October 23, 2025 • 40 mins
The FBI unearthed a historic illegal sports betting scheme and rigged poker games Thursday, involving 4 NBA teams and 4 Mafia crime families that reportedly made $7 million over a 2-year period. Portland Trail Blazers head coach Chauncey Billups, Miami Heat guard Terry Rozier and former NBA player Damon Jones are among those caught up in the scheme, who have been indicted. We discussed all the details involving this bombshell gambling bust!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
It's nice eyes with Dan Ray. I'm telling you Boston's
Meat Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
All right, let's step back to the calls. We are
talking about the NBA sports betting and gambling scandal, and
many of these type cases are pretty difficult to follow.
You read the indictment and you got to read it
to it. This was laid out very clearly today by
(00:27):
the head of the FBI and also by the US
attorney in New York. And this this is the This
is the assistant FBI director. This US Attorney for New York,
Joseph Nocella, Junior rob Please play thirty five A for
those who are just joining us.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
The off site operator sent the information via cell phone
back to a co conspirator at the table, and that
person at the table was known as the quarterback. The
quarterback then signaled secretly the information he had received from
others to others at the table, and together they used
(01:12):
that information in order to win their games and.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
To cheat the victims.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Defendants used other cheating technologies, such as poker chip tray analyzers,
which is a poker chip tray that secretly reads cards
using a hidden camera, special contact lenses or eyeglasses that
could read pre marked cards and an X ray table
that could read cards face down on the table.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Let me tell you this is how the the poker
games were rigged. So there were people who were looking
to be able to say they were in a high
stake poker game with an NBA player. I believe that, uh,
the NBA player Jones was involved in that. Uh he
(02:06):
was involved, I guess in both things. But Chauncey Billups
was I guess the lead in the in the in
the poker game. So basically, these wealthy individuals were Williams
being led to a slaughter. You know. Look, you go
to anywhere a casino and you assume the things are
on the level. Obviously the house has an advantage or
(02:28):
they're going to go out of business. But WHOA. Let
me go back to the calls here if you'd like
to join the conversation. I'm stunned by the the level here.
I just think it's breathtaking. And I the only lines
we have open right now were six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty. Let me go to Michael. Michael, not sure
what was going on with your phone before, but hopefully
(02:48):
it's back in work and right ahead, Michael A right, Yeah,
you sound a little underwater. What do you want to
You want to speak a phone? Where? What type of
phone are you using? Rob? This is this sort of
thing that these guys have to you get Look, did
Rob not tell you just put the phone up to
your ear? If you're on a speakerphone or a headset,
(03:09):
it's difficult for us to understand what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (03:12):
No, no, no, I was on it. I had to
speak a phone on because I was jilly dally and
doing something.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
But I know that that's what messed you up the
first time. So what did you have on when? When
I brought you back here first up at eleven?
Speaker 4 (03:24):
It was still on. It was so on until I
shut it.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
But anyway, okay, next time, when Rob tells you get
off the speakerphone, please follow his instructions.
Speaker 4 (03:33):
Go ahead, I will, I will. I'm not a sports guy,
but I gotta tell you this does not amaze me.
The thing that I thought you were talking about before
I heard how it all happened, by the way I
thought later, was long gone. I'm glad to hear those
guys are still around to keep keep an eye on things,
(03:54):
but I think that they've.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Been cleaned up in some areas, but there's always another
group of people who think they can they can take over. Yah.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
Yeah. Anyway, I when gamblers started, and then they started
letting you do it online. Then you could do it
on the phone. And the really bad thing was you
could bet on college games. So I said, I said,
you know what, I'm going to watch a college game,
and I swear there were a couple of players who
would just lack a daisil during that game. I know
(04:25):
nothing about sports. I don't know much about sports. I'm
learning more.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
If you're talking about a Division I college football game,
maybe someone appeared lack of days ago to you. But
those guys at Division one football they hit pretty hard,
so I would be surprised they may have been a
little slower than expected. Part of the problem is what
they call, in my opinion, the prop bets. So, for example,
you can bet on a running back in the NFL
that he's going to either make more or less than
(04:52):
fifty yards, or quarterbacks going to throw more or less
than two hundred and fifty yards. And though and some
of the bets in the NBA, I understand that a
certain player will at least score more than more or
less than eight points. And I think that's where Rogier
is alleged to have been involved, where he told some
people that he was going to pull up lame and
(05:15):
get out after seven minutes. Well, you can't score that
many points, you know, as soon as he pulls up
lame and is out of the game, everybody who had
jumped on that less than eight points, they're going home
a winter that night. But those are also red flags.
And I think that when they went through all the records,
and they did say the FBI and the US Attorney's
(05:35):
Office did give credit to these sports organizations, the sports
books for whatever you want to call them, draft kings,
et cetera, were cooperative, and that the NBA was cooperative.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
So yeah, I just I mean, I've had it with
all the spalling too much. Let's go back to the fifties.
Like the girl from every.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Thanks, Michael, have a good one. Good night. Let me
go next to Alex in Millis. Alex, you're next on
night side. Won't make your way through the news. You wait,
you're waiting through the news. I won't make your way
through the commercial.
Speaker 4 (06:12):
Go right ahead, Hey Dan.
Speaker 6 (06:14):
Hell are you I'm not a gambler. But on the
other side of this, those folks that got swindled at
the casino. So this makes me think, can they file
a class action lawsuit? So all the times that my
wife and I we whoa, whoa, whoa.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Hold on, I don't think there's anything suggests that people
were swindled at casinos. I think if they got swindled,
you're talking about the poker games.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Well, they had card readers, and they had I don't
know if it's blackjack, but maybe just poker. They had
the ability.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Has nothing to do with casinos. You mentioned casinos, Alex,
and I'm quick to I need to correct you. These
were high end private poker games that took place, I
guess in New York City. There might have been one
on Long Island where people were showing up with a
lot of money and they and the inducement was you
(07:15):
could play at the same table with according to the
allegations with Chauncy Phillips. So there are some people who
like to be able to say, oh, last night I
was playing polker or New York or is it a game
with Chauncey Phillips. And a lot of people said whoa
you know, from a Hall of Fame basketball player, Portland
Trailblazer's coach. This wasn't done at casinos or in conjunction
(07:36):
with casinos, but apparently they bought some high end equipment
which gave them I mean the games were rigged. They
knew what these high end people had for hens.
Speaker 6 (07:48):
Yeah, the games are rigged. So can't they come back
and say, look, I unknowingly got ripped off, and so
I'm filing a class action lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Well, so they had nothing to do with casino. They
got ripped off by a bunch of people who are
now under indictment. They may be there may be an
effort by you know, victims programs that exist in federal
offices or into state offices where they try to recover
(08:20):
funds of victims who have been exploited. But these folks,
you know, they wanted to This wasn't It wasn't a
scam in the sense that someone called them on the
phone and said, hey, you know, we need money here
to feed you know, hungry children in Biafro or something
like that, or in Bangladesh or in Senegal. Uh, and
(08:44):
found out that these people were just taking the money.
These folks wanted to play poker with these guys. I mean,
and and and these guys, if they are convicted, they're
probably going to pay substantial fines. Maybe out of that mind,
they might get some money back. But I'm not particularly
(09:04):
feeling a great deal of sympathy for the people who,
for their own ego had enough money. You know, were
they defrauded, yes, yes, but they they were sort of
liambs who took themselves to the slaughter. They wanted to
be able to say I was playing poker last night
with you know whomever. That's this is a small group
(09:24):
of people. There's no class action involved there. If let's
say there was a casino somewhere where they found out
that there were thousands of people who were who were
ripped off, well then you could have a potential class
action lawsuit. But this, you know who these people are,
because these are the people were playing poker with these
well known athletes. Did you listen to the did you
(09:48):
listen to the news reports on this tonight? Where did
you get the idea that casinos were involved?
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Well?
Speaker 6 (09:53):
No, The reason the reason I thought that it was
when they said on the second part that they used uh,
you know, high tech uh means our devices to read
uh read the cards. So so I'm assuming you know
this had to do maybe uh. I don't know where
(10:15):
this took place.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
That was an assumption that was wrong, Alex. So thank
you for clarifying that. I appreciate it. I got to
keep rolling here, buddy, talk to you. So thanks great night.
Six one seven, two, five, four ten thirty six one seven,
nine three one ten thirty. Got to take This is
a very quick commercial break. You want to get in
right now. Six one seven, two five four ten thirty
six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Got a
(10:38):
couple of open lines. Feel free coming back on night Side.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on WBS Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Next up, we're going down in in San Antonio, Texas
in this is a huge story. What's your thoughts on this?
Speaker 7 (10:56):
Well, my question is, first of all, it is very sad.
Corruption is never okay. But my question is, and that
might be kind of a dumb question. And I know
part of it is money, of course, but I think
a lot of it must be greed. Lakos and ostra.
(11:18):
Why would they choose still choose an illegal gambling ruse
rather than fan Dual a fan dual type company or
draftings where they are legal.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Well, they did both. The money they were they were
involved in both. So here's how it worked. Okay, again
according to the allegations, and it's important that we always
you know, say this is an allegation. So there's people
have a presumption of innocence that they claim that one
of the players and maybe two of the players were
(11:56):
able to communicate with friends before a game sometime that
day that they didn't feel good and instead of playing
the full game they were going to have faken injury
or or you know, claim that their ankle was sore
(12:19):
and they would get out at seven. Now it's the
seven minute mark. Okay, specifically, So what you have with
DraftKings and fan Duel and on this, you have what's
called prop bets. So you can bet on what if
a team's gonna win, whether or not the San Antonio
Spurs are playing the Mavericks, who's gonna win, and then
(12:42):
the points spread and all of that. But they also
can say, okay, you can bet will this player score
more or less than ten points? Will this player get
more or less than five assists. That's what's called prop
it's a proposition bet on an individual player as a
to the team. And apparently there was some heavy bets
(13:04):
that came into in one game on this player underperforming.
And now they're alleging that the player intentionally left the
game faithed an injury so that his friends could bet
with that prior knowledge that he would not score enough points,
(13:24):
he would not get enough asists. That's as I understand it.
Speaker 7 (13:27):
Okay, right, okay, I understand that, and I understand that
the gambling.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
The gambling is a different situation. That they had private
poker games, high end poker games. They had equipment set
up in these poker games so that the rich people,
the wealthy men who wanted to go be able to
say they had played poker the night before with this
NBA player or that NBA player. Right, they were they
(13:56):
were they were cheap either, well, they weren't cheap being
led to the slaughter They were sheep that wanted to
go to the slaughterhouse. They didn't know what was in
store for them. So it's kind of two separate and
the private high end poker games were apparently coordinated with
(14:18):
according to the indictments, Leakosa Nostra organized crime. And so
you know this thing, the more they investigate, they may
find more and more and more here. And to be
really honest with you, but it's not looking pretty at
this point, I guess would be the way to describe it.
So and it hasn't been. This is We've had betting
(14:41):
scandals before, you know, in the NFL there was Paul
Horning and Alex Carris who were accused of some point shaving.
There have been college point shavings, the Black Sox scandals,
but all of those were they were small money. Pete Rose,
who supposedly is a baseball manager, better on his team
to win, but that was illegal because you're not supposed
(15:02):
to bet either on your team to win or lose.
But this is, this is a humongous, if true, is
a humongous operation which was involved tens of millions of dollars.
Speaker 7 (15:19):
Right. But what my question was was, like Cozenostra in particular,
why would they still choose illegal gambling when there's legal
gambling that makes a lot of money.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
You know, just because the And I think that's a
good question because these high end poker games. Okay, you
could have a high end poker game if you and
I and some friends want to have a poker game,
and the minimum to get in is twenty bucks or
one hundred bucks, you can do that. But if you're
(15:53):
running a high end poker game and you're inducing people
to join the game, and somehow someone you're the dealer,
and you're you're able to tell what cards I have
and what cards the other guy has, and so if
you're sitting there, uh, and you're supposedly the dealer. I'm
just using an example, and every time I have a
(16:14):
good hand, you kind of look at me and give
me a hand signal, so you know that I know
I have the hand to beat this guy. I'll keep
raising and get more money. If, on the other hand,
you tell me that he has a better hand or
what that person at the table, I'll fold early. So
the advantage then it becomes unfear for me because part
(16:36):
of poker is you don't know what the other guy has.
You know what you have in your question. So yeah,
but that's that's taken into the nth degree because they
they apparently had uh you know, communication signals. I mean,
they were defaunt.
Speaker 7 (16:50):
I want to know because poker faces or you know, that's.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Part of the game. That's part of the game. No,
this was much more than. This was an organized criminal
enterprise with a basic It would be like if if
someone in organized crime went to someone and said, look,
we need a million dollars because that million dollars we're
going to send to the poor people in wherever, and
(17:17):
they took that money and they never sent a cent
to the poor people. They put it in their own
pockets and they bought you know, a condominium and an
airplane and a boat or whatever. That's fraud. This is what,
in effect they're dealing with here in terms of the
poker game. Fraud. So I've explained it as best I
can in but I think if you read the newspaper
(17:38):
tomorrow that you'll you'll fill in the blanks for you.
Speaker 7 (17:41):
Okay, you've done great, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Thanks Ianne. I appreciate the opportunity. All right, let's keep
rolling here. I'm going to go to fill in Boston. Phil.
I'm going to get you in here before the break
of the bottom of the are Go right ahead, Phil, Ah.
Speaker 5 (17:54):
Going you know. Yeah. So the bottom line is, I'm sorry,
I had a thought. I thought. I can't think of it.
The gambling I vils. They're just so vicious. These people
not long do they cheat. These people want their money
to send out a bunch of people they don't know
(18:14):
with cigars and the kangnac putting on the bull bullet
whatever act. I mean, they had yet tough guys to
go out and collect the money they owed them.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
They probably no, yeah, that was that was part of
the role of organized crime as well. It wasn't. It wasn't.
There's no I don't think there's any allegations that Chauncey
Billups was going up to someone's door late at night.
But again, all of the allegations here against everybody whose
name has been mentioned today, they still are presumed innocent
(18:49):
until the facts of the case. And these are high
end public public figures. They're not public officials public figures.
I want to make sure everybody understands that.
Speaker 5 (18:58):
And I still the track IM better on the No
one with a dog tracks like a highlight with whitey
balls is heavy? Were your golf with your wonder with
ex Colna there, I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Well, there's a lot of dishonest people, Phil you know,
and you've got to be careful who you deal with
and the advice that your mother gave you when you
were younger, which was, if something seems true, good to
be true, it probably is. So if all of a
sudden someone knew that there was a guy that liked hide,
there were people who were wealthy who loved the thrill.
(19:34):
I'm told there's a professional golfer who likes to do
high you know, high end poker games. Not you know
where it's you know, two bucks to get in. No,
you're talking like thirty forty thousand dollars a he in.
I mean there are people like that. I don't know anybody,
but personally expect that. I'm sure you don't either. Yeah,
(19:58):
oh yeah. On the golf course too. We have a
lot of that stuff. People are they I'm told there
are some pro basketball players, a full football pro basketball
players who do a lot of gambling. But again they're
doing gambling at casinos, and it's maybe bad judgment and
they lose money, but that's a casino that is regulated
(20:18):
and therefore it's above board. And what the What the
officials today said was that the NBA and the betting
organization's draft kings and the sports books cooperated because obviously
they had to open up their records to get a
lot of the evidence which led led to the the
(20:42):
charges against these individuals.
Speaker 5 (20:43):
Today, they found the fantastic guys to create a table
which has actual vision is unboth out of a Spencer
trade is unbelievable. I mean, it's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It's not James Bond. Well, I won't date it with
Spencer Tracy, but yeah, it's it's stuff.
Speaker 5 (21:01):
Good combination of different groups of the bad guys different countries,
all had to sit in skills a butter's with a
muscle of brains, the skills to get to get these things.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Well, again, there's a lot of people out there who
they think they're good poker players or whatever. There are
people thought they were good investors. And the guy that
was running the high end scam out of New York
and Florida, there were people who were paying money just
to have access to him, and they were investing the
money and they were investing in a Ponzi scheme.
Speaker 5 (21:34):
It's like I normally they pick all the fancy areas Hampton, Well.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
You got it. Look what was it? Willie Sutton when
they said you know, why do you rob banks? And
he said rob Banks? Is that's where they keep the money.
You know, why do they go after wealthy people because
you know, you go after some blue collar guy that
he might say five dollars minimum per hand? What are
your nuts? I Phil, that's your right man? Talk soon,
(22:05):
all right. I all of a sudden, the lines have
slowed up a little bit. I want to know what
you think, bottom line is this? Does this change your
view towards professional sports? Look, we all know that going
to a sporting event, whether it's pro baseball, pro football,
pro look hockey, it's got expensive. It's got expensive, particularly
(22:31):
if you have kids. It's not like what it was
when you and I were growing up. Does this turn
you off to because this will have a splash over
effect not only on basketball but on any of the
professional sports. Look, I know what the ticket prices are
at the best seats at the Celtics and the Bruins
and the Red Sox and the Patriots. It's just the
(22:52):
way of the world. It's as simple as that. And
most people would say, well, I know the things on
the level, it's a great event, it's a great experience.
I'll take the kids or I'll take the family. I
don't know that maybe this is not going to have
an impact. As I said, the NBA just signed a
seventy six billion that's an eleven year deal, almost seven
(23:13):
billion dollars a year. That's a lot of money. And
those players in all the pro sports are making much
more different levels. Hockey players don't make as much as
basketball players. Baseball players have better contract deals than football players.
It's kind of complicated, but I'm familiar with it. However,
(23:35):
they're all doing very well. They're all doing very well,
and yet some of them apparently felt they had to
get a side hustle, and unfortunately the side hustle allegedly
is illegal. Six one, seven, two, five, four ten thirty
six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Does this
change your attitude towards professional sports? This is as big
(23:56):
a scandal that I think any sport has faced. And
Dan Shaughnessy in the last hour agreed with me. We're
coming right back on the Night Side. We have open lines.
Join the visition.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
We're talking about a huge story and it broke today
and perhaps some of you have not had a chance
to digest this, but I am interested for those of
you who know the story, does this change your opinion
towards going to see a Red Sox game, or a
Bruins game, or a Celtics game, or a Patriots game.
(24:39):
It's increasingly more expensive, obviously. But this is a huge scandal, okay,
assuming the allegations are true, simple as that, and I
just for the purpose of I think it was Ian
in San Antonio. Before I get back to my calls,
(25:01):
I'm gonna go Tina and Debbie, you will be next.
I do have a couple of lines still open. Six one, seven, two, five,
four ten thirty six one seven, nine three one ten thirty.
This is Joseph Nosella. He's the US attorney in New
York talking about the sophistication of this. Now is the
poker high end poker games where uh, this is not
(25:24):
sports betting. This is basically individuals who paid a lot
of money to play poker, but they didn't realize that
the games were rigged. This is cut thirty five.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
Rob The defendants used a variety of very sophisticated cheating technologies,
some of which were provided by other defendants in exchange
for a share of the profits from the scheme. For example,
they used off the shelf shuffling machines that had been
secretly altered in order to read the cards in the deck,
(25:57):
predict which player at the table had the best poker hand,
and relay that information to an off site operator.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Then apparently the off site operator was able to communicate
with one of the people at the table. I guess
to some sort of an earpiece, But you would think
that someone who's at this high end poker game would
Now I don't know, I don't know. Maybe they have
it in a room where simply a light goes on
(26:27):
or there's I don't know, this was sophisticated stuff. Let
me get back to the calls. See what people think again.
You know, the truth, the guilt or innocence of these
people be be determined by a jury of their peers.
All we know is what the allegations are up. The
(26:47):
allegations are pretty wild. NBA players who late in the season,
you know, you're you're an under five hundred team, uh,
and you're Terry Roseier and you're playing late the season.
I think one game was in March that he's alleged
to have basically pulled himself himself out of early and
(27:07):
his friends or people could have bet prop bets that
he was not going to score a certain number of points.
That's how it went. Tina in wunsakat Rhode Island. Tina,
you were next on Nightsiger, Right.
Speaker 8 (27:18):
Ahead, Yes, I have a question.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Sure.
Speaker 8 (27:22):
Let's say. Let's say I'm a professional baseball player. I'm
just an ordinary, run of the mill baseball player. But
I am a professional, whether I'm a great player or mediocre,
and sometimes I may be making great plays, and then
somebody in the gambling world could be betting on me
(27:42):
making thousands or millions of dollars of what I do
or don't do. Is my understanding correct of a professional player?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Yeah? Will they have what's called let me simplify it
for you. Okay, but you're right on the money. So,
for example, most of the prop bets, and I don't
do prop bets, but I know people who have explained
it to me. Most of the prop bets. Let's say
you're gonna watch the Patriots game next Sunday, and you
(28:13):
want to have a little action on the Patriots game.
You can bet if the Patriots let's assume the Patriots
are going to be I'm just gonna pick a number,
a three point favorite over the Cleveland Browns, so you
can bet the game on what they call the number line.
So if you say, I think the Patriots are going
to win that game by more than three, so you
(28:33):
can bet whatever you want, ten bucks, fifty bucks, one
hundred bucks, a thousand bucks, whatever, and say the Patriots
are going to win now. In order for you to
collect on your bet, and to win, the Patriots only
have to beat the Cleveland Browns by three points, and
normally it'll be like three and a half, but they
have to get more points. They have to win by
more points, so it's you know, then you could bet
(28:56):
the game straight up, but then there's odds on that.
So in other words, the points are supposed to even
out the field the playing field. But then they have
prop bets, and these are the ones that have caused
the problem here because it's easier, it's tougher to fix
a team game unless you can get to the most
(29:17):
critical player. But you could say, okay, let's say the
Patriots have a running back, okay, and they say, well,
he's gonna have to he's gonna score, he's gonna gain
fifty yards and he's going to score a touchdown. So
you can take those two bets and you can say,
(29:37):
I think player so and so is going to run
for more than fifty yards and he's going to score
at least one touchdown. And if he does that, if
he goes more than fifty yards during the course of
the game and scores a touchdown, you win. If he
has a bad game and he only gets forty nine
yards and he doesn't score a touchdown, you lose. So
(29:58):
that that is how you can make money off the performance.
And of course a big gambler, can you know, they
can do their research and say, wow, you know we're
gonna bet on you know, a major league play major
League baseball player. They do with pitchers strikeouts. How many
strikeouts will will this pitcher have in this game? So
(30:23):
if he has more than seven strikeouts, you win the bet.
If it's seven strikeouts or less, you'll lose the bet.
So there's this, you know, and again if you the
thing that Rosier apparently got himself in trouble on was
that late in the season, I guess he decided that
(30:44):
he needed to make some extra money and he figured
that on this particular game he was going to have
a sprained ankle, and that he was going to pull
himself out of the game with you know, with only
seven minutes play, and so therefore he did not make
the things that he was supposed to do. He didn't
score ten points, he didn't have five assists, that sort
(31:05):
of stuff. So, okay, they thought that that would go
under the radar. But apparently I'm DraftKings and these other
professional sports organizations said, why is there so much money
coming in that Terry Roser Terry Rozier is not gonna make.
You know, normally they like to have the bets fifty
to fifty because that way the sports book makes their money.
(31:28):
That's how they make their money.
Speaker 8 (31:31):
Well, okay, Dan, thank you for explaining it as much
as I can understand. I think I do understand what
you were saying.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
Yeah, that's it. I mean, they could say, for example,
they could have let's I'll keep it real simple. Aaron Judge,
the New York Yankee player. He hits all the home runs.
He doesn't hit a home run in every game. Some
games he hits one, some games he hits two, some
games he hits none. Right, So you know, they could
they could say Okay, he's facing a good picture tonight.
We're gonna say that he has to hit one home run.
(32:02):
So a lot of people say, oh, I love Aaron Judge,
and they say he'll hit one home run at least,
and he doesn't, they lose their bets. That's what it's
called a prop betyar. It's on the proposition. It's not
on whether the team will win or lose, but it's
on what will the player do in whatever the sport is.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Okay, okay, all right, I get it, all.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Right, thank you, Tina, appreciate it. Look, I thank you
very much, Tina. I know it's been slow the last
two nights, but right now I have wide open lines.
I'm going to go to commercials and I want to
hear from some of you who understand this and some
of you don't understand it. I want to know, does
this shake your faith in the legitimacy of professional sports
(32:46):
in America? Or maybe you didn't believe in the professional
sports in America. I always felt, and I still feel
that because these players are so highly compensated, they want
to win and they want to perform well so they
can get another years, another year at high wages. A
lot of the NFL players. I think the average career
(33:08):
for an NFL player is like three point eight years.
A lot of them have long careers like Tom. Some
have long careers like Tom Brady, but they're the exception.
A lot have very short careers. I want to know,
has this shaken your faith in professional sports? And this
story today is an extraordinary story, and it may it
may actually mushroom into a bigger story if the prosecutors
(33:32):
start to have plea deals with some of these people
who are involved, because there could be a lot of
people who get thrown under the bus, bigger names even
than the players who were indicted and arrested today. Six seven, two,
five thirty six one seven nine three, one ten thirty.
I thought this story would light the lines up for
(33:55):
two hours. It slowed down in the last twenty minutes.
Let's like these lines up again. Coming right back on
night Side.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on news radio.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
Back to the phones we go, got Chris in East Ridgewater. Chris,
appreciate you calling in. You're next on Nightside. Your thought
on this this sports betting scandal?
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Hey, Dan, how's it going been a while?
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Well, don't don't be a stranger. Chris, what's what's your
take on the sports betting scandal? Go right ahead.
Speaker 4 (34:29):
Well, I don't know if it will change my mind
about going to a game. I really don't go anyway.
It's you know, prohibitively okay, sad enough to get there.
I don't bettle on the sports.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
I know.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
I have friends that have been doing these prop bets
for a long time, even before it became so popular.
But I understand how it works. If I start thinking
that there's you know, tanking or collusion like that in
the games, I'm probably gonna be less interested because to me,
that's like going to a CA concert where you think
there's a good chance the artists might not really be singing,
(35:04):
and that there are artists that I think do that
and I won't go, or or.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
You could you could compared to going to a professional
wrestling match, where I mean it's that's theater. Uh if
people go and think that those those matches are on
the level, you know that the matches are scripted, but
you if you go, you like the athleticism of the
of the moves that the restless can make. But in sports,
(35:29):
I mean, this is devastating. This is devastating in my opinion.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Right, Oh yeah, well I've been. It's funny you mentioned
that I've been a wrestling day my whole life. And
you know, even before they started calling it sports entertainment.
You know, I knew somebody who worked for one of
the bigger promotions briefly. And yes, they have to know
who's gonna end up winning. Occasionally that changes if injuries
(35:53):
happen because they can't write the stories right, the matches themselves,
move by move or somebody are more scripted than others, and.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Got you totally totally get it. So this is not
going to change your mind because you're not You're not
somebody who's do you watch games on TV? Will this? Well?
You will you watch less games on TV?
Speaker 6 (36:13):
You know?
Speaker 4 (36:16):
Well, I really only pay attention to football, So if
it's starts hitting in the NFL when there's anything proven,
it will seriously diminish my enjoyment of it to a
point where I might not bother or watch anymore. What's
a huge game year and that's you know pretty much
I Hockey and basketball don't do it for me. If
I can briefly quick to touch on the poker thing.
(36:39):
I I studied a little bit about one of those
poker sites back that was accused of it. It was
absolute poker, I know it covers and somehow somebody got
a hold of a super yuser account that could see
all the cards and would have that account up on
one screen and be playing under their regular screen name
(36:59):
on another. Trriminal. That's how that was happening. It wasn't
really a team thing. But once, once it was caught,
because they are brought to their attention, they investigated it
kind of what happened and reimburse anybody who would lost
any money in those tournaments.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Okay, that's that's good. That's good to know. I know
that a lot of people love that stuff. Hey, Chris,
I got a couple more. I'm going to try to
sneak in here if I can. Thank you as always,
be a don't be a stranger, come on back. Okay.
Speaker 4 (37:31):
Everybody tells me every time they see me, I'm stranger.
What can I say?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
No, I said, don't be a stranger. Okay, thanks very much,
have a good night. Good night. Let me go to
John in New Hampshire, John, John, go right ahead.
Speaker 6 (37:44):
This is John in New York.
Speaker 2 (37:47):
John in New Hampshire. Which which is it New York?
John and New York had said John in New Hampshire.
So that's Rob's fault, not mine. What's your take on this?
This is a New York centric story Today story in
New York.
Speaker 9 (38:01):
John, Yeah, I know, but I wanted to make a
comment about I mean, it's a sport horse racing, right.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
Go ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 9 (38:15):
Years ago when I was young. I'm gonna tell you
a situation.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
All right.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
You gotta be quick because we're getting tied on time here.
Gotta be quick, all right.
Speaker 9 (38:23):
Yeah, you have a group of jockey, so right, they're
in a bar and talking and everything. It's a club,
all right. And you got one guy that isn't doing
so well that season, right, what can't happen? This is true.
They hold back and let that game. They did not
make it much money. He might not put around walking.
He's in a great guy, so everybody helps him out
and they make sure he wins. This is what goes
(38:45):
on sometimes, Dan, not all the time.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Okay, Okay, that's that's possible. That's possible. I had never
heard that story before. That's interesting, John. I want to
get one other person into I appreciate your calling. I
really do. Good night, good night. Let me go to
Linda in Weymouth. Linda, you gotta be quick for me.
I only got about thirty seconds. You have called very late,
but I'd love to accommodate.
Speaker 5 (39:08):
You.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Go ahead.
Speaker 10 (39:10):
I just want to say that I am extremely just
hottened over this whole thing, and it has shaken my
faith in in the sports. Now it really has well,
and I think.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
It might get I think as this thing involves, it
might even get worse, Linda, So prepare yourself. And again,
this is these these are the exceptions, they're not the rule.
I think it's important for us to understand that that
most of these guys are going out there doing their
best because they're earning their money the old fashioned way.
They're working, they're working hard.
Speaker 7 (39:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
I want to thank you Linda for forgetting in later,
and I want to thank all the callers. We're flat
out of time, so I will thank you again. I'm
going to be on Facebook nice with Dan Ryan about
two minutes. Maybe I'll see you there. Okay, thank you,
thanks lending.
Speaker 7 (39:58):
Yeah, thanks good night soon, good all right.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Rob Brooks a nice job. I want to thank Marita
I want to thank all the callers night. This was
a tough subject, but thank you for calling. I want
to thank all the listeners, but callers are very important.
I just want to say thanks to all of them.
I will be on Nightside with Dan Ray alendus. Always
have a great Friday everyone, and in the meantime, all
remind you all dogs, all cats, all pets go to heaven.
(40:22):
That's my pal Charlie ray Is, who passed fifteen years
ago in February. That's where all your pets are who
had passed. They loved you and you love them. I
do believe you'll see them again. Hope to see again tomorrow
night at Nightside. We will see you on Facebook nights
Oie with Dan Ray Just a couple
It's nice eyes with Dan Ray. I'm telling you Boston's
Meat Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
All right, let's step back to the calls. We are
talking about the NBA sports betting and gambling scandal, and
many of these type cases are pretty difficult to follow.
You read the indictment and you got to read it
to it. This was laid out very clearly today by
(00:27):
the head of the FBI and also by the US
attorney in New York. And this this is the This
is the assistant FBI director. This US Attorney for New York,
Joseph Nocella, Junior rob Please play thirty five A for
those who are just joining us.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
The off site operator sent the information via cell phone
back to a co conspirator at the table, and that
person at the table was known as the quarterback. The
quarterback then signaled secretly the information he had received from
others to others at the table, and together they used
(01:12):
that information in order to win their games and.
Speaker 4 (01:17):
To cheat the victims.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Defendants used other cheating technologies, such as poker chip tray analyzers,
which is a poker chip tray that secretly reads cards
using a hidden camera, special contact lenses or eyeglasses that
could read pre marked cards and an X ray table
that could read cards face down on the table.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Let me tell you this is how the the poker
games were rigged. So there were people who were looking
to be able to say they were in a high
stake poker game with an NBA player. I believe that, uh,
the NBA player Jones was involved in that. Uh he
(02:06):
was involved, I guess in both things. But Chauncey Billups
was I guess the lead in the in the in
the poker game. So basically, these wealthy individuals were Williams
being led to a slaughter. You know. Look, you go
to anywhere a casino and you assume the things are
on the level. Obviously the house has an advantage or
(02:28):
they're going to go out of business. But WHOA. Let
me go back to the calls here if you'd like
to join the conversation. I'm stunned by the the level here.
I just think it's breathtaking. And I the only lines
we have open right now were six one, seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty. Let me go to Michael. Michael, not sure
what was going on with your phone before, but hopefully
(02:48):
it's back in work and right ahead, Michael A right, Yeah,
you sound a little underwater. What do you want to
You want to speak a phone? Where? What type of
phone are you using? Rob? This is this sort of
thing that these guys have to you get Look, did
Rob not tell you just put the phone up to
your ear? If you're on a speakerphone or a headset,
(03:09):
it's difficult for us to understand what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (03:12):
No, no, no, I was on it. I had to
speak a phone on because I was jilly dally and
doing something.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
But I know that that's what messed you up the
first time. So what did you have on when? When
I brought you back here first up at eleven?
Speaker 4 (03:24):
It was still on. It was so on until I
shut it.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
But anyway, okay, next time, when Rob tells you get
off the speakerphone, please follow his instructions.
Speaker 4 (03:33):
Go ahead, I will, I will. I'm not a sports guy,
but I gotta tell you this does not amaze me.
The thing that I thought you were talking about before
I heard how it all happened, by the way I
thought later, was long gone. I'm glad to hear those
guys are still around to keep keep an eye on things,
(03:54):
but I think that they've.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Been cleaned up in some areas, but there's always another
group of people who think they can they can take over. Yah.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
Yeah. Anyway, I when gamblers started, and then they started
letting you do it online. Then you could do it
on the phone. And the really bad thing was you
could bet on college games. So I said, I said,
you know what, I'm going to watch a college game,
and I swear there were a couple of players who
would just lack a daisil during that game. I know
(04:25):
nothing about sports. I don't know much about sports. I'm
learning more.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
If you're talking about a Division I college football game,
maybe someone appeared lack of days ago to you. But
those guys at Division one football they hit pretty hard,
so I would be surprised they may have been a
little slower than expected. Part of the problem is what
they call, in my opinion, the prop bets. So, for example,
you can bet on a running back in the NFL
that he's going to either make more or less than
(04:52):
fifty yards, or quarterbacks going to throw more or less
than two hundred and fifty yards. And though and some
of the bets in the NBA, I understand that a
certain player will at least score more than more or
less than eight points. And I think that's where Rogier
is alleged to have been involved, where he told some
people that he was going to pull up lame and
(05:15):
get out after seven minutes. Well, you can't score that
many points, you know, as soon as he pulls up
lame and is out of the game, everybody who had
jumped on that less than eight points, they're going home
a winter that night. But those are also red flags.
And I think that when they went through all the records,
and they did say the FBI and the US Attorney's
(05:35):
Office did give credit to these sports organizations, the sports
books for whatever you want to call them, draft kings,
et cetera, were cooperative, and that the NBA was cooperative.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
So yeah, I just I mean, I've had it with
all the spalling too much. Let's go back to the fifties.
Like the girl from every.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Thanks, Michael, have a good one. Good night. Let me
go next to Alex in Millis. Alex, you're next on
night side. Won't make your way through the news. You wait,
you're waiting through the news. I won't make your way
through the commercial.
Speaker 4 (06:12):
Go right ahead, Hey Dan.
Speaker 6 (06:14):
Hell are you I'm not a gambler. But on the
other side of this, those folks that got swindled at
the casino. So this makes me think, can they file
a class action lawsuit? So all the times that my
wife and I we whoa, whoa, whoa.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Hold on, I don't think there's anything suggests that people
were swindled at casinos. I think if they got swindled,
you're talking about the poker games.
Speaker 6 (06:43):
Well, they had card readers, and they had I don't
know if it's blackjack, but maybe just poker. They had
the ability.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Has nothing to do with casinos. You mentioned casinos, Alex,
and I'm quick to I need to correct you. These
were high end private poker games that took place, I
guess in New York City. There might have been one
on Long Island where people were showing up with a
lot of money and they and the inducement was you
(07:15):
could play at the same table with according to the
allegations with Chauncy Phillips. So there are some people who
like to be able to say, oh, last night I
was playing polker or New York or is it a game
with Chauncey Phillips. And a lot of people said whoa
you know, from a Hall of Fame basketball player, Portland
Trailblazer's coach. This wasn't done at casinos or in conjunction
(07:36):
with casinos, but apparently they bought some high end equipment
which gave them I mean the games were rigged. They
knew what these high end people had for hens.
Speaker 6 (07:48):
Yeah, the games are rigged. So can't they come back
and say, look, I unknowingly got ripped off, and so
I'm filing a class action lawsuit.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Well, so they had nothing to do with casino. They
got ripped off by a bunch of people who are
now under indictment. They may be there may be an
effort by you know, victims programs that exist in federal
offices or into state offices where they try to recover
(08:20):
funds of victims who have been exploited. But these folks,
you know, they wanted to This wasn't It wasn't a
scam in the sense that someone called them on the
phone and said, hey, you know, we need money here
to feed you know, hungry children in Biafro or something
like that, or in Bangladesh or in Senegal. Uh, and
(08:44):
found out that these people were just taking the money.
These folks wanted to play poker with these guys. I mean,
and and and these guys, if they are convicted, they're
probably going to pay substantial fines. Maybe out of that mind,
they might get some money back. But I'm not particularly
(09:04):
feeling a great deal of sympathy for the people who,
for their own ego had enough money. You know, were
they defrauded, yes, yes, but they they were sort of
liambs who took themselves to the slaughter. They wanted to
be able to say I was playing poker last night
with you know whomever. That's this is a small group
(09:24):
of people. There's no class action involved there. If let's
say there was a casino somewhere where they found out
that there were thousands of people who were who were
ripped off, well then you could have a potential class
action lawsuit. But this, you know who these people are,
because these are the people were playing poker with these
well known athletes. Did you listen to the did you
(09:48):
listen to the news reports on this tonight? Where did
you get the idea that casinos were involved?
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Well?
Speaker 6 (09:53):
No, The reason the reason I thought that it was
when they said on the second part that they used uh,
you know, high tech uh means our devices to read
uh read the cards. So so I'm assuming you know
this had to do maybe uh. I don't know where
(10:15):
this took place.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
That was an assumption that was wrong, Alex. So thank
you for clarifying that. I appreciate it. I got to
keep rolling here, buddy, talk to you. So thanks great night.
Six one seven, two, five, four ten thirty six one seven,
nine three one ten thirty. Got to take This is
a very quick commercial break. You want to get in
right now. Six one seven, two five four ten thirty
six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Got a
(10:38):
couple of open lines. Feel free coming back on night Side.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on WBS Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Next up, we're going down in in San Antonio, Texas
in this is a huge story. What's your thoughts on this?
Speaker 7 (10:56):
Well, my question is, first of all, it is very sad.
Corruption is never okay. But my question is, and that
might be kind of a dumb question. And I know
part of it is money, of course, but I think
a lot of it must be greed. Lakos and ostra.
(11:18):
Why would they choose still choose an illegal gambling ruse
rather than fan Dual a fan dual type company or
draftings where they are legal.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Well, they did both. The money they were they were
involved in both. So here's how it worked. Okay, again
according to the allegations, and it's important that we always
you know, say this is an allegation. So there's people
have a presumption of innocence that they claim that one
of the players and maybe two of the players were
(11:56):
able to communicate with friends before a game sometime that
day that they didn't feel good and instead of playing
the full game they were going to have faken injury
or or you know, claim that their ankle was sore
(12:19):
and they would get out at seven. Now it's the
seven minute mark. Okay, specifically, So what you have with
DraftKings and fan Duel and on this, you have what's
called prop bets. So you can bet on what if
a team's gonna win, whether or not the San Antonio
Spurs are playing the Mavericks, who's gonna win, and then
(12:42):
the points spread and all of that. But they also
can say, okay, you can bet will this player score
more or less than ten points? Will this player get
more or less than five assists. That's what's called prop
it's a proposition bet on an individual player as a
to the team. And apparently there was some heavy bets
(13:04):
that came into in one game on this player underperforming.
And now they're alleging that the player intentionally left the
game faithed an injury so that his friends could bet
with that prior knowledge that he would not score enough points,
(13:24):
he would not get enough asists. That's as I understand it.
Speaker 7 (13:27):
Okay, right, okay, I understand that, and I understand that
the gambling.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
The gambling is a different situation. That they had private
poker games, high end poker games. They had equipment set
up in these poker games so that the rich people,
the wealthy men who wanted to go be able to
say they had played poker the night before with this
NBA player or that NBA player. Right, they were they
(13:56):
were they were cheap either, well, they weren't cheap being
led to the slaughter They were sheep that wanted to
go to the slaughterhouse. They didn't know what was in
store for them. So it's kind of two separate and
the private high end poker games were apparently coordinated with
(14:18):
according to the indictments, Leakosa Nostra organized crime. And so
you know this thing, the more they investigate, they may
find more and more and more here. And to be
really honest with you, but it's not looking pretty at
this point, I guess would be the way to describe it.
So and it hasn't been. This is We've had betting
(14:41):
scandals before, you know, in the NFL there was Paul
Horning and Alex Carris who were accused of some point shaving.
There have been college point shavings, the Black Sox scandals,
but all of those were they were small money. Pete Rose,
who supposedly is a baseball manager, better on his team
to win, but that was illegal because you're not supposed
(15:02):
to bet either on your team to win or lose.
But this is, this is a humongous, if true, is
a humongous operation which was involved tens of millions of dollars.
Speaker 7 (15:19):
Right. But what my question was was, like Cozenostra in particular,
why would they still choose illegal gambling when there's legal
gambling that makes a lot of money.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
You know, just because the And I think that's a
good question because these high end poker games. Okay, you
could have a high end poker game if you and
I and some friends want to have a poker game,
and the minimum to get in is twenty bucks or
one hundred bucks, you can do that. But if you're
(15:53):
running a high end poker game and you're inducing people
to join the game, and somehow someone you're the dealer,
and you're you're able to tell what cards I have
and what cards the other guy has, and so if
you're sitting there, uh, and you're supposedly the dealer. I'm
just using an example, and every time I have a
(16:14):
good hand, you kind of look at me and give
me a hand signal, so you know that I know
I have the hand to beat this guy. I'll keep
raising and get more money. If, on the other hand,
you tell me that he has a better hand or
what that person at the table, I'll fold early. So
the advantage then it becomes unfear for me because part
(16:36):
of poker is you don't know what the other guy has.
You know what you have in your question. So yeah,
but that's that's taken into the nth degree because they
they apparently had uh you know, communication signals. I mean,
they were defaunt.
Speaker 7 (16:50):
I want to know because poker faces or you know, that's.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Part of the game. That's part of the game. No,
this was much more than. This was an organized criminal
enterprise with a basic It would be like if if
someone in organized crime went to someone and said, look,
we need a million dollars because that million dollars we're
going to send to the poor people in wherever, and
(17:17):
they took that money and they never sent a cent
to the poor people. They put it in their own
pockets and they bought you know, a condominium and an
airplane and a boat or whatever. That's fraud. This is what,
in effect they're dealing with here in terms of the
poker game. Fraud. So I've explained it as best I
can in but I think if you read the newspaper
(17:38):
tomorrow that you'll you'll fill in the blanks for you.
Speaker 7 (17:41):
Okay, you've done great, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Thanks Ianne. I appreciate the opportunity. All right, let's keep
rolling here. I'm going to go to fill in Boston. Phil.
I'm going to get you in here before the break
of the bottom of the are Go right ahead, Phil, Ah.
Speaker 5 (17:54):
Going you know. Yeah. So the bottom line is, I'm sorry,
I had a thought. I thought. I can't think of it.
The gambling I vils. They're just so vicious. These people
not long do they cheat. These people want their money
to send out a bunch of people they don't know
(18:14):
with cigars and the kangnac putting on the bull bullet
whatever act. I mean, they had yet tough guys to
go out and collect the money they owed them.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
They probably no, yeah, that was that was part of
the role of organized crime as well. It wasn't. It wasn't.
There's no I don't think there's any allegations that Chauncey
Billups was going up to someone's door late at night.
But again, all of the allegations here against everybody whose
name has been mentioned today, they still are presumed innocent
(18:49):
until the facts of the case. And these are high
end public public figures. They're not public officials public figures.
I want to make sure everybody understands that.
Speaker 5 (18:58):
And I still the track IM better on the No
one with a dog tracks like a highlight with whitey
balls is heavy? Were your golf with your wonder with
ex Colna there, I mean, it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Well, there's a lot of dishonest people, Phil you know,
and you've got to be careful who you deal with
and the advice that your mother gave you when you
were younger, which was, if something seems true, good to
be true, it probably is. So if all of a
sudden someone knew that there was a guy that liked hide,
there were people who were wealthy who loved the thrill.
(19:34):
I'm told there's a professional golfer who likes to do
high you know, high end poker games. Not you know
where it's you know, two bucks to get in. No,
you're talking like thirty forty thousand dollars a he in.
I mean there are people like that. I don't know anybody,
but personally expect that. I'm sure you don't either. Yeah,
(19:58):
oh yeah. On the golf course too. We have a
lot of that stuff. People are they I'm told there
are some pro basketball players, a full football pro basketball
players who do a lot of gambling. But again they're
doing gambling at casinos, and it's maybe bad judgment and
they lose money, but that's a casino that is regulated
(20:18):
and therefore it's above board. And what the What the
officials today said was that the NBA and the betting
organization's draft kings and the sports books cooperated because obviously
they had to open up their records to get a
lot of the evidence which led led to the the
(20:42):
charges against these individuals.
Speaker 5 (20:43):
Today, they found the fantastic guys to create a table
which has actual vision is unboth out of a Spencer
trade is unbelievable. I mean, it's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It's not James Bond. Well, I won't date it with
Spencer Tracy, but yeah, it's it's stuff.
Speaker 5 (21:01):
Good combination of different groups of the bad guys different countries,
all had to sit in skills a butter's with a
muscle of brains, the skills to get to get these things.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Well, again, there's a lot of people out there who
they think they're good poker players or whatever. There are
people thought they were good investors. And the guy that
was running the high end scam out of New York
and Florida, there were people who were paying money just
to have access to him, and they were investing the
money and they were investing in a Ponzi scheme.
Speaker 5 (21:34):
It's like I normally they pick all the fancy areas Hampton, Well.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
You got it. Look what was it? Willie Sutton when
they said you know, why do you rob banks? And
he said rob Banks? Is that's where they keep the money.
You know, why do they go after wealthy people because
you know, you go after some blue collar guy that
he might say five dollars minimum per hand? What are
your nuts? I Phil, that's your right man? Talk soon,
(22:05):
all right. I all of a sudden, the lines have
slowed up a little bit. I want to know what
you think, bottom line is this? Does this change your
view towards professional sports? Look, we all know that going
to a sporting event, whether it's pro baseball, pro football,
pro look hockey, it's got expensive. It's got expensive, particularly
(22:31):
if you have kids. It's not like what it was
when you and I were growing up. Does this turn
you off to because this will have a splash over
effect not only on basketball but on any of the
professional sports. Look, I know what the ticket prices are
at the best seats at the Celtics and the Bruins
and the Red Sox and the Patriots. It's just the
(22:52):
way of the world. It's as simple as that. And
most people would say, well, I know the things on
the level, it's a great event, it's a great experience.
I'll take the kids or I'll take the family. I
don't know that maybe this is not going to have
an impact. As I said, the NBA just signed a
seventy six billion that's an eleven year deal, almost seven
(23:13):
billion dollars a year. That's a lot of money. And
those players in all the pro sports are making much
more different levels. Hockey players don't make as much as
basketball players. Baseball players have better contract deals than football players.
It's kind of complicated, but I'm familiar with it. However,
(23:35):
they're all doing very well. They're all doing very well,
and yet some of them apparently felt they had to
get a side hustle, and unfortunately the side hustle allegedly
is illegal. Six one, seven, two, five, four ten thirty
six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Does this
change your attitude towards professional sports? This is as big
(23:56):
a scandal that I think any sport has faced. And
Dan Shaughnessy in the last hour agreed with me. We're
coming right back on the Night Side. We have open lines.
Join the visition.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
We're talking about a huge story and it broke today
and perhaps some of you have not had a chance
to digest this, but I am interested for those of
you who know the story, does this change your opinion
towards going to see a Red Sox game, or a
Bruins game, or a Celtics game, or a Patriots game.
(24:39):
It's increasingly more expensive, obviously. But this is a huge scandal, okay,
assuming the allegations are true, simple as that, and I
just for the purpose of I think it was Ian
in San Antonio. Before I get back to my calls,
(25:01):
I'm gonna go Tina and Debbie, you will be next.
I do have a couple of lines still open. Six one, seven, two, five,
four ten thirty six one seven, nine three one ten thirty.
This is Joseph Nosella. He's the US attorney in New
York talking about the sophistication of this. Now is the
poker high end poker games where uh, this is not
(25:24):
sports betting. This is basically individuals who paid a lot
of money to play poker, but they didn't realize that
the games were rigged. This is cut thirty five.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
Rob The defendants used a variety of very sophisticated cheating technologies,
some of which were provided by other defendants in exchange
for a share of the profits from the scheme. For example,
they used off the shelf shuffling machines that had been
secretly altered in order to read the cards in the deck,
(25:57):
predict which player at the table had the best poker hand,
and relay that information to an off site operator.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Then apparently the off site operator was able to communicate
with one of the people at the table. I guess
to some sort of an earpiece, But you would think
that someone who's at this high end poker game would
Now I don't know, I don't know. Maybe they have
it in a room where simply a light goes on
(26:27):
or there's I don't know, this was sophisticated stuff. Let
me get back to the calls. See what people think again.
You know, the truth, the guilt or innocence of these
people be be determined by a jury of their peers.
All we know is what the allegations are up. The
(26:47):
allegations are pretty wild. NBA players who late in the season,
you know, you're you're an under five hundred team, uh,
and you're Terry Roseier and you're playing late the season.
I think one game was in March that he's alleged
to have basically pulled himself himself out of early and
(27:07):
his friends or people could have bet prop bets that
he was not going to score a certain number of points.
That's how it went. Tina in wunsakat Rhode Island. Tina,
you were next on Nightsiger, Right.
Speaker 8 (27:18):
Ahead, Yes, I have a question.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Sure.
Speaker 8 (27:22):
Let's say. Let's say I'm a professional baseball player. I'm
just an ordinary, run of the mill baseball player. But
I am a professional, whether I'm a great player or mediocre,
and sometimes I may be making great plays, and then
somebody in the gambling world could be betting on me
(27:42):
making thousands or millions of dollars of what I do
or don't do. Is my understanding correct of a professional player?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Yeah? Will they have what's called let me simplify it
for you. Okay, but you're right on the money. So,
for example, most of the prop bets, and I don't
do prop bets, but I know people who have explained
it to me. Most of the prop bets. Let's say
you're gonna watch the Patriots game next Sunday, and you
(28:13):
want to have a little action on the Patriots game.
You can bet if the Patriots let's assume the Patriots
are going to be I'm just gonna pick a number,
a three point favorite over the Cleveland Browns, so you
can bet the game on what they call the number line.
So if you say, I think the Patriots are going
to win that game by more than three, so you
(28:33):
can bet whatever you want, ten bucks, fifty bucks, one
hundred bucks, a thousand bucks, whatever, and say the Patriots
are going to win now. In order for you to
collect on your bet, and to win, the Patriots only
have to beat the Cleveland Browns by three points, and
normally it'll be like three and a half, but they
have to get more points. They have to win by
more points, so it's you know, then you could bet
(28:56):
the game straight up, but then there's odds on that.
So in other words, the points are supposed to even
out the field the playing field. But then they have
prop bets, and these are the ones that have caused
the problem here because it's easier, it's tougher to fix
a team game unless you can get to the most
(29:17):
critical player. But you could say, okay, let's say the
Patriots have a running back, okay, and they say, well,
he's gonna have to he's gonna score, he's gonna gain
fifty yards and he's going to score a touchdown. So
you can take those two bets and you can say,
(29:37):
I think player so and so is going to run
for more than fifty yards and he's going to score
at least one touchdown. And if he does that, if
he goes more than fifty yards during the course of
the game and scores a touchdown, you win. If he
has a bad game and he only gets forty nine
yards and he doesn't score a touchdown, you lose. So
(29:58):
that that is how you can make money off the performance.
And of course a big gambler, can you know, they
can do their research and say, wow, you know we're
gonna bet on you know, a major league play major
League baseball player. They do with pitchers strikeouts. How many
strikeouts will will this pitcher have in this game? So
(30:23):
if he has more than seven strikeouts, you win the bet.
If it's seven strikeouts or less, you'll lose the bet.
So there's this, you know, and again if you the
thing that Rosier apparently got himself in trouble on was
that late in the season, I guess he decided that
(30:44):
he needed to make some extra money and he figured
that on this particular game he was going to have
a sprained ankle, and that he was going to pull
himself out of the game with you know, with only
seven minutes play, and so therefore he did not make
the things that he was supposed to do. He didn't
score ten points, he didn't have five assists, that sort
(31:05):
of stuff. So, okay, they thought that that would go
under the radar. But apparently I'm DraftKings and these other
professional sports organizations said, why is there so much money
coming in that Terry Roser Terry Rozier is not gonna make.
You know, normally they like to have the bets fifty
to fifty because that way the sports book makes their money.
(31:28):
That's how they make their money.
Speaker 8 (31:31):
Well, okay, Dan, thank you for explaining it as much
as I can understand. I think I do understand what
you were saying.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
Yeah, that's it. I mean, they could say, for example,
they could have let's I'll keep it real simple. Aaron Judge,
the New York Yankee player. He hits all the home runs.
He doesn't hit a home run in every game. Some
games he hits one, some games he hits two, some
games he hits none. Right, So you know, they could
they could say Okay, he's facing a good picture tonight.
We're gonna say that he has to hit one home run.
(32:02):
So a lot of people say, oh, I love Aaron Judge,
and they say he'll hit one home run at least,
and he doesn't, they lose their bets. That's what it's
called a prop betyar. It's on the proposition. It's not
on whether the team will win or lose, but it's
on what will the player do in whatever the sport is.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Okay, okay, all right, I get it, all.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Right, thank you, Tina, appreciate it. Look, I thank you
very much, Tina. I know it's been slow the last
two nights, but right now I have wide open lines.
I'm going to go to commercials and I want to
hear from some of you who understand this and some
of you don't understand it. I want to know, does
this shake your faith in the legitimacy of professional sports
(32:46):
in America? Or maybe you didn't believe in the professional
sports in America. I always felt, and I still feel
that because these players are so highly compensated, they want
to win and they want to perform well so they
can get another years, another year at high wages. A
lot of the NFL players. I think the average career
(33:08):
for an NFL player is like three point eight years.
A lot of them have long careers like Tom. Some
have long careers like Tom Brady, but they're the exception.
A lot have very short careers. I want to know,
has this shaken your faith in professional sports? And this
story today is an extraordinary story, and it may it
may actually mushroom into a bigger story if the prosecutors
(33:32):
start to have plea deals with some of these people
who are involved, because there could be a lot of
people who get thrown under the bus, bigger names even
than the players who were indicted and arrested today. Six seven, two,
five thirty six one seven nine three, one ten thirty.
I thought this story would light the lines up for
(33:55):
two hours. It slowed down in the last twenty minutes.
Let's like these lines up again. Coming right back on
night Side.
Speaker 1 (34:02):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on news radio.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
Back to the phones we go, got Chris in East Ridgewater. Chris,
appreciate you calling in. You're next on Nightside. Your thought
on this this sports betting scandal?
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Hey, Dan, how's it going been a while?
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Well, don't don't be a stranger. Chris, what's what's your
take on the sports betting scandal? Go right ahead.
Speaker 4 (34:29):
Well, I don't know if it will change my mind
about going to a game. I really don't go anyway.
It's you know, prohibitively okay, sad enough to get there.
I don't bettle on the sports.
Speaker 1 (34:41):
I know.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
I have friends that have been doing these prop bets
for a long time, even before it became so popular.
But I understand how it works. If I start thinking
that there's you know, tanking or collusion like that in
the games, I'm probably gonna be less interested because to me,
that's like going to a CA concert where you think
there's a good chance the artists might not really be singing,
(35:04):
and that there are artists that I think do that
and I won't go, or or.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
You could you could compared to going to a professional
wrestling match, where I mean it's that's theater. Uh if
people go and think that those those matches are on
the level, you know that the matches are scripted, but
you if you go, you like the athleticism of the
of the moves that the restless can make. But in sports,
(35:29):
I mean, this is devastating. This is devastating in my opinion.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
Right, Oh yeah, well I've been. It's funny you mentioned
that I've been a wrestling day my whole life. And
you know, even before they started calling it sports entertainment.
You know, I knew somebody who worked for one of
the bigger promotions briefly. And yes, they have to know
who's gonna end up winning. Occasionally that changes if injuries
(35:53):
happen because they can't write the stories right, the matches themselves,
move by move or somebody are more scripted than others, and.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Got you totally totally get it. So this is not
going to change your mind because you're not You're not
somebody who's do you watch games on TV? Will this? Well?
You will you watch less games on TV?
Speaker 6 (36:13):
You know?
Speaker 4 (36:16):
Well, I really only pay attention to football, So if
it's starts hitting in the NFL when there's anything proven,
it will seriously diminish my enjoyment of it to a
point where I might not bother or watch anymore. What's
a huge game year and that's you know pretty much
I Hockey and basketball don't do it for me. If
I can briefly quick to touch on the poker thing.
(36:39):
I I studied a little bit about one of those
poker sites back that was accused of it. It was
absolute poker, I know it covers and somehow somebody got
a hold of a super yuser account that could see
all the cards and would have that account up on
one screen and be playing under their regular screen name
(36:59):
on another. Trriminal. That's how that was happening. It wasn't
really a team thing. But once, once it was caught,
because they are brought to their attention, they investigated it
kind of what happened and reimburse anybody who would lost
any money in those tournaments.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Okay, that's that's good. That's good to know. I know
that a lot of people love that stuff. Hey, Chris,
I got a couple more. I'm going to try to
sneak in here if I can. Thank you as always,
be a don't be a stranger, come on back. Okay.
Speaker 4 (37:31):
Everybody tells me every time they see me, I'm stranger.
What can I say?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
No, I said, don't be a stranger. Okay, thanks very much,
have a good night. Good night. Let me go to
John in New Hampshire, John, John, go right ahead.
Speaker 6 (37:44):
This is John in New York.
Speaker 2 (37:47):
John in New Hampshire. Which which is it New York?
John and New York had said John in New Hampshire.
So that's Rob's fault, not mine. What's your take on this?
This is a New York centric story Today story in
New York.
Speaker 9 (38:01):
John, Yeah, I know, but I wanted to make a
comment about I mean, it's a sport horse racing, right.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
Go ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 9 (38:15):
Years ago when I was young. I'm gonna tell you
a situation.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
All right.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
You gotta be quick because we're getting tied on time here.
Gotta be quick, all right.
Speaker 9 (38:23):
Yeah, you have a group of jockey, so right, they're
in a bar and talking and everything. It's a club,
all right. And you got one guy that isn't doing
so well that season, right, what can't happen? This is true.
They hold back and let that game. They did not
make it much money. He might not put around walking.
He's in a great guy, so everybody helps him out
and they make sure he wins. This is what goes
(38:45):
on sometimes, Dan, not all the time.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Okay, Okay, that's that's possible. That's possible. I had never
heard that story before. That's interesting, John. I want to
get one other person into I appreciate your calling. I
really do. Good night, good night. Let me go to
Linda in Weymouth. Linda, you gotta be quick for me.
I only got about thirty seconds. You have called very late,
but I'd love to accommodate.
Speaker 5 (39:08):
You.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
Go ahead.
Speaker 10 (39:10):
I just want to say that I am extremely just
hottened over this whole thing, and it has shaken my
faith in in the sports. Now it really has well,
and I think.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
It might get I think as this thing involves, it
might even get worse, Linda, So prepare yourself. And again,
this is these these are the exceptions, they're not the rule.
I think it's important for us to understand that that
most of these guys are going out there doing their
best because they're earning their money the old fashioned way.
They're working, they're working hard.
Speaker 7 (39:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
I want to thank you Linda for forgetting in later,
and I want to thank all the callers. We're flat
out of time, so I will thank you again. I'm
going to be on Facebook nice with Dan Ryan about
two minutes. Maybe I'll see you there. Okay, thank you,
thanks lending.
Speaker 7 (39:58):
Yeah, thanks good night soon, good all right.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Rob Brooks a nice job. I want to thank Marita
I want to thank all the callers night. This was
a tough subject, but thank you for calling. I want
to thank all the listeners, but callers are very important.
I just want to say thanks to all of them.
I will be on Nightside with Dan Ray alendus. Always
have a great Friday everyone, and in the meantime, all
remind you all dogs, all cats, all pets go to heaven.
(40:22):
That's my pal Charlie ray Is, who passed fifteen years
ago in February. That's where all your pets are who
had passed. They loved you and you love them. I
do believe you'll see them again. Hope to see again tomorrow
night at Nightside. We will see you on Facebook nights
Oie with Dan Ray Just a couple
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