September 12, 2019 • 47 mins
Not everyone is cut out to be an entrepreneur. What if you love your job and where you work, but you really want to make it a better place? What if you want to feel more connected to your work and your co-workers? What if YOU have the power to make it a better place to be?
This week's interview with Jason Treu is for you.
Jason Treu is a Chief People Officer and culture and leadership expert. He helps leaders, managers and HR professionals build high-performing cultures and teams with unbreakable connection, extreme scrappiness and the ability to have courageous conversations. He spent 15+ years in leadership positions working with game-changing leaders such as Steve Jobs, Reed Hastings (CEO at Netflix), and Mark Cuban. He also created the culture and team building game, Cards Against Mundanity that more than 20000 employees to use to significantly improve teamwork, trust and team closeness in minutes.
Dan and Jason sit down and talk about building an amazing culture at work that makes you love where you work even more and helps you do work that makes you feel fulfilled.
In this episode, Dan and Jason discuss...
- How you can become the change you want to see at work instead of waiting for management to create it for you.
- The power of vulnerable sharing at work and how to build an environment where people feel comfortable to open up.
- The right questions you can ask to build real connections in an open environment with your co-workers.
- The #1 factor that builds a strong work culture.
- Why teamwork in the office is more important to productivity than self awareness.
- How you can create your own user manual that can help you and the people you work with build better communication.
Download Cards Against Mundanity and learn more about Jason and his work at JasonTreu.com
Find Jason on Instagram @jasontreu
Find Dan on Instagram @cscdanmason
Join the Life Amplified Power Tribe Facebook group at facebook.com/groups/lifeamplified
To work one-on-one with Dan, visit creativesoulcoaching.net
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Episode seventy nine, How to Be the Change you want
to see in the Workplace with Jason Troy. My name
is Dan Mason. I was overweight, getting divorced, battling depression,
and feeling trapped in a career where I was successful
but bored and unfulfilled. And it's actually the greatest gift
I've ever been given. I use my pain as a
(00:21):
springboard to discover my life's purpose. Now I want to
share the same tools and strategies which helped transform my
life with you so you can live life amplify love.
This quote from Cheryl Sandberg at Facebook. She says true
leadership stems from individuality that is honestly and sometimes imperfectly expressed.
(00:43):
Leaders should strive for authenticity over perfection. But doesn't it
seem like sometimes we go to work in an environment
where the boss is trying to be some cookie cut
out of what he or she believes should be a
true leader, and it just trickles down to the employee.
So many people tell me they feel like a paid
wire every day going to work, and certainly at my
(01:04):
last corporate job that it took in once that honeymoon
period wore off after about eight months, I sat down
with my boss at the time, who was just sort
of like this it look well meaning, little southern guy
receding hairline. You know, he wasn't a bad guy, but
he looked at me one day he's like, you know, buddy,
I'm not telling you that you can't be yourself. But
(01:25):
and as soon as I heard but I was like,
here it is. He's gonna tell me I have to
chandene you I am in order to survive. But this
becomes the problem, you know. To give you another quote
from Simon Sinek, he says customers will never love a
company until the employees love it first. So so much
of this is how do we walk into work every
day a doing work that we love in an environment
(01:49):
where we're truly connected to our coworkers and we can
express ourselves fully and authentically. Well, my guest this week
is going to help us answer the questions on how
we can do it and how we can take it
upon ourselves to change the company culture. Regardless whether or
not you're a manager. Jason Troy is the chief People
(02:09):
Officer and a culture and leadership expert. He helps leaders, managers,
and hr professionals build high performing cultures and teams with
unbreakable connection, extreme scrappiness, and the ability to have courageous conversations.
Over the last fifteen years in leadership, he's worked with
game changers like Steve Jobs, Read Hastings from Netflix, and
(02:30):
Mark Cuban. He's also the creator of a team building
game called Cards Against Mundanity that more than twenty employees
have used to significantly improve teamwork, trust, and team closeness
within minutes. It's an amazing conversation. I really love connecting
with Jason today. In this conversation, some of the things
will discuss or how you can become the change you
(02:51):
want to see at work instead of waiting for management
to create it for you. We'll talk about the power
of vulnerable sharing at work and how to build an
environment where people feel comfortable to open up. He's gonna
tell us the right questions you can ask to build
real connection and an open environment with your co workers.
He's gonna talk to us about the number one factor
that builds a strong work culture. We'll talk about why
(03:13):
teamwork in the office is more important to productivity than
self awareness, and he'll explain how we can create our
own user manual that can help you and the people
you work with build better communication. You can find him
online Jason Troy dot com, Jason t r eu dot com.
And if you're loving the conversation, be sure to screenshot
(03:34):
the podcast uploaded to Instagram. Let Jason and I know
you're listening. You can tag me at c sc Dan Mason,
and you can tag Jason at Jason True t r EU.
Don't forget, still a couple of weeks left for you
to get in the running to win that brand new
pair of Apple air Pods or a one fifty dollar
Amazon gift card. The only thing you have to do is,
(03:56):
if you love in this episode, leave us an honest
review up on Apple or whatever platform you're listening to,
and before your click suit meant take a screenshot and
email it to me Dan at Creative Soul Coaching dot net.
For every new review we get, I'm going to make
a donation that will help feed one and six people
(04:17):
through Feeding America. Plus every entry goes in the running
for that grand prize for the Apple AirPod, so you
can have a more amplified experience listening to the podcast
every week. But from the bottom of my heart, I
appreciate you being part of this community and your reviews,
your kind words. Just help us with the algorithm and
help us get this message in front of more people.
(04:39):
In the meantime, if you love your work but just
want a better work environment, you're gonna learn how to
create it this week as we get Amplified with Jason Troy.
Jason Troy, Welcome to Life Amplified. My man, Hey, Well,
thanks for having me on the show and speaking to
your fantastic drive. It's interesting because you and I talk
(05:01):
about a lot of the same research. We talk about
a lot of the same data, and it's staggering. Two
thirds of people are disengaged at their job in the
United States, and globally the numbers up over But a
lot of the conversations that I've had on this podcast
in the past is for the people it's not even
that they hate their job, but they hate their career.
(05:23):
They got into the wrong vocation, and how do we
steer them in the direction of their purpose. But one
of the things that I think you're going to really
be able to speak to today is for the people
who they like what they're doing, they don't necessarily want
to go out and start an entrepreneurship, but there's some
things going on in the office. They don't feel valued,
they don't feel connected. It's getting in the way of
(05:45):
their experience. So the question is obviously, what the hell
do we do about that? I think, and I think
that question is on the minds of every CEO. It's
on the minds of every head of human resources at
the largest companies having this conversation. And what you're doing
(06:06):
is you're seeing people just try almost anything, right. I mean,
if you look at Zappos, you can look at all
the crazy things that they have tried in the last
several years to really jump start their company and head
it in the right direction. And it's essentially it's the
wild wild West, because what you're seeing now is companies
and it's still on the early side of this, but
(06:28):
at a large level, they're starting to look at KPI s,
profit revenue in any of the financial metrics you want
to go with, is equating to connection, belonging, impacts, psychological safety, vulnerability,
teamwork right, But they don't know how to create that
(06:49):
right and they know that culture execute strategy. But the
problem is is that word culture is like in quotes,
like what does that really mean and how do we
blend that and create ate that inside of our organization
And that's really where the juices now. And so you're
going to start seeing a lot of things and people
(07:09):
talk about it that are going to be off the
reservation kind of crazy, and then people trying all this stuff,
and then probably in the next five or ten years,
you're going to see people start reporting on this more.
And those are the people that are going to be
the leaders at whatever company's size that are out there.
So for the person who is listening today and they're like,
you know, I don't want to go start an entrepreneurship,
(07:33):
but man, I hate walking into the office every day.
And and you've probably seen this as much as I have,
there are plenty of leaders that are like, oh, we're
we're fostering connection and culture. We bought a ping pong
table for the red room for people to use on
their break There's got to be a level beyond this.
And one of your key messages is really the employee
(07:55):
also taking some responsibility for it. I think there's two conversations.
We need better leadership at companies, but we also need
to take responsibility for how we're showing up not just
physically in the office, not you know, taking a P
T O day, but but the energy that we're bringing
and the spirit that we bring into work every day.
(08:15):
Could you talk a little bit more about what that means, Yeah,
because I think the problem we're looking at it typically
when you're looking at culture, team or connection creating purpose
is you're waiting around for someone else to do something
for it to allow you some opportunity or to doing something.
And I think in life, whenever we do that, we
(08:36):
lose control and we feel extremely vulnerable, and then that
leads to paralysis by analysis, and you'll see people lacking
motivation and all the rest of the things instead of
being proactive and really leading the charge. And I think
that you can see the data and stuff like if
you look at they've done studies where if one person
(08:58):
and the team and not the manager, starts to on
a weekly basis say something positive about other teammates and
team meetings, they're looking at their production going up thirty
as a whole, as an entire team with only one person, right,
So there's tons of other data that shows that the
person on a team can change the entire team to
(09:20):
dynamic and that not be the manager itself, so you
don't need to keep waiting around for other people in
order to do that. And I think that when I
looked at how would someone go about doing that, Ultimately
it's the same process as we do in our personal lives,
(09:40):
and that's really through sharing, right, but it's through vulnerable
sharing with other people and in groups. And when you
can do that, you can create significant connections with other
people that are deep and meaningful. And when you get
that level of carrying, that's what creates an opportunity for
(10:02):
other people to bring out their best selves. And then
that allows you to do the same thing right. And
when you can do that, that is when we do
our greatest work. You know, I recently did a podcast
a couple of weeks ago on this topic of vulnerability
more in personal relationships. But let's talk about it in
an office setting. I know you do coaching. I do also,
(10:24):
there are many organizations. I'll give an example from one
of my clients. She had a meeting with one of
the board members of the CEO of the company who
came into town and he started asking these questions like,
so are you married, and she wasn't sure what was
going on. At first, She's like, well, no, I'm divorced,
and he looks at her and says, well, good, that
(10:45):
means you're going to give to your job. There are
people out there who are afraid to self disclose about
their life, who are afraid to talk about their children.
I find this a lot with my female clients because
they're almost scared of like mom penalty when it comes
time for a promotion. There's a lot of men out
there who are struggling to be open if they're struggle,
(11:07):
you know, if they're having a hard time in their
life to talk about that with a coworker because they're
afraid that they'll be seen as weak, particularly to a
male boss. It's great for us to talk about this
idea of well, let's bring our most vulnerable selves into
the office. But how do we feel safe to do that,
and how do we create cultures where that celebrated and
(11:27):
appreciated and not penalized in corporate America. Yeah, well, I
think what you have to do is get people to
start sharing by asking questions right instead of you leading,
Start to get them talking. And if you're leading the team,
you have to be vulnerable and lean with it with
(11:48):
the team, because then it will open them all up, right,
and that's where you'll see performance at the highest levels happen,
right if you're leading a team. But if you're part
of the team, which you have to do is start
asking questions to get other people to start vulnerably sharing.
And a lot of it can be done either by
directly asking some questions to them, right, or you can
(12:11):
even orchestrate it, like I've created a game around these
cards against Mondanity where you can get people to do
it where they're not even really realizing that they're doing
it ahead of time. They're just playing a game sort
of sharing, right. And what happens is that all of
us want to open up and share. The problem is
we don't know how, and we've never really taught this,
and so what happens is we just do it by
(12:32):
chance in our lives, right, We just we open up
and share people at work because an experience happens, some
tragedy happens, or in some down moment, and we decide
to be vulnerable. But it's really more accidental than it
is an operationalized or engineered or something that we do
on a regular basis with everyone. We deal with right
internal and outside the organization as a business, and that's
(12:57):
that's the problem, so we never really experience it. And
then a team, what you'll normally see is some people
get along great, some people don't, and so it's just
their scattered right and their little pockets, and that becomes
the problem because you're not one cohesive unit. You have
best friends or people that you feel like understand you, right,
(13:19):
but then other people don't, and then we're locked in
this lack of diversity of thinking. Right, we just hang
out with many knees and then all these other things
start to spiral in our own lives and then we
feel locked in. And I know I've seen the game
cards against Moundanity game up on your website. What are
some examples of questions that people could bring into the
office that that fostered this environment of sharing, connection and
(13:43):
belonging because a lot of times it's like, oh, we'll
sit around the water cooler, we'll talk about the football
game yesterday, and I'll have some superficial conversation about your
kids my kids. But how do we go a little
bit deeper? You know, one of the research studies that
I found is I was doing this thing. You know,
probably four years ago as I was doing my TED
talk was I was trying to figure out, okay, well,
what research studies are out there to show how what
(14:05):
people have done to sort of recreate the same feeling
that we have when we've met someone in five or
ten minutes and we had a great conversation and we
feel really close to them, like we've known them our
entire life, right, and in that moment we've done in
that one conversation which usually takes twenty or thirty and
so we feel this closeness like that person is in
(14:27):
our inner circles psychologically, but time wise they or not.
So how do we recreate that on a regular basis
with people rather than having only moments throughout a lifetime
where that's possible? And I saw this study by Professor
Arthur Aaron in back he was trying to do something
similar and he got complete strangers with grad students together
(14:48):
and paired them to ask questions, right, thirty six questions
over forty five minutes, and they were pretty vulnerable questions.
And what ended up happening is the people said they
created the closest relationship in their life minutes, right. So
that means I could take anyone listening and go to
a coffee shop and they could find a best friend.
(15:09):
And I've done that before and this works. And what
ends up happening is you ask people questions in a
compressed period of time when you actually can do the
whole cycle, and you know more about them in that
moment then you know about anyone in your life and
anyone will ever ask you. So by really diving in deep,
(15:31):
you can go and build an incredible amount of trust, closeness,
belonging connection in the shortest period of time possible, because
we just don't ask anyone anything, and no one really
knows us very well, even the people we think that
do really don't. And so my premise was, after listening
to this is what happened? Did we do this in
a group? Because one on one someone could share more
(15:54):
than someone else, But in a group, you're going to
find multiple people who you feel really close with that's
going to be sharing, especially if they're answering the same question,
because you'll connect on an experiential level but also on
an emotional level of the people, right, And that's really
where the juices on the emotional level, not even necessarily
on having the same experience the ones we can relate to.
(16:16):
And so I decided, okay, well, there has to be
questions that could start to listt this and after digging
and testing a lot of stuff, their questions such as,
tell me about the most important lesson you've learned in
the last year. Right, if you were to thank one
person for becoming you know the person you are today,
who is that person and what did they do? Right?
Tell me the biggest blessing you had in disguise, Tell
(16:39):
me about what you're most grateful for in your life today. Right.
When we start asking questions like those, and then we
can even dig deeper and ask questions like what's your
greatest achievement. When you ask people like that, or you
ask your boss those questions or your boss's boss like
you learn a lot about who they are as a
person and no one ever asked them these questions. So
(17:00):
it shows that you care. It shows that you're interested
in regardless of whether you even share things, you're learning
about them, right, and that ultimately is more important. If
you don't have an opportunity to share now, it's great
when you can share back with them. Obviously, that's important.
But primarily I look at these things is how do
I learn about other people? How do I learn how
(17:22):
they tick, about their experiences, hot buttons and what matters
to them? Because that allows me to work with them better.
And if I bring out the best in them, they're
going to bring out the best of me, because they're
going to look and say, geez, wow, Jason, you really
care Because no one asked me those questions, even the
people that are my best friends, people that I'm in
life for partnerships with, and Mary too, but you do.
(17:47):
So that must mean something I need to figure out more.
And you know, it's just one of the fundamental needs
that we all have is for connection where tribal creatures.
And what's ironic is so many people are feeling disconnected
at work. But it's not just to work conversation, you know.
I think Visos was the one that was talking about
(18:08):
it that you know, it's this life work continuum. If
you're miserable at work, you're taking the energy home to
your family. But you know, when things aren't clicking in
the evening at home with the people that you love,
you're bringing that back into the office, right Yeah, And
it's and I think today there's all these pressures that
weren't around before. And I think because everyone is trying
(18:28):
to get their life in a great place and there's
so many more complexities we're dealing with that your personal
life is going to impact your business life, so they're
all one and that becomes the bigger challenge today is
when you don't share that and people don't know about that,
you have to hide or try to compartmentalize it or
(18:48):
put it in baggage. And the problem with that is
if people around you don't know that, they will misallocate work,
they won't understand the impact, they can't support you, and
then everyone actually suffers. Right. So, because if if a
person is going through divorce and they don't tell anyone
and they're responsible for a major project, you know they're
not showing up as their best, well you shouldn't give
(19:09):
them the most amount of work because the thing is
gonna fall apart. But if that person doesn't share and
there's an environment, everyone loses on that team because their
production level is hurt and everything fails. Right, So all
this stuff impacts us and in order to work better together,
and so we have to start asking each other these questions,
(19:30):
both one on one in groups, right, even doing it
in terms of our clients, prospects, partners, I mean, other
people in order for us to create that bond, because
ultimately it's all comes down to trust, right, And that's
primarily the whole everything is built on level of trust.
I mean, it's we look at a relationship and I
(19:51):
look at that. That's really the leaf on the tree,
and that's the problem, right, And I used to think
about it differently, but now I look at it that
in the root our trust and you neither have extreme trust,
meaning on a scale on one to five. If it's
not at a five, you can't have a great relationship
and you cannot create your greatest work. So if you
go to a job and it's not good, and then
(20:14):
you go to be an entrepreneur, well you still have
the same problem because you have to create that same
trust with all these people because ultimately you don't have
a successful business that can scale if you don't. So
if you don't figure out how to do that, the
problem just shows up in a different way. It doesn't
go away, right, And that's the problem today is that
people don't know how to do that, and they're not
(20:35):
equipped to do that. And companies and organizations skip over
this as well, right because you'll see stuff as like
if you go and get hired, the on boarding process. Right.
I saw something on LinkedIn about they went through like
their onboarding process, and you know subset six point four was, oh,
let's do ice breakers, right, Well, that should be point
(20:55):
one through twenty six because like you, and that's how
you you integrate the employee faster on the team and
you build trust, performance goes off, happiness, satisfaction, all the
all the problems disappear, right because it's people trust each
other and know each other and know they can count
on each other. And that integration process and time is
(21:18):
what prevents us from doing our greatest work and hurts
us in every possible way. You mentioned something that I
really wanted to go back to for a second because
you were and this was a spin off and what
we were talking about with home and work that how
you do one thing is typically how you do all things.
These situations of fear of vulnerability or hiding yourself at work,
(21:40):
or being the person who is changing who you are
to please others at work, you're bringing that into other
relationships in your life. One of the big reasons why
I love doing executive coaching, and I know that that's
a passion for you as well, because none of us
are ever really taught the soft skills. You know, we
go through through management trainings, but it's more just about
(22:03):
drinking the company kool aid, and it's all these things
about maximizing and squeezing another drop of blood out of
the stone. But none of us are really taught emotional intelligence.
That's a problem, and most of the trains that people
do that go through it are really I think backwards too,
because the problem with doing soft skill training with people
(22:25):
in a room is that they aren't extremely vulnerable and open.
Then you had and shown them the gateway on how
to do that right. It's like I heard things about empathy. Well,
that's great to put yourself into someone else's shoes, and
we can run through all these exercises, but that also
requires a level of trust and getting out of our
(22:45):
own thinking and getting out of our own way and
challenging our own beliefs, assumptions and leaving them away. And
we won't do that unless we deeply care. And you
can't mimic that for a bunch of exercises. You've got
to show people how to do that immediately with the
people around them and c at that connection level where
they actually care, because otherwise all the rest of this
stuff is just it's the same thing as a hard
(23:06):
skills training. Will show this and how how it goes.
You know, how you do this, and then you can
practice this, and then no one does it, and then
no one's really good at it. Yeah. You know. One
of the things that I work a lot with in
my coaching business is talking about attachment. And it's so
funny because people are like, well, what does my childhood
stuff have to do with how I'm showing up at work?
And the answer is everything. You know, if you're a
(23:27):
person who is avoidant attachment and you're not, you know,
you like to keep people at arms length, you don't
like to open up to people, or maybe you're just
really rigid and create. You know, you grew up in
a home where there was a lot of rules, so
you didn't know how to connect emotionally. You're absolutely going
to bring that into work relationships. You know, an anxious
attachment person who is afraid of rejection and is constantly
(23:52):
molding who they are to please others. Yeah, they might
advance up the ladder for a period of time at
work and then one day go, well, who the hell
am I? And why am I? So this ceram but
nobody's having these conversations incorporate. And I think that that's
the next level is to really sort of take that
that masculine energy facet of do do do achieve, achieve, achieve,
(24:14):
let's go colonize Mars, but actually combine it with that
feminine energy need for connection. Is that where the the
exponential companies of the future are really going to be created. Well, yeah,
because I mean I think teamwork is I realize now
that ultimately I used to put sol awareness at the top,
and now I actually think it's probably more teamwork because
ultimately a lot of people won't do the soulf awareness work,
(24:37):
and I think without learning how to do teamwork as
a soft skill, everything else is lost. Because your ability
to work with other people now is the hardest thing
ever because before, if we go back forty years, you
were around people for a really long period of time,
so you had a lot of leeway in order to
(24:57):
create relationships. Now, with agile team and things moving around
really fast, you don't. But your success depends on those
relationships with other people and getting the most out of them.
And if you don't figure out how to do that
as an employee, as a manager, as a leader, I
don't care where you are, you're not going to be successful.
And because these compressed times, you have to do what
(25:19):
Professor Arthur Aaron did as part of what you do
every single day, and if you don't, you won't be
as successful. And if we go back and look at
the most successful times we've had in our career, whether
they are moments or years, you were able to do
that or somehow that was facilitated to create really close,
great relationships with whomever you had to deal with, and
(25:40):
that is when you did your greatest work. Right, Let's
forget about how, but let's think about the feeling you
had in that moment. Right. If you go back to that,
that's what it's all dependent on, is how do I
create that feeling with other people and that feeling towards me.
That's where the juice really is. It's not on your
own performance level because that's a slippery slope, because that's
(26:04):
like the sales person who's great at selling, but then
a horrible sales manager, which happens all the time, right so,
and all the data shows you that it doesn't really matter.
Your performance level will not help you pass an individual
contributor level at all. In fact, it actually will undo
you if you can't bring out the best in other people.
(26:25):
The current culture right now, particularly if you look on
Instagram and you watch any of the air quote influencers,
is I can't achieve this teamwork in the office, I
can't get my needs meant, I'm not safe. My company
doesn't care about me. You know. There's a lot of
people who believe that. So the answer for them becomes,
I got it. I'll become an entrepreneur that will solve everything.
(26:48):
And you and I had an interesting conversation before the
interview today that you said if you had had a
different experience when you were in your corporate job, that
you would not have become an entrepreneur. I think people
lose sight that there's also a lot of challenges and
going to work for yourself, and that a lot of
(27:08):
these same things about building safety, building connection with others
applies just as much in entrepreneurships as as in corporate America.
Could you speak more to a your experience and why
you left, but also some of the challenges that you
faced and how in some ways it's not any better
when you go to work for yourself. Yeah. Well, part
(27:29):
of it was the fact that I, you know, when
I was working in corporate America, I got to a
point where I just got disenfranchise, I think more so
from the people that I was around. And I guess
I never really thought about that. I had a really
surround myself with people that brought up in the best
in me and sort of interviewed when I was interviewing
(27:50):
to interview for the fit for me behaviorally, not just
on the company itself. Sure, what is my boss? Did
they bring the same values I do? What? What? How?
Did they work right? And I think because I didn't
find that, it became this just political battle and people
that really I didn't have. Now. I had that at
(28:12):
other points at the times in my career, but over
the last few jobs I had, there were just things
that ended up happening. So it seemed like being an
entrepreneur was the way for me to make it all
line up. But I think that if I would have
had different environments and around different people, I may have
looked at it differently because I could have done some
(28:33):
great work inside of an organization. I just didn't. I
didn't have it right. But in retrospect, I think that
it really was true. But also I think the conversations
we're having right now, I mean, I didn't have when
I started doing stuff, you know, seven eight years ago,
so that probably also led to the path that I'm
on today. But I also think, like a larger picture,
(28:56):
whenever thing's really had way too far to one way
or another, they swing left or right. You have to
realize that often that's an over correction, and an over
correction is that people are not really seeing things as
clearly as they should and have to dive deep. And
I think that's part of the challenge, is that being
an entrepreneur, we still have to do the same thing.
I got to create great relationships. I have a different
(29:17):
level of headache and challenges of finding clients, dealing with
all the rest of this stuff, traveling, working you know,
seven days a week on this thing continually, and having
to deal with new sets of problems that I didn't
have before. So it's just different. It's not necessarily better
or worse. It's just not the same, And I think
that's the problem I think a lot of people we
talked about beforehand is that people talk about entrepreneurism is
(29:40):
some great thing, but end of the day, if we
had to lock people in the room and put you know,
lie detector test on there, you find a lot of
stuff you're seeing on Facebook and ESPN highlights is not
the truth. Right. They're dealing with the same level of
challenges they had before. It's just different. I think people
have to realize that. So oftentimes, if you're in a
situation where may it's not the greatest for you, but
(30:02):
you like your work, it's time to start really diving
around and asking questions and looking for organizations that one
start espousing the values and things that you really care about.
And then as you start interviewing, it matters more about
the people that you're going to work with and start
to behaviorally interviewing them right and not just asking them
(30:26):
normal interview questions, but asking hard questions like how do
you hand people on the team are having a dispute?
How how does that handle on your team? Right? Like?
What do you do about it? How do you help
your people that on your team that you manage how
to develop them, right, Like, how do you help them
on their career path? Right? I mean questions, right, tell
me about what is your biggest pet peeve, what's your
(30:47):
hot button? And if you start asking questions like that
in the interviewing process, you're going to find organizations and
environments that are much better for you overall. Right, It's
the same way when I help clients, when they start
interviewing behaviorally, they find way better candidates that are hot,
much higher retention. It's just that most people don't do
that because they look at a job and they hire
(31:08):
for the hard skills. They don't hire for the soft
skills and the personality and a personality test can only
tell you so much. It more tells about experience and
how they're dealing with stuff behaviorally super important points. And
I've always believed that back when I was working in corporate,
and I've given that advice to other people, that the
interview process is just as much you interviewing an employer
(31:31):
as it is then interviewing you. It can be the
best benefits and you know, the sexiest company in the world,
but if it's not aligned with your values, and particularly
your boss is not matched up with your values. You're
going to be dead in the water after a few
months once the new cars wears off. Correct, Yeah, exactly,
and that happens, right, But often, like time, the other
(31:51):
way is entrepreneurism is the same way, right. You have
clients and you're going to have the same problems on
that end. It's not it's not some sure all solved problem.
People wake up like, oh my god, I'm an entrepreneur.
It's the greatest thing ever. Right. The people who think
that are being led and sold the bill of goods
that aren't true. And so I just think that we
need have more to conversations about the reality of all
(32:11):
of this stuff because it's going to take people longer
and longer. When I started out, the word of advice
from people was probably would take you five to seven
years to really build a successful sustainable business. That same
conversation changed over the last several years where more people
were telling me it's probably gonna take you somewhere between
ten to fifteen if you don't have it at that point,
(32:34):
right that where you have a seven figure business that's
consistent and scanaling growth right now, not stalling, but at
a really significant clip. Right, Well, that changes. That's the
pretty hard road to go. If someone says, well, you know,
what's gonna take you fifteen years to build a business
where you're not waking up on Saturday night with sweat
(32:54):
on your pillow because you're wondering how you're going to
grow the business in the next twelve months, Well, the
question is do you want that or not? In some
ways it's six of six of one a half dozen
of the other. Right, Like for some people being in
a job that is not aligned with their values, there's
struggling that. Obviously they're struggling going to bed at night going, uh,
(33:16):
is this all there is? Like is this what I'm
working toward? And then you know, maybe I get to
enjoy ten years after retirement and then I'm dead. But
on the other side and working for yourself, it's not
so much struggle, but it's challenge. You're more in control
of it. But it just depends on what your recipe is.
You know, do you want to put in the work
(33:37):
and take the personal responsibility for it, or do you
want to you know, shift, modify, adapt or or in
some regards settle and you know, get the secure paycheck
every two weeks. Yeah, and I think it's just something
that I know we talked about. I think it's just
a conversation that really hasn't been had normally, and I
think people need to really think about that, because you know,
(33:59):
I've known a bunch of people, and some of them
have actually helped that have been an entrepreneur go back
to corporate America and find the places that actually fit better.
And I know that's not what most people would do
in a coaching modality or helping consulting with people. But
I find often that people are making these choices because
they think it's the only option is to get out right.
(34:19):
But it's not. Now. I will tell you it is
still a mine, a very small minority, but they all
are out there right. If you look at companies like
w D forty, they almost had zero turnover in their company,
and people i've interviewed their love it. I interviewed to
mid one mid and one senior level of person and
I asked him a question, I said, what would it
take for you to leave your job and go to
(34:41):
another company? And they also they both of them said
they would have to get at least fifty more and
pay because they said they would never find another company
like this, or a place where people cared about them
across the board, and they wouldn't give that up for anything,
or unless it was most significant that because they had families,
(35:03):
that they would have to choose that over their family.
But even then they said they would probably hesitate because
they know that money wouldn't buy them long term happiness.
So there are multiple tactical routes to build a career
that you love. Right. You could stay working for your
existing company. You could go find another company that's you know,
(35:23):
that pays more, it's more aligned with your values. You
could go to work for yourself. But what we're talking
about at the end of the day is the real
juice and all this is what are your emotional needs,
which for most of us is connection, safety and trust
and realizing that if you don't know how to build
that where you're at, until you really know that skill
(35:46):
how to cultivate it, then maybe it doesn't matter what
tactic you take, You're going to find yourself back at
s where one all roads lead to the same place. Right.
And I think that the conversation we're having is extremely
valuable because I think it's one that probably if we
look at all the podcast out there, there's probably close
to zero that are having them. Maybe there maybe one
other one. I mean I think there's probably almost none,
because that is really the key. If you can't do
(36:08):
those things, you can't just leave to go somewhere else
and then decide to to figure out that, oh I'm
going to learn this, because those are the hardest lessons
in life to learn, right. I mean, there's so few
people that can do that consistently. Right. You could argue
that probably subone percent, right, maybe a hundredth of a
(36:29):
percent of end people out that are able to do that, right.
I mean, I'm working on these years and it's a
struggle to come up with stealth like to interview managers right,
really great manager. I spend time probably interview more than
a thousand people over the last few years to try
to understand what they're doing. And all of them are struggling,
and they're learning from other people by asking and trial
by error to do things right. And so if I
(36:51):
were to do a couple of things, if I were
an employee, one, I would start to figure out how
I can vulnerably share and self disclosed and get other
people to do it. The next thing that I would
do to get people actually practical things to do is
create your own user manual. Right. I've seen these where
managers and teams do them. Where a user manual is
(37:13):
here's how to work with me, right, here's my hot buttons,
here's my communication style, Here's how I build trust. If
you're having a problem with me, here's how to pull
me aside and give me hard feedback. Right, here's what
I don't like to be challenged on. Right. I mean,
there's a whole set of questions you can do, and
literally you can create this on your own. You don't
(37:35):
need buying from your manager, you don't need buying from anyone,
And literally you could hand us out to the team
and saying, look, I want to make it easier for
everyone to work with me on the team. And I
know a lot of people may not know how to
communicate with me well, or maybe they just want to
do it better, or maybe they just want additional information
just in general. Right, Well, I created something that's going
(37:56):
to help you be able to work with me better.
That's another step in this process that I would start
to do would be to send something out like that, right,
which is really from what I'm hearing you as you
explain that that would be the ultimate vulnerability in the office, right, Like,
here's the manual on me wards and all, this is
(38:18):
what I'm great at, this is what I suck at,
and yeah, here you go. Let's make it work because
then people know. Right, the problem in most of the
situations for team or too, if we look at it,
we're guessing. We're trying to predict and analyze, and what
happens is we're wrong most of the time. And we're
typically right about the people that are most like us, Right,
(38:41):
I think like us and act like us because it
isn't as far as stretch and we're sort of kindred spirits. Well,
the problem is that most people are not like that,
So you're gonna have challenges with probably in some form
or another because they don't understand you. Well. Explicit communication
is the best way, and it's hard for a lot
people to do that. So the other way to do
(39:02):
it is to create a user manual, right. I mean,
if you're in ray dally is created in its company,
you know, a radical candor right where people just say
what's on their mind. Well, most organizations don't have that
um and I'm not sure whether that's great or not
it works for them, but you have to do something
in order to help other people understand you better. Right,
(39:24):
And that would be the second thing that I would
end up doing right. And then I think the third
thing I would start to do is really invest in
understand how do you create great teamwork? How do I
create create soft skills? What is my emotional intelligence? Look
in my self awareness? Right? And even if you know
you have limited opportunities to do that, and that's only
(39:46):
reading books, listening to a podcast or whatever it is,
be way better off served doing that than doing nothing,
even if you have zero budget to do this on right,
because those are incredibly important in order to create teamwork
and interact with people better. Even if you don't have
the support of your boss, even if you know the
support of the organization, you can still create it differently
(40:10):
in other people. Right. And I would say the fourth
thing I would do is I would praise other people
and share how much value and impact they have on you. Right.
Do thanksgiving cards coming up to all the people on
your team or people you work with, thanking them for
helping me, right, and tell them why they what they
did right? How it impacted you, and thanking them for
(40:33):
stuff right and meanings too, because what will happen is
is that people will love working with you, because if
you look at all the data to people would rather
have someone publicly praise them than get money. You all
might think that's crazy, but that's what people write down
and tell because getting praise from other people and getting
thanked is probably one of the things that happens the
(40:56):
fewest and the least amount. And think about in your
personal life, how some of them that actually happens where
someone doesn't say I love you, but someone says I
love you because you went out of your way and
did X, Y and Z, and you know, this is
the impact that had on me, and I'm grateful for it, right,
I mean, that's I mean, let's be honest. I mean,
that doesn't happen to any of us unless we're really
(41:18):
fortunate to be in a situation probably more than a
couple of handfuls in our entire life. You know, my
friend Kristen Hadid who's been on this podcast, she started
basically just as a way to afford to buy designer
jeans when she was in college. She started a company
called Student made out of Florida, and she started hiring
other college students and they were cleaning houses. And it's
(41:39):
more than a maid service now, as it is just
like a place of culture and training and giving young
people both soft and hard skills for when they go
out into the world. But one of the things that
she did to incorporate this in her company is they
just have a wall where people will post either on
post it notes or grab a piece of paper and
you take it up to the wall that there's just
(42:00):
a wall of praise where people acknowledge their coworkers, acknowledge
the people who went the extra mile, somebody who went
in above and beyond the call of duty. But that
is just like a foundation of the culture that they've
built in their company and it's really helped and their
retention rates are crazy. Yeah, And that's a great idea, right. So,
I mean, if you just did those four things, you
(42:23):
would see a radical change in the next thirty days
and how people interacted with you. And if you do
it for an entire year, those things alone, you're gonna
see your performance go up, You're gonna make more money,
you're gonna be better in your career, and things are
gonna look significantly differently, right, because that will help change
all the stuff we're talking about and make it better
(42:44):
because that's the route, right, that's and you'll see it
show up and manifest itself on the leaf of the tree.
But you'll do it in a way that's consistent, and
that will give you abundance, right, and so it'll start
popping up. You're like, oh my gosh, all these great
things are happening. Yeah, because you're looking at the actual roots. Right.
That's why when people talk about abundance and I'm like
(43:06):
and all these great things happening, I'm like, yeah, because
you're doing the right things to feed the tree at
the root level. So that's why they're all popping off.
Otherwise it wouldn't happen like that. And consistency is a
word you've used several times today, But I think that
that's important. There are so many companies that might do
like the the beach Day where they all take a
(43:27):
field trip and do three legged races and have the
cook out one day summer to get everybody together. But
this has got to be if not daily, then at
least a weekly effort to foster this environment. Correct. Yeah,
and I mean I think if you take the lead
and you go to your manager and you say things like, hey,
can we just you know, can we go around and
(43:48):
have everyone that started a weekly meeting thanks someone for
helping them in the last month, right. Or another exercise
could be I've had teams do this, is that everyone
email or tax someone outside the team and thank them
for helping them and what they did. Right, we just
went through this, And if you do, if you do
something like that, everyone feels good and everyone getting that
(44:11):
tax or email in the organization or a company feels
great to get it right, and it takes and it
would take you three minutes to do it, and the
effects would be massive for the entire day of production,
and that team meeting will be much more productive. Now, you,
as an empltee, can suggest that to your manager, and
I don't know many managers and say, oh, that's really
a dumb idea because they you'd be thinking where everyone
(44:33):
would be really in a good mood and they'd be
more productive. And the manager would say, well, heck, let
me try this, because what do I have to lose
At this point the meetings are boring and I know it, Well,
what can I do to spice them up. And if
you gave a couple of ideas and how to do
it right, why not so you can influence people at
every level because most people want help right. Most managers,
end of the day, aren't some evil person. They just
(44:54):
don't know how to manage other people need because they're
not managing and leading themselves, and organizations do a very
poor job of helping them and their expectations are out
of the roof of what they need to do. So
if you show and care and give them ideas and
be proactive, now not only are you the hero, but
you're making everything in your team better and you're the
(45:15):
person that is causing all these things to occur. I
love it. Amazing conversation today, Jason Troy, Thank you so
much for the time. And if people want to find
you online, what is the best place for them to
do it? Sure, they can go to my website. It's
Jason Troy dot com Jason t r eu dot com.
And then you can download Cards Against Mundanity the game
(45:38):
that you can use at Cards against Mundanity and it's free,
and there's also a card paid card deck that people
can use as well. Because some people want to have
something nicer that they can use. So amazing. Thank you
so much for the insights. I think that this is
a conversation that I haven't had on this podcast, and
like you said, I don't think many people are having.
It's an important one and I thank you for leading
(46:00):
the way on it. I realized I have a reputation
for being me. Do you hate your job? Guy? And
the fact is there are many people who were stuck
in a soul sucking job where they really need to
transition into an entirely new career. That Dad's meaning. But
there are so many of some of my best clients
and some of my favorite clients who genuinely love the
(46:22):
work they're currently doing, but they haven't found that way
to bring their most authentic self. They don't feel like
they can fully self express in the workplace, and that
is a difficult way to go. So I was so
excited that we could have this conversation. It's a very
different one than we've had here on the podcast before.
And if it's serving you, let Jason and I know
(46:43):
screenshot the podcast uploaded to Instagram or Twitter. You can
find me at c sc Dan, Mason and Jason can
be found at Jason Troy t r EU. Don't forget
those honest reviews up on Apple or whatever podcast platform
you listen too. We're running the contest for reviews right now,
(47:03):
so we'll pick one lucky person coming up at the
end of the first week of October, and we will
get them their choice of an Amazon gift card or
a brand new pair of Apple air Pods. Still time
for you to get in there. And if you're looking
for some one on one support to create a career
and the life full of meaning, passion and more free time,
(47:24):
I've got you v I P. Coaching spots are open
right now. You can apply to work with me at
my website, Creative Soul Coaching dot net. I'd love you
for listening, Thank you so much for being here, and
I'll talk to you next week. In the meantime, turn
down the volume on your negativity, turn up the volume
on your purpose so you can live life amplifi
Episode seventy nine, How to Be the Change you want
to see in the Workplace with Jason Troy. My name
is Dan Mason. I was overweight, getting divorced, battling depression,
and feeling trapped in a career where I was successful
but bored and unfulfilled. And it's actually the greatest gift
I've ever been given. I use my pain as a
(00:21):
springboard to discover my life's purpose. Now I want to
share the same tools and strategies which helped transform my
life with you so you can live life amplify love.
This quote from Cheryl Sandberg at Facebook. She says true
leadership stems from individuality that is honestly and sometimes imperfectly expressed.
(00:43):
Leaders should strive for authenticity over perfection. But doesn't it
seem like sometimes we go to work in an environment
where the boss is trying to be some cookie cut
out of what he or she believes should be a
true leader, and it just trickles down to the employee.
So many people tell me they feel like a paid
wire every day going to work, and certainly at my
(01:04):
last corporate job that it took in once that honeymoon
period wore off after about eight months, I sat down
with my boss at the time, who was just sort
of like this it look well meaning, little southern guy
receding hairline. You know, he wasn't a bad guy, but
he looked at me one day he's like, you know, buddy,
I'm not telling you that you can't be yourself. But
(01:25):
and as soon as I heard but I was like,
here it is. He's gonna tell me I have to
chandene you I am in order to survive. But this
becomes the problem, you know. To give you another quote
from Simon Sinek, he says customers will never love a
company until the employees love it first. So so much
of this is how do we walk into work every
day a doing work that we love in an environment
(01:49):
where we're truly connected to our coworkers and we can
express ourselves fully and authentically. Well, my guest this week
is going to help us answer the questions on how
we can do it and how we can take it
upon ourselves to change the company culture. Regardless whether or
not you're a manager. Jason Troy is the chief People
(02:09):
Officer and a culture and leadership expert. He helps leaders, managers,
and hr professionals build high performing cultures and teams with
unbreakable connection, extreme scrappiness, and the ability to have courageous conversations.
Over the last fifteen years in leadership, he's worked with
game changers like Steve Jobs, Read Hastings from Netflix, and
(02:30):
Mark Cuban. He's also the creator of a team building
game called Cards Against Mundanity that more than twenty employees
have used to significantly improve teamwork, trust, and team closeness
within minutes. It's an amazing conversation. I really love connecting
with Jason today. In this conversation, some of the things
will discuss or how you can become the change you
(02:51):
want to see at work instead of waiting for management
to create it for you. We'll talk about the power
of vulnerable sharing at work and how to build an
environment where people feel comfortable to open up. He's gonna
tell us the right questions you can ask to build
real connection and an open environment with your co workers.
He's gonna talk to us about the number one factor
that builds a strong work culture. We'll talk about why
(03:13):
teamwork in the office is more important to productivity than
self awareness, and he'll explain how we can create our
own user manual that can help you and the people
you work with build better communication. You can find him
online Jason Troy dot com, Jason t r eu dot com.
And if you're loving the conversation, be sure to screenshot
(03:34):
the podcast uploaded to Instagram. Let Jason and I know
you're listening. You can tag me at c sc Dan Mason,
and you can tag Jason at Jason True t r EU.
Don't forget, still a couple of weeks left for you
to get in the running to win that brand new
pair of Apple air Pods or a one fifty dollar
Amazon gift card. The only thing you have to do is,
(03:56):
if you love in this episode, leave us an honest
review up on Apple or whatever platform you're listening to,
and before your click suit meant take a screenshot and
email it to me Dan at Creative Soul Coaching dot net.
For every new review we get, I'm going to make
a donation that will help feed one and six people
(04:17):
through Feeding America. Plus every entry goes in the running
for that grand prize for the Apple AirPod, so you
can have a more amplified experience listening to the podcast
every week. But from the bottom of my heart, I
appreciate you being part of this community and your reviews,
your kind words. Just help us with the algorithm and
help us get this message in front of more people.
(04:39):
In the meantime, if you love your work but just
want a better work environment, you're gonna learn how to
create it this week as we get Amplified with Jason Troy.
Jason Troy, Welcome to Life Amplified. My man, Hey, Well,
thanks for having me on the show and speaking to
your fantastic drive. It's interesting because you and I talk
(05:01):
about a lot of the same research. We talk about
a lot of the same data, and it's staggering. Two
thirds of people are disengaged at their job in the
United States, and globally the numbers up over But a
lot of the conversations that I've had on this podcast
in the past is for the people it's not even
that they hate their job, but they hate their career.
(05:23):
They got into the wrong vocation, and how do we
steer them in the direction of their purpose. But one
of the things that I think you're going to really
be able to speak to today is for the people
who they like what they're doing, they don't necessarily want
to go out and start an entrepreneurship, but there's some
things going on in the office. They don't feel valued,
they don't feel connected. It's getting in the way of
(05:45):
their experience. So the question is obviously, what the hell
do we do about that? I think, and I think
that question is on the minds of every CEO. It's
on the minds of every head of human resources at
the largest companies having this conversation. And what you're doing
(06:06):
is you're seeing people just try almost anything, right. I mean,
if you look at Zappos, you can look at all
the crazy things that they have tried in the last
several years to really jump start their company and head
it in the right direction. And it's essentially it's the
wild wild West, because what you're seeing now is companies
and it's still on the early side of this, but
(06:28):
at a large level, they're starting to look at KPI s,
profit revenue in any of the financial metrics you want
to go with, is equating to connection, belonging, impacts, psychological safety, vulnerability,
teamwork right, But they don't know how to create that
(06:49):
right and they know that culture execute strategy. But the
problem is is that word culture is like in quotes,
like what does that really mean and how do we
blend that and create ate that inside of our organization
And that's really where the juices now. And so you're
going to start seeing a lot of things and people
(07:09):
talk about it that are going to be off the
reservation kind of crazy, and then people trying all this stuff,
and then probably in the next five or ten years,
you're going to see people start reporting on this more.
And those are the people that are going to be
the leaders at whatever company's size that are out there.
So for the person who is listening today and they're like,
you know, I don't want to go start an entrepreneurship,
(07:33):
but man, I hate walking into the office every day.
And and you've probably seen this as much as I have,
there are plenty of leaders that are like, oh, we're
we're fostering connection and culture. We bought a ping pong
table for the red room for people to use on
their break There's got to be a level beyond this.
And one of your key messages is really the employee
(07:55):
also taking some responsibility for it. I think there's two conversations.
We need better leadership at companies, but we also need
to take responsibility for how we're showing up not just
physically in the office, not you know, taking a P
T O day, but but the energy that we're bringing
and the spirit that we bring into work every day.
(08:15):
Could you talk a little bit more about what that means, Yeah,
because I think the problem we're looking at it typically
when you're looking at culture, team or connection creating purpose
is you're waiting around for someone else to do something
for it to allow you some opportunity or to doing something.
And I think in life, whenever we do that, we
(08:36):
lose control and we feel extremely vulnerable, and then that
leads to paralysis by analysis, and you'll see people lacking
motivation and all the rest of the things instead of
being proactive and really leading the charge. And I think
that you can see the data and stuff like if
you look at they've done studies where if one person
(08:58):
and the team and not the manager, starts to on
a weekly basis say something positive about other teammates and
team meetings, they're looking at their production going up thirty
as a whole, as an entire team with only one person, right,
So there's tons of other data that shows that the
person on a team can change the entire team to
(09:20):
dynamic and that not be the manager itself, so you
don't need to keep waiting around for other people in
order to do that. And I think that when I
looked at how would someone go about doing that, Ultimately
it's the same process as we do in our personal lives,
(09:40):
and that's really through sharing, right, but it's through vulnerable
sharing with other people and in groups. And when you
can do that, you can create significant connections with other
people that are deep and meaningful. And when you get
that level of carrying, that's what creates an opportunity for
(10:02):
other people to bring out their best selves. And then
that allows you to do the same thing right. And
when you can do that, that is when we do
our greatest work. You know, I recently did a podcast
a couple of weeks ago on this topic of vulnerability
more in personal relationships. But let's talk about it in
an office setting. I know you do coaching. I do also,
(10:24):
there are many organizations. I'll give an example from one
of my clients. She had a meeting with one of
the board members of the CEO of the company who
came into town and he started asking these questions like,
so are you married, and she wasn't sure what was
going on. At first, She's like, well, no, I'm divorced,
and he looks at her and says, well, good, that
(10:45):
means you're going to give to your job. There are
people out there who are afraid to self disclose about
their life, who are afraid to talk about their children.
I find this a lot with my female clients because
they're almost scared of like mom penalty when it comes
time for a promotion. There's a lot of men out
there who are struggling to be open if they're struggle,
(11:07):
you know, if they're having a hard time in their
life to talk about that with a coworker because they're
afraid that they'll be seen as weak, particularly to a
male boss. It's great for us to talk about this
idea of well, let's bring our most vulnerable selves into
the office. But how do we feel safe to do that,
and how do we create cultures where that celebrated and
(11:27):
appreciated and not penalized in corporate America. Yeah, well, I
think what you have to do is get people to
start sharing by asking questions right instead of you leading,
Start to get them talking. And if you're leading the team,
you have to be vulnerable and lean with it with
(11:48):
the team, because then it will open them all up, right,
and that's where you'll see performance at the highest levels happen,
right if you're leading a team. But if you're part
of the team, which you have to do is start
asking questions to get other people to start vulnerably sharing.
And a lot of it can be done either by
directly asking some questions to them, right, or you can
(12:11):
even orchestrate it, like I've created a game around these
cards against Mondanity where you can get people to do
it where they're not even really realizing that they're doing
it ahead of time. They're just playing a game sort
of sharing, right. And what happens is that all of
us want to open up and share. The problem is
we don't know how, and we've never really taught this,
and so what happens is we just do it by
(12:32):
chance in our lives, right, We just we open up
and share people at work because an experience happens, some
tragedy happens, or in some down moment, and we decide
to be vulnerable. But it's really more accidental than it
is an operationalized or engineered or something that we do
on a regular basis with everyone. We deal with right
internal and outside the organization as a business, and that's
(12:57):
that's the problem, so we never really experience it. And
then a team, what you'll normally see is some people
get along great, some people don't, and so it's just
their scattered right and their little pockets, and that becomes
the problem because you're not one cohesive unit. You have
best friends or people that you feel like understand you, right,
(13:19):
but then other people don't, and then we're locked in
this lack of diversity of thinking. Right, we just hang
out with many knees and then all these other things
start to spiral in our own lives and then we
feel locked in. And I know I've seen the game
cards against Moundanity game up on your website. What are
some examples of questions that people could bring into the
office that that fostered this environment of sharing, connection and
(13:43):
belonging because a lot of times it's like, oh, we'll
sit around the water cooler, we'll talk about the football
game yesterday, and I'll have some superficial conversation about your
kids my kids. But how do we go a little
bit deeper? You know, one of the research studies that
I found is I was doing this thing. You know,
probably four years ago as I was doing my TED
talk was I was trying to figure out, okay, well,
what research studies are out there to show how what
(14:05):
people have done to sort of recreate the same feeling
that we have when we've met someone in five or
ten minutes and we had a great conversation and we
feel really close to them, like we've known them our
entire life, right, and in that moment we've done in
that one conversation which usually takes twenty or thirty and
so we feel this closeness like that person is in
(14:27):
our inner circles psychologically, but time wise they or not.
So how do we recreate that on a regular basis
with people rather than having only moments throughout a lifetime
where that's possible? And I saw this study by Professor
Arthur Aaron in back he was trying to do something
similar and he got complete strangers with grad students together
(14:48):
and paired them to ask questions, right, thirty six questions
over forty five minutes, and they were pretty vulnerable questions.
And what ended up happening is the people said they
created the closest relationship in their life minutes, right. So
that means I could take anyone listening and go to
a coffee shop and they could find a best friend.
(15:09):
And I've done that before and this works. And what
ends up happening is you ask people questions in a
compressed period of time when you actually can do the
whole cycle, and you know more about them in that
moment then you know about anyone in your life and
anyone will ever ask you. So by really diving in deep,
(15:31):
you can go and build an incredible amount of trust, closeness,
belonging connection in the shortest period of time possible, because
we just don't ask anyone anything, and no one really
knows us very well, even the people we think that
do really don't. And so my premise was, after listening
to this is what happened? Did we do this in
a group? Because one on one someone could share more
(15:54):
than someone else, But in a group, you're going to
find multiple people who you feel really close with that's
going to be sharing, especially if they're answering the same question,
because you'll connect on an experiential level but also on
an emotional level of the people, right, And that's really
where the juices on the emotional level, not even necessarily
on having the same experience the ones we can relate to.
(16:16):
And so I decided, okay, well, there has to be
questions that could start to listt this and after digging
and testing a lot of stuff, their questions such as,
tell me about the most important lesson you've learned in
the last year. Right, if you were to thank one
person for becoming you know the person you are today,
who is that person and what did they do? Right?
Tell me the biggest blessing you had in disguise, Tell
(16:39):
me about what you're most grateful for in your life today. Right.
When we start asking questions like those, and then we
can even dig deeper and ask questions like what's your
greatest achievement. When you ask people like that, or you
ask your boss those questions or your boss's boss like
you learn a lot about who they are as a
person and no one ever asked them these questions. So
(17:00):
it shows that you care. It shows that you're interested
in regardless of whether you even share things, you're learning
about them, right, and that ultimately is more important. If
you don't have an opportunity to share now, it's great
when you can share back with them. Obviously, that's important.
But primarily I look at these things is how do
I learn about other people? How do I learn how
(17:22):
they tick, about their experiences, hot buttons and what matters
to them? Because that allows me to work with them better.
And if I bring out the best in them, they're
going to bring out the best of me, because they're
going to look and say, geez, wow, Jason, you really
care Because no one asked me those questions, even the
people that are my best friends, people that I'm in
life for partnerships with, and Mary too, but you do.
(17:47):
So that must mean something I need to figure out more.
And you know, it's just one of the fundamental needs
that we all have is for connection where tribal creatures.
And what's ironic is so many people are feeling disconnected
at work. But it's not just to work conversation, you know.
I think Visos was the one that was talking about
(18:08):
it that you know, it's this life work continuum. If
you're miserable at work, you're taking the energy home to
your family. But you know, when things aren't clicking in
the evening at home with the people that you love,
you're bringing that back into the office, right Yeah, And
it's and I think today there's all these pressures that
weren't around before. And I think because everyone is trying
(18:28):
to get their life in a great place and there's
so many more complexities we're dealing with that your personal
life is going to impact your business life, so they're
all one and that becomes the bigger challenge today is
when you don't share that and people don't know about that,
you have to hide or try to compartmentalize it or
(18:48):
put it in baggage. And the problem with that is
if people around you don't know that, they will misallocate work,
they won't understand the impact, they can't support you, and
then everyone actually suffers. Right. So, because if if a
person is going through divorce and they don't tell anyone
and they're responsible for a major project, you know they're
not showing up as their best, well you shouldn't give
(19:09):
them the most amount of work because the thing is
gonna fall apart. But if that person doesn't share and
there's an environment, everyone loses on that team because their
production level is hurt and everything fails. Right, So all
this stuff impacts us and in order to work better together,
and so we have to start asking each other these questions,
(19:30):
both one on one in groups, right, even doing it
in terms of our clients, prospects, partners, I mean, other
people in order for us to create that bond, because
ultimately it's all comes down to trust, right, And that's
primarily the whole everything is built on level of trust.
I mean, it's we look at a relationship and I
(19:51):
look at that. That's really the leaf on the tree,
and that's the problem, right, And I used to think
about it differently, but now I look at it that
in the root our trust and you neither have extreme trust,
meaning on a scale on one to five. If it's
not at a five, you can't have a great relationship
and you cannot create your greatest work. So if you
go to a job and it's not good, and then
(20:14):
you go to be an entrepreneur, well you still have
the same problem because you have to create that same
trust with all these people because ultimately you don't have
a successful business that can scale if you don't. So
if you don't figure out how to do that, the
problem just shows up in a different way. It doesn't
go away, right, And that's the problem today is that
people don't know how to do that, and they're not
(20:35):
equipped to do that. And companies and organizations skip over
this as well, right because you'll see stuff as like
if you go and get hired, the on boarding process. Right.
I saw something on LinkedIn about they went through like
their onboarding process, and you know subset six point four was, oh,
let's do ice breakers, right, Well, that should be point
(20:55):
one through twenty six because like you, and that's how
you you integrate the employee faster on the team and
you build trust, performance goes off, happiness, satisfaction, all the
all the problems disappear, right because it's people trust each
other and know each other and know they can count
on each other. And that integration process and time is
(21:18):
what prevents us from doing our greatest work and hurts
us in every possible way. You mentioned something that I
really wanted to go back to for a second because
you were and this was a spin off and what
we were talking about with home and work that how
you do one thing is typically how you do all things.
These situations of fear of vulnerability or hiding yourself at work,
(21:40):
or being the person who is changing who you are
to please others at work, you're bringing that into other
relationships in your life. One of the big reasons why
I love doing executive coaching, and I know that that's
a passion for you as well, because none of us
are ever really taught the soft skills. You know, we
go through through management trainings, but it's more just about
(22:03):
drinking the company kool aid, and it's all these things
about maximizing and squeezing another drop of blood out of
the stone. But none of us are really taught emotional intelligence.
That's a problem, and most of the trains that people
do that go through it are really I think backwards too,
because the problem with doing soft skill training with people
(22:25):
in a room is that they aren't extremely vulnerable and open.
Then you had and shown them the gateway on how
to do that right. It's like I heard things about empathy. Well,
that's great to put yourself into someone else's shoes, and
we can run through all these exercises, but that also
requires a level of trust and getting out of our
(22:45):
own thinking and getting out of our own way and
challenging our own beliefs, assumptions and leaving them away. And
we won't do that unless we deeply care. And you
can't mimic that for a bunch of exercises. You've got
to show people how to do that immediately with the
people around them and c at that connection level where
they actually care, because otherwise all the rest of this
stuff is just it's the same thing as a hard
(23:06):
skills training. Will show this and how how it goes.
You know, how you do this, and then you can
practice this, and then no one does it, and then
no one's really good at it. Yeah. You know. One
of the things that I work a lot with in
my coaching business is talking about attachment. And it's so
funny because people are like, well, what does my childhood
stuff have to do with how I'm showing up at work?
And the answer is everything. You know, if you're a
(23:27):
person who is avoidant attachment and you're not, you know,
you like to keep people at arms length, you don't
like to open up to people, or maybe you're just
really rigid and create. You know, you grew up in
a home where there was a lot of rules, so
you didn't know how to connect emotionally. You're absolutely going
to bring that into work relationships. You know, an anxious
attachment person who is afraid of rejection and is constantly
(23:52):
molding who they are to please others. Yeah, they might
advance up the ladder for a period of time at
work and then one day go, well, who the hell
am I? And why am I? So this ceram but
nobody's having these conversations incorporate. And I think that that's
the next level is to really sort of take that
that masculine energy facet of do do do achieve, achieve, achieve,
(24:14):
let's go colonize Mars, but actually combine it with that
feminine energy need for connection. Is that where the the
exponential companies of the future are really going to be created. Well, yeah,
because I mean I think teamwork is I realize now
that ultimately I used to put sol awareness at the top,
and now I actually think it's probably more teamwork because
ultimately a lot of people won't do the soulf awareness work,
(24:37):
and I think without learning how to do teamwork as
a soft skill, everything else is lost. Because your ability
to work with other people now is the hardest thing
ever because before, if we go back forty years, you
were around people for a really long period of time,
so you had a lot of leeway in order to
(24:57):
create relationships. Now, with agile team and things moving around
really fast, you don't. But your success depends on those
relationships with other people and getting the most out of them.
And if you don't figure out how to do that
as an employee, as a manager, as a leader, I
don't care where you are, you're not going to be successful.
And because these compressed times, you have to do what
(25:19):
Professor Arthur Aaron did as part of what you do
every single day, and if you don't, you won't be
as successful. And if we go back and look at
the most successful times we've had in our career, whether
they are moments or years, you were able to do
that or somehow that was facilitated to create really close,
great relationships with whomever you had to deal with, and
(25:40):
that is when you did your greatest work. Right, Let's
forget about how, but let's think about the feeling you
had in that moment. Right. If you go back to that,
that's what it's all dependent on, is how do I
create that feeling with other people and that feeling towards me.
That's where the juice really is. It's not on your
own performance level because that's a slippery slope, because that's
(26:04):
like the sales person who's great at selling, but then
a horrible sales manager, which happens all the time, right so,
and all the data shows you that it doesn't really matter.
Your performance level will not help you pass an individual
contributor level at all. In fact, it actually will undo
you if you can't bring out the best in other people.
(26:25):
The current culture right now, particularly if you look on
Instagram and you watch any of the air quote influencers,
is I can't achieve this teamwork in the office, I
can't get my needs meant, I'm not safe. My company
doesn't care about me. You know. There's a lot of
people who believe that. So the answer for them becomes,
I got it. I'll become an entrepreneur that will solve everything.
(26:48):
And you and I had an interesting conversation before the
interview today that you said if you had had a
different experience when you were in your corporate job, that
you would not have become an entrepreneur. I think people
lose sight that there's also a lot of challenges and
going to work for yourself, and that a lot of
(27:08):
these same things about building safety, building connection with others
applies just as much in entrepreneurships as as in corporate America.
Could you speak more to a your experience and why
you left, but also some of the challenges that you
faced and how in some ways it's not any better
when you go to work for yourself. Yeah. Well, part
(27:29):
of it was the fact that I, you know, when
I was working in corporate America, I got to a
point where I just got disenfranchise, I think more so
from the people that I was around. And I guess
I never really thought about that. I had a really
surround myself with people that brought up in the best
in me and sort of interviewed when I was interviewing
(27:50):
to interview for the fit for me behaviorally, not just
on the company itself. Sure, what is my boss? Did
they bring the same values I do? What? What? How?
Did they work right? And I think because I didn't
find that, it became this just political battle and people
that really I didn't have. Now. I had that at
(28:12):
other points at the times in my career, but over
the last few jobs I had, there were just things
that ended up happening. So it seemed like being an
entrepreneur was the way for me to make it all
line up. But I think that if I would have
had different environments and around different people, I may have
looked at it differently because I could have done some
(28:33):
great work inside of an organization. I just didn't. I
didn't have it right. But in retrospect, I think that
it really was true. But also I think the conversations
we're having right now, I mean, I didn't have when
I started doing stuff, you know, seven eight years ago,
so that probably also led to the path that I'm
on today. But I also think, like a larger picture,
(28:56):
whenever thing's really had way too far to one way
or another, they swing left or right. You have to
realize that often that's an over correction, and an over
correction is that people are not really seeing things as
clearly as they should and have to dive deep. And
I think that's part of the challenge, is that being
an entrepreneur, we still have to do the same thing.
I got to create great relationships. I have a different
(29:17):
level of headache and challenges of finding clients, dealing with
all the rest of this stuff, traveling, working you know,
seven days a week on this thing continually, and having
to deal with new sets of problems that I didn't
have before. So it's just different. It's not necessarily better
or worse. It's just not the same, And I think
that's the problem I think a lot of people we
talked about beforehand is that people talk about entrepreneurism is
(29:40):
some great thing, but end of the day, if we
had to lock people in the room and put you know,
lie detector test on there, you find a lot of
stuff you're seeing on Facebook and ESPN highlights is not
the truth. Right. They're dealing with the same level of
challenges they had before. It's just different. I think people
have to realize that. So oftentimes, if you're in a
situation where may it's not the greatest for you, but
(30:02):
you like your work, it's time to start really diving
around and asking questions and looking for organizations that one
start espousing the values and things that you really care about.
And then as you start interviewing, it matters more about
the people that you're going to work with and start
to behaviorally interviewing them right and not just asking them
(30:26):
normal interview questions, but asking hard questions like how do
you hand people on the team are having a dispute?
How how does that handle on your team? Right? Like?
What do you do about it? How do you help
your people that on your team that you manage how
to develop them, right, Like, how do you help them
on their career path? Right? I mean questions, right, tell
me about what is your biggest pet peeve, what's your
(30:47):
hot button? And if you start asking questions like that
in the interviewing process, you're going to find organizations and
environments that are much better for you overall. Right, It's
the same way when I help clients, when they start
interviewing behaviorally, they find way better candidates that are hot,
much higher retention. It's just that most people don't do
that because they look at a job and they hire
(31:08):
for the hard skills. They don't hire for the soft
skills and the personality and a personality test can only
tell you so much. It more tells about experience and
how they're dealing with stuff behaviorally super important points. And
I've always believed that back when I was working in corporate,
and I've given that advice to other people, that the
interview process is just as much you interviewing an employer
(31:31):
as it is then interviewing you. It can be the
best benefits and you know, the sexiest company in the world,
but if it's not aligned with your values, and particularly
your boss is not matched up with your values. You're
going to be dead in the water after a few
months once the new cars wears off. Correct, Yeah, exactly,
and that happens, right, But often, like time, the other
(31:51):
way is entrepreneurism is the same way, right. You have
clients and you're going to have the same problems on
that end. It's not it's not some sure all solved problem.
People wake up like, oh my god, I'm an entrepreneur.
It's the greatest thing ever. Right. The people who think
that are being led and sold the bill of goods
that aren't true. And so I just think that we
need have more to conversations about the reality of all
(32:11):
of this stuff because it's going to take people longer
and longer. When I started out, the word of advice
from people was probably would take you five to seven
years to really build a successful sustainable business. That same
conversation changed over the last several years where more people
were telling me it's probably gonna take you somewhere between
ten to fifteen if you don't have it at that point,
(32:34):
right that where you have a seven figure business that's
consistent and scanaling growth right now, not stalling, but at
a really significant clip. Right, Well, that changes. That's the
pretty hard road to go. If someone says, well, you know,
what's gonna take you fifteen years to build a business
where you're not waking up on Saturday night with sweat
(32:54):
on your pillow because you're wondering how you're going to
grow the business in the next twelve months, Well, the
question is do you want that or not? In some
ways it's six of six of one a half dozen
of the other. Right, Like for some people being in
a job that is not aligned with their values, there's
struggling that. Obviously they're struggling going to bed at night going, uh,
(33:16):
is this all there is? Like is this what I'm
working toward? And then you know, maybe I get to
enjoy ten years after retirement and then I'm dead. But
on the other side and working for yourself, it's not
so much struggle, but it's challenge. You're more in control
of it. But it just depends on what your recipe is.
You know, do you want to put in the work
(33:37):
and take the personal responsibility for it, or do you
want to you know, shift, modify, adapt or or in
some regards settle and you know, get the secure paycheck
every two weeks. Yeah, and I think it's just something
that I know we talked about. I think it's just
a conversation that really hasn't been had normally, and I
think people need to really think about that, because you know,
(33:59):
I've known a bunch of people, and some of them
have actually helped that have been an entrepreneur go back
to corporate America and find the places that actually fit better.
And I know that's not what most people would do
in a coaching modality or helping consulting with people. But
I find often that people are making these choices because
they think it's the only option is to get out right.
(34:19):
But it's not. Now. I will tell you it is
still a mine, a very small minority, but they all
are out there right. If you look at companies like
w D forty, they almost had zero turnover in their company,
and people i've interviewed their love it. I interviewed to
mid one mid and one senior level of person and
I asked him a question, I said, what would it
take for you to leave your job and go to
(34:41):
another company? And they also they both of them said
they would have to get at least fifty more and
pay because they said they would never find another company
like this, or a place where people cared about them
across the board, and they wouldn't give that up for anything,
or unless it was most significant that because they had families,
(35:03):
that they would have to choose that over their family.
But even then they said they would probably hesitate because
they know that money wouldn't buy them long term happiness.
So there are multiple tactical routes to build a career
that you love. Right. You could stay working for your
existing company. You could go find another company that's you know,
(35:23):
that pays more, it's more aligned with your values. You
could go to work for yourself. But what we're talking
about at the end of the day is the real
juice and all this is what are your emotional needs,
which for most of us is connection, safety and trust
and realizing that if you don't know how to build
that where you're at, until you really know that skill
(35:46):
how to cultivate it, then maybe it doesn't matter what
tactic you take, You're going to find yourself back at
s where one all roads lead to the same place. Right.
And I think that the conversation we're having is extremely
valuable because I think it's one that probably if we
look at all the podcast out there, there's probably close
to zero that are having them. Maybe there maybe one
other one. I mean I think there's probably almost none,
because that is really the key. If you can't do
(36:08):
those things, you can't just leave to go somewhere else
and then decide to to figure out that, oh I'm
going to learn this, because those are the hardest lessons
in life to learn, right. I mean, there's so few
people that can do that consistently. Right. You could argue
that probably subone percent, right, maybe a hundredth of a
(36:29):
percent of end people out that are able to do that, right.
I mean, I'm working on these years and it's a
struggle to come up with stealth like to interview managers right,
really great manager. I spend time probably interview more than
a thousand people over the last few years to try
to understand what they're doing. And all of them are struggling,
and they're learning from other people by asking and trial
by error to do things right. And so if I
(36:51):
were to do a couple of things, if I were
an employee, one, I would start to figure out how
I can vulnerably share and self disclosed and get other
people to do it. The next thing that I would
do to get people actually practical things to do is
create your own user manual. Right. I've seen these where
managers and teams do them. Where a user manual is
(37:13):
here's how to work with me, right, here's my hot buttons,
here's my communication style, Here's how I build trust. If
you're having a problem with me, here's how to pull
me aside and give me hard feedback. Right, here's what
I don't like to be challenged on. Right. I mean,
there's a whole set of questions you can do, and
literally you can create this on your own. You don't
(37:35):
need buying from your manager, you don't need buying from anyone,
And literally you could hand us out to the team
and saying, look, I want to make it easier for
everyone to work with me on the team. And I
know a lot of people may not know how to
communicate with me well, or maybe they just want to
do it better, or maybe they just want additional information
just in general. Right, Well, I created something that's going
(37:56):
to help you be able to work with me better.
That's another step in this process that I would start
to do would be to send something out like that, right,
which is really from what I'm hearing you as you
explain that that would be the ultimate vulnerability in the office, right, Like,
here's the manual on me wards and all, this is
(38:18):
what I'm great at, this is what I suck at,
and yeah, here you go. Let's make it work because
then people know. Right, the problem in most of the
situations for team or too, if we look at it,
we're guessing. We're trying to predict and analyze, and what
happens is we're wrong most of the time. And we're
typically right about the people that are most like us, Right,
(38:41):
I think like us and act like us because it
isn't as far as stretch and we're sort of kindred spirits. Well,
the problem is that most people are not like that,
So you're gonna have challenges with probably in some form
or another because they don't understand you. Well. Explicit communication
is the best way, and it's hard for a lot
people to do that. So the other way to do
(39:02):
it is to create a user manual, right. I mean,
if you're in ray dally is created in its company,
you know, a radical candor right where people just say
what's on their mind. Well, most organizations don't have that
um and I'm not sure whether that's great or not
it works for them, but you have to do something
in order to help other people understand you better. Right,
(39:24):
And that would be the second thing that I would
end up doing right. And then I think the third
thing I would start to do is really invest in
understand how do you create great teamwork? How do I
create create soft skills? What is my emotional intelligence? Look
in my self awareness? Right? And even if you know
you have limited opportunities to do that, and that's only
(39:46):
reading books, listening to a podcast or whatever it is,
be way better off served doing that than doing nothing,
even if you have zero budget to do this on right,
because those are incredibly important in order to create teamwork
and interact with people better. Even if you don't have
the support of your boss, even if you know the
support of the organization, you can still create it differently
(40:10):
in other people. Right. And I would say the fourth
thing I would do is I would praise other people
and share how much value and impact they have on you. Right.
Do thanksgiving cards coming up to all the people on
your team or people you work with, thanking them for
helping me, right, and tell them why they what they
did right? How it impacted you, and thanking them for
(40:33):
stuff right and meanings too, because what will happen is
is that people will love working with you, because if
you look at all the data to people would rather
have someone publicly praise them than get money. You all
might think that's crazy, but that's what people write down
and tell because getting praise from other people and getting
thanked is probably one of the things that happens the
(40:56):
fewest and the least amount. And think about in your
personal life, how some of them that actually happens where
someone doesn't say I love you, but someone says I
love you because you went out of your way and
did X, Y and Z, and you know, this is
the impact that had on me, and I'm grateful for it, right,
I mean, that's I mean, let's be honest. I mean,
that doesn't happen to any of us unless we're really
(41:18):
fortunate to be in a situation probably more than a
couple of handfuls in our entire life. You know, my
friend Kristen Hadid who's been on this podcast, she started
basically just as a way to afford to buy designer
jeans when she was in college. She started a company
called Student made out of Florida, and she started hiring
other college students and they were cleaning houses. And it's
(41:39):
more than a maid service now, as it is just
like a place of culture and training and giving young
people both soft and hard skills for when they go
out into the world. But one of the things that
she did to incorporate this in her company is they
just have a wall where people will post either on
post it notes or grab a piece of paper and
you take it up to the wall that there's just
(42:00):
a wall of praise where people acknowledge their coworkers, acknowledge
the people who went the extra mile, somebody who went
in above and beyond the call of duty. But that
is just like a foundation of the culture that they've
built in their company and it's really helped and their
retention rates are crazy. Yeah, And that's a great idea, right. So,
I mean, if you just did those four things, you
(42:23):
would see a radical change in the next thirty days
and how people interacted with you. And if you do
it for an entire year, those things alone, you're gonna
see your performance go up, You're gonna make more money,
you're gonna be better in your career, and things are
gonna look significantly differently, right, because that will help change
all the stuff we're talking about and make it better
(42:44):
because that's the route, right, that's and you'll see it
show up and manifest itself on the leaf of the tree.
But you'll do it in a way that's consistent, and
that will give you abundance, right, and so it'll start
popping up. You're like, oh my gosh, all these great
things are happening. Yeah, because you're looking at the actual roots. Right.
That's why when people talk about abundance and I'm like
(43:06):
and all these great things happening, I'm like, yeah, because
you're doing the right things to feed the tree at
the root level. So that's why they're all popping off.
Otherwise it wouldn't happen like that. And consistency is a
word you've used several times today, But I think that
that's important. There are so many companies that might do
like the the beach Day where they all take a
(43:27):
field trip and do three legged races and have the
cook out one day summer to get everybody together. But
this has got to be if not daily, then at
least a weekly effort to foster this environment. Correct. Yeah,
and I mean I think if you take the lead
and you go to your manager and you say things like, hey,
can we just you know, can we go around and
(43:48):
have everyone that started a weekly meeting thanks someone for
helping them in the last month, right. Or another exercise
could be I've had teams do this, is that everyone
email or tax someone outside the team and thank them
for helping them and what they did. Right, we just
went through this, And if you do, if you do
something like that, everyone feels good and everyone getting that
(44:11):
tax or email in the organization or a company feels
great to get it right, and it takes and it
would take you three minutes to do it, and the
effects would be massive for the entire day of production,
and that team meeting will be much more productive. Now, you,
as an empltee, can suggest that to your manager, and
I don't know many managers and say, oh, that's really
a dumb idea because they you'd be thinking where everyone
(44:33):
would be really in a good mood and they'd be
more productive. And the manager would say, well, heck, let
me try this, because what do I have to lose
At this point the meetings are boring and I know it, Well,
what can I do to spice them up. And if
you gave a couple of ideas and how to do
it right, why not so you can influence people at
every level because most people want help right. Most managers,
end of the day, aren't some evil person. They just
(44:54):
don't know how to manage other people need because they're
not managing and leading themselves, and organizations do a very
poor job of helping them and their expectations are out
of the roof of what they need to do. So
if you show and care and give them ideas and
be proactive, now not only are you the hero, but
you're making everything in your team better and you're the
(45:15):
person that is causing all these things to occur. I
love it. Amazing conversation today, Jason Troy, Thank you so
much for the time. And if people want to find
you online, what is the best place for them to
do it? Sure, they can go to my website. It's
Jason Troy dot com Jason t r eu dot com.
And then you can download Cards Against Mundanity the game
(45:38):
that you can use at Cards against Mundanity and it's free,
and there's also a card paid card deck that people
can use as well. Because some people want to have
something nicer that they can use. So amazing. Thank you
so much for the insights. I think that this is
a conversation that I haven't had on this podcast, and
like you said, I don't think many people are having.
It's an important one and I thank you for leading
(46:00):
the way on it. I realized I have a reputation
for being me. Do you hate your job? Guy? And
the fact is there are many people who were stuck
in a soul sucking job where they really need to
transition into an entirely new career. That Dad's meaning. But
there are so many of some of my best clients
and some of my favorite clients who genuinely love the
(46:22):
work they're currently doing, but they haven't found that way
to bring their most authentic self. They don't feel like
they can fully self express in the workplace, and that
is a difficult way to go. So I was so
excited that we could have this conversation. It's a very
different one than we've had here on the podcast before.
And if it's serving you, let Jason and I know
(46:43):
screenshot the podcast uploaded to Instagram or Twitter. You can
find me at c sc Dan, Mason and Jason can
be found at Jason Troy t r EU. Don't forget
those honest reviews up on Apple or whatever podcast platform
you listen too. We're running the contest for reviews right now,
(47:03):
so we'll pick one lucky person coming up at the
end of the first week of October, and we will
get them their choice of an Amazon gift card or
a brand new pair of Apple air Pods. Still time
for you to get in there. And if you're looking
for some one on one support to create a career
and the life full of meaning, passion and more free time,
(47:24):
I've got you v I P. Coaching spots are open
right now. You can apply to work with me at
my website, Creative Soul Coaching dot net. I'd love you
for listening, Thank you so much for being here, and
I'll talk to you next week. In the meantime, turn
down the volume on your negativity, turn up the volume
on your purpose so you can live life amplifi
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