he went from gonna be
high picked.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Okay, fine, let's say he's the first round and says
in the first round, say's early second drop down the fifth.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Robbie just didn't make sense.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
This did make sense that they evaluated him differently because
they looked at a lot of things. For what I'm
telling you to starts the same way. Nobody wanted Tim
Tebow around.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Not a quarterback.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
No, but but I'm but I'm talking about when Tim
Tebow he won a national championship.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
In college quarterback.
Speaker 4 (21:58):
Yeah yeah, no, Tim, Yeah, Like we coming out, we
knew he was not a great court Okay, but no,
he went to Denver.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
They moved up in the draft and wound up costing
the who is it that? From the Patriots? The offensive
coordinator wind up cost of his job.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
He moved up to draft mc uhm m, moved up,
got him.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
He won a playoff game against Pittsburgh, right, and still
people because he wasn't that they didn't he wasn't that good,
and then all the other stuff that comes with him.
In the case of Shador, I do believe that while
he did put some of those numbers up, and I'm
not saying that there's a lot of guys who have
put numbers up. Do you have guys in smaller schools.
(22:43):
I'm not saying Colorado's small, but who put up numbers
and they still don't get the look or people don't
buy into them. And the fact that he only beat
one rank school and in some of the bigger matchups
against better school that he didn't perform that well. I'm
not saying he doesn't deserve a spot in the NFL,
but I think the evaluations early I don't. I can't
(23:03):
believe that thirty teams with multiple picks could pass on
him if they really believe he's gonna be a star.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Because that's what you're in a draft.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
That is what you're looking for, is that is that
moment that people are passing on somebody and you're the
one that that grabs them. And that's what I'm trying
to say. Here's what I can't buy that that all
these people went off of one report and that is.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
Where were true. I believe he's not.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
I believe he is not a clear cut Andrew Louck
type of talent where that was right. But I think
he also the reports that come out, I think his
father being his father and kind of putting them in.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
All of that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
But but I think I don't think he had to
have a top ten talent, meaning I don't think he
does other guys. But he absolutely that had extreme more
talent than warranted a fifth round pick. And I think
everybody knows that, and I think we're going to see
it too. And I think he's the starter. He be
the start from they're gonna start because they got went.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
And got him, They got Matt Flynn and paid him
a ton of money in Seattle and guess what, Russell
Wilson showed up and guess what, they got the job.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
But they brought in hold On, they draw Joe. I'll
answering your question.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
They brought in Joe Flecco, they brought in Picket, they
drafted Gabriel. That's why, if it was just one guy,
you take the going to start.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
To take the best player because as a coach, Door,
you're trying to win.
Speaker 4 (24:30):
Looking where Brown's are the out a quarterback. Sanders will
be the starter at some point next.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Season, and if he's not, then then they were right.
Speaker 4 (24:38):
No if he if he do, he is answer Shad Door.
Sanders is going to be their long term starter period.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I don't think he will be eight seven, seven ninety
nine on Fox, because he will be. It will be
a historic rise from being drafted where he was uns.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Who's the goat?
Speaker 1 (24:56):
No?
Speaker 3 (24:57):
Uh Joe Montana? Yes? Yeah? Who the other go?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
No, there's only the fourth round, there's a sixth round,
there's the only week ago?
Speaker 3 (25:05):
No yo, go my go five? Five?
Speaker 1 (25:08):
Fifth round? Tom Brady? Did you see Tom Brady and
co split the diff? Did you see Tom Brady in college?
You're the muscle every snap?
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search f s
R to listen live.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Join now, bar O Man, It's Onnio Daniels, NBA Champ
Series x M NBA Radio and also New Orleans Pelicans
and Fox Sports Radio NBA analysts a d.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Every days. Oh what's up? Ady?
Speaker 7 (25:40):
What's up? Man? First first and foremost, I have to
congratulate hold.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
On, hold on, hold on, do not don't do it.
Don't do it.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Don't congratulate me because you can't do it. Instead, were
waiting for in a formal announcement thank you.
Speaker 7 (25:53):
Though a d okay, all right, I won't well, I.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Won't do it.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Thank you, won't do them? Announcement coming in other words,
how you doing? No, I appreciate you. Hey, let's go.
Hear me and Kelvin are having a big argument.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I'm saying the Knicks were supposed to go to the
finals after they beat the Celtics. They were number one seed.
They blew a fourteen point lead with Game one. Whatever,
I had a clear path, Cleveland got knocked off. Here
it is, and I'm saying that if I could upgrade
at the coaching position. I would get rid of TIBs
(26:30):
and hire Michael Malone tomorrow because they underachieved.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
They were supposed to go to the final.
Speaker 7 (26:41):
Rob Listen, let's let's keep it.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
You ain't picked no pace I can go to the finals.
Did you did you pick the five? I'm asking you.
Did you pick the Pacers?
Speaker 7 (26:52):
Did you pick the Knicks?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
No?
Speaker 3 (26:55):
I didn't know. I did not. I didn't believe in TIBs.
Speaker 7 (26:59):
No, but what on? Hold on, rum, We're not talking
about the Pacers, right, We're talking about the Knicks. And
if we're not talking about the Pacers, we're talking about
the Knicks. And this is what I say. No one,
I haven't picked the Pacers to go to the finals,
but we're not talking about them. We're talking about the Knicks.
The Knicks actually overachieved because if you think of where
they were last year, right, Remember they got eliminated second
(27:22):
round last year by the same exact team. This year
they got eliminated in the Eastern Conference finals. I don't
think this is a temp situation. I think it's the
way the roster's constructed. There are some things that they
need to change. I still think see this is the
This is what always happens when the team gets eliminated.
Everybody kind of goes in on that team. This team
did not underachieve, Yes they did not.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
They beat the Celtics right by coming back from two
twenty point games on the road.
Speaker 3 (27:50):
Okay, so they knock off the Celtics.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
They have the Pacers down in game one by fourteen,
we're two thirty to go. A games in that same
scenario been played and no one had ever lost the
game until.
Speaker 7 (28:05):
The next game.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Hold on, can they come back to game two to
make it an equalizer? And guess what they do? They
lose and Tims doesn't play the bench. Okay, and those
guys peter out at the end.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
But are you kidding? Time to move on from him?
Speaker 7 (28:21):
If you're telling me, if you're telling me that you
have an issue with Thibb's not playing his bench, join
the club. So do I. I'm a guy that came
up to be thirteen years in this league. There you go.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
You know what it means.
Speaker 7 (28:35):
I know what that means to not be trusted and
to have to be played out of necessity as opposed
to being played out of trust. But here's the thing,
that's who Thims has always been. And if you're telling
me that you want to upgrade because you want this
team to get deeper, and because when you're playing against
a team like the Indiana Pacers, it becomes a war
of attrician not know.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
And don't you and Rick call out out coached them?
Rick carl is a way better coaching. Yeah, U, but
coaching does count. Okay, coaching does count. And guess who's
sitting out there, Michael Malone, who coached the Nuggets to
a championship and I made it to this Antonio. The
Detroit Pistons had a young Rick Carla who had gotten
(29:20):
the Pistons to the second round when they hadn't done
anything in years, and Larry Brown was available who had
never won a championship.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
And you know what they did.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
They upgraded and they won the next year with Larry Brown.
Speaker 7 (29:33):
Rob but Rob. They also up the roster by Anna
Raci Wallace.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah but but Larry Brown was a big part of
it because he made Chaunty better, a better player.
Speaker 7 (29:43):
I was, I was.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I covered that team.
Speaker 7 (29:46):
I get it, no question, no question about it. But
I'll go back to what we talked about the Knicks
for two and a half hours to day of our
three hour show about what can they do to upgrade?
What can they do to prove? What can they do
to get better? It is not simply Everything is not
simply a coaching issue. Sometimes it's roster constructions, how the
(30:08):
team is constructed. There are certain areas that team needs
to get better in and I don't know if that
falls on fans. I don't know if that falls on
fans or not. But to say that it's it's simply
a tense conversation and once you upgrade there, everything will
fall in place. I still you keep everything status quote.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
I didn't say that it is. I didn't say that.
I didn't. I didn't say that if you.
Speaker 7 (30:30):
Do, that does not put you past the Indiana Pacers.
I just seem that eliminated it on back to back years.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
I just don't think that you're going to get there.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Sometimes coaches could get to it to a certain level
and then other coaches could take you over the top.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
That that's where I'm I agree with that, agree with that.
Speaker 4 (30:47):
ADR guests Antonio Daniels I do. I just thought they overachieved.
None of us thought that they were. We all said
they were underachieving things.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Everybody had them going to the finals, and the street
names named after place.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
Pint it all. No, they didn't.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
I'm talking about after they beat the Celtics, everybody and
their uncle had them going.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
Come on, man, No, that's not how his works roped.
That's not how his words.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Yes it is.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
You change your expectations when things happened. So you after
they beat the Celtic, you go, oh, but they're still
not going to get to the finals?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
Is that what you said?
Speaker 7 (31:18):
Man, this is the same team you didn't say that
beat him last year.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yeah, Game seven and they were a little banged up
at Madison Square. Go, I'm not gonna make excuses. The
Pacers did win in a Game seven. I've never seen
if Antonio. If you can't get fired after blowing a
fourteen point lead with two minutes and thirty seconds to go,
you can never be fired.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I don't know what else it would take.
Speaker 7 (31:42):
Well, the thing about it, I don't know. I mean,
I don't know if he's gonna be fired from what
I hear. And he has the backing of the players,
and he has the backing to.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
The frontalf nice and then they'll go another The last
time the Knicks won a championship, Moby Dick was a guppy.
So keep doing the same thing and we'll see where
they are. They're not winning a championship, not with it
behind the bench.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah a d.
Speaker 4 (32:02):
Let's go to the other side of this is this
is what I equated to as a purist. NBA Finals
meeting casual. Hey, I want to peek in, check in
o Lebron in the finals, the step in the finals.
No oh, but if you love basketball, you got the
two best teams literally since January first, they've been the
best two teams in basketball. You got one team that's
high power offense. The other team can score obviously, but
(32:24):
their high power defense. Two great basketball teams. What do
you make it as finals? And do you believe it's
going to be the snooze fest? And a lot of
folks think it'll be.
Speaker 7 (32:33):
I don't know what makes it a snooze fans? Are
people saying this because it's like, you know what's wild Covenant?
During the season, everybody is always talking about, you know what,
it's time to pass the torch, right, It's time to
move on from Lebron and stats and KD and Chris
Paul and it's time to actually give some shine to
(32:54):
some of these young stars. You know, the Ebney Edwards
and he's Jalen Brunton, the Teresa Halliburtons, and the state
gives us Alexander's and then when they actually get to
that point, then everybody's mad. Everybody's upset. I allann to
say what I wanted to see. No, I this is
something I want to see. I don't. I will be honest.
I will be one hundred percent honest. I do not
(33:16):
think this is going to be a very long drawn
out series. I don't. I'm not sure how competitive this
series is going to be. That's if my own personal opinion,
the way that I have seen this Oklahoma City thunder
team defense, I have a hard time seeing the Indiana
Pacers get more than one.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, I got it at five at least as of now,
I'm thinking, yeah.
Speaker 7 (33:39):
Me too. Yeah it's got okay, see and five. But
the but the.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Fans are the ones who determine as you want to
watch people. All those players you mentioned were all young
and all started the Warriors. Weren't winners right away, okay,
but they developed. Okay, so everybody who won didn't win
at first, Michael Jordan did didn't win at first, and
neither did anybody. So except for Magic Johnson his first
(34:04):
year going into the NBA, he won, you know, but
but most guys don't. And my point is it has
a lot to do with market size. As much as
people talk about the NBA.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Oh, no question, it's regional.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
It's regional and and and the Spurs were a great team,
won five chair. You played on that team, right, hey,
they own two of the lowest rated NBA finals, right
the Spurs and then the New Jersey. That's the New
New Jersey didn't even have like a home base. People
in New York didn't care, and the ratings were bad,
Like it just the Senate Tonio is a small market.
(34:40):
I don't know that.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
I don't know what. I'm just saying that there is
no alternative.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
But I don't believe this is going to be a
ratings bonanza because of the sides of those markets.
Speaker 7 (34:49):
Oh, it's definitely not. It is definitely not going to
be a rating bonanza. You have two of the smallest
markets in the league. You're like, no, there's there won't
be people in LA and New York right up to
see this. You won't be see people in New York
lining up to see this game. All these bigger markets,
(35:09):
you definitely will not. You will get people from Oklahoma City,
oh yeah, people from Norman. You'll get people from the Midwest.
But no. So that's what makes it a snooze fest,
so to speak, is the rating. Then it won't be
a snooze fest by the rating. Yeah rating, some good basketball, yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
Hope it's gonna be some grasswa citiz perios. Right, It's
like it's like I acquate it to hip hop. We'll
talk further about that, but uh, I just think you
need a star and generally you would love to have seen.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
Are MVP I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
So then you have him go up against you know,
a Lebron led team or or a Warriors team against
the Pacers something like that, where you get the great
balance the upcoming versus the old hot guard. And that's
usually kind of how it goes. You get the old
guard and the new guys coming in making it.
Speaker 7 (35:55):
I know you think about it. Oh guards, they making it.
Old guards didn't either didn't make the player also got
eliminated in the first round because that's not on the
young stars that are actually advancing.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
Yep a d. We appreciate you as always, Madam, we'll
appreciate it.
Speaker 7 (36:11):
Thank you, my man for sure appreciated fellows
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Odd Couple podcasts.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday from seven
pm to ten pm Eastern four to seven Pacific on
Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for The Odd
Couple at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us
live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
You're listening to the Best of the Odd Couple.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
So obviously the finals are set. We know it's the
Pacers and the Thunder. We'll get into that. The finals
doesn't start till Thursday, but there's some stuff we need
to you know, hash out and talk about of the
fallout because the last series, of course, was the Pacers and.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
The Knicks and Rob G.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
I don't think I don't know we didn't talk about this,
But do we have the sound or no from Jalen
Brunton when they were asking him about.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yeah, like is that a real question? It was kind
of like, am I right? Rob G? Is that fair?
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Right?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
It was like, is that a real right? Yeah? No,
He's gonna talk to me. Now, he didn't know what
I was gonna be saying.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Okay, he didn't know, But my point is this, and
I know if you're Nick fans, you know they were
ready in the streets and they were naming streets after
players and all that. But if you're a New York
Knick fan and you don't think what happened this season
was a failure, then you have no idea what's going on.
The twenty twenty four to twenty five season was a
(01:29):
big failure for the New York Knicks. You went out,
you got Karl Anthony Towns, you made a big trade
Miquel Bridges, you gave a five first round picks, right,
You did all these things, and the idea that last
year went to second round lost right in seven games
to the Patriots. You wanted to be better, you thought,
(01:49):
blah blah blah. You made all those moves. Not only that,
you beat the defending champs, and you can talk about, oh,
you know, oh the Celtics got Tatum got hurt. No, no, no,
they won the first two games in Boston being down
by twenty.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Once you do that, you tear up the script.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So all the people didn't think the Knicks were gonna
go because they couldn't beat the Celtics because of all
what happened in regular seasons that changed and so should
have the expectations of this basketball team, which was that
they were gonna finally get to the championship for the
first time in twenty five years, right since nineteen ninety nine.
(02:34):
Prince sang about it. The Knicks were about it back then,
and now this year they have the Celtics beating up.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
The only team in their way.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Is the Indiana Pacers, a team that nobody talked about
all year, a team that no one expected to beat
the Cavaliers, and a team you had down by fourteen
with two thirty eight to go, down by nine with
fifty seconds to go. You win Game one at Madison
Square Garden and you're.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Going to the finals.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Okay, you would have had a chance to go to
the finals right there.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
And guess what they didn't do it.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
They choked that down, lost Game two at home, and
basically the series was over. I told you after they
lost Game one they weren't going to the finals. You
don't recover from that. They forced a Game six and
guess what, their stars don't show up in Game six
at Indiana have awful shooting nights.
Speaker 3 (03:37):
Ray Charles could see that. I mean, like just awful.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Don't celebrate the New York Knicks for what they did
in the excitement they gave the city, had people in
the streets, had rats carrying pizza all over town, and celebration.
None of it mattered, Kelvin, none of it. They failed
(04:03):
this season. The Knicks should be in the NBA Finals,
not the Indiana Pacers. And for that reason, if I'm
the Knicks, I gotta look at TIBs and.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Honestly make a change. And if you ask me who
I got the who.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
His name is Michael Malone, who coached the Denver Nuggets
to a soup to an NBA Finals championship.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
There you go.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
All right, let me say this, And I never in
my life thought I would be sitting up here defending
the Knicks. What in the world has the world come to?
All right, Rob, Now this is where I gotta bring
you back down to reality a little bit. None of
us went into this Eastern Conference playoffs thinking the Knicks
really had a shot.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
In fact, we.
Speaker 4 (04:58):
Came on, all of us talking about how they underachieved
and they were one of the worst three seeds or
are like, oh nobody believes it is.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
They don't even beat the good teams.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
And not only did they come in and beat solid
teams and the Pistons and upcomings team. They beat the
raigning champs, and then they beat the Pacers, who, by
the way, were thirty four and fourteen since January first.
The only team better than them are in the finals
the Oklahoma City Thunder. So the Pacers have actually been
it's our fault for ignoring them as being the second
(05:30):
best team in the NBA since the beginning of twenty
twenty five. So the Knicks come in, they beat a
young Pistons team who has a really good team, They
beat the rainning Champs, and.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
They lose admirably in six to the Pacers.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
Now, also when you look at what they've done for
an organization that is underachieved for twenty five thirty years,
to me, they have something to hang their hat on.
They have officially won thousand percent, unequivocally found their guy,
and we know how hard that is in sports. And
Jalen Brunton is no but he's a heck of a player,
one of the best clutch players in the league, one
(06:04):
Cutch player of the Year. And then you have a
guy in kar Anthony Towns who you say, okay, the trade.
He played well, there's some things we can work on,
and that's a conversation for another day.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
But to me, the next overachieve. We literally kept.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
Going, Okay, this is about it. Now they'd had their fun, Okay,
there's no all right, well their selth's gonna come back again. Okay, well,
I mean now, and then PACER's gonna and they got
six out of this. And so to me, I'm looking
at the Knicks and saying, they played hard. You never
ever ever felt like they quit. They literally competed all
in all the games. And I even gotta give teams
who I never want to give credit to because all
(06:37):
he does is look like another version of Darvin Ham
with his hands in his pockets instead is are hands voted.
But we talked about and I said, man, he's got
to start playing that bench a little bit. He's got
to get there's no way they can sustain those legs.
Those legs are gonna go out on them. And they
sustained throughout the season. Michel Bridges, who is the iron
man calling them out, Hey, man, we gotta we gotta
get some breaks. We're tired. They fall through that as
(06:58):
a team, they get postseason guys are playing too much again.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
He starts to play the Bitch.
Speaker 4 (07:03):
He plays right, he plays Sammy, he plays goes to
Mitchell Robinson more, he plays the McBride. He starts to
play some guys, and I gotta give him credit that
he at least was trying to do something. So this
was an overachievement. It to me they have some things
that if I were the general manager, absolutely we're addressing.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
There's some things to fix.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
But man, there's no way if I'd have told you
starting in the beginning of the season the Knicks would
be a game and a half away from being in
the finals, did you would think that was they underachieved?
Speaker 1 (07:35):
Now, I don't even know how you could even think
about them underachieving. When they beat the defending champs that
nobody expect him to beat, and they're up by fourteen
against the Pacers at home. It's one thing if they
got molly wopped and got swept by the Pacers and
they were just better.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
But they coughed up a historic choke.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
If you can't get fired off a historic choke, you
can never get fired.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
I'm dead serious.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Like the idea that you think they underachieved blowing and
not only did they do that?
Speaker 3 (08:09):
You thought they bounced.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Back in game two, right, because all right, I was
just one game, one game. They they not only did that,
they lost game two at home to the Pacers, and
and so you're in a two to zero hole, which
you're not gonna bounce back.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
There's no way you can look at that and call
that an over.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
So how did I How am I not firing Missoula
Missoula because they won a championship, but then.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
They need a championship team.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
No, No, do not lose two games from the twenty
because they won one. It does I'm saying based off
that they lost one. They and he literally just got
them further than any any team they got into twenty
five years. And again I'm not sitting there reacting like
he's Phil Jackson. But if my star player comes out
(08:54):
and it gives him a major endorsement, my player I
am absolutely tied to in Jalen Brunton. He ain't go nowhere,
and he is my guy, and he sings a ringing endorsement.
The guys got me further. Now I'm in the playoffs
two years in a row, which does not happen to
the Knicks all the time. Two years in a row,
and not only two years in a row, I improve, I
get further than I did the next year. I don't
(09:15):
see why they're gonna end up firing that Guy's it
because they.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
Did it before. Can I give you an example?
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yes, Can I give you Rick Carlile and the Detroit Pistons.
Can I give you an example? And I want you
to listen to this example. The Pistons had gotten further
than they had ever gone with Rick Carlile. And guess
what they looked and said, there's Larry Brown. And at
that time, Larry had never won a championship in the NBA.
But he was a better coach at that time than
(09:42):
Rick Carlile. If you're the Knicks and Timbs, he's never
been able to go further with any team he's been.
Mike Malone, Michael Malone is available. Mike Malone is not
a question mark whether he can get a team to
where you need to go.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
He's available.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
Teams you upgrade when you have a chance to upgrade.
And that's the exemple I'm gonna give you because I
have seen it before. Smart teams go. Thank you, Tibbs,
you got it to a certain point, keV is his difference.
First of all, there's a massive different.
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Rick Carlile was just starting to coach facts or none fact.
But he's still want to go facts or no facts. Now,
he was a new coach that they thought, all right, cool,
that was cute.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
Get out of here.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Here comes this forty five fifty year veteran and uh
and your boy Brown, Larry Brown. So this is not
the same where Timms is a veteran quarter coach who
has been there, who is veteran.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Players love and adore him. I'm not stamping him.
Speaker 4 (10:42):
I'm just saying, if Jalen Brunson and your front off
has already come out and say he's their guy, he's
gonna be their guy.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
And again the team is overachieved.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
None of us thought they would do this in the
beginning of this playoffs and they lost to the Pacers,
who have the second best record since the turn.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
It changes changes once you beat the Celtics. Come on, man,
you don't go backwards once you've already and they were
the better team than the Celtics. Said no, no, they
literally weren't.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
They were the best teams, the only team better than
these of January first.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
Who had who had a higher seed in the playoffs?
Speaker 4 (11:11):
I just said, I don't care about that.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Who had a higher seed? Does it matter? Does? January four?
Speaker 1 (11:19):
The favorite in that series? Was it the Knicks or
the Pacers? The Pacers were playing were they were not
the favorite?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
The Pacers the only team that played better than there's
the two teams in the Whigs.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
Who was the higher seed and who was the favorites?
I'm asking you the Celtics underachieved. We've all talked about that.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
We're talking about I'm talking about with the Knicks and
the Pacers.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
Two questions.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
So higher seeds, No, the Knicks, I'm talking about the
about the Celtics, the.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Knicks, okay? And who was the favorite in that series? Actually?
I was it the Knicks? Yes? It was all right.
Speaker 4 (11:57):
So if you hold on, if you're all adamant, why
did you pick the Pacers to win?
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Because I still didn't believe in and TIBs And that
there's your point. I don't believe in Taylors. I don't
believe in TIBs. I don't care if they call you
mister TIBs. I want you, mister out.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Be sure to catch live editions of the Odd Couple
with Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington weekdays at seven pm
Eastern four pm Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the
iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 5 (12:26):
You mentioned it right off the top, Shador Sanders fell
to the fifth round, and if depending on who you ask,
it had less to do with his on field performance
and everything to do with him off the field, specifically
the way he conducted himself when he met with teams
at the combine and during the draft process. According to
at least one report, he had a particularly disappointing meeting
(12:49):
with the New York Giants. They wouldn't say exactly what
it was, just that they came away very unimpressed with him,
that he seemed uninterested in selling himself to the franchise
and what he could bring to them, And the word
that was thrown around by a lot of outlets was unprofessional.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
And then and then in one of the meetings he
had headphones on them. That was alleged.
Speaker 5 (13:09):
So according to dion Sanders on the latest podcast of
episode of Say What Needs to be Said.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
Say what you need to say, Dionna is not a
family's reports.
Speaker 6 (13:18):
Take a listen when you sit up there and say
something like he went in a meeting unprepared, like dude,
Chador Sanders, who's had six different coordinators, who has still
functioned and went up, leveled up every time we brought
somebody new in.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
And you're gonna tell me every situation.
Speaker 6 (13:37):
You're gonna tell me he had on headphones, Chadors, anybody
know my son? I understand he's a professional, Like he's
gonna go into a meeting with headphones on, Like, Yo.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Here's my issue. Seriously, I wasn't in there. Dion wasn't
in there. We don't know, Okay, we gotta.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Go out of respect of who Dion is. Okay, everybody's
lying on Chador against Dion, a Hall of fame of
one of the greatest football players that played in the National.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
Football League for sure.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
Played Major League Baseball too, Okay, Like seriously, and the
whole idea that these are fake stories that they put
out a narrative whatever. All these different teams, they have
their own scouts or own people. A report comes out
that's going to chase you. If that wasn't your situation
or what you experience, or if you wanted to pick
(14:31):
up the phone and called Dion or.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Whatever it is you do you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
I can't buy into the idea that somehow Chador was
wrong and everybody just went on a one report or
some and the anonymous quotes. I wish people would stop this.
This is how you know they don't know anything about journalism.
Some of the biggest stories ever broken and most important
(14:55):
news and information we've ever gotten in this country, or
anonymous sources okay and anything. And the people who are
the bosses at these outlets, they know who said it.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
A reporter can't just put it out. Well, where'd you
get that from?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I got it from the owner of the team or
the general manager of the team.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Okay, Then we were rolling with it, not the.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Guy who's uh working the door at security who says this.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Like it's vetted number two, which if there was on
a podcast and they were really asking questions if that's
the case and it was made up, and you know,
and they just ran with this report. Why didn't Tom Brady,
who supposedly his mentor okay, who has worked with Shador
(15:43):
and knows the kid and all that. Why did the
Raiders pass over Shador five times? Cause if I was
Tom Brady and I was a sixth round pick, and
people picked over me, passed on me.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
And I see this kid who's a bonafar.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
We're supposed to be number one and he's dropping and
I'm the Raiders. Tom Brady, you want to change in
the organization, that's where you change the organization. I don't
care what the reports are. We're taking Chador. He's gonna
be our quarterback for the future. That was on the table,
and even Tom Brady, Rob g didn't they have five
(16:19):
or six picks in the first five rounds because they
know they had multiple in one round at least, so
they passed over him.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
Come on, be fair.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
People are trying to hold on to their jobs, general managers,
scouting directors. Right, it's not an exact science. It's not
and we talked about it before. They're wrong more than
they're right, and they could be wrong on Shador, but
don't act like it's just what one report surfaced and
that was the only thing that was made people not
(16:52):
pick sha Door. First of all, there were only four
teams looking for a quarterback that's number one, So twenty
eighteen twenty six teams didn't pass on them.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
They didn't want the quarterback, right, it only takes four.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
And guess what, Tom Brady not pushing the Raiders to
get him is my validation because he knows the kid.
How in the world what an extra pick? Did you
just not take a flyer? You've been dying for a
quarterback with the Raiders, dying for a quarterback, and they
didn't do it. So I'm just I'm not gonna sit
(17:28):
there and buy it. And I get it. That's his kid, kid.
You know that you have kids. I don't have kids.
They can't do anything wrong in their parents' eyes. You
know privately you'll scold your kids, but you wouldn't do that,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
Well, Tom said that he wasn't a part of valuation,
which I don't fully buy. I mean, but he worked
with him. As I'm saying, you're Tom Brady, he didn't worry,
thank you. And I've been right to.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
Say he's a mentor and you're not a mentor. Mentor
if you haven't looked at him or evaluate him as
a quarter.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
He's saying he has a valuation team with the Raiders.
It's what he's saying. That was his cop out. I
don't buy that and that maybe you literally weren't in
the room. Absolutely are, Tom Brady, you have something to
say with that.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
That's just like having a hat in your locker that
says make America great.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I don't even know what I don't know. Oh wow, Mega,
what does that even mean? I don't even know what
that means. No, So a couple of things I think there.
I think what we're witnessing is a little bit of
half truth. What I mean is, so let's say somebody
said he walks in with headphones, and let's say he literally,
like actually walked into the facility with headphones in but
(18:32):
not in the meeting. But it comes out now it
looks like it's in the meeting, but it's you know
how things get misconstrued. They can't walk in with headphones.
How about if he walked in with headphone. That is
a possibility. We want to make sure. But to me,
I go back to this, I do believe a large
portion of what we're seeing is in response to not
just should dore Dion. I think there is a part
(18:53):
of people and organizations that were fearful of Dion. And
what I mean by that is we draft him, but
we're playing Joe Blow in front of him, and Dion
is saying, Joe Blow shouldn't be starting my shun. And
because the thing, it becomes a thing because unlike a
lot of dads and even famous dads, they don't have
a megaphone or microphone like Deon Sanders. The man has
about three different shows on three different streaming apps. He's
(19:16):
massive on social media. He he has an entire state
of Colorado loving him.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Didn't stop the Lakers from drafting the Alonzo ball. His
dad was out out front. It didn't stop them because
they thought they had they thought they had got well.
But that's what I'm saying with Shador, because you would
endure a loud parent if I got a superstar kid
and I'm not worried about whether he's gonna play or
no bar ball while big.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
In that moment those handful of months is not Dion great.
I get, I get what you're saying. So I do
think there's an element of folks like what if we
and dionna is a coach, does a does the cries
become oh is Deon should be the coach? Should we
fire and then have the son and the father. I
think that was a real thing. I also think just
people misunderstanding because now we get a you got the
(20:00):
color analyst who was spoken out about how great Shador
has been, what a great guy is, how fantastic of
a football player he's been so far in the OTAs,
and he said, man, he's very confident, like very confident,
but not cocky. And I think people the misconstrued him.
And I was talking to Robgi earlier. If you saw
a video of the number two and number one quarterbacks
(20:21):
we thought would be cam Ward did Shador Sanders going
at it at a joint training session, you would have
thought them dudes hated each other. It was the most
trash talking, hardcore you'd been like, oh, mak, this is intent,
my lion, Robbi, it was intent, But that's just how
they are. Shaduur Deon Sanders, his players, his sons. He
(20:42):
demands nothing but respect from them. So it is goes
against everything we've seen from him to not be respectful,
to hear him not being respectful because we've had twenty
something years of him being that and a going last point,
when you just look at again what the kid did
on the field, it just didn't make sense, which is
why it was such a big deal that he went
(21:02):
down the fifth because if he wasn't supposed to be
drafted higher, or wasn't a better talent, we wouldn't have
had those conversations. What made this one of the biggest
drops in the draft history is that he was good.
He did throw for fourteen thousand yards, one hundred and
thirty four touchdowns to only twenty seven interceptions, seventy four
percent completion rate, one of the worst.
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Offensive lines in college football.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
Yet he threw a guy to a Heisman Trophy and
I didn't, And that's why people were shocked.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Then all of a sudden, he went from gonna be
high picked.
Speaker 4 (21:34):
Okay, fine, let's say he's the first round and says
in the first round, say's early second drop down the fifth.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Robbie just didn't make sense.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
This did make sense that they evaluated him differently because
they looked at a lot of things. For what I'm
telling you to starts the same way. Nobody wanted Tim
Tebow around.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Not a quarterback.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
No, but but I'm but I'm talking about when Tim
Tebow he won a national championship.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
In college quarterback.
Speaker 4 (21:58):
Yeah yeah, no, Tim, Yeah, Like we coming out, we
knew he was not a great court Okay, but no,
he went to Denver.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
They moved up in the draft and wound up costing
the who is it that? From the Patriots? The offensive
coordinator wind up cost of his job.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
He moved up to draft mc uhm m, moved up,
got him.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
He won a playoff game against Pittsburgh, right, and still
people because he wasn't that they didn't he wasn't that good,
and then all the other stuff that comes with him.
In the case of Shador, I do believe that while
he did put some of those numbers up, and I'm
not saying that there's a lot of guys who have
put numbers up. Do you have guys in smaller schools.
(22:43):
I'm not saying Colorado's small, but who put up numbers
and they still don't get the look or people don't
buy into them. And the fact that he only beat
one rank school and in some of the bigger matchups
against better school that he didn't perform that well. I'm
not saying he doesn't deserve a spot in the NFL,
but I think the evaluations early I don't. I can't
(23:03):
believe that thirty teams with multiple picks could pass on
him if they really believe he's gonna be a star.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Because that's what you're in a draft.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
That is what you're looking for, is that is that
moment that people are passing on somebody and you're the
one that that grabs them. And that's what I'm trying
to say. Here's what I can't buy that that all
these people went off of one report and that is.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
Where were true. I believe he's not.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
I believe he is not a clear cut Andrew Louck
type of talent where that was right. But I think
he also the reports that come out, I think his
father being his father and kind of putting them in.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
All of that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
But but I think I don't think he had to
have a top ten talent, meaning I don't think he
does other guys. But he absolutely that had extreme more
talent than warranted a fifth round pick. And I think
everybody knows that, and I think we're going to see
it too. And I think he's the starter. He be
the start from they're gonna start because they got went.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
And got him, They got Matt Flynn and paid him
a ton of money in Seattle and guess what, Russell
Wilson showed up and guess what, they got the job.
Speaker 3 (24:14):
But they brought in hold On, they draw Joe. I'll
answering your question.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
They brought in Joe Flecco, they brought in Picket, they
drafted Gabriel. That's why, if it was just one guy,
you take the going to start.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
To take the best player because as a coach, Door,
you're trying to win.
Speaker 4 (24:30):
Looking where Brown's are the out a quarterback. Sanders will
be the starter at some point next.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Season, and if he's not, then then they were right.
Speaker 4 (24:38):
No if he if he do, he is answer Shad Door.
Sanders is going to be their long term starter period.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I don't think he will be eight seven, seven ninety
nine on Fox, because he will be. It will be
a historic rise from being drafted where he was uns.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Who's the goat?
Speaker 1 (24:56):
No?
Speaker 3 (24:57):
Uh Joe Montana? Yes? Yeah? Who the other go?
Speaker 1 (25:00):
No, there's only the fourth round, there's a sixth round,
there's the only week ago?
Speaker 3 (25:05):
No yo, go my go five? Five?
Speaker 1 (25:08):
Fifth round? Tom Brady? Did you see Tom Brady and
co split the diff? Did you see Tom Brady in college?
You're the muscle every snap?
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (25:15):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search f s
R to listen live.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Join now, bar O Man, It's Onnio Daniels, NBA Champ
Series x M NBA Radio and also New Orleans Pelicans
and Fox Sports Radio NBA analysts a d.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Every days. Oh what's up? Ady?
Speaker 7 (25:40):
What's up? Man? First first and foremost, I have to
congratulate hold.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
On, hold on, hold on, do not don't do it.
Don't do it.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Don't congratulate me because you can't do it. Instead, were
waiting for in a formal announcement thank you.
Speaker 7 (25:53):
Though a d okay, all right, I won't well, I.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Won't do it.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Thank you, won't do them? Announcement coming in other words,
how you doing? No, I appreciate you. Hey, let's go.
Hear me and Kelvin are having a big argument.
Speaker 1 (26:10):
I'm saying the Knicks were supposed to go to the
finals after they beat the Celtics. They were number one seed.
They blew a fourteen point lead with Game one. Whatever,
I had a clear path, Cleveland got knocked off. Here
it is, and I'm saying that if I could upgrade
at the coaching position. I would get rid of TIBs
(26:30):
and hire Michael Malone tomorrow because they underachieved.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
They were supposed to go to the final.
Speaker 7 (26:41):
Rob Listen, let's let's keep it.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
You ain't picked no pace I can go to the finals.
Did you did you pick the five? I'm asking you.
Did you pick the Pacers?
Speaker 7 (26:52):
Did you pick the Knicks?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
No?
Speaker 3 (26:55):
I didn't know. I did not. I didn't believe in TIBs.
Speaker 7 (26:59):
No, but what on? Hold on, rum, We're not talking
about the Pacers, right, We're talking about the Knicks. And
if we're not talking about the Pacers, we're talking about
the Knicks. And this is what I say. No one,
I haven't picked the Pacers to go to the finals,
but we're not talking about them. We're talking about the Knicks.
The Knicks actually overachieved because if you think of where
they were last year, right, Remember they got eliminated second
(27:22):
round last year by the same exact team. This year
they got eliminated in the Eastern Conference finals. I don't
think this is a temp situation. I think it's the
way the roster's constructed. There are some things that they
need to change. I still think see this is the
This is what always happens when the team gets eliminated.
Everybody kind of goes in on that team. This team
did not underachieve, Yes they did not.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
They beat the Celtics right by coming back from two
twenty point games on the road.
Speaker 3 (27:50):
Okay, so they knock off the Celtics.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
They have the Pacers down in game one by fourteen,
we're two thirty to go. A games in that same
scenario been played and no one had ever lost the
game until.
Speaker 7 (28:05):
The next game.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Hold on, can they come back to game two to
make it an equalizer? And guess what they do? They
lose and Tims doesn't play the bench. Okay, and those
guys peter out at the end.
Speaker 3 (28:16):
But are you kidding? Time to move on from him?
Speaker 7 (28:21):
If you're telling me, if you're telling me that you
have an issue with Thibb's not playing his bench, join
the club. So do I. I'm a guy that came
up to be thirteen years in this league. There you go.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
You know what it means.
Speaker 7 (28:35):
I know what that means to not be trusted and
to have to be played out of necessity as opposed
to being played out of trust. But here's the thing,
that's who Thims has always been. And if you're telling
me that you want to upgrade because you want this
team to get deeper, and because when you're playing against
a team like the Indiana Pacers, it becomes a war
of attrician not know.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
And don't you and Rick call out out coached them?
Rick carl is a way better coaching. Yeah, U, but
coaching does count. Okay, coaching does count. And guess who's
sitting out there, Michael Malone, who coached the Nuggets to
a championship and I made it to this Antonio. The
Detroit Pistons had a young Rick Carla who had gotten
(29:20):
the Pistons to the second round when they hadn't done
anything in years, and Larry Brown was available who had
never won a championship.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
And you know what they did.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
They upgraded and they won the next year with Larry Brown.
Speaker 7 (29:33):
Rob but Rob. They also up the roster by Anna
Raci Wallace.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Yeah but but Larry Brown was a big part of
it because he made Chaunty better, a better player.
Speaker 7 (29:43):
I was, I was.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I covered that team.
Speaker 7 (29:46):
I get it, no question, no question about it. But
I'll go back to what we talked about the Knicks
for two and a half hours to day of our
three hour show about what can they do to upgrade?
What can they do to prove? What can they do
to get better? It is not simply Everything is not
simply a coaching issue. Sometimes it's roster constructions, how the
(30:08):
team is constructed. There are certain areas that team needs
to get better in and I don't know if that
falls on fans. I don't know if that falls on
fans or not. But to say that it's it's simply
a tense conversation and once you upgrade there, everything will
fall in place. I still you keep everything status quote.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
I didn't say that it is. I didn't say that.
I didn't. I didn't say that if you.
Speaker 7 (30:30):
Do, that does not put you past the Indiana Pacers.
I just seem that eliminated it on back to back years.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
I just don't think that you're going to get there.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Sometimes coaches could get to it to a certain level
and then other coaches could take you over the top.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
That that's where I'm I agree with that, agree with that.
Speaker 4 (30:47):
ADR guests Antonio Daniels I do. I just thought they overachieved.
None of us thought that they were. We all said
they were underachieving things.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Everybody had them going to the finals, and the street
names named after place.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
Pint it all. No, they didn't.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
I'm talking about after they beat the Celtics, everybody and
their uncle had them going.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
Come on, man, No, that's not how his works roped.
That's not how his words.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Yes it is.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
You change your expectations when things happened. So you after
they beat the Celtic, you go, oh, but they're still
not going to get to the finals?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
Is that what you said?
Speaker 7 (31:18):
Man, this is the same team you didn't say that
beat him last year.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Yeah, Game seven and they were a little banged up
at Madison Square. Go, I'm not gonna make excuses. The
Pacers did win in a Game seven. I've never seen
if Antonio. If you can't get fired after blowing a
fourteen point lead with two minutes and thirty seconds to go,
you can never be fired.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I don't know what else it would take.
Speaker 7 (31:42):
Well, the thing about it, I don't know. I mean,
I don't know if he's gonna be fired from what
I hear. And he has the backing of the players,
and he has the backing to.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
The frontalf nice and then they'll go another The last
time the Knicks won a championship, Moby Dick was a guppy.
So keep doing the same thing and we'll see where
they are. They're not winning a championship, not with it
behind the bench.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah a d.
Speaker 4 (32:02):
Let's go to the other side of this is this
is what I equated to as a purist. NBA Finals
meeting casual. Hey, I want to peek in, check in
o Lebron in the finals, the step in the finals.
No oh, but if you love basketball, you got the
two best teams literally since January first, they've been the
best two teams in basketball. You got one team that's
high power offense. The other team can score obviously, but
(32:24):
their high power defense. Two great basketball teams. What do
you make it as finals? And do you believe it's
going to be the snooze fest? And a lot of
folks think it'll be.
Speaker 7 (32:33):
I don't know what makes it a snooze fans? Are
people saying this because it's like, you know what's wild Covenant?
During the season, everybody is always talking about, you know what,
it's time to pass the torch, right, It's time to
move on from Lebron and stats and KD and Chris
Paul and it's time to actually give some shine to
(32:54):
some of these young stars. You know, the Ebney Edwards
and he's Jalen Brunton, the Teresa Halliburtons, and the state
gives us Alexander's and then when they actually get to
that point, then everybody's mad. Everybody's upset. I allann to
say what I wanted to see. No, I this is
something I want to see. I don't. I will be honest.
I will be one hundred percent honest. I do not
(33:16):
think this is going to be a very long drawn
out series. I don't. I'm not sure how competitive this
series is going to be. That's if my own personal opinion,
the way that I have seen this Oklahoma City thunder
team defense, I have a hard time seeing the Indiana
Pacers get more than one.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, I got it at five at least as of now,
I'm thinking, yeah.
Speaker 7 (33:39):
Me too. Yeah it's got okay, see and five. But
the but the.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Fans are the ones who determine as you want to
watch people. All those players you mentioned were all young
and all started the Warriors. Weren't winners right away, okay,
but they developed. Okay, so everybody who won didn't win
at first, Michael Jordan did didn't win at first, and
neither did anybody. So except for Magic Johnson his first
(34:04):
year going into the NBA, he won, you know, but
but most guys don't. And my point is it has
a lot to do with market size. As much as
people talk about the NBA.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
Oh, no question, it's regional.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
It's regional and and and the Spurs were a great team,
won five chair. You played on that team, right, hey,
they own two of the lowest rated NBA finals, right
the Spurs and then the New Jersey. That's the New
New Jersey didn't even have like a home base. People
in New York didn't care, and the ratings were bad,
Like it just the Senate Tonio is a small market.
(34:40):
I don't know that.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
I don't know what. I'm just saying that there is
no alternative.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
But I don't believe this is going to be a
ratings bonanza because of the sides of those markets.
Speaker 7 (34:49):
Oh, it's definitely not. It is definitely not going to
be a rating bonanza. You have two of the smallest
markets in the league. You're like, no, there's there won't
be people in LA and New York right up to
see this. You won't be see people in New York
lining up to see this game. All these bigger markets,
(35:09):
you definitely will not. You will get people from Oklahoma City,
oh yeah, people from Norman. You'll get people from the Midwest.
But no. So that's what makes it a snooze fest,
so to speak, is the rating. Then it won't be
a snooze fest by the rating. Yeah rating, some good basketball, yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
Hope it's gonna be some grasswa citiz perios. Right, It's
like it's like I acquate it to hip hop. We'll
talk further about that, but uh, I just think you
need a star and generally you would love to have seen.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
Are MVP I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
So then you have him go up against you know,
a Lebron led team or or a Warriors team against
the Pacers something like that, where you get the great
balance the upcoming versus the old hot guard. And that's
usually kind of how it goes. You get the old
guard and the new guys coming in making it.
Speaker 7 (35:55):
I know you think about it. Oh guards, they making it.
Old guards didn't either didn't make the player also got
eliminated in the first round because that's not on the
young stars that are actually advancing.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
Yep a d. We appreciate you as always, Madam, we'll
appreciate it.
Speaker 7 (36:11):
Thank you, my man for sure appreciated fellows
Hosts And Creators
kelvin washington
Rob Parker
Popular Podcasts
True Crime Tonight
If you eat, sleep, and breathe true crime, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT is serving up your nightly fix. Five nights a week, KT STUDIOS & iHEART RADIO invite listeners to pull up a seat for an unfiltered look at the biggest cases making headlines, celebrity scandals, and the trials everyone is watching. With a mix of expert analysis, hot takes, and listener call-ins, TRUE CRIME TONIGHT goes beyond the headlines to uncover the twists, turns, and unanswered questions that keep us all obsessed—because, at TRUE CRIME TONIGHT, there’s a seat for everyone. Whether breaking down crime scene forensics, scrutinizing serial killers, or debating the most binge-worthy true crime docs, True Crime Tonight is the fresh, fast-paced, and slightly addictive home for true crime lovers.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.