December 2, 2025 • 33 mins
At the top of the hour Wes Uhler joins Tom to discuss the Steelers, then Mike DeFabo at the bottom of the hour.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Tom Offerman in for Mark Man Today.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
This segment is brought to us by eighty four Lumber,
a dynasty partner of the Pittsburgh Steelers, joining me now
in studio. You hear him on the Drive every day
with Matt Williamson on Steelers Nation Radio. He is Wesley Yuler. Wes,
thanks for joining me in studio, partner.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Always fun to put a face to the legend that
is Tommy Radio. Let's be honest. You just finished the
drive and you just mosied on over here. Yeah, I
mean I came down like two studios. It was a
really far trip. But you know, in these gray, soulless studios,
you can never really tell which room is which.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, the big news that just broke was Darius Slay
getting released by the Steelers. I don't think that's a
big deal at all because he was probably going to
be an act of moving forward every week as long
as everybody was healthy in that secondary. And I think
they got enough out of us Sante Samuel where they
were like, hey, we're good with him moving forward. It's
going to be him and Pierre's kind of that duo
opposite of Joey Porter Junior And do you want to
go out and try to find your way with someone else.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Darius Slay feel free.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Yeah, And I like that they give him that option,
you know, for a veteran guy end of his career. Hey,
we're not just gonna make you inactive for the rest
of the season. Go ahead and see if you can
seek employment somewhere else. But I think you're right the
writing on the wall. Maybe we should have seen this.
I mean, his role has steadily decreased. He was a
healthy scratch. He was inactive on Sunday against Buffalo. And then, yes,
(01:20):
I'll be it, in a small sample size, you saw
a Sante Samuel Junior finally after a couple weeks of practice.
And then, you know, Mike Tomlin earlier today it is
weekly Tuesday press conferences. You know, I forget what the
exact line was, but he said something like, we liked
what we saw or we liked what we've seen with
a Sante Samuel Junior. So I think this makes a
ton of sense. I think he can slot in well
(01:41):
right now with what you're asking him to do. And
tom if it goes pretty you know, Darius Slay was
a one year lease, you know, in an apartment downtown,
whereas a Sante Samuel, he could be a mortgage for
you for a few years. If you like what you
see here, in the next couple of weeks, you bring
him back. He's in Latrobe in late July. He's in
the mix, you know, with Eckles and Joey Porter Junior,
(02:03):
and hopefully maybe there could be something longer term here
with him too that you were just never gonna get
with Sleigh.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I mean, he's on the right side of thirty by
a couple of years. I'd still think he'd be in
the Charger second area right now if he didn't have
that devastating injury at the end of last season. Today
at Mike Thomlins press conference West he ruled out Derek Harmon,
which I think is just great news considering the Bills
just ran for two hundred and forty nine yards without
Harmon out there, and they're facing Derrick Henry and the Ravens,
who in their previous two games combined for two or
(02:30):
for five hundred and nineteen rushing yards against the Steelers.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So you need Harmon out there.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I don't want to put it all on the rookie
shoulders and say, hey, you have a great run defense
with him, a terrible one without him. But kind of
seems to be that way, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
One of the things that I talked about with our
buddy Matt Williamson on the drive today was how there's
not much I know about this team for sure right now.
You know, I know the defense is heavily reliant on takeaways,
and when they get him, the Steelers can win. When
they don't, the Steelers aren't gonna win. And even sometimes
when they get him, like they did in the first
half against Buffalo, it only gets you a four point
(03:02):
lead and not as worthwhile as you need it to be.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
The Bears game got him, didn't win the game.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
And even you know, against New England in Indianapolis, you
got five and six and it was only a one
possession of inner. I know how reliant this team is
and this defense are on splash plays. There's not a
ton else that I know other than this area or
that player has underwhelmed. But another thing that I do
know is if you look at this Steelers run defense
with and without Derek Harmon, it's a drastic difference.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
It's like it was with Cam Hayward. Last with Cam Hayward.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
Last year, the Steelers were like a top five run
defense when he was on the field and a bottom
five run defense when he was off the field. And
it's almost getting to feel that way with Derek Harmon.
Think about how much they struggled against the run those
first two weeks when he was absent at the start
of this year, and then he comes back in New
England and they get better, and they were really good
in Dublin in that department against the Vikings. There was
(03:52):
I think a direct correlation between Harmon's absence and James
Cook running right at where he typically is on the
defensive line to great success on Sunday, over and over
and over again. And you're right, you shouldn't be putting
that on the rookie. You shouldn't be that reliant on
one player, especially a rookie, on your defensive line. But
(04:13):
I think it's pretty clear, and maybe high Smith deserves some,
you know, some credit in this regard to because he's
good against the run and has missed a few weeks.
But Derek Harmon has been so crucial to the kind
of ebb and flow the pendulum that we've felt about
this Steelers run defense. And it really showed on Sunday,
and you mentioned against a guy like Derrick Henry, even
(04:33):
with Lamar clearly not being healthy and his you know,
athleticism and his legs not being as big of a factor,
you could see Derek Henry getting like twenty five carries
and just them being unable to slow him down. Once again,
Harmon is a is a huge absence. I think we
all spent time last week talking like what's the bigger loss?
Broderick Jones on the offensive line, Derek Harmon on the
(04:54):
defensive line, both in the trenches, both big guys. With
all due respect to Broderick Jones, I think it was
shown that it's Derek Harmon. On Sunday, we have some
more Steelers breaking news. You ready for this, He's a
little spicy. They have claimed veteran wide receiver Adam Thielen
off of waiver. No, Lord, I got a feeling Adam
Thielen is a Pittsburgh Steeler.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Does that solve anything as far as the wide receiver
too is concerned. I don't even know if like they
got a Jacoby Meyer type of player in here, that
it would have solved anything, because I just don't know
if they know how to use it properly, Like, I
don't know if that offense is capable of getting the
most out of a number two wide receiver because they
ain't getting the most out of the number one wide receiver.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Like, how are we going to talk about getting more
out of your number two wide receiver when we're having
that same conversation, when we're having that conversation with John
hu Smith and Pat Fryarmouth.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
It's everybody in the past game.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
You might have Rob Gronkowski dipped in Randy Moss in
their prime walking out there on Sunday, Tom and I'm
not sure if they could put up numbers.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
It's a massive issue.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
It hasn't mattered who the quarterback was, It hasn't mattered
who the number two wide receiver was. It hasn't mattered
how you deploy the tight ends. Maybe this is another
thing that we know for sure about this team. The
pass game has been utterly ineffective. You know, they signed
MVS to the practice squad a few weeks ago. Haven't
seen him, And I'm not saying I'm like beating the
door down for that guy, but at least he's a
different body type than Calvin Anderson and Roman Wilson. He's
(06:17):
bigger and has some of that, you know, not nearly
to DK Metcalf size, but he again is certainly bigger
than Roman Wilson or Calvin Austin. I just they have
had failure to launch on so many elements of this offense.
I think a lot of it gets back in the
in the inconsistencies in the ground game. But even still,
when they've had Jalen Warren running really effectively, it hasn't
(06:38):
translated to opening things up and having success in the
pass game.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Tom.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
This is kind of like, I give them a smidge
of credit for at least trying something, But this is
also like, this is the equivalent of like showing up
for your college class when you're hungover at eight thirty
in the morning. Yeah, you're there, but are you really
gonna do anything? Are you really gonna learn anything?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I doubt it.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And it's just another player that, you know, if this
was in twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, this would be great.
I'd love having Adamtheland on the team. It's just passed
his prime. Played in eleven games for the Vikings this year,
caught eight balls for sixty nine yards, did not find
the end zone. Last year with Carolina, started ten games,
six hundred and fifteen yards on forty eight catches for
(07:19):
five touchdowns. This is a former second team All Pro,
former Pro bowler who's just way past his prime. And again,
you know when people keep talking about how great George
Pickens is doing in Dallas in that same vein that
we were just talking with Jacobe Meyer as someone who's
better in their prime than Adam Thielen coming in here
being a wide receiver too. I just don't trust this
(07:40):
offense to get the most out of them. So I
get what you're saying, like it's they haven't done to
them for addressing it right now and trying something, But
this is not going to do anything for them.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
No, they haven't figured it out with DK, they haven't
figured out with John news Smith, guys that are much
more in their prime and much more talented. And yeah,
Tom again, like you have to do something, but it
almost feels like polishing the brass on the Titanic.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Should Aaron Rodgers be playing right now in your opinion,
especially since it's so clear he cannot take a snap
under center and that limits your playbook especially the running
portion of your playbook.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
I'm gonna steal a Matt Williamson line and say, this
isn't exactly what you asked me. But he loves saying that,
doesn't He does love saying that. And you also know
too that that's when you're gonna get the good stuff.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah right. I don't know if I can say the same, You.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Know, is that an insult to us, by the way,
because it's like, why aren't you asking me the right?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Why aren't you asking me something?
Speaker 3 (08:30):
I think he's an NFL head coach here or something
he could dictate how the questions are asked, you know.
I I don't know, I.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Tom, I just I don't know.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I don't think he should play. I think if you
can't get under center, it limits you too much.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
What I would have really liked to see.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And again this is the not what you asked me
and easy to see in hindsight or easy to say
in hindsight.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Pardon me.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
It would have been probably better to sit him down
against Buffalo again this past Sunday, give him that kind
of two games off three weeks to get right. Here's
the fence that I sit on, is I don't think
it's gonna get much better with Mason. Like, your only
chance of somewhat improving this offense, somewhat saving the season,
maybe going to the playoffs, is for Aaron Rodgers to
(09:16):
perform like he did, you know, back at times in
September and October.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Yeah, Jets game, Bengals game, they lost.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Absolutely right, even you know, like the Browns game coming
out of the Byway, the offense was effective. There's been times.
I'm not saying that they were a top five, top
ten unit in the NFL, but there's certainly been times
where they've been effective, and he's been the straw that
stirred that drink. That's your only hope of really turning
a corner or you know, noticeably improving as an offense.
(09:42):
But it's also very clear that he is not one
hundred percent healthy. Tom He turns forty two years old today.
He turned forty two years old today, and he got
a thirty five year old wide receiver as a gift.
And he got a thirty five year old wide receiver
as a gift who caught eight passes so far this season.
How's that risk gonna you know, if he was thirty,
maybe it's a different conversation. But I think even if
(10:03):
you set him down for a couple weeks at this point,
it probably doesn't make that much of a difference. And
here I am talking in circles about this because there's
no clear cut answer. But I would continue to stick
with Aaron Rodgers because I again, I think Mason is
a fine, serviceable backup, but he's not going to change
the trajectory of your season. Neither is Will Howard, who
hasn't taking a meaningful snap until early August.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
I'm sure him in.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
There, six and six, six and sixth Baltimore, I'll go
into the Ravens House for a chance to take control
of the division. Throw the kid from the sixth round
in there. Can't run, can't throw, can't protect. But let's
put in the quarterback who hasn't thrown a pass since August.
I just there is no right answer, so I'm a
default too. I'll continue to ride with the future Hall
of Fame quarterback, even if he's clearly only seventy seventy
(10:48):
five eighty percent healthy, whatever it is, because that's your
only hope to get right, is him getting right.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
Now.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
They do go to Baltimore this weekend to face the Ravens,
one of two games against Baltimore in the month of
December for the down the stretch run. Their last game
of the season in January at home against the Ravens
as well. It's sad to say this, but the best
thing that the Steelers have going for them right now
between these two six and six teams is that the
Ravens aren't playing well either. Is that they're having the
injured and they're having these same talks on their Ravens
(11:16):
Nations radios and all their Ravens talk shows too.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Is that what's.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Wrong with the offense? We can't get complimentary football going.
Once the defense, you know, gets up to speed, our
offense all of a sudden disappears.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
So similar criticisms for the coaches exactly past their prime.
Things are getting stale.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
So the Ravens are in a lot of the same
places that the Steelers are.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
In right now.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
So at least you have something going in your favor.
Is that they stink too. So it's like who can
stink less?
Speaker 3 (11:44):
On Sunday tom one of these two teams has to
make the playoffs or do they? And well, I don't
think the Bengals coming off from the outside. I think
the Bengals if they had if they were five and
seven instead of four and eight, completely different conversations, they
could have won one more games like that one against
Chicago that they gave as game Jets game that they
gave away. Either of those, they would really be scary
(12:04):
right now, because I do think their defense is slightly improved.
But for Baltimore and Pittsburgh, one of these teams has
to make the playoffs, and it's almost like one of
them is gonna be the ugliest girl at the beauty pageant,
you know, and hey, you if you're at the beauty pageant,
there's still something to be said for that. But it
is a very interesting. This is another thing Matt and
I talked about. You know, typically when you get to
(12:25):
this time of year, Steelers Ravens historically, right, it's like two.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Dogs, one bone. You know, one of these teams.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Is gonna win the division, one's gonna go to the
AFC Championship Game.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
One's gonna have a chance to win the super Bowl.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
It's now it's kind of like who can crawl to
the finish line and just outlast the other that's had
a disappointing year, that's dealing with a lot of injuries,
that has a roster and a coaching staff, and an
organization under fire from its fan base, all those different things.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
It is a very weird because.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
If you squint right and the image is kind of blurry,
it's like, oh, it's Steelers Ravens in a big game
with playoff implication in December. But it is again, it's
like choosing the ugliest girl at the beauty pageant in
a couple ways. But at the same time, if you're
both of these teams right now, if you do want
any hope of kickstarting your season and feeling a little
differently down the stretch, going out and handling business against
(13:14):
your biggest rival is maybe the only way to realistically
get there.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Wes, as always, thanks for the time, partner. Enjoy listening
to you with Matt on the Drive. We'll keep doing so.
We'll talk to you soon. Thanks Tommy. A's Wes Yehler
from the Drive Steelers Nation Radio, part of the Steelers
Audio Network eight three, three, four one two ninety nine
thirty nine. Get your calls in right now. Tell me
what you think of the Adam Theelen claim off of
waivers by the Pittsburgh Steelers, does he fix the offense?
(13:40):
It's tom Off from an Infra Mark one O five
ninety X.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Thanks to Wes.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeuler for just joining us.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Mike de Fabo's coming up in about ten minutes or
so to talk more Steelers tuck more Adam Thielen. Steelers
claim thirty five year old wide receiver Adam Thielen off
of waivers just a little bit ago. And you cannot
make this up, our buddy, said Throorbaugh tweeted out after
the Steeler game on Sunday. Seth of course covers the
(14:05):
Penguins for the trip. He said, Mike Tomlin will say
something like we can't eat soup with forks, we need spoons.
Then the Steelers will sign a twenty eighteen pro bowler
to the practice squad. That was seven oh two pm
on Sunday that Seth tweeted that out. Well, fast forward
to today, we had the Mike Tomlin press conference where
he probably did say something like we can't eat soup
(14:25):
with forks, we need spoons. And then just about five
or six minutes ago, the Steelers signed a twenty eighteen
pro bowler to their practice squad in Adam Thielen, It's
kind of pathetic to be honest with you, like, sure
they need help at the wide receiver position. What the
hell is Grandpa theln gonna do? Couldn't see the field
(14:46):
in Minnesota, Carolina didn't want him after last year.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
This guy just needs to retire.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And now the Steelers bring him in and what they're
gonna work him into the offense.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
They signed Valdez Scanlon like three weeks ago. He can't
get off the practice squad.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
And Thelan could come to Pittsburgh and tap into his
prime years, his second team All Pro form that he
had once upon a time in Minnesota. The Steelers' offense
isn't capable of getting a lot out of a player
like that, of getting a lot out of a wide
receiver too. It really just seems like such a move
(15:22):
just for the sake of making a move. They also
waved Darius Slay today. That makes a lot of sense
to me. I'm sure Slay and the Steelers had a
conversation where Slige would prefer to be available for other
teams if the Steelers are going to keep making him
an active I don't know what other team's gonna want
him though, after seeing how badly he's stunk in Pittsburgh.
It is crazy, though that the Steelers released Darius Slay
(15:44):
and then somehow got older by signing Adam Theelean.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
Now.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
I don't know if Flan's gonna.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Start on the practice squad like Asante Samuel did, like
Valdez Scantling still is. But I can't imagine that Adam
Thelon is going to be the needle mover that changes
this offense in such a dynamic way and thrust them
back into contender category eight three three four thirty nine.
(16:12):
What do you think about the Adam Thielen signing Mike
de Fabo from the Athletic. He's going to join us
next share his thoughts on that and a lot more
things regarding the Steelers. It's Tom Afferman infromark On one
of five nine the x Tom Afferman inframark Mann joining
us now as he always does on Tuesdays, is Mike
de Fabo from the Athletic.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Brought to us by Armstrong the Internet.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
You count on the people you trust Armstrong one wire
dot com.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Uh Mike.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Just a little bit ago, the Steelers claimed wide receiver
Adam Thielen off of waivers. Has the offense been fixed
and thus the season been saved?
Speaker 4 (16:45):
You know, back from my days of covering the Penguins,
that was good buddies with SEPs Or Bough and he
had a hilarious isn't that amazing?
Speaker 1 (16:52):
I brought this up or just before you came on.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Yeah, I mean Seth was was spot on. I'm look,
the Steelers had interest in Adam Delan last year at
the trade deadline, so it makes sense that if they
could get him for free, they can kick the tires.
But if you're thinking that this guy is going to
suddenly ignite an offense that cannot throw the football downfield,
has not been consistent running the football that Aaron Rodgers
(17:18):
has looked very poor over the last you know, ten
quarters that he's played. You know, you're lying to yourself,
you know, I think that philosophically, if he was in
his prime, he would make sense. He's a big body guy,
he's a willing blocker, he can work in the middle
of the field. All those things mesh with Aaron Rodgers,
who wants to coordinate a precision passing game at Arthur Smith,
(17:38):
who wants to run the ball a ton, but he's
thirty five years old. He had eight catches in eleven games.
He was a healthy scratch on Sunday. So I file
this into the Marquez Valdez Scanbaling category of aging player
that probably shouldn't expect much from.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Well, that's just the thing, Mike, Like, we just did
this a few weeks ago, and he can't get a hat.
He's still stuck on the practice squad. I haven't seen
officially yet if Fland was added to the practice squad
or not. I don't know if you know that yet
or not, But like exactly, it's the same exact type
of move. It feels like it's almost just we're making
a move because we feel like we need to make
a move.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
But this really isn't going to fix any of our problems.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
It's too little, too late. When the Steelers traded George Pickens,
and I will continue to defend that decision big picture,
because I think that his expiration date had hit in Pittsburgh,
the next move should have been to go out and
get a legitimate wide receiver too, and they just simply
did not. They ignored it. They had too much faith
that Roman Wilson was going to step up the season,
(18:41):
misplaced belief in Roman Wilson. They had too much faith
in Calvin Austin and it's just not worked. And so like, yeah,
you can make a move right now week fourteen of
the season, but they should have made a more substantial
move bringing in a younger and more talented receiver about
sixteen weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I do have to say, though, Mike, it's not like
I'd be overly confident in the Steelers offense under Arthur
Smith being able to get the most out of a
younger number two wide receiver. I agree with you that
I am still on board with the Steelers getting rid
of George Pickens. I think he did hit his expiration
date here, but I also think a part of that
is what he's doing in Dallas would not be happening
(19:23):
here in Pittsburgh. I mean, they're struggling getting their number
one receiver going. Mike, Now you want to make a
number two part of that equation.
Speaker 4 (19:31):
Yeah, I completely agree the Steelers. I mean, well, first
of all, George Pickens is with a better quarterback than
what he would have in Pittsburgh. He's with a better
play caller and offensive mind than he would have in Pittsburgh,
he has a better number two or number one B
to take some pressure off him than he would have
in Pittsburgh. And like in Pittsburgh, the Steelers have the
(19:55):
least wide receiver friendly offense in the entire league. They
use multiple receivers the least amount out of anybody, they
throw it to their receivers less than anybody, and they
throw downfield less than anybody else. So none of that
would marry well with what George Pickens does. Well not
to mention the fact that the Steelers had George Pickens
for three years and were never able to help him
(20:16):
reach his potential, and he was frustrated. He clearly wanted out.
I mean, let's all remember he was making cryptic statements
on social media all the time about, you know, how
ineffective the quarterback play was around him. So, you know,
George is a fantastic player. He's one of the best
athletes I've ever seen in person, and if he can
(20:37):
keep his head on his shoulders, he has the potential
to be a Hall of Fame receiver. And I've always
believed that whether he's able to do that, I don't
know if he was going to be able to do
that in Pittsburgh. I know for a certain he was
not going to be able to Today.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
At Mike Commins press conference, he ruled Derek Carmon out
again this week against Baltimore, which is a terrible blow
for the Steelers. The Bills put up two hundred and
forty nine yards rush against the Steelers without Derek Harmon.
The last two times the Steelers met the Ravens and
Dereck Henry Mike, they put up five hundred and nineteen
yards combined against the Pittsburgh Steelers. I don't want to,
you know, pin all of the successes on the run
(21:13):
defense to just one player, rookie Derek Harmon, but it
does seem to be a drastic difference when he's in
there and when he's not.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
Well, you look at it and go back to OTAs
and Taroll. Austin was pretty transparent. He said, we had
a Baltimore problem last year, So what did they do
to address that? They drafted Derek Carman in the first round,
expected him to be a great immediately and to play
all seventeen games. When he's played, he's been very good.
And I think that was that was a good draft
(21:43):
pick and he's going to turn into a very good
defensive lineman.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Agreed.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
The problem is that's the only thing that they did
that's different, right, Like, they didn't bring in they should.
It should have been an and situation. It should have
been draft Derek Carmon and sign legitimate started caliber or
new year starting caliber defensive lineman. Instead they went out
and they got Daniel Ekuala who had a history of
peed offenses and he failed a p now suspended. They
(22:12):
had Dean Lowry who was on his last leg as
a mid thirty defensive lineman and he tore his acl
in the last leg that he was standing on. You know.
They had Isaiah Laudermilk who has never developed into much
of anything, and they brought him back and he continued
to not develop, and now he's injured. So they didn't
(22:33):
do anything to change it. Their whole face and the
whole reason why you could say, well, this will be
different this time around Steelers versus the Baltimore Ravens was
counting upon Derek Harmon being the savior to make a
meaningful and significant change. Now with him injured. I just
I'm a skeptic. I have a hard time believing that
(22:53):
this defense that we just saw get run all over
by the Buffalo Bills using the same play over and
over is going to suddenly go to Baltimore and produce
a different result.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
No, I'm skeptical as well and sticking with that Bill's
rushing attack. What did you make of James Cook's comments
after the game saying that they really look to attack
the Steelers' corners. They recognize that they're extremely weak tackling
in that cornerback room, and once they got to the edge,
they were able to exploit that. I honestly thought Mike
Joey Porter Junior had some pretty decent tackles in that game,
you know, maybe put the lid on what could have
(23:25):
been an even worse run. But I think there is
something to what James Cook was saying, and it's something
that teams like Derrick Henry and the Ravens, Jamier Gibson,
the Lions down the road are going to exploit an attack.
Speaker 4 (23:37):
Yeah, I agree with you, Like, I don't know that
if I'm assigning blame for who is responsible for the
defense getting gash on the ground, Joey Porter Junior necessarily
would be a top list. I think what he's getting
at is when teams run, you know, use the zone runs,
which was a lot of what the Bills were doing
that often is meant to put corners in one on
(23:59):
one tack going situation, and the Steelers weren't good enough
in that area. But I mean I look back at it,
and you know, watching the film and stuff, seem PJ.
Watt getting man handled by a tight end one on
one against a tight end is just startling. And you know,
guys up front that they've invested in, like he on
event not taking a step forward. You know, ya Black
(24:23):
just looking like a developmental fifth round pick. He's not
a bad player, but what do you expect out of
a rookie who's the fifth round pick? And that's why
they needed to address things in a different way. I
also put it on the inside linebackers. I think that
Patrick Queen, as much as he's you know, a fast
and fearless player who's good in coverage, he's not a
(24:45):
guy that can come downhill and hit and be an enforcer.
You know, Malie Harrison feels like he's been a step
back from a Landon Roberts from a physicality standpoint. Cole
Holcomb looks like you know, he's fighting to keep his
career alive at this point. So they've got they've got
a lot of problems, And I get what James Cook
is saying, but I think that I don't know that
(25:09):
Joey Porter Junior was the reason why they gave up
nearly two hundred and fifty rushing yards.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
It's really hard to analyze that offensive performance, isn't it.
I mean, they only had the ball for eighteen minutes,
but there's just really nothing there in that game against
Buffalo that you can build off of even a little bit.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
No. I mean they only had the ball eighteen minutes
because they kept going three or three and out or
you know, five play drives, seven play drives. So I
think that that was a big part of it. Unfortunately,
I think that right now the offense is confirming my
worst fears coming into this year. You know, I felt
(25:46):
like we had seen this story before. We had seen
Ben Roethlisberger lead the Steelers to an eleven to no start,
relying on a short, quick passing game and supported by
a decent defense, only for the whole thing to unravel
at the end of the y. We saw Russell Wilson
in an advanced age get the Steelers off to a
hot start, only for things to completely unravel down the stretch,
(26:08):
and so I just feel like it's history repeating itself. Unfortunately,
with old quarterbacks, they give you glimmers of hope. They
don't their skills and their amazing gifts don't just disappear overnight.
You still see the flashes of why they were once great.
And even in the worst performances that Rogers has had,
I e. That Chargers game, he made some incredible throws
(26:31):
over the middle of the field where he looked like himself.
The problem is you can get intoxicated by those brief,
flittering moments and forget that it takes a quarterback doing
that for sixty minutes. And right now their biggest problem
is they just simply cannot throw the football downfield. And
it's partially on Rogers. When he throws the deep ball,
(26:52):
it flutters on him, it's inaccurate, it's not on target.
He doesn't want to get hit, so he's not sitting
in the pocket long enough to tack downfield. But it's
also on his receivers. Even DK Metcalf has not been
getting open well enough. You know, they don't have a
competent receiving core to give Rogers a variety of weapons.
The offensive line, you know, has not come together as
(27:15):
much as they needed to protect Rogers and give them
the time to attack. So because of that, what what
you're looking at is is an offense that just seems
to rely way too much on short, quick passes and
yards after the catch. And if they're not getting the
ball to DK Metcalf and he's not bursting, you know,
downfield for a long yards after the catch, you know,
(27:35):
play there's very little that they can count on that
they can do consistently. There's nothing really other than that
that I could point to and say they've done this
well through all thirteen weeks of the season. They've just
been inconsistent. Running the ball, getting the ball to playmakers
has been inconsistent. Personnel usage has been puzzling. I can't
(27:58):
believe that they have two of the top ten paid
tight ends in the league, and yet Darnol Washington's probably
the best tight end that they've got. It's just up
and down the board. They've got warts and they've got problems,
and that's the reason why they're six and six right now.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
We're talking to Mike de Fabae from The Athletic here
on The Mark Man Show.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Mike's brought to us by Armstrong.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Do you think Rogers should be playing, especially if he
can't take a snap under center, and he so clearly
cannot do that.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
I do, just because I have no faith in the
other options. We've seen what Mason Rudolph is. We know
what Mason Rudolf is, and it's the guy that came
in and through the interception. You know, when you were
counted on him to just manage a game and not
let it get away from them. And Will Howard is
just not ready. He missed virtually. I mean he's only
(28:47):
been practicing. And when I say practicing I mean taking
some scout team reps over the last handful of weeks
because he was inactive and injured for most of the year.
I guess fake injured, pretend injured to stash him on
injured reserve.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Ah, forget it, Mike, Just throw him out there in
Baltimore with the division on the line.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
He'll go great.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
I mean to me, the only reason why you would
go to Will Howard is if you gave up on
the season. You want to see what the younger has
and you want to develop him. I don't think they're
at that point. If they lose three more games, yeah,
maybe then you're at that point. But let's just be
logical about this. Mike Tomlin isn't walking into the meeting
room and telling Aaron Rodgers his career is done and
(29:30):
that Will Howard is going to be the starting quarterback.
You made your bed when you decided to wait Rogers,
and now you've got to lay in it. And now
you've got to ride this out. And maybe they still
look they still could could win three of their last
whatever games and make it to the playoffs, and you're
going to need Aaron Rodgers to start in that game.
So for that reason, you've got to keep starting Aaron
(29:51):
Rodgers even with his limitations.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Now as they head to Baltimore Sunday, with the division
really hanging in the balance, both teams six and six,
this will go a lot way. Whoever wins this game
is the best thing the Steelers have going for them.
Just how bad the Ravens look too. Like it's not
a good place to be in when you're looking at
your own team. But Baltimore is not without their struggles.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
Yeah, I think that that should be the reason why
Steelers fans have the most hope or optimism is that,
you know, as much as the Steelers have disappointed, I
think this is what everyone kind of expected out of
the Steelers, but the Ravens have been like significantly worse.
And it doesn't look like Lamar Jackson is healthy. He's
(30:35):
not moving around like he once was. And I feel
like you have the good and the bad with with Lamar.
And he takes sacks and he holds onto the ball
too long, but you can live with that because he
is just an elite athlete and a magician with the
football in his hand. But right now you're seeing the
bad come out without the good to justify it. And
(30:59):
so like this, this Ravens offense, like this Ravens offense
is supposed to be a juggernaut and supposed to have
this two headed monster with Lamar and Derrick Henry. They
put up twelve points against the Bengals defense that's historically
bad and that's not overstating it one bit. They literally
might be the worst defense of all time. So I
(31:20):
think that that's the Steelers' best bet is that just
the Ravens never figure it out and they continue to
go into this tailspin and somehow the Steelers could sneak
into the playoffs with you know, eight or nine wins
in you know, at that point, who knows, But let's
just acknowledge the fact that even if the Steelers get
into the playoffs, they are not playing like a playoff team,
(31:43):
and getting into the playoffs was never the goal. This
was always about when they signed Aaron Rodgers and brought
in an old Jalen Ramsey and you know, brought in
John news Smith who's thirty one years old, and reassigned
TJ Watt, it was about ending this play off drought
that has gone on for too long, and anything short
of winning a playoff game should absolutely be taken as
(32:07):
a complete and utter failure for this franchise.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Finally, Mike, we got about a minute or two here.
Do you think there is a chance that eight and
nine could win the AFC North this year? And do
you still give the Cincinnati Bengals an outside shot?
Speaker 4 (32:21):
I think that there is a chance that eight and
nine could get it done, just because none of the
teams within the AFC North have proven that they're even
remotely competent. And you look at the schedule that the
Ravens have Armenian, So they played the Steelers twice. Obviously,
they've also got to play the Packers, and they've also
got to play the Patriots and the Bengals since the game. Yeah,
(32:46):
so I mean you're looking at them. I mean, maybe
they split with the Steelers, you know, maybe they beat
the Bengals in the rematch, and where's their other win
going to come from?
Speaker 2 (32:58):
You know?
Speaker 4 (32:59):
And similarly at the Steelers, like I feel like they're
a team that just plays seventeen coin flip games this season,
So just flip your coin and determine whether they're going
to finish nine and eight or eight nine. So, you know,
I think as much as it's been bad football, there
is still some drama and I think that there's going
to continue to be intrigued until the last game of
(33:20):
the year.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Mike, great stuff. As always, We'll talk to you next week.
Enjoy the game Sunday in Baltimore.
Speaker 4 (33:28):
All right, sounds good, Tom, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Mike Defebo from the Athletic read his fine work there
and he's brought to us by Armstrong the Internet. You
can count on the people you trust Armstrong one wire
dot Com, Tom Afferman, inframark On one oh five ninety
x
Tom Offerman in for Mark Man Today.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
This segment is brought to us by eighty four Lumber,
a dynasty partner of the Pittsburgh Steelers, joining me now
in studio. You hear him on the Drive every day
with Matt Williamson on Steelers Nation Radio. He is Wesley Yuler. Wes,
thanks for joining me in studio, partner.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Always fun to put a face to the legend that
is Tommy Radio. Let's be honest. You just finished the
drive and you just mosied on over here. Yeah, I
mean I came down like two studios. It was a
really far trip. But you know, in these gray, soulless studios,
you can never really tell which room is which.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, the big news that just broke was Darius Slay
getting released by the Steelers. I don't think that's a
big deal at all because he was probably going to
be an act of moving forward every week as long
as everybody was healthy in that secondary. And I think
they got enough out of us Sante Samuel where they
were like, hey, we're good with him moving forward. It's
going to be him and Pierre's kind of that duo
opposite of Joey Porter Junior And do you want to
go out and try to find your way with someone else.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Darius Slay feel free.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Yeah, And I like that they give him that option,
you know, for a veteran guy end of his career. Hey,
we're not just gonna make you inactive for the rest
of the season. Go ahead and see if you can
seek employment somewhere else. But I think you're right the
writing on the wall. Maybe we should have seen this.
I mean, his role has steadily decreased. He was a
healthy scratch. He was inactive on Sunday against Buffalo. And then, yes,
(01:20):
I'll be it, in a small sample size, you saw
a Sante Samuel Junior finally after a couple weeks of practice.
And then, you know, Mike Tomlin earlier today it is
weekly Tuesday press conferences. You know, I forget what the
exact line was, but he said something like, we liked
what we saw or we liked what we've seen with
a Sante Samuel Junior. So I think this makes a
ton of sense. I think he can slot in well
(01:41):
right now with what you're asking him to do. And
tom if it goes pretty you know, Darius Slay was
a one year lease, you know, in an apartment downtown,
whereas a Sante Samuel, he could be a mortgage for
you for a few years. If you like what you
see here, in the next couple of weeks, you bring
him back. He's in Latrobe in late July. He's in
the mix, you know, with Eckles and Joey Porter Junior,
(02:03):
and hopefully maybe there could be something longer term here
with him too that you were just never gonna get
with Sleigh.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
I mean, he's on the right side of thirty by
a couple of years. I'd still think he'd be in
the Charger second area right now if he didn't have
that devastating injury at the end of last season. Today
at Mike Thomlins press conference West he ruled out Derek Harmon,
which I think is just great news considering the Bills
just ran for two hundred and forty nine yards without
Harmon out there, and they're facing Derrick Henry and the Ravens,
who in their previous two games combined for two or
(02:30):
for five hundred and nineteen rushing yards against the Steelers.
Speaker 1 (02:33):
So you need Harmon out there.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I don't want to put it all on the rookie
shoulders and say, hey, you have a great run defense
with him, a terrible one without him. But kind of
seems to be that way, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
One of the things that I talked about with our
buddy Matt Williamson on the drive today was how there's
not much I know about this team for sure right now.
You know, I know the defense is heavily reliant on takeaways,
and when they get him, the Steelers can win. When
they don't, the Steelers aren't gonna win. And even sometimes
when they get him, like they did in the first
half against Buffalo, it only gets you a four point
(03:02):
lead and not as worthwhile as you need it to be.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
The Bears game got him, didn't win the game.
Speaker 3 (03:06):
And even you know, against New England in Indianapolis, you
got five and six and it was only a one
possession of inner. I know how reliant this team is
and this defense are on splash plays. There's not a
ton else that I know other than this area or
that player has underwhelmed. But another thing that I do
know is if you look at this Steelers run defense
with and without Derek Harmon, it's a drastic difference.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
It's like it was with Cam Hayward. Last with Cam Hayward.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
Last year, the Steelers were like a top five run
defense when he was on the field and a bottom
five run defense when he was off the field. And
it's almost getting to feel that way with Derek Harmon.
Think about how much they struggled against the run those
first two weeks when he was absent at the start
of this year, and then he comes back in New
England and they get better, and they were really good
in Dublin in that department against the Vikings. There was
(03:52):
I think a direct correlation between Harmon's absence and James
Cook running right at where he typically is on the
defensive line to great success on Sunday, over and over
and over again. And you're right, you shouldn't be putting
that on the rookie. You shouldn't be that reliant on
one player, especially a rookie, on your defensive line. But
(04:13):
I think it's pretty clear, and maybe high Smith deserves some,
you know, some credit in this regard to because he's
good against the run and has missed a few weeks.
But Derek Harmon has been so crucial to the kind
of ebb and flow the pendulum that we've felt about
this Steelers run defense. And it really showed on Sunday,
and you mentioned against a guy like Derrick Henry, even
(04:33):
with Lamar clearly not being healthy and his you know,
athleticism and his legs not being as big of a factor,
you could see Derek Henry getting like twenty five carries
and just them being unable to slow him down. Once again,
Harmon is a is a huge absence. I think we
all spent time last week talking like what's the bigger loss?
Broderick Jones on the offensive line, Derek Harmon on the
(04:54):
defensive line, both in the trenches, both big guys. With
all due respect to Broderick Jones, I think it was
shown that it's Derek Harmon. On Sunday, we have some
more Steelers breaking news. You ready for this, He's a
little spicy. They have claimed veteran wide receiver Adam Thielen
off of waiver. No, Lord, I got a feeling Adam
Thielen is a Pittsburgh Steeler.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Does that solve anything as far as the wide receiver
too is concerned. I don't even know if like they
got a Jacoby Meyer type of player in here, that
it would have solved anything, because I just don't know
if they know how to use it properly, Like, I
don't know if that offense is capable of getting the
most out of a number two wide receiver because they
ain't getting the most out of the number one wide receiver.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Like, how are we going to talk about getting more
out of your number two wide receiver when we're having
that same conversation, when we're having that conversation with John
hu Smith and Pat Fryarmouth.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
It's everybody in the past game.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
You might have Rob Gronkowski dipped in Randy Moss in
their prime walking out there on Sunday, Tom and I'm
not sure if they could put up numbers.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
It's a massive issue.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
It hasn't mattered who the quarterback was, It hasn't mattered
who the number two wide receiver was. It hasn't mattered
how you deploy the tight ends. Maybe this is another
thing that we know for sure about this team. The
pass game has been utterly ineffective. You know, they signed
MVS to the practice squad a few weeks ago. Haven't
seen him, And I'm not saying I'm like beating the
door down for that guy, but at least he's a
different body type than Calvin Anderson and Roman Wilson. He's
(06:17):
bigger and has some of that, you know, not nearly
to DK Metcalf size, but he again is certainly bigger
than Roman Wilson or Calvin Austin. I just they have
had failure to launch on so many elements of this offense.
I think a lot of it gets back in the
in the inconsistencies in the ground game. But even still,
when they've had Jalen Warren running really effectively, it hasn't
(06:38):
translated to opening things up and having success in the
pass game.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Tom.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
This is kind of like, I give them a smidge
of credit for at least trying something, But this is
also like, this is the equivalent of like showing up
for your college class when you're hungover at eight thirty
in the morning. Yeah, you're there, but are you really
gonna do anything? Are you really gonna learn anything?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I doubt it.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And it's just another player that, you know, if this
was in twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, this would be great.
I'd love having Adamtheland on the team. It's just passed
his prime. Played in eleven games for the Vikings this year,
caught eight balls for sixty nine yards, did not find
the end zone. Last year with Carolina, started ten games,
six hundred and fifteen yards on forty eight catches for
(07:19):
five touchdowns. This is a former second team All Pro,
former Pro bowler who's just way past his prime. And again,
you know when people keep talking about how great George
Pickens is doing in Dallas in that same vein that
we were just talking with Jacobe Meyer as someone who's
better in their prime than Adam Thielen coming in here
being a wide receiver too. I just don't trust this
(07:40):
offense to get the most out of them. So I
get what you're saying, like it's they haven't done to
them for addressing it right now and trying something, But
this is not going to do anything for them.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
No, they haven't figured it out with DK, they haven't
figured out with John news Smith, guys that are much
more in their prime and much more talented. And yeah,
Tom again, like you have to do something, but it
almost feels like polishing the brass on the Titanic.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Should Aaron Rodgers be playing right now in your opinion,
especially since it's so clear he cannot take a snap
under center and that limits your playbook especially the running
portion of your playbook.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
I'm gonna steal a Matt Williamson line and say, this
isn't exactly what you asked me. But he loves saying that,
doesn't He does love saying that. And you also know
too that that's when you're gonna get the good stuff.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah right. I don't know if I can say the same, You.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Know, is that an insult to us, by the way,
because it's like, why aren't you asking me the right?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Why aren't you asking me something?
Speaker 3 (08:30):
I think he's an NFL head coach here or something
he could dictate how the questions are asked, you know.
I I don't know, I.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Tom, I just I don't know.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
I don't think he should play. I think if you
can't get under center, it limits you too much.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
What I would have really liked to see.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
And again this is the not what you asked me
and easy to see in hindsight or easy to say
in hindsight.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
Pardon me.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
It would have been probably better to sit him down
against Buffalo again this past Sunday, give him that kind
of two games off three weeks to get right. Here's
the fence that I sit on, is I don't think
it's gonna get much better with Mason. Like, your only
chance of somewhat improving this offense, somewhat saving the season,
maybe going to the playoffs, is for Aaron Rodgers to
(09:16):
perform like he did, you know, back at times in
September and October.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Yeah, Jets game, Bengals game, they lost.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Absolutely right, even you know, like the Browns game coming
out of the Byway, the offense was effective. There's been times.
I'm not saying that they were a top five, top
ten unit in the NFL, but there's certainly been times
where they've been effective, and he's been the straw that
stirred that drink. That's your only hope of really turning
a corner or you know, noticeably improving as an offense.
(09:42):
But it's also very clear that he is not one
hundred percent healthy. Tom He turns forty two years old today.
He turned forty two years old today, and he got
a thirty five year old wide receiver as a gift.
And he got a thirty five year old wide receiver
as a gift who caught eight passes so far this season.
How's that risk gonna you know, if he was thirty,
maybe it's a different conversation. But I think even if
(10:03):
you set him down for a couple weeks at this point,
it probably doesn't make that much of a difference. And
here I am talking in circles about this because there's
no clear cut answer. But I would continue to stick
with Aaron Rodgers because I again, I think Mason is
a fine, serviceable backup, but he's not going to change
the trajectory of your season. Neither is Will Howard, who
hasn't taking a meaningful snap until early August.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
I'm sure him in.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
There, six and six, six and sixth Baltimore, I'll go
into the Ravens House for a chance to take control
of the division. Throw the kid from the sixth round
in there. Can't run, can't throw, can't protect. But let's
put in the quarterback who hasn't thrown a pass since August.
I just there is no right answer, so I'm a
default too. I'll continue to ride with the future Hall
of Fame quarterback, even if he's clearly only seventy seventy
(10:48):
five eighty percent healthy, whatever it is, because that's your
only hope to get right, is him getting right.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
Now.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
They do go to Baltimore this weekend to face the Ravens,
one of two games against Baltimore in the month of
December for the down the stretch run. Their last game
of the season in January at home against the Ravens
as well. It's sad to say this, but the best
thing that the Steelers have going for them right now
between these two six and six teams is that the
Ravens aren't playing well either. Is that they're having the
injured and they're having these same talks on their Ravens
(11:16):
Nations radios and all their Ravens talk shows too.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Is that what's.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Wrong with the offense? We can't get complimentary football going.
Once the defense, you know, gets up to speed, our
offense all of a sudden disappears.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
So similar criticisms for the coaches exactly past their prime.
Things are getting stale.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
So the Ravens are in a lot of the same
places that the Steelers are.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
In right now.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
So at least you have something going in your favor.
Is that they stink too. So it's like who can
stink less?
Speaker 3 (11:44):
On Sunday tom one of these two teams has to
make the playoffs or do they? And well, I don't
think the Bengals coming off from the outside. I think
the Bengals if they had if they were five and
seven instead of four and eight, completely different conversations, they
could have won one more games like that one against
Chicago that they gave as game Jets game that they
gave away. Either of those, they would really be scary
(12:04):
right now, because I do think their defense is slightly improved.
But for Baltimore and Pittsburgh, one of these teams has
to make the playoffs, and it's almost like one of
them is gonna be the ugliest girl at the beauty pageant,
you know, and hey, you if you're at the beauty pageant,
there's still something to be said for that. But it
is a very interesting. This is another thing Matt and
I talked about. You know, typically when you get to
(12:25):
this time of year, Steelers Ravens historically, right, it's like two.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Dogs, one bone. You know, one of these teams.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Is gonna win the division, one's gonna go to the
AFC Championship Game.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
One's gonna have a chance to win the super Bowl.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
It's now it's kind of like who can crawl to
the finish line and just outlast the other that's had
a disappointing year, that's dealing with a lot of injuries,
that has a roster and a coaching staff, and an
organization under fire from its fan base, all those different things.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
It is a very weird because.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
If you squint right and the image is kind of blurry,
it's like, oh, it's Steelers Ravens in a big game
with playoff implication in December. But it is again, it's
like choosing the ugliest girl at the beauty pageant in
a couple ways. But at the same time, if you're
both of these teams right now, if you do want
any hope of kickstarting your season and feeling a little
differently down the stretch, going out and handling business against
(13:14):
your biggest rival is maybe the only way to realistically
get there.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Wes, as always, thanks for the time, partner. Enjoy listening
to you with Matt on the Drive. We'll keep doing so.
We'll talk to you soon. Thanks Tommy. A's Wes Yehler
from the Drive Steelers Nation Radio, part of the Steelers
Audio Network eight three, three, four one two ninety nine
thirty nine. Get your calls in right now. Tell me
what you think of the Adam Theelen claim off of
waivers by the Pittsburgh Steelers, does he fix the offense?
(13:40):
It's tom Off from an Infra Mark one O five
ninety X.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Thanks to Wes.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
Yeuler for just joining us.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Mike de Fabo's coming up in about ten minutes or
so to talk more Steelers tuck more Adam Thielen. Steelers
claim thirty five year old wide receiver Adam Thielen off
of waivers just a little bit ago. And you cannot
make this up, our buddy, said Throorbaugh tweeted out after
the Steeler game on Sunday. Seth of course covers the
(14:05):
Penguins for the trip. He said, Mike Tomlin will say
something like we can't eat soup with forks, we need spoons.
Then the Steelers will sign a twenty eighteen pro bowler
to the practice squad. That was seven oh two pm
on Sunday that Seth tweeted that out. Well, fast forward
to today, we had the Mike Tomlin press conference where
he probably did say something like we can't eat soup
(14:25):
with forks, we need spoons. And then just about five
or six minutes ago, the Steelers signed a twenty eighteen
pro bowler to their practice squad in Adam Thielen, It's
kind of pathetic to be honest with you, like, sure
they need help at the wide receiver position. What the
hell is Grandpa theln gonna do? Couldn't see the field
(14:46):
in Minnesota, Carolina didn't want him after last year.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
This guy just needs to retire.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And now the Steelers bring him in and what they're
gonna work him into the offense.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
They signed Valdez Scanlon like three weeks ago. He can't
get off the practice squad.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
And Thelan could come to Pittsburgh and tap into his
prime years, his second team All Pro form that he
had once upon a time in Minnesota. The Steelers' offense
isn't capable of getting a lot out of a player
like that, of getting a lot out of a wide
receiver too. It really just seems like such a move
(15:22):
just for the sake of making a move. They also
waved Darius Slay today. That makes a lot of sense
to me. I'm sure Slay and the Steelers had a
conversation where Slige would prefer to be available for other
teams if the Steelers are going to keep making him
an active I don't know what other team's gonna want
him though, after seeing how badly he's stunk in Pittsburgh.
It is crazy, though that the Steelers released Darius Slay
(15:44):
and then somehow got older by signing Adam Theelean.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
Now.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
I don't know if Flan's gonna.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Start on the practice squad like Asante Samuel did, like
Valdez Scantling still is. But I can't imagine that Adam
Thelon is going to be the needle mover that changes
this offense in such a dynamic way and thrust them
back into contender category eight three three four thirty nine.
(16:12):
What do you think about the Adam Thielen signing Mike
de Fabo from the Athletic. He's going to join us
next share his thoughts on that and a lot more
things regarding the Steelers. It's Tom Afferman infromark On one
of five nine the x Tom Afferman inframark Mann joining
us now as he always does on Tuesdays, is Mike
de Fabo from the Athletic.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Brought to us by Armstrong the Internet.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
You count on the people you trust Armstrong one wire
dot com.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Uh Mike.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Just a little bit ago, the Steelers claimed wide receiver
Adam Thielen off of waivers. Has the offense been fixed
and thus the season been saved?
Speaker 4 (16:45):
You know, back from my days of covering the Penguins,
that was good buddies with SEPs Or Bough and he
had a hilarious isn't that amazing?
Speaker 1 (16:52):
I brought this up or just before you came on.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Yeah, I mean Seth was was spot on. I'm look,
the Steelers had interest in Adam Delan last year at
the trade deadline, so it makes sense that if they
could get him for free, they can kick the tires.
But if you're thinking that this guy is going to
suddenly ignite an offense that cannot throw the football downfield,
has not been consistent running the football that Aaron Rodgers
(17:18):
has looked very poor over the last you know, ten
quarters that he's played. You know, you're lying to yourself,
you know, I think that philosophically, if he was in
his prime, he would make sense. He's a big body guy,
he's a willing blocker, he can work in the middle
of the field. All those things mesh with Aaron Rodgers,
who wants to coordinate a precision passing game at Arthur Smith,
(17:38):
who wants to run the ball a ton, but he's
thirty five years old. He had eight catches in eleven games.
He was a healthy scratch on Sunday. So I file
this into the Marquez Valdez Scanbaling category of aging player
that probably shouldn't expect much from.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Well, that's just the thing, Mike, Like, we just did
this a few weeks ago, and he can't get a hat.
He's still stuck on the practice squad. I haven't seen
officially yet if Fland was added to the practice squad
or not. I don't know if you know that yet
or not, But like exactly, it's the same exact type
of move. It feels like it's almost just we're making
a move because we feel like we need to make
a move.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
But this really isn't going to fix any of our problems.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
It's too little, too late. When the Steelers traded George Pickens,
and I will continue to defend that decision big picture,
because I think that his expiration date had hit in Pittsburgh,
the next move should have been to go out and
get a legitimate wide receiver too, and they just simply
did not. They ignored it. They had too much faith
that Roman Wilson was going to step up the season,
(18:41):
misplaced belief in Roman Wilson. They had too much faith
in Calvin Austin and it's just not worked. And so like, yeah,
you can make a move right now week fourteen of
the season, but they should have made a more substantial
move bringing in a younger and more talented receiver about
sixteen weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
I do have to say, though, Mike, it's not like
I'd be overly confident in the Steelers offense under Arthur
Smith being able to get the most out of a
younger number two wide receiver. I agree with you that
I am still on board with the Steelers getting rid
of George Pickens. I think he did hit his expiration
date here, but I also think a part of that
is what he's doing in Dallas would not be happening
(19:23):
here in Pittsburgh. I mean, they're struggling getting their number
one receiver going. Mike, Now you want to make a
number two part of that equation.
Speaker 4 (19:31):
Yeah, I completely agree the Steelers. I mean, well, first
of all, George Pickens is with a better quarterback than
what he would have in Pittsburgh. He's with a better
play caller and offensive mind than he would have in Pittsburgh,
he has a better number two or number one B
to take some pressure off him than he would have
in Pittsburgh. And like in Pittsburgh, the Steelers have the
(19:55):
least wide receiver friendly offense in the entire league. They
use multiple receivers the least amount out of anybody, they
throw it to their receivers less than anybody, and they
throw downfield less than anybody else. So none of that
would marry well with what George Pickens does. Well not
to mention the fact that the Steelers had George Pickens
for three years and were never able to help him
(20:16):
reach his potential, and he was frustrated. He clearly wanted out.
I mean, let's all remember he was making cryptic statements
on social media all the time about, you know, how
ineffective the quarterback play was around him. So, you know,
George is a fantastic player. He's one of the best
athletes I've ever seen in person, and if he can
(20:37):
keep his head on his shoulders, he has the potential
to be a Hall of Fame receiver. And I've always
believed that whether he's able to do that, I don't
know if he was going to be able to do
that in Pittsburgh. I know for a certain he was
not going to be able to Today.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
At Mike Commins press conference, he ruled Derek Carmon out
again this week against Baltimore, which is a terrible blow
for the Steelers. The Bills put up two hundred and
forty nine yards rush against the Steelers without Derek Harmon.
The last two times the Steelers met the Ravens and
Dereck Henry Mike, they put up five hundred and nineteen
yards combined against the Pittsburgh Steelers. I don't want to,
you know, pin all of the successes on the run
(21:13):
defense to just one player, rookie Derek Harmon, but it
does seem to be a drastic difference when he's in
there and when he's not.
Speaker 4 (21:21):
Well, you look at it and go back to OTAs
and Taroll. Austin was pretty transparent. He said, we had
a Baltimore problem last year, So what did they do
to address that? They drafted Derek Carman in the first round,
expected him to be a great immediately and to play
all seventeen games. When he's played, he's been very good.
And I think that was that was a good draft
(21:43):
pick and he's going to turn into a very good
defensive lineman.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Agreed.
Speaker 4 (21:46):
The problem is that's the only thing that they did
that's different, right, Like, they didn't bring in they should.
It should have been an and situation. It should have
been draft Derek Carmon and sign legitimate started caliber or
new year starting caliber defensive lineman. Instead they went out
and they got Daniel Ekuala who had a history of
peed offenses and he failed a p now suspended. They
(22:12):
had Dean Lowry who was on his last leg as
a mid thirty defensive lineman and he tore his acl
in the last leg that he was standing on. You know.
They had Isaiah Laudermilk who has never developed into much
of anything, and they brought him back and he continued
to not develop, and now he's injured. So they didn't
(22:33):
do anything to change it. Their whole face and the
whole reason why you could say, well, this will be
different this time around Steelers versus the Baltimore Ravens was
counting upon Derek Harmon being the savior to make a
meaningful and significant change. Now with him injured. I just
I'm a skeptic. I have a hard time believing that
(22:53):
this defense that we just saw get run all over
by the Buffalo Bills using the same play over and
over is going to suddenly go to Baltimore and produce
a different result.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
No, I'm skeptical as well and sticking with that Bill's
rushing attack. What did you make of James Cook's comments
after the game saying that they really look to attack
the Steelers' corners. They recognize that they're extremely weak tackling
in that cornerback room, and once they got to the edge,
they were able to exploit that. I honestly thought Mike
Joey Porter Junior had some pretty decent tackles in that game,
you know, maybe put the lid on what could have
(23:25):
been an even worse run. But I think there is
something to what James Cook was saying, and it's something
that teams like Derrick Henry and the Ravens, Jamier Gibson,
the Lions down the road are going to exploit an attack.
Speaker 4 (23:37):
Yeah, I agree with you, Like, I don't know that
if I'm assigning blame for who is responsible for the
defense getting gash on the ground, Joey Porter Junior necessarily
would be a top list. I think what he's getting
at is when teams run, you know, use the zone runs,
which was a lot of what the Bills were doing
that often is meant to put corners in one on
(23:59):
one tack going situation, and the Steelers weren't good enough
in that area. But I mean I look back at it,
and you know, watching the film and stuff, seem PJ.
Watt getting man handled by a tight end one on
one against a tight end is just startling. And you know,
guys up front that they've invested in, like he on
event not taking a step forward. You know, ya Black
(24:23):
just looking like a developmental fifth round pick. He's not
a bad player, but what do you expect out of
a rookie who's the fifth round pick? And that's why
they needed to address things in a different way. I
also put it on the inside linebackers. I think that
Patrick Queen, as much as he's you know, a fast
and fearless player who's good in coverage, he's not a
(24:45):
guy that can come downhill and hit and be an enforcer.
You know, Malie Harrison feels like he's been a step
back from a Landon Roberts from a physicality standpoint. Cole
Holcomb looks like you know, he's fighting to keep his
career alive at this point. So they've got they've got
a lot of problems, And I get what James Cook
is saying, but I think that I don't know that
(25:09):
Joey Porter Junior was the reason why they gave up
nearly two hundred and fifty rushing yards.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
It's really hard to analyze that offensive performance, isn't it.
I mean, they only had the ball for eighteen minutes,
but there's just really nothing there in that game against
Buffalo that you can build off of even a little bit.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
No. I mean they only had the ball eighteen minutes
because they kept going three or three and out or
you know, five play drives, seven play drives. So I
think that that was a big part of it. Unfortunately,
I think that right now the offense is confirming my
worst fears coming into this year. You know, I felt
(25:46):
like we had seen this story before. We had seen
Ben Roethlisberger lead the Steelers to an eleven to no start,
relying on a short, quick passing game and supported by
a decent defense, only for the whole thing to unravel
at the end of the y. We saw Russell Wilson
in an advanced age get the Steelers off to a
hot start, only for things to completely unravel down the stretch,
(26:08):
and so I just feel like it's history repeating itself. Unfortunately,
with old quarterbacks, they give you glimmers of hope. They
don't their skills and their amazing gifts don't just disappear overnight.
You still see the flashes of why they were once great.
And even in the worst performances that Rogers has had,
I e. That Chargers game, he made some incredible throws
(26:31):
over the middle of the field where he looked like himself.
The problem is you can get intoxicated by those brief,
flittering moments and forget that it takes a quarterback doing
that for sixty minutes. And right now their biggest problem
is they just simply cannot throw the football downfield. And
it's partially on Rogers. When he throws the deep ball,
(26:52):
it flutters on him, it's inaccurate, it's not on target.
He doesn't want to get hit, so he's not sitting
in the pocket long enough to tack downfield. But it's
also on his receivers. Even DK Metcalf has not been
getting open well enough. You know, they don't have a
competent receiving core to give Rogers a variety of weapons.
The offensive line, you know, has not come together as
(27:15):
much as they needed to protect Rogers and give them
the time to attack. So because of that, what what
you're looking at is is an offense that just seems
to rely way too much on short, quick passes and
yards after the catch. And if they're not getting the
ball to DK Metcalf and he's not bursting, you know,
downfield for a long yards after the catch, you know,
(27:35):
play there's very little that they can count on that
they can do consistently. There's nothing really other than that
that I could point to and say they've done this
well through all thirteen weeks of the season. They've just
been inconsistent. Running the ball, getting the ball to playmakers
has been inconsistent. Personnel usage has been puzzling. I can't
(27:58):
believe that they have two of the top ten paid
tight ends in the league, and yet Darnol Washington's probably
the best tight end that they've got. It's just up
and down the board. They've got warts and they've got problems,
and that's the reason why they're six and six right now.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
We're talking to Mike de Fabae from The Athletic here
on The Mark Man Show.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Mike's brought to us by Armstrong.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
Do you think Rogers should be playing, especially if he
can't take a snap under center, and he so clearly
cannot do that.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
I do, just because I have no faith in the
other options. We've seen what Mason Rudolph is. We know
what Mason Rudolf is, and it's the guy that came
in and through the interception. You know, when you were
counted on him to just manage a game and not
let it get away from them. And Will Howard is
just not ready. He missed virtually. I mean he's only
(28:47):
been practicing. And when I say practicing I mean taking
some scout team reps over the last handful of weeks
because he was inactive and injured for most of the year.
I guess fake injured, pretend injured to stash him on
injured reserve.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Ah, forget it, Mike, Just throw him out there in
Baltimore with the division on the line.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
He'll go great.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
I mean to me, the only reason why you would
go to Will Howard is if you gave up on
the season. You want to see what the younger has
and you want to develop him. I don't think they're
at that point. If they lose three more games, yeah,
maybe then you're at that point. But let's just be
logical about this. Mike Tomlin isn't walking into the meeting
room and telling Aaron Rodgers his career is done and
(29:30):
that Will Howard is going to be the starting quarterback.
You made your bed when you decided to wait Rogers,
and now you've got to lay in it. And now
you've got to ride this out. And maybe they still
look they still could could win three of their last
whatever games and make it to the playoffs, and you're
going to need Aaron Rodgers to start in that game.
So for that reason, you've got to keep starting Aaron
(29:51):
Rodgers even with his limitations.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Now as they head to Baltimore Sunday, with the division
really hanging in the balance, both teams six and six,
this will go a lot way. Whoever wins this game
is the best thing the Steelers have going for them.
Just how bad the Ravens look too. Like it's not
a good place to be in when you're looking at
your own team. But Baltimore is not without their struggles.
Speaker 4 (30:13):
Yeah, I think that that should be the reason why
Steelers fans have the most hope or optimism is that,
you know, as much as the Steelers have disappointed, I
think this is what everyone kind of expected out of
the Steelers, but the Ravens have been like significantly worse.
And it doesn't look like Lamar Jackson is healthy. He's
(30:35):
not moving around like he once was. And I feel
like you have the good and the bad with with Lamar.
And he takes sacks and he holds onto the ball
too long, but you can live with that because he
is just an elite athlete and a magician with the
football in his hand. But right now you're seeing the
bad come out without the good to justify it. And
(30:59):
so like this, this Ravens offense, like this Ravens offense
is supposed to be a juggernaut and supposed to have
this two headed monster with Lamar and Derrick Henry. They
put up twelve points against the Bengals defense that's historically
bad and that's not overstating it one bit. They literally
might be the worst defense of all time. So I
(31:20):
think that that's the Steelers' best bet is that just
the Ravens never figure it out and they continue to
go into this tailspin and somehow the Steelers could sneak
into the playoffs with you know, eight or nine wins
in you know, at that point, who knows, But let's
just acknowledge the fact that even if the Steelers get
into the playoffs, they are not playing like a playoff team,
(31:43):
and getting into the playoffs was never the goal. This
was always about when they signed Aaron Rodgers and brought
in an old Jalen Ramsey and you know, brought in
John news Smith who's thirty one years old, and reassigned
TJ Watt, it was about ending this play off drought
that has gone on for too long, and anything short
of winning a playoff game should absolutely be taken as
(32:07):
a complete and utter failure for this franchise.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Finally, Mike, we got about a minute or two here.
Do you think there is a chance that eight and
nine could win the AFC North this year? And do
you still give the Cincinnati Bengals an outside shot?
Speaker 4 (32:21):
I think that there is a chance that eight and
nine could get it done, just because none of the
teams within the AFC North have proven that they're even
remotely competent. And you look at the schedule that the
Ravens have Armenian, So they played the Steelers twice. Obviously,
they've also got to play the Packers, and they've also
got to play the Patriots and the Bengals since the game. Yeah,
(32:46):
so I mean you're looking at them. I mean, maybe
they split with the Steelers, you know, maybe they beat
the Bengals in the rematch, and where's their other win
going to come from?
Speaker 2 (32:58):
You know?
Speaker 4 (32:59):
And similarly at the Steelers, like I feel like they're
a team that just plays seventeen coin flip games this season,
So just flip your coin and determine whether they're going
to finish nine and eight or eight nine. So, you know,
I think as much as it's been bad football, there
is still some drama and I think that there's going
to continue to be intrigued until the last game of
(33:20):
the year.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Mike, great stuff. As always, We'll talk to you next week.
Enjoy the game Sunday in Baltimore.
Speaker 4 (33:28):
All right, sounds good, Tom, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Mike Defebo from the Athletic read his fine work there
and he's brought to us by Armstrong the Internet. You
can count on the people you trust Armstrong one wire
dot Com, Tom Afferman, inframark On one oh five ninety
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