December 9, 2024 • 42 mins
Daniel Penny, the former U.S. marine who put a homeless man in a chokehold on the NYC subway after the man was acting “erratically,” was found not guilty of criminally negligent homicide.
We discussed the case and heard your reaction to the verdict.
Ask Alexa to play WBZ NewsRadio on #iHeartRadio and listen to NightSide with Dan Rea Weeknights From 8PM-12AM!
We discussed the case and heard your reaction to the verdict.
Ask Alexa to play WBZ NewsRadio on #iHeartRadio and listen to NightSide with Dan Rea Weeknights From 8PM-12AM!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's nice eyes.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Undoing Boston's news radio.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
So we're going to continue to talk about the arrest
of Luigi Menngioni. He has not yet been formally charged
with the murder of Brian Thompson. That will happen, I
assume shortly once he is brought back to New York
from the state of Pennsylvania. He is facing charges in
(00:28):
the state of Pennsylvania dealing with false ideas lying to police.
But he's being held without bail, so he's not going anywhere.
His life, for all intents and purposes, is over. I mean,
you talk about a case that is a solid case,
that is it now if you want to look at
(00:49):
the other side of the coin, and a pretty weak
case also dealing with a murder with a homicide, I
should say. In New York, Daniel Penny, former marine, was
acquitted in the death of Jordan Neely on that subway
confrontation a year and a half ago. It was on
May first, twenty twenty three when Neely, who is described
(01:14):
as a Michael Jackson impersonator. By the way, I guess
the gentleman did some sort of street dances Michael Jatt,
but not like he's some professional impersonator. I mean he
was a homeless person who had all sorts of mental
(01:37):
health issues, maybe compounded by a use of substances drugs,
gets on a subway car and threatens people, and this
ex marine who was twenty four years old at the time,
Daniel Penny, gets up and puts him in a brings
him to the ground, puts him in a chokehold, and
(01:57):
they struggle for a while as the train continues on
people trying to get off the train. Alvin Bragg, who
was the district attorney in Manhattan, who is not what
you call a lauren on a district attorney, made an
exception in this case and wanted to make an example
of Daniel Penny, and he backfired. The judge, upon a
(02:22):
motion of the defense on Friday, dismissed the more serious
charge of murder in the second degree. I believe that
was the charge. And then today the jury came back
they had they had been hung up on the more
(02:42):
serious charge. Today he was acquitted of what is in
effect in New York criminally negligent homicide, which would be
sort of a manslaughter conviction here. So there was the
ugly demonstrations outside the courtroom side the court house, I
actually say. But the demonstrations were pretty loud, and there
(03:04):
of course was reaction when it was over. When it
was over, this is the the lawyer for.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
This is this is Daniel penny Cut, number twenty two raw,
giving an account of how the incident transpired. This is
a little over a minute, but this is this is
penny Cut twenty two.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
The village in Manhattan. So I take the subway multiple
times a day. In this instance, I was coming from school.
I got out of class around two fifteen, and I
took the I was at j Street metro Tech, took
the uptown F train. At Second Avenue. A man came on,
stumbled on. He appeared to be on drugs. The doors
(03:54):
closed and he ripped his jacket off and violent and
threw it at the people sitting down to my left.
I was listening to music at the time and he
was yelling, so I took my headphones out to hear
what he was yelling. And the three main threats that
he repeated over and over was I'm gonna kill you,
I'm prepared to go to jail for life, and I'm
willing to die. You know, this is a This was
(04:16):
a scary situation, and mister really came on. He was
he was threatening. He's I'm six too, and he was
taller than me. So it was And there's a common
misconception that Marines don't get scared. We're actually taught one
of our core values is courage, and courage is not
the absence of fear, but how you handle fear. And
(04:37):
you know, I was scared for myself, but I looked around.
I saw women and children.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
He was yelling in.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
Their faces, saying, saying these threats. I couldn't just sit still.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
He went on and continued. I'm saying that the whole
incident took about five minutes cut twenty two a roup.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
Some people say that I was holding on to mister
really for fifteen This is not true. I mean between
stops is only a couple of minutes, so the whole
interaction less less and less than five minutes. Some people
say I was trying to choke him to death, which
is also not true. I was trying to restrain him.
You could see in the video there's a clear rise
and fall of his chest indicating that he's breathing. I'm
(05:19):
trying to restrain him from him being able to carry
out the threats. And then some people say that this
was about race, which is absolutely ridiculous. I didn't see
a black man threatening passengers. I saw a man threatening passengers.
It's a lot of whom were people of color. The
men who helped restrained mister Neely was a person of color.
(05:40):
And then a few days after the incident, I read
in the papers that a woman of color came out
and called me a hero.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
What.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
I don't believe that I'm a hero, but she was
one of those people that I was trying to protect.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
So this is the the Daniel Perry comment. Then one
final comment from him, and I believe this is cut
twenty two B. Please Rob. We were all scared.
Speaker 4 (06:08):
Mister Neely was yelling in these passengers' faces, and they
looked terrified. The reason why there was no video at
the start of the altercation was because people were too
afraid getting away from him and didn't The videos didn't
start until they saw that situation was under control. I
knew I had to act, and I acted in a
way that would protect the other passengers, protect myself, and
(06:31):
protect mister Neely. I used this hole to restrain him,
and I did this by leaving my hand on top
of his head to control his body. You could see
in the video there's a clear rise and fall of
his chest indicating that he was still breathing. And I'm
calibrating my grip based on the force that he's exerting.
And I just I mean, I was trying to keep
(06:53):
him on the ground until the police came. I was
praying that the police would come and take this situation,
take this situation. I didn't want to be put in
that situation, but I couldn't just sit still and let
him carry out these threats.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
To me, listening to him, it sounds like a reasonable story. Now.
The lawyer for Jordan Neely's family was outside of quote
after the verdict, issuing, but he calls a call to action.
(07:31):
Cup twenty Dante Mils.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
We have a call to action because you have to
do something with this anger and with this rage. Our
call to action is to take care of each other.
We can't rely on outside people. If we see someone
asking for food, we have to take the responsibility to
give it to him. If we see someone cold, to
(07:53):
give them a cold. If we see something someone going
through something to act them if they're okay, right on.
That's how we help each other, because we can't rely
on the system to do it for us. And clearly,
if we get to this point, it's too late. We
have to be there for each other. And that's our
(08:15):
call to action. Everybody that's pissed off at this verdict,
I challenge you to go outside today and help one
person right on. That's my challenge.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Well, there were other statements that were a little more provocative, understandably,
so I guess this is Jordan Neely's dad under a Zachary.
I do nothing about the Neely family, but his son
obviously was a person who was dealing with some serious issues,
(08:50):
and I can understand how he feels, but I disagree
with his conclusion Cut twenty one.
Speaker 6 (08:59):
I just want to say I missed my son. My
son didn't have to go through this. I didn't have
to go through this either. It hurts, really really hurts.
What are we going to do?
Speaker 3 (09:16):
People? What's gonna happen to us?
Speaker 7 (09:19):
Now?
Speaker 8 (09:23):
I had enough of This system is rigged? Come on, people,
the system is rigged. Alvin braggs the prosecutor in this case.
Lettissa James is the attorney general. Of New York in
(09:44):
this case, she did not have jurisdiction of the case.
But I don't understand that belief. Now, last sound bit,
and then we'll take a quick break and go to
phone calls. Daniel Penny and his lawyers celebrated his acquittal
understandably slow so because it's been a year and a
(10:05):
half and this is this is a snippet of this
celebration today. I guess it was around noontime. Cut number
twenty three is that they're at the bar.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Hey, how are you failing?
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (10:18):
Great, Yeah, it's fairly good.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
It's fairly good.
Speaker 10 (10:21):
It's so good.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
What's up? We're cut together? How's it going? How's it feel?
Its great?
Speaker 9 (10:29):
He's finally got the justice he's deserved.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Well, did you think it was going to happen?
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Sorry?
Speaker 9 (10:36):
Uh no, we think that this is uh should have happened,
probably on day one. But the point thing is it happened,
so we can't control the timing of it, but you
can certainly savor the outcome.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
I think some might see this as a George Floyd case.
I do not see it that way. I'd love to
know what your reaction is. Six A nine three one thirty.
We can talk about this case, the Daniel Petty case,
or we can talk about now the Luigi Mangione case.
One man is acquitted, walk free and we'll walk free.
Speaker 7 (11:12):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
The other arrested in Altoona, Pennsylvania. We'll probably see another
day of freedom for his entire life. Two lives impacted
in New York City. I think that both of them
were unnecessary. But I think justice was done for Daniel Penny,
and I hope justice will be done for Luigi MANGIONI.
(11:37):
We'll be back on night Side. That's get some phone
calls right after this.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Now back to Dan ray Line from the Window World
Nightside Studios on w b Z News Radio.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
It's go to call. It's gonna go to Robert in Wellesley.
Robert appreciate you calling in. How are you tonight, sir? Oh?
Speaker 11 (11:55):
Pretty good?
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Dan?
Speaker 11 (11:56):
Really a loaded topic topic you have the saving.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Well, it's an interesting topic because there's kind of two
sides of the same coin. I mean, in the one hand,
you have a guy who clearly fires a guy in
his back, I mean, cold blooded murder. And then in
this other situation that this guy who decides to act.
Let's assume I mean, you're on the subway and this happens.
What do you just sit there and let somebody you
(12:23):
know attack someone else. I mean, it's this guy's an
ex marine, he's twenty four years old. Yeah, he's in
physical condition to take control of the situation and the
ends up facing facing a homicide trial.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Yes, I agree here, And.
Speaker 11 (12:39):
I'm curious about your opinion as a as an attorney
for in future instances, could you suggest a useful procedure
to go through to make a citizens arrest, because that's
I think that the ex marine had good qualifications by
(13:01):
had good credentials as being a marine, because as you know,
the Navy automatically uses marines as part of its security force,
and he did use the wrestling hold as opposed to
a strike. I'm just wondering if you have an opinion
as to what could have been done to make it
clearer that I think he was effectively was making a
(13:23):
citizen's arrest. Would you agree with that?
Speaker 3 (13:26):
Well, he was. I don't know if he was making
a citizens arrest. I think he was trying to prevent
a bad situation from getting into a horrific situation there.
Apparently he was a mother there with a baby stroll
or a typical you know, New York subway riders. And
it's easy for people who have never rode on a
(13:48):
subway system to think, well, you know, you have to
put up with that stuff if you're on a subway system.
It's funny. I you know, as kids, I remember watching
Don k Notts or whatever, you know, and Andy Griffin
and citizens arrest and stuff like that. I don't even
know what a citizens arrest means. I mean, I think
that he was basically trying to stabilize the situation. Uh
(14:11):
so that people on that you know, you're you're you're
you're trapped, You're you're a subway car. You have nowhere
to go. You know, you maybe just hoping to get
to the next stop and get off. But this guy
gets on and he's really invective at a lot of people,
and he's telling him I'm ready to die, and I'm
ready to go to prison for life. I'm going to
(14:32):
kill you. I mean, what else does he have to
do to to get someone's attention. You know, we all
could be in that situation. I can't I commend Petty
for doing what he did. To be honest with you,
and maybe people were going to say, well, it's it's
horrible that, uh, that that mister Neely lost his life.
It is horrible, But this is not the same situation
(14:53):
as that Derek Chouvin George Floyd situation in Minneapolis, which
people have tried to make it out to be. He
was acting sa as a citizen, trying to protect others
who were probably more vulnerable than he. I'm sure if
it was a straight out fight, he could have dealt
with Neely in whatever way he needed to, because Deelis
Neely is under the influence of something. But again, everybody
(15:15):
tries to politicize Alvin Bragg the prosecutor. You know, I
can't wait till New York voters turn him out of office.
I mean, he's he's he He wanted to prosecute the
little guy at the bodego who defended himself and killed
killed a robber. It's like he wants to defend the
(15:36):
guilty and prosecute the innocent. That that's his that's his
practice as a district attorney.
Speaker 11 (15:44):
I think I wonder, well, yeah, thank you for your opinion.
And I also wonder if before putting the chokehold on
if he could have. He might have had the training
to do what something I can't think of a charm,
something like an intercession or intervention. And then if the if, if,
(16:06):
if the aggressor had made the mistake of winding a
blow which the marine could easily have defended, then that
would wouldn't that be a matter of assault and battery
and they could have acted on that procedure. What would
your opinion be on that?
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Well, you have a right to defend yourself, but you
also have a right to defend others. I mean, if
if somebody you know is walking down the street. There's
the old story, you know that this kind of a
little bit of a joke that said, well, well I
was I was watching and there were eight guys, young guys,
pretty tough guys, who were beating up a couple of nuns,
(16:40):
and the police guys says, well, why do you do something?
He said, Well, I didn't know who started the fight,
you know. I mean he did intuitively, which I think
most people who physically had the capacity to do that
would have done it. I mean maybe he could have
tried to reason with the guy, but maybe he felt
that this guy I was so whacked out he couldn't
(17:01):
reason with him, and maybe he figured the easiest thing
to do is to take him down, immobilize him, and
wait for the train to get to the next station.
I'm not going to second guess him and that set
of circumstances. I listened to him, you heard his sound bites.
He sounded to me to be a pretty rational guy.
I don't think he got on that train looking to
end up being indicted for in a homicide case. He
(17:22):
was trying to do the right thing. And what did
they say, no good de goos unpunished.
Speaker 11 (17:27):
Yes, of course.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
It should be the case. We live in a society
now where we're told, well, don't do this, don't do that.
You know there, you know there were times when all
of a sudden, you're presented with a situation where you
got to do something to help someone, and you know,
if you're going to sit there and be quiet. I
know I'm no hero, but I once used the Heimich
(17:54):
maneuver on a guy who was choking in a restaurant.
This is go this forty years ago, uh, And it
took me three tries with the Heimach maneuver to get
the guy to pop out the piece of chicken that
was that had had occluded his his windpipe, and nobody
(18:14):
else in that restaurant moved. As a matter of fact,
the moment the guy got up and started to hold
his throat and you could tell he couldn't make a noise,
the place went deadly silent. Now I could have sat
there and said, I'm not getting involved in this. I
don't know the guy. That's not what you're supposed to
do as a human being, in my opinion, but hey,
call me crazy.
Speaker 11 (18:34):
Good case in point, I.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Wish if I had been on that subway train, I
wish I would have had the same courage and capacity
that that that Daniel Penny had.
Speaker 11 (18:46):
I hope his attorney, his defense attorney or draw out
the fact it appears that he was placing himself between
the aggressor and the other people that were on the
on the train.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
No question, because once he takes the guy down offense, well,
once he takes the guy down, the guy's attention and
he doesn't know if the guy hasn't knie, if he
doesn't know that whatever, you know, he puts himself in
some foam of in some potential danger there. I'm sure
he was watching the guy's hands and where they were
and all of that. But I think the guy was
a hero, simple as that. And if you did, if
(19:18):
they disagreed, feel free to bring it on.
Speaker 11 (19:20):
Thank you, Robert, Thank you for you, thank you, bye bye,
you much.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
All right, take quick break here. Uh, let's light these
lines up. This is too good a topic to let
it go to waste. Folks have some courage, uh. He
Daniel Penny had the backbone to act. You should have
the courage to call. And if you disagree with me
and want to tell me that that that that that
that Penny Uh should have just sat there and shut
(19:43):
up and allowed this guy to do whatever he wanted
to do and scare the hell out of people. That's
fine too. Love there you make that argument back on
Night's Side, right after the news at the bottom of
the hour, It's.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Night Side, Foston's News Radio.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
All of a sudden, we have full line. So let's
go to Mike and Beverly first. Mike next on Nightside.
Gotta be quick for me. Mike and I got a
bunch of callers tonight.
Speaker 10 (20:09):
Go ahead, Mike, good Indian, how I am gonna get
Dan Perry Perry case grows you know that's she never
been brought before. Actually I find you know, he was
definitely innocent. And then we took Alvin Bryant ten days
I believe to finally uh go after uh after I'm
(20:32):
from political pressure on the outside, that meaning why he
did that, you know, and that way.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
We got a bad connection. Here, Mike, are you breathing
into the phone or is there someone standing next to
you breathing into the phone?
Speaker 10 (20:46):
No, I'm on, uh, I'm in my mike here.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
Yeah, I don't know. It was just I was hearing
like some heavy breathing there. Yeah. The guy's name is
Daniel Kenny. Yeah, and I agree with you. It was
very much a political prosecution. It took ten days for
Alvin Bragg to get really interested in the case. But
that's that's Alvin Bragg's style. He doesn't look at issues
(21:10):
from a legal point of view, from a prosecutorial point
of view. He looks upon these these situations in the
context of politics, and sadly, he looks at it, I
think from a racial point of view, which is what
every bad prosecutor the history of this country has done.
Back in the day of the of the South, the
(21:33):
white prosecutors used to prosecute black men for crimes. They
would not prosecute white men, for they looked at it
from a racist point of view. And Alvin Bragg is
the is the successor, the philosophical successor to the to
the racist prosecutors of the Deep South of the early
twentieth century.
Speaker 10 (21:54):
The guy was alive when the police showed up, so
he didn't kill him. You know, the guy was alive,
he was on and now yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Well again, we know how the case came out. So
it came out.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
At the end of the day.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
He got he got the acquittal. But it's time for
people in New York to say, hey, look, we want
prosecutors who will treat everybody equally before the law, and
we're not gonna go after some guy because he happens
to be white or black, depending upon the bias of
the prosecutor.
Speaker 10 (22:23):
Just I just don't know why they get to pull
the race guard with this situation, because there's a nott
and do with the race guard, you know, and why
I have to go that way, because I've had that
done on myself. But I'm going to do it now
and then so all.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Right, thanks Mike, appreciate your call.
Speaker 10 (22:39):
Thanks, good night, good night.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Let me go to Geene and met for Gene next
on nights. I go right ahead, Okay, let's put Gina
on hold. We'll come back to Gene and she's ready.
Everybody's got problems with their phone lines tonight. Don't get this.
Pete is in New York. Pete, how are you, sir?
Speaker 1 (22:56):
Good? Damn?
Speaker 3 (22:57):
How are you good? Let's get the New York perspective
in here, Pete Grette.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Right, let me tell you we have a serious problem
in New York. We have a progressive, liberal city council.
We have a progressive creep like this Alvin Berg. And
he's a Harvard graduate. Believe that now. But there's a
very serious.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
The guy, the guy arrested in by the way, look, look,
let me just say this. The guy arrested in Pennsylvania
today is a University of Pennsylvania graduate. I know. I mean, anyway,
not everybody who goes to Harvard or goes to penn
turns out to be, you know, a great person. Absolutely,
(23:40):
the unibomber Kazinski was a Harvard graduate. Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
So I'm eighty six. Now, if I were twenty years younger,
I would I would have a vigilante committee in New York.
The cops aren't allowed to do anything, or told me
that they don't pick the homeless up. They don't pick
the mental up because they take them to Bellevue. And
(24:09):
Congress sets medicaid so it only can take hey for
three days. You can't keep a mental patient in hospital
for three days. The well, you keep it for.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Three days, you're not going to have much more success.
But no, you're right, you're absolutely right. But it's not
time for vigilantes. You know what it's time for is
that for the people of New York to start to
turn out of office the people who should have never
been elected in the first place. It's as simple as that.
And it's going to be done in other cities as well.
It's got to be done in Chicago, it's going to
(24:44):
be done in Boston. We have a city councilor up here.
Who is the first. She came here illegally, I believe,
as a child, no fault of hers, and she uh
somehow has been legalized. She became the first member of
the Boston City Council to have come from I believe
(25:07):
it was a West African country. I'm not exactly sure.
She's just been indicted by the FEDS for bathing bonuses
bonuses to her staff and getting a kick. I mean,
you know, I don't know it would seem to be that.
I guess it's people, and it's I guess it's people
of all backgrounds. But but it just mean that if
(25:30):
you're the first of something, you know, you know, if
you're Jackie Robinson the baseball player, you know, you knew
that you had to set a standard that other that
would be impeccable that he did. I just look at
this now. I don't know, you know, she she enjoys
the presumption of innocence. She's been on my show. I'm
(25:50):
not particularly a big fan of hers. At the same time,
I think to myself, it's time for her to resign.
How could she effectively represent her constituent while she has
a federal indictment hanging over her head. But she's not
going to resign.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
You know, we need to get people to get involved.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
If I make look look, people will all the media
was surprised by the Donald Trump victory, and I don't
know how good a president he's going to be. I
know that he had big problems in his first term,
and I think he made some pretty poor judgments. At
the same time, he's the president. He starts with a
clean slate. Let's if he does well, I'll commend him.
(26:32):
Does badly, I'll criticize him.
Speaker 1 (26:36):
I'm with you. I'm praying that he can do some good.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
I would hope every president would do good, because guess what,
you and I only have one president right now. His
name is Joe Biden, whether you voted for him or not.
And on January twentieth, afternoon time, his name would be
Donald Trump. And I know that there are people who
who are going to try to frustrate him at every turn.
I thought he's had Look the fact that this guy
in Syria is out of the way Israel hit a
(27:04):
bunch of ISIS encampments that have been alloted to set
up in Syria. Things takes could be breaking in the
right direction. Maybe Putin's finally tied of Ukraine. Maybe we
can settle that war down. I mean, there is a
lot that could be done here, you know, in my opinion, So.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Did you hear that we have a base in Syria?
Speaker 3 (27:22):
Yes we do.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Yeah, I was shocked, but.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Yes we do. We kind of fact I think that
three of the of the US soldiers who were killed
by the Iranian missile last spring was at a base.
It's just inside the border of Syria. I think it's
on the Syria Iraq border, if I'm not mistaken. So yeah, yeah.
(27:47):
I have a good friend of mine who was a
US guard at the US embassy in Damascus earlier this century,
you know, fifteen, fifteen years ten or fifteen years ago.
You know, that's that's all. He's a marine and he
that was a tough spot to be in to guard
our embassy in Damascus. Big go, lets you run, thanks
(28:10):
for calling and call more off, and you sound great
about you.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
I will. I feel better, all right, Daniel Henry. There
were more black people on the train than white people.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
They usually is, yeah, yeah, so that's yeah. He was not.
He was not you know, defending you knows, with the
white Aryan brotherhood. Now, he was defending poor people who
were now being you know, we don't know how to
deal with mental illness, which is which is sad. But
this guy gets on the train and he starts threatening people.
(28:45):
I'm ready to die. I'm ready to kill everybody. I'm
willing to go to prison for life. That's pretty serious.
That'll shake you up. That's not like, hey, how about
those Yankees? They lost Soto and now the Mets have Soto.
I mean, that's not some guys starting the conversation on
the train, which you might want to ignore, but you know,
I mean you look at it. I said, yeah, too
bad for the Yankees. Man, you're a Mets fan, good
(29:07):
for you. But but this guy's coming on. I'm going
to kill people. I'm ready to die. I'm ready to
go to prison for life, take people that they weren't thanks, thanks,
beat and.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Heard his father. Oh yeah, that father the courthouse. His
father's a hustler. He didn't take care of his kid.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
I think, yeah, I would tend to agree with that, knowing,
not knowing the inner workings of that family, I'd be interesting.
Wasn't about it, but he was calling it wasn't was
calling for vigilantes today. So we don't need vigilantes. We
need Laura, we need law enforcement. That is fair. Hey,
I got to run, Pete. There's always be well, talk
(29:48):
to you soon. Good night, Shelton in Westwood, Shelton. Next
time nights.
Speaker 7 (29:52):
I welcome, Hey Dan, thank you. Interesting copt huh oh,
my pleasure. I don't call often, but uh, I just
had the time and thought I chime in on this one.
It's unfortunately both of those situations obviously lots of life
on both. In both cases, uh the common denominator and
one guy touched on it, you just did as well.
(30:13):
Mental illness. I think both of those cases rik of
mental illness. Mangione, you know, well educated, family's well to
do apparently, but something went, something went haywire somewhere. I'm
imagining that's what it seems like.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
I suspect you, right, I suspect you.
Speaker 7 (30:32):
Unless unless someone put him up to it. I have
no idea.
Speaker 10 (30:35):
We don't know.
Speaker 7 (30:36):
We'll find out, I'm sure, and that.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
That might mitigate his judgment, you know, if and when
he gets to the to the pearly gates of heaven.
But I don't think it's going to mitigate. But but
they how he should be treated.
Speaker 7 (30:49):
For the rest of his life not gonna help much.
But and also the other case, to forget all the
political stuff about whether the guy you know, I have
a special I have a uh an adult autistic son.
He's high functioning, but you know he'll he's not you
know he's never going to be fully independent, and it
always frightens me. He's almost forty now, you know that
(31:13):
I would get a call one day that uh, you know,
he's been accused of something, and and because not that
he would be accused of anything, but but that he
would have been harmed. I think we need more training
for people who law enforcement, particularly and we know there's
(31:34):
been some focus on that. There was a killing in
Boston a while back where the cops killed this especially
in these kids, young man, and.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 7 (31:47):
Well there was one in the South End as well,
but it probably has more than once, right anyway, Anyway,
perhaps the guy on the subway, if he had some
sort of training other than you know, uh, joke holds
or wrestling someone like de escalation and situations. Often those
people just need, you know, they say anything off the
(32:09):
top of their minds. I don't know how you know
much impact any drugs may have had on the on
the guy who was you know, who was choked. But
you know, sometimes if he didn't touch it, did he
did he physically harm anyone? People get on the train
and rant all the time. Come on, I used to
ride the Redline back and forth the work of the
Boston every day, and I saw all kinds of people
(32:30):
on the train. Used to be a guy that had
an aluminum goll cap on every day riding on the train.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
But I but let's assume let's assume that you're on
the train. Let's assume you're on the train and there's
other people on the train. And let's assume you're a
twenty four year old ex marine. Okay, I don't know
how old you are now, but you said you had
a forty year old son, so I assume but three
times that, right, yeah, right, exactly, yeah. And let's assume
(32:57):
someone gets on and apparently takes his jacket off, frozen
at some people and tells him today's the day he's
going to die, and they're going to die, and he
doesn't worry about dying or going to you. He's going
to kill people. Now, you could sit there and you
could say, you know, maybe he's just you know, he's
having a bad day, or you could take action. I
think in most cases like that, someone sometimes has to
(33:19):
take control of the situation. I think that's all Daniel
Penny did.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Exactly.
Speaker 7 (33:26):
Yes, he and he could only he could only he
could only utilize the skills that he had. Right he
didn't Maybe he didn't have uh training to de escalate
situations with would have been great.
Speaker 3 (33:39):
If there was a social work on there that could
have said said to mister Neely, now do you really
mean that you want to kill someone and we're just
enjoying a little train ride here?
Speaker 7 (33:51):
Wow, I don't think I don't think that would be
conven or why I don't I don't think. I don't
think he has been Well, you know, some time you
can say, hey, hey, buddy, Hey, what's going on?
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Man?
Speaker 7 (34:02):
Look, come here, let's talk. Let's you know your joke Shelton.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
The next time we're on a train. But next time
you and I are on a train together and something
like this happens in front of us, I'm going to
invite you to start the conversation and I'll be there
and back you walk, Okay.
Speaker 7 (34:19):
If I never if I never ride the subway again,
it'll be to the anyway with you. You have a
great nights. Thank you for taking my call. God bless
you have a wonderful Christmas and happy Year.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
You have a great Christmas if you celebrate Christmas and
I and also best of luck with your son. Please
say hi to them for us.
Speaker 7 (34:36):
Okay, thank you very much. Do you have a great night?
Speaker 3 (34:38):
Now, talk to you. So we'll take a break, coming
right back on Nightside.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
Nightside Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
Back to the phone we go. Let's go back to
see Jean. See if she is off the speakerphone. Jean,
welcome back. How are you.
Speaker 12 (34:57):
I'm good? How are you?
Speaker 3 (34:59):
We tried to get you before. My suspicion is you
might have been across the room in the speakerphone listening
on the speakerphone.
Speaker 12 (35:06):
I was walking through the door as I just left
MGM on landsdown Street. Maybe right next deal, We're.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Not as down street. That's okay. So what's your take
on either of both of these cases?
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Go right ahead, so you're gonna laugh.
Speaker 12 (35:24):
But I called you last week and I told you
what my thought was about this Tangione person. I said
to you, I said, I felt that he did what
he did because a significant other was refused some type
of medical care. We don't know yet really what the
whole deal is, but it's looking more and more like
(35:48):
that's uh, you know, a strong possibility.
Speaker 3 (35:52):
Yeah, I don't think you were the only person who
speculated on that. Clearly he went after the guy from
United Healthcare, maybe because he felt someone within his family
was wrong. The problem is this, I mean, let's assume,
you know, he killed this guy in cold blood, shot
(36:12):
him in the back. He's a coward. Then he fled.
What do you do with him now? In other words,
knowing that, let's assume that he had that his I
don't know his grandmother or his mother was denied a
drug that was potential. I don't know, we picked the
worst case scenario. How do you adjust You're not in
(36:34):
any way, shape or form, I.
Speaker 7 (36:35):
Know, justin correct, absolutely not.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Yeah, yeah, but you know what if you're on the jury,
how long do you keep this guy away for? By
the way, tonight, the Globe is now reporting that he
has been uh, he has been charged with murder, says.
Authorities arrested a suspect and charge him with murder Monday.
(36:59):
So he's already been charged now with murder. So this
is I thought they might bring him back to New
York last late Monday, Matt Manhattan prosecutors filed murder and
other charges against men. And you're only according to an
online courte so that's their source on that. So how
long should he spend in jail?
Speaker 12 (37:18):
I don't even know if Jill's really the answer. I mean,
if the guy's got serious mental illness, then what do
you do?
Speaker 3 (37:27):
How long should he be? Should he be should he
go into some sort of treatment center. I don't think
the guy ever sees the light of day, is what
I'm saying.
Speaker 12 (37:37):
I think the rest of his life, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
I mean, you know, you could say, well, forty years
from now, somehow they rehabilitate him. Look at John Hinckley,
who shot Ronald Reagan in nineteen eighty one in Washington, DC,
eventually was paroled from his life sentence.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
I mean, I don't think he was no weird gilitation
for this.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
The problem with this guy is if he had if
he had shot the guy in the leg and and
and maybe they found him to be insane, you know,
he would have faced assault and battery charges. But when
you take someone's life fifty years, a gentleman who's fifty
years of age, leaves a widow and two kids, I
don't think anything short of life sentence if there was
(38:22):
a death penalty, which is not available in New York.
That's the only other option. All right, gee, what are
you doing. You're making dinner as I'm talking to you.
Speaker 12 (38:31):
No, no, I'm just walking home, just getting getting in
the house, trying to get my legs out.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
All right, well, you got a busy agendas. A'll let
you run. Thanks, Gane. Appreciate your call. Thank you. Yeah,
good night. Let me go to Bill in New Jersey.
Bill in Jersey, your next Bill.
Speaker 13 (38:49):
Gorett ahead, thank you, Dan, I thank you for taking
my call. I appreciate your show. You have common sense.
Speaker 7 (38:57):
Uh.
Speaker 13 (38:58):
The problem I'm in Jersey. A lot of people here
commute to New York. Okay. The problem is mister Bragg
releases repeat dangerous offenders, criminals without bail, and most of
them go on, not surprisingly, to victimize more innocent people
(39:22):
because they are what they are. And you mentioned President
Trump something interesting. Well, he obviously doesn't believe in releasing
criminals without bail. I'd like to make one point, thank you.
You take just think of this the worst communist country
(39:42):
in the world. Okay, North Korea, you name whatever, I'll take.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
I don't North Korea might qualify for that, Go ahead.
Speaker 13 (39:51):
Thank you. They do not do two things. That Number one,
they don't release dangers risk criminals to which go on
who go on to victimize more innocent people. They don't
do that. And they don't confuse their school children as
to what gender they are, like elementary school children or
(40:16):
junior high Okay, just it's just food for thought. But
it's called comments.
Speaker 3 (40:22):
There's no suggestion. And that's related to this. I mean
this is this is a kid who was born with
the proverbial silver spoone in his mouth. Didn't appreciate who
are we talking about, MANNGIONI Oh, no, no.
Speaker 13 (40:37):
I was referring to the situation of the the subway
marine who helped out people were scared.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
And no, no, no, Well I think the submame. I
say that the marine, Daniel Penny is his name, did
the right thing and he may have saved innocent people
from being injured. Mister Neely died. But I don't think
there's any suggestion that I could have come back with
a guilty verdict. And I think it became a political
(41:10):
prosecution by the same pecuty you just mentioned. Yeah.
Speaker 13 (41:14):
Absolutely, I bet it's time.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
For people in New York to vote this this guy
out of office.
Speaker 13 (41:19):
Thank you, thank you. Unfortunately, from what I gathered, the
city council as also well, then.
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Vote them out to look Trump did better in New
York than anyone expected. Maybe finally voters in New York
are going to wake up. All right, I got to
run Bill, keep calling my show. Well, I need I
need callers like you. Thank you so much, thank you,
great night, good night. Now there's a caller calling right
now to help put that person on hold. It's about
(41:50):
fifteen seconds left of the show, Rob. We're done for
the night. Back tomorrow night. My name is Dan Ray.
I want to thank Rob. I want to thank Marita,
want to thank the callers and the listeners, and I
hope to get the listeners to become callers. All dogs,
all cats, all pets go to heaven. That's my pale
Charlie ray Is, who passed fourteen years ago in February.
Last February. So all your pets are a past. They
(42:11):
loved you and you love them. I do believe you'll
see them begin to see again tomorrow night. On Night's side,
have a safe and dry Tuesday. Everyone, good night,
It's nice eyes.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Undoing Boston's news radio.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
So we're going to continue to talk about the arrest
of Luigi Menngioni. He has not yet been formally charged
with the murder of Brian Thompson. That will happen, I
assume shortly once he is brought back to New York
from the state of Pennsylvania. He is facing charges in
(00:28):
the state of Pennsylvania dealing with false ideas lying to police.
But he's being held without bail, so he's not going anywhere.
His life, for all intents and purposes, is over. I mean,
you talk about a case that is a solid case,
that is it now if you want to look at
(00:49):
the other side of the coin, and a pretty weak
case also dealing with a murder with a homicide, I
should say. In New York, Daniel Penny, former marine, was
acquitted in the death of Jordan Neely on that subway
confrontation a year and a half ago. It was on
May first, twenty twenty three when Neely, who is described
(01:14):
as a Michael Jackson impersonator. By the way, I guess
the gentleman did some sort of street dances Michael Jatt,
but not like he's some professional impersonator. I mean he
was a homeless person who had all sorts of mental
(01:37):
health issues, maybe compounded by a use of substances drugs,
gets on a subway car and threatens people, and this
ex marine who was twenty four years old at the time,
Daniel Penny, gets up and puts him in a brings
him to the ground, puts him in a chokehold, and
(01:57):
they struggle for a while as the train continues on
people trying to get off the train. Alvin Bragg, who
was the district attorney in Manhattan, who is not what
you call a lauren on a district attorney, made an
exception in this case and wanted to make an example
of Daniel Penny, and he backfired. The judge, upon a
(02:22):
motion of the defense on Friday, dismissed the more serious
charge of murder in the second degree. I believe that
was the charge. And then today the jury came back
they had they had been hung up on the more
(02:42):
serious charge. Today he was acquitted of what is in
effect in New York criminally negligent homicide, which would be
sort of a manslaughter conviction here. So there was the
ugly demonstrations outside the courtroom side the court house, I
actually say. But the demonstrations were pretty loud, and there
(03:04):
of course was reaction when it was over. When it
was over, this is the the lawyer for.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
This is this is Daniel penny Cut, number twenty two raw,
giving an account of how the incident transpired. This is
a little over a minute, but this is this is
penny Cut twenty two.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
The village in Manhattan. So I take the subway multiple
times a day. In this instance, I was coming from school.
I got out of class around two fifteen, and I
took the I was at j Street metro Tech, took
the uptown F train. At Second Avenue. A man came on,
stumbled on. He appeared to be on drugs. The doors
(03:54):
closed and he ripped his jacket off and violent and
threw it at the people sitting down to my left.
I was listening to music at the time and he
was yelling, so I took my headphones out to hear
what he was yelling. And the three main threats that
he repeated over and over was I'm gonna kill you,
I'm prepared to go to jail for life, and I'm
willing to die. You know, this is a This was
(04:16):
a scary situation, and mister really came on. He was
he was threatening. He's I'm six too, and he was
taller than me. So it was And there's a common
misconception that Marines don't get scared. We're actually taught one
of our core values is courage, and courage is not
the absence of fear, but how you handle fear. And
(04:37):
you know, I was scared for myself, but I looked around.
I saw women and children.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
He was yelling in.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
Their faces, saying, saying these threats. I couldn't just sit still.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
He went on and continued. I'm saying that the whole
incident took about five minutes cut twenty two a roup.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
Some people say that I was holding on to mister
really for fifteen This is not true. I mean between
stops is only a couple of minutes, so the whole
interaction less less and less than five minutes. Some people
say I was trying to choke him to death, which
is also not true. I was trying to restrain him.
You could see in the video there's a clear rise
and fall of his chest indicating that he's breathing. I'm
(05:19):
trying to restrain him from him being able to carry
out the threats. And then some people say that this
was about race, which is absolutely ridiculous. I didn't see
a black man threatening passengers. I saw a man threatening passengers.
It's a lot of whom were people of color. The
men who helped restrained mister Neely was a person of color.
(05:40):
And then a few days after the incident, I read
in the papers that a woman of color came out
and called me a hero.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
What.
Speaker 4 (05:47):
I don't believe that I'm a hero, but she was
one of those people that I was trying to protect.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
So this is the the Daniel Perry comment. Then one
final comment from him, and I believe this is cut
twenty two B. Please Rob. We were all scared.
Speaker 4 (06:08):
Mister Neely was yelling in these passengers' faces, and they
looked terrified. The reason why there was no video at
the start of the altercation was because people were too
afraid getting away from him and didn't The videos didn't
start until they saw that situation was under control. I
knew I had to act, and I acted in a
way that would protect the other passengers, protect myself, and
(06:31):
protect mister Neely. I used this hole to restrain him,
and I did this by leaving my hand on top
of his head to control his body. You could see
in the video there's a clear rise and fall of
his chest indicating that he was still breathing. And I'm
calibrating my grip based on the force that he's exerting.
And I just I mean, I was trying to keep
(06:53):
him on the ground until the police came. I was
praying that the police would come and take this situation,
take this situation. I didn't want to be put in
that situation, but I couldn't just sit still and let
him carry out these threats.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
To me, listening to him, it sounds like a reasonable story. Now.
The lawyer for Jordan Neely's family was outside of quote
after the verdict, issuing, but he calls a call to action.
(07:31):
Cup twenty Dante Mils.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
We have a call to action because you have to
do something with this anger and with this rage. Our
call to action is to take care of each other.
We can't rely on outside people. If we see someone
asking for food, we have to take the responsibility to
give it to him. If we see someone cold, to
(07:53):
give them a cold. If we see something someone going
through something to act them if they're okay, right on.
That's how we help each other, because we can't rely
on the system to do it for us. And clearly,
if we get to this point, it's too late. We
have to be there for each other. And that's our
(08:15):
call to action. Everybody that's pissed off at this verdict,
I challenge you to go outside today and help one
person right on. That's my challenge.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Well, there were other statements that were a little more provocative, understandably,
so I guess this is Jordan Neely's dad under a Zachary.
I do nothing about the Neely family, but his son
obviously was a person who was dealing with some serious issues,
(08:50):
and I can understand how he feels, but I disagree
with his conclusion Cut twenty one.
Speaker 6 (08:59):
I just want to say I missed my son. My
son didn't have to go through this. I didn't have
to go through this either. It hurts, really really hurts.
What are we going to do?
Speaker 3 (09:16):
People? What's gonna happen to us?
Speaker 7 (09:19):
Now?
Speaker 8 (09:23):
I had enough of This system is rigged? Come on, people,
the system is rigged. Alvin braggs the prosecutor in this case.
Lettissa James is the attorney general. Of New York in
(09:44):
this case, she did not have jurisdiction of the case.
But I don't understand that belief. Now, last sound bit,
and then we'll take a quick break and go to
phone calls. Daniel Penny and his lawyers celebrated his acquittal
understandably slow so because it's been a year and a
(10:05):
half and this is this is a snippet of this
celebration today. I guess it was around noontime. Cut number
twenty three is that they're at the bar.
Speaker 3 (10:17):
Hey, how are you failing?
Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (10:18):
Great, Yeah, it's fairly good.
Speaker 3 (10:20):
It's fairly good.
Speaker 10 (10:21):
It's so good.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
What's up? We're cut together? How's it going? How's it feel?
Its great?
Speaker 9 (10:29):
He's finally got the justice he's deserved.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Well, did you think it was going to happen?
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Sorry?
Speaker 9 (10:36):
Uh no, we think that this is uh should have happened,
probably on day one. But the point thing is it happened,
so we can't control the timing of it, but you
can certainly savor the outcome.
Speaker 3 (10:51):
I think some might see this as a George Floyd case.
I do not see it that way. I'd love to
know what your reaction is. Six A nine three one thirty.
We can talk about this case, the Daniel Petty case,
or we can talk about now the Luigi Mangione case.
One man is acquitted, walk free and we'll walk free.
Speaker 7 (11:12):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
The other arrested in Altoona, Pennsylvania. We'll probably see another
day of freedom for his entire life. Two lives impacted
in New York City. I think that both of them
were unnecessary. But I think justice was done for Daniel Penny,
and I hope justice will be done for Luigi MANGIONI.
(11:37):
We'll be back on night Side. That's get some phone
calls right after this.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Now back to Dan ray Line from the Window World
Nightside Studios on w b Z News Radio.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
It's go to call. It's gonna go to Robert in Wellesley.
Robert appreciate you calling in. How are you tonight, sir? Oh?
Speaker 11 (11:55):
Pretty good?
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Dan?
Speaker 11 (11:56):
Really a loaded topic topic you have the saving.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Well, it's an interesting topic because there's kind of two
sides of the same coin. I mean, in the one hand,
you have a guy who clearly fires a guy in
his back, I mean, cold blooded murder. And then in
this other situation that this guy who decides to act.
Let's assume I mean, you're on the subway and this happens.
What do you just sit there and let somebody you
(12:23):
know attack someone else. I mean, it's this guy's an
ex marine, he's twenty four years old. Yeah, he's in
physical condition to take control of the situation and the
ends up facing facing a homicide trial.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Yes, I agree here, And.
Speaker 11 (12:39):
I'm curious about your opinion as a as an attorney
for in future instances, could you suggest a useful procedure
to go through to make a citizens arrest, because that's
I think that the ex marine had good qualifications by
(13:01):
had good credentials as being a marine, because as you know,
the Navy automatically uses marines as part of its security force,
and he did use the wrestling hold as opposed to
a strike. I'm just wondering if you have an opinion
as to what could have been done to make it
clearer that I think he was effectively was making a
(13:23):
citizen's arrest. Would you agree with that?
Speaker 3 (13:26):
Well, he was. I don't know if he was making
a citizens arrest. I think he was trying to prevent
a bad situation from getting into a horrific situation there.
Apparently he was a mother there with a baby stroll
or a typical you know, New York subway riders. And
it's easy for people who have never rode on a
(13:48):
subway system to think, well, you know, you have to
put up with that stuff if you're on a subway system.
It's funny. I you know, as kids, I remember watching
Don k Notts or whatever, you know, and Andy Griffin
and citizens arrest and stuff like that. I don't even
know what a citizens arrest means. I mean, I think
that he was basically trying to stabilize the situation. Uh
(14:11):
so that people on that you know, you're you're you're
you're trapped, You're you're a subway car. You have nowhere
to go. You know, you maybe just hoping to get
to the next stop and get off. But this guy
gets on and he's really invective at a lot of people,
and he's telling him I'm ready to die, and I'm
ready to go to prison for life. I'm going to
(14:32):
kill you. I mean, what else does he have to
do to to get someone's attention. You know, we all
could be in that situation. I can't I commend Petty
for doing what he did. To be honest with you,
and maybe people were going to say, well, it's it's
horrible that, uh, that that mister Neely lost his life.
It is horrible, But this is not the same situation
(14:53):
as that Derek Chouvin George Floyd situation in Minneapolis, which
people have tried to make it out to be. He
was acting sa as a citizen, trying to protect others
who were probably more vulnerable than he. I'm sure if
it was a straight out fight, he could have dealt
with Neely in whatever way he needed to, because Deelis
Neely is under the influence of something. But again, everybody
(15:15):
tries to politicize Alvin Bragg the prosecutor. You know, I
can't wait till New York voters turn him out of office.
I mean, he's he's he He wanted to prosecute the
little guy at the bodego who defended himself and killed
killed a robber. It's like he wants to defend the
(15:36):
guilty and prosecute the innocent. That that's his that's his
practice as a district attorney.
Speaker 11 (15:44):
I think I wonder, well, yeah, thank you for your opinion.
And I also wonder if before putting the chokehold on
if he could have. He might have had the training
to do what something I can't think of a charm,
something like an intercession or intervention. And then if the if, if,
(16:06):
if the aggressor had made the mistake of winding a
blow which the marine could easily have defended, then that
would wouldn't that be a matter of assault and battery
and they could have acted on that procedure. What would
your opinion be on that?
Speaker 3 (16:19):
Well, you have a right to defend yourself, but you
also have a right to defend others. I mean, if
if somebody you know is walking down the street. There's
the old story, you know that this kind of a
little bit of a joke that said, well, well I
was I was watching and there were eight guys, young guys,
pretty tough guys, who were beating up a couple of nuns,
(16:40):
and the police guys says, well, why do you do something?
He said, Well, I didn't know who started the fight,
you know. I mean he did intuitively, which I think
most people who physically had the capacity to do that
would have done it. I mean maybe he could have
tried to reason with the guy, but maybe he felt
that this guy I was so whacked out he couldn't
(17:01):
reason with him, and maybe he figured the easiest thing
to do is to take him down, immobilize him, and
wait for the train to get to the next station.
I'm not going to second guess him and that set
of circumstances. I listened to him, you heard his sound bites.
He sounded to me to be a pretty rational guy.
I don't think he got on that train looking to
end up being indicted for in a homicide case. He
(17:22):
was trying to do the right thing. And what did
they say, no good de goos unpunished.
Speaker 11 (17:27):
Yes, of course.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
It should be the case. We live in a society
now where we're told, well, don't do this, don't do that.
You know there, you know there were times when all
of a sudden, you're presented with a situation where you
got to do something to help someone, and you know,
if you're going to sit there and be quiet. I
know I'm no hero, but I once used the Heimich
(17:54):
maneuver on a guy who was choking in a restaurant.
This is go this forty years ago, uh, And it
took me three tries with the Heimach maneuver to get
the guy to pop out the piece of chicken that
was that had had occluded his his windpipe, and nobody
(18:14):
else in that restaurant moved. As a matter of fact,
the moment the guy got up and started to hold
his throat and you could tell he couldn't make a noise,
the place went deadly silent. Now I could have sat
there and said, I'm not getting involved in this. I
don't know the guy. That's not what you're supposed to
do as a human being, in my opinion, but hey,
call me crazy.
Speaker 11 (18:34):
Good case in point, I.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Wish if I had been on that subway train, I
wish I would have had the same courage and capacity
that that that Daniel Penny had.
Speaker 11 (18:46):
I hope his attorney, his defense attorney or draw out
the fact it appears that he was placing himself between
the aggressor and the other people that were on the
on the train.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
No question, because once he takes the guy down offense, well,
once he takes the guy down, the guy's attention and
he doesn't know if the guy hasn't knie, if he
doesn't know that whatever, you know, he puts himself in
some foam of in some potential danger there. I'm sure
he was watching the guy's hands and where they were
and all of that. But I think the guy was
a hero, simple as that. And if you did, if
(19:18):
they disagreed, feel free to bring it on.
Speaker 11 (19:20):
Thank you, Robert, Thank you for you, thank you, bye bye,
you much.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
All right, take quick break here. Uh, let's light these
lines up. This is too good a topic to let
it go to waste. Folks have some courage, uh. He
Daniel Penny had the backbone to act. You should have
the courage to call. And if you disagree with me
and want to tell me that that that that that
that Penny Uh should have just sat there and shut
(19:43):
up and allowed this guy to do whatever he wanted
to do and scare the hell out of people. That's
fine too. Love there you make that argument back on
Night's Side, right after the news at the bottom of
the hour, It's.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Night Side, Foston's News Radio.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
All of a sudden, we have full line. So let's
go to Mike and Beverly first. Mike next on Nightside.
Gotta be quick for me. Mike and I got a
bunch of callers tonight.
Speaker 10 (20:09):
Go ahead, Mike, good Indian, how I am gonna get
Dan Perry Perry case grows you know that's she never
been brought before. Actually I find you know, he was
definitely innocent. And then we took Alvin Bryant ten days
I believe to finally uh go after uh after I'm
(20:32):
from political pressure on the outside, that meaning why he
did that, you know, and that way.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
We got a bad connection. Here, Mike, are you breathing
into the phone or is there someone standing next to
you breathing into the phone?
Speaker 10 (20:46):
No, I'm on, uh, I'm in my mike here.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
Yeah, I don't know. It was just I was hearing
like some heavy breathing there. Yeah. The guy's name is
Daniel Kenny. Yeah, and I agree with you. It was
very much a political prosecution. It took ten days for
Alvin Bragg to get really interested in the case. But
that's that's Alvin Bragg's style. He doesn't look at issues
(21:10):
from a legal point of view, from a prosecutorial point
of view. He looks upon these these situations in the
context of politics, and sadly, he looks at it, I
think from a racial point of view, which is what
every bad prosecutor the history of this country has done.
Back in the day of the of the South, the
(21:33):
white prosecutors used to prosecute black men for crimes. They
would not prosecute white men, for they looked at it
from a racist point of view. And Alvin Bragg is
the is the successor, the philosophical successor to the to
the racist prosecutors of the Deep South of the early
twentieth century.
Speaker 10 (21:54):
The guy was alive when the police showed up, so
he didn't kill him. You know, the guy was alive,
he was on and now yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Well again, we know how the case came out. So
it came out.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
At the end of the day.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
He got he got the acquittal. But it's time for
people in New York to say, hey, look, we want
prosecutors who will treat everybody equally before the law, and
we're not gonna go after some guy because he happens
to be white or black, depending upon the bias of
the prosecutor.
Speaker 10 (22:23):
Just I just don't know why they get to pull
the race guard with this situation, because there's a nott
and do with the race guard, you know, and why
I have to go that way, because I've had that
done on myself. But I'm going to do it now
and then so all.
Speaker 3 (22:37):
Right, thanks Mike, appreciate your call.
Speaker 10 (22:39):
Thanks, good night, good night.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
Let me go to Geene and met for Gene next
on nights. I go right ahead, Okay, let's put Gina
on hold. We'll come back to Gene and she's ready.
Everybody's got problems with their phone lines tonight. Don't get this.
Pete is in New York. Pete, how are you, sir?
Speaker 1 (22:56):
Good? Damn?
Speaker 3 (22:57):
How are you good? Let's get the New York perspective
in here, Pete Grette.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
Right, let me tell you we have a serious problem
in New York. We have a progressive, liberal city council.
We have a progressive creep like this Alvin Berg. And
he's a Harvard graduate. Believe that now. But there's a
very serious.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
The guy, the guy arrested in by the way, look, look,
let me just say this. The guy arrested in Pennsylvania
today is a University of Pennsylvania graduate. I know. I mean, anyway,
not everybody who goes to Harvard or goes to penn
turns out to be, you know, a great person. Absolutely,
(23:40):
the unibomber Kazinski was a Harvard graduate. Yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
So I'm eighty six. Now, if I were twenty years younger,
I would I would have a vigilante committee in New York.
The cops aren't allowed to do anything, or told me
that they don't pick the homeless up. They don't pick
the mental up because they take them to Bellevue. And
(24:09):
Congress sets medicaid so it only can take hey for
three days. You can't keep a mental patient in hospital
for three days. The well, you keep it for.
Speaker 3 (24:23):
Three days, you're not going to have much more success.
But no, you're right, you're absolutely right. But it's not
time for vigilantes. You know what it's time for is
that for the people of New York to start to
turn out of office the people who should have never
been elected in the first place. It's as simple as that.
And it's going to be done in other cities as well.
It's got to be done in Chicago, it's going to
(24:44):
be done in Boston. We have a city councilor up here.
Who is the first. She came here illegally, I believe,
as a child, no fault of hers, and she uh
somehow has been legalized. She became the first member of
the Boston City Council to have come from I believe
(25:07):
it was a West African country. I'm not exactly sure.
She's just been indicted by the FEDS for bathing bonuses
bonuses to her staff and getting a kick. I mean,
you know, I don't know it would seem to be that.
I guess it's people, and it's I guess it's people
of all backgrounds. But but it just mean that if
(25:30):
you're the first of something, you know, you know, if
you're Jackie Robinson the baseball player, you know, you knew
that you had to set a standard that other that
would be impeccable that he did. I just look at
this now. I don't know, you know, she she enjoys
the presumption of innocence. She's been on my show. I'm
(25:50):
not particularly a big fan of hers. At the same time,
I think to myself, it's time for her to resign.
How could she effectively represent her constituent while she has
a federal indictment hanging over her head. But she's not
going to resign.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
You know, we need to get people to get involved.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
If I make look look, people will all the media
was surprised by the Donald Trump victory, and I don't
know how good a president he's going to be. I
know that he had big problems in his first term,
and I think he made some pretty poor judgments. At
the same time, he's the president. He starts with a
clean slate. Let's if he does well, I'll commend him.
(26:32):
Does badly, I'll criticize him.
Speaker 1 (26:36):
I'm with you. I'm praying that he can do some good.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
I would hope every president would do good, because guess what,
you and I only have one president right now. His
name is Joe Biden, whether you voted for him or not.
And on January twentieth, afternoon time, his name would be
Donald Trump. And I know that there are people who
who are going to try to frustrate him at every turn.
I thought he's had Look the fact that this guy
in Syria is out of the way Israel hit a
(27:04):
bunch of ISIS encampments that have been alloted to set
up in Syria. Things takes could be breaking in the
right direction. Maybe Putin's finally tied of Ukraine. Maybe we
can settle that war down. I mean, there is a
lot that could be done here, you know, in my opinion, So.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
Did you hear that we have a base in Syria?
Speaker 3 (27:22):
Yes we do.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Yeah, I was shocked, but.
Speaker 3 (27:27):
Yes we do. We kind of fact I think that
three of the of the US soldiers who were killed
by the Iranian missile last spring was at a base.
It's just inside the border of Syria. I think it's
on the Syria Iraq border, if I'm not mistaken. So yeah, yeah.
(27:47):
I have a good friend of mine who was a
US guard at the US embassy in Damascus earlier this century,
you know, fifteen, fifteen years ten or fifteen years ago.
You know, that's that's all. He's a marine and he
that was a tough spot to be in to guard
our embassy in Damascus. Big go, lets you run, thanks
(28:10):
for calling and call more off, and you sound great
about you.
Speaker 1 (28:12):
I will. I feel better, all right, Daniel Henry. There
were more black people on the train than white people.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
They usually is, yeah, yeah, so that's yeah. He was not.
He was not you know, defending you knows, with the
white Aryan brotherhood. Now, he was defending poor people who
were now being you know, we don't know how to
deal with mental illness, which is which is sad. But
this guy gets on the train and he starts threatening people.
(28:45):
I'm ready to die. I'm ready to kill everybody. I'm
willing to go to prison for life. That's pretty serious.
That'll shake you up. That's not like, hey, how about
those Yankees? They lost Soto and now the Mets have Soto.
I mean, that's not some guys starting the conversation on
the train, which you might want to ignore, but you know,
I mean you look at it. I said, yeah, too
bad for the Yankees. Man, you're a Mets fan, good
(29:07):
for you. But but this guy's coming on. I'm going
to kill people. I'm ready to die. I'm ready to
go to prison for life, take people that they weren't thanks, thanks,
beat and.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Heard his father. Oh yeah, that father the courthouse. His
father's a hustler. He didn't take care of his kid.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
I think, yeah, I would tend to agree with that, knowing,
not knowing the inner workings of that family, I'd be interesting.
Wasn't about it, but he was calling it wasn't was
calling for vigilantes today. So we don't need vigilantes. We
need Laura, we need law enforcement. That is fair. Hey,
I got to run, Pete. There's always be well, talk
(29:48):
to you soon. Good night, Shelton in Westwood, Shelton. Next
time nights.
Speaker 7 (29:52):
I welcome, Hey Dan, thank you. Interesting copt huh oh,
my pleasure. I don't call often, but uh, I just
had the time and thought I chime in on this one.
It's unfortunately both of those situations obviously lots of life
on both. In both cases, uh the common denominator and
one guy touched on it, you just did as well.
(30:13):
Mental illness. I think both of those cases rik of
mental illness. Mangione, you know, well educated, family's well to
do apparently, but something went, something went haywire somewhere. I'm
imagining that's what it seems like.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
I suspect you, right, I suspect you.
Speaker 7 (30:32):
Unless unless someone put him up to it. I have
no idea.
Speaker 10 (30:35):
We don't know.
Speaker 7 (30:36):
We'll find out, I'm sure, and that.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
That might mitigate his judgment, you know, if and when
he gets to the to the pearly gates of heaven.
But I don't think it's going to mitigate. But but
they how he should be treated.
Speaker 7 (30:49):
For the rest of his life not gonna help much.
But and also the other case, to forget all the
political stuff about whether the guy you know, I have
a special I have a uh an adult autistic son.
He's high functioning, but you know he'll he's not you
know he's never going to be fully independent, and it
always frightens me. He's almost forty now, you know that
(31:13):
I would get a call one day that uh, you know,
he's been accused of something, and and because not that
he would be accused of anything, but but that he
would have been harmed. I think we need more training
for people who law enforcement, particularly and we know there's
(31:34):
been some focus on that. There was a killing in
Boston a while back where the cops killed this especially
in these kids, young man, and.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
If I'm not mistaken.
Speaker 7 (31:47):
Well there was one in the South End as well,
but it probably has more than once, right anyway, Anyway,
perhaps the guy on the subway, if he had some
sort of training other than you know, uh, joke holds
or wrestling someone like de escalation and situations. Often those
people just need, you know, they say anything off the
(32:09):
top of their minds. I don't know how you know
much impact any drugs may have had on the on
the guy who was you know, who was choked. But
you know, sometimes if he didn't touch it, did he
did he physically harm anyone? People get on the train
and rant all the time. Come on, I used to
ride the Redline back and forth the work of the
Boston every day, and I saw all kinds of people
(32:30):
on the train. Used to be a guy that had
an aluminum goll cap on every day riding on the train.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
But I but let's assume let's assume that you're on
the train. Let's assume you're on the train and there's
other people on the train. And let's assume you're a
twenty four year old ex marine. Okay, I don't know
how old you are now, but you said you had
a forty year old son, so I assume but three
times that, right, yeah, right, exactly, yeah. And let's assume
(32:57):
someone gets on and apparently takes his jacket off, frozen
at some people and tells him today's the day he's
going to die, and they're going to die, and he
doesn't worry about dying or going to you. He's going
to kill people. Now, you could sit there and you
could say, you know, maybe he's just you know, he's
having a bad day, or you could take action. I
think in most cases like that, someone sometimes has to
(33:19):
take control of the situation. I think that's all Daniel
Penny did.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Exactly.
Speaker 7 (33:26):
Yes, he and he could only he could only he
could only utilize the skills that he had. Right he
didn't Maybe he didn't have uh training to de escalate
situations with would have been great.
Speaker 3 (33:39):
If there was a social work on there that could
have said said to mister Neely, now do you really
mean that you want to kill someone and we're just
enjoying a little train ride here?
Speaker 7 (33:51):
Wow, I don't think I don't think that would be
conven or why I don't I don't think. I don't
think he has been Well, you know, some time you
can say, hey, hey, buddy, Hey, what's going on?
Speaker 1 (34:02):
Man?
Speaker 7 (34:02):
Look, come here, let's talk. Let's you know your joke Shelton.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
The next time we're on a train. But next time
you and I are on a train together and something
like this happens in front of us, I'm going to
invite you to start the conversation and I'll be there
and back you walk, Okay.
Speaker 7 (34:19):
If I never if I never ride the subway again,
it'll be to the anyway with you. You have a
great nights. Thank you for taking my call. God bless
you have a wonderful Christmas and happy Year.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
You have a great Christmas if you celebrate Christmas and
I and also best of luck with your son. Please
say hi to them for us.
Speaker 7 (34:36):
Okay, thank you very much. Do you have a great night?
Speaker 3 (34:38):
Now, talk to you. So we'll take a break, coming
right back on Nightside.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World
Nightside Studios on WBZ News Radio.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
Back to the phone we go. Let's go back to
see Jean. See if she is off the speakerphone. Jean,
welcome back. How are you.
Speaker 12 (34:57):
I'm good? How are you?
Speaker 3 (34:59):
We tried to get you before. My suspicion is you
might have been across the room in the speakerphone listening
on the speakerphone.
Speaker 12 (35:06):
I was walking through the door as I just left
MGM on landsdown Street. Maybe right next deal, We're.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Not as down street. That's okay. So what's your take
on either of both of these cases?
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Go right ahead, so you're gonna laugh.
Speaker 12 (35:24):
But I called you last week and I told you
what my thought was about this Tangione person. I said
to you, I said, I felt that he did what
he did because a significant other was refused some type
of medical care. We don't know yet really what the
whole deal is, but it's looking more and more like
(35:48):
that's uh, you know, a strong possibility.
Speaker 3 (35:52):
Yeah, I don't think you were the only person who
speculated on that. Clearly he went after the guy from
United Healthcare, maybe because he felt someone within his family
was wrong. The problem is this, I mean, let's assume,
you know, he killed this guy in cold blood, shot
(36:12):
him in the back. He's a coward. Then he fled.
What do you do with him now? In other words,
knowing that, let's assume that he had that his I
don't know his grandmother or his mother was denied a
drug that was potential. I don't know, we picked the
worst case scenario. How do you adjust You're not in
(36:34):
any way, shape or form, I.
Speaker 7 (36:35):
Know, justin correct, absolutely not.
Speaker 3 (36:39):
Yeah, yeah, but you know what if you're on the jury,
how long do you keep this guy away for? By
the way, tonight, the Globe is now reporting that he
has been uh, he has been charged with murder, says.
Authorities arrested a suspect and charge him with murder Monday.
(36:59):
So he's already been charged now with murder. So this
is I thought they might bring him back to New
York last late Monday, Matt Manhattan prosecutors filed murder and
other charges against men. And you're only according to an
online courte so that's their source on that. So how
long should he spend in jail?
Speaker 12 (37:18):
I don't even know if Jill's really the answer. I mean,
if the guy's got serious mental illness, then what do
you do?
Speaker 3 (37:27):
How long should he be? Should he be should he
go into some sort of treatment center. I don't think
the guy ever sees the light of day, is what
I'm saying.
Speaker 12 (37:37):
I think the rest of his life, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
I mean, you know, you could say, well, forty years
from now, somehow they rehabilitate him. Look at John Hinckley,
who shot Ronald Reagan in nineteen eighty one in Washington, DC,
eventually was paroled from his life sentence.
Speaker 1 (37:56):
I mean, I don't think he was no weird gilitation
for this.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
The problem with this guy is if he had if
he had shot the guy in the leg and and
and maybe they found him to be insane, you know,
he would have faced assault and battery charges. But when
you take someone's life fifty years, a gentleman who's fifty
years of age, leaves a widow and two kids, I
don't think anything short of life sentence if there was
(38:22):
a death penalty, which is not available in New York.
That's the only other option. All right, gee, what are
you doing. You're making dinner as I'm talking to you.
Speaker 12 (38:31):
No, no, I'm just walking home, just getting getting in
the house, trying to get my legs out.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
All right, well, you got a busy agendas. A'll let
you run. Thanks, Gane. Appreciate your call. Thank you. Yeah,
good night. Let me go to Bill in New Jersey.
Bill in Jersey, your next Bill.
Speaker 13 (38:49):
Gorett ahead, thank you, Dan, I thank you for taking
my call. I appreciate your show. You have common sense.
Speaker 7 (38:57):
Uh.
Speaker 13 (38:58):
The problem I'm in Jersey. A lot of people here
commute to New York. Okay. The problem is mister Bragg
releases repeat dangerous offenders, criminals without bail, and most of
them go on, not surprisingly, to victimize more innocent people
(39:22):
because they are what they are. And you mentioned President
Trump something interesting. Well, he obviously doesn't believe in releasing
criminals without bail. I'd like to make one point, thank you.
You take just think of this the worst communist country
(39:42):
in the world. Okay, North Korea, you name whatever, I'll take.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
I don't North Korea might qualify for that, Go ahead.
Speaker 13 (39:51):
Thank you. They do not do two things. That Number one,
they don't release dangers risk criminals to which go on
who go on to victimize more innocent people. They don't
do that. And they don't confuse their school children as
to what gender they are, like elementary school children or
(40:16):
junior high Okay, just it's just food for thought. But
it's called comments.
Speaker 3 (40:22):
There's no suggestion. And that's related to this. I mean
this is this is a kid who was born with
the proverbial silver spoone in his mouth. Didn't appreciate who
are we talking about, MANNGIONI Oh, no, no.
Speaker 13 (40:37):
I was referring to the situation of the the subway
marine who helped out people were scared.
Speaker 3 (40:48):
And no, no, no, Well I think the submame. I
say that the marine, Daniel Penny is his name, did
the right thing and he may have saved innocent people
from being injured. Mister Neely died. But I don't think
there's any suggestion that I could have come back with
a guilty verdict. And I think it became a political
(41:10):
prosecution by the same pecuty you just mentioned. Yeah.
Speaker 13 (41:14):
Absolutely, I bet it's time.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
For people in New York to vote this this guy
out of office.
Speaker 13 (41:19):
Thank you, thank you. Unfortunately, from what I gathered, the
city council as also well, then.
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Vote them out to look Trump did better in New
York than anyone expected. Maybe finally voters in New York
are going to wake up. All right, I got to
run Bill, keep calling my show. Well, I need I
need callers like you. Thank you so much, thank you,
great night, good night. Now there's a caller calling right
now to help put that person on hold. It's about
(41:50):
fifteen seconds left of the show, Rob. We're done for
the night. Back tomorrow night. My name is Dan Ray.
I want to thank Rob. I want to thank Marita,
want to thank the callers and the listeners, and I
hope to get the listeners to become callers. All dogs,
all cats, all pets go to heaven. That's my pale
Charlie ray Is, who passed fourteen years ago in February.
Last February. So all your pets are a past. They
(42:11):
loved you and you love them. I do believe you'll
see them begin to see again tomorrow night. On Night's side,
have a safe and dry Tuesday. Everyone, good night,
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