September 22, 2025 • 39 mins
This week the U.N. General Assembly will take place in New York for its 40th session where talks of a two-state solution to the Israeli Palestinian conflict is expected to dominate the conversation. The U.K., Australia and Canada have already formally recognized a Palestinian state, prompting an angry response from Israel. What other countries will join in support of a Palestinian state?
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBSY. He cast
in his radio.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I thank very much, Dan Watkins. As we move into
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(01:11):
I would encourage you. Now some of you probably don't
have hit that button wrong, but that's my mistake. Don't
have the app, I get it, no problem. You got
to call the show if you want to express yourself. Well,
here's the topic that is I'm happening. Even as we speak,
world leaders are now recognizing a Palestinian state. Looks as
(01:35):
if the two countries who are holding strong against a
Palestinian state remain Israel and the United States. There are
some other countries as a matter of fact, but right
now I think it's about one hundred and fifty three
of the one hundred and ninety two countries around the
world have decided that they I guess France is the
(01:56):
latest country to capitulate it. It's amazing to me. First
of all, I don't know where there is a Palestinian state.
I don't know where it would be. For years and
years and years, Israel tried to offer leand to various
(02:19):
Palestinian organizations. They were always rebuffed, and then, of course,
the event of October seventh, twenty twenty three, which resulted
in the master of hundreds of innocent Israelis and now
has led to the to hold the whole situation in Gaza.
(02:41):
And it seems to me that by now recognizing a
Palestinian state, which Hamas is thrilled about, basically rewards Hamas
for having conducted their cowardly raid. On October seventh, twenty
twenty three, with me is Jeff Robbins with us tonight
Asjeff Robbins. Jeff, who is a well known Boston attorney,
(03:05):
is also the former executive director of the New England
Anti Defamation League, and actually represented the Clinton administration at
the United Nations during part of President Clinton's time in
the White House in the nineteen nineties. Jeff Robbins, you
know the way the United Nations works. The United Nation
is convening this week in New York, and it seems
(03:28):
as if all of a sudden, it just happens that
we have a lot of recognition of Palestine. It doesn't
seem to me a coincidence. Does it seem that way
to you?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
No?
Speaker 4 (03:43):
I agree with you, and you know your prelude reminds
me of something that a guy who had been a
Senate lawyer Senate Council. What he said to me before
I went down to Washington to be a council to
a Senate committee. He said, the guy had taken him
aside and said, listen, son, let me just tell you
one thing. Things ain't all on the level down here,
(04:04):
and that that really describes the United Nations, which is
you know, Petro Dollars driven that that.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Is talking more about the Potomac more than the Potomac
River base.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, it applies in spades at the UN of course,
which is well known for its lack of spine. Well,
you've said so many important things, and the first one
is what you alluded to historically, which may be boring
to some people, but of course the Israelis are acutely
aware of it, as are other experts in the region.
(04:40):
And that is that literally, a Palestinian state was declared
by the United Nations in nineteen forty seven. There was
to be a Palestinian Arab state and the Palestinian Jewish
state called Israel. It was rejected. Five states Arab states
invaded it, trying to obliterate it. It lost. Between forty
eight and sixty seven, Israel had no presence in no
(05:00):
presence in the West Bank, no presence in eas Jerusalem,
could have been a Palestinian state, no interest in that.
Two thousand and two thousand and one, again the Palestinian state,
exactly as you said, was offered on essentially all the
West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza, no interest rejected by
our fat two thousand and five, the Israelis leave Gaza altogether.
(05:22):
The whole purpose was for it to be part of
the Palestinian state. No thanks, that's not what we wanted
it at all. Four Instead, tens of thousands of rockets
leading up to this massacre on October seven of twenty
twenty three. So Pete, when israelis here, oh, there should
be a Palestinian state. Really, if that's what the answer
(05:43):
to the question is, then why was it rejected all
these times? There is no answer to that question, unfortunately,
And that's the backdrop. The second hugely important point that
you made, I think is that, of course saying this
now rewards some us but incentivizes them to keep doing
(06:04):
what they have been doing. They could end this war
which they started any time they wanted by returning the
hostages that haven't already been killed. Saying and putting down
their arms and agreeing to lose control, to leave Gaza anytime,
at any moment, this could stop. They choose not to
(06:25):
do that for their own reasons. And when Macron or
Stamm or anybody these people do what they have done,
they cause cheers to ring out in Gaza City because
the message is we are winning. The international community is
going to put pressure on Israel, and we should continue
doing exactly what we're doing. And that means more death.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yeah. And by the way, just for clarification, they're are
believed to be fifty hostages are still there, thirty of
whom they've believed to be dead, only twenty still alive.
And Hamas is so cruel. They apparently have sent a
letter to the White House asking the President of the
(07:08):
United States to become the foreign Minister of the State
of Israel, which we have no writing to do. And
they are saying they were released half of the hostages. Now,
I don't know if that means twenty five at the
thirty dead hostages or fifteen at the dead hostages and
(07:29):
ten of the twenty live hostages, but either way, it's
just cruel to hold that out there sort of as
a carrot for families who have been without their loved
ones now for nearly two years.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
And well, you're so right, You're so right, and it
should be said again that and I you know, I've
made very clear in my own writing and the rest
of it that I have no I have very little
appetite for the Trump administration and for this president. I
have to say, though, that credit needs to be given
where credit is due, and great credit is due to
(08:04):
this president with whom I disagree passionately, and with his
administration with which I disagree passionately on so much. They
are absolutely right in taking the position that if you
do this, you are prolonging this war, and you are
prolonging the suffering of Gazans. Israel didn't ask for this war.
(08:25):
They didn't want this war. They were dancing at a festival,
they were sleeping in their beds. That's what they would
have preferred to have continued to do. And when you
sort of reward them by saying, how about this, as
a result of what you've done, we are going to
recognize a Palestinian state. Now there are these statements like, well,
(08:47):
we don't want Hamas to be running Gaza. Oh, that's great,
that's lovely. How is that supposed to happen? That's supposed
to happen by clapping your hands and waiting for Tinkerpell
who's supposed to remove Hamas from the equation. The only
ones that's going to do that is Israel. We think,
you know, the hostages have to come home with splendid, wonderful, great,
(09:08):
except that Hamas refuses to do it, So it's inane.
And I think that the President and the Sector of
State are to be applauded, quite frankly for the position
that they're taking.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Well. I think that the President speaks to the General
Assembly tomorrow and it's going to be interesting what he
has to say. And it's also going to be interesting
what the reaction will be of some of these countries
around the world, which obviously are anti Israeli an anti American.
I suspect there will be people who will walk out,
you know, representatives of some of these countries that will
(09:41):
walk out. We'll have to see how that plays out tomorrow.
We'll talk about that tomorrow night. My guest Jeff Robbins,
if you'd like to join the conversation with Jeff, if
you truly believe that there should be a Palestinian state,
and you want to make the argument, feel free. Jeff
will be more than happy to have a conversations six
one seven, two, five, four to ten thirty or six
(10:03):
one seven, nine three one ten thirty. I don't know
what part of Gaza at this point is even inhabitable.
I really don't know, so I don't know where they
would be a Palestinian state erected, constructed, observed, noted there
(10:24):
are of several Arab countries who have refused the Palestinians
a ground to form a state. It's up to Israel
to surrender part of israel leand that they have fought
in one uh after having been attacked. That's the irony here.
(10:45):
And I just don't understand how people of goodwill can
believe that the answer is this is a Palestinian state.
Six one seven, two, five, four to ten thirty six
one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Coming right back
on Night Side with Jeff Robbins. He's a great attorney,
a writer, a thinker, has represented the Clinton administration the
(11:06):
United States government, and also served as the executive director
of the Anti Defamation League here in New England and
as far as I'm concerned there's nobody that makes more
sense on this topic, on this subject from a factual
point of view than Jeff Robins, But feel free to
join the conversation. Bring it on if you have a
(11:27):
different point of view. Love to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Coming back on Nightside Night Side with Dan Ray. I'MBZ
Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
I'm joined by Jeff Robbins, who Jeff, you spend time
at the United Nations in the nineteen nineties as a
US delegate. Is it as dysfunctional an institution as it
seems to me from afar? I've never even been in
the United Nations building all the times I've been to
(11:57):
New York. What is is it sort of a surreal experience.
I always think of the Jeff McNelly cartoon of many
years ago that you might have seen, which had like
this panel of representatives from different countries, including some guy
wearing a Yankee hat, which said the Bronx.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
What I mean, Yeah, Well, Yankee stadium is orderly compared
to the UN.
Speaker 5 (12:23):
Look.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
I was privileged, quite frankly, to be appointed to be
a US delegate to the UN Human Rights Commission in
Geneva in ninety nine, and then again in two thousand
and you know, representing your country, represent the United States
in an international form that the UN is a huge honor.
Having said that the UN itself is fully dysfunctional, the
(12:47):
ordures are phenomenal, I have to say that. But you know,
it's a place.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Where giving credit where credit is due.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I like that about you, Jeff, exactly. But in terms
of I mean, the UN Human Rights Commission, for example,
is composed of some of the most egregious human rights
violators in the world when it comes to Israel. Aught
of all they pretty much do is to pacc these
resolutions condemning Israel. That's all that they have ever done.
(13:18):
I remember when I was appointed, the Vice President's counsel,
who had been instrumental in me being appointed, told me
that his father had come back from some similar appointment
after World War Two and had been very proud to
tell the family that he was responsible for changing the
word and a resolution that nobody read from should to
(13:39):
Shall you know, it's not a place which is going
to make anybody feel particularly high minded at any moment. Say,
it's a place where power politics prevails.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yeah, let's get some phone calls here. Jeff, let me
go first to Jack and Newton. Jack, I know has
strong feelings about this issue. Jack, you go right ahead.
You're on with Jeff Robins.
Speaker 6 (14:03):
Hi, Jack Porter Federy muzzle TIV under eighteen years.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Hi, well we haven't finished eighteen yet. We start nineteen
on October first. But I thank you. I don't want
to make any assumptions here here, Jack, go ahead of
only DC.
Speaker 6 (14:20):
Only it'll make three points. The one both he could
and Labor over the years have entertained the idea of
a Pealestonian state. So Bb is the first to reject
any possibility. The two. This will make his real even
more vulnerable because the Pelstinians will now have no hope
for the state and the terror will increase. And three,
there's a tremendous gap between young Jews between eighteen and
(14:41):
thirty five, and there was over sixty five according to
the Jewish Telegraphic Agency survey. And I think overall that
the majority of non orthodox Jews support a true state solution.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Jack, is your position in of a two state solution?
Speaker 6 (15:01):
Just for the record, absolutely there has to be a
Palestinian state next time.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Okay, Well, let's see what Jeff has to say about that.
I'm sure he's not going to change your mind, but
I'm sure he'll have a good response.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
Go ahead, Jeff, Well, the first thing I want to say,
with your permission, is to digress based on the first
thing you said, Jack, which is about Dan because in
a week in which we've seen the country convulse over
the lack of stability, Dan Ray's show for if it's
eighteen years, then eighteen years is the rare place where
civility prevails. It's an island in the midst of all
of this incability. So it's worth pointing that out, especially
(15:36):
this week, given what we've all been through as the country.
I agree with you that it was unwise for net Yahoo,
I think to say there would never be a Palestinian state.
I don't think that's a helpful thing to say at all.
It's basically, as you say, leaves people saying, well, then
(15:59):
we have no reason to do anything what we've been doing.
The problem is that, realistically, I don't know how you
say that there can be a Palestinian state anytime soon.
It's been rejected over and over and over and over again.
The October seventh massacre is the product of Israel having
tried to help a two state solution along by handing
(16:23):
Gaza over to Amas. And now you have twelve hundred
people murdered, thousands maimed, and two hundred and fifty kidnapped.
So it feels like a fool's Errand to say, oh,
I see what we'll do now is we'll have a
Palestinian state. No Israeli. I shouldn't say no Israeli. Very
few Israelis think that that, practically speaking, can happen anytime soon?
(16:46):
Where would it be in Gaza with Amas running it?
Speaker 6 (16:49):
How could it possibly use? Who I thank and possibly
in future? But I agree with you, I don't know.
I think it was Abba Eban said that the Palestinians
never lose an opportunity, to lose an opportunity. You're absolutely right.
They had many, many chances to have a Palestinian state,
but they wanted everything. So now they have nothing. You know,
they want to let every return. They want to Lussalem.
(17:11):
You know, if they would only be happy with a
piece of the pie, you know, on the West Bank,
or not make all these other they would have had
a state decades ago.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
They want more than a piece of the pie Jack.
They want the bakery is what they want. The New
York Times is quoting Mahmoud de Bass, the leader of
the Palestinian Authority, tonight, is saying the authority would form
a government of the West Bank and Gaza with no
role for Hamas. How's he going to make sure if
there's no role for Hamas? The US denied a visa
(17:42):
for mister Obas to attend the events in New York,
so he addressed the meeting today by video. It's a mess.
It's a mess.
Speaker 6 (17:52):
But I agree with Jeff that the Palestinians have rejected
a Palestinian state many times in the task and now
they better, you know, wake up and say if this
is your chance, then then then grab it. And of
course there'll be an American guarantees or or some are
Israel sadly will have to try to guarantee that Hamas
(18:14):
will not take over as they did violently from Abula
bas It's a difficult situation.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
But should that, I mean, it's assuming so so so basically,
in order for I'm not trying to be argumented of
Jack just but in order for a Palesidian state to
exist exist, Israel is going to have to play the police,
(18:40):
the police role, to police the state to make sure
that Hamas doesn't take over. That's that's I think that's
exactly the situation that they would find themselves in.
Speaker 6 (18:51):
Unfortunately, I know that's some somehow someone will have to
protect the modern Palestinians from Harmas. I mean, I don't
know who's going to do that. The Uropeans couldn't help out.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
You know, the Europeans are right worried right now about
the Russians. But let me get Jeff's quick comment on
that concept, which I think is you're very accurate, Jack.
You see it clearly that if they did establish a
Palestinian state, who would prevent Hamas from you know, take
it over, Jeff, hold on, Jack just for a second, Jeff,
(19:26):
go ahead.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Jack. You used the phrase piece of the pie. And
I'm struck by the word peace, because all that the
Palestinians had to do to get that Palestinian state that
has been offered to them over and over and over
again was to agree to peace. Peace. They declined to
do it. They refuse to do it if as long
(19:49):
as they refuse to do that, and Hamas of course
is as you know, committed doctrinally and thoroughly to the
elimination of Israel. As long as that's the case, well,
I'll tell you it requires uh uh, it requires a
whole heck of a lot to imagine. How as long
as that's the case, there can be the Palestinian state,
(20:12):
which the Palestinian leadership, at least on the West Bank,
non Gaza, says that they want.
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Well, I think that's parfully true. I mean, basically the
West Bank has been peace vaught. He didn't have an
October seventh situation under Adas uh and so, but I
think the Palestinian moderators asked for things that Israel's is
not going to give out, you know, like a law
of return. You know, every Palestarian can go back to
(20:41):
where their houses or whatever. Certain things the Palestinians just
have to, you know, you know, bite their tongue and
then then accept that you're not going to get everything
you want.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
But thanks, thanks.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
That is like myself. They had a chair on first State, Jack.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
I don't think there were too many houses for Palestinians
to return to it. At this point, gentlemen, I'm way
past my ten thirty break here. Before Rob pulls the
plug on all of us. Jack is always thoughtful call.
Thank you so much for joining us a different perspective.
Talk soon we'll take quick break back with more calls
for my guess, Jeff Robbins. Six one seven, two, five four.
(21:28):
Those lines are now full six one seven ninety. There's
one line there if you want to get in, we'll
get you on before eleven. I promise coming back on
night Side.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on w BZY,
Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
My guest is Jeff Robbins. You know Jeff as a
as a writer, UH, as a commentator, lawyer, as a
representative of the Clinton administration to the United Nations in Geneva.
And we're taking phone calls talking about what's going on.
The General Assembly is convening in New York. It has
convened in New York. Several major countries US allies, the
(22:13):
United Kingdom, Australia, now, France, and and others have decided
in recent days to recognize a so called Palestinian state.
I'm not sure where they would suggest it would it
(22:33):
would exist. I guess whatever's left of Gaza UH and
whatever's left of the West Bank and Gaza it's it
is a problem that could have been solved many years ago.
As my guest Jeff Robinsons explained, back to the phone calls,
who go, let's go to Ken in Waltham. Hey, Ken,
(22:56):
welcome your next one nights. I go right ahead, your un.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Jeff Rohi, Jeff, Yeah, I wanted to. I have a
few points, but my first one wasn't I know, Dan,
you've you've disagreed with us. It sounds like, Jeff, you
do too. I thought that, you know, giving up Gozel
is the right thing for Israel to do. And I
think the miss I thought, always thought. The mistake they
(23:19):
made is when ten thousands of rockets were being launched,
you know, Israel did not respond hard enough. And you know,
I certainly am not blaming Israel.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
They get criticized for not responding hard enough or responding
too hard, no matter. It's kind of like one of
those dans. If you do dans, if you don't moments.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah, I just I guess.
Speaker 5 (23:39):
I sort of feel like if Mexico was launching rockets
over the southern border to us the same way you
know what's happening in Godzia, there wouldn't be in Mexico anymore,
you know, or we responded, yeah, but yeah. The other
thing I was thinking too is, you know, Jack made
me has come in about I don't remember exactly how
(24:00):
he phrased it, but something about the Palestinians having every
opportunity to lose every opportunity or something they seem to
recall as a kid hearing gold in my ears say,
you know that the Palestinians hate us more than they
love our children, and or they love their children. Yeah,
and yeah. The last point I had was I thought,
(24:24):
and I can't believe I haven't heard anybody else say this,
so maybe I'm just really wrong, but it feels like,
you know, mcclan and others are who want to give
the Palestinians a state at this point or you know,
my recollection of history is that the Jews were given
Israel because of what happened that the genocide in World
(24:46):
War Two, And this just sounds like a real thumb
in the eye to Israel saying Okay, yeah, you're committing
genocide against the Palestinians, so we're going to recognize them
as a Palestinian state.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
That but I I think, you know, I don't know
about that, Jeff, your thoughts on Ken's observations.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Well, Ken make so many important points, including the first
one that he made, which was, yeah, as soon as
Israel had left Gaza, rooting out eleven thousand people who
lived there, instead of building the core of the Palestinian
State or one of the two corps to the Palestinian
State that General Sharon, Prime Minister Sharon wanted them to do,
(25:29):
they turned it into a launching pad. And what happened
is literally exactly as you say, tens of thousands of
rockets fired at Israeli civilians. And when Israel tried to
stop that from happening for a few days, the international
community demanded that had stopped, accusing it of genocide and
all the rest, and you had people like Diana Presley
(25:50):
and AOC and Bernie Sanders saying it was a genocide.
And of course, after a few days the Israeli stopped.
And what happened is ultimately it started again again and again,
and culminating in the calculation that Israel would be unable
to do anything more than fight for a couple of
days before it was forced to stop after October seventh,
(26:12):
which was a calculation that proved. Pardon me wrong, You're
right about that. The quote is that the Palestinians never
miss an opportunity, to miss an opportunity, it's aba even,
and the last sixty or seventy years proved that point.
Is this really about a Palestinian state? If it is,
(26:34):
then why haven't the various offers for one been accepted?
And so the conclusion is this ain't about a Palestinian state.
This is about the annihilation of Israel, and Hamas has
made that very very clear. It's lovely. As I said
before that some of these states have said gravely in
their statements Hamas has no place running Gaza's. But it's meaningless.
(26:56):
They're sitting in Paris. The croissants are terrific comparison, the
pastries are unbelievable. The problem is that somebody is going
to have to remove from us, and it's only going
to be Israel. You can't, on one hand say sternly
Hamas has no right to be in control in Gaza
and then attack Israel for trying to remove from us
(27:16):
from Gaza. So you made a lot of I thought
excellent points in your call.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Dan.
Speaker 5 (27:25):
I'm when I throw it the thought I know this
isn't tonight's topic, but I just want to say I
support Trump the way he's handling Israel, and I just
wish he was doing the same in Ukraine. But and
I know that's not tonight's topic.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
But I appreciate that. And again, you know, Ken, you're
one of my callers who I think is a like Jeff,
a self described Democrat. So I understand, I understand, you know,
for you to say that needs more than for some
person who is a maga. We're in a mega hat
you would expect them to support Trump, And I'm you know, so,
(28:00):
I'm I think it takes some courage for you to
say that, and some courage for Jeff to say that,
to be honest with you, so so far, I think
he's done some good work in the Middle East, including
taking out the Iran nuclear capability. Although today Russia, UH
and Iran signed some sort of a nuclear arrangement between
(28:23):
those two countries. I'm sure both of you probably saw
a note of that. So it just it just shows
shows you, you know, people are lining up on the right,
on the correct side of the field.
Speaker 6 (28:36):
Right.
Speaker 5 (28:37):
Well, thanks taking care much, thank you all.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Right, talk soon back with Jeff Robbins, if you'd like
to join the conversation. Everybody on we're going to get in.
I promise we got one line at six one seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty and one line at six one seven ninety.
Jeff will stay with us until eleven. He actually work,
he has to work for a living tomorrow morning, and
I can sleep in a little bit, but I'm I
(29:01):
will be more than happy to carry this topic into
the eleven If you folks who are interested, we can switch.
You have the numbers coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
It's night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
That's Kip Roland here, trying to get as many folks
in as we can. Going to go next to Matt
and Brighton. Matt, welcome next to Nightside.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
Hey, we're doing Dan.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Good Matt, what's your take on this?
Speaker 6 (29:29):
Appreciate it?
Speaker 7 (29:30):
Uh, mister Robbins, appreciate your time to get to say.
Speaker 6 (29:36):
You know very quickly.
Speaker 7 (29:37):
I think I've spoken on this topic many of times.
You know, Jack, I don't see eye to eye with
I think he's very weak on the sort of topic.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Why don'd you just tell us, would you what you think? Mat? Okay,
that's what I'm interested in.
Speaker 7 (29:55):
What you have thought before on her. But nevertheless, what
I will say is that with her, mister Robbins, you
have made excellent, excellent topics on this issue. You know,
(30:16):
Israel was attacked, Israel was attacked by humous and it's
not just the West Bank issue. You know, this is
a whole separate you know, intraduity that's being can put
uh you know, conflated together. And I think it's important
(30:38):
to know that obviously on this topic that the world
issue has been conflated against Israel, can flated against design
and some and it's made the same as hatred points.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
I got to keep rolling here because I got some
full lines. Thank you, Matt, appreciate it. Let me go
next to I lean in well Fame, I lean you
were next on Nightside.
Speaker 8 (31:08):
Go right ahead, I lean, good evening and good evening, Jeff.
I think you were too kind.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
On to the U n.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
You never has.
Speaker 8 (31:23):
I've had plenty of doors. I don't need their website.
You And secondly, we hear this phrase all the time
free hamas. Now, I don't know if these leaders are ignorant,
stupid or just playing corrupt because you can't have a
free Palestine as long as the mass is in control,
(31:45):
and a mass is basically a proxy, proxy or red.
So from my view on I'm Irish factor, I'm not
juwish or just want it out by that. Hamas is
just it's just a proxy of Iran, and this is
just Iran wants to not control all of the Middle
East and down to Africa with this incredible amounts of
(32:06):
genocide too.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
I think you're right. I think you're right, Eileen. Jeff
quick comment if you will.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
I couldn't agree with you more. And the proof is
in the pudding. You have the victims of a genocidal
attack by a genocidal group that pledges to repeat the
genocide until it's finished.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
Achieve genocide.
Speaker 8 (32:28):
It's total brutality, and.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
You have the Israel trying to stop the perpetrators of
the genocide being accused of the genocide. That's how upside down,
that's how Alison wonder.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
And a good good point is how many Jewish citizens
are there in Palestine?
Speaker 6 (32:47):
I assume zero? Correct, Well, yeah, there are one.
Speaker 8 (32:54):
Point five million Arab Israeli Arab is long Israelic people
citizens of Israel. Who's who's so so I'm to said,
if that those are the statistics, then Israel isn't very
good at juicide.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
All right, fair enough, go ahead, no, no, I I
I agree with much of what you say, and I
appreciate the call.
Speaker 8 (33:24):
Thanks Alien, appreciate thank you for your defense of this
because I think I think colass is a threat to
the whole world, the whole free world.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Thank you very much. Let me go to Esther and
and over Esther, you're next to nights. I appreciate you
calling in with Jeff Robins.
Speaker 9 (33:38):
Pleasure to call your show, Dan Ray, and I'm learning
so much from your guests. Relatives in Israel. Friends, my
son made Aliyah was able to go to Israel Adam anyway,
my father was uh past Apartment State and National Committee
(34:01):
for Jewish War Veterans. My mother was in the auxiliary.
And this is such a complex issue.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
You know, no.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Problem, Nope, nope, we're listening to you. Esther. You go
right ahead, you're on with Jeff, going on.
Speaker 9 (34:16):
I had a chance to go to Israel a few
years ago and I couldn't go.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Did you tell me this was your first time calling earlier? Yes? Yeah, Well,
first of all, thank you very much for be on across.
Don't be nervous, just say what's in your heart. Esther,
go right ahead.
Speaker 9 (34:31):
Thank you. My backstore neighbor Phil Levin, and it's sister
Cherry went to Hebrew Teachers College in Jerusalem and learned
Arabic and it did well. And I taught the kid
how to ride a bicycle. His name was Phil and
changed to me. And I had a friend Stephen Lazars
and Israeluse I could go on and on, and I
(34:55):
God bless everybody.
Speaker 6 (34:58):
You know, we are in.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Agreement, Esther, and I know Jeff appreciates your support tonight,
that's for sure, because it's important. It's important for people
like you to pick up the phone and express yourself
on this program. You're always welcome to call and feel
freak called any night. Okay, I mean that seriously, God
bless all right, right back, gotcha, thanks Esther. Let me
(35:20):
go to Canada. Darryl is up and go ahead, Jeff.
I'm sorry I interrupt you.
Speaker 4 (35:26):
Oh no, no, go right ahead, go right ahead.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Darryl is in New Brunswick, Canada. Darryl a min. It's
getting some frost on the pumpkin up there pretty soon.
Go right ahead, Darryl.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
Oh, we're up to fifty tonight, so we're good for
a couple of days.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Good, you're right, but yes, but.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Damn, Jeff, great topic. The one thing you mentioned prior
was about the UN. Russia and China. Have they ever
counted how many times Russian and China have vetoed any
kind of negotiation.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I'm sure they have, but I don't have those statistics
in front of me. Probably not as many times as
Pete Rose got base hits, but pretty darn clothes.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
Go ahead, Jeff, Well, I mean, you're you're right that
Russia and China have played a malevolent role in trying
to broker piece in the Middle East. But frankly, they
aren't the reason that there isn't a piece in the
Middle East. The reason there isn't peace in the Middle East,
at least between Israel and the Palestinians, is because, quite simply,
(36:35):
over and over and over and over again, there's been
a rejection of that piece. It takes two to tango,
as they say at the UN, and as long as
it's only one tangoing, we're not going to have an
end to this terrible, painful, bloody conflict.
Speaker 3 (36:53):
In addition, to what you just mentioned. It's what when
people come from the to North America, they keep teaching
the same cycle of the wrongs. It's almost like somebody's
gonna hate on for the other family.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Yeah. You know, by the way, Daryl, I didn't mention
that your nation, through your current prime minister, also issued
a recognition of Palestine a statehood. No, that's why I know.
I know that represents you know, again, the Canadian government,
(37:38):
at least as it's currently constituted. So we have the
United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, and France, four of our most
important allies, not only deserting the United States position, but
deserting Israel as well. Darryl. Thanks, I'm flat out of time.
I got you in. Thank goodness, and we'll talk soon,
my friend. Okay, thank you so much for it for
(38:00):
checking in. Thanks all right, good night, Jeff Robbins is
always I thank you for your time and your wisdom here.
People just you know, they need to understand how important
this issue is and what's going to the kabuki dance
that is going to be done at the United Nations
(38:21):
for the next couple of weeks whatever while they're in
until the media becomes bored with the historyonics, but it
will be the lead in the nightly newscast. What admonition
final thirty seconds would you give the American people, who
probably are not as focused on this as as you are,
(38:43):
and to some extent as.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
I am, well, it is to focus on what actually
is happening there and not on the kabuki dance. What
is happening there is that one side seems to think
it's within its right to slaughter Israelis and there's just
got to be a stop to that. And unless there
is a stop to that, then this thing is going
(39:08):
to go on. And is it a huge amount of
suffering that's going on in Gaza? Everybody wants it over.
Hamas has it in its power to end this, and
countries like the ones you've discussed have at least an
ability to try to affect what Hamas does and hopefully
not incentivize it to continue doing what it's been doing.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
Absolutely, Jeff Robbins has always Thank you, my friend, and
we will stay on top of this and I'll have
you back quicker than you realize.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Thank you, Thank you, Dan, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Will we get back, will if you'd like to continue
to talk about this. I'm more than game. This is
an issue that is very important to this program, very
important to me. If you're interested, you have the numbers.
If you're not, we'll change topics. Coming back on Night's side,
It's night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBSY. He cast
in his radio.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I thank very much, Dan Watkins. As we move into
our third hour tonight on a Monday night, I'll remind
you by the way, I know some of you are
shy and some of you are intimidated about calling the
talk show okay and getting on the line and all
of that. So iHeartRadio has this new app. It's a
cool way for you to be part of our night
(00:26):
side broadcast by taking advantage of the talkback feature on
the new and improved iHeartRadio app. You just got to
download the app and you'll have the free iHeartRadio app
with you while you're listening to night Side and radio.
Here's something you want to comment on, you call WBC
the app. All you have to do is tap on
the red microphone talkback button. It's in the top right
(00:49):
hand corner, easy to see, easy to find, and send
us a personalized greeting in thirty seconds. It's an audio
message thirty seconds, that's all, and then we get to
play it back on nights. It's that simple. Once again,
hit the red microphone button at the top right corner
of the app while listening to night side and you
can send us your audio message. And by the way,
you can do it during the day as well. But
(01:11):
I would encourage you. Now some of you probably don't
have hit that button wrong, but that's my mistake. Don't
have the app, I get it, no problem. You got
to call the show if you want to express yourself. Well,
here's the topic that is I'm happening. Even as we speak,
world leaders are now recognizing a Palestinian state. Looks as
(01:35):
if the two countries who are holding strong against a
Palestinian state remain Israel and the United States. There are
some other countries as a matter of fact, but right
now I think it's about one hundred and fifty three
of the one hundred and ninety two countries around the
world have decided that they I guess France is the
(01:56):
latest country to capitulate it. It's amazing to me. First
of all, I don't know where there is a Palestinian state.
I don't know where it would be. For years and
years and years, Israel tried to offer leand to various
(02:19):
Palestinian organizations. They were always rebuffed, and then, of course,
the event of October seventh, twenty twenty three, which resulted
in the master of hundreds of innocent Israelis and now
has led to the to hold the whole situation in Gaza.
(02:41):
And it seems to me that by now recognizing a
Palestinian state, which Hamas is thrilled about, basically rewards Hamas
for having conducted their cowardly raid. On October seventh, twenty
twenty three, with me is Jeff Robbins with us tonight
Asjeff Robbins. Jeff, who is a well known Boston attorney,
(03:05):
is also the former executive director of the New England
Anti Defamation League, and actually represented the Clinton administration at
the United Nations during part of President Clinton's time in
the White House in the nineteen nineties. Jeff Robbins, you
know the way the United Nations works. The United Nation
is convening this week in New York, and it seems
(03:28):
as if all of a sudden, it just happens that
we have a lot of recognition of Palestine. It doesn't
seem to me a coincidence. Does it seem that way
to you?
Speaker 3 (03:43):
No?
Speaker 4 (03:43):
I agree with you, and you know your prelude reminds
me of something that a guy who had been a
Senate lawyer Senate Council. What he said to me before
I went down to Washington to be a council to
a Senate committee. He said, the guy had taken him
aside and said, listen, son, let me just tell you
one thing. Things ain't all on the level down here,
(04:04):
and that that really describes the United Nations, which is
you know, Petro Dollars driven that that.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Is talking more about the Potomac more than the Potomac
River base.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, it applies in spades at the UN of course,
which is well known for its lack of spine. Well,
you've said so many important things, and the first one
is what you alluded to historically, which may be boring
to some people, but of course the Israelis are acutely
aware of it, as are other experts in the region.
(04:40):
And that is that literally, a Palestinian state was declared
by the United Nations in nineteen forty seven. There was
to be a Palestinian Arab state and the Palestinian Jewish
state called Israel. It was rejected. Five states Arab states
invaded it, trying to obliterate it. It lost. Between forty
eight and sixty seven, Israel had no presence in no
(05:00):
presence in the West Bank, no presence in eas Jerusalem,
could have been a Palestinian state, no interest in that.
Two thousand and two thousand and one, again the Palestinian state,
exactly as you said, was offered on essentially all the
West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza, no interest rejected by
our fat two thousand and five, the Israelis leave Gaza altogether.
(05:22):
The whole purpose was for it to be part of
the Palestinian state. No thanks, that's not what we wanted
it at all. Four Instead, tens of thousands of rockets
leading up to this massacre on October seven of twenty
twenty three. So Pete, when israelis here, oh, there should
be a Palestinian state. Really, if that's what the answer
(05:43):
to the question is, then why was it rejected all
these times? There is no answer to that question, unfortunately,
And that's the backdrop. The second hugely important point that
you made, I think is that, of course saying this
now rewards some us but incentivizes them to keep doing
(06:04):
what they have been doing. They could end this war
which they started any time they wanted by returning the
hostages that haven't already been killed. Saying and putting down
their arms and agreeing to lose control, to leave Gaza anytime,
at any moment, this could stop. They choose not to
(06:25):
do that for their own reasons. And when Macron or
Stamm or anybody these people do what they have done,
they cause cheers to ring out in Gaza City because
the message is we are winning. The international community is
going to put pressure on Israel, and we should continue
doing exactly what we're doing. And that means more death.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Yeah. And by the way, just for clarification, they're are
believed to be fifty hostages are still there, thirty of
whom they've believed to be dead, only twenty still alive.
And Hamas is so cruel. They apparently have sent a
letter to the White House asking the President of the
(07:08):
United States to become the foreign Minister of the State
of Israel, which we have no writing to do. And
they are saying they were released half of the hostages. Now,
I don't know if that means twenty five at the
thirty dead hostages or fifteen at the dead hostages and
(07:29):
ten of the twenty live hostages, but either way, it's
just cruel to hold that out there sort of as
a carrot for families who have been without their loved
ones now for nearly two years.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
And well, you're so right, You're so right, and it
should be said again that and I you know, I've
made very clear in my own writing and the rest
of it that I have no I have very little
appetite for the Trump administration and for this president. I
have to say, though, that credit needs to be given
where credit is due, and great credit is due to
(08:04):
this president with whom I disagree passionately, and with his
administration with which I disagree passionately on so much. They
are absolutely right in taking the position that if you
do this, you are prolonging this war, and you are
prolonging the suffering of Gazans. Israel didn't ask for this war.
(08:25):
They didn't want this war. They were dancing at a festival,
they were sleeping in their beds. That's what they would
have preferred to have continued to do. And when you
sort of reward them by saying, how about this, as
a result of what you've done, we are going to
recognize a Palestinian state. Now there are these statements like, well,
(08:47):
we don't want Hamas to be running Gaza. Oh, that's great,
that's lovely. How is that supposed to happen? That's supposed
to happen by clapping your hands and waiting for Tinkerpell
who's supposed to remove Hamas from the equation. The only
ones that's going to do that is Israel. We think,
you know, the hostages have to come home with splendid, wonderful, great,
(09:08):
except that Hamas refuses to do it, So it's inane.
And I think that the President and the Sector of
State are to be applauded, quite frankly for the position
that they're taking.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Well. I think that the President speaks to the General
Assembly tomorrow and it's going to be interesting what he
has to say. And it's also going to be interesting
what the reaction will be of some of these countries
around the world, which obviously are anti Israeli an anti American.
I suspect there will be people who will walk out,
you know, representatives of some of these countries that will
(09:41):
walk out. We'll have to see how that plays out tomorrow.
We'll talk about that tomorrow night. My guest Jeff Robbins,
if you'd like to join the conversation with Jeff, if
you truly believe that there should be a Palestinian state,
and you want to make the argument, feel free. Jeff
will be more than happy to have a conversations six
one seven, two, five, four to ten thirty or six
(10:03):
one seven, nine three one ten thirty. I don't know
what part of Gaza at this point is even inhabitable.
I really don't know, so I don't know where they
would be a Palestinian state erected, constructed, observed, noted there
(10:24):
are of several Arab countries who have refused the Palestinians
a ground to form a state. It's up to Israel
to surrender part of israel leand that they have fought
in one uh after having been attacked. That's the irony here.
(10:45):
And I just don't understand how people of goodwill can
believe that the answer is this is a Palestinian state.
Six one seven, two, five, four to ten thirty six
one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Coming right back
on Night Side with Jeff Robbins. He's a great attorney,
a writer, a thinker, has represented the Clinton administration the
(11:06):
United States government, and also served as the executive director
of the Anti Defamation League here in New England and
as far as I'm concerned there's nobody that makes more
sense on this topic, on this subject from a factual
point of view than Jeff Robins, But feel free to
join the conversation. Bring it on if you have a
(11:27):
different point of view. Love to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
Coming back on Nightside Night Side with Dan Ray. I'MBZ
Boston's news Radio.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
I'm joined by Jeff Robbins, who Jeff, you spend time
at the United Nations in the nineteen nineties as a
US delegate. Is it as dysfunctional an institution as it
seems to me from afar? I've never even been in
the United Nations building all the times I've been to
(11:57):
New York. What is is it sort of a surreal experience.
I always think of the Jeff McNelly cartoon of many
years ago that you might have seen, which had like
this panel of representatives from different countries, including some guy
wearing a Yankee hat, which said the Bronx.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
What I mean, Yeah, Well, Yankee stadium is orderly compared
to the UN.
Speaker 5 (12:23):
Look.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
I was privileged, quite frankly, to be appointed to be
a US delegate to the UN Human Rights Commission in
Geneva in ninety nine, and then again in two thousand
and you know, representing your country, represent the United States
in an international form that the UN is a huge honor.
Having said that the UN itself is fully dysfunctional, the
(12:47):
ordures are phenomenal, I have to say that. But you know,
it's a place.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Where giving credit where credit is due.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I like that about you, Jeff, exactly. But in terms
of I mean, the UN Human Rights Commission, for example,
is composed of some of the most egregious human rights
violators in the world when it comes to Israel. Aught
of all they pretty much do is to pacc these
resolutions condemning Israel. That's all that they have ever done.
(13:18):
I remember when I was appointed, the Vice President's counsel,
who had been instrumental in me being appointed, told me
that his father had come back from some similar appointment
after World War Two and had been very proud to
tell the family that he was responsible for changing the
word and a resolution that nobody read from should to
(13:39):
Shall you know, it's not a place which is going
to make anybody feel particularly high minded at any moment. Say,
it's a place where power politics prevails.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yeah, let's get some phone calls here. Jeff, let me
go first to Jack and Newton. Jack, I know has
strong feelings about this issue. Jack, you go right ahead.
You're on with Jeff Robins.
Speaker 6 (14:03):
Hi, Jack Porter Federy muzzle TIV under eighteen years.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Hi, well we haven't finished eighteen yet. We start nineteen
on October first. But I thank you. I don't want
to make any assumptions here here, Jack, go ahead of
only DC.
Speaker 6 (14:20):
Only it'll make three points. The one both he could
and Labor over the years have entertained the idea of
a Pealestonian state. So Bb is the first to reject
any possibility. The two. This will make his real even
more vulnerable because the Pelstinians will now have no hope
for the state and the terror will increase. And three,
there's a tremendous gap between young Jews between eighteen and
(14:41):
thirty five, and there was over sixty five according to
the Jewish Telegraphic Agency survey. And I think overall that
the majority of non orthodox Jews support a true state solution.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Jack, is your position in of a two state solution?
Speaker 6 (15:01):
Just for the record, absolutely there has to be a
Palestinian state next time.
Speaker 2 (15:05):
Okay, Well, let's see what Jeff has to say about that.
I'm sure he's not going to change your mind, but
I'm sure he'll have a good response.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
Go ahead, Jeff, Well, the first thing I want to say,
with your permission, is to digress based on the first
thing you said, Jack, which is about Dan because in
a week in which we've seen the country convulse over
the lack of stability, Dan Ray's show for if it's
eighteen years, then eighteen years is the rare place where
civility prevails. It's an island in the midst of all
of this incability. So it's worth pointing that out, especially
(15:36):
this week, given what we've all been through as the country.
I agree with you that it was unwise for net Yahoo,
I think to say there would never be a Palestinian state.
I don't think that's a helpful thing to say at all.
It's basically, as you say, leaves people saying, well, then
(15:59):
we have no reason to do anything what we've been doing.
The problem is that, realistically, I don't know how you
say that there can be a Palestinian state anytime soon.
It's been rejected over and over and over and over again.
The October seventh massacre is the product of Israel having
tried to help a two state solution along by handing
(16:23):
Gaza over to Amas. And now you have twelve hundred
people murdered, thousands maimed, and two hundred and fifty kidnapped.
So it feels like a fool's Errand to say, oh,
I see what we'll do now is we'll have a
Palestinian state. No Israeli. I shouldn't say no Israeli. Very
few Israelis think that that, practically speaking, can happen anytime soon?
(16:46):
Where would it be in Gaza with Amas running it?
Speaker 6 (16:49):
How could it possibly use? Who I thank and possibly
in future? But I agree with you, I don't know.
I think it was Abba Eban said that the Palestinians
never lose an opportunity, to lose an opportunity. You're absolutely right.
They had many, many chances to have a Palestinian state,
but they wanted everything. So now they have nothing. You know,
they want to let every return. They want to Lussalem.
(17:11):
You know, if they would only be happy with a
piece of the pie, you know, on the West Bank,
or not make all these other they would have had
a state decades ago.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
They want more than a piece of the pie Jack.
They want the bakery is what they want. The New
York Times is quoting Mahmoud de Bass, the leader of
the Palestinian Authority, tonight, is saying the authority would form
a government of the West Bank and Gaza with no
role for Hamas. How's he going to make sure if
there's no role for Hamas? The US denied a visa
(17:42):
for mister Obas to attend the events in New York,
so he addressed the meeting today by video. It's a mess.
It's a mess.
Speaker 6 (17:52):
But I agree with Jeff that the Palestinians have rejected
a Palestinian state many times in the task and now
they better, you know, wake up and say if this
is your chance, then then then grab it. And of
course there'll be an American guarantees or or some are
Israel sadly will have to try to guarantee that Hamas
(18:14):
will not take over as they did violently from Abula
bas It's a difficult situation.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
But should that, I mean, it's assuming so so so basically,
in order for I'm not trying to be argumented of
Jack just but in order for a Palesidian state to
exist exist, Israel is going to have to play the police,
(18:40):
the police role, to police the state to make sure
that Hamas doesn't take over. That's that's I think that's
exactly the situation that they would find themselves in.
Speaker 6 (18:51):
Unfortunately, I know that's some somehow someone will have to
protect the modern Palestinians from Harmas. I mean, I don't
know who's going to do that. The Uropeans couldn't help out.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
You know, the Europeans are right worried right now about
the Russians. But let me get Jeff's quick comment on
that concept, which I think is you're very accurate, Jack.
You see it clearly that if they did establish a
Palestinian state, who would prevent Hamas from you know, take
it over, Jeff, hold on, Jack just for a second, Jeff,
(19:26):
go ahead.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Jack. You used the phrase piece of the pie. And
I'm struck by the word peace, because all that the
Palestinians had to do to get that Palestinian state that
has been offered to them over and over and over
again was to agree to peace. Peace. They declined to
do it. They refuse to do it if as long
(19:49):
as they refuse to do that, and Hamas of course
is as you know, committed doctrinally and thoroughly to the
elimination of Israel. As long as that's the case, well,
I'll tell you it requires uh uh, it requires a
whole heck of a lot to imagine. How as long
as that's the case, there can be the Palestinian state,
(20:12):
which the Palestinian leadership, at least on the West Bank,
non Gaza, says that they want.
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Well, I think that's parfully true. I mean, basically the
West Bank has been peace vaught. He didn't have an
October seventh situation under Adas uh and so, but I
think the Palestinian moderators asked for things that Israel's is
not going to give out, you know, like a law
of return. You know, every Palestarian can go back to
(20:41):
where their houses or whatever. Certain things the Palestinians just
have to, you know, you know, bite their tongue and
then then accept that you're not going to get everything
you want.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
But thanks, thanks.
Speaker 6 (21:00):
That is like myself. They had a chair on first State, Jack.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
I don't think there were too many houses for Palestinians
to return to it. At this point, gentlemen, I'm way
past my ten thirty break here. Before Rob pulls the
plug on all of us. Jack is always thoughtful call.
Thank you so much for joining us a different perspective.
Talk soon we'll take quick break back with more calls
for my guess, Jeff Robbins. Six one seven, two, five four.
(21:28):
Those lines are now full six one seven ninety. There's
one line there if you want to get in, we'll
get you on before eleven. I promise coming back on
night Side.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on w BZY,
Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
My guest is Jeff Robbins. You know Jeff as a
as a writer, UH, as a commentator, lawyer, as a
representative of the Clinton administration to the United Nations in Geneva.
And we're taking phone calls talking about what's going on.
The General Assembly is convening in New York. It has
convened in New York. Several major countries US allies, the
(22:13):
United Kingdom, Australia, now, France, and and others have decided
in recent days to recognize a so called Palestinian state.
I'm not sure where they would suggest it would it
(22:33):
would exist. I guess whatever's left of Gaza UH and
whatever's left of the West Bank and Gaza it's it
is a problem that could have been solved many years ago.
As my guest Jeff Robinsons explained, back to the phone calls,
who go, let's go to Ken in Waltham. Hey, Ken,
(22:56):
welcome your next one nights. I go right ahead, your un.
Speaker 5 (22:58):
Jeff Rohi, Jeff, Yeah, I wanted to. I have a
few points, but my first one wasn't I know, Dan,
you've you've disagreed with us. It sounds like, Jeff, you
do too. I thought that, you know, giving up Gozel
is the right thing for Israel to do. And I
think the miss I thought, always thought. The mistake they
(23:19):
made is when ten thousands of rockets were being launched,
you know, Israel did not respond hard enough. And you know,
I certainly am not blaming Israel.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
They get criticized for not responding hard enough or responding
too hard, no matter. It's kind of like one of
those dans. If you do dans, if you don't moments.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah, I just I guess.
Speaker 5 (23:39):
I sort of feel like if Mexico was launching rockets
over the southern border to us the same way you
know what's happening in Godzia, there wouldn't be in Mexico anymore,
you know, or we responded, yeah, but yeah. The other
thing I was thinking too is, you know, Jack made
me has come in about I don't remember exactly how
(24:00):
he phrased it, but something about the Palestinians having every
opportunity to lose every opportunity or something they seem to
recall as a kid hearing gold in my ears say,
you know that the Palestinians hate us more than they
love our children, and or they love their children. Yeah,
and yeah. The last point I had was I thought,
(24:24):
and I can't believe I haven't heard anybody else say this,
so maybe I'm just really wrong, but it feels like,
you know, mcclan and others are who want to give
the Palestinians a state at this point or you know,
my recollection of history is that the Jews were given
Israel because of what happened that the genocide in World
(24:46):
War Two, And this just sounds like a real thumb
in the eye to Israel saying Okay, yeah, you're committing
genocide against the Palestinians, so we're going to recognize them
as a Palestinian state.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
That but I I think, you know, I don't know
about that, Jeff, your thoughts on Ken's observations.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Well, Ken make so many important points, including the first
one that he made, which was, yeah, as soon as
Israel had left Gaza, rooting out eleven thousand people who
lived there, instead of building the core of the Palestinian
State or one of the two corps to the Palestinian
State that General Sharon, Prime Minister Sharon wanted them to do,
(25:29):
they turned it into a launching pad. And what happened
is literally exactly as you say, tens of thousands of
rockets fired at Israeli civilians. And when Israel tried to
stop that from happening for a few days, the international
community demanded that had stopped, accusing it of genocide and
all the rest, and you had people like Diana Presley
(25:50):
and AOC and Bernie Sanders saying it was a genocide.
And of course, after a few days the Israeli stopped.
And what happened is ultimately it started again again and again,
and culminating in the calculation that Israel would be unable
to do anything more than fight for a couple of
days before it was forced to stop after October seventh,
(26:12):
which was a calculation that proved. Pardon me wrong, You're
right about that. The quote is that the Palestinians never
miss an opportunity, to miss an opportunity, it's aba even,
and the last sixty or seventy years proved that point.
Is this really about a Palestinian state? If it is,
(26:34):
then why haven't the various offers for one been accepted?
And so the conclusion is this ain't about a Palestinian state.
This is about the annihilation of Israel, and Hamas has
made that very very clear. It's lovely. As I said
before that some of these states have said gravely in
their statements Hamas has no place running Gaza's. But it's meaningless.
(26:56):
They're sitting in Paris. The croissants are terrific comparison, the
pastries are unbelievable. The problem is that somebody is going
to have to remove from us, and it's only going
to be Israel. You can't, on one hand say sternly
Hamas has no right to be in control in Gaza
and then attack Israel for trying to remove from us
(27:16):
from Gaza. So you made a lot of I thought
excellent points in your call.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
Dan.
Speaker 5 (27:25):
I'm when I throw it the thought I know this
isn't tonight's topic, but I just want to say I
support Trump the way he's handling Israel, and I just
wish he was doing the same in Ukraine. But and
I know that's not tonight's topic.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
But I appreciate that. And again, you know, Ken, you're
one of my callers who I think is a like Jeff,
a self described Democrat. So I understand, I understand, you know,
for you to say that needs more than for some
person who is a maga. We're in a mega hat
you would expect them to support Trump, And I'm you know, so,
(28:00):
I'm I think it takes some courage for you to
say that, and some courage for Jeff to say that,
to be honest with you, so so far, I think
he's done some good work in the Middle East, including
taking out the Iran nuclear capability. Although today Russia, UH
and Iran signed some sort of a nuclear arrangement between
(28:23):
those two countries. I'm sure both of you probably saw
a note of that. So it just it just shows
shows you, you know, people are lining up on the right,
on the correct side of the field.
Speaker 6 (28:36):
Right.
Speaker 5 (28:37):
Well, thanks taking care much, thank you all.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Right, talk soon back with Jeff Robbins, if you'd like
to join the conversation. Everybody on we're going to get in.
I promise we got one line at six one seven, two, five, four,
ten thirty and one line at six one seven ninety.
Jeff will stay with us until eleven. He actually work,
he has to work for a living tomorrow morning, and
I can sleep in a little bit, but I'm I
(29:01):
will be more than happy to carry this topic into
the eleven If you folks who are interested, we can switch.
You have the numbers coming back on Nightside.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
It's night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
That's Kip Roland here, trying to get as many folks
in as we can. Going to go next to Matt
and Brighton. Matt, welcome next to Nightside.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
Hey, we're doing Dan.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Good Matt, what's your take on this?
Speaker 6 (29:29):
Appreciate it?
Speaker 7 (29:30):
Uh, mister Robbins, appreciate your time to get to say.
Speaker 6 (29:36):
You know very quickly.
Speaker 7 (29:37):
I think I've spoken on this topic many of times.
You know, Jack, I don't see eye to eye with
I think he's very weak on the sort of topic.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
Why don'd you just tell us, would you what you think? Mat? Okay,
that's what I'm interested in.
Speaker 7 (29:55):
What you have thought before on her. But nevertheless, what
I will say is that with her, mister Robbins, you
have made excellent, excellent topics on this issue. You know,
(30:16):
Israel was attacked, Israel was attacked by humous and it's
not just the West Bank issue. You know, this is
a whole separate you know, intraduity that's being can put
uh you know, conflated together. And I think it's important
(30:38):
to know that obviously on this topic that the world
issue has been conflated against Israel, can flated against design
and some and it's made the same as hatred points.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
I got to keep rolling here because I got some
full lines. Thank you, Matt, appreciate it. Let me go
next to I lean in well Fame, I lean you
were next on Nightside.
Speaker 8 (31:08):
Go right ahead, I lean, good evening and good evening, Jeff.
I think you were too kind.
Speaker 6 (31:13):
On to the U n.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
You never has.
Speaker 8 (31:23):
I've had plenty of doors. I don't need their website.
You And secondly, we hear this phrase all the time
free hamas. Now, I don't know if these leaders are ignorant,
stupid or just playing corrupt because you can't have a
free Palestine as long as the mass is in control,
(31:45):
and a mass is basically a proxy, proxy or red.
So from my view on I'm Irish factor, I'm not
juwish or just want it out by that. Hamas is
just it's just a proxy of Iran, and this is
just Iran wants to not control all of the Middle
East and down to Africa with this incredible amounts of
(32:06):
genocide too.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
I think you're right. I think you're right, Eileen. Jeff
quick comment if you will.
Speaker 4 (32:13):
I couldn't agree with you more. And the proof is
in the pudding. You have the victims of a genocidal
attack by a genocidal group that pledges to repeat the
genocide until it's finished.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
Achieve genocide.
Speaker 8 (32:28):
It's total brutality, and.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
You have the Israel trying to stop the perpetrators of
the genocide being accused of the genocide. That's how upside down,
that's how Alison wonder.
Speaker 8 (32:39):
And a good good point is how many Jewish citizens
are there in Palestine?
Speaker 6 (32:47):
I assume zero? Correct, Well, yeah, there are one.
Speaker 8 (32:54):
Point five million Arab Israeli Arab is long Israelic people
citizens of Israel. Who's who's so so I'm to said,
if that those are the statistics, then Israel isn't very
good at juicide.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
All right, fair enough, go ahead, no, no, I I
I agree with much of what you say, and I
appreciate the call.
Speaker 8 (33:24):
Thanks Alien, appreciate thank you for your defense of this
because I think I think colass is a threat to
the whole world, the whole free world.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
Thank you very much. Let me go to Esther and
and over Esther, you're next to nights. I appreciate you
calling in with Jeff Robins.
Speaker 9 (33:38):
Pleasure to call your show, Dan Ray, and I'm learning
so much from your guests. Relatives in Israel. Friends, my
son made Aliyah was able to go to Israel Adam anyway,
my father was uh past Apartment State and National Committee
(34:01):
for Jewish War Veterans. My mother was in the auxiliary.
And this is such a complex issue.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
You know, no.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Problem, Nope, nope, we're listening to you. Esther. You go
right ahead, you're on with Jeff, going on.
Speaker 9 (34:16):
I had a chance to go to Israel a few
years ago and I couldn't go.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Did you tell me this was your first time calling earlier? Yes? Yeah, Well,
first of all, thank you very much for be on across.
Don't be nervous, just say what's in your heart. Esther,
go right ahead.
Speaker 9 (34:31):
Thank you. My backstore neighbor Phil Levin, and it's sister
Cherry went to Hebrew Teachers College in Jerusalem and learned
Arabic and it did well. And I taught the kid
how to ride a bicycle. His name was Phil and
changed to me. And I had a friend Stephen Lazars
and Israeluse I could go on and on, and I
(34:55):
God bless everybody.
Speaker 6 (34:58):
You know, we are in.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Agreement, Esther, and I know Jeff appreciates your support tonight,
that's for sure, because it's important. It's important for people
like you to pick up the phone and express yourself
on this program. You're always welcome to call and feel
freak called any night. Okay, I mean that seriously, God
bless all right, right back, gotcha, thanks Esther. Let me
(35:20):
go to Canada. Darryl is up and go ahead, Jeff.
I'm sorry I interrupt you.
Speaker 4 (35:26):
Oh no, no, go right ahead, go right ahead.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Darryl is in New Brunswick, Canada. Darryl a min. It's
getting some frost on the pumpkin up there pretty soon.
Go right ahead, Darryl.
Speaker 3 (35:35):
Oh, we're up to fifty tonight, so we're good for
a couple of days.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
Good, you're right, but yes, but.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Damn, Jeff, great topic. The one thing you mentioned prior
was about the UN. Russia and China. Have they ever
counted how many times Russian and China have vetoed any
kind of negotiation.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I'm sure they have, but I don't have those statistics
in front of me. Probably not as many times as
Pete Rose got base hits, but pretty darn clothes.
Speaker 4 (36:13):
Go ahead, Jeff, Well, I mean, you're you're right that
Russia and China have played a malevolent role in trying
to broker piece in the Middle East. But frankly, they
aren't the reason that there isn't a piece in the
Middle East. The reason there isn't peace in the Middle East,
at least between Israel and the Palestinians, is because, quite simply,
(36:35):
over and over and over and over again, there's been
a rejection of that piece. It takes two to tango,
as they say at the UN, and as long as
it's only one tangoing, we're not going to have an
end to this terrible, painful, bloody conflict.
Speaker 3 (36:53):
In addition, to what you just mentioned. It's what when
people come from the to North America, they keep teaching
the same cycle of the wrongs. It's almost like somebody's
gonna hate on for the other family.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
Yeah. You know, by the way, Daryl, I didn't mention
that your nation, through your current prime minister, also issued
a recognition of Palestine a statehood. No, that's why I know.
I know that represents you know, again, the Canadian government,
(37:38):
at least as it's currently constituted. So we have the
United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, and France, four of our most
important allies, not only deserting the United States position, but
deserting Israel as well. Darryl. Thanks, I'm flat out of time.
I got you in. Thank goodness, and we'll talk soon,
my friend. Okay, thank you so much for it for
(38:00):
checking in. Thanks all right, good night, Jeff Robbins is
always I thank you for your time and your wisdom here.
People just you know, they need to understand how important
this issue is and what's going to the kabuki dance
that is going to be done at the United Nations
(38:21):
for the next couple of weeks whatever while they're in
until the media becomes bored with the historyonics, but it
will be the lead in the nightly newscast. What admonition
final thirty seconds would you give the American people, who
probably are not as focused on this as as you are,
(38:43):
and to some extent as.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
I am, well, it is to focus on what actually
is happening there and not on the kabuki dance. What
is happening there is that one side seems to think
it's within its right to slaughter Israelis and there's just
got to be a stop to that. And unless there
is a stop to that, then this thing is going
(39:08):
to go on. And is it a huge amount of
suffering that's going on in Gaza? Everybody wants it over.
Hamas has it in its power to end this, and
countries like the ones you've discussed have at least an
ability to try to affect what Hamas does and hopefully
not incentivize it to continue doing what it's been doing.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
Absolutely, Jeff Robbins has always Thank you, my friend, and
we will stay on top of this and I'll have
you back quicker than you realize.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Thank you, Thank you, Dan, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Will we get back, will if you'd like to continue
to talk about this. I'm more than game. This is
an issue that is very important to this program, very
important to me. If you're interested, you have the numbers.
If you're not, we'll change topics. Coming back on Night's side,
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